# Turn Key Ag Rigs



## MAH (24/8/06)

There has been quite a bit of talk lately about construction of AG rigs. This can certainly create envy in those not as technically gifted in the construction department. This thread is to start a bit of discussion on what is available off the shelf. A good starting point is what the US suppliers can provide. These are certainly at the top end of the scale for price when you factor in shipping, but some Aussie brewers have handed over the cash.

B3
SABCO

Lets try and keep to the minimum the "geez for that price I could have built x, y and z", because this is meant to be putting information out there for those who can't build their own due to limited abilities or time.

So if you have already looked into this, please post what you know and if there are any Australian retailers already building turn key rigs, also please post details and prices.

Once again, please don't turn this simply into a tight-arse DIY thread, trying to do everything on the cheap, lets see how much bling can be *bought * for your bucks.

Cheers
MAH


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## T.D. (24/8/06)

Does anybody have any info on the Grain and Grape HERMS system? I remember seeing some info posted here on AHB a while back but can't find it.

Is it a system they are selling on an ongoing basis?

This is definitely one of the more feasible "turn key" home brewing systems available in Australia. From memory it cost around the $3,000 mark, which is quite a bit cheaper than what it would cost to buy a B3 and import it.


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## Coodgee (24/8/06)

LHBS at Gaythorne has mash tuns made from cylindrical coolers with an aluminium false bottom. but they don't seemed to have replaced the little plastic tap.


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## bugwan (24/8/06)

Grain and Grape in Melbourne are still offering the $3,000 full Herms system. Very sexy stuff, complete with SS everything (incl. 50ltr pots), polysulphone disconnects, silicone transfer leads, March pump, stainless false bottoms, brew stand and burners.

I saw it in action a couple of months ago on a brew demo morning. Dead sexy - and probably not bad when you sum all the parts...


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## MAH (24/8/06)

Any pictures or component lists for the G&G system?

Cheers
MAH


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## Doc (24/8/06)

MAH said:


> Any pictures or component lists for the G&G system?
> 
> Cheers
> MAH



Yep. In this topic

Beers,
Doc


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## warrenlw63 (24/8/06)

Seen it in the flesh several times. Not overly high-tech but very well made to the point of being bulletproof. All high quality bits too.  

Even offered to field test it but was met with a "no-way" :lol: :lol: 

Warren -


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## jayse (24/8/06)

The following post is not worth reading if your sane :beerbang: 


heres something a tad insane for the home use and more of the pallet rather than of the shelf job, actually three pallets.

At 20 grand plus I'am badly guessing around 10 grand to get shipped here for all up around 30 grand it might seem excessive for a hobby but look at people who own light aircrafts or top of the range street machines simply as a hobby. Looking at what some guys spend on their hobbies then this isn't to overly insane...OK yes it is.  

This isn't actually what MAH had in mind I know but it is certainly major bling 250litre complete brewery.
Main problem for most would be the brite beer tanks arn't really gunna fit in your old keg fridge. :blink:



Alcohol fueled brewtality
Jayse


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## sicklizard (25/8/06)

Well, this thread seems to have been created precisely for the brewer like me, so I hope this helps. After 6 years of brewing with kits and some experimentation with partial extracts I decided to take the natural step into AG. 

I looked at all the equipment available - from stainless stove top pots and the two plastic bucket lauter tun with converted esky mash tuns, then looked at sparge arms, then looked at burners, then pumps, thermometers, manifolds, temp controllers, false bottoms, stands, chillers, no weld stainless fittings, larger pots, converted kegs etc etc etc. ARRGGGGGH! Added to this is the fact that I am completely useless when it comes to clever design, plus and I live in a regional town which has NO HBS to speak of and Im 300 km from a capital city. So that when I stumbled across the prefab systems I seriously began to consider them.

I looked at the three tier systems from the US and the RIMS system from Sabco. As far as I could tell, there were no similar systems available here. If G&G is offering one, I didnt come across it in my search!!

Anyway, I added up the cost of making one myself, plus my time, plus the fact I would no doubt stuff up many times and have to fork out to correct my mistakes and in the end I still may not have a system that works. 

So I bit the bullet and have shelled out for a SABCO system. It seems to me (god knows if Im right) that the SABCO system seems to be sufficiently different to the 3-tier systems in temperature control. There also seems to be a few brewpubs in the US using them semi commercially. And my experience so far with them is that their customer service is spot on plus there is a forum specifically for owners and those thinking about buying one, which has SABCO people responding frequently.

The cost of the unit in $AUD is $4800
Shipping from the US to Melbourne was $1000
Freight forwarder in Melbourne $150 (they recommend one which makes things easier for international shipping novices like me)
Excise $280
GST $623

Total $6853 (ouch!). But as I said, if I did it DIY Id stuff up so many times Id be shelling out for the next 5 years. 

The main cost of the unit (and what sold me in the end) is the thermocouple and controller that allows for accurate temp control. The other main cost is the stand in comes on which seems to get the main volume of criticism, and is probably fair enough because you could make one yourself easily enough (remember Im useless with a spanner) and I think it makes it look cool and I was after a nice looking unit too (yes, yes, I know, vanity, vanity). 

So thats my experience so far. Its due to be shipped from the US next week, and takes a few weeks on the boat to get to Melbourne. As the original post said, Im sure many will say Ive wasted my money but brewing is my only real hobby so what the heck. If anyones interested Ill post my experience with it after Ive had a few goes.

Ben


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## razz (25/8/06)

I looked at these rigs too Ben and decided I couldn't affort one. I had a crack at building one myself and fortunately I pulled it off. (not that it looks like Sabco's) I'm thinking the next few weeks for you will be slow one's, so I suggest you join that forum you mentioned and learn as much as you can about your new system. There is one thing to be said about making your own great beer, it's not a question of if you can do it but when you will do it, and for you my friend that day is fast approaching. Good luck to you!


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## bindi (25/8/06)

So I bit the bullet and have shelled out for a SABCO system.

Ben, which model did you buy? Green with envy. B)

Was it the: 'Top-of-the-Line' Commercial Edition Model, takes the final step up with solid stainless fittings, frame and panel box as well? End quote from SABCO.


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## roach (25/8/06)

BenW said:


> So I bit the bullet and have shelled out for a SABCO system. It seems to me (god knows if Im right) that the SABCO system seems to be sufficiently different to the 3-tier systems in temperature control.



Excellent work Ben. I have had my eyes on those SABCO systems, and agree if brewing is your hobby, and gadget building isn't, then these systems are the way to go. No mucking around and just focus on the brewing.

Be keen to see piccies of it in action.

I would be interested to know what made you choose the sabco system over the b3 systems, such as here

cheers
roach


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## Lukes (25/8/06)

Ben,
I am green with envy too. (I must trade in my 36 ltr esky for some bling..)
I take it you are in Vic ?
Let us know how you go setting it up and when you are going to do your first AG with that beast.

Merc's got one of the B3 systems.
I have seen a thread on getting it here and brewing with it.
I just can't find it now.

Jayse,
I found one better just over the ditch.
Cock and Bull Rig

The web page is a bit old and it might be a bit big for a single car garage... :blink: 

:super: 
Luke


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## big d (25/8/06)

Way to go Ben.Just outta curiosity how have you got around the power side of things with the USA being different than our version(240v)
Looking forward to some pics and a rundown of a few brewdays with it.

Cheers
Big D


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## dreamboat (25/8/06)

Toys I tell you... all of them...

Check this out for a nice, tidy 150L setup to put in your garage...

http://www.brauhaus-austria.com/en/150.htm




dreamboat


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## warrenlw63 (25/8/06)

Now why did ya go and do that to a bloke Dreamboat?  

Time to write to Father Christmas. :lol: (I wish)

Warren -


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## sicklizard (25/8/06)

bindi said:


> Ben, which model did you buy? Green with envy. B)


The SABCO system I got was the cheaper one. They call it the Pro-Brewer edition. This model is the exactly the same set up, but with some brass fittings as opposed to stainless steel (I had to draw the line somewhere). And although I would love a shiny stainless stand, not even Im that vain (well, I am but I couldnt justify the cost). 


roach said:


> I would be interested to know what made you choose the sabco system over the b3 systems, such as here
> 
> cheers
> roach


The reason I chose the SABCO over the B3 models is rather interesting. My feeling is that the SABCO system allows for greater reproducibility because of the RIMS and the thermocouple, but maybe B3 models can do that just as well. But that wasnt was actually sold me in the end (although the fact that some small brewpubs use them for recipe testing seemed kind of cool assuming theyre telling the truth!). What did it for me was reading posts in other forums on similar topics. Posts recommending SABCO systems got heavily blasted by proponents and owners of B3 systems, but when B3 systems came up for discussion, there was often balanced discussion about the pros and cons from SABCO owners and others. It just seemed to me that the B3 proponents were trying too hard. The other thing was that many people commented on the great customer service from SABCO and I can certainly attest to that with my dealings with them so far but then again Im sure the B3 makers also provide great service.



big d said:


> Way to go Ben.Just outta curiosity how have you got around the power side of things with the USA being different than our version(240v)
> 
> Cheers
> Big D


Yes the power differences between the US and here are of course different, but it comes with a step down converter which was $90 (sorry, forgot that cost in the earlier post). Gas fittings are also different but suppliers here can modify.

Happy to provide updates and few pictures when in operation as long as people don't think I'm showing off - too much. No doubt I'll need heaps of advice about actually brewing AG even if I do have all the right bling!! (when it eventually arrives!!).

Ben


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## big d (25/8/06)

Thanks for the feedback Ben.Do keep the forum posted as im sure there are a few people interested in how it all goes.Better check out the sabco forum.

Cheers
Big D


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## johnno (25/8/06)

roach said:


> and agree if brewing is your hobby, and gadget building isn't, then these systems are the way to go. No mucking around and just focus on the brewing.
> 
> cheers
> roach




Totally agree with this statement. 
Good on you Ben for getting one of these. I know I would if I had the oppurtunity.
Hope it goes well for youas I'm sure it will.

cheers
johnno


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## MagicMan (15/9/06)

Hope you all don't mind my posting here. I work for Sabco and am responsible for serving the home brewers
and Brew Magic customers.

We now have at least 6 units either in place or on the way to Austraila. You brewers from "down under" are a great emerging market for us.

The Brew Magic may not be for everyone, but it certainly has a loyal group of users. 

I would be happy to address any questions you may have, either here on the forum, or directly.

I agree with the investment vs hobby string. I brew, but I also am an avid fisherman and hunter. When I buy a boat, I sure don't try to justify the price by how often I get to use it. The investment in a Brew Magic can easily be pro-rated over a 10-20 year period. With proper care, it should easily last that long.

Good luck to all of you and keep the beer flowing.


Every day on the green side of the ground is a reason to celebrate with a home brew!


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## bugwan (15/9/06)

Hi magic man - we certainly don't mind you posting here. The time zones will mean a delay between replies though!

Those Brew Magic kits look fantastic - just enough bling to impress the mates! However, I'm happy with my slap-dash esky/keg/pot at the moment. Do you have any idea what they will retail for in Aus?

You wouldn't happen to be able to supply us with Stainless Steel conical fermentors at a decent price by any chance??! They're in very short supply down here. And then there's SS kegs, which I would buy at a decent price - saves people having to "borrow" them from breweries...


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## BrissyBrew (18/9/06)

MashMaster has something planned for the future but as the market is small it will be a little way off but always interesting to see what people want.


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## aspro (18/9/06)

Gday Ben 

Just a quick one what size batch can you make with your brewery.

Cheers Aspro


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## sicklizard (23/9/06)

aspro said:


> Gday Ben
> 
> Just a quick one what size batch can you make with your brewery.
> 
> Cheers Aspro



sorry, out of range for a while. The brewery is still on a ship so I haven't had the chance to test drive it but I think the maximum people do it 10.5 gallons - so I think that's about 40 litres?? I read somewhere you can do two batches easily in a brew day.
Ben


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## Beerpig (9/11/06)

Any news on how the Sabco system goes?

Cheers


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## BrissyBrew (9/11/06)

MashMaster has this project bubbling away on the back burner. But it is always interesting to read what people want in a turn key system

cheers
people.


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## PeterF (5/1/07)

Hi 
I have been lurking for a while (my first post) and I thought I would show you my relatively new AG setup.
Having read this thread it made a lot of sense for me to buy a Turnkey system.
So I chose the 50L HERMS G&G system.
G&G
I purchased it as is except without the stand. John & Chris of G&G answered my numerous questions and assisted me in getting it up and running.
I added the foam around the Mash Tun and built the 2 stands.




Peter


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## sicklizard (11/1/07)

Well I finally managed to fire up the new Sabco Brew Magic and it was a dream to use. A few teething problems to get it to work in Australian conditions, but after that, as someone relatively new to AG brewing, seeing the sweet, beer coloured wort coming out of the mash tun was just brilliant.

The first brew took 12 hours (a few stuff ups there - my fault) but the second one only took 5 hours. No doubt I'll get quicker as I learn how to use it properly. 

So all in all it is exactly what I was after, and it was certainly worth the $$$ (and there were lots of $$ involved). Although it takes out of brewing some of the variables to do with temperature control, it certainly doesn't make the beer for you. I still have a long way to go before being able to call myself a good brewer, but definitely the Brew Magic made the whole process a whole lot of fun.

Below is a picture of the gear in our beer room (brewing is done outside at the moment). The keg at the very front is the fermenter I also got from Sabco. 





If anyone is interested in seeing some pictures and a bit more detail about my first brew day, there's a blogspot at http://bungobrew.blogspot.com and I'm happy to answer any questions from anyone considering one of these systems.

Ben


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## Cortez The Killer (11/1/07)

That is one awesome looking setup

Good job!

Cheers


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## ausdb (11/1/07)

BenW said:


> Below is a picture of the gear in our beer room (brewing is done outside at the moment). The keg at the very front is the fermenter I also got from Sabco.


Hi Ben the inline image does not appear to work but I have looked at your blog site, nice toy!!

Is the sabco fermenter the one with the racking arm on it or just the one called a yeast brink with a corny keg top welded to the top of a keg? I have a couple of damaged corny's and 50L stainless vessels I plan on turning into something similar and a few close up photo's of the real thing would be nice.


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## sicklizard (12/1/07)

hmmm, sorry about that. I can see the image when I look at it. I think I'll just post links for a while until I work out what I doing wrong.

The fermenter I got has a racking arm which can be tilted at any angle inside the fermenter. It's probably easiest to have a look the Sabco website for a better description and a couple of photos http://www.kegs.com/fermenters.html. If I can work out how to post images properly I'll post a few close ups of its other features/problems.
Ben


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## sicklizard (12/1/07)

I think I worked it out. Rather simple really


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## ausdb (12/1/07)

BenW said:


> hmmm, sorry about that. I can see the image when I look at it. I think I'll just post links for a while until I work out what I doing wrong.
> 
> The fermenter I got has a racking arm which can be tilted at any angle inside the fermenter. It's probably easiest to have a look the Sabco website for a better description and a couple of photos http://www.kegs.com/fermenters.html. If I can work out how to post images properly I'll post a few close ups of its other features/problems.
> Ben


Have looked at Sabco already some closeups of the racking arm setup would be good especially disassembled (if you do that for cleaning purposes)


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## BrissyBrew (13/1/07)

MashMaster is looking at producing a turn key brewing system. I am really interested in what brewers who would be interested in purchasing a turn key system want.

eg 
-capacity how many liters are you after and are willing to pay for (greater capacity greater cost)
-All gas
-electric/gas combination, eg electric HLT, gas kettle
-process control
-heated but non insulated mash tun so it can be fired
-insulated mash tun, but not direct fired
-HERMS/RIMS
-would you except a matching size conical fermenter to come with it
-how many optional extras do you want to be able to attach, eg water filters, inline 02 injectors, heat exchanges


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## ArnieW (13/1/07)

BrissyBrew said:


> MashMaster is looking at producing a turn key brewing system. I am really interested in what brewers who would be interested in purchasing a turn key system want.
> 
> eg
> -capacity how many liters are you after and are willing to pay for (greater capacity greater cost)
> ...


Hi BrissyBrew,

I'm not in the market for one myself, just someone interested through my own experience.

How about something modular/flexible. That way someone could start out with basic mash/HLT/kettle combo and upgrade to HERMS/RIMS or process control if they wanted to. I think with some good design these extras should be able to plug in quite simply.

The other thing about a venture like this is it can get very expensive very quickly. Sometimes the 'add-on' approach can be easier to sneak through those who control the finances - or it can spread the costs over a bit more time.

All the best with your thinking/planning/dreaming.

cheers, Arnie


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## lonte (13/1/07)

BrissyBrew,

A system I could be talked into buying would be 50L capacity - 50L into the fermenter/s that is - HERMS with Electric HLT and HE and gas fired kettle. Single, or at most 2, teir. I'd want the ramp times on the HE to be short to allow step mashes. All SS and set up for CIP. I'd also want a chiller solution that can get to lager pitching temps - i use your plate chiller and it's effective but with 30+ tap water it can only do so much. So maybe glycol?

Conicals, etc. could come later.


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## WSC (18/2/10)

Hi All,

I would love to here how the Sabco units are going and how any other people's turn key units are going.

I have looked at Sabco and BB Brew Boy/Pilot.

I'm not that handy so am interested in them.

Not looking to have a 'spending heaps of money on prefab kit doesn't make you a good brewer' type discussion.

Just curious on people's perception of the breweries, the pro's and con's and of course pics.

Cheers


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## WSC (23/2/10)

Anyone?


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## Paul H (23/2/10)

WSC said:


> Anyone?



Talk to Ross at Craftbrewer (a sponsor at the top of the page) he has one at his shop & has been using it regularly.

Cheers

Paul


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## Ross (23/2/10)

WSC,

Come down anytime if you want to have a look. I'm brewing pretty well every other day at present if you want to see it in action.

cheers Ross


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## WSC (24/2/10)

Ross said:


> WSC,
> 
> Come down anytime if you want to have a look. I'm brewing pretty well every other day at present if you want to see it in action.
> 
> cheers Ross



Thanks Ross I will call before I come down. Not sure when at this stage, but thanks for the offer.
Cheers.


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## kcurnow (20/3/12)

I know I'm dredging up an old thread but have there been any additions to turn-key systems in Australia yet?Anyone with the newer Sabco brew magic, B3 etc?
Cheers,
Karl


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## pmastello (20/3/12)

Brewnut said:


> I know I'm dredging up an old thread but have there been any additions to turn-key systems in Australia yet?Anyone with the newer Sabco brew magic, B3 etc?
> Cheers,
> Karl



Does a Braumeister count?


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## kcurnow (20/3/12)

Gingerbrew said:


> Does a Braumeister count?


well i was hoping for info on the more traditional 3 vessel systems rather than the Braumeister


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## bradsbrew (20/3/12)

I'd like to hear from Ross what he would prefer to brew with, the Sabco or the Braumeister. Pro's and cons would be good too.


Cheers


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## Rowy (20/3/12)

bradsbrew said:


> I'd like to hear from Ross what he would prefer to brew with, the Sabco or the Braumeister. Pro's and cons would be good too.
> 
> 
> Cheers




Hey Brad does my bag count as turnkey? :lol:


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## Batz (20/3/12)

bradsbrew said:


> I'd like to hear from Ross what he would prefer to brew with, the Sabco or the Braumeister. Pro's and cons would be good too.
> 
> 
> Cheers




I'm interesred as well, Ross?


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## kcurnow (21/3/12)

+1 re the pros and cons.

One of the issues i had heard about on the Sabco was the drain on the boil kettle is in the centre of the base which means you cant whirlpool as you would just suck all the trub out when you started to pump out the kettle.


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## stux (21/3/12)

+



= Turnkey brewery?


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## argon (21/3/12)

Brewnut said:


> +1 re the pros and cons.
> 
> One of the issues i had heard about on the Sabco was the drain on the boil kettle is in the centre of the base which means you cant whirlpool as you would just suck all the trub out when you started to pump out the kettle.


Which is why the use of a false bottom in the kettle is the way to go for central dump out the base.

I've talked to Ross in the past about the sabco, as he has it sitting in the shop. Says he loves brewing on it (when he once did) but also says if the braumeisters were more available when he got the sabco, he would of just got one of those for an easy brew day on electricity rather than the full gas setup.

Paraphrasing of course, but that was my impression. Sabco is a nice bit of kit though


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## JaseH (21/3/12)

argon said:


> Which is why the use of a false bottom in the kettle is the way to go for central dump out the base.
> 
> I've talked to Ross in the past about the sabco, as he has it sitting in the shop. Says he loves brewing on it (when he once did) but also says if the braumeisters were more available when he got the sabco, he would of just got one of those for an easy brew day on electricity rather than the full gas setup.
> 
> Paraphrasing of course, but that was my impression. Sabco is a nice bit of kit though



How would a 3V electric system fit in? Best of both worlds?


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## kcurnow (21/3/12)

Frothie said:


> How would a 3V electric system fit in? Best of both worlds?


something along these lines then http://theelectricbrewery.com/
it looks pretty good except that you cant run both elements at the same time.


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## malt_shovel (21/3/12)

Brewnut said:


> I know I'm dredging up an old thread but have there been any additions to turn-key systems in Australia yet?Anyone with the newer Sabco brew magic, B3 etc?
> Cheers,
> Karl



The FARRA guys in NZ who advertised in the Beer & Brewer mag a while back, make a pretty sweet (IMO) 3 tier system.

I was very close to pulling the trigger when a larger second 3V system came up with a lot of extras for less than half the price.

FARRA SBB (Small Batch Brewery)

Cost is NZ$3735 (~AUD$3000) plus GST plus freight. I didn't get any info from AHB members when I put a thread out a while back, but someone might have bought one since then. I got in touch with the FARRA guys for more info (probably out of date thought), so can post that if interested. 

Cheers
:beer:


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## JaseH (21/3/12)

Brewnut said:


> something along these lines then http://theelectricbrewery.com/
> it looks pretty good except that you cant run both elements at the same time.



Thats what I was thinking of  . If you ran the kettle and the HLT on separate circuits you could run both at once. Thats how I have mine configured. Although I haven't had a need to run both at once yet.


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## brettprevans (21/3/12)

argon said:


> .... sabco, as he has it sitting in the shop. Says he loves brewing on it (when he once did) ....


 carn ross deal of the day, cheap used sabco rig :lol:


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## matho (21/3/12)

beerbelly

not cheap but they have everything you need on it


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## chopdog (21/3/12)

This is a very relevant thread for me at the moment. I'm waying up whether to spend some money on my rig, eg pumps, chiller, tri ball valves and so on or fork out for a braumeister or a turn key. 
Hope for some more updates soon fellas


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## Cocko (21/3/12)

chopdog said:


> This is a very relevant thread for me at the moment. I'm waying up whether to spend some money on my rig, eg pumps, chiller, tri ball valves and so on or fork out for a braumeister or a turn key.
> Hope for some more updates soon fellas



Sorry, A little OT:

If you have the coin to go a braumeister or build - simple question to answer IMO - do you enjoy the building and design? If no, BM, if yes build your own designed and build rig and be proud of it every time you brew etc... Not saying either is better because the BM seems awesome, just saying, for me and I am sure others, the build and designing is as much fun as the brewing.

Sorry OT 2c.


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## Goose (22/5/12)

> I'd like to hear from Ross what he would prefer to brew with, the Sabco or the Braumeister. Pro's and cons would be good too.




Everybody asking Sir Ross about pro's and cons of BM vs Sabco.... judging from the passion that people have for their BM's and some responses I have read on related threads I can see why he chooses not to answer :unsure:. 

I was also looking at a Braumeister , and while I don't own one and so do not have the benefit of experience thought I'd have a crack at the question myself. So I could be wrong, but feel free to correct add or comment...

The point, to help me decide which is best for purpose...


*Sabco*

_Pros_ 
Touch Screen Colour graphical microprocessor control
Data recording downloadable to PC
Graduated sightglasses on HLT and boiler for accurate volume measurements
Can begin a second batch while previous is boiling
Higher grain capacity (for bigger beers)
CIP by recirculation

_Cons_
No electric option
Whirlpooling difficult
Cost


*Braumeister*


_Pros_
Small footprint
Single heating element
Single vessel

_Cons_ 
Lifting out grain a challenge on 50l + systems
No gas option
Separate hot water source required for rinsing
Cleaning of the elements
Cleaning of the pump
Available ampage for 50l


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## hsb (22/5/12)

BM has cons around available ampage as well re 50l or batch size/ABV for 20l. 

They're all great systems I'm sure.


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## Goose (22/5/12)

hsb said:


> BM has cons around available ampage as well re 50l or batch size/ABV for 20l.
> 
> They're all great systems I'm sure.




tks hsb I'll add in as I get them..


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## QldKev (22/5/12)

Goose said:


> Everybody asking Sir Ross about pro's and cons of BM vs Sabco.... judging from the passion that people have for their BM's and some responses I have read on related threads I can see why he chooses not to answer :unsure:.
> 
> I was also looking at a Braumeister , and while I don't own one and so do not have the benefit of experience thought I'd have a crack at the question myself. So I could be wrong, but feel free to correct add or comment...
> 
> ...



Need to add

Braumeister
- Ability to upgrade to a 3V easily. (everyone seems to have kettle/urn and a sparge bucket handy for them)


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## mjadeb1984 (22/5/12)

Brewnut said:


> something along these lines then http://theelectricbrewery.com/
> it looks pretty good except that you cant run both elements at the same time.




great link there alot of good pictures and tips on how to build and set up. not perfect but pretty sure most people in their build phase could benifit from reading thru this. i know i am.

:icon_cheers:


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