# Cock Ale... As In Chicken!



## barto1308 (1/11/10)

One of the recent Home brew mags had an article on an old english ale recipe which included a cooked chook amongst its ingredients. The authors tried the recipe and the final product was apparently quite good...
Has anyone tried a recipe like this or something equally whacky?
After reading the article it got me thinking about playing around with a similar idea. I have a tupperware container full of Masterstock sitting in the freezer at the moment and not being used. Amongst its ingredients, masterstock has also sorts of aroma-full ingredients like star anise, yellow rock sugar, soy, shiao xing, ginger, garlic & tangerine peel. It has a beautiful spicy aroma, and I cant help but think it would be interesting to try and incorporate it into a beer. The stock has had pork cooked in it (you keep re-using it and it develops complex flavours over time)- would the fat from this spoil any brew? could I scrape the layer of fat of the top and use the liquid underneath? I have been thinking of heating and cooling the liquid a few times to try and separate the fat and remove it to try and purify the liquid a bit more. 
SO what do people think? I know I could just incorporate all the spices, etc on their own, but I'm after the novelty value of using the whole thing...


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## brettprevans (1/11/10)

No Exp in this area but it has been disc before. Have a search. Dont remember how useful the threads were.


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## brettprevans (1/11/10)

here's the search results

quite a few threads that will be of use I think.


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## BeansBrew (19/6/13)

BartHaus Breweries said:


> The stock has had pork cooked in it (you keep re-using it and it develops complex flavours over time)- would the fat from this spoil any brew? could I scrape the layer of fat of the top and use the liquid underneath? I have been thinking of heating and cooling the liquid a few times to try and separate the fat and remove it to try and purify the liquid a bit more.
> SO what do people think?


Did you end up brewing this BartHaus?
I just threw my own interpretation of a Cock Ale in the fermenter today and was thinking about the same thing. I used roasted chicken skins (essentially chicken skin cracking) and some chicken carcases in the boil. I was afraid of the fat content and as the wort was boiling I used a ladle to scoop out all the visible fat floating on the top of the kettle but I am still concerned about the suspended fat content. I'm thinking a possible solution is to chill down to 1 or 2 degrees after fermentation is finished and scoop off the top layer of fat. Did you end up brewing with your masterstock? or do you have any other tips or tricks?

Cheers


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## bum (19/6/13)

Why?


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## Dave70 (20/6/13)

I use to think this cock ale thing was a gee up based on what I'd read about 'oyster stout', as in it was actually a case of brewers adding oyster 'shells' to the mash for their calcium content.

Then I came across this recipe in BYO.

*Black Pearl Oyster Stout*
*5 gallons/19 L, all-grain with bivalve mollusks; OG = 1.052 FG = 1.013; IBU = 37; SRM = 60; ABV = 5.0%

Ingredients:*

*9.0 lbs. (4.1 kg) 2-row pale malt*
*0.5 lb. (0.22 kg) flaked oats*
*1.0 lb. (0.45 kg) roasted barley*
*0.5 lb. (0.22 kg) chocolate malt*
*0.25 lb. (0.11 kg) black patent malt*
*10 oz. (283 g) raw oysters and brine*
*1 tsp. Irish moss (15 mins)*
*8.6 AAU Fuggles hops (60 mins) (1.5 oz./43 g of 5.7% alpha acids)*
*4.3 AAU Fuggles hops (20 mins) (0.75 oz./21 g of 5.7% alpha acids)*
*Wyeast 1084 (Irish Ale) yeast*
*Step by Step: *
*Mash grains for 45 minutes at 152 °F (67 °C). Boil wort for 120 minutes. Add hops at times indicated. Add oysters and Irish moss with 15 minutes left. Cool wort. Transfer to fermenter, leaving oyster bits behind. (Don’t eat the oysters, Joe and Jim say they taste terrible.) Aerate, pitch yeast and ferment at 68 °F (20 °C*

Not my cuppa, but I guess I could see that.
As I could also see adding the spices mentioned in the aforementioned masterstock. 

But I dunno. I cant help thinking that even if you made based it on a Rauchbier - at least it'll taste BBQ'ed - you're still going to end up with a keg of headless, fizzy, black, weak chicken stock. 

Conversely, it may turn out wonderful so be sure to keep us updated. Might even spawn a cult following. Of cocksuckers.


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## Batz (20/6/13)

I believe the guys at Bacchus Brewing did this at least once.

Batz


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## Ross (20/6/13)

Done it a few times Batz & it took out a silver medal at last years AIBA championships.
Currently a cask sat here conditioning waiting to go on Hand pump at The Scratch during our Calendar launch for Qld Beer Week on Monday 15th July.


Cheers Ross


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## Ross (20/6/13)

This is the recipe we follow:

_COCK ALE (circa the 1500's) A real recipe from some obscure text found in the Scottish Highlands... Enjoy...._

Procedure:
"Take 10 gallons of ale and a large cock, the older the better; parboil the cock, flay him, and stamp him in a stone mortar until his bones are broken (you must gut him when you flaw him). Then, put the cock into two quarts of sack, and put to it five pounds of raisins of the sun - stoned; some blades of mace, and a few cloves. Put all these into a canvas bag, and a little before you find the ale has been working, put the bag and ale together in vessel.
In a week or nine days bottle it up, fill the bottle just above the neck and give it the same time to ripen as other ale."


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## Batz (20/6/13)

> Done it a few times Batz & it took out a silver medal at last years AIBA championships.
> Currently a cask sat here conditioning waiting to go on Hand pump at The Scratch during our Calendar launch for Qld Beer Week on Monday 15th July.
> 
> 
> Cheers Ross


Never one to shy away from the unusual @ the Bacchus Brewhouse.


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## Bribie G (20/6/13)

"two quarts of sack" = a couple of litres of Sherry, sack being the old name. Did you use sherry in your method? I expect it would kill botulism


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## Ross (20/6/13)

Bribie, we used port instead of Sherry.


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## breakbeer (20/6/13)

Haha, my nickname is Chicken & my 'brewery' is called Chicken Piss. Might have to look into this just for the novelty factor

sounds interesting to say the least


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## manticle (20/6/13)

Is the chook mainly a yeast nutrient? Does it influence flavour much?


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## Aydos (20/6/13)

So do you actually get the chicken taste come through ross?


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## wbosher (20/6/13)

I've heard some describe some types of beer as a meal in a glass...this gives that a whole new meaning. :lol:


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## Ross (20/6/13)

From my research into recipes & brewing this quite a few times now I am under the firm belief that the chicken is added primarily as a fining agent.
Chicken bones are full of gelatin, all the recipes tell you crack open the bones & to add to the beer at end of ferment. The 1st time we did this, the beer stalled & dropped bright overnight. 
For the chicken addition, we take whatever is left over from Sunday dinner, chop up into small pieces & boil in a litre of port with the spices for 30 mins. The resultant broth complete with bones etc is poured into the beer once ferment is completely finished. The broth has a very strong taste, whether you would recognise it as chicken is subjective.

It's a great tasting beer & causes much mirth/innuendo when on tap - Give it a try...


Cheers Ross


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## Bribie G (20/6/13)

Chicken bones for finings. Might check out the local KFC dumpster tonight


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## NewtownClown (20/6/13)

Bribie G said:


> Chicken bones for finings. Might check out the local KFC dumpster tonight


 and once you have finished your dinner you could use the bones!


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## Bribie G (20/6/13)

That's what I mean, I'd rather they be sucked clean first.


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## bum (20/6/13)

Thanks for that image, Bribie. Just what I needed.


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## NewtownClown (20/6/13)

sucking a chicken is just fowl


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## Aydos (20/6/13)

NewtownClown said:


> and once you have finished your dinner you could use the bones!


Ha ha nice work!


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## chewy (20/6/13)

That's just fowl...


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## Batz (20/6/13)

I never had a Cock Ale, I have had a couple made by a Cock though.

Batz


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## BeansBrew (30/6/13)

So is anyone concerned about food poisoning? 
For most bacteria (that is present in chicken)to stay dormant you'll need to keep the temperature below 7 degrees Celsius. But obviously using an ale yeast will require the temperature to be higher than that. 
Possibly the alcohol produced by the yeast will kill off some bacteria. But am I the only one who's worried about this? 
I went ahead and made a cock ale but I'm a bit worried about serving it to friends and family. 
Botulism is not cool


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## tiprya (30/6/13)

Did you read Ross' process? He boils the leftovers into a broth for 30 minutes.

I wouldn't be adding raw chicken to anything.


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## Mardoo (30/6/13)

FWIW many old school mead recipes say to throw a steak into the ferment. The folks who say they've done it say the steak has disappeared by the end of the ferment. This meat/beer thing may not be so odd after all. Meat Beer. Has a certain ring to it.


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## manticle (30/6/13)

Supposedly a source of nitrogen for yeast nutrition from what I've read.


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## BeansBrew (30/6/13)

tiprya said:


> Did you read Ross' process? He boils the leftovers into a broth for 30 minutes.
> 
> I wouldn't be adding raw chicken to anything.


Yeah I read that. Boiling the chicken will eliminate salmonella but there are other bacteria in chicken that I am more worried about.


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## Batz (30/6/13)

The whole chicken in beer thing makes me feel a bit crook. :icon_vomit: 

A great beer I'm sure but for someone else not me.

Batz


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## bradsbrew (30/6/13)

BeansBrew said:


> Yeah I read that. Boiling the chicken will eliminate salmonella but there are other bacteria in chicken that I am more worried about.


Such as?


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## TNT650R (1/7/13)

I have only done oysters stout...not chicken..
But the fat of the chicken, can't damaged the foam?
there is also the bacon beer http://rogue.com/beers/voodoo-bacon-maple.php


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## sp0rk (2/7/13)

TNT650R said:


> I have only done oysters stout...not chicken..
> But the fat of the chicken, can't damaged the foam?
> there is also the bacon beer http://rogue.com/beers/voodoo-bacon-maple.php


I can confirm Bacon Beer (mine atleast) will have little to no head
I oven roasted the bacon and then removed as much oil as possible with paper towels
it ended up tasting pretty average, but I think it's because I dry hogged (geddit?) the beer with bacon for 2 weeks instead of 3 or 4 days like most people suggest


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## BeansBrew (6/7/13)

bradsbrew said:


> Such as?


well i'm not sure exactly, but obviously cooked chicken starts to smell after a few days. Properly cooked chicken will have no salmonella present, clearly there are other bacteria at play.

Another thing, while some bacteria only grow where there is oxygen present, other bacteria thrive in an environment containing no oxygen (such as in fermenting beer).


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## bradmccoy (23/7/13)

Batz said:


> I believe the guys at Bacchus Brewing did this at least once.
> 
> Batz


Yep, I had this on tap a year or so ago. Red Cock Ale. Itwas delicious.


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