Style Of The Week 22/11/06 - Witbier

[Steve]

If you really can't or really don't want to use liquid, and it is easily the best choice for this style, t58 is a backup option.
Mind you, Chad from this forum has been placing very well in comps with his wit, and it used k-97... So the use of raw wheat and appropriate spice levels would appear to be the most important aspect...

I an also say that WLP550 works quite nicely, if you are interested in a more multi-purpose yeast for reuse reasons...
But a specialty wit yeast would be the best choice...

Thanks bc - ive only made one wit before and that was with T58. It turned out well.
Cheers
Steve

 

[Tony]

OK..... i have plans to make a Belgian Witbier.

Im growing my own coriander seeds in the garden and they are starting to seed which is tops.

I have been thinking o unmalted wheat. This "sot white wheat" they speak about.

Can i just use plain old unmalted wheat. i can get it cheap at the local Ag store that sells all that sort o thing. and some oats.

It would all go through through the mill no worries and mized in with some pils malt would possibly work. May need some rice gulls too.

anyway.... back to the coriander seeds. I cant wait to harvest them. Im going to get hunderds o them

I am making a big batch o bitter orange marmalade this weekend with 30% cumquats so will scoop a bit o this in or the orange hit.

anyway....... what is everyones opinion on unmalted wheat?

Im interested to know.

cheers

 

[tangent]

unmalted wheat is great Tony.
you get that fresh smell when you mill it, so you know it's all good
I'd much rather use that than commercial flour.

 

[Tony]

I will get some resh wheat and oats and give it a try with some malted wheat and pils malt. should be nice.

Shame to have to buy an expensive liquid yeast or the one brew. Does anyone have a culture i could borow a bit. I will pay postage

cheers

 

[amita]

I will get some resh wheat and oats and give it a try with some malted wheat and pils malt. should be nice.

Shame to have to buy an expensive liquid yeast or the one brew. Does anyone have a culture i could borow a bit. I will pay postage

cheers

Hi Tony, cant help but laugh when I read your mail written with *ucked keyboard and looking at your photo I wonder if you speak like you write????

anyway cant help you with the wheat question but regarding the harvest of your corriander seeds,my partner harvests them by putting the whole plant in a big brown paper bag and wait for the seeds to dry and fall of the stalks, just shake the bag and collect the seeds in the bottom.

Bottled my Wit 2 weeks ago and am surprised to find that the taste has changed considerably, the orange has gone to the background, as well as the corriander , its almost like its a different beer, will wait few more weeks and hope it will come back,did use wyeast Belgian Wit, went of like a rocket after I made a starter for a 50 liter batch.

good luck,
cheers amita

PS dont think my culture will survive shipping from country WA :unsure:

 

[Tony]

yeah thats what i was going to do. I googled it. It said when hal the seeds start to turn brown to cut them o and hang them in bags to catch the seeds as they dry and drop.

And as or my picture.... its amazing how many AHB people i meet that say...... you look nothing like your avatar

click on my mane or a pic o the real me

cheers

PS..... i sent a WLP833 yeast culture in a whitelabs vial to Ash in perth and it survived the trip

 

[Screwtop]

OK..... i have plans to make a Belgian Witbier.

Im growing my own coriander seeds in the garden and they are starting to seed which is tops.

I have been thinking o unmalted wheat. This "sot white wheat" they speak about.

Can i just use plain old unmalted wheat. i can get it cheap at the local Ag store that sells all that sort o thing. and some oats.

It would all go through through the mill no worries and mized in with some pils malt would possibly work. May need some rice gulls too.

anyway.... back to the coriander seeds. I cant wait to harvest them. Im going to get hunderds o them

I am making a big batch o bitter orange marmalade this weekend with 30% cumquats so will scoop a bit o this in or the orange hit.

anyway....... what is everyones opinion on unmalted wheat?

Im interested to know.

cheers

Geez Tony the Coriander looks happy, I wait for the flowers to die off then cut off the seed heads and put them in paper bags in the shed to dry. Crushed fresh seeds explode with citrus aroma, keep some to plant again next year to keep it going. I prefer Torrified wheat easier on the sparge. K97 makes great Wit and it's cheap.

Screwy

 

[Tony]

YEah screwey, its happy alright. You should have seen it when it was all upright. We have had about 6 inches o rain recently (tipped 72mm out o the rain guage thismorning orm the last couple o days) and the water weighed it all down and it layed down over the lawn. I acually lost a third o it to this as it all died underneath and i had to rip some out because it was killing my basil plants, and i wasnt going to stand or that.

Im gowing them mysel because i really want the seeds to be resh when i use them. I squshed a green one today and it smelt great.

K97 hey.... i have a pack o it in the ridge. what temp do you use it at?

cheers

 

[Screwtop]

YEah screwey, its happy alright. You should have seen it when it was all upright. We have had about 6 inches o rain recently (tipped 72mm out o the rain guage thismorning orm the last couple o days) and the water weighed it all down and it layed down over the lawn. I acually lost a third o it to this as it all died underneath and i had to rip some out because it was killing my basil plants, and i wasnt going to stand or that.

Im gowing them mysel because i really want the seeds to be resh when i use them. I squshed a green one today and it smelt great.

K97 hey.... i have a pack o it in the ridge. what temp do you use it at?

cheers

Recently made Chad's Wit, it was the best home brew examply I've ever tasted. Fermented with 2 sachets of K97 @ 18C from 1.044 to 1.008 in 12 days.

Screwy

 

[dig]

I'm on the raw wheat band wagon at the moment. Back in my MSB days, we used to use raw wheat in a wit by simply adding it whole to the mill. Aaaw man, it sounded like ball bearings being crushed.

I've punched out about ten wits recently using raw but torrified (puffed) wheat. Interesting stuff. Lends a definite 'breakfast cereal' character to the beer rather than a fresh wheatiness.

On Monday, I'll be punching out another pair, this time employing raw rolled wheat. It does taste deliciously fresh and wheatie and I hope that characters carries over into the finished beer. I've finally tracked down some dried bitter orange peel too which will save me an hour of zesting before each brew day.

 

[reVoxAHB]

Great thread guys.. I've learned a lot. Cheers Stuster for the initial post with some fantastic links.. just listed to the BBR session :super:

In all of this information, no one has mentioned toasting your corriander or cumin seed before crushing. Would this be advised? I know a quick 30 seconds in a hot dry pan can do wonders for dried spice (seed or powder).. was thinking this can only help to bring out the spice, certainly awaken it.

I'll be using Indian corriander and cumin seed.

Cheers,
reVox

 

[sponge]

I'm not sure about beer making, but it sure works in cooking. Id be assuming that it would only do the beer a world of good.


Sponge

 

[Weizguy]

I think that you don't need any toasted spice flavour in this style, but hey, suck it and see. It could be fantastic.
However, maybe there's a reason that the original Belgian brewers do not do it...?

Just my opinion though. If you toast your spices, please report here or in a new toasted Wit thread.

Beerzup
Les

 

[reVoxAHB]

However, maybe there's a reason that the original Belgian brewers do not do it...?

That was my concern, as well. Realistically, I'll have to do a split batch to test this (toast vs. untoast).. or back to back batches (I have a 1kg bag of Indian Coriander and Indian Cumin seed, so at least the adjunct/ingredient will be consistent across batches).

Thanks,
reVox

 

[Fourstar]

I couldnt forsee an issue with 'toasting' the spice, simply warming them would be enough to 'awaken' the aromatics. If you have cooked a curry from scratch before you will know within 10-20 seconds of spices hitting the dry pan (no colour on them yet) they are already perfuming the kitchen. On the other hand when you make asian soups/mastertocks, you simply dump the spices into the broth, no questions asked, they still permiate the liquid with a beautiful spice profile.

Side note, with the K97 yeast. Isnt this a dry German wheat yeast? Does it impart the tartness of a liquid Belgian yeast??

Saf have a S-33 Yeast which is designed for Belgian trappist and wit. Has anyone used this with sucess?

profile below.

A very popular general purpose yeast, displaying both very robust conservation properties and consistent performance. This yeast produces superb flavour profiles and is used for the production of a varied range of top fermented special beers (Belgian type wheat beers, Trappist, etc.). Sedimentation: medium. Final gravity: high.


T-58 is another option, has a peppery/spicy profile. To Style with a Belgian Wit as per the BJCP guidelines.

 

[Snow]

Ok guys, I need some help working this out.

I made a wit yesterday, with 3kg Wyermann pilsener malt and 3kg torrefied wheat. I normally get around 65% efficiency from my system, but this time I got a pathetic 51%

The volume came out perfect, the crush was the same I always use, although I noticed the milling didn't seem to make much of a difference to the torrefied wheat, which was already pretty flat. The sparge went well, with temps around 78-81c. My mash-in liquor to grain ratio was 3L/kg. I did a double batch sparge of equal amounts.

Any thoughts on what the hell went wrong?

Cheers - Snow

 

[Snow]

<Bump> anybody?........ class, anybody?......Bueller?

 

[warrenlw63]

Hey Snow

I'd probably be dubious about Weyermann Pils malt handling such a large non-malt adjunct load with a standard mash.

Generally paranoia dictates I use JW, BB Pils malts when making a wit. Galaxy malt is particularly good in this regard.

Warren -

 

[gap]

I had similar low efficiency using Wey Pils malt in a Wit.

 

[Snow]

Hey Snow

I'd probably be dubious about Weyermann Pils malt handling such a large non-malt adjunct load with a standard mash.

Generally paranoia dictates I use JW, BB Pils malts when making a wit. Galaxy malt is particularly good in this regard.

Warren -

Oh wow - you know it never ocurred to me that the Pils would be the problem! Is Wey Pils generally low in efficiency in all grists, or is just with non-enzymatic grains/adjuncts?

I'm spewing now, as I have 10kg of Galaxy, but I just thought the Wey Pils would go better in the wit. <_<

Cheers - Snow