# Style Of The Week 13/12/06 - American Ipa



## Stuster (13/12/06)

Not the traditional IPA shipped from England to India, but American IPA which is basically a stronger, hoppier APA. (Let's not get bogged down in the name business again, please.)

So what are your recipes for this style? What grains do you use? What yeast? And importantly, what hops? This is definitely a style kit brewers can brew. Any tips? And what commercial examples have you guzzled that you can recommend, especially any that may be available here? :chug: 

Tell us all you know about this style. :super: 

Here's what the BJCP has to say about this style. From here.



> 14B. American IPA
> 
> Aroma: A prominent to intense hop aroma with a citrusy, floral, perfume-like, resinous, piney, and/or fruity character derived from American hops. Many versions are dry hopped and can have an additional grassy aroma, although this is not required. Some clean malty sweetness may be found in the background, but should be at a lower level than in English examples. Fruitiness, either from esters or hops, may also be detected in some versions, although a neutral fermentation character is also acceptable. Some alcohol may be noted.
> 
> ...


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## neonmeate (13/12/06)

huge room for variation in this style but i like amarillo and simcoe. 70ishIBU, 1065, mixture of pils and maris otter, 5% crystal and maybe a touch of amber malt. thames valley and 1318 worked well for me, 1056 is too boring and WLP002 is too sweet and WLP023 is too sulfury. cold conditioning is good only i gave my fridge away to a dog.


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## Voosher (13/12/06)

I'm yet to brew this style but I took on some comments from the IPA thread of some time back and have the current work-in-progress:

12l batch
85% Joe White, 15% JW Light Munich - Target OG 1075

10g Chinook @ 60m
10g Simcoe @ 60m
10g NB @ 60m
10g Simcoe @ 20m
10g Amarillo @ 15m
10g Cascade @ 10m
10g Chinook @ 5m

And something as yet undecided for aroma and/or dry hopping.

Target bitterness 72IBU

Thinking of Wyeast 1332.

My thoughts are that I want this a little maltier than an APA but still quite simple malt-wise - hence the Munich and the choice of yeast.
I was half-tempted to go US-56 but I'm with neonmate neonmeate in wanting character out of the yeast.


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## Duff (13/12/06)

Boy, where do you start with a great style like this?

I think combo's of hops are the way to go as they provide more depth in the flavour profile. There are loads of potential combo's andloads of beer to be made to try them, but I find that anything over the 4 different hop mark then it can get to a little too much going on. I've made a few, here are some of the better ones.

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This one dissapeared extremely quickly one afternoon between 3 of us, one being an ex pro Welsh rugby player. The Cascade/Amarillo combo is great, and surprisngly the Scottish Ale yeast went very well with it. The Pilsner base also gave good results.

05-25 American IPA

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 20.00 Wort Size (L): 20.00
Total Grain (kg): 5.92
Anticipated OG: 1.069 Plato: 16.84
Anticipated SRM: 8.3
Anticipated IBU: 66.9
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
79.3 4.70 kg. JWM Export Pilsner Australia 1.037 2
13.6 0.80 kg. JWM Wheat Malt Australia 1.040 2
3.3 0.20 kg. TF Crystal UK 1.034 74
2.3 0.13 kg. Melanoidin Malt 1.033 35
1.5 0.09 kg. JWM Dark Munich Australia 1.039 13

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
10.00 g. Hallertau Northern Brewer Pellet 10.50 15.8 60 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 6.7 60 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 4.5 60 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 6.3 50 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 4.2 50 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 5.1 40 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 3.4 40 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 3.4 30 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 2.3 30 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 2.2 20 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 1.5 20 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.3 10 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.9 10 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.1 5 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.8 5 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.1 4 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.8 4 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.1 3 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.8 3 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.1 2 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.8 2 min.
5.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 1.1 1 min.
5.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.8 1 min.
10.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 0.0 0 min.
10.00 g. Cascade Pellet 6.00 0.0 0 min.


Yeast
-----

White Labs WLP028 Edinburgh Ale

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This one was also a great beer and is a clone of the Victory Hop Devil. Tasted just like Goatherders contribution to the recent case swap, but more hoppy. It's also a great beer. The 009 Australian Ale gave it a little more fruitiness. Centennial is a great hop, to me like Cascade on steroids.

06-13 Victory Hop Devil I

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 20.00 Wort Size (L): 20.00
Total Grain (kg): 5.60
Anticipated OG: 1.066 Plato: 16.19
Anticipated SRM: 11.2
Anticipated IBU: 75.8
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
64.3 3.60 kg. JWM Traditional Ale Malt Australia 1.038 3
19.6 1.10 kg. JWM Light Munich Australia 1.038 10
8.9 0.50 kg. JWM Export Pilsner Australia 1.037 2
3.6 0.20 kg. JWM Crystal 140 Australia 1.035 74
1.8 0.10 kg. JWM Dark Munich Australia 1.039 30
1.8 0.10 kg. Weyermann Melanoidin Germany 1.037 36

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
26.00 g. Centennial Pellet 10.00 39.5 60 min.
15.00 g. Centennial Pellet 10.00 11.6 30 min.
10.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 6.9 30 min.
20.00 g. Tettnanger Pellet 5.20 8.1 30 min.
15.00 g. Centennial Pellet 10.00 6.1 15 min.
10.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 3.6 15 min.
40.00 g. Centennial Pellet 10.00 0.0 0 min.
40.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.90 0.0 0 min.


Yeast
-----

White Labs WLP009 Australian Ale


I thought I'd push the limits a bit more when I made Pliny the Elder. It was a big beer hop wise (nothing like what's being pushed out now from a local Hills Brewer  ) but it did have just too much happening. I may do it again since I have my hands on some Columbus.

I think though for my taste buds, around the 90 - 100IBU mark is the go. I'm working on my next one which will be this Saturday, a clone of Three Floyds Dreadnaught IPA, but I'll post the receipe in another thread.

Overall for yeast, I tend to settle now for either 029 Kolsch, 001 California, or recently US-56. A clean profile to shine the hops is the go, one that has high attenuation to achieve a drier finish. Malt wise, I think use your favourite pale ale base to get the OG up to the 1.060 - 1.075 and simply load up the hops :chug: 

Cheers.


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## mikem108 (13/12/06)

Love this style, one of my and other hopheads favourites. Oportunity to use loads of US hops.

Try White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale if 56 is too boring I find it a bit more flavoursome with a less dry finish.


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## neonmeate (13/12/06)

mikem108 said:


> Try White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale if 56 is too boring I find it a bit more flavoursome with a less dry finish.



been meaning to try this one, pparently the best non-belgian yeast for hot weather too.


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## warrenlw63 (13/12/06)

Is it my piss-addled memory or does this strain come from Sam Adams? Or am I thinking of another? :unsure: 

Warren -


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## neonmeate (13/12/06)

warrenlw63 said:


> Is it my piss-addled memory or does this strain come from Sam Adams? Or am I thinking of another? :unsure:
> 
> Warren -



thass right i ffink


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## McBeer (13/12/06)

Hey Duff,
I'm just wondering why you add the hops at such close intervals?
I've read that adding less hops more regular gives the beer a nice integrated complexity with the malt. Is this what you are achieving with the above recipe ?
I'm not questioning your method, just interested


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## Adamt (13/12/06)

Brewed this style for this year's SA Xmas case swap. Recipe is linked here.

I think it's pretty tasty, but it's probably best to wait for other, more experienced people to taste and judge after the swap this sunday.


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## Malnourished (15/12/06)

This is the one style where I have a settled recipe, though I tinker with it occasionally. In fact I brewed another one yesterday.

85% JW Pils, 10% JW Light Munich, 5% JW Crystal. OG ~1.060, ~80IBUs with Amarillo the whole way through. Two big flavour additions, a fairly big one at flameout and about 2-3g/L dry hops. US-56/1056/001 fermented on the warm side. Soft water.

I like US-56/1056 but have had good results with British yeasts too. Anything much higher than 1.060 gets a bit too sweet and 'unsessionable' for me, and anything lower gets a bit out of balance. Timing of hop additions doesn't really matter as long as you get enough bitterness and dry hops I reckon. I've tried other hop varieties but only really use them when I get a bit sick of Amarillo. I just wish we could get more US varieties than Cascade in plugs.


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## hooky (15/12/06)

I'm a kit brewer, i have a coopers IPA ready to make at home, if i use simcoe and amarillo then does that make the style an American IPA?


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## RobboMC (15/12/06)

G'Day hooky,

I wouldn't do that. To make American PA I would start with Coopers Aussie Pale Ale. It's much more of a blank kit and lends itself quite well to 'tinkering' with hop varieties. I recently tried to make APA from this kit with Cascade for flavouring and aroma. 
( 20 g @ 45 min, 10 g @ 30 min, 10 g @ 10 min, 10 g dry )
You can use DME and Brew Enhancer to beef up the kit to required alcohol and malt concentration. Made a beautifully clean tasting beer but not a true APA as there's no caramel notes in the malt mix.

I believe ( subject to more learned opinion ) that the Coopers IPA kit is flavoured with Fuggles. When I added more Fuggles aroma it came out pretty good. I wouldn't be mixing Fuggles with US hops, might make a nice beer, but not in any style.

Are you making beer for the style, or for yourself to drink nice beer. If your prepared to drink it, have a go and be the first to find out how it turns out.


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## DJR (15/12/06)

RobboMC said:


> G'Day hooky,
> 
> I wouldn't do that. To make American PA I would start with Coopers Aussie Pale Ale. It's much more of a blank kit and lends itself quite well to 'tinkering' with hop varieties. I recently tried to make APA from this kit with Cascade for flavouring and aroma.
> ( 20 g @ 45 min, 10 g @ 30 min, 10 g @ 10 min, 10 g dry )
> ...



If i were making an American IPA using a CPA kit, i would use 2x 1.7kg cans and a bit of dextrose, probably only about 250g, that will be 38IBU or so and something like 1050-55 or so OG. Then just do a steep of about 250g of Crystal malt and 250g of Caramalt or Munich to add the caramel notes.

Add lots of 30m and 10m hops in a quick boil of some of the malt or in the steeped crystal/caramalt boil, using something like simcoe amarillo cascade or whatever C hop takes your fancy. About 2-3g per litre of flavour/aroma hops should do it - ie. about 50-75g. Then dry hop with somewhere between 15 and 50 grams of US hops.

US56 of course, although i've discovered that S-33 doesn't make a bad APA, but US56 definitely tastes better. Recultured Cooper's yeast should work fairly well for the experimental, and if going to liquid yeast, an Alt/Kolsch strain is also very good for the style.


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## sluggerdog (3/1/07)

I have this brew in planning for the next one, I want to do this one to use up some of the ingredients I have so I don't want to vary too much from the following but was wondering if anyone had any suggestions:



Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 40.00 L 
Boil Size: 45.13 L
Estimated OG: 1.054 SG
Estimated Color: 24.0 EBC
Estimated IBU: 51.4 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 55.0 %
Boil Time: 75 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
9000.00 gm Pale Malt (Powells) (4.5 EBC) Grain 69.5 % 
2750.00 gm Munich Malt (Powells) (15.0 EBC) Grain 21.2 % 
600.00 gm Melanoidin (Weyermann) (59.1 EBC) Grain 4.6 % 
500.00 gm CaraPils (10.0 EBC) Grain 3.9 % 
100.00 gm Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (800.0 EBC) Grain 0.8 % 
125.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (20 min) Hops 25.7 IBU 
30.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (20 min) Hops 12.9 IBU 
60.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (75 min) (Mash Hop) Hops 4.3 IBU 
20.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (75 min) (Mash Hop) Hops 3.0 IBU 
20.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (5 min) Hops 2.8 IBU 
40.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (5 min) Hops 2.7 IBU 
30.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (25 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops - 
2.00 tsp Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs Safale - American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-56) Yeast-Ale (Will probably build the 1 pack up to suit the double batch)


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## Jye (3/1/07)

My only suggestion is not to mash hop and use them at 10 and 15min. You could also dry hop instead of steeping for more aroma.


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## sluggerdog (3/1/07)

Thanks Jye, I have now updated it... As Follows:


Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 40.00 L 
Boil Size: 45.13 L
Estimated OG: 1.054 SG
Estimated Color: 24.0 EBC
Estimated IBU: 52.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 55.0 %
Boil Time: 75 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
9000.00 gm Pale Malt (Powells) (4.5 EBC) Grain 69.5 % 
2750.00 gm Munich Malt (Powells) (15.0 EBC) Grain 21.2 % 
600.00 gm Melanoidin (Weyermann) (59.1 EBC) Grain 4.6 % 
500.00 gm CaraPils (10.0 EBC) Grain 3.9 % 
100.00 gm Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (800.0 EBC) Grain 0.8 % 
125.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (20 min) Hops 25.7 IBU 
30.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (15 min) Hops 10.6 IBU 
60.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (15 min) Hops 10.1 IBU 
30.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (5 min) Hops 4.2 IBU 
30.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (5 min) Hops 2.0 IBU 
30.00 gm Cascade [5.80%] (25 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops - 
2.00 tsp Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
2 Pkgs Safale - American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-56) Yeast-Ale


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## therook (20/8/10)

G'day everyone,

Thoughts on my first IPA

IPA (American IPA)

Original Gravity (OG): 1.060 (P): 14.7
Colour (SRM): 8.5 (EBC): 16.7
Bitterness (IBU): 59.9 (Average)

60% Ale Malt
30% Pilsner
5% Crystal 60
5% Wheat Malt

2 g/L Amarillo (8.2% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Amarillo (8.2% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Cascade (5.1% Alpha) @ 15 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Amarillo (8.2% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Cascade (5.1% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Simcoe (12.3% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Cascade (5.1% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Simcoe (12.3% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Cascade Plugs (6.8% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop)
0.7 g/L Simcoe (12.3% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop)

0.0 g/L Calcium Chloride @ 90 Minutes (Mash)
0.0 g/L Epsom Salt (MgSO4) @ 90 Minutes (Mash)
0.2 g/L Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) @ 90 Minutes (Mash)

Single step Infusion at 66C for 90 Minutes. Boil for 90 Minutes

Fermented at 20C with Safale US-05

Rook


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## Supra-Jim (20/8/10)

Personally I would sub out the 5% wheat and up the crystal to 10%. With all those lovely hop resins you'll have no dramas with heat retention/lacing etc.

Hop combo looks pretty good!

Cheers SJ


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## Stuster (20/8/10)

I'll have to disagree with Supra-Jim there. For my tastes, 10% crystal in a beer like this is too much and I'd go with the recipe you have. I'd prefer to end up with a dryer, more sessionable beer. It really depends what you like though and both will work fine, just personal taste. And I certainly agree that the wheat is not essential.


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## Supra-Jim (20/8/10)

Should also mention, I would probably mash at 64/65 (if i was using 10% crystal)

Cheers SJ


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## therook (20/8/10)

I have modified it slighty and swapped the wheat for munich 1


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## Maple (20/8/10)

therook said:


> G'day everyone,
> 
> Thoughts on my first IPA
> 
> ...



I can't believe you're like 80 and this is your first aipa... h34r: 

But seriously, good move with the munich from wheat. now if i may suggest 1 minor tweek, swap your simcoe and cascade additions around, and 1 major change, sub the Pils for Rye. you'll have a winner.


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## reviled (20/8/10)

I personally think that an IPA should have a good malt balance, so would agree with SJ to up the crystal to at least 10% total

What stu refers to sounds like more of an APA to me, but at the end of the day its all about brewing what you like eh :icon_cheers:


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## argon (20/8/10)

here's my first IPA probably do it this weekend... double batch... still not sure about the hop schedule... 

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Black Diamond IPA
Brewer: Argon
Asst Brewer: 
Style: American Style India Black Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0) 

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 38.00 L 
Boil Size: 45.39 L
Estimated OG: 1.067 SG
Estimated Color: 53.0 EBC
Estimated IBU: 57.4 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
9.00 kg Ale Malt (Barrett Burston) (6.0 EBC) Grain 71.44 % 
2.20 kg Munich II Malt (Weyermann) (22.5 EBC) Grain 17.46 % 
0.35 kg Carafa Special T3 Malt (Weyermann) (1400Grain 2.78 % 
0.35 kg Aromatic Malt - (Dingemans) (37.0 EBC) Grain 2.77 % 
0.35 kg Carapils Malt (Weyermann) (4.0 EBC) Grain 2.77 % 
0.35 kg Wheat Malt (Barrett Burston) (3.0 EBC) Grain 2.77 % 

40.00 gm Centennial [9.90 %] (60 min) Hops 21.8 IBU 
20.00 gm Cascade [5.00 %] (60 min) Hops 5.5 IBU 
20.00 gm Cascade [5.00 %] (30 min) Hops 4.2 IBU 
30.00 gm Centennial [9.90 %] (30 min) Hops 12.6 IBU 
25.00 gm Centennial [9.90 %] (15 min) Hops 6.8 IBU 
20.00 gm Cascade [5.00 %] (15 min) Hops 2.7 IBU 
25.00 gm Centennial [9.90 %] (5 min) Hops 2.7 IBU 
20.00 gm Cascade [5.00 %] (5 min) Hops 1.1 IBU 
30.00 gm Centennial [9.90 %] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops - 
10.00 gm Cascade [5.00 %] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops - 

2 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [Starter Yeast-Ale 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 12.60 kg
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body
Step Time Name Description Step Temp 
90 min Mash In Add 37.80 L of water at 72.7 C 66.0 C 
10 min Mash Out Heat to 75.6 C over 2 min 75.6 C 


Notes:
------
All hop additions minus 15 mins for NC Cube adjustments
5 min Hop additions french pressed into fermenter prior to pitching

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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## drsmurto (20/8/10)

reviled said:


> I personally think that an IPA should have a good malt balance, so would agree with SJ to up the crystal to at least 10% total
> 
> What stu refers to sounds like more of an APA to me, but at the end of the day its all about brewing what you like eh :icon_cheers:



That's the opposite of the way i think.

As the OG goes up the % of crystal comes down.

The higher the OG, the higher the malt backbone of your beer given the same mash temp. Fairly logical given you are putting more malt into your mashtun - it has to go somewhere......

I've made uber malty English IPAs with base malt and a dash of chocolate malt for colour.

I only just snuck up to 10% crystal malt in my last light beer mashed at 70C! 

My 2 c.
DrSmurto

p.s. agree with Maple suggestions, rye + munich = :icon_drool2:


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## reviled (20/8/10)

DrSmurto said:


> That's the opposite of the way i think.
> 
> As the OG goes up the % of crystal comes down.
> 
> ...




Its funny you say that because I used to think along those lines, I used to be scared of using too much crystal malt because I didnt want a beer that was too sweet or cloying, but after being in the states and trying all their awesome IPA's they all have an intense caramel flavour that alot of them get from using up to 20% crystal!!! Split between carapils and crystal 40L

My pliny clone I brewed from memory was 7% carapils and 3 or 4% carared, with a 7ish kilo grist and I reckon I could've gotten away with more crystal to achieve a stronger caramel flavour..


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## Stuster (20/8/10)

DrSmurto said:


> As the OG goes up the % of crystal comes down.
> 
> p.s. agree with Maple suggestions, rye + munich = :icon_drool2:



Agreed on the crystal issue. It's a big beer so you should still get plenty of malt to back up the hops.


And agreed on the rye and munich front too. Rye and Munich - perfect to bring up in my 5,000th post! :chug:


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## Duff (20/8/10)

Rook,

Looks good. You better send a couple of bottles up to myself and the Bunyip for evaluation.

Cheers.


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## The Scientist (20/8/10)

Stuster said:


> I'll have to disagree with Supra-Jim there. For my tastes, 10% crystal in a beer like this is too much and I'd go with the recipe you have. I'd prefer to end up with a dryer, more sessionable beer. It really depends what you like though and both will work fine, just personal taste. And I certainly agree that the wheat is not essential.



Yeah thats what I'd be doing for an American IPA. The hops are the main event and they really can shine through in a drier beer. Like Supra said for the wheat though, no need for it in a beer of this magnatude :beerbang:


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## bum (20/8/10)

reviled said:


> Its funny you say that because I used to think along those lines, I used to be scared of using too much crystal malt because I didnt want a beer that was too sweet or cloying, but after being in the states and trying all their awesome IPA's they all have an intense caramel flavour that alot of them get from using up to 20% crystal!!!



+eleventy-two

They do get _very_ chewy over there. But I have said a number of times here that Australian brewers (and breweries) approach this style completely arse about and I never seem to find a sympathetic ear. People always just talk about American crystals not being as sweet as ours so we need to use less. I dunno, they usually seem pretty sweet to me if you can taste your way around the IBUs. Looks like it is just you and me, Reviled.


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## drsmurto (21/1/11)

Thoughts on water chemistry in this style?

For my APAs i tend to go Ca 100, SO4 160 and Cl 85 ppm. 

Up the SO4 a touch?

I don't brew that many AIPAs and the last one used tap water.


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## speedie (29/1/11)

yeast selection has a lot to do with residual sweetness
anderson valley beer starts sweet then goes back to hop
would think that the cyrstal is more for colour


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## felten (11/7/11)

Has anyone had a go at a big Australian style IPA? 

I have some pacific gem, stella, galaxy and topaz that I want to squeeze into an IPA but I've never used any of them before. I've heard good and bad things about pacific gem, and that its easy to over do galaxy late, but I don't know how they will go in a new world style IPA.

Anyway I've been plugging numbers in using McDole's celebration ale as a base, comments welcome. Oh and I'll be no-chilling this, thinking about adding the 10m hops to the cube but not 100% sure yet.


Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 32.08 l
Post Boil Volume: 25.20 l
Estimated OG: 1.069 SG
Estimated Color: 25.4 EBC
Estimated IBU (rager): 74.6 IBUs (tinseth) 93.5
Brewhouse Efficiency: 76.00 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
6.00 kg Bohemian Pilsner (Weyermann) (3.5 EBC) Grain 1 81.1 % 
0.47 kg Carafoam (Weyermann) (3.9 EBC) Grain 2 6.3 % 
0.47 kg Caramel Malt - 60L (Briess) (118.2 EBC) Grain 3 6.3 % 
0.23 kg Caramel Malt - 120L (Briess) (236.4 EBC) Grain 4 3.1 % 
0.23 kg Munich II (Weyermann) (22.5 EBC) Grain 5 3.1 % 

8.00 g Pacific Gem [15.00 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 6 15.4 IBUs 
28.00 g Pacific Gem [15.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 7 18.1 IBUs 
57.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 18.6 IBUs 
57.00 g Topaz [17.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 9 22.5 IBUs 
28.00 g Stella [16.40 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 12 0.0 IBUs 
28.00 g Topaz [17.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 13 0.0 IBUs 
28.00 g Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 11 0.0 IBUs 

1.0 pkg American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [124.21 Yeast 10 - 


Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 7.40 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time 
Saccharification Add 36.72 l of water at 69.9 C 66 C 75 min


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## Newbee(r) (11/7/11)

Dear Lord NOOOOOO! 

Having ruined 2 brews with pacific gem, I suggest don't take the risk. You are safer with them upfront (at beginning of boil) but I wouldn't risk them full stop unless you have tasted them and love them. 

Galaxy can be overpowering, I'd drop the 10 min addition and just dry hop with it.


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## O'Henry (11/7/11)

I'd hop with stella late and dry hop too. Hold back on the galaxy. Also, if you can split the ferment, dry hop the beer with single hops only, then you can get a real idea for the dry hop potential. Do Stella, Topaz and then a few bottles straight for comparison. I did a split with stella in one and amraillo/centennial in another and the stella was my fav by far. Split my brewing buddy though, he was very loyal to his US favourites...


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## felten (12/7/11)

Cheers guys, thanks for the tips. I think I was just trying to fit the galaxy in because I had some, I'll save it for a 10m IPA or something and stick with the topaz+stella in this beer, with a little galaxy in the dry hop.


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## freezkat (25/8/11)

felten said:


> Cheers guys, thanks for the tips. I think I was just trying to fit the galaxy in because I had some, I'll save it for a 10m IPA or something and stick with the topaz+stella in this beer, with a little galaxy in the dry hop.


I have been discussing IPAs with other American home brewers. I was surprised to read a recipe that had 500g of hops in a 20L recipe. And these weren't weak hops.

Is this common?


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## felten (25/8/11)

It's common in the US for an imperial IPA. Looking at the CYBI recipes for firestone union jack it has 340g of hops in it, avery mahajra has 480g as well.


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## drtomc (25/8/11)

I listened to a Basic Brewing Radio podcast the other day where they had measurements of the IBUs using the standard analytic technique, and they found that the IBUs maxed out pretty quickly, and indeed, that a couple of commercial IIPAs which were supposed to have 100 IBUs, came in at about half that.

The conclusion I came away with was that in terms of IBUs, things max out round 50.

That's not to say adding more hops doesn't keep changing the beer, just that the specific measurement of IBUs maxes out.

2c,
T.


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## yum beer (25/8/11)

its my understanding that the human palette can only detect up to about 100IBu, after that we cant tell the difference.

If this is the case why waste 300 or 400 gms of hops on a beer that effectively will not taste any different then if you stuck to 180-200 gms and 
banged out 100ish IBU.



Though I have never tried any of these real big IBU beer, but am certainly keen.


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## felten (25/8/11)

Bitterness and flavour are 2 different things.


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## bconnery (25/8/11)

yum beer said:


> its my understanding that the human palette can only detect up to about 100IBu, after that we cant tell the difference.
> 
> If this is the case why waste 300 or 400 gms of hops on a beer that effectively will not taste any different then if you stuck to 180-200 gms and
> banged out 100ish IBU.
> ...






felten said:


> Bitterness and flavour are 2 different things.



As felten said, they aren't the same thing. 
The palette may stop detecting the IBU, but not necessarily the flavour. These big beers may be nowhere near the nominal IBU by the recipe, but there is definitely a flavour, pallette, whatever you will, difference between a 100IBU, a 200IBU and a 400 etc. 
I tasted a 200 and a 400IBU beer made by Ross quite a few years back (hop wastage was not high on his list of concerns ...) and they were definitely different beasts. 
The 200 IBU really smacked you on the tongue in a delicious way, and I'm sure I wasn't tasting all 200 IBU, but it was surprisingly drinkable. 
The 400 attacked you and you couldn't taste anything but hops for ages. And I still found it quite drinkable but some couldn't even get past the first sip...
Would I make one? Probably not? Would you bother on a regular basis, maybe not. 
Were they interesting and enjoyable? Yes. 
Was there a difference, absolutely.


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## Joshisgood (27/8/11)

Thinking of doing an extract American ipa with 4 kg dry malt, 200g light crystal, 200 g dextrose and 10 minute hop addition of 80g cascade, 50g centennial, 50g Amarillo. Anyone had any experience with 10 min ipa's? I'm pretty new to brewing, this will only be my 5th brew (2nd extract brew) so any advice would be great.
Cheers josh


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## mje1980 (23/9/11)

Sipping on a SN torpedo got me keen to do my 10 min APA. Then i thought, F*ck it, lets bump it up a bit!!. 

89.6% Best pils malt
6% TF pale crystal
4.5% Simpsons aromatic. 

A little Columbus and cascade @ 30 mins 

A lot of Columbus and cascade @ 10 mins

1.067
51 IBU's 

7%
US05

62c for 30, 69c for 30, then mash out.


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## mje1980 (24/9/11)

Can't edit the above?

Made some changes

Rainy day IPA

87.6% Maris Otter
5.8% TF pale crystal
4.4% Simpsons aromatic
2.2% Victory malt. 

Little bit of columbus and cascade @ 30 mins

Lots of cascade and columbus @ 10 mins

67c mash, 90 boil 

US05

1.068
51 IBU


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## mje1980 (24/9/11)

I somehow missed the 30 min addition. Freaked out a little, and went back to beertools. Came up with another charge at 1min. All up 170g of cascade and columbus in a 20 litre batch!!!.


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## Lecterfan (24/9/11)

mje1980 said:


> I somehow missed the 30 min addition. Freaked out a little, and went back to beertools. Came up with another charge at 1min. All up 170g of cascade and columbus in a 20 litre batch!!!.




Awesome! I'm on AIPA kick at the moment, the last two have been reasonably succesfully (not yet carbed but tasting good at bottling and from secondary respectuvely). I really like the columbus/cascade combo. I think columbus late in the boil is a wonderful thing!

I think I'll be trying some aromatic in the next one also. Let us know how it comes out?


The (potentially) best one I've done so far (being bottled tomorrow) consisted in me emptying my fridge of last years homegrown flowers at flameout (about 500gms of cascade and chinook flowers) - I had to squeeze the flowers to get all the wort out haha, but fantastic nonetheless. It's taken me a long time to come around to the AIPA style but I have a serious crush on it at the moment.


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## Spork (24/9/11)

I did an AIPA earlier this week, using %100 MO malt, Zeus @ 60 mins and cascade @ 5 and 0 minutes.
Unfortunatley, I forgot to check the no chill" button on BrewMate, so the IBU's ended up a touch high - 71.8. Thats with "only" 110g of hops for 21 litres. Only 1.8 IBU over the max. for the style, so shouldn't hurt. Had a couple of high-ish (70-80) IBU beers earlier in the week, noice. Got a Mikkellar "Hop Thief" in the fridge. Says 1000 IBU on the label, not sure if this is true or just marketing.


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## mje1980 (24/9/11)

Lecterfan said:


> Awesome! I'm on AIPA kick at the moment, the last two have been reasonably succesfully (not yet carbed but tasting good at bottling and from secondary respectuvely). I really like the columbus/cascade combo. I think columbus late in the boil is a wonderful thing!
> 
> I think I'll be trying some aromatic in the next one also. Let us know how it comes out?
> 
> ...




My thoughts exactly!


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## Lecterfan (12/10/11)

Quick update on my first AIPA attempt at 4 weeks in the bottle - it has gone from almost cloyingly sweet (pre-carbonation) to now having a nice caramel "chewiness" as Bum (i think) described the American versions earlier in this thread.

OG 1.064 - FG 1.016
IBU 56

roughly:
%70 Simpsons maris otter
%14 Wey munich
%7 Wey Wheat
%4 Wey biscuit to help balance the
%4 crystal (even blend of simpsons light and dark).
Wy1272

Citra 60 mins for 28 IBUs
Centennial 20 mins 15IBUs
Citra 15 mins 7 IBUs
Centennial at 15 mins 2 IBUs
Centennial 10 mins 3
Citra 5 mins 1 IBU

20gms Citra at flameout

20gms Citra, 20 gms Centennial and 20 gms Nelson Sav dry hopped at day 4 of primary fermentation and then racked off at day 7.

Admittedly, next time around I would keep the grain bill the same but increase the IBU's to 60, maybe 65 (but that also may be a function of the higher FG dueto this being mashed with my old dodgy thermometer haha - next time around my FG may be lower and thus 56 IBU might be heaps). My second AIPA used the same grist, different hops but was done to 65 IBU and for my taste is much cleaner but is close to the bitterness limits of what my palate wants from a 1.065ish OG beer. 

I have my third going at the moment (the first AIPA mashed with my new thermometer so I am expecting it to finish a bit lower, I have used a combo of galaxy and first gold with a bit of FWH and is tasting great so far out of primary) in which I have increased the crystal, subbed some MO for JW pils but also increased the IBU so now OG 1.070 and 72 IBU. Love it.


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## mje1980 (3/11/11)

mje1980 said:


> Can't edit the above?
> 
> Made some changes
> 
> ...




Only a week or so in the bottle but i couldn't resist trying one. This was a "scaled up" version of my 10 min APA, which im very happy with. Well, im very happy with the scaled up version so far!!. Yummy hoppy aroma and flavour, good malt prescence, strong bitterness, and no higher alcohols i can pick up ( i took great pains to keep it cool while fermenting ). I have a 6 pack of SN torpedo, so i'll compare when i finish this. This is not a clone, but it'll be cool to try a side by side, though the SNT is a faarken cracking beer IMHO. 

5 litres of this is in a 5litre willow "cube" awaiting a beer engine at our brew clubs RAF ( real ale festival ) next weekend.


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## A3k (22/5/12)

Hi guys,
I made the recipe below which is actually my first American IPA. Its just finishing fermenting.
I over sparged as I wasnt paying attention, and started with an OG of 1.057, not 1.063 I was aiming for.
I mashed too low (just below 63), and its fermented down to about 1.007 already, but still bubbling a little.

Ive tasted it, and it seems a little thin and watery.
Im contemplating adding some extra crystal, adding a little extract, or doing a small batch mashed really high.
I keg, so I guess I could do a 3lt beer and add it to each keg.
Anyone have any ideas of what I should do?

Cheers,
Alan


Kegging Volume: 65.00 l
OG: 1.057 SG
Estimated Color: 21.1 EBC
Estimated IBU: 62.6 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 84.00 %

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
12.50 kg Pale Malt (Weyermann) (6.5 EBC) Grain 1 88.7 % 
1.60 kg Crystal, Medium (Thomas Fawcett) (130.0 Grain 2 11.3 % 
65.00 g 1. Chinook [11.00 %] - Boil 70.0 min Hop 3 27.2 IBUs 
90.00 g 2. Cascade [4.50 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 4 9.0 IBUs 
45.00 g 2. Centennial [8.70 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 5 8.7 IBUs 
17.50 g 2. Chinook [11.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 6 4.3 IBUs 
100.00 g 3. Cascade [4.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 7 5.6 IBUs 
45.00 g 3. Centennial [8.70 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 5.2 IBUs 
17.50 g 3. Chinook [11.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 9 2.6 IBUs 
1.0 pkg American Ale II 1272 
126.00 g Cascade 3.15g/L [4.50 %] - Dry Hop Hop 12 0.0 IBUs 
90.00 g Centennial 2.25g/L [8.70 %] - Dry Hop 6 Hop 13 0.0 IBUs 
90.00 g Simcoe 2.25g/L [9.90 %] - Dry Hop Hop 14 0.0 IBUs


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## black_labb (23/5/12)

Adding some steeped crystal late is an option, but don't go overboard. I've done this with a dark belgian strong that fermented out very low. In your cae I'd be using some lighter crystal malts. carapils, carared, caramunich I, ect.

I'd think that it's a much better option than a minimash.


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## hwall95 (31/10/15)

After brewing a bunch of single hop APAs (Mosiac, Simcoe, Columbus, Chinook, Galaxy), I think it's time to combine two of them and make an IPA. Just tasted the chinook APA while cold crashing and it tastes like it would make a great pair to mosiac. So based on that I've just scaled up my APA recipe to be a bit stronger. Generally my brewhouse is between 70-80%, but with the extra grain may knock it down a bit so thought I'd aim for 70%.

My APAs are fairly malty, so hopefully this translates well into the IPA, although had to decrease the mash temp from 68 to 66 as I was afraid it would end a bit too chewy for liking. Pretty keen to get it brewing post uni exams. Will be nice to finally make an IPA again

*Est OG:* 1.070 *Est FG*: 1.016
*IBU:* 65 *Est Alc*: 7.2%
*Colour*: 19 EBC *Size*: 23L

*Grains:*
5.15kg Maris Otter
1.5kg Munich I
0.35kg Wheat Malt
0.35kg Crystal

*Hops:*
17g Chinook @ 60min
40g Chinook - Cube
40g Mosiac - Cube
Dry Hop - not really decided, probably 40g of each

*Yeast:*
Wy 1272 - 1.5L Starter

*Mash & Boil:*
90 min mash at 66, 10min Mash out at 78. 70min boil.


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## Yob (13/11/15)

I love a good step through the temp ranges for IPA, if you can it's rewarding, 63/30 66/20 72/10 78/10 

Wiked balance between good body and fermentability, fg usually 1.014 but tastes full.

2 ha'penny


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## hwall95 (13/11/15)

Yob said:


> I love a good step through the temp ranges for IPA, if you can it's rewarding, 63/30 66/20 72/10 78/10
> 
> Wiked balance between good body and fermentability, fg usually 1.014 but tastes full.
> 
> 2 ha'penny


Cheers Yob. I can do steps pretty easy via direct heat, just a bit more effort/heavy lifting. I'll give it a go and see how it turns out


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