# Homebrewing Some Hoegaarden



## spicks

Have been drinking a couple of Hoegaardens, and I've decided I would be drinking this all the time if it wasn't for the price (about $16 a 4-pack at a local boutique supermarket). So I wanna try and brew some of my own, and given I'm a complete novice (my third brew is fermenting as we speak) I will attempt it with a kit.

I've found two recipes:

iBrew Hoegaarden Recipe

and this one in a book:

- Black Rock Whispering Wheat Beer
- Dried Wheat Malt 1kg
- Coriander 15g
- Orange Peel zest 2 Tbsp
- Safwheat yeast

- Treat coriander and organe peel in the same way as grain
- Final volume 21L

I suppose I shouldn't just post that without giving a reference, it's from "Brewing Crafts" by Mike Rodgers-Wilson.


Similar recipes from the look of it, almost identical. Questions I have are:

- Has anybody tried one or both of the recipes? Has anybody got a better way to make a fairly simple clone of this one? If it involves getting yeast from an existing bottle of hoegaarden, I would need to have this explained in excrutiating detail :huh:. 
- What temperature is the best to brew this one? The book doesn't give the information on this yeast.
- Where can you get Coopers Wheat beer? I'm guessing not at my AHB store because the book they gave me only ever mentions their kits, as if they don't stock Coopers stuff. And, most importantly, is it a good kit?

Thanks guys.


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## kitkat

spicks said:


> - Where can you get Coopers Wheat beer? I'm guessing not at my AHB store because the book they gave me only ever mentions their kits, as if they don't stock Coopers stuff. And, most importantly, is it a good kit?



The coopers wheat kit is part of their "brewmaster" range, which is only available in homebrewshops (ie. not in supermarkets).
If your shop doesn't stock them, Maltshovel seems to have a decent wheat beer kit (http://www.hbkitreviews.com/search.php?search=Malt%20Shovel), but it only makes 11.5 liters and is a bit more expensive than a basic kit.

ESB has a 3kgs Bavarian Wheat kit (http://www.hbkitreviews.com/search.php?search=E.S.B ), that would contain all the necessary ingredients, but it may taste different from the belgian whites.

One thing to get from your HB shop is SAFWheat (K97?) yeast, a yeast more specifically designed for wheat beers.

Edit:
Couple more kit recipes:
http://www.homebrewandbeer.com/ourhomebrews.html


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## barfridge

I'm not a huge fan of k-97, its not a proper wheat yeast, merely a german ale yeast. You dont get any of the bubblegum or banana flavours that are characteristic of a wheat beer, you just get a bland tasting beer.

I recommend if you want a proper tasting wheat beer, to get a proper wheat yeast.


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## kitkat

just saying it's probably a more suitable dry yeast than SAFale or Coopers' ale yeasts.

Edit: of course liquid or cultured yeasts will be better, but at beginner level, spending $15 on a liquid yeast when I'm only half sure of what I'm doing with the rest seems a waste of money. Not to mention I wouldn't be culturing it, as I have already planned 4 or 5 styles I'd like to try, so it'd be useless to me in the next 6 months.

I agree, once I have a better idea of what I'm doing and what I like, I'll give liquid/culture a try.


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## Weizguy

spicks said:


> Have been drinking a couple of Hoegaardens...
> [post="49208"][/post]​


Say no more. The memory of your first Hoegaarden will stay with U 4eva. :chug: 

To brew (a true) one though, you will need at least a mini-mash with flaked/ rolled wheat, plenty of coriander and a Belgian yeast. You could culture the yeast from a Unibroue beer, or Hoegaarden or Blanche de Bruges, or any phenolic Belgian beer. U should be able to find plenty of hits for a site search 4 "yeast farming", or IIRC the FAQs.

Unless someone local can help U with a culture... Anyone, Beuller, anyone?

U need the yeast. Trust me. I'm the Weizguy...and brew cool -say, close to 16C. :beerbang: 

U can make a fairly good facsimile except for colour, using DME and wheat DME. Nice enough to my taste, until I started doing a partial mash on this recipe. If U want the recipe, I'll have to transcribe from my journal (oh, that makes me sound lke a real beer wanker). Let me know.

Seth out
Testify


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## Snow

Weizguy is spot on. The yeast is everything. Get some Belgian Wit liquid yeast from Wyeast or Whitelabs, or culture some up from a bottle of Belgian wit. You should also give a mii mash a go with some flaked wheat or wheat malt and some pilsener malt. Go 50/50 as much as your pot can take. Check out www.howtobrew.com for mini mash instructions. It is so easy, you'll do them all the time. I'd also up your coriander by 5 or 10 grams and throw this in at the end of the boil (last 2-5 mins. Get some dried orange peel from the asian grocery store and throw in about 10-15g for 20 mins of the boil.

Cheers - Snow.


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## Backlane Brewery

Spicks, if you type "culturing" in the little box then hit the search button you will find a heap of info on the pleasures and pitfalls of culturing yeast.

Also, FWIW, after our experience with coriander in beer would suggest it is best to used cracked not ground.


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## Wreck

Spicks,

I was trying to do the same thing a bit over a year ago, when I started out. I've done everything from a wheat kit to all grain. 

Only started to get close to a hooegarden when I used the whitelabs yeast, and mashed some unmalted wheat (with pilsner malt). The kit wheat beers I did were ok though, just couldn't quite get that spicy/zesty sort of flavour. 

If you want to try a mini mash, the grumpy's recipe is a good place to start. 

http://www.grumpys.com.au/r1.php3?recipeid=16

It's pretty simple, and was my first step into mashing.

As the other guys have said, at the very least, you need the right yeast. And crush some corriander seed. You can get that from any asian grocery store.

Good luck,
Wreck.


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## kitkat

Snow said:


> You should also give a mii mash a go with some flaked wheat or wheat malt and some pilsener malt. Go 50/50 as much as your pot can take.



By 50/50 do you mean 1 Kgs of pilsnet malt or wheat for 1 liter of water?

Grumpy's seem to suggest 3 liters per Kgs.


As a side note, does anybody know of a shop in Melbourne selling liquid yeasts? The one next to Vic Market doesn't, and brewcraft doesn't either.


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## Wreck

50/50 is the grain percentages. Half pilsner malt, half wheat. 

For a belgian wit, unmalted wheat is better. You then need another malt like pilsner which has the enzymes to convert the wheat.

2.5-3.0 litres of water per kilo of grain is a good ratio.


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## Weizguy

kitkat said:


> ... does anybody know of a shop in Melbourne selling liquid yeasts? The one next to Vic Market doesn't, and brewcraft doesn't either.
> [post="49262"][/post]​


 KitKat,

as I suggested above, maybe there is someone local who could share an apropriate yeast culture, or perhaps a brew day with you. Anyone available.

I'm at Newcastle, so I s'pose that counts me out as a brew/ yeast buddy.

Seth


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## GMK

Wyeast

No Affiliation but i get my Wyeast from Grain & Grape in Melb.
He sells smack packs at 15.00 ea or i buy the six month old ones for 7.50.

Never had one not work - nice way to get cheap yeast.


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## Jovial_Monk

The new Coopers Wheat Beer kit has unmalted wheat in it, making it the best kit IMO. The Black Rock Whispering Wheat, according to the ingredients listed on the cans, contains malted and unmalted barley, no mention of wheat.

A simple way to imitate a Hoegaarden Wit using kits would be Coopers wheat Beer, coopers liquid wheat malt, dissolve this, off heat into some hot water, bring to a boil and add 15g each coriander and orange zest, boil 15 mins. the Coopers wheatbeer yeast will be a proper wheat yeast

Jovial Monk


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## Sean

kitkat said:


> Snow said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should also give a mii mash a go with some flaked wheat or wheat malt and some pilsener malt. Go 50/50 as much as your pot can take.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By 50/50 do you mean 1 Kgs of pilsnet malt or wheat for 1 liter of water?
> 
> Grumpy's seem to suggest 3 liters per Kgs.
> 
> 
> As a side note, does anybody know of a shop in Melbourne selling liquid yeasts? The one next to Vic Market doesn't, and brewcraft doesn't either.
> [post="49262"][/post]​
Click to expand...

Go to Grain & Grape (www.grainandgrape.com). Definitely a shop worth browsing around.


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## Backlane Brewery

There is already a link to G & G (and to many other HB stores & resources) on the spiffy new links page.  

Don't think it lists everything they sell though, always best to ring & ask. :huh:


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## kitkat

thanks for the link to G&G, I will pay them a visit soon - shame they only open until 1 on Saturdays :unsure: 
Looks like heaps of goodness available, including the ESB 17Kgs kits.

And for the purpose of this thread, their own hoegarden recipes:
http://www.grainandgrape.com.au/BeerOTMonth/riggers_wit.htm


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## Jovial_Monk

50/50 means equal amounts of raw wheat and pilsner malt, I would suggest 40/60, especially for a first part mash.

3L/kg seems high to me. I aim for 2L/kg then any additions cold/boiling water to adjust rest temp mean I am not far from 2.5L/Kg. But I like dextrinous/thick beers not dry ones.

Jovial Monk


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## spicks

Thanks for every reply so far. The link to the Grain and Grape was great, I have no doubt in the next few weeks (if not this Saturday) I'll be driving out there for some liquid yeast and information. They say their staff are friendly and helpful, which for somebody like me would be great. Unfortunately, I sensed the guy at the closest home brew store saw me, a complete newbie, as a waste of his time.

I think I'll stick mainly to the Coopers recipe - hopefully using some liquid Wyeast instead of the saf. One of the websites I visited claimed culturing yeast from a commercial brew was not something he has done or ever considered doing, and the other sites focused only on culturing from fermentors. So I will stick to Wyeast and dry yeast for now.

The grain and grape site indicated a hoegaarden clone was not really possible with a kit so I'll focus on making a drinkable brew, if not a good one.

Hopefully some cold weather will come my way and I'll be drinking my wheat beer soon.

Thanks again.


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## voota

this is the (extract) recipe that I have used and it's pretty tasty, not far off hoegaarden. I allways keg it, and it seems to be best 2-5 weeks from carbonation (not that it usually lasts 5 weeks). Also a good idea to use freshly ground corriander.



Wimble White



Brewer: Chris Landvogt 

Low: Recipe: High:
IBU: 15 20.6 22
SRM: 2 3 4 
ABV: 4.2 4.96 5.5
OG: 1.042 1.048 1.055
FG: 1.010


Boil wheat/oats for 60 (min) at 68 deg, 
Remove grains, add wheat dme then boil for another 20 mins
add 20g of Nor. brewer hops then boil for 10 mins, 
add 20g of saaz, 20g corriander and 30g of orange peel and boil for 15 mins, 
add 20g of saaz, 1tsp of irish moss then boil for 5 mins 
then cool wart,

Total mash time: 60 mins
Total boil time: 50 mins 

Yeast:
Wyyeast 3944 Belgian Wit
or dreggs from at least 2 hoegaarden (grand cru/forbidden or white)


Malts / Fermentables: Amount: Points: Lov: %: Mash? 
Honey 200.00gr 1.035 1.0 7.3 

Rolled Oats 50.00 gr 1.025 2.2 1.8 M 
Torrified Wheat 500.00gr 1.036 2.0 18.2 M 
Wheat DME 2.00 kg 1.046 2.7 72.7 
Total: 2.75 kg 1.048 3.0 

Hops: Amount: Type: Alpha: Add: Minutes: IBU: 
Northern Brewer 20.00 gr Pellet 6.9 Boil 30 14.0 
Hallertauer 20.00 gr Pellet 3.1 Boil 20 4.9 
Hallertauer 20.00 gr Pellet 3.1 Boil 5 1.6 
Total: 60.0 gr 20.6 

Miscellaneous Ingredients
Ingredient: Amount: Units:
Orange peel 30.00 gm 
Irish Moss 1.00 tsp 
Coriander 20.00 gm 



Ferment 5 days in primary at 19 deg, then secondary for 5 days at 19 deg.


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## johnno

Weizguy said:


> Say no more. The memory of your first Hoegaarden will stay with U 4eva. :chug:
> [post="49234"][/post]​


Thats for sure Weizguy.
I knew there was a reason I have been avoiding tasting this beer. Coriander.
Am just having a couple tonight and I must say I am not very impressed. The coriander leaves a foul burnt aftertaste, even to my quite jaded pallette. I cant quite put an exact description to it. Sort of like the smell of burning hair.
Anyway to each their own.

cheers
johnno


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## Gerard_M

When it comes to using Corriander what are you guys using. I have used the root of the plant in my last 3 batches of Wheat and it is awesome. I only used 25g in 600litres. I know the roots & leaves give different flavours, I have never used the seeds. It is easier to find fresh Corriander at 5am where we are!
Cheers
Gerard


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## Dunkel_Boy

Jovial_Monk said:


> 50/50 means equal amounts of raw wheat and pilsner malt, I would suggest 40/60, especially for a first part mash.
> 
> 3L/kg seems high to me. I aim for 2L/kg then any additions cold/boiling water to adjust rest temp mean I am not far from 2.5L/Kg. But I like dextrinous/thick beers not dry ones.
> 
> Jovial Monk
> [post="49348"][/post]​



1.5qts/lb = 3.11L/kg, so 3L/kg is quite normal. 2.8 - 4.5 is the typical range. In terms of protein breakdown, it's good to do step infusion, because you start with a stiff wort, around 2.8L/kg (which promotes protein breakdown) and your infusions dilute it out to around 4L/kg, which obviously gives highly fermentable wort (temperature permitting).


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## Gough

johnno said:


> Weizguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Say no more. The memory of your first Hoegaarden will stay with U 4eva. :chug:
> [post="49234"][/post]​
> 
> 
> 
> Thats for sure Weizguy.
> I knew there was a reason I have been avoiding tasting this beer. Coriander.
> Am just having a couple tonight and I must say I am not very impressed. The coriander leaves a foul burnt aftertaste, even to my quite jaded pallette. I cant quite put an exact description to it. Sort of like the smell of burning hair.
> Anyway to each their own.
> 
> cheers
> johnno
> [post="56515"][/post]​
Click to expand...


I'm with you Johnno  Love the Coriander in my Thai food, but my beer???

Like you said, each to their own  

Shawn.


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## Wreck

Gough and Johnno, 

Not sure if your mixing up the corriander leaf and seeds, but they taste very different. The leaf is bitter, but the seeds give you a nice citrus flavour/aroma.


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## warrenlw63

Also bear in mind that the flavour/aroma contributions of corriander (seed) diminish over time.

It starts out quite noticeable in the flavour (citrusy), though I'd never say overbearing and gradually drops into the background to aid in the beer's complexity. Generally only takes about 3 months to mellow completely.

Haven't had Hoegaarden for a while, however IIRC it's a pretty mild, refreshing beer. Even my wife could tolerate it and she hates beer.

Warren -


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## warrenlw63

Also if you're making a Hoegaarden clone. Don't forget the correct drinking tools.  

This bad boy holds 500ml and weighs exactly 1 kg.

Makes a great paper weight too. :beer: 

Warren -


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## warrenlw63

Just as a comparison to give you an idea of it's sheer size. Here it is sitting next to your regular 1 pint nonik.  

Warren -


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## grunter

nice hoe glass warren. Im guessing that you have a coat with very big pockets?

we dont get those glasses anymore in the pubs i go to in sydney as apparently there was some problem with them breaking???


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## warrenlw63

Grunter,

It was not a five-finger discount. I bought it in Brussels. IIRC it cost me about 10 Euros.

Warren -


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## Gough

Nice glass there Warren.

Should have stayed out of this thread, sorry about that. Coriander or no coriander there are beers out there that just aren't for me and Hoegarden is one of them. Tried it a few times now and always struggled to finish it. 

Good luck with the brews,

Shawn.


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## johnno

Wreck said:


> Gough and Johnno,
> 
> Not sure if your mixing up the corriander leaf and seeds, but they taste very different. The leaf is bitter, but the seeds give you a nice citrus flavour/aroma.
> [post="56539"][/post]​




Hi Wreck,
I've never known coriander leaf to be bitter. Just an annoying taste.


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## warrenlw63

I must admit that Hoegaarden isn't exactly the benchmark of Wits. Might be the most widely available though.

There certainly are better ones about. Though hard if not impossible to find in Australia.

Dentergems is very, very nice. As is Brugs Tarwebier. Blanche de Chambly is a good one that you can quite often find in Oz if you look hard enough too. It's not Belgian though, it's from Unibroue of Canada.

Better still make your own. You'll be even better off. For the wowsers that don't like corriander just leave it out and try some other spices. Small amounts of cardamom, cumin and assorted peppercorns work well, various citrus zests and/or peels, like lime or mardarin.

Sky's the limit. I aways make a batch to start off any Belgian strains I buy then use the yeastcake for a higher grav. Beglian specialty.

:super: :super: :beer: 

Warren -


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## Weizguy

warrenlw63 said:


> I must admit that Hoegaarden isn't exactly the benchmark of Wits. Might be the most widely available though.
> 
> There certainly are better ones about. Though hard if not impossible to find in Australia.
> 
> Warren -
> [post="56605"][/post]​



Warren,

This is sad but true. Hoegaarden was the benchmark for quite a while. Then Interbrew bought it. Celis Wit was the benchmark (Pieree Celis was the original brewer of Hoegaarden).

Is there a benchmark any more? :blink: 

BTW, I have purchased Blanche de Bruges at my local Corkers bottlo. I hear that it's the same as Brugs Tarwebier, just alternatively named .

Seth


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## warrenlw63

Think you may be right Seth,

IIRC They're both produced by Alken-Maes. 

Warren -


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## kitkat

correct, they're the same thing - Belgium has 2 official languages, french and flemish, hence the 2 names.


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## Weizguy

Thanks for the assist, kat.

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, now I'm getting the taste for a wit. S'pose I should brew one, coz I have spent some bucks on beer stuff from Stone recently, and should be taking it easy on beer purchases for a little while. No point "buying trouble", is there?

Seth


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## warrenlw63

Weizguy said:


> No point "buying trouble", is there?
> 
> Seth
> [post="56625"][/post]​



Better the trouble you know.  

Warren -


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## scott

G'day all,

I am new to home brewing. Three down in quick succession. None have been in the bottle long enough to try? I am also going to put the same hoegaarden down this weekend, from the brewcrafts recipe list. How did it turn out?


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## tangent

Onya Scott! , that's faith doing a 4th brew before you've tasted your 1st.


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## WillM

Sipping a Hoegaarden now, doing research for the next brew.

It's tough deciding which taste I like


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## peas_and_corn

I'm a bit more interested in making a clone of the gran crue- any partial recipes for this?


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