Ag Setup And Stand

[jel]

Hi all,

Well, after fudging my way through a few partials on the kitchen stove, and getting many the odd look from the wife when her feet get stuck to the floor, I thought it was time to step things up a bit.

So here's my proposed new shiny set-up for comment/review:




Staging
As this will not be a cheap exercise, I was planning on staging the purchases.

Stage 1 (where I am currently at)
70L robinox kettle with beerbelly deluxe hopscreen and 1/2 inch full bore s/s valve
Italian spiral burner with med. pressure reg.
30 plate chiller
Dodgy 25L esky MLT with braid
Assorted 10L pots for HLT on the kitchen stove
No stand, manually lift everything

Stage 2
Build MLT and HLT, still manually lift everything and balance on assorted old washing machines

Stage 3
Build stand.
Gravity drain water from HLT into MLT for infusion mashing and batch/fly sparging
Gravity drain into Kettle and manually lift for boiling.
Gravity drain through chiller into fermenter.

Stage 4
Buy a march pump and avoid OH&S concerns from the wife/parents and shocked onlookers.

Stage 5
Add HERMS

So, keeping in mind that I am at Stage 1 and would like to get to Stage 5, any comments on the following equipment:

Kettle
As mentioned, 70L Robinox Pot, with single 1/2 inch full bore tap. Gas heating.

MLT
50 L Robinox Pot, insulated
S/S full sized custom false bottom
Mashmate Temp probe (is this a waste of money? any other options?)
1/2 inch drain through base of pot
1/2 inch inlet at handle height

HLT
50 L Robinox Pot - not planning on insulating at this stage
2400 Watt screw-in HW element (most likely buy from Stokes : Stokes Parts PDF - any thoughts on type? keeping in mind i am limited to 10A)
Mashmate Temp probe (is this a waste of money? any other options?)
1/2 inch full bore tap
Polycarbonate sight glass

HERMS - basically very little idea here ....
20 L Pot? - insulated.
1/2 inch copper coil - length?
1/2 inch inlet and outlet - bulkhead style fittings
2400 Watt element <---- same as HW element? or better to use kettle type element?
PID controlled temp monitoring on outlet (will definitely need help setting this up as I am electrically illiterate)


I was planning on purchasing camlocks (or similar) and avoiding fixed plumbing anywhere. All parts will be S/S except for herms coil.

The MLT will be a tip-dump system with a removable flase bottom for easy cleaning.

Sorry for the long post but I would really appreciate any feedback, before I lock myself into something I will ultimately regret later.

Cheers
Jon

 

[Wardhog]

MLT
50 L Robinox Pot, insulated
S/S full sized custom false bottom
Mashmate Temp probe (is this a waste of money? any other options?)
1/2 inch drain through base of pot
1/2 inch inlet at handle height

HLT
50 L Robinox Pot - not planning on insulating at this stage
2400 Watt screw-in HW element (most likely buy from Stokes : Stokes Parts PDF - any thoughts on type? keeping in mind i am limited to 10A)
Mashmate Temp probe (is this a waste of money? any other options?)
1/2 inch full bore tap
Polycarbonate sight glass

You might save a few bucks by going for one of the 4" dial thermometers for the mash tun, a Mashmate might be a bit of overkill for the mash tun if you're not applying heat to the mash tun. One of them will be perfect for the HLT.

 

[raven19]

Stage 3
Build stand.
Gravity drain water from HLT into MLT for infusion mashing and batch/fly sparging
Gravity drain into Kettle and manually lift for boiling.
Gravity drain through chiller into fermenter.

Jon - love the drawing mate, very professional.

My thought on the above (I am in a similar position myself setting up for AG), is to maybe gravity drain from mash tun into smaller pots, then simply pour this into your kettle (which can stay at the right height for boiling). Smaller lifts this way, just need to keep an eye on the smaller pot. This will eliminate the need to lift a heavy kettle onto the elevated burner once gravity filled also.

Dont forget to take photos during construction so we can all enjoy the brew p*rn.

Cheers!

 

[raven19]

HLT
50 L Robinox Pot - not planning on insulating at this stage
2400 Watt screw-in HW element (most likely buy from Stokes : Stokes Parts PDF - any thoughts on type? keeping in mind i am limited to 10A)

Depending on your batch size, anything over 30L may need more than 2400W initially to get up to the boil. I am looking into 2 elements so I can do 50L batches. Will need two separate power cords though, as I will also be on 10A limitation.

More discussion on this thread on electric too in relaton to Wattage, etc...
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...=going+electric

Being a fellow Adelaide lad, would be keen to see how it goes once set up?
Hope this helps.
Cheers! :icon_cheers:

 

[Fents]

those drawings are amazing. i have a similar drawing.....in my head though. no way i could get that down on paper!

 

[the_fuzz]

Depending on your batch size, anything over 30L may need more than 2400W initially to get up to the boil. I am looking into 2 elements so I can do 50L batches. Will need two separate power cords though, as I will also be on 10A limitation.

2 power cords going to 2 different circuits - 2400w is 10amp, thus you will need to circuits - unless of course you just get a bigger circuit

 

[raven19]

2 power cords going to 2 different circuits - 2400w is 10amp, thus you will need to circuits - unless of course you just get a bigger circuit

Yes agree - sorry should've clarified that in my previous post!

 

[brettprevans]

you should be able to get a 3600W element running on a normal household power outlet (unles its a really old house). a 3600w from stokes is only about $20 more from memory

 

[jel]

Thanks all for the comments so far.

@ Wardhog
Yes I figured I could get away with a dial thermometer in the mash tun. Although if I am using digital temp monitoring for the rest, maybe it is not worth the saving? Are there any quality/reliability differences between the two?

@ Fents
Thanks mate. I am an architect by trade, and although the program I use at work (Archicad) isnt really designed for these type of designs, I managed to beat it into submission. Once I get the design sorted, I will be making up shop drawings for the frame, so I am more than happy to send them to you if they will help. I can export to most formats, or .pdf if you prefer.

@ all re HLT power.
I had thought that 2400W might be a little underpowered for double batches, however at this stage I will mainly be doing single batches, and setting the HLT to heat up while I am still happily snoring in bed.
When I finally build my own place, I will install many a 15A outlets in my shed, then swap the the element for a more suitable 3600W.
I have had a new DB installed in the house I am currently in, a few years back but not all of the wiring was upgraded, so I can not vouch for how safe it would be to overload the circuits.

@ raven.
No worries mate, I will definitely keep you posted on progress (although this project may take a few months) and let you know what I find along the way.
I already have the s/s bits and bobs stuff sorted through pro-chem and geordi's (although I would like to keep as much of this local as possible)
Stokes is close by on richmond road, and I will be taking a trip to Dotmar plastics to pick up some polycarbonate tube for the sight glass tomorrow (let me know if you need any as I will have more than ample)
I am getting a few quotes for the stainless work, so once that is finalised, I will order all the parts.
Pity I am not good friends with any electricians ...

Cheers
jon

 

[Wardhog]

Although if I am using digital temp monitoring for the rest, maybe it is not worth the saving? Are there any quality/reliability differences between the two?

I don't know if one is better than the other (I might soon though, I'm putting the DEI-109 in my shiny new HLT, and have the dial thermometer in my mash tun), I just don't really see $40 worth of value in a MashMate used in a non-heated mash tun. As it's not controlling any active heat source, it's really just an expensive digital thermometer.

 

[FarsideOfCrazy]

Hi Jel, That all looks fantastic and I dream of getting setup like that in the future. Have you thought of one of the setups from beerbelly though?

http://www.beerbelly.com.au/brewboy.html

I remember reading somewhere that you can buy them in stages also and as your looking at their pots maybe an enquiry about that avenue might be what your after.

Just a thought.

 

[Effect]

+1 for brewboy from beer belly!

I wouldn't bother going to all the trouble of making one - get a professional to build you one!

 

[wambesi]

+1 for brewboy from beer belly!

I wouldn't bother going to all the trouble of making one - get a professional to build you one!

Where's the fun in that!
I'd rather be involved (as much as I can with my limited skills anyway), hence why my pop is coming round to help do up this frame I have lying around as my brew stand, he'll be doing the more tech stuff but I'm still helping out...

 

[reviled]

http://www.beerbelly.com.au/brewboy.html

So shiny, must have!!!

 

[porky]

I don't know if one is better than the other (I might soon though, I'm putting the DEI-109 in my shiny new HLT, and have the dial thermometer in my mash tun), I just don't really see $40 worth of value in a MashMate used in a non-heated mash tun. As it's not controlling any active heat source, it's really just an expensive digital thermometer.

I agree with this, but I would go with a digital thermometer instead of the dial one. I have the dial type and I don't like it.
If I was doing it again, or when the thermometer dies, I will get a digital with probe from Jaycar, stock number XC-0224. They cost $39.50 same as the dial ones. You can read with just a glance. too easy.

Cheers,
Bud

 

[jel]

@ Wardhog

Out of interest, what exactly is a DEI-109 and where is it available from?

@ budwiser

My only concern with the jaycar thermometer would be the probe. Do you know if they can handle being knocked around a bit? If I had to upgrade the probe to something a little more purpose built, it starts getting up in price, similar to the mashmate.

@ all

Any opinions on the layout of the brewstand, and my proposed method of use?

The herms side of things I can deal with at a later stage, although any advise on elements, controls etc would still be appreciated. From what I have read, the best place to locate the thermometer would be on the wort out side of the herms?

I have also asked Wayne for a quote to complete the MLT and HLT, and to be honest I would rather get these items from him, as the prices are great as is the quality, so hopefully he will confirm costs soon.

As for the stand, well although I love all things shiny, I felt it was one area I could save a bit of cash, get creative with, and like wambesi, spend some time with the old man learning some new skills. Plus I get to add some sexiness with a colourful paint job B)

I also really enjoy the whole learniing process behind the build side of things, which probably explains why i chose to be an architect rather than a developer.

Anyways, appreciate the comments.

Cheers
jon

 

[Wardhog]

My apologies, it's a DEI-106 not 109. Craftbrewer sells them as well. Have a cruise through the sponsors up the top of the page, there's tons of cool gadgetry to be found.

 

[porky]

@ budwiser

My only concern with the jaycar thermometer would be the probe. Do you know if they can handle being knocked around a bit? If I had to upgrade the probe to something a little more purpose built, it starts getting up in price, similar to the mashmate.

I don't know mate, but it looks like it would be good. Look at this link and judge for yourself. I don't have one so can't say

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?I...=&SUBCATID=

Cheers,
Bud

 

[yardy]

Plus I get to add some sexiness with a colourful paint job B)

if you're going to all that hard work and it's not stainless (like mine :wub: ) i would consider getting it powder coated, when you build it you may have to drill some drain holes for the chemical treatment.

cheers