# Drinking water hose for brewing?



## carniebrew (10/2/15)

From this Saturday (Feb 14), Aldi have 20m of food grade hose for $24.99: https://www.aldi.com.au/en/special-buys/saturday-14-february-2015/saturday-detail-wk-7/ps/p/20m-drinking-water-hose/ 

The same length Pope branded one is $40 on the Bunnings website: http://www.bunnings.com.au/pope-drinking-water-hose-20-m-1011402_p3130595


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## GoodDuck (10/2/15)

carniebrew said:


> From this Saturday (Feb 14), Aldi have 20m of food grade hose for $24.99: https://www.aldi.com.au/en/special-buys/saturday-14-february-2015/saturday-detail-wk-7/ps/p/20m-drinking-water-hose/
> 
> The same length Pope branded one is $40 on the Bunnings website: http://www.bunnings.com.au/pope-drinking-water-hose-20-m-1011402_p3130595


It says "2mm diameter hose" - I'm assuming that is a typo.


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## stux (10/2/15)

I bought a reel of that style "water hose" from bunnings. The water tasted of plastic, even after a few days soaking/clearing etc. Might be because I was using it for hot water, but still.

This stuff from clark rubber was the go, rated for food/water applications at up to 60C, and up to 250psi.

http://www.clarkrubber.com.au/clear-reinforced-hose.html

I use this for filling my brewday water requirements. And the water comes straight out of a gas instant heater.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (10/2/15)

Shit i havent tasted my water and I put hot water at 60C through the blue potable water hose from my gas instant heater.... eek!


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## sp0rk (11/2/15)

carniebrew said:


> From this Saturday (Feb 14), Aldi have 20m of food grade hose for $24.99: https://www.aldi.com.au/en/special-buys/saturday-14-february-2015/saturday-detail-wk-7/ps/p/20m-drinking-water-hose/
> 
> The same length Pope branded one is $40 on the Bunnings website: http://www.bunnings.com.au/pope-drinking-water-hose-20-m-1011402_p3130595


Arse, I paid $20 for 10 meters from bunnings a few weeks ago 




Stux said:


> I bought a reel of that style "water hose" from bunnings. The water tasted of plastic, even after a few days soaking/clearing etc. Might be because I was using it for hot water, but still.
> 
> This stuff from clark rubber was the go, rated for food/water applications at up to 60C, and up to 250psi.
> 
> ...


I ran ambient temp water through a heat exchanger for a couple of hours to rinse first (the pope hose from bunnings),then filled my brew kettle with it afterwards (through a caravan carbon filter), tasted fine to me, might have been luck of the draw


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## DJ_L3ThAL (11/2/15)

I'll check mine and confirm, the specs say it is suitable for hot water use...


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## technobabble66 (11/2/15)

Specs also say it's PVC, which generally leaves a plasticky taste. 
However I'd be keen if others reckon they can rinse it out and provide clean tasting water.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (11/2/15)

Ahh, sounds like I need to experiment for the good of brewin! My hose has probably had 5 cold water and 12 hot water brew days through it, haven't noticed anything in the finished beer but I haven't tasted the brewing water. I am still in the realm of ignorance pretending there is no need to adjust my water for brews....... Hah!

Side note I've always "drained" the hose after each brew as I roll it up elevated to where I brew so the water inside simply drains out.... But have wondered if the moisture that is left will eventually create scum/algae/mold in the hose when stored? Would it be better to leave the hose full of water when rolling up?


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## technobabble66 (11/2/15)

Aah right. That sounds promising if you've put that many thru it already.

Fwiw, I'd keep the hose drained and dry. All bugs/fungi need food and water to live. If you deny the water part you'll minimize the risk of bugs growing in your hose while stored. Though I'd flush it out before you use it in case crawlies have hidden in there. Once drained, slight air movement thru the hose should hopefully continue to fully dry it over time. 
2c


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## DJ_L3ThAL (11/2/15)

technobabble66 said:


> Aah right. That sounds promising if you've put that many thru it already.
> 
> Fwiw, I'd keep the hose drained and dry. All bugs/fungi need food and water to live. If you deny the water part you'll minimize the risk of bugs growing in your hose while stored. Though I'd flush it out before you use it in case crawlies have hidden in there. Once drained, slight air movement thru the hose should hopefully continue to fully dry it over time.
> 2c


Yeah that's what I figured and why I drain it and leave the valve open, but figure the walls would remain wet, would be difficult to get enough air flow through that without some external fan or air compressor (then there's issues with oils in the air anyway).... As I take hot water from my instantaneous gas heater I run that until at full heat and then for another 30secs or so before commencing brewing (I save that water as clean up water with PBW)....

I'll still pour myself a glass of hot water to drink prior to next brew to smell and taste it, I expect it's alright


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## nosco (12/2/15)

I use one of these caravan carbon water filters with some brass fittings and my Bunnings drinking water hose and the water taste's great. A lot better than out of the tap but I only use cold water.


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## carniebrew (12/2/15)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Shit i havent tasted my water and I put hot water at 60C through the blue potable water hose from my gas instant heater.... eek!


I checked with Pope, they told me not to use it for hot water, the hose is rated for up to 40C only.


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## technobabble66 (12/2/15)

Bloody carniebrew. 
Fancy going off and getting the answer like that. Humph!! Spoilt a good 2 pages of discussion right there. 
Should be reported!!


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## gezzanet (12/2/15)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Shit i havent tasted my water and I put hot water at 60C through the blue potable water hose from my gas instant heater.... eek!


I do exactly the same gas heated water 66deg with blue tube. Maybe have to rethink that one mmmm


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## DJ_L3ThAL (12/2/15)

Thanks carnie! I'm emailing Pope about Bunnings false advertising that it is suitable for hot water use. Will report back!


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## carniebrew (12/2/15)

technobabble66 said:


> Bloody carniebrew.
> Fancy going off and getting the answer like that. Humph!! Spoilt a good 2 pages of discussion right there.
> Should be reported!!


http://www.gotwavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=MP3S&type=Movies&movie=Dragnet&quote=facts.txt&file=facts.mp3


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## thuperman (12/2/15)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Thanks carnie! I'm emailing Pope about Bunnings false advertising that it is suitable for hot water use. Will report back!


Would you consider 40 degrees hot? How hot is the water from an average kitchen hot water tap? I've never measured it.


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## stux (12/2/15)

thuperman said:


> Would you consider 40 degrees hot? How hot is the water from an average kitchen hot water tap? I've never measured it.


50C plus.


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## TSMill (12/2/15)

Per Australian Standards, 60 degrees minimum in the unit itself, and tempered to a maximum of 50 degrees at fixtures in residential appliactions.


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## thuperman (12/2/15)

Definitely would not consider 40C to be classified hot in that case.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (12/2/15)

Instantaneous units can put out 50C and most do because they don't store water and no chance of growth which is the intent of 60C plus. I have a 60C enviro unit, no thermostatic valve so I can get 60C ish into my hose. Have shot off an email to Pope so will see if they can enlighten us whether Bunnings have incorrect info or the hoses are in fact ok for "hot water"


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## sp0rk (12/2/15)

If pope are communicating with us, we should totally persuade them into doing something for the homebrew market...
A decently priced all rounder hose that can do 90°C+, withstand pumping and doesn't contribute flavour


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## carniebrew (12/2/15)

Wouldn't it just be silicon hose, which you can buy now?

I smell a silicon hose bulk buy, someone call Yob!


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## stux (12/2/15)

Is it not time for a kindly mod to split this thread off into its own topic from this post?


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## stux (12/2/15)

carniebrew said:


> Wouldn't it just be silicon hose, which you can buy now?


un-reinforced Silicon tubing is not very pretty at mains level pressures...

Burst rating of about 100kpa at 21C


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## DJ_L3ThAL (12/2/15)

Got a reply from Pope.

Thank you for your email.

I have spoken with our Product people, they are saying the drinking water hose is only tested up to 40 degrees. They would not recommend this to be used with a higher temperature. Please return the hose back to the store of purchase for refund.

I have notified our marketing crew and they will change this on their website ASAP, thank you for letting us know.


Ive asked if they have another suitable product. If not i guess its off to bunnings for a refund and clarke rubber for a suitable hose...
Should ask them to pay for all the batches of beer i SHOULD, but wont, throw out.


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## stux (1/3/15)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Got a reply from Pope.
> Thank you for your email.
> I have spoken with our Product people, they are saying the drinking water hose is only tested up to 40 degrees. They would not recommend this to be used with a higher temperature. Please return the hose back to the store of purchase for refund.
> I have notified our marketing crew and they will change this on their website ASAP, thank you for letting us know.
> ...


Cool. Wonder if I can get a refund too. Got a useless blue hose in the shed 

Won't be able to find the receipt though


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## carniebrew (1/3/15)

All the right noises from those involved, yet weeks later Bunnings still have "Yes" next to "Hot Water Use": http://www.bunnings.com.au/pope-drinking-water-hose-20-m-1011402_p3130595


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## stux (1/3/15)

What incentive do they actually have to care? Will sell more blue hoses this way.


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## superstock (1/3/15)

Easier to placate you with money back...... there is 100+ others who won't winge.


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## peas_and_corn (2/3/15)

I think it's more likely that the person who gave the refund didn't tell anyone the reasons and so the information didn't go up the chain.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (2/3/15)

Still haven't taken my hose back (haven't even brewed this year :S)... Am planning on getting a Clarke rubber or similar hose... Question though, what about the hose fittings? I currently have the grey and orange Pope type plastic hose fittings to click fit onto my hot water tap inside and then the other end has a plastic ball valve also Pope grey and orange plastic type. Guessing they are not suitable for hot water and maybe not even drinking water use?


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## DJ_L3ThAL (2/3/15)

I poked for another response from Pope and got one today:


[SIZE=11pt]The hose has been tested against the following standards:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]AS/NZS 4020 - Testing of products for use in contact with drinking water. Testing conducted up to 65[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]o[/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]C. This covers the chemical leeching, micro-organism growth etc.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]AS/NZS2620.1 Domestic Garden Hose – Reinforced Hose. This standard covers pressure testing & construction of the hose. This standard covers pressure testing up to 40oC. Therefore we know the hose is safe under pressure, up to 1200kpa, at 40oC. We cannot guarantee the hose above this temperature. Whilst the Drinking water hose is not specifically a garden hose (and could be argued that it falls outside of the scope of this standard), this standard is the most relevant standard to test against.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]As the lesser of the standards only tests to 40oC, this is the maximum temperature we can recommend.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]The garden hose fittings have been tested to the same 1200kPa @40oC standard. They have not been tested above this temperature, and as an irrigation product, are not specified as a food grade material.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Hope this information [/SIZE][SIZE=11pt]helps.[/SIZE]


I'm satisfied to continue using this hose I think, it's tested for leeching etc above what temperature I supply through the hose and given mains pressure water would only be around 600kPa (I think?) the risk of rupture of the hose is minimal. I'm always around when it is in use too so no risk of it bursting and flooding anything.

As for the fittings, I can probably get some metal (brass?) fittings from bunnings that are for potable water and use instead of the plastic, but the small amount of contact with the small fittings might not even be worth the bother?

Thoughts?


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## TheWiggman (2/3/15)

That hose is fine then. The first standard listed confirms it is safe for drinking with temps up to 65°C. The second standard consists of a pressure test which the first does not, so to apply a pressure rating you have to take into consideration the max temp for that test. 1200 kPa is shitloads, most mains pressures are around 300-450 kPa, but can get beyond 600 kPa. That's a problem that could be easily solved with a PRV, but then we're not talking bargains any more.


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## stux (2/3/15)

1200kpa does happen to some unlucky people 'luckily' I only get 100-150 kpa here

I use brass garden fittings. 

They're brass. brass is used in the potable water plumbing


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## jc64 (2/3/15)

Listen to this at 24:36.....http://ec.libsyn.com/p/d/4/a/d4ab1ff10e2b417b/bbr02-27-14toxicology3.mp3?d13a76d516d9dec20c3d276ce028ed5089ab1ce3dae902ea1d06ca8234d1ca5d53af&c_id=6889047

No other discussion required. I use a blue hose though.......


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## stux (3/3/15)

jc64 said:


> Listen to this at 24:36.....http://ec.libsyn.com/p/d/4/a/d4ab1ff10e2b417b/bbr02-27-14toxicology3.mp3?d13a76d516d9dec20c3d276ce028ed5089ab1ce3dae902ea1d06ca8234d1ca5d53af&c_id=6889047
> 
> No other discussion required. I use a blue hose though.......


Interesting podcast. Worth pointing out they're discussing toxicology, not flavour contributions.


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## Eagleburger (3/3/15)

$20 is a small price.


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## jc64 (3/3/15)

Stux said:


> Interesting podcast. Worth pointing out they're discussing toxicology, not flavour contributions.


That's right. I was really responding to the OP's thread title, in homebrewing I think it's easy to start losing a bit of perspective in relation to what is crucial vs what is best practice. I know I've been guilty of debating 6 grams or 7 grams of gypsum before. 

I was in my caravan this past weekend and when I hooked up my drinking hose I wondered whether or not the hose fittings were 'food grade drinking water safe' as well? Could have a market there, same fittings, but charge more and say it's a 'drinking water fitting'


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## bluc (26/5/16)

Hey all I bought one of the bunnings hoses and the water stunk of plastic, so I returned it. I then bought a hoselink hose and while better than the pope it still has a plastic taste. (Hose looks identical to the pope one). Seen mention of caravan charcoal filters,wondering do they work to remove the plastic taste? Also would type of hose do people use for the last few meters to avoid plastic taste? Thanks in advance.


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## slcmorro (26/5/16)

I use a regular old garden hose that sits outside when not in use anyway. Never had any issue, no-one has ever made comment about it and several beers have been tasted by professional brewers and won a handful of awards.


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## angus_grant (26/5/16)

I just run water through my garden hose for 2 or 3 minutes to get rid of the old water first.


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## Curly79 (26/5/16)

Hey bluc. I wouldn't use any green garden hoses at all. I had the same problem years ago. I couldn't figure out why the water out of my camper trailer tasted so bad untill I realised it was the hose I was filling it with. Use the potable water hoses or caravan water hose. Normally white and blue.


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