Show Me You Counter Pressure Bottle Fillers

[warrenlw63]

sits and waits for the fun police to remove zwickels post.

sits and waits for the fun police to remove zwickels post. sits and waits because its so hypnotising. B)

Warren -

 

[KoNG]

counter pressure fill-her

 

[Cracka]

Spose its one way to see if any mods r on line

 

[devo]

Spose its one way to see if any mods r on line

Well they removed my "pissed posting thread" quick smart so I'd be a bit miffed/suprised if they let this one go!!! <_<

 

[Franko]

no, no, I wouldnt like to have a completely automated brewery, otherwise I had to release my "Brauhelfer" (brewing assistant), I wouldnt like.

I prefer to sit down and watch all the manual work gets done:

look at the nice shoes she is wearing

nice kegs :lol:


Franko

 

[troydo]

!! thats great! and your CPF is nice too zwickle!

where do you find these things!! :icon_chickcheers: :beer:

 

[beeroclock]

i wish the backof that keg would be my face :icon_drool2:

 

[Whistlingjack]

I have discussed the following with Zwickel...

If you decide to build a CPBF like he has done, please be sure you construct a barrier to protect yourself from exploding bottles. A fault in the bottle could see you in the emergency department having glass fragments removed from your face. Worst case scenario would have you shopping for guide dogs.

Please be careful...

WJ

 

[schooey]

Worst case scenario would have you shopping for guide dogs.

I'd expect the same result if my wife caught me tuning Zwickels brew assistant too... I wouldn't doubt for a second that she could extract my two good eyes through the third one....

 

[Whistlingjack]

I'd expect the same result if my wife caught me tuning Zwickels brew assistant too... I wouldn't doubt for a second that she could extract my two good eyes through the third one....

WJ

 

[bugwan]

Guys, what are you using as your source of compressed air for the pneumatics?? I presume an air compressor, but what size? I've seen the ones tradies use, but that looks a bit cumbersome and sizeable.

And regarding the pic Zwickel posted, I happened across the same one (plus a full frontal version ) posted on these forums a couple of years back... They've survived the the gaze of the 'fun police'...! Long live the unhygienic cellar-hand.

 

[Zwickel]

Guys, what are you using as your source of compressed air for the pneumatics?? I presume an air compressor, but what size? I've seen the ones tradies use, but that looks a bit cumbersome and sizeable.

bugwan, I have a simpel and cheap air compressor from a building market, oil-free, one cylinder with a 25l-reservoir, max pressure 8bar= 800KPa with pressure regulator.
That compressor is a very handy tool, not only to inflat the tires of our cars, motobikes, bicycles, also to mount/unmount the weels (impact wrench). I use it for varnishing, to impregnate our garden furniture. I use it also as a dry blower for used hoses and the plate chiller, preload kegs with some cleaner in, to clean beerlines and many other opportunities.

Mine is really a cheap on, but its worth each penny and it works since 5 years already without any problems.


To the people they are concerned about the security of the filler:

with that Alu-profiles Ive used, it is easy to install a sliding door at the front of it. just to slide a sheet up and down.

Cheers mates :beer:

edit: in case Id need some compressed air somewhere, for example inflate some tires, Im gonna fill a keg with 800KPa compressed air and take it with me, just as in the pic:

thats really very handy, isnt it?

 

[mudsta]

Zwickel,

That is a sweet filler and sweeter melons on the brew wench!

With regard to you adding a bottle capper I am nearly finished building a semi-auto one myself.
I have a pneumatic & electronic circuit incorporating a pressure switch.
Because I have a pressure switch as the limit i can use different height bottles

I hit the button, the cyclinder extends, until it reaches the top of the bottle.
The pressure in the cyclinder builds up force until it reaches my limit set by pressure switch.
Once reached the cyclinder retracts back ready to go again.

FYI: I found that using a 50 diameter cyclinder (50mm stroke) with 88psi of force (117kg) will not cap a bottle. :blink: It gets almost there but not quite!
I've now got my hands on a 80 diameter cyclinder (301kg @ 88psi), but think a 63 diameter (187kg @ 88psi) would do the job.

EDIT: These figures are to cap screw cap bottles not pop top ones, as screw caps require more force than pop tops.

Cheers,

Mudsta :beerbang:

 

[Zwickel]

Mudsta, thats quite interesting to me, do you have any photos you can show?

I thought already, that I would need a cylinder with more diameter than the filler has. Would you say, that the capper needs also a security chamber to protect from exploding bottles?

If you have one, would you show your electronic circuit diagram?

btw: the cylinder Ive used has a stroke of 180mm, thats enough for all kind of bottles Im gonna use.

Cheers :icon_cheers:

 

[sqyre]

As long as i dont post in this thread the Fun Police will never find it..

OOPS!!! :blink:

Sqyre... :unsure:

EDIT: P.S. Nice work Zwickel and guys... never bottled myself due to it being a pain in the arse(except for case swaps with a carb cap.) but now there is hope..

 

[mudsta]

Zwickel,

Below is my original pneumatic circuit.
I swapped the push button part of the circuit and pressure switch output signal to electronic as that was the parts I dug up second hand.


I have only hooked up the whole circuit quickly and tested it in a '20 second job' timber frame.
I will post photos in a few weeks when I build the proper frame and mount it all.

Referring to your safety question, it is more important to have a guard for this type of capper because if your pressure switch ever fails while the bottle is being capper the ram will continue until full stroke and thus the bottle would be smashed. :excl:

Can you please show me your schematic of your counter pressure filler? I'm going to build one the same but may try to add a double purge/ pre evac.

Cheers,

Mudsta :beerbang:

 

[Zwickel]

Zwickel,

Below is my original pneumatic circuit.
I swapped the push button part of the circuit and pressure switch output signal to electronic as that was the parts I dug up second hand.
View attachment 19260

unfortunately the pic gets not shown if I click on it.

Referring to your safety question, it is more important to have a guard for this type of capper because if your pressure switch ever fails while the bottle is being capper the ram will continue until full stroke and thus the bottle would be smashed. :excl:

hmm...thats a fact I dont understand. Why are you going to limit the pressure by a pressure switch rather than limiting the absolute pressure?
I think, the pressure I need to cap a bottle will also be the max. working pressure.

Can you please show me your schematic of your counter pressure filler? I'm going to build one the same but may try to add a double purge/ pre evac.

okay, I havent done a drawing yet, but soon I will do and post it here.

Thats very interesting to me, you are going to evacuate the bottles prior purge. Thats a fact that seemed very complicated to me, although Id be interested to integrate it in my system.

Im really looking forward for the photos of your gear, Cheers mate :beer:

 

[mudsta]

Zwickel,

Hopefully that pic works better for you.

hmm...thats a fact I dont understand. Why are you going to limit the pressure by a pressure switch rather than limiting the absolute pressure?
I think, the pressure I need to cap a bottle will also be the max. working pressure.

I am using a pressure switch to automatically trigger the valve once the bottle has been capped, if you just limit the system pressure only, you will need to manually switch the valve or set up a limit switch on the ram. Another reason I want to use higher system pressure is I plan to bank more than one capper system together, thus I will use more air.
Contrary to this, once I have set the pressure switch I will wind down the system pressure as a safety measure.

okay, I havent done a drawing yet, but soon I will do and post it here.

I really look forward to having a look at how you have got your circuit set up.

Thats very interesting to me, you are going to evacuate the bottles prior purge. Thats a fact that seemed very complicated to me, although Id be interested to integrate it in my system.

I'm not exactly sure how I'm going to do it, but it may incorporate a PLC or anything else that will do the job. I plan on filling the bottle with Co2, release it, fill and release again, pressurize with Co2 then fill with beer.
If i cant get that to work I will stop the filler just shy of the bottle and get a metered dose of Co2 into the bottle to purge most of the oxygen.

Cheers,

Mudsta :beerbang:

 

[Zwickel]

thanks Mudsta for your explanations.

Today Ive finished the drawing of the circuit; its a little bit a primitive drawing, but Im not a CAD specialist. I think youll understand anyway.



I will try to explain how it works. Apologies in advance for my poor english.

There are only two switches, one is just a open/close switch for the pneumatic. If the switch is open, the head of the filler is in upper position, if the switch is closed, the head is down. So far thats all about the pneumatic.

how to fill a bottle?
It works the same way my manual filler works:

there is one switch with three positions, left to flush the bottle with gas, middle is neutral, nothing is going on, right for the beer flow.

So Im gonna start with the first bottle:
put an empty bottle in
switch the upper switch to lower the head
switch the second switch to the left to open the gas solenoid to blow CO2 into the bottle. At first the needle valve is closed, so the gas pressure in the bottle will rise til max. gas pressure, in my case 1bar=100KPa.
wait for a few seconds, then switch over to beer flow.
Now the beer cannot start to flow, because the pressure inside the bottle is the same as the beer is at.
Open carefully the needle valve and watch how the beer is flowing into the bottle.
Adjust the needle valve to a position the beer rises slowly.
When the beer level is at the neck of the bottle, set the switch to neutral, in the middle position.
Now the pressure inside the bottle drops, because the needle valve is still open and so it will remain over the whole following filling process.
After a few seconds the pressure is down, upper the head an cap the bottle.

For the following bottles you dont need to change the adjustment of the needle valve anymore, leave it a little opened all the time.
Start to flush the bottle. Because the intake of the gas is much higher than the outflow over the needle valve, the pressure inside the bottle will rise
Switch over to beer and so on.....

pooooohhh...I hope its middling understandable

Cheers :beer: