# Lager Using An Ale Malt



## moonshine (23/4/10)

Was wanting to make a larger today in honor of German beer day, bav purity law an all that, but only have JW ale as a base malt atm,

I've got some Saflager s23, Saflager W-34/70, Hallertau, Saaz and a fair amount of spech malt,

any tips greatly apriciated

Cheers


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## kevin_smevin (23/4/10)

moonshine said:


> Was wanting to make a larger today in honor of German beer day, bav purity law an all that, but only have JW ale as a base malt atm,
> 
> I've got some Saflager s23, Saflager W-34/70, Hallertau, Saaz and a fair amount of spech malt,
> 
> ...



JW ale will be fine. Some even say its better. Its one of the lighter pale malts so no worries on that front


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## jayse (23/4/10)

Tip number one - drop the r


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## Nick JD (24/4/10)

I make lagers all the time with ale malt. 

If you're trying to accurately copy a recipe, then I wouldn't - but ale malt makes a delicious lager. I add about 20% wheat malt as well and that lowers the colour and ups the foam.


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## moonshine (24/4/10)

my inability to spell aside....  




Here's the recipe i ended up making last night

*Ingredients*

5kg JW ale

100g Cara Munich II

100g Cara Pills

30g Hallertau (60min boil)

20g Hallertau (20min boil)

10g Saaz (20min boil)

5g Hallertau (5min boil)




1 x packet of saflager 23




*Method**
*

Simple 60min mash at 65c, 60min boil then placed into an old not working chest fridge with 3L of frozen water bottles in there...*
*

Will check temp today and see how it went overnight (i've got some more frozen water to adjust but think it should be fine)


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## Jazman (24/4/10)

drop the caramunich and use a bit of munich malt instead..ale u be good as i have use ale when i had no pils it be fine just a bit darker


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## hoppinmad (24/4/10)

I think most australian and american lagers are made with ale malt anyway aren't they?


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## Bribie G (24/4/10)

HoppinMad said:


> I think most australian and american lagers are made with ale malt anyway aren't they?



No, mostly domestic Pilsener Malt such as Barrett Burston Pale Pilsener or BB Galaxy in the case of XXXX and Tooheys, I think Carlton use Joe White? I've found that domestic Ale malts go well in lagers, but I have had some _meh _brews the other way round, trying to trick up Pilsener Malt in a UK Bitter or Aussie Old on a couple of occasions when I've been using up leftovers.


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## Nick JD (24/4/10)

Brings up the question: what's the difference between say, BB Ale and BB Plisner?

Are they the same barley malted and kilned differently?

Or are they actually different strains of barley? 

Or just kilned differently?

Or something?


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## Nick JD (25/4/10)

Nick JD said:


> Brings up the question: what's the difference between say, BB Ale and BB Plisner?
> 
> Are they the same barley malted and kilned differently?
> 
> ...



Anybody?


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## A3k (25/4/10)

Hi Nick,
I'm pretty sure Ale malt is kilned at higher temperatures than pilsner malt.
As for the strain, i don't know. I'm pretty sure Galaxy is a different type of Barley, but i reckon BB ale and BB pilsner would be the same.

Cheers,
Al


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## Nick JD (26/4/10)

A3k said:


> Hi Nick,
> I'm pretty sure Ale malt is kilned at higher temperatures than pilsner malt.
> As for the strain, i don't know. I'm pretty sure Galaxy is a different type of Barley, but i reckon BB ale and BB pilsner would be the same.
> 
> ...



Thanks Al.


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## Bribie G (26/4/10)

Ross would know for sure.


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## Ross (26/4/10)

Nick JD said:


> Brings up the question: what's the difference between say, BB Ale and BB Plisner?
> 
> Are they the same barley malted and kilned differently?
> 
> ...




BB Pale & Ale are both from Gairdner Barley - Current EBC 3.9 & 5.1 respectively. Galaxy is Galaxy Barley - current EBC 3.5

Cheers Ross


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## unrealeous (26/4/10)

Nick JD said:


> I make lagers all the time with ale malt.


Interesting - I presume you mean you ferment at lager temps? And if that's a yest next question would be does it take the same time as if you used a lager yeast?


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## manticle (26/4/10)

Pretty sure he's just talking about the malt, not the yeast.

Lagers can be made with any base malt as it's the yeast strain that makes it a lager, not the malt.


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## Screwtop (26/4/10)

manticle said:


> Pretty sure he's just talking about the malt, not the yeast.
> 
> Lagers can be made with any base malt as it's the yeast strain that makes it a lager, not the malt.




Yeast strain, ferment temp and lagering ...............is what makes lagers. Oh, and a good brewer.

Screwy


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## MHB (26/4/10)

> Yeast strain, ferment temp and lagering ...............is what makes lagers. Oh, and a good brewer.
> Screwy



+1

Apparently the longer hotter kilning breaks down the DMS precursors, so if you wanted to make a darker lager or a Bock it would look like a good choice.

MHB


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## Nick JD (26/4/10)

Screwtop said:


> Oh, and a good brewer.



I disagree. Even I can make a delicious lager.


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## Let's Brew Beer (29/8/16)

I'm using 20% Maris Otter in my lager grain bill and it tastes fine.


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## mtb (29/8/16)

TowelBoy2013 said:


> I'm using 20% Maris Otter in my lager grain bill and it tastes fine.


That response was six years in the making mate :lol:


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## SBOB (29/8/16)

Was worth the wait...


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## barls (29/8/16)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP6v4T3VT7I&index=1&list=RDCP6v4T3VT7I


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## Bribie G (29/8/16)




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## Black Devil Dog (29/8/16)

FWIW: Pilsner malt for lagers


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## Randai (29/8/16)

I am sure lager would taste great with "Ale Malt" or some such. Nearly a vienna?


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## MHB (29/8/16)

Fair go guys - Towelboy has clearly done a search and found a thread relating to something he is interested in. Lets face it who hasn't told people to do a search before starting a new thread?
We probably shouldn't give people a hard time when they do.
Mark


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## mtb (30/8/16)

Who's giving him a hard time? Highlighting the six year delay between responses is simply making light of an unusual and humorous situation.
A constructive response is due, and that's what he's being given. The accompanying zombies are purely for sh1ts and giggles


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (30/8/16)

Well done Towelboy.

I recently made what was going to be a Classic American Pilsner, but the ferment was done between be old and new ferment fridge and therefore fermented at ambient Qld "winter" (is there a bigger nisnomer than "winter" in SEQ?) temps with Notto (my fave faux-lager yeast).

I went BB Pale, with 20% mixed rice and corn cooked to glug and added to the mash.

The body is certainly 'lager' like, though the esters make it non lager like.

Thinking it'd be a good idea to do with a true lager yeast or notto at 13 degrees in future.


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## yankinoz (11/4/17)

Bribie G said:


> No, mostly domestic Pilsener Malt such as Barrett Burston Pale Pilsener or BB Galaxy in the case of XXXX and Tooheys, I think Carlton use Joe White? I've found that domestic Ale malts go well in lagers, but I have had some _meh _brews the other way round, trying to trick up Pilsener Malt in a UK Bitter or Aussie Old on a couple of occasions when I've been using up leftovers.


Agreed, but pilsner malts work fine in American ales.

In my admittedly limited experience with JW malts, they seem to be generally on the light side of their class. For example, JW Vienna, which I often use, is a Vienna but one that's close to an ale malt, and other contributors above note Aussie pale ale malts tend to be on the light side.

Re Maris Otter, I've found it out of character in lagers, blondes and American wheats. Among UK malts, I prefer Golden Promise for those beers.


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## klangers (28/4/17)

Half the time there is no difference between *pale* malts (not ale) and pilsner malts. Historically there was a lot more difference than there is now, mainly around level of modification during the malting process. Pilsner/lager malts historically were under-modified compared to pale malts, which gave a slightly higher diastatic power.

Nowadays, pale malts are just finished at a higher temperature in the kiln, eg 115 degrees vs 105 degrees.


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## Bribie G (28/4/17)

I recently went the opposite way and brewed an excellent London Porter with Wey Pilsner as the base malt to use up an excess.


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## mtb (28/4/17)

Bribie G said:


> I recently went the opposite way and brewed an excellent London Porter with Wey Pilsner as the base malt to use up an excess.


I guess an extra 50g of roasted barley would easily offset the EBC difference anyway. Makes me wonder if I ought to begin stocking up on Pilsner only as a base malt (can always darken a brew, not so easy to lighten)


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## good4whatAlesU (28/4/17)

Agreed I have found good results with at least 50% pilsner malts in my stouts.


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