Anyone For Sensational Head?

[a1149913]

Will just about all beers benefit from a 15 min protein rest between 50 and 55C? How long should the saccharification rest be if you have a protein rest?

Thanks, Jacob

 

[Fourstar]

Will just about all beers benefit from a 15 min protein rest between 50 and 55C? How long should the saccharification rest be if you have a protein rest?

Thanks, Jacob

IMO, majority of cases may benefit with a 55deg protein rest and have minimal to no negative impact on foam stability as long as you do not drop below this temperature and hold for an extended period.

Simply hold at 55 deg for 5-10 mins and begin your ramp or dump in your next infusion temperature and you're food to go with saccharification rests.

Unless you have a real need to perform a lower temperature protein rest, stick with 55 deg.

 

[Bongchitis]

IMO, majority of cases may benefit with a 55deg protein rest and have minimal to no negative impact on foam stability as long as you do not drop below this temperature and hold for an extended period.

Simply hold at 55 deg for 5-10 mins and begin your ramp or dump in your next infusion temperature and you're food to go with saccharification rests.

Unless you have a real need to perform a lower temperature protein rest, stick with 55 deg.

So doughing in at 38 degC and ramping up to the 55 degC rest is a no go in terms of foam stability? Still trying to get my head around the best general mash regime for the BM.

Cheers for any assistance.

 

[Fourstar]

for the short time its held at those lower protease temperatures it shouldn't be much of an issue however there is no need to start your rests any lower than 55deg for 99% of cases of using highly modified modern malts. The only exception to the rule would potentially be for a ferule acid rest if doing a weizen or to increase the available FAN. consequently for the latter you would probably be degrading the much loved medium chain proteins that we are trying to emphasise as discussed in this thread.

IMO, don't waste your time with anything else if not required. Simply dough in and attempt to nail the 55deg rest. If missed begin ramping/cooling immediately, reach 55deg and hold for 5-10 mins

 

[Malted]

Still trying to get my head around the best general mash regime for the BM.

Cheers for any assistance.

I too tried to tackle this one. Whilst there are a few threads about various mash regimes, here is a link to one of them: http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=62204

 

[Danwood]

Big fairy clap - I'm finally a beer god ...... i shall now retire and live of hte royalties from my posts ....
BBB

How does one become a 'Beer God' ?

Is it by chopping off another beer god's head...similar to 'Highlander.....there can be only one !!!

Right....where's my kilt <_<

 

[Nick JD]

I usually dough in with hot tap water (because I mill so fine it avoids doughballs) which gives me an initial rest temperature in the mid fifties.

IMO, using my gear it improves head retention and body in general - but only really when I ramp up to low sacc rests like 62-64C. I find no difference in mashes warmer than 66C.

 

[hsb]

I too tried to tackle this one. Whilst there are a few threads about various mash regimes, here is a link to one of them: http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=62204

That thread (which is a great resource already) talks about 50, 52, 55 and 58C.

(From other thread)
50 - Short Protein Rest
52 - ? I'm assuming just an ideal just above 50C?
55 - ? in the middle ideal ?
58 - Medium Protein Rest

What's the deal there? Stop at 50C and 58C?
Is 55C just an in-the-middle number to try and nail the best of both worlds?

 

[Nick JD]

That thread (which is a great resource already) talks about 50, 52, 55 and 58C.

(From other thread)
50 - Short Protein Rest
52 - ? I'm assuming just an ideal just above 50C?
55 - ? in the middle ideal ?
58 - Medium Protein Rest

What's the deal there? Stop at 50C and 58C?
Is 55C just an in-the-middle number to try and nail the best of both worlds?

Have a read about highly modified malts and protein rests.

 

[hsb]

What's the deal there? Stop at 50C and 58C?
Is 55C just an in-the-middle number to try and nail the best of both worlds?

 

[SJW]

I dough in at tap temp, ie about 10 deg C these days, and ramp it up to 54 deg C for 10 min the 61, 71 & 78 or just go to 73 deg C for mash out.
My understanding is there is a whole bunch of enzymes that will be activated and working on the mash from about 20 deg C up, so any short amount of time the BM spends ramping up through these temps does not hurt and may indeed help the mash.

 

[hsb]

Hehe, 50,52,54,55,58. The protein lottery numbers are in! I'll stick with 52/58 for now then but might consider just going 55 instead. As per the other thread, there is a multitude of similar but dissimilar information to be had.

61/71 - sounds unusual - super dry/extra body & head retention? Is that for lagers? Or just very dry ales?

 

[Malted]

How does one become a 'Beer God' ?
Is it by chopping off another beer god's head...similar to 'Highlander.....there can be only one !!!
Right....where's my kilt <_<

I think it is actually a bastardisation of "Oh Dear God" and is derived from the AGB or After Grog Bog, or more precisely, sharting. "Oh Dear God! I have Just Shart Myself" which is generally contracted to "Dear God!". So I guess the simple answer is once you have drunk so much beer that you have at some stage shart yourself because of having drunk such a volume of beer. I suppose that once you have muttered this phrase that those nearby you may well utter the same phrase once their olfactory systems kick in, it may well be that you could be mistaken for thinking they were calling you a 'beer god'.

That thread (which is a great resource already) talks about 50, 52, 55 and 58C.

There are other posts that have hit this territory, I just went to that thread for personal reasons.

(From other thread)
50 - Short Protein Rest
52 - ? I'm assuming just an ideal just above 50C?
55 - ? in the middle ideal ?
58 - Medium Protein Rest

What's the deal there? Stop at 50C and 58C?
Is 55C just an in-the-middle number to try and nail the best of both worlds?

Just use temperature numbers that are easy to remember. See below:

I often do the "twos" in my step mashing as it's easy to remember.
42, 52, 62, 72C

 

[Danwood]

I think it is actually a bastardisation of "Oh Dear God" and is derived from the AGB or After Grog Bog, or more precisely, sharting. "Oh Dear God! I have Just Shart Myself" which is generally contracted to "Dear God!". So I guess the simple answer is once you have drunk so much beer that you have at some stage shart yourself because of having drunk such a volume of beer. I suppose that once you have muttered this phrase that those nearby you may well utter the same phrase once their olfactory systems kick in, it may well be that you could be mistaken for thinking they were calling you a 'beer god'.




There are other posts that have hit this territory, I just went to that thread for personal reasons.



Just use temperature numbers that are easy to remember. See below:

And there are a lot of 'Beer' Gods on this site, aren't there...oh dear

 

[SJW]

61/71 - sounds unusual - super dry/extra body & head retention? Is that for lagers? Or just very dry ales?

<_< 61 for Beta amalase conversion and 71 for Alpha amalase conversion, and I vary the time at each temp depending on what I am brewing and what profile I want. Why is there any other way to do it? seeing as we are talking temp step mashing?

 

[manticle]

.

61/71 - sounds unusual - super dry/extra body & head retention? Is that for lagers? Or just very dry ales?

Look up 'hochkurz'

As SJW suggests you are targeting both sets of saccharification enzymes. I do 62-3 and 67 -68 for most beers. A drier beer gets a longer low rest and a fuller bodied/dextrinous beer gets a shorter low rest.

You get a full bodied, dextrinous beer that attenuates well and finishes dry, just like a good beer should.

Have a crack. My regular regime is low for 10-15 and high for 40-50. Finishes the same as my 64-67 single infusion beers (1010-1012 depending on yeast, as low as 1008 for some special types like duvel homage) but with a nice body that belies that. Not sweet.

55 and 72 rest for head retention. Both 5-10 mins only.

 

[Clutch]

I usually dough in with hot tap water (because I mill so fine it avoids doughballs) which gives me an initial rest temperature in the mid fifties.

IMO, using my gear it improves head retention and body in general - but only really when I ramp up to low sacc rests like 62-64C. I find no difference in mashes warmer than 66C.

No hot water taste issues Nick?
I've often thought about doing this to shortcut warmup, but read that it can affect taste?

 

[SJW]

Thanks Manticle

 

[Nick JD]

No hot water taste issues Nick?

I can't tell the difference.

 

[Ross]

This is interesting Ross, can you give more details?
For instance, how long are they in the boil? What sort of amount g/L would you use? Do they go in as-is or would you recommend crushing the nibs or some sort of other pre-treatment? Do you skim during the boil, would this removes the fats with the coagulated components on the surface? Are there fining agents that you use that would bond with the cocoa fats?

Can you account for how you are able to get a good head on the beers despite the potential presence of the cocoa fats? Is it good head or good, persistent head? I know that the presence of saliva can be enough to kill the head on a beer in a glass in some circumstances, so I am genuinely interested in the cocoa nibs. Maybe it is just a case of, ok if used in small amounts?

We add at the start of the boil & grind the nibs through our grain mill, we boil for 60 mins & don't skim. When "dry nibbing" we process the nibs through a coffee grinder to a powder for maximum extraction. The head on these beers matches that of any other similar style not using nibs.
Generally used at approx 110gm per 20L but have gone much higher. Never noticed any coagulated components on the surface, but then we always draw from the bottom (as you would) leaving the surface layer with the break material in the boiler or the yeast in the fermenter. If you are kegging, you are always drawing from the bottom, so again, any surface layer will not be noticed to the very last drop. That said, i've never noticed any surface film regardless. If you are bottling, then you may have to be carefull not to bottle the surface film if there is one.

Sorry, I don't know the science, just practical experience.

cheers Ross