Fermzilla

[Grmblz]

Hey all dont know if this has been raised before but i need some help or suggestions. when it comes to dry hopping under pressure I set my spunding at 25psi so its carbed by the time i keg. I shut the butterfly valve and go to release the pressure slowly out of the pet screw lid on the collection jar. Twice the thing has blown off and hops have gone everywhere haha. Litterally a hop explosion. Dont know the best way to release the pressure in the collection jar to then add more hops for dry hopping.

It's been mentioned before, hop socks with a magnet in them, NOT! the black ferrous ones but the shiny little rare earth things on evil bay, magnet on the outside of fermenter to hold it in place, when you want to hop just remove external magnet, and sock n hops fall into wort. Any oxygen in the hop sock will have been purged during fermentation and the saurus has enough head space for 4 or 5 hop additions, no worries about pressure. I would question the need for 25 psi but each to their own. For hot and quick without the pressure try a Kveik unless you're doing lagers of course.

 

[Elmar]

Hey all dont know if this has been raised before but i need some help or suggestions. when it comes to dry hopping under pressure I set my spunding at 25psi so its carbed by the time i keg. I shut the butterfly valve and go to release the pressure slowly out of the pet screw lid on the collection jar. Twice the thing has blown off and hops have gone everywhere haha. Litterally a hop explosion. Dont know the best way to release the pressure in the collection jar to then add more hops for dry hopping.

You could use one of the cheap carbonation caps on your collection container, put on a quick disconnect and some beerline with a tap and release pressure slowly

 

[Saersy]

It's been mentioned before, hop socks with a magnet in them, NOT! the black ferrous ones but the shiny little rare earth things on evil bay, magnet on the outside of fermenter to hold it in place, when you want to hop just remove external magnet, and sock n hops fall into wort. Any oxygen in the hop sock will have been purged during fermentation and the saurus has enough head space for 4 or 5 hop additions, no worries about pressure. I would question the need for 25 psi but each to their own. For hot and quick without the pressure try a Kveik unless you're doing lagers of course.

25psi drops down to about 8psi and 2.3 vols of co2 when cold crashed to 2°c so perfect carbonation once its done but good idea with the magnets.

 

[Saersy]

You could use one of the cheap carbonation caps on your collection container, put on a quick disconnect and some beerline with a tap and release pressure slowly

Yeah i think that's the easiest and best option hopefully the plastic ones are easier to pull apart and clean than the stainless ones as theyll get clogged up with hops

 

[Nullnvoid]

Yeah i think that's the easiest and best option hopefully the plastic ones are easier to pull apart and clean than the stainless ones as theyll get clogged up with hops

I reckon the plastic ones are a pain in the arse. And I don't think they come apart for cleaning. From what I have seen.

I've gone back to the stainless, very easier to use and clean and just bought some new washers so they seal properly

 

[cb341982]

Hey Null. I'm not a big fan of the red plastic carb caps either. I pulled a few apart to clean and the o rings just **** themselves . Replaced the o rings and they were a nightmare to get back together. What size/material/where did you get your replacement washers for the stainless carb caps from?

 

[Nullnvoid]

Hey Null. I'm not a big fan of the red plastic carb caps either. I pulled a few apart to clean and the o rings just **** themselves . Replaced the o rings and they were a nightmare to get back together. What size/material/where did you get your replacement washers for the stainless carb caps from?

It was KL07177 (5 Pack) Camlock Replacement seal from Kegland. Works a treat and they are nice and thick.

 

[Grok]

Hey Null. I'm not a big fan of the red plastic carb caps either. I pulled a few apart to clean and the o rings just **** themselves . Replaced the o rings and they were a nightmare to get back together. What size/material/where did you get your replacement washers for the stainless carb caps from?

Grolsch flip top bottle red rubber seals work ok as well on the stainless caps.

 

[Mya]

It's been mentioned before, hop socks with a magnet in them, NOT! the black ferrous ones but the shiny little rare earth things on evil bay, magnet on the outside of fermenter to hold it in place, when you want to hop just remove external magnet, and sock n hops fall into wort. Any oxygen in the hop sock will have been purged during fermentation and the saurus has enough head space for 4 or 5 hop additions, no worries about pressure. I would question the need for 25 psi but each to their own. For hot and quick without the pressure try a Kveik unless you're doing lagers of course.

I don't trust cheap rare earth magnets. Is there any reliable way to make these inert? Like a thin silicone covering for the inside magnet?

 

[f00b4r]

I don't trust cheap rare earth magnets. Is there any reliable way to make these inert? Like a thin silicone covering for the inside magnet?

You can buy Teflon coated ones.

 

[Vic]

I don't trust cheap rare earth magnets. Is there any reliable way to make these inert? Like a thin silicone covering for the inside magnet?

Use a magnetic stir bar in the hop sock. They come Teflon coated. On the outside use a powerful rare earth magnet.

 

[Mya]

Use a magnetic stir bar in the hop sock. They come Teflon coated. On the outside use a powerful rare earth magnet.

The magnetic stir bars are powerful enough to hold up 200g+ of dry hops?

 

[Vic]

The magnetic stir bars are powerful enough to hold up 200g+ of dry hops?

No problem with up to 100g. I haven’t tried with any more but should be OK provided outside magnet is powerful enough. Or use 2 bags.

 

[Mya]

Cheers.

Has anyone had cleaning issues with being unable to use hot water in these?

 

[TheBeerBaron]

Cheers.

Has anyone had cleaning issues with being unable to use hot water in these?

FermZilla (body) can't tolerate anything above 50 Celsius. So depending on how hot your water gets out of the tap, might not be a good idea

This is in the instructions

 

[Mya]

Yep I realise that, which is specifically why I asked if anyone has had any issues in cleaning the product without using hot water...

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Cheers.

Has anyone had cleaning issues with being unable to use hot water in these?

With my PET fermenters fill past the krausen mark with cold water disolve a tablespoon of sodium perborate in a cup of hot water pour into fermenter leave for 24 hours.
Sodiun perc will do the same job.

 

[TheBeerBaron]

Yep I realise that, which is specifically why I asked if anyone has had any issues in cleaning the product without using hot water...

Apologies, I did not read your post correctly!

As WEAL mentions a good soak with PBW etc. over night will sort it. I use the KegLand version this way. After the soak any bits that do stick will come straight off with a blast from the hose on full tilt

 

[cb341982]

It was KL07177 (5 Pack) Camlock Replacement seal from Kegland. Works a treat and they are nice and thick.

Thanks

 

[KegLand-com-au]

Apologies, I did not read your post correctly!

As WEAL mentions a good soak with PBW etc. over night will sort it. I use the KegLand version this way. After the soak any bits that do stick will come straight off with a blast from the hose on full tilt

I think it's a good idea for us to jump in here. Sodium percarbonate works reasonably well and can be left overnight. If however you are using sodium percarbonate mixed with sodium metasiliate you should limit contact time to 20 minutes.

Any product that contains sodium metasilicate should have 20 min contact time or less. Sodium metasilicate is quite an aggressive chemical on plastics in particular and it can weaken PET and a number of other rubbers and plastics. For this reason even other products such as Five Star PBW or even our own KegLand brand of PBW should have a limit of about 20 minute contact time. Please do not leave in the fermenter for days at a time. This is something that is mentioned in the instruction sheet for the FermZilla however it's often overlooked.

If you are using straight sodium percarbonate it's not an issue but it's also not quite as effective as a cleaner when used in combination with a number of other chemicals at the same time.

 

[TheBeerBaron]

however it's often overlooked

Well I sure have overlooked this fact! so good to know. it's lucky then that I had actually run out of PBW and my FZ has been sitting for a week with just sodium perc so hopefully that hasn't damage the body.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

Well I sure have overlooked this fact! so good to know. it's lucky then that I had actually run out of PBW and my FZ has been sitting for a week with just sodium perc so hopefully that hasn't damage the body.

Yes it's something I think we need to make more effort to educate customers on. The reality is all the effective cleaning happens in the first 10 minutes so really no point to leave longer. Sodium metasilicate is really effective but just don't leave it for longer than you need to.

 

[pauly]

Hey all dont know if this has been raised before but i need some help or suggestions. when it comes to dry hopping under pressure I set my spunding at 25psi so its carbed by the time i keg. I shut the butterfly valve and go to release the pressure slowly out of the pet screw lid on the collection jar. Twice the thing has blown off and hops have gone everywhere haha. Litterally a hop explosion. Dont know the best way to release the pressure in the collection jar to then add more hops for dry hopping.

I also did a few brews at 25 PSI, mainly as experiments to see how it would suppress yeast flavours and possible retain more hop flavour from a dry hop at pitch.

I do not know if it was coincidence or not but the collection vessel was packed hard whereas it was not like that when fermenting at 10 PSI. The first time I did not think about it and gently loosened one of the soda caps to relive pressure as I had done previously, left it for half an hour and came back to take it off. It looked like the car scene from pulp fiction soon after that, this was in the bathroom and the wife was not impressed.

The second time I tried using a plastic carb cap to drain the pressure but blocked almost immediately. I then very very carefully loosened the soda cap, in the shower whilst covering it with a towel and wearing safety goggles. Still a massive explosion but at least it was contained!

If I do it again I will do the only sensible thing and purge down to 5 PSI or so before removing the collection container.

If you find a good way to do it please let me know!

 

[pauly]

Originally posted 3/10/19. “An easy way to dry hop using a Fermzilla and keeping O2 out. If under pressure, release pressure via PRV. Remove gas post, don't worry, air won't enter, liquid will still be giving up CO2. Using a funnel add hops via the opening where the gas post was. Don't worry about releasing pressure, little carbonation will be lost. You can always add some extra CO2 if you wish. If not fermenting under pressure, connect a CO2 line to the liquid post, set regulator to minimum. Turn gas on until bubbles can be seen coming out the dip tube, remove gas post & dry hop. EASY.”

I think this is a good suggestion and I have tried this.

It's a little hard to get some of the hop pellets down the funnel though, and I had to do 150g over three batches due to mild volcanoing. I think if you are fermenting at 25 PSI you need to be prepared for this.

I have actually bought a FZ all rounder and plan to use this method again, I have never harvested the yeast from the FZ so for me I am thinking it's a lot of extra cleaning I can avoid.

I also got some of the new PET t-pieces https://www.kegland.com.au/pco-1881-carbonation-cap-tee-piece.html and am planning to make some hop tea, transfer to PET bottles and enclosed transfer that into the keg as an alternative to dry hopping.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

I also did a few brews at 25 PSI, mainly as experiments to see how it would suppress yeast flavours and possible retain more hop flavour from a dry hop at pitch.

I do not know if it was coincidence or not but the collection vessel was packed hard whereas it was not like that when fermenting at 10 PSI. The first time I did not think about it and gently loosened one of the soda caps to relive pressure as I had done previously, left it for half an hour and came back to take it off. It looked like the car scene from pulp fiction soon after that, this was in the bathroom and the wife was not impressed.

The second time I tried using a plastic carb cap to drain the pressure but blocked almost immediately. I then very very carefully loosened the soda cap, in the shower whilst covering it with a towel and wearing safety goggles. Still a massive explosion but at least it was contained!

If I do it again I will do the only sensible thing and purge down to 5 PSI or so before removing the collection container.

If you find a good way to do it please let me know!

If you are trying to suppress ester production and get cleaner fermentation you should aim for about 10-15psi max. If you get up to 25psi this starts to have a negative impact on the fermentation process. It's not simply more pressure is necessarily better. I think we need to do more to educate customers about this. I think a lot of customers are often going higher in pressure than is actually desirable just because they can.

The other thing that will probably help you is if you remove the soda cap really slowly. With hops and other trub you will find this is a fairly thick paste and when you remove the soda cap you will need a few ml of this paste to come out of the cap first so the pressure is reduced before the cap is completely removed. If you do it too fast the cap does blow off.

I should also say that if you turn off the butterfly valve it's important to either remove the whole collection container fairly soon after or at least release the pressure using the PCO threaded caps. If you leave the butterfly valve closed and the collection container in place you can continue to get this separate chamber continuing to ferment and also continue to build up more pressure making the hop explosion effect greater. Really there is no reason to leave it connected once you have turned off the butterfly valve off so it should be removed and dumped.

 

[Saersy]

I also did a few brews at 25 PSI, mainly as experiments to see how it would suppress yeast flavours and possible retain more hop flavour from a dry hop at pitch.

I do not know if it was coincidence or not but the collection vessel was packed hard whereas it was not like that when fermenting at 10 PSI. The first time I did not think about it and gently loosened one of the soda caps to relive pressure as I had done previously, left it for half an hour and came back to take it off. It looked like the car scene from pulp fiction soon after that, this was in the bathroom and the wife was not impressed.

The second time I tried using a plastic carb cap to drain the pressure but blocked almost immediately. I then very very carefully loosened the soda cap, in the shower whilst covering it with a towel and wearing safety goggles. Still a massive explosion but at least it was contained!

If I do it again I will do the only sensible thing and purge down to 5 PSI or so before removing the collection container.

If you find a good way to do it please let me know!

Haha yeah happened to me twice too and in my brew shed things are still coated in hops because I'm too lazy to clean it up I dont actually put it under pressure until day 3 so it can produce those ale esters then let it rise itself to 25psi. I think purging down the pressure is the safest option, removing the collection jar, add dry hops, purge with co2, open valve then put 25psi back into the tank. Cheers!

 

[Saersy]

If you are trying to suppress ester production and get cleaner fermentation you should aim for about 10-15psi max. If you get up to 25psi this starts to have a negative impact on the fermentation process. It's not simply more pressure is necessarily better. I think we need to do more to educate customers about this. I think a lot of customers are often going higher in pressure than is actually desirable just because they can.

The other thing that will probably help you is if you remove the soda cap really slowly. With hops and other trub you will find this is a fairly thick paste and when you remove the soda cap you will need a few ml of this paste to come out of the cap first so the pressure is reduced before the cap is completely removed. If you do it too fast the cap does blow off.

I should also say that if you turn off the butterfly valve it's important to either remove the whole collection container fairly soon after or at least release the pressure using the PCO threaded caps. If you leave the butterfly valve closed and the collection container in place you can continue to get this separate chamber continuing to ferment and also continue to build up more pressure making the hop explosion effect greater. Really there is no reason to leave it connected once you have turned off the butterfly valve off so it should be removed and dumped.

Ive never had an issue with fermenting at 25psi but I dont put it under pressure until day 3 anyways so by that time most fermentation is done. I also let it gradually get to that pressure by day 10 its carbed, cold and ready for kegging.

 

[Mya]

So bought one of these and have no end of problems. The main bottom cone ring leaked and the collection cup leaked. Managed to get the bottom cone ring sealed after disassembling a few times, collection cup I had 4 different goes at different tightness (including different amounts of keg lube) starting from hand tight (recommended here) and working upwards, the last tightness was so tight I literally couldn't remove it without putting something through the two side ports on the collection cup just to get leverage (like you're not meant to do). Now I'm too scared to remove the collection cup (even if I could) during fermentation incase I can't even get it back on without it leaking with the fermzilla full of beer, kind of defeats the whole purpose. Doesn't help of course that the fermzilla is so light, soft and round that you can't get leverage on ANYTHING when trying to use the undoing tool.

Now after my ferment I can't remove the lid, the rubber on the undoing tool keeps slipping doesn't matter how tight I hold the rubber. Between the bottom cone and collection cup I probably spent over an hour trying to undo them now another half hour on the lid, I'm running out of patience.

Any tips on removing the lid? I only did it up a little harder than hand tight. It doesn't have pressure and it had keg lube on.

I also suspect despite everything, there is still a slow leak somewhere because the spunding valve decayed from 15 to 0 psi once fermentation was over.

 

[Schikitar]

I recently switched the carb caps over from the SS ones to the plastic ones, dunno why, just did. Anyway, one of the plastic ones leaks unless I get a pair of pliers out and tighten it right down, never had a problem with the SS ones so I'll swap them back for the next brew. I was under the impression the plastic ones would seal better!?

starting from hand tight (recommended here)

It needs to be hand tight and then a nudge on mine, others have luck backing it off just under hand tight but if you go to ridiculous tightness then expect to have to replace the seal as it's likely compromised now.. as for your lid, try the tool again but perhaps try a pipe over the handle for more leverage. Maybe pump some CO2 in their to keep the body tight for better grip, grab a second pair of hands, don't forget if you loosen the lid release the pressure before undoing all the way.. PS. This could all be bad advice!

 

[dkril]

Doesn't help of course that the fermzilla is so light, soft and round that you can't get leverage on ANYTHING when trying to use the undoing tool.

Now after my ferment I can't remove the lid, the rubber on the undoing tool keeps slipping doesn't matter how tight I hold the rubber. Between the bottom cone and collection cup I probably spent over an hour trying to undo them now another half hour on the lid, I'm running out of patience.

Any tips on removing the lid? I only did it up a little harder than hand tight. It doesn't have pressure and it had keg lube on.

I also suspect despite everything, there is still a slow leak somewhere because the spunding valve decayed from 15 to 0 psi once fermentation was over.

Whack a few PSI in in, and give it a big hug . Seirously, arms and legs around it to give you maximum grip on the body. Obviously you'll need a second pair of hands to operate whatever tool you can get to undo the lid. Maybe an old style strap wrench. I'd advise against a chain wrench, as I suspect that would probably damage the plastic.