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Boiling the alcohol out of beer for a N/A brew

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wobbly

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It seems that the additional boiling to drive off alcohol and add bitterness (IBU) may not be a good way to go.

So would it be a solution to produce an unhopped wort-ferment-heat to say 80C to drive off the alcohol and then use "hop shots" to add IBU/flavour

Wobbly
 

Jack of all biers

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barls said:
does it matter if we sold it or not.
i was giving an answer to the question.
have you not had https://www.danmurphys.com.au/product/DM_172708/schlossgold-non-alcoholic-beer
SJW, I think you may be pushing the limits of HB and I applaud you. I used to drink alcohol free beer in Germany and found they had a much better selection than here and some of their beers tasted just like the standard brews you could get (exept without the alcohol). I found the two best ones were Claustaler alcoholfreies Pils (IMO the best of the alcohol free pale lager type) and Erdinger Alcoholfreies Weisbier, which IMO was as good if not better than their real thing. I didn't think you could get either here in Aus, until I saw the above link with Dan's supplying the Erdinger, so thanks Barls.
 

CmdrRyekr

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wobbly said:
It seems that the additional boiling to drive off alcohol and add bitterness (IBU) may not be a good way to go.

So would it be a solution to produce an unhopped wort-ferment-heat to say 80C to drive off the alcohol and then use "hop shots" to add IBU/flavour

Wobbly
There would need to be un-isomerised alpha acids in the beer to increase IBU, but that is unlikely to be the case. What has probably happened however is that the perception of bitterness increases...
 

Ducatiboy stu

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It wont have the mouthfeel from alcohol, but just adjust your recipe and mash temp and you can give it a decent mouthfeel
 

Dan Pratt

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Ducatiboy stu said:
It wont have the mouthfeel from alcohol, but just adjust your recipe and mash temp and you can give it a decent mouthfeel
Maybe 25% wheat and 10% carapils with any base malt mashed at 70c for 30mins could do the trick.
 

Blind Dog

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I realise a Nanny State type solution isn't what the OP asked, but hopefully a discussion of it is still on topic. Been reading the reviews and they're all roughly what you'd expect reading the recipe - lots of hop aroma not backed up the flavour, thin and watery body, overly bitter. But generally decent scores.

Personally, I think I'm drawn to a small batch inspired by their beer., but maltier and less bitter. Must admit I'd never given much thought to brewing a 0.5% beer before reading their recipe, despite numerous attempts to turn a 3ish% beer into a lower alcohol one
 

Jack of all biers

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timmi9191 said:
Erdinger Alcoholfreies Weisbier - has previously been sold at Aldi
Except Aldi only arrived in Adelaide last year... And even then the current three stores are so far away, I couldn't be F'd driving all the way there to see something I used to treat as a convenience store in Germany.

Personally, I'm going to give the GYX recipe from Bronzed Brews a go and see what a 1920's Australian low alcohol beer turns out like (0.83%).
 

barls

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Jack of all biers said:
SJW, I think you may be pushing the limits of HB and I applaud you. I used to drink alcohol free beer in Germany and found they had a much better selection than here and some of their beers tasted just like the standard brews you could get (exept without the alcohol). I found the two best ones were Claustaler alcoholfreies Pils (IMO the best of the alcohol free pale lager type) and Erdinger Alcoholfreies Weisbier, which IMO was as good if not better than their real thing. I didn't think you could get either here in Aus, until I saw the above link with Dan's supplying the Erdinger, so thanks Barls.
np. mate.
 

S.E

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barls said:
does it matter if we sold it or not.
i was giving an answer to the question.
have you not had https://www.danmurphys.com.au/product/DM_172708/schlossgold-non-alcoholic-beer
Well yes it does matter if you sold it or not. Your post gave the impression you’re a pro brewer and know what you’re talking about.

The Schlossgold non alcoholic beer that you linked is not unfermented wort so I don’t know what point you are trying to make there.

Do you know of any non alcoholic beers that are produced by simply packaging unfermented wort? How are they packaged safely without the risk and danger of spontaneous fermentation? Not in glass bottles that’s for sure!!
 

MHB

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Yes they are, whole class called Malta, unfermented wort, filtered and carbonated and packaged in bottles and cans.
Very popular in Africa and the Caribbean. Some are pretty good, even found a Belgian made one at an African specialist shop here in Newcastle (not the best I have tried).
In tunnel pasteurisers we trust!
Mark
 

SJW

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I sent an e-mail to Coopers and asked the question regarding the process they use for making the Ultra Light. This was their response.

G'day Stephen,

We ferment Birell with a proprietary yeast that will only ferment monosaccharides (glucose or fructose) and can't ferment maltose, sucrose or any of the polysaccharides. Boiling fermented beer results in oxidation and other unwanted by-products so give it a go if you really want to but you'd need to get through the keg pretty quickly before it became undrinkable (sorry can't give you a timeframe on that).

Cheers, Frank.

So like Mark said the 85 Deg C boil for an hour might be the best bet and do the flavour and aroma hop addition then....maybe
 

Jack of all biers

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When you do, maybe heat your kettle/vessel with a water jacket to gently bring the brew up to 85C. (ie your keg/pot containing your beer, being heated in a pot filled with water, which is heated by your heat source). The heat source direct approach will likely cause temps closer to boiling point near to the heat source, hence causing some of the oxidation/other off flavours Coopers were talking about.
 

MHB

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Jack the Braumeister is a bit of a special case.
The element in a Braumeister has such a low watt density that you can hold the element between your fingers until the water is too hot to have your hand in.
There are next to no surface heat effects to worry about, any other type of element I have seen yes you are right indirect heat would be a good idea.
One of the many things about the BM that is truly well designed.
Mark
 

S.E

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MHB said:
Yes they are, whole class called Malta, unfermented wort, filtered and carbonated and packaged in bottles and cans.
Very popular in Africa and the Caribbean. Some are pretty good, even found a Belgian made one at an African specialist shop here in Newcastle (not the best I have tried).
In tunnel pasteurisers we trust!
Mark
Well bugger me so there is. That the answer then just pasteurise the wort and it will be fine.
 

Ducatiboy stu

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S.E said:
Well bugger me so there is. That the answer then just pasteurise the wort and it will be fine.
Yet another use for a plate chiller....
 

S.E

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Ducatiboy stu said:
Yet another use for a plate chiller....
How would you get the bottles through a plate chiller though? No chill in bottles perhaps?
 

MHB

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Google up Tunnel Pasteuriser basically a big heated conveyer oven that you run bottles/cans through, the product is heated, held hot long enough to kill bugs, then cooled.
Pretty standard equipment in any big brewery filling bottles or cans, up to 450 Pasteurisation Units (PU's) can be applied to beer in breweries with bad hygiene problems. A PU is 1 minute at 60oC, one sterilisation unit roughly enough to kill 90% of bacteria in a product in 1 minute
Here is a pretty good look at the process and the calculations Pasteurisation Units & Sterilisation Units.
Mark
 
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