Cold Conditioning

[churchy]

Hi guys I hope this post is in the correct section.After cold conditioning my brew has finished the temperature of the beer will be around 3C , do I bottle as is or bring the beer up to room tempreture.

Thanks Andrew

 

[Adamt]

Safest to rack to your bottling bucket and let it warm up to room temperature. If you bottle whilst cold you may end up with overcarbonated beer.

 

[buttersd70]

I dont see how bringing up to temp then bottling vs bottling then bringing up to temp could make any difference in the level of carbonation. Same amount of fermentables will be added, they will be left at the same temperature whilst carbonating, so what difference?

 

[Tyred]

I only thing I can think of with this is that a colder beer will hold more CO2 than one at room temperature. That could increase carbonation, but I don't know if would be enough for overcarbonation.

Also, the cooler beer may be more dense and may expand as it comes up to temperature. If the bottle is capped then more gas will be absorbed by the beer as there will be less headspace. However, I am not sure if this is correct.

 

[PostModern]

I dont see how bringing up to temp then bottling vs bottling then bringing up to temp could make any difference in the level of carbonation. Same amount of fermentables will be added, they will be left at the same temperature whilst carbonating, so what difference?

When beer is colder it can hold more CO2. Warming it will make it release any CO2 in suspension, so you can calculate the priming rate more easily. Of course, it will only gain more CO2 if the yeast continues working as the temp drops, so it's a bit grey. The best priming calculators will include a variable for the temperature at the end of fermentation.

 

[wambesi]

Funnily enough a subject I was researching a little today.

According to Beersmith if my porter is at 21deg then I should prime with 131g Dex, but if it's at 4deg then I should prime with 77g.
It's all to do (as most will know) with the residual amounts of CO2 left in the beer.

The big question I had was what temp do you use. Fermentation (or average) temp? Final temp? Final temp if CC'ing?

According to an Oz CraftBrewer article it states:

Considering that less CO2 can be held in the beer at higher temperature, the short answer is to use the highest temperature the beer has been at since the end of fermentation, since we expect the CO2 level to come to a new equilibrium if rested at a higher temperature.

So if thats the case I should use the 131 dex, so has anyone actually looked more into this?
Sorry to hijack the thread Andrew but it is all kind of relevant

EDIT: Was writing this as PM wrote his replies, but my question still stands which temp? And since cooling and then warming it back up does it go back to the same levels it was at? Or am I now confusing myself.

 

[Goofinder]

I'd go with the higher temp. I primed a beer based on a carbonation calculator going by the temp it was at when I bottled (rather than the highest it had been) that ended up way under carbonated.

I assume it's got to do with the CO2 coming out of solution as it warms up, but not being re-absorbed if it cools down again.

 

[A3k]

Id have to agree with goofinder,

If its at room temperature in the fermenter, then put into a sealed cube with very little head space, then put in the fridge, theres not going to be any CO2 to go back into the beer.

If youre going to use the wambesi added, give it a swirl the few days prior to racking, or let it sit a few days after fermentation has finsished to make sure the excess CO2 has dissipated to equilibrium. This will help prevent what they call supersaturation, which I take as the CO2 levels being above theoretical equilibrium.

cheers
Al

 

[A3k]

The link wambesi added has a section called Variable temperature History. Its got some pretty good points to consider, such as lager yeasts can still ferment at lager temperatures, and actually mentions to use the highest post fermentation temperature to calculate the abount of sugar to prime with.

Sorry for the ramble.

Al

 

[buttersd70]

my prior comment is based pretty much on what has been expanded upon. ie fermentation is complete, highest temp is used for the calculation, reabsorption is not considered, and a calculator with residual co2 in the workings being used.
When thats the case, just going off the beers I've bottled, both cold and then allowed to warm, and those that were warmed and then primed, any inconsistancies have been so minimal as to be discarded.

Edit: I don't do lagers, so they may react differently due to the yeast being able to work at lower temperatures, as has been stated by others in this thread. Just thought I'd point out that lagers are an unknown for me.

 

[gregs]

Hi guys I hope this post is in the correct section.After cold conditioning my brew has finished the temperature of the beer will be around 3C , do I bottle as is or bring the beer up to room tempreture.

Thanks Andrew

Think about it, if your brew is at 3 dergees & you bottle at that temperature your yeast won't kick in untill the bottle & content warms back to the required temp. So it dosn't realy matter if you bottle when your brew is below the (yeast working temp) as long as it sits at the correct temp to carbinate over time.

 

[Bribie G]

I now chill and polyclar all my brews except my toucan stout 9% Xmas brew and let them warm up afterwards to room temp. I bottled a Scottish Ale when it was still cold and had been sitting in secondary for a while in the fridge. I was in a hurry and had to do it that day. After ten days in the bottle although I used what should have been an appropriate priming rate, it's a tad over carbed with a stout type head. I reckon I should have left it for two days to warm up and bleed off excess co2 then bottle.

It looks impressive, though

 

[buttersd70]

I think the main contributor to this is taking into acount the co2 left in the beer for the temp that it finishes in primary....as I said, I've done it both ways with no noticable difference. (thats what she said....sorry, been drinking :lol: )

One thing of importance though; I've only ever, in all the brews that I've done, had 1 overcarbed beer. And that particular issue was more due to inattention when priming more than anything else. And on that occasion, priming and bottling was done after the beer had warmed up. Not that this was the cause. Just highlighting that no probs have been encountered with bottling cold and warming up.