E-keggle Won't Maintain Boil

[matho]

it looks like you would be losing about 1.2kw of heat through the top of the pot and about 0.4 - 0.6 kw through the sides at boiling, I would insulate the sides, I have used camping mat and gaff tape on my HLT and it has worked well

cheers

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

it looks like you would be losing about 1.2kw of heat through the top of the pot and about 0.4 - 0.6 kw through the sides at boiling, I would insulate the sides, I have used camping mat and gaff tape on my HLT and it has worked well

cheers

How did you work that out?
I need to know that sort of info for my electric setup.
Nev

 

[QldKev]

How did you work that out?
I need to know that sort of info for my electric setup.
Nev

+1, I would like to work out my pot's losses

 

[iralosavic]

it looks like you would be losing about 1.2kw of heat through the top of the pot and about 0.4 - 0.6 kw through the sides at boiling, I would insulate the sides, I have used camping mat and gaff tape on my HLT and it has worked well

cheers

Interesting! Thanks, mate. It would stand to reason that using a lid that narrows the opening diameter would make the most significant difference. I will try camping mat/gaffer tape (I have BCF vouchers anyway) first and move onto a custom lid next. Would a concave slope to the opening reduce the likelihood of condensate collecting around the lid?

Cheers.

 

[matho]

all the Info I used came from the attached PDF


View attachment Section_18___Technical_Data.pdf

I have made up a spreadsheet but it doesn't take into account losses through the side

View attachment element_sizing.xls

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

all the Info I used came from the attached PDF


View attachment 52988

I have made up a spreadsheet but it doesn't take into account losses through the side

View attachment 52989

Thanks Matho
Can you drop a screen shot of the xls file with a quick rundown on how to set it up ?
I had a look and I didnt see how it all related.
Nev

 

[matho]

I used this when I was working out the braumiser

up the top you put in the volume and wattage

then in the middle the intial water temp

then down in the set temp fields you put in your desired temperature steps, to make it work better if your doing a large step say 19 to 100, put mulitple steps in because the spreadsheet calculates the losses at the highest step temp, if you put 100 in the mash in step the losses you be 54% and the time would be too long

last put in the diameter of the pot

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

View attachment 52998

I used this when I was working out the braumiser

up the top you put in the volume and wattage

then in the middle the intial water temp

then down in the set temp fields you put in your desired temperature steps, to make it work better if your doing a large step say 19 to 100, put mulitple steps in because the spreadsheet calculates the losses at the highest step temp, if you put 100 in the mash in step the losses you be 54% and the time would be too long

last put in the diameter of the pot

Thanks I appreciate the effort.
Nev

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

View attachment 52998

I used this when I was working out the braumiser

up the top you put in the volume and wattage

then in the middle the intial water temp

then down in the set temp fields you put in your desired temperature steps, to make it work better if your doing a large step say 19 to 100, put mulitple steps in because the spreadsheet calculates the losses at the highest step temp, if you put 100 in the mash in step the losses you be 54% and the time would be too long

last put in the diameter of the pot

So % loss = W ?

 

[iralosavic]

I was just wondering how you calculated loss of walls and opening... I looked over the spreadsheet, but haven't read the PDF yet.

 

[stux]

what; in the wife? :huh:

In the time off around the birth

 

[kelbygreen]

you calling her fat now?? gee lucky she isnt on the forum

 

[matho]

So % loss = W ?

it was just something I was playing with doesn't do anything down the bottom

iralosavic,
the spreadsheet will tell you the loss out of the top of the pot and from the top graph on page 18.4 I guessed the losses would be somewhere around curve a , given that the two styles of kegs in oz has a side surface area of 0.5 - 0.6 m2 then losses would be somewhere around 0.5kW, neither are perfect figures but they are ball park.

cheers

 

[iralosavic]

it was just something I was playing with doesn't do anything down the bottom

iralosavic,
the spreadsheet will tell you the loss out of the top of the pot and from the top graph on page 18.4 I guessed the losses would be somewhere around curve a , given that the two styles of kegs in oz has a side surface area of 0.5 - 0.6 m2 then losses would be somewhere around 0.5kW, neither are perfect figures but they are ball park.

cheers

I see... so do you know if negating the 500w loss via insulation will allow the kettle to maintain 4c higher or do you reckon I'm going to have to play with a narrower opening (new lid)?

Either way, foam mats are $12 from BCF and I'm sure they exceed the keg dimensions of 53cm high 126cm Diameter, so I'll have a play with that.

 

[manticle]

I use a 2400 over the side in a keggle and it gets to a perfect rolling boil. Slower than when I use a 4 ring but easy maintenance once boiling.

I wouldn't put a lid on at all once boiling (preboil is fine). Something either wrong with your element, electricity supply or the keggle is losing too much heat somehow. Could try insulating it with neoprene as suggested.

 

[DKS]

I see... so do you know if negating the 500w loss via insulation will allow the kettle to maintain 4c higher or do you reckon I'm going to have to play with a narrower opening (new lid)?

Just a point here mate, I feel I should speak up. This could lead to bad astrigency issues with your beers I had continuous score sheets saying my beers had astringency probs. A narrow 300mm openning in my keggle was the prob. I moved to an ali pot and not an issue since.
My tip.... Dont boil with a lid on at all and have as large an openning as pos. Find another way.
Daz

 

[QldKev]

I agree with DKS,

REAL BREWERS BOIL HARD

 

[matho]

I see... so do you know if negating the 500w loss via insulation will allow the kettle to maintain 4c higher or do you reckon I'm going to have to play with a narrower opening (new lid)?

Either way, foam mats are $12 from BCF and I'm sure they exceed the keg dimensions of 53cm high 126cm Diameter, so I'll have a play with that.

I would definitely put insulation on the side of the pot after all 500w is almost 1/4 of your power, the nominal voltage in Australia is slowly moving to 230v +10% - 6%, your element is rated at 2200w at a nominal voltage of probably 230v which means the resistance of the element would be about 24ohms, now if you are a fair way from the transformer in your street and the volts are at 216v the power output of your element would be p = v2/r = 1944 watts, now if you were at the upper limit which is 253v then the power would be 2667 watts and you would be blowing light bulbs more regularly. These are extreme examples most of the time the volts should be somewhere around the 230v- 245v, it all depends on the load of your street circuit and the size of the cables on your street, its a fine juggling act between the people close the the transformer having to high volts in lightly loaded times and the people at the end of the run having too little volts in heavily loaded times.

I would think with insulation and the lid on until it is boiling you will be fine.

cheers steve

 

[iralosavic]

Kev - I want to boil like a man!

Steve- thanks for the info mate. I will definitely see how I go after wrapping in camping mat material. Do you just take all connections out, wrap it and mark hole locations to cut then fit it back on with connections?

 

[QldKev]

Kev - I want to boil like a man!

Steve- thanks for the info mate. I will definitely see how I go after wrapping in camping mat material. Do you just take all connections out, wrap it and mark hole locations to cut then fit it back on with connections?

Jumping on the question for Steve

I would cut it/ mount so you can easily remove it, just to make cleaning easy.

QldKev