How To Make A Wit

[LethalCorpse]

Hi guys,
I've run a search on this and come up empty handed, but it looks to be a common enough goal that it's probably been discussed before. Apologies if I'm repeating anyone.

I'm working towards the objective of all-grain, but it's a big investment in equipment and design (I plan to have electronic temperature control over my mashing) that I haven't gotten around to yet. So, for my next brew I want to make a hoegaarden clone without doing any mashing. The idea of a partial doesn't appeal to me - I figure if I can mash half my beer, I can mash the whole lot. One of my main shortfalls in equipment is a boiler - the most I can boil is 8L. But I want to make this one without using a kit, doing my own partial boil.
Unfortunately all the recipes I've come across are either k&k or AG.

So, what I'm after is guidance on which fermentables, yeast and hop additions I should use. I plan to boil as much water as I can with a portion of the fermentables, and add the hops, orange peel and coriander seeds at appropriate intervals as though it was a full boil. I'm particularly aiming for the white colour/haze of hoegaarden (everything I've brewed so far has turned out dark amber, regardless of my intent), and the spicy aroma/flavour. Suggestions?

 

[Adamt]

Welcome to the forums.

Not too experienced (well not at all experienced) with brewing Wits but I'll try and shed some light. Other recipes, whether K&K or AG will give you a good idea of how much coriander/orange peel/etc. to put in for your batch size and when to add them.

As far as the colour/haze goes, this is a problem which will be hard to overcome in extract brewing. The very light colour comes from a selection of very light malts (i think its 40%/60% wheat/pils malt), and run a specific mash schedule to yield the right dryness. Light Dry Malt Extract is, I'm guessing extracted from a cheap ale malt, which will not ferment as dry as a dry-mashed pils malt will, and is also darker in colour. You can get wheat malt extract too but I don't know too much about that.

Because of this extra body you'll get using extract, it will hide some of the crispness from the orange and spiciness from the coriander. You can dry it out a little by using some dextrose, but I'd say this style is something that can't be emulated perfectly with standard extract.

This is not to say, by any means, that you cannot make a nice beer though.

Brew for yourself and your tastebuds only; if it doesn't look or taste exactly like Hoegaarden, it doesn't matter; as long as you enjoy it!

Adam

 

[bconnery]

You are basically not going to be able to achieve the whiteness with an extract brew. The white comes, as said, from light malts and also the use of raw wheat, which requires a mash. In fact you will struggle to achieve close to it without a mash of some sort.

Forgetting the partial idea you could still due a mini-mash, which could be done with your 8L and would get you closer.

I will also say, as someone who's now done both, that a mini or partial is worlds removed from an AG. Mashing 1-15kg, or even 2, is very different from 5 in terms of process and effort!! Mashing some will give you a better result though!

Here's a recipe I've made which is a mini-mash. The colour is light, but still darker than a proper wit. It was a very tasty beer though. Drink them early...

The ingredients were based on readings on this site and some books, plus a little of what I had lying around... The mini-mash schedule is also based on readings. The raw wheat was from the health food section in Woolies. You need raw wheat for that bite as opposed to malted wheat which is what normal wheat malt is...

I used WL550 because I was making another belgian. You could select one of the specific belgian wit yeasts for a closer result.

400g rolled oats. 200g pilsner malt. 500g wheat malt . 950g cracked raw wheat. 500g W DME 500g Dextrose. 1.5kg Coopers W LME. 30g dried wild orange. 30g cracked coriander. 10g Saphir hop pellets. 40g Smaragad hop pellets. WL550 Belgian Ale

Mashed oats, wheat, cracked wheat and pilsner @50C for 25 minutes. Raised to 65-70 for 70 mins. Sparged. Saphir and 20g @45. LME, DME and Dextrose, 20g coriander, 20g orange peel. 10g Smaragad @ 10. 10g Smaragad @ end. 10g coriander, 10g orange peel @end.



If the mini mash really doesn't appeal I would replace all the grain with wheat malt extract tins and boil a very small amount of that for the full time, adding the bulk of it @10, but you'll be missing something.

 

[brettprevans]

Hi guys,
I've run a search on this and come up empty handed, but it looks to be a common enough goal that it's probably been discussed before. Apologies if I'm repeating anyone.

I'm working towards the objective of all-grain, but it's a big investment in equipment and design (I plan to have electronic temperature control over my mashing) that I haven't gotten around to yet. So, for my next brew I want to make a hoegaarden clone without doing any mashing. The idea of a partial doesn't appeal to me - I figure if I can mash half my beer, I can mash the whole lot. One of my main shortfalls in equipment is a boiler - the most I can boil is 8L. But I want to make this one without using a kit, doing my own partial boil.
Unfortunately all the recipes I've come across are either k&k or AG.

So, what I'm after is guidance on which fermentables, yeast and hop additions I should use. I plan to boil as much water as I can with a portion of the fermentables, and add the hops, orange peel and coriander seeds at appropriate intervals as though it was a full boil. I'm particularly aiming for the white colour/haze of hoegaarden (everything I've brewed so far has turned out dark amber, regardless of my intent), and the spicy aroma/flavour. Suggestions?

yoou could use dried wheat extract as a fermentable lighter colour and flavour

 

[Josh]

Drinking my latest wit out of the fermenter at the moment, but that's another post.

Just off the top of my head I would think as suggested earlier that using extract will give you a darker and fuller bodied beer. You could look at using the lightest dry malt extract you can find, with some sort of wheat extract and dextrose in 1/3 each ratio. This should keep the colour and maltiness down a little.

Then I would do the following:

Add some of the light DME and wheat extract to a boiling pot of water. Remember to take it off the heat while adding as you don't want any scorching.

Then add your bittering hops for a 60 minute boil.

Add about 35g dried bitter orange peel, 20g cracked coriander seeds and about 0.5g/L of noble hops at 10 mins.

Chill down in an ice bath then add to the fermenter with the rest of the fermentables. Top up till you hit the desired OG and add your yeast.

That's what I would do. If you have a hopping and spice plan already mapped out, go with that.

BTW The wit I'm drinking at the moment only had 35g dried orange peel, 4g of coriander seeds and 7g each of ground nutmeg and cinnamon. Tastes pretty strong, but enjoyable if it were carbonated.

 

[LethalCorpse]

Drinking my latest wit out of the fermenter at the moment, but that's another post.

Just off the top of my head I would think as suggested earlier that using extract will give you a darker and fuller bodied beer. You could look at using the lightest dry malt extract you can find, with some sort of wheat extract and dextrose in 1/3 each ratio. This should keep the colour and maltiness down a little.

Then I would do the following:

Add some of the light DME and wheat extract to a boiling pot of water. Remember to take it off the heat while adding as you don't want any scorching.

Then add your bittering hops for a 60 minute boil.

Add about 35g dried bitter orange peel, 20g cracked coriander seeds and about 0.5g/L of noble hops at 10 mins.

Chill down in an ice bath then add to the fermenter with the rest of the fermentables. Top up till you hit the desired OG and add your yeast.

That's what I would do. If you have a hopping and spice plan already mapped out, go with that.

BTW The wit I'm drinking at the moment only had 35g dried orange peel, 4g of coriander seeds and 7g each of ground nutmeg and cinnamon. Tastes pretty strong, but enjoyable if it were carbonated.

Awesome, thanks for the suggestions guys. I'll report back on how it goes.

 

[Josh]

Awesome, thanks for the suggestions guys. I'll report back on how it goes.

No probs. I might have a go at this too to see how my own suggestion turns out for next time someone asks.

 

[LethalCorpse]

Does a kilo of LDME, a kilo of W DME and 500g dextrose sound about right, or would 1.5kg morgans extra pale LME result in a a lighter colour than the LDME? Indeed, does anyone know where in Sydney or online I can find Extra Light DME (BeerSmith has it as an ingredient, but I can't find it on any of the brew shop websites)? Would I get a better wheat haze/flavour if I also steeped, say, 350-500g of cracked wheat?
Can I cultivate the yeast from a bottle of hoegaarden grand cru, or should I use another wit yeast?
And what effect would the rolled oats have? I could steep them with the wheat...

 

[bconnery]

Does a kilo of LDME, a kilo of W DME and 500g dextrose sound about right, or would 1.5kg morgans extra pale LME result in a a lighter colour than the LDME? Indeed, does anyone know where in Sydney or online I can find Extra Light DME (BeerSmith has it as an ingredient, but I can't find it on any of the brew shop websites)? Would I get a better wheat haze/flavour if I also steeped, say, 350-500g of cracked wheat?
Can I cultivate the yeast from a bottle of hoegaarden grand cru, or should I use another wit yeast?
And what effect would the rolled oats have? I could steep them with the wheat...

I believe, but can't be certain without checking, that hoegaarden bottle with a different strain.

I haven't seen extra light DME anywhere in Aus, but that doesn't mean it isn't there.

If you are using raw wheat or oats you will need to mash them, or in other words, steep them at a controlled temperature for a period.

I used to do a mini-mash as follows. Heat water to 72C or so, remove from heat and mix in grains.

Place pot in an oven turned down very low. Mine goes to about 50C so I use to use 70C or so and it seems to work.

I would take it out and check after half an hour. Raw wheat and rolled oats would be best down with a base malt, even 500g pilsner will help. Strain into pot and boil for a lesser time, 30-45 minutes, to reduce the colouring effect. Adust the hop levels if required.

The rolled oats help with a smooth body. I read somewhere that they where a part of the original recipe but are no longer in Hoegaarden since it was taken over by inbev...

Raw wheat in some form, as opposed to malted wheat, is essential to get that tang.

Somewhere on this forum is a discussion about the use of flour in the process to achieve the cloudiness but you will ahve to search...