over gravity and brewmate

[fletcher]

i've been looking to brew some beers of higher volume (20L) on my smallish stove set up where i usually bash out 10L batches.

my math is probably off, but i'm looking to try and do these calculations in brewmate where i'd make a batch of 15L, but top up to 20L in the fermenter or cube with distilled water. reason being is i use a 19L pot and i can get a boil going that leaves me with 15L of wort less the trub and 4% cooling.

is there anything in brewmate i'd need to set up for? or should i just calculate my batch to be 20L, and then work out the calculations of my over-gravity wort to match 20L on my own? i'm guessing the latter.

i just want to see how i go with this before i splurge on a bigger kettle/urn.

beer love.

fletcher.

 

[Droughtmaster]

beersmith

 

[fletcher]

beersmith

:/

 

[bum]

What you're looking at doing is rather "non-standard" (air-quotes to indicate that what you suggest is almost par for the course here, these days). The maths in your average brewing software is generally set up for full-volume (whatever that volume happens to be) BIAB to older methods.

Forget software for a second, going full volume will repay your investment very quickly. So much easier (as this thread indicates), so much more fun, so much better (yeah, I said it) - but I digress...

If you want to do some non-standard brew-maths then you need pencil and paper. MHB has always been pretty good for that stuff, and BigFridge. Both are AWOL - may respond to PM. Otherwise, I think braukaiser.com might be your best bet for finding the background stuff.

 

[fletcher]

What you're looking at doing is rather "non-standard" (air-quotes to indicate that what you suggest is almost par for the course here, these days). The maths in your average brewing software is generally set up for full-volume (whatever that volume happens to be) BIAB to older methods.

Forget software for a second, going full volume will repay your investment very quickly. So much easier (as this thread indicates), so much more fun, so much better (yeah, I said it) - but I digress...

If you want to do some non-standard brew-maths then you need pencil and paper. MHB has always been pretty good for that stuff, and BigFridge. Both are AWOL - may respond to PM. Otherwise, I think braukaiser.com might be your best bet for finding the background stuff.

thanks mate. i appreciate your genuine feedback. for me it's more about lack of size (both in gear and apartment space) for full volume at this stage. i do want to do that, but wanted to see how workable this method was if possible before i number crunch and get into a debate with SWMBO. i vaguely remember one of nick's BIAB threads talking about an over-gravity beer that needed to be diluted, but i've been too lazy to look (another standard on AHB now i'm sure also). i'll try a PM to those members. cheers.

 

[bum]

Yeah, I get the apartment thing. I've got a move coming up soon-ish and I fear it may be high-density living and I am trying to work out how I'll have to change my gear.
I have no doubt that the method is workable but I do doubt that you'll get out-of-the-box numbers from any of the common softwares without a really in-depth knowledge of how they work (and if you had that then pencil and paper would still probably be quicker).

I think the thread of Nick's was something about "intermediate" something? Advanced search, "intermediate", his name and limiting to threads (not posts) should find it (unless I'm more drunk than I think I am).

[EDIT: may be time to stop drinking then? Perhaps you mean this one? http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/44264-20l-stovetop-all-grain-aussie-lager/]

 

[Florian]

Yep, that's what he meant, "intermediate" was with stovetop decoctions IIRC.

 

[fletcher]

haha that's the one, thanks mate. his was 15L to 20L also. i'm sure it can work out okay. the mission starts...

yeah i'll give it a bash and see how it turns out. i've tasted beers before that have been diluted with (what i understand to be) very little, if any, taste changes or problems so i'm sure i can do it. there are a bunch of calculators too on brewmate with diluting and how it affects the volume/gravity and IBU. i'll arm myself with that, and a pen and paper for quick IBU calculations on the fly and see how it pans out.

 

[dammag]

http://www.biabrewer.info/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=352


http://www.biabrewer.info/viewtopic.php?f=89&t=1059

BIABrewer seems to have some info on this.

 

[brad81]

Droughtmasters post may have been a little light on information.

Beersmith2 has a dilution tool in it. You enter your OG and volume, and then you can start adding litres of water and that will work out the OG of your "diluted" wort.

I haven't checked out the other posters links, but BS2 has a trial period where you can use it to work out the dilution if you're in a hurry.

Craftbrewer sell BS2 cheaper than what you can get it for in the US too.

http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/details.asp?PID=2887

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

A couple of possible tips:

BIABrewer.info has high grav ideas - RdeVjun on this board is the one to ask.

You can do over grav calcs in brew mate. It's a matter of punching in the recipe in the main screen and then using the dilution calculator in the tools menu and basically going back and forward between the two screens to find out your numbers. It is there in brewmate, I've used it in the past.

When I got to your predicament - space/time/money - I ended up coming up with the two pot stovetop method with lauter to sort of solve it. Our kitchen was tiny (our house was about the same size as my mate's 2 bedroom apartment in Brisbane), and this worked in a tiny kitchen and on the stove.

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/60922-2-pot-stovetop-ag-with-lauter/

It saved me having to continually fart around with brewmate to keep hitting numbers.

So there's a number of solutions, just a matter of a little ingenuity, and you'll be fine.

 

[fletcher]

thanks guys for your replies! really appreciate it. after i posted last night i did check out the dilution calc on brewmate and it looks like something i can work with. might see how that goes with a brew, and failing that, look at the other options.

 

[Nick JD]

if you have say, 14L of 1.070 and you want X liters of 1.048...

70/48 = 1.46

So multiply 1.46 by 14L

20.4 ... so you need to add 6.4L to your fermenter.

 

[Draughton]

I've done this a few times with the same setup

I calculate the grain bill and hops for 20L of wort in the fermenter. Mash in with around 13L and then ghetto sparge in a bucket
Top up with as much sparge water as you can fit without boiling over

Keep in mind that about 3-3.5kg of grain is your limit so you'll probably need some DME

At the end I'd have about 12 or 13 litres of higher gravity wort to dilute

Also, low ball your efficiency because it will take a hit