# Belgian Wit



## troydo (22/10/07)

This is the first recipe i have "designed" i have looked at a few other wit recipes and came up with this combo, anyone have any thoughts?

I know you do!!

Troy

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Ho'Garden
Brewer: Troy
Asst Brewer: 
Style: Witbier
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0) 

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 25.00 L 
Boil Size: 33.87 L
Estimated OG: 1.047 SG
Estimated Color: 3.9 SRM
Estimated IBU: 14.2 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.0 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
2.50 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 42.0 % 
2.00 kg Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 33.6 % 
1.00 kg Wheat Malt, Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 16.8 % 
0.25 kg Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) Grain 4.2 % 
0.20 kg Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 3.4 % 
18.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (60 min) Hops 9.5 IBU 
18.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (15 min) Hops 4.7 IBU 
18.00 gm Saaz [4.00%] (0 min) Hops - 
12.00 gm Coriander Seed (Boil 5.0 min) Misc  
18.00 gm Orange Peel, Bitter (Boil 5.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs Belgian Wit Ale (White Labs #WLP400) Yeast-Wheat 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 5.95 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temp Step Time 
Mash In Add 15.53 L of water at 72.4 C 66.0 C 90 min


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## bconnery (22/10/07)

I'd say you've hit heaps of the ticks there really. 
Raw wheat in some form in a good amount. 
Good hop variety choice. 
Good amounts of coriander and bitter orange. 
The coriander is actually on the low side as to what I have read is recommended but many people start that way. The rate I have read is closer to 1gm per Litre of finished beer. 

I think you'll find that is a very nice beer.


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## ozpowell (22/10/07)

Troydo said:


> This is the first recipe i have "designed" i have looked at a few other wit recipes and came up with this combo, anyone have any thoughts?
> 
> I know you do!!
> 
> ...




I've now made two of these puppies. In my first, I only added about 20g of orange peel (in 28L). It was noticable, but not as much as I had hoped. So, in my second one I added about 50g. Obviously, this is very much a personal choice. Still conditioning the second one at the moment, but all indications are that amount is about right for what I'm looking for.

I also include some Chamomile in my Wits. Learned this from the TBN Jamil show Wit special.

I usually add around 750g of Oats for a nice silky mouthfeel and not so much Munich (~2%). Another thing I learned from the Jamil Wit special was to throw in a little acidulated malt (~2.5%), just to lend a little support to the citrusy zing of the style.

Probably the only other thing I'd suggest is to perhaps include a 30min Protein rest at around 50-55 C.

Make sure you have a blow-off as wit yeast is pretty messy (and slooow - allow 2 weeks in primary).

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Michael


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## andrewg (22/10/07)

I wouldn't use any Munich in a wit as this style is not malt-driven.
But would increase the coriander to 20-25g but make sure you use Indian variety and just crack it - don't grind to a powder as this will give lots of phenolics that will take ages to mellow out.
Otherwise looks good - witbier is a great style, enjoy!
cheers
HStB


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## beersom (22/10/07)

Looks like a very good recipe, but personally I would drop the munich malt and the last hop addition.
I also agree with Ben in regards to upping the coriander seed slightly.

Witbiers are awesome at this time of year.... or any other time of year.


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## troydo (22/10/07)

thanks for the responses, i will bump the corriander and orange up to 20g, id prefer it to be a little bland than undrinkably strong.


what do you think about didtching the munic and adding that amount more oats?


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## DarkFaerytale (22/10/07)

i'v never tryed munich in any of my wits either, might think about it in the next one for something different

i added a very very small amount of cummin to my last wit along with the corriander and thought that gave it something a little bit extra, i'v tryed chamomile a few times as well but not brewed with it, comes out good as long as you don't use to much. less is sometimes more with this style

as for the corriander cook it on the stove (or other hot plate ie. HLT/mash tun) for a little bit befor adding it to your brew to really release some of those aromatic oils

i love witbier  

-Phill


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## Weizguy (22/10/07)

I'd recommend that you ditch the Munich and substitute acidulated (0.2 kg). Dunno about the wheat malt, as I'd use pils and flaked wheat only, but you'd still make a mighty nice beer.

I suggest that you browse the web to read a little Witbier history. Believe it or not, it will help you make better beer.

From here (by me):
"peel was used to supplement the bitterness, which we do not need coz we aren't being excessively rorted for the price of the hops, unlike the Belgians of old, and we can afford enough hops for bittering, Also, the coriander was added to supplement the hop flavour for the same reason. The unmalted oats and wheat were added to produce fermentables due to the price of the malt at the time. History lesson endeth."

So, you can see that Witbier is a good beer for Australian conditions, as we are also masters of the "make-do" attitude.

I prefer a little more corianader for aroma and flavour (2 additions) and less finishing hop (as it's prob not too authentic, and may overpower the spices). As I said before, it will still make a nice beer, but maybe a little less authentic or less balanced.
I have also made one of these babies with some sour mashed malt, which aded s ome nice tartness.

Oh, and don't ferment too warm or you'll get too much phenolic character, and you'll regret it for a while, as you stuggle to polish off the funky brew. Been there, done that. Check the recommended temp for your yeast.

Seth out


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## troydo (22/10/07)

Flaked wheat and flaked oats... 

surely they can be bought from the supermarket? or are they something different to rolled oats? and where would you find flaked wheat?

Thanks Troy


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## ozpowell (22/10/07)

Looks like your going to end up with 45-50% unmalted wheat and oats. With that amount of unmodified grain, I'd recommend doing a protein rest or your efficiency may suffer.


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## troydo (22/10/07)

i know im sposed to do a protein rest , how do i do that if i dont have a heated tun? can i do that with batch sparging?


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## Ross (22/10/07)

Troydo said:


> Flaked wheat and flaked oats...
> 
> surely they can be bought from the supermarket? or are they something different to rolled oats? and where would you find flaked wheat?
> 
> Thanks Troy



Rolled (flaked) oats from the supermarket - Flaked wheat available through at least one of the sponsors B) 

Cheers Ross


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## Ross (22/10/07)

ozpowell said:


> Looks like your going to end up with 45-50% unmalted wheat and oats. With that amount of unmodified grain, I'd recommend doing a protein rest or your efficiency may suffer.



He's using flaked wheat - converts fine without a protein rest  Edit: Substitute the Pils for Galaxy if you are at all worried - would be my preference anyway.


Cheers Ross


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## troydo (22/10/07)

Done cheers Ross, 

PS you'll get my order in a week or 2 

Troy


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## troydo (22/10/07)

rice hulls?


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## DarkFaerytale (22/10/07)

there not really needed IMO, but if your worried use 250g

-Phill


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## troydo (23/10/07)

Ok i ditched the munich and took some of lez's advice and reduced the last hop addition a little. i also increased the coriander and orange. i replaced the 0.2kg of munich with 0.2kg of oats:

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
2.50 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 42.0 % 
2.00 kg Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 33.6 % 
1.00 kg Wheat Malt, Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 16.8 % 
0.45 kg Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) Grain 7.6 % 
18.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (60 min) Hops 9.5 IBU 
18.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (15 min) Hops 4.7 IBU 
15.00 gm Saaz [4.00%] (0 min) Hops - 
20.00 gm Coriander Seed (Boil 5.0 min) Misc 
20.00 gm Orange Peel, Bitter (Boil 5.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs Belgian Wit Ale (White Labs #WLP400) Yeast-Wheat

total 5.95kg grain

also ross what do you reccomend you ferment the belgian ale yeast you have at? the temp range says 15-24 i was thinking 18?


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## Ross (23/10/07)

Troydo said:


> also ross what do you reccomend you ferment the belgian ale yeast you have at? the temp range says 15-24 i was thinking 18?



I'd be fermenting at it's upper limit to get the full character of the yeast. i wouldn't be using in a wit though, unless that's the character you want. S-33 or K-97 would be more to style for a wit.

cheers Ross


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## troydo (23/10/07)

any preference Ross?


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## andrewg (23/10/07)

I've found K-97 works very well in a wit - just rehydrate it and aerate the wort well before pitching
cheers
HStB


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## Randall the Enamel Animal (23/10/07)

Caution with WLP400: make sure it's in good shape as it'll throw a ton of ester, especially banana (which isn't a good look for wit), if it's struggling. Grow up a starter if in doubt. 400 does not travel well.


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## troydo (23/10/07)

yep will be changing yeasts to one of the 2 that Ross suggested


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## troywhite (23/10/07)

wow glad I read this thread, I was thinking of trying a Wit next and was going to use a WLP400.

Another question, and apologies for thread hijacking but, what exactly is "flaked wheat"? And where do you get it?
I assumed flaked oats are just like good ol' uncle toby's?

Edit: Oooops should have read the first page of the thread. Ross already answered my question


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## troydo (23/10/07)

Getting mine from ross


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## Ross (23/10/07)

Troydo said:


> any preference Ross?



Never tried the K-97 in a Wit so can't comment. But used the S-33 & was very happy with the results.

Cheers Ross


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## troydo (23/10/07)

SOLD!  cheers again ross


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## AndrewQLD (23/10/07)

The Whitelabs WLP410 Belgian Wit II is a really great wit yeast, ferments very well, it's much less phenolic than WLP400 and is slightly more spicy, and it clears well too. This is my yeast of choice for a true Wit.
For my mind the S-33 finishes too clean and attenuates too much and lacks the spicyness required.

Cheers
Andrew


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## Ross (23/10/07)

AndrewQLD said:


> The Whitelabs WLP410 Belgian Wit II is a really great wit yeast, ferments very well, it's much less phenolic than WLP400 and is slightly more spicy, and it clears well too. This is my yeast of choice for a true Wit.
> For my mind the S-33 finishes too clean and attenuates too much and lacks the spicyness required.
> 
> Cheers
> Andrew



I agree, use a liquid if you want the best Wit possible. The S-33 would still be my pick of the dry yeasts though & makes a pretty good drop.

Cheers Ross


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## bconnery (23/10/07)

I wouldn't have picked it myself but Chad's Wit from the case swap used k97 and it worked very well...


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## amita (23/10/07)

Ross said:


> I agree, use a liquid if you want the best Wit possible. The S-33 would still be my pick of the dry yeasts though & makes a pretty good drop.
> 
> Cheers Ross



friends, the Wit is the next on my list too.My recepie is an extract one,this recepie comes from a mate , he suggest the following:

Grain: steeped at 67 degrees for 50 minutes( sparged into fermenter as much as I can with a siff)
250g Cara Malt
250g Munich Malt
400g Wheat Malt

Malt:boil for 10 min (including fermentables)
1.5l Wheat Malt 
1.5l Light Malt
2.0l Glucose

Fermentables:
800g Dextrose
1500g Malto Dextrine



Hops: @ 60 min
70g Kent Goldings
40g Saaz

@ 75 min
40g kent Goldings
40g Saaz
15g Corriander Seeds
10g Cummin Seeds


Zest of 3 Seville Oranges( homemade dried) added to fermenter

the yeast was suggested as Wyeast 3944 Belgian wit

this is for a 50 liter brew.

any suggestions appreciated
cheers amita


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## AndrewQLD (23/10/07)

Wits are not hop driven, I would stick with the EKG for the 60 minute additions and don't go much higher than 20 IBU total. To be honest I really don't think Saaz has a place in a Wit. Do you really need the malto dextrine? that's going to give you a very full bodied beer.
I have not done a partial in about 20 yrs so others may be better suited to advise you on the grains.
Don't forget the orange peel should be added in the last 5 minutes of the boil, it's essential.
However you do it your sure to love a Wit.

Cheers
Andrew


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