# Extra Stout.



## Stouter (23/3/17)

Yesterday's effort, now sitting at pitching temp in a cube in the fridge -

21L BIAB batch.
5 kg - B.B malt,
350g - Roasted Barley,
200g - Caramalt,
100g - Choc malt,
500g - Cane sugar.

EKG - 50g @ 60,
EKG - 20g @ 40.

I'm getting an O.G at 1.070, which a guess is higher than I expected due to the cane sugar addition which I haven't done since playing about with cans and kits. *Any suggestions for yeast?* I usually have to go with dry yeast, but I'm making a trip to the big smoke tomorrow and visiting a store there for fresh supplies, so I've got better options than the US-04 I originally intended to use.


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## Bribie G (23/3/17)

Either Wyeast Irish Ale 1084 or MJ New World Strong Ale.

I've been using the MJ for a lot of strong ales lately, does a brilliant clean job.

Good to see you aren't just relying entirely on the Roast Barley (a common fault) but adding in some "middle malts" in between the RB and the BB to add complexity.


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## Stouter (23/3/17)

Cheers Bribie.
I'll suss out my supplier for the Wyeast. I haven't used that before. Not often I get to play with anything but dry supermarket bought yeast. Locally I'm limited to Safale 04/05, Coopers, and some dodgy HomeBrand looking S#!t.
The MJ New World is one that I'm already ordering today for weekend pickup anyway, so I might save that for next week's repeat performance on this brew.
I left out any CARAFA III in this, which I've used in previous Stout recipes (not even sure why other than it's black), and gone with Cara and Choc, not that I've any idea about substitutions at this stage, I'm just playing with different marbles.
I was hesitant to add in the cane sugar as I'm trying to stay very much 'all grain', but it seems to be what makes the Coopers version I enjoy so much. It definitely made a difference to the higher O.G, though my efficiency might also be improved slightly with a couple of new tricks I tried out with bag lifting and draining too.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (23/3/17)

Looks good and very similar to mine.

I've pitched mine on a 1/3rd cake of WLP004 Irish Ale yeast, leftover from a mild I've now kegged.

Same thing, a bit of dark crystal, black malt, choc malt and some roasted barley.

Tried a new stout malt that hoppy days are selling.


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## good4whatAlesU (23/3/17)

Cold steeping any of the dark grains or all in? .. I've started 50/50 .. cold steep/In mash.


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## Stouter (23/3/17)

All in together. I'm not in steeping territory yet. Will this give me a head start on extracting colour?

Supplier hasn't any Irish Yeast until next week. Might call in at another place on the way.


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## good4whatAlesU (23/3/17)

Not sure, I was all in but thought I got too much atringency .. so I started cold steeping. 

Then I opened a bottle 6 months later from an "astringent brew" and it tasted bloody good. So I'm thinking I'll go back to all in.

It's just a time thing .. how long are we prepared to wait to drink the beer I think.


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## Stouter (23/3/17)

I'm the first to admit I'm very time poor, and a greedy bastard too.
I'm hoping to put some of this aside for the next 4 - 5 months and enter it in a local comp. But I'm also intending this recipe to be my mainstay drink if it comes off well. If I can pick up an Wyeast Irish Ale 1084 pack this weekend I'll pitch the MJ New World on Sunday, replicate the brew on Monday, and pitch the Wyeast on Tuesday.
By Aug/Sept hopefully there'll be a few bottles left of each and a chosen contestant for entering in the comp.


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## Stouter (23/3/17)

Using the magic Oxy wand on this baby too.
Starting at 18C and I thought I'd try lifting that to 20C once I get about a 1.020 reading .


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## Tex083 (23/3/17)

I love Scottish Ale from Wyeast for my stouts, coopers stout yeast re cultured also works well.


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## Mardoo (23/3/17)

The Wyeast Scottish Ale 1728 is an awesome all-around player. It excels at many styles. The White Labs 013 is the bomb for stouts.


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/3/17)

Mardoo said:


> The Wyeast Scottish Ale 1728 is an awesome all-around player. It excels at many styles. The White Labs 013 is the bomb for stouts.


Have used w1728 for ages...got it when it first came out years ago...prob 8yrs ago I started using it 

I would suggest doing the following

Pillar of Stout 

Pillar of Red ( Cracking Scotish Ale )

W1728 works best at low ferm temps ( 13*c ), and also loves big beers


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/3/17)

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/recipe/302-pillar-of-stout/


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## Stouter (26/3/17)

Mardoo said:


> The Wyeast Scottish Ale 1728 is an awesome all-around player. It excels at many styles. The White Labs 013 is the bomb for stouts.


The 1728 was the closest I could get to the recommendations on here. Not much selection in Wyeast, and I was worried about keeping it cold on the 4.5hr trip home, little esky worked ok though.
Pitching tomorrow, then looking toward the Pillar of Stout.


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## Bribie G (26/3/17)

Stouter, I see you don't have your location in the side bar, if you are in a remote area it might flush out a couple of brewers that you can buy with. 
Happened to me when I lived in Old Bar and very handy for Newcastle purchasing. 

They are long time lurkers but came popping out of the woodwork and we ended up brew buddies.


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## manticle (26/3/17)

Geraldton


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## Stouter (26/3/17)

I've always has my location there. Dunno why it's not showing for you.
Did get a local response to my sodium percarb buy, and I'm told this new fangle thing called facebook is the go for finding fellow enthusiasts, but I don't want to get on it.


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## manticle (26/3/17)

Facebook is the devil's armpit


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## louistoo (26/3/17)

That link is dodgy.. not a recipe still worth a chuckle though Stu.


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

My first time using a smackpak with the Wyeast 1728 Scottish Ale, and I'm very impressed.
My O.G. was high at 1.070 and I set my FV temp at 18C for the first 5 days, took a sample and got 1.034, upped the temp to 22C and that was all she wrote after a total of 11 days, and finishing at 1.016.
Very happy with that, and after emptying the FV into bottles I noticed the sludge on the bottom was quite compact.
Tastes good, and I've split the batch, 12 bottles at least a couple of which I'll put in an upcoming comp, and 12 bottles I'll try my best to condition for longer

At $15 a pack, that's about half my usual budget/brew. I feel like it was worth it though compared to my usual pack of S-04/05 sprinkling efforts. I've still got a couple of dry MJ packs I'll rehydrate and build up into starters, which I've never tried doing before.
This has spurred me on to look further into yeasts now. I'm now going to try harvesting from some Coopers Stout bottles and give it a go.


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## TheWiggman (6/4/17)

As it happens I'm doing a Scottish 80/- this weekend and an extra stout the following weekend on the cake, with 1728 already spun and ready to go. Plan is (based on the infamous whiteboard recipe) -

21L, OG 1.068 scaled up to 23l
5.50 kg MO
0.60 kg Black Malt
0.45 kg Wheat Malt
Super Pride at 60 mins to the tune of 45 IBU

Intended ABV around 6.8%. Going to be literal neck oil.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

Stouter said:


> My first time using a smackpak with the Wyeast 1728 Scottish Ale, and I'm very impressed.
> My O.G. was high at 1.070 and I set my FV temp at 18C for the first 5 days, took a sample and got 1.034, upped the temp to 22C and that was all she wrote after a total of 11 days, and finishing at 1.016.
> Very happy with that, and after emptying the FV into bottles I noticed the sludge on the bottom was quite compact.
> Tastes good, and I've split the batch, 12 bottles at least a couple of which I'll put in an upcoming comp, and 12 bottles I'll try my best to condition for longer
> ...



18*c is the high end for this yeats

Give it a go at 13-15*c...very nice

This yeast also will make great big beers like RIS and heavy stouts


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## Yob (6/4/17)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> 18*c is the high end for this yeats
> 
> Give it a go at 13-15*c...very nice
> 
> This yeast also will make great big beers like RIS and heavy stouts


Indeed it does.. Bloody good yeast, one of my faves for high gravity darks


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> 18*c is the high end for this yeats
> 
> Give it a go at 13-15*c...very nice
> 
> This yeast also will make great big beers like RIS and heavy stouts


I expect the timeline would push out at 13-15C?
Slow and steady wins the race though.
Is it the nutrient pack in these smakpacs that see them do so well or the strain?


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

Its how you look after the yeast

How did you split the initial pack ?


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

Punched the shit out of it until the insides split, let it sit in the already at temp fv fridge for a few hours, then poured it in.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

So you didnt maker a starter and split the starter before pitching into your wort ?


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

Nope, not that far into things yet.


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## manticle (6/4/17)

1728 is brilliant at 14 deg C. Not yet tried it in a stout - might change that in the next few weeks as I'm knocking out some stouts for the winter in upcoming weeks.

I don't split either but I do (mostly) make active starters and sometimes top crop.

Splitting will massively reduce per brew costs.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

manticle said:


> 1728 is brilliant at 14 deg C. Not yet tried it in a stout - might change that in the next few weeks as I'm knocking out some stouts for the winter in upcoming weeks.


Its awsome in Porter as well


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## Lionman (6/4/17)

When you bottle, you can drain some of the trub into a sanitised bottle and refrigerate it. Pitch it the next batch.

I have started pitching on the day I keg the previous batch. Empty the FV into the keg, then tip the fermenter forward a bit, let the beer dregs run into a jug and then catch about 100ml of cleanish yeast.

Then I clean and sanitise the fermenter, empty the cube, oxygenate and pitch the saved yeast.

Seems to work well and can save a fair bit of $$ when using more expensive yeasts.

I like the idea of splitting a starter though too.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

Stouter said:


> Nope, not that far into things yet.


How far into the ferment is it ?


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

manticle said:


> 1728 is brilliant at 14 deg C. Not yet tried it in a stout - might change that in the next few weeks as I'm knocking out some stouts for the winter in upcoming weeks.
> I don't split either but I do (mostly) make active starters and sometimes top crop.
> Splitting will massively reduce per brew costs.


I see where this is heading now, and my wallet thanks you.


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> How far into the ferment is it ?


I meant not thinking that far ahead yet, and not experienced yet.
It's finished and bottled now.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

Stouter said:


> I meant not thinking that far ahead yet, and not experienced yet.
> It's finished and bottled now.


DAMN


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## Stouter (6/4/17)

Yeah, what a dumb phunt. 
I should have split it. The fv is all cleaned out too.
How long does a split starter last in the fridge, or a dregs run off?


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/4/17)

Split starter will last years.

My first 1728 I got I split that into 6 from an initial starter of 1 ltr made from the pack

I turned 1 starter into another 1lt starter and put the other 5 in the fridge under wort 

From the 1 ltr starter, pitch enough into your wort and make another starter with whats left

But make sure you are SUPER ANAL with sanitation when you make your first starter....otherwise you will just be brewing Bretts from that starter


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## labels (6/4/17)

Reculture from one of the bottles if you want to save the strain.

If you live in a rural area where getting yeast strains is a struggle then starting up a yeast-slant ranch makes a lot of sense


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## Stouter (7/4/17)

Fully intending to do this.....once I learn how.


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## Ducatiboy stu (7/4/17)

Stouter said:


> Fully intending to do this.....once I learn how.


Its actually very very easy


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## Jrrj (7/4/17)

For Foreign Extra Stout I've used wyeast 1028 per Ray Daniels' guidance in Designing Great Beers. Excellent results. Daniels recommends London over Irish stout strains from memory due to attenuation not being high enough. From 1.070 London should get you down into the high teens similiarly to what you reported for 1728. London is also very fast - reaching terminal gravity inside 4 days at 20 degrees in my experience.


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## GalBrew (7/4/17)

If you want to stick with a dry yeast I have found that s-04 works really well with dark ales. Just make sure your pitching rate is adequate. I usually pitch 2 rehydrated packs into a stout of that OG.


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