# Hops Stuck At Customs From Northern Brewer



## phoenixdigital (29/12/11)

Hi Guys,

Just got an email from Shipitto.com saying that customs where holding my hops and wont release unless I provide more information.

Shipito is a freight forwarder which I have used in the past to import hops from northernbrewer.com

There were two emails the first being
--------------
Hello,

TNT has contacted us because they are requiring additional information.
The email states, "Con No : xxxxx/ REF: xxxxx-O - We need the
manufactures declaration. The shipment is under quarantine and will
require a formal customs clearance entry in Australia. " Please
provide us with a certificate of origin. Thank you.
--------------

The second

-------------
TNT has send a second emial with some clarification as to what is
needed.

"If your shipper or receiver do have an inquiry as to what is needed on
the manufactures declaration, I do have those details below:

This declaration must detail the following information.

MUST BE ON A COMPANY LETTERHEAD
MUST BE IN ENGLISH
MUST STATE CONSIGNMENT NUMBER
FULL CONTENT/COMMODITY
BIO/ANIMAL/PLANT/SYNTHETIC
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN
END USE OF PRODUCT
MUST BE SIGNED AND DATED

Please ensure the consignor provides this information in detail, the
more
information provided on the declaration, the easier for Quarantine to
clear. "
-------------

We did order a lot of hops  About 3.5kg all up and they are all pellet hops.

Has anyone had this happen?

They seem to indicate they want northern brewer to send it which I doubt they will.

Do you guys think that we could send it through to customs?

Pain in the ass as I would hate for our $250+ of hops to get denied


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## Batz (29/12/11)

phoenixdigital said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Just got an email from Shipitto.com saying that customs where holding my hops and wont release unless I provide more information.
> 
> ...




Could Nothern Brewer email you the info, you print it out sign etc and send it in.
I have had hops opened by costoms but they have always arrived.


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## stux (29/12/11)

You're the shipper right?

Hmmm

Good luck


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## ShredMaster (29/12/11)

I often get warranty replacement parts from overseas and they all come with a shipping declaration from the company providing the parts. I'm quite surprised there isn't one already included from the people you are ordering it from.


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## phoenixdigital (29/12/11)

ShredMaster said:


> I often get warranty replacement parts from overseas and they all come with a shipping declaration from the company providing the parts. I'm quite surprised there isn't one already included from the people you are ordering it from.



I used a freight forwarder so as far as Northern Brewer were concerned it was being shipped within the USA.

As Stux said I am the shipper so maybe something from me should be enough.

Going to call customs now.


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## phoenixdigital (29/12/11)

phoenixdigital said:


> Going to call customs now.



Ok customs said its TNT that have requested that information in order to clear it on customs behalf.... calling them now.

They will be calling me later today.


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## phoenixdigital (29/12/11)

no callback from them which I am not surprised about.

Did find this other thread
http://www.ahb.com.au/forum/index.php?show...48827&st=20

which references some customs information on hops which I can direct them too if they give me some hassles
http://www.aqis.gov.au/icon32/asp/ex_casec...CommodityId=936


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## bookworm1707 (29/12/11)

If it needs an import dec then it must be from the shipper, or at least appear to be. If people import a lot of stuff from craft brewer then they will probably have something on file. They are telling you because sometimes it is faster for you to contact the shipper.


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## phoenixdigital (30/12/11)

Ok now this is getting annoying.

I now recieved this email from shipitto.

------------
Australian customs is requesting for a Manufactures Declaration for the
contents in this shipment, also known as country of origin. Please
provide that document so I can go ahead and forward it to TNT.
----------

Also found this
http://www.daff.gov.au/aqis/import/biologi...oods___Why_not_


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## kelbygreen (30/12/11)

that sucks, I got a filter from USA and it took a week to get here and then sat in customs for 2 and a half weeks before the decided they would send it on. Cant be to hard to open a box to see whats in there and close it again but obviously it is.


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## chunckious (30/12/11)

As Shredy stated before, the sender should have had to supply this information before being able to despatch goods.


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## brettprevans (30/12/11)

As already said You need tge shipping declaration from northernbfewrr. Its slack of them not to have provided it.its gotnothing to do with a declaration from you as implied by otherss. Contact northernbrewer. Tbey can fix it easily.

Theres so no reason ti use a freight forwarder.for.hops. Unless northern brewer wont ship out of US. In which case id use someone lije nikohops or hopsdirect. Screw paying for something for no reason.


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## bookworm1707 (30/12/11)

pheonix, have you contacted northern brewer? What did they say?
Or was it was it easier to complain on here?


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## chunckious (30/12/11)

Ouch!


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## punkin (30/12/11)

Slightly off topic and not helpful at al to the OP, but i still don't get the advantage with buying from the states?

It's not price, as Ellerrslie is just about on par per kilo, so is it freshness? Availability of different varieties that Ellerslie don't have?

Just seems such a hassle and knowing that the hops are sitting for 7-10 days out of the fridge if you're lucky, charges for currency conversion etc. And of course this risk...


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## phoenixdigital (30/12/11)

bookworm1707 said:


> pheonix, have you contacted northern brewer? What did they say?
> Or was it was it easier to complain on here?



I have emailed them and am waiting for a response.

I am not really complaining just asking for advice. Though its probably coming off as a whingefest that is not my intention.


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## bookworm1707 (30/12/11)

Sorry about the grumpy reply, coffee has kicked in now. 

The other thing to do is ask the fruit company if they have tried to get in touch with NB. in theory they should not have sent it without the correct paperwork.

Most companies will have this on file somewhere, and it is very standard paperwork.

Other thing is to make one if you are any good with computers? Not that I would ever advocate falsifying documents! Get the logo off the net, put it on a word doc, fill in the details. Whoops, did I say that out loud?


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## brettprevans (30/12/11)

punkin said:


> Slightly off topic and not helpful at al to the OP, but i still don't get the advantage with buying from the states?
> 
> It's not price, as Ellerrslie is just about on par per kilo, so is it freshness? Availability of different varieties that Ellerslie don't have?
> 
> Just seems such a hassle and knowing that the hops are sitting for 7-10 days out of the fridge if you're lucky, charges for currency conversion etc. And of course this risk...


Ellerslie would haveneeded to drop a lot to be comparabke in price. Its still generally cheaoer to import in bulk than it is to buy in aust. Plus tbe aussje.dollar helped, u can get more varieties etc. need I go on?


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## WitWonder (30/12/11)

punkin said:


> Slightly off topic and not helpful at al to the OP, but i still don't get the advantage with buying from the states?
> 
> It's not price, as Ellerrslie is just about on par per kilo, so is it freshness? Availability of different varieties that Ellerslie don't have?
> 
> Just seems such a hassle and knowing that the hops are sitting for 7-10 days out of the fridge if you're lucky, charges for currency conversion etc. And of course this risk...



A combination of those things you've listed. Having bought from hopsdirect they are the freshest hops I've ever seen/used. The fact that they are sitting out of the fridge for a few days would have a negligible impact on the product and the issue in this case is that the OP used a freight forwarding service (no idea why) and thus northern brewer assumed they didn't need the same paperwork as they would have supplied had they known it was going to Australia. 

BTW, my experience with Northern Brewer customer service has been fantastic. They will do whatever they can to assist I am sure.


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## phoenixdigital (30/12/11)

WitWonder said:


> A combination of those things you've listed. Having bought from hopsdirect they are the freshest hops I've ever seen/used. The fact that they are sitting out of the fridge for a few days would have a negligible impact on the product and the issue in this case is that the OP used a freight forwarding service (no idea why) and thus northern brewer assumed they didn't need the same paperwork as they would have supplied had they known it was going to Australia.
> 
> BTW, my experience with Northern Brewer customer service has been fantastic. They will do whatever they can to assist I am sure.



Will definitely be giving hops direct a go next time. This time we ordered the following

Chinook Hop Pellets 1 lb.
Amarillo Hop Pellets 1 lb.
German Magnum Hop Pellets 1 lb
Czech Saaz Hop Pellets 1 lb.
US Fuggle Hop Pellets 2 lb.
Centennial Hop Pellets 1 lb.
Cascade Hop Pellets 2 lb.

I used a freight forwarder as last time I ordered from Northern Brewer they would not ship to Australia. Got hops through last time no issues.

I price checked the difference when buying these hops compared to Australia and I paid about $250 for what would have cost approx $400 if purchased locally (costs include shipping)

Fingers crossed it gets sorted out soon. At least we dont have a stinker of a summer this year otherwise I would be very stressed.


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## goomboogo (30/12/11)

bookworm1707 said:


> Other thing is to make one if you are any good with computers? Not that I would ever advocate falsifying documents! Get the logo off the net, put it on a word doc, fill in the details. Whoops, did I say that out loud?



Imagine if a Customs Officer regularly read this forum.


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## phoenixdigital (30/12/11)

goomboogo said:


> Imagine if a Customs Officer regularly read this forum.



I was going to direct them to this thread for more info too.... maybe not


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## punkin (30/12/11)

phoenixdigital said:


> Will definitely be giving hops direct a go next time. This time we ordered the following
> 
> Chinook Hop Pellets 1 lb.
> Amarillo Hop Pellets 1 lb.
> ...





Sorry, that's just not right.
I'm not trying to start a shitfight, i really am trying to understand.

I have a price list from a few months ago, it's still current. There's one posted in the elerslie thread in retail.
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&id=50988

These prices are for .5 or 1 kilo
obviously being 2 and a quarter odd pounds in a kilo, you get a bit more when you buy local (100 gms or so in a kilo)

Chinook Hop Pellets .5 not available
Amarillo Hop Pellets .5 not available
German Magnum Hop Pellets .5 = $20
Czech Saaz Hop Pellets .5 = $26.50
US Fuggle Hop Pellets (uk) 1kg = $41.00
Centennial Hop Pellets .5 = 21.50
Cascade Hop Pellets 1kg = $57.50

That's $166.50 plus GST ($183.10) and you are missing 1kg of hops that they don't sell. You are also getting 450 gms (1 pound) for free by buying by the half kilo rather than the pound. So you're one pound short (and two varieties i acknowledge)
I've also found that MHB gave me prices very similar when i asked him for wholesale prices on kilo (850g in his case) hops. So your two varieties (or the whole order) could have come from him.

I just plain don't believe there is a price advantage to buying from the states and the figures prove it.

As for freshness i can't say as i've never bought from there 9this is why i ask these q's) but i can say i've never been dissapointed with Elerslies hops in my long and distinguished six month allgrain career. <_< 

My last order from them was for three kilos of hops and i didn't get charged any freight at all. Maybe that was an oversight? I don't know but on other orders i've been charged $15.



Clearly you didn't gather prices from the Aussie wholesaler




> Ellerslie would haveneeded to drop a lot to be comparabke in price. Its still generally cheaoer to import in bulk than it is to buy in aust. Plus tbe aussje.dollar helped, u can get more varieties etc. need I go on?



Refer above please.


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## phoenixdigital (30/12/11)

punkin said:


> Sorry, that's just not right.
> I'm not trying to start a shitfight, i really am trying to understand.



Nothing to apologise for. If I can get them cheaper locally I definitely will. I was basing it off the only prices I could find at the time in Australia.


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## punkin (30/12/11)

Elerslies prices are in the link in my above post. They may not always be cheaper for each variety, and i wish they had amarillo as i'm out, but overall i can't see the benefit pricewise in buying from the states (or i would buy there for sure).

That's why i keep asking the question.


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## WitWonder (30/12/11)

punkin said:


> Elerslies prices are in the link in my above post. They may not always be cheaper for each variety, and i wish they had amarillo as i'm out, but overall i can't see the benefit pricewise in buying from the states (or i would buy there for sure).
> 
> That's why i keep asking the question.



What year are the hops in question? That's the key for me. If they have 2011 varieties I will give them a go for sure.


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## pcmfisher (30/12/11)

I would be asking your freight forwarder why they sent your hops without the proper paperwork.
Its their job to organize it. If not, why did they receive the goods knowing it was going to Australia?
What did you pay them for?
Did you have to send over a box for them to put the hops in?


Tell them to get off their arse and fix it because you want your hops. They know where they came from.


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## punkin (30/12/11)

WitWonder said:


> What year are the hops in question? That's the key for me. If they have 2011 varieties I will give them a go for sure.




You'd have to ask them mate.

I saw a post from one of the american suppliers here yesterday (nickohops) saying they won't be releasing any of their 2011 varieties until they first sell their 2009 and then there 2010 vintages, so the situation is comparable.


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## benno1973 (30/12/11)

Hey punkin,

I've bought both from Ellerslie and Hopsdirect, and both are excellent products, packed well and comparable in freshness. 

When I ordered from Ellerslie, I ordered in kilo bags and received slightly over 1kg (like around 15-20g over in each bag). When I ordered pounds from hopsdirect, I actually received 500g in each bag (not that I expected or even knew that before ordering).

When I bought pounds of the domestic hop pellets from hopsdirect recently, they were priced between US$8 and $US16 per pound of pellets. Some of these were 2011 harvest, fresh off the bines. Postage was $45 for 5lb of hops, so essentially it was around $110 for new season Amarillo, Centennial, etc to my door. That's around $44/kilo and the decision was based on the fact that they were the new season hops, which ultimately sold out pretty quickly. Remember also that this includes delivery, which was surprisingly quick (around 1 week).

Last time I bought from Ellerslie, I ordered 4.5kg (nearly twice as much) and the freight was $40. While this made the hops average out to around $42/kilo, the order included POR and some of the other cheaper varieties. Additionally, they weren't necessarily current season hops. The package was dispatched on a Thursday and delivered by the courier company on the following Tuesday.

So it's a bit horses for courses. I recently bought from hopsdirect because the hops were fresher (straight off the bine) despite the slightly extra travel time (a couple of days). Also remember that if I were to buy from Ellerslie, the hops have already had to travel internationally anyway at some point (unless I'm ordering POR), so the travel time is less of an issue.

Your figures don't really prove that it's cheaper to buy locally, as they exclude the two most expensive items on the order (Chinook and Amarillo) and negate postage. Assuming Ellerslie postage is around $50, your figures show the total bill being $233 and there's still nearly a kilo of Amarillo/Chinook missing from the order! I think in this case, the advantage is to ordering from the states. It's not always the case, but the figures indicate that it works out for these varieties.


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## punkin (30/12/11)

Sure mate, i get the little differences. As i said, my last order was freight free, but i've never been charged over $20 by Elerlslie, let alone $50. Also need to take into account currency fees from the banks when using other currencies.


As i said, just trying to understand, as the prices (even in your example) are so close.

I often buy stuff from the states, i imported my last sounder for the boat and saved about 4 grand, so it's not like i'm against it. Just that the savings have to be large for me to go to the risk and trouble.


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## benno1973 (30/12/11)

Yep, freight free would make a big difference to the example. I just looked back through my emails and it seems that I questioned the cost of the freight last time, and they said that freight to WA was prohibitive, so maybe it's just the fact that I'm in WA that they charged me $40. They used TNT couriers, which ended up being slower than AusPost. 

If you're still wondering why people buy hops from the US, then I chose hopsdirect last time due to price (for me was cheaper), freshness and varieties available. But my purchasing decisions aren't always about price - I'll seek out a hop I like (i.e. Amarillo) and if Ellerslie don't supply it, I'll buy from elsewhere.

As far as the 'risk and trouble', hopsdirect is pretty used to sending to Aus and it certainly wasn't any more trouble than dealing with Ellerslie.


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## bookworm1707 (30/12/11)

If you are worried about heat they are probably in TNT's warehouse so ask them to put them in the fridge. Most bond stores have one.
If a customs officer read my earlier comments in know they will not be interested, even the broker will look at it and probably spot it is a copy and think why bother argueing. At least that has been my experience working with them.


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## DUANNE (30/12/11)

do you think they would bother fridging the hops? most of the time they wont even shrink wrap pallets before releasing them.


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## Josh (1/1/12)

goomboogo said:


> Imagine if a Customs Officer regularly read this forum.



Imagine... h34r:


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## razz (1/1/12)

Josh said:


> Imagine... h34r:


I was waiting for you to pop up Josh, where have you been? Checking hop imports? :lol:


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## phoenixdigital (1/1/12)

update...

Northern brewer said they dont have a document like this (response below)
----------------
We don't have any declarations paperwork or anything like that around here since we don't do international shipping, unfortunately. The packages do say Hop Union LLC on them which is who packages them for us. They are definitely located in the US so I hope if you point that out to them, that will make it fairly obvious what's going on with the hops. I hope that helps some.
---------------

Does anyone have an example of what this "Manufcaturer Declaration" looks like? I will send that example to Hop Union for them to fill out.

I am scared for my hops now.


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## tavas (1/1/12)

goomboogo said:


> Imagine if a Customs Officer regularly read this forum.




They can read????


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## goomboogo (1/1/12)

tavas said:


> They can read????



Ouch. Take that, Josh.


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## Josh (2/1/12)

phoenixdigital said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Just got an email from Shipitto.com saying that customs where holding my hops and wont release unless I provide more information.
> 
> ...



Is it possible to have it inspected by DAFF Biosecurity or whatever they're calling themselves these days? I'd be calling them and explaining what the goods are and pointing them to the ICON database.

:icon_offtopic: 
This is the biggest issue with importing through an air cargo freight forwarder. Air cargo is largely screened electronically using the documentation provided by the shipper. If there are any discrepencies such as the OP then the goods can be held up awaiting added paperwork. If your shipper was the seller, then they would more than likely have included the declaration as required. But because NB thought they were sending the hops to the USA there was no requirement for them to include anything.

The best bet is to ship using USPS or if you're in a hurry, EMS. Using these methods, there is no paper trail that Quarantine can use to hold up your goods. With EMS, your parcel is x-rayed pretty much on the day it arrives in Australia and if Quarantine want to pull it up, they will just examine it, rather than request more paperwork. Hops pellets are seen quite often in the mail centre and most Quarantine Officers know they are fine. And if they don't know that, they will simply look it up in ICON and release during the examination anyway.


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## bigfridge (2/1/12)

phoenixdigital said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Just got an email from Shipitto.com saying that customs where holding my hops and wont release unless I provide more information.
> 
> ...



There is no problem with the amount of hops - just that they require a formal declaration of what you are importing. This is normally only required where the value exceeds $A1,000.

Here is an example used by Wyeast - as you can see there is nothing special, just a factual description of the product.

Have you tried talking to the local TNT office ?

If all else fails you could get a local customs agent to sort it out for you.

HTH,
Dave

View attachment IMG_0001.pdf


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## stux (2/1/12)

citymorgue2 said:


> As already said You need tge shipping declaration from northernbfewrr. Its slack of them not to have provided it.its gotnothing to do with a declaration from you as implied by otherss. Contact northernbrewer. Tbey can fix it easily.
> 
> Theres so no reason ti use a freight forwarder.for.hops. Unless northern brewer wont ship out of US. In which case id use someone lije nikohops or hopsdirect. Screw paying for something for no reason.



Northern Brewer don't ship out of the USA, so you need to use a forwarder, as such NB really don't have to supply the import declaration


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## phoenixdigital (2/1/12)

bigfridge said:


> There is no problem with the amount of hops - just that they require a formal declaration of what you are importing. This is normally only required where the value exceeds $A1,000.
> 
> Here is an example used by Wyeast - as you can see there is nothing special, just a factual description of the product.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the example of the declaration. I might make some changes to match hops and send it through to Hop Union for them to add to a letterhead and sign.

If anyone has an example of a hop declaration that would be great.

I have spoken to TNT about 3 times and they said they would be forwarding on all my information to the customs area. The customs area were suppoed to ring me but have failed to do so. They have also sent a link to hops in the AQIS database showing pelleted hops are allowed to be imported.

That said its not specifically customs being pains here. I think it is a dept at TNT becauase when I rang customs they sad I had to ring TNT about it as they didn't deal with it from their end.

Either way I appreciate the help so far. I hope I can get the hops out of the stalemate soon.

I might even contact hops direct and ask for an example document from them. Then in the future purchase from them if they can assist. I have jsut sent them an email asking for a copy of their document.

I hate red tape.


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## Mattzilla (2/1/12)

just to clear things up.... hops etc get checked and stopped by Australian Quarantine, not Customs


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## abanygavin (2/1/12)

In this situation,you have to do Customs work and pay tax and other charges.

We always ship our goods to our Customers by FEDEX,DHL or UPS,if sample order.
If so,our Customers will never do Customs work and just sign for packages from Courier.
We supply conical fermenters/brew kettles.


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## Mattzilla (2/1/12)

oh for bulk/commercial imports then yes customs will collect duty and GST and make sure all documentation is in order


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## Duff (2/1/12)

Josh said:


> Imagine... h34r:






razz said:


> I was waiting for you to pop up Josh, where have you been? Checking hop imports? :lol:



I started reading this thread thinking the same thing :lol:


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## phoenixdigital (3/1/12)

Sigh..... just got this email from TNT
---------
Dear Sir/Madam,

Australian Quarantine has inspected your freight for Chinook alcohol brewing pellets and before it can be cleared, they require the following documents:

*Manufacturers Declaration stating end use and origin is required.*
Could you please email me these documents at your earliest convenience in order to have your freight release.

Thank you,
--------

I hope Hop Union get back to me.... this is starting to get really old...

I wonder if it is only the chinook?


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## phoenixdigital (4/1/12)

I just sent TNT (or whoever is dealing with this) this email. Will see what response I get.
-----------------
Hi,

I am trying to get in contact with the manufacturer but as yet have had no response.

If it is just the Chinook that is causing issues please just remove them and dispose of them.

The longer the other hop pellets are left in warm temperatures they will be damaged and lose their usefulness for brewing. I would appreciate it if you could put them into a coolroom.

I understand the importance of Australian Quarantine and I appreciate the work you do. I have had a lot of hops delivered in the past using this same method and have never needed a "Manufacturers Declaration". I was also under the impression that there would be no issues with insects or disease due to the method of processing of hop pellets and the AQIS database 
http://www.aqis.gov.au/icon32/asp/ex_casec...CommodityId=936

Anyway either way can you please tell me what happens if I cannot get this "Manufacturer Declaration"?

Also as previously mentioned if it is only the Chinook holding this up please remove and destroy as the other hops in this package are deteriorating due to not being refrigerated.

Please call me on 0421 xxx xxx if you have any questions.

Again the purpose as you have even stated in your description "Chinook alcohol brewing pellets" is beer brewing and the manufacturing origin is "203 Division Street, Yakima, WA 98902"
http://www.hopunion.com/

I do hope this can be resolved soon as I personally had these posted from the USA. They were not sent from a distributor or the manufacturer which is why there was no documentation you are asking for. Which is also why I am having trouble getting in contact with them.

Regards
------------


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## beerbog (4/1/12)

ahh, yawn.


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## HoppingMad (4/1/12)

No offence to Customs reading this, but most of those manning our so-called border security are morons.

And to answer the question - they can't read - here's my story to prove it.

Just had my brother get hassled at Melbourne Airport bringing in 200g of Moteuka pellets fresh from Auckland. All sealed and in commercial foil packs.

The dumbass at the airport gave my brother a lecture about them needing to be sprayed and him paying a $100 import fee. He obviously couldn't read that they were pellets (Not Flowers) despite them being clearly labelled as such.

My brother surrendered his hops to customs rather than argue it out, then checked the AQIS site and realised they were morons and hadn't checked their own guidelines which are spelt out on the website which clearly states that bringing in processed pellets is fine. He phoned them right away and they fished them out of the airport bin just in time. We got them mailed back to us from Daff Biosecurity. Their contracted inspectors I guess. We were very lucky.

Having now brought pellets in via mail and on plane, it never ceases to amaze me how these [email protected]#kheads get flowers and pellets muddled up. 
Hopefully if more of us continue to bring them in they'll get educated out there in border security land.

If you are reading this Customs & AQIS get your sh#t together. 

Hopper.


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## the_new_darren (4/1/12)

I agree, if you get a job in customs or the child support agency, you dont need to know your ar$e from your head.

tnd


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## phoenixdigital (4/1/12)

Gibbo1 said:


> ahh, yawn.



Sorry to keep you awake. 

Just got a response from the email I just sent out. They have cleared customs and will be sent out today.

You can go back to sleep now Gibbo.

To all those that assisted and gave suggestions I appreciate your help. Bit miffed that this many hoops needed jumping through.


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## HoppingMad (4/1/12)

Haha amen to that. 

Just wonder how hard it is for these guys to actually check the facts on their database rather than making out they know everything.

I realise that these dudes must see some weird stuff coming through, and need to be on top of it all but if in doubt, they should check it out on their little computer.

My brother got a long-winded lecture at the end of a flight when they were totally in the wrong. 

Hopper.


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## Maheel (4/1/12)

good to hear the hops made it 






the_new_darren said:


> I agree, if you get a job in the child support agency, you dont need to know your ar$e from your head.
> tnd



how true, be good if they got off their arse and actually made some people pay the back pay they owe the parents taking care of kids....


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## Fish13 (4/1/12)

for all my parenting payments i prefer going to medicare then centrelink. much easier to work with. although if you are polite they seem to be a bit smarter.


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## brettprevans (11/1/12)

punkin said:


> Sorry, that's just not right.
> I'm not trying to start a shitfight, i really am trying to understand.
> 
> I have a price list from a few months ago, it's still current. There's one posted in the elerslie thread in retail.
> ...


latest prices from elerslie have hallatau for example at $23 per 500g plus postage for 2010 crop. Hops direct is $10.9. so ur getting a kilo for the same price (excl postage wgich is about $20 for 3 lb). 

So how we are wrong?.....


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## punkin (11/1/12)

citymorgue2 said:


> latest prices from elerslie have hallatau for example at $23 per 500g plus postage for 2010 crop. Hops direct is $10.9. so ur getting a kilo for the same price (excl postage wgich is about $20 for 3 lb).
> 
> So how we are wrong?.....



Well if you really want to be a dick about it....

You're quoting the 500gm price when you are talking about a kilo.
The kilo price is $36 + postage at $15 = $51

So hops direct is $10.90 per 1/2lb (i assume as you haven't said) so 10.90 X 2.25 = $26.70 + postage $20 = $46.70


You are $4.30 au in front buying from the states (assuming you are going to conveniently ignore the conversion penalty on you credit card or paypal, and of course the maybe good, maybe bad exchange rate) 

And also assuming you are going to ignore the real case example i made from the real order and pick the example that you thought would show you right.

Current exchange rate is on your side, but next week may well not be.





What i'm saying is that people saying they are saving a stack of money (like twice the price) by buying overseas is just wrong.

It comes down to cents or a couple of dollars and i don't see the sense in it.


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## brettprevans (11/1/12)

No ur a dick by telling us we are wronf. 
Current season crop from usa v 2010 from ellerslie.
Ive used 500g as an exampke cause I cant be arsed converting bulk prices frim usa which also get cheaper the more h buy. Based on 500g v 450g u cant argue. Besides not evrryone wants 1kg of hops.

. Our point is tgat its fkn ridiculos that we can buy hops from usa that are fresher for less than what we can buy here. 

As for ur real case.example ive got plenty of them. We check our sums before we buy. now yes currency rate isnt as good as what it was but if u werr smart you would have bought usa$.whikst it was good for this reason. 
Now if u like we could look at nz hops and see that we are.still getting about a 30% discount when buying direct from nz on exchange and cheaper than buying local

U asked the question and didnt like the answer. Not our problem

U do what u like.


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## punkin (11/1/12)

No actually it's you who doesn't like the answer.

I could be arsed about doing the sums. And did them for you.

The exchange rate right now is as good as it's been for 10 years or more. It's over $1 and actually supporting your point (slightly).


You can say what you want in your rant, but the sums don't add up.

What i first said was wrong is what you quoted me as saying in reply.

What i said was just plain wrong was this statement;



> I price checked the difference when buying these hops compared to Australia and I paid about $250 for what would have cost approx $400 if purchased locally (costs include shipping)




And i proved it with the actual current prices.



Now you take what i said and twist it any way you like to try and prove me wrong.

You won't do it.


As i said, there may be a dollar or two in it, but there's no way there's twice the savings that you people are claiming. 


edit the spelling, cause i could be arsed about that too.


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## punkin (11/1/12)

BTW, nicko is only quoting 2 oz bags of hallertau and it's the 2010 crop 

And the site this thread is about (northern brewer is quoting undeclared year Hallertau at $17.50 a pound (us $43.75 a kg)


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## bookworm1707 (11/1/12)

Hopping mad, might want to get your morons straight. 

Customs officers have nothing to do with AQIS. Daff is actually AQIS, that is their department name. To simplify it.

If you are bringing plant material into the country without checking to see if it is okay then maybe it is you that could have some monikers attached to you, lucky for you you found out it was okay. yes the AQIS officers should have known. 

I don't work for either of them, or any other govt department and never have. Just find it comical when people blame others...


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## Rowy (11/1/12)

How about you all just buy Hops from Australian suppliers! Keep an Australian in work I say. Know I'm going to cop some flack. All suppliers here in Australia employ people. I did the sums recently with a supplier just to get the numbers and your saving little in the scheme of things anyway.


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## thebeemann (11/1/12)

+1 or grow ur own


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## HoppingMad (12/1/12)

bookworm1707 said:


> Hopping mad, might want to get your morons straight.
> 
> Customs officers have nothing to do with AQIS. Daff is actually AQIS, that is their department name. To simplify it.
> 
> ...



Worm, clever of you to split hairs. 

Yes I know one government bureaucrat is different to the other, but fantastic of you to point this out.

Yes we checked the AQIS website prior to bringing this material in, but thanks for inferring we are morons - very helpful.

As an aside, here's an apology from AQIS confirming they are morons. Please note the poor moronic use of 'apologises'. 







They don't specifically mention it in this brief note, but if you read between the lines what they are confirming is, yes they are morons, yes they stuffed up and can't tell one piece of plant material from another when it is clearly marked on commercial packaging, and they are also acknowledging that they are too slack to look up their own database, but at the same time are happy to lecture people who are doing the right thing at the end of a long flight and who have properly declared their safe plant material and brought it in via the correct packaging.

Interesting that you find it 'comical when people blame others'. But I think in this instance, I am correct in blaming AQIS for stuffing up and causing some inconvenience.

Your and my taxes are paying for this official to be protecting our borders. Maybe this is actually more moronic and comical.

Hopper.


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## going down a hill (12/1/12)

What a wonderful note! You should call all of the brews made with those hops the Apologises Series. I hope they haven't been too damaged sitting around getting hot, hopefully they did refrigerate them.


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## stux (12/1/12)

HoppingMad said:


> Worm, clever of you to split hairs.
> 
> Yes I know one government bureaucrat is different to the other, but fantastic of you to point this out.
> 
> ...



"Dear [blah], [AQIS] apologises for any inconvenience, regards [blah]"

not so moronic if you insert the silent assumed word


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