Fat Yak - Ag Clone

[Fourstar]

personally... YES! keeping to being a clone, i'd say no.

Im sure the 1st time i had this it was before it was even being marketed. and im positive it WAS dry hopped (even though it was my 4th pint for the day~). I had it in lambsgobar in collingwood/fitzroy, It was really hazy and had an awesome grassy cascade notes to the aroma and flavour. It was very much like a balls-to-the-wall AIPA, SWMBO'd had to drag me out before i could get another one! i dont know if they did a limited run or a few trials before settiling on their current recipe but whatever i had, it ticked all the boxes. The stuff in the bottles and out of the taps now is a great beer, just a little lack luster. The hop flavour profile really reminded me of Hargreaves Hill ESB.

Back on topic, i'd probably dry hop 10g each of Sauvin and Cascade. Or you could add another 5g each of those, just to be safe :icon_drool2:

 

[T.D.]

I think even that will be too hoppy. A very subtle hop flavour is what you're after with this beer I reckon.

Also not sure NS is the best one to use. I can't put my finger on what the late hop is though (goes to show how subtle it is).

Your recipe also has JW Crystal as 34 SRM. That would be more like Caramalt's SRM.

 

[Fourstar]

I think even that will be too hoppy. A very subtle hop flavour is what you're after with this beer I reckon.
Also not sure NS is the best one to use. I can't put my finger on what the late hop is though (goes to show how subtle it is).
Your recipe also has JW Crystal as 34 SRM. That would be more like Caramalt's SRM.

Err Caramalt is like 20 SRM~ (+- 5 SRM from what i calculate). Its really really light, my beer colours match up with what i pop into beersmith and ive also adjusted the colours in Beersmith too for the JW malt snap-in. jw malts from beersmith.com are incorrect SRM values AFAIK, adjust EBC to SRM from the JW website using the average of their colour, you will be suprised. my beers where completly out of whack until i adjusted.

I somewhat agree its proabably overly hoppy. may be better @ 30-35IBU but i created the recipe based on my 1st experience w/fat yak. uber hoppy.

 

[clean brewer]

I think even that will be too hoppy. A very subtle hop flavour is what you're after with this beer I reckon.

Also not sure NS is the best one to use. I can't put my finger on what the late hop is though (goes to show how subtle it is).

Your recipe also has JW Crystal as 34 SRM. That would be more like Caramalt's SRM.

Have you seen this??? I reckon NS is the dry hop.....

:icon_cheers: CB

 

[discoloop]

^^^ For those who can't be bothered clicking through to the above link the relevant text pasted below:

Fat Yak is brewed with natural ingredients, including premium malts, American Cascade hops and a hint of New Zealand Nelson Sauvin hops.

http://www.matildabay.com.au/the-wall/news

 

[Uncle Fester]

You knew I'd have to have a go....

After positive reviews of the Pigs Arse (Pigs Fly clone) I couldn't resist.


Went into the fridge for some CC tonight. Tastes on the money out of the fermenter....

Here's the recipe... Sorry, couldn't help myself with the name...

Fat **** Pale Ale
American Pale Ale


Type: All Grain
Date: 21/07/2009
Batch Size: 20.00 L
Brewer: Uncle Fester
Boil Size: 23.47 L Asst Brewer: Princess
Boil Time: 75 min Equipment: My Equipment

Ingredients

Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Joe White Pilsner Malt (3.0 EBC) Grain 65.9 %
1.00 kg Carahell (25.0 EBC) Grain 22.0 %
0.50 kg Oats, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 11.0 %
0.10 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (118.2 EBC) Grain 1.1 %
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (60 min) Hops 15.0 IBU
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (20 min) Hops 9.1 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (20 min) Hops 4.3 IBU
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (7 min) Hops 4.0 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (7 min) Hops 1.9 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 20.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs US-05 Yeast-Ale




Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 4.6 %
Bitterness: 34.4 IBU Calories: 90 cal/l
Est Color: 12.9 EBC Color: Color

 

[MHB]

I am interested in the processes involved in making a "Clone Brew" there have been a couple (3) ideas posted in this thread about what would work, maybe we should start a new thread on recipe development, I am working on an Innis & Gunn clone, being very taken with this beer at the moment, it would be interesting to see how other people approach the process.
One question I have is WTF do I keep seeing grain specified in SRM, all the malt available is only specified in EBC, to use any other unit is as weird as seeing recipes posted in Pounds and Ounces (yes I mean you 4Star), being in a metric country cant we use the metric system?

4Star not having a shot at you personally, just genuinely bemused. I think one point you made was vital.

personally... YES! keeping to being a clone, i'd say no.

When making a clone brew we aren't trying to make a beer we like but a faithful reproduction of a beer we admire there is plenty of scope to make beer just for fun, but making a good clone recipe is a real challenge that I believe demonstrates a brewers knowledge of their system, processes and the ingredients available to them.

MHB

 

[DJR]

I seem to remember there was a post a while back about CUB purchasing all the left over NS for a particular year - they probably had to use up their stocks from the freezer somewhere so Fat Yak got a good dose of late hopped NS

Link here http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=192073

 

[Fourstar]

One question I have is WTF do I keep seeing grain specified in SRM, all the malt available is only specified in EBC, to use any other unit is as weird as seeing recipes posted in Pounds and Ounces (yes I mean you 4Star), being in a metric country cant we use the metric system?

4Star not having a shot at you personally, just genuinely bemused. I think one point you made was vital. When making a clone brew we aren't trying to make a beer we like but a faithful reproduction of a beer we admire – there is plenty of scope to make beer just for fun, but making a good clone recipe is a real challenge that I believe demonstrates a brewers knowledge of their system, processes and the ingredients available to them.MHB

No offence mate but since when is SRM imperial? Its merely a way of measuring light desnity/colour. It was developed by Americans and EBC was developed by Europeans. Upon reference, its actually caclulated via Nanometers, i guess that would make it metric.

Anyway, as for the reason, well i just prefer to use the smaller numbers. I think its OTT having to deal with 800EBC choc malt when its 400 in SRM. or 14 EBC Munich, when its 7 in SRM. I also alot easier to work out the beer colour when the increment is smaller between shades. Either way Horses for Courses. if you are confused by it, convert my recipes by 1.97

Any-hoo, I do agree with your cloning theory, theres 'trying to make a replica' or 'making a beer based on x product'.Personally whenever i 'clone', i go for building the base recipe that i think would replicate the beer. I will either then stick with it and brew it as a clone, or sleep on it and add things to it to make it more to my style, making that little/bigger brother version. I won't ever remove things from the recipe unless after tasting the base clone, i believe the ingredient was not required.

Cheers!

Edit: strange formatting

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Most brewers working in the trade here use EBC most Hommies use SRM. Each to their own.I prefer EBC as I understand what it equates to. IBU or HBU.Same difference. Neither is wrong.
GB

 

[Uncle Fester]

You knew I'd have to have a go....

After positive reviews of the Pigs Arse (Pigs Fly clone) I couldn't resist.


Went into the fridge for some CC tonight. Tastes on the money out of the fermenter....

Here's the recipe... Sorry, couldn't help myself with the name...

Fat **** Pale Ale
American Pale Ale


Type: All Grain
Date: 21/07/2009
Batch Size: 20.00 L
Brewer: Uncle Fester
Boil Size: 23.47 L Asst Brewer: Princess
Boil Time: 75 min Equipment: My Equipment

Ingredients

Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Joe White Pilsner Malt (3.0 EBC) Grain 65.9 %
1.00 kg Carahell (25.0 EBC) Grain 22.0 %
0.50 kg Oats, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 11.0 %
0.10 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (118.2 EBC) Grain 1.1 %
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (60 min) Hops 15.0 IBU
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (20 min) Hops 9.1 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (20 min) Hops 4.3 IBU
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (7 min) Hops 4.0 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (7 min) Hops 1.9 IBU
10.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [12.20%] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 20.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs US-05 Yeast-Ale




Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 4.6 %
Bitterness: 34.4 IBU Calories: 90 cal/l
Est Color: 12.9 EBC Color: Color

just kegged this baby up... Drinking nicely, 24 hours out of the fermenter!

The cascade comes through a bit too much for my liking. Next time, dry hop with NS only and see how we go, or maybe use the NZ Cascade instead.

Either way, this keg won't last long h34r:


Fester.

 

[MHB]

The reason I referred to it as an "Imperial" unit is, well the definition of SRM is something like, SRM=10 X the Absorbance of 430nm light passing through a half inch sample. Effectively the absorbance in a 5 inch glass, it's just a tooled up way of doing the old Lovibond sight tube and coloured glass disc method.

When we are using it to describe the effect a malt will have on the colour of a beer, when all the malt available to us is specified in EBC and sold to us in Kilograms, to me it makes no sense to tell people they need:-

15&1/2 Slugs of Malt, 1.89 Firkins of water and one fortieth of a Zentner of hops to make 4 Hogs Heads of beer (the hops are Northern Brewer at 7.5% AA).

Your right SRM and EBC do (now) describe the same thing, in different terms; as do all the units I used above, as do pounds and gallons it's just not real helpful.

MHB

 

[blackbock]

After tasting the Fat Yak recently, I reckon all of you are being extremely generous on the IBU level. Sure there was plenty of late floral hopping there, and I could definitely taste the resin-iness of NZ varieties, but the bitterness was almost imperceptible to my palate. To suggest that this beer could be cloned at 30-35IBU is just not right. Sub 20 is my guess!

 

[Fourstar]

to me it makes no sense to tell people they need:-
15&1/2 Slugs of Malt, 1.89 Firkins of water and one fortieth of a Zentner of hops to make 4 Hogs Heads of beer (the hops are Northern Brewer at 7.5% AA).
Your right SRM and EBC do (now) describe the same thing, in different terms; as do all the units I used above, as do pounds and gallons it's just not real helpful.
MHB

Cheers mate, i understand your point. I know how easy it is to interchange the values so converting it for explanation to EBC is no issue to me, out of habit, i always reference in SRM. Llike how the Metric system is taught in American schools along side imperial, i like my knowledge to be interchangable, especially when most of the HB resources on the interwebs are from a US source. It makes it easier to build recipes/formulate if you know what the conversion of SRM to EBC is.

I advocate all to know both types for the above reason as allot of people get it wrong, the perfect example of this is the JW malt spec are completly out in beersmith. (unsure if this has been updated recently but i did it myself manually)

 

[jayse]

After tasting the Fat Yak recently, I reckon all of you are being extremely generous on the IBU level. Sure there was plenty of late floral hopping there, and I could definitely taste the resin-iness of NZ varieties, but the bitterness was almost imperceptible to my palate. To suggest that this beer could be cloned at 30-35IBU is just not right. Sub 20 is my guess!

I think the beer should be at least 35-40IBU, the fat yak from the bottles I have had lately have not finished all that great because the bitterness to me is too low in this beer, it to me really needs at least another 5ibu to liven it up a bit and give it a more refreshing finish.
Too be honest I can't imagine buying it in bottles again but will enjoy it on tap again at the casino for sure.

So yeah I agree however I think it would be better with more bitterness.

 

[HoppingMad]

After tasting the Fat Yak recently, I reckon all of you are being extremely generous on the IBU level. Sure there was plenty of late floral hopping there, and I could definitely taste the resin-iness of NZ varieties, but the bitterness was almost imperceptible to my palate. To suggest that this beer could be cloned at 30-35IBU is just not right. Sub 20 is my guess!

Certainly something interesting going on with the late hopping. I caught some hop floating in mine the other day. The tiniest piece. Must have snuck through the filter! Unless they've taken to dry hopping their kegs? :blink: Seemed like the Nelson Sauvin to me that was 'decorating' the head on the glass - the tiniest little piece of leaf! Just guessing though.

Hopper.

 

[discoloop]

Interesting inconsistencies in this beer. I've been working through a case of the stuff all week, but had one out of the tap with lunch today. The tap product had a much more interesting late hop character than the bottled stuff... But maybe the bottles were a little on the old side, or a dud batch. The case was on special.

 

[blackbock]

I think the beer should be at least 35-40IBU, the fat yak from the bottles I have had lately have not finished all that great because the bitterness to me is too low in this beer, it to me really needs at least another 5ibu to liven it up a bit and give it a more refreshing finish.
Too be honest I can't imagine buying it in bottles again but will enjoy it on tap again at the casino for sure.

So yeah I agree however I think it would be better with more bitterness.

Glad to hear that someone else feels the same way. It would be a better beer with more IBUs but from what I tasted, the real thing just has the nice hop aromas and an inoffensive blandness!

 

[Fourstar]

Certainly something interesting going on with the late hopping. I caught some hop floating in mine the other day. The tiniest piece. Must have snuck through the filter! Unless they've taken to dry hopping their kegs? :blink: Seemed like the Nelson Sauvin to me that was 'decorating' the head on the glass - the tiniest little piece of leaf! Just guessing though.

Was like the 1st time i had it, i could have sworn it was dry hop hazy. all the other bottles and beers on tap have been crystal clear and taste nothing like the 1st batch.

 

[gava]

from the recipes posted in here. has anyone tasted theirs and how close is it? i haven't tasted one of theses but we had friends around the other week who said this was a nice drop..

was interested in brewing this and want a nice recipe.. AG ofcourse..