# Xxxx Bitter



## dougsbrew (19/10/11)

is it just me or is it loosing its flavour. 
i use to drink it alot back when the cans were black. 






they were 4.8%, now there punching at 4.6%. 
and they dont seem to have that lovely cluster hit anymore. 
during my last tour at milton the guide mentioned that they had found a way to make the hops go further, 
so there using less hops, and more water. shame.


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## Bribie G (19/10/11)

I think all the Aussie mainstreams are gradually being blanded and blanded. Now that they are in foreign hands, watch out for a ruthless culling of local brands to be replaced with Miller, Peroni, Kirin etc. 
Thats what the likes of Watneys and Courage did in the UK when they took over local breweries. Make the beer blander and weaker until the locals wouldn't drink it any more, then withdraw it on the grounds of "lack of sales" and push the megabrew instead.
Happened with Powers Bitter.

Edit: seems to be happening with XXXX as well. Last time I was in Cairns there wasn't a single pub I could find that had XXXX heavy on tap. Lion's policy is to make the absolutely awful Toohey's new the "national" full strength brand. Five years from now it will probably be extinct or severely restricted to Brisbane and environs, although still brewing and pushing the 3.5% gold of course which will probably then be blanded even further to about 3%.


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## Nick JD (19/10/11)

The sole Aussie beer not made with POR is kicked in the shins. 

RIP, my bogan staple.


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## bunyips (19/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> I think all the Aussie mainstreams are gradually being blanded and blanded. Now that they are in foreign hands, watch out for a ruthless culling of local brands to be replaced with Miller, Peroni, Kirin etc.
> Thats what the likes of Watneys and Courage did in the UK when they took over local breweries. Make the beer blander and weaker until the locals wouldn't drink it any more, then withdraw it on the grounds of "lack of sales" and push the megabrew instead.
> Happened with Powers Bitter.
> 
> Edit: seems to be happening with XXXX as well. Last time I was in Cairns there wasn't a single pub I could find that had XXXX heavy on tap. Lion's policy is to make the absolutely awful Toohey's new the "national" full strength brand. Five years from now it will probably be extinct or severely restricted to Brisbane and environs, although still brewing and pushing the 3.5% gold of course which will probably then be blanded even further to about 3%.


 Hey there BribieG
I have noticed the same in the past few years that it is getting blander and weaker... used to quite enjoy a glass or two on tap. Has anybody got a good AG clone for the old school barbed wire? And if so could you put me onto the recipe. Could be interesting to brew one up


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## Rowy (19/10/11)

I was a confirmed XXXX heavy man for years. I noticed about 2 or so years ago that something wasn't right. I just thought I was a dickhead, probably a true thought, anyway I looked into this through a couple of publican friends and pretty much everything that is said here is the truth. It's about NO DIVERSITY! It's about having a standard beer for a standard bloke. Anyway now I brew my own so I don't give a Fxxck.


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## adniels3n (19/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Last time I was in Cairns there wasn't a single pub I could find that had XXXX heavy on tap.



I lived in Cairns 2002 till 2005, & you were flat out finding xxxx anywhere. If it's not an old pub, then it's aimed at tourists who know that real aussies drink Fosters. Apparently.


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## dougsbrew (19/10/11)

bunyips said:


> I have noticed the same in the past few years that it is getting blander and weaker... used to quite enjoy a glass or two on tap. Has anybody got a good AG clone for the old school barbed wire? And if so could you put me onto the recipe. Could be interesting to brew one up



its a work in progress for me, i did an ag one not long ago using s189 that my missus prefers over the now xxxx bitter, 
however i found that the malt was too strong to represent the combrew. ones done inpast with some dextrose came closer. 
the latest i done with dme(time restraints) us05 some dex came close too, however i had 8g por that i wanted to use up so 
it spoiled it a little.always got cluster hops at my place, a favorite of mine.


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## Bribie G (19/10/11)

Mash at 64 then raise to mashout
Ferment 13 raising gradually to 17

Fine and Polyclar the shyte out of it:

*XXXX*


*Recipe Specs*
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 4.550
Total Hops (g): 30.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.045 (P): 11.2
Final Gravity (FG): 1.010 (P): 2.6
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 4.61 %
Colour (SRM): 3.8 (EBC): 7.5
Bitterness (IBU): 21.6 (Average)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

*Grain Bill*
----------------
4.000 kg Pilsner Barrett Burston (87.91%)
0.350 kg Cane Sugar (7.69%)
0.200 kg Caramalt Barrett Burston (4.4%)

*Hop Bill*
----------------
30.0 g Cluster Pellet (5.7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (1.3 g/L)

*Misc Bill*
----------------
5.0 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) @ 0 Minutes (Mash)

Single step Infusion at 64C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 13-17C with Wyeast 2042 - Danish Lager


Recipe Generated with *BrewMate*


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## bunyips (22/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Mash at 64 then raise to mashout
> Ferment 13 raising gradually to 17
> 
> Fine and Polyclar the shyte out of it:
> ...


Hey thanks BG
Will give it a go one day and serve it to some of my idiot mates and see what happens... most are southerners and generally equate it with losing the Origin repeatedly. Will up the grain bill a bit and run 5% al. Another great use for gypsum 
Todd


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## Bribie G (22/10/11)

Probably drop the Cluster to around 22g as well B)


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## TheWiggman (14/5/14)

REVIVE you old thread.

I'm a XXXX fan from way back and tried this as my first lager attempt. Copied the recipe and ended up with OG 1.052 and FG of 1.012. 5.2% which is fine by me. Result -




Pretty damn close to the real thing.

I used flowers instead of pellets at 55 mins and no-chilled. Did a 20 min rest at 56°C. Used MEU malt from MHB instead of BB Pils. Tastes slightly less 'flavoursome' I think but it's been a while since I've had one. If this came out of the tap at a pub I reckon most wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

Underpitched slightly which explains the FG, and took about 3 weeks to ferment. Also didn't treat the water but will do so next time.
I've got a Better Red Than Dead in the other keg and I'm reaching for this one first.

Recommended.


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## Not For Horses (14/5/14)

TheWiggman said:


> ...Pretty damn close...


Falling short of xxxx but still happy? Easily pleased.


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## madpierre06 (14/5/14)

Thoughts here of a couple of years ago confirm my suspicions...serve up bland which is offensive to as few people as possible, then use marketing to get 'em to drink the swill. Use same principle and apply to commercial radio i.e. overdoses of tonic, matchbox twenty and nickelback etc interspersed with radio personalities and competitions. The trouble with actual 'taste' is that for every person who is attracted, there is an overly unacceptable (to the bean counters) percentage who dislike the product.

About 12/13 years back when I was previously brewing I had a kit 'n' bit recipe for XXXX which I used to make up which was better than the real thing, I have no idea what was in it. I am still going through stuff to hopefully find out if I hadn't tossed all my leaflets out with a couple of clean ups twixt then and now. Back in the day XXXX certainly was my beer of choice.....particularly after the fourex beer strike of '79 when I had first started drinking...there were some real ****ing horror brews being imported to cover the shortages. I still shudder at the name Southwark..

I'm interested to try the recipe set out above but that (AG) is still a little ways (month or so) off yet.


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## Red Baron (14/5/14)

I arrived at pretty much Bribie's recipe above through trial and error. I like subbing 200g of ale malt for wheat for head retention, and do 25g Cluster @60 and 15g @10 as I love the cluster taste.
XXXX is now brewed with POR in some proportion (it even says it on the bottle) for the higher AA, and that's what dougsbrew is talking about in the 1st post in regards to making the hops go further. It's also shifted the taste of Queensland's finest to more middle ground aussie lager for your "average drinker".

Cheers,
RB


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## TheWiggman (14/5/14)

Agreed with the above. I drank it a fair bit when I lived in Queensland (I've never really stuck to one beer, I buy all sorts) and took off when the cans went to maroon in time for a Stage of Origin. I can't say I noticed a change in taste in that short time.
Above recipe would go better with some additional hops I think. I would have thrown more in late a la Red Baron but I only had 30g on hand. The higher ABV% is refreshing too - has a bit more bite. But then it's not a XXXX Bitter clone now, is it? If I can brew something better then that's what I'll do. I'm not after a clone, I'm after a crisp Aussie lager, and seeing as XXXX Bitter (NOT Gold, do not like) is my megaswill of choice I figured this was the place to start.

Didn't necessarily fall short of XXXX Bitter Not For Horses. Being close doesn't make it worse :beerbang: 
Might go pour one now...


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## Lincoln2 (14/5/14)

I was born and bred in QLD and XXXX was my first beer and still a sentimental favourite. Now I'm in NSW I drink a bit of New but still buy the odd XXXX if it's on special. I can still taste the difference but it is nowhere near what it was in my youth, pre XXXX Gold days. It's sad but inevitable and one of the reasons I brew.

Damn Bribie, who's the fox you've pulled in your avatar?


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## madpierre06 (16/5/14)

The nostalgia element got me thinking. I do recall 'back in the day' before I had a real appreciation of a good beer there would be those times when finances dictated that beer was way down the food chain when it came to spending priorities. I may go a month or so without having a beer and the palate would no longer be desensitised from daily beer drinking. A hot day and the first XXXX in weeks, it ALWAYS had a wonderful im pact on the taste buds. It really was a lovely drop. As it's so long since I've had one I might buy a couple stubbies today just to see if it does still match the memory (being aware that nothing ever seems to match the memory of something).


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## TheWiggman (16/5/14)

I can understand that not everyone likes the megaswill lagers, but what I don't get is how this has dropped in popularity and instead Summers and XXXX Gold is on shelves and taps everywhere. I haven't ever bought - and will never buy - either of those 2. Bitter is the far superior beer to my tastes.
The majority of Queenlanders aren't Bitter fans. When I first got up there I rocked up to a party with XXXX Bitters someone asked "you on the heavies?". It was then - at the age of 24 - I learnt what midstrength beer was. I'd never had one before having grown up on the Murray and later moving to Newcastle. To me you either had 'beer' or lights. When I questioned why they were drinking low alcohol beer rather than real stuff I was met with stifling criticism and angst. "We're not the ones drinking shit beer!" etc. and then it turned very rapidly to State of Origin results. Having not represented the team I couldn't accept responsibility from their poor performance.
Simple question from the New South Welshman, passionate hatred and defence from Queenslanders. All because I was enjoying a Qld beer that they'd decided they didn't like.

Ahh well, I suppose if everyone liked what the beer fans think are the best beers then the big labels wouldn't be selling.


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## Bribie G (16/5/14)

First Prize: A week on XXXX island with as much Gold as you can drink.

Second Prize: Two weeks on XXXX island...........


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## QldKev (13/9/15)

Bribie G said:


> Mash at 64 then raise to mashout
> Ferment 13� raising gradually to 17�
> 
> Fine and Polyclar the shyte out of it:
> ...



Got some w34/70 yeast on a pils at the moment and was chasing something to throw on top of the yeast cake. Thought I would bastardize this one.


XXXX Bitter Bastard

28L batch
Eff 85%
target abv 4.3%

3.4kg Golden Promise (cause I had en open bag)
0.2kg Crystal (no caramalt on hand)
0.35kg Sugar

40g Cluster (26.5 IBU)
w34/70 yeast (as per yeast cake handy)

I pushed the IBU a bit to offset the GP malt. I was tossing up leaving it a bit lower as I have a lower abv, but decided the hops are a couple of years old so I prob wont get the full IBU from them anyway.


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## Bribie G (13/9/15)

Probably turn out more like a Vienna lager, I did something similar as a golden ale and decided to use up a pack of Nottingham. To my horror I realised I'd pitched w 34/70 instead and it's turned out a slightly weird crossover but very drinkable.


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## QldKev (13/9/15)

More I think about it, it is as you said, a Vienna. I had a delay starting it, it's starting to come to the boil now. Now I'm thinking of pushing the IBU a few more points and waving some late hal hops over it. Maybe 30IBU and 10g Hal at 20mins? XXXX Bitter Vienna, will give it a go


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## Bribie G (13/9/15)

Should work fine, I used a bit of Hersbrucker hop tea to turn it more Germanic.


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## Bribie G (13/9/15)

A bit chill hazy that could be the MO .. probably gets indignant having its Pommy knackers frozen off. I seem to remember a few years ago I submitted a recipe for Vienn-ale that goes the other way and uses the Vienna malt to make a faux lager, turned out good as well.


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## indica86 (13/9/15)

I made one too, let me find a picture....

Here we go






Late hooped with Cluster, worked really well....


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## QldKev (13/9/15)

I ended up with Perle as it was at the font of the hop storage. I'm thinking a straight cluster would had been nice. I need to drink more so I can experiment more often


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