# Dry Hopping, Grassiness And Cold Conditioning



## The Giant (12/4/11)

Howdy ALl

Been doing some research on here around cold conditioning and just had some questions around it and dry hopping.

Been dry hopping in a lot of my brews and generally just chuck the hops in but have also used hop bags. I will never dry hop for more than 4 days to avoid grassiness so I always ensure to dry hop 4 days prior to bottling.

I have recently been cold conditioning as well but given the fact that I want to avoid grassiness I've only ever really cold conditioned for 2 days max. I will dry hop, wait 2 days, crank the fridge down and cold condition for 2 days, then bottle.

I have been getting some good results but want to cold condition longer. Given I dont want to rack to secondary my question is does cold conditioning eliminate the chances of your beer getting grassy flavours from dry hopping longer? Can I leave my brew with the hops for 4 days and then cold condition for a week all in the primary fermenter, or will this cause grassiness due to the fact the hops will be in there a total of 11 days?

Got a nice fat yak clone going atm and really want to get the best out of it.

Cheers 
Steve


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## manticle (12/4/11)

Just cold condition for as long as you want and chuck the dry hops in 4-5 days before you want to bottle. I often CC then chuck dry hops in after a couple of days.


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## The Giant (13/4/11)

Thanks mate, cant believe i didnt think about doing it that way hahahah idiot


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## Acasta (19/9/11)

Im wondering, is there much difference in the resultant flavour of CC dry hopping as oppose to ferment temp dry hopping?


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## Lecterfan (19/9/11)

Acasta said:


> Im wondering, is there much difference in the resultant flavour of CC dry hopping as oppose to ferment temp dry hopping?




There is an awesome "brew strong" episode on the Brewing network all about that very topic - worthwhile checking out if you have the time. I won't paraphrase as I'll probably get something wrong and then have my carcass shredded... But yes, they do address differences in temps and dry hopping etc.


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## The Giant (19/9/11)

Funny you mention that Acasta

My last few brews that I chucked the hops in to dry hop and cold conditioned at the same time I found the beer very overpowered or even grassy. I was only dry hopping for a max of 3 days and the results were very different to what I experienced before. It was taking a month for it to calm down in the keg where I was happy with it. Add to that the flavours/aromas of the dry hop left after about 2 months.

I did a LCPA recently. Great in the fermented, dry hopped and cold conditioned for 3 days.
Went into keg and gassed up for 1 week. After that 1st week was real fruity and nothing like a LCPA, after a month it was perfect, now 2 months on its got none of that hoppy goodness.

I've just done a blonde and Fat yak without cold conditioning for the above reasons to test it out. 1 week in the keg and I am very happy with the flavours already.

I dont know the reasoning behind it but I would but I def feel that I'm not getting as good results cold conditioning and dry hopping at the same time.


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## Acasta (19/9/11)

Thanks Lecter, Ill have a search to see if i can find it.

Giant, thanks for the observation. I guess ill have to brew more too find out. At the moment i've got a APA i dry hopped for a week, it tastes really grassy and im yet to CC it. I don't really wanna leave the hops in it so i may rack+strain it into secondary.

Another option i through would be to use hop bags then remove them and CC in the same vessel. You'd want it to be bigish, so the hops can be free and do there thang.


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## The Giant (19/9/11)

yeah thats the conclusion i've come to as well mate
either rack to secondary and then cold condition
or use a hop ball/bag that i can take out when finished and then cold condition


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## Yob (19/9/11)

(BN) Dry Hopping 

can never be assed with a hop bag these days, it's just one more thing to bloody clean or expence if you throw it out, I just bung em in, by the time they have settled and I then CC for 4-5 days and then rack to bulk prime there is very little to nil 'floaties'. Its not a concern for the process I use.

Yob


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## Acasta (19/9/11)

iamozziyob said:


> (BN) Dry Hopping
> 
> can never be assed with a hop bag these days, it's just one more thing to bloody clean or expence if you throw it out, I just bung em in, by the time they have settled and I then CC for 4-5 days and then rack to bulk prime there is very little to nil 'floaties'. Its not a concern for the process I use.
> 
> Yob


Thanks, I found this before. Its got good info but its quite long and i got bored.

My worry is not with particles floating, but the grassy-ness that dry hopping for too long can cause. Im thinking I may mess around with some CC hopping, as well as removing hops from the beer before CCing so i can hop at higher temps.
The reason i would like to separate the hops out is because i don't always have an empty keg to add the beer them too.


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## Nick JD (19/9/11)

For me, grassiness and dry hopping is almost enteriely due to the hop strain (and even in part to the hop bintage (heh heh) or growing region). 

Some hops are grass-city (centenial and hallertau). Some no matter how hard I push never get grassy (citra). 

I often hop 1g/L of citra in a keg and it just keeps getting better and better. Once I dry hopped a euro lager (Wey Pils and Hallertau to 30 IBUs) and wreck it completely - hallertau is a tad grassy in the boil. 

Then there's the surprising dry hoppers, like galena (blueberry) and southern cross (lemon/pine). 

But centenial, lawn clippings (the stuff I have anyway).


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## Acasta (19/9/11)

Yeah, i also read it is very dependent on strain. In terms of 'how long' the brew strong dudes were saying just to taste it. So i guess next time ill be taking samples then racking onto gelatine and filtering hops.
Then after that ill try CC + dry
Then ill have to learn what to go with and avoid.

Nick, atm I've got Cascade and Pacifica (pacific hallertau), maybe the Pacifica is giving off the grassyness.


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## argon (19/9/11)

Nick JD said:


> For me, grassiness and dry hopping is almost enteriely due to the hop strain (and even in part to the hop bintage (heh heh) or growing region).
> 
> Some hops are grass-city (centenial and hallertau). Some no matter how hard I push never get grassy (citra).
> 
> ...



I reckon tour on the money here nick. I've had terrible results with centennial dry hopping, like you said, overpowering lawn clippings... Completely ruined a batch for me. Wheras I recently dry hopped a combo of chinook, cascade and simcoe at 6g/L cold and it came out fan-bloody-tastic. Same beer that's on at the archive right now, if anyone wants a tester.


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## MarkBastard (19/9/11)

I have never experienced 'grassyness' when dry hopping. Maybe I have but I like grassyness? Not sure.

From memory I've dry hopped with Cascade, Chinook, Willamette, Nelson Sauvin (flowers) and EKG. Dry hopping in the keg too.

I love dry hopped character, that resiny goodness that tastes even better when you burp after a big gulp of beer.


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## The Giant (19/9/11)

Could be on to something Nick

The LCPA I had was Chinook and Cascade.
Other brews I havent loved the results of were also using Simcoe, NS and more Cascade.

I've kegged a recent blonde with Simcoe hops again but this time no CC so will be interesting to see the results compared to the same batch i made last time with Simcoe that I CC at the same time


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## argon (19/9/11)

Simcoe throws resin and grassiness when dry hopped, so you may be getting that. Where i love it, you may hate it.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (19/9/11)

Citra is the king of dry hoppiness for APA. All the fruitiness, none of the grassiness. Nelson is pretty good too - I thought it would be too wine-y, but actually retains fruit without tasting like cheap sav-blanc.

Cascade gives me a little grassiness, but the flavour it gets combined with the minor grassiness I find to be really nice.

The big disappointment for me is galaxy.

Saaz is always a winner and works in almost anything.

Goomba


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## The Giant (19/9/11)

+1 for disappointment with Galaxy, 30g of that dry hopped ruined my brew
tasted like some nasty herbal remedy $hit

Might have to get me hands on some Citra


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## chunckious (19/9/11)

The Giant said:


> +1 for disappointment with Galaxy, 30g of that dry hopped ruined my brew
> tasted like some nasty herbal remedy $hit
> 
> Might have to get me hands on some Citra



******* great.
My 1st dry hopping experience was 30g of Galaxy.....in the fermenter now. Though I do like Grassy-ness in hoppy beers.


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## argon (19/9/11)

Chunkious said:


> ******* great.
> My 1st dry hopping experience was 30g of Galaxy.....in the fermenter now. Though I do like Grassy-ness in hoppy beers.


FWIW ... i dry hopped 1.5g/L in a single hop Galaxy Pale Ale about 12 months ago and loved... goes to show each to their own


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## MarkBastard (19/9/11)

Hang on, isn't Stone & Wood Pacific Ale heavily dry hopped with Galaxy? Taste it fresh from Byron and it is absolutely awesome.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (19/9/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Hang on, isn't Stone & Wood Pacific Ale heavily dry hopped with Galaxy? Taste it fresh from Byron and it is absolutely awesome.



I'd love to get hold of their hopping schedules.

If I can't, I'm going to put together a 4.5% quaffer 50/50 wheat and pilsner malt, mash in at a higher temp 68-70 deg, and put a truck load of galaxy at 10m.

I found that galaxy got lost among Citra, Nelson and Cascade in my Lord Nelson Citra Cascading out of this Galaxy Pale Ale. Great beer, but if I'd replaced the galaxy with citra, I'd have had basically the same beer. It appears as though Citra has the strength to overcome nelson (and vice versa), but galaxy seems to drown in among it.

That's perception, I do grant. And the beer is fantastic, so I'm really only whinging over nothing.

And if I'd had a hop ball, I'd have whacked in the keg with some Cascade or Citra. As a fresh beer, I was burping Cacade from the 10 minute addition. Now the bitterness has mellowed, the cacade isn't as fierce, which is a shame.

Goomba


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## The Giant (20/9/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Hang on, isn't Stone & Wood Pacific Ale heavily dry hopped with Galaxy? Taste it fresh from Byron and it is absolutely awesome.



Apparantly so but I've made this twice now, once with dry hop and once without and I found I was much closer in flavour profile without the dry hop. But i was only making it as an extract recipe. Used around 60g of hops all under 20mins adding all down to 5 mins. Was getting plenty of flavour as expected but the beauty of no dry hop was no herbal kind of taste.

Maybe they have a secret of Galaxy and dry hopping that we dont know about?


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## Naztone (20/9/11)

The Giant said:


> Apparantly so but I've made this twice now, once with dry hop and once without and I found I was much closer in flavour profile without the dry hop. But i was only making it as an extract recipe. Used around 60g of hops all under 20mins adding all down to 5 mins. Was getting plenty of flavour as expected but the beauty of no dry hop was no herbal kind of taste.
> 
> Maybe they have a secret of Galaxy and dry hopping that we dont know about?




I would love to know what that secret is. I've had problems with grassiness and galaxy and just don't know what to do about it. I dont know if it was because I left it too long or if that's just how Galaxy rolls.
Maybe less at dry hop and more at flame out?


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## The Giant (20/9/11)

Would Galaxy flowers produce different results for dry hopping rather than pellets?

I've heard of people making like a hop tea with a plunger and adding to the brew after fermentation. I wonder if that would impact on grassiness of galaxy as well, but still giving good aroma


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (20/9/11)

I generally do the majority of my hopping for any fruity APA/AAA (and even IPA) at 5-10 minutes. I do sometimes dry hop now, but generally if there is a nice big quantity at 5-10, then there will be enough aroma. It's only when I have a 60/20 min addition that I would venture to dry hop.

Goomba


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## The Giant (20/9/11)

I to have been venturing down this path and been very happy with the results.

Dry hopping now is another variable for me that I wasnt happy with the results, not to mention another pain in the a$$ come kegging time.


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## MattC (20/9/11)

There seems to be much talk about grassiness with the increased use of Galaxy as a dry hop, wondering if there may be any experience of astringency which has been my problem rather than grassiness when I have tried to up the dry hop galaxy to clone the S&W Pacific Ale. 

Was thinking the next time I might use more hops and dry hop for less time.

Cheers


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## manticle (20/9/11)

Personally I don't like galaxy and I don't care much for stone and wood so this comment is general only.

If experiencing grassiness in a dry hopped brew but you are determined to use that hop, up the flavour/late additions and just dry hop conservatively (1g per litre) for 2-3 days. If that gives you grassiness, I'd guess you'll never get the results from that hop. If it doesn' - build until you find the threshold for said beer and hop.


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## Acasta (20/9/11)

Good advicde manticle,

I was listening to that pod cast of brewstrong, and they were suggesting using a small amount for a long time, or a large amount for a small time to get a better flavour.


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## peaky (20/9/11)

I've heard people complain about grassiness with Cascade dry hopped but I've never come across it. I've got a 23L batch in the fridge atm that I have dry hopped with 60gms of Cascade for 3 days at ferment temps (after ferment has finished) and then added a further 60gms Cascade at cold temp for 5 days. Wonder if I'll get grass this time...?


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## MarkBastard (20/9/11)

When I dry hop I make up a swiss voile baggy and put it in the keg. I don't remove it until the keg is drunk, sometimes months later.


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## argon (20/9/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> When I dry hop I make up a swiss voile baggy and put it in the keg. I don't remove it until the keg is drunk, sometimes months later.


I'm the same mark... i routinely dry hop, with many different varieties of hop into the fermentor from anything from a few days to couple of weeks before kegging, or dryhop in the keg and don't remove it till the keg is done. Never had this grassiness from over exposure that people talk. Or if i have i like it.


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## BobtheBrewer (20/9/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> When I dry hop I make up a swiss voile baggy and put it in the keg. I don't remove it until the keg is drunk, sometimes months later.




I do roughly the same, except for the "sometimes months later", and I use a small piece of kneehighs.


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## MarkBastard (21/9/11)

I remember before I stopped posting people were talking about some large tea bags that would be good for single use dry hopping. Anyone found an online source for them?


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## MarkBastard (21/9/11)

http://www.heirloombodycare.com.au/bags-large-p-240.html

These look good, you can fill them with hops and then use the iron to seal them up. 50 for 10 bucks so 20 cents each. Simply discard after use.


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## awall (21/12/12)

Hey, bit of a gravedig, but it seemed like a decent place to add some info and ask for some advice. I've dry hopped with galaxy/amarillo and cascade/amarillo at ~2g/L for about a week. Both times they were great, no grassiness at all. The galaxy combo was insane. Smelled like a breakfast/tropical juice. It ended up like a stone and wood pacific ale on steroids  . The Cascade combo ended up smelling like a fruity jam and was very nice too. Amarillo is a great hop overall for that fruity flavour and it's just backed up with Galaxy. Cascade was slightly more subtle and not so tropical. I love the fruity aroma's atm so I'm into the galaxy/amarillo and will brew something using them again soon.

I've got an IPA currently fermenting and I've used Topaz and Kohatu in the boil. I have about 30g of each left and was thinking of just throwing them all in for 5-7 days before bottling, so I'd end up with a 60g dry hop for 21L. It's more than I've used before, so I'm a bit hesitant atm. Anyone had any experience with these hops and dry hopping with them?


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## Florian (21/12/12)

Heaps of people here dry hop with 200g+ and personally I've used at least 150g on several occasions. It's a matter of taste, it'll give you an awsome aroma but some might find it a bit over the top. 

Up to you what you like, but nothing wrong with it from a process point of view.


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## felten (21/12/12)

I've dry hopped a few times with ~6g/L and no negative effects other than an unrelated hangover or two.

ed: I should add that contact time was kept under a week, and the beer was between 18-20c.


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## awall (21/12/12)

... and i thought i was being adventurous getting near 3g/L  . I just primary atm, so they'll go in for a week before bottling at 20C. I'll report back with the results. Thanks for the help.


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## Thefatdoghead (21/12/12)

MattC said:


> There seems to be much talk about grassiness with the increased use of Galaxy as a dry hop, wondering if there may be any experience of astringency which has been my problem rather than grassiness when I have tried to up the dry hop galaxy to clone the S&W Pacific Ale.
> 
> Was thinking the next time I might use more hops and dry hop for less time.
> 
> Cheers


Thats exactly what I was thinking. 3 day dry hop with maybe 30% more hops. Could even try a big hit with a hop rocket as well as a short dry hop.


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