# S-04 is super fast



## Mall (23/4/15)

Bloody hell, put a ESB down on Tuesday late arvo and by morning it was raging....Checked this morning (Thursday) and it has virtually finished (1.010, settled and beer is clear in under two days!!

Is this normal and can it be kegged already?


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## Yob (23/4/15)

not normal no...


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## mosto (23/4/15)

What temp did you ferment at?

I'm not a fan of S04 as I've had it stall a couple of times and had to fluff around to get it to finish off. Having said that it's currently munching away through a single hopped Mosaic pale ale quite happily.


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## nvs-brews (23/4/15)

just read a review on the s04.. i mostly use us-05.. think i will have to give it a try!


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## S.E (23/4/15)

Mall said:


> Bloody hell, put a ESB down on Tuesday late arvo and by morning it was raging....Checked this morning (Thursday) and it has virtually finished (1.010, settled and beer is clear in under two days!!
> 
> Is this normal and can it be kegged already?


I frequently use s04 and have done for years. It usually finishes fermenting in 2-3 days @18c-20c and has dropped clear after about 4-6 days. I’ve read on here (and as mosto commented above) that people have had trouble with it stalling but I’ve never had any trouble hitting FG.

2 days to finish and drop clear sounds a bit odd though.


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## dannymars (23/4/15)

I split a batch between s04 and US05 last weekend...

the US05 is way finished... where as the S04 is still bubbling out the airlock 10 days later....


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## Mall (23/4/15)

mosto said:


> What temp did you ferment at?
> 
> I'm not a fan of S04 as I've had it stall a couple of times and had to fluff around to get it to finish off. Having said that it's currently munching away through a single hopped Mosaic pale ale quite happily.


Fermented at 18.5. I'm going to check this again tonight..


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## labels (23/4/15)

It's quick, at least I find it's quicker than most and it's usually done in 72 hours or less at 18°C. I bump the temp up to 25C at the end just to make sure it's completely done before dragging it down to -1°C for a week. Clears really nicely as well. Good all-round neutral ale yeast and clears a whole lot better than US-05


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## michaeld16 (23/4/15)

Despite the bad wrap so4 gets I quite like it and havnt had stalling dramas usually find it at fg 3-4 days


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## wide eyed and legless (23/4/15)

I can never understand the negative posts for s04, can't say I have ever had a problem with it in the years I have been using it.


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## antiphile (23/4/15)

michaeld16 said:


> Despite the bad wrap so4 gets I quite like it and havnt had stalling dramas usually find it at fg 3-4 days


I also know lots of people that dislike S-04 intensely saying it stalls. However, the half a dozen times I've used it it has worked an absolute treat, and finished as expected in about 4-5 days.

My gut feeling is it needs good aeration: I don't use pure oxygen, just air and airstones. But it's never failed me yet (even though 6 is only a very small sample size).


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## panzerd18 (23/4/15)

I've used US-05 twice and it took over 2 weeks.

Used S-04 and it was done in 3 days.


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## Black Devil Dog (23/4/15)

Only used it once, but I found that s-04 stripped hop bitterness. Haven't used it since because of that, but I keep reading that others love it.

The beer turned out ok, but it wasn't what I was expecting.

Still have a pack in the fridge and I'll give it another go.


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## labels (23/4/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Only used it once, but I found that s-04 stripped hop bitterness. Haven't used it since because of that, but I keep reading that others love it.
> 
> The beer turned out ok, but it wasn't what I was expecting.
> 
> Still have a pack in the fridge and I'll give it another go.


 Basing the problem on a once only experience is probably not conclusive by any means. I_ could _understand _perhaps_ hop aroma being stripped out by CO2 gas because of the fast fermentation but bitterness is very hard shift, once the alpha acids have been isomerized, it's in.


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## Black Devil Dog (23/4/15)

It might be that the yeast had little to do with the lack of bitterness, possibly hop age instead and I must say, I was surprised with the outcome. First sample and I noticed a complete lack of bitterness, instead, it was a very malt forward beer. Quite a sessionable beer it turned out to be though.

I've got a couple of cubes that I'm going to do a side by side with. Two identical brews and I'll use S-04 in one and US-05 in the other.


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## Yob (24/4/15)

Yeast do uptake bitterness, but you'd need a shit load to strip it.

I made the mistake of chewing up a raspberry that had been in my RIS for a few weeks.. 

Hot damn.. Never again


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## wide eyed and legless (24/4/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> It might be that the yeast had little to do with the lack of bitterness, possibly hop age instead and I must say, I was surprised with the outcome. First sample and I noticed a complete lack of bitterness, instead, it was a very malt forward beer. Quite a sessionable beer it turned out to be though.
> 
> I've got a couple of cubes that I'm going to do a side by side with. Two identical brews and I'll use S-04 in one and US-05 in the other.


You might find this article interesting Bill.
http://sciencebrewer.com/2012/03/02/pitching-rate-experiment-part-deux-results/


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## Black Devil Dog (24/4/15)

I tried to find the recipe, but I've just got a new computer and still haven't transferred my recipes over. Not sure how to actually :unsure: .

Cheers Tony, that looks like an interesting experiment and the way I read it, is that if my pitch rate was a bit higher, the bitterness would/could have come through.


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## verysupple (24/4/15)

panzerd18 said:


> I've used US-05 twice and it took over 2 weeks.
> 
> Used S-04 and it was done in 3 days.


US-05 taking over two weeks doesn't sound right. For an average gravity ale it's usually done in 3 - 5 days for me - as in finished fermenting. If you're talking about clearing then that sounds normal. US-05 takes a while to clear some times


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## TimL (24/4/15)

I remember reading on the jims beer kit website under the yeast section a while back that the majority of English micros either use saf 04 or dried nottingham so it must be fairly decent as it's their livelihood.Went to loch brewery today near leongatha and he uses it in his 3 beers and they were nice,best bitter,amber and dark ale.Its great in dark beers,it's the old Whitbread brewery yeast.Pretty sure willie Simpson/seven sheds uses it and stone brewing in the states use it in their pale ale.


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## panzerd18 (24/4/15)

verysupple said:


> US-05 taking over two weeks doesn't sound right. For an average gravity ale it's usually done in 3 - 5 days for me - as in finished fermenting. If you're talking about clearing then that sounds normal. US-05 takes a while to clear some times


Yes something was very wrong with the packets of US-05 I sourced from the same supplier. Maybe they had been mishandled and they had a low cell count or something.


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## Matplat (4/5/15)

Both times I used S-04, it took 3 weeks to attenuate, and that was even when I pitched all the harvested yeast from the first into the second.... turned out a pretty good beer though!


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## wide eyed and legless (4/5/15)

I think that the 2 biggest mistakes that some homebrewers especially the new ones are make are, underpitching yeast, not calculating the number of cells required for the beer they are brewing, secondly carbonation, when bottling it is essential that when bottling get the right carbonation for the type of beer they have made, there is nothing worse than an over carbonated bottle of English style beer.


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## takai (4/5/15)

TimL said:


> I remember reading on the jims beer kit website under the yeast section a while back that the majority of English micros either use saf 04 or dried nottingham so it must be fairly decent as it's their livelihood.Went to loch brewery today near leongatha and he uses it in his 3 beers and they were nice,best bitter,amber and dark ale.Its great in dark beers,it's the old Whitbread brewery yeast.Pretty sure willie Simpson/seven sheds uses it and stone brewing in the states use it in their pale ale.


Most will probably use a cultured liquid yeast that is similar, rather than a packaged dried yeast, keeps the costs down. It might be the same strain though.
Stone state that they use WLP007 though, not S-04.

My experiences with S-04 have been terrible attenuation, and the dreaded 1020 stall. The latest one despite double dosing, and oxygenating with a medical O2 cylinder.

I now tend to use WLP007, or MJ British Ale instead.


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## TheWiggman (4/5/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Cheers Tony...





wide eyed and legless said:


> You might find this article interesting Bill.


Should get a bit of the ol' agro thing going, ala 12th Man.


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## wide eyed and legless (4/5/15)

All I can say is those who have been using S-04 and have not been happy with it have either used old stock or not enough, the only way you could try to compare 2 different types of yeast is to split the batch of wort to be fermented into two make sure you have fresh yeast of both types and pitch the recommended number of cells in both.


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