# Dry Yeast For A Kolsch ?



## yardy (29/11/07)

morning all,

i'm planning JZ's AG Kolsch and would like some help with a dry yeast ( possibly K-97 ? ) and fermentation temps that would best suit this beer.

Cheers
Yard


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## Ross (29/11/07)

Liquid is what you really need, but if going dry...

Weyermann's recommend $-33 for there brew house kolsch. Jamil in his new book recommends US-05.
I reckon the K-97 could work well though, just ferment at the lower end of its range, say 15 - 17c.

cheers Ross


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## Fents (29/11/07)

yardy said:


> morning all,
> 
> i'm planning JZ's AG Kolsch and would like some help with a dry yeast ( possibly K-97 ? ) and fermentation temps that would best suit this beer.
> 
> ...



Having just made a kolsch i would say that if you can afford it and you can be arsed get some 2565 liquid kolsch yeast just this one time. Its all about the yeast in a kolsch and as there are no real dry kolsch yeasts as such go the liquid. plus it will last you for ages and you can make more kolsch's if you like it. i stuffed my kolsch up by using a 2565 liquid starter and then adding W34/70 dry yeast to finish it off. Dont make the same mistake.


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## yardy (29/11/07)

Ross said:


> Liquid is what you really need, but if going dry...
> 
> Weyermann's recommend $-33 for there brew house kolsch. Jamil in his new book recommends US-05.
> I reckon the K-97 could work well though, just ferment at the lower end of its range, say 15 - 17c.
> ...



Thanks Rossco,
I've never liked the S-33 much, i'll try the K-97.

i'll have to get JZ's new book, this is a recipe that i dragged off another site with all liquid yeast suggestions.

Cheers


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## Screwtop (29/11/07)

Definitely not 97 use 33. IMO W2565 gives the better flavour profile BUT it has to be fresh and you need a big starter, even then it needs some help to produce a dry beer to style. It was recommended on a US podcast recently to make a Weizen using 2565 first and dumping a Klsch straight onto the yeastcake. Apparently it makes a reasonable Weizen.

Screwy


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## yardy (29/11/07)

Fents said:


> Having just made a kolsch i would say that if you can afford it and you can be arsed get some 2565 liquid kolsch yeast just this one time. Its all about the yeast in a kolsch and as there are no real dry kolsch yeasts as such go the liquid. plus it will last you for ages and you can make more kolsch's if you like it. i stuffed my kolsch up by using a 2565 liquid starter and then adding W34/70 dry yeast to finish it off. Dont make the same mistake.



Fents,

yeah, i would like to try the liquid but availability etc has it's problems.

at what stage did you add the dry yeast and how did it stuff it ?

Cheers


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## yardy (29/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> Definitely not 97 use 33. IMO W2565 gives the better flavour profile BUT it has to be fresh and you need a big starter, even then it needs some help to produce a dry beer to style. It was recommended on a US podcast recently to make a Weizen using 2565 first and dumping a Klsch straight onto the yeastcake. Apparently it makes a reasonable Weizen.
> 
> Screwy




Hi Screwy,

yeah, i heard that podcast or one similar, but like i said availability etc and i'm enjoying playing around with the dried yeasts.

if i was to go with the S-33 the ferm temps would be around 18 or 19 i'm guessing ?

why not the 97 btw ?

Cheers


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## mfdes (29/11/07)

What about WLP29 vs. WY2565?
WLP29 makes a mean summer ale with Nelson Sauvin hops


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## devo (29/11/07)

go the liquid yeast and ferment around the 17c mark to achieve the subtle fruitiness . My previous attempts were done at 15c and although great brews they could have benefit better from this temp.

also let it cold condition for approx 4 weeks.


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## Whistlingjack (29/11/07)

devo said:


> go the liquid yeast and ferment around the 17c mark to achieve the subtle fruitiness . My previous attempts were done at 15c and although great brews they could have benefit better from this temp.
> 
> also let it cold condition for approx 4 weeks.



Definitely second this!

I am drinking mine now after a three week lagering and its lovely. I also used the 2565 and fermented around the 17 to 18 mark.

WJ


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## Fents (29/11/07)

yardy said:


> Fents,
> 
> yeah, i would like to try the liquid but availability etc has it's problems.
> 
> ...



addded it at about 1.5weeks. Mine stopped at 1.030 and wouldnt budge cause i didnt have a big enough starter, so i threw in W34/70 at the end to finish it. Unfortuantly i cant control brew temps so it may have crepped up to 20-22c, leaving a more fruity tatste than i wanted.


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## warrenlw63 (29/11/07)

devo said:


> go the liquid yeast and ferment around the 17c mark to achieve the subtle fruitiness . My previous attempts were done at 15c and although great brews they could have benefit better from this temp.
> 
> also let it cold condition for approx 4 weeks.



+ 1 :beerbang: 

Warren -


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## andrewg (29/11/07)

yardy said:


> Thanks Rossco,
> I've never liked the S-33 much, i'll try the K-97.
> 
> i'll have to get JZ's new book, this is a recipe that i dragged off another site with all liquid yeast suggestions.
> ...


I've brewed a Kolsch with K-97 and while it was a nice easy-drinking beer it really lack the flavour profile I was expecting in a Kolsch. Next time I'll go with 2565.
cheers
HStB


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## Screwtop (29/11/07)

yardy said:


> why not the 97 btw ?




Klsch without the right yeast is gonna be pretty boring! For me most of it's character comes from yeast/fermentation which needs to balance out the grainey/bready profile of the Pils malt, hops should be seen but not heard, I find that 2565 fermented at the right temp gives a very subtle pear ester and a very slight wineyness.

I think 97 would leave you with a pretty bland beer. Good for something like a Wit where you want a blank canvas to zoosh up with citrus peel and corriander.


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## Kai (29/11/07)

Ross said:


> Liquid is what you really need, but if going dry...
> 
> Weyermann's recommend $-33 for there brew house kolsch. Jamil in his new book recommends US-05.
> I reckon the K-97 could work well though, just ferment at the lower end of its range, say 15 - 17c.
> ...



From personal experience I wouldn't recommend US-05 at all. I brewed my mash paddle koelsch with it but decided not to enter it because I didn't think it gave the desired flavour profile at all. It made a very nice beer, just not what I'd call a very nice koelsch.


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## andrewg (29/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> Klsch without the right yeast is gonna be pretty boring! For me most of it's character comes from yeast/fermentation which needs to balance out the grainey/bready profile of the Pils malt, hops should be seen but not heard, I find that 2565 fermented at the right temp gives a very subtle pear ester and a very slight wineyness.
> 
> I think 97 would leave you with a pretty bland beer. Good for something like a Wit where you want a blank canvas to zoosh up with citrus peel and corriander.



Right on Screwy - K-97 goes very well in a wit. Fairly neutral and takes a fair while (several weeks) to drop out of the finished beer so keeps things cloudy = perfect for a Wit
cheers
HStB


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## mfdes (29/11/07)

What about WLP29 vs. WY2565? 
Anyone used them both?

MFS


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## Ross (29/11/07)

Yard,

I agreed with the others in using a liquid, but if you want to go dry, maybe use a very neutral yeast & add your ester character afterwards as required.

"Liquid Hops - Esters (5ml)"
Contains the components of hop oil that contribute a fruit/pear like character.
Pineapple - Pear Skin - Sweet - Fruity.

Now that should get 'em going  

Cheers Ross


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## randyrob (29/11/07)




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## Kai (29/11/07)

Never seen that one before!

Surprised there was no mention of NS...


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## randyrob (29/11/07)

Kai said:


> Surprised there was no mention of NS...



thought of it but with Randal lurking i didnt have the balls.


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## Screwtop (29/11/07)

mfdes said:


> What about WLP29 vs. WY2565?
> Anyone used them both?
> 
> MFS




Yes, very little diff, both in esters and attenuation.


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## hughman666 (29/11/07)

i started doing this style with us05 last year but have since gone onto 2656. wlp029 was ok, i just prefer 2656

us05 is a very neutral yeast so it was ok for a kolsch as long as you hopped it right (NS), but even then it wasn't a true kolsch.

i think it's going to be hard to get THAT flavour with a dry yeast....


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## yardy (29/11/07)

thanks for all the replies fellas, dunno what to do now :lol: 

33 or 97 i suppose.

Cheers
Yard


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