# Chilling vs No Chill



## jaypes (15/1/13)

Just doing some research into who does what


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## dougsbrew (15/1/13)

good to see the results if you get numerous hits. i imagine no chill would be most popular.


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## donburke (15/1/13)

you need an option for someone who uses both methods


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## QldKev (15/1/13)

I no chill my beer, but I always chill out after brewing


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## keifer33 (15/1/13)

QldKev said:


> I no chill my beer, but I always chill out after brewing


... with a beer.


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## dougsbrew (15/1/13)

just noticed the delete my vote option... whats that all about... peer group pressure?


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## bruce86 (15/1/13)

no chill cuz im cheap and it allows me to hold off fermentation if i have to.


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## Crusty (15/1/13)

No chill is heaps more convenient for me. Brew & rack em up until I'm ready to ferment. High Summer temps also make it hard to chill without an ice slurry in an esky to get the wort below ambient temps. 30+deg temps are quite common.


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## Truman42 (16/1/13)

I chill, firstly because it means I can pitch sooner and therefore to to the end and enjoy my beer sooner. 

Secondly becuz my brewery looks that little bit more awesome with a shiny plate chiller in view. My neighbours must look in the garage when its open and think I have a meth lab.


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## QldKev (16/1/13)

Truman said:


> I chill, firstly because it means I can pitch sooner and therefore to to the end and enjoy my beer sooner. Secondly becuz my brewery looks that little bit more awesome with a shiny plate chiller in view. My neighbours must look in the garage when its open and think I have a meth lab.


 :icon_offtopic: all my neighbors thought I was making Bundy Rum when they first saw me and my 3V in the carport :blink: . I've had to disappoint all of them.


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## Phillo (16/1/13)

Crusty said:


> No chill is heaps more convenient for me. Brew & rack em up until I'm ready to ferment. High Summer temps also make it hard to chill without an ice slurry in an esky to get the wort below ambient temps. 30+deg temps are quite common.


What he said...


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## JDW81 (16/1/13)

Truman said:


> My neighbours must look in the garage when its open and think I have a meth lab.


 :icon_offtopic:

That's funny. I used to brew on a balcony on a busy street and someone thought I was up to no good so they called the coppers on me. Coppers turned up, saw there was nothing suspicious going on and then proceeded to chat for about 1/2 hour about the process as one of them was just getting into brewing.

To the OP: I'm a no chiller as it is most convenient for me. I also find it hard to justify the water wasted when chilling as I don't have a tank to recycle the chilling water. That may change though, as I've just bought a new place with the perfect spot for a permanent brewery with space for a tank :kooi:


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## Florian (16/1/13)

JDW81 said:


> Coppers turned up, saw there was nothing suspicious going on and then proceeded to chat for about 1/2 hour about the process as one of them was just getting into brewing.


Haha, if you were in Brisbane I'd say I know who that copper is...


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## Damien13 (16/1/13)

oh I love my meth lab on the balcony... with my red dexter gloves on, I think at bunnings today I will buy a respirator just to see if someone calls the cops on me as well. Damn that would be a great story!


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## Smokomark (16/1/13)

Florian said:


> Haha, if you were in Brisbane I'd say I know who that copper is...



And he would have taken all equipment and ingredients as evidence.

And put them to good use.


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## Byran (16/1/13)

donburke said:


> you need an option for someone who uses both methods


Perhaps we could see this as "which method do you prefer to use" poll.
I cant afford to buy a chiller and im too busy (lazy) to make one so.........


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## QldKev (16/1/13)

Byran said:


> Perhaps we could see this as "which method do you prefer to use" poll.
> I cant afford to buy a chiller and im too busy (lazy) to make one so.........


I've got one, and I'm too lazy to use it :lol:

Na, I just like saving time (and water), and separating brew day from my fermenting regime. It means I can brew bulk cubes and ferment random different ones keeping a differing supply of beer on tap.


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## wbosher (16/1/13)

I chill, mainly because of an abundant supply of cold water here. I just fill up a large container of water and ice and dump the fermenter in.

If I had a tap in my SS pot, I would probably give no chill a shot, just too lazy to put one in at the moment. Sure I'll try it one day, but at the moment it's just easier for me (with help from my wife) to dump the cooled contents of the pot straight into the fermenter.


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## DUANNE (16/1/13)

i use no chil because it is convenient and the only way to make my current brewing situation work for me.


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## Judanero (16/1/13)

I no chilled about 3 brews ago- Terribly hung over on the Sunday so the brew day got pushed back a couple hours...

I don't have a tap on my kettle so I just cleaned up a small saucepan and chucked it in the boiling wort for the last 15 mins of the boil, fished it out at flameout and after letting the wort rest for ten mins, started scooping and pouring into the waiting funnel and jerry can. ~20L scooped into jerry in about 5 mins.

Pitched my starter the next day. Too easy! Just wondering though if this is an ok way to transfer the wort sans kettle tap? I got no infection but don't know if I'm running the gauntlet so to speak. :unsure:


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## doon (16/1/13)

if kittens werent ice skating on a lacto infection then it should be ok


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## Silver (16/1/13)

No chiller. Convenient, simple and economic.


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## stux (16/1/13)

Judanero said:


> I no chilled about 3 brews ago- Terribly hung over on the Sunday so the brew day got pushed back a couple hours...
> 
> I don't have a tap on my kettle so I just cleaned up a small saucepan and chucked it in the boiling wort for the last 15 mins of the boil, fished it out at flameout and after letting the wort rest for ten mins, started scooping and pouring into the waiting funnel and jerry can. ~20L scooped into jerry in about 5 mins.
> 
> Pitched my starter the next day. Too easy! Just wondering though if this is an ok way to transfer the wort sans kettle tap? I got no infection but don't know if I'm running the gauntlet so to speak. :unsure:


A better way is to use some heavy duty silicon tube and a jiggle siphon starter

S/S AUTO SIPHON HOSE TIP 







SILICONE HOSE 1/2 " HEAVY DUTY PER METER * OUT OF STOCK*


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## Yob (16/1/13)

Im trying to get Botulism


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## QldKev (16/1/13)

Yob said:


> Im trying to get Botulism


Botulism puts hairs on ya chest


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## JDW81 (16/1/13)

QldKev said:


> Botulism puts hairs on ya chest
> 
> 
> 
> ...


How did you get my photo?


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## doon (16/1/13)

on those bear forums he was


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## ratchie (16/1/13)

Looks like a Fitter I know


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## QldKev (16/1/13)

ratchie said:


> Looks like a Fitter I know


lol, that's what I though :lol: pic will be deleted soon


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## twizt1d (16/1/13)

always chilled, only no chilled 2 batches and didnt really like the way it muted the late hops

lucky enough to have a bore though so my wort is chilled to 18 - 20c all year round and no wastage
the way i have my rig set up though it wouldnt be any quicker to fill a no chill cube than run it through the chiller


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## Lemon (16/1/13)

No chill, no tap no jiggler, just silicon hose and my thumb straight into the cube that I later ferment in, couldn't be easier.

Lemon


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## jaypes (16/1/13)

Surprising results so far, I would have thought most people would chill


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## Mikedub (16/1/13)

I chill, had some cracking no-chill beers made by others, but I reckon my brews are better since getting a chiller,

(having said that. I should do another no-chill and see if its because of the chiller or my brewing skills have increased,)


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## Mr. No-Tip (16/1/13)

Wouldn't mind seeing more options to really break up the demographics:


Used to no chill, now upgraded.
Mix of both based on circumstance.
Would never, ever, no way no-chill.


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## Pleasure Master (18/1/13)

I no-chill, but will change that soon.. unless someone can lean me a sure fire method way to control bitterness, hop flav & aroma..


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## jayahhdee (18/1/13)

Currently no-chill but I am looking at chilling options for Pales, APA's and IPA's and anything else with decent late hop additions.


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## fletcher (18/1/13)

can i get some clarification on both? is there a time factor? i use an ice bath soon after flameout, because i don't have a copper tube chiller or other hectic chiller; does that technically mean i no chill? or is ice bath chilling too. it usually only takes 20 mins to an hour with that method for me.


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## Rowy (18/1/13)

I no chill only because of the water wastage issue. I don't have a tank. I reckon the swimming pool idea is good but unfortunately I don't have one at this house as the last house had one and hardly got used due to A/C and good insulation so we didn't bother this time around. If I had a pool or a tank I reckon I would chill for sure and certain!


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## dicko (18/1/13)

Ah! Reason behind chilling.... I like it


Pleasure Master said:


> I no-chill, but will change that soon.. unless someone can lean me a sure fire method way to control bitterness, hop flav & aroma..





jayahhdee said:


> Currently no-chill but I am looking at chilling options for Pales, APA's and IPA's and anything else with decent late hop additions.


Btw I chill...


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## Dave70 (18/1/13)

Even though the subject's been flogged like a rented mule, I'd be interested to hear what range we're talking about here - ie, wort at x temp was chilled to y temp in z minutes, and to that end, if you're outside those parameters, then are you really just wasting your time?

For example, I dunk my cubes in our 100,000 L water tank and call that 'chilled'.
Am I really just a no chiller who likes to watch his cubes bob around in a water tank?


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## pmastello (18/1/13)

I chill because I make better IPA's than you


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## mje1980 (19/1/13)

I do 10 minute no chilled IPAs with no calc adjustments and they taste fine to me. I also have no problem controlling bitterness flavour and aroma. But I also have botulism so that might a come into it. I also think red cars are faster than black ones. I know this because the aliens told me when they abducted me. They're just like us, some of them are chillers, some of them are no chillers. They do make some pretty good beers though, the anal probe IPA I had was awesome


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## TasChris (19/1/13)

I chill, immersion chiller, because I have access to unlimited cool water. I run water from rain tanks through chiller then back into water tanks.

Chilling in my mind lessens the chance for infections and gives greater control over the finished product.
And because its what I have done right from day one of AG, I'm used to it and comfortable with the process.

Get 10 brewers in a room and you will get 12 different opinions

Cheers
Chris


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## jc64 (22/1/13)

Both, I'm testing out all of my beers both ways.


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## xragon (24/1/13)

I chill, mostly because I didnt know about the no chill method until recently and I have already had a lot of fun, with the help of a plumber mate, building an immersion chiller. Seems a waste to not use it.


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## JDW81 (24/1/13)

Gingerbrew said:


> I chill because I make better IPA's than you


Really? Have you ever tasted a well made no chill IPA? I have, and it was one of the best beers I've ever drunk, and one of the worst beers I've had was a chilled IPA.

I don't think chilling or not chilling makes a better or worse beer. The care taken to produce the wort and then how well you can control your fermentation are (IMHO at least) the primary determinants of the quality of the beer. 

My 2c

JD.


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## GalBrew (24/1/13)

JDW81 said:


> Really? Have you ever tasted a well made no chill IPA? I have, and it was one of the best beers I've ever drunk, and one of the worst beers I've had was a chilled IPA.
> 
> I don't think chilling or not chilling makes a better or worse beer. The care taken to produce the wort and then how well you can control your fermentation are (IMHO at least) the primary determinants of the quality of the beer.
> 
> ...


It doesn't matter whether you chill or no chill. You merely adjust for either process in your recipe formulation. Sure you will handle your aroma hopping differently but it's really not that hard.


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## Logman (29/7/13)

I'm going to break out the copper chiller :super: .

To save water I'll fill two cubes, dump them into the HLT, pump it through the chiller and back into the cubes and save it. I realized I could throw the cubes in the fridge the night before to chill quicker. Knowing nothing about cold break I wondered if it's OK to use cold water?

Also, is two 20 ltr cubes of cold water going to get a 40 litres down to pitching temp?


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## slash22000 (29/7/13)

Over the weekend I got a sweet deal on a 60 litre esky, and an el-cheapo 1000 L/min pond pump. Now I'm pumping ice water through my copper chiller. 

Haven't tried it "in the field" yet, but I have the connections on the chiller set up like a standard garden hose, so I can connect it to my tap to chill the first 50 - 60 degrees or so, then my ice bath for the remainder. Darwin tap water being ~30ºC it doesn't really help too much.

I don't know if it's worth the money, probably spent at least $200 on my chilling setup alone at this point, but what can I say, I'm an equipment addict. h34r:


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## verysupple (29/7/13)

I just saw this thread in the side bar and thought it was Stu trolling again  . 

I chill because I need to keep the fermentation cycle going to keep up with demand and because I think I get better late hop character in the styles that I want it in.


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## sponge (29/7/13)

I no chill, because it allows me to use leftover wort to make starters, and also allows me to brew at any time and then ferment when I have the necessary resources available.

I've found they make a more bitter beer without changing the hopping schedule, and have found adding an extra 20min to the boil times provides me with a decent approximation of additional bitterness.

As per usual, YMMV, and this is just how I've worked it with my setup. Others have reported not changing hop schedules on their setups to no ill effect either. I originally added on 10min, but still found a lot of the beers to be quite bitter, so upped the times to 15min, then 20min.

Test, taste, and tinker.


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## Silver (29/7/13)

I NC because I am a busy boy. It's the same as taking a short cut with no ill effects to the final product when done well.


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## Logman (30/7/13)

Logman said:


> I'm going to break out the copper chiller :super: .
> 
> To save water I'll fill two cubes, dump them into the HLT, pump it through the chiller and back into the cubes and save it. I realized I could throw the cubes in the fridge the night before to chill quicker. Knowing nothing about cold break I wondered if it's OK to use cold water?
> 
> Also, is two 20 ltr cubes of cold water going to get a 40 litres down to pitching temp?


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## krausenhaus (30/7/13)

I chill because all of my beers have big late and whirlpool hop additions; I want to preserve as much aroma and flavour as I can and keep things consistent and repeatable. Also, I like to pitch yeast as soon as possible so I can taste it sooner.


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## mosto (30/7/13)

I plan to knock out my first AG on the weekend. I plan to no chill at this stage even though I have two tanks. With three young kids and lots of other stuff around the house that needs doing, I'll only be able to brew when I get the chance. If the planets align and I can brew on consecutive days, or weekends, I don't want to waste the opportunity because I don't have a free fermenter, so I'll dump it into a cube instead. Secondly, I've spent a fair bit of cash setting up my BIAB system so can't really justify buying a chiller at this stage. If time and cash becomes more plentiful down the track, I will probably move to chilling then.


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## Rocker1986 (30/7/13)

I no chill all my beers. It's more convenient for me to just brew when I can and then ferment whenever I have enough empties to put the batch into. Aside from one batch (recipe formulation issue there), I've been very satisfied with the results I've been getting.


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## Byran (30/7/13)

sponge said:


> I no chill, because it allows me to use leftover wort to make starters, and also allows me to brew at any time and then ferment when I have the necessary resources available.
> 
> I've found they make a more bitter beer without changing the hopping schedule, and have found adding an extra 20min to the boil times provides me with a decent approximation of additional bitterness.
> 
> ...


I agree with this on my many , many no chill brewing efforts. 20 mins to your boil hop additions is almost spot on for no chill


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (31/7/13)

20 minutes no chill tastes like 60 chill. Flameout is about 30 minutes to my taste.

I do both. Depends on the beer. If I want to have lots of late additions, aroma, flavour, it has to be chilled.

If I'm doing early addition beers where hop profile isn't within the guidelines, then it's no chill.


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## brewbienewbie (31/7/13)

I used to chill (ice bath) but switched to no-chill to save water. The difference in late hop character is definitely noticable, but I've been getting some good results with cube hopping and dry hopping.


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## brewbienewbie (31/7/13)

Logman said:


> I'm going to break out the copper chiller :super: .
> 
> To save water I'll fill two cubes, dump them into the HLT, pump it through the chiller and back into the cubes and save it. I realized I could throw the cubes in the fridge the night before to chill quicker. Knowing nothing about cold break I wondered if it's OK to use cold water?
> 
> Also, is two 20 ltr cubes of cold water going to get a 40 litres down to pitching temp?


I don't think so. Assuming your cold water is 4 degrees and your hot wort is 90, it's not going to bring the temperature much under 50.


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## soundawake (31/7/13)

I pool chill. FIll a cube, tie a rope around it and let it bob in my pool. Currently two hours is how long it takes to get it to pitching temp. So I guess I'm kinda inbetween.


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## Logman (31/7/13)

brewbienewbie said:


> I don't think so. Assuming your cold water is 4 degrees and your hot wort is 90, it's not going to bring the temperature much under 50.


Ok thanks - I was hoping to get it chilling fast to prevent bitterness, so down to 50 or so would be great. I can use the hose once the cubes are done and use the hose water to make some PBW.

Just want to get something going for APA's - tired of bitter beers. (might as well inflame another no-chill riot while I'm at it ) .

:icon_cheers:


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## Midnight Brew (31/7/13)

So many options and more.

No chill
Chill
Pool chill
No chill then mini boil
Cube hop
Chill to 80C then cube
Dump the kettle in ice to chill
No chill cube hop, french press, dry hop


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## Yob (31/7/13)

Forgot Kettle no chill..


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## Silver (31/7/13)

Logman said:


> Ok thanks - I was hoping to get it chilling fast to prevent bitterness, so down to 50 or so would be great. I can use the hose once the cubes are done and use the hose water to make some PBW.
> 
> Just want to get something going for APA's - tired of bitter beers. (might as well inflame another no-chill riot while I'm at it ) .
> 
> :icon_cheers:


I recall doing a graph when i was a chiller and the temp drop by hose alone was quite dramatic to a point. I was considering at that stage to run the hose water through a copper tube in an ice bath to encourage another steep drop to pitching temp. Sadly all data lost and forgotten when i went NC but i think your goal would be within your reach.


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## micblair (31/7/13)

Mr. No-Tip said:


> Wouldn't mind seeing more options to really break up the demographics:
> 
> 
> Used to no chill, now upgraded.
> ...


I've been fortunate enough to try all 3 of the common techniques, cube, immersion and more recently using a plate chiller; all of which are highly capable in making excellent beers. That said, using a plate chiller is by far the superior method for chilling wort, and allows me to have the yeast in within minutes of transferring into the fermenter. Seeing it in action, made it more obvious why commercial breweries use this method exclusively.


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## Cosh (31/7/13)

I chill with a copper immersion chiller that a friend and I made.

My brewery is set up next to a rainwater tank and pump, I just recirculate the hot water back into the top of the tank 

I previously had a plate chiller with my BIAB rig, but I didn't find it to be as effective as the immersion chiller; maybe I wasn't using it correctly, running the wort through to quickly or something.

If I didn't have the rainwater tank i'd probably no-chill and adjust the late hop additions accordingly.


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## sponge (31/7/13)

Once we (myself and my partner) move on from our apartment, I shall be investing in a rain water tank which is conveniently placed next to the brew dungeon for the prime reason of being able to chill without the water wastage.

Until I have a water tank in which I can recycle my water (I realise there are other ways to recycle water, but this is by far the most convenient and practical) I shall remain a NC'er.


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## WarmBeer (31/7/13)

I'm a fence-sitter, and with the recent build of a whirlpool immersion chiller my last two beers have been chilled. These were, respectively, an IPA and a lager that I wanted to get down to pitching temps quickly.

I plan on brewing next week, and as I've planned a stout, I will simply cube it and pitch the following day.

I have a full toolbox at my disposal. Use the most appropriate tool for the job.


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## Yob (31/7/13)

Just bought 6 x 220l sorbitol drums to set up rain water collection for garden/chilling $15 a pop :beerbang:


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## Parks (31/7/13)

Logman said:


> Ok thanks - I was hoping to get it chilling fast to prevent bitterness, so down to 50 or so would be great. I can use the hose once the cubes are done and use the hose water to make some PBW.
> 
> Just want to get something going for APA's - tired of bitter beers. (might as well inflame another no-chill riot while I'm at it ) .
> 
> :icon_cheers:


Mate that's the wrong way round!

You have equal water to wort in your cube cooling scenario, so, say you want to brew an ale. Get your wort down to 32 degrees and then recirculate your 4 degree water. Equilibrium should be at 18.

For a lager you'll either need colder water or more water as you'd need your hose to get you down to 20 max.


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## Florian (31/7/13)

I do a bit of everything really depending on what, when and how I brew.

The majority I no chill, but often those cubes contain wort that's only been bittered. When I no chill hoppy beers I generally do an Argonaise boil afterwards.

When I chill I immersion chill, recirculating tank water like so many others. Once I'm down to 35ish it's hard to get the water any colder, so I dump a bag of ice into a 19L pot and get the trusty brown pump out to circulate ice water through the chiller. Depending on the number of ice bags I use I can get down to 6 degrees for a lager. 

In the past I've also done kettle in sink chill, kettle no chill, pool chill and probably some others I can't think of now. When pool chilling I make sure though that the cube lid sits above water level, I usually place a few tiles under the cube to achieve the correct height.

I've also pool fermented, which I reckon is the best temp control one can get (if the pool water is the right temperature, of course). If you no chill in a jerry can, just open the lid while in the pool, jerry cans usually expand quite a bit once opened to give some head space, pitch your yeast and put some glad wrap over the lid. Can't get much easier than that with precise temp control.


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## WarmBeer (31/7/13)

Florian said:


> When I chill I immersion chill, recirculating tank water like so many others. Once I'm down to 35ish it's hard to get the water any colder, so I dump a bag of ice into a 19L pot and get the trusty brown pump out to circulate ice water through the chiller. Depending on the number of ice bags I use I can get down to 6 degrees for a lager.


Tank water was 8 degrees last time I used my chiller.

There is some advantage to living in Melbourne.


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## Logman (31/7/13)

Parks said:


> Mate that's the wrong way round!
> 
> You have equal water to wort in your cube cooling scenario, so, say you want to brew an ale. Get your wort down to 32 degrees and then recirculate your 4 degree water. Equilibrium should be at 18.
> 
> For a lager you'll either need colder water or more water as you'd need your hose to get you down to 20 max.


Thank you sir, was wondering if I had it arse about face. 

:icon_cheers:


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## Clutch (31/7/13)

This thread reminds me, I really should try and use the $800 Chill Wizard I have at home.


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## Bizier (1/8/13)

This poll needs an option for "both" or "either according to circumstance/recipe"

Chilling is better, unless you are lazy, grossly incompetent regarding sanitation, have no yeast on hand, or require a large hot water bottle in bed.



Yob said:


> Just bought 6 x 220l sorbitol drums


You a bit blocked up there Yob?


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## Dengue (1/8/13)

Clutch said:


> This thread reminds me, I really should try and use the $800 Chill Wizard I have at home.


why havent you used it yet ? heard these are awesome.....


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## Ross (1/8/13)

I'm happy chilling or no chilling - all our FWK's are obviously no chilled, but all our brewery beers are crash chilled.

I find it ironic that there are guys posting in this thread that no chill is fine, when they lambasted brewers in the Dry v hydrate yeast thread, when every scientific paper I've read says "no chilling" is bad & for best results you must chill 

cheers Ross


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## slash22000 (1/8/13)

Has anybody ever done a subjective side-by-side test of the same wort, half chilled, half not chilled?


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## MartinOC (1/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> Has anybody ever done a subjective side-by-side test of the same wort, half chilled, half not chilled?


+1 on that....?


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## bradsbrew (1/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> Has anybody ever done a subjective side-by-side test of the same wort, half chilled, half not chilled?


Problem with that is, that you are going to get different results based on the recipe.


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## slash22000 (1/8/13)

I imagine that would be true, Bradsbrew.

Ross says he has read scientific papers concluding chilling is superior to no-chilling, so the tests must exist somewhere, but I can't imagine how you could test it objectively given the final product is pretty much 100% based on your own sense of smell/taste.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (1/8/13)

bradsbrew said:


> Problem with that is, that you are going to get different results based on the recipe.


and based on your own subjective tastes which may be influenced by, among other things, prejudice toward your preferred method.


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## piraterum (1/8/13)

Check out this Beersmith article on hop oils. It provides arguements to perform chilling to preserve hop oils and thus flavour and aroma.


http://beersmith.com/blog/2013/01/21/late-hop-additions-and-hop-oils-in-beer-brewing/


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## Dengue (1/8/13)

I fail to see why, if you have the facility/ability to chill, that you would opt for no-chill instead..... ?


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## treefiddy (1/8/13)

Plenty of reasons already mentioned.

For example, my last brew day I made a mild and chilled it. While it was chilling, my bitter was in the mash tun doing its thing. That one got cubed so that I could pitch it when the mild was done. An effective use of my time.

I did that because I was going to have little time to brew in the next few weeks, and there wasn't enough space in the fridge. The single batch mild is also making enough yeast for my double batch of bitter (cubed).


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## Florian (1/8/13)

Dengue said:


> I fail to see why, if you have the facility/ability to chill, that you would opt for no-chill instead..... ?


Seems like you also failed to read... this very thread.


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## Clutch (1/8/13)

Florian said:


> Seems like you also failed to read... this very thread.


You mean I'm supposed to read the threads before commenting? THE HELL YOU SAY!?


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## soundawake (1/8/13)

Florian said:


> I've also pool fermented, which I reckon is the best temp control one can get (if the pool water is the right temperature, of course). If you no chill in a jerry can, just open the lid while in the pool, jerry cans usually expand quite a bit once opened to give some head space, pitch your yeast and put some glad wrap over the lid. Can't get much easier than that with precise temp control.


Holy shit I've got a temp controlled pool, why have I never thought of this??


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## manticle (1/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> Has anybody ever done a subjective side-by-side test of the same wort, half chilled, half not chilled?



Yes.

I was interested in tasting the results in a beer I was familiar with, mainly for my own understanding so not expecting the results to be conclusive nor the experimental design foolproof.

I basically took a highly hopped APA recipe of mine and brewed a double batch. 1/2 chilled through a plate chiller, half straight into a cube. Fermented with the same yeast strain, similar conditions, both dry hopped.

Then got several people to taste and pick which was NC and which was chilled as well as describe characteristics. The NC beer was definitely more bitter (higher IBU contribution has been measured in lab conditions with other NC beers before - I believe ??? and Thirsty Boy have looked at it).

However strangely enough and I don't expect this to be the result in every case, most people picked the NC beer has having more hop aroma and flavour.

They were definitely different and I preferred the NC brew because I had designed it based around my practices (NC) and tweaked the recipe to my palate. If I was going to chill that kind of beer, I would cut back on crystal and munich as I found it a touch sweet/not bitter enough. I also felt the hop profile was perhaps more delicate in the chilled version.


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## slash22000 (1/8/13)

I imagine the extra bitterness from no chilling is very similar if not identical to the effect of a hop stand. Effectively, you're adding ~15 minutes boil worth of IBU's.

The "no chill" option in Brewmate accounts in the same way, by adding ~15 minutes worth of IBU's.


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## manticle (1/8/13)

You mean the extra bitterness comes from hops continuing to isomerise while in lengthier contact time with wort over 80 deg C?


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## Dengue (1/8/13)

Florian said:


> Seems like you also failed to read... this very thread.


sorry florian , I fail to see what you are taking about.

the only people that "no chill" use this method because they fail to be _able_ to chill.


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## brad81 (1/8/13)

Dengue said:


> I fail to see why, if you have the facility/ability to chill, that you would opt for no-chill instead..... ?


Saves time and water mate.

Gives me an extra hour or so (instead of chilling and then oxygenation) to spend with the kids, after investing about 4 hours in a brew day. I chill/nochill dependant on time. I don't adjust the hops, just end up with a more bitter brew.


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## slash22000 (1/8/13)

manticle said:


> You mean the extra bitterness comes from hops continuing to isomerise while in lengthier contact time with wort over 80 deg C?


Right. The oils will continue to isomerise despite the wort being drained into a cube away from any physical hop matter, as long as it's >80ºC.


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## Clutch (1/8/13)

Dengue said:


> sorry florian , I fail to see what you are taking about.
> 
> the only people that "no chill" use this method because they fail to be _able_ to chill.


Yeah, that's why I don't use my Chill Wizard.
You're spot on.


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## manticle (1/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> Right. The oils will continue to isomerise despite the wort being drained into a cube away from any physical hop matter, as long as it's >80ºC.



I know. I was being stupid.

That fact is quite well known and, as I mentioned at least 2 users on this forum have used laboratory equipment to measure the actual IBU contribution from late/flameout hops.

The whole point of my home experiment was to see what difference it made to one of my recipes and where my references lay. I know and understand the science - that final palate calibration/measurement/personal experience thing is what I was chasing.


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## GalBrew (1/8/13)

Ross said:


> I'm happy chilling or no chilling - all our FWK's are obviously no chilled, but all our brewery beers are crash chilled.
> 
> I find it ironic that there are guys posting in this thread that no chill is fine, when they lambasted brewers in the Dry v hydrate yeast thread, when every scientific paper I've read says "no chilling" is bad & for best results you must chill
> 
> cheers Ross


Fully aware of the limitations and benefits of no-chill. Difference is I don't find the need to repeatedly start a thread stating that chilling is a waste of time and not necessary at all.


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## Silver (1/8/13)

Dengue said:


> sorry florian , I fail to see what you are taking about.
> 
> the only people that "no chill" use this method because they fail to be _able_ to chill.


Not so in my case. I made myself a great little chiller, did a few brews with it and decided to give NC a go. Kept chiller for quite a long time before i sold it. There are many reasons why i moved to NC and they have all been covered.


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## Dengue (1/8/13)

Clutch said:


> Yeah, that's why I don't use my Chill Wizard.
> You're spot on.


then,why did you buy it ? sounds like an expensive option

well, let me know if u want to let it go please


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## manticle (1/8/13)

You can have my plate chiller for $450


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## Dengue (3/8/13)

manticle said:


> You can have my plate chiller for $450



hmm, 300 plates at that price ?


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## lukiferj (3/8/13)

I have chilled and no chilled. Currently cube and slow chill in the pool. If I brew in the morning I can still pitch that night. Eventually will look at chilling but currently suits my brew day. I like that I can knock out most brews between 3 and 4 hours and pitch the next day. Or the next week/month. A little bit of extra bitterness works in most of the styles I brew.


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## bradsbrew (3/8/13)

Dengue said:


> hmm, 300 plates at that price ?


Are you acting a "goose" ??


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## Thefatdoghead (3/8/13)

I mostly chill but sometimes ill No chill. I only No chill malty beers and beers with early hop additions.


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## Bizier (3/8/13)

slash22000 said:


> Right. The oils will continue to isomerise despite the wort being drained into a cube away from any physical hop matter, as long as it's >80ºC.


Alpha acids and perhaps beta acids, but not oils.
Oils degrade or oxidise or evaporate or a combination thereof, resulting in less aroma.


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## mje1980 (9/8/13)

I now only no chill when standing on my left leg when brewing. When brewing while standing on my right leg, I add 33.66% more hops with my left hand, then do a pirouette, and go back to standing on my right leg. This is spot on for brewing this way. It is exactly the perfect and best way to brew, and I'm right and you're all wrong.


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## Diesel80 (9/8/13)

I can hop on both legs.

I chill my brews in cubes, no chilling implies that the wort is kept boiling. Adding yeast to boiling wort will kill it and make no beer.

We all chill, just some slower than others and using different mediums to exchange and transfer the heat out of the wort.

Love to see someone make beer without chilling wort.

Cheers,
D80


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## citizensnips (9/8/13)

Diesel80 said:


> Love to see someone make beer without chilling wort.


a rolling boil fermentation perhaps? there's a true steam beer


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