# How Much Lactose



## Screwtop (20/3/12)

Have a Cider on oak atm it finished at .098 so dry as a nun's ninnie. Anyone have experience (means real hands on experience over a number of batches) with backsweetening Cider using lactose, how much as a starting point? Can always make it again to tweak, so far the best cider I've ever made. Have backsweetened using juice and a touch of lactose before, but never one that has finished so low. Tony Thorogood offered advice re oaking and it now has a beautiful french oak vanilla aroma, don't want it to me mouth puckering dry.

Screwy


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## Ross (20/3/12)

Sounds great as is Michael, would love to taste it before you back sweeten.


cheers Ross


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## bradsbrew (20/3/12)

Interested in advice too Screwy. 

How much juice to cider ratio have you used in the past to back sweeten?

Cheers


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## Renzo (20/3/12)

What % of oak chips did you add and when?

Cheers


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## Effect (20/3/12)

There has been some local adelaide brewers that have used a chemical that allowed them to bottle carb a sweet cider...interesting I thought.

Hopefully they pipe up (I know QB was one of them as he told me about the product at a case swap). It would be great if you could get your hands on some of that and maybe back sweeten with some juice...and then bottle condition


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## troopa (20/3/12)

Phillip as far as i can think it will either be Lactose or Stevia.. edit: didnt see that you mentioned they use is for bottle carbing .. im confused now

Screwy, Ive been back sweetening with between 200-400g of lactose to 19 liters at around 1.000sg which is up to about 1.005 and that gives me something my wife my mates and i enjoy but i do enjoy a dry cider as well...
But mate as you know sweetness, dryness and bitterness is all subjective 
Personally (and how i started) i would take 100mls and add "X" amount of Lactose till you find a level your happy with then scale up 

I also agree with Ross it sounds great as it is


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## Screwtop (20/3/12)

Troopa said:


> Phillip as far as i can think it will either be Lactose or Stevia.. edit: didnt see that you mentioned they use is for bottle carbing .. im confused now
> 
> Screwy, Ive been back sweetening with between 200-400g of lactose to 19 liters at around 1.000sg which is up to about 1.005 and that gives me something my wife my mates and i enjoy but i do enjoy a dry cider as well...
> But mate as you know sweetness, dryness and bitterness is all subjective
> ...




You buggers! This all came about after tasting Thatchers Green Goblin Oak Aged Cider a couple of months ago. This stuff would put a horn on a jellyfish.

Around 2 weeks after adding the oak chips I tasted it and liked it as is. The vanillin from the French oak chips added a perceived sweetness (subjective as Troopa advises). However Son no.2 on who has a fantastic beer palate says "nah it's really dry dad". 

Maybe I'll add 500g of Lactose and make the call based upon the outcome. Never really been too serious about cider, made it to have on tap for family get togethers mainly. All the kids and nieces and nephews seem to like cider. In the past I've fermented Aldi apple juice with S-04 or US-05 and been happy enough. These have been back sweetened using 2L of Pear Juice (bradsbrew) in the keg once chilled, and sometimes using 100 or 200g of lactose at this point. Quite often I use 20L of apple and 2L of grape, pear or blackcurrant. All have been popular (grape more so with SWAMBO). This time I used 14L of apple and pear and 6L of apple. The oak chips were French toasted. Have three types of oak chips, smelled them and decided upon French Toasted. Dropped to 4C after 2 weeks fermentation. Used 30G of French toasted oak chips, put them in 500ml of water, heated on power 2 in the microwave for 10 min, then strained into the brew, 17 days now since adding the oak chips. Tasted pretty much the same 7 days ago. Decided that longer time on oak was increasing the risk of infection so thinking of kegging on Friday. 

Screwy


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## Batz (20/3/12)

OK Mike.

But save a dry one for me hey? 


batz


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## Screwtop (20/3/12)

Batz said:


> OK Mike.
> 
> But save a dry one for me hey?
> 
> ...




Will do

Screwy


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## punkin (22/3/12)

Thanks for the detailed description, i'm guessing that when you say strained and added, you added the chips and discarded the water?

i have stacks of american oak here that i toast in sticks. I may try adding some to a batch of my cider. They come off with a load of vannilla and some maple flavours in bourbon.


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## Screwtop (22/3/12)

punkin said:


> Thanks for the detailed description, i'm guessing that when you say strained and added, you added the chips and discarded the water?
> 
> i have stacks of american oak here that i toast in sticks. I may try adding some to a batch of my cider. They come off with a load of vannilla and some maple flavours in bourbon.




Natch, discard the water and toss in the chips. Should be nice!

Screwy


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## Screwtop (2/4/12)

Well this is kegged and carbonated and tastes pretty damn good. I would change some things next time.... surprise, surprise!

Next time double the amount of oak and add lactose (200g) at the beginning not post fermentation. Sweetness is spot on for balance. This one was 14L of Berri Apple and Pear and 6L of Homebrand Apple, would use all Berri Apple and Pear juice in the next one.

Screwy


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## troopa (2/4/12)

Its a slippery slope now screwy to a love of cider... im almost as happy to have a decent cider on tap now as i am to have a good AG 
And the worst thing about a cider is how bloody quick and easy it is even compared with a K&K. Makes you feel kinda dirty and a cheat sometimes hehe only sometimes 

Sigh at it being another 12 months before apple season again

Off to Aldi i go i ho i ho


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