# Cherry Beer Suggestions



## Mark Van Moolenbroek (23/8/10)

Prior to my home brewing days I once bought some Belgium cherry beer for Xmas, not sure what it was called but was a very nice touch to the festive season.

Still not set up for AG so hoping someone can suggest a good kit, extract or partial recipe and instructions for this type of beer given its a good time for getting Xmas brewing underway.

Any recomendations would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Markvm


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## Andrew Coleman (23/8/10)

Hey mate, one question,

Is this your beer?
http://www.beeradvice.com.au/59/belle-vue-kriek/

If so I have been looking for a clone with not a whole lot of luck for ages, i'll try hunt it down again if thats what your after because I'm also keen on making some sort of clone.

Drew


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## petesbrew (23/8/10)

Haven't done cherries myself, but here's the article (found in the links above) for using fruit in beers.
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...;showarticle=39

For a base kit, I'd suggest the Coopers Canadian Blonde.


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## matr (23/8/10)

Love the Krieks. I have about 4kg of Cherries in my freezer. Just waiting to find a decent recipe to use them with.

Was thinking of going for the lambic. But not sure if it's a good idea to introduce Brett to my fermenter???


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## Andrew Coleman (23/8/10)

petesbrew said:


> Haven't done cherries myself, but here's the article (found in the links above) for using fruit in beers.
> http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...;showarticle=39
> 
> For a base kit, I'd suggest the Coopers Canadian Blonde.



+1 to this link, always refernce it myself with no problems, keeping in mind this is after some batches that didnt work out so well :S


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## petesbrew (23/8/10)

matr said:


> Love the Krieks. I have about 4kg of Cherries in my freezer. Just waiting to find a decent recipe to use them with.
> 
> Was thinking of going for the lambic. But not sure if it's a good idea to introduce Brett to my fermenter???


A mate gave me some dregs of a sour beer when I had my last framboise bottled.

Basically I just opened a dozen bottles, poured in a few drops, recapped and let them sit for a few months.
The result was fantastic - the sourness played off well with the raspberries!


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## matr (23/8/10)

Has anyone recultured from a kriek or framboise?


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## Swinging Beef (23/8/10)

matr said:


> Love the Krieks. I have about 4kg of Cherries in my freezer. Just waiting to find a decent recipe to use them with.
> 
> Was thinking of going for the lambic. But not sure if it's a good idea to introduce Brett to my fermenter???


Wigh plastic, Brett is forever.
Decide you are gonna make brett beers and stick that fermenter aside just for brett beers.
Use an old one, and shout yourself a new one for 'regular' beer


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## matr (23/8/10)

Swinging Beef said:


> Wigh plastic, Brett is forever.
> Decide you are gonna make brett beers and stick that fermenter aside just for brett beers.
> Use an old one, and shout yourself a new one for 'regular' beer



Hmmm That's what I thought.. 

The Mrs loves them more than I do so I may just have to get another fermenter (for her).. I have a cunning plan...


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (23/8/10)

Drewcifer said:


> Hey mate, one question,
> 
> Is this your beer?
> http://www.beeradvice.com.au/59/belle-vue-kriek/
> ...




yep you nailed it, thats the one, anything close to that would be terrific

Cheers,

Markvm


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## Andrew Coleman (23/8/10)

Markv said:


> yep you nailed it, thats the one, anything close to that would be terrific
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Markvm




No worries mate, now the hunt begins! heaps keen :lol: 

Drew


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (25/8/10)

Thanks for the feedback!

Talk about opening a can of worms! I have looked at some of the links upon links and there is a large ammount of information available but has resulted in a head spin on the complications of this sort of brew which seems historically to be a beer requiring large ammounts of fermentation time, some ammount of dark arts and alchemy to produce a successful result.

For a guide a couple of extract recipes I found are as below 

*Batch #3, Extract* 
6 Cans (3.3lb ea) M&F Wheat Extract (55% wheat, 45% malt)
3oz aged Perle hops
15+ gal water
Chimay Red yeast culture
Boil for 1 hour, hops in at start. 

Notes:
7/15/91 Started
? Added Brett / Pedio
9/11/91 Going well, very acid.
9/26/91 Pellicle changing from 'ropy scum' to thin and whitish as the Brett takes over.
12/16/91 Mixing with 15 lbs frozen raspberries.


*Batch #1, Extract*
For 15 gallons of base pLambiek 
6.6# Northwestern Weizen Malt Extract
6.6# Northwestern Gold Malt Extract
3.3# Northwestern Amber Malt Extract
1.5# Dextrose
3.0oz Hallertauer Leaf Hops (1.5 years old + baked 20 min at 250F)
15gal Palos Hills Tapwater (quite soft)
8gm Gypsum
6gm Sodium Chloride
24 floz starter from Sierra Nevada Pale Ale (same as Wyeast #1056)
16 floz starter of Brettanomyces lambicus (two weeks in starter flask)
16 floz starter of Pediococcus cerevisiae (two weeks in starter flask)
Boil: 2hrs
OG: oops!
SG after 20 days: 1019
SG after 3 months: 1012 

After 3 months in a white, 20 gallon HDPE Brute, the batch was split into four sub-batches: sub-batch A: 15 lbs dark, sweet cherries + 4.25 gallons of p-lambic,
sub-batch B: 13.5 lbs dark, sweet, pitted cherries + 4.25 gallons of p-lambic
sub-batch C: 12 lbs red raspberries + 1 gallon boiled/chilled water (result of the fruit sanitation) + 3.25 gallons of p-lambic, and sub-batch D: 3.25 gallons of p-lambic (destined to be pseudo-gueuze). 

Will think on a skeleton recipe and hoping for forum input?


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (26/8/10)

Okay heres what I am thinking as a basic starter recipe, please feel free to comment / make suggestions, will be needing plenty of help.

1.5kg can of wheat malt
1.5kg can of pale liquid malt
LDME - 300g (not sure?)
300g specialty grains probably, carapils and light crystal, maybe some pale wheat
Hops - one of the following - Brewer's Gold, Northern Brewer, or Fuggles(suggestion of aged hops so may leave in a low oven for a few hours?), 60g for 60min boil?
Belgium liquid yeast perhaps Wyeast 3942 or similar
to 20 litres

Primary fermentation 7 to 12 days @ 20c

2 - 3kg cherries, tinned or bottled including juices, still to source
Wyeast 3278 Belgiun Lambic Blend
to 23 litres
Secondary fermentation 2 to 6 weeks @ 20c

Big learning curve for me here, have only done kits and bits and some basic extracts, not done secondary fermentation before, or anywhere near this style of beer, not sure how the transfer goes from primary to secondary and at what risk is there of unwanted bugs and flavours in the process. Probably not a true Kriek or Lambic, but hoping with a bit of help and adjustments this should result in a reasonable specialy beer? 

Markvm


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## sirotilc (26/8/10)

I put together a Sour Cherry Wit last year that came off very nicely. It was AG, but it would be easy enough to duplicate with extract:
50% Pilsner
45% Torrefied Wheat (What malt would be fine as a sub)
5% Oats (this can probably be left out)
(So probably the two tins you have would be fine - assuming the wheat malt is 100% wheat, and not the 50/50 pale/what blend)

Boiled for 60 min, Styrian goldings as a bittering addition to about 20 IBUs, added 5g of cardomon and 2g of pepper in the last 10 min for a bit of extra flavour (would probably up the cardoman next time)

Fermented with T58 (gives a strong peppery aroma) for 1 week, racked to secondary, added 6kg of Sour (Morello) Cherries. Bottled.

The sour cherries gave it a nice twang, which might work in getting at some of the sourness of a kriek. The T58 worked well giving a nice dry spiciness that works well with the cherries.

I added the cherries in the secondary - stuff a pair of cut off pantyhose with frozen whole cherries, and then racked the beer on top of it. I figured that the beer was fairly anti-microbial by that point given the alcohol and C02 levels. The stuffed stockings worked great, made cleanup much easier. Don't skimp on the amount of cherries as well. I got mine at a good price from frozberries (www.frozberries.com.au) in Sydney (I think they might be in Brisbane as well). Much cheaper than the supermarket. 

It has surprisingly gotten more drinkable with age as well, the sourness has mellowed a little. Will be doing something similar again this year I think with Saison yeast and a mix of sour and sweet cherries.


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (26/8/10)

Thanks for your reply sirotilc

Sounds like your recipe would be the basis of a better starting point for me, like the pantyhose sock idea not doubt will save a lot of mess, like the sound of the Saison, the 6kg of cherries was this for a double batch or 23l ?

Will modify to the following

1.5kg can of wheat malt
1.5kg can of pale liquid malt
LDME - 300g 
300g specialty grains probably, carapils and light crystal, maybe some pale wheat
Hops - one of the following - Brewer's Gold, Northern Brewer, Fuggles or Styrian 
Wyeast Saison
to 20 litres

Primary fermentation 5 days @ 22c

rack to secondary, add 3kg cherries, tinned or bottled including juices, still to source

will be bottling, assume normal priming with carb drops / white sugar?, not sure about the cardomon and pepper, not heard of this before, do you think these profile well with the cherries?

Apologies for more questions and thanks for your help.

Cheers Markvm


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## sirotilc (27/8/10)

6kg of Cherries for a normal 23 L batch - about right IMO, it leaves a great colour. The Cardomon and pepper were substitutes for the coriander which normally goes in a Wit. You can probably leave those out and let the yeast do the work.

From my experience I'd give it at least week on the cherries - I bottled in a hurry and so the bottles were a little more carbed than I expected! I bulk-primed with white sugar - about 150g for the entire batch I think.


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## MitchDudarko (27/8/10)

I made this for the wife, and it turned out really well. Seeing as she's pregnant, it's not going anywhere soon, so i'm going to save the keg for christmas. It should disappear fairly quickly. I assume you could just sub the raspberries for cherries. Grist lets the fruit flavour shine.



BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: AG #6 - Raspberry Wheat
Brewer: Mitch Dudarko
Asst Brewer: 
Style: American Wheat or Rye Beer
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0) 

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L 
Boil Size: 26.33 L
Estimated OG: 1.050 SG
Estimated Color: 6.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 20.9 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
2.50 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) (1.8 SRGrain 51.02 % 
2.20 kg Copy of Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe WhGrain 44.90 % 
0.20 kg Crystal Malt - 60L (Thomas Fawcett) (60.0 Grain 4.08 % 
45.00 gm Hallertauer [4.40 %] (60 min) Hops 20.9 IBU 
2.10 kg Raspberries (Secondary 7.0 days) Misc 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 4.90 kg
---------------------------


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## MitchDudarko (27/8/10)

Sorry, didn't realize you werent set up for AG. That'll teach me to read the WHOLE post first. Agologies


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (27/8/10)

sirotilc said:


> 6kg of Cherries for a normal 23 L batch - about right IMO, it leaves a great colour. The Cardomon and pepper were substitutes for the coriander which normally goes in a Wit. You can probably leave those out and let the yeast do the work.
> 
> From my experience I'd give it at least week on the cherries - I bottled in a hurry and so the bottles were a little more carbed than I expected! I bulk-primed with white sugar - about 150g for the entire batch I think.




Happy for the guidance, will up the 3kg, have a bit of fresh corriander growing in the herb patch, might throw a little of that in mix.

Thanks for the help Markvm


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (27/8/10)

MitchDudarko said:


> Sorry, didn't realize you werent set up for AG. That'll teach me to read the WHOLE post first. Agologies




no problem will keep, not too far off getting a start with the AG just a couple more bits and am off and running

Cheers,

Markvm


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## Mark Van Moolenbroek (12/11/10)

Morning All,

For those interest thought I would pass on my Xmas Cherry Beer 1st attempt, combined a few suggestions from the original posts, went like this:-

2 x 1.5 kg wheat extract
500g ldme
Carapils 125g
Pale wheat 125g
Pale crystal 50g

12g Haulertauer @5mins
12g Tettnager @5mins
12g Saaz dry

wyeast 3724 Belgium Saison

6 bottles of Morello cherries and 6 tins of cherries

Primary for 7 days without cherries, 20l, 24 degrees, plenty of Krauser the first couple of days but went a little quiet, put the temp up to 27 degrees after reading up a little more on the 3724, racked to secondary on top of all the cherries in a sock plus half of all the juices, carboy was overfull, did not allow for enough extra space from the cherries and liquid, but did not think it would be an issue, wrong, within 12 hours I had pink foam everywhere, kept the temp in the high 20's range for 2 weeks. OG 1.053 - FG 1.015. No idea what effect the cherries would have had on the FG or final %alc but thinking I am around the 6% mark? 

Have tried several bottles since three weeks bottled and just love this stuff, good balance between the wheat and sour cherries, has a nice sour dry note, (I think? tastes buds are still a bit green), for me definitely a far better result than expected, and thinking a real treat for Xmas, thats if I can stop testing along the way. The colour is a rich cherry, lively pink head, clarity not the best, thinking this is from a combination of the yeast and the cherries. Not sure if it is the answer but next time I may rack to a third carboy for a bit of cold conditioning. Although this is an expensive beer to brew but for special occasions why not, bit of fun and variation from the normal brews, thinking of one day trying something similar with mangoes. 

Note quite the Fruit Frambic but a tasty Belgium Cherry Ale


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