Fermentability Of Rice Maltose Syrup

[Renegade]

After taking some reading over the past few days on a quick & basic brew I whipped up last Sunday, the SG is sitting at around 1.018, from a 1.050 OG. It's been a bit cool here so I applied some heat over the past few days to bring the temp up to around 22 degrees, but there's still no further activity.

Im wondering if the addition of chinese rice maltose syrup has introduced a low-fermenatble sugar into the mix, or whether I can expect further gravity drop. The recipe was as follows:

Pitched 22 May 09
22 litres
1 can Coopers Cerveza
500g rice maltose
1kg Coopers BE2
100g Steeped Crystal
10g Cascade Hops 6.3%AA @ 60
20g Cascade Hops 6.3%AA @ 30
20g Cascade Hops 6.3%AA @ flameout
Brewcraft Kit yeast 7g

 

[Thirsty Boy]

I don't know to what level - but I do believe that that stuff is less than 100% fermentable.

as are the BE 2 and the crystal

Still, 1.018 seems a little high - try swirling up the fermenter a little to rouse the yeast, keep up the 22 and give it another week. It might drop a few points for you even if you don't see any airlock or foaming action.

might help

 

[manticle]

Brewcraft Kit yeast 7g

That might be the problem.

That said, it is a cold time of the year and 22 May wasn't long ago.

Try the usual suspects - warming, swirling, waiting etc.

Then maybe think about extra pitching but only if it's really needed. If you do, make a starter first.

 

[Bribie G]

I've used the maltose in 4 brews already and it has certainly left a bit of body and smoothness in the brew but I haven't checked the fg, being lazy and knowing the characteristics of the various yeasts .. naughty boy.
I used it in an AG Cerveza and it ended up about the same sweetness and body as Carlton Crown so I'm happy with it but can't comment on the fg. However I have a lager in primary ATM, won't be ready for cold conditioning till the weekend but I'll post the FG then if you are still interested.

 

[Millet Man]

Rice syrup I've used in the past has been 50-70% fermentable depending on the brand so that could be the issue.

Cheers, Andrew.

 

[lanerigg]

I brewed a Brew Craft Corona kit Using there BE2 mix and 500g of there liquid rice malt. I used a American San Francisco Lager Yeast Pro-25. It fermented fine to 1025 then took a further 3 weeks to get to 1015! I did slighty shake the fermter to give the yeast a kick. Ok brew, the rice malt does give a real corona taste, but I wont redo. It came out just under 4%. Should of been 5%.

Hope that helped.

 

[phonos]

I made a beer using just the Rice Malt available at coles just to work out the answer to this question. It's lagering at the moment, but I'll bottle it in a couple of days and let you know what attenuation it had.

 

[Bribie G]

I made a beer using just the Rice Malt available at coles just to work out the answer to this question. It's lagering at the moment, but I'll bottle it in a couple of days and let you know what attenuation it had.

I was thinking of doing that as well, I'll be fascinated to know how it turns out, you are a very brave man Phonos and deserve the extreme brewers medal :icon_cheers:
I'll report on my kilo of ALDI cornflakes brew in a couple of weeks as well.

 

[phonos]

I bottled the beer last night and it was very pale/yellow (I'd guess 2-3 SRM or 4-6 EBC). I think it had taken on the colour of the hops as it was looking a little green...

The recipe I used was:

Rice Malt Extract Lager - 10 Litres
1.5kg coles Rice Malt ( I can't remember the brand name)
10g 3.7% AA Hallertau 60mins
10g 3.7% AA Hallertau 40mins
10g 3.7% AA Hallertau 20mins
22 IBUs
Yeast =SafLager S-23

OG = 1.043
FG = 1.008

Apparent attenuation = ~80%

Tasting the beer at bottling, its really bland. Its so bland that even with my dodgy palate I could taste the 'green apple' Acetaldehyde flavour young lagers can sometimes have. If you are using a large proportion of rice malt extract I'd suggest using some yeast nutrient.

The malt also seemed to have a lower sugar:water ratio than regular malt extract. Working backward, I get an extract potential of 1.034 rather than 1.037 (which is standard for liquid extract). The syrup was noticably runnier than a regular coopers tin.

Other than that, I think it should be fine to use this for an extract version of a Classic American Pilsner.

I'll take a photo and upload when I've poured myself a glass.

OT - I also did a full extract comparison between Saunders Malt Extract (which you can get from any coles or Woolworths/safeway) and the LDME from my LHBS (Absolute Homebrew - not sure which brand of malt it is). The saunders malt isn't too bad to use either.

 

[KingPython]

Champagne yeast wouldn't help- would it?

 

[KingPython]

Maybe champagne yeast can munch through the unfermentables that ale yeasts can't? I'm not sure haven't done enough research.

Champagne yeast will dry out your beer if there are still some fermentables in it.

 

[Jimbo9]

Hi

I've used rice malt in my last 3 brews (I live near to Box Hill and can get the maltose dirt cheap from the Chinese markets there) and I couldn't get the fg below 1018 in any of them. Tried swirling, warming, repitching etc. Not too worried anymore as each beer has tasted lovely before bottling - I was just concerned the fg was so high and the beer may be too sweet. I think I'll up the dex in future brews using maltose to raise the sg.

Jim

 

[Neill]

can't speak specifically about your problem, but i've had quite a few brews finish around 1018 or 1020 (ales using us05 or nottingham) from 1050 and all have turned out fine in terms of taste. A bit more body but not overly sweet or anything.

 

[Bribie G]

On Monday I'm racking a lager that contains a tub of maltose into secondary, I'll do a gravity reading then, and again on bottling. That will be a bit late for the OP but may be handy for future reference.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

Tap off precsely 1L, make sure to get some Yeast in it. Let it sit for a day to make sure that just tapping it off doesn't make anything happen at all.

Add to it exactly 20g of sugar and stir in so it dissolves. This should raise the OG to 1.027

If it starts to ferment, your yeast is still alive and able to ferment available sugars - when it stops fermenting, take a gravity. If it has dropped from 1.027 to 1.018, then the yeast has in fact eaten all the sugar you added, and stopped where it was before. The gravity has dropped to 1.018 because the little bit of alcohol made is less dense than water and has lowered the density of the whole 1L - but you still have the same amount of residual extract in there.

This would tell you that the only sugars left in your wort are unfermentable ones and nothing you do will get the gravity any lower.

At least - I reckon thats what will happen... anyone think I am giving renegade a bum steer??

TB

 

[Neill]

I bottle. My ones that have finished high are nicely carbonated. I think sometimes the yeast just isn't as vigorous as it should be. That's my only real explanation because other times with very similar recipes they've attenuated down to 1008 without issue.

 

[Jimbo9]

Hi Jim, That's handy to hear some practical experience on botling a 1018 beer without expolosions. May I ask what your priming quantities were, did you drop it down to compensate for any unexpected further activity in the bottle ?

Sounds to me like youree having repeatable high FG experience with the maltose, so it appears to be inherent with the particula addition. Did you use the whole 5oo grams?

For me, if it doesnt drop any further, Im thinking I'll perhaps use 3/4 (max) of the priming dextrose. Anyway, going to talk to the shop today and see if theres any suggestions of adding more yeast (champagne, as mentioned above).

Hi

I didn't think to reduce priming levels - but iIm pretty sure it won't matter as I think the fg is final and the maltose won't ferment anymore. I tried repitching a vigourous rehydrated us05 yeast but it had little effect.

One brew I did ith the maltose was also a cerveza which ended at 1020 - cant wait to taste it!

 

[chappo1970]

BribieG had some success with rice malt might pay to PM him.