# Low Carb Coopers Pale Ale - Malt Or Dextrose?



## Bremmario (8/6/09)

I'm running out of beer and it's time for a new brew.

I'm fairly new to the game but I'm lovin' the steady supply of 25c beers. So far I've brewed all coopers concentrate kits - draught, lager and a few pales.

I've decided I need to lose some weight though but at the same time I refuse to stop drinking beer, I'm sure you all know what I'm talkin' about!

I have the following ingredients:

coopers pale concentrate kit
20kg light dry malt extract
25kg dextrose
packet of dry enzyme


1. What sugar will work best and how much? If I use malt instead of dextrose will it be any tastier or will it just be a waste of malt?

2. Furthermore, how much sugar will I need? The brew store guy told me 500g of 'sugar' as the enzyme will allow the yeast to eat up the more complex sugars, but I forgot to ask about malt vs dextrose.

3. Is 1 gram of light dry malt extract equivalent to 1 gram of dextrose in terms of fermentability?

4. I bottle ferment, will the dry enzyme mean that I need to put less sugar in each bottle or risk over carbonation/bottle bombs?

5. Would it be worthwhile investing in a hops teabag for this brew?


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## chappo1970 (8/6/09)

PM Sully for his "All Ranga Ale" recipe.. :chug: 

I think its Can of Coopers Draught and 10kg of Dex and 2ltrs of lemon juice from woolies and a used tampon.. Ferment at 50degrees.. :super: 

Chappo


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## slacka (8/6/09)

Bremmario said:


> coopers pale concentrate kit
> 20kg light dry malt extract
> 25kg dextrose
> packet of dry enzyme


You will find that the dry enzyme will pretty much strip any malt flavour from your beer leaving you with something rather crisp almost watery. Your final gravity will also be much, much lower - as expected - somewhere around the 0.996 mark thus you will need to ease back on the sugar additions. As you 'brew shop guy' said, 500g is about right.

In the absence of enzyme, malt extract helps add mouth feel and body to your beer. However in this circumstance you may as well be adding white sugar.

You should still carbonate at the same rate as sugar pretty much ferments out regardless of enzyme.

I like to give my beers that little extra finish with hops tea. It imparts a beautiful aroma to your beer.


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## AndrewQLD (8/6/09)

Ignore Chappo, he's just getting his post count up. Slacka is pretty much on the money.

The dextrose will give you a dryer beer, but at the expense of flavor and mouth feel, the malt will give you more flavor but also more mouth feel.
If you want a dryer beer use the dextrose. the enzyme will give you a very thin, dry watery beer.

Andrew


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## Rodolphe01 (8/6/09)

1g malt does not = 1g dextrose in terms of fermentability - it is something pretty close to 1.3g malt = 1g dextrose.

Since you mention wanting to lose weight, rather than actually desiring a dry beer, you are probably more concerned with the total energy content of the beer. The bulk of the energy in beer comes from the alcohol, not residual carbs floating about. And if you use an enzyme those carbs floating about will ferment to alcohol making a higher alcohol beer, i.e. the energy is still there (unless you use less malt). But as others have said, if you are going to use malt and enzyme, you might as well just use dex as the enzyme destroys the malt characteristics. Unfortunately you can't have your cake and eat it too.

So in conclusion, the only real solutions in my opinion are:
1. Drink less
2. Drink lower alcohol beer
3. Trim away kilojoules in other areas of your diet
4. Exercise to off-set the energy intake from beer (be prepared to move a lot!)


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## Bremmario (9/6/09)

Thanks for the advice fellas - except for the tampon based advice, I don't think I'm quite that advanced a brewer.

I'll try it out with some malt, hopefully preserve some flavour and texture.


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## AussieJosh (9/6/09)

Stuff trying to lose weight by drinking low carb beer shit! Make the pale the way Coopers intends it! Recommended to be brewed with 1kg of Coopers Brew Enhancer2. But Paul From Coopers recomends this to get it more like the comercial pale ale..... try using 500g Coopers Light Dry Malt and 250g Dextrose/Sugar.

Drink as much GOOD BEER as you can! Also Eat as much GOOD FOOD as you can! not junk/fatty foods combined with some excersise and youll be fine! better to sacrifice tasty food instead of tasty beer!


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## Bremmario (16/6/09)

I didn't realise this was a diet advice forum haha.

Aside from the beer, I'm all over the diet, I'm an amateur bodybuilder so I'm not trying to lose a gut.

I just thought I'd give making a tasty low carb a try, I know I'm unlikely to succeed if the commercial guys can't make a tasty low carb beer - and lets face it, they haven't thus far.

As far as hops bags are concerned, am I right in thinking that the kind of impact this has on a beer is perhaps analogous to the difference between say the flat lack of aroma on a beer such as a tooheys pilsner versus a little creatures bright ale? Both tasty in my mind but, the creatures clearly a massive cut above.

If anyone has made a low carb beer with a hops bag I'd be very much interested in hearing about the result.

If I can succeed in making an even moderately tasty low carb beer, when it's beer time I'll just drink 2 full carb awesome homebrews, then when I don't care/can't tell I'll drink 8 of the the low carbs!


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## Adamt (16/6/09)

If you're all over the bodybuilding diet, then you should know that it's only the alcohol that is the issue. The carbohydrate content is moot when you compare it to the alcohol.

If you like alcohol more than bodybuilding, just drink whatever... the small benefit a low carb beer will bring is grossly outweighed by the effort required to make/perfect a good low carb beer. If you like bodybuilding more than alcohol then look into lower-alcohol beers or just drink less. It's quite easy to make full-bodied low-alcohol beers, with hop character if you want it.

Oh... and LCBA has a slightly fuller, sweeter malt profile and as you guessed, a hop flavour profile, where Tooheys pilsner (as far as i can recall!) has little of either.


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## bum (16/6/09)

Adamt said:


> If you're all over the bodybuilding diet, then you should know that it's only the alcohol that is the issue. The carbohydrate content is moot when you compare it to the alcohol.
> 
> If you like alcohol more than bodybuilding, just drink whatever... the small benefit a low carb beer will bring is grossly outweighed by the effort required to make/perfect a good low carb beer. If you like bodybuilding more than alcohol then look into lower-alcohol beers or just drink less. It's quite easy to make full-bodied low-alcohol beers, with hop character if you want it.



+1 Good advice. From both a dietary and enjoyment perspective.


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## manticle (16/6/09)

Bremmario said:


> 20kg light dry malt extract
> 25kg dextrose
> packet of dry enzyme



I doubt 1 packet of enzyme will be enough with all that malt.

All joking and dietary advice aside, if you want to make a low carb beer for whatever reason (and no reason why you shouldn't if that's how you're inclined) then it will be a matter of balancing sugars that dry it out (like dex or white sugar) with malts that give it body and flavour. If you're using less malt then hops might help prevent it being too bland. Maltodextrin can be used to up the body while contributing little to alcohol, although it won't give any flavour. Another thing you could try is using a wine yeast - it will ferment out everything which will give you a drier, thinner brew (and higher alc/lower flavour but you could make it lower gravity to start so it balances).

I'm not particularly recommending these things - they are just possibilities and ideas to consider. I find most low carb beers to be very bland personally but you want advice on how to make something, not whether I would enjoy drinking it, so good luck. Experiment with balancing everything at your disposal until you find the balance you like.


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## bum (16/6/09)

He does say it is to lose weight, though, not because he likes dry/low carb. Low carb beer will do nothing to contribute to weight-loss, even for an active person. Adamt is all over the right answer. No beer or tasty low alc beer.


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## cdbrown (16/6/09)

Despite the name being low carb it still has roughly the same amount of calories. Also low carb probably equates to not eating the last two samboy bbq chips in the packet. You are better of health wise to go for a lower alc beer than lower carb as overall the calorie content will also be reduced.


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## Ronin (16/6/09)

bum said:


> He does say it is to lose weight, though, not because he likes dry/low carb. Low carb beer will do nothing to contribute to weight-loss, even for an active person. Adamt is all over the right answer. No beer or tasty low alc beer.



I was wondering that the other day when I saw a add for pure blonde - "75% less carbs than other beers". So I got onto their website, and it's 33cal/100mL. According to beersmith a standard 4.2% beer is 42cal/100mL. That's only ~25% less calories. 50 calories less per pint. It's all marketing. The energy in beer is tied up in alcohol not carbohydrates. Drink less, drink better IMO.

One of my aims in the next few beers is to make a low alcohol (so low calorie) southern english brown ale. Something I can have a few pints of without having to run an extra 10 km. Have a look at making a good low alcohol beer. INHO it's more appropriate to losing weight (or not gaining weight as quick, as the case may be) than low carb beers.

Not saying don't brew it, I'm all for people making whatever they want. It's why we brew our own and don't just buy what's available (one of the reasons).

But I agree, I don't think it'll make that big a difference to your weight loss.

James


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## manticle (16/6/09)

bum said:


> He does say it is to lose weight, though, not because he likes dry/low carb.



I know and I agree. However the question, for better or worse, was 'how do I make a low carb beer' which was generally answered with 'low carb beers are rubbish and ineffective'. Just providing an alternative and it sounds as though s/he may like to experiment anyway. I know it's a marketing gimmick but I'm sure the OP is adult enough to work it out. If not s/he can stay fat but at least the question will be (partly) answered.

Disclaimer: I in no way advocate the use of low carb beer, whether for losing weight or general consumption. I think it contravenes rule number one of any beverage or foodstuff which is 'thou shalt contain flavour'.


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## Bremmario (21/7/09)

Anyone that is interested, I have now almost finished my entire batch of low carb beer with the help of my mates.

I have had nothing but good reviews and I am quite pleased with the results. IMO, much better than commercial low carb offerings, not watery as expected!

I used 650g of LDME as the sugar and 1 can of coopers pale concentrate with the included wheat plus the sachet of dry enzyme of course.

I honestly didn't notice any difference between previous successful batches made up from 500g LDME and 500g dextrose. That got me wondering whether the dry enzyme potentially failed to work. However I seem to be getting drunk enough. Unfortunately I forgot to take the OG so I cannot work out the approx. alcohol content via the standard formula.

I will definitely be brewing this again next time with some hops pellets.


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