# I Feel Some Sake Action Coming On!



## pdilley (19/12/09)

I just finished building this box that will let me make Sake mould spores.

I have not been brewing for a while with the bee hive building and then buying property and organising architects and all the build-your-own home grief but I think I will get back close to my roots of working with fungi and start a project with a goal of nothing but making tons and tons of spores for making saccharified rice products which are the fundamental ingredient in making Sake.

I already have some Sake yeast from Ross so I'm itching to get back into brewing again and I think this is just the ticket to get me there!

I'll keep a progress tally on the mould production :unsure: 



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (20/12/09)

Ok I have tested the incubator with a loaf of bread and it works great!

Good news is temperatures I need to incubate Sake mould is lower than that needed to rise a loaf of bread.

If this works out I'll end up with 5 to 6 cups of Sake mould rice. When done I will take it to the next level and create spores so I can keep making Sake rice for the rest of my life 

To make spores I have to make Sake rice and this is where most of you that don't like the idea of having clouds of mould spores around them will stop as this is where you freeze your Mouldy rice until needed to brew Sake!


Q. Why is mouldy rice needed?
A. Rice is not malted to saccharify so the yeast can eat the sugars.

Q. Does all the rice need to be mouldy rice to brew Sake?
A. No, just as with barley malt, their is enough converting power in the enzymes in the mouldy rice to convert normal
rice, you could push up to four times the volume converted!

Q. Mouldy rice sounds nasty, is it?
A. No, it's quite sweet and clean smelling, like chestnuts.

Ok you do get sulphur elephant farts smell in the first 24 hours of incubation but this gives way to a nice chestnut smell rapidly after the first day of incubation.


How to make:

I'm running out of battery so I'll keep it short.

We need to make proper steamed rice. Not rice made in a rice cooker or boiled on a stove! Do this and it will liquify into a mess when the mould starts growing.

Q. So how do you make steamed rice, proper steamed rice?
A. You wash the rice and soak in a container until it absorbs about 30-33% of it's volume in water. Then some muslin or coarse weave cloth in a cheap bamboo steamer will let you pour the rice on the cloth and gently steam the water soaked rice for the required one hour.

Q. Is rice type important?
A. Yes and no  If making mould spores you can use any rice. If making Sake you want short grained rice. In old days gone by in Japan Sake was made from brown rice. The extra bran and nutrients made for a different tasting Sake than today. Today short grain white rice is used. You even get polished rice which will effect your ABV and flavour.

Q. Is real Sake clear?
A. No, all rice even white has remnants of bran and husk materials even if ever so slight. This imparts a yellow color to final Sake. Like modern fascination with filtering you can filter Sake to make it clear but like all brewers know, filtering removes flavoirs and aromas from the Sake. If you want clear Sake you might be better buying commercial megaswill Sake. Like home brew beer we like a final drink with flavour aroma and quality above the commercial offerings.

500ml of rice in a marked container. Once it reaches 500 * 1.33 which is approximately 670ml measurement line I will note the time. This will take about one hour or more.

Then steamer bamboo basket on a pot of water to steam the rice. Be sure to put enough water in the pot to keep the steam going this long.



To be continued...


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (21/12/09)

Ok rice when finished is chewy to the bite but not dry and crumbly in the centre.

It is however so dry compared to what you are used to from a rice cooker or what you get in a restaurant you may worry that it is too dry. It stirs wonderfully with a few minimal kernels sticking together.

In the incubator with a jar of water and it's not really getting any drier which is a good thing.



Incubation report: 21 Hours of incubation.

Opened the incubator for the once every 10 hour stir of the rice (I'm not strictly adhering). If it was time for the weekend I would do it like a ritual but I'm not on holidays yet so I keep it as close as I can to every 10 hours.

I stir with a clean kitchen butter knife.
o open the incubator
o remove the tray (plastic cake round container)
o stir with knife mixing and moving the kernels around
Notes: I notice the rice has not dried out any more which is good as I was worried they would dry out completely to hard kernels and kill off the mould. I also noticed no sulphur smells which I was looking for but the styrofoam box has a strong styrofoam smell so that will be masking any delicate aromas as I might have caught a nutty aroma but it was weak under the chemical smell of the styrofoam. Hopefully near 40-50 hours when the mould gets stronger aroma I can settle my curiosity to if the mould is growing or not. No visual indications of mould growth but that should not be visible anyway until tomorrow.
o place the container back in the incubator on top of the temperature probe
o put the lid back on the incubator

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## Thirsty Boy (22/12/09)

have you added any "seed" spores at all? or are you just relying on nature taking its course?


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

Thirsty Boy said:


> have you added any "seed" spores at all? or are you just relying on nature taking its course?



Forgot to add that in the post where battery ran out.

Seed spores added at 0 Hours in the process. Folks brought them from overseas as could not source any locally.



Report 31.5 Hours:

Woke to find the temperature 1 degree C higher than my setting on the TempMate. Good sign! We have life generating heat! The rice has an ever so minor and slight gray tint on it -- that or it's I've not drank any coffee this morning yet. Stirring was more difficult and looking at the side of the cake tin where a kernel of rice had stuck it had white fuzzy/cottony filaments around it! Mycelium growth!

Still no super nutty smells - to someone familiar with Mycelium growth I can say it definitely smells mycelium-like and maybe that's what laymen describe as nutty?

Little time left now to incubate Sake rice. Less than 20 or more hours until the rice should be 100 % covered in mould mycelium wrappings.


Chuffed!


Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

Quick note. While easy to stir the rice before now it's a bit tougher from being stuck in the Mycelial mat growing over everything.

I just took the butter knife and sliced all down the cake container then sliced lines in the other direction make a hatch pattern. In small squares I went back to stirring with the flat blade of the knife and most rice broke up but a few were glued with mould filaments. I just sliced and worked them some more to break them up.

Then back in the incubator and TempMate down to 31.5/.5


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

Report 42H:

2 hours past due but can't be helped due to work. Arrived home to see a TempMate reading of 37.4C 

Almost jumped that's higher than my limit of 35C which is near upper end of mould temp range.

A quick slice and mix with a kitchen knife and I looked at a clump of mouldy rice and said what the hell
*Bottoms Up!*
Chucked the chunk in my mouth and chewed. It's definitely sweet! Not in a sugar way but it's there. Also a bit mushroomy to me and still smells like Mycelium to me rather than nuts.

Worried that I may have let the temp kill the mould I sliced and mixed some more and chucked it back in the incubator over the sensor.

Right Now IT IS DONE... don't hold it back like I am doing, just chuck it in a pack (vacuum sealer if you got one on the hop buy craze) and bung this rice in the fridge for a few weeks or in the freezer for up to 3 months storage. And start planning to make Sake right away!


Ok what Im doing is an old mushroom trick to see if I can get it to make millions if not billions of spores for an endless supply of spore seed to make all future Sake with!

Water is out of the incubator and the jar emptied into the kitchen sink . I have left the lid open because it is already climbed up to 34.4 C already just sitting on the sensor even after cutting ip the dense mycelial mat that's grown over the rice.

I want to keep it below 35 C as much as I can.

Hopefully by tomorrow I'll know if it's survived and is making spores.


Advanced Note: The temperature of the koji mould growth on rice and the type of rice used are the factors that will influence the flavoirs and quality in the final Sake. This is the area to fine tune and adjust as a brewer.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete

Ps I've thought of fan hookup to cold side of TempMate as cold control but think of spores on millions and billions being blown around the house. Should work if just making mouldy rice for Sake but not going on to the spore making step.


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## Eggs (22/12/09)

Hi Pete, just a note to say I'm enjoying this thread. Keep it up! looking forward to hearing the result.


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

At 46H:

Temp slowly dropped to 31.2 on it's own beforehand but just now see it's 33.0 so it survived and is living and regrowing after my chop chop mix session. 

40C would be terminal so I'm in the safe zone. I cracked the lid and sat next to th TempMate for 15 minutes and watched it fight back and forth tween 33.0 and 33.1 and then solid stuck on 33.1 so thermo increase in spite of lid crack. Left tiny crackd lid and went to bed.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## superdave (22/12/09)

Very interested in seeing how you go with this. One of my home brew mags has a story on sake making and would love to give it a go.


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

Eggs said:


> Hi Pete, just a note to say I'm enjoying this thread. Keep it up! looking forward to hearing the result.



glad you are enjoying it mate, it's fun doing this so plan on joining in on the fun if this works out!

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (22/12/09)

superdave said:


> Very interested in seeing how you go with this. One of my home brew mags has a story on sake making and would love to give it a go.




I have a feeling already it's a go. Making mouldy sake rice is hopefully not to much effort. I did show a Chinese friend the writing for the spores and be wrote the Chinese symbols for the rice already moulded to show the local Chinese shop merchants. It comes out of Sydney already packed in small tubs in the refrigerator section. My local didn't have any but he gave me 3 shops to try.

Buying you only get the one brand or flavour dimension. Need to make your own eventually using this method to get full control over end results. The rice in the Sydney stuff most likely is not sake quality rice so your next step up is to make your own and control what rice goes into making the mouldy rice and sake.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## Adamt (22/12/09)

Brewer Pete said:


> Folks brought them from overseas as could not source any locally.



Have purchased from here before without trouble (based in Perth).

http://tibbs-vision.com/sake/index.html


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## absinthe (22/12/09)

i was under the impression that just incubating _koji_ and adding it to some more steamed rice wouldnt work (although you could use it for its enzymes for other rice)



> "It needs to be understood that _koji_, while being a fungus, is not yeast. It's not possible to culture more of it by simply mixing some of a previous batch of koji with some steamed rice. It won't spread kernel-to-kernel like that, it's just not how it works."



(from http://www.taylor-madeak.org/index.php/200...omebrewing-sake )

you need to stress the mold, by letting it dry out slightly untill you see green spores form

or are you just makeing _koji_ rice? and not _tane-koji_?


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## Thirsty Boy (23/12/09)

Brewer Pete said:


> I have a feeling already it's a go. Making mouldy sake rice is hopefully not to much effort. I did show a Chinese friend the writing for the spores and be wrote the Chinese symbols for the rice already moulded to show the local Chinese shop merchants. It comes out of Sydney already packed in small tubs in the refrigerator section. My local didn't have any but he gave me 3 shops to try.
> 
> Buying you only get the one brand or flavour dimension. Need to make your own eventually using this method to get full control over end results. The rice in the Sydney stuff most likely is not sake quality rice so your next step up is to make your own and control what rice goes into making the mouldy rice and sake.
> 
> ...



Any chance of you posting a photo of those chinese symbols?? I'm pretty sure I would be able to buy the spore infested rice (red rice?) here - but don't know what to look for or how to ask for it.

I know that you can buy "chinese yeast" that contains the spores, some enzymes and a diastatic yeast (as well as sach serv) - and thats what you would use if you wanted to make chinese style rice wine... but sake is made slightly differently. You can also buy tubs of "sweet rice wine" which are essentially the same as amakaze (or what you get if you let kome koji go for a while) ... but once again, there is yeast present.

I think that if you go to specialty Japanese grocers... you can buy frozen Kome Koji... and with a bit of care you could get that to push out spores... or just use it straight to make the sake if you dont mind spending the cash.

Keep us posted Pete

TB


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## pdilley (23/12/09)

absinthe said:


> i was under the impression that just incubating _koji_ and adding it to some more steamed rice wouldnt work (although you could use it for its enzymes for other rice)



Adamt - Also try G&G as they should have it listed for sale. By local I meant all my lhbs' don't stock and don't have it listed from their distributors.

absinthe - Bobs a great guy with good knowlegde, we've had a good talk on amylase and protease and saccharificatiob vs amino acid production and protein breakdown. That statement is correct within context but my mind would disagree and here's why. Mycelium spread through contact with food substance, they travel through it and spread, this is how the rice gets glued or perhaps better term woven together into clumps. If you've not got refrigerated, frozen, or stressed / old mould then you can do contact expansion of mycelium. This may not be traditional Japanese way but more lab way and how mushroom mycelium is expanded from lab to grow room beds to supermarket shelf. Making just spores and not using the rice for sake I can be less tradition adherent as making sake you want to saccharify but stop before any less desirable enzymes are produced in quantity that are not good for you. So it's good to say that for most situations and to people not familiar with mycelium cultivation. But his information is spot on and worth a study.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (23/12/09)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Any chance of you posting a photo of those chinese symbols?? I'm pretty sure I would be able to buy the spore infested rice (red rice?) here - but don't know what to look for or how to ask for it.
> 
> I know that you can buy "chinese yeast" that contains the spores, some enzymes and a diastatic yeast (as well as sach serv) - and thats what you would use if you wanted to make chinese style rice wine... but sake is made slightly differently. You can also buy tubs of "sweet rice wine" which are essentially the same as amakaze (or what you get if you let kome koji go for a while) ... but once again, there is yeast present.
> 
> ...



麴菌, 麴霉菌, 曲霉菌 the last characters in each set tell of fungus-bacteria and the first describes it but we didn't know those bits.

The already made rice I have in a phone photo and only way to send is email on phone if you need asap pm addy to email. Otherwise when I get home I could xfer to computer.

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (23/12/09)

Report 65H:

o Bloody sweltering 37.8C on way home from work
o Arrived home and no massive spore production *yet*
o Saw condensation on the cake container so let it sit outside in 32C indoor temp for over an hour to de-humidify
o Photo for prosperity
o Back in the box for final incubation






Inside photograph of incubator showing rice in a plastic cake container.
Control board is for dumb-temperature control for bread rising when not making mould rice for Sake brewing.
Glass jar with water next to bulb for humidity inside the container when running.
The dumb mode light-dimmer assembly is bypassed when using the TempMate.
TempMate probe underneath cake container on bottom of incubator.
Rice SHOWN as just placed in incubator at 0H after inoculation with spores.





Now you know why I call my incubator "My Own Personal Nuclear Reactor"
:lol: 

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (23/12/09)

Incubator

+ 

Appropriately Steamed Rice with low moisture content


=


Mouldy Rice! (at the spore making stage too!)




At 0H you think the rice is too dry and this will not work
At 65H you see how wet and sticky and translucent the rice gets from all the enzymes in the mould breaking the rice down



Ahhhh! Brewing!! Only Brewing will make you smile  so much to see mouldy food. A joy for the senses from eye to tongue! 
:lol: 


Cheers,
Brewer Pete

EDIT: Do not eat nor use for brewing mouldy rice at the spore making stage -- let me say again, you no longer want to eat the mouldy rice or use it in brewing. The idea is to use mouldy rice up in sake or refrigerate or freeze it before the metabolism of the mould switches to spore production stage of the mould life cycle which starts to include the production a few acids and enzymes you don't really want to eat a lot of. So back at 40H plus a few hours depending on your rice type when its all fuzzy but not small spores being made yet, take it out of the incubator because YOU ARE DONE! its time to chill it to halt further grown and then switch to making actual Sake with it!


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## pdilley (23/12/09)

:icon_offtopic:





I think Thirsty wanted Red Yeast Rice -- 
Chinese is 紅麴米, 红曲米

This rice is high in statins so this is probably where modern drug labs got their cholesterol lowering drug from and of course charge a lot of money for. Probably easier just to eat a bit of this rice in your diet 

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## manticle (23/12/09)

Those characters just come up on my screen as a series of vertical lines.

I'm really just posting that as a way of saying I enjoy what you bring to non-beer brewing. I'm a long way behind you but I'm interested in beer, cider, perry, wine, mead, gruit and this (and variations).


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## pdilley (24/12/09)

I'm glad you like the posts. Now in back in Oz I want to make sure all my fellow AHBs get the brewing bug to expand beyond their current ideas and make the hobby more expanded and enjoyable. As long as some consider the possibility of trying something new I'm happy to have shared notes from the pathway I'm taking.

On a more serious Sake note, Im expecting s good 3-4 days to complete sporulation so time will tell how it goes.

I've monitored the weather noticing a 50% overnight humidity and burning off to around 18% as the day progresses. I've also been scouring Japanese scientific papers looking for any hints along the way.



Temperature reading 35.3 C at 87H


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (24/12/09)

OH YEAH BABY!!!


SUPER MOULDY - SUPER SPORE LADEN RICE!


TANE-KOJI is now made and complete. Now to dry out the rice (important step) as we don't want the rice to rot. Instead we want nice dry rice with no moisture so that we can put a good scoop of mouldy rice into a salt shaker, preferably like those larger tin ones at the fish and chippy! (too bad I cannot find a photo of one, but you know the type)

Then from now on every time you want to make Mouldy Rice for Sake Brewing, you just steam rice, cool and *SHAKE* *SHAKE* your mould starter shaker all over the top of the rice ala Bob Taylor style.

Imagine instead of this:





That you are shaking out spores on your new batch of steamed rice!

In Heaven :wub: 

So long as the holes are small enough to not let the dried rice fall through but still let the tiny spore go through any container will do. Even if you drill the holes in the lid of a tin yourself.

Without further delay, the photos of the mouldy rice covered in spores!

*Super Spore Laden Rice Photo#1 at 92H:
*


Now to do some serious SAKE BREWING OVER CHRISSY HOLIDAYS!


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## pdilley (24/12/09)

*Super Spore Laden Rice Photo#2 at 92H (No Flash):
*
EDIT: The aroma at this point opening the incubator is an in the face, full on sweet smell 



Reposting my Koji-Kin post for identification of which strain of Koji we are dealing with!

Shochu is Japans distilled product, so we are more interest in nihon-shu or Sake! the brewed product. Because they both use the same Kojikin on the rice as the first step to making either, its time to get down with our friendly rice mold and learn a little about it.

Kojikin (aspergillus oryzae) is the mold used in shochu and nihon-shu production to break down the starches in steamed rice or sweet potatoes into fermentable sugars so that the yeast can then begin their job of converting the sugar into alcohol. Koji-kin is very, very important in producing or affecting the taste of the final shochu or nihon-shu product.

There are three kinds of koji-kin (mold) for making shochu. They are kuro (black) koji mold; Ki (yellow) koji mold; and shiro (white) koji mold. Each koji mold has a different function to give variation to the final product.





*Shiro koji-kin (White)*



Shiro koji mold was found in a mutation of kuro koji mold. This koji mold quickly converts starch into sugar since its enzyme power is very impressive. Shochu made with shiro koji mold can taste plump, sweet, mild or sharp.


*Kuro koji-kin i (Black)*



Kuro koji mold is very strong and is used to aid decomposition. It makes Shochu taste slightly sweet, rich and strong. Awamori (Thai rice) is usually used with kuro koji mold. Imo (sweet potato) shochu is often made with kuro koji since it produces a very impressive aroma. Any brewing facility or person who works where shochu is made with kuro koji mold will often be covered in black dust.


*Ki koji-kin (Yellow)*



Ki koji mold is very sensitive, and its temperature is very difficult to control. The taste of shochu made with ki-koji is very fruity, light, and smooth.


Now Koji is also used in making Miso paste for Japanese foods. What is sold as koji-kin is not identified from the LHBSs locally or overseas as to which origin their koji-kin comes from. Those that have point back to a company known as a Miso producer. The interchangeability of these strains might be in question to the quality of the end product, the same with all the different strains of Ale yeast.



We have Ki Koji (Yellow-Green Spores). This is what was expected due to what is already known about the strain of Koji I bought. This is the only colour you should be expecting of the spores. Another identification trait that will tell you if you have real Koji is that this colour will slowly fade over time while being stored and lose its original bright yellow-green colour.



Hope you guys enjoyed this. Next up will be Sake making after I dry these out and use this spore laden rice to inoculate rice in the 10kilo bag of Sun Japanese style Sushi Rice I bought at the local asian store (short grain white rice).


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (25/12/09)

I've been mulling over some traditional Sake making knowledge and just posting a few thoughts.


1. First and foremost, Sake is water, almost 80% of Sake is water. The quality of the water you use will have a large impact on the final quality of your Sake. Sake is high ABV% up to 18% or more. In the first batch(es) of Sake I will just use what I have available (soft local water) until I can get more information.

2. Sake is watered down. Not all Sake, but a lot of Sake which ends up at 18% or higher ABV after fermentation is complete is watered down to bring the ABV% down near 15%, this also gives the impression of smoothing out the Sake.

3. Sake is 18% ABV. At high ABVs like this fermentation temperature is critical to achieve smooth finish alcohol levels and minimise any harsh fusels or higher order alcohols. Its closer to making Lager at temperatures around 10C than Ales at 18C+.

4. Rice impacts flavour. This opens up a whole avenue to us as brewers in rice selection and amount of polishing to adjust the flavour of the Sake. However, until we build our own Rice polishing machines from odds and sods laying around our sheds we won't have much control over that in Australia for a while. Rice type we are going to have to experiment with. Old Sake uses brown rice, this is normally a problem but as Brown Rice Miso makers found out, scratching the outer coating of the husk/bran layers lets enough gap for Koji mould to grow its filamentous mycelium strands in to do its magic. If we want to go for more modern Sake brewing styles then short grain white rice is called for. We have Sun rice Japanese Sushi Rice and I think that is about it for selection, there is imported rice from America and if you can find it, Japan but these are pricey options that need to eventually be replaced with acceptable alternatives to keep the costs down.

5. Table Rice is not Sake Rice. Sake Rice is milled, or rolled around and around letting the kernels grind off their outer layers. Special rices like Yamada Nishiki grows such that the starch is more concentrated in the centre and the fats and brans on the outside. This fits perfectly with milling where you can grind off the outer layers down to the pure starch centre of the grain. That said older rustic or more traditional Sake has unique grainy flavours from not milling it. Again as brewers room for interpretation and experimentation. For now I'm going to have to experiment with 90% Sun brand Japanese style Sushi Rice (10% milled) as that is all I have available. As you can see from the picture below the resulting Sake will have a natural yellow tinge to it as well as a taste with grain background flavours. But I'm wasting less of each grain and keeping the cost down which is important in the early stages of experimentation and sorting out ones brewing techniques for Sake.




6. Japanese Sake Brewers read AHB. I knew it, here we see they have the typical Aussie penchant for stainless steel bling and you can also plainly see they have been reading the Brew In A Bag method thread. In Japanese fusion fashion they have melded the BIAB bag with stainless steel bling and have come up with a rice washing vessel par excellence. If they get a hole in one I'm sure they just ring up Gryphon and get a new one sewn up and sent out in the same days post.




7. Rice needs to be washed. Washed and rinsed again and again until the water runs clear. This will have to be addressed with our needs for not wasting water and water restrictions. Somehow we must come up with a secondary use for all this rice starch laden water sitting around after the process of cleaning is done and steaming begins.

8. Rice needs steaming. It also needs a moisture content of around 33% before chucking it in the steamer. You can be low tech and watch water absorption or a bit higher tech and weight out how much water you add and then weigh the residual left over water. That or just bung it in the fridge for a soak overnight. Take your pick. We don't have monster steamers covered with metres of muslin cloth as below so we go to the local Asian market and get a bunch of bamboo steamers and stack them together and then go to Spotless and get ourselves a metre or so of muslin to line the bottom of the steamers and wrap the wet rice after it is added to each bamboo steamer. You need low moisture steamed rice so that you think its too dry when it comes out because if you do rice in a pot of boiling water or rice cooker you can end up with too much moisture such that you end up with a pile of liquid goo after adding spores to your rice.




9. Rice needs to be cool before inoculating with Kojikin. Granted the idea of a metal salt shaker adds an additional bling element to ones brewery but as you can see you can go old school like this lad who looks like he is reusing an old hop sack perhaps and just shake shakes ... shakes his baggy all over the place. So long as you don't put one of your used socks to use as a bag then I don't see any issues keeping a mono culture of pure koji mould growing on your rice instead of a collection of things growing in your socks. Rice needs to be cooler than skin temperature or between 32 to 38C if you feel like putting your TempMate probe right into the rice for a measure before inoculation with spores.




10. Japanese brewers read AHB. I mean, come on, you can clearly see how our many brewery automation projects have infected the Japanese brewer, below is probably the windshield wiper motor off an old Japanese farm combine. It screams AHB. Stirring is an important part of making traditional Sake, whether it be by hand with poles or sticks or done by more automated means such as this motor. The main mash, or moromi, is combining the koji, rice, water, and Sake Yeast together and letting the conglomeration mature and brew over time. Commercial hoses pump out Sake in 18 days but a craft brewer can take up to 32 to make a very nice Sake with qualities he desires.




11. If you like squeezing your BIAB then get ready for Sake! Once you are done brewing you need to remove the rice solids from your brew. Traditional methods involve pressing the bag -- I can already see an AHB adaption of the jack from the boot of the car to provide the squeeze. For the lazy AHB'er there is always the rare drip drip drip method used in 1/2 % of Sake made in Japan, Junmai Daiginjo grade, which ensures that the delicate, refined, ethereal character of the sake is preserved and also preserves peace in the neighbourhood from grunting and groaning home brewers squeezing their Sake bags.




12. When done squeezing you have all the left over solids, a kind of yeasty mouldy rice cheese known as kasu. Don't throw it out, there are plenty of recipes you can use with it and if you freeze it you have 6 months to find out what they are. Otherwise its high quality food product and give it to your chooks or livestock if you feel weak in the knees eating it yourself. This is the equivalent of the spent grains from making beer.

13. Pasteurisation. You don't have to, not doing so makes one grade of Sake and doing it another. You loose aroma and flavour qualities but gain shelf life. Its up to you. Another chance to experiment as a home brewer. It is done in the bottle where you raise the temperatures up to 60C and then cool them down rapidly.

14. Ageing. Different ages make different grades. Time mellows the alcohols produced during fermentation and can change the character of your Sake.


Thats the basic process in an overview. Now once I have my mould dried (it would decide to rain all day after all those sweltering days giving 90% humidity where before it was 18% *just* when I wanted to switch to drying out my mouldy rice as quick as possible to make mould shakers 


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (27/12/09)

I found my mould shaker!


Well bit more than I wanted to spend and initially I was not going to buy one because of the large holes, but then I spotted this screen topped variation and decided I had to have it!



Woolworths Essentials Shaker, bamboo mat extra.


The Woolies shaker will let me put a scoop of dried mould spore rice in it and then the plastic cap will allow me to seal it until needed. If the rice is not properly dried and the plastic cap makes the rice rot then just remove the cap and let the low humidity air keep the mouldy spore rice dry inside.



Removable plastic cap and fine mesh screen top.


Now the all day rain of the past two days has let up, humidity hit an all time high of 94% yesterday. Lets see if we can burn some of that off and get this mouldy rice dry or else I will have to resort to using the kitchen oven.



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (27/12/09)

Quick Update... Its raining again tonight.


The temperature to dry out your Koji is 45 degrees C (113 F).

From traditional Japanese sources to store koji rice you spread thin layers of koji rice on sheets of newspaper and allow to dry for 10 to 20 hours in a clean and warm location in your house. Then sealed and stored in a cool, dry place you can store it up to a month or two in good condition, or up to 6 months with loss in flavour and potency of enzymes.

For long-term storage, spread the koji rice (can be salted if you wish) on a clean sheet in sunlight or place in baking tins and in then in an oven at 45 degrees C (113 F) until it is thoroughly dried. Seal and store in a cool and dry place for up to one year.


If your oven does not go down to 45 C then you could set the incubator to 45 C and leave the lid slightly cracked open to let moisture escape. I think I will be doing this as it just started raining again tonight and I don't see moisture leaving the house any time soon!



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (29/12/09)

After a day at 45C the rice cake has shrunk both in hight and width as it has pulled away from the edge of the cake container about 1.5cm all around the edges.

Using a kitchen butter knife I cut the rice into brownie bars sized chunks. It was thick and chewy like a moist brownie so the inside has plenty to dry out.

The bottom is completely covered in white mycelium, the top covered in spores and the middle is a brown colour possibly form the enzymes.

I then cut the brownie bars into smaller chunks to quicken the drying out process.

If I had to do this again I would build a two-tier wooden shelf system and then take two plastic cake containers and spread the rice very thin agains both of them along all edges. Or perhaps break the mouldy rice down into lots of small popcorn or smaller chunks and mound them up. Why? To give more surface area for mould spores to develop on.

Cutting them I had puffs of spores given off which is a good sign. This mould is GRAS rated (Generally Recognised as Safe) worldwide as its has multiple thousands of years of use for mankind with no ill effects ever recorded -- so I was not worried about spores.

I just am thinking about how to maximise the spore production in future but there is plenty here to do a hell of a lot of mouldy rice! I would estimate maybe 30-40 kilos or rice which is double in volume when steamed so thats a hell of a lot of rice!


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (30/12/09)

Day 2 in the incubator at 45C and I am noticing the light is coming on much more often than on the first day. Taking that as a sign the moisture in the rice is going away and not enough mass to store the heat energy.

I opened the cracked lid all the way for a look and sure enough the rice mass has shrunk. And boy has it ever shrunk!

I'm still not as happy as I could be with the chunks I cut earlier. Yes they have shrunk but I think I'd prefer more individual grains instead of cubes for the second spore farming attempt.

It's a lot more fiddly up front but should eliminate the cutting fiddly bit at the end of the first attempt so could balance out in the end. This is how I envisage my second go at making spores:

All steps the same as attempt one until last mix of the rice at day two. Then instead of leaving the rice in the cake container I will spread it out one grain level thickness on non absorbant wax paper or those velum a4 plastic sheets used in binding stationary. I like the velum idea because I can buy a plastic a4 stacked drawer system in back to school sales. I just need to cut the sides open to let the humidity to equalise. This gives me 4 stacked drawers I can turn into four stacked trays in the incubator and for a4 velums can hold the mouldy rice and increase the total exposed surface area and give even more spores!

Sorry for not jumping right into the Sake making but I consider this a critical step and skill as in my waiting time Ive been learning a whole lot about rice, barley and soybean fermentations involving this very same mould! I've learned traditional spore raising is on brown rice and involves wood ash but Ive not found any text explaining how they are used in a procedure. I've also learned that the byproductsvof this mould have amazing health benefits including radiation fallout resistance (pulls heavy metal compunds out of the body -- but we hopefuly won't need to put that to the test anytime soon but it's been tested in japan at ground zero during WWII)

With all this new found knowlege Ill have to do a series on making your own miso fermentations next 


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## manticle (30/12/09)

This thread is a wealth of information and should be archived into something so it doesn't get lost.

It will be some time before I try my hand at this (have to try sulphite free grape wine, naturally fermented breton style cider, mead and sour fruit beer first) but I'd like to be able to come back to it as it reads as an informative resource.


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## Thirsty Boy (30/12/09)

I'm not sure - but I seem to recall reading somewhere that in going all the way to the koji kin stage... stirring is important so that the mass of rice remains "loose" and dries properly. Ergo the shallow boxes traditionally used?? Kind of like turning the grains during germination when you are malting. Evens out the temps, re-distributes the surface area available for mold to grow on, evens out access to or lack of oxygen and convection..

But - I only "seem" to recall that, cant find the reference dammit.

TB


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## pdilley (31/12/09)

manticle said:


> This thread is a wealth of information and should be archived into something so it doesn't get lost.
> 
> It will be some time before I try my hand at this (have to try sulphite free grape wine, naturally fermented breton style cider, mead and sour fruit beer first) but I'd like to be able to come back to it as it reads as an informative resource.



I am sure this thread will be around so long as people have interest in the subject of Sake making and Mouldy Rice making as the pre-requisite step to brewing Sake.

I thought this was a small tidbit to chew on, try something different, but a whole world has opened up and I bit small but ended up biting on the whole hog. The amount of variations in Sake and Miso might match or beat all variations in Beer and Wine brewing combined. Its a very engrossing world if you dig deeper into the history and hows and whys of how it all came about.

Another good health benefit is nicotine. The enzymes in fermented koji-rice + beans + salt mixes (miso) will break down nicotine rapidly and are considered better than an apple-a-day for keeping you healthy in a world of air pollution, so it does more than just pull radioactive heavy metals from the body. There is a long part on the alkalinisation of the body and health versus the acidification of the body and loss of health (sugar, coffee, tea, stimulants like these even alcohol acidify the body). A cup of miso soup each day is promoted for coffee drinkers trying to kick the habit as well as for smokers for health benefits. After a month or so you are said to feel your body get stronger.

Too bad all we can find at the local markets is dried miso powder in ready made soup packets. Overseas I had access to fresh packets of the paste which is better but then I learned a lot of them are sterilised to kill the bacteria and koji mould so that they can sit on the shelf longer before puffing up from CO2 gassing like with beer. Looks like making your own is the only way to get live culture and the benefits living bacteria and mould provide until living miso is available locally. Mind you the fresh paste isn't half bad, full of enzymes and amino acids forming complete protein mix for the body just has the bacteria and mould killed off. And that includes reduction in stomach and intestinal cancers.

Another interesting tidbit was a Chinese Buddhist Monk brought both sugar and koji-kin spores and the mouldy rice to Japan from China around 753 A.D. The Japanese kept the koji-kin spores and mouldy rice and sugar was ignored and remained unheard of until around 1776 when the first refinery went up. Even then it was consumed at very low amounts until the Americans took over Japan after WWII and consumption rates jumped from 28 pounds per annum to 64 pounds. Still lower than American's consumption over 120+ pounds per year of sugar (14+ tablespoons per day of the stuff).





Thirsty Boy said:


> I'm not sure - but I seem to recall reading somewhere that in going all the way to the koji kin stage... stirring is important so that the mass of rice remains "loose" and dries properly. Ergo the shallow boxes traditionally used?? Kind of like turning the grains during germination when you are malting. Evens out the temps, re-distributes the surface area available for mold to grow on, evens out access to or lack of oxygen and convection..
> 
> But - I only "seem" to recall that, cant find the reference dammit.
> 
> TB



I've seen it too Thirsty,

This was the first round, more of a proof-of-concept. I'll put the photo in the post of beginning of Day #3 at drying temperatures and its noticeable how much its shrunk.

Very little, unfortunately, koji is done in bamboo boxes like you see in the photos and read. Its less than 0.5% of all Sake made. As with everything in the modern world everything is done forced incubation and fermentation by "MegaSwill" sake makers getting the time down as rapidly as mechanically/engineeringly possible and removing all the human labour in the production stages.

I've seen large steamers that dump the rice into long large metal tube containers like long 50 gallon drums and inside are large steel rods attached to a central shaft that rotates these metal fingers through the rice mass stirring it up as the enclosed metal tube heats up incubating the mould. No humans involved and no spreading thin. 

For us home brewers we at least can choose how much automation or manual labour and traditional techniques we wish to apply. I'm sure some of the home brewers will move to the bling side and get their own tricked out rice polishers and mashing tuns and automation is soon to follow for the more technical electronics and computer types.

Even Miso has gone from 18+ month fermentations low and slow with the changing seasons to automated processing chucking the stuff out in 5 to 10 days (of course it has no shelf life, has more alcohols, and less enzyme action and amino acid breakdown) but its cheap, and consumers go for it enough that its a self sustaining industry. The traditional stuff can sit unrefrigerated for years on end as you slowly use it up from its tub its sat in fermenting away.

Only thing is sourcing tubs. Most materials are Cedar based for its hygienic nature but I've been eyeing those plastic 35Litre tubs at Bunnings with the fake rope handles that say for washing Veggies etc. Just have to be sure about the plastic if its going to have 18+ month food contact so I'd get the white ones instead of the coloured ones.



Cheers,
Brewer Pete




Picture of Koji-Rice at beginning of Day#3 of drying temperature levels. Next time I will try lots of very thin layers on multiple shelves inside the incubator to expose more surface area to promote even more spore production. Seen is three layers, mould spore layer, central layer brown from enzymatic digestion (how miso goes dark brown colours naturally - lots of readily digestible amino acids in there!) and a final bottom layer of mycelium mat. If I wanted I could just cut the top spore layer off and dry that making it easier. The other two layers are not of use for spore production but are of food production like with miso.


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## Airgead (31/12/09)

Brewer Pete said:


> Picture of Koji-Rice at beginning of Day#3 of drying temperature levels. Next time I will try lots of very thin layers on multiple shelves inside the incubator to expose more surface area to promote even more spore production. Seen is three layers, mould spore layer, central layer brown from enzymatic digestion (how miso goes dark brown colours naturally - lots of readily digestible amino acids in there!) and a final bottom layer of mycelium mat. If I wanted I could just cut the top spore layer off and dry that making it easier. The other two layers are not of use for spore production but are of food production like with miso.
> View attachment 34252



I hereby dub thee - "Mr Mould"

Good stuff. Keep it coming.

Cheers
Dave


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## pdilley (31/12/09)

Cheers Dave 


The mouldy rice has not shrunk any more. :blink: 
It is completely rock hard to the touch! -- completely dried out! :icon_chickcheers: 

So once you notice the light or heat source in the incubator coming on very often it won't take long at all until its dry.

I can not get over how dry it is, really, its like concrete! 

The smell from the incubator upon opening the cracked lid is faint mycelium smell compared to the in-your-face blast of aroma when the moisture was being drawn out of the rice during the beginning of the drying session.

*A few larger chunks of mouldy rice on top of a lot of single grain kernels at the bottom of the tin
*



Lessons learned:

1. I spent no time at all with a pair of chopsticks filling up the ice cream container with chunks of dry mouldy rice. I will get a proper air-tight container next time as I can see the need to keep the moist outside air out if the rice is this dry to start with.

2. I spent forever with the tiny single grains stuck to the sides of the tub. About 60+ of them and my hands were getting a little cramped. I am sure I could have just used a spoon and scraped the container down in no time but for some reason chopsticks struck my fancy this time around.


But now I have my rice I noticed with a bit of wedging with a knife or the tips of chopsticks you can snap larger chunks into smaller chunks provided they are not too thick.

The final proof will be repeating the mouldy rice growth but this time with my own spores I have grown to see if the heat treatment levels are just right for not killing spores but drying out the rice as rapidly as possible.


*Lid sealed on shaker and plastic cap on top to keep the environment dry inside until ready to shake the spores out on the next batch of rice*





Cheers,
Brewer Pete


EDIT: You can see a lot of spores left in the cake container. If I had a production line going I would put new cooled down steamed rice in there and stir it all in and shake some new spores on as well.


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## pdilley (1/1/10)

I have been soaking a new batch of rice to test my spores for viability and prove to myself that I can create an endless supply of Koji rice for brewing as well as new Koji spores for when I get low on my current batch of spore supplies.


In the mean time I have made this graph on my computer using some new software called OmniGraphSketcher.


This represents my current best understanding of the *Commercial* Koji Rice incubation steps (well before commercial breweries went full automation and mechanisation) and the different temperature ranges during the two-day ordeal of making a new batch of Koji rice for brewing Sake.





A large batch of rice is incubated when below 45 C and then thoroughly mixed and wrapped up into a cloth crib so that it looks like a gigantic wrapped burrito. After the Koji mycelium grows and starts generating its own heat the mass slowly heats up. Once it gets into the ideal growth temperature range (pink colour zone) then it is broken open and stirred and then placed into trays in thin layers. These bamboo trays are then placed into the Incubation Room. As the temperature rises, the trays get stirred twice after which they are left alone until the end of two days when the trays are removed from the Incubation Room and the Koji rice is now complete and ready to be immediately used in brewing Sake or refrigerated until enough Koji is created to start the brewing.

Of course with my method we are down-sizing the making of the rice and just using a temperature controlled (automation) incubator as we are not dealing with large mass of rice that needs to be managed before it gets out of control, thermally speaking.

I won't repeat the rice washing, rice steaming, and inoculation and incubation steps for this second test batch. Just hopefully will be able to post a success story, or not, in a few days.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (3/1/10)

No need to wait! I'm too excited.

Well I took the mouldy rice with spores on it and placed it in the metal shaker can as show above. I then made a new batch of rice and then spore inoculation time!

I thought I might have difficulty breaking up the rice chunks in the shaker. So I left the plastic lid on and shook the buggary out of the shaker. I had nothing to fear. Instantly I had a total complete layer of spore power clogging up the gap between the plastic lid and the metal screen on the shaker lid. I had spore overkill! :beer: 

I put the shaker over the rice and took the plastic cap off and a huge mass of concentrated 100% spore powder just fell onto the rice in one big clump :huh: So much for being neat! 

I then shook a little around the edges just to see how well the shaker works and it works bloody brilliant!



I then used my just washed hands and stirred the rice all around and then in my hands rubbed it back and forth letting it fall into the cake container. Mixed rice in no time at all. Once again it felt so dry I feared I had not enough water in it but I stuck to my plan as the first batched worked out so well when I thought it was too dry as well.

Into the incubator and by today before I went out to a picnic by the lake I saw the incubator TempMate read 34 C, and I had it set to 32C so its alive and generating heat! I opened the box and gave the rice another freshly washed hand rub down treatment. The rice had changed look to powder coated from far away and ropey mould mycelium all over from up close inspection.  


Rice / Price *Score!*

I also scored big on the rice front. I found the oldest asian store in The Capital and the lady there told me about a special rice from China. Grown in the North East of the country it is *THE* top-quality rice in all of China. And best of all she sold it to me for $50 for a 25 kilo sack. That brings the cost down to $2/kilo for the best rice in China. You can make rice to eat, rice for Sushi making, rice for making Sake and Mouldy Rice, and rice for making Chinese Rice Wine, just about everything from this one type of rice. The lady said if you can only get one rice, get this because it is such good quality you can use it for everything.

Japonica rice is round grain corn and not the long slender ones. This makes superior tasting Sake so I am including a photo of the bag with both Chinese and English showing importer for Australia in case anyone wants to get any themselves. It is marked Medium grain but its Japonica, slightly larger than the domestic Sun Rice brand Sushi Style Rice which costs $3 per kilo in bulk but only available in 10kilo bag from Asian stores. 




Spore Making Tower of Power!

Ok being a brewer I can not help think up new ways to use other everyday items for brewing. I needed a large surface area, something that would not rot, and something that would have breathing capability to let humidity travel inside when I have a humidity incubator but also let humidity outside when I want a drying incubator.

And here it is. One slightly modified Reject Shop A4 Plastic Stacked Filing system for back-to-school kids. The sides have holes drilled allowing moisture in and out while still allowing moisture to flow out when its drying time.



Look at that sexy thing!



I got a rhythm down to my hole spacing after the top shelf which was my test shelf for drilling. I found that it works best with a wooden backing board to help keep pressure uniform for no cracking.



All four trays spread with a thin layer of mouldy rice and they are stacked in the holder and then the whole unit goes in my incubator. I am going to have enough spores to inoculate the Eastern half of Australia at this rate! It will be a Sake overload piss up like you have never seen.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## superdave (4/1/10)

Brewer Pete said:


> I am going to have enough spores to inoculate the Eastern half of Australia at this rate! It will be a Sake overload piss up like you have never seen.



Had a read through my mag on the Sake making the other day, doesn't seem as difficult now as when I first started brewing :lol: If you find yourself running out of space for all those spores I'll be willing to take some off your hands.
I also await your method of brewing the Sake.


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## pdilley (4/1/10)

superdave said:


> Had a read through my mag on the Sake making the other day, doesn't seem as difficult now as when I first started brewing :lol: If you find yourself running out of space for all those spores I'll be willing to take some off your hands.
> I also await your method of brewing the Sake.



Superdave, if you want spores no worries, you're welcome to some. Not looking to start selling them just yet but if you want to trade it's ok or if nothing to trade then enough money to cover postage, parcel and vacuum sealer bag and I'll just post some as time permits to get to the lost office. If you slant yeasts or grow hops then those are items I'm a bit short on due to losses this year.

If anyone wants any just send a PM.

Sake is made in the cold months in Japan. Sake brewers were always farmers who left their families and went to the Sake Breweries to work for additional income during downtime in crop growing. Brewers worked 14 hour days 7 days a week. This is why today's Brewers of Sake are 60+ years old. Young people have so many other work options and when you can work 5 days 8 hours a day and have the weekend to do what you want who wants to become a Sake Brewer?

Today you see women Sake Brewers and even women Head Sake Brewers as the industry is desperate for anyone to work for them. They are even offering 5 days work and rotate workers to give 2 days off!

Therefore I won't be doing anything but lager style cold fermentation. Nothing too far removed from Bob Taylor whom I will make an updated koji temperature/growth phase graph above for use on his website.

I will add in temperature ranges promoting amaylase production versus protease production as Sake needs amylase and Miso needs more protease. So knowing how to dial in both will make you a better koji maker and target you end needs better.

This also means tracking down proper Japonica rice like either the 10 kilo Sun Rice brand Sushi Rice or that North Eastern China grown rice. Both are Japonica. You can not make decent Sake with the long grain in my photos but they are good enough for spore production.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (6/1/10)

Updated Graph

I've been working on modifying the koji incubation graph for use by Bob Taylor in his guide so we have both been putting our heads together and nutting out all the set points on the graph and looking up lots of research papers to determine if the initial peak in temperature was a lag from ambient room air temperature or the initiation of exothermic generation.

We've settled on lag and shifted the exothermic reaction further down where the label makes a lot more sense.


Final Koji Incubation Graph




My second batch of rice is in the 4-tray system in the incubator as we speak and progressing. I've already removed the water and vented the residual humidity twice. Pushing the temperature down to 32 this time in the Protease range has produces a rice with no discernible sweetness in it so that range marking I put in seems spot on. For Sake you want to target the Amylase zones which I will do with future rice production.

The experiment option will be a pure Amylase incubation versus modelling the traditional old fashioned temperature curve through Protease and through the entire Amylase range before removing the rice and brewing with it.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (7/1/10)

Second Batch of Spores Done

The second batch of spores is done and the incubator is now at 45C in drying out mode.

This is the first time the tray system was used and it was both an overwhelming success and also not  


What do I mean by that?

The tray system takes up all the free space inside the incubator while allowing the light bulb heat source to be at the far end. This places the edge of the tray system right up against the light bulb. The section of the trays right next to the light bulb had the rice dry out more than the 28-33% moisture content and so the mould stopped growing.

However the pattern shows this mostly with the top most tray. As you go down the trays you notice less and less dry spots until you get to the bottom tray which is absolutely covered in spore laden rice.

Lessons Learned:


Close proximity of rice to light bulb heat source will dry out the rice.
For the first time and insulation method will be needed in between the light globe and the edge of the tray or the light globe as heater will have to be replaced with an alternative heating source.
This method works better than a single large container for keeping kernels of rice separate.
I placed the temperature probe inside the tray hole on the side near the back. Instead I should try at least once placing the temperature probe in the top tray first hole on the side right next to the light bulb. This should prevent the light side over-heating while waiting for the lag of temperature to make it to the back of the tray.
Alternatively I could block up the first three holes or so on each side of the tray near the light globe trapping the moisture inside and only allowing venting out the rear of the trays away from the light globe.


*TOP-TRAY PHOTO - 2/3rds of rice dried out, 1/3rd heavy spores
*





*MIDDLE-TRAY - 1/3rd of rice dried out, 2/3rds heavy spores
*





*BOTTOM-TRAY PHOTO - 1/8th of rice dried out, 7/8ths heavy spores
*




Looking Forward

Sake is directly influenced in its final quality by everything used in making it. The first step, making this koji influences greatly the final taste and aroma and quality of the final brew. This step needs to be tested as above and adjusted to ensure consistent quality results. Because I am not making spores when making real Sake I will not use this tray system which will eliminated the dry patch issue. Because I am not making spores I also will not be using this long grain rice. The long grains were used as it was less expensive to use as a grow medium for spore production than Japanese short grain japonica rice.

Now that I am thinking of making Sake I will take into consideration professional Sake brewers who vary their koji making temperatures and times with up to 55 hours being used to make koji destined for use in the top grade of Sakes with times over 40 hours used for every-day grade Sake.

I will also look at ratios of koji to plain steamed rice - 20% to 80% and even experiment with 100% koji and 0% steamed and other set points of ratios in between just to learn first hand how adjusting just the ratios effects the resulting brew.

If you are reading this and looking forward to giving it a try I will tell you a bit about water quality for making Sake.

Water quality maters a lot when making Sake, after all you have over 80% of it in the final brew which you directly drink and you have immensely more of it used in all processes of the brewing from washing the rice to steaming that can impart flavours into the rice. It is best to get the water right. Sake breweries are built next to sources of good water because its more economical than treating your water when you brew at commercial volumes.

Japan has moderately soft water in general but as most countries has other mixtures of water hardness. If you are near water source as in mountains with melting snow pack you have access to good water, softer than most bore water. If you have a well and are near a mountain then you are better off than if you have a well and are in the middle of say NSW Tablelands where you can have harder water.

Iron is completely out. You don't want any of it in your water if making Sake. If you have some in your water don't use it. Get any iron in your Sake brew and you will get off colours and flavours as iron has an affinity to attach to amino acid produced during Sake fermentation/mashing (its combined with Sake, quite different than how beer is made) as well as reacting with the residual sugars. Iron increases the speed at which Sake will deteriorate.

Manganese is also bad to have in your water. Just like hops exposed to sunlight skunks beer, Sake with Manganese in it when exposed to sunlight will ruin Sakes colour and luster in an hour or so.

What is good? Things promoting yeast health and yeast fermentation. Potassium, Magnesium and Phosphoric Acid are good to have in your Sake brew. If not available in amounts required by yeast the reproduction of yeast cells will decline, and the timing of your long 18-32 day Sake brewing will be thrown out of whack and you will have lost control of your fermentation.

Potassium in the rice itself can be lost as you wash it as it is soluble in water. Phosphoric acid is in the fat and protein molecules and need to be released by our koji mould digesting it before it is readily available to contribute in the fermentation/mash process.

If you are a water manipulation nutter from beer brewing you will love slaving over your water quality when making Sake. If you just want to make Sake to try it then if your water doesn't make your tea or coffee taste nasty then give it a go. Otherwise look for spring water at the supermarket or mix spring with distilled water depending on the hardness of the spring water.

With beer, lower pH and harder waters are beneficial.

With Sake, higher pH and softer waters are beneficial only because this is the style of water it developed with over all these years in Japan.



Thats enough to chew on for now.

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (9/1/10)

Spore Production for year 2010 Has Ended!
I have halted spore production for this year as I have so many spores (Estimated 140,000,000,000 - 140 Billion of them!) that I figure this could supply the LHBSs on this side of Australia for a while 



Just showing the last of the photos I pulled off the camera. As now it is time to start thinking about moving into the serious production phase of Sake itself. I have the rice mould growing down pat now.

Photo at the end is very large so you can see detail.
The second to last photo has enough spores left over on the tray to make 2 full batches of koji on its own :beer: 

















Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## Steve (9/1/10)

BP! Un-f#*&^%king believable thread. I read a few posts before christmas and then came back to it today. Your dedication is something to be proud of and i reckon you'll be soon selling your sake to the Japs! :lol: Looking forward to the updates of sake brewing process.

Cheers
Steve


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## superdave (9/1/10)

Brewer Pete said:


> Rice / Price *Score!*
> 
> I also scored big on the rice front. I found the oldest asian store in The Capital and the lady there told me about a special rice from China. Grown in the North East of the country it is *THE* top-quality rice in all of China. And best of all she sold it to me for $50 for a 25 kilo sack. That brings the cost down to $2/kilo for the best rice in China. You can make rice to eat, rice for Sushi making, rice for making Sake and Mouldy Rice, and rice for making Chinese Rice Wine, just about everything from this one type of rice. The lady said if you can only get one rice, get this because it is such good quality you can use it for everything.
> 
> ...


Was that just the shop telling you want you wanted to hear, or have you found mention of Japonica rice in your searches? Just asking before I go out in search of a bag of Japonica rice.

That said I can read one symbol on the bag, and it is definitely from the north at least :lol:


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## pdilley (9/1/10)

I should crack the bag and make some rice as the shop owner keeps asking me "Have you tried it" every time I go back into the store. So she is confident about something  I have a rice cooker from Japan coming over so I was really waiting for a proper Japanese rice cooker to actually cook the North-East China rice to eat for some cooked rice perfection. (Japanese cookers are light years ahead of white persons rice cookers sold in Australia). EDIT: For example you can tell it what type of rice you are putting in, white long grain, brown rice, or even rice which you did not wash the starch of in a rinse before putting it in the cooker and a computer using fuzzy logic adjusts ever single cooking session and cooks the rice to perfection. You tell the cooker I *need* my rice at 5:47PM and it will be done exactly at that time waiting for you.  

If you are worried about an unknown, you can get the Sun Rice brand which is also a Japonica rice but domestic grown. Its smaller quantity but also more expensive per kilo but you are talking $30 range for a sack that is a little more than 1/3rd the size than the Chinese one.

If you want a guaranteed rice you can get Kokuho Rose Sushi Rice. It is close to $5 per kilo! as it is grown in California and shipped to Australia. It only costs $2.20 or so per kilo in the US for brewers in the States so they have gone with that brand. If we follow the brewers in the States, we will be paying more than twice the price for the same amount of finished Sake. But if you want to match the brand used in the guides, get the Kokuho Rose for the first batch and then you can use the Chinese and domestic Australian Japonica rice in your next batches and compare.

For rice evaluation, the Kokuho Rose rice will be moist and sticky when cooked but also when cooled will retain a uniform texture.

With regards to Medium Grain Rice such as the Chinese Japonica type:
o Most popular variety used in sushi in the US
o Grains remain glossy and upright after cooking
o Retains moist texture for longer periods of time
o Distinctively sweet, softer and stickier, resembling characteristics of a short grain rice at a more economical price point

Of course these are Sushi characteristics that are desirable.

Sake final ABV% is dictated by how much polishing is on the rice. We are going to end up with the highest proof Sakes (near 20% ABV) because we don't have rice polished down to 50% of its size available to us in Australia yet.

If you are just starting out and want to see if you can grow koji rice, just some cheap no name long grain rice will suffice to start with. Just don't use it for making Sake.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (9/1/10)

Steve said:


> BP! Un-f#*&^%king believable thread. I read a few posts before christmas and then came back to it today. Your dedication is something to be proud of and i reckon you'll be soon selling your sake to the Japs! :lol: Looking forward to the updates of sake brewing process.
> 
> Cheers
> Steve



Well *exlamation!* right! Good to see you as excited as me 

The Sake brewing process is based on Fred Eckhardt's process and with Bob Taylor's assistance in bouncing ideas off of.

I love Fred's take on Sake Brewing difficulty versus that of making wine or beer so I'll quote it.



> ...it is also called Seishu refined shu or rice beer. We have come to call it "sake" which is another pronunciation of "shu". They share the same Chinese character.
> 
> "Refined." Now that ought to tell the reader something. IT'S NOT SIMPLE. You want simple; make wine. Get used to it. All grain beer brewing is not simple either, but if you want to do that you do what it takes. Sake brewing is no more difficult, in fact it is easier. All grain brewing takes all day. Sake brewing takes longer, but the steps are much easier. THE HARD PART IS DOING THINGS IN THE RIGHT ORDER.



So there you have it, if you can make an all grain beer as many of us here can, then you can make Sake. You just have some new techniques and a different schedule to learn and in no time you'll be making your own Sake to compliment your other brewing activities. Its no more difficult than AG Brewing, just different things to make sure are done at different schedule than making beer.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (16/1/10)

Just a note, I read the directions for 50% to 60% polished rice when formulating a brewing schedule. I will have to go back to Taylor's method for 90% polished rice and build a table for that, so the Sake making is delayed about a week from that mistake.

I did cook the Chinese Japonica rice,

and I did it in this!










The ultimate rice cooker is always a Japanese rice cooker. The new models are all fuzzy logic based programming that cooks each batch exact fuly computer controlled.

As you can see I can do white rice with bran, white rice without bran, normally milled rice and the new Japanese PreWash Milling technique rice (not much good in Australia this option), Sushi rice, brown rices, sweet rices with red beans, you can make porridge even, hell even Paella with all the seafood in it. 

Two timers so it will make sure rice is cooked exactly when you need it. One for dinner rice and one for breakfast rice is my guess why they have two.

It will keep rice perfectly moist and warm for 12 hours, 8 hours, and reheats to serving temperature.

It even has different handling for new seasons harvest rices and old seasons harvest rices, its the bees nuts.

I made the Chinese Japonica rice in here. It was 2008 harvest so I told the machine that and said I wanted a slightly harder rice good for curries and my god!

It made perfect rice, shiny, slightly translucent, mildly sticky, not burning hot but still steaming, very very Japanese texture, just the tiniest amount of chew and everything clean with no burning or crusting from the Australian White People rice cookers I've gone through. I never enjoyed rice so much. Put some miso paste on the plate to go with it. Best of all it will always make perfect rice every time with full consistency. Expensive but these cookers usually last a lifetime.

Had to buy from Singapore to get English manual plus 240Volt/50Hz power although it is the UK style plug. I already have a UK to AUS adapter from the wife when she came over so it works perfect in Australia. The plug is fused and all the small things are taken care of.

Not sure if I can get used to a rice cooker that sings to me when the rice is ready.

This is *NOT* required to make Sake, let me make that clear. Its just when you start studying Sake making you really get to know your rice and learn how much behind the curve we are over here. I've been making a lot of Japanese curries lately so I had to splurge on a proper cooker. They are even advertised to be able to bake cakes inside them.


I will work tomorrow on putting together a brewing schedule but this time for 90% polished rice as we only have at our disposal currently to brew Sake with.


I would also like to thank Brew Your Own At Home in Kambah, ACT, Col is very interested in getting to try making Sake and will graciously help out on a joint brew of Sake.



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (17/1/10)

Sake Brewing Calendar is done!


Published in .ICS ICalendar format (Native for Mac OS X and Linux, Windows users should be able to import it into one program or another on Windows).


Download the file here:
View attachment Homebrew_Sake_Timetable.ics.zip



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (17/1/10)

Here is the calendar steps for those who want to build their own brewing calendar for Sake.

Some modification from Taylors, taken from Eckhardt's schedule for non polished rice.

Please note that the lowest grade commercial Sake is made from 75% polished rice. All we have as brewers in Australia is 90% polished rice so we do what we must until we can get higher polished rice in our home brew stores. This fermentation schedule is designed for 90% polished rice.

Creating the Starter (Japanese: Moto)

Day #1

Morning - Buy all your ingredients.
*If you are not buying ready made koji then make sure you set aside enough time before this day to make your own fresh koji from koji mould spores as shown before in this post.*
2 PM - Place koji in 2.5 cups of cold water with 0.75 teaspoon of yeast nutrient and a pinch of epsom salt. Soak in fridge over night. Also soak 1.5 cups of rice for same amount of time.
Day #2

8 AM - Steam the rice for an hour. Add the steamed rice to the fermenter along with cold water and koji. Mix well with cleaned hands to break up all the rice clumps.
9 AM - Let the koji and rice mixture stand inside the fermenter at room temperature for 2 days. Stir the mixture twice a day.
Day #2 Notes:

*Add the steamed rice to the fermenter along with cold water and koji.* When you first add the rice and water to the fermenter it will look like a loose porridge mixture. By the end of the first day the rice will have absorbed almost all of the water so do not be alarmed! It will look like there is not enough water there to be useful but just wait! By the end of the next day you will see the mixture begin to liquefy again as the koji enzymes break the rice starches down into hygroscopic sugars. By the end of the second day the solution will be almost completely liquid and you will barely be able to tell that there was ever any rice in the fermenter.

Day #3

Continued - stirring of the mixture twice a day.
Day #4

8 AM - Add your Sake Yeast to the fermenter. Chill to 10C (50F) for 12 hours.
Stir the moto 2 times each day for the next 3 days.
Day #4 Notes:

*Chill to 10C (50F) for 12 hours.* A cool temperature is important at this point because lactobacillus activity that was rampant before you added the yeast is retarded at cooler temperatures, while this particular strain of yeast will thrive, multiply, and crowd out the lactobacillus. You are trying to give your sake yeast a fair go in its first 12 hours.

*Stir the moto 2 times each day for the next 3 days.* By stirring often, we are trying to introduce oxygen to encourage the yeast to multiply and not start the anaerobic fermentation phase of the yeast yet. Remember that we are just making a yeast starter for the main sake fermentation which will take place later on.

Day #5

Continues - stirring the moto 2 times each day for the next 3 days.
Day #6

Continues - stirring the moto 2 times each day for the next 3 days.
Day #7

Stir the moto now only once per day for the next 3 days.
Day #8

Continues - stirring the moto now only once per day for the next 3 days.
Day #9

Continues - stirring the moto now only once per day for the next 3 days.
Day #10

Chill to 10C (50F) and hold at this temperature for 5 days.

Day #10 Notes:

*Chill to 10C (50F) and hold at this temperature for 5 days.* At this point we are conditioning the yeast for the upcoming cool fermentation as well as allowing a little bit more of the acids to be produced.

Day #11

Continues - holding at 10C (50F) for 5 days.
Day #12

Continues - holding at 10C (50F) for 5 days.
Day #13

Continues - holding at 10C (50F) for 5 days.
Day #14

Continues - holding at 10C (50F) for 5 days.


Stay tuned next time for the next post where we will continue with our Sake Brewing calendar continuing on with:

Prepare for the Main Mash (Japanese: Moromi)
Prepare the First Addition (Japanese: Hatsuzoe)
Prepare the Second Addition (Japanese: Nakazoe)
Prepare the Final Addition (Japanese: Tomezoe)
Yeast Multiplication/Fermentation (Japanese: Odori - literally "Dance" or Dance of the Yeast!)


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (21/1/10)

First batch of Sake is underway!



Colin is building a starter from wlp705, which is Sake Yeast #7 and we will use that for the first batch and reserve some starter yeast for future batches.
We are going to run a second batch using the WYeast Sake#9 yeast and compare results.
I am building up some Koji starting last night. This time with the proper rice and pushing for most of the time in the Amylase enzyme production temperature zone.
That puts the timing at the earliest start to this Saturday to proceed with the starter building schedule I already have outlined in the above post.
Brewing calendar will continue in a future post before the two weeks are up for making the Moto (starter).

For those who would like a quick visual graphic of the entire process in one graphic to see the high level overview of brewing Sake, here you go:



Yeast #7, #9, and #10 are perhaps the most important Sake yeast in use these days. Yeast #7, discovered by Masumi of Nagano, is the single most commonly used yeast in Japan, with its mellow fragrance and robust strength during fermentation. Yeast #9 is the most common yeast for ginjo-shu, due to its wonderful fragrance-creating abilities, and fairly healthy constitution during fermentation. Yeast #10 produces a lower-acid, fine-grained flavor in sake, but is a bit fickle at all but the lowest fermentation temperatures.

Yeast #1,2,3,4,5,6,8,11,12,13 have been discontinued in Japanese Sake brewing as they produce too much acidity which is no longer required with modern brewing methods.

Yeast #14 is known as "Kanazawa Kobo." Used a lot in Shizuoka too. Low acid, with pears and apples in nose.

Yeast #15 is Akita Moromi. "AK-1," or "Akita Hana Kobo." Very lively fragrance and characteristic nose/flavor; but needs to ferment slowly and at low temperatures.

Yeast# 601, 701 901, and 1001 known as "Awa nashi" or foamless versions of the 6, 7, 9 and 10 yeasts. Nothing else changes, say most. Used by a few breweries to save labour cleanup of previous batches krausen rings on the fermenters.


I'm looking forward to Yeast #9. What is so special about it? In brewing, it ferments thoroughly and slowly at low temperatures, allowing brewers to control the fermentation closely. This all leads to wonderfully smooth and fine-grained flavors, good aromatic acid content, and lovely fruity aromas reminiscent of delicious apples and perhaps melon. Clean and bright sake with wonderful balance is the trademark of this line of yeasts. Indeed, there is nothing quite like classic #9 flavors and aromas in a sake.



Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (23/1/10)

We are up and rolling with the Moto. The yeast starter is done (they were long in the tooth so we used them instead of chucking them). They hit high krausen and then down again.


Koji is done, sealed in a shrink wrap plastic bag and in the fridge at the LHBS. I also brought in some Japonica rice, enough to do the batch of Sake.


We are not going to be making that standard 11 litres of Sake this time. I can't blame SWMBO as she tried to help me and when I asked for 3 cups of rice on soak in the refrigerator, because she is used to making rice in the rice cooker she used the rice cooker's cup measure. Just so you know, that is 180ml capacity traditional Japanese cup size. Australian cup size is 250ml so our Koji volume is smaller.

Not a worry we are just multiplying each quantity by the difference percentage and adjusting down accordingly. '

I had a taste of the koji leftovers after shrink wrapping it and it was quite nice and sweet, so high hopes!

EDIT: Curent Japanese cup size is 200ml, just rice cookers still use the traditional 180ml cup size of Japans past.

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## bennoz (1/2/10)

Awesome stuff

Ive just started looking into making sake, and this thread has been a huge help. Cant wait to see how it all turns out.

Now to try and source some Kome Koji in sydney...


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## pdilley (1/2/10)

Primary Fermentation steps for those who want to build their own brewing calendar for Sake.


Preparing for the Main Mash (Japanese: Moromi) for the First Addition (Japanese: Hatsuzoe)

Day #15

2 PM - Add 1 cup of koji to the moto you have made in the fermenter.
2 PM - Wash 2 1/2 cups rice in water until it rinses clear.
2 PM - Soak the washed rice for 18 hours in water.

Preparing the First Addition (Japanese: Hatsuzoe)

Day #16

8 AM - Steam the soaked 2.5 cups of rice.
9 AM - Cool the steamed rice by mixing it with 2 3/4 cups of special prepared and chilled water as described in the Day #16 Notes.
Day #16 Notes:

Prepare the water by dissolving 1 1/4 teaspoons of salt substitute (potassium chloride) in a little bit of warm water, then add cold water to obtain a total volume of 2 3/4 cups. Chill this water in the refrigerator while the rice steams.


Preparing for the Main Mash (Japanese: Moromi) for the Second Addition (Japanese: Nakazoe)

Day #17

2 PM - Stir 1 1/2 cups of koji into the moromi.
2 PM - Wash and 6 cups of rice in water until the rinse water runs clear.
2 PM - Soak the washed rice for 18 hours in water.

Preparing the Second Addition (Japanese: Nakazoe)

Day #18

11 AM - Steam the 6 cups of rice.
12 PM - Cool the steamed rice by adding to 8 3/4 cups of chilled water.
12 PM - Add rice and water to the moromi, mixing with clean hands to break up all the clumps. Let stand for 12 hours.
8 PM - Wash and soak the remaining 2.26 kilograms (5 pounds) of rice for 18 hours.
12 AM - Stir the remaining koji into the moromi with a sanitised spoon.

Preparing the Final Addition (Japanese: Tomezoe)

Day #19

2 PM - Steam your remaining rice, in batches if you do not have the pots and bamboo steamers to do it all at once.
3 PM - Cool your steamed rice by adding to 4 litres (1 gallon + 1 cup) chilled water.
3 PM - Add rice and water to the moromi, mixing well with clean hands to break up all clumps. Let this stand at room temperature for 12 hours.

Preparing the Main Mash (Japanese: Moromi) for the Primary Fermentation (Japanese: Odori)

Day #20

Move fermenter to a cool location or a temperature controlled fermenting refrigerator.
Chill the fermenter to 10C (50F).
Hold the temperature at 10C (50F) for 3 weeks.
Day #20 Notes:

This is the primary fermentation for your sake. Around day 19, start checking your specific gravity with a hydrometer. While there is no way to get an accurate Starting Gravity for sake without filtering, watching the progression of the Final Gravity readings will tell you when fermentation is nearly complete. When it gets below 1.000 it is the time to transfer to a secondary fermenter.


Day #38

Take a hydrometer reading to confirm end of fermentation.
Day #39

Take a second hydrometer reading to confirm end of fermentation.
Day #40

Take a third hydrometer reading to confirm end of fermetnation.



Stay tuned next time for the next post where we will continue with our Sake Brewing calendar continuing on with:

Racking to Secondary and Secondary Fermentation (Japanese: Yodan)
Clarification of the fermentation
Bottling and Ageing


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## pdilley (1/2/10)

Day #20 Notes - by 19th day I meant the 19th day into the primary fermentation which is Day #38 as already pointed out on calendar to start first hydrometer reading.




bennoz said:


> Awesome stuff
> 
> Ive just started looking into making sake, and this thread has been a huge help. Cant wait to see how it all turns out.
> 
> Now to try and source some Kome Koji in sydney...



Sounds great. Sydney of all places in Australia should be the easiest to source fresh koji. That's relatively speaking of course, worse case make your own from spores.


Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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## laleIcegrap (4/2/10)

glanced at the LA times this morning and saw an article stating tht alfa romeo and fiat may be coming into the US market? watcha think?


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## manticle (4/2/10)

Fiat is better for spore production numbers but alfa romeo usually result in a better quality beverage. I've been making sake out of my Chevrolet recently and it just isn't the same.


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## bennoz (2/3/10)

any update on this ?


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## pdilley (3/3/10)

Sorry guys, government has stuffed my contract so I'm spending all my time getting that work contract fixed.

But I have some information for you on Koji front. I'm sure I have forgotten to post it but I have been talking with an actual brewery in Japan who makes Sake commercially and they have given me some Koji making tips that match closely to my chart and my guess that optimum Koji for sake will be in the Amylase enzyme range.

90% polish rice will make a thin and sharp Sake at best but its still good considering thats the best we can do without making our own rice polishing equipment.

From the Japanese Brewery:

In general, the koji-making prosess takes 40 to 45 hours.

During this time, the developing koji is checked and mixed constantly to ensure proper temperature and moisture are maintained.

The general formula is shown down below:

1, Mix and Cool steamed rice (34 to 36 ℃ and moisture of rice 34％）
2, Sprinkle Koji spore on the rice and mix well
3, 10 hours later mix well again
4, Another 12 hours later mix well once more
5, Another 8 to 10 hours later mix well (a rice temperature of 34 to 36 ℃ is best)
6, Another 5 to 7 hours later mix well (a rice temperature of 35 to 37 ℃ is best)
7, Another 12 hours later mix well (a rice temperature of should be 37 to 38 ℃ is best)

Overall the entire process could take up to 47 to 52 hours to complete after steaming of the rice.

EDIT: Yes I note the time differential too. This is the best translation between my bad Japanese and their bad English 

Cheers,
Brewer Pete


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