# Hop Bill Help Please



## Three Sheets (24/1/14)

Hi people, I'm after the collective thoughts of what hops to throw at my can of Morgans Caramalt Amber Liquid malt extract 1.5 kg combined with a can of Thomas Coopers light malt extract. I figured 3 kgs of LME will make up around 22 litres.

I have the following hops to choose from and this is where I seek suggestions on a Hop Bill -

All are pellets.

Fuggles
Centennial
Chinook
Galaxy
Ccascade
Citra
EK Goldings
Simco
POR
Green Bullet

I don't mind a hoppy beer.

Thoughts?


TIA

PS Yeast is Safale S.04


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## hoppy2B (24/1/14)

How about an English bitter with maybe 40 to 50 grams of dark crystal and 80 grams each of Golding and Fuggles as a late addition?


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## HBHB (24/1/14)

16g Cascade - 60 minute boil
25g Cascade @ 10 Minutes Boil
20g Chinook @10 Minutes Boil
20g Cascade @ Flame Out
25g Chinook @ Flame Out
25g Chinook Dry Hopped @ day 5 for 4-5 days


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## yum beer (24/1/14)

centennial at 60 to about 18IBU
EKG at 10 to about 10IBU
Fuggles at flameout for another 3 or 4 IBU
Cant be arsed putting it through software,
Im sure you can do that.


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## Bribie G (24/1/14)

Yum beer's suggestion is good for an English bitter. Edit; a lot of UK breweries, even the mainstreams, are starting to blend in US hops.

I would normally use around 40g of a bittering hop such as EKG or Challenger then 20 or 30 of Fuggles, very rarely does my hop bill go into three figures.

However with S04 you can still go American Pale Ale, you could go three C's, Centennial, Chinook and Cascade in any order you like, 30g of each and end up with a very hoppy brew as well.


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## Three Sheets (25/1/14)

Thanks guys I'm appreciating the input. 

My first go at an extract only if you hadn't gathered.

I do like hop hog, SN harvest, torpedo and most IPA's as a guide to my tastes


So many combo's. My bittering should probably come from Simco 11-15% Green Bullet 10-13% Galaxy 13%, Chinook 11-15% or even Centennial 7 to 12%.

Is it worth using 4 or move different hops from 60 mins to dry hop???

As I have an English bitter in the fridge, I'm leaning away from the Goldings and Fuggles.

With AUS UK USA and NZ I could concoct the a Nations Ale. (Might be a reason this is not done)

anyway thinking thus far is -

20g Simco @ 60 (or Galaxy or Green Bullet) ( wondering if this is enough bittering)

15g Chinook @ 45

15g Citra @ 30

??? @ 15
???? @ 10
??? @ 5




Cheers

TS


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## Yob (25/1/14)

20g Simcoe @ 60 - _Work out toal IBU you are after and go 1/3 max from the 60 min_

10g Citra @ 30 -
10g Centennial @ 30 -
10g Simcoe @ 30 -

15g Citra @ 0 -
15g Centennial @ 0 -
15g Simcoe @ 0 -

Dry hop 10g of each @ 1014 or when you Cold condition.

Something like this will be delish :icon_drool2:

ed: off the top of my head without running it through brewmate, you might be looking at 50 - 60 IBU?

as I say, target the IBU you want, get 1/3 from the 60 and everything else late, play with the times and additions to achieve it.

:icon_cheers:


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## Three Sheets (25/1/14)

Thanks Yob,

20g Simcoe @ 60 puts on about 27 IBU With your suggested boil that 30 grams @ 30, another 32 IBU

So that is close as I'd be looking for 65-75 IBU range

So I might add a third tranche into the boil time. (possibly at 10 mins)


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## Three Sheets (25/1/14)

All done. Thanks people for your suggestions.

Here's what I've done, I've got time to think about the dry hopping.

20g Simcoe @ 60 -

10g Chinook @ 30 -
15g Centennial @ 30 -
10g Simcoe @ 30 -

10g [email protected] 0 -
10g Centennial @ 0 -
10g Simcoe @ 0 -
Steeped for 20 mins 

Thinking to dry hop Citra, Galaxy or the trio above but again open to suggestions.

TS


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## fletcher (25/1/14)

your call but citra is an AMAZING dry hop. i'd just go that by itself. looks nice though whatever you choose


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## Yob (25/1/14)

Citra and centennial dry hop, id keep galaxy out of that mix personally

Cheers


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## elcarter (25/1/14)

Fletch is right on with the Citra every time it's come out far beyond all my expectations.

My personal view Chinook's a great bittering hop but always ends up, to my personal tastes a little harsh some times.


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## Three Sheets (26/1/14)

Citra it is then. 20 Grams I think should do it. 

Bubbling away nicely. Smells awesome coming out of the airlock.

mmmmmmmm.


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## Three Sheets (27/1/14)

Last minute indecision - I have 10 grams of simcoe left, what's the thoughts of 10g Simcoe 10g Citra.?????

I know its all personal taste but how's this combo for dry hoping?


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## law-of-ohms (27/1/14)

20g citra, 10g simcoe, comon, you know you want to...


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## Three Sheets (27/1/14)

Common in 22 litres? Seems strong but I guess it will sit in a keg for five or six weeks.


Cheers


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## Three Sheets (16/2/14)

Ok I went with 20 grams Citra dry hop.

I'm currently drinking one of the surplus to keg stubbies and am very please with the result. Wife impressed. 

This could be worthy of being published on the recipe folder, given the ease it can be made.

I'll see how it goes out of the keg. Great base to work from. Looking forward my next extract.

Thanks guys for the input.

TS



I'm in the process of doing a coopers pale ale with their No 2 brew booster - Green bullet 10g @ 30m 10g @ 15 m and 10g @ flame out. Currently waiting for it to Steep for 30 mins. which is why I'm trying my beer now.


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## Yob (16/2/14)

You need a reason to try it?


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## Three Sheets (16/2/14)

I had promised myself not to try it for another week. Works out ok because I'll be in town this week and will buy my extract.

What an easy way to brew premium type homebrew. 

The IBU seems a little less than anticipated and my taste buds will happily allow me to amp it up a touch next time.

Hop flavours could be a little more up front, if that makes sense. Any suggestions on how this could be achieved?

TS


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## Yob (16/2/14)

0 Min or whirlpool additions and/or flamboyant dry hopping


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## Three Sheets (16/2/14)

Thanks.

So how important is the size of the boil when it comes to IBU??? I don't have a pot that can take more than 4 litres.


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## Camo6 (16/2/14)

Big W sell 20L Stockpots for $20. They have 100 other uses in the brewery once you outgrow them too.


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## indica86 (16/2/14)

Those pots are great. I do AG in them. Total cost of my set up... that pot,.


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## Three Sheets (17/2/14)

I'll keep an eye out for a pot. I don't think I'll move to full grain brewing until I retire, if results from extract as already this good , so do I need a bigger boil to get more out of the hops?? I use around 500 grams of extract with 4 litres of water. 

Perhaps I nearly jagged it first go but I'll be tweaking this one for my American Style beers.


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## Yob (17/2/14)

1040 is often quoted as the ideal gravity for hop utilisation, that'd make your gravity a touch high, as homebrewers we don't have to worry too much about that but it's a good number to go by for small boils.


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## Three Sheets (19/2/14)

hoppy2B said:


> How about an English bitter with maybe 40 to 50 grams of dark crystal and 80 grams each of Golding and Fuggles as a late addition?


Being very happy with my first Extract US ALE I might have a go at a UK one- (found Spitfire very nice).

So once again I welcome suggestions, with hops stock -
Fuggles
Centennial
Chinook
Galaxy
Ccascade
Citra
EK Goldings
Simco
POR
Green Bullet
. 

By the way I have two cans of Morgans Master Brew enhancer (Contains 2 Row Pale Malt Extract, Glucose and Honey.) and 2 cans of Morgans Larger Malt (Contains 100% 2 Row Barley Lager Malt being 1350g of barley malt.)



I will use two tins but do I mix and match them?


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## Yob (19/2/14)

Fuggles and EKG to about ~35 IBU


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## Three Sheets (19/2/14)

Yob said:


> Fuggles and EKG to about ~35 IBU


50/50 combo from bittering and all the way through?

How do these two go with dry hopping?

Any thoughts on the extracts?


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## Three Sheets (21/2/14)

Hi people.

Can anyone post a link for an IBU calculator (metric) I cant recall the last one I used.

I thinking I might use some of my Green Bullet (11% AA) for bittering my British ale too. 20g @ 60 minutes.

Apparently Green Bullet's relo is Fuggles. 

TS


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## Yob (21/2/14)

Download brewmate


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## Three Sheets (21/2/14)

Thanks again Yobs,

So here is the hop plan for opinion -

20g @ 60 mins Green bullet

25 x 25 Fuggles EK Goldings @ 15 mins

15 EK Goldings @ 5 mins

15 EK Golding @ 0 mins

Steep for 20 mins.

22 litres IBU of 43

3 kg of liquid malt 200 grams dry, Safele 04


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## Yob (21/2/14)

Only 1 pack?


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## Three Sheets (21/2/14)

Yob said:


> Only 1 pack?


1 pack ? If you mean yeast, yes. Currently drinking my keg of aforementioned US Ale concoction and can report its right up there for reward for effort. I would love to try some of what the full grain brewers out.

anyway I have now moved to extract and hops brewing for the time being.


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## Three Sheets (23/2/14)

Decided to skip the Green Bullets

Fuggles 15g @ 60m

Fuggles 25 @ 30 m

E K Golding 30 @ 15m

E K Golding 15 @ 5 m

22 litre the 2 tins of malt and 500grams of Coopers Brew booster #2.


35 -40 IBU.


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## hoppy2B (23/2/14)

Have you read the online book by John Palmer called 'How to Brew'? It contains a lot of useful information for both extract and all grain brewers and a section on calculating hop IBU.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter5-5.html


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## Three Sheets (23/2/14)

Thanks Hoppy2B. I really should sit down and read it several times.

Looks like my brew will sit around 40 IBU.


At current rates It wont be long before its time to order some new hops. I am liking the piney type above the fruity ones, not so keen on the floral. 

So any suggestions for a piney hop?


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## hoppy2B (23/2/14)

Chinook is meant to be piney. I have never brewed with it but have some approaching harvest and am looking forward to using it.

I notice a lot of people grow a combination of Chinook and Cascade so they may go well together.


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## Yob (23/2/14)

They most certainly do


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## Helles (23/2/14)

, not so keen on the floral. 


If you don't like floral stay away from Goldings
I hate them for this reason


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## lukiferj (23/2/14)

Chinook and columbus if you like the piney hops. More us than uk type hops though. Both of them play very nicely with just about any other us hop.


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## lukiferj (23/2/14)

helles said:


> , not so keen on the floral.
> 
> 
> If you don't like floral stay away from Goldings
> I hate them for this reason


 I like goldings but you need to pick the beer you're using them in. Fairly inconspicuous but don't add them in early or you won't get much from them.


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## Three Sheets (23/2/14)

helles said:


> , not so keen on the floral.
> 
> 
> If you don't like floral stay away from Goldings
> I hate them for this reason


Well that might suck, because I just put down a brew loaded with EK Goldings. Still its rare my brews go down the drain. We shall see.


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## lukiferj (23/2/14)

Three Sheets said:


> Well that might suck, because I just put down a brew loaded with EK Goldings. Still its rare my brews go down the drain. We shall see.


 I reckon you will be fine. Certainly not a bad hop. Just dont get a lot from them. Use with some other hops and it great. Even without other hops, doubt it would make a bad beer on its own.


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## hoppy2B (23/2/14)

As with some of the other comments here I consider Golding a difficult hop to pin down flavourwise. It definitely adds something but I wouldn't be able to describe it. I used to think it was vanilla but I now put that down to the particular yeast I used for one brew. I'm surprised that anyone would could it floral. I personally describe it as quite neutral.

Fuggle on the other hand seems to be pretty rich. You might want to go easy on the Fuggle if you don't like fruit flavours


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## Three Sheets (23/2/14)

Leaves me wondering what to dry hop it with. Was going to be 20 grams of EK Golding.


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## Three Sheets (24/2/14)

Dry hopping suggestions please? Will add probably tomorrow night.


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## Yob (24/2/14)

Or styrian goldings

Mmmmm


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## Three Sheets (25/2/14)

Dry hopped with 10 gms EK Golding and 12 gms Fuggles.

Will report back in 3 or 4 weeks with taste test.

Next will be an Australian Beer playing with POR and Galaxy.

TS


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## Three Sheets (1/3/14)

Ok (hope this is the correct thread) I am about to embark on an Aussie ale. I have 2 cans of Morgan's malt and 500 grams of coopers brew enhancer,

So I have POR and Galaxy hops to play with but am considering bringing in Green bullet into the equation. 

Open to suggestions as to hop bill.


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## Yob (1/3/14)

What IBU are you shooting for?


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## hoppy2B (2/3/14)

If you want to make a good Aussie ale you will need to steep say 40 grams of dark crystal at 70 degrees for a half to 1 hour first before dissolving your malt and adding your hops. 

25 - 30 grams of POR for 60 minutes or more depending on your IBU target

15 grams of Galaxy and the same of Green Bullet as a 10 minute additition if you want a bit of flavour. And dry hop the same again if desired. 

US05 yeast.


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## Three Sheets (2/3/14)

An IBU of 40 plus should suit my pallet, and hopefully the wife's. 

I've not used crystal before, what impact and role does it have on the beer?

POR seems to lack friends when late in the boil or dry hopping, why is that?


Note I wont be able to get any HB supplies till next Friday so crystal wont be part of this brew.

I have US05


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## hoppy2B (2/3/14)

Dark crystal will give your beer a sharp toffee flavour typical of beers like Coopers Pale Ale or maybe VB. It a flavour that seems to get lost in the extract manufacturing process to some degree. It will also sweeten the beer a bit and give better balance. The sweetness tend to fade as the beer ages.

My preference is to use light cans and add some dark crystal rather than go for a dark can.

Do you know the Alpha rating of your hops? The additions I suggested above should get you up over 40 IBU.


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## Three Sheets (7/3/14)

Ok. I scored 200 grams of crystal to give it a whirl.

Will probably brew this weekend.


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## Three Sheets (8/3/14)

Done.

3KG of Liquid LME
125g Corn sugar
150g dextrose
250 dry LME

15 g @ 60 POR
10 g @ 20 POR
20g @ 10 Galaxy
10g @ 0 Green Dragon

Steeped for 10 mins.

200 grams Crystal steeped 45 mins

Unfortunately I didn't adjust Brew Mate to take into account my POR was 5.6% AA as opposed to the 8.3 default from Brew mate.

This crashed my IBU to 23. ( I chilled it with ice water pretty quickly however how does one account for the 10 min steep??)

Hopefully I haven't made this too sweet.

Open to suggestions for dry hopping this.( or should I not?)

Cheers


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## hoppy2B (9/3/14)

It will be hell sweet if its dark crystal you used, so will need aging for a fair bit before you will be able to tolerate drinking it. I've seen other people on here recommend 200 grams of dark crystal but for me even 100 grams is too much.

You can always boil up a half to one litre of water and put some hops into it for 30 minutes and pour into the ferment vessel to give a bit more IBU. That's what I would do.


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## Three Sheets (9/3/14)

Thanks HB2

It was a light crystal. recommended for pilsners and lagers. My IBU via Brew mate comes in at 29.5, with the no chill rated at 48. 

So I am hoping the 10 min steep from flame out will lift it from the 29.5 ( I added ice water once it hit the FV,)

I am wondering whether to try a bit after a few days before heading down you suggested path.

incidentally the Brewmate spread sheet lists the Crystal from 10 to 120 and none seem to effect the ibu calculator

Might add that Balance Value sits at 1.36 and BU:GU is at 0.59


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## Three Sheets (10/3/14)

Ok I am concerned this will be too sweet, but 29.5 couldn't be too far off the mark?

Any guess as to what the 10 mins from steep might have added?

Hoppy2B care to suggest a hop tea that could add 10 to 15 IBU's or should I just do a mini boil for a length of time.?


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## hoppy2B (11/3/14)

Actually, you should be ok with a Light Crystal. Cockos Sierra Nevada Pale Ale uses 500 gram of Medium Crystal for a standard batch if I recall correctly. The lighter the crystal the less sweet.

You should get close to 20 IBU for a 10 min addition of 30 grams of hops with an average alpha acid rating of 13% in a 1.040 wort if my calculations are correct. Does that sound right? :blink: It will be less than 20.

Its Green Bullet by the way. I went searching for Green Dragon hops to no avail. :lol: You wrote Green Bullet the first time.

Your beer should be fine as it is. It will probably be a cracker actually. :drinks:


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## Three Sheets (11/3/14)

Thanks I feel better now. Are you talking about a boil for 10 mins or steeping?

If its a boil as I think its what you mean, I was going use POR, and drop that into my coffee press and steep
a 50/50 blend of POR/Green BULLET. 

Edit - ok my hop tea ended up with a boil of POR 15g @ 15mins and Galaxy 5g @ 10mins
then poured this onto 5 g each of Green Bullet, Galaxy and POR.

Steeping as I type. 30 mins - 60 mins I guess.


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## hoppy2B (11/3/14)

I was thinking that maybe the ten minute steep you spoke of above may have added enough IBU. You could be around the 40 IBU.

Your no chill figure was 48. Is that calculated for the small partial boil you do with kits? I'm not familiar with Brewmate.

The 20 IBU I came up with was for a straight boil. I don't know the the AA rating of your hops.


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## hoppy2B (11/3/14)

OK, had another look and you are saying you are actually at 23 IBU + the 10 steep before chilling. That would most likely put your beer at around 30 IBU. Therefore add enough hops to take it to the level you are after.


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## Three Sheets (11/3/14)

Hi Hoppy2B.In the original , I let the boil steep for 10 mins before adding to the wort then chilled in the FV with ice water.

My actual IBU using the BrewMate calculations had my IBU at 29.5. There was no place to measure any IBU that may have been added during the steep. 

I edited my last post with what I've done. Looks like I am about to add another 15 IBU's. I can live with that.

If it turns out ok well it will be a true Australian beer- Bastardised.


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## Three Sheets (13/3/14)

Three Sheets said:


> " I'm in the process of doing a coopers pale ale with their No 2 brew booster - Green bullet 10g @ 30m 10g @ 15 m and 10g @ flame out. Currently waiting for it to Steep for 30 mins. which is why I'm trying my beer now. "


This turned out to be rather bland with the old fashioned and home brew tang. Should improve with time but for me I could comfortably doubled the hops.

One and a half stars.


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## hoppy2B (16/3/14)

I think you'll be around 50- 55 IBU with your latest effort.


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## Three Sheets (9/4/14)

Three Sheets said:


> Done.
> 
> 3KG of Liquid LME
> 125g Corn sugar
> ...


Edit - ok my hop tea ended up with a boil of POR 15g @ 15mins and Galaxy 5g @ 10mins
then poured this onto 5 g each of Green Bullet, Galaxy and POR.




OK the "sample" bottles of this turned out very good and tomorrow night I tap the keg my Aussie based Ale. The British one with the Fuggles and E K Golding was a bit sweet for my liking and I'll need to be a little more aggressive when using these hops. Currently bubbling away is an extract IPA ,with predominantly Chinook , with a touch of Centennial and Simcoe.


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## hoppy2B (10/4/14)

How did your Aussie based ale turn out? I don't expect to hear any complaints regarding too low an IBU. :lol:


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## Three Sheets (1/5/14)

Turned out very nice HB. Will use it as a base to tweak. IBU was fine but I'll chase a few more. (I'll be more careful when using the spread sheet so I don't need the secondary tea.)

THE POR was overwhelmed by the Galaxy but the combo of the three was smooth. 

So I need to play with this -

15 g @ 60 POR
10 g @ 20 POR
20g @ 10 Galaxy
10g @ 0 Green Bullet.


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## Three Sheets (1/5/14)

About to put down 1.5 kg of Amber and 1.5 kg of Extra light liquid malts with 500 grams Dry light malt, 250 grams dextrose, with 200 grams of Cara malt grain infusion pack. Yeast either 04 or 05.

The voices in my head have told me to use Green Bullet (AA 13%) and Citra (AA13%).

Suggestions for the boil and dry hops welcome (IBU 40 to 65)................and is the Infusion pack a waste in this brew?


TS


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## Three Sheets (2/5/14)

Three Sheets said:


> About to put down 1.5 kg of Amber and 1.5 kg of Extra light liquid malts with 500 grams Dry light malt, 250 grams dextrose, with 200 grams of Cara malt grain infusion pack. Yeast either 04 or 05.
> 
> The voices in my head have told me to use Green Bullet (AA 13%) and Citra (AA13%).
> 
> ...


Hop bill was -
7g @ 30m Citra
7g @ 30m Green Bullet
15g @ 20m Citra
15g @ 20m Green Bullet
10g @ 10m Citra
10g @ 10m Green bullet

Note that the GB had an AA of 11.5

I also made it up to 24 litres ( I have found that 20 litres with 3kg of liquid malt and a brew booster is just too much body for my US IPA I am currently drinking
)


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## Three Sheets (5/6/14)

Three Sheets said:


> Hop bill was -
> 7g @ 30m Citra
> 7g @ 30m Green Bullet
> 15g @ 20m Citra
> ...


This turned out pretty good. Medium body, nice bitterness , Hops distinctly citrus . I'd leave out the 10g @ 10m Citra next time and I think that would make it perfect.


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