# Willamette Lager?



## sparkycameron (8/6/13)

Hey all,

I have some Willamette Hops sitting in my freezer, and at the same time, My far better half wants a pilsner in 2 months (currently pregnant), so I figured that I could do both at the same time... problem is, I'm yet to find a recipe that does that combo??? 

Anyone done anything similar? This is something like I'll be trying: (BIAB - NC)


Recipe Specifications -------------------------- 
Boil Size: 9.82 l 
Post Boil Volume: 8.99 l 
Batch Size (fermenter): 20.00 l 
Bottling Volume: 19.05 l 
Estimated OG: 1.048 SG 
Estimated Color: 7.4 EBC 
Estimated IBU: 32.5 IBUs 
Brewhouse Efficiency: 68.00 % 
Est Mash Efficiency: 68.0 % 
Boil Time: 60 Minutes Ingredients: 
------------ 
Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
4.44 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (3.9 EBC) Grain 1 96.8 % 
0.15 kg Cara-Pils/Dextrine (3.9 EBC) Grain 2 3.2 % 
45.00 g Willamette [5.50 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 3 21.7 IBUs 
20.00 g Willamette [5.50 %] - Boil 45.0 min Hop 4 8.3 IBUs 
16.00 g Willamette [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 5 2.6 IBUs 
1.0 pkg Urquell Lager (Wyeast Labs #2001) [124.2 Yeast 6 - 
How is this going to fly? any thoughts?


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## Dan Pratt (8/6/13)

I like it. what temp are you planning to mash and ferment at?


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## sparkycameron (8/6/13)

No idea as yet... Thinking a little warmer mash after a 20min protien rest, but haven't gotten that far


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## Nick JD (8/6/13)

Willamette is Fuggles is Tettnang.


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## Bribie G (8/6/13)

Was originally Fuggles. Styrian Goldings were originally fuggles, nothing like them nowadays. A bit like your new avatar isn't Sir Isaac Newton.


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## sparkycameron (9/6/13)

was aware of it's origin, has anyone tried this? if not, why not?


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## bradsbrew (9/6/13)

Do you chill or no-chill?
Have you got any saaz you could use as the late hops?

Never used Williamette in a lager but have used others as such as columbus, cascade or Vic secret as a bittering only hop in lagers and they have worked well.

If I was experimenting with it, I would go all the williamette at 45 to the required IBU then dump some saaz into the whirlpool.

Cheers


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## sparkycameron (9/6/13)

No chill, have no saaz.. originally i was just going to punch out a pretty standard german pilsner and then got given some hops from the yakima valley, so want to use that instead, it certainly wouldn't hurt to use the saaz though to keep it roughly pilsner like but I was just wondering if Willamette would ruin it if used as an aroma / flavour hop as well....


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## Cube (9/6/13)

This may help you.


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## manticle (9/6/13)

Nick JD said:


> Willamette is Fuggles is Tettnang.



When?


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## Florian (9/6/13)

Sparkycameron, go for it. I can't say I'm very familiar with Willamette, but I'd try any hop in a lager.

Currently have a Cascade Pils on tap and I find it works beautifully. Additions at 40, 10, 5 and 0 minutes from memory.

Stella is another great one. No need to stay with Nobles unless you're brewing for comps or tradition.


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## Nick JD (9/6/13)

manticle said:


> When?


Yonks ago!

They found some hops growing on Mr Fuggles estate that were from Tettnang. Williamette is US grown fuggles.

They all taste like mushroom compost.


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## bradsbrew (9/6/13)

Nick JD said:


> Williamette is US grown fuggles.
> 
> They all taste like mushroom compost.


But it is nothing like fuggles. I like williamette but hate fuggles. Fuggles throws a flavour that is like boiled peanuts. But I like boiled peanuts. Had never seen it compared to tett though.


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## Nick JD (9/6/13)

_Willamette Hops was named after the mighty river that pours through the *Willamette* Valley in Southern Washington and Northern Oregon. It was developed and released by the U.S.D.A in 1976 and has taken root on the craft brewing industry and accounts for about 20% of total U.S. hops acreage. Willamette was a triploid seedling of Fuggle, which is a quintessential English variety that has shaped decades of brewing._

I have a dislike of "earthy" hops - so they taste really similar to me - eg. both earthy.

Also - here's the connections, though as you mention, the varieties have diversified significantly, but they share parentage.

_Fuggle is an English hop cultivar. Sometimes considered an English landrace, Fuggles were seedling selected in England in 1875. The true Fuggle (English) is sometimes considered a noble hop, and while it is sometimes considered inferior to Golding hop varieties such as the famous East Kent Goldings, Fuggle's flavor and aroma are deeply characteristic of English beer._

_Fuggles Around the World_
_Most landrace hop varieties do not produce the same results when transplanted around the world, and as with most other European hops, American Fuggles are not as highly regarded as the true English Fuggle. Fuggle, however, does seem to be one of the easiest to grow of the traditional European hops, and to retain more of a noble character wherever it is grown. As a result, in addition to being grown around the world as Fuggle, this cultivar has at times stood in for other noble hops._
_For example, the Styrian Goldings grown in Austria and Slovenia are not in fact true Golding hops but Fuggles, which may have been mislabeled by the growers for marketing reasons or may have been sold to the Styrians as "Fuggles Golding" in the first place for much the same reason. Also, the "Swiss Tettnanger" traditionally grown in Switzerland appears to be Fuggle or a closely related hop, and, probably as a result, the hops grown as "Tettnanger" in the United States and Australia also appear to be Fuggles._
_The worldwide popularity of this hop, and its ability to fit in for different noble hops in different parts of the world, is a good indicator of this hop's quality and durability, and makes it worth a look both for homebrewers and for home hop growers._


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## manticle (9/6/13)

Tettnanger and fuggles are worlds apart.

I'm aware that willamette is US grown fuggles which makes it not fuggles. Might as well say Cz. Saaz is Riwaka.


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## mje1980 (9/6/13)

Love willamette, not sure I'd be game to use it in a lager. Have a porter with 3 willamette additions in the keg. Nummy num num


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## Nick JD (9/6/13)

manticle said:


> Tettnanger and fuggles are worlds apart.
> 
> I'm aware that willamette is US grown fuggles which makes it not fuggles. Might as well say Cz. Saaz is Riwaka.


Unless you buy US Tett, which is Fuggles.


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## Bribie G (9/6/13)

I reckon that the Marco Polo wasn't Fuggles.


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