Clay's Cider (SIMPLE!)

[manticle]

. This board used to be populated by people who knew how to do stuff and would share that knowldge

Many of them were kind and patient with noobs. I remember some of the stupid things that came from me when I was young and enthusiastic only a few years ago. People (in the main) treated me with some gentleness and I learned a lot.

I see your main point and agree with it but, like others I think your introduction to it would be more effective if phrased differently. You don't teach someone to swim by standing on their fingers when they hold onto the edge of the swimming pool.

 

[pk.sax]

I, for one find your analogy inaccurate here tickler. Sic is jumping right in and making a tutorial. Not exactly holding on to the edge... kinda like, hey kids, it's my first day, I brought a whistle, now, everyone line up by the board and jump when I say.

PS: Did you start making guides when you were 'young and enthusiastic'?

PPS: If it weren't for the sheer cheek of the thread all it'd have got would be DASFFS

 

[manticle]

While I don't think the guide is necessary, the analogy of 'I brought a whistle....' is no better than mine in regards to the pool.

Let's forget the analogies for a second - I suggest there are more effective ways of communicating than some of those encountered thus far.

 

[pk.sax]

I can agree to that.

 

[jyo]

My whistle is always small when in the pool, but that's only because the water is cold.

 

[Fossey]

and whether I've made 5 posts or 5000...

Someone who has made 5 posts on one forum may have made 5000 on another, you have to start somewhere. Forums are for advice based on personal experience so take what you want from each post and offer up what you deem appropriate.

 

[Bribie G]

My cider yeast has arrived in the mail. Tomorrow I shall purchase 20L of supermarket juice and pour it into my 20L BCF fermenter, add a tsp of CraftBrewer yeast nutrient, a kilo of da sugaz, ferment for a week or so and then, without a hydro reading, rack it into a keg and after a couple of days start drinking.

It will be refreshing, fruity and drinkable as always. Often the preceding keg of cider will take a while to serve so the new batch will be dryish so I backsweeten with apple juice. Other times the old keg will have been drunk quickly so the new batch will still be unattenuated and sweetish. bonus.

Then it will continue and work slowly in the keg, producing its own gas so I can keep the cylinder tuned off. bonus.

As it becomes more dry I will backsweeten in the glass with apple juice.

beer / cider: different brews, different rules.

 

[bum]

To the wankers (read: Bum etc) that decided it'd be more constructive to throw out insults without substance

In my own defence (assuming this is something I'm allowed to do), I haven't really issued any personal remarks. I have, however, seen a great many of them directed my way and I haven't even responded in kind.

FYI - The other thread that you mention which yes, is a lot better than mine, was posted a couple of hours after this one.

Shit, I am sorry about that then. Not sure how I buggered up the timing stuff. I guess I just assumed it was more recent as it was active but with fewer posts. MY bad.

Think, if I didn't, your existences would have been that little bit duller, not having a person to aim your flamegun at for a couple of days.

No shortage of targets, I'm afraid. Also, you might want to read the thread again - I'm actually fairly on topic throughout. Swears don't turn a real post in to a flame.

I suggest there are more effective ways of communicating than some of those encountered thus far.

I cannot imagine a more effective way to say "**** this thread" than saying "**** this thread". I am not sure why you think my intention is (or why it should be) helping OP. OP has clearly read the recent cider tutorials and said "**** those threads - here's the way easy shit". I don;t care about OP, OP has made a clear decision. My concern is for people reading the thread from ignorance I'd like them to know how fucked this thread is.

Anyway, guys, you're getting ahead of yourselves. DeepEnd is drafting the "How to fix bum" thread already.

(You may want to take notes on that one, Cocko.)

 

[manticle]

I cannot imagine a more effective way to say "**** this thread" than saying "**** this thread". I am not sure why you think my intention is (or why it should be) helping OP. OP has clearly read the recent cider tutorials and said "**** those threads - here's the way easy shit". I don;t care about OP, OP has made a clear decision. My concern is for people reading the thread from ignorance I'd like them to know how fucked this thread is.

My point is not limited to the OP - indeed the OP is least important in that regard. You take umbrage with the idea that there might be people who read the guide and think 'cool'. Your initial contribution will not change that by much, if anything. '**** this thread' does nothing to help people make good cider.

That's why I suggest your method of communication could be more effective.

 

[bum]

You're probably right as my communication is clearly ineffective. Can't seem to get the simplest of points across, apparently.

 

[Bribie G]

Quite so

 

[manticle]

You can get them across fine for the most part. It's your opening address that's likely to alienate people.
Try 'friends, romans, countrymen' or somesuch next time (and stop playing the victim - you were a rude prick and some people told you so. You'll live and so should Clay).

 

[bum]

It's your opening address that's likely to alienate people

How so? It actually seems to have encouraged people to rally around and point out where the deficiencies the OP lies (a selective list, obviously). Whodathunkit?

The only product of this thread would have been a few posts of thanks from noobs, silence from people who know and a tonne of sub-par cider.

 

[manticle]

Could have been encouraged with a similar motive but different process is my point.

Smacking someone on the ear because you're right and they're wrong can generate discussion but is it the best or most effective way to communicate that? As much (or more) discussion has been generated about you being an areshole as has been about the quality of information.


You know you're rude - to argue that point is futile. It's more whether or not you think that rudeness is the best vehicle to get the job done. I propose there are better ways, particularly in circumstances such as these.

 

[bum]

You know you're rude - to argue that point is futile.

That would be why I've never done it.

It's more whether or not you think that rudeness is the best vehicle to get the job done. I propose thete are better ways, particularly in circumstances such as these.

I propose that the state of the board in general proves you utterly and completely wrong.

 

[manticle]

I propose that you being rude has done little to change the state of the board.

 

[bum]

I propose (yet again) that lots of people who would not have commented negatively under any other circumstance have done so ONLY so that they could comment on my behaviour.

I also propose you follow Goomba's advice. Your disappointment is too much of a burden for me to carry.

 

[manticle]

You mean blocking user names?
Seriously?
I'm not that guy and I'm not disappointed particularly with you.

I made a simple point while agreeing with the essence of what you were getting at.
Some diplomacy, while remaining critical can be more effective.
If you really believe '**** this thread' is the only phrase or that attitude is the only route to critical discussion, then I'd be pretty surprised.

Mode of delivery is all we are talking about. Do you stand by yours as the best?

 

[bum]

Let me present an example:

The people who told me to go **** myself were heard and understood and no more was needed to be said by either side.

How do you think your point is coming along?

 

[manticle]

Actually re-reading and case in point - first response in this thread was from airgead with some legitimate and well laid out critique.
No **** youse in sight until after that.