# Babbs Systems Wars For The Qld Homebrewing Conference



## clarkey7 (25/9/11)

Brisbane Amateur Beer Brewers will be battling it out for Ultimate Glory on the 8th October 2011 in a Brewing Systems Wars.

We'll be brewing an ESB on 4 different systems concurrently while discussing all things beer and brewing.

There will be a short presentation and wrap-up of the day and the systems/techniques used at the QLD Homebrewing Conference and of course "The blind taste-off" and result review.

If you can't make it to the conference on November 5th or you are just curious about all the systems or want to get involved on the day, you are most welcome to show up at Craftbrewer/Bacchus Brewing @ Unit 1, 2 Christine Place Capalaba.

We plan to mash in at around 10am, so we'll be going until 3-4pm ish.....

Representing in the 4 corners we have:

BribieG on BIAB
Bradsbrew on Traditional 3 Vessel
Ross and PocketBeers on the Braumeister (thanks for the instructions Florian)
Browndog on a thrown together bits & Pieces Ghetto System

Should be a fun day  

Who will take out the Systems Wars???

PB


----------



## NickB (25/9/11)

No HERMS..... You guys are so biased!


----------



## winkle (25/9/11)

You need some assistants Brad?
Daz and I can 'help'


----------



## bradsbrew (25/9/11)

winkle said:


> You need some assistants Brad?
> Daz and I can 'help'



Wouldn't be a brewday without your 'assistance' Winkle. You can help Ross clean my mash tun.  Should be a good day. 

Cheers


----------



## ashley_leask (25/9/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> We plan to mash in at around 10am, so we'll be going until 3-4pm ish.....



The fly sparging 3V guy maybe. I'm thinking Bribie will be done by 1.30. h34r:


----------



## clarkey7 (25/9/11)

Another Ash said:


> The fly sparging 3V guy maybe. I'm thinking Bribie will be done by 1.30. h34r:


We'll probably all be done by 2 with everything setout, weighed, cracked and heated.......but I reckon we might need a buffer 1 or 2hrs in case of any mishaps :lol:


----------



## winkle (28/9/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> We'll probably all be done by 2 with everything setout, weighed, cracked and heated.......but I reckon we might need a buffer 1 or 2hrs in case of any mishaps :lol:



What, like boil-overs - that'll never happen. B)


----------



## edschache (28/9/11)

I think this will work out perfectly for me. I have been meaning to go out and buy a BIAB setup from Ross. This will give me a good chance to watch the various approaches and confirm that BIAB is the one for me. Given that the guys will likely be too busy to deal with all my questions about BIAB on the day I might have to buy one more FWK while I'm there and then go out the following Saturday to purchase. What a pity - another 2 trips to CB. :lol:


----------



## yardy (28/9/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Brisbane Amateur Beer Brewers will be battling it out for Ultimate Glory on the 8th October 2011 in a Brewing Systems Wars.
> 
> We'll be brewing an ESB on 4 different systems concurrently while discussing all things beer and brewing.
> 
> ...



Carn 3V :beerbang:


----------



## Bribie G (28/9/11)

As the day approaches, and my lab coat is at the cleaners, a couple of issues (might as well make these public - transparency and all that)

Will the water be treated appropriate to style, or should I bring along some salts? I suppose it should be equal across the systems. 

As part of my _process_ I use BrewBright as the kettle floccer. Now it's not an ingredient, as it won't be in the finished beer, it's part of my floccing _process_. I regard it as analogous to other guys' processes that might involve "forming a grain bed" or "halting sparging at 1010" whatever. If there's any grey area here I'm more than happy to bring along enough for the other brewers as well. 
I realise everyone has their own pet procedure - just offering. 

:icon_cheers:


----------



## bradsbrew (28/9/11)

yardy said:


> Carn 3V :beerbang:



With the kids and misses up the Bunya mountains for a couple of days thought I might take some time to practice. I normally do triple batches so its like learning how to use my rig all over again :huh: . Add in the fact that I have just added a second pump and some dodgy plumbing.
Can't guarantee it will be pretty but hopefully it should produce a good beer for the conference. 

Cheers


----------



## banora brewer (28/9/11)

Do we need to book or just turn up? Also go the Braumeister!!!!


----------



## Logman (28/9/11)

Can anyone attend this or do you need to be a BABBs member? Also, can I make an online order and pick it up on the day?


----------



## bradsbrew (28/9/11)

Bribie G said:


> As the day approaches, and my lab coat is at the cleaners, a couple of issues (might as well make these public - transparency and all that)
> 
> Will the water be treated appropriate to style, or should I bring along some salts? I suppose it should be equal across the systems.
> 
> ...


Bribie I am pretty sure Dave has added some salts to the recipe for the day. We all have to stick to the same ingredients so it comes back to the method used when the beers are blind tasted.
I am happy to use what ever, as long as we all use it.

Cheers


----------



## Bribie G (28/9/11)

Logman said:


> Can anyone attend this or do you need to be a BABBs member? Also, can I make an online order and pick it up on the day?



No, Bacchus brewing will be fenced off with razor wire and a temporary machine gun tower in the corner of the car park  


If you get in during normal trading hours I'm sure you'll be fine. We're just going to be like the clowns or petting zoo at the shopping mall, stroll over and have a look at what's going on


----------



## Malted (28/9/11)

Bribie G said:


> No, Bacchus brewing will be fenced off with razor wire and a temporary machine gun tower in the corner of the car park
> 
> 
> If you get in during normal trading hours I'm sure you'll be fine. We're just going to be like the clowns or petting zoo at the shopping mall, stroll over and have a look at what's going on


Electricfied razor wire is even better


----------



## clarkey7 (28/9/11)

The more the merrier!

Anyone welcome to come down for a chat a sticky-beak and a laugh  

ALL ingredients will provided..Gypsum + Redlands water, grain, hops yeast, Whirlfloc, yeast nutrient etc...

Just bring your systems, your experience, your enthusiasm and your humour.

Cubes provided, but you may need to BYO a fermentor.....

Should be a top day....

PB


----------



## NickB (28/9/11)

I'm a tentative yes to come down and help heckle watch on the day. I would imagine my attendance will hinge on how much trouble Oktoberfest brings this Saturday... <_< 

Cheers


----------



## Paul H (28/9/11)

Let's throw a FWK in just for fun  

:icon_cheers: 

Paul


----------



## bradsbrew (28/9/11)

Paul H said:


> Let's throw a FWK in just for fun
> 
> :icon_cheers:
> 
> Paul



They will all be FWK's. B) 

Ya dumb arse


----------



## Bribie G (4/10/11)

Bumpo

Only 4 more sleeps 

Anyone interested in coming along to Bacchus brewing at Christine Place Capalaba from around 10 am on Saturday get your skateboard out and come for a look see. 
If you are looking to start full-mash brewing and not sure about what system, then here's your chance to see the alternatives on display in a real world situation.







Now of course BIAB is the way to go and as well as handing out fact sheets I'll have a few litres of samples of three styles made using BIAB 


*Lager Lout* - a pale Euro lager definitely nothing to do with the Reinheitsgebot
*Pint o yer best, Landlord* - full fruity UK special bitter made on floor malted malt 
*Golden Squire's Fat Creatures* - says it all
On tasting these BIAB masterpieces of course you will be keen to get the recipe sheets on sale for $2 each, proceeds to Brisbane Amateur Beer Brewers (BABBs)

:icon_chickcheers:


----------



## bradsbrew (4/10/11)

I'd like to apologise in advance for 

My behaviour on the day
My not so pretty brewrig
Drinking so many of Ross' beers
My many bad, bad odours
My poor technique
Embaressing 3V brewers
Making the superior beer :icon_chickcheers: .

Looking forward to the day, I may have a few beers to sample on the day as well.

Cheers


----------



## clarkey7 (4/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Bumpo
> Now of course BIAB is the way to go


Let the competition begin buddy...

Just a teaser for a test brew I ran through the BM on Sunday.....













Brewing again tomorrow to iron out the process a bit more  

See you all on Saturday at Bacchus/Craftbrewer.....

PB :icon_chickcheers:


----------



## bradsbrew (4/10/11)

Come on Dave practising is cheating mate. I will be flying by the seat of my pants, just like every brewday.

Cheers


----------



## Bribie G (4/10/11)

System? 
Call that a system?
That ain't no system
This is a system






Aplogies for the hazy disgusting sub-beer that it produces :unsure: 
I hang my unworthy head in shame


----------



## Janelle Kerr (4/10/11)

OMG! I so want one of those, but do I forsake Bathurst on the Saturday?? Hmmmmmm............ Decisions........


----------



## Nick JD (4/10/11)

I'd so be there if I didn't need such a complicated apparatus, that can both make beer _and_ do a roast lamb with new potatoes, pumpkin and parsnips ... at the same time. 

You guys should splash out. Ze Germans make them - called a Stovemeister.


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

Should make a brief appearance to 'give advice'.... Will bring a couple of samples along too (from a Proper 3v HERMs System - tragically NOT represented in the System Wars......). Probably stick around for about an hour or so.

Cheers!


----------



## clarkey7 (4/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> Come on Dave practising is cheating mate. I will be flying by the seat of my pants, just like every brewday.
> 
> Cheers


Thought I better at least brew on the thing once before the big day..need to do it justice.

Have learned a few things already....BM Brewday No.2 tomorrow!!

PB :icon_cheers:


----------



## Deebo (4/10/11)

Will there be video for those of us on the other side of the country?


----------



## clarkey7 (4/10/11)

Deebo said:


> Will there be video for those of us on the other side of the country?


Not unless someone turns up with a video camera...

I'll be collating all the information, photos and short videos clips to present a session at the QLD Homebrewing Conference in November on all the systems details, pros and cons and brewer knowledge etc...

After that, am happy to share with the homebrewing community :icon_cheers:


----------



## Bribie G (4/10/11)

I'll definitely take some blackmail photos and post them


----------



## the_new_darren (4/10/11)

Just out of curiosity, is Ross Carpetbombing your meeting?

cheers

the_new_darren


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

On behalf of BABBs (unofficially - but mostly from myself), keep your cynical bullshit to yourself Darren.


----------



## Bribie G (4/10/11)

the_new_darren said:


> Just out of curiosity, is Ross Carpetbombing your meeting?
> 
> cheers
> 
> the_new_darren



Oh dear I thought you had been banned again. 
Poor lost soul, may ye find salvation


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

+1 Michael!


----------



## Bribie G (4/10/11)

Hey Nick, would be great to see you there. Drink my Lager Lout beer and let's go out and bash some parking inspectors :icon_chickcheers:


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

OI OI OI!


----------



## the_new_darren (4/10/11)

Hey, admit it, you love to abuse me for stating the bleating obvious.

BIAB's March on. 8)

cheers

the_new_darren


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

I get very annoyed when people (you) bring up things (Ross' QABC entries) in threads that have no relevance.... This is a thread for the BABBs System Wars day on Saturday. Why don't you make the trip over and come along. I'm sure there's a few of us that would like to say 'hello' in person....


----------



## the_new_darren (4/10/11)

NickB said:


> I get very annoyed when people (you) bring up things (Ross' QABC entries) in threads that have no relevance.... This is a thread for the BABBs System Wars day on Saturday. Why don't you make the trip over and come along. I'm sure there's a few of us that would like to say 'hello' in person....




Hi Nick,
I feel confident in stating that if I were to attend the BABB's society as a homebrewer then I would fit in very well and as someone as exceptional knowledge on the subject.

I also accept that "someone" might feel SO aggressive to feel SO negative about an internet poster.

Its just about brewing for me mate :icon_chickcheers: 

cheers

the_new_darren


----------



## NickB (4/10/11)

Good for you then! I'm just annoyed at the constant derailing of threads that you seem to make a habit regardless of which username you use...

Cheers


----------



## the_new_darren (4/10/11)

Great, I get sick of threats hijacked by Qnldrs towing the "company" line


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

Ignore the Ignoramus


----------



## Tim F (5/10/11)

the_new_darren said:


> Great, I get sick of threats hijacked by Qnldrs towing the "company" line


Everyone in your home state thinks you're a wanker too...


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

As it's only a few days till the event, we decided that we would like to keep the thread bumped to gain maximum publicity - glad to have Darren on board doing that for us. 

Now what's your opinion of the family court?


----------



## Aus_Rider_22 (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Now what's your opinion of the family court?



It now makes sense who this pest is!


----------



## pimpsqueak (5/10/11)

I get the distinct feeling I should be putting this arsehat on my ignore list, along with speedie and a few other wastes of oxygen. h34r:


----------



## clarkey7 (5/10/11)

Back to the topic at hand....

Gearing up for another practice run on the Braumeister today.....

I heard BribieG was ironing his pillow slip and has painted lightning bolts onto his urn.......
There's also a rumour that he and has installed S/S spinning spokes on his urn to disable other competitors rigs :unsure: 

He really wants to win!!

Can't wait till Saturday.

Bring on the big System Wars Brewday :icon_cheers: 

PB


----------



## winkle (5/10/11)

I'll be there as Brads ernstwhile assistant :icon_cheers: 
Go the vessels three!
(I'll try and put BribieG off by dropping lager bombs while he mashs in)


----------



## RdeVjun (5/10/11)

Seeing as I won't make it to today's Brisbane pub crawl, I'm aiming to get to this event instead! :icon_cheers: 
Better help Bribie keep the pecker up- seeing as he has such a clear and obvious advantage, other competitors are tending towards sabotage!


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> I'd like to apologise in advance for
> 
> My behaviour on the day
> My not so pretty brewrig
> ...



Not being able to spell. 

If you had a stove there, I'd be able to bring down my two big w pots and knock out a batch, make it a 5 ways system wars!

_*If *_Crown Urn BIAB from Bribie is considered a poor man's Braumeister (which is considered a poor man's 3V), then surely 2 big w pots (one $19, one $12 on special) BIAB is surely a poor man's crown urn BIAB.

This looks rocking.

Goomba


----------



## winkle (5/10/11)

Pity there's not a HERMES and RIMS system in the fray - with energy meters and water usage monitered on all rigs. But thats complicated and probably only of interest to sad buggers like me.


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

Now there's an idea, I might bring the other urn as well and do a second batch just for myself using Ross's power  :

Edit: and bring my two over the side heaters, a couple of buckets and a spare doonah and do a third batch just for myself. 

And ferment them at Bacchus using their cold rooms

And bring all my lagering beers and sit them in his zero degree room for a month

and.......

B)


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

It was only a stove, and only for the system wars and the benefit of new brewers. B) 

I wasn't trying to pork barrel  

But the idea has merit.


----------



## argon (5/10/11)

Not entirely a bad idea... i'm sure the guys would be willing to expand the system wars to include a Maxi-BIAB . Tends to be the starting point for alot of new brewers these days (as well as knocking out award winning beers). 

Just need a portable heat source, like one of Bribie's pot heaters or a camp stove, your BigW pot, bag and a kitchen kettle.

I'd do it if i could spare the time (which is severely limited these days)


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

argon said:


> Not entirely a bad idea... i'm sure the guys would be willing to expand the system wars to include a Maxi-BIAB . Tends to be the starting point for alot of new brewers these days (as well as knocking out award winning beers).
> 
> Just need a portable heat source, like one of Bribie's pot heaters or a camp stove, your BigW pot, bag and a kitchen kettle.
> 
> I'd do it if i could spare the time (which is severely limited these days)



If it were next weekend, then I'd have a better chance of getting my permission slip.

I have a butane cooker - another one of those, and we'd be set, though my home stove is far quicker.

Goomba


----------



## raven19 (5/10/11)

winkle said:


> Pity there's not a HERMES and RIMS system in the fray ...



I'd rather be there with my rig than here at work chaps! Enjoy!


----------



## clarkey7 (5/10/11)

winkle said:


> Pity there's not a HERMES and RIMS system in the fray


Braumeister is a RIMS Winkle........Chappo should bring his HERMS and we'd have a full set.


----------



## winkle (5/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Braumeister is a RIMS Winkle........Chappo should bring his HERMS and we'd have a full set.



Yeah (if a single vessel one), I was thinking of a certian Sabco unit though


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Braumeister is a RIMS Winkle........Chappo should bring his HERMS and we'd have a full set.



<in his best _iron chef_ voice> Today, folks, we have a 6 way vessel brewing battle. Stainless steel chef Bribie-san with his Crown Urn Brew in a Bag system... who gets it, whose beer reigns supreme.

</_iron chef _voice>

Just sayin' 

Goomba


----------



## winkle (5/10/11)

"What! 
The Sabco! 
Nobody's brewing on the Sabco! 
I just shampooed the ball valves"

(or words to that effect.)


----------



## RdeVjun (5/10/11)

The shop Sabco looked to be undergoing a refit when I was there last weekend, had no vessels.  
The MaxiBIAB apparatus fits in a car boot with ease (even my tiny beep beep) and the gas camping stove is just enough to boil the kettle. In fact, its much like a Braumeister- sits up proudly in the front seat all strapped in safely while the kids all pile in the back!  Anyway, it was suggested and discussed briefly but four rigs seemed to be enough shenanigans for the purposes of the event, however maybe I'll bring it along anyway, knock one out in the car park in protest!


----------



## bconnery (5/10/11)

Don't forget the resulting beers are intended to be served at the conference later, so the more systems the more mechanics of getting those beers to everyone for a side by side tasting. 
Even 4 beers will be a stretch so adding more to the brew day, although fun for all involved, will make things a bit more difficult down the line...


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

RdeVjun said:


> ... Anyway, it was suggested and discussed briefly but four rigs seemed to be enough shenanigans for the purposes of the event, however maybe I'll bring it along anyway, knock one out in the car park in protest!



Maybe consider it for a future vessel-wars. It'd be fantastic, though I understand that a short-notice organisation makes it difficult.  

Seriously - it's got to be done. B) 

The whole idea of vessel-wars/system-wars is, in part, to show that good beer doesn't always need large amounts of expensive equipment (though said equipment does make brewing _easier_ in a lot of aspects). Also, it shows how theory of mashing, sparging, boiling, hop additions and chilling applies in practice and over a wide variety of apparati (?).

Instead, you have a situation where someone, with $40-$50 bucks worth of readily available stuff (at its most expensive) can knock out a good batch of AG beer. Even Bribie's crown urn, cheap as it is, can't do this (though again, it's easier to use).

If I'm a newbie, this appeals to me, because the ability to select one's entry point (price, and equipment) is a major factor in going toward AG. In fact, I'd be pretty confident in saying that if it weren't for BIAB, some newer 3V brewers mightn't be there. BIAB, especially cheaply, breaks down barriers.

So having the stovetop method/maxi BIAB is another demonstrator that, if you down have $300 to buy an urn and bag, you can still AG. And that the theory and knowledge of how it applies is the most important factor in brewing beer.

Just a couple of thoughts. Either way, I think it's a fantastic idea for BABBs to do and shows the sense of community and openness that we have up here. :beer: 

Goomba


----------



## Nick JD (5/10/11)

RdeVjun said:


> The shop Sabco looked to be undergoing a refit when I was there last weekend, had no vessels.
> The MaxiBIAB apparatus fits in a car boot with ease (even my tiny beep beep) and the gas camping stove is just enough to boil the kettle. In fact, its much like a Braumeister- sits up proudly in the front seat all strapped in safely while the kids all pile in the back!  Anyway, it was suggested and discussed briefly but four rigs seemed to be enough shenanigans for the purposes of the event, however maybe I'll bring it along anyway, knock one out in the car park in protest!



That's what they _say_. What they _mean_ is "OMG, what if Stovetop Maxi-BIAB wins the system wars?" Bit like America not letting Cuba and Japan into the "World Series".


----------



## browndog (5/10/11)

Nick JD said:


> That's what they _say_. What they _mean_ is "OMG, what if Stovetop Maxi-BIAB wins the system wars?" Bit like America not letting Cuba and Japan into the "World Series".




Nick, I'm doing a ghetto brew mashing in a fermenter and boiling in a 20L mayonnaise pail, so I'll be doing a concentrated boil (somewhat stovetop like) they are going to have egg on their faces if I get the gong. Picks of the rig this arvo.

cheers

Browndog


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Did you end up getting your kettle element working Tony?


----------



## RdeVjun (5/10/11)

Yeah, I\'m not part of the organising committee and the event is in their hands, plus I was really planning on coming along as a spectator, so I\'m only winding up in this particular discussion. AFAIK, the focus is really about the brewers and their own skills, not so much the actual equipment, so there\'s an abundance of that lined up for the event. And as browndog points out, ghetto is covered! :super: 
However, you\'re right LRG, there\'s loads of folks out there that can\'t drop hundreds of dollars on kit, let alone thousands (I for one know that I can\'t), but don\'t really know where to get started or that there\'s an el- cheapo entry point to get their all- grain shenanigans underway. For a future event, I\'d be chuffed to see Maxi or a kitchen alternative alongside other systems as an awareness and informational resource, hope one day that can eventuate. :icon_cheers:



> That\'s what they _say_. What they _mean_ is \"OMG, what if Stovetop Maxi-BIAB wins the system wars?\" Bit like America not letting Cuba and Japan into the \"World Series\".


I love a good, old- fashioned conspiracy theory Nick! But perhaps if that scenario did eventuate (and doofus here actually completed the job without a major spill or SNAFU), really all that would be demonstrated is that Maxi, and by extension just about every damn kitchen the world over, can produce top shelf beer- which has already been established! B)


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

RdeVjun said:


> .... For a future event, I'd be chuffed to see Maxi or a kitchen alternative alongside other systems as an awareness and informational resource, hope one day that can eventuate. :icon_cheers:



Absolutely. Given the whole point of these things is education and sharing of knowledge (rather than making AG brewing an "exclusive fraternity"), it'd be a fantastic idea.

Some people are visual people and would rather _see_ it being done, than _read_ about it (notwithstanding the fact that Nick's stovetop thread has a kazillion hits and has put many on the path).

Goomba


----------



## clarkey7 (5/10/11)

Shaved a couple of hours off the brewday on run No.2 of Braumeister.......
Had a great brewday once I got the crush and environment sorted.

Heading off to taste IPA's all night....  Have a cube in the boot.

PB


----------



## stux (5/10/11)

Future BABBS BIABS War 

Braumeister vs 40L Crown Urn BIAB vs Maxi-BIAB 19L pot vs Dual Mini-BIAB 2x19L


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

Stux said:


> Future BABBS BIABS War
> 
> Braumeister vs 40L Crown Urn BIAB vs Maxi-BIAB 19L pot vs Dual Mini-BIAB 2x19L



:beer: 

And sell it as a "been reading about BIAB, thinking about AG, but a bit afraid to make the final jump...."

Goomba


----------



## browndog (5/10/11)

Here is the ghetto rig, one fermenter doubles as a mash tun with the piece of conduit drilled with holes as a manifold and one Liam Ahearn signature series 20L bucket of death with a 2400W kettle element as a HLT and kettle. Can't get much simpler than that.






Bring it on.

Browndog

Nick I could not get the 25L bucket to boil with the 1800W element and so stole Liam's BoD and roped him in to help too.


----------



## RdeVjun (5/10/11)

browndog said:


> Here is the ghetto rig, one fermenter doubles as a mash tun with the piece of conduit drilled with holes as a manifold and one Liam Ahearn signature series 20L bucket of death with a 2400W kettle element as a HLT and kettle. Can't get much simpler than that.


Feck it, where do you guys keep getting those authentic Kraft mayo tubs from? I've been after one of those for yonks, searched everywhere! Oh wait, its Liam's own personal BoD, probably only breaks it out for 'special occasions'!


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

do you want to borrow my 9" false bottom for the day?


----------



## sim (5/10/11)

RdeVjun said:


> Oh wait, its Liam's own personal BoD, probably only breaks it out for 'special occasions'!




..ahh! so the secret ingredient those boys have been winning all the awards with is plastic!  

hot diggy! im off to smash my glass fermenters...


sim


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Thats surprising Tony! I had my HLT with 30 odd L in it boiling on my last brew day (had my temp controller set to 99C for some reason - brain fart most likely!).....

Oh well, as long as it all works. Keen to have a look at all the rigs on Saturday!

Cheers


----------



## browndog (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> do you want to borrow my 9" false bottom for the day?



That's way too high tech for us ghetto boys Bribie, but if you could bring your over the side element just in case, that would be awesome.


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

I'm using my new OTS but I also bought one second hand off Batz, so I'll bring that as well . Now that IS Ghetto :lol:


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

Apart from Brad the gas man, it looks like we will all be on electric - I'll need two circuits and possibly Browndog as well, and of course one circuit for the BM - I take it there will be enough power points and extension leads available? I'll bring a couple of leads. I'll be pumpin' 4800w at a couple of points.


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Apart from Brad the gas man, it looks like we will all be on electric - I'll need two circuits and possibly Browndog as well, and of course one circuit for the BM - I take it there will be enough power points and extension leads available? I'll bring a couple of leads. I'll be pumpin' 4800w at a couple of points.


I will need one point to heat my HLT, and one for the Magnetic Pump, and one for the Perastaltic pump. I will only be using two points at any one time.

I will bring my own gas.......which can be shared.

i will also bring an LPG bottle for the kettle  

Cheers


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)




----------



## winkle (5/10/11)

View attachment 48865


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)




----------



## Silo Ted (5/10/11)

Is Brad bringing his brewstand ? :lol:


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

Listen here Silo-Nanna. I moved away from tables and crates and heavy lifting quite some time ago. I have two pumps which I believe makes me twice the brewer.
Uuummm so there


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Or twice as lacking in the downstairs department....


If the cap fits....... Brew it it!


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Or twice as lacking in the downstairs department....
> 
> 
> If the cap fits....... Brew it it!



And I thought you were my freind  










You hermies bitch


----------



## geoff_tewierik (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> View attachment 48864



Reminds me of home.

Looks like Loy Yang Power Station.


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

And does the winning brewer get a sheild like this one? Yes tidalpete that is the State of Origin sheild and yes I had my hands on it.

This was today


----------



## Bribie G (5/10/11)

geoff_tewierik said:


> Reminds me of home.
> 
> Looks like Loy Yang Power Station.



Home? you don't look like a South Korean :huh:


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Gay as, Brad. So Gay.


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Gay as, Brad. So Gay.




Gay as AFL. I know.


----------



## Northside Novice (5/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> Gay as AFL. I know.




thats a bit harsh against the gays isnt it ?


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Not as gay as the Rugby League Arse Thumbers....... If tight shorts are a crime, well, AFL is guilty. If being gay is a crime, Rugby League is the WINNA...


----------



## Northside Novice (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Not as gay as the Rugby League Arse Thumbers....... If tight shorts are a crime, well, AFL is guilty. If being gay is a crime, Rugby League is the WINNA...




being gay isnt a crime unless your taliban ? in which case tight shorts are your least problem init?


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Indeed....


----------



## bradsbrew (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Not as gay as the Rugby League Arse Thumbers....... If tight shorts are a crime, well, AFL is guilty. If being gay is a crime, Rugby League is the WINNA...




hahahahaha. but really snickers aussie rules is boring, ffs it doesn't take much to kick a ball between a couple of posts and get a point for missing WTF.


----------



## Northside Novice (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Indeed....




classic ... or her cock


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Nor does it take much to be felt up by three guys and then hit in the throat........















OR...


----------



## geoff_tewierik (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Home? you don't look like a South Korean :huh:



Ha. Googled Power Station Images, found the one you linked, and yep it's Loy Yang.

And no it's not Korean, it's Victorian, just outside of Traralgon in the Latrobe Valley. 170kms east of Melbourne.


----------



## Northside Novice (5/10/11)

if thats your thing ??


royal flush a haha 

hows ya pokerface?

which system needs a hoppa bung?


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Brad's....


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)




----------



## browndog (5/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Apart from Brad the gas man, it looks like we will all be on electric - I'll need two circuits and possibly Browndog as well, and of course one circuit for the BM - I take it there will be enough power points and extension leads available? I'll bring a couple of leads. I'll be pumpin' 4800w at a couple of points.



The ghetto rig will only need one 10amp power point, we used to use a wood fire but upgraded to that electrics thing.


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Plastic + Fire = Headache And/Or A Party....


----------



## Northside Novice (5/10/11)

NickB said:


> Plastic + Fire = Headache And/Or A Party....



sounds/looks like a vfl match ... teehee


----------



## browndog (5/10/11)

browndog said:


> The ghetto rig will only need one 10amp power point, we used to use a wood fire but upgraded to that electrics thing.




besides, who but management types can afford electricity these days?


----------



## NickB (5/10/11)

Indeed! None of us 'trade types' are installing new 32A circuits. Not us, for sure!!!


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

Now before I pop off to the hairdressers then get my nails done, I'm in a bit of a tizz about whether to iron my lab coat as-is or to use Fabulon as well. Do you think Fabulon could be considered a bit wanky?


----------



## RdeVjun (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Now before I pop off to the hairdressers then get my nails done, I'm in a bit of a tizz about whether to iron my lab coat as-is or to use Fabulon as well. Do you think Fabulon could be considered a bit wanky?


Well, that's what the professionals use, don't they?


----------



## browndog (6/10/11)

I think Liam and I will be in appropriate ghetto attire, were were even thinking of sleeping in the dumper bin outside Bacchus on friday night to get right in the mood!

-BD


----------



## bradsbrew (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Now before I pop off to the hairdressers then get my nails done, I'm in a bit of a tizz about whether to iron my lab coat as-is or to use Fabulon as well. Do you think Fabulon could be considered a bit wanky?
> 
> View attachment 48879



I was contemplating getting my plumbers crack waxed for the occasion.


----------



## RdeVjun (6/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> I was contemplating getting my plumbers crack waxed for the occasion.


Why not go all out and get back, sack & crack?


----------



## winkle (6/10/11)

RdeVjun said:


> Well, that's what the professionals use, don't they?



Ring the Ponds Institute and check 

No prizes for what PB and co will be wearing...
View attachment 48882


----------



## RdeVjun (6/10/11)

winkle said:


> Ring the Ponds Institute and check


Love the Ponds Institute- "scientifically- proven...", "independent research shows 99%..." etc. :lol:


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> View attachment 48828



Wow! i can see my house from here!

As I have this saturday off, i'm gonna make an appearance. 10am start? I'll start walking about 9.30.........


----------



## clarkey7 (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Apart from Brad the gas man, it looks like we will all be on electric - I'll need two circuits and possibly Browndog as well, and of course one circuit for the BM - I take it there will be enough power points and extension leads available? I'll bring a couple of leads. I'll be pumpin' 4800w at a couple of points.


Hi Guys,

Had a brewday at Bacchus yesterday with the BM. Had the electricity cut out on me twice as we had too much plugged into one powerboard :blink:

So, I had a bit of a look around for power points for Saturday...We have enough to each use a separate power point (not sure about the circuits they'll be on) if we bring along a couple of long power cables.

I have 2 of them that I'll bring...BribieG bring yours and we should be right.

I don't really want everyone firing up 2 elements together as we'll probably blow circuits etc...

We should be OK, as the Brewery HLT will be on and we'll bucket say 80deg water across to our rigs from that to get the day off to a quick start and negate the need for heaps of power needed all at once to heat up water from room temp to 70ish.

BM = 1 power
3V = 0 as HLT water provided gas kettle
Ghetto - 1 power for kettle
BIAB - 1 power for urn for boil

It's not a race, it's an learning experience and a chance to talk to beer and brewing enthusiasts :beer: 

Has everyone plugged the recipe into there software to figure out if they'll get close to the original gravity with their system.
If you don't get 75 routinely (higher or lower), you will have to make some adjustments.

We could change the grain pack for huge discrepancies, but I'd like to be able to state that the ingredients were identical and rather you make the adjustments to your process to get to the correct gravity and bitterness balance.....a little less or more than 20l of beer at the correct gravity is fine.....

See you all there,

PB


----------



## Paul H (6/10/11)

Would you like to borrow a pair of my undies BD? You could use them as a strainer of sorts.. :icon_vomit: 

Cheers

Paul


----------



## bconnery (6/10/11)

Paul H said:


> Would you like to borrow a pair of my undies BD? You could use them as a strainer of sorts.. :icon_vomit:
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Paul


BIABBB?


----------



## Paul H (6/10/11)

bconnery said:


> BIABBB?



Brew In A Big Ball Bag :lol: 

Cheers

Paul


----------



## winkle (6/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> I was contemplating getting my plumbers crack waxed for the occasion.



So the 3V dress requirements are 20 year old stubbies, double pluggers and a bluey - sweet!


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

What's the recipe?

And I only use Indian Polenta nowadays, none of that Peroni crap.


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (6/10/11)

no-one likes hairy cleavage, whether it's builder's cleavage or the nicer variety.

Should have a "Ghetto System Wars" - that'd make BribieG at the top of pecking order in terms of equipment....

Goomba


----------



## clarkey7 (6/10/11)

This is what Beersmith puts out if you say 20L @ 75% efficiency and a 10%/hr boil-off rate with a mash out which we'll be doing. The only changes I've made since I sent this to you all was the (boil) gypsum addition, kettle-floc and yeast nutrient.
The book doesn't say what kind of crystal malt, we assume it's dark crystal (120L/240EBC) to get the colour suggested.

*Nochill cube supplied, pitched at 19 degrees with WY1968 and fermented together in the Bacchus Fermentation room.
You guys need to bring a fermentor, I'll let you know when it's time to transfer them to keg as I might get some help for that. Kegs supplied also. Served at the QLD Homebrewing Conference for lunch where we are asked to vote on a favourite (blind), results will be announced at the conclusion of the Systems Wars presentation at the conference.*

BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com
Recipe: BABBs QHC System Wars ESB
Brewer: BABBs Members - Fullers ESB from British Real Ale Graham Wheeler
Style: Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 20.00 L 
Boil Size: 25.25 L
Estimated OG: 1.052 SG
Estimated Color: 26.8 EBC
Estimated IBU: 34.1 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
4.00 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (Thomas Fawcett) (5Grain 90.91 % 
0.40 kg Crystal Extra Dark - 120L (Crisp) (236.4 EGrain 9.09 % 
7.00 gm Challenger [7.50 %] (60 min) Hops 6.3 IBU 
14.00 gm Target [11.00 %] (60 min) Hops 18.5 IBU 
7.00 gm Northdown [8.50 %] (60 min) Hops 7.2 IBU 
10.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [4.80 %] (10 min) Hops 2.1 IBU 
2.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [4.80 %] (Dry Hop 3 dHops - 
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc 
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 min) Misc 
5.00 gm Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
2.00 gm Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Boil 60.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs London ESB Ale (Wyeast Labs #1968) Yeast-Ale 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 4.40 kg
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body
Step Time Name Description Step Temp 

60 min Mash In Add 11.50 L of water at 72.4 C 66.0 C 
10 min Mash Out Add 6.50 L of water at 95.1 C 75.6 C 


Cheers and may the best prevail !!!

PB


----------



## bradsbrew (6/10/11)

Dave I don't understand the water? Mash in with 11.5L and mash out with 6.5L gives 18L pre-boil? Has it left out the sparge water? I dont use beersmith.

Cheers


----------



## clarkey7 (6/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> Dave I don't understand the water? Mash in with 11.5L and mash out with 6.5L gives 18L pre-boil? Has it left out the sparge water? I dont use beersmith.
> 
> Cheers


Yep - you're onto it Brad, actually systems will differ with there water/grain ratios (one of the main differences) during mashing and also boil volume, sparge water etc...

I suggest you plug the recipe into whatever you use and make adjustments to settings etc and print off a brew sheet.

Actually - I'll like to have a brew-sheet from all of you...ta

PB :beerbang:


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

Also I don't understand the 20L batch, boil size 25.25L - If you are referring to boil off, I wouldn't have a clue what my boil off rate is - I just judge by the line on the sight tube  

If we are filling a Ross Cube then that's 21L, which is a good size to fill a corny after slurry loss in the fermenter. 20L would leave headspace in the cube. 

Allowing a couple of litres at least of trub loss in the kettle that brings me to 23L after the boil, with 21 of that into the cube and 2L left in the kettle.

So to get a 1052 wort, according to BrewMate I'll need at least 4.6 of MO plus 0.46 of crystal, with the hops (kettle) increased at the ratio of hops/20 * 23


Apart from that, looks good - I'll send you a brewsheet.


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

I'll just post it:

System Wars Bitter


Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 5.060
Total Hops (g): 63.50
Original Gravity (OG): 1.052 (P): 12.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.013 (P): 3.3
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.11 %
Colour (SRM): 10.9 (EBC): 21.5
Bitterness (IBU): 39.3 (Average)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 75
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
4.600 kg Pale Malt Maris Otter TF (90.91%)
0.460 kg Crystal Heritage Simpsons (9.09%)

Hop Bill
----------------
8.0 g Challenger Pellet (7.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.3 g/L)
8.0 g Northdown Pellet (8.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.3 g/L)
16.0 g Target Pellet (11% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
11.5 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.8% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.5 g/L)
20.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (0.9 g/L)

Misc Bill
----------------
7.0 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) @ 0 Minutes (Mash)
1.0 g Whirlfloc Tablet @ 0 Minutes (Boil)
5.0 g Yeast Nutrient @ 0 Minutes (Boil)

Single step Infusion at 66C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 19C with Wyeast 1968 - London ESB Ale


Recipe Generated with BrewMate

:icon_cheers:


----------



## clarkey7 (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Also I don't understand the 20L batch, boil size 25.25L - If you are referring to boil off, I wouldn't have a clue what my boil off rate is - I just judge by the line on the sight tube
> 
> If we are filling a Ross Cube then that's 21L, which is a good size to fill a corny after slurry loss in the fermenter. 20L would leave headspace in the cube.
> 
> ...


20L was originally selected so as not to push the Ghetto system and because 19L fits in a keg (allow for 1L loss to ferm trub).
20L into cube will be fine BribieG, we'll use oven gloves and a helper to squeeze out the air and cap the cubes.
Also we are pitching as soon as the temp is down to 19.
How far off 1052 are you with a 20L batch with the stated ingredients? 
I would have thought your efficiency may be a touch higher than 75 anyhow???
Let me know guys as the grain will be packed tomorrow for us.

If one of the batches is way off, we can always fix on the fly anyway.

You worry to much Bribie....you're gonna loose to the Ipswich Ghetto, Brads Man Rig or the Bling factor anyway h34r:


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

Well in that case I'll need to do a 22L batch with loss to trub. Remember the trub isn't just trub, it's got a lot of the fermentables "lost" in it as well. Mate, I'm quite happy to do a 22L batch to yeild 20L into the cube but really I'd just go the 23L as it's what my system generally does for a Rosscoe cube and if a bit gets wasted at the end it shouldn't be an issue on this occasion - maybe a couple of dollars (if that is an issue I'll donate $2 to a busker next time I'm in the Valley :lol: )


----------



## bradsbrew (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Also I don't understand the 20L batch, boil size 25.25L - If you are referring to boil off, I wouldn't have a clue what my boil off rate is - I just judge by the line on the sight tube
> 
> If we are filling a Ross Cube then that's 21L, which is a good size to fill a corny after slurry loss in the fermenter. 20L would leave headspace in the cube.
> 
> ...


I thought the same thing Bribie, regarding brew size. Perhaps its a scandal to accomodate the 20L braumeister hmmmmmmmmmm. But I guess if we all start with the same weight of grain, same milling of grain, same water temp, same water profile, then the results should indicate which system gave the best mash efficiency as well. But it will also indicate if better mash efficiency may attribute to grain astringiency through over sparging etc etc.
I will be out of my comfort zone as my rig usually pushes out triple batches and aiming for a single batch in a 100L kettle is a bit harder to judge volumes when I have a mental note of what it should look like normally. I have done a couple of single batches in the last couple of weeks to try and get volume measurements for stages. My main concern is boil off % but I will aim to just fill a cube, if I have to top up that will be better than having too much.
IMO we all need to start with the same recipe amounts and have same volume at the end to give a proper indication of "system results" . So I think we aim to fill a cube to an equal mark each, that way we all have consistency in volume compared to ingredients.

Cheers


Edit= writing while PB posted


----------



## Bribie G (6/10/11)

I hear what you say, Brad, but for a 20L total length that's probably only going to yield 17-18L into the cube with loss to trub. However considering that it's probably going into the lagering room and get pitched ASAP I can't see that cube headspace is going to be a problem. However to get a corny you are going to need at least 19 into the cube, thus 18 into the corny and that's why I mention 22 or 23 litres based on experience of brewing those quantities. 20L _including _trub ain't gonna cut it IMHO.


----------



## bradsbrew (6/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> I hear what you say, Brad, but for a 20L total length that's probably only going to yield 17-18L into the cube with loss to trub. However considering that it's probably going into the lagering room and get pitched ASAP I can't see that cube headspace is going to be a problem. However to get a corny you are going to need at least 19 into the cube, thus 18 into the corny and that's why I mention 22 or 23 litres based on experience of brewing those quantities. 20L _including _trub ain't gonna cut it IMHO.



Aaah now I see what you mean. I general don't count trub, so a 20L batch is 20L into the cube. 

Cheers


----------



## winkle (6/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> I thought the same thing Bribie, regarding brew size. Perhaps its a scandal to accomodate the 20L braumeister hmmmmmmmmmm. But I guess if we all start with the same weight of grain, same milling of grain, same water temp, same water profile, then the results should indicate which system gave the best mash efficiency as well. But it will also indicate if better mash efficiency may attribute to grain astringiency through over sparging etc etc.
> I will be out of my comfort zone as my rig usually pushes out triple batches and aiming for a single batch in a 100L kettle is a bit harder to judge volumes when I have a mental note of what it should look like normally. I have done a couple of single batches in the last couple of weeks to try and get volume measurements for stages. My main concern is boil off % but I will aim to just fill a cube, if I have to top up that will be better than having too much.
> IMO we all need to start with the same recipe amounts and have same volume at the end to give a proper indication of "system results" . So I think we aim to fill a cube to an equal mark each, that way we all have consistency in volume compared to ingredients.
> 
> ...



Dang, we could have cobbled together a single batch rig easily. Should have talked about it earlier, still controlling the MT temp should be ok and boil off volumes can be sorted with a simple measuring stick and extra water. Do-able Brad, or you could use a smaller kettle?


----------



## bradsbrew (6/10/11)

winkle said:


> Dang, we could have cobbled together a single batch rig easily. Should have talked about it earlier, still controlling the MT temp should be ok and boil off volumes can be sorted with a simple measuring stick and extra water. Do-able Brad, or you could use a smaller kettle?




Tis all good winkle have the tun sorted and boil off is under control.

Cheers


----------



## clarkey7 (6/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> Aaah now I see what you mean. I general don't count trub, so a 20L batch is 20L into the cube.
> 
> Cheers


Yep - I was getting confused too. I also do not count kettle trub when I'm describing my output volume.
The trub I mentioned earlier was fermentation trub.
Kettle trub has been allowed for in my brewing software for when using my usual rig, but I hadn't added it to the recipe specs for this exercise.

I know others won't add the losses into brewing software as it doesn't account for the lost IBU's etc...

So, if we all just use the ingredients supplied and aim for 20L into the cube that would be great. Don't stress too much about hitting 1052.

At one stage I was wanting us all to be fermenting a beer with the same OG as previous experiences from people/clubs/conference organisers who have conducted other taste offs (water chem, ANHC system wars and podcasts + ?? other etc) showed that differing OG's certainly can change the drinkers perception, experience and mouth-feel etc, but this meant we would have to use different recipe ingredients....or adding LDME or upping the hop additions etc...

To be a true systems wars we have to all brew a beer with the same ingredients and take readings/measurements of all stages and compare the differences...This way we'll get a better idea of the advantages and disadvantages I reckon.

I know that we could all change things to manipulate the final beer....but in this case see me first as we may all need to change something together. 

I have no doubt all the beers will turn out great :beer:


----------



## browndog (6/10/11)

Jeebers, you guys are thinking too hard, we all get the same amounts of ingrediants and we all brew with it. The beauty about the ghetto system is I've got NFI how it's going to turn out, hence, will see what happens on the day.

cheers

Browndog

will use my experience, wit and cunning to produce a beer to the required specs.


----------



## clarkey7 (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> Jeebers, you guys are thinking too hard, we all get the same amounts of ingrediants and we all brew with it. The beauty about the ghetto system is I've got NFI how it's going to turn out, hence, will see what happens on the day.
> 
> cheers
> 
> ...


Reckon you blokes will be alright.... 2 X State Champions brewing together.... Ghetto..we haven't got a chance.


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (7/10/11)

Hey guys,

Does anyone have any objection to me filming the system wars tomorrow?

Not only am I fascinated about other peoples brew rigs, I can give copies to anyone that wants them.

Let me know if its ok, no dramas if it isnt.


----------



## Ross (7/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Does anyone have any objection to me filming the system wars tomorrow?
> 
> ...




Definately welcome Dan :icon_chickcheers:


----------



## Bribie G (7/10/11)

As I'm erm supposed to be somewhere else tomorrow that's fine as long as you don't get my face in B)


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (7/10/11)

Just let me know who you are when you see me mate and I'll make sure I only get your best side  

See you all tomorrow, 3 V for the win!!!!


----------



## bradsbrew (7/10/11)

Phew just got back from my waxing, didn't know they charge by the inch when it comes to crack waxing, I paid for an extra inch because of the filming and stuff. Looking forward to the day tommorrow. Better go and clean the mash tun after the brew I done last week B) .


----------



## Howlingdog (7/10/11)

we were there yesterday afternoon for a taste of all. Ryeld child got our vote

HD


----------



## Howlingdog (7/10/11)

how did I do that? Wrong thread

HD


----------



## clarkey7 (7/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Just let me know who you are when you see me mate and I'll make sure I only get your best side
> 
> See you all tomorrow, 3 V for the win!!!!


How's your editing skills KBB?

I'll be recording the day on paper and with photos and maybe a couple of little video clips on my camera, but It would be great if someone was capturing the whole thing on video.....

I reckon a short video compilation of the day would go down well in the presentation at the conference too!

See you tomorrow,

PB (Dave)


----------



## RdeVjun (7/10/11)

Bringing some tucker for the headliners, entourage and road crew, seeing as there's probably not much local that will be open. Nothing fancy, just Tandoori chicken wings, pakoras and condiments, think Bribie has something on the go, should be microwaveable. :icon_cheers:


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

Liam and I are off to Archive when the system wars wraps up, anyone else interested?

-BD


----------



## bradsbrew (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> Liam and I are off to Archive when the system wars wraps up, anyone else interested?
> 
> -BD



I may be up for it, if I can sort out my vehicle. Was going to try and have a beer with Ralph and Bribie at the Bitter suite as well.

Cheers


----------



## RdeVjun (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> Liam and I are off to Archive when the system wars wraps up, anyone else interested?


After a pint at Bitter Suite, that's where I was headed for sure. :icon_cheers:


----------



## argon (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> Liam and I are off to Archive when the system wars wraps up, anyone else interested?
> 
> -BD


what time tone?


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Just plugged the recipe into my software and with a final batch size of 20L the IBUs will be 45.

The recipe posted earlier states IBU's @ 36 but this would be for the full 25L.

Anyone else pick up on this?


----------



## WSC (7/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> I may be up for it, if I can sort out my vehicle. Was going to try and have a beer with Ralph and Bribie at the Bitter suite as well.
> 
> Cheers


What time do you guys think you will be at Bitter Suite, happy hour is 3 to 4pm but it may be able to be extended if I ask nicely?


----------



## clarkey7 (7/10/11)

The Scientist said:


> Just plugged the recipe into my software and with a final batch size of 20L the IBUs will be 45.
> 
> The recipe posted earlier states IBU's @ 36 but this would be for the full 25L.
> 
> Anyone else pick up on this?


Nope..that doesn't sound right..What equation does your software use to calculate IBU's?

Edit - If you plug BribieGs edited recipe version in it might be..

The Book the recipe came from, beersmith and brewmate have it around 34-36 IBU's for a 19-20L batch :icon_cheers:


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

argon said:


> what time tone?



When the System Wars is done and dusted, the vanquishing kings have been paid homage and the corpses have been buried, and hopefully if Liam can still drive we will be headed in towards the CBD, should be a couple of seats spare for anyone game.


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Nope..that doesn't sound right..What equation does your software use to calculate IBU's?
> 
> The Book the recipe came from, beersmith and brewmate have it around 34-36 :icon_cheers:



I'm using Promash and with 75% efficiency I get 1.050 at 20L and 45.7 IBU.

I use Rager for Hop utilisation.

@ 25L I get 36 IBU

Not sure whats going on :unsure:


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Nope..that doesn't sound right..What equation does your software use to calculate IBU's?
> 
> The Book the recipe came from, beersmith and brewmate have it around 34-36 :icon_cheers:




Don't worry about Liam, although he is a scientist he has an abacus that he used to formulate recipes and I think his young bloke may have chewed off a few crucial beads......

Damn, he beat me by seconds


----------



## clarkey7 (7/10/11)

The Scientist said:


> I'm using Promash and with 75% efficiency I get 1.050 at 20L and 45.7 IBU.
> 
> I use Rager for Hop utilisation.
> 
> ...


Rager vs Tinseth probably, but no matter, we are all brewing the same recipe - bring your A game boys :beerbang:


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Rager vs Tinseth probably, but no matter, we are all brewing the same recipe - bring your A game boys :beerbang:




Hope none of those wing nuts accidentally come loose and muck you brew up Dave.......


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Ghetto ESB
A ProMash Recipe Report
Recipe Specifics
----------------
Batch Size (L): 20.00 Wort Size (L): 20.00
Total Grain (kg): 4.40
Anticipated OG: 1.050 Plato: 12.49
Anticipated SRM:	13.7
Anticipated IBU:	45.7
Brewhouse Efficiency:	75 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate:	15.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size:	23.53 L
Pre-Boil Gravity:	1.043 SG 10.69 Plato


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
90.9 4.00 kg. TF Maris Otter Pale Ale Malt UK 1.037 3
9.1 0.40 kg. Crystal 105L Great Britain 1.033 120

Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
7.00 g. Northdown Pellet 8.50 9.8 60 min.
7.00 g. Challenger Pellet 7.90 9.1 60 min.
14.00 g. Target Pellet 11.00 25.3 60 min.
10.00 g. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 5.00 1.6 10 min.


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Starting Boil Vol 25L

End Boil Vol 20L

20% Evaporation 

Its a bit high isn't it?


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

The Scientist said:


> Ghetto ESB
> A ProMash Recipe Report
> Recipe Specifics
> ----------------
> ...



Liam, I can see your problem, you are using antiquated deadware......


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> Liam, I can see your problem, you are using antiquated deadware......



Yeah but it won me the State Championship!!!


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

The Scientist said:


> Yeah but it won me the State Championship!!!



Only because Ross could not be buggered fermenting his FWKs at home.

all 22 of them that is.


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Some photos of my Ghetto gear over the years:


----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

The Scientist said:


> Some photos of my Ghetto gear over the years:
> 
> View attachment 48947
> 
> View attachment 48946




A real and honest apprenticeship there mate, that mayonnaise bucket looks familiar.


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)




----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

browndog said:


> A real and honest apprenticeship there mate, that mayonnaise bucket looks familiar.



Ahhh...the early years :lol:


----------



## Bribie G (7/10/11)




----------



## browndog (7/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> View attachment 48951




Liam follows an ancient practice where they inhale the fumes from a boiling pot and spit them into a collection vessel.


----------



## The Scientist (7/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> View attachment 48951



Look how happy that guy is, its like he really want to live :lol: 

or maybe he's blind and didn't know his photo was being taken h34r:


----------



## bradsbrew (8/10/11)

*System Wars ESB* (Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale))

Original Gravity (OG): 1.052 (P): 12.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.013 (P): 3.3
Alcohol (ABV): 5.11 %
Colour (SRM): 14.2 (EBC): 28.0
Bitterness (IBU): 38.1 (Average)

90.91% Maris Otter Malt
9.09% Crystal 120

0.4 g/L Challenger (7.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.4 g/L Northdown (8.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.7 g/L Target (11% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.5 g/L East Kent Golding (4.8% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil)


Single step Infusion at 66C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 60 Minutes

Fermented at 20C with 


Recipe Generated with *BrewMate*


----------



## browndog (8/10/11)

Thunder and lightning and raining cats and dogs............ an ominous omen for the system wars. Bring it on.


----------



## bradsbrew (8/10/11)

browndog said:


> Thunder and lightning and raining cats and dogs............ an ominous omen for the system wars. Bring it on.


My mash tun should be full by the time I get there


----------



## pike1973 (8/10/11)

I hope its not outside or everyone is going to get pretty wet.


----------



## Bribie G (8/10/11)

browndog said:


> Thunder and lightning and raining cats and dogs............ an ominous omen for the system wars. Bring it on.



Just got up and read the above. Obviously BD's attempt at poetry and allusion, what's the sirry plick on about? Anyway hopped across to the BOM page and managed to load the car before *this* hit the Island - I was a blur


----------



## RdeVjun (8/10/11)

Yeah, started here a bit earlier but wasn't quite as intense. I may be waylaid a little.


----------



## mccuaigm (8/10/11)

Good luck guys, hope it all goes well.


----------



## Bribie G (8/10/11)

Nah only rained kittens and airlocks here, worst over - hopping into shower then on my way.


----------



## Florian (8/10/11)

Good luck today guys, may the best system win... Well, either that, or the Ghetto Boys.

Sad I can't be there today to repesent the system that allows me to brew while at work, but am confident that Dave will do a good job either way. 
Am having an awesome time here in Berlin though, sampling a few German IPAs tonight, didn't even know they existed.


----------



## RdeVjun (8/10/11)

Florian said:


> sampling a few German IPAs tonight, didn't even know they existed.


Looking forward to sampling yours in BABBs MiniComp later this month!  Seriously, neither did I, what will they think of next??!! :icon_cheers: 

Heading around 930- 1000, a few things to straighten out here before I can go.


----------



## RdeVjun (8/10/11)

Apologies, won't make it to the Capalaba battlefield now as I've had some transport strife, the chariot's bloody alternator has packed it in by the looks- just put four new tyres it on yesterday an' all! :angry:


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (8/10/11)

Popped in for some sorghum syrup for a GF beer for a mate.

Laughed myself silly at the fact that the power kept tripping and a simple purchase took 20 mins because poor Ross' computers kept shutting down due to power overload on the circuit. And his saying "why didn't anyone bring gas?". He's right, though.

Then looked at the "ghetto brew" fermenter. That ain't ghetto, it's gold class compared to my 2 pots on the stove.

Wish I could have been there start to finish. SWMBO in the car and quick purchase meant nope.

Goomba


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (8/10/11)

The ghetto was definitely a spectacle.

I cant believe the ghetto lads were cubed and drinking beer before the braumeister and the BIAB were even properly boiling.

I have videos of the day, but cant upload them, got terrible bandwidth, will do it on monday at work.


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (8/10/11)

Dropped into archive on the way home and tried the Blackbeard IPA. Very nice, like that bit of roasted malt over the top of it.

Even the mrs seemed to think it was nice - spat when I got her a S&W Lager. I've trained her better than I thought.

Goomba


----------



## pike1973 (8/10/11)

I went down ,but had to go early could only stay around untill the ghetto brew system was all finished, but it was an awsome thing to see that a brewery that cost no more than $40-$50 could have its brew done and dusted when two of the others were just starting to boil properly. The three vessel was not too far behind when I left, but it definitely was a sight to see, great day. :beerbang:


----------



## Bribie G (8/10/11)

Yes 2 mayo tubs, a kettle element and ...

Actually I don't know why I typed that "and" because that was it :lol: Not even a half decent bag.....

Will be interesting to see how it stacked up against the $2500 worth of advanced tech. 

Hey LRG you should have announced yourself around, would be good to put a face to the name.


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (8/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Yes 2 mayo tubs, a kettle element and ...
> 
> Actually I don't know why I typed that "and" because that was it :lol: Not even a half decent bag.....
> 
> ...



You were busy trying to get the over-the-side element sorted (and Ross running around trying to get power to stop cutting out)  - no-one likes brewday interruptions.

I would have, but had SWMBO in the car (and on strict instructions), and if I had, I'd have spent an hour talking shop. But next time for sure.

If there's ever a ghetto system wars (though I think I'd still be slower than the mayo bucket), I'd be happy to bring the pots and butane stoves down.

I bet you didn't know yourself brewing without polenta h34r: 

Cooking some rice in the micro for a soghum and rice faux-lager for my GI mate. Kind of a surprise whilst he's away on camping with his mrs.

Goomba


----------



## clarkey7 (8/10/11)

All done and dusted by 2.30pm.... Most of the boys then headed into various drinking establishments...

Thanks to Ross for donating ingredients, allowing us crash his shop and fermentation room and bugging his staff etc....and for the power outages....Oops. h34r: 

What a day.... 2 systems done in 3 hrs, 2 in 4hr....4 cubes waiting to be pitched (the pre-heated water really cut down the brewday.

Really looking forward to tasting the lot at the conference.

Thanks to all the participants and for all the guys who came down for a chat and a sticky beak...It was great talking to you all.

Cheers,

PB :kooi:


----------



## yardy (8/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> *I cant believe the ghetto lads were cubed and drinking beer before the braumeister and the BIAB were even properly boiling.*



looking forward to the pics n vids :icon_cheers: 



is it all done and dusted ?
what were the official placings ?

cheers


----------



## Silo Ted (8/10/11)

yardy said:


> looking forward to the pics n vids :icon_cheers:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Um, Yardy... the brews haven't started fermenting yet. You are waaaaaay too impatient.


----------



## winkle (8/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> All done and dusted by 2.30pm.... Most of the boys then headed into various drinking establishments...
> 
> Thanks to Ross for donating ingredients, allowing us crash his shop and fermentation room and bugging his staff etc....and for the power outages....Oops. h34r:
> 
> ...



I'd forgotten about the pre-heated water otherwise I'd have gotten there sooner instead of leaving Brad do all the work. Pity about that, athough I did stir the kettle twice  . 
Coming soon to a retailer near you - Ipswich Getto BrewerysTM (POA).


----------



## yardy (8/10/11)

Silo Ted said:


> Um, Yardy... the brews haven't started fermenting yet. You are waaaaaay too impatient.




i thought this all grain thingo was the ducks guts...pfft.






nah mate, meant time placings


----------



## edschache (8/10/11)

Thanks all, was a great day and very educational. 

Big thanks to Bribie G for talking me through BIAB and showing me how it's done (not to mention the fact sheet). 

With Anthony's great help I have my own BIAB setup. Hoping it rains tomorrow so I can't do the gardening and get to brew instead.

Thanks for putting up with us Ross - the more excuses I have to visit the better (for me and your sales figures).

Cheers,

Ed


----------



## bradsbrew (8/10/11)

Lord Raja Goomba I said:


> Laughed myself silly at the fact that the power kept tripping and a simple purchase took 20 mins because poor Ross' computers kept shutting down due to power overload on the circuit. And his saying "why didn't anyone bring gas?". He's right, though.
> 
> 
> Goomba


Big thanks to Dave for all his work organising this day! Another big thanks to Ross and team CB for their support.

You were not the only one laughing when the power kept cutting out actually mine was more of a snigger. 

Oh and you should have had a better look the 3V system was not effected by the power outages because that big hot burny thing under the kettle was a rambo burner powered by gas  

Probably one of my quickest brewdays ever. And the mash tun was clean mid boil. Probably had a five minute clean up after the cube was full :beerbang: 

Cheers


----------



## clarkey7 (8/10/11)

yardy said:


> nah mate, meant time placings


I don't want us giving everything away as I'll be doing a session at the conference on the whole day etc... but a few details and a few photos is cool..

Ghetto guys - cube lid screwed on in under 3 hrs.....from Mash In. Now that is fast.....

PB


----------



## NickB (8/10/11)

Good fun seemingly had by all. Was great to drop by for a couple of hours to see how the non HERMS people brew... 

Cheers


----------



## Tanga (8/10/11)

Tim F said:


> Everyone in your home state thinks you're a wanker too...



LOL, plus eleventy billion.

Tim, I still want to check out that (not so) ghetto system of yours. Are you going to the case swap?


----------



## Bribie G (8/10/11)

Got home and measured my "strike liquor" mark on the urn sight tube and _bugger_ - I'd actually set everything up for a 24L batch with the supplied ingredients and indeedy I got 24L with an og of 1043 - which according to BrewMate gave me an eff of 75%. 
However it will be interesting to see how it goes at the tasting day. Could probably have done with a 90 min boil but stable door/ horse

Note to self: mark off a properly calibrated sight tube instead of "yeah that looks the mark"  

Great time, and it was held at the right location as I had not packed my bag in the gear  but bought a newie from Ross. Good to see so many new brewers popping in for a look-see


----------



## argon (8/10/11)

Buying a false bottom, a lauter tun/bucket and forgetting the bag.... Hmmm. I see what's happening here. h34r:


----------



## Bribie G (8/10/11)

How can I forget the bag? I've now got 4 of the buggers - I'll need to get two more urns and do quadruple batches. Or take up a lot of cheese making.


----------



## Tim F (9/10/11)

Tanga said:


> LOL, plus eleventy billion.
> 
> Tim, I still want to check out that (not so) ghetto system of yours. Are you going to the case swap?


Nah but I put my name down for the insanely over the top swap!


----------



## browndog (9/10/11)

just got home after a brilliant day doing the system wars. Liam and I headed into Archive for our first visit. What a great bar, we were blown away then off to The End bar and back to Archive, we could not believe how many beers they had that we've not tried. Did our best to tryu as many as possible. Looking forward to the conference now to see who's cusine will reign supreme!


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (10/10/11)

Guys,

Got the videos of the Babbs System Wars up on youtube.

Just search for 'Babbs System Wars' and they should all pop up.

Was a fun day.


----------



## Barley Belly (10/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Guys,
> 
> Got the videos of the Babbs System Wars up on youtube.
> 
> ...




Not working for me :huh:


----------



## mccuaigm (10/10/11)

Me either


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (10/10/11)

Hmmmm,

Let me have a play with it.

Sorry guys, no idea what I am doing here.


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (10/10/11)

OK, some are still uploading, give it an hour or so, then I will post links.


----------



## MarkBastard (10/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Ghetto guys - cube lid screwed on in under 3 hrs.....from Mash In. Now that is fast.....
> PB



Hmm is that abnormal?

Takes me about that long with my Urn BIAB system. Assuming you mean from time adding the grain.

0 minute - Add grain
5 minute - Finished mixing, added lagging, official start of mesh timer
1h 5 minute - End mash, hoist bag
1 h 30 minute - Begin boil
2 h 30 minute - End boil
2 h 50 minute - Transfer to cube
2 h 55 minute - All done (other than cleaning)


----------



## yardy (10/10/11)

since when did heating strike and cleaning not become part of a brewday ? :icon_cheers:


----------



## Parks (10/10/11)

yardy said:


> since when did heating strike and cleaning not become part of a brewday ? :icon_cheers:



When you have an urn on a timer so your strike water heats while I sleep


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (10/10/11)

Ok here are the links to the first thrilling installment of Babbs System wars

3 Vessel

Intro - http://youtu.be/spaG9-hBaRU
Mash in - http://youtu.be/QvbdUy0n_LU
Sparge 1 - http://youtu.be/V0pigXtvPEs
Sparge 2 - http://youtu.be/zZL0ttPYeBM
Recirc - http://youtu.be/G6KMQ9MX-Mw
Flame on - http://youtu.be/5HkLEFmD-xo

Can someone have a look and let me know if its working?


----------



## Parks (10/10/11)

1st works - will look through the rest shortly


----------



## Parks (10/10/11)

Yep all look good - good job!


----------



## MarkBastard (10/10/11)

yardy said:


> since when did heating strike and cleaning not become part of a brewday ? :icon_cheers:



He did say 'since mash in' or whatever.


----------



## booargy (10/10/11)

thats Rodney Rude?


----------



## bradsbrew (10/10/11)

Good work Dan. Did you have to include the part where i had forgot to plug in the power and was wondering why the pump wasn't working  

I've had a shave and haircut to avoid being stopped in the street and stuff  

Boargy I've been called worse :icon_cheers: 

Cheers


----------



## The Scientist (10/10/11)

What a great day, I had heaps of fun brewing with Browndog and then a night out on the town which will be hard to top.

Such a smooth brew day on the ghetto system I'm thinking of doing it more often. We'll have to wait for the taste testing for the real consensus but for anyone looking to start out with AG, this is the way to go. Cheap and easy, just like I take my women :icon_chickcheers: 

Cheers,

TS


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (11/10/11)

And now for the second thrilling installment of the BABBs System wars; BIAB!!!!!

BIAB intro - http://youtu.be/LCtqoP9qZi4
BIAB intro 2 - http://youtu.be/EPvyAygASkU
BIAB strike water - http://youtu.be/I-AdlXfUmrg
BIAB Mash In - http://youtu.be/Yb04sig4NkI
BIAB goes has a snooze in a doona - http://youtu.be/-q2gl0uiU0M
BIAB Mash out - http://youtu.be/5Jve0Pq9lns
BIAB Bag out - http://youtu.be/qixIkPm74I8
BIAB squeezing his bag - http://youtu.be/NhAeA6WgMyE

More installments coming........


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (12/10/11)

Here is the 3rd installment of the BABBs System Wars - Braumeister!!!!

Intro - http://youtu.be/rxtiQd6yqZA
Mash In - http://youtu.be/DxEiNQZCGrc
Mashing - http://youtu.be/NHvcEFcPa2U
Sparge - http://youtu.be/SiA8Gd8qijk

One more installment to come......Stay tuned....


----------



## pike1973 (12/10/11)

Looks like your leaving the best till last.


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (12/10/11)

You have no idea....

I can still not believe the simplicity and ease of the ghetto system.

Having 2 champion brewers manning it probably helped somewhat, but still....

Ghettolicious.


----------



## pike1973 (12/10/11)

I was there on the day and was so impressed that on sunday I went out and got the gear to build my own bucket of death so bring on the ghetto style.


----------



## Bribie G (12/10/11)

Nothing wrong with the old B.O.D. - Owned one in the UK and sent it here where it eventually karked it after a couple of years usage. , if they were available in Australia I'd never have gone the urn route.


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (12/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> Nothing wrong with the old B.O.D. - Owned one in the UK and sent it here where it eventually karked it after a couple of years usage. , if they were available in Australia I'd never have gone the urn route.





But could you wrap it in a sleeping bag or a doona.....


----------



## MarkBastard (12/10/11)

Is sparging optional in the braumeister? Also I take it the sparge water came from elsewhere?


----------



## Bribie G (12/10/11)

No, in the UK it would have to be a duvet B) 

:icon_offtopic: (Australian Soft Furnishings Association in the 1970s invented the word "doonah" because they figured that Australians were too fucken thick to make them pronounce French Words like "Doo - Vay". - similar to the original idea to bring out the first Commodore with a forward sloping nose (like the Torana) as the "shovel nose" of the Opel derived Commodore would be just too radical for the fucken thick Australian motoring public. General Motors put their foot down and made them go the shovel nose. 
Shows what big business thinks of Joe and Jane Aussie, hey. )


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (12/10/11)

Well there you go...

I will sleep soundly tonight now that I know that.

cheers Bribie


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (12/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Is sparging optional in the braumeister? Also I take it the sparge water came from elsewhere?




Not sure about optional, and yes they got the water out of one of ross's kettles.

Dave might be able to answer this question a bit better than me.


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (12/10/11)

Hell, still the same now with Holdens.

Instead of rebadging opel reckfords, they're now doing the same thing with Daewoos and the public buys an "aussie" car, which is actually 2nd-rate Korean.

An now Opel are re-sending the Corsa back to Australia badged as an Opel, not a Barina (which is now a Daewoo Kalos).

Speaking of which, given you're living on a certain Island up there, mentioned Hadrian's Wall (hence, you must be a northerner or summat like it), and a certain red-headed British born (Yorkshire, no-less), Australian raised Rugby League player from Bribie Island recently pledged his allegence to English RFL - you didn't have owt to do wi' it?

Oops, cat is out of the bag!


----------



## banora brewer (12/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Is sparging optional in the braumeister? Also I take it the sparge water came from elsewhere?


It is optional, just brInge your water level back up to the 25 ltr mark, and rinses the grain


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (13/10/11)

And here is the moment that everyone has been waiting for.....

The final installment in the epic Babbs System Wars - The Ghetto System

Ghetto Introduction - http://youtu.be/STwEyy06yR0
Ghetto Mash In - http://youtu.be/vvFTztjB5Pw
Ghetto Mash Out - http://youtu.be/16UGf1VRapY
Ghetto Lauterin - http://youtu.be/O35EwHjS5AI
Ghetto Sparge - http://youtu.be/U-OfZDs7TOc
Ghetto Sparge 2 - http://youtu.be/Ft0sbQI5FRU
Ghetto Recirc - http://youtu.be/B5TTLLWQ-c0
Ghetto boil/ bucket of death - http://youtu.be/0E2OfUjUp8Q

I still cant believe how effective and efficient the ghetto system was, I really hope this pushes some of you kit/ extract brewers to have a crack, because it is obvious that money is not an issue to make great beer.

Thanks for watching Babbs system wars!


----------



## RdeVjun (13/10/11)

There are warts with Ghetto? I never knew that.  

Seeing Bribie getting all barred up about a holy bucket- now the other thread makes much more sense! Its a shame Michael G wasn't there to see it on the day, hopefully he can catch these vids from his sick bed.


----------



## MarkBastard (13/10/11)

Are those ghetto ones out of order? I couldn't really follow the sparge process.


----------



## browndog (13/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Are those ghetto ones out of order? I couldn't really follow the sparge process.



Not really, we drained the lauter tun into the kettle which you see, then we added sparge water and started recirculating which you see also. There was a bit missed where we recirculated prior to draining to the kettle the first time.

-BD


----------



## MarkBastard (13/10/11)

ahh okay, you added sparge water from elsewhere right?


----------



## The Scientist (13/10/11)

King Brown,

Thanks heaps for filming the day and for the effort you've taken to post all the links to Youtube. Great to meet you too, so hope we can catch up for a beer soon at Archive.

Can wait to taste the final beers and see the conclusion at the QHC 2011

Cheers,

TS


----------



## browndog (13/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> ahh okay, you added sparge water from elsewhere right?




I remember we had water heating in the kettle and we used this for mashout, I can't recall if we had enough left over tippedin another bucket to sparge with. Liam should remember, much younger than me.


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (13/10/11)

Yeah I was pretty excited guys, and by that time I had a glass of beer so I may have missed a stage or two from the different systems.

And thanks all for taking the time to put on this spectacle for all the people looking to take the leap into AG.


----------



## MarkBastard (13/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Yeah I was pretty excited guys, and by that time I had a glass of beer so I may have missed a stage or two from the different systems.
> 
> And thanks all for taking the time to put on this spectacle for all the people looking to take the leap into AG.



I really appreciate the vids mate


----------



## bradsbrew (13/10/11)

Good to see nickJD make an appearance on the day, you still coming to the conference Nick?


Cheers


----------



## The Scientist (13/10/11)

browndog said:


> I remember we had water heating in the kettle and we used this for mashout, I can't recall if we had enough left over tippedin another bucket to sparge with. Liam should remember, much younger than me.



Yeah we used water from the shop HLT to sparge, but the strike water and mash out water was heated in the BOD.


----------



## bradsbrew (13/10/11)

I still cannot believe how quick Liam and Browndogs strike water came up to temp and how quick they had a boil happening. Pretty inspiring effort by the ippy boys.

Cheers


----------



## clarkey7 (13/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Yeah I was pretty excited guys, and by that time I had a glass of beer so I may have missed a stage or two from the different systems.
> 
> And thanks all for taking the time to put on this spectacle for all the people looking to take the leap into AG.


Thanks go to you too Dan,

You did a really good job of displaying all the systems and asking pertinent questions to keep things interesting on your videos.

Thanks for sharing with us all too.

It was a fun day (had a brewday on the Braumeister, was taking photos, video snippets, notes and making sure it all went to plan). It all went pretty smoothly once we moved one of the elements onto a different circuit.

I went into Bacchus on Monday morning instead of turning up to my actual job.

I re-sanitised all 4 fermentors and pitched the smack packs into all 4 beers.

Our 4 babies are fermenting away :icon_chickcheers: 

Can't wait to taste them at the conference (I guess I'll have to do some "Quality Control" at filtering time).

PB


----------



## Dazza88 (13/10/11)

Vids were great. Wish i could of been there.


----------



## browndog (13/10/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Thanks go to you too Dan,
> 
> You did a really good job of displaying all the systems and asking pertinent questions to keep things interesting on your videos.
> 
> ...



I hope it was a sickie mate, Dave, you are a bloody ripper.


----------



## clarkey7 (13/10/11)

browndog said:


> I hope it was a sickie mate, Dave, you are a bloody ripper.


No...just worked really late that night....got frowned at and asked "What time do you call this?" a couple of times when I rocked up late morning....

I just shrugged and said...."When I F$%^n feel like showing up time!"

Well - I thought it was funny :icon_cheers:


----------



## clarkey7 (28/10/11)

All 4 Systems Wars ESB's have completed the fermentation cycle.

They have been in cold conditioning for a few days already.

I'll be taking readings, observations and tasting next week right before I filter and carbonate them all in readiness for the conference lunch break and the final wrap up.

Who will win....3V, BIAB, Ghetto or Braumeister  

PB


----------



## Kingbrownbrewing (28/10/11)

3V for the win!!!

(although a little part of me would love to see the boys from the ghetto get up)


----------



## MarkBastard (28/10/11)

I reckon the best outcome would be if all beers were nearly indistinguishable from each other.


----------



## Wolfman (28/10/11)

Thanks for these vids. I was having alot of trub when BIABing (up to 7 liters). Now I'm ghettoing and getting less than 1! 

Cheers guys and I hope the ghetto boys win.


----------



## browndog (29/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> I reckon the best outcome would be if all beers were nearly indistinguishable from each other.



If I was a gambling man I would say there are going to be two very similar and two that are distinctly different from the other three.
Shan0066, that's good to hear mate, it makes the effort all worthwhile.

cheers

Browndog


----------



## Nick JD (29/10/11)

bradsbrew said:


> Good to see nickJD make an appearance on the day, you still coming to the conference Nick?
> 
> 
> Cheers



I think you have your Nickers in a twist. T'was not my good self there.


----------



## clarkey7 (1/11/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> I'll be taking readings, observations and tasting next week right before I filter and carbonate them all in readiness for the conference lunch break and the final wrap up.
> 
> Who will win....3V, BIAB, Ghetto or Braumeister
> 
> PB


Done.....System Wars Beers have now been filtered and carbed.

Now they are marked as BABBs ESB 1-4.......

Who's going to win Ultimate Glory????


----------



## [email protected] (1/11/11)

Will be interesting....

Would be cool if the judges said " these beers all taste the bloody same! "


----------



## tallie (1/11/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> Now they are marked as BABBs ESB 1-4.......





Beer4U said:


> Would be cool if the judges said " these beers all taste the bloody same! "


Better hope that's the case if the keys to the numbers go missing or get mixed up h34r:  

Five sleeps to go! :beer: 
tallie


----------



## clarkey7 (6/11/11)

The results...

System	Vol(L)	OG	MashE TotalE FG	AA	ABV	



3V 20.25 1051 78%	75%	1012	76%	5.1%
BIAB 21.75 1042 70%	66%*1009	79%	4.3%
Braum	20.00 1054 83%	78%	1013	76%	5.3%
Ghetto	20.75 1051 78%	76%	1011	78%	5.2%

The volume stated is the Final volume of wort that was tipped out of the cube.
* Would have been approx 73% if boiled down to hit gravity (somewhere in the vicinity of 3L trub was wasted on the day)

The Taste-off was conducted over lunch before I gave the Systems Wars presentation so no pre-conceived ideas could happen.
I underestimated the loss of carbonation from lowly carbonated english beer in the corny kegs, to jug, to plastic cup....prepoured. So I do apoligise for that.

2 Systems were clear winners from the taste off.

BABBs ESB No.2 (Braumeister) and BABBs ESB No.4 (BIAB)

Within 3 votes of each other with 120 total written voting cards counted up.

Statistically insignificant, but there can be only one winner of Systems Wars.

The inaugural BABBs Systems Wars trophy is awarded to:

BIAB

Well Done BribieG and BIAB.

Cheers,

PB (Dave Clarke)

Edit: The full presentation with all the photos and system comparisons will be available on the QHC webpage soon.


----------



## winkle (6/11/11)

Rigged!


----------



## Bribie G (6/11/11)

I had a small vial of "Extract of Pure Naked Blonde" in my lab coat pocket, stolen from Yatala, which I slipped into my brew, giving it irresistible mass-market-appeal ( remember when I shouted "hey look at that helicopter on fire crashed in the car park" ) 
h34r:


----------



## MattC (6/11/11)

Without going through 13 pages of this thread, can anyone let me know if there is info about the recipes that were used? I know they were all ESB's but was it the same recipe used for each system or was the recipe up to the brewer?

Cheers


----------



## Bribie G (6/11/11)

4 Identical ingredient packs - all grains vac packed and premeasured hop additions in two cups, were prepared at Bacchus Brewing and handed to each contestant. Pocket Beers will have recipe.


----------



## clarkey7 (6/11/11)

MattC said:


> Without going through 13 pages of this thread, can anyone let me know if there is info about the recipes that were used? I know they were all ESB's but was it the same recipe used for each system or was the recipe up to the brewer?
> 
> Cheers


The Recipe - Fullers ESB BYO British Real Ale (Wheeler)

Same ingredient pack for everyone - Brewday Target @ 75% Efficiency (20L @ 1052 OG)

4kg Maris Otter Pale Ale, 400g Dark Crystal
Single Infusion Temp Rest @ 66oC with Mash Out
14g Target, 7g Challenger, 7g Northdown @ 60min
10g East Kent Goldings & Whirlfloc @ 10min
5g Gypsum in Mash, 2g Gypsum in Boil
Wy1968 London ESB Ale Yeast fermented @ 19oC
All beers No-chilled, pitched, fermented, cold conditioned and filtered together in temp controlled environment
Approx 32 IBUs & 5% ABV, 27 EBC


----------



## Bribie G (6/11/11)

Hey did anyone get a shot of Liam's T shirt he wore at the conference? It cracked everybody up :lol: 

If not I'll post details shortly.


----------



## MattC (6/11/11)

Thanks. Seems the approach was controlled as best it could have been. This makes for a pretty fair comparison between the techniques. 

Well Done guys


----------



## browndog (6/11/11)

I got a very crappy pic on my phone, who would have thought these two would hit it off like that......






cheers

Browndog


----------



## jyo (6/11/11)

winkle said:


> Rigged! up to a skyhook



B) 

Well done, Bribie.


----------



## [email protected] (6/11/11)

jyo said:


> B)
> 
> Well done, Bribie.



Yes well done. BUT would the results have been the same with the bucket that's now replaced the bag??


----------



## Dazza88 (6/11/11)

browndog said:


> I got a very crappy pic on my phone, who would have thought these two would hit it off like that......
> 
> View attachment 49851
> 
> ...



LMAO!

Next t-shirt bulk buy . . .


----------



## The Scientist (6/11/11)

DazDog said:


> LMAO!
> 
> Next t-shirt bulk buy . . .



These shirts are already on sale from Bonj's store at Redbubble.com

Cheers,

Liam


----------



## MarkBastard (6/11/11)

Interesting the differences in efficiency and how these affected the ABV. Would that have been a factor in the taste test at all?


----------



## winkle (6/11/11)

The Scientist said:


> These shirts are already on sale from Bonj's store at Redbubble.com
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Liam



Does he still do the "No1 male prostitute" one with pricing?
(Sorry can't be assed looking) :huh:


----------



## PistolPatch (8/11/11)

Pocket Beers said:


> The results...
> 
> System	Vol(L)	OG	MashE TotalE FG	AA	ABV
> 
> ...



Well done to you guys in QLD who put so much hard work into this event. These things don't happen without a lot of very hard work.

It's nice to see BIAB being declared a winner but I'm not sure that it should have been. I'm tempted to start a whole new thread on why but maybe it's best if I let you guys deal with it.

Here's my reasoning....

1. Firstly, the reader should regard me as pro-BIAB. (Iam , but I have good reasons for it.)

2. Even though BIAB 'won', I can see serious flaws in the 'war.'

3. The BIAB efficiency into kettle was way below a normal BIAB. Why?

4. In my thinking, you can't compare beers of different original gravities. The beers should have been measured by several people as many times as possible. (One reading means nothing.) The beers should have certainly been diluted to a common ground of the lowest OG before fermentation.

Whilst I personally _*know*_ that BIAB is a magnificent way of all-grain brewing, this experiment would do nothing to convince me. I don't see it as a 'win' for BIAB. If the experiment was done in the manner I proposed above I would fully expect BIAB to be a winner but I really think on side by sides, original gravity, carefully measured, needs to be the common ground.

And, even if you get the above right, you need to repeat the experiment many times.

The 'wars' are a great idea, fun and interesting but I think a lot more thought needs to be put into them. BIAB and traditional brewing have a lot of things of value to share and, more importantly, investigate.

Spot!
Pat


----------



## Parks (8/11/11)

I really don't think the point was to actually get a winner, just to show how easy it can be to make beer in a variety of ways.

A winner via "I like this better" is never going to prove anything in a once off event.

As you said it was a bit of fun .

-- I wish I had a chance to do some tasting myself...


----------



## clarkey7 (8/11/11)

PistolPatch said:


> Well done to you guys in QLD who put so much hard work into this event. These things don't happen without a lot of very hard work.
> 
> It's nice to see BIAB being declared a winner but I'm not sure that it should have been. I'm tempted to start a whole new thread on why but maybe it's best if I let you guys deal with it.
> 
> ...


Happy to hear from you Pat,
That's a short post for you mate  
Yes it was a lot of work, but was worth it to showcase brewing to the people that came on the day and at the conference.

1) B) 

2) You really cannot split the 2 winning systems as the difference is statistically insignificant, but we had to declare one winner. I did as much as I could to level the playing field to make the differences the system and the brewer only. It wasn't perfect. Everything post cubing was me doing it side by side and the recipe packs were identical for all 4 systems.
The only "flaw" I see was in the tasting part....We just asked everyone to vote on their favourite.....this was to make it easy and fun.....

3) Efficiency means nothing unless you have a very accurate volume and measure the gravity correctly. The volume in the BIAB case was an estimate as the original one I was told was a stuff up. I'm not sure what happened on the day. Note that BIAB was the system that also ended up with too much wort at the end of the boil and had to tip "efficiency down the drain." Just not Bribie's day  

4) OG's - This was discussed and fleshed out in the planing stages. In the end, to make it about the systems (and brewers), I asked everyone to hit 75% efficiency and to target 20L @ 1052. I really did not expect such a huge difference in OG. 
What should have happened on the day - BIAB should have boiled down further to get the gravity....not the other 3 systems watered down.
I am a trained laboratory scientist and did all the measurements until I got 3 identical readings with a hydrometer on all the worts post cubing at the different stages. This made it fairer (and ironed out the bravado factor) IMO.

NOTE: If I had been allocating points in the systems wars for time, technique, accuracy, gravity, education, clothing, humour etc .....the result would have been different....and everyone would have said it was rigged (I brewed on the Braumeiser).

It was too much work to do it every weekend......but we will do more in the future to showcase brewing and have fun which was our original intention....

Dave


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (8/11/11)

browndog said:


> I got a very crappy pic on my phone, who would have thought these two would hit it off like that......
> 
> View attachment 49851
> 
> ...



Cup of tea almost went straight up the nose. I couldn't stop laughing :lol: :lol: :lol: 

The shirt is funny enough. The fact that Liam is wearing it - even funnier. The fact that Ross is there smiling in the photo is priceless.


----------



## Bribie G (8/11/11)

Hi Pat
As I said in another thread, I usually make a 23 - 25L batch and on the day we had to do a 20. So using the marks already on the sight tube of the urn I took a stab at what strike water should give me a 20L batch, and I overshot woefully, ended up with 3L of wort left after the cube was filled. Not an option, really, to keep boiling the guts out of it as the day was already dragging over schedule and Ross and the boys needed to clean up and lock up, they were good enough to put in the extra hours for us and it was their afternoon off. 

I'm recalibrating my urn properly now with a dipstick calculator that a guy on the forum provided for Birkos, Crowns etc. and in fact I'm going to rebrew to a proper 20L length as I quite liked the beers sampled on the day of the Conference. 

Cheers
Bribie G


PS adjusting for the over-dilution in my case, the four systems all came out at around 73-75 % efficiency which was pleasing because it tends to dispel the "BIAB has lower efficiency" thing, well on this one occasion anyway.


----------



## MarkBastard (8/11/11)

Bribie, why not use the sight tube on your urns?


----------



## the_new_darren (8/11/11)

Lord Raja Goomba I said:


> Cup of tea almost went straight up the nose. I couldn't stop laughing :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> The shirt is funny enough. The fact that Liam is wearing it - even funnier. The fact that Ross is there smiling in the photo is priceless.




That is funny. Was the shirt real or photoshopped??

Could this be the next range of AHB merchandise?



tnd


----------



## PistolPatch (8/11/11)

Hey Dave and Bribie,

Thanks a heap for writing back. (Your post was as long as mine Dave .) Reading both your posts has made things a heap clearer to me now.

Looking forward to getting the time to look at the pics from the day etc. From what I gather, everything went really well so congratulations again.

And Bribie, do you ever not come first?

:lol: and good on you guys,
Pat


----------



## Bribie G (8/11/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> Bribie, why not use the sight tube on your urns?



That's what I did, but I have more Marks on the tube than the German inflation of the 1920s - so I've solvented them all off and starting again from scratch


----------



## Lord Raja Goomba I (8/11/11)

Bribie G said:


> That's what I did, but I have more Marks on the tube than the German inflation of the 1920s - so I've solvented them all off and starting again from scratch



Classic quote.

Have you been paying your war reparations?

Goomba


----------

