# The 'no Messin Method' Fermenter To Keg



## Pumpy (1/8/07)

For those who found there filtering process messy .

Just a pic of my attempt at an enclosed system Fermenter with new 'Super lid' (as patented by Pistolpatch) and 'fermenter outlet' (as patented by Doogiechap) for filtering beer into a keg.

Thanks for all the help you guys gave me. 

Gas in top of the fermenter the other bulkhead fitting is a bit surplus but can be used as the blow tube or for taking hydrometer reading samples .

Fermenter outlet instead of a conventional tap. 

Keg inlet into normally beer outlet tube .


Pumpy


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

fermenter inlet


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

Fermenter outlet


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

outlet fitting 3/4 male 1/4 female BSP


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## Doogiechap (1/8/07)

Looks the good bloke !

The one thing that Pat and I found out the hard way is it's best to crash chill the fermenter before you filter to drop as much yeast out as possible. It took way tooooooo long to filter our respective warm batches. 
Cheers
Doug


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

JG fitting 

keg inlet on outlet


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

Doogiechap said:


> Looks the good bloke !
> 
> The one thing that Pat and I found out the hard way is it's best to crash chill the fermenter before you filter to drop as much yeast out as possible. It took way tooooooo long to filter our respective warm batches.
> Cheers
> Doug




Yep DC I always thought dropping the temp made it was less likely to oxidise ( may be totally wrong but stops excess foam too )

Pumpy


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## Tony (1/8/07)

good work pumpy

I like it

cheers


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## Pumpy (1/8/07)

Tony said:


> good work pumpy
> 
> I like it
> 
> cheers




Thank Tony ,It makes it so much simpler


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## redgums500 (1/8/07)

Pumpy said:


> Thank Tony ,It makes it so much simpler



Cumbs Pumpy........How much gas do you use in filtering into the keg like that ?

redgums


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## NRB (1/8/07)

I'd guess the volume of the fermenter, approximately 30L?


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## kook (1/8/07)

Pumpy / Doogiechap, have either of you experienced issues with dry hops clogging the outlet? That looks like a really cool idea, but I'd be concerned that using 1/4" fittings it would be too easy to clog with hop particulate?


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## tangent (1/8/07)

that's the only problem is you have to use more than the size of your fermenter in gas to make it all move. take a while to save the $'s in gas with a peristaltic pump though... be interesting to do the sums.


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## Andyd (2/8/07)

tangent said:


> that's the only problem is you have to use more than the size of your fermenter in gas to make it all move. take a while to save the $'s in gas with a peristaltic pump though... be interesting to do the sums.



Especially if you're buying CO2 in 22L lots.... 

Not sure why you're using the bottom outlet... I have two bulkheads in my fermenters, one of which has a beer line dip tube to take up the beer. That works a treat for me...

Andy


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## Doogiechap (2/8/07)

kook said:


> Pumpy / Doogiechap, have either of you experienced issues with dry hops clogging the outlet? That looks like a really cool idea, but I'd be concerned that using 1/4" fittings it would be too easy to clog with hop particulate?



G'day Kook,
Sorry but the only dry hopping that I have done has been in the keg. Certainly a possibility of clogging. I think I would toss the hops in a muslin bag if I was to dry hop in thr fermenter.


Andyd said:


> Especially if you're buying CO2 in 22L lots....
> 
> Not sure why you're using the bottom outlet... I have two bulkheads in my fermenters, one of which has a beer line dip tube to take up the beer. That works a treat for me...
> 
> Andy



I have tried both methods and have found that I pick up less trub and yeast off the bottom using the bottom outlet. (Providing I chill the fermenter first  ) . I also have one less item to pull apart and clean afterwards.
CO2 wise it's a fairly small amount in the scheme of things and at my current level of production and consumption it suits me fine  , on the other hand, a perestaltic pump, more brewing toys hmmmmmm.
Cheers
Doug


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## Pumpy (2/8/07)

redgums500 said:


> Cumbs Pumpy........How much gas do you use in filtering into the keg like that ?
> 
> redgums



I have the gas set on the lowest and just turn it on until it starts flowing then turn it off then back on again when it slows , I really could not say how much gas but I dont think it is much.

Pumpy


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## Pumpy (2/8/07)

kook said:


> Pumpy / Doogiechap, have either of you experienced issues with dry hops clogging the outlet? That looks like a really cool idea, but I'd be concerned that using 1/4" fittings it would be too easy to clog with hop particulate?




Kook as Doogie I only dry hop in the keg with flowers in a SS mesh basket 

pumpy


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## Pumpy (2/8/07)

Andyd said:


> Especially if you're buying CO2 in 22L lots....
> 
> Not sure why you're using the bottom outlet... I have two bulkheads in my fermenters, one of which has a beer line dip tube to take up the beer. That works a treat for me...
> 
> Andy



Andy ,

I added the bottom outlet after I had put the two holes in the lid and happy with the result 


I felt it may need less gas to get it moving either way I have both options .

Its all Research annd Development and unless you try these things you never know if it is an improvement .


Pumpy


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## BrissyBrew (2/8/07)

I must admit I have some design plans around this issue already. One this that has always concerned me is the air that gets sucked into the fermenter when your draining it. I know you normally have a blanket of C02 but in inrush of air into the top of the fermenter must disturb this. 

Furthermore, maybe over kill but you could always purge the fermeter a little before filling it and pitching. Provide a C02 blanket from the very first minute of the fermentation process. Sorry I am always worried about airborne nasties. A cheaper solution would be to filter air and purge it with an aquairum pump, airstone add 02 to the fix at the same time

No doubt Ross will have all the necessary fittings for the no Mess Filter kits soon.


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## Thirsty Boy (2/8/07)

I experimented with something similar to this on a batch of koelsch that I was putting down the drain (dont ask..)

Anyway, for the outlet I managed to fudge a connection between the standard fermentor tap and the inlet of the filter, out let of the filter just went to a tube and in through the lid of the keg.. anyway, all that is a little academic, the fittings in Pumpy's setup would be much better, the main bit is how I pressurised.

I just fitted a bog standard mag wheel schrader valve into the airlock hole in my fermentor lid, and pressurised the whole thing with a bike pump !!

It worked a treat. I wasn't worried about contamination because I was throwing out the batch of beer anyway, but you could certainly shove a sanitary filter into the outlet of the schrader valve to take care of any airborne nasties.

I suppose that you could freak out about oxygenation... but its not like i was bubbling the air through the beer. It was about 30mins worth of exposure of the top layer of beer to air that was mixed in with the C02 that was already in the fermentor. I cant see how it would be any worse than when I drain the fermentor straight into the keg when I'm not filtering even without the sanitary filter. And thats 30 litres plus of C02 that isn't being wasted.

Maybe good, maybe bad.. just thought I'd share.

BTW, whats the purpose of the line connecting the fermentor to the vent on the filter?? I cant see a reason why they need to be connected.

Thirsty


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## tangent (2/8/07)

Pumpy, if your fermenter is 30L, you'll need more than 30L of CO2 to push it all out.


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## Pumpy (2/8/07)

tangent said:


> Pumpy, if your fermenter is 30L, you'll need more than 30L of CO2 to push it all out.




Thirsty boy /Tangent ,

I have an electric car tyre pump will that work ?

Pumpy


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## tangent (2/8/07)

i'd still use a filter Pumpy. some compressors throw a little oil.


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## Plastic Man (2/8/07)

There was a link posted a few months ago about a guy who saved the CO2 from fermentation into one of those smiley balloons, and then had made a pump that pumped it into kegs. I tried looking for the link or the site but can't find it again.

Would be a solution if you were worried about using bought CO2. Use free CO2 instead (?????). Sort of like Thirsty's idea with a pump but you are pumping CO2 not air.......


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## Jye (2/8/07)

Looks the goods Pumpy, but your not a real brewer...


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## Pumpy (2/8/07)

Jye said:


> Looks the goods Pumpy, but your not a real brewer...
> 
> View attachment 14078




Until you can afford to buy a perastaltic pump Jye 

I just want a cheap hobby not one that is running away with costs 

Well I am happy with my CO2 pushing it though the filter it is still cheap until an alternative can be found 

Pumpy


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## Pumpy (4/8/07)

redgums500 said:


> Cumbs Pumpy........How much gas do you use in filtering into the keg like that ?
> 
> redgums




After much unecessary concern from brewers about the waste of CO2 to push the beer through the filter.

This morning I filtered 40 litres of beer into the kegs . and suprise, suprise 

I used NO CO2 gas !!!!!!  

I just placed the beer on the work bench and and the filter on a crate and the kegs on the floor .

It was all gravity fed !!

I found I could go away and leave it and the whole process looked afer itself only when it went below the tap I had to tip the fermenter for the last drop to go down the tube .

I always dislike the messing around with filtering but now it is clean and simple I even have the beer from the bleeder tap dispense into a bottle with grommet to save going on the floor .

I liked Ross's idea about filtering a few batches in one go it saves time .

Pumpy


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## Punter (4/8/07)

Pumpy said:


> After much unecessary concern from brewers about the waste of CO2 to push the beer through the filter.
> 
> This morning I filtered 40 litres of beer into the kegs . and suprise, suprise
> 
> ...



How long did it take to filter using gravity?


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## Pumpy (4/8/07)

Punter said:


> How long did it take to filter using gravity?




It took 40 mins for 40 liter approx 

The beer had been in fridge at 4C so a lot of stuff had dropped out of suspension .

Try it for yourself next time 


Pumpy


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## Thirsty Boy (5/8/07)

Just a quick general question about filtering. I haven't actually filtered a proper batch yet.

When you have emptied the fermetor or keg or whatever you are filtering OUT of. Do you lose all the beer in the filter housing, or can you turn it upside down to try and eek an extra stubbie's worth out of it??

Thirsty


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## Doogiechap (5/8/07)

You can flip the housing Thirsty  . You loose a tiny bit but it won't make too much of a dent in your 11 litre batches  .
Cheers
Doug


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## Pumpy (5/8/07)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Just a quick general question about filtering. I haven't actually filtered a proper batch yet.
> 
> When you have emptied the fermetor or keg or whatever you are filtering OUT of. Do you lose all the beer in the filter housing, or can you turn it upside down to try and eek an extra stubbie's worth out of it??
> 
> Thirsty



With gravity yes 

but if you just connect the gas directly to the filter for the last glass , I did not bother this time 

pumpy


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## Pumpy (5/8/07)

I have finally come to the conclusion that you will feel more proud of a beer that has 'clarity' than one that has the slightest 'haze' .

At the end of the day we are trying to brew beer that not only tastes good but presents well to the customer.

Be the customer you or your mates you will feel better.

Pumpy


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## oldbugman (5/8/07)

agreed.

Always feel much happier handing a visitor a nice looking and tasting beer.


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## tangent (5/8/07)

Agree with you Pumpy, a filtered and properly carbed beer is a good way to get newbies believing that home brew isn't all murky undrinkable crap.


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## Pumpy (5/8/07)

tangent said:


> Agree with you Pumpy, a filtered and properly carbed beer is a good way to get newbies believing that home brew isn't all murky undrinkable crap.




Thanks for the support Tangent & Bugman  

Pumpy


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## Pumpy (13/9/07)

Kegging tonight just a pic in action connect it forget it


Pumpy


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## skippy (13/9/07)

Pumpy i agree with you that homebrew should be cheap and present well.

With the last photo, dont you have to loosen the lid of the fermentor to get the flow of beer occuring through the filter and into keg...thus Oxygen contacting with the brew...how do you go about the process? As well as that wouldnt you have to loosen the keg lid to allow air to escape as keg fills with beer?

Sure would like a pump like JYE though! would like to know how long his beer would take to filter.


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## Jye (13/9/07)

skippy said:


> Sure would like a pump like JYE though! would like to know how long his beer would take to filter.



10min with the pump turned down.


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## Pumpy (13/9/07)

skippy said:


> Pumpy i agree with you that homebrew should be cheap and present well.
> 
> With the last photo, dont you have to loosen the lid of the fermentor to get the flow of beer occuring through the filter and into keg...thus Oxygen contacting with the brew...how do you go about the process? As well as that wouldnt you have to loosen the keg lid to allow air to escape as keg fills with beer?
> 
> Sure would like a pump like JYE though! would like to know how long his beer would take to filter.



Skippy ,

The lid is quite loose dont have a rubber seal 

Hey guys beer dont hang around long here so oxidisation is not a problem 

the filtering takes about 20 mins trust me gravity is fine 

pumpy


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## skippy (13/9/07)

JYE, just out of interest what is your procedure for filtering your brew... 

You filter from fermentor to keg, using pump, do you have a tube going inside the keg, or liquid disconnect attached to fill the keg?

Do you loosen keg lid to allow air to escape as she fills, or use some sort of pressure release valve to allow air to escape but not enter?


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## Jye (13/9/07)

The receiving keg is connected with a quick disconnect and I just remove the airlock from the fermenter. The whole setup is easy to sanitise too since I just recirculate through the filter for 10min, then purge with co2 and hook it up to the fermenter to filter.


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## skippy (13/9/07)

Sounds easy pump or gravity, I believe the end product is a clear, well presented beer (after carbonation!)

JYE, I saw somewhere (could be this site - can't remember), that someone made some sort of valve that you could place on gas poppet to allow air to escape, do you just loosen the corny keg lid when filling ??


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## Jye (13/9/07)

Just open the pressure relief valve.


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## skippy (13/9/07)

Just got my keg setup and made one brew....all my additional gear is arriving soon. Still a little green but hey... 

when you say open the pressure release valve do you mean you stand over the keg, lifting the valve until she is full...or do you unscrew the valve and come back later?


P.S I want a pump, but they are bloody expensive. Do you have to use a perlistatic pump?

What is the best value for money pump?


...and have you ever stuffed up the filter membrane using one????


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## oldbugman (13/9/07)

pull ring and turn 90deg it then stays open


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## skippy (13/9/07)

Too easy, cheers pal

:chug:


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## Pumpy (14/9/07)

skippy said:


> Just got my keg setup and made one brew....all my additional gear is arriving soon. Still a little green but hey...
> 
> when you say open the pressure release valve do you mean you stand over the keg, lifting the valve until she is full...or do you unscrew the valve and come back later?
> P.S I want a pump, but they are bloody expensive. Do you have to use a perlistatic pump?
> ...




Skippy , Trust me , try the gravity "No Pump method" first .

realise how much money you have saved then send me 20%  

Pumpy


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## Kingy (14/9/07)

your about to cost me money pumpy, on a filter. The only reason i was hesitating was addding the perilstatic pump to go with it,i mean 285 is a lot of dolllars. Even for the wealthy earners.
cheers,kingy

edit: im far from wealthy


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## dr K (14/9/07)

Very clever system!
I might have to buy some lids for my fermentors !
On the subject of oxidation, I understand that the pleated filter cartridge still allows a tiny bit of yeast through, if the beer is chilled right down (-0.5) and the receiving keg purged, and, most importantly the filter and lines are purged with CO2 the piddly bit of O2 that makes its way to the keg will either:
1) Does not matter, the beer will stay chilled and be drunk in less time than it takes to show.
2) The beer will be allowed to return to ferment temp or a tad warmer for a few days and the tiny bit of yeast will scavenge the tiny bit of oxygen

K


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## Thirsty Boy (15/9/07)

Pumpy,

What micron filter are you doing that gravity thing with? I've got a 0.9 or 0.8 micron filter. Woudl gravity still do the trick or is that what you are using anyway?

I've got 4 batches to filter in the next week or two and I'd like to give your method a go. 

Cheers mate

Thirsty


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## Pumpy (15/9/07)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Pumpy,
> 
> What micron filter are you doing that gravity thing with? I've got a 0.9 or 0.8 micron filter. Woudl gravity still do the trick or is that what you are using anyway?
> 
> ...




Thirsty ,I use a '1 micron Absolute pleated cartridge filter' the purple topped one from the USA , it is expensive but the quality is really high every time I clean it the filter comes up as new .
My filter flows well ,So long as your filter is not a spun solid polyester , I dont have any experience down to 0.8 micron with gravity but you should give it a try , I found I could filter by gravity purely by 'Serendipity' .

Chill the fermenter overnight down to 5C or lower .

I say it takes 20 mins to filter 20 litres but may well be less, just bleed the filter of air' sit down and watch TV while its happening and wedge the fermenter for the final bit near the base of the fermenter.

with all the talk of Oxidisation I feel the turbulance to the beer ,would be less than handling the beer in any normal process .

Pumpy


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## Thirsty Boy (15/9/07)

Thnks Pumpy,

One of my fermentors is up on top of a fridge and was going ot be a pain inthe arse to lift down... now it will be coming down empty 

Cheers mate

Thirsty


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## Pumpy (15/9/07)

Pumpy said:


> Fermenter outlet






Pumpy said:


> outlet fitting 3/4 male 1/4 female BSP



Thirsty, just ensure that you use a good six or seven rounds of PTFE Tap around the fitting as metal to plastic is not always good .

Pumpy


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## dr K (15/9/07)

> Thirsty ,I use a '1 micron Absolute pleated cartridge filter' the purple topped one from the USA , it is expensive but the quality is really high every time I clean it the filter comes up as new .



This is the one that Craftbrewer sells, yes ?
I agree 100%..brilliant..I screwed around with filtering 5 years ago and figured it was not worth the effort in my set up..the Craftbrewer cartridge seems to be the perfect compromise, I love it !! As do quite a few other chaps round here...

K


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## Pumpy (15/9/07)

dr K said:


> This is the one that Craftbrewer sells, yes ?
> I agree 100%..brilliant..I screwed around with filtering 5 years ago and figured it was not worth the effort in my set up..the Craftbrewer cartridge seems to be the perfect compromise, I love it !! As do quite a few other chaps round here...
> 
> K



Yes Dr K ,

I got mine in Sydney , I think in years time it will still look the same. It really does the job .

I like to have the abilty to get the beer into the kegs quickly where it is safer and last longer .

whilst there is a little investment in the equipment , and my first attempts at filtering I found messy and slow 

I find the enclosed system is clean efficient .

The only thing I would like to explore now is the uses of Gelatine or Polyclar to give the beer a final finish .

pumpy


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## Tony (15/9/07)

BrissyBrew said:


> I must admit I have some design plans around this issue already. One this that has always concerned me is the air that gets sucked into the fermenter when your draining it. I know you normally have a blanket of C02 but in inrush of air into the top of the fermenter must disturb this.





skippy said:


> With the last photo, dont you have to loosen the lid of the fermentor to get the flow of beer occuring through the filter and into keg...thus Oxygen contacting with the brew...how do you go about the process?



Jesus H Christ people.

do you put glad wrap over your beer glass and lift it between mouthfulls?

do you really think the flash micro's everyone raves about worry about this.

anyway...... not knocking people individually..... not at all. 

I just cant get over the whole "dont let any air near your beer" thing. I have never worried about it and the beer wins awards. I even like to give the first few liters a bit of a splash in "air" when i rack to secondary. I find the small hit of "air" gives firmentation a bit of a kick and helps it finnish off.

I filter too. I agree that its a fantastic, cost effective way to greatly improve the beer. I have been racking into an empty keg and then using gas to push it through into another keg.

The whole process is a bit messy with lots of vessels to clean afterwards. I usually filter 50 liters and find if the beer has too much yeast in it it gets really slow at the end, requiring more pressure to push it through.

I recon the "Pumpy gravity filter method" would work well for me if i racked to secondary and let it settle for a bit then chilled it. I could have a special firmenter set up for it.

where did you get the fittings pumpy? mainly the ones thet fit to the lid.

another thing im interested to know is how many liters of gas are there in a 9kg Co2 bottle. I mean its what...... $30 for the gas. my last bottle lasted me 18 months and i dont drive miss dazy's brewery  

how much does say 100 liters of Co2 cost to filter the beer?

cheers


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## Pumpy (15/9/07)

Tony said:


> I recon the "Pumpy gravity filter method" would work well for me if i racked to secondary and let it settle for a bit then chilled it. I could have a special firmenter set up for it.
> 
> where did you get the fittings pumpy? mainly the ones thet fit to the lid.
> 
> cheers



Tony,

I dont use the lid Bulkhead fittngs anymore cuz I dont use CO2 any more to push the beer through the filter only Gravity .

People who buy a pump would not be using CO2 to push the beer through the filter 

but here is a friendly supplier for the bulkhead fitting :-

http://craftbrewer.com.au/index.php?page=s...t&Itemid=29

pumpy


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## Tony (16/9/07)

good point pumpy

I looked at it thisarvo and i could set it up no worries in my garage.

will give it a go next time

cheers


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## Jye (17/9/07)

I gave gravity filtering a try this arvo with the fermenter about 1m above the filter and the beer flew through, took about 7min to filter a already very clear pils. It went so well I hooked up an Ofest and filtered that through the same filter. It ended up take about 20min and the filter housing wouldnt drain empty so ended up pushing the last bit through with co2.

A couple of pic of the final product.


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## Ross (17/9/07)

Jye said:


> I gave gravity filtering a try this arvo with the fermenter about 1m above the filter and the beer flew through, took about 7min to filter a already very clear pils. It went so well I hooked up an Ofest and filtered that through the same filter. It ended up take about 20min and the filter housing wouldnt drain empty so ended up pushing the last bit through with co2.
> 
> A couple of pic of the final product.
> 
> ...



They look nice Jye.

Must admit, the gravity method has me worried for beers that aren't pretty clear in the 1st place, I've needed to up the pressure a fair bit in the past on more cloudy ones. It's certainly a way to save a bit of gas though & lets non keggers filter thier beer into bottles as well  

cheers Ross


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## Jye (17/9/07)

If I am to believe an online water depth pressure calculator the 1m drop gives about 10kpa which would explain why the first one flew through. From my experience today I think a normal conditioned ale (2ndary 1 wk or what ever you do) will filter fine with gravity.

As for filtering and bottle I had the same thoughts, just stick a bottling cane on the end and away you go.


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## Pumpy (17/9/07)

Jye said:


> I gave gravity filtering a try this arvo with the fermenter about 1m above the filter and the beer flew through, took about 7min to filter a already very clear pils. It went so well I hooked up an Ofest and filtered that through the same filter. It ended up take about 20min and the filter housing wouldnt drain empty so ended up pushing the last bit through with co2.
> 
> A couple of pic of the final product.
> 
> ...




Well done Jye , I will try my fermenter a bit higher 

With gravity to filter the beer , you will find the one micron filtering ability will be preseved longer over the life of your pleated filter cartridge .

We take so much time to make our beer ,what is another five minutes extra on the filtering time. 

Pumpy


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## Thirsty Boy (18/9/07)

I was just thinking of a solution if the gravity doesn't provide quite enough pressure for maybe the last litre or two..

You could include a seriously ghetto version of a peristaltic pump in your line and pump it through.

And by ghetto I mean just include a 60cm or so piece of the neoprene or silicon tube in the pre-filter line... let gravity do most of the work and if/when it needs a little bit of a hand towards the end of the fermentor - give it some peristalsis by running a rolling pin or skateboard wheel along the length of the neoprene tube a few times.

1/2" ID tube is going to have about 1.23cc of volume per cm of line, so 60cm would give you nearly 75ml per "roll" so a dozen or two rolls would get your last few litres through easy. No pump or C02 required.

Just an idea

Thirsty


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## Thirsty Boy (19/9/07)

Well,

I had my first session of filtering for real today... 2 kegs worth via C02 pressure that I had kegged before I noticed this thread (sigh) and 27litres of brown ale via the gravity method.

Both worked well... but the gravity method was so much easier and with less sanitising and rooting about the place.

It ended up that I was able to get it so that the fermentor was on top of a fridge and the receiving keg was down a flight of stairs. A good 3+ meters of head. I ended up gettting a litre or two of extra beer out of my fermentor because with just gravity.. the filter kept right on working even when I had drained half the yeastcake through it. When it was all over.. I nearly had to empty out the filter housing with a spoon!

Initially when I bought my filter, I thought I would only bother doing it for special beers, or for kegs that I wanted to transport and so needed to be able to shake up without ruining the condidtioning. But I have to drain out of the fermentor into the keg anyway; it might as well be through a filter. So I'll be filtering pretty much everything from now on. I'm well and truly sold.

Oh... and I have developed an unhealthy love of JG quick release fittings and plan on spending half my next pay packet on a bag full of the damn things.

Thanks for this thread Pumpy. You have saved me hours of effort in the future and my beers will all be lovely and bright from here on in.

Cheers

Thirsty

Edit to Add pictures.

Using the Gas - 



With LOTS of gravity -


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## Jye (26/9/07)

I gave this another go today but with already carbonated beer and from keg to keg, setup like here with a filter in-line. 

Worked great but one tip is to increase the pressure to about 1.5 times your carbed pressure. This will prevent any foaming of the beer. This is a trick I also use when CPBF to stop foam and increase filling speed.


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## Doogiechap (26/9/07)

I used this method for the first time this week with outstanding results  . I did 2 fermenters of 20L and the whole process was simple and suprisingly quick compared to some of my CO2 driven attempts with poorly flocc'd beers. I'll definately be going down this path in the future with the only proviso being possible prem spoilage due to oxidisation but current taste tests indicate that these kegs wont last too long  .
Thanks Punpy !
Cheers
Doug


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## Jye (26/9/07)

Hey Doug, if your concerned about oxidation then purge the filter with co2 before hand. I always use co2 to push the sanitise out and through the filter, this way I know the filter is completely sanitised and full of co2.


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## Pumpy (26/9/07)

Well done Thirsty boy , 

I am glad it has been a sucess with the ' No Messin method ' for you too.

Sometimes it is difficult to convince people thing work ,yes I like how you can get every single drop from the fermenter .I am addicted to the JG fittings too  

Hey Doogie , 
It was you who got me going onto this method, I do fill the filter and the keg with a shot of CO2 prior to filtering, now, but did not before and drank those batches without any worry of oxidisation like I said before there is less handling and turbulence of the beer into the kegs anyway .

Pumpy


----------



## Doogiechap (26/9/07)

Pumpy said:


> Well done Thirsty boy ,
> 
> I am glad it has been a sucess with the ' No Messin method ' for you too.
> 
> ...



Sorry bloke, major brain fade :wacko: . Yes I have been doing this for a few months but was previously using CO2 to push things through at ground level and this was my first gravity based transfer. Yes I purge my filter with no rinse and CO2 but was thinking about the oxygen being drawn into the fermernter when it drains. COMPLETELY forgetting that this is how it it is for all poor buggers who are still enslaved to bottles.... Idiot that I am....
Anyone got some spare sleep for sale 
Cheers
Doug de mug.

PS Thirsty, Pumpy is there anywhere I can go for my John Guest fitting addiction ?


----------



## Pumpy (26/9/07)

Doogiechap said:


> Sorry bloke, major brain fade :wacko: . Yes I have been doing this for a few months but was previously using CO2 to push things through at ground level and this was my first gravity based transfer. Yes I purge my filter with no rinse and CO2 but was thinking about the oxygen being drawn into the fermernter when it drains. COMPLETELY forgetting that this is how it it is for all poor buggers who are still enslaved to bottles.... Idiot that I am....
> Anyone got some spare sleep for sale
> Cheers
> Doug de mug.
> ...



Doug ,

Unsure if there is a JG Clinic locally but they will put you on a course of 'MethoJohne' :blink: 

I find the JG connection to a vein in the arm simpler to connect a beer line directly to the glass, so I can take my ESB intreveiniously . 

Saves all that old fashioned drinking .

Pumpy


----------



## PistolPatch (20/11/07)

Pumpy,

Your gravity filtering has been a God-send. Really been enjoying it. Thanks mate!

Came up with a few other uses of the lid and Doogie's taps on the last 2 brews. nstead of posting the details here I might link your thread and post up the details in that old thread, "Things To Make Your Brew Day Easier. I think your thread here should be linked to that one for sure!

Thanks again,
Pat


----------



## deckedoutdaz (25/11/07)

I tried the gravity method and after filtering 2 kegs it slowed to a trickle so i sanitised this pump and whamo!...so i bought a cheap $15 trolley from supercheap and fixed the whole lot to it, makes everything so much easier, took an idea, added to it and there it is......

Daz


----------



## Pumpy (25/11/07)

PistolPatch said:


> Pumpy,
> 
> Your gravity filtering has been a God-send. Really been enjoying it. Thanks mate!
> 
> ...



Hey PP it was you and Doogie that helped me and pure 'Serendipity' that I noticed it worked by gravity alone , I like reading Mobriens post "Things To Make Your Brew Day Easier". it s got some great ideas in 


Pumpy


----------



## cliffo (25/11/07)

Pumpy said:


> Hey PP it was you and Doogie that helped me and pure 'Serendipity' that I noticed it worked by gravity alone , I like reading Mobriens post "Things To Make Your Brew Day Easier". it s got some great ideas in
> Pumpy



Hey Pumpy,

Do you use standard beer line for your gravity feeding?

I use JG line and can't seem to get a good flow going (lots of bubbles etc....) Prob takes 30mins to filter 19litres or so.

cheers,
cliffo


----------



## Doogiechap (25/11/07)

cliffo said:


> Hey Pumpy,
> 
> Do you use standard beer line for your gravity feeding?
> 
> ...


G'day Cliffo,
my last effort was about 20 mins with standard beer line. A couple of points, make sure you purge all of the air/ co2 out of your filter to ensure the maximum surface area of your filter is being utilised. Secondly the higher you can place your fermenter with respect to your filter and keg the faster the transfer. I've just bought a 60 litre fermenter for 40l batches so will need to munch on my Weetbix before doing some risky lifting  .
Cheers
Doug


----------



## cliffo (25/11/07)

Doogiechap said:


> G'day Cliffo,
> my last effort was about 20 mins with standard beer line. A couple of points, make sure you purge all of the air/ co2 out of your filter to ensure the maximum surface area of your filter is being utilised. Secondly the higher you can place your fermenter with respect to your filter and keg the faster the transfer. I've just bought a 60 litre fermenter for 40l batches so will need to munch on my Weetbix before doing some risky lifting  .
> Cheers
> Doug



Just remember "bend at the knees" :lol: 

I was purging the air...maybe i haven't got it all out, hence the bubbles - will have to try again next time


----------



## Pumpy (25/11/07)

cliffo said:


> Hey Pumpy,
> 
> Do you use standard beer line for your gravity feeding?
> 
> ...




Cliffo I use a combination of 8mm & 3/8" line fittings but 8MM is fine .

make sure you chill the fermenter for a day or two to drop the yeast out of suspension 

You must bleed your filter to let the air out .

But hey dont worry if you get some in I have never had a problem with oxidising the beer .

You dont have to wait for 15 -20 mins to watch all the beer go through the fermenter ( a watch pot never boils )

just release the valve on the keg and go away and enjoya beer and your favourite program on the TV for that time 

Cliffo forcing beer through your filter with a pump or gas is really for the impatient, it is not conducive to good filtering ,as you want it togently pass through the filter .

Trust me it works if you have the right filter .

Pumpy


----------



## Doogiechap (25/11/07)

cliffo said:


> Just remember "bend at the knees" :lol:
> 
> I was purging the air...maybe i haven't got it all out, hence the bubbles - will have to try again next time


Bloke the other thing that happens to me sometimes is the disolved CO2 comes out into the filter housing reducing the liquid level. A quick press on the purge button now and then will kep thing in check.  
Cheers
Doug


----------



## kook (25/11/07)

Doogie, I'd get a hand lifting those. I don't trust the handles on them once you've got 50 kilos worth of liquid in them. Really need two people, holding both the handles and the base of the fermenter. Last thing you want is a 50kg vessel dropping on your foot, then spilling beer everywhere!


----------



## pokolbinguy (25/11/07)

deckedoutdaz said:


> I tried the gravity method and after filtering 2 kegs it slowed to a trickle so i sanitised this pump and whamo!...so i bought a cheap $15 trolley from supercheap and fixed the whole lot to it, makes everything so much easier, took an idea, added to it and there it is......
> 
> Daz




Nice idea with the trolley.

Where did you get the pump?

Pok


----------



## cliffo (25/11/07)

Pumpy said:


> Cliffo I use a combination of 8mm & 3/8" line fittings but 8MM is fine .
> 
> make sure you chill the fermenter for a day or two to drop the yeast out of suspension
> 
> ...



Thanks for the tips - I used to use CO2 to push things through but gave up when I was needing a refill every 6 months.

I've done a couple of batches via the gravity method but the last two really seemed to take an eternity and lotsa bubbles in the line.

Will certainly be giving it another go on the next batch.


----------



## Pumpy (25/11/07)

Doogiechap said:


> G'day Cliffo,
> my last effort was about 20 mins with standard beer line. A couple of points, make sure you purge all of the air/ co2 out of your filter to ensure the maximum surface area of your filter is being utilised. Secondly the higher you can place your fermenter with respect to your filter and keg the faster the transfer. I've just bought a 60 litre fermenter for 40l batches so will need to munch on my Weetbix before doing some risky lifting  .
> Cheers
> Doug




Steady with the60 litre fermenter , I have one and the amount of times that I have pulled a muscle in my back lifting it into and out of the fridge dont bear thinking about  

Pumpy


----------



## Trough Lolly (27/11/07)

G'day all....congrats on a great thread! :super: 

Now I have a confession or two to make...I haven't got a filter nor have I ever used JG fittings...So, I want to get cracking on the Xmas lobbying to score a filter unit!

Has anyone managed to transfer under gravity using the 0.35 micron filter that country brewer flogs?

Cheers,
TL


----------



## captaincleanoff (23/12/07)

how does one purge the filter using the gravity method? Just got a filter, and I'm not quite clear on how to purge it. Do you connect co2 to it before hand to purge, then connect the beer? Or do you let the beer flow in, and then purge?


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## Thirsty Boy (23/12/07)

captaincleanoff said:


> how does one purge the filter using the gravity method? Just got a filter, and I'm not quite clear on how to purge it. Do you connect co2 to it before hand to purge, then connect the beer? Or do you let the beer flow in, and then purge?



I suspect that a lot of people just let beer run into it and hold down the purge button till beer comes out. That would expose the first litre or so to oxygen but the rest would be fine.

Me personally - I fill my filter housing up with no-rinse sanitiser (starsan) and then blow that out with C02.. then I know my lines and filter are sanitised and don't have any air at all in them. I only worry about purging the filter to make it work effectively, not for removing O2.

When I run out of beer in the fermentor, I disconnect the keg and I turn the filter upside down and drain the remaining beer in it (usually have to blow on the inlet side a bit) into a PET bottle. It gets force carbed (carbonator cap) as my test bottle. Drunk within an hour or so of being filled so infection from blowing the beer through by mouth isn't a problem.

No waste and I don't even worry too much about stirring the fermentors up or letting them crash out too clear... hell, I usually tilt the fermentor and filter half the yeast cake before I call it quits. Yesterday I managed to get 38L of kolsch filtered, left less than 2L of yeast slurry behind between the two fermentors and the flow rate was till OK at the end. Mind you... I run the line down a flight of stairs, so I have a pretty good head height. Still, on a single batch I just go from the top of my fridge until the stuff coming out of the fermentor into the filter is basically solid and wont actually flow!

Cheers

Thirsty


----------



## captaincleanoff (23/12/07)

thanks Thirsty, that clears things up. Sounds like you have it down!


----------



## Thirsty Boy (23/12/07)

Oh ..... I make it sound good, but you should see me running around the place swearing when something springs a leak


----------



## SpillsMostOfIt (23/12/07)

I filtered my first batch just the other day into a party keg and some bottles. There was about three vertical metres between fermenter and filter and it all kinda just happened through 15metres of BEVA hose. I screwed fermenter taps into both sides of the filter housing and used 'standard' silicon tube to connect John Guest connectors to the fermenter taps to the BEVA hose. It was then just the standard plastic hose to little bottler.

I reckon I will do it better next time, but it is about as easy as it should be and you do get to have a bottle or two at either end that has to be force-carbonated and tested reasonably soon if you don't want to fart around with CO2-flushing the whole system...


----------



## cliffo (4/1/08)

Hi Guys,

I'm needing some help with a filtering problem I'm having.

I'm able to filter about 10-12 litres without any issues and at good speed, however, after this the line out of the fermenter gets a lot of air bubbles forming to the point where the flow stops completely.

My set up is pretty much identical to Pumpy's, with the chilled beer in the fermenter sitting on the kitchen bench, filter housing on a chair and then the keg on the floor.

My process is I hold down the filter housing's relief valve until beer starts to come out of the top, then open the ball valve on the out side of the housing. The flow starts fine until the above mentioned problem occurs each time.

Can anyone help shed some light on what I may be doing wrong?

The only thing I can think of is that maybe the filter needs replacing as I've given it a good workout (using CO2 to push the beer through) over the last 12+ months.

Any ideas or suggestions?

Cheers,
cliffo


----------



## Thirsty Boy (5/1/08)

Is the air able to get into the fermentor via an unrestricted path?? if your running a sanitary filter as the air inlet, maybe its restricting the airflow too much and once the liquid starts running, the whole fermentor is under a little bit of vacuum, therefore the pulling in of bubbles at the connection between filter and line??

I get a bit of bubble action happening, but its usually coming out of the filter... been wondering whether its just outgassing of C02, or whether maybe the fittings aren't sealing as well against vacuum as they are against outwards leaking. Its gets worse a the filter gets more and more clogged, so the flow restriction is above the point where bubbles happen, the weight of the liquid in the line below is pulling a vacuum and sucking in the air??

I'm going to get a thingy to cut my lines more squarely and cleanly, and next time I filter, maybe put a dab of keg sealant on the end of the lines where they go into the JG fittings. Perhaps you could try that as well? When we are sure that all our fitting are sealing properly, then I suppose we will both need to go looking for other answers

Thirsty


----------



## Pumpy (5/1/08)

cliffo said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I'm needing some help with a filtering problem I'm having.
> 
> ...



Cliffo ,

if you are getting air bubbles, I take it you are bleeding the air out again if there is any more build up of air in the filter .

I use the one micron absolute USA filter exactly as this http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/details.asp?PID=723

What micron are you using I have not tried it with a 0.35 micron absolute filter 

Are you using the JG fitting ? so it dont suck in air (they dont need lubrication)

Pumpy


----------



## cliffo (5/1/08)

Pumpy said:


> Cliffo ,
> 
> if you are getting air bubbles, I take it you are bleeding the air out again if there is any more build up of air in the filter .
> 
> ...



Pumpy,

I'm using the same filter as you, JG fittings and bleed the air out but it does not seem to get the flow going again.

I just finished running 20L of water through the system as a test and it handled that without any bubbles at all, then again it was just water so not much to filter.

I'm going to pull the unit apart then put all the bits back together and give it another go.

Fingers crossed that will work. Other than that the only thing I can think is I do need a new filter.

Will report back later today on thel atest attempt.

TB - I agree with Pumpy re not needing to lube the line going into the JG fittings

cliffo


----------



## Ross (5/1/08)

Cliffo,

To me, it sounds like either trapped air or CO2 coming out of solution, which is then rising to the top, traveling up your inline & restricting the flow.
Once you have purged your canister via the relief valve, simply turn your filter canister upside down, so any gas will rise to the bottom of the filter unit, away from the connectors - this should solve your problem.
We are currently designing a new set up with a sturdy base, thet will run in this configuration, making the unit more stable (lines at base of unit) while reducing the risk of oxidisation. 

Cheers Ross


----------



## Ross (5/1/08)

Thirsty Boy said:


> I'm going to get a thingy to cut my lines more squarely and cleanly, and next time I filter, maybe put a dab of keg sealant on the end of the lines where they go into the JG fittings. Perhaps you could try that as well? When we are sure that all our fitting are sealing properly, then I suppose we will both need to go looking for other answers
> 
> Thirsty



Thirsty,

It won't be leaking fittings - if they were leaking you'd be getting beer everywhere. The fittings are designed to handle huge pressures without leaking & the lines should not be greased.

Cheers Ross


----------



## Thirsty Boy (6/1/08)

Ross said:


> Thirsty,
> 
> It won't be leaking fittings - if they were leaking you'd be getting beer everywhere. The fittings are designed to handle huge pressures without leaking & the lines should not be greased.
> 
> Cheers Ross




I agree, the design of the JG fittings actually seal tighter when subject to increasing internal pressure; but I'm talking about sealing against vacuum not internal pressure trying to escape, and the JG fittings handle the two different things in a different way...

Not having the ends cut neatly square shouldn't really effect the fittings ability to deal with internal pressure trying to escape... not so with the fittings ability to deal with a vacuum. And if the system is in a state of reduced pressure due to the liquid weight of a running syphon.... then it could be in a state of (admittedly slight) vacuum

In my instance, I suspect the filter housing leaking more than the JG fittings, but the JG fittings are by no means foolproof (I'm a fool thats made them leak) and especially under a vacuum, there is indeed a chance that one of them could let in air if its not put together properly.

Lube - nothing in the design of a JG fitting suggests to me that lube could possibly hurt, and seeing as in the end its just a tube shoved in a tight fitting O'ring.. it might help. They aren't magic and lube does tend to help most O'ring solutions.

The escaped C02 things is pretty reasonable... but you'd think it would be happening to most people who filter via gravity, and it doesn't seem to be, apart from that Cliffo, if you can work out how bubbles are magically appearing in a line who's beginning is under 10 or so litres of liquid, then the most logical place to start looking for the source would be the connections, or a hole in the line.


----------



## Screwtop (6/1/08)

Going to try the gravity method. How does everyone connect from the fermenter to the filter. I saw Pumpy's stainless steel bushes with the JG fittings screwed in, but what about a tap. To use the system without a tap you would need to have it all connected then rack to the fermenter. 

Pumpy, do you have all of your fermenters fitted with the bushes? Do you use a tap on a short length of line on each one? Where did you source the SS bushes?

I bought some fittings and a SS valve, but it all looks far to vulnerable, sticks out of the bottom of the fermenter, plus costly to fit to all of my fermenters. Thought about having one fermenter fitted out in this way to rack to before filtering, but this is adding more steps to a simple process, more cleaning and time.

Screwy


----------



## Ross (6/1/08)

Thirsty Boy said:


> I agree, the design of the JG fittings actually seal tighter when subject to increasing internal pressure; but I'm talking about sealing against vacuum not internal pressure trying to escape, and the JG fittings handle the two different things in a different way...
> 
> Not having the ends cut neatly square shouldn't really effect the fittings ability to deal with internal pressure trying to escape... not so with the fittings ability to deal with a vacuum. And if the system is in a state of reduced pressure due to the liquid weight of a running syphon.... then it could be in a state of (admittedly slight) vacuum
> 
> ...



Thirsty, I'd be amazed if it's a leak, the only negative pressure with a syphon is above fermenter level & that's easily sorted by having a continuous line; the rest of the system including the filter is under positve pressure. Also, Cliffo says his system is the same as Pumpy's, & that comes out the fermenter tap from memory, so no negative pressures at all.

While the fermenter is full there is enough head pressure to keep the CO2 out the lines, as the volume drops the CO2 gets the upper hand. Also, any CO2 coming out of solution is all collecting at the top of the unit, again increasing the chance of the CO2 gaining the upper hand as the beer filtering rate slows due to the cartridge clogging up.

There are not that many people gravity filtering yet, so results will be very thin on the ground. Different fermentation regimes like warming the beer before chilling phase are going to have an effect on amount of CO2 dissolved etc. What yeast you are using, how long you leave your beer to clear, will all also affect flow rates & abillity to filter purely under gravity. I've filtered many beers where the gravity method will not work; the cartridge has slowly clogged & needed increasing pressures up to 100kpa to get any flow, so Cliffos problem may be purely that as well.

cheers Ross


----------



## cliffo (6/1/08)

Screwtop said:


> Going to try the gravity method. How does everyone connect from the fermenter to the filter. I saw Pumpy's stainless steel bushes with the JG fittings screwed in, but what about a tap. To use the system without a tap you would need to have it all connected then rack to the fermenter.
> 
> Pumpy, do you have all of your fermenters fitted with the bushes? Do you use a tap on a short length of line on each one? Where did you source the SS bushes?
> 
> ...



Screwy,

I'm using a 3/4" to 1/4" plastic bush with plastic ball valve screwed into that and then a JG straight adapter screwed into the BV with a JG stem elbow into that (all available from Ross).

This allows me to filter direct from primary plus makes it a breeze to take hydro samples along the way.

Probably cost about $27 for this setup but you could do away with the stem elbow which would bring it back to near $20.

If you didn't want to do this to all your fermenters I guess you could have one of these attached to one fermenter or cube and simply rack your brews into it then filter.

cliffo


----------



## Pumpy (6/1/08)

Screwtop said:


> Going to try the gravity method. How does everyone connect from the fermenter to the filter. I saw Pumpy's stainless steel bushes with the JG fittings screwed in, but what about a tap. To use the system without a tap you would need to have it all connected then rack to the fermenter.
> 
> Pumpy, do you have all of your fermenters fitted with the bushes? Do you use a tap on a short length of line on each one? Where did you source the SS bushes?
> 
> ...




This is the same fitting in plastic http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/details.asp?PID=722

, I got the SS ones from the Blackwoods catalogue 

all my fermenters are fitted with the bushes and a tap . In the pic it show the Bush and a tap with the grey fitting converts this tap from 3/8 OD to 5/16mm OD(beer line)

The pipe between the tap is 3/8 OD


----------



## Screwtop (6/1/08)

Pumpy said:


> This is the same fitting in plastic http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/details.asp?PID=722
> 
> , I got the SS ones from the Blackwoods catalogue
> 
> ...



Thanks Pump, do you have all your fermenters fitted out like this or do you only have one and rack to it? Sorry, more questions than Tony Barber, I know!


----------



## Pumpy (6/1/08)

Screwtop said:


> Thanks Pump, do you have all your fermenters fitted out like this or do you only have one and rack to it? Sorry, more questions than Tony Barber, I know!




Screwy ,

No racking is a thing of the past for me and long CC , All my fermenters I have converted this way .

It really works well I have had no problems at all .

"Some day all serious home brewers will handle thier beer this way " 

Pumpy


----------



## Thirsty Boy (7/1/08)

Screwy,

I have mine set-up just like cliffo (without the stem elbow) works a treat. Its just like a normal fermentor with a tap, but my tap can have 8mm OD line connected straight into it. It sticks out just a few mm more than a standard fermentor tap would.


Ross,

You're of course right about the lack of vacuum in a syphon system, except where the inflow of air into the fermentor might be restricted. Remember I was originally talking about a situation where a sterile filter might be being used on the air inlet to guard against infection... if the restriction through the filter were too high, as the head pressure of the liquid lowered, then the lower pressure inside the fermentor could well get close to balancing out the head pressure. That would leave a situation where a leaky connection could allow air bubbles to be pulled in by the syphon action. 

It is however far more likely that your scenario is the one thats happening and its just a build up of C02 coming out of solution. I like your remedy too. Turn the housing upside down to keep the gas away from the line. With the clear housing, you can even see if the gas builds up too much, turn it over again and purge it. Nice.

Still... wouldn't hurt to make sure the ends of your line are nice and square and that the JG fittings are in good nick. I have broken one or two of the fittings "teeth" in the past and then they still mostly seal, but if you pull the line at certain angles... leaky leak. Its worth a look down the business end of the fitting just to make sure that there are still the full complement of 5 little grey plastic leaves with the little metal blades.

Thirsty


----------



## Screwtop (7/1/08)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Screwy,
> 
> I have mine set-up just like cliffo (without the stem elbow) works a treat. Its just like a normal fermentor with a tap, but my tap can have 8mm OD line connected straight into it. It sticks out just a few mm more than a standard fermentor tap would.
> Ross,
> ...



Thanks Thirsty, the adapter with a short length of 3/8 hose and tap appeals to me. The fermenter taps have always been a pita for me. My ferm fridge fits two fermenters but they have to be positioned with the taps on an angle, can be difficult taking refrac samples, think the hose would protrude from the fermenter less than the fermenter tap giving a little more room and being able to maneuver the tap on a short length of hose could make sampling easier.

Thanks for the heads up on the JG "teeth" also.

Screwy


----------



## HKS (8/1/08)

Pumpy I notice you don't run a line from the gas in from the keg back to the fermenter airlock grommet. That would make it a fully sealed system. I know people don't think the short exposure period to oxygen would affect it. I was thinking of purging the keg with CO2, then have a tap on the gas line that you could shutoff so that when you disconnect it the gas stays in the line, disconnecting the CO2 from the gas bottle, then put that end into the fermenter airlock. Turn the tap back on so it creates a fully sealed system. 

I've gone away from the idea of using the larger lines or fermenter taps because of turbulence it may create. I'm not going to use any 90deg connections either for the same reason. I'm just going to use regular beer line and JG fittines.

What's your opinion on doing this?


----------



## Pumpy (8/1/08)

HKS said:


> Pumpy I notice you don't run a line from the gas in from the keg back to the fermenter airlock grommet. That would make it a fully sealed system. I know people don't think the short exposure period to oxygen would affect it. I was thinking of purging the keg with CO2, then have a tap on the gas line that you could shutoff so that when you disconnect it the gas stays in the line, disconnecting the CO2 from the gas bottle, then put that end into the fermenter airlock. Turn the tap back on so it creates a fully sealed system.
> 
> I've gone away from the idea of using the larger lines or fermenter taps because of turbulence it may create. I'm not going to use any 90deg connections either for the same reason. I'm just going to use regular beer line and JG fittines.
> 
> What's your opinion on doing this?




Sounds a plausible idea HSK ,would the gas not blow thought the beer in the fermenter ?

Pumpy


----------



## HKS (8/1/08)

Pumpy said:


> Sounds a plausible idea HSK ,would the gas not blow thought the beer in the fermenter ?
> 
> Pumpy




:lol: I'm having a little trouble understanding your Engrish!  

Would the gas blow through the beer in the fermenter I think is what you were trying to say? The idea would be to not have a lot of gas pressure. Just a few psi to purge the keg. I'm assuming that pressure would then equalize once the beer started to flow and the flow pressure would then just be the pressure the gravity filtering creates?

So if the beer absorbs the gas pressure that would actually be a plus I think, reducing the pressure to only gravity filtering pressure. If you get what I mean.


----------



## HKS (8/1/08)

Another bonus of using the "Closed loop gravity filtering" would be that you would know when the keg was full (albeit over-full) when the beer starts coming out the gas line.


----------



## Pumpy (8/1/08)

HKS said:


> :lol: I'm having a little trouble understanding your Engrish!
> 
> Would the gas blow through the beer in the fermenter I think is what you were trying to say? The idea would be to not have a lot of gas pressure. Just a few psi to purge the keg. I'm assuming that pressure would then equalize once the beer started to flow and the flow pressure would then just be the pressure the gravity filtering creates?
> 
> So if the beer absorbs the gas pressure that would actually be a plus I think, reducing the pressure to only gravity filtering pressure. If you get what I mean.




I may give that a try  

Pumpy


----------



## HKS (8/1/08)

Pumpy said:


> I may give that a try
> 
> Pumpy



Be good if you could mate to test the Closed Loop Gravity filtering theory. I haven't got a filter yet, in the middle of moving house and won't get one until I've moved (maybe). Although I have a batch ready to go, but Ross is out of filters I believe. I really wanted to filter this batch. I might have to if I get desperate to get it elsewhere (Clarence Water Filters). Any ETA Ross on the new filter kit?

This also might fix some peoples problems who are having trouble with air bubbles and the filtering stopping and them having to purge the filter again to get it to continue filtering.


----------



## Kingy (8/1/08)

HKS said:


> I really wanted to filter this batch. Any ETA Ross on the new filter kit?.


Ditto


----------



## Ross (8/1/08)

HKS said:


> Be good if you could mate to test the Closed Loop Gravity filtering theory. I haven't got a filter yet, in the middle of moving house and won't get one until I've moved (maybe). Although I have a batch ready to go, but Ross is out of filters I believe. I really wanted to filter this batch. I might have to if I get desperate to get it elsewhere (Clarence Water Filters). Any ETA Ross on the new filter kit?
> 
> This also might fix some peoples problems who are having trouble with air bubbles and the filtering stopping and them having to purge the filter again to get it to continue filtering.



Friday this week they'll be on the site.

cheers Ross


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## Pumpy (8/1/08)

Ross said:


> Friday this week they'll be on the site.
> 
> cheers Ross



I would like a clear filter housing for my birthday 

Pumpy


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## PistolPatch (10/1/08)

HKS said:


> Be good if you could mate to test the Closed Loop Gravity filtering theory.



The closed loop works fine mate. I thought I wrote a post on that here but can't find it - could have been a late night one and been deleted :icon_cheers: 

I use a bulkhead connector in the lid of the fermenter but a lot of airlock grommets are close to 8mm and should do just as well, certainly well enough to prevent any oxidisation. The only advantage of the correct connector would be in a case of accidental over-fill - at least you won't have beer everywhere.

As a matter of interest, my most recent filterings have also been done with the fermenter still in the fridge which is only about 1200mm off the ground. Works well and saves lifting although once the fermenter is about two thirds empty, I'll sometimes lift it on to the top of the fridge to speed things up.

Spot ya,
Pat


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## Kingy (18/1/08)

Ross said:


> Cliffo,
> 
> To me, it sounds like either trapped air or CO2 coming out of solution, which is then rising to the top, traveling up your inline & restricting the flow.
> Once you have purged your canister via the relief valve, simply turn your filter canister upside down, so any gas will rise to the bottom of the filter unit, away from the connectors - this should solve your problem.
> ...



Exactly what i was looking for. Is this the procedure to follow for gravity filtering.

1. Submerse everything in iodopher including filter. Then drain off.
2. hook everything up.
3. Turn the flow on and let cannister fill up with the relief valve (at the top) depressed untill beer is just about to come out.
4. Turn cannister around so lines are at the bottum (with relief valve).
5. Have a beer and come back later.

surely ive missed something :huh: That sounds like its way to easy.

Looking to filter my 1st batch today.

P.S I thought that you couldnt bottle cold beer. I was under the impresion that it had to warm up before bottling.


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## Ross (18/1/08)

Kingy said:


> Exactly what i was looking for. Is this the procedure to follow for gravity filtering.
> 
> 1. Submerse everything in iodopher including filter. Then drain off.
> 2. hook everything up.
> ...



Just make sure your recieving keg is below your fermenter & you're there :super: 

Cheers Ross


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## Kingy (18/1/08)

cheers thx guys
also a question for PP

do i leave the plastic on the filter  :lol:


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## altstart (18/1/08)

PP is the man to ask.
 
Cheers Altstart


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## PistolPatch (18/1/08)

Yes, plastic is best left on to maximise cartridge life. Full details from this post on.

:icon_cheers:
Pat


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## cliffo (27/1/08)

Hey guys,

Just an update on my gravity filtering exploits.

I replaced the filter with a new one and the whole process went through without any issues. 

Didn't have to invert the housing either so I'm thinking that maybe the old filter was at the end of its life.

Anyway, I'm happy now I've got this gravity filtering thing working well.

cliffo


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