Recipe Help Dunkelweizen

[Sammus]

howdy... didnt really know where to start with this one (palmer doesnt seem to mention wheat beer and mhb is closed ). Anyway, I just plugged in some numbers in beersmith until it told me it was in style (also abiding by the 'max % in recipe guidelines in the grain selection window )

Batch Size: 25.00 L

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Wheat Malt, Ger (3.9 EBC) Grain 57.7 %
1.50 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (3.9 EBC) Grain 28.8 %
0.50 kg Caramel Wheat Malt (90.6 EBC) Grain 9.6 %
0.20 kg Chocolate Wheat Malt (788.0 EBC) Grain 3.8 %
28.30 gm Hallertauer [4.80%] (45 min) Hops 12.2 IBU
28.30 gm Hallertauer [4.80%] (5 min) Hops 2.7 IBU


As far as yeast goes, havent decided, maybe that new brew cellar wb-06 or whatever its called - dunno if ill fork out for a liquid for my first.

Any comments on the recipe? do you have to step wheat beers or will a single infusion be ok?

Cheers

S

 

[GMK]

I think you will need a protien rest and a long mash.
The 1.5kg of Pilsner to 3 kg of wheat is alot of work the enzymes in the Pilsner have to do to convert the starches/protiens in the wheat.

Hope this helps

 

[tangent]

smack it, it puffs up (if your bought it at the right place) you tear the top off and tip it in. is it the smacking the bubble that's so challenging?

don't be a pussy and use a good liquid wheat yeast, you can use it straight from the packet without a starter.

2nd, normally i'd reckon the choc would be too much (most people seem to make chocolate beers) but it's way less in your face than choc barley, so i think that's spot on.

3rd, maybe use 2/3 - 1/2 the cara wheat for my taste.

otherwise, brew away!

looks good.

 

[tangent]

Sorry GMK, I gotta disagree - skip the protein rest, you're using malted grain with no adjuncts, but use an acid rest at ~42-45C make the yeast sing.

 

[Jye]

Hey Sammus,

The first place I would checkout is the BJCP guidelines for dunkelweizen, this will give you plenty of tips on the grain bill. Also have a look at Beerdujour for some award winner recipes. I would look at adding some munich in place of the pils and remove the choc... but then again the choc could be interesting. Definitely keep the crystal wheat. I think the 5min addition is to large and may interfere with the clove/banana esters.

You could try the wb-06, I just kegged a hefe and will have it on tap in a few days. If you can hold out brewing for a while there should be a couple of reviews up soon.

Im with tangent and would try an acid rest if possible but dont sweat it if you cant do a step mash, single infusion will work fine. If you want a good read check out the link in my signature to the northern brewer forum about hefeweizens.

Heres my last dunkelweizen which went down very well.

Dunkelweizen

Batch Size: 23.00 L Assistant Brewer:
Boil Volume: 30.08 L Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 80.0 %


Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
2.90 kg Wheat Malt, Pale (Weyermann) (2.0 SRM) Grain 62.4 %
1.40 kg Munich I (Weyermann) (7.1 SRM) Grain 30.1 %
0.25 kg Caramunich I (Weyermann) (51.0 SRM) Grain 5.4 %
0.10 kg Carafa III (Weyermann) (525.0 SRM) Grain 2.2 %

35.00 gm Liberty [4.70%] (60 min) Hops 17.9 IBU
10.00 gm Liberty [4.70%] (5 min) Hops 1.0 IBU

1 Pkgs Weihenstephan Weizen (Wyeast Labs #3068) Yeast-Wheat

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.053 SG (1.044-1.056 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.052 SG
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.013 SG (1.010-1.014 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Color: 15.2 SRM (14.0-23.0 SRM) Color [Color]
Bitterness: 18.9 IBU (10.0-18.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 1.0 AAU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 5.3 % (4.3-5.6 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 5.2 %

 

[Sammus]

yeah mate - anyone can hit a smack pack im not a moron. It's not only the $13 odd dollar price tag for an experimental (for me) brew that adds about 30% to the price, but also the fact that i've never done a wheat or a step before, its my 3rd ag and 2nd on the gear that im using, im still getting used to it all and dont want to have to plan a week ahead to give myself time to f*ck around with building up culture to make price increase worthwhile.

that said - thanks for the input re the cara.

still nothing useful on doing a protien rest, ive got one yes and one no.

edit: toned it down a bit, original post came across a bit harsh.

 

[Sammus]

Cheers Jye thats the kind of response I was after.

 

[jayse]

I think you will need a protien rest and a long mash.
The 1.5kg of Pilsner to 3 kg of wheat is alot of work the enzymes in the Pilsner have to do to convert the starches/protiens in the wheat.

Hope this helps

What? :lol:
its wheat MALT!

 

[Sammus]

Alright... here's an amended recipe... any further comments?

Batch Size: 25.00 L

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Wheat Malt, Pale (Weyermann) (3.9 EBC) Grain 56.6 %
1.80 kg Munich I (Weyermann) (14.0 EBC) Grain 34.0 %
0.40 kg Caramunich I (Weyermann) (100.5 EBC) Grain 7.5 %
0.10 kg Chocolate Wheat (Weyermann) (817.6 EBC) Grain 1.9 %
30.00 gm Hallertauer [4.80%] (60 min) Hops 14.3 IBU
10.00 gm Hallertauer [4.80%] (10 min) Hops 1.7 IBU

Mash Profile Name: Single Infusion
Weight: 12.50 kg
Mash Grain Weight: 5.30 kg Mash PH: 5.2 PH
Grain Temperature: 2.0 C Sparge Temperature: 75.6 C
Sparge Water: 21.72 L Adjust Temp for Equipment: TRUE

Name Description Step Temp Step Time
Mash In Add 13.83 L of water at 77.8 C 66.0 C 75 min

 

[tangent]

i still reckon the cara dominates too much
and normal choc would blow it out of the water but i just used 100gm of choc wheat in a brew and it's right on the money.
agree with Jye on the munich and late hopping though
wheat malt is light and subtle, the extras can really dominate

this is one beer that is worth spending an extra $13 on or maybe go for something else.
if you use a packet wheat yeast (unless you've tried the new one) i'd say you're wasting your time and beer if you don't use a liquid yeast.
i know you're not a moron, but you guys sure use a lot of excuses for not using liquid yeasts.
dump a brew on the yeastcake and it's 1/2 the price.

edit - top crop once and it's a 3rd

 

[kirem]

From the July/August edition of zymurgy;

for 19L

3.18kg of German wheat malt
2.27kg German Pilsner malt
0.45kg munich malt
113g melanoidin malt
28g German Carafa
0.45-1.36kg rice hulls for sparge (optional)
14g hallertau hersbruker 3.5%AA 60min

german, weihenstephan or bavarian wheal ale yeast

OG 1.077
FG 1.015
IBU 10.3

protein rest 50degC for 20mins
65.5degC for 60mins
mashout 75.5degC for 10mins

OR double or triple decoction

ferment at 20degC

 

[Jye]

Looks the goods Sammus, I would go with it.

kirem is this OG correct? looks very high.

OG 1.077
FG 1.015
IBU 10.3

 

[kirem]

My bad, it is really a wheat dopplebock

I suppose it depends on your efficiency. At 75% it is 1.077.

It is Amahl's clone of Aventinus

 

[oldbugman]

10ibu seems pretty low for a weizenbock.

 

[Sammus]

Cheers for the input - I may drop back the cara a little.
Yeah if I was going to use a packet it would have been the new one - reports seem ok so far. may even end up going the liquid route anyway - the main reason I was hesitant is that what isnt a style i was planning to do a lot of. Then I realised my girlfriend and half my family have a thing for wheat beers, so maybe a should build up a bit of a bank for it...

 

[weizenhiemer]

The 1.5kg of Pilsner to 3 kg of wheat is alot of work the enzymes in the Pilsner have to do to convert the starches/protiens in the wheat.

Hope this helps

absolute rubbish!Wheat will convert well on its own.

Read THIS if you don't believe.

grand master of misinformation

 

[tangent]

either make a double batch or only put 25L or less in a 30L fermenter, unless you enjoy yeast squirting out of your airlock
mmm, this is making me thirsty, might have to go pour one.

 

[Weizguy]

Kirem, I like the look of the Aventinus clone recipe. It may well get a run here soon, with W3638 (which is reputed to be Schneider yeast...it sure tastes like it).

Sammus, are you coming to Newie soon, or is someone from here visiting you soon? If so, I can shout you one of my wheat yeast cultures. A litre of say W3608, W3638, W3056, WLP380, WLP300 WLP320 or you can buy a package of K97 :lol: . Please let me know.
I could also recommend dark munich malt in a dunkelweizen, rather than any roasted malts to obtain the colour. Happy to hear your results, either way. I made a dunkelweizen with 300g of Carafa 1 (lhbs owner was generous with the malt) and made a weizenporter instead. Also contained 300g each of Vienna, Caramel Wheat, Carmunich I and melanoidin. Very drinkable dark ale, made interesting by the W3068 yeast.

Weizenhiemer, thanks for that link to the 100% wheat thread. Reminds me that I was gonna have a go at that recipe. It'll have to get in line behing the Pommie Pale, Belgian GSA and the Berliner weisse that are waiting in bags (grist only) in my dining room.

Beerz
Seth

 

[tangent]

ever since i saw that thread i've been upping the wheat % in my weizens

 

[weizenhiemer]

ever since i saw that thread i've been upping the wheat % in my weizens

And??..................................Do 100%' er you Pussy.