Continuous Step Mash Rise From 62c To 77c

[Hogan]

Since incorporating a motor drive stirrer into my mash tun I have had the ability to conduct step mashes by direct heat. Since that time I have been searching for the right step profiles to use in a variety of mashes. Any brewer who does step mashes will know that there are hundreds of suggested step / temp / duration profiles on record for all types of recipes. These profiles can be attributable to a single style or many styles of beer, so what constitutes the right profile can be very confusing. The only true method of finding the profile that fits your specific recipe is by trial & trial & trial.

I did however tune into a BN podcast recently where the brewer from Meantime Brewery, London, Steve Schmidt (sic) was interviewed for Jamils CYBI show. Steve gave his receipe for Meantime IPA which included the following mash schedule.

Mash in @ 62c.
Hold mash for 30 minutes.
Raise mash to 77c over 30 minutes (1c every 2 minutes)
Mash out.

The duration of this mash will give a sufficient rest at the 'B' amylase end of the spectrum to produce a good fermentable wort and the subsequent slow rise through the remaining 'B" temps and then through the 'A' temps up to denature and mashout is meant to give the best results possible from both.

I tried this profile out on an IPA (6.8 kg grain for final 25 lt volume) I cooked yesterday and I must admit I was a bit reticent at not doing my usual mash rests of 15 minutes at 62c. rising to 45 minutes at 67c rising to mashout.

Once I got the flame right to give me the 1c every 2 minutes rise time the 1hr 10 minute mash went smoothly. The first runnings hit 1.098 and the pre boil and post boil targets (1.053 and 1.066) were right on target. The wort has a nice krausen on it this morning and the quality of the fermentation is yet to be seen.

This profile was only suggested for the IPA but I would be interested to hear from other step mashers who have used a similar profile for other styles of beer.


Cheers, Hoges.

 

[raven19]

Hoges, I certainly find with my electric RIMS, that if I mash in lowish (say around 55 ish) then ramp to 66. Rest for 40 - 60mins then ramp out at 78 (over 10 - 15 mins) that my FG is certainly lower (1004 - 1008) compared to me mashing in at 66 then ramping up after 60 min to 78 deg (FG 1008 - 1012+) {brew dependant of course}.

I am yet to do a continuous ramp on the mash from go to whoa though.

My efficiency tends to hover around 70% with my current batch sparge technique and MM2 crush regardless.

 

[Hogan]

Hoges, I certainly find with my electric RIMS, that if I mash in lowish (say around 55 ish) then ramp to 66. Rest for 40 - 60mins then ramp out at 78 (over 10 - 15 mins) that my FG is certainly lower (1004 - 1008) compared to me mashing in at 66 then ramping up after 60 min to 78 deg (FG 1008 - 1012+) {brew dependant of course}.

I am yet to do a continuous ramp on the mash from go to whoa though.

My efficiency tends to hover around 70% with my current batch sparge technique and MM2 crush regardless.

Raven - For the IPA mash I set my brewhouse efficiency (single batch sparge) to 77% and achieved that with the 'efficiency pre-boil' being 84%. This is about 6% better than the previous step mashes for this recipe.

I previously did a protein rest at 54c but found that I was not seeing any particular benefit as opposed to mashing in at b amylase temp.

The FG of this wort should go some ways in determining if the continuous ramp from 62 to 77 with no stops in between gives a better fermentation result.


Cheers, Hoges.

 

[MHB]

Step mashing really is a descendant of the European decoction brewing methods; these were worked out imperially, before we even had thermometers to cope with malt that was generally undermodified and higher in protein.

In the UK with their very low protein and very well modified malt Isothermal mashing is/was the norm.

The two methods lead to some interesting knock-on effects, like the prevalence of Party-Gyle, as less water is mashed in there is the option to do a couple of batch sparges and make several beers from the one mash in the UK and single beer coming from the thinner continental mashes.

Continuous heating is another method common enough in Belgian and other low-country breweries. Again it's a way to handle European malt.

Some of the better authors (going to point at Graham Wheeler) have over the years had very good access to breweries and have reported what the brewers do, not necessarily why. If you looking at a recipe for a beer that's been around for a long time you have to think that some of what they do might be redundant with modern malt and brewing systems, but they are looking for a particular flavour so the wont be changing what works.

All the different enzymes available to a brewer (nearly 30) can be used to make changes to the beer if you really want to get your head around enzymes (and that's what mash temperature is all about) I can't think of a better place than Braukaiser, the mash theory section is very detailed and quite easy to follow.

Have fun

MHB

 

[Thirsty Boy]

I do "step" mashes, but tend to think about the process as a ramp with a series of pauses, rather than a series of steps with ramps in between. So when designing a mash profile... Basically i am looking at a continuous ramp from 56 to 78 degrees, and i will insert "rests" at certain temperatures to achieve certain things. If there is nothing specific that i think needs doing at a given temperature - then i ramp right through it.

I could easily see myself not thinking that i needed to rest at any particular temperature and just going continuously from A to Z... My system probably ramps faster than ideal for that... But you can turn the flame down. Especially on something like an IPA that could easily be made with an isothermal mash at say 66. A continuous ramp from 56 - 76 would basially = an average of 66 with maybe a tendany towards being a little drier. I think i would almost see a continuous ramp mash as more of a variation of an isothermal mash than of step mashing. With the average temperature more or less being equivalent to the "single" temperature in an isothermal mash.

The rest at a given beta temp and ramp straight to mash out makes a lot of sense to me and i have done that quite a few times with good results - and i am very familiar with at least one commercial brewery that mashes that way every time.

Sounds like your stirred mash system is working really well - any more refinements since last time you posted pics??

TB

 

[speedie]

tb
the use of a stirring system in step mashing should always produce better results as there is much more contact for hydrolisis to do its job
a way to test this would be try the same base profile mashing with and without aggitation
and monitor extract % from each batches

 

[Hogan]

I do "step" mashes, but tend to think about the process as a ramp with a series of pauses, rather than a series of steps with ramps in between. So when designing a mash profile... Basically i am looking at a continuous ramp from 56 to 78 degrees, and i will insert "rests" at certain temperatures to achieve certain things. If there is nothing specific that i think needs doing at a given temperature - then i ramp right through it.

I could easily see myself not thinking that i needed to rest at any particular temperature and just going continuously from A to Z... My system probably ramps faster than ideal for that... But you can turn the flame down. Especially on something like an IPA that could easily be made with an isothermal mash at say 66. A continuous ramp from 56 - 76 would basially = an average of 66 with maybe a tendany towards being a little drier. I think i would almost see a continuous ramp mash as more of a variation of an isothermal mash than of step mashing. With the average temperature more or less being equivalent to the "single" temperature in an isothermal mash.

The rest at a given beta temp and ramp straight to mash out makes a lot of sense to me and i have done that quite a few times with good results - and i am very familiar with at least one commercial brewery that mashes that way every time.

Sounds like your stirred mash system is working really well - any more refinements since last time you posted pics??

TB

Thanks for your input MHB - I found that 'Science of Mashing' site some time ago and often refer back to it.

TB - I agree with you that 'ramping' is a more accurate term for the profile that I described when heating continuously from A - Z. However as this is a continuous ramp any pauses along the way would revert it back to a step mash. The Meantime brewer obviously uses different profiles and his Meantime London Porter starts off with a 30 minute rest at 62c then a 20 minute rest at 72c before mash out at 78c. And I would call this a step mash as there is a break (rest) between the first and last stages.

What puzzled me initially with these numbers for a ramp mash was that I had always thought that to brew a lager, use a long rest at beta and a shorter rest at alpha. The opposite applying to ales. The ramp routine changes that concept as there is always a good rest at beta but a slow ramp up to mash out which obviously provides all the necessary alpha requirement. The half proof of this is in the efficiency numbers I achieved and a satisfactorily low FG after ferment should add confirmation - in my mind at least. And I do agree that at prima facie the ramp routine could not be applicable to all profiles.

Not that I am concerned with time during cooking but the ramp process has dropped a previous 90 minute mash down to just one hour with equal if not better results.

Yes I am very happy with my stirrer and have made no major changes to it over the past two years but I am considering adopting a quieter motor. The greek rotisserie motor that I am using tends to overheat and makes a hell of a racket.

I said to a brewing mate this morning. "We have known each other for three years and have contact with you every other day but we still continually find new subjects to discuss and implement on brewing equipment and techniques."


Cheers, Hoges.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

Excellent, i always thought it cool that someone was going down the road of a stirred direct fired tun, i've so often thought about that myself. One of these days maybe when the rims gives me a hard time one brew, or when i am bored and feel the urge to tinker seriously.