# Wyeast 3638



## Hubby (29/12/06)

Been sampling the first few of a "hefeweizen" I did last month using Wyeast 3638.



"Wyeast website" said:


> 3638 Bavarian Wheat Yeast. Top cropping hefeweizen yeast with complex flavor and aroma. Balance of banana and bubble gum esters with lichi and apple/plum esters and cloviness. Flocculation - low; apparent attenuation 70-76% (64-75 F, 18-24 C)


It was a partial recipe I threw together:

1.4 kg wheat malt (JW)
1.4 kg pale malt (JW)
0.6 kg DME light
0.6 kg DME wheat light
14g POR pellets (9.2) - 60 min
14 g Saaz pellets (3.4) - 15 min
Wyeast 3638 1.5 L starter

Thin mash 3L / kg - single infusion @ 67 degrees C (batch sparged)

Batch: 22L
OG 1.046 FG 1.010

Comments: Fermentation was very strong and "complete" @ 19 degrees C within 3 days, then racked to secondary for 7 days (19 down to 16 degrees C) & bottled. (Yes, I wanted it done before Xmas  ). Selection of hops based on what I had in hand.

I know it's not an ideal recipe or method, but it worked and I'm very pleased with the result.

*Wyeast 3638 - highly recommended  * :beerbang:


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## Ross (29/12/06)

looks nice Hubby, i reckon the spiceyness of por would go well in the style, though never thought of using it before  . With a wheat i'd be pitching a lower volume to get more character out the yeast though, you don't really want a big starter...

cheers Ross


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## Hubby (30/12/06)

I will try less starter next time, Ross. Thanks for the tip. 

By the way, the POR & Saaz idea came from Matilda Bay Brewing Co - used in Redback (not that I was looking for that style).

I forgot to mention, I used 3638 simply because 3068 was out of stock at the time. In any case, I now have several 3638 cultures ready to go for the next trials :chug:


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## Weizguy (30/12/06)

Hubby, ...mate, the W3638 is the Schneider yeast, IIRC.

Great choice for yeast. This style focusses on the malt, esters and phenolics. 19C is a good temp to ferment a weizen.
As Ross sez, a smaller culture should produce more esters, but I have no experience with this yeast and it's prob good either way. Can you describe the balance of flavours? Does the malt, wheat and banana/ other fruit tastes shine through?

How was the bitterness and hop flava. I'd hope for floral and not too bitter.

Redback was a good introductory weizen, and I'm not sure if the recipe has changed much since I last had one. It's certainly not a bad thing to emulate a good, clean beer and then update the recipe to match your own tastes.

Your recipe looks pretty reasonable. I never (can't remember if I did anyway) make a partial mash weizen. The all-DME weizens were great and I just went straight to a.g. rather than going halfway. I did a few partials, including some Witbiers, and they were great too, but the clour was a little dark. By the time I got to brewing another weizen, I had used up all my Muntone wheat DMA and already had a few ag's under my belt, so I jumped in and made an ag weizen. A bit nicer than the DME beer, but both are still good for the style.

Great to see another wheat beer brewer in the ranks. I'm keen to try the W3638 soon, but I better save up, coz I spent all my State comp prize vouchers at the lhbs already.

Weizen on! :beer: 

Seth out


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## Hubby (30/12/06)

Hey Seth, thanks for the words of encouragement. I only do partials because I'm still building the AG rig - time/cost permitting. The brew prior to this pushed the partial rig to its limits and I still fluked a very nice pilsener. In my research for a wheat beer, I recall that 3638 was the Schneider yeast - although I've never tried one, so that put me behind the 8-ball. I like this little blurb from Georg Schneiders first wheat beer lexicon (link):


> *Typology of a wheatbeer drinker *
> It is very difficult to imagine wheatbeer drinking people as lonesome, grumpy, and we-against-the-world-attitude, sitting in front of the TV. Rather, people come to mind that indulge in wheatbeer together, that discuss beer, politics, sport, and cultural events until late during warm summer nights. Such tightly knit communities of happy, dynamic, sociable, and life enjoying people sometimes spontaneously organize themselves in Schneider Weisse Fan clubs.


In terms of taste (excuse my poor description here): it had the initial bite then lots of bananas. The hop bitterness is very slight and there's a nice subtle spiciness to balance the bananas. It has a full body and creamy head, and of course the mandatory bottle roll to rouse the yeast. Colour is light amber and with a chill haze evident. 

Still over the moon with the result. :chug:


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## Jye (15/7/07)

I pulled a year old start of 3638 out of the fridge this arvo and chucked it on the stir plate for an up coming hefe. There was still plenty of bubble gum esters in the beer but not a lot of banana. Does anyone else have some tasting notes and fermentation temp with this yeast? 

Im pretty excited about giving it another go especially if the banana also comes through with the bubble gum.


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## razz (15/7/07)

Sorry Jye, no tasting notes. Just this courtesy of Wyeast.
3638 Bavarian Wheat Yeast. Top cropping hefeweizen yeast with complex flavor and aroma. Balance of banana and bubble gum esters with lichi and apple/plum esters and cloviness. Flocculation - low; apparent attenuation 70-76% (64-75 F, 18-24 C)


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## Paul H (15/7/07)

Jye said:


> I pulled a year old start of 3638 out of the fridge this arvo and chucked it on the stir plate for an up coming hefe. There was still plenty of bubble gum esters in the beer but not a lot of banana. Does anyone else have some tasting notes and fermentation temp with this yeast?
> 
> Im pretty excited about giving it another go especially if the banana also comes through with the bubble gum.



From what I have read & my limited experience with this yeast I believe the higher temp range you go the more banana comes through.


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## mika (15/7/07)

Though some podcasts recommend fermenting as low as 16degs, with all the extery notes coming from the high precentage of quality wheat malt in the grainbill.


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## Weizguy (15/7/07)

I have my first beer using W3638 carbing up in a number of bottles now.

It's a Schneider Weisse clone and the initial tasting suggests an excellent balance of malt and fruity (banana and apple/lichi/fruit salad) flavour, with some clove.

If I remember, I'll post here when it's gassed up (and tasted). It's a little slow at room temp 16C at the moment.

Very similar to commercial Schneiders I've sampled. I'll be very pleased to have a crack at an Aventinus clone with this yeast.

Beerz
Seth


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## troywhite (16/7/07)

Hubby said:


> *Wyeast 3638 - highly recommended  * :beerbang:



Very nice 

I just pitched a 3638 into my Schneider Weisse clone (all grain) this morning. Looking forward to the outcome.

Using the "No Chill" method in Canberra at this time of year can actually go a bit too far. My 100 degree wort last night at 8.30 was a 13 degree wort this morning at 7am!!! And that is inside a garage. Bloody cold. Thank god for my fish tank immersion heaters


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## Jye (16/7/07)

Les the Weizguy said:


> It's a Schneider Weisse clone and the initial tasting suggests an excellent balance of malt and fruity (banana and apple/lichi/fruit salad) flavour, with some clove.



Are you fermenting at ambient temp 16C? I was thinking of fermenting between 19-20C.

Its been less than 24 hrs and the starter has kicked off woo-hoo


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## Inge (24/7/07)

I just put on a hefe yesterday, made as per Les' Saaz + liquid extract recipe in some other thread which I have now lost. I made a hefe some time ago using the 3638 and the Black Rock whispering wheat kit, and found it had very little of the ester character that I was after. In fact, the tartness of the wheat is what shone through the most. I put it down to too low a fermentation temperature :huh:

Bloody strong fermentation, the constant release of CO2 is damn near blowing all the water out of my airlock. SG is sitting at 1020 from 1040, and initial tastes of the wort suggest a better ester flavour than the last time, but it's still not as strong as I had hoped. Tartness still very much noticeable. I'm fermenting at around 21 degrees. I read before that maybe the size of the starter has something to do with it, I pitched roughly 1200 mLs of starter... Maybe try to pitch less next time?

:unsure:


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## Inge (25/7/07)

Patience....

Spoke too soon. The banana is on its way now.


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## Hubby (12/8/07)

I've just put down a third brew using a 3638 split (from the original - seems like a long time ago :blink: ) and I'm really looking forward to the result. It's great to see everyone else trying it too


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## clay (13/8/07)

I ended up with a pack of this after my supplier ran out of 3068. I'm still deciding whether to use the 3638 or Ross' new dried yeast in my next hefe...maybe split the batch and do a side by side comparrison.


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## Weizguy (13/8/07)

Jye said:


> Are you fermenting at ambient temp 16C? I was thinking of fermenting between 19-20C.
> 
> Its been less than 24 hrs and the starter has kicked off woo-hoo


Finally replying to this message...

I fermented at 16, then raised to 20-22, with the fermentor 1/2 on/off a heat pad.
Would have preferred a constant temp of 20.

The beer is drinking well with the right bready and fruity notes.

There seems to be an issue with head retention, so I'll leave out the protein rest next time. Maybe the maltsters have made the malt so idiot-proof that the protein rest is not required.

Beerz
Seth


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## pk.sax (22/9/10)

going to get a delivery of this soon
would be fun brewing a weissbeer when I do.... Already have a kit + extract brewed wheat ale done with US-05 carbing up, I'm gonna love my summer if I can get these beers done and bottled up 

Now, bottles! I NEED more bottles, stubbies, 500ml, 750 ml whatever really.. lol anyone in melbourne looking to get rid of glass? I bought my last batch of second hand 500 ml bottles from the shop @ 40 cents a piece, can do that again if anyone is supplying bottles.... good ideas even?

http://www.onebeer.net/yeaststrains_wheat.html

Now who has tried them ^ all!!


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## Phoney (23/9/10)

Has anyone done a side-by-side comparison of 3638 with 3068? Im interested in the differences.


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## pk.sax (5/11/10)

I have a sleepy weiss yeast :S

Pitched earlier today, been nearly 10 hrs, wort was well and truly aerated. No crausen yet 
Yeast does seem to have grown a bit, neat layer of deposit at the bottom. I didn't let the smack pack swell all the way through though, pitched into fwk diluted to 1051. Well, considering people have these yeasts trying to burst out of everything, I am a bit worried. Temp was 20C at start but ice packs have worked to get that down to 18.

Wake up I'm der morgen?! Sigh...


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## Nick JD (6/11/10)

phoneyhuh said:


> Has anyone done a side-by-side comparison of 3638 with 3068? Im interested in the differences.



I find 3068 more banana and more tart - actually, more "hefe", with 3638 being a bit mellower overall. 

3068 is a handful during fermentation but I like it slightly better. 

3638 also seems not to last as long. After a couple of weeks in the bottle the beer is very different to fresh, whereas 3068 seems to hold the esters and phenolics better.

I don't get a hell of a lot of phenolics with either, but I tend to stress the yeast. 

3068 is often sulphury - way more than 3638. It almost always passes though.


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## pk.sax (6/11/10)

Came back home to a lovely krausen  Clingwrap is domed but it doesn't look like its gonna push it off yet... am I being too optimistic about that!? hmnnnn... well, it was 16C when I left it and has climbed to 18C now. I have it under constant icepack control, basically I stack a few icepacks and a frozen bottle around it to keep it a bit cool.

Pic:




Its nearly an inch thick.


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## Florian (6/11/10)

practicalfool said:


> ... am I being too optimistic about that!?




Yes, you are! Wait another 24 hours at the most and it should look like this if everything goes well:


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## pk.sax (6/11/10)

bloody hell! And your's is only half full.... Mine is 19.3 litres in a 30 litre fermenter..... I should be in trouble soon. Hmnn... I'll have to keep an eye on it  Its been ~28 hours since pitch.

PS: The second pic makesmewantto kiss the cling wrap :lol:


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## Nick JD (6/11/10)

I've had a 15L batch in a 25L fermenter try to get out with 3068. It's a monster. 

And don't think you're gonna be okay because three days have past - it's random. You think you've escaped it, and BOOM. Mess everywhere.


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## pk.sax (8/11/10)

It climbed 3 inches above the wort line and is now receding. 16-18C being the culprit?! Oh well, I'm happy but will keep a sideways eye on it.


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## Adam Howard (8/11/10)

I wanted to try something all grain but don't have any gear together so I threw in an ArtisanAle wheat with 3638 today. I get the feeling it's going to get massive. Wyeast pack was swollen in a little over 30 minutes and had an amazing smell when opened! (Both the yeast and the FWK!) Already bulging the glad wrap with CO2.

Bought this because G&G were out of 3068. Hoping to keep it around 17-18 to get a balance of banana and clove and plum. Excited.


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## pk.sax (8/11/10)

Cheers to that mate!! Yayyy, we're doing the same exact beer. Same temps too 

Btw, was your wort actually 16.3 litres rather than 17 litres?? Mine either was or my fermenter has dodgy graduations. I got every last drop out of the cube.


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## Adam Howard (8/11/10)

practicalfool said:


> Cheers to that mate!! Yayyy, we're doing the same exact beer. Same temps too
> 
> Btw, was your wort actually 16.3 litres rather than 17 litres?? Mine either was or my fermenter has dodgy graduations. I got every last drop out of the cube.



Yeah it was under 17, hard to say whether that's the cube or the fermenter that's out. I topped up to a touch over 20L and pitched. I never take hydrometer readings but it should be high 1040's-1050.

FWK smelt so unreal. AG is definitely on the cards by next Autumn.

Haha it's pretty funny how easy it is to make the beer too! Pour in, yeast in. BAM.

You're only in FTG, have to trade bottles once both brews are carbed up. Fancy a dodgy train station swap?


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## pk.sax (9/11/10)

Hehehe, definitely, mine should be a touch heavier, I took it to 19.3 on fermenter, exactly 3 litre dilution afaik. Apparently mountain goat make them and their own hefe is nice too 

Dodgy Stn swap it is, I'll bottle you a couple half litre ones


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## Adam Howard (9/11/10)

Yep, Mountain Goat. I really wonder how anyone could buy the silly recipe kits from Brewcraft for close to $50 when you can get fresh wort and Wyeast for not much more. FOOLS!

Yeah I have a few Franziskaner bottles @ 500ml and will do the same ^_^ 

Krausen is really getting up there now. 3-4 inches.

If this goes well I'm itching to do another. Going to investigate a BIAB setup for next autumn but want AG quality beer now!


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## pk.sax (9/11/10)

Hehehe, well, there's punters that never search the net and never land on ahb ya no. Lol

Mate, ag is so simple with all the info on here, just keep it simple and do a stovetop batch of something yummy. I'd say keep the mash fairly generously liquid and spathe/squeeze the grain to fill up the pot to ~17.5 litres and you should have enough to put all that in the cube you now have empty 

Waddaya know, u could maybe no chill and then ferment in the cube itself. Hehe, just grab a metro length of voile, even cotton works great. Now I'm thinking of doing his myself that I've just written it all out! Hmnnnnn. I have all the supplies for the beer i want except the malts, here we go again.


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## beerdrinkingbob (9/11/10)

Adamski29 said:


> Yep, Mountain Goat. I really wonder how anyone could buy the silly recipe kits from Brewcraft for close to $50 when you can get fresh wort and Wyeast for not much more. FOOLS!



Hey Adam, Go easy on the Kits :icon_cheers: 

I agree AG is awesome but we all start somewhere and some are happy to stay doing what they do. 

I know you weren't having a go but could be discouraging to our fello kit brewers.


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## Adam Howard (9/11/10)

beerdrinkingbob said:


> Hey Adam, Go easy on the Kits :icon_cheers:
> 
> I agree AG is awesome but we all start somewhere and some are happy to stay doing what they do.
> 
> I know you weren't having a go but could be discouraging to our fello kit brewers.



It's not having a go. But spending the same money and spending even less time to make superior beer makes a lot more sense. Remember, a fresh wort kit is still a 'kit', just a much better kit.


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## pk.sax (11/11/10)

What do guys have their fwk Weiss beers finish up on FG? mine looks done, haven't taken a reading yet but all the krausen has dissipated over two days to just a few blobs of foam now. Pretty quick one, just what I expected. Fermented at 16-18 with icepack help and now sitting at 20.

Also, how long do you leave a wheat beer on the yeast cake to clean up?


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## pk.sax (12/11/10)

practicalfool said:


> What do guys have their fwk Weiss beers finish up on FG? mine looks done, haven't taken a reading yet but all the krausen has dissipated over two days to just a few blobs of foam now. Pretty quick one, just what I expected. Fermented at 16-18 with icepack help and now sitting at 20.
> 
> Also, how long do you leave a wheat beer on the yeast cake to clean up?



Anyone......... Bueller... anyone?


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## pk.sax (19/11/10)

It's only been 3 days but my wheat seems all carbed up. The pet bottle is hard and generous amount of yeast atthe bottom of the bottles now, there wasn't much the day after I bottled, bubbles too. Is it usual for hefe styles to carb up really quick? And how long is it recommended to mature them? I'm keen to give them a go as fresh as it's feasible.


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## Weizguy (19/11/10)

practicalfool said:


> It's only been 3 days but my wheat seems all carbed up. The pet bottle is hard and generous amount of yeast atthe bottom of the bottles now, there wasn't much the day after I bottled, bubbles too. Is it usual for hefe styles to carb up really quick? And how long is it recommended to mature them? I'm keen to give them a go as fresh as it's feasible.


This style can carb very quickly if the yeast is active, and especially if the temp is higher than 20C.
It's possible that the carbonation could be a bit coarse, with larger bubbles, and low head at this stage.
I suggest you chill one and test if the carbonation is right.

I have made a weizen which was grain to brain (bottled and fully carbed, not kegged) in 10 lazy days.


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## donmateo (20/11/10)

I used 3638 for the vic xmas case swap. I didn't do a starter - to test the underpitching theory, and try and bring out some more phenolics from the growth phase, so just dumped swollen packet into about 25L Hefe wort @ 1.055.
The next day - very small thin white krausen - I thought, 'ok it's taking it's time, lets wait a bit more'. about 12 hours later. I open the fermenting freezer. It's the same!!! I could almost see through it. 
Anyway, I come back the next day, and it's completely gone!! The gravity is still over 1.025, so this is pretty strange. On looking more closely through the glad wrap, I can see it's fermenting well...bubbling away like there was no problem.
Finally attenuated to 1.013, and smells pretty reasonable - but have never seen anything like this from a weizen fermentation. Normally for me they just go (sometimes nuts) and when they're done, the krausen breaks - but not before.
Anyway, all signs are good so far.


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## pk.sax (20/11/10)

You mean ur bringing it to the case swap today?! I'll bring a bottle along then would be good to compare.

PS: following les' advice I have chilled one bottle to see where it's at.


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## pk.sax (22/11/10)

My version passed the taste test, so all happy  concurrent with Les' experience too, very short aging required. Don's taste test should show up in the Vic Xmas case swap taste test thread, I have my unofficial bottle, need to let it carb up, he bottled on the morning of the swap! Haha. Will get back on it when I eventually swap bottles with Adam.

Btw, mine was banana, but subdued, Chris' black hefe was more banana than my 3638 maybe the fermenting at 16-18 did it. Little hint of spice but there definitel. Was something other than banana that was fruity too, I can't place it but it was good might be the plum the yeast maker talks of!


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## lastdrinks (19/6/11)

Put down my first wheat brew with the following recipe and am fermenting at 21c after pitching a Wyeast 3638. its been going for 2 days now. It seems i am fermenting higher than most people do according to this thread. Any advice on what i can expect with phenolics at this higher temp and should i have done it at a lower temp? Either way i am looking forward to trying this out, as i am just starting to try different styles than APA'a and stouts. 

This went into two cubes so i can ferment the second lower if that hear back that 21c is very wrong somehow.

6.3kg JW Wheat
1.8kg vienna
1.7kg pilsner
1kg dried wheat malt (efficiency was down due to lazy initial mash stir, i think)
.6kg med crystal
50gm hersbrucker 25min
50gm Pacifica 25min
IBU 16
OG 1.049
43litres


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