# Malt Shovel Homebrew Concentrates



## PMyers (16/5/03)

Just thought you all might like to know that the new Malt Shovel Homebrew concentrates have arrived at our Girraween store this afternoon, and will be at the other Country Brewers (excluding Bathurst - sorry Brian) from tomorrow.

Just a reminder that these kits are retailing for $18.90 and make 11.5 litres.

Cheers,
Pete

:chug:


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## kook (16/5/03)

I just called West Brew distributors, and they "hadn't heard of it".

Unless Malthouse brings some over directly (which I doubt they will due to the expenses) we wont be seeing them in WA  Malthouse stock ESB kits & fresh wort here(with a fair markup due to the amount it costs them to ship them here for 1 store).


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## Jazman (17/5/03)

well for the price and reduced volume it would have to be good and just as good as the james squire range or just as good as muntons gold range. so i wait to hear how u guys go with it before i will buy it.


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## Doc (17/5/03)

I'm thinking about doing the two can brew with a liquid yeast. 
Just can't decide on the Oatmeal Stout, the Deep Roasted Ale or the Pale Ale.
Decisions decisions.

Doc


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## Jazman (17/5/03)

Well doc lets us know how the brew turns out to see if it is any good


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## Doc (25/5/03)

Well, I went and saw Pete and picked up two cans of the Pale Ale.
Put the brew down this morning using a cultured Coopers Vintage Ale yeast.
OG 1044 with the two cans and 19.7 litres of water.

Will let you guys know how it turns out.

Beers,
Doc


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## kook (25/5/03)

Doc said:


> Well, I went and saw Pete and picked up two cans of the Pale Ale.
> Put the brew down this morning using a cultured Coopers Vintage Ale yeast.
> OG 1044 with the two cans and 19.7 litres of water.
> 
> ...


I'll be putting down one next weekend. Probably the "Nut Brown Ale". I'll let you all know what I think of that one 

btw Perth people, West Brew did get them in after all ..


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## RegBadgery (7/6/03)

Hello all - wondering if anyone has tasted a msb kit brew yet?

cheers
reg


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## Doc (7/6/03)

Mine is still in secondary.
Had a tasted when I racked it.
Tasted alright.
Not very hoppy though.
Will report back when I've kegged it.

Cheers,
Doc


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## GMK (7/6/03)

Doc,

Sounds like a prime case for some DRY HOPPING...


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## kook (7/6/03)

Mines still in primary. I'm not going to secondary it. I'm leaving it in primary for 14 days then kegging. Need to fill a keg quickly, I'm almost out of keg beer


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## nicko (8/6/03)

i did the pale ale

just racked straight into the keg.

definately needs some more hops....thought it would be better personally.


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## Linz (11/6/03)

I had a discussion with a retailer in th HB industry and here's what resulted. if you use a can that "promotes" 1kg of "sugar", dont add the "sugar" and make to 11.5 litres..excellent beer..the sugar doesn't add flavour ,it just ups the alc level and thins out the body of the beer, hop level is the same. Therefore the same goes for the MS cans....add your usual adjuncts and make to 22.5/23ltr. The only reason they stipulate 11.5ltr and no additives; is to keep it in a ball park of flavour of the JS beers and make you, THE CONSUMER,pay near double the price of any decent can on the market.Only when you add malt and other adjuncts that leave flavour residuals/unfermentables does it change the hopping rates/mouthfeel of the can...which can be easily altered with extra hop additions and proper additives. The trick is matching the hops used in the can and achieving the desired hop levels without starting IBU's of the can.

Something to muse anyway


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## PostModern (12/6/03)

Fair enough, Linz, but if you're going to add more hops and more malt and other grains, why not just make your own recipe from scratch? Why use a kit at all? I mean if the aim is to match the flavour profile of the can in the first place, either buy 2 cans and suck down the cost or make your own brew. If you don't match the kit's taste exactly, you're changing the flavour profile/balance anyway.


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## Linz (12/6/03)

thats the point...its just another can with somebody elses name on it.And they want you to buy 2 cans to make 23lts when one and a booster will do

And an expensive one at that.If you keep buying it then the other/same makers will want the same price for the other cans.

The big boys have landed looking for another .0005% of the market share and its h/brewings turn to pay if we let them


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## Linz (12/6/03)

just remember its Lion Nathan NOT the Malt Shovel Brewery

Bring on The Australian Strong Ale!!!!


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## PostModern (12/6/03)

Linz said:


> thats the point...its just another can with somebody elses name on it.And they want you to buy 2 cans to make 23lts when one and a booster will do
> 
> And an expensive one at that.If you keep buying it then the other/same makers will want the same price for the other cans.
> 
> The big boys have landed looking for another .0005% of the market share and its h/brewings turn to pay if we let them


 One can and a booster _won't_ do. Unless you really luck out, you won't get beer that tastes like the kit alone. That's my whole point. 

I've presently got a Roger's clone going. If they released a Roger's kit, I wouldn't buy it, I'd just keep adjusting my recipe until it tastes the way I want it to. Not that copying commercial beers exactly is my aim. I actually prefer to just make beers that I like.


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## Linz (12/6/03)

> One can and a booster won't do.
> 
> Point taken


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## Linz (12/6/03)

Not that I want to start "THAT" argument over here too


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## kook (12/6/03)

I'll be racking my MSB "Deep Roast Ale" to a keg tomorrow evening or saturday late morning. I'll give some feedback on sunday evening hopefully. It was made pretty much to the can, except I used 21.5L of water instead of 23. I even used the kit yeast.

I'll be racking my extract/grain IPA to secondary too. Going to dry hop that with 1/2 a plug of styrian goldings and 1/2 a plug of cascade.

I'll take some of the WY1056 trub and make something with it. Not sure what yet though. Either an amber ale or another APA.

Should probably bottle my barleywine sometime this weekend too..


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## Jazman (15/6/03)

well i have seen msb in adelaide any good reports on them yet or am i wasting my money


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## GMK (15/6/03)

Kook

What was your Barley Wine recipee ?


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## PMyers (16/6/03)

Linz - I have always been of the belief that the average homebrew concentrate is designed with the knowledge that people will be adding only sugars/boosters to the kit, and the makers have therefore overcompensated the flavour profile to make up for this. Double dump your average brew and you will more than likely get a _very_ strong tasting beer - not always for the better. The MSB cans have not been designed this way, and I am certain that if you made one of these tins to 23 litres using a booster pack in place of double dumping, you may well end up with a very bland beer. Just a thought.

Cheers,
Pete

:chug:


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## kook (16/6/03)

GMK said:


> Kook
> 
> What was your Barley Wine recipee ?


 15L volume:

4.5KG Light LME
400g dark crystal malt (110L)
100g goldings pellets (65g @ 60, 35g @ 15)

I used WYeast scottish ale. Still in secondary at the moment.

I *really* need to rack my MSB Deep Roast to a keg tonight. I was lazy and got no brewing done on the weekend :angry


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## PMyers (16/6/03)

Mmmmmm ... Barley Wine ....

Started an impromptu Barley Wine on 03/04 that only stopped fermenting at the end of May - about nine weeks of ferment! Basically it was 5 tins of Munton's Pilsner and a tin of Munton's Wheat with 28g Styrian Goldings dry hopped, fermented with a champagne yeast & dry enzyme. It had an O.G. of 1140 and finished at 1.030, making it about 15.4% bottled. It isn't worth a pinch of shit at the moment, but I think it may mellow out in about 12 - 18 months. I'm normally not into making super-strong beers just for the hell of it, but when the thought for this crossed my mind I thought "what the hell".

Cheers,
Pete


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## GMK (16/6/03)

Kook,

Your barley wine recipee.

What was your OG....


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## kook (16/6/03)

GMK said:


> Kook,
> 
> Your barley wine recipee.
> 
> What was your OG....


 1091 OG


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## GMK (16/6/03)

Kook,

IMHO an OG of 1091 is a touch low for a Barley Win.

I usually aim for around 1100.

But is it all right to use your recipee as a basis for an extract partial mash BW - 
However, i still have 2 cans of Muntons Barley Wine in the pantry.

I have made 2 barley wines..one in 1999 came 2nd in 2000 ACT State and 2nd in Nationals.

Second in 2000 - came 3rd in the 2001 ACT State championships and 9th at the Nationals.
My recipee is for 28 litres.
2x cans Muntons Barley Wine
2.5 kg of amber LME
500 gms of dark brown sugar
4 teaspoons of gypsum
50 grams of East Kent Goldings - EKG Boil
25 gms EKG for Dry Hoping.

Made a yeast starter with 2 x Muntons yeast.

Boil LME and sugar in pot with 6 litres of water and Hops for 20 mins. Let stand for 10 mins.

Pour into fermenter - unstrained - with contents of 2 cans...
top up to 28 ltrs or until og is approx 1100.
Ferment in primary for 2 weeks...Rack to secondary - dry hop with 25 gms of EKG for one month.
Optional - rack to tertiary and lager in fridge for a further 2 to 4 weeks.
Bottle and prime with half the normal sugar. I bottled in stubbies.
Great in Canberra Cold Winters.
I still have only one stubbie of 1999 BW left :angry: 
but, when the time is right  iwill be :chug:


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## kook (16/6/03)

By BJCP guidelines a barleywine is OG 1080 - 1120. 1091 is enough for me. The WYeast got it down to 1021 FG! Damn good yeast that scottish ale.

You can do whatever you want with the recipe, it was a quicky thrown together cause I wanted to brew one


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## GMK (16/6/03)

Kook,

Thanks for that...

When i do my extract/partial mash BW i will base it on your recipee.

Will use a Wyeast this time:
The Scotish Ale
or maybe the sweat mead. 

My BW Fg doesn't finish that low....think it was around 1025.

If you make it to Ballarat...I would like to try one... :chug:


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## nicko (16/6/03)

I finished my keg of pale ale

It did not clear up at all, i was quite dissapointed with it really.

Wasn't the most enjoyable thing to drink that i've brewed either.


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## kook (18/6/03)

Racked my "Deep Roast Ale" tonight to a keg. I'll give it a taste on saturday and see what its like . Looked a bit cloudy, the kit yeast didnt seem to flocculate? all that well.


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## Linz (21/6/03)

Looking at the above two, maybe a can and a booster....and maybe some finnings might be a chance then eh??? :unsure:


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## kook (21/6/03)

OK.

MSB Deep Roast Ale:

Linz, you definately wouldnt want to kit/kilo it, you'd end up with incredibly bland beer. I just tasted the first glass from my keg of this, and I was, well a little dissapointed. Great texture (due to my high FG of 1015 I presume). Lovely appearance, clear very dark brown, red tinges when you hold it up to the light. Great head, and suprisingly good retention too. The aroma was very lacking though. Smelt slightly malty/biscuity, that was about it really. Flavour was dissapointing too, rather bland malty taste with an aftertaste of chocolate malt. No real burnt or bitter tastes to it at all.

IMO this beer could benefit from some steeped dark grains (bit of choc malt, and a touch of roast barley?) and finishing hops. Its completely lacking in hops.

Not a bad kit beer, but nowhere near as good as the Muntons Premium Gold brew I tried (Smugglers Ale).


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## Linz (22/6/03)

The sooner people stop paying $20 for a 1.7kg can the better!! If it keeps going then you'll see brewiser at $20 a can(and that can't be good!).
Yeah I might be tight, but half the reason most start is the cost saving,not to mention the improvement in flavour & quality(something this product lacks on both counts according to the previous posts)
Remember its lion nathan NOT the malt shovel after their share

Give me an ESB 3kg can for $20 anyday


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## Doc (23/6/03)

Finally kegged my Pale Ale MS kit tonight.

Had a taste and the dry hopping of the fuggles has made a noticable difference. Definitely smells better for a start.
Didn't taste too bad either, but it isn't going to be anything special.

Will report back later in the week when I tap the keg.

Beers,
Doc


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## PostModern (24/6/03)

kook said:


> Not a bad kit beer, but nowhere near as good as the Muntons Premium Gold brew I tried (Smugglers Ale).


 Man, that was a GREAT brew.
The Mrs and I was stunned that it had come from a kit.

It's a shame about the Malt Shovel kits, there was such potential there. I hope word gets to the top about this and the recipes are saved before the name is dragged thru the mud


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## Snow (25/6/03)

Po Mo, did you just kit n kilo the Munton's Smugglers Ale or did you add anything else to it?

- Snow.


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## kook (25/6/03)

Muntons Premium Gold range is much like the ESB 3KG range, except its 3.4KG. Two 1.7KG tins in a box, with muntons "gold" ale yeast.

Costs around $42 for a kit though, but its got everything you need ingredients wise, apart from water. Works out around the same price as buying 2x MSB kits, but IMO tastes and smells better. I've never got such strong hop aroma from a kit before.

Next time I need a keg filler I may make another MPG brew.

Has anyone tried a Woodfordes brew?


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## Doc (27/6/03)

I started work on the Pale Ale keg last night.
Working on it again tonight and it is pretty good for a straight kit beer, although the addition of the dry hopped fuggles in secondary has definitely improved it from when I tasted it on racking.

All-in-all not a bad drop. Pretty much a good session beer. Nothing over distinctive or special but will go down well.

Beers,
Doc


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## dane (27/6/03)

Picked these up the other day from Daniel @ Country Brewer, just to see what all the fuss was about.

About to mix it all up now.

Will report how things go. Looking forward to it.


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## kook (27/6/03)

TIP TO EVERYONE:

Pick up a case of MSB Australian Strong Ale while you can! Damn tasty shit. $48 too (which is pretty good for a premium 6.8% ABV beer).


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## Doc (29/6/03)

Had a couple of the MSB Australian Strong Ale today.
Very nice drop.
Hope they make it an annual brew.

Beers,
Doc


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## dane (13/7/03)

Doc said:


> Had a couple of the MSB Australian Strong Ale today.
> Very nice drop.
> Hope they make it an annual brew.
> 
> ...


 Yeah a friend bought around a 6 pack last night. 6.8 %  Gotta Love that!!

Same price as their other 6 packs. 

As you guys found, nice and strong and a top drop


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## PostModern (13/7/03)

Snow said:


> Po Mo, did you just kit n kilo the Munton's Smugglers Ale or did you add anything else to it?


 Sorry dude, didn't notice your post until now. I didn't brew it. kook did and mailed me a bottle as an entry to a brewing comp on _another forum_. It was really an excellent brew. I think it would have scored better had kook not posted before hand that it was a kit. The Mrs loved it but said "I'm marking it down coz it's a kit". She reckons real HB should be crafted


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## Armstrong (13/7/03)

> The Mrs loved it but said "I'm marking it down coz it's a kit". She reckons real HB should be crafted



Sort of misses the point really ... good beer is good beer, regardless how it is brewed


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## PostModern (16/7/03)

Armstrong, I agree completely. I rated the beer second overall. The winning beer was outstanding. The Mrs ranked it about 3rd, with kook's other entry second if I recall correctly... No I don't (just checked). Let's just say it scored well but didn't win.


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