# Water quality in plastic fermentor - May have found some important inf



## trustyrusty (24/1/16)

Hi Guys

FYI 

I thought I have or had an issue with my water quality.... So put some water in a black racking container I have to leave overnight and use for brewing. This, as I understand it, was bought at market where someone was selling their home brew stuff. It actually has a larger opening and in that larger cap is another smaller opening that is used for checking or adding hops (both screw caps)
etc. I actually added an airlock to that to use as an another primary fermentor. The tooling looks exactly the same as Coopers white fermentor. Says Ampac on the bottom and as far as I can tell is a homebrew product. I was concerned that was not food grade. Think black container is pretty old. White container has 03/11 date but black just has circle with arrow pointing to 1.

Anyhow I was reading about leaving your brewing water over night to reduce chlorine.

24 hrs later I can hardly drink the water - takes like plastic - SH$^%&&T. 50 % of brews have been racking in there or used when priming....URGGHHHHH. I am now testing white container....Maybe black container pre-dates the BPA testing and protocols. Or can I just have very good taste buds? This is really bad and maybe reason for some brews brews that are not great...

If you don;t have good water you don't have good beer.

Has anyone experienced this...? Tested your tanks? I have given a shot in the arm for stainless steel tanks .

Will know in AM about white one...

Thanks


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## manticle (24/1/16)

You want recycling number 2. High density poly-ethylene or HDPE for short.
Most blue jerry cans and white fermenters will be hdpe. You may still want to fill with boiling water, let cool then taste the water to make sure it's all sweet.
Also be careful of what kind of hoses you use - silicon is pretty reliable but some pvc hoses are very ordinary.


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## trustyrusty (24/1/16)

Thanks - filled up with boiling water to make sure the initial water was fine....I tasted water before ...it was fine...


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## wynnum1 (24/1/16)

Have some old black fermenters and they have year and are still usable have had white fermenters that the plastic disintegrated had to throw away a lid the center part crumbled.Problem with the old fermenters is they are smaller then the newer ones.


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## superstock (24/1/16)

manticle said:


> Also be careful of what kind of hoses you use - silicon is pretty reliable but some pvc hoses are very ordinary.


Second this! The first 2 brews I made, I used the garden hose and made crap beer.


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## wynnum1 (24/1/16)

lead and phthalates in garden hose


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## wide eyed and legless (24/1/16)

Think black container is pretty old. White container has 03/11 date but black just has circle with arrow pointing to 1.

The number 1 identifies the plastic as not reusable (polyethylene terephthalate or PET)


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## wynnum1 (24/1/16)

Black fermenter 4/1976.


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## wide eyed and legless (24/1/16)

Number 4 LDPE regarded as safe.


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## trustyrusty (24/1/16)

wide eyed and legless said:


> The number 1 identifies the plastic as not reusable (polyethylene terephthalate or PET)


Not reusable ... Did they expect people to buy a fermentor each brew... Do you mean recycle? I have used garden hose, but is a more expensive hose.. Hoselink. I have tasted from hose and seems ok, (the cheaper hose I can smell and taste the plastic. )Could that be an issue too..?


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## Danscraftbeer (24/1/16)

I've got a Stainless Steel 50lt kegmenter now. Far out its fantastic. No worries about plastic now after I had a bad run of beers that tasted like plastic too. First beer pressure fermented and transferred to 2 X 18lt kegs in 7 days. All carbonated and practically ready to drink although I'll give them another week to condition. It looks and smells to be my best beer. Totally stoked. 
One thing is undeniable about plastics. its permeable. It stains which means it absorbs. If it absorbs your beer then so too with anything else like Caustic soda, whatever cleaners, bacteria etc. You cant use a plastic fermenter that's been used for sour beers for any other beer because of this.

And for silicon hoses. I boil mine to sterilize them before racking etc and that water always smells like rubber afterwards. Which makes me wonder how much of that transfers into the beer when people recirculate hot wort with them. h34r:


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## wide eyed and legless (24/1/16)

Trustyrusty said:


> Not reusable ... Did they expect people to buy a fermentor each brew... Do you mean recycle? I have used garden hose, but is a more expensive hose.. Hoselink. I have tasted from hose and seems ok, (the cheaper hose I can smell and taste the plastic. )Could that be an issue too..?


I bought my hose from Bunnings the Blue hose. Not reusable, should be recycled after first use.
HDPE Rinse out with bicarb to get rid of plastic taste and smell, I had the same problem with a collapse-able water container which I put my beer in, was ok after washing out with bicarb. 
http://www.healthychild.org/know-your-plastics/


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## superstock (24/1/16)

Trustyrusty said:


> I have used garden hose, but is a more expensive hose.. Hoselink. I have tasted from hose and seems ok, (the cheaper hose I can smell and taste the plastic. )Could that be an issue too..?


My hose is a Hoselink on a reel. If you fill a bucket it will foam as if it has detergent in it. You have to run out all the water that's stored in the hose before that stops. BTW one of my reels has green reinforced hose the other semiclear reinforced. It's the green one I'm talking about. The opaque one doesn't seem to do it.


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## trustyrusty (26/1/16)

Hi - Just re tasted old black fermenter - yuk....
and white tank - Standard one most people will have - slight plastic taste.... mmmm palatable but not great...

I am going to do a blind test taste and make sure I not thinking what it should taste like.. Get back soon..

cheers


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## TheWiggman (26/1/16)

Trustyrusty said:


> I am going to do a blind test taste and make sure I not thinking what it should taste like..


Wise words. Perception can definitely influence how something tastes.


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## Midnight Brew (26/1/16)

wide eyed and legless said:


> HDPE Rinse out with bicarb to get rid of plastic taste and smell, I had the same problem with a collapse-able water container which I put my beer in, was ok after washing out with bicarb.
> http://www.healthychild.org/know-your-plastics/


Discovered this the hard way with the the collapsibles I was using for cask ale. Soaked heaps with percarbonate but nothing changed same taste.

How much bicarb did you used to get best result?


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## Bribie G (26/1/16)

When I ran a LHBS in the late 1970s, Home brew complete outfits such as Brigalow came with a black fermenter. That's the last time I ever saw one of those.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (26/1/16)

All this effort when you can simply buy a new HDPE fermenter from Bunnings, removing all doubt re the FV. I recently had a swollen cube and wasted some time starting to sterilise it then thought, why of why. My times more precious than a cheap piece of plastic. Spend the saved time on brewing your next batch well and enjoying it


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## Brewnicorn (21/10/16)

Danscraftbeer said:


> I've got a Stainless Steel 50lt kegmenter now. Far out its fantastic. No worries about plastic now after I had a bad run of beers that tasted like plastic too. First beer pressure fermented and transferred to 2 X 18lt kegs in 7 days. All carbonated and practically ready to drink although I'll give them another week to condition. It looks and smells to be my best beer. Totally stoked.
> One thing is undeniable about plastics. its permeable. It stains which means it absorbs. If it absorbs your beer then so too with anything else like Caustic soda, whatever cleaners, bacteria etc. You cant use a plastic fermenter that's been used for sour beers for any other beer because of this.
> 
> And for silicon hoses. I boil mine to sterilize them before racking etc and that water always smells like rubber afterwards. Which makes me wonder how much of that transfers into the beer when people recirculate hot wort with them. h34r:


Care to note your model at all? I'm interested in this down the track. Plastics retaining the beer/hop smells a lot these days no matter how new/old.


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## BKBrews (27/10/16)

Glad I found this topic RE: garden hoses. I've been using a cheap shitty hose that I got from masters to fill my grainfather. I can 100% taste a garden hose in the 2 beers I've done. Very annoying!!


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## damoninja (27/10/16)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Number 4 LDPE regarded as safe.


Up to about 80C which rules out ever cleaning it with water hotter than your hot tap, HDPE on the other hand stable to ~120C.




BKBrews said:


> Glad I found this topic RE: garden hoses. I've been using a cheap shitty hose that I got from masters to fill my grainfather. I can 100% taste a garden hose in the 2 beers I've done. Very annoying!!


Garden hose is PVC also only food safe up to ~70C before degrading. Boiling water through it will buckle the crap out of it and leech crap quick smart. 

I use it to fill up my HLT with water starting about 55C water from my hot tap, I've let some of this water cool and tasted and it's been fine.


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## BKBrews (27/10/16)

> Up to about 80C which rules out ever cleaning it with water hotter than your hot tap, HDPE on the other hand stable to ~120C.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've never run anything but room temp water through it, but it's definitely imparting some kind of weird flavour. I also didn't think about it properly and didn't run the water that had been sitting in the hose into the garden prior to filling my grainfather - just put it straight in there. Going to put down another Maris Otter/Chinook SMaSH with a few of my water issues sorted out and see how much better I can do.


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