# Mangrove Jacks M54



## Matplat

Just wondering if anyone has used this yeast yet? I'm thinking about using it in an Anchor steam beer clone, as local supplies of wyeast 2112 are a few too many weeks away...


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## bigmunchez

Did you use it yet? I just pitched it into a cali common last night - I'm doing a split batch side by side with 2112. I'll let you know how it goes. Its quoted attenuation is quite a bit higher than 2112 so I'm expecting some differences, but the triangle tests will reveal all in good time.


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## Spohaw

Interested in this , want to just make an American wheat with it or a pale ale and see how she goes , planning on fermenting at the low end of the recommended temp (18) deg
Got so many beers planned ATM but this sits at fourth place in the que 
Following


Edit: also wondering how this would go with a Munich style grain bill and hop schedule


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## Matplat

Yep been in the bottle 8 weeks now.

It turned out a nice beer, but the recipe let it down... followed brewing classic styles recommendation of including some pale chocolate (60g) and that is the overbearing flavour. The only point of reference that I have, for california common, is a 6 pack of anchor steam.... and it didn't taste like that. It's hard for me to know if the yeast is true to the style.

Still a tasty beer, but missed the mark. If you told me it was an english brown ale, I would believe it.....

Keen to hear the results of a direct comparison, I plan on brewing the recipe again without the pale chocolate and would be good to know ahead of time if I should try and get 2112, or use some of this slurry.


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## Spohaw

What sort of yeast flavours did it throw matplat ? 
Guessing it's cleanish but doesn't flocc that well


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## Matplat

You're right about the clean character, but it does flocc out. I didn't have any problems with attenuation, but the yeast in the bottle has to be the most compact I've seen for a while.


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## tj2204

Used this on a whim in a low gravity (1.040) aussie lager. Keen to see how it turns out.


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## yum beer

This was real close


Steam Ale

Original Gravity (OG): 1.051 (°P): 12.6
Final Gravity (FG): 1.013 (°P): 3.3
Alcohol (ABV): 5.01 %
Colour (SRM): 9.6 (EBC): 18.8
Bitterness (IBU): 37.4 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)

72.73% American 2-Row
18.18% JWM Traditional Ale Malt
4.55% Crystal Pale
2.27% Caramel Dark - Best Malz
2.27% Carapils (Dextrine)

1.1 g/L Northern Brewer (9% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil)
0.3 g/L Cascade (6.2% Alpha) @ 3 Minutes (Boil)
0.1 g/L Northern Brewer (9% Alpha) @ 3 Minutes (Boil)
0.4 g/L Cascade (6.2% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil)
0.2 g/L Northern Brewer (9% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil)

10.0 g/L LDM @ 0 Minutes (Bottling)

Single step Infusion at 67°C for 60 Minutes. Boil for 75 Minutes

Fermented at 16°C with WLP810 - San Francisco Lager


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## bigmunchez

Just following up on my side by side comparison. Brewed a double batch of a fairly standard Cali common recipe and split the wort between WY2112 and MJ M54. Started them off at 16°, then after 3 days slowly ramped to 19°. OG was 1.049, both finished out at 1.010-1.011. 
I've done a total of 9 blind triangle tests (8 different tasters) and of those there were 5 correct. I personally got it right once and wrong once.
The only difference I thought I perceived was a hint of additional sweetness in the mid tongue with the WY2112. But both were very clean and well attenuated. Both dropped bright very quickly, M54 maybe a bit faster.
Interestingly there was a very slight colour difference - 2112 ever so slightly lighter.
Preference wise, of the 5 correct choices there was a slight tendency to the M54. 
I don't think you'd pick the difference between these two from one pint to the next.
So bottom line - if you're brewing a cali common and want a dried yeast. MJ 54 seems to be a good choice. I'm actually now experimenting with other styles, hoping it might become a bit of a house strain - I really like the clean crisp finish and how well it flocculates.


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## pablo_h

I've been using MJ54 over winter, as it's been one of the yeasts that don't mind 16C that my house gets to overnight (the other being nottingham).
I usually start my beers at 18-20 and they'll stay there for the first week, but in the second week they'll hit 16C after activity drops. I usually have to fix S04 and windsor with adding coopers kit yeast (doesn't affect the flavour much that late and that cold and more importantly even if you can control your fermenter temps you're still going to be in trouble with bottle carbing/conditioning with those yeasts anyway...)

But anyway, I found the same as you, MJ54 finishes darker and more bitter than say US05 when I've used both in pale ales.
I originally got MJ54 to do a cali common, but I've also dropped it into aussie "bitters" megaswill type beers and it's done very good for a lawnmower beer I've made to stock up for summer.


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## RobB

I'm currently drinking my first attempt with M54. It fermented strongly and ended up with about 80% apparent attenuation resulting in a clean, crisp beer. If I have one criticism of it, it's that there's more to lager than "clean and crisp" and that it's missing that certain lageriness......lagerocity......lagernitude.......you know what I mean. I can still see this yeast being very versatile in a number of refreshing summer styles.

It's warm and sunny today, and if the worst thing that happens to me is that my pale lager is more like a blond ale, then I can cope with that.


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## Brewnicorn

Spohaw said:


> Interested in this , want to just make an American wheat with it or a pale ale and see how she goes , planning on fermenting at the low end of the recommended temp (18) deg
> Got so many beers planned ATM but this sits at fourth place in the que
> Following
> 
> 
> Edit: also wondering how this would go with a Munich style grain bill and hop schedule


Like to know how folks found this to work in beers like a pale and what fermentation temps used. Attenuation I've found is always about 65-77% with the safale yeasts etc even when made up in a starter.


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## goatchop41

Brewnicorn said:


> Like to know how folks found this to work in beers like a pale and what fermentation temps used. Attenuation I've found is always about 65-77% with the safale yeasts etc even when made up in a starter.


Depending on which Fermentis yeasts you're using, I'd be looking at other culprits if that all the attenuation that you're getting (direct pitching vs rehydrating, low pitch rate, etc.)


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## goatchop41

Rehydrated and pitched M54 last night in to ~20L of 1.054 vienna lager (mashed at 66oC). Pitched at ~23-24oC, as I forgot to put it in the ferm fridge first to get to temp. Got down to 18o probably a couple of hours after pitching, which will be my ferment temp initially, then ramp up to 20-21 after about 3 days. Aerated with a paint stirrer on corded drill for 2-3 mins.

No real activity when I left for work at 8:30 this morning. Got home at about 9:30 to see this......
Looks like the krausen got high enough to touch the glad wrap (sanitised, luckily), and then has dropped rapidly - only about 2cm of krausen sitting on top of the wort currently.

I'll be interested to see what the gravity reading is in a couple of days. I'm hoping to get at least 80% attenuation out of it (finish at or below 1.010)


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## Brewnicorn

goatchop41 said:


> Depending on which Fermentis yeasts you're using, I'd be looking at other culprits if that all the attenuation that you're getting (direct pitching vs rehydrating, low pitch rate, etc.)


This is why I love this blog. I've just got a heap more things to go away and research - hello pitch rate calculators vs OG vs rehydrating. 
Thanks goatchop41


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## goatchop41

Brewnicorn said:


> This is why I love this blog. I've just got a heap more things to go away and research - hello pitch rate calculators vs OG vs rehydrating.
> Thanks goatchop41


No need to go too overboard either and do a million things either. If you're not rehydrating yet (after letting the yeast packet come up to room temp after taking it out of he fridge), that will make a huge difference.

A good rule of thumb is one pack of dry yeast (provided that it has been stored well) per ~20L of 1.050 wort. Greater volume or higher OG = a second pack (or you can split off ~5-10L of wort, pitch the rehydrated yeast in to that, then pitch the whole lot in to the rest of the wort once the smaller amount is at high krausen)


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## kalbarluke

Malty Cultural said:


> I'm currently drinking my first attempt with M54. It fermented strongly and ended up with about 80% apparent attenuation resulting in a clean, crisp beer. If I have one criticism of it, it's that there's more to lager than "clean and crisp" and that it's missing that certain lageriness......lagerocity......lagernitude.......you know what I mean. I can still see this yeast being very versatile in a number of refreshing summer styles.
> .


I recently attempted a California Common. Used extract and MJ54. Underdid the amount of Northern Brewer and went a bit overboard on the Cascade hops but it is a decent beer. 
The comments about "summer beers" are how I feel also. I wouldn't mind trying it again with galaxy.


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## technobabble66

Has anyone fermented with M54 at "normal" lager temps, say 10-14*C?
I notice the manufacturers instructions say to ferment at 18-22*C. 
However, I plan on doing a few lagers with some friends (who don't have temp control) and the fermentation temp could be anywhere between 10-20*C, so I'm wondering if S-189 might be better for that range. (I've used S-189 before and been v happy with it, but am also keen to try the M54 soon). 

Thoughts/experience?


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## Brewnicorn

All good points. I'm a fair way along into the changes to make to improve my brews, and Yeah I've started rehydrating the yeast and those are good tips. Getting to a point where I can pin down the process and know I've got a viable pitch rate to the wort volume/OG is something I'd not considered. I'd knocked over a few brews above 21 litres and not considered the 'quick' ferment as even being a possible by product of not enough yeast. Lots of factors in there but this seems like an straight forward one to master before I over complicate anything else.


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## Aussiekraut

Sorry for bumping this old thread.

I've started experimenting with this yeast to see what it can do. I've made a simple lager style beer based on Pilsener and Munich malts with a good helping of Hallertau mf. Taste wise, I can't fault the yeast and I found it to be a fairly quick starter compared to other yeasts. Not sure if it flocculates as well as I'd like it to though. I use ClarityFerm, mainly to reduce the gluten content and used polyclar as fining but the result is still fairly cloudy after about a week in the keg. It still tastes a little green and another week will certainly help it, which is good because the Kegerator is full  

I'm wondering if a proper lager process will benefit the beer in terms of clarity and developing the typical lager crispness or is it a waste of time?

I know nothing really beats a real lager, fermented cold with a proper lager yeast and 6-8 weeks in cold storage but for a quick and dirty lager kind of beer, I think M54 could be quite handy.


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## Aussiekraut

Ok, so after 3 weeks in the keg, and stored @3C in a keezer, the beer is very clear and half the keg is gone. It is clean tasting, malty and sweet, owing to the 40% Munich malt in the grain bill. I just kegged a take on a Munich Helles using M54. If it comes out just as clean, I might use M54 more often. In the end, turnaround time is 2 weeks, compared to 3 weeks using trusty old W34/70 and regardless of what they say, lagering does is the way to go as it improves a lot and clears up nicely. So I save a week and a few bucks as I only need 1 pack of the yeast and it is cheaper than a pack of Dubbya. 

So far, I can't fault the yeast. to be honest.


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## yankinoz

If M54 is the Anchor steam strain, a big if. fermenting cold won't suit it, but cold storage after fermentation might,

California commons are a crossover style between ales and lagers, not meant to replicate or rival true lagers, Depending on tastes, they can sub for lager drinkers who can't ferment low, but Anchor aimed at a different, niche market and tossed in an underappreciated hop, Northern Brewer.


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## Aussiekraut

yankinoz said:


> If M54 is the Anchor steam strain, a big if. fermenting cold won't suit it, but cold storage after fermentation might,
> 
> California commons are a crossover style between ales and lagers, not meant to replicate or rival true lagers, Depending on tastes, they can sub for lager drinkers who can't ferment low, but Anchor aimed at a different, niche market and tossed in an underappreciated hop, Northern Brewer.


I'm currently experimenting with the yeast, just to see what it can do but I am quite happy with the results so far. If the Helles I am currently carbing in the keg will taste as nice as a properly, cold fermented Helles, I'm happy. I know of people who swear by the yeast and others who hate it. In my case, the jury is still out but I am confident it performs well. I bought 4 packs of it and used 2 so far, 3 if you count today's brew as well. Next try will be an Aussie type lager and after that, I will see what I think of the yeast. I don't intend to use it as a replacement for proper lager yeast but for a quick and dirty "lagers", I'd be inclined to use it.


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