# Cooper's Bavarian Lager Kit



## Trough Lolly (8/9/03)

I have a 1.7Kg tin of Coopers BL in the cupboard that needs a good brewing and I have a 1Kg tub of Pale LME and a teabag if Tettnanger Hops. The missus will only let me go berserk on malt extract and partial mash brews, once the kits are out of the cupboard!  

If I want to work up a 23Litre SG of around 1.050, I reckon I need to add more to the primary in the way of LME or sugars... What would you experience extract guru's recommend?

Another 500g to 1Kg of LME? 1Kg of Dextrose? 3 drops of sinister sauce?  

Nothing?? 

According to my Excel calcs, I need 3594g of LME for a 23L brew (based on an 80 degrees Brix extract at 30 IBU). I plan on chucking in the tea bag for bittering and finish off with some pellets of EKG (6.1% AAU).

Anyone got a better way to spruce up the Coopers Bavarian Lager Kit extract?  

Thanks in advance,

Rowan


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## Moray (8/9/03)

my last brew was based on this.

I used the coopers bl kit, and .5 kg of dme
and a can of coopers wheat lme ( 1.5 kg ?)

my s.g was about 1046 from memory for a 23 liter brew.

I added 15 g's of hallertau for bittering, and dry hopped the secondary with 25g's hallertau.

I used wyeast's barvarian lager yeast.

from my inital tastings, it is one of the best brews I've ever done.

based on this to get your s.g. to around 1050 i would another kilo of pale lme ( ie 2 kg's total lme + coopers bl) 

use a good lager yeast, and consider dry hopping with halletau or saaz

cheers
Moray


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## Trough Lolly (8/9/03)

Moray,

Have you been sneaking around my cellar?  I just happen to have a tin of Coopers wheat LME handy!

I assume that you are suggesting I ditch the yeast sachet and go for the Wyeast Bavarian Lager yeast from the local homebrew shop?

I'm using the Tettnanger and some leftover EKG because the shop ran out of Hallertau


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## GSRman (8/9/03)

TL: im in canberra on the northside, and due to an eyes bigger than belly i have a bit of extra hellertau and saaz pellets, i could let you have 100gms of each for $5 each? (i think thats around what they cost me...) drop me an e-mail if you want some.. 

ive also got some light LME if you wish to bump up the gravity that way... 

drop me an e-mail if your keen..


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## Jazman (8/9/03)

i have done a partial mash and used this can it my fav and it may go into a comp so look at my old post germal lager ( another spelling mistake)

but i would use halletau with this kit it goes well and the wyeast 2206 bavarian lager goes well too so if you want the recipe i will post it


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## Gout (8/9/03)

Guys on a side issue what length of time do you wait before your lagers are good?

I normally brew, 2ndry , then cold condition for say 2 weeks, then keg and its in the fridge (4deg)

at the moment a part mash is 1 month old and tasting very very young!!! ohhh yuck watery

I normally like a min on 3 months, just wondered what every one else needs


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## Snow (9/9/03)

Ben,

I usually lager in secondary for a minimum 4 weeks, then give it 2 weeks to carbonate in the bottle before drinking. This seems to work ok for me.

- Snow


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## Gout (9/9/03)

Currently i can only "lager" outside (read dam cold at night - for about 1 more month)

i want to be able to lager it in a fridge, but in time!
main problem is having enough room to lager for4 weeks - (room for say 4 fermentors)

would being in the keg(after 2ndry 2 weeks) for 4 weeks have the same effect? or does it need to be on the yeast cake? to age


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## Trough Lolly (9/9/03)

Jazman,

Had a quick search and couldn't find your BL recipe...

Any chance you could repost it?  

The lowest I can get my primary down to in the cellar is around 16C - is that too high for Lager Yeasts? I have wine collection that will spak if I chill down the cellar - perhaps it's time to relocate the spare fridge out of the garage or drink all the wine ?! :lol: 

GSRman - Before I read your post, I managed to get some Hallertau and Saaz last nite. Thanks anyway for the offer...  

Cheers...

Rowan


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## GSRman (9/9/03)

TL: no worries


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## Gout (9/9/03)

Does Lager take longer to age than ales (not super dark / heavy high gravity ales)

because the month old lager tastes young, yet the younger ale taste great, i think it will gain better malt flavour / hops with some more age but its rather nice, much better than the part mash older brother



ponder...... Dam beer, i just cant build up stock and aging time, with summer on the way i'm in big trouble!!!!!


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## Jazman (9/9/03)

ok used 1.5kg munich malt (mashed)
1.5 kg pilsner malt (mashed)
can of coopers bavairan lager

30 grams hallertua hops for 60min 
30 grams hallertua for last 10 min of boil

wyeast 2206 bavarian lager liquid yeast


if doing a kit and kilo replace the grain with dme or lme and add extra hops

and also trolly i would still do a lager and put your fermenter in a big tray or something that hols water and fill it with water and wrap a wet towell around it it will drop the temp by a few degs


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## Trough Lolly (10/9/03)

Jazman,

Thanks for that....I have large black plastic tubs that I store the longnecks in that I reckon will hold the fermenter and a few litres of cold water so that should keep the temp down to a reasonable level. I used one of them as a baby bath for the young fella!

I couldn't resist trying my first brew using Halletau hops - they went into a draught that had been bulk primed (also another first for me) and bottled only a couple of weeks ago - it was a ripper given that its only a week or two old - carbonation was down a tad but it was pretty lively in the glass and the head stayed in place!!  I couldn't believe the difference some hops and racking the brew actually makes to the brew! 

No more kit and kilos for me! And the instructions were crap - I tossed them, along with the heating mat and made the best brew since I started this caper!!

Problem now is leaving it alone long enough to bottle condition!

Cheers,

Rowan :chug:


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## PostModern (15/9/03)

I haven't brewed for a few months now, and just started thinking about Christmas. It's time to put on your Christmas brews, people!

Now at Chrissy, lagers are basically the go. They are "light", refreshing and great to drink super cold. I reckon the premium beers of Aussie are great, but aren't really "special" enough for Christmas, so I'm going a "homebrew plus", based on the Coopers Bavarian Lager kit, which is why I'm hijacking this thread 

1 can Coopers Bavarian Lager - straight into the carboy.
Steep 250g or CaraMunich III in 750ml of 70C water for 30 mins. - strain the result into boiler.
Boil:
Caramunich wort,
1.7Kg of light LME
2L water.
Hop with 15g of Saaz Pellets for 15 mins
25g dried corriander ground for 15 mins
grated rind of 2 navel oranges 5 mins (should give it an orangey aroma)

Pour into carboy with Coopers kit then top to 23L.
Start with a 1L Saflager yeast starter.

This should give a fruity and slightly spicy lager with a nice deep amber colour. 

I plan to rack after a week @ 12-16C into secondary, then rack again once fermentation stops completely, then 1 day @ 25C and then lager the fermenter at 1-4C (whatever I can get the old fridge down to) for a month or so before bulk priming.

Any suggestions before I start the boil?


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## Gout (15/9/03)

very similar to the brew i just put down although mine is somewhat boring

coopers lager, 1.7kg + 1.7Kg of LLME, 50g carapils 40g caramber, hallertau hops for 20 min boil, + dry hop

Wyeast munich lager fermenting at 10-11 deg C. I will rack after a week, and do similar to you with respect to lager etc


Question is do you want the yeast with the beer to lager or even long secondry's?

so if i brew then 2ndry 1 week after, then when finished rack to dry hops, then after that keg and keep cold for a month. Or is it better to keep cold for a month in the 2ndry (with its yeast)



What ages beer? the yeast? or just time / cold


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## PostModern (15/9/03)

I ended up using 1/2 the corriander and I strained out the grated rind after the boil. I wasn't quite as adventurous as I planned. I made up the volume to just under 25 litres for an OG of 1.046

As for aging, I think it's best for the beer to lager away from it's trub, which is why I'm racking after secondary fermentation. There should be enough yeast in suspension to handle carbonation later (I'll be bottling not kegging). I'm usure of yeast's role during lagering. Anyone?


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## Trough Lolly (15/9/03)

Well, I'm not a Lager Guru, but from what I've read the yeast assists in removing the sulphur smell and associated compounds from the wort. The yeast turns a rotten egg smelling lager into hopefully something that is clean, clear and crisp on the palate.  

Of course, the yeast plays an important role in conditioning the lager, but so too does the malts that are used and the temperature in which the wort is left to condition in. 

John Palmer's book has a good section on yeasts and Lagering here...

This article written in 1997 from the BYO website is also a good read on Lagers.

Cheers,

Rowan :chug:


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## PostModern (17/9/03)

I'd always assumed that the yeast went dormant during lagering and the acidity of the beer lent it's hand at conditioning. Palmer thinks differently, so I have to change my view


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## Gout (17/9/03)

looked at the artical online and its very interesting

never knew about the keg fermenting with 10 PSI (any one know the point?)

Looks like i need another fridge and about 6 more kegs to have for lagering 

I'll brew for 1 week, then 2ndry for 1 week, diactyl for 2-3 days then keg and cool and store cold for 4 weeks (or as long as i can last)


From this i gather i need (ome of you have)

a fridge to control fermenting temps 

a fridge to CC your beers

and a fridge to have kegs in for tap beer...

ohhh its not going to be a happy house when i pull 2 more fridges home


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## Trough Lolly (18/9/03)

Ben,

I'd get an another fridge to keep the glasses chilled, too!!  

Your visitors will think they've walked into Hardly Normal!

TL


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## Gout (18/9/03)

Then i will need one for the food 

I have a test running at the moment for brewing in using a home made peltier device cooler but i dont think it will have the power to keep a exothermic brew cool enough.

It may be ok to keep kegs CC (dont think it will get it down to 4deg though.......

what and see when the tests are done. Its only been on 20 min


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## Trough Lolly (4/10/03)

Put down the Bav Lager yesterday arvo - yeah, took the day off to brew!!  

For those interested, here are some notes:

Ingredients:
1.7Kg Coopers Bavarian Lager kit into fermenter
1 Kg Coopers Liquid Extra Pale Malt Extract for small boil (6L)
125g Barrett Burston Crystal Malt 140EBC (steeped)
W3470 SAFLAGER Dry Yeast (for yeast starter)
Hallertau Plugs for bittering and finishing

Sterilised everything!

No major issues with cookup, but this morning there is little activity - I did get a good yeast starter going, in fact it looked like a cappucino at 20C!! but the brew is now around the 18C mark and no krausen yet - perhaps its a bit too warm despite the yeast kicking in the cup at 20C??

Airlock shows displacement, but not going berserk yet - will check again this evening to see if I need to perhaps pitch some more lager yeast and chill the fermenter down a bit further. I won't rush this (or any other) lager - it's like brewing in slow motion!!  

Question: I did strain the crystal malt, but left the plugs in the primary, ie, I didn't strain the wort out of the boiler into the fermenter. I did this once before with a Kilkenny clone and it worked beautifully. Is this non-straining the reason why the krausen is slow to form?? :blink: 

I hope to keep in primary for a couple of weeks, rack to secondary for a couple of weeks then bulk prime and bottle. 

SG was 1040 - a touch lighter than expected.

Cheers,

TL


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## Trough Lolly (2/11/03)

Update on Brewing:

Primary Fermentation - 9 Days.

Racked to secondary fermenter for cold conditioning at 6C for 3 weeks.

Bulk Primed (155g Dextrose) and cold bottled yesterday. FG - 1010.

Taste Test: Very clear golden hue with a fragrant, crisp palate already present. Hallertau hops were there but not as overpowering as was the case when I sampled before lagering. The grains have given the lager added depth and mouthfeel without making the lager too "thick" on the tongue. Very good finish - the mild tang of bitterness at the start of the mouthful will smooth out even further with bottle conditioning and cellar storage over summer (17C) or as long as they remain untouched  .

IMHO - This is a very good result from a kit beer - the W3470 Saflager yeast, Crystal Malt and Hallertau plugs have turned an ordinary kit beer into one of my best lagers!

Currently fermenting - GMK Australian Draught for the summer barbies. A London Porter is next on the list...between feeds for the new addition to the family and getting Mum and bub out of hospital!!

Cheers,

TL
:chug:


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## Trough Lolly (1/12/03)

It is now nearly two months since I brewed this beer.

Had a couple of bottles over the weekend and it is developing very well. Next time I will substitute more grain and less malt extract. The hops are balancing out very nicely, but I would prefer a maltier taste - perhaps some more xtal malt or maybe a mini mash with some Munich Grains? The bulk conditioning helped the whole brew develop rather than taking the green beer straight into the bottles.

Anyway, it's a hell of a lot better than the first time I made this kit brew with 1kg of Dextrose and no additional hops a few years ago!

Cheers,

TL


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## Jovial_Monk (1/12/03)

A long lag time is not necessarily a bad thing, means the yeastie beasties are multiplying, ensuring you of a strong complete ferment.

If the lag is over 24 hours, try running the wort into a second fermenter, with aeration, and I bet this will kick the yeast into action quickly.

I had this trouble with an IPA, no sign of any krausen forming at all. Put a heating belt around the fermenter to warm the wort to ale temps, no result. A hydrometer sample I had, transferred from sample jar to a cup and back to sample jar a couple of times, 1" of foan in the sample jar next morning. Dropped the IPA in the fermenter, soon had a very healthy krausen.





Jovial Monk


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