I think I'm Going to Stop Trying to Reculture Yeast

[manticle]

I don't really consider top cropping 'reculturing'. I love the results of top cropping.
Instant, fresh active starter.

I love active starters too - almost every brew gets one.

 

[rehabs_for_quitters]

I was going to get a lab separating funnel thing to make it easier I have been freezing yeasts and using washed yeasts for a while,

Then I just thought why not bottle 12 stubbies and put them aside from each brew, I sanitise then purge the bottle with CO2 then fill with beer and leave them in a nice dark out of the way spot, when I need a yeast I drink the beer and chuck the yeast from the bottle in a flask and away we go again, easiest way ever less risk than washing and way less stuffing around

 

[Yob]

I was going to get a lab separating funnel thing to make it easier I have been freezing yeasts and using washed yeasts for a while,

Then I just thought why not bottle 12 stubbies and put them aside from each brew, I sanitise then purge the bottle with CO2 then fill with beer and leave them in a nice dark out of the way spot, when I need a yeast I drink the beer and chuck the yeast from the bottle in a flask and away we go again, easiest way ever less risk than washing and way less stuffing around

cleaning, sanitising and purging 12 bottles is less work than rinsing/freezing?

...Bollox to that

 

[rehabs_for_quitters]

When you take into account total time taken, if you clean bottles properly and store in a clean place after use after use, quick splash of no rinse sanitiser quick blast of CO2 bobs yer uncle no time at all compared to waiting for trub to settle when washing

and the most important part you get to drink the beer to liberate the yeast from its malty captive to go about doing more fermenting goodness :kooi:

 

[DUANNE]

I'm another quitter. I don't brew enough anymore to bother with reculturing and with the price of yeast coming down as much as it has I usually just pitch two vials instead of farting around with a starter unless I'm doing something big or a lager.working between 50 to 60 hours a week spare time is at a premium so it works for me, less time wasted and next to no chance of accidentally introducing an infection to a beer I've spent a full day brewing.

 

[SnakeDoctor]

Dry yeast for the win!

 

[manticle]

No

 

[klangers]

I've had a go at bottling the slurry left over from a ferment (is this "top cropping"?) and it worked very well on the brew I made 1-2 months after that.

Generally though I won't bother because refrigerated space is at a premium and I rarely make the same style consecutively.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

That's more a classic slurry repitch.

Top cropping is scraping (sanitary of course) from the active krausen (the happiest most buoyant yeast) and pitching it into a fermenter of wort waiting to be inoculated.

BRY97 (another classic lagger) takes off like a flamin rocket when you do this.

 

[mje1980]

Yep, top cropped pitched yeast gets going quickly and violently !!

 

[klangers]

Ah thanks, makes perfect sense!

I guess it's most used for splitting batches or for those who have multiple fermenters.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

As a side point. With Bunnings having the plastic water drums for $15-$20 for a 20-30L drum, there is no excuse for even the tightest brewer (like me) to not own multiple fermenters.

I didn't use it for splitting a batch, I had an APA in the fermenter going off, I brewed an an IPA and needed it to be done fast, and with top cropping I can get two batches from the one packet, before I even need to look at taking the trub. In this instance it was part $$, part healthy yeast (I wanted no major esters in a high grav beer) and part time (I shaved about 4 days off, I reckon, given it was a very high grav beer).

2 batches from the one packet - at $5 a packet, you only need to do it 3 or 4 times to pay for that extra fermenter. If it's liquid, even less.

 

[carniebrew]

Ah thanks, makes perfect sense!

I guess it's most used for splitting batches or for those who have multiple fermenters.

Not only. You can top crop into something like a sanitised jar/container, and keep it in the fridge for your next batch. I do this a lot with 3068...wait until fermentation is about 50% complete (doesn't take long on a properly aerated & pitched 3068 batch, often less than 2 days) then top crop (skim) once and discard (the "dirt" skim), wait half a day or so, then skim again and put it in the fridge. Once it's settled, I decant most of the wort, and transfer into a 50ml test tube, which helps me work out (roughly) how many cells I have. Less important with something like American Pale Ale yeast, where pitch rates (within reason!) don't appear to have the same effect on the end flavour, but critical IMO for weizens.

Good reading on it here: https://www.wyeastlab.com/com-yeast-harvest.cfm, which includes a pic helping you estimate cell count by the volume of the yeast solids:

 

[hoppy2B]

Not only. You can top crop into something like a sanitised jar/container, and keep it in the fridge for your next batch. I do this a lot with 3068...wait until fermentation is about 50% complete (doesn't take long on a properly aerated & pitched 3068 batch, often less than 2 days) then top crop (skim) once and discard (the "dirt" skim), wait half a day or so, then skim again and put it in the fridge. Once it's settled, I decant most of the wort, and transfer into a 50ml test tube, which helps me work out (roughly) how many cells I have. Less important with something like American Pale Ale yeast, where pitch rates (within reason!) don't appear to have the same effect on the end flavour, but critical IMO for weizens.

Good reading on it here: https://www.wyeastlab.com/com-yeast-harvest.cfm, which includes a pic helping you estimate cell count by the volume of the yeast solids:

sedimentation.jpg

You're not meant to aerate if you want esters from your 3068. At least that's the general consensus. From my understanding though, aeration produces a greater amount of yeast and rapid yeast growth is responsible for ester production.
Do you aerate your 3068 batches Carnie, and what sort of results do you get?

 

[carniebrew]

You're not meant to aerate if you want esters from your 3068. At least that's the general consensus. From my understanding though, aeration produces a greater amount of yeast and rapid yeast growth is responsible for ester production.
Do you aerate your 3068 batches Carnie, and what sort of results do you get?

I hadn't heard that one hoppy, which surprises me given all the reading I'd done chasing a true Weihenstephaner clone. I have always aerated all the batches I pitch liquid yeast on.

My current process certainly works for me, I love how my hef's come out. I'm already chasing ester production by under pitching (about 75% of what Yeastcalc tells me to use), then limiting those esters by fermenting low, so maybe the extra esters gotten by aerating are also helping?

Actually re-reading your post now...you're saying you're not meant to aerate if you want esters, but then you go on to say that aeration produces greater amounts of yeast, and that leads to more esters. So aren't those two statements contradictory? Aeration will produce more yeast, more rapidly, leading to more esters?

 

[hoppy2B]

There are conflicting reports on whether aeration increases or decreases ester production. That's why I was wondering what your results were like.

Most of the advice is not to aerate, but some evidence and the fact that rapid yeast growth and the fact that aeration increases the quantity of yeast produced, both suggest that aeration might increase esters. Go figure.

 

[ashley_leask]

I gave up trying to rinse yeast post fermentation, but I do still culture my own by growing a volume through stepped starters, then splitting into 4 or 5 test tubes and freezing with glycerine. I hated the rinsing process, could never seem to get it right and like you, wasn't really happy with the results. Other people manage it fine, but not me it seems.

The way I do it now, I'm working with yeast that has never fermented a full beer, no worries about hop material, large volumes of trub to rinse but I can still maintain my own library of the yeasts I use without having to worry about buying them every time I brew.

 

[antiphile]

G'day all

Please take note that any suggestions mentioned here are designed purely for beginners thinking about harvesting yeast. Almost everyone here is a lot more experienced than me and have much better techniques, but if you've wondered about trying it for the first time and want a simple way, this may be worth considering. I did this with one of the newer types of the Coopers fermenters, but should also work with most other types of fermenting vessels with a tap.
Yeast Harvesting for Dummies.

Cheers

 

[mckenry]

Another quitter as of today. Fucked around for hours trying to separate WLP820 nicely. Plenty of cold break separation, sweet **** all white yeast. Did over 1.5L from the conical, so diluted in varying tests from 25% to 12.5% and still not seeing anything resembling a good yeast layer.
Maybe there's too much yeast in the cone, which doesnt come through. Its different to swishing around a plastic fermenter. My beer is now cold conditioning, (I'd hoped) without sitting on yeast cake. Not so sure now. I'd not be confident stepping this up to make another lager, thats for sure. Regardless, the farking effort is nowhere near worth it for me. If I was charging for my time, the amount of yeast I get back costs $240. Bullshit argument anyway I know, but I could have been kicking the footy with the kids, out riding my bike, cooking something, or maybe even sampling a few brews!

For $8 I'm going new each time from now on. I step up for 50L anyway, so a new vial works out at less than 7c / schooner.

 

[Midnight Brew]

Depending on the styles you're brewing Mckenry, could always select a few top cropping strains and keep them going quiet easily.