Boiling the alcohol out of beer for a N/A brew

[SJW]

Ok, I'm still going alcohol free for 12 months, till 20th April 2017, but have had a couple of the Coopers Ulta Lights that got me thinking. So rather than selling off all my gear I might start thinking about making low/no alcohol beer. I know Coopers Ultra is 0.5%.
Have read all there is to read on the net and have decided on the following method, using my Braumeister.

Make a normal beer that I have made before, preferably a malt driven lager or pale ale. Was thinking of not adding any hops during the initial boil. Then ferment as normal. Then prior to kegging, adding back to the BM and boil for 60min to drive off alcohol and boil hops as recipe requires. Then add water to top up for second boil loss.
I understand that heating to 78.5 deg C will vaporise or evaporate alcohol, but why not flat out boil to drive off alcohol and do hopping at the same time.
Cool then keg.
Would love to know what MHB has to say on this subject. I understand that I could never drive off all the alcohol especially if Coopers can't do it, but short of reverse osmosis surly this method would work?


Steve

 

[GalBrew]

Why not boil a commercial beer and find out?

 

[Maheel]

your beer = Alcohol / water + other stuff mix and will want to boil at more than 78.5 as that it the temp of boiling pure alc nto your mix.

it will work to remove alc but what it will taste like is another issue.

could you just go boil a beer from a bottle, chill it back down and try it.... if you have a carb cap thing you could try carbing it back up

 

[barls]

it will change the flavours, your flavour and aroma will be converted to more bitterness.
personally id brew at about 1035 gravity and about 32-35 ibu and just force carb it unfermented.

 

[Maheel]

it will change the flavours, your flavour and aroma will be converted to more bitterness.
personally id brew at about 1035 gravity and about 32-35 ibu and just force carb it unfermented.

i had that idea but wont it be too sweet like drinking syrup?

fermenting then hopping on post ferment boil may get you closer to taste ?

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

What you want to do is boil it under vacume


Think keg, burner and vacuum pump. Not as hard as you think

 

[S.E]

it will change the flavours, your flavour and aroma will be converted to more bitterness.
personally id brew at about 1035 gravity and about 32-35 ibu and just force carb it unfermented.

[SIZE=11pt]You forgot to use the emoticons to show you’re not being serious. [/SIZE]

 

[mattjm]

Side note: what did you think of the ultra, I saw hahn is also doing an ultra light. I haven't tasted either but interested what the consensus is, I personally found I enjoyed hahn super dry 3.5 over their full strength offering but Ive never gone lower than that as Ive never enjoyed comercial lights (hahn/fosters).

 

[barls]

i had that idea but wont it be too sweet like drinking syrup?

fermenting then hopping on post ferment boil may get you closer to taste ?

you need about that number of ibus to balance it out.
i did make one when i was working at a brewery and we well over shot the ibus and it was around that number and it was actually pleasant to drink.

 

[SJW]

Side note: what did you think of the ultra, I saw hahn is also doing an ultra light. I haven't tasted either but interested what the consensus is

Well after drinking ever increasing IBU brews and alcohol brews for near 20 years it's tastes pretty thin. But it's interesting to have a "beer" and have no buzz. I've only had 1 and it was fine. Would be great on a hot day after mowing ect. Need to cut out the alcohol. Even after 10 days dry my wife said tonight I'm a lot more involved and plugged in around the house and seem happier. I don't miss the strong stuff but it did feel good to have that brown glass stubble in my had today even if it was Ultra Light.

 

[MHB]

Hey Steve
I would make beer the normal way, then try to dealcoholize it rather than boiling after fermentation.
There are lots of reactions that take place during a boil and I have no idea exactly what will happen to the flavours but suspect nothing too good. The would be some colour development and some of the products from the yeast could react in very strange ways.
On the yeast, make sure the beer is as yeast free as possible before you heat it, cooked yeast isn't an attractive flavour.

If you just add the finished beer to the BM and set the temperature to 80oC or just a bit higher in manual mode, until you know the cycle time then you could just program it.
Big advantage of the BM is the very low watt density element, the very gentle heat should do less harm to the flavour than would a fire or shorter element.
It might be worth playing around with a bit of dry hopping post heating to add back some aromatics that will be lost, or make some highly hopped beer and add a little back after the heat, it would add very little alcohol but should build up the flavour.

Remember Alcohol vapor is very flammable, well ventilated area, open a window... don't burn the house down. I'm sure the missus would be ticked.
Mark

 

[danestead]

From tasting unfermented wort with lots of hops, it is very astringent. I think the fermentation has a lot to do with the final flavour of the hops.

 

[S.E]

you need about that number of ibus to balance it out.
i did make one when i was working at a brewery and we well over shot the ibus and it was around that number and it was actually pleasant to drink.

[SIZE=11pt]So just to ensure we are understanding this correctly, when you worked in a commercial? brewery they produced and sold a low/non alcoholic beer by bottling/kegging un-fermented wort? [/SIZE]

 

[SJW]

Hey Steve
I would make beer the normal way, then try to dealcoholize it rather than boiling after fermentation.
There are lots of reactions that take place during a boil and I have no idea exactly what will happen to the flavours but suspect nothing too good. The would be some colour development and some of the products from the yeast could react in very strange ways.
On the yeast, make sure the beer is as yeast free as possible before you heat it, cooked yeast isn't an attractive flavour.

If you just add the finished beer to the BM and set the temperature to 80oC or just a bit higher in manual mode, until you know the cycle time then you could just program it.
Big advantage of the BM is the very low watt density element, the very gentle heat should do less harm to the flavour than would a fire or shorter element.
It might be worth playing around with a bit of dry hopping post heating to add back some aromatics that will be lost, or make some highly hopped beer and add a little back after the heat, it would add very little alcohol but should build up the flavour.

Remember Alcohol vapor is very flammable, well ventilated area, open a window... don't burn the house down. I'm sure the missus would be ticked.
Mark

Thanks mate, just the advice I was after. Thanks again, hope life is good for you bro.

Steve

 

[Blind Dog]

To me, all commercial alcohol free or damn close beers have a really nasty, almost metallic, aftertaste. I've tried a number of times to get a decent really low ABV beer. Best I've done yet was a mild, mashed high, a smidge of EKG to about 5 IBU, fermented with wlp002, then gelatine and twice filtered, then heated at 85C on the BM for an hour with EKG added half way through. It's a lot of work, doesn't quite taste like beer, but it's a better drink the any ultra low alc commercial beer I've ever had.

But, and it's a fairly big but, the alcoholic version of the same mild at a mere 3.2% is soooo much better

 

[Charst]

Side note: what did you think of the ultra, I saw hahn is also doing an ultra light. I haven't tasted either but interested what the consensus is, I personally found I enjoyed hahn super dry 3.5 over their full strength offering but Ive never gone lower than that as Ive never enjoyed comercial lights (hahn/fosters).

Ive tried the ultra, for a .9% beer is taste ok actually, has a bit of malt and hops, better than any beer that low ive tried and ive been through alot of them, has a slight rose water aroma to me.

 

[danestead]

There is a very low alc beer in the brew dog document. I can't vouch for what it tastes like but it could be worth looking at.

 

[barls]

[SIZE=11pt]So just to ensure we are understanding this correctly, when you worked in a commercial? brewery they produced and sold a low/non alcoholic beer by bottling/kegging un-fermented wort? [/SIZE]

does it matter if we sold it or not.
i was giving an answer to the question.
have you not had https://www.danmurphys.com.au/product/DM_172708/schlossgold-non-alcoholic-beer

 

[dannymars]

When I'm having a break from beer/alcohol I usually drink kombucha, might not be to your tastes, but it does it for me. It's somewhere around 0.5%ABV

You can use your brewing gear to make 20 litre batches of it. It's fairly easy and you can use super cheap black n gold tea, it doesn't have to be the good stuff.

You could try sweetening the tea with wort instead of sugar, might give it a more malty taste (I've not tried this, but now I think I might)....

 

[Blind Dog]

There is a very low alc beer in the brew dog document. I can't vouch for what it tastes like but it could be worth looking at.

Nanny State at 0.5% ABV, 800g of malt, 55 IBU and 187.5g dry hop! I suspect it'll taste like hop infused water, but I might just give it a whirl