I Love No Chill

[Silo Ted]

Pete, why can't a hefeweizen be NC'd?

 

[ekul]

No chill allows me to pitch at the perfect temp all the time, every time. When i was chilling i could only get temps down to 24C at best, most of the time it was sitting at 30C.
While i don't think pitching at 24 and letting the wort cool in the fridge was too harmful my beers do taste slightly bettter when i've pitched at the right temp.

I really like the idea that i can knock out 6 batches in a weekend and ferment whenever i want. Work is heating up and i'm not going to get as much time for brewing as i used to, so i'm really glad i went to no chill. No empty fermenters for me!

Recently i discovered cube hopping, I made up two batches of a stone and wood clone. One bittering addition @ 30 and the rest in the cube. The intensity of flavour and aroma is not something i had been able to achieve with chilling. PLus i can do a double batch and end up with two different beers by hopping each cube differently, try do that with chilling!

Nice chart Barley Belly, i only move mine back by 15min. I've only just started experimenting with cubes so i'll give the 20min move a go.

 

[jakester]

I think there are alot of reasons people no chill out there. For me, as i work all day and usually very busy on weekends we tend to brew a fair bit on weekdays when we get home from work. Sometimes we end up at the end of boil at about 10pm so we just put it in the no chill cube, go to bed and its ready to pitch the next day. Works for us.
When i first started no chill i didnt realize the bittering factor. We were brewing the Golden ale with a 60min addition and the end result was terrible. When i read on here some months ago we need to alter it i nearly fell over and have been experimenting to get it right ever since. That table is great, could be a big help. I too brewed a stone & wood ale this week, a heavily hopped beer and will add some to my secondary when i rack. If im using pellets, is it best to use a hop bag, make a tea or throw the pellets straight in?

 

[felten]

Throw em straight in, commando style. But if you want to put them in a bag make sure its a big one so they aren't constricted.

 

[Gavo]

Hey me ole mate Chappo is back... Sorry Chap CHap still no chillin here, will plan to try the chiller over Christmas though.

Oh and on topic, No chill is convenient and the main reason I use this method. I will be trying out a lovely plate chiller soon and maybe I will be converted to the chiller usage.

Now two of my cubes are empty so I will refill them today with a faux American Lager.

Cheers
Gavo.

 

[Duff]

I've no chilled for over 5 - 6 years with hundreds of batches done.

Of late, I'm thinking about going back to chilling as I'm lacking flavour compared to when I was brewing no chill in Sydney. I think it's the water here and will be amending next weekend for the first time. Maybe it's the heat as well as the cube stays hotter for longer, but it's just not right for some reason. The water test from yesterday indicates I need around 7 grams of gypsum and 5gm of salt to balance things out. Will see how that goes.

 

[winkle]

Hey me ole mate Chappo is back... Sorry Chap CHap still no chillin here, will plan to try the chiller over Christmas though.

Oh and on topic, No chill is convenient and the main reason I use this method. I will be trying out a lovely plate chiller soon and maybe I will be converted to the chiller usage.

Now two of my cubes are empty so I will refill them today with a faux American Lager.

Cheers
Gavo.

Meh, he'll disappear again quicker than you can say - "Where's the goat spoof curry?"

+ convenience.
I'd better put an APA out of one and prep up the grain for a gose to goes into one.

 

[Bribie G]

Now that Chap Chap has resurfaced, hopefully for a while, he will confirm that at his last brew day (Altstart, Ross, Me, CM3, Gravity Guru etc, )he offered a surplus plate chiller and no takers - With the ambient water temps hereabouts and especially on sandy old Bribie plate or CF chilling is most inefficient and with our water charges the highest in the Western World, thanks Anna Blight, not an attractive thing. Also it's probably hard for people south of the Border to appreciate, but we genuinely do think before turning on the tap. We nearly ran out of water last year and now the dams are full, but we really did get on board and our water consumption is half that of NSW and Vic per head of pop.
Fine if you have a tank or dam.

As for commercials, they didn't go to flash chilling until well into the 20th Century but used coolships (big open flat pans) and in the case of breweries such as Urquell they were in use until fairly recently. Coolships also oxygenate the wort. Still in use in some trad breweries - here's one still used in Belgium to make wits, geuze etc. Can't see why you wouldn't do a hefe.



The big commercials started using rapid cooling when they went into lager production - here's one from around the time of the First World War at Allsop's in London. It's a 'trickle down' refrigerated unit. I reckon a fridgie could make something similar from a couple of old bar fridges. It also oxygenates the wort.
I would guess that commercially the major attraction of plate / CF chilling is recovery of waste heat, the ability to crank out three or four brews in the same day on the same kit, and hence $$


Fig. 5.REFRIGERATORS IN "LAGER" BREWERY OF MESSRS. ALLSOPP.
The hot wort trickles over the outside of the series of pipes, and is cooled
by the cold water which circulates in them. From the shallow collecting trays
the cooled wort is conducted to the fermenting backs.

 

[drew9242]

I Love No Chill aswell. I have a copper immersion chiller, which i used to chill all the time. But i though i would try no chill one day just see how it works. Haven't turned back yet. Great time saver, especially as i do 2 batchs in one day, instead of taking me 7 hours i can cut it down too less then 6 hours. Then you can leave it for a week until fermenters and yeast starters are all ready, and then dump it. In quality department i myself am producing the best consitent beers ever in my short brewing life.

I still got the imersion chiller just in case i may want to use it. But i doubt it would be anytime soon.

 

[chappo1970]

Hey me ole mate Chappo is back... Sorry Chap CHap still no chillin here, will plan to try the chiller over Christmas though.

:lol: Give a brewer a perfectly good plate chiller and what does he do? Uses it as a dust collector FFS!

 

[Bribie G]

Aha, So Gavo took it - in the winter out there he'll be able to use it just by sticking it out of the window

 

[manticle]

Well, let me see.... I haven't read the other thread, so I'll just comment on how I feel about No Chill.

It works. I allows guys to make beer that THEY love to drink, without the cost or hassle of a chiller or the water that they use. I think it's perfectly suitable for those folks that do it, and love their beer.

I prefer to brew my beer with as much of the "Professional" style and equipment as I can. I feel that professional brewers have had thousands of years to try to perfect a system that balances cost with great beer. Most of the professionals DON'T brew great beer.. but that's not a fault of the equipment.

I have brewed in a fairly large commercial brewery (2000 litre batches), and I have learned a LOT while doing it. a few of those things that were really important, were getting the wort from the kettle quickly, through a chiller, and oxygenating the wort on it's way. Another was holding the beer at an exact temperature during the fermenting process (Glycol chiller jackets on the fermenters.) If anyone would like to see pictures of these very important features, I can supply them.

So, what I am saying is that truly great beers need specific processes and temperatures to make them taste great, and almost as important, consistent. A good Heffeweizen can NOT be fermented at 24 degrees, nor can it be no chilled. You will still make beer, but it won't be the same beer as if you fermented at 17 degrees and rapidly chilled it.

No chill is good, and it works and for the folks that do it an love it, it's the ticket. But a proper chilling method and even more importantly a proper fermentation temperature is vital if you are trying to make great beers.

Yes, I know some members have made award winning beers via no chill. Imagine if they had chilled and fermented at the proper temperature what that award winning beer might have tasted like?

Compare apples with apples though. For a large commercial brewer, no chill is completely impractical. Not only would they need a giant cube and some very strong knees, they're generally wanting to get fermenting as quickly as possible, not wait the week that 10,000 decalitres will take to cool.

Home brewing has been around at least as long as professional brewing and the reason they 'get things right' is because they continually analyse and shift perspective where necessary. I don't buy the 'if it works commercially, it must work that way on an HB scale' because there are so many different contexts.

No chill is a proven method, as is chilling and speculation on what a beer 'might' taste like had it been brewed differently or fermented differently isn't much use really.

 

[raven19]

Now that Chap Chap has resurfaced, hopefully for a while...

I take full responsibility for getting him back on the horse. Or is that raven pie?

Anyway back on topic - awesome historical pics there Bribie.

I have a plate chiller now, but some brews that have minimal or nil late hopping I might still NC. Certainly saves an hour on the brew day when you dont have to recirc pbw thru the chiller, etc, etc,...

 

[Gavo]

Now that Chap Chap has resurfaced, hopefully for a while, he will confirm that at his last brew day (Altstart, Ross, Me, CM3, Gravity Guru etc, )he offered a surplus plate chiller and no takers

Ah there was a taker, I stuck me hand up ... no water problems here, full weir, full tanks and full swimming pool. Just haven't had time to try it out yet. It won't happen overnight but it will happen.

Gavo

Edit: geez, sorry Chappo just there's been a lot of **** happening here lately and frankly haven't had time nor the inclination to get it up and running.. As said, much appreciated and will happen.

 

[matr]

So if you removed all hop debris at the end of the boil would you still have to adjust? Is it the actual hops remaining that causes the increase in IBU or the hop oils. With my limited knowledge I would have thought if you took them out you can't extract any more bitterness...

Like making a cup of tea. If you pull the tea bag out but let the cup sit it won't get any stronger.

Cheers, Mat

 

[Gavo]

Yeah you can remove the hop debris but the compounds are still there ismorizing or whatever that word is - adding bitterness.

Dons flame suit and sits back with the popcorn. h34r:

Gavo.

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

Chilling is more important for some beer styles than others, I believe.

Pilsners and such lagers should be chilled. Aussie Lagers should be chilled even further. Some ales can be enjoyed at room temperature in cooler climates, thus qualifying for No Chill.


Or am I missing something...

 

[Gavo]

Chilling is more important for some beer styles than others, I believe.

Pilsners and such lagers should be chilled. Aussie Lagers should be chilled even further. Some ales can be enjoyed at room temperature in cooler climates, thus qualifying for No Chill.


Or am I missing something...

Gold :lol:

By the way Chappo - answer your Pm's


Gavo.

 

[goomboogo]

A question for Peteoz77. You mentioned a couple times, the need to ferment at correct temperature. You won't get any argument about that but what has no-chill got to do with fermentation temperature? You can no-chill and still ferment in the range of acceptable temps for the particular yeast exactly the same as if the wort was chilled immediately after brewing.

I will point out that I have never no-chilled. However, I may try it one day as I am open to the idea.

 

[Peteoz77]

No chill has nothing to do with fermentation temp, I merely pointed it out because I believe it is the second most important factor in the taste of your beer (after yeast selection... and of course hops).

I have two fermentation fridges, so if I don't chill the wort enough, it's still in temp within an hour or so.

I also have a 5,000 litre water tank that only cost me $400 (after my $400 rebate) and I recirculate from that, so I don't use any water essentially.

Tell you what I'm going to do. Next batch I'll cube half of the wort, and chill the other half. I'll ferment them both in the same fridge, and we'll see if there is a taste difference.

Maybe you will convert me......