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The NEIPA thread

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Schikitar

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You could always throw a little CaCl in a glass with it (and then in the keg if it works for you) to help with the mouthfeel.
I think I'll try and deal with the CaCl a little better in the blend batch (the original I was at 2:1 ratio), I just don't want to expose the current brew to O2 if I can avoid it. I will give it a go in a glass, just got to do some math to work out the amount relative to the glass.

I would personally either halve or get rid of the FWH altogether and move the IBUs to a late/whirlpool addition.
Yep, I think the FWH is what stuffed it, I won't do that again for this style..

..
 

Dan Pratt

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Yep, I think the FWH is what stuffed it, I won't do that again for this style..

..
Ive done FWH on many a NEIPA and that has not been of any issue for me so doubting its the cause.

Wondering how old the Azzaca hops are?
 

damohb

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Hey why no dry hop during high krausen ferment for biotransformation process of hops which is one of the methods for this style?

Also, water , what did you do with it?
Mainly because I wanted to harvest the yeast before dry hopping. Even with the soft crash there was probably still enough yeast left behind for some biotransformation of sorts, there was certainly some refermentation even after the 2nd DH

Water profile was roughly 65 Ca, 10 Mg, 50 Na, 150 Cl, 85 SO4 and mash pH of 5.3
 

Ferg

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I think I'll try and deal with the CaCl a little better in the blend batch (the original I was at 2:1 ratio), I just don't want to expose the current brew to O2 if I can avoid it. I will give it a go in a glass, just got to do some math to work out the amount relative to the glass.


Yep, I think the FWH is what stuffed it, I won't do that again for this style..

..
I've found my NEIPA beers benefit from a decent cold crash / conditioning. Early on they can taste real bitter (hop burn) as you are literally drinking hops! Give it a while to see if it calms down.
 

goatchop41

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Yep, I think the FWH is what stuffed it, I won't do that again for this style....
If it's not just bitterness from hop burn, then you could experiment with a batch that has no early hops, then another with about half of the early IBUs that you had this time (so ~10 IBUs from FWH)
 

fdsaasdf

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For NEIPAs my only hop additions are at whirlpool and yeast pitch, to avoid over-bittering and oxidisation.
 

Schikitar

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Ive done FWH on many a NEIPA and that has not been of any issue for me so doubting its the cause.

Wondering how old the Azzaca hops are?
Well the issue is I think I over did it slightly, I used 50g of Ahtanum for FWH and in thinking back, after the boil/whirlpool I took a sample and it tasted about where I would want an approachable IPA. It wasn't until after the first dry hop that my head was getting blown off and I attributed that all the hop particulates in suspension. All the hops were from 2017 crops which I bought back in June (so not as fresh as I'd normally like I suppose).

I've found my NEIPA beers benefit from a decent cold crash / conditioning. Early on they can taste real bitter (hop burn) as you are literally drinking hops! Give it a while to see if it calms down.
I crash chilled for about a week at 0.5 degrees before transferring to the keg. It definitely helped but it's still just a little too much for the style I think, not undrinkable just a little extra hence why I want to dilute the bitterness with something far less punchy but yet fruity..

I think all up this was my first crack and rather than following a tried and tested recipe I went rogue (a bad habit of mine). I kinda got to stick with this now so thinking I might brew again using the same malt bill and then maybe single hop it with maybe El Dorado..??
 

Dan Pratt

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Making a NEIPA this weekend for the AFL GF day

OG 1060
FG 1010
ABV 6.5%
IBU 31
EBC 7
18L Vol in FV

Water 2:1 Chloride to Sulfate, pH approx 5.4 - Mashed at 64c/30min, 68c/30mins, 78c/15mins

60% Weyermann Pilsner
20% Floor Malted Wheat
20% Aldi Oats

60min Boil
@ 30mins - Magnum = 20ibu
@ WP 56g Galaxy = 5ibu
@ WP 56g Nelson Sav = 5ibu

Chill to 22c with IC and ferment with Lallemand New England IPA Yeast @ 21c

Dry Hop 1 @ High Krausen ( Bio-transformation ) = 84g Galaxy / Nelson Sav
Dry Hop 2 @ Post Ferment = 84g Galaxy / Nelson Sav
 

goatchop41

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Chill to 22c with IC and ferment with Lallemand New England IPA Yeast @ 21c
I am yet to hear anything remotely good about this yeast, at least in terms of making a NEIPA, comparative to liquid yeasts. I've even heard of people preferring S04 to it.
 

Dan Pratt

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I am yet to hear anything remotely good about this yeast, at least in terms of making a NEIPA, comparative to liquid yeasts. I've even heard of people preferring S04 to it.
I bought 2 packets and was not overly impressed by its outcome, found BRY97 does better. However that was at 19c, so this one will be at 21c and see if I get some of the fermentation esters coming through and will report back.

looking at the danstar site its shows BRY97 higher % than this strain, go figure

https://www.lallemandbrewing.com/wp...bestpractices-Biotransformation-digital-1.pdf
 

koshari

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I prefer to drink beer, rather than hop juice.

I have tasted a whole range of these at my brewclub, and can't for the life of me see the attraction in them. For me, they are totally unbalanced.
each to their own, i love hoppiness, but then again i drink red whine with chicken and fish.
 

Schikitar

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So I bought a Balter XPA last night and 50/50 it with my bitter NEIPA in a big glass - much better, the wife said "oh yeah, I can drink that now" which is effectively a go-ahead for me to brew what I'm calling "The Fixxxer" for blending across two kegs. It will be 0 IBU's (technically, but perceived there will still be some bitterness), I'll be looking to maintain body with a tried and tested Oatmeal XPA recipe of mine whilst trying to get some more fruity/tropical flavour and aroma in there. I just need to figure out what hops and the schedule to use. I'm wary of Galaxy, the NEIPA as it stands is already leaning too far towards earthy/grassy - just wonder if anyone has any suggestions? I still have Azacca, Idaho 7 and some Mosaic on hand from the NEIPA but not sure if I should use those again or not..

Cheers!
 

Stressfest

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Fairly new to the craft but threw together this tasty number a few months back, would definitely brew again.

20L Batch, Mashed 75 min @68, 10 Min Mashout @76
Wyeast London III, 1L Starter, OG 1.062, FG 1.019

4KG Pale 2 Row
600g Oats
500g Wheat
150g Crystal 60L

25g Citra Boil 10 Min
25g Galaxy Boil 10 Min

37g Citra Whirlpool 90C for 15 Mins
37g Galaxy Whirlpool 90C for 15 Mins
37g Mosaic Whirlpool 90C for 15 Mins

37g Galaxy Dry Hop 7 Days
25g Citra Dry Hop 7 Days
25g Mosaic Dry Hop 7 Days

37g Galaxy Dry Hop 3 Days
31g Citra Dry Hop 3 Days
25g Mosaic Dry Hop 3 Days

Batch size tweaked to the quantity of hops I had on hand, more or less. Beer turned out great \o/
 

Binetti

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I have been working with this water profile for NEIPAs recently, which I derived from Brew n Grow of Minnesota.
NEIPA CA 62 Mg 2 Na 8 CL 99 SO4 13 Cl/SO4 7.62 (yes, it's crazy malty)
Obviously, it depends on your starting water but for my unfiltered tap, it's not disappointing.
Key difference from a West Coast IPA would be very low SO4, meaning the malt comes through and any hops are low on bitterness (even if you add some for bittering).

Regarding Dry Hopping, there is some debate about the biotransformation approach, with some people saying the ongoing fermentation & CO2 can scrub out the hop aromas.
In any case, I would definitely go with a 2-stage dry hop.
 

goatchop41

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I have been working with this water profile for NEIPAs recently, which I derived from Brew n Grow of Minnesota.
NEIPA CA 62 Mg 2 Na 8 CL 99 SO4 13 Cl/SO4 7.62 (yes, it's crazy malty)
Obviously, it depends on your starting water but for my unfiltered tap, it's not disappointing.
Key difference from a West Coast IPA would be very low SO4, meaning the malt comes through and any hops are low on bitterness (even if you add some for bittering).
I've been pushing mine up to around 50ish for the SO4 and 200ish for the Cl. I have found that this gives the hops a little bit of an accentuation, without bringing out too much bitterness, whilst still giving the big, soft mouthfeel that I'm after.

Regarding Dry Hopping, there is some debate about the biotransformation approach, with some people saying the ongoing fermentation & CO2 can scrub out the hop aromas.
In any case, I would definitely go with a 2-stage dry hop.
Again, just personal experience here, but I wouldn't worry too much. I've done a few with double dry hopping, and a few with one dry hop that is added when the yeast is pitched - I haven't been able to tell any difference (albeit in completely unblinded tasting which is always prone to some sort of bias)
 

Schikitar

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Good selection of hops there!

This is the grain bill I recently used which gave me a really orange-juicy looking NEIPA in the glass..
IMG_20191011_183500_803.jpg
72% Maris Otter
9% Toffee Malt
8% Rolled Oats
8% Wheat Malt
3% CaraMunich II

I used London Fog Ale WLP066 for the ferment, it's a beast! Weeks on and the beer is still looking and tasting great but I stuffed the hop schedule the first time round (so bitter!) and had to brew another version at 0 IBUs to blend with the first one. I think building your recipe to 20-30 IBUs max is plenty, a lot of hop particulates can stay in suspension and the perceived bitterness (hop burn) can really undo a great NEIPA if you push it too far..

 

Schikitar

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What IBUs did the first one come in at?
Honestly, according to the recipe I 'designed' (using that term loosely) it was supposed to be about 43 IBUs but it tasted like 143 IBUs. I nearly fell over when I had my first taste test and I will attribute it to the completely unnecessary FWH addition. I don't think this style requires any boil additions, on the second batch I didn't add any hops until whirlpool at ~66 degrees, from there I followed the same dry hop schedule. That second batch still had some bitterness just from those additions, fortunately nothing harsh and once I blended the two I reckon it puts it in the 50-60 IBU range, still a little on the high side for the style. Pretty happy with the malt profile and I pushed the calcium chloride in the water. Even though the London Fog Ale was a beast I think I'd use something cleaner that drops out next time..
 
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