# 8 Beers you should never drink... supposedly



## davedoran (29/5/14)

Saw this "article".

Just ridiculous. Dont drink Guinness because it has isinglass. Better not. Or also strike wine off the list.


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## sp0rk (29/5/14)

Big old load of shite
The sooner the anti-GMO brigade die of malnutrition, the better...


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## manticle (29/5/14)

Dumb article but you probably _shouldn't_ drink the majority of those beers because they are mostly bland dishwater.


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## lukiferj (29/5/14)

Wouldn't drink most of those beers anyway.


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## peas_and_corn (29/5/14)

Even if brewers were forced to include ingredients on the label it won't include isinglass anyway because it's not an ingredient, it's a process aid


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## Dave70 (29/5/14)

*Here’s some harmful ingredients that are commonly found in beer:*


*GMO Corn Syrup*
*GMO Corn*
*High Fructose Corn Syrup*
*Fish Bladder*
*Propylene Glycol*
*Monosodium Glutamate (MSG)*
*Natural Flavors*
*GMO Sugars*
*Caramel Coloring*
*Insect-Based Dyes*
*Carrageenan*
*BPA*
*& lots more!*
Harmfulness - HFCS > ethanol. _Phew.._

the "& lots more' is a bit of a worry. It could be ANYTHING...!!!!


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## Not For Horses (29/5/14)

I don't need an idiot to tell me not to drink PBR. My tastebuds will tell me that.


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## TimT (29/5/14)

I'd actually go out of my way to drink something *because* it had GMO in it.

On the other hand, why not? Different people drink craft beer for different reasons - some for the flavour, others because they like knowing where a product comes from and perhaps like the assurance that it doesn't contain 'unnatural' ingredients like GMO, or ingredients that come from animals, like isinglass or gelatine.From a business perspective, it certainly makes sense to try to appeal to these sections of the market when selling your brew.


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## sp0rk (29/5/14)

I love blowing minds when you mention to people that we've been eating GMO foods for around 14,000 years now...


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## davedoran (29/5/14)

Can see your point Tim. Guinness would be the only one on that list i would drink anyway. I can definitely understand the marketing idea of making and advertising drinks with no additives and no hidden chemicals but i can see a difference between drink our brand xyz if you like because of reasons abc not 8 beers you should never drink. I think if the author had done a little bit more research the article would have been very different.


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## Dave70 (29/5/14)

sp0rk said:


> I love blowing minds when you mention to people that we've been eating GMO foods for around 14,000 years now...


Then tell em* all* food is organic. 

Then show em this. 

http://youtu.be/ku6m0TF9CUg


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## sp0rk (29/5/14)

Dave70 said:


> Then tell em* all* food is organic.
> 
> Then show em this.
> 
> http://youtu.be/ku6m0TF9CUg


lol, I rewatched that episode the other day


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## wide eyed and legless (29/5/14)

I should be in New York now, was due to leave on Tuesday, 2 weeks ago I had a gastroscopy found a large tumour in my stomach just below my oesophagus, had CAT scan, PET scan and last Thursday another gastroscopy and laparoscopy by the surgeon yesterday a heart check and today my first Chemotherapy.
Chances of survival less than 30%, cause, first question, do you smoke, no, do you drink, yes, how much, how often, because I drink every night, according to the surgeon and oncologist that is the cause.
What a load of pish, it seems that it doesn't matter if one has been hanging around any carcinogenic chemicals it has to be the drink.
I will admit we all know alcohol is toxic but from what I have read there is a myriad of causes for cancer anyhow I have cut out the alcohol and eating an extremely healthy diet, if I don't beat the cancer I will give it a bloody good fright.

On a funny note the Oncologist advised me not to go down Jim Stynes route, I asked what route was that then, he leant forward and said he drank his own urine and had coffee enemas, I jokingly told him I had tried the coffee enema and I didn't like it, he asked why I told they didn't put any sugar in it.


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## jaypes (29/5/14)

Nothing about Melbourne Bitter? h34r:


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## TimT (29/5/14)

Wide Eyed - Dude. I hope you survive this and are with us and drinking for many years to come.


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## wide eyed and legless (29/5/14)

Thanks Tim I am not the type to give up easily and I am not worried by death, comes to all of us, I could have sworn my stop was further down the road though.


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## Airgead (29/5/14)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Chances of survival less than 30%,


Fark dude... ummm... good luck. Not much more I can say.


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## wide eyed and legless (29/5/14)

Don't want to put d d's post off topic, just thought it was worth mentioning as we must remember we are drinking something that is not good for us when I do get through it I will continue to drink but not every night. (Thanks Airgead)

Agree with jaypes Melbourne


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## wide eyed and legless (29/5/14)

Didn't finish my post Melbourne Bitter & Carlton Draught should be on the list


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## davedoran (29/5/14)

Wishing you all the best mate. Chin up and try maintain a positive attitude. That's the advice my bro got (going through chemo). If you get down and think your sick your body will respond. It's working for him for what it's worth.


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## Pogierob (29/5/14)

Dave70 said:


> *Here’s some harmful ingredients that are commonly found in beer:*
> 
> 
> *GMO Corn Syrup*
> ...


WATCH OUT FOR THOSE NATURAL FLAVOURS!!!!

deadly shit those natural flavours, I'd never want those in my beer


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## wide eyed and legless (29/5/14)

Thing is most of those ingredients are found in countless food items.


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## TimT (29/5/14)

_deadly shit those natural flavours, I'd never want those in my beer_

Gasp! I hear they have *chemicals* in them!


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## manticle (29/5/14)

Beer is a superfood though. An organic superfood with antioxidants.


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## manticle (29/5/14)

And enzymes


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## TimT (29/5/14)

Was poking about at a local naturopath today and found on the shelf a number of weird items that would be good for brewing; of relevance to this discussion, a 'vegetarian enzyme' pill that not only contained 'amylase' but also protease and lipase (they're milk-curdling enzymes - apparently we normally have them in our own bodies. Chymosin is the one cheesemakers use though). Also: 'milk thistle' pills - milk thistle being another old herb sometimes used to flavour ales. Was kind of tempted to buy some, crush them up and use them in my next herbal brewing experiment.


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## nathan_madness (29/5/14)

MSG, really. If you ferment that out you end with GHB in ciders. There were some discussions on here before about it. Or you can Google it.


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## jaypes (29/5/14)

nathan_madness said:


> MSG, really. If you ferment that out you end with GHB in ciders. There were some discussions on here before about it. Or you can Google it.


Mostly cheap chinese beers use MSG


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## Green-Lobster (29/5/14)

I avoid GMO`s were i can . quite happy to cross these of any list . not like im stuck for choice and they are all unremarkable.
CUB beer does not claim to be GMO free , but i have a soft spot for Melbourne Bitter.
I think there should be honesty in labeling . If your proud of what you make, label it . let the buyer make an imformed choice .


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## manticle (29/5/14)

I avoid unnecessary apostrophes where I can.
Genetic manipulation and modification, depending on your definition of what it constitutes, has been going on for a long time. It's why we have insulin, burmese cats and brewer's yeast.


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## Rdyno (29/5/14)

I have little knowledge on modern genetic manipulation techniques, but in saying that I have looked into older styles and from my knowledge they are different. As far as I was aware modern techniques came about after the equipment was developed to brake DNA down and reinsert it into other strains.

Just a bit of bragging I'm friends with a professor in botany that specialises in genetics he worked on the team that made a wheat strain that was resistant to something, the funny thing is I never talk about plants with him lol except when asking him about his garden of course.


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## manticle (29/5/14)

They've been inserting dna into strains for yonks as far as I'm aware. Not suggesting there's no potential issues, just that there is a lot of scaremongering based on ignorance.


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## Rdyno (29/5/14)

manticle said:


> They've been inserting dna into strains for yonks as far as I'm aware. Not suggesting there's no potential issues, just that there is a lot of scaremongering based on ignorance.


What is your definition of yonks? I was trying to find some info on my friends work (I will have to ask him) and found some info on x-ray mutilation but the common method seems to be inbreeding or more correctly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis . As far as the DNA manipulation go's I would've thought the 70's or 80's would've been around the time they first had these technologies which not that long ago. 

Here is a link to wheat I chose wheat because of my last post also because it is in beer and is a crop that would be considered high on the GMO priority list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat .


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## TimT (29/5/14)

P J O'Rourke wrote about GM and anti-GM activism in _All The Trouble in the World_ in 1994.... so it's been round in its modern form for more than 20 years at any rate.

But engineering was practiced in cruder forms before DNA was found by James Watson and Francis Crick: for instance, crops were irradiated to encourage mutations. Prior to that, for many many eons people have been selectively breeding animals and plants (and in the case of yeast, fungus) - a crude but effective form of engineering.


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## manticle (29/5/14)

Rdyno said:


> What is your definition of yonks? I was trying to find some info on my friends work (I will have to ask him) and found some info on x-ray mutilation but the common method seems to be inbreeding or more correctly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis . As far as the DNA manipulation go's I would've thought the 70's or 80's would've been around the time they first had these technologies which not that long ago.
> 
> Here is a link to wheat I chose wheat because of my last post also because it is in beer and is a crop that would be considered high on the GMO priority list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheat .


Yonks for me is in relation to how alarmist people have recently become about it. Bigger than a beesdick smaller than an eon.
When I studied biology in high school, gene splicing for various purposes, including medical (actually mostly) was a well established technology. I was in high school in the early 90s. As I implied - most diabetics rely on genetically manipulated material daily.


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## Ducatiboy stu (29/5/14)

nathan_madness said:


> MSG, really. If you ferment that out you end with GHB in ciders. There were some discussions on here before about it. Or you can Google it.


Cheap apples and some MSG from the asian shop...I knew them cider blokes had something going on...


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## sp0rk (29/5/14)

Rdyno said:


> As far as I was aware modern techniques came about after the equipment was developed to brake DNA down and reinsert it into other strains.


That is Genetic Engineering (or Genetically Modified Crops, depending on where you are from), not Genetic Modified Organisms per se
All GE is GMO, not all GMO is GE


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## GalBrew (29/5/14)

People have been inserting genes into yeast and bacterial for a long time. Zero of these bugs have ever been used to ferment beer. What would be the pony when we have so many excellent yeast available. There needs to be an economic imperative before genetically modified anything is put in our beer/food.


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## Dave70 (30/5/14)

wide eyed and legless said:


> I should be in New York now, was due to leave on Tuesday, 2 weeks ago I had a gastroscopy found a large tumour in my stomach just below my oesophagus, had CAT scan, PET scan and last Thursday another gastroscopy and laparoscopy by the surgeon yesterday a heart check and today my first Chemotherapy.
> Chances of survival less than 30%, cause, first question, do you smoke, no, do you drink, yes, how much, how often, because I drink every night, according to the surgeon and oncologist that is the cause.
> What a load of pish, it seems that it doesn't matter if one has been hanging around any carcinogenic chemicals it has to be the drink.
> I will admit we all know alcohol is toxic but from what I have read there is a myriad of causes for cancer anyhow I have cut out the alcohol and eating an extremely healthy diet, if I don't beat the cancer I will give it a bloody good fright.
> ...


Off topic.

REPORTED..


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## TimT (30/5/14)

_There needs to be an economic imperative before genetically modified anything is put in our beer/food._

I've seen a few articles talking about the possibility. The economic imperative would be making a better yeast more suited to the task of brewing, which would attract interest from brewers - obvious examples would be better ester production or quicker ferments; I'm sure there are many others that scientists are working on at the moment.

I've heard that brewer's yeast these days has completely lost the ability to breed because brewers don't like the unpredictability - that may or may not be true, but it reminds me of those Monsanto-engineered seeds you hear about occasionally - seeds which only work for one generation, and then have to be bought again from the supplier. Clever - but ultimately of dubious benefit: good for the companies who engineer the seeds (I'm sure it's not just Monsanto), not much good for anyone else. A yeast which can't breed would ultimately be much more susceptible to infections.

Personally, I think wild yeast has a lot to offer too... so maybe we don't need to wait around for new and weird yeast strains. They might be floating around the house right now h34r:


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## Not For Horses (30/5/14)

This should be an interesting read for you all then.
White Labs are already sitting on a large number of GM yeast strains.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/27/science/craft-beer-at-the-genetic-level.html?_r=0


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## Green-Lobster (30/5/14)

I would definately avoid a beer with a burmese cat in it . no matter how good its grammer was/is .
each to thier own . I would at least hope the label supported the product ingredients .
A glow in the dark pig using jellyfish dna might be a novelty for some .


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## Toper (23/6/14)

> Quackmail: Why You Shouldn't Fall For The Internet's Newest Fool, The Food Babe.
> 
> She made the front page of the Financial Times as the blogger who humbled Big Food and whose latest campaign for transparency in beer ingredients left “The King of Beers,” Anheuser Busch InBev, and close running rival SabMiller clamoring like Neville Chamberlain to appease a bully. “The rapid response by AB InBev and SABMiller—which capitulated to Ms Hari’s demands within 36 hours—underscores the growing power of social media over corporate policy,” wrote the FT’s Consumer Industries Editor, Scheherazade Daneshkhu.
> Ironically, one of the key factoids in blogger Vani Hari—aka, “The Food Babe’s”—attack on Big Beer was that they “even use fish swim bladders” to make their product without putting this self-evidently dodgy fact on the label; the implication is that beer should not from fish bladder be made. Yet, isinglass—as dried fish bladder is Tolkienesquely called—has been used to clarify beer, wine and liquor since the early 18th century, and its manufacture was widespread in Colonial America (a versatile compound, it was also mixed with gin and used as a glue to repair broken china). While this may cause vegans to pause before a draught, isinglass has been used and consumed without incident for centuries.
> ...


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## Burt de Ernie (23/6/14)

> Off topic.
> 
> REPORTED..


Reported for reporting!


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## sp0rk (23/6/14)

toper01 said:


> > Quackmail: Why You Shouldn't Fall For The Internet's Newest Fool, The Food Babe.
> >
> > She made the front page of the Financial Times as the blogger who humbled Big Food and whose latest campaign for transparency in beer ingredients left “The King of Beers,” Anheuser Busch InBev, and close running rival SabMiller clamoring like Neville Chamberlain to appease a bully. “The rapid response by AB InBev and SABMiller—which capitulated to Ms Hari’s demands within 36 hours—underscores the growing power of social media over corporate policy,” wrote the FT’s Consumer Industries Editor, Scheherazade Daneshkhu.
> > Ironically, one of the key factoids in blogger Vani Hari—aka, “The Food Babe’s”—attack on Big Beer was that they “even use fish swim bladders” to make their product without putting this self-evidently dodgy fact on the label; the implication is that beer should not from fish bladder be made. Yet, isinglass—as dried fish bladder is Tolkienesquely called—has been used to clarify beer, wine and liquor since the early 18th century, and its manufacture was widespread in Colonial America (a versatile compound, it was also mixed with gin and used as a glue to repair broken china). While this may cause vegans to pause before a draught, isinglass has been used and consumed without incident for centuries.
> > ...


I provided this to a vegan mate, but he said he'll still go with The Food Babe's shite because she's promoting critical thinking and questioning what companies put in our food (even if she's wrong)
There's no reasoning with some fools


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## GalBrew (23/6/14)

Food Babe has shown that she likes to use big words and acronyms, but has no idea what any of it means. Internet slacktivism at its best......if it's in a blog it must be true.


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## TimT (23/6/14)

Not surprising that in an age where people know less and less about where food comes from it's easy to play on their suspicions by talking offhandedly about ingredients like isinglass.

Nor is it surprising that folks like vegans or vegetarians might not want to be drinking something with isinglass in it.


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## Batz (23/6/14)

Ever tasted a heritage tomato?

We like to try to grow most of our own food, it's not possible to do it all but, we are closer than most.

GMO seeds don't grow, someone owns the plant...Monsanto perhaps? I grow my own plants and reuse the seeds, each year the plants are better as they adapt to the environment.

I'm wasting my time here, but don't let go of what we own, and grow a veggie garden....taste the difference.

Batz


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/6/14)

"Dont believe everything you read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln, 1846


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/6/14)

Batz said:


> Ever tasted a heritage tomato?
> 
> 
> Batz


Love heritage tomatoe's. Black Russian,Tigeralla, San Mazarno ( best pasata tomatoe )

Started growing heirloom carrots to.


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

GalBrew said:


> Food Babe has shown that she likes to use big words and acronyms, but has no idea what any of it means. Internet slacktivism at its best......if it's in a blog it must be true.


I note also she does a nice line in cross promotion pimping de-bunked tripe like The China Study and alkaline diet. But we'll just ignore that bit. 

As usual, she has the default harrowing diet hell story.

About Vani Hari 
*Hi there! First of all, I want to say welcome and thank you for stopping by.*
*My name is Vani Hari, but I’m now better known as “The Food Babe.” For most of my life, I ate anything I wanted. I was a candy addict, drank soda, never ate green vegetables, frequented fast-food restaurants and ate an abundance processed food. My typical American diet landed me where that diet typically does, in a hospital. It was then, in the hospital bed more than ten years ago, that I decided to make health my number one priority.*

Wow. Lucky for you. 



Food Babe Voted Dr Oz’s “Healthiest Facebook Page”!
By Food Babe


*Dr. Oz recommended the Chlorophyll in Green Vibrance today as the fountain of youth! I believe it!*

https://www.facebook.com/thefoodbabe/posts/190935464339378



Oh dear..

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/06/17/health/senate-grills-dr-oz/

http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2013/01/29/the-great-and-powerful-dr-oz-dissected-in-the-new-yorker/

http://www.vox.com/2014/6/23/5834160/watch-john-oliver-pull-back-the-curtain-on-dr-oz-and-the-fda


Food shill Babe, what are you hiding?.....


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## Not For Horses (24/6/14)

Speaking of tomatoes and vegans, did you know that some tomato plants are actually omnivorous?
Tomato plants have hairs on the stems that attract insects. The plant then poisons the insect and it drops to the ground around the root base where it is broken down and consumed by the plant.


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## TimT (24/6/14)

_GMO seeds don't grow, someone owns the plant...Monsanto perhaps?_

Terminator seeds. Yep, one of the most infuriating abuses of GMO technology. The root problem (plant... root.... boom tish!) is copyright law - should a company like Monsanto have ownership over a plant gene or a particular species of plant? They ought to be allowed to profit from their research but to the extent of having ownership of a basic food source? 

It's a hard area of law, this one, and I reckon we'll be sorting out its problems for another century or two....


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## Not For Horses (24/6/14)

Is it any different from Plant Breeders Rights that protect many, many other crops? Barley is one close to our hearts. Someone owns Maris Otter and controls who grows it.


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## TimT (24/6/14)

True.


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## wide eyed and legless (24/6/14)

Not For Horses said:


> Speaking of tomatoes and vegans, did you know that some tomato plants are actually omnivorous?
> Tomato plants have hairs on the stems that attract insects. The plant then poisons the insect and it drops to the ground around the root base where it is broken down and consumed by the plant.


I watched a YouTube video where the guy fed his tomatoes vacuum cleaner dust mainly because of dust mites and dead skin cells.

Alkaline diet, I had a guy lecturing me on the subject of acid / alkaline balance of our bodies which never cut any cloth with me but since then I have wondered how much truth there is in it, to get the best out of a plant the PH has to be right for that plant to grow as a healthy specimen so would our own PH also be important, not read any scientific studies on the subject (if any has been carried out ) just that it could make some sense.


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## Forever Wort (24/6/14)

Not For Horses said:


> Is it any different from Plant Breeders Rights that protect many, many other crops? Barley is one close to our hearts. Someone owns Maris Otter and controls who grows it.


This is a massive can of worms. I would say that before genetic engineering became powerful in the 20th century the concept of owning and trademarking an entire discrete life form was less threatening. 

Now, and looking to the future, it's downright scary. Not because "GM is bad for us" but for all the other economic, social and ecological implications for us. On top of that - beyond direct ramifications for humans - I feel like there is something philosophically wrong with claiming ownership to an entire living species. 

On that level I guess it comes down to how much you care about a life form's "freedom", be it microbe, plant, fungi, person or puppy.


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

The alkaline diet can work, but not for the reasons generally claimed. Eating lots of fruit and veg is simply good for you, not because they are keeping you blood pH stable. 
Same for similar fads like paleo. Gee, who would have thought cutting out processed foods and eating less sugar would help you loose weight and feel better?..


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## Not For Horses (24/6/14)

wide eyed and legless said:


> I watched a YouTube video where the guy fed his tomatoes vacuum cleaner dust mainly because of dust mites and dead skin cells.
> 
> Alkaline diet, I had a guy lecturing me on the subject of acid / alkaline balance of our bodies which never cut any cloth with me but since then I have wondered how much truth there is in it, to get the best out of a plant the PH has to be right for that plant to grow as a healthy specimen so would our own PH also be important, not read any scientific studies on the subject (if any has been carried out ) just that it could make some sense.


I don't really know a lot about the alkaline diet thing. All I really know is Dr Warburg's research in the 1930s showed that cancer cells convert glucose into lactic acid, hence the whole 'cancer is acidic' thing. 



Forever Wort said:


> This is a massive can of worms. I would say that before genetic engineering became powerful in the 20th century the concept of owning and trademarking an entire discrete life form was less threatening.
> 
> Now, and looking to the future, it's downright scary. Not because "GM is bad for us" but for all the other economic, social and ecological implications for us. On top of that - beyond direct ramifications for humans - I feel like there is something philosophically wrong with claiming ownership to an entire living species.
> 
> On that level I guess it comes down to how much you care about a life form's "freedom", be it microbe, plant, fungi, person or puppy.


Depending on how strongly you feel about your philosophy, you should probably stop using cultured yeasts too. Someone owns them too.

I don't agree with you but I also don't disagree.
I can see both sides of the argument. Someone has to pay researchers. These new strains of plants that are being developed are being done for the good of mankind. Probably. The people that fund the research should have the right to own them. They built them after all. My big concern is the potential for monopoly. If new and better species are produced, will they push the others to extinction? And if yes, that means that the only way to grow *insert crop here* is to pay someone for it. This, I think, is bad.


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## wereprawn (24/6/14)

wide eyed and legless said:


> I watched a YouTube video where the guy fed his tomatoes vacuum cleaner dust mainly because of dust mites and dead skin cells.
> 
> Alkaline diet, I had a guy lecturing me on the subject of acid / alkaline balance of our bodies which never cut any cloth with me but since then I have wondered how much truth there is in it, to get the best out of a plant the PH has to be right for that plant to grow as a healthy specimen so would our own PH also be important, not read any scientific studies on the subject (if any has been carried out ) just that it could make some sense.


Nah. All all shit mate. Its not scientists, Doctors or anyone with half a brain promoting this. ( unless you consider dickheads like Dr Oz credible ). Have a squiz what a real doctor has to say.http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/DSH/coral2.html


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## Forever Wort (24/6/14)

Not For Horses said:


> I don't agree with you but I also don't disagree.
> I can see both sides of the argument. Someone has to pay researchers. These new strains of plants that are being developed are being done for the good of mankind. Probably. The people that fund the research should have the right to own them. They built them after all. My big concern is the potential for monopoly. If new and better species are produced, will they push the others to extinction? And if yes, that means that the only way to grow *insert crop here* is to pay someone for it. This, I think, is bad.


Yes, that is one of the economic consequences. In reality the human-induced homogenisation of life forms on Earth may prove to be in humankind's interest in the long run. It may not. It's impossible to know. 

Some would even disagree with that as a criteria for evaluation. I see where such people are coming from as my _intuition _is filled with sadness with every extinction.


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

Forever Wort said:


> Some would even disagree with that as a criteria for evaluation. I see where such people are coming from as my _intuition _is filled with sadness with every extinction.


About 99.9% of all the spices that have ever existed in the planet in the last four and a half billion years have become extinct. 
Sadder than emo


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

_Son of a bitch_, did it again!
I_ hate_ emoticons..


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## Forever Wort (24/6/14)

General death is sad in a general way, but when humans are responsible it is extra emo cos I am a human and I dig nurturing, not killing. We could bring so many more species along for the ride than we seem to be doing. 

So much potential, damn yee humans, quit squandering it!

:mellow:


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## TimT (24/6/14)

_Sadder than emo _

NOTHING is sadder than emo.

http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/13700000/sad-emo-emo-13789212-536-396.jpg


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## TimT (24/6/14)

Of course if a big GM company didn't have copyright they wouldn't bother inventing something like terminator seeds.... and anyway, such things existed before GM, didn't they. The issue isn't even really terminator seeds that last only one generation - it's the deceptive or tricky salesmanship sometimes associated with it (getting a farmer to get rid of their old crops, buy the seeds for a new crop, and then, with no seeds from their old crop, buying new seeds from the same company year after year).

So it's a hard issue. While a company should have a right to make a profit from their research I am far from convinced that they should have that right forever - because what's lost, then, is a valuable concept of common knowledge, common property. Some things should ultimately just not be owned by anyone.

Case in point, the bullshit artist in the USA who is currently trying to sue for the ownership of the symbol Pi! I mean, I'm all for creative people being able to earn money from their work - but on the other hand, what a dickhead!


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## zarniwoop (24/6/14)

sp0rk said:


> I provided this to a vegan mate, but he said he'll still go with The Food Babe's shite because she's promoting critical thinking and questioning what companies put in our food (even if she's wrong)
> There's no reasoning with some fools


I think this attitude is related to the quite popular approach of "I feel it's right", there are a disturbing number of people who completely ignore research and go with what they think purely based on it being their opinion and therefore having some validity.

(This is where I continue ranting about the increasing narcissism present in society...)


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

In other words, a hucksters paradise.


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/6/14)

I ate a salad today.

I feel empowered.











...Ok...now that I am empowered....I off to the pub


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## wide eyed and legless (24/6/14)

Acid / Alkaline diets, after writing the post this morning, my nutritionist rang to see how my diet is going asked her about the PH levels in our bodies and was told how good our bodies are at balancing PH without any supposed help from ourselves or experts and if our bodies did become to acid the main organs would fail and we would die.
Not for Horses, read a lot about carbohydrates conversion to glucose feeding cancer, this is not the case have found the best way to learn about cancer is stick to the Australian, American and British official sites, there is no super food, no magic bullet in fact the only way that I can see of helping the chemotherapy is to use the mind to fight cancer, if athletes minds destroys their bodies ( muscle meltdown ) I would hope that it is just as powerful to repair the body.


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## Dave70 (24/6/14)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> I ate a salad today.
> 
> I feel empowered.
> 
> ...



Me to.

Arranged vertically and compressed between a beef patty and two pieces of bread. 

Hope I don't catch coeliac disease from the rolls.


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## heshtek (24/6/14)

Yeah an anti GMO friend of mine who likes constantly spamming me on facebook with anti GMO stuff posted this also. Funny thing is that i think they are so blinded by the GMO crap they forgot that the actual ingredient in beer that is not good for you is alcohol. I love drinking the stuff myself but I'm not kidding myself into thinking that it is good for me.


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## sp0rk (24/6/14)

heshtek said:


> Yeah an anti GMO friend of mine who likes constantly spamming me on facebook with anti GMO stuff posted this also. Funny thing is that i think they are so blinded by the GMO crap they forgot that the actual ingredient in beer that is not good for you is alcohol. I love drinking the stuff myself but I'm not kidding myself into thinking that it is good for me.


They also don't realise most foods they eat have been GMO for quite a few thousand years via cross pollination/breeding
Genetically Engineered however...


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## Not For Horses (24/6/14)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Acid / Alkaline diets, after writing the post this morning, my nutritionist rang to see how my diet is going asked her about the PH levels in our bodies and was told how good our bodies are at balancing PH without any supposed help from ourselves or experts and if our bodies did become to acid the main organs would fail and we would die.
> Not for Horses, read a lot about carbohydrates conversion to glucose feeding cancer, this is not the case have found the best way to learn about cancer is stick to the Australian, American and British official sites, there is no super food, no magic bullet in fact the only way that I can see of helping the chemotherapy is to use the mind to fight cancer, if athletes minds destroys their bodies ( muscle meltdown ) I would hope that it is just as powerful to repair the body.


Your body will make glucose out of just about anything. It's a bit like Mr Fusion in that respect. Not eating carbohydrates isn't going to change that.
Also, your stomach is very acidic and an almost unbelievably good pH buffer. It is in fact true that cancer cannot live in an alkaline environment but that is because none of the cells in your body can. It is as silly as saying cancer can't survive in the centre of the sun so we should heat our bodies up to 15 million degrees to get rid of it.


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## Batz (27/6/14)

http://consciouslifenews.com/monsanto-patent-control-natural-gmo-tomatoes/1174646/#

My apologizes for way off topic here but I think the thread heading in a positive way. For me anyway.

Batz


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/6/14)

On your side Batz.

I share my seeds with all and sundry.

Ask and I will give


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