# First Raw Apple Cider



## ciderlover (19/5/14)

G'day gents,

Kicked off my first raw apple cider last Sunday using 69 large Granny Smith apples which resulted in just under 8 litres of juice. We juiced them in a cheap slow juicer picked up from Target which did a pretty decent job for under $80. Once I poured the juice into my fermentation vat (a re-purposed ornamental drink dispenser) I added about 300g of white sugar and stirred in a flattened teaspoon of wine yeast. Today the whole thing is bubbling away nicely as you can see in the video below 

I just had a quick couple of questions to ask of the more experienced cider makers here:

1) Should I have put more sugar in or will the apples' own raw sugar be enough food for the yeast to do it's job?
2) I didn't filter that foam that you get on the top layer of of freshly juiced apples, but merely skimmed some of it off once it was in the FV, is leaving the foam in okay or will it cause problems?

Many thanks!

http://youtu.be/ChLmX_H1aPg


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## Mutaneer (19/5/14)

the apples have more than enough sugar for 6-7% ABV
But you may want to throw some yeast nutrient in there as apple juice has very little nutrients to keep the yeast healthy


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## ciderlover (19/5/14)

What sort of yeast nutrient would you suggest? This is the first non-kit brew I've done so I'm really out in open waters right now.

By the way my OG before adding the sugar & yeast was 1.053


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## Mutaneer (19/5/14)

I use one called GoFerm, but your local home brew shop should have something.

yeah my SG's are between 1.055 and 1.065 for the juice I buy from local orchards (they do all the hard work in pressing)


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## ciderlover (19/5/14)

Hey Rob, I just liked your FB page, nice setup mate!


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## spryzie (19/5/14)

I am bottling my first freshly pressed cider tonight.

I added 1 teaspoon per 5 litres of Diammonium Phosphate. That's what yeast nutrient is. Ask your homebrew shop.

Juiced my apples. 10L fuji, 5L golden delicious, 5L pink lady and 1L quince juice (for tannins - an experiment).

My OG was 1056. I didn't add any sugar. My SG was 1001 yesterday so that's like 7.5% ABV. I'm expecting FG to hit 1000 or less this arvo.

I wouldn't add any sugar.

I poured my juice through a sieve but otherwise left the scum/foam alone. It all sinks into trub.

Tastes like cider. Should be great carb'd over ice.


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## TimT (19/5/14)

Plenty of yeast nutrient at the home brew shops, all along similar lines. If you have a packet of organic raisins in your cupboard that should suffice for yeast nutrient too (they have a lot of nutrients occurring naturally on their skin and so are perfect for an organic source of nutrient). Make sure they're hippy-dippy organic ones though - otherwise they might have been pasteurised/washed in some form and had a lot of the goodness taken out of them.

Good luck, your cider sounds great; wouldn't worry about the scum - the yeast will sort all that out during the fermentation. What doesn't get eaten or turned to cidery goodness will just sink to the bottom.


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## ciderlover (19/5/14)

Thank you for the info gents, I might pop into my local HBS and pickup some nutrient tomorrow.

I have a busy one tonight; bottling a European Lager & pitching another one in it's place


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## spryzie (19/5/14)

Oh, I am also bottling immediately after FG is reached (day after) as I'm told oxidation is a bigger problem for cider compared with beer.

Get it in bottles straight away.


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## Mutaneer (19/5/14)

I've racked mine after the primary fermentation and left them for 2 weeks in either glass or plastic fermenter and had no issues from oxidisation.
I syphon it with minimal splashing
after the racking process, I always get further fermentation, clearing and bubbling through the airlock. so any oxygen is being kicked out by the CO2 anyway.

I think there's a lot of worry over a very small matter for most of us only doing 10-20L at a time.


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## spryzie (19/5/14)

Hey! It took me a couple of hours to juice 20 litres of apples!

I don't use an airlock - only have one of those coopers fermenters.


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## spryzie (19/5/14)

Well, all bottled. FG is 1000.

Still cloudy and time will tell if I made the right decision to bottle early and not wait for everything to settle out - it'll settle out in the bottle I figure. Nothing wrong with a little yeast.

I'm not sure how much the quinces added - no quince flavour but on tasting the cider it is as drying to the mouth as red wine so I'm thinking it's worked quite well.

I could happily drink it now although it's a little yeasty.

Give it a few weeks in the bottle and we'll see... :chug:


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## Mutaneer (20/5/14)

My Coopers Kit fermenter came with an airlock.?

You'll be suprised at how much less dry it becomes after a few weeks in the bottle.,
I initially left my first batch of 6 weeks and it was great.
I've still got a couple of bottles that are now out to 9 weeks and they get better and better.


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## spryzie (20/5/14)

New coopers kits just have a non-airtight lid. No airlock.


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## Not For Horses (20/5/14)

Spryzie, You may still find that it will drop another point or two or three.
I'm still drinking last years cider and it is awesome. After a month in the bottle it had a slight but almost imperceptible carbonation. Now it is reasonably lively.
I left it for over 6 weeks in primary and it dropped crystal clear.
I recently had some cider from a mate I brew with that was 5 years in secondary. It was amazing.
I don't think you should rush bottling so long as you are good at excluding oxygen.


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## spryzie (20/5/14)

I primed the bottles too with the usual amount of dextrose (carb drops because I had some).

So let's say worst case if it still has a few extra gravity points to drop they will be really fizzy - but hopefully not bombs.

I have a screw top tester bottle anyway. Will monitor.

I used S04 and it got quite warm (25 degrees) so I'm not too worried. The krausen had dropped and FG of 1000 should be safe.


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## ciderlover (26/5/14)

G'day gents,

So it looks like the bubbling in my cider has slowed down somewhat in over the last 8 days, my SG reading right now is actually 0.980 which sounds like it might be time to bottle. However, is it wiser to just strain the floaty bits (see picture below) and rack into a proper FV with an air-lock, or not bother with racking and just strain right into bottles?







By the way, I gave it a try and it has a very strong dry flavour, almost spirit-like, and based on my OG=1.053, the alcohol content looks to be nearly 10% AbV (completely unintentional) though I wonder if the wine yeast my local HBS sold me to try has anything to do with it.

Any reconsiderations on what I should do next, bottle or rack?


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## Mutaneer (26/5/14)

I'd rack it, even just for a few days to allow a little more to settle out.


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## ciderlover (26/5/14)

Rob, do you think that filtering that floating garbage during racking would cause accelerated oxidation due to increased exposure to air? I'm really not keen on that stuff floating around in my bottles.

Lesson learned from this first experience with using raw apples: Strain out the sludge and crap before tipping into the FV.


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## Mutaneer (26/5/14)

put a filter (clean stocking) on the intake of a piece of hose and syphon it out

I do all my racking with tube down into the bottom of the new container to minimise aeration (unless I require it)


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## TimT (26/5/14)

Give it some time for the taste to alter too - it's often the case with home wines that you need to let them mature over a period, probably a few months. Over time it ought to go from the strong 'spirit-like' taste to something more cider like.


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## ciderlover (26/5/14)

Thanks for the tips gents.

Tomorrow I bottle one of my other finished beers, so I'll have a free FV into which, I'll rack this cider using Rob's method.
Cheers,
Pete


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## spryzie (26/5/14)

0980 SG? is that possible?


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## Mutaneer (26/5/14)

The only thing to take note of after racking is to make sure you do have enough yeast going into the bottles to actually allow carbonation.
Most apple juices should hold enough in suspension that it's not a worry,
but if you rack multiple times or for months you may need to top up the batch with some fresh yeast when you come to bottling time.


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## ciderlover (7/6/14)

G'day gents, just a quick update on this raw apple cider experiment.

I racked it into another FV 10 days ago using Rob's method, and it has been sitting there not doing much at all, there's definitely no yeast action happening so I'm wondering... Should I go to bottles or rack again, but this time into a demijohn with some fresh yeast & nutrient and let it sit for a few more weeks?


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## ciderlover (7/6/14)

Well, after tasting it this morning I decided there was no way this was drinkable, I swear the alcohol content was double what it was before and my SG reading confirm it's sitting at around 14% abv. So I've racked it into a new demijohn and sprinkled a little more yeast & nutrient into it. The taste was more like soured wine. Anyway, I'm just going to leave it in the dark and forget about it for a couple of months.


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## seamad (7/6/14)

You may be getting some of your terminology mixed up a bit.
SG/OG = starting/original gravity. You need to measure this after adding sugar otherwise you haven't measured it. I personally don't add any sugar to ciders as They have enough kick in them for me ( but I'm getting old )
FG = finished/final gravity.
There is no point adding yeast to a cider that's at 0.98 because there aint nothing left for it to eat. In fact you may get vegemite flavours from yeast autolysis , depending how much you've got in there.
A rough alc guess would be @ 11%, which is going to leave some pretty hot alcohol flavours , especially if the ferment was warmish.
If you want to give it a chance maybe cold crash for a while and then transfer to a storage container and cross your fingers. It's probably rocket fuel though :blink:
The next one will be better
cheers


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## ciderlover (7/6/14)

Oh right, I thought SG was Specific Gravity, being a reading you take at any time between OG & FG.

Yeah I think adding more yeast & nutrient may in fact turn this into something more potent, I might as well add some sugar for the yeast to eat and put it down to a learning experience.


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## seamad (7/6/14)

Yea it also means specific gravity, but can also be starting, confusing.


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## Waltzing Matilda (7/6/14)

Good one mate' I've heard of a black velvet, mix stout with Apple cider.


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## Pilchard (8/6/14)

If the alc is that high you could spice it with ginger, cinnamon etc and have a nice wine. Just keep racking it off till it leaves no more sediment and a year in corked bottles.

I am about to do a big batch of apple wine for the wife with a little spice, will have to dig the recipe out but atm apples are a good price so good time to do it.


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