The New Unique Australian Beer

[chappo1970]

BTW, I can't breed without a male *cough* all I have is a healthy young randy nubile female harem for one lucky humulo-suitor.

Bizier we need you step up your hop campaign BTW mate. I only read thru that thread last night. I love the idea and it really is a worth while pursuit. Had much luck yet? I see someone was offering seeds?

Cheers

Chappo

 

[tcraig20]

So, what is "our" pumpkin ale .. what is native to Australia that we can use in a a brew as a style ?

Macadamia nuts. They are the only Australian foodstuff grown on any real commercial scale.

Hmmm... Aussie Frangelico... but that would be another thread!

 

[jayse]

Jayse, Tony, Josh and Adamt,
I agree that a style needs to be defined and then the recipes will flow. I see gaps currently in the style guidelines that a distinctly Australian beer could sit:

1. Australian Bitter Ale
2. Australian Porter
3. Australian Amber
4. Australian Pils
5. Australian Pale Ale
6. Australian IPA

The last three IMO is were the glaring holes are that I know we can work on.

Toughts, comments?

I think your thinking on the same lines as me now, although I think this thread has two very different sides, those talking about basically inventing a style on the spot one of which has not been brewed before and as lovely as brewing in your thongs and filtering through some merino wool might be that style isn't gunna take off.

For this style I would say bitter, amber, pale and even IPA would all be in the same catergory with broad guidelines that covers beers that losely fit american pale and amber plus english bitter and pale but the hop character is more like new zealand and australian varieties such as bsaaz, dsaaz, NS and galaxy etc.
The style is fairly well balanced, commercial example could/would be to name a few of the top of my head, hargraeves hill ESB, Macs sazzy red, stone and wood draught, brewboys maiden ale, holegate Mt mac, white rabbit, gippsland gold, mildura storm, hop thief, bright ale, wicked elf pale, nirvana and the list is nearly endless and it is broad.

So the style is there it is being brewed yeah some may fit APA alright also and some may fit bitter OK but its a local style of the beers that are being brewed.
This is real its happening its not some crazy homebrew forum idea, its a new evolving style.

 

[Supra-Jim]

So, what is "our" pumpkin ale .. what is native to Australia that we can use in a a brew as a style ?

That's a tough one. We've got plenty of unique bush spices and berries and such, however you would struggle to describe these as mainstream, as they're really only starting to appear in shops/fancy restaurants now. Where as pumpkin/sweet potato is pretty widely accepted/appreciated across America.

Kangeroo Stew Stout? Can't imagine that one getting popular quickly.

I do like the idea of using wheat, but not a wheat beer.

Cheers SJ

 

[FNQ Bunyip]

like the sound of Tonys Iron bark smoked malt ,,, I'm a smoked malt fan ..

what about Wattle seeds , Lemon Myrtell (sp), Eucaliptus leaves...

salt bush & Fort Bourke gypsum, for water chemistry

cheers

 

[bconnery]

Macadamia nuts. They are the only Australian foodstuff grown on any real commercial scale.

Hmmm... Aussie Frangelico... but that would be another thread!

Holgates latest brown ale is apparently a macadamia nut brown. Haven't tasted it yet but there you go, it's already been done...

 

[chappo1970]

<snip>...I think your thinking on the same lines as me now....

I am and I am starting to see your original reference points. I agree that the style should also support the NZ hop varieties as they are not only from our neck of the woods, so to speak, but also a major importer and hop influence here in Oz are they not? NZ hops also have a character that is subtly different from Yank hops IMO.

Chappo

 

[Bizier]

I see someone was offering seeds?

Cheers Chappo,

I just had a 'special' moment where I couldn't find my own thread with a google search...

 

[peted27]

like the sound of Tonys Iron bark smoked malt ,,, I'm a smoked malt fan ..

what about Wattle seeds , Lemon Myrtell (sp), Eucaliptus leaves...

salt bush & Fort Bourke gypsum, for water chemistry

cheers

mmmm Eucaliptus leaves, they smell tasty. anyone tried chucking this in as a hop addition??

 

[PostModern]

mmmm Eucaliptus leaves, they smell tasty. anyone tried chucking this in as a hop addition??

Apart from shuddering at the thought of making beer that tastes like Anticol, I found this on the web:

Poisonous Part of Eucalyptus:
Leaves, bark.
Symptoms :
Nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, coma. Skin redness, irritation, and burning from handling leaves and bark. Eucalyptus oil is extremely toxic if eaten.
Toxic Principle:
Eucalyptus oil and cyanogenic glycoside.
Severity:
TOXIC ONLY IF LARGE QUANTITIES EATEN. SKIN IRRITATION MINOR, OR LASTING ONLY FOR A FEW MINUTES.

Adds a whole new meaning to the shout question, "What's your poison?"

 

[peted27]

Apart from making beer that tastes like Anticol, I found this on the web:



Adds a whole new meaning to the shout question, "What's your poison?"

takes care of that idea

edit:

ive eaten thousands of these (falvoured with Eucalyptus Oil) http://www.candystore.com.au/product.php?id=10&cat_id=5 and am still here to tell the story... so cant be that bad

 

[Mercs Own]

A uniquely Aussie style???? you mean like this http://stoneandwood.com.au/blog/draught-ale/

Another unique style that comes to mind is American Wheat beer - it has wheat in it but doesnt use a wheat yeast to ferment. They use an ale yeast so doesnt that make it an Ale, or a pale ale (but not of course an American Pale Ale) but it is not a wheat beer in my mind.

"American wheat beer is a brand new style, invented by specialty brewers in the United States only about 10 years ago. It may even stretch the definition of "style," for nowhere is the creativity and diversity of America's craft brewers better displayed than in the new wheat beers.

American wheat beer does not use the traditional German weizenbier/weissbier yeast. The whole point of American wheat beer is to avoid the typical spicy/phenolic character of German wheat beers, which many brewers and beer drinkers find objectionable or unsaleable. Most micro and pub brewers use a conventional ale yeast, but doubtless there are bottom-fermented versions in use."

Uniquely Australian - VB, Fosters, Tooheys New, Tooheys Old, Emu Bitter, Coopers Ale etc they are already undique to Australia are they not? Stone and Wood Draughts seems to me to have been designed to be something a little different and therfore unique.

It may be possible to make something uniquely Australian (Barons Wattle Seed ale) but I would hate to see a style created that is similar to the American Wheat which to me is not a unique style at all - we all make ales with plenty of wheat malt and ale yeast and those who started doing this 15 years ago didnt even know they were brewing a uniquely american style??!??

How about a witchety grub wheat using, BB, Aussie hops, Aussie rice and a lager yeast at an ale temp that would be unique?

The point is what are we already making that is unique to us?

I may be in a slightly cynical mood as I am out of work - time to get brewing.

 

[PostModern]

This bit:

Nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, coma.

reminds me of my local pub. Maybe they have a secret eucalyptus beer on tap out the back?

 

[Bizier]

A uniquely Aussie style???? you mean like this http://stoneandwood.com.au/blog/draught-ale/

I think you are near spot on here Mr. Merc.
I thought that this beer nailed an ethereal Australian 'vibe', even if it did not particularly appeal to my sensibilities.

 

[winkle]

It may be possible to make something uniquely Australian (Barons Wattle Seed ale)

Rosella wit (for want of a better name) coming soon to a hogshead brewery near you
Hopefully I can get the fruit for less than $10 a kg (effing Toowong prices) - I'm growing my own next year.

 

[Bizier]

Rosella wit (for want of a better name) coming soon to a hogshead brewery near you

How do you plan on getting a Rosella in your mashtun?

 

[winkle]

How do you plan on getting a Rosella in your mashtun?

They follow the grain in. <_<

 

[Fatgodzilla]

1.A uniquely Aussie style???? you mean like this http://stoneandwood.com.au/blog/draught-ale/


2. American wheat beer does not use the traditional German weizenbier/weissbier yeast. The whole point of American wheat beer is to avoid the typical spicy/phenolic character of German wheat beers, which many brewers and beer drinkers find objectionable or unsaleable. Most micro and pub brewers use a conventional ale yeast, but doubtless there are bottom-fermented versions in use."



3. I may be in a slightly cynical mood as I am out of work - time to get brewing.

Three interesting points from MO.

1. I like the usage of malted and unmalted grains in the stone & wood blurb. If we are to have a "new" and "unique" style, we need to think outside the square on ingredients. Forget rosellas, seagulls and wattle - whilst all plentiful, they are not commercially available in numbers to warrant thinking about. But there must be something ..

2. American wheat is a style through adjustment of an old recipe adapted to suit a new market. I have made a number of wheat based more on the american style than european (remember my dark american wheat that used Wyeast scottish ale in a past case swap). Maybe the unique australian concept beer will also be a major variation on an existing beer.

3. Didn't you have a member of your family that told you to forget acting and get a real job ?

 

[tcraig20]

Three interesting points from MO.

1. I like the usage of malted and unmalted grains in the stone & wood blurb. If we are to have a "new" and "unique" style, we need to think outside the square on ingredients.

Stone and wood draught is sort of where this all started from (post 9). Im not sure that you could call it a unique 'style' of beer or not.

Ive had this before, and its a decent enough drop. Quite thin, which you'd expect from Aussie beer. I didnt really pick up the wheat, or the unmalted grain (although my palate is probably not sophisticated enough to recognise unmalted grain).

What really sets it apart from the macros is that it has flavour and aroma. I was very pleasantly suprised when I placed the first schooner under my nose caught a strong wiff of beautiful hop aroma.

I agree it doesnt really fit with the 'low aroma' beers typical of Australia, but is it really a new 'style'?

 

[PostModern]

Stone and wood draught is sort of where this all started from (post 9). Im not sure that you could call it a unique 'style' of beer or not.

Ive had this before, and its a decent enough drop. Quite thin, which you'd expect from Aussie beer. I didnt really pick up the wheat, or the unmalted grain (although my palate is probably not sophisticated enough to recognise unmalted grain).

What really sets it apart from the macros is that it has flavour and aroma. I was very pleasantly suprised when I placed the first schooner under my nose caught a strong wiff of beautiful hop aroma.

I agree it doesnt really fit with the 'low aroma' beers typical of Australia, but is it really a new 'style'?

Galaxy hops will do that. Hit you with their presence, and they're not an unpleasant hop. Thing is, a lot of micros are using Galaxy now, which is not a bad thing in some ways, but it does mean that many many local beers have the same hop profile.

I haven't tried Stone and Wood yet. Would love to, tho.

 

[KingPython]

Belgians use candi syrup, Australians use cane sugar so it should be in it's part of our history.
Bottle conditioned. Pale malts. Easily drinkable for our hot weather.
Using readily available ingredients it would be an Australian Pale Ale. Moderate use of sugar, pale malts, moderate hop bitterness, moderate hop aroma, moderate maltiness.
A bit boring though. It's set apart from other pale ales by it's high use of sugar and new age Australian hops.

 

[jayse]

A uniquely Aussie style???? you mean like this http://stoneandwood.com.au/blog/draught-ale/


The point is what are we already making that is unique to us?

These have been my exact points aswell but for the most part has fell on deaf ears with people claiming this brew should be something no one has brewed yet and made out of the arse of grandpa's gardening pants and other unique australian ingredients.

My idea is to set out some guidelines which discribe these new beers being brewed by everyone.

Belgians use candi syrup, Australians use cane sugar so it should be in it's part of our history.
Bottle conditioned. Pale malts. Easily drinkable for our hot weather.
Using readily available ingredients it would be an Australian Pale Ale. Moderate use of sugar, pale malts, moderate hop bitterness, moderate hop aroma, moderate maltiness.
A bit boring though. It's set apart from other pale ales by it's high use of sugar and new age Australian hops.

I disagree, these beers are craftbrewed styles already being made by microbrewers and homebrewers and no such examples use sugar and most have more hop character than that. I don't know of a single one which is simply a aussie sparkling ale with a little bit more pleasant hop character, maybe beechworth pale, but again that is a craftbrewed style not simply a thin swill pale.
The style can have more malt character and nearly always has more malt character than a standard aussie pale ale.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

who the hell says there has to be THE Australian style?? Why cant there be a few?

Fair enough a candidate will, or might even already be, emerge from the commercial examples - but why cant someone try to envisage what a beer that was "Australian" by character and ingredient might be? Think it up, brew it, tell people how great it is and if they brew it and agree -- maybe it becomes popular enough to deserve an official style designation one day.

I'm for an Aussie wheat, light to med body and bitterness with Aussie or NZ hop character. Coopers or similar yeast.

That keeps the common features of the current reasonably unique aussie beers - and also the features of the beers that are actually popular with the majority of Australians - makes it a beer appropriate for the local climate - as well as using ingredients that are if not uniquely, certainly typically Australian.

I actually think that we have a better chance of inventing something on spec. I personally don't notice anything particularly unique emerging about most of the Micro brewed beers I taste - they are mostly well within what I would consider to be the existing styles of beer, usually English, American or Aussie pale ales - recently that might be a little different because so many of them are using Galaxy.

I love micro brewed beer - but to be honest there are bugger all of them doing anything much that could be considered new or different. Its still exciting when one of the local guys breaks away from the Pale Ale-Stout/Porter-Hefe trio and brews a belgian or something. Micros who have brewed something daring or unique and also actually good - are pretty thin on the ground. Certainly not common enough to be developing any sort of an ongoing theme.

IMO if we get a new genuinely Aussie style - it'll emerge from the less constrained ranks of homebrewers

 

[Wardhog]

I was thinking the same thing myself, TB.

Next brew is going to be an invention. All Aussie malts (sod the sugar), Galaxy at 60 and POR at 15 to high 20s IBU.

-No hop aroma, just malt
-High 4 ABV, about 4.8 will be good
-All crystal malts to be centered around 50-75 Lovibond
-Light fruitiness remains from the Galaxy, no trace of anything from the yeast (US-05 or a lager yeast)

I'm drooling just thinking about this. It's not complete yet, I have to think about a few more things, but it will certainly be a beer to drink rather than judge.

 

[flattop]

It would be good to brew a style that worked for us... POR is a must, has to be drunk cold i mean COLD on a hot day, you have to hum working class man while brewing it in a blue truckies singlet to get the right flavor profile....

Seriously though, i guess what we are really known for here is middle of the range megaswill lagers (thinking blue cans)

 

[chappo1970]

who the hell says there has to be THE Australian style?? Why cant there be a few?

Fair enough a candidate will, or might even already be, emerge from the commercial examples - but why cant someone try to envisage what a beer that was "Australian" by character and ingredient might be? Think it up, brew it, tell people how great it is and if they brew it and agree -- maybe it becomes popular enough to deserve an official style designation one day.

I'm for an Aussie wheat, light to med body and bitterness with Aussie or NZ hop character. Coopers or similar yeast.

That keeps the common features of the current reasonably unique aussie beers - and also the features of the beers that are actually popular with the majority of Australians - makes it a beer appropriate for the local climate - as well as using ingredients that are if not uniquely, certainly typically Australian.

I actually think that we have a better chance of inventing something on spec. I personally don't notice anything particularly unique emerging about most of the Micro brewed beers I taste - they are mostly well within what I would consider to be the existing styles of beer, usually English, American or Aussie pale ales - recently that might be a little different because so many of them are using Galaxy.

I love micro brewed beer - but to be honest there are bugger all of them doing anything much that could be considered new or different. Its still exciting when one of the local guys breaks away from the Pale Ale-Stout/Porter-Hefe trio and brews a belgian or something. Micros who have brewed something daring or unique and also actually good - are pretty thin on the ground. Certainly not common enough to be developing any sort of an ongoing theme.

IMO if we get a new genuinely Aussie style - it'll emerge from the less constrained ranks of homebrewers

TB I do like the way you think outside the square and totally agree.

<Chappo hops up on the soapbox>
From my stance on this subject I really do believe more than any one entity, we the craft brewers of Australia, have the ability to not only to dream up a new style or three but also push it through to become an accepted Unique Aussie style. It may even go main stream but that not the object of the exercise by any stretch of the imagination. I don't believe commercial success is the ultimate measure and yard stick for the acceptance of a style. We are!

As for getting traction and acceptance. Well that needs to come from us as craft brewers. The more we accept a certain style and that style starts being brewed by us craft brewers and entered into competitions the style itself will hopefully become the norm. There are plenty of Club commitee members and Judges on this forum that could help, if they saw the need or felt strong enough, to make this happen make it become a reality rather than being a dream.

Australia is a big beer drinking nation and to only have a handful of styles considered as being Australian I find riddiculous and to be honest embarassing. Seriously those style put forward as Asutralian are IMHO, well boring, flat and completely uninspired from an era that didn't have craft brewing as a main stream hobby. I for one would like to see this forum and it's members push the boundaries of style because we DO have the brains trust, we DO have the ability and we can effect change even if it is just at our level.

I do believe it is more than possible and do-able.
<Chappo hops down off the soapbox>

I was thinking the same thing myself, TB.

Next brew is going to be an invention. All Aussie malts (sod the sugar), Galaxy at 60 and POR at 15 to high 20s IBU.

-No hop aroma, just malt
-High 4 ABV, about 4.8 will be good
-All crystal malts to be centered around 50-75 Lovibond
-Light fruitiness remains from the Galaxy, no trace of anything from the yeast (US-05 or a lager yeast)

I'm drooling just thinking about this. It's not complete yet, I have to think about a few more things, but it will certainly be a beer to drink rather than judge.

I like it especially the lager yeast. I do think it needs to clean and let the flavours and aromas to come thru and shine.


Cheers

Chappo

 

[marlow_coates]

"Four score and seven years ago....."

Nice Chappo, I agree, just look at recent additions to styles accepted at competitions in recent years.

Will put some time and thought into how I am going to rumble up something Aussie inspired as of next week.

Marlow

 

[Barry]

I have made two beers recently. Inspired by the Americans ability to take a style and add their influence (eg American IPA, APA). First is a brown ale, grain bill like an American brown ale but with WLP009 Aussie ale yeast hopped with POR and Galaxy to 40IBU with lots of flavour and aroma. An uncommon mix of esters, hops and dark malts (Americans don't seem to appreciate esters in anything besides wheat and Belgian beers).
The second is an attempt at an Aussie IPA. Basically make a sparkling ale with OG 1.065, 50 IBU, lots of POR and especially Galaxy (still in the fermenter, needs to be dry hopped with galaxy).
Having new Australian hops such as Galaxy gives more freedom to be creative.
Just some ideas to kick around.

 

[jonocarroll]

<Chappo hops up on the soapbox>

I'll add my $0.02 while I have a spare minute (edit: okay... that took a while);

What makes an 'English Beer' English - does it have tea and scones in it?

What makes a 'German Beer' German - is it particularly productive?

I doubt that when Pilsners were being created people thought 'what would be particularly Bavarian about this?' - they were using a new technique (lagering), and that gave the beers a distinct character. English beers aren't low carbonated because the creamy head reminds them of fog. I find it odd to try to force the idea of a (new) 'Australian Beer Style' by randomly introducing 'Australian... things'.

Apart from the argument of 'why does Australia even need a style?' - a respectable style should come about naturally, and be identified as 'Australian' because that's where it originated - why should you not be considering a large proportion of the English ingredients? A style that comes about naturally in Australia will probably have English roots.

As for Australians being big beer drinkers, that's a bit of a stretch. Other countries are proud of their world-class beers, exported and respected globally. As Aussies we (as in, the general population) seem to be overly proud of the mainstream swill produced for local consumption, but you wouldn't put it out to play with the big boys. Sure, craft brewing is taking off in a big way, but it's still very much a minority, and ignored by most of the population. The term 'craft-brew' is actually known throughout America, and these beers are sought-after, not just stumbled upon.

Now I'm all for craft-brewing, but I think this is where you'll need to look if you're ever going to see something 'Australian'. Even then, any 'new' style will likely fit somewhere in between BJCP styles, so it will be 'a bit of English with American notes', or whatever. As homebrewers we can play around with new techniques - and I believe that this is where those techniques will be developed - but those techniques will need to be picked up by micros before they get any good recognition.

I'm not trying to (entirely) discourage you, but rather make you think about 'what exactly it is that you're trying to do.' Although you'll likely make something quite nice with an interesting range of ingredients (and that's a great achievement) I think if you want to make 'a new style' you'll need to start looking into turning the entire process on it's head, and producing a new technique that gives a beer a distinct quality. Think what decoctions did for German beers. That may or may not come about by random trial and error, but education (one of the main reasons many people frequent this forum) is a great place to start.

 

[eamonnfoley]

I would imagine that eventually a new style is going to "fall out" of all the activity/recipes on Aussiehomebrewer. From there, new breweries are going to take it up and bang - we have a new style. But an aussie style needs aussie ingredients (grain & hops) and probably a unique yeast strain (which we already have one in coopers). One of our strengths is decent quality malt, so maybe we need a way to showcase that in a beer style.

Has anyone taken the spakling ale concept any further in a way that works well? I.e. different hops/grain ?