Best Carbonation Method For No Refrigerated Keg?

[markph]

Hi, I am a newbie to homebrewing, have never made a brew at all yet.
I am planning to make my first brew of Coopers lager to be used in a 50 litre keg.
I will be using the keg on a refrigerated temprite system so obviously you dont normally chill the kegs.
I have read up a bit about forced carbonation and it seems most methods require the keg to be chilled for carbonation.
my question is is it possible to carbonate 40 litres of beer in an unchilled keg?
is natural carbonation with sugar an option?
If so, can someone suggest the best method to do this?
one othe question, is it a good idea to filter the beer from the fermenter to the keg? I do have a 1 micron filter that i could use if it is a worthwhile excercise.

Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Dave70]

Most people will judge your homebrew by holding the glass up to the light. Then they'll judge it by strength, so use plenty of white sugar...

Seriously though, if you aren't taking any other steps to brighten up your beer, filtering is a good idea, especially with a lager.

Without chilling and gassing, you will need to bulk prime with sugar.

Use this.

http://webspace.webring.com/people/ms/sirl...Calculator.html

cheers.

 

[DU99]

I natural carbonate mine using sugar/dextrose..only place in fridge when i have a near empty keg..when are you planning to drink the keg

 

[Fatgodzilla]

I natural carbonate mine using sugar/dextrose..only place in fridge when i have a near empty keg..when are you planning to drink the keg

cooled (cold) beer will absorb more carbon dioxide (or so I think). I naturally carbonate all kegs then transfer to fridge at least a few days prior to first pour. I'm just guessing, but if a naturally carbed keg is warm (and not cooled at any time prior to serving) and served through a chiller, I reckon all you'll get is foam!

 

[markph]

Thanks for the replies guys,

I think i am going to go with the natural carbonation.

the calculator in the link looks real handy, just not sure how long it would need to carbonate, I assume the tempretaure will have some affect on howl long it is before it is fully carbonate.

whats the worst thing that can happen?? I will F#%k it up, learn something, then start again!

Cheers.

 

[Amber Fluid]

Thanks for the replies guys,

I think i am going to go with the natural carbonation.

the calculator in the link looks real handy, just not sure how long it would need to carbonate, I assume the tempretaure will have some affect on howl long it is before it is fully carbonate.

whats the worst thing that can happen?? I will F#%k it up, learn something, then start again!

Cheers.

That is a calculator for bulk priming bottles. If you are kegging then halve the result you get.
I don't know why but I believe this is the general rule of the thumb for kegs.

 

[komodo]

cooled (cold) beer will absorb more carbon dioxide (or so I think). I naturally carbonate all kegs then transfer to fridge at least a few days prior to first pour. I'm just guessing, but if a naturally carbed keg is warm (and not cooled at any time prior to serving) and served through a chiller, I reckon all you'll get is foam!

Nope mate of mine serves his naturally carb'd kegs through a temprite and no foaming issues at all.

 

[krusty_oz]

Force carbing can occur at room, its just quicker/more effective at lower temperature.

If you leave the beer at room temp on the gas between 20-25psi (approx 2.2 CO2 volume - if it was cold you would have it at 8-10psi) for a week or so it will carb up to the correct level it needs to be to have the right fizz once its chilled. I've done this for a couple kegs when I have not had fridge space.

Room temperature varys from place to place, so if you live in cooler climate, go the lower of the range

The 20-25 range would also be need to be your serving pressure otherwise it will probably foam up too much. The coil in the temprite should provide sufficient line resistance to balance the pour.

 

[michael_aussie]

Thanks for the replies guys,

I think i am going to go with the natural carbonation.

the calculator in the link looks real handy, just not sure how long it would need to carbonate, I assume the tempretaure will have some affect on howl long it is before it is fully carbonate.

whats the worst thing that can happen?? I will F#%k it up, learn something, then start again!

Cheers.

if you are going to naturally carbonate you need to make sure your yeast is still active, so you need to make sure you keep your keg at your fermenting temperature (20 degrees?) while you are carbonating (say 2 weeks) .... after that you can chill.

That is a calculator for bulk priming bottles. If you are kegging then halve the result you get.
I don't know why but I believe this is the general rule of the thumb for kegs.

i have never naturally carbonated my kegs, but many here have said to use only 1/2 the amount of sugar that you would use when bottling ..... does anyone know why you 1/2 it?

 

[stux]

Think it's because of the reduced headspace relative to volume. The yeast will produce more pressure as the headspace is relatively smaller.

 

[markph]

Hi Guys,
I really love this Forum! it has got so much information and members are only too happy to answer dumb questions from noobs like my self.

1 more dumb question in relation to my first post.

What would be a recommended timeline for brewing this brew under these conditions?
eg, time in fermenter, time naturaly carbonating in the unchilled keg after being filtered to 1 micron? how long before you can drink it?

Thanks again

 

[markph]

That is a calculator for bulk priming bottles. If you are kegging then halve the result you get.
I don't know why but I believe this is the general rule of the thumb for kegs.

I filtered the beer through a 1 micron filter to the keg and added half the amount of cane sugar and left in keg for a bit over 2 weeks at room temp, then chilled in fridge for 4 days.
when i poured the first beer it came out nice and clear but had no carbonation and had an unusual taste to it.

any ideas why it would not have carbonated?
would filtering require more sugar for natural carbonation than unfiltered beer?
Should i leave it longer or should i now force carbonate it?
I have another 2 kegs sitting filtered, should i add more sugar and leave longer?

Cheers

 

[argon]

I filtered the beer through a 1 micron filter to the keg and added half the amount of cane sugar and left in keg for a bit over 2 weeks at room temp, then chilled in fridge for 4 days.
when i poured the first beer it came out nice and clear but had no carbonation and had an unusual taste to it.

any ideas why it would not have carbonated?
would filtering require more sugar for natural carbonation than unfiltered beer?
Should i leave it longer or should i now force carbonate it?
I have another 2 kegs sitting filtered, should i add more sugar and leave longer?

Cheers

typically a filtered beer will take longer to natural carbonate as there is less yeast to do the jobe. B

ut in saying that, just force carb it now it's hooked up. Either the Ross Method, leave it at serving pressure for a week or have it at 300Kpa for a day and then back to serving pressure.

 

[pyrosx]

I filtered the beer through a 1 micron filter to the keg and added half the amount of cane sugar and left in keg for a bit over 2 weeks at room temp, then chilled in fridge for 4 days.
when i poured the first beer it came out nice and clear but had no carbonation and had an unusual taste to it.

any ideas why it would not have carbonated?
would filtering require more sugar for natural carbonation than unfiltered beer?
Should i leave it longer or should i now force carbonate it?
I have another 2 kegs sitting filtered, should i add more sugar and leave longer?

Cheers

Sounds to me like you filtered out all the yeast.... that would explain the unusual taste too: it's the priming sugar that hasn't been converted by the yeast that isn't there.

 

[markph]

Sounds to me like you filtered out all the yeast.... that would explain the unusual taste too: it's the priming sugar that hasn't been converted by the yeast that isn't there.

I read here that filtering to 1 micron was ok.

The filter that i used was an Omni carbon wrapped 1 micron water filter, it does not say if it is absolute or nominal.

Cheers

 

[markph]

typically a filtered beer will take longer to natural carbonate as there is less yeast to do the jobe. B

ut in saying that, just force carb it now it's hooked up. Either the Ross Method, leave it at serving pressure for a week or have it at 300Kpa for a day and then back to serving pressure.

I have since removed it from the fridge.
Was thinking about force carbonating but was worried that if i force carb it and it eventually natural carbonates then it may end up over carbonated.

 

[markph]

Sounds to me like you filtered out all the yeast.... that would explain the unusual taste too: it's the priming sugar that hasn't been converted by the yeast that isn't there.

forgot to mention, it was in fermenter for 2 weeks prior to kegging.

 

[bradsbrew]

Sort of on topic for this.

I am looking to have a 50L of aussie/coopers ale keg sitting outside the fridge and naturally carbonate. How much beer line would I need to be able to have the keg warm but the line running into the fridge and still poor a cold glass or 2. I have a ss miracle box heat exchanger made with about 7m of ss beer line but think I would need some extra beer line pre this. I would not have any more than 200mm of beer line outside the fridge.

Would this work? Or would I just get foam?

Cheers