Coopers Pale Ale Yeast

[fergi]

i have recultured coopers pale ale yeast, i made up about 1 litre as a starter and b4 i tossed it into my brew i poured a little into a glass to make sure it was ok, i know it shouldnt sound surprising but it was so much like the coopers pale ale that we buy , and this was just malt that had been feeding the pale ale yeast. so i wonder if any KK brewers have made a coopers pale ale with this recultered yeast and what did you add in for the extra fermentables, what was the end product flavor. i am thinking

1....can coopers pale ale
2....1kg ldme.
3....1 litre starter of coopers pale ale yeast culture
4....maybe some grain of some type to steep and add a bit of freshness and flavor, but not too much as to take away the properties of the original yeast
5 ... make it up to 21 litres
this will be akeg beer
cheers
fergi

 

[buttersd70]

On the right track, fergi, but you will also need a bit of extra hop to balance the extra malt...I would presume POR, probably 15min for about 6-7ibu ish off the top of my head...but guessing on that, Aussie beer is not my forte.

 

[benh82]

I know that this is a real newbie question, but what are the actual steps in culturing a yeast? Is it as simple as saving the bottom third of a stubbie and adding LDME? If so, how much LDME, and how long should you let it sit? Should you temp control it same as you would the wort?

Sorry for the 'beer-making-101' style question, but have seen so many references to reculturing yeast that I would love to know how!

Ben

 

[Supra-Jim]

hi Benny,

There is a PDF on this in the articles section of this forum. But the summary basically goes like this:

Boil 1 ltr of water and add 100gms of LDME and boil to 10 minutes. Put the lid on the saucepan and let it cool for a little while (sit in a sink of cold water). Then transfer your wort to a santised container (i use a 2 ltr juice bottle with an air lock on the lid). Allow this to cool to around 20-22 deg. You can just loosly place the lid on and then press some alu foil over the top to protect from nasties.

Now the fun bit, get two stubbie and pour out the good stuff into some glasses. Try to keep as much of the yeasties in the bottom of the bottle. Give this a good swirl to get all of the yeast into the remaining beer. Add these to your bottle. Give the bottle a good shake.

Now wait for a few days, keeping the temp around 20deg.

 

[Supra-Jim]

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...;showarticle=40

Here is the link for you. Good luck, i will be doing this tonight.

 

[muckey]

Back to the original question, butters mentioned 6-7 IBU, I think the 15 minute boil is about right but I thing 1 kg of LDME is going to need closer to 10 IBU.

I remember a couple of BMD kits tried quite some time ago, I forget the actual amounts but I tried to push the malt without actually having to do a boil to up the hopping, turns out they ended up needing another 6 - 7 IBU with only about half the amount of LDME if memory serves me.

in the end, when using that kit with around 400g LDME even dry hopping let the sweetness come through a little more than I would have liked.
(dry hopping doesn't give any extra IBU, the extra hop flavour/aroma gives an impression of bitterness)

 

[Adamt]

As an AG beer I would make this with all malt. However in a kit i'd probably use some sugaz to lighten the body a little; extract is nowhere near as fermentable as you can make mash liquor. Maybe go 600g LDME and 400g dextrose, or 700/300.

I agree with the others about the hops.

 

[rich_lamb]

1) Good point about the shuga; as extract is not so fermentable and a coopers clone should be aiming for an FG of about 1.006 or therabouts. 400g would be the absolute max I would have thought, but it's hard to guage with extract

2) On the plus side this is one of the chainsaw yeasts that cuts through just about anything, so attenuation will be better than expected anyway (as will krausen - watch out for blowoff)

3) Err on the side of MORE hops with the coopers clone, especially if the FG will be low (yes, I know that may sound counter intuitive, but higher attenuation supports more IBU's)

4) Pretty hard to go wrong with an Aussie ale. It's a basic beer so anything you do will be in the ballpark.

 

[malbur]

Hi Fergi,

I have had a few atempts at trying to get some where near this style, just go easy with the POR hops there got some kick.
What i have been using is.
Coopers APA kit
Coopers BE2 1kg
250g LDME
Hops
Cascade 10g 20min
POR 10g 10min
Cascade 5g 5 min
Coopers bottle yeast.
you get OG around 1042 and FG 1010
it does't taste to bad.

malbur.

 

[benny_bjc]

When starting up the yeast culture do you need to use LDME or can I use the equivalent amount of Dextrose instead? Will it be much different?

 

[0M39A]

When starting up the yeast culture do you need to use LDME or can I use the equivalent amount of Dextrose instead? Will it be much different?

without a doubt you need to use malt. dextrose wont have the nutriants in it that the yeast needs to reproduce.

also, malbur, why are you using cascade in a coopers clone? very out of place.

 

[fergi]

thanks for the ideas there guys, on the reculturing the coopers ale yeast this is the second one that i have done, the first one i started the yeast off on dextrose only . i think it was only 250 grms to begin with then i uped it to 500 ml with ldme ,and then up to 1 litre with the malt, this was the coopers pale ale with a tiny critters adda pack and this has been the best kit beer i have ever tasted, this time i just went all ldme and pitched that one into the brew last nite.

cheers
fergi

 

[Bribie G]

< dons flameproof suit>
Personally I dislike Coopers Sparkling Ale and Pale Ale intensely - so have never been tempted to culture the yeast from the bottle.
<removes flameproof suit>

On the other hand Coopers Stout is the brew that God Drinks after golf.

However it is pretty well a given that the yeast is NOT the yeast that is used to brew the beer - it is the yeast that is introduced at bottling stage to carry out the secondary in the bottle, presumably added to a filtered or even pasteurised beer? Thus not necessarily the most appropriate yeast to use in primary fermentation.

A lot of the attraction of Coopers recultured yeast seems to lie in a sort of triumphant "woohoo I've hacked this ******* and got a genuine industrial yeast for free ....suckeeeerrrssss :beerbang: "

I would imagine that the actual yeast used in the Primary fermentation of Coopers ales is locked up tighter than Fort Knox?? Just puzzled as to why so many home brewers spend so much time on reculturing Coopers bottle conditioning yeast strain, or am I missing something here?

 

[tdack]

I think someone on the forum has received a reply from Coopers indicating that the yeast in the Sparkling and Pale ales is actually the same as the stuff that they ferment with.

I recultured some, mainly for the self satisfaction of knowing I could. It was also a good learning experience for stepping up salvaged yeasts from my own batches.

 

[fergi]

I think someone on the forum has received a reply from Coopers indicating that the yeast in the Sparkling and Pale ales is actually the same as the stuff that they ferment with.

I recultured some, mainly for the self satisfaction of knowing I could. It was also a good learning experience for stepping up salvaged yeasts from my own batches.

yes you are correct troy, the yeast is the same as the main fermentation yeast in the coopers pale ale, see my original post, just with ldme and a bit of the bottle yeast cultered up for a starter it definately has the exact coopers flavor from the pale ale bottle, and bribie i certainly agree with you mate about the stout, now if only i could play golf like god
cheers
fergi

 

[buttersd70]

Back to the original question, butters mentioned 6-7 IBU, I think the 15 minute boil is about right but I thing 1 kg of LDME is going to need closer to 10 IBU.

I remember a couple of BMD kits tried quite some time ago, I forget the actual amounts but I tried to push the malt without actually having to do a boil to up the hopping, turns out they ended up needing another 6 - 7 IBU with only about half the amount of LDME if memory serves me.

in the end, when using that kit with around 400g LDME even dry hopping let the sweetness come through a little more than I would have liked.
(dry hopping doesn't give any extra IBU, the extra hop flavour/aroma gives an impression of bitterness)

You're right, now that you mention it.....but it was 500g malt and 5IBU needed.....so 10 would be closer to the mark...this would only give 0.56 bugu, though, the coopers pale ale is not very bitter (both in kits and the real deal....its not bitter enough for me, and I'm not a fan of bitter beer at all). So more certainly wouldn't hurt...maybe 12ish?

And as for the sugaz.....this is one of the (very) few times where I would agree, it probably would need a little. It's meant to be a low bodied beer.....just make it dex, not table sugar :lol:

Edit....and the Coopers using the primary strain in the bottle has been addressed several times...someone (I think it might have been Braufrau?) contacted coopers, and they confirmed via email that this is correct for pale and sparkling

 

[seemax]

Many months ago I did a K&K using this yeast.

1 can Pale Ale
1 BE2
5 IBU's of PoR
1L starter from 2 stubbies

It fermented wildy at <20C for days and I left it for 2 weeks. Produced a lot of quite nasty fruity gas. At bottling time it tasted, hmm, awful. After 4 weeks it turned out drinkable. Too thin for my liking, bitterness was about right though. Comparable to the real thing, not terribly!!

A mate drank a slab of this stuff and was over the moon

 

[np1962]

BribieG,

Here's the link indicating the Cooper's bottling yeast is the same strain as used for primary fermentation.

Wally

This from the Coopers Virtual Brewery Tour:-
"Beer is piped from the fermenting vessels through a centrifuge to remove the yeast and small amounts of gelatinised proteins.
After clarification, the beer is seeded with fresh yeast (same strain as used in primary fermentaion), primed with liquid sugar and transferred to a holding tank for same day packaging."

Take the tour Here follow conditioned beer tour step 11.

Nige.