Protein Haze When Using Pilsener Malt

[dpadden]

Hi Guys,

I mainly use Joe White Ale and Pilsener base malts for my ales. When I use the ale malt I usually get a nice clear beer in the keg after a week or so, however if I use Pilsener as the base I almost always get a bad chill haze that hangs around for ever.

Rather than use post-boil clarifiers at this stage, I want try making a few changes to my wort production to try and combat these haze-causing proteins. At the moment I am doing a single step infusion on a three tier gravity set-up, and also no-chill. I use whirfloc in the boil and always get a nice clear wort into the cube.

Some of the things I am thinking about....

1) Including a protein rest
2) Decoction
3) More vigorous boil
4) Get a chiller!

Any suggestions would be very much appreciated.

 

[jbirbeck]

easiest one is a protein rest. Do it as a setp infusion or a decoction. I use a decoction and I've found it really helps.

The other one that helps post boil without adding anything is a period of lagering...

 

[Fourstar]

Hi Guys,

I mainly use Joe White Ale and Pilsener base malts for my ales. When I use the ale malt I usually get a nice clear beer in the keg after a week or so, however if I use Pilsener as the base I almost always get a bad chill haze that hangs around for ever.

Rather than use post-boil clarifiers at this stage, I want try making a few changes to my wort production to try and combat these haze-causing proteins. At the moment I am doing a single step infusion on a three tier gravity set-up, and also no-chill. I use whirfloc in the boil and always get a nice clear wort into the cube.

Some of the things I am thinking about....

1) Including a protein rest
2) Decoction
3) More vigorous boil
4) Get a chiller!

Any suggestions would be very much appreciated.

Do it in stages. the only thing i'd do 1st off is a 55deg protein rest and do a low temp sparge (70-73deg~) to reduce tannin extraction if your pH is out. other than that, chilling is the next best thing for you.

Also, are you sure its definitely chill haze and not hop haze related?

 

[jbirbeck]

Do it in stages. the only thing i'd do 1st off is a 55deg protein rest and do a low temp sparge (70-73deg~) to reduce tannin extraction if your pH is out. other than that, chilling is the next best thing for you.

Also, are you sure its definitely chill haze and not hop haze related?

What is hop haze? I've hopped the buggery out of a few beers and never had haze

 

[AndrewQLD]

What is hop haze? I've hopped the buggery out of a few beers and never had haze

You can get hop haze mainly from very aggressive dry hopping, a perfectly clear beer can become quite hazy when dry hopped although this isn't always the case.

Andrew

 

[Fourstar]

What is hop haze? I've hopped the buggery out of a few beers and never had haze

Excessive late hopping, dry hopping or cube hopping can result in haze formed by hop resins and vegetal matter. From what im aware, polyphenols from the hop leaf combining with wort proteins can also cause the formation of chill haze as well.

If its not diamond bright, its got haze. If its not chill haze or yeast, its probabaly hop haze.

 

[dpadden]

Also, are you sure its definitely chill haze and not hop haze related?

Pretty sure its not hop haze. My cream ale using Pilsener is full of haze, whilst the dry hopped APA using ale malt is clear as

 

[Fourstar]

Pretty sure its not hop haze. My cream ale using Pilsener is full of haze, whilst the dry hopped APA using ale malt is clear as

saying that, you have left a sample out at room temperature to see if the haze disappears and it ends up bright?!

 

[dpadden]

saying that, you have left a sample out at room temperature to see if the haze disappears and it ends up bright?!

Good point, and tried that last night. Cleared up nicely :icon_cheers:

 

[Fourstar]

Good point, and tried that last night. Cleared up nicely :icon_cheers:

Sweeto burrito! B)

 

[altstart]

Do a search on a product called Brewbrite it is designed to be added to the kettle for the last 15 mins of the boil.

 

[dpadden]

Do a search on a product called Brewbrite it is designed to be added to the kettle for the last 15 mins of the boil.

Looks like interesting stuff allstart. Have you used it, and where can you purchase it?

Paddo

 

[Tony M]

Got rid of a lot of my chill haze problems when I started boiling for 90 min. A month in a jerry at 3C drops out the rest.

 

[altstart]

Looks like interesting stuff allstart. Have you used it, and where can you purchase it?

Paddo

Yes I am useing it very good product I add 40 grams to 80 litres of wort 15 mins before the end of the boil. I make the product into a paste and drop it into the kettle no more chill haze. It does everything the manufacturer claims for it.
Cheers Altstart

 

[mfeighan]

and where can you get this stuff?

 

[Smashin]

Yes I am useing it very good product I add 40 grams to 80 litres of wort 15 mins before the end of the boil. I make the product into a paste and drop it into the kettle no more chill haze. It does everything the manufacturer claims for it.
Cheers Altstart

Hey Altstart,

Finally someone else using brewbrite. Great stuff really works a treat.



I pretty surprised at your addition rate though. ISP recommend 10-20g per 100L. I take it you don't get any adverse flavour or head retention issues??

I'm mashing a wisenbier as we speak, tempted to up the dosage on this one to your level and see how it goes on the wheat beer.

 

[altstart]

Hey Altstart,
in great detail
Finally someone else using brewbrite. Great stuff really works a treat.

View attachment 34851

I pretty surprised at your addition rate though. ISP recommend 10-20g per 100L. I take it you don't get any adverse flavour or head retention issues??

I'm mashing a wisenbier as we speak, tempted to up the dosage on this one to your level and see how it goes on the wheat beer.

I have had no problems useing this product it does not affect head retention and is so simple to use compared to Polyclar VT. I will cut back to 20 grams next brew no sense wasteing it very hard to get hold of. This was discussed here Visit My Website in detail I have had mine for about a year and its shelf life is no problem.
Cheers Altstart

 

[altstart]

Hey Altstart,
Finally someone else using brewbrite. Great stuff really works a treat.

View attachment 34851

I pretty surprised at your addition rate though. ISP recommend 10-20g per 100L. I take it you don't get any adverse flavour or head retention issues??

I'm mashing a wisenbier as we speak, tempted to up the dosage on this one to your level and see how it goes on the wheat beer.

I have had no problems useing this product it does not affect head retention and is so simple to use compared to Polyclar VT. I will cut back to 20 grams next brew no sense wasteing it very hard to get hold of. This was discussed here Visit My Website in detail I have had mine for about a year and its shelf life is no problem.
Cheers Altstart

 

[Smashin]

I have had no problems useing this product it does not affect head retention and is so simple to use compared to Polyclar VT. I will cut back to 20 grams next brew no sense wasteing it very hard to get hold of. This was discussed here Visit My Website in detail I have had mine for about a year and its shelf life is no problem.
Cheers Altstart

Yep, hens teeth but there if you know where and how, mine also about 18mths old and going strong.

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

Yep, hens teeth but there if you know where and how, mine also about 18mths old and going strong.

ISPCorp don't seem to want to send me any and I haven't found anyone who will sell it in HB size/shape quantities, so I have been persisting with the VT product.