Normans Australia Ale clone

[AmatureHour]

Gday all,

First post so please forgive any faux pas.

I'm looking to brew an all grain clone of Yulli's Brews - Norman Australian Ale.

The site says its got a light malt base with hops exhibiting an earthy floral aroma and hints of apple & pear on the palate before finishing with a crisp, clean bitterness.

Galaxy and Ella are the two named hops but I've never heard of them exhibiting 'apple and pear'. I also don't know if there is wheat in this as 'locally sourced malt' doesn't exactly make it easy to build a grain bill.

Only been brewing for a year so looking for feedback on what I've missed and what needs tweaking / changing entirely. Is there a mystery hop other than Galaxy and Ella? Is the grist lacking?

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Draft recipe for 24L (Keggle BIAB):
5% abv
23 IBU
5.6 SRM

BIAB - Full body

Grain
- 5.4 kg - 2 row pale malt
- 500g caramalt 10L
- 250g carapils

Boil Hops
- 5g Ella @ FWH
- 10g Galaxy @ 30
- 10 g Ella @ 5
- 10g Galaxy @ 5

Dry hop (3 days)
- 10g Galaxy
- 15g Ella

 

[Droopy Brew]

The Pear/apple is common to Coopers yeast (recultured from a bottle, not the dry packets with the kits). Unsure if another company would have the rights to use that yeast but i believe it is identical to a commercially available English yeast (name escapes me atm).

So without having tasted the beer you are trying to clone, Id look to reculture up some yeast from a coopers pale or sparkling ale.

As for the rest of the recipe I would drop the 30 minute Galaxy addition to 10 min and double the 5 minute additions or there abouts to get your 23IBUs. Galaxy any earlier than 15-20 min is not good IMO.

 

[Coodgee]

yeah agree that the apple and pear probably comes from the yeast not the hops 6 EBC is very pale, probably all pale ale or pilsner malt. I just did some googling and the guy is a home brewer turned semi pro so I would probably just email him and ask. he'd probably be flattered to give you some tips.

It's probably something like this:


Batch Size (fermenter): 23.00 l
Estimated OG: 1.047 SG
Estimated Color: 5.7 EBC
Estimated IBU: 30.7 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
5.00 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) ( Grain 1 100.0 %
10.00 g Ella (aka Stella) [15.00 %] - Boil 60.0 Hop 2 15.8 IBUs
15.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 3 12.2 IBUs
20.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 5.0 Hop 4 2.7 IBUs
1.0 pkg Cooper Ale (Coopers #-) [23.66 ml] Yeast 5 -

 

[Dan Pratt]

in order for you to achieve the Crip Clean Bitterness you need to address your waters pH

Getting the pH to 5.2 for the mash will get you closer to the crispness you are after, plus the bittering needs to be more from the 60min addition then late.

Coogee's recipe above seems more on track for a commercial brewery, using the whirlpool for any aroma that beer has for this style but definitely contact them and ask the questions.

 

[tugger]

The Norman ale uses us05 yeast.

 

[AmatureHour]

Really appreciate all the replies. I will try and get in touch with the brewer as suggested

Also:
@Droopy Brew - thanks for the advice regarding Galaxy, I've also found it to be very grassy on 5+ day dry hops
@ Coodgee - hadn't though to use Pilsner malt, would you also dry hop?
@Dan Pratt - Will try and hit a 5.2 this time, I've got slightly alkaline water so my mash pH normally hovers around 5.8 with salt additions (minus lactic acid).
@ tugger - Thanks for the tip on the yeast!

 

[Coodgee]

you can probably get him to answer most of these queries with some generic questions/answers:

1. I can't imagine you use much, if any, speciality malt if the EBC is 6. Is it all Pils malt?
2. Do you dry hop the beer or get all the aroma from late kettle/whirlpool additions.
3. Do you have a target mash ph, should I be aiming for down around 5.2?
4. Do you get apple/pear from the yeast or is that from the hops? Is the yeast available to home brewers?

 

[AmatureHour]

you can probably get him to answer most of these queries with some generic questions/answers:

1. I can't imagine you use much, if any, speciality malt if the EBC is 6. Is it all Pils malt?
2. Do you dry hop the beer or get all the aroma from late kettle/whirlpool additions.
3. Do you have a target mash ph, should I be aiming for down around 5.2?
4. Do you get apple/pear from the yeast or is that from the hops? Is the yeast available to home brewers?

I think I'll try that verbatim mate Thanks!

 

[Dan Pratt]

Oh and i was thinking of this while walking the dog and the yeast that throws apple and pear is Burton Ale strain 023.

Ive used it a few times but not in lighter beers like this, only Porters and big IPAs so i never really got those notes but its a possibility for a style like this

http://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-bank/wlp023-burton-ale-yeast

 

[AmatureHour]

G'day all,

So I've been in contact with 'James' from Yulli's Brews who was extremely helpful, and was more than willing for me to share his advice... did I mention this is my favourite beer?

Grist:
Barrett Burston Ale Malt | 88.0 %
Wheat Malt | 8.0%
Carapils | 4.0%

Mash PH | 5.2

Hops:
Ella | 60%
Galaxy | 40%
Healthy dose of hops during whirlpool
Dry Hop to 3g/L

Yeast:
US-05

With all that in mind I've altered Coodgee's recipe as follows:

24L batch (23 bottled)
ABV: 5.15%
OG: 1.056
SG: 1.017
IBU: 25.9
SRM: 5.0

Amt Name Type # %/IBU
5.50 kg Barrett Burston Ale Malt - 88.0 %
0.50 kg Wheat Malt - 8%
0.25 kg Carapils - 4%
60.00 g Ella (aka Stella) [15.00 %] - Whirlpool / Steep Hop (10 mins) 15.8 IBUs
40.00g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Whirlpool / Steep Hop (10 mins) 10.1 IBUs
69.00 g Ella (aka Stella) [15.00 %] - Dry Hop
46.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop
1.0 pkg US-05 (100ml starter)

I've yet to get beersmith for the desktop so this was done on the mobile version... apologies for any formatting errors.

Edit: My efficiency is set to 72%

 

[Coodgee]

Looks like the shizzle man.

 

[Edd Mather 6]

If you can get the Whitbread Golding Variety over there it's a good finishing hop, also on the Racking Hops , have you tried Savijnski Golding's ??