Fast Lager ferment

[cke11y]

I just wanted to describe my current brewing situation - see if anyone has any opinions. I don't necessarily need help I don't think... But sing out if this sounds weird...

I've brewed a triple batch (60L) Munich Helles (All fresh weyermann pils, and some hallertau). Didn't hit my 1.050 target (OG is low at 1.044 due to some clumps in my grain bag - yep I'm BIAB'ing with an engine hoist).

I pitched from a starter - this was based on Mr Malty recommendation of 4 packets of Wyeast Munich Lager in a 16L (yep 16!) starter. I made a lowish gravity (1.025) 16L starter, fermented out, crashed, decanted, then added another 16L of 1.035 - fermented this, decanted, and pitched at 9.5 degrees.

I have my FTSS and a freezer with 30L cold water reservoir controlling temp nicely between about 8.8 and 9.9 degrees.

Within 6 days, its dropped from 1.044 to 1.010 - this seems pretty quick, but then my starter was huge for the gravity of the wort.

I am thinking I will start raising to Dactyl rest temp today, then drop back to as low as I can manage with the FTSS. Does this sound like a plan????

Another question for conical fermentor owners doing lagers - when do you dump trub??? I don't want to dump any yeast that may still be necessary???

I'm not too worried - I'm a pretty relaxed brewer - I am just keen to do some learning on this situation.

TIA.

 

[Goose]

I am thinking I will start raising to Dactyl rest temp today, then drop back to as low as I can manage with the FTSS. Does this sound like a plan????

All looks fine to me.

Except I would do the "forced" diacetyl test first. You may not need a diacetyl rest given the maount of yeast you used and the success of your fermentation.

 

[cke11y]

Thanks for the tip on Diacetyl test!

I performed this test and my heated sample smelled of butter.

Off to a diacetyl rest we go.

Just again, when do people dump out of the bottom valve of their conicals when doing a lager? This is my first lager outside of a carboy, so I assume just do it after D-rest as though you have racked the beer off the muck at the bottom? Let the suspended yeast do the rest?

Cheers

 

[Black n Tan]

I pitched from a starter - this was based on Mr Malty recommendation of 4 packets of Wyeast Munich Lager in a 16L (yep 16!) starter. I made a lowish gravity (1.025) 16L starter, fermented out, crashed, decanted, then added another 16L of 1.035 - fermented this, decanted, and pitched at 9.5 degrees.


Within 6 days, its dropped from 1.044 to 1.010 - this seems pretty quick, but then my starter was huge for the gravity of the wort.

All my lagers hit FG in about 5-7 days so that is not unusual if you pitch a big healthy starter.

Now let's talk about that starter, that is huge and seems unnecessary. 4 packets in a 16L starter then stepped to another 16L starter for 60L of low gravity wort, seems over the top. Are you sure that's what MrMalty says?? For a 50L batch of lager I usually do a 1- 2L then 4l stepped starter on a stir-plate from 1 pack of yeast. With starters you normally step up in size ie. 1L then 4L, otherwise the health of the yeast can be compromised. Do you have a stir plate?

EDIT: I find this calculator helpful for doing stepped starters
http://www.yeastcalc.co/yeast-pitch-rate-and-starter-calculator

 

[Grainer]

16L starter ..OMG

 

[cke11y]

Right... So I should clarify something....

Mr Malty definitely said 16L and 4 packets.

I did this (above) and went about my brew day... One of the carabiners that holds my bag off the bottom of my 114L Blichmann was in the wrong tabs of my bag and was touching the bottom. 3/4 of the way through the stepped mash I smelt chemicals, raised the bag, and all the grain fell out... whoops! Took me almost a week to get the charcoal off the bottom of my pot.

My starter was at the perfect stage before this catastrophe. Without thinking or researching, I just decanted and tossed in another 16L of starter wort. This may have been the wrong thing to do? unsure...

SO yeh, the starter is super aggressive.

I don't have a stir plate. Besides, would they handle a 20L better bottle? hahaha... ahhhh 16L starter! fun and games!

 

[rude]

If you just did a simple starter then 16 Litres depending on viability would be about right

As Black & Tan said 5x to 10x step up is the best for yeast health

You need a stir plate, easy to make, less size volume starter needed for same number of cells

Good luck for the rest of you're beer report back on you"re results it might be a ball tearer

 

[Black n Tan]

My starter was at the perfect stage before this catastrophe. Without thinking or researching, I just decanted and tossed in another 16L of starter wort. This may have been the wrong thing to do? unsure...

Thanks for explaining what happened and your thinking. That starter would be fine sitting in the fridge for a couple of weeks, probably longer: just decant the spent wort. if you bought a stir-plate it would almost have paid for itself, with the savings in yeast and malt just for this batch. The digital stir-plate (http://www.digitalhomebrew.com/digital-stirplate-v3 or available from the site sponsors) are the ducks nuts and quite affordable (no affiliation). A stir-plate is a pretty necessary piece of equipment for good lager brewing IMO. You can make one from a computer fan if you're on a budget.