Berliner Weisse

[brendanos]

Other than watching Jess Caudhill's presentations, I would recommend:

50% pils malt
45% wheat malt
5% acidulated

Mash at 60 - 68 (I don't think it is critical)
Mash hop 1 plug old low alpha hops
Lauter and raise to 100C but don't boil
Target OG <1.030
Chill to 45C
Ferment with 5335 2 - 7 days at 40 - 45C
Chill to 20C and ferment with 1007 or US05
After primary add Brett (I have had good results with all strains) and condition for a few months before bottling
Bottle in champagne bottles with loads of sugar (10 - 12g/L)
Wait 6 - 12 months
Enjoy!

FWIW I won best wheat beer at the PRBS 3 years in a row with 3 different batches, won best farmhouse at AABC 2010 and 2nd place in 2011.

Entering it in comps has been a rollercoaster - some times I have expected beer of show and scored less than 20, other times scoring 47 and 48. It is a hard style to judge - especially for inexperienced judges or those lacking confidence. You can carbonate it to within an inch of it's life and by the time it reaches the judges it will have no head and be marked down for "lacking stylistic characteristics". You can't win em all!

Patience is key to this style. Some of mine have tasted pretty foul when young (medicinal, smokey, sulphury) - just wait it out. They are generally best once they have dropped clear, which may take forever, but it is worth the wait.

 

[joshuahardie]

What FG are people getting with these.

Both my BW's mentioned in a previous post have now dropped to 1004, the Wyeast blend is showing some subtle lacto notes, and tastes like a light witbier.
The Billy Ray Citrus yeast version is not showing much tartness/sourness yet.

How long are people leaving these beers in primary fermentaiton?
Is anyone doing a secondary?
and lastly, with these lacto blends, is everyone retiring these plastic fermenters for sours only, or can lacto be cleaned out of plastic effectivly?

 

[QldKev]

What FG are people getting with these.

Both my BW's mentioned in a previous post have now dropped to 1004, the Wyeast blend is showing some subtle lacto notes, and tastes like a light witbier.
The Billy Ray Citrus yeast version is not showing much tartness/sourness yet.

How long are people leaving these beers in primary fermentaiton?
Is anyone doing a secondary?
and lastly, with these lacto blends, is everyone retiring these plastic fermenters for sours only, or can lacto be cleaned out of plastic effectivly?

Not sure where mine currently is at, but BeerSmith shows 1.007 FG, I'm guessing it would drop more than that.
Mine is still in the primary fermenter, since 13-Nov-2012
None of beer beers get secondary anymore (since about 5 years ago)
My fermenter is marked so a normal beer will never be made in it again. Also, I will be bottling it and not kegging.

 

[joshuahardie]

I am getting a very strong acetone smell coming from my BW.
I fermented at 18 degreess for a week, then left it at ambient after that.
I am also fermenting in a willow jerry can if it makes any difference.

General research tells me that nail polish remover smells are the result of high ferments, or poor quality plastics, but that is with a normal sach yeast.

Does that rule ring true for lacto beers?

 

[raven19]

Plastic smells could be a wild yeast infection too.

 

[joshuahardie]

Totally could be that.
It is fermenting next to a lambic

However the lambic does not have the same smell.

But certainly by the fact that these two fermenters are side by side, it could of been cross contamination, even though I thought my process was solid at the time.

 

[Bada Bing Brewery]

Going for my first BW (thanks Florian).

2 questions

1 - Got a wyeast BW pack. Can i split this as you usually would???? What would you do a starter with, some cooled BW wort from the batch?

2 - The thought of bottling makes me feel sad and depressed. I have PET bottles but would rather keg. I understand this needs a big whack of CO2. Anybody done it and any problems???

After a fair bit of reading I'm going for:

Berliner Weisse (23L)
49% wey pils
49% wey wheat
2% acid

Step mash - 1.5hr @ 55C, 1 hr @ 65C, 15mins 78C mashout

Handfull of wey pils grain in the 65C mash

No boil - still tossing up if I'll do a decoction.

Hall Mittlefrusch to 10 IBU's in mash

Wyeast BW @ 20C and ramp to 24C after 3-4 days

Any help appreciated
Cheers
BBB

 

[Bada Bing Brewery]

EPIC FAIL - Infection ......... The wyeast BW pack was from jun 2012 - tried it on a stir plate for 12 hours. The starter did move a bit on the refracto so I thought there was life but helaas ........... down the *******....
Next one I'll try Brendanos's procedure.
Cheers
BBB

 

[Tony]

All i did with mine was mash and drain strait to the fermenter and tip in the pack of berliner weise blend that failed to swell

It took about 5 weeks to finnish fermenting and went down to 1.003 or so from memory.

i also chucked in a handfull of freshly cracked weyermann pilsner malt, pushed under the stairs and let it rot for 3 months

I filled 5 champagne bottles to age. No fresh yeast, just some dex for carb.

The corks have pushed up on the wire cages and they are slowly settling out clear so i assume they are carbed.

We will see come comp time

 

[Bada Bing Brewery]

Serious horseblanket and vegetable soup aroma's ......... I didnt taste it but I can taste it now if you know what I mean - the smell permeates....
the laundry started to get a whiff so it was time to move it along.
I threw some uncracked grain in the mash as well Tony......
Chalk one up too experience.
Cube down, cube down people
cheers
BBB

 

[brettprevans]

Hmmm this madewme think of doing a belgian wheat strong ale then running a no boil gyle type berlinner. Hmmm roselare.

Ive got the last of my other berlinner in beerfest. Lwts see how it does.

Make sure u report back tony.

 

[adryargument]

2.5 months red wine barrel oak aged berliner weisse with 2KG of raspberries.

Just kegged 40L of my Weisse and then added 60L into a fermenter for further aging.

So far its fantastic warm, can't wait until its cold so i can force carb one of the kegs.
Finished on ~1.001.

Has a light pink golden colour.
Its dry, tart, sour, chalky (Forces you to smile as it puckers your cheeks).
Consistency of water and has that 'wet' water mouth feel.
The oak comes through quite strong, however its nicely balanced by the sourness.
Raspberries are there in the background, very subtle, 2kg was all i could afford on the day, would of benefited with another 5-10kg.

Hopefully the brett starts kicking in shortly, however theres nothing left for them to eat


That is currently pumping, its a very light pink straw colour in the tube.

Lastly i just dropped another 100L of the below into the barrel, should be extra super funky (est 4.5%):
----------------------------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
6.00 kg Wheat Malt (Barrett Burston) (1.5 SRM) Grain 1 42.0 %
4.00 kg Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner (Weyermann Grain 2 28.0 %
3.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) ( Grain 3 21.0 % (Ran out of pilsner grrrr)
0.30 kg Acidulated (Weyermann) (1.8 SRM) Grain 4 2.1 %
80.00 g Aged Hop [1.00 %] - Mash 60.0 min Hop 5 0.8 IBUs


Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash Step Heat to 45.0 C for 15 min
Mash Step Heat to 50.0 C over 5 min 50.0 C 15 min
Mash Step Heat to 65.0 C over 10 min 65.0 C 45 min
Mash Step Heat to 70.0 C over 5 min 70.0 C 30 min
Mash Step Heat to 76.0 C over 6 min 76.0 C 15 min
Sparge @ 68.0 C

Mashed,
No boil,
Chilled
and barreled.

 

[brettprevans]

According to jusges mine was too sour. Wtf?! Roselare yeast is awsome imo

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

According to jusges mine was too sour. Wtf?! Roselare yeast is awsome imo

Too sour? No such thing.

 

[fcmcg]

According to jusges mine was too sour. Wtf?! Roselare yeast is awsome imo

CM...
After getting some of my results back from Beerfest , consistency from the judges and maybe understanding some of the styles isn't their strong point...1 beer , 3 judges , 2 say it hits targets and one says it doesn't...
Last year a club member got a comment from a judge that because his AIPA lacked noticeably in the cascade hop department , it wasn't true to style lol

 

[brettprevans]

CM...
After getting some of my results back from Beerfest , consistency from the judges and maybe understanding some of the styles isn't their strong point...1 beer , 3 judges , 2 say it hits targets and one says it doesn't...
Last year a club member got a comment from a judge that because his AIPA lacked noticeably in the cascade hop department , it wasn't true to style lol

mate we all know how judging goes. My post was more a comment on roselare being good for this style imo. All good buddy

 

[manticle]

You want consistency (ie all judges confer and basically agree with the most vocal through power of suggestion) or you want proper independent judging from 3, possibly very different palates with different sensitivities and different experience?
Judges do make some bad/odd calls sometimes but it's amateur beer judged by amateur judges. Reading the same comments 3 times on a feedback sheet isn't an indication of good judging.

I've had many a comment that makes me scratch my head (old uk ipa, chocolate esters etc) and had beers get a 42 from one judge and a 29 from another (rectified to 7 point spread) but that's how it works. Anyone who expects that every judge will be spot on is deluding themselves and needs to sit at the judging table more often.
Not specifically directed at you guys that last bit as I'm sure you have both sat there many times, but worth re-iterating.
Sorry for OT.

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

It feels like mine's been in there for ages, but I realised it's only been six weeks. Temp has been a bit variable (19-27) since primary finished as I've used the fridge for other things. It's still offgassing like a fat man on curry and has a nice pellicle.

I think I'll throw it off into secondary now though...I brewed up a stronger ( ~1042 - out of style) one today that I want to pitch onto the cake...onward and upward...

 

[QldKev]

I've got mine finally kegged up and drinking. It was in the fermenter since oct/nov last year. Carb'd up pretty hard, and drinking really nice. Not as chalky on the teeth as I would expect, but the smell is very wet horse blanket. The taste is nothing like the smell and is a great drinker on our hot days.

I dropped a second batch onto the full yeast cake to see how it goes. Be a couple of months but it fired up and is off. (even though due to not checking temps the wort was 45c when it got dropped onto the cake.)

QldKev

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

All i did with mine was mash and drain strait to the fermenter and tip in the pack of berliner weise blend that failed to swell

It took about 5 weeks to finnish fermenting and went down to 1.003 or so from memory.

i also chucked in a handfull of freshly cracked weyermann pilsner malt, pushed under the stairs and let it rot for 3 months

I filled 5 champagne bottles to age. No fresh yeast, just some dex for carb.

The corks have pushed up on the wire cages and they are slowly settling out clear so i assume they are carbed.

We will see come comp time

I decided to rack mine today. Had dropped down to 1.002 in six weeks. Sample fits the bill but it could be more sour. It started a bit light (1028) and feels a bit thin, but it was a not quite cold, uncarbonated sample, which wouldn't have helped.

I've put some crushed grain with 5l of it in a demi, but the main 15l was racked as is. Is it actually going to get any more sour off the cake and without extra grain? Perhaps I should have just bottled it...