# When & How to start a Wyeast Smack Pack



## Blitzer (8/8/13)

Hey, so I'm going to throw down a Dr Smurto Landlord this weekend. I have hopefully a very newbie question, it is my first time using liquid yeast. 

How long before my brew do I smack the wyeast smack pack? Also at what temperature do I keep it at during that time between smacking and pitching?

I read the back of the pack mentions 21-24c though I have also read smacking 24+ hours in advance, would it be fine to leave it at those temps for that long?

Thanks Ya'll!


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## warra48 (8/8/13)

Smack it and leave it at room temperature. It will be fine like that until you do your brew, for at least a week. No need to fret over it.

I smack mine up to a week before a brew, but I also build it up into a starter to increase the volume of my yeast.


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## Blitzer (8/8/13)

mm yeah no equipment for a starter. I'll smack it at least tomorrow night and leave it at room temp then, brewing on Sunday.


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## dammag (8/8/13)

I brewed a Dr Smurto's landlord recently and it is a great brew.

I did a 14L batch and pitched the smack pack that I smacked that morning. So about 10 hours smacking to pitching. The smack pack was only 2 weeks old.

I saved some of the slurry in some 300mL water bottles and used these in subsequent brews. The bigger beers with starters. I just make my starters in an old 2L port bottle. Ghetto Erlenmeyer flask.


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## gap (8/8/13)

If you already have the yeast I would smack it now.


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## Mclovin (8/8/13)

You only need a 3ltr juice bottle, one small funnel, some gladwrap a rubber band and sanitiser. So easy...


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## Blitzer (8/8/13)

Smack it tonight you think? I can do that.

Mclovin: So you just make some wort sterilise the bottle (plastic?) add the yeast and leave it at room temp? Do you stir it at all? I always hear people requiring stir plates etc..


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## gap (8/8/13)

If I just put the starter into a sterilized PET bottle , soft drink bottle, I put. the lid on the bottle and shake it whenever I walk past the bottle.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

Mclovin said:


> You only need a 3ltr juice bottle, one small funnel, some gladwrap a rubber band and sanitiser. So easy...


Thats all I have ever used for starters.


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## Ross (8/8/13)

Blitzer,

If the manufacture date is within the last 2 months, smack the pack on Saturday morning for pitching Sunday. No need to stress with making starters.
Just leave at room temp & give it a good shake before opening & pitching. 

Cheers Ross


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## slash22000 (8/8/13)

Blitzer said:


> Do you stir it at all? I always hear people requiring stir plates etc..


You don't need a stirplate to make a starter, but you get much better results if you do have one. If you don't have a stir plate, give your starter a good shake/swirl every time you walk past it. It won't be as effective as a stirplate but it will be much more effective than just adding the yeast pack directly.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

gap said:


> If I just put the starter into a sterilized PET bottle , soft drink bottle, I put. the lid on the bottle and shake it whenever I walk past the bottle.


Yep. Make shure you loosen the cap to allow the CO2 to escape or you will end up with a fire extinguisher.

Make your starter wort about SG 1020


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## Parks (8/8/13)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Make your starter wort about SG 1020


?

Everything I have ever read says to make your starters 1040


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## donburke (8/8/13)

Parks said:


> ?
> 
> Everything I have ever read says to make your starters 1040


for a normal gravity beer that is correct, 1.040 starter

for a 1.100 beer use a 1.060 starter


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## slash22000 (8/8/13)

donburke said:


> for a 1.100 beer use a 1.060 starter


I thought that starters were recommended to be ~1.040 OG to avoid stressing the yeast? Correct me if I'm wrong.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

You want 1020. This gives a low alc% which stresses the yeast less especially in storage.

Think of it this way. You get a better starter from Coopers Mild than Coopers Sparkling.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> I thought that starters were recommended to be ~1.040 OG to avoid stressing the yeast? Correct me if I'm wrong.


Dont forget you are pitching into wort that has O% alc


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

donburke said:


> for a normal gravity beer that is correct, 1.040 starter
> 
> for a 1.100 beer use a 1.060 starter


It is the amount of yeast you need for big beers, not the alc strength of the starter


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## Mclovin (8/8/13)

Blitzer said:


> Smack it tonight you think? I can do that.
> 
> Mclovin: So you just make some wort sterilise the bottle (plastic?) add the yeast and leave it at room temp? Do you stir it at all? I always hear people requiring stir plates et


For dried yeast I always make a starter, I use LDME and water boiled in a sauspan and chilled in the sink to 21C, then pour it into the bottle with the yeast and stir every so often.

My latest starter bottle is a 3 ltr OJ bottle i have a hole in the screw cap with a grommet and air lock fitted. When not in use I fill the bottle with starsan and store. 

The smack packs are more designed to give a professional brewery pitching rate with 19 ltrs of standard ale wort, so batch size is an important factor. No real need to make a starter if you are brewing 19 ltrs.


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## GalBrew (8/8/13)

There is no need to make a starter with dry yeast either.


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## slash22000 (8/8/13)

You've got it backwards mate. You don't need a starter with dry yeast, but you do with liquid yeast (most of the time). That whole "professional brewery pitching rate" line Wyeast spruik is bullcrap.

Also, don't put an airlock on your starter, that defeats the purpose, it needs to be oxygenated.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> That whole "professional brewery pitching rate" line Wyeast spruik is bullcrap.
> .


You just cant help yourself can you


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## Mclovin (8/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> You've got it backwards mate. You don't need a starter with dry yeast, but you do with liquid yeast (most of the time). That whole "professional brewery pitching rate" line Wyeast spruik is bullcrap.
> 
> Also, don't put an airlock on your starter, that defeats the purpose, it needs to be oxygenated.


Thanks for the info, why would they lie.......


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## GalBrew (8/8/13)

Here we go again......


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## slash22000 (8/8/13)

Oh Christ, I forgot.

Disregard previous comment, pitch whatever you want whenever you want.


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## brewbienewbie (8/8/13)

I use a soft drink bottle for starters, I leave it sitting next to the fan outlet on my laptop to keep warm and give it a swirl every now and then, it seems to work pretty well. When it comes to pitching the starter though, does anyone wait till the slurry has settled out and decant off the liquid? I think Palmer says that's the best way to do it, but I'm never organised enough to make a starter that far in advance. I always end up chucking the whole lot in while it's still at high krausen.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

As long as your starter is neutral then not a prob. High krausen is the best time to pitch


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## Camo6 (8/8/13)

For your first time using a liquid yeast Blitzer it's best to keep it simple. Follow Ross' advice if the pack is recent and has been stored well. If you're not sure about it's viability allow an extra day or more and keep some dry yeast for backup if it fails to swell. Be sure to sanitise the pack and scissors and mix the contents well before you pitch.
Sure you could do a starter but for your first time the KISS principle works fine. No point chancing infection or yeast stress by adding steps you're not prepared for and ruining a batch. In between brews try building up some test starters with the dregs of a coopers or two. There's a few guides around on this. Taste the starters and gain some confidence in what tastes fine and what doesn't. My first CPA starter turned a nice ESB kit into a glass of cloves and would have been tossed if I'd tasted the starter first. This put me off liquids for a while till I had the confidence to try again.

We _could_ start another thread about the merits of starters, quantities of yeast and SG of starter wort or we could just answer Blitzer's question.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

Camo6 said:


> We _could_ start another thread about the merits of starters, quantities of yeast and SG of starter wort or we could just answer Blitzer's question.


I vote the latter


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## surly (8/8/13)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> I vote the latter


This has been an interesting read. Makes me realise there are debates within debates that I have missed.
Nothing is ever simple is it?


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## Camo6 (8/8/13)

surly said:


> This has been an interesting read. Makes me realise there are debates within debates that I have missed.
> Nothing is ever simple is it?


Depends if you believe Carlton Draught adds I spose...


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## jaypes (8/8/13)

If its new yeast then smack it an pour the lot in

If its a bit old make a starter, if you cant then just use it anyway. Your wort will ferment but you want to get the yeast working as efficient as possible.


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## donburke (8/8/13)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> It is the amount of yeast you need for big beers, not the alc strength of the starter


maltose falcons have an article on brewing big beers, have a read about why they use a 1.060 starter for 1.100 beers

http://www.maltosefalcons.com/tech/thinking-big-getting-handle-brewing-big-beers


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

They didnt actually say why a high sg starter was better...apart from speed....and it needed oxygenating.....and not to go to big

There are fore & against for both big & small gravity starters.

Going to stop now because this will derail the thread and turn into a shit fight.


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## GalBrew (8/8/13)

Things only turn into a shitfight when no explanation as to why a particular thing is done is given.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

Well I have stated my thoughts.


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## Blitzer (8/8/13)

Yeah, I will smack it tomorrow no starter for me this time. But if this brew turns out I will probably brew it a second time in 3 weeks or so and try a starter then. Thanks.


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/8/13)

A great way to get a starter is to draw off 500ml-1ltr at high krausen thru the tap. Put it in the fridge to stop it. Ideally you want to draw your starter off at about sg1020. You can then split or warm up and direct pitch into your next beer.


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