Belgian Saison

[Nick JD]

Mine's fizzing away madly through the gladwrap. Bloody hot though ... 34C right now.

I'm kegging, and not filtering this one, so no worries about bombs. It's already got that "silky, weird low body" thing going.

Dunno if I'll wait to get it to the very bottom FG if it takes 2 weeks to drop 4 points - a tiny bit of sweetness seems appropriate in there with that amount of fruit.

 

[Tanga]

Mine's mashing now @ 66. It's pretty complex, with a fair wack of Munich and some last minute rolled oats coz I could. I'm adding a few spices too (not enough to taste, just complexity). Can't wait.

 

[Nick JD]

It's done. 1.009 - probably might drop a few more points but I'm gonna bung it in the keg and have at it. There's zero activity (no bubbles rising) so I suspect that's probably it. If I was bottling I'd give it a few more days - but since it's sat at 34C every afternoon I have a feeling that's done it. My mash was 68C, so I'm not thinking it'll get as low as some Saisons.

Will take a photo and do a taste test day after tomorrow when it's cold and carbed.

:icon_cheers:

I'm using the saved yeast for a "mild saison" to be made tomorrow; true to the historic style like Tony suggested. A 1.040, Pils malt only, EKG to 25 IBUs.

WY3724 = :wub: A yeast that makes great beer at 34C!

 

[Tony]

Mine's mashing now @ 66.

66 deg wont give you the really low FG you want......... better to mash at 63 - 64 with a quick 10 ot 15 min hit at 71 perhaps.

Thats what i will be doing this summer.

I pitched a 1 year old vial of Belgian Saison thats been patiently sitting in the kegorator since 14.11.2010 in a starter last night...... and its fizzing nicely in the 28 deg garage now just 24 hrs later.

Very happy!

Gunna make the Bulls Head Summer Saison but use Golden Naked oats in it to see what they do.

cheers

 

[Nick JD]

You put any sugar in your low OG Saisons, Tony?

I thought with the nutso attenuation and the sugar I needed a hot mash - do I want it finishing that dry?

I reckon I could tell someone it was Perry!

 

[Tony]

dude............ thats how its suposed to be...... dry tart and acidic.

Low FG is the go!

Quotes From BJCP............

Overall Impression: A refreshing, medium to strong fruity/spicy ale with a distinctive yellow-orange color, highly carbonated, well hopped, and dry with a quenching acidity.

Vital Statistics: OG: 1.048 1.065
IBUs: 20 35 FG: 1.002 1.012
SRM: 5 14 ABV: 5 7%


Edit...... and no sugar..... mash low!

 

[pk.sax]

this brew is behaving funny.

I'd come home to find the gladwrap kinda limp, will give it a tap so I can see in and then tighten it, within 15 minutes the gladwrap blows up again. Since I took the heat belt off its re-developed a thin layer of foam again (its not infected, I'm sure of that). My last test a few days ago was 1012 or 1015. I'll have to do one again!

 

[Nick JD]

I'd like to try to get one to 1.002

This Saison caper is mental. Still can't get past putting the fermenter in the hottest part of the house. I'm going to add heating to my STC-1000 so I can have these in winter too (and a bit more control).

 

[Nick JD]

this brew is behaving funny.

What's the temp there. Must be 30C+?

How much did you pitch. Mine's only a 16L batch and I pitched a whole pack with a lot of aeration.

 

[Tony]

They are not easy beers to make.... they are simple beers but take a lot of mental weok i think.

We get so used to beers just fermenting out in said time at said temp........ This stuff is way outside the square!

I have had them take 3 weeks and then 3 months with the same repitched yeast.

I truly believe its pH related when it comes to this yeast and i will be testing wort pH this time round before putching and recording results.

I think its why people have such varied results and varied fermentation times, and my different timew were between a pale saison with acidulated malt, and a Saison stout with shed loads of roast malts in there.

I recon there is a majic pH level and i plan to find it!

 

[pk.sax]

@ Tony That'd be good! I just added a little CaCl2 without thinking to the mash anyway as my PH was 5.2-5.4 ish already.

@ Nick, yeah, most of its been done @ 32 on the kitchen bench. I do notice it dips to 28ish without the heat at night. anyway, its just the space and fermenter tied up, I wanted to have one easy drinking one kegged and ready as my last brew is a bit harsh on the hops (galaxy no-chilled... no adjustment) and needs a bit more mellowing out. I'll just prepare better next time and put this one in a cube where I don't have to worry about it taking up space.

Also, I kinda wanted to do a braggot with the LCBA grain bill on this yeast cake next. just for fun

 

[Nick JD]

I recon there is a majic pH level and i plan to find it!

So the patented 1.030 stall is due to the pH getting critically low during fermetation?

Just read about the same thing happening in Mead and the addition of KOH at stall to bump the pH that gets lowered by CO2 (carbonic acid?). Interesting stuff.

Wonder why mine didn't stall?

 

[wraith]

My first Saison got first place in state comps a few years ago (2007) (it was my 5th AG) (here's a couple of pics, first is of the trophies (with Bo Pils trophy), second is the end of Jayse's score sheet (thanks Jayse, love it). If interested in the recipe let me know, happy to share.




Wraith

 

[wraith]

Stained with beer of course

Wraith

 

[Nick JD]

If interested in the recipe let me know, happy to share.

Noice! Can you post the recipe?

 

[Tony]

Yes......... recipe please

So the patented 1.030 stall is due to the pH getting critically low during fermetation?

Just read about the same thing happening in Mead and the addition of KOH at stall to bump the pH that gets lowered by CO2 (carbonic acid?). Interesting stuff.

Wonder why mine didn't stall?

I had one not stall and it was the best of them all.

Perhaps i should take regular pH readings and map it.

Mmmmmmm should be fun

 

[wraith]

OK, this was the recipe, bear in mind if I was to do this again, I would change it (this was made in 2007) I'll write the recipe as it was, then say what I would change.

89% Pils (5.3kg)
10% Pale Wheat (595g)
1% CaraMunich I (60g)
(All Weyermann)

OG was 1.049, mash @ 63c
35L boil/23.5L final
IBU was 23.26

EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 40 to go, 40g
EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 15 to go, 28g
EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 0, 30g
Czech Saaz 3.4% Pellets @ 0, 20g

Yeast: Wyeast 3724 Saison

*Now I would change the pils malt to Dingeman's because it's Belgian and up the CaraMunich a little, maybe 5%. And maybe also the Wheat.

The thing is the new version may not be as good, but you have to try don't you? That's how you learn and it's fun to try and better yourself.

Wraith

 

[Charst]

OK, this was the recipe, bear in mind if I was to do this again, I would change it (this was made in 2007) I'll write the recipe as it was, then say what I would change.

89% Pils (5.3kg)
10% Pale Wheat (595g)
1% CaraMunich I (60g)
(All Weyermann)

OG was 1.049, mash @ 63c
35L boil/23.5L final
IBU was 23.26

EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 40 to go, 40g
EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 15 to go, 28g
EKG 5.06% Plugs @ 0, 30g
Czech Saaz 3.4% Pellets @ 0, 20g

Yeast: Wyeast 3724 Saison

*Now I would change the pils malt to Dingeman's because it's Belgian and up the CaraMunich a little, maybe 5%. And maybe also the Wheat.

The thing is the new version may not be as good, but you have to try don't you? That's how you learn and it's fun to try and better yourself.

Wraith

My Recipe was very similar, 90% dingermans pils (its what farmhouse ales says dupont use(100% belgian pilsner malt))
10% local wheat.

55 for 10. mashed at 63 for an hour, ramped to 65 for 30, ramped to mashout.

EKG all the way

28 IBU bittering,

40g at knockout.

3711 yeast,started at 19 degrees for 2 days then went up half a degree before and after work, every 12 hoursish till i got to 27.

not a huge hop character and lacking bitterness when compared to Dupont. still a great beer, one of the best I've done, noticeable WIT characteristics from the 3711. also in starter which was built up at 20. think i should have ramped quicker after initial 2 days to get more saisony flavours. let us know how the 3724 goes.

 

[Nick JD]

I just did another Saison with Wey Ale malt and Amarillo ... yup, Amarillo! Heh heh.

Reckon the fruity hops might go pretty well with this yeast.

Nelson Sauvin seems an obvious choice, but I have none.

While I only have room for one batch in my fermenting fridge, I'm filling any old vessel and chucking a Saison in the shed to sweat!

 

[jyo]

I just did another Saison with Wey Ale malt and Amarillo ... yup, Amarillo! Heh heh.

Reckon the fruity hops might go pretty well with this yeast.

Nelson Sauvin seems an obvious choice, but I have none.

While I only have room for one batch in my fermenting fridge, I'm filling any old vessel and chucking a Saison in the shed to sweat!

Nick, I pitched a cube of Tony's LCBA clone with some French saison last year....sensational. Down from 1042 to 1002!! It was a great summer beer.
Ask Tony about his Stout Saison :icon_cheers: