# White Labs WLP059 Melbourne Ale yeast to be released



## Korev

Hi Guys,

For those of you who have been hanging out to get WLP059 Melbourne Ale Yeast to use on some Bronzed Brew recreations - White Labs are releasing it in April.

So I suggest that you contact your LHBS to preorder some - N.B. there is no point in contacting me!!



Cheers
Peter


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## Mardoo

Awesome!


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## kaiserben

I think the way it works is that they still need to receive (currently) 202 orders by April 17, or it won't happen.


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## Korev

Contact Andrew at the brew shop Peakhurst via email [email protected] thebrewshop.com.au *to pre order*

Cheers


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## Korev

kaiserben said:


> I think the way it works is that they still need to receive (currently) 202 orders by April 17, or it won't happen.


That's not what their customer club email states "Now is your chance to get these specialty strains without the wait. "

Peter


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## kaiserben

I tried to get stuff from the Vault before, unsuccessfully.

Anyway, I've contacted Andrew and it seems it is definitely happening no matter the numbers. I've put my order in. Happy days!


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## sp0rk

this is a good reason to start freezing yeast
might grab a few packs and build up a vault


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## Spiesy

That's great news


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## Weizguy

Korev said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> For those of you who have been hanging out to get WLP059 Melbourne Ale Yeast to use on some Bronzed Brew recreations - White Labs are releasing it in April.
> 
> So I suggest that you contact your LHBS to preorder some - N.B. there is no point in contacting me!!
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Peter


No point contacting you? Not even to say thanks for the heads-up?

Goodonya.

Maybe this is the chance to use my 50% off voucher, not that the yeast is till available in vials.


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## Coldspace

That's awesome. I've sent Andrew an email to see how to get onto this order. I have a dozen original tooths tallie bottles from the 1st world war era, would love to mash the receipe and use the right yeast and bottle it up for special occasions.

The high pressure lager yeast looks interesting since I pressure ferment....

Interesting stuff.

Cheers


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## Bribie G

Well done Korev and WL, will pre order a few.


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## stuartf

Keen to get my hands on some of the melbourne yeast. Never used Whitelabs before so what's the shelflife like, can it be frozen etc?


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## Danscraftbeer

Ha, I actually mentioned it to the LHBS a week ago in chat. I'll have to press on it now. Well done Peter!


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## droid

thanks for the post :beer:


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## Weizguy

Did anyone else not receive a reply at the email address provided above?
I might just try again.


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## droid

Les the Weizguy said:


> Did anyone else not receive a reply at the email address provided above?
> I might just try again.


Me neither bro, don't know if I'm in or not


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## mosto

Les the Weizguy said:


> Did anyone else not receive a reply at the email address provided above?
> I might just try again.


 I emailed Andrew 6 weeks ago and emailed me back within 40 min. He said he was negotiating with White Labs to do a pre-order. They don't usually allow homebrew shops to pre-order, they get whatever the commercial customers don't buy. However, given their vault is only open to US customers he was hopeful of doing a deal with them to supply some in April/May. Outside that, he said he'd heard they would be releasing it under the 'Platinum Series' in July. He said he was keeping a list of everyone who contacted him and would do his best to supply everyone if/when he gets some in.


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## Weizguy

mosto said:


> I emailed Andrew 6 weeks ago and emailed me back within 40 min. He said he was negotiating with White Labs to do a pre-order. They don't usually allow homebrew shops to pre-order, they get whatever the commercial customers don't buy. However, given their vault is only open to US customers he was hopeful of doing a deal with them to supply some in April/May. Outside that, he said he'd heard they would be releasing it under the 'Platinum Series' in July. He said he was keeping a list of everyone who contacted him and would do his best to supply everyone if/when he gets some in.


Successfully, I'd say.
Spotted today on the WhiteLabs site...


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## Jack of all biers

So any news on this from anyone? Are we getting it in Aus or is that a negative? Or have some of you already been supplied some (I'm looking at Korev here) and have some feedback for the rest of us plebs.


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## Korev

Jack of all biers said:


> So any news on this from anyone? Are we getting it in Aus or is that a negative? Or have some of you already been supplied some (I'm looking at Korev here) and have some feedback for the rest of us plebs.


I have contacted Andrew at the Brew Shop Peakhurst - and nothing has materialised yet. Hopefully some will turn up in the next few weeks. Failing that it will be available in July as part of the platinum program


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## Midnight Brew

This has just bumped its way to the top of the freeze list come platinum release.


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## Randai

So what is everyone thinking once it comes out? Which at least through the brisbane yeast buy with hoppy days is happening real soon.
I am thinking a lowish hopped XXX or even maybe a more modern dark old ale. Just to get a flavour of the yeast. But I wouldn't mind using some more hops in an IPA or something? or even a full roasty stout?


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## Bribie G

I'll be doing a Tooheys Old tribute. From memory the brew hasn't changed since the 1970s and I'd bet that the current yeast is closely related to Melbourne No 1.

We can kick off a thread when the hero returns to its homeland.

Shit I just teared up a bit.


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## Korev

Randai said:


> So what is everyone thinking once it comes out? Which at least through the brisbane yeast buy with hoppy days is happening real soon.
> I am thinking a lowish hopped XXX or even maybe a more modern dark old ale. Just to get a flavour of the yeast. But I wouldn't mind using some more hops in an IPA or something? or even a full roasty stout?


I am going to do a Sheaf Stout 
Peter


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## captain crumpet

Randai said:


> Which at least through the brisbane yeast buy with hoppy days is happening real soon.



What


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## Randai

https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...yeast-bay-buy-april.94468/page-3#post-1459656


captain crumpet said:


> What


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## captain crumpet

So what is everyone going to brew with their wlp059? Recipes from bronzed brews or something new? Anyone intend on keeping it in their yeast banks? Thoughts on possible blends with other yeasts? I'm going to brew 80L of 1917 Tooths Pale this weekend. I Was thinking of keeping 40L straight to original recipe, and then doing 20L with different dry hops. I've got lots of Topaz, Colombus and Fuggles so they will probably make an appearance. Then some point done the line I want to make a sparkling ale with wlp059. That will have me sorted for the next few months anyway.


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## Mardoo

Yep, already banked it. I'm going for something from Bronzed Brews. Not sure what though. I'd like to check out its ability to deal with high % of sugar. I'll stay pretty orthodox for the first couple uses, although that's not really something I'm known for  Maybe I'll indulge that by doing a high % of caramelised sugar. Oooo, might work well for salted caramel beers…see, already off-track.


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## captain crumpet

I should add ive got supply of invert through work. Have 30L of it sitting here if anyone in Melbourne wants to pick some up.


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## TheWiggman

Many thanks to Hoppy Days for supplying this yeast, I got myself two vials. I brewed up the online recipe for Tooth's White Horse Ale and got these yeasts yesterday and am getting a bit excited, especially considering there is very little known about the yeast and the blurb only says '74 - 78 attenuation' and that it's a 'medium' floccer.

I prepped a 1l starter last night and noted the yeast was very 'gloopy', and peeled off the vial in single piece with very little sticking to the walls. It has an almost English smell about it but reminds me a bit of 2042 ("catty" if you will). I aerated it well and this morning there's minimal krausen and clear signs of activity. It seems to have taken off well. I'm planning to decant and pitch at the standard 18°C, no plans for a cold crash just yet.

I'm going to split the other vial and am tossing up between a Toohey's Old, Sheaf Stout and standard bitter ale (>95% JW pils with some roast barley, EKG and Cluster). Might even warm it up a bit to see what sort of esters it brings to the table.


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## captain crumpet

Just pitched wlp059 into a left over bitsa-stout

34% Ale
27%Golden Promise
22% invert
6%caramunich
4% carafa2
4% pale choc
3% black 

51ibu columbus at 90min
6ibu fuggle at 10min
6ibu ekg at 10min


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## Bribie G

My experience with the "bootleg" sample last year was that it ain't no Nottingham or San Diego Super Yeast, it's a bit of a plodder like many of the UK ale yeasts but will get you there in the end. Expect a ten day ferment (two sabbaths) and don't ferment too cold.


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## technobabble66

Has anyone used this in a hoppy beer, like an APA or (New World) IPA?
I'm curious as to how it works with more prominent hops elements (there is currently just a single review on WLP-059 website, & the brewer reported an hoppy beer he made with it was a bit "meh"), and whether it'll work well in some of the other styles we're familiar with. Basically wondering whether to go more in the malty direction (probably) or the hoppy direction (maybe).

Edit: one option is to try a Belgian style beer or 2 (such a Leffe Blonde clone, Dubbel, or Saison), given 059 seems to have a similarity to the Belgian Ale yeasts in it's prodigious ability to tolerate sugar.


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## Batz

Does anyone know the history of this yeast?

A little bit here.

http://prstemp.wixsite.com/tritun-books/100-year-old-australian-yeast


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## Bribie G

Batz, if you click on the insert in the page you linked to, it's basically page 76 of Korev's book.

It seems to have come originally from Ballarat. (yet again at odds with the BJCP description).


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## Batz

Thanks Bribie, yes have the book.


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## sp0rk

Definitely will get myself a few packs on the next buy that Hoppy Days does


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## kaiserben

Finally got my hands on a vial of WLP059. Will freeze some and re-read Bronzed Brews to decide what to make.


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## captain crumpet

My stout is down to 1.010 with fg expected to be 1.006. OG was 1.060. There is a huge taste of diacetyl present, will note how long it is present for post fermentation.

So for me it has nearly hit fg in 4 days. It has been fermenting at 20c


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## Bribie G

I put my first vial on stir plate for 24 hours before pitching, then 24 hours later there was a nice low krausen. I'm now on Bribie Island for a few days while it does its thang back home at 20 degrees. 

I've done a 1970s style Tooths ale with BB, Vienna, POR and about 30% raw sugaz.


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## indica86

I made a Tooths ish knock off as per the recipe available. First early taster today and it is a winner for sure.
I used BB Ale, polenta, sugar and EKG.
Really good beer. I am suitably impressed. I harvested 4 jars from this so have plenty of spare yeast.


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## MitchD

So I have the book and now the yeast however I can't see it referenced in the recipes, do I substitute it for the often required 037, 013, 023?


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## Randai

MitchD said:


> So I have the book and now the yeast however I can't see it referenced in the recipes, do I substitute it for the often required 037, 013, 023?


Yeah that is the current plan for myself, all the ales being able to use the WLP059. I think there is a reference in the book that the melbourne ale yeast was quite pervasive in its usage.


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## kaiserben

MitchD said:


> So I have the book and now the yeast however I can't see it referenced in the recipes, do I substitute it for the often required 037, 013, 023?



WLP059 is mentioned a couple of times in the book (but not directly in the recipes, I assume because WLP059 simply wasn't available when the book was released). 

I don't have the book in front of me but I recall, right near the end of the book, I think, reading a suggestion that you try it with any of the ales and (most of?) the stouts. And I think I read elsewhere in the book that anywhere that a recipe had included the WLP017 Whitbread Ale yeast as one of the choices that WLP059 could be subbed in.


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## TheWiggman

I pitched my 1l starter into a 1.050 Tooth's White Horse Ale last Sunday and like Bribie said, this one's a slow plodder. It hadn't even dropped 20 points after 3 days so I bumped the temp from 18 to 20°C. At day 6 it's down to just under 1.020. Too early to get a feel for how it tastes, hydro sample is still quite sweet.


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## indica86

Mine smashed through it in a few days...


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## Bribie G

Actually this time around I oxygenated for 24 hours, pitched last Wednesday and it's already dropped bright, 8 days - will keg tomorrow after a quick cold crash to get it down to 2 degrees to add Biofine. 
I had even forgotten to use yeast nutrient.


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## indica86

technobabble66 said:


> Has anyone used this in a hoppy beer, like an APA or (New World) IPA?



I will be soon, when some more hops turn up.


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## MitchD

How is the attenuation and fg with the addition of sugar? I've put a few recipes directly into beersmith and the expected fg has always come in really low around 1.004 where the book example is 1.012. For me beersmith is always fairly accurate within .001 in regards to expected fg.

See my thread below
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/bronzed-brews-recipe-discussion.96025/


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## HoppyDays

Follow the link to recipe from the white Labs vault. 


http://www.whitelabs.com/sites/default/files/1916_Tooths_Pale_Ale.pdf


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## MitchD

I know what it should finish at but if you have a look at the thread I started the other day the estimated fg is much lower than the 1.008 in the recipe. Has anyone using the yeast noticed whether it finishes at the recipe fg or software expected fg?


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## Bribie G

I keg and don't really bother about FG. If it's been properly brewed, oxygenated and pitched then when it's cleared from the top it's done. I smashed my last hydrometer about 2011 but might pick one up again just to test my finished beers out of interest. 

When randyrob was still around and developing BrewMate I asked him about FG calculations with regard to mash temperatures and other inputs, and he more or less said that if you could write software that could _accurately_ predict your FG then you'd be up for the Nobel Prize in Brewing.


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## MitchD

Bribie G said:


> I keg and don't really bother about FG. If it's been properly brewed, oxygenated and pitched then when it's cleared from the top it's done. I smashed my last hydrometer about 2011 but might pick one up again just to test my finished beers out of interest.
> 
> When randyrob was still around and developing BrewMate I asked him about FG calculations with regard to mash temperatures and other inputs, and he more or less said that if you could write software that could _accurately_ predict your FG then you'd be up for the Nobel Prize in Brewing.



I keg also but I'm not looking for a 6% smasher that's as dry as water. I'll still be brewing it when I pick up the yeast and hops and I'll report back on how it goes, just trying to work out what I'm getting into before hand.


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## Bribie G

My experience with my original "bootleg" sample of yeast was that it turned out surprisingly sweet for a high sugar beer. Kegging mine off tonight actually as it's now down to biofine temp - will report.


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## HoppyDays

What temp u add biofine @ Bribie & how much?


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## Bribie G

About 2 degrees after a cold crash to settle things out.
A capful.

edit: totally off topic but an APA kegged 24 hours ago and kept on an insanely high pressure overnight, good drinking now.


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## stuartf

Got some of this coming in next week and trying to decide what to brew. What sort of flavours have people found with this yeast?


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## Bribie G

I bottled off my Tooths 1960s style XXX last night as opposed to kegging this time around.
Not dry, and a slight floral hint of bubble gum or even musk sticks. Not unpleasant and I've tasted that before somewhere. 
It might even be from the raw sugar ... 
I'll be interested to hear if anyone else gets that. 

Im going to chuck slurry into a toucan kit stout today to breed up a serious quantity.


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## schoey

Bribie G said:


> I bottled off my Tooths 1960s style XXX last night as opposed to kegging this time around.
> Not dry, and a slight floral hint of bubble gum or even musk sticks. Not unpleasant and I've tasted that before somewhere.
> It might even be from the raw sugar ...
> I'll be interested to hear if anyone else gets that.
> 
> Im going to chuck slurry into a toucan kit stout today to breed up a serious quantity.



I got a hint of bubble gum with this yeast while fermenting the 1917 Tooth's pale ale. The beer itself reminds me of a cross between an English bitter and a Belgian pale ale.


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## Bribie G

Thanks, that's where I tasted it ... da candy sugaz syrupz


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## MitchD

Yeast is here, id upload a pic but I cant figure it out on the new format. Anyway its thick, really thick. I shook it for about 10 minutes anf there was still a large chunk that wouldn't separate


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## Bribie G

MitchD said:


> Yeast is here, id upload a pic but I cant figure it out on the new format. Anyway its thick, really thick. I shook it for about 10 minutes anf there was still a large chunk that wouldn't separate


Did you end up poking it with a flame sanitised spoon or something?


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## Bribie G

Fuzzy shot. It needs a heap more conditioning but I sneaked a bottle anyway.
You know how it is when after many years you eat a musk stick or some old dude walks by wafting Old Spice or something and suddenly you are seven years old again, or 18 whatever.

Well when I tasted this beer it was 1979 once again, and I was in Tenterfield NSW on my very first trip out of QLD, at a time when beers very strictly stopped at the border and NSW brews were quite different to Brisbane XXXX or Bulimba.

I love this yeast and the recipe guidelines in Bronzed Brews.

Won't drink this style all the time, but, but bloody eck...........

*Australian Bitter 2017*
Australian Bitter Ale

*Recipe Specs*
----------------
Batch Size (L): 15.0
Total Grain (kg): 2.733
Total Hops (g): 23.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048 (°P): 11.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.009 (°P): 2.3
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.14 %
Colour (SRM): 7.3 (EBC): 14.4
Bitterness (IBU): 32.5 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 74
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

*Grain Bill*
----------------
1.700 kg Base Barrett Burston Pilsener (62.2%)
0.500 kg Raw Sugar (18.29%)
0.500 kg Weyermann Vienna (18.29%)
0.033 kg Carafa II malt (1.21%) - for colouring - it's the Amber Fluid, not the pale sickly crisp super dry Fluid FFS

*Hop Bill*
----------------
23.0 g Pride of Ringwood Pellet (8.3% Alpha) @ 30 Minutes (Boil) (1.5 g/L)


Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20°C with WLP059 - Melbourne Ale Yeast


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## MitchD

Bribie G said:


> Did you end up poking it with a flame sanitised spoon or something?


Not yet, ferm fridge is tied up with a lager for another week and the garage is too cold for a starter. I'll post up when it's away but probably a couple of weeks. 

I see you added some carafa to up the colour, that's another thing I've noticed with the beersmith version of the recipes. They all come in very much under the colour listed in the book, I was thinking something similar about adding some carafa or even English choc malt to up the colour


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## Mardoo

I think I'm going to use this on a too-high gravity IBA so I can hit it hard with sugar to thin it out. I've already fermented a couple cubes of it on different yeasts, so it'll be an interesting comparison.


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## stuartf

Ok finally decided to have a crack at the cascade xxxk recipe from bronzed brews for my first brew with this yeast. Any tips to be aware of like stalling at a particular og etc?


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## Bribie G

Oxygenate the wort well and don't let it get too cool, and you should be sweet.


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## stuartf

Bribie G said:


> Oxygenate the wort well and don't let it get too cool, and you should be sweet.


Will do, don't have an O2 setup but I do have a mash paddle in a drill which usually gets me through.


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## TidalPete

Bribie G said:


> Oxygenate the wort well and don't let it get too cool, and you should be sweet.



He should be sweet at an anticipated 72 IBU Bribie?  
The 1887 Cascade XXXK is on P.265.
Almost went for that one but decided on the 1894 Macclesfield XXXK on P.269 which is in the cleaning-up process & should be Biofined & kegged in about 10 days. I subbed the sugar with home-made No2 Invert to get it to the approx EBC as mentioned before somewhere on here as the BeerSmith calcs do seem to be out of sync with Bronzed Brews recipes.
Agree with Bribie's temp & O2 comments stuartf.
Good luck with it.


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## stuartf

TidalPete said:


> He should be sweet at an anticipated 72 IBU Bribie?
> The 1887 Cascade XXXK is on P.265.
> Almost went for that one but decided on the 1894 Macclesfield XXXK on P.269 which is in the cleaning-up process & should be Biofined & kegged in about 10 days. I subbed the sugar with home-made No2 Invert to get it to the approx EBC as mentioned before somewhere on here as the BeerSmith calcs do seem to be out of sync with Bronzed Brews recipes.
> Agree with Bribie's temp & O2 comments stuartf.
> Good luck with it.


Yeah at 72IBU I think it might need some time to mature before it's at its best?


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## MitchD

The gen y in me couldn't wait. So I kegged the lager I was cc'ing and have 059 spinning now. Plug came out with a thud, but it seems to be starting quickly.


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## Bribie G

I bottled my first batch of Tooths Tribute a bit over a week ago. This is a brilliant bottling yeast. I didn't use biofine or anything but the beer has cleared to perfect brilliance and pours clear to the last drop.
Rather than settling as a "fluffy" layer like most other yeasts that cloud up as you pour, the WLP059 forms micro-cornflakes that you can see clearly on inverting the bottle, and they just sit on the bottom like clinker. Another equivalent would be those snowstorm globes. 

It will be interesting to see if anyone else gets that. The bottles seem to be carbing up a fair bit slower but no doubt they'll get there in the end and I'm considering using this yeast as a bottler for any comps in the future.


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## technobabble66

What %-age attenuation are you getting?
Or are you still boycotting your hydrometer [emoji57]


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## Bribie G

What is this hydrometer you speak of?

I'll be in the LHBS in Lismore shortly which, by the Grace of my god(praise be to the Invisible Pink Unicorn) is just over the road from Aldi, to get a box of PETs so you have twisted my arm, I'll buy one.


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## kaiserben

(I just got a starter going on the stir plate last night) 

It's interesting how the yeast was all clumped together in the vial. No amount of shaking would break it up. It came out of the vial as a single mass. 

That might make things tricky when it comes to splitting some off into more vials for freezing.


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## Bribie G

Bribie G said:


> What is this hydrometer you speak of?
> 
> I'll be in the LHBS in Lismore shortly which, by the Grace of my god(praise be to the Invisible Pink Unicorn) is just over the road from Aldi, to get a box of PETs so you have twisted my arm, I'll buy one.



Yay, hydrometer _and_ Flensburger from the same car parking spot. Doesn't get any better than that.


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## Lionman

Bribie G said:


> I keg and don't really bother about FG. If it's been properly brewed, oxygenated and pitched then when it's cleared from the top it's done. I smashed my last hydrometer about 2011 but might pick one up again just to test my finished beers out of interest.
> 
> When randyrob was still around and developing BrewMate I asked him about FG calculations with regard to mash temperatures and other inputs, and he more or less said that if you could write software that could _accurately_ predict your FG then you'd be up for the Nobel Prize in Brewing.



Get a refractometer, so much easier to take a reading, just record it in brix and its easy to convert the original and final brix into corrected SG values and ABV.

Not that I bother half the time anyway...


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## Mardoo

Uh oh, here we go…another hydro/refract smack down


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## Bribie G

I have a refrac that I use (several times) on every brew day and now a hydro.
However I've never had much luck using the correction chart for FG and really can't be arsed as the FG looks after itself and I keg anyway. I just paid out $12.50 for a hydro to check - merely out of interest - the FG in finished beer (degassed out of keg or bottle).

As for OG I agree you'd be mad to use a hydro to waste half a glass of wort sample when a few drops does the trick in a few seconds.


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## stuartf

kaiserben said:


> (I just got a starter going on the stir plate last night)
> 
> It's interesting how the yeast was all clumped together in the vial. No amount of shaking would break it up. It came out of the vial as a single mass.
> 
> That might make things tricky when it comes to splitting some off into more vials for freezing.


Made a starter for mine on the weekend and found the same, it was one solid block of yeast but it dissolved well into the starter so I'm thinking I'll take a chunk of the yeast cake and depending on how solid it is I'll make a new starter with that and have a go at freezing with glycerine.


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## Tony121

kaiserben said:


> That might make things tricky when it comes to splitting some off into more vials for freezing.



Anyone tried splitting & freezing this yet?


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## kaiserben

Tony121 said:


> Anyone tried splitting & freezing this yet?



I did last night. Went a lot smoother than I thought it would. There were still little clumps that didn't want to separate, but overall I was happy with what I was able to get into vials.


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## Tony121

kaiserben said:


> I did last night. Went a lot smoother than I thought it would. There were still little clumps that didn't want to separate, but overall I was happy with what I was able to get into vials.


Thanks for the reply, good to hear it went well. I'll be trying it in the next week or two when the stir plate is freed up.


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## MitchD

I'm down to 1.012 with no sign of slowing down. BS estimates 1.002 so we'll just have to see.


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## kaiserben

MitchD said:


> I'm down to 1.012 with no sign of slowing down. BS estimates 1.002 so we'll just have to see.



How many days into the ferment are you?


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## MitchD

Pitched late Saturday, was visibly going Sunday morning


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## Bribie G

Well at least one Australian Bitter made on this yeast has now been entered, and judged, in the NSW State Comp.

I was pleased with the results, comments were a pleasant well brewed beer with some nice fruity character but somewhat undercarbed, average score 33.5.

The carbing issue was expected, this yeast drops like a drop bear onto a Dutch Tourist and was so clear in the bottles that I could hardly see any yeast regrowth on tipping bottles, even after three weeks.
Next time I need to bottle any I'll save some of the first murky stuff out of the FV tap and re-inoculate the portion to be bottled.

I did a sort of Tooths XXX 1960s and 1970s tribute using POR in this case to conform with the BJCP specs (grrrrr grrrrr ) but as I posted earlier it really was strongly reminiscent of beers I had in Northern NSW back in that era before Tooths got shafted by CUB and switched all their yeasts to Fosters B strain. 

Note: that was a 15L batch I did in my "comp size" fermenter. I may have posted this elsewhere adjusted to a 22L for anyone maybe looking to do it. 

*Australian Bitter 2017 comps*
Australian Pale Ale

*Recipe Specs*
----------------
Batch Size (L): 15.0
Total Grain (kg): 2.733
Total Hops (g): 23.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048 (°P): 11.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.009 (°P): 2.3
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.14 %
Colour (SRM): 7.3 (EBC): 14.4
Bitterness (IBU): 32.5 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 74
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

*Grain Bill*
----------------
1.700 kg Base Barrett Burston Pilsener (62.2%)
0.500 kg Cane Sugar (18.29%)
0.500 kg Weyermann Vienna (18.29%)
0.033 kg Carafa II malt (1.21%)

*Hop Bill*
----------------
23.0 g Pride of Ringwood Pellet (8.3% Alpha) @ 30 Minutes (Boil) (1.5 g/L)

*Misc Bill*
----------------

Single step Infusion at 66°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20°C with WLP059 - Melbourne Ale Yeast


Recipe Generated with *BrewMate*


----------



## Bribie G

I used the yeast in my poly fermenter this time around - a Tooheys 1913 Standard Pale Ale - so I can see what's going on, and its UK and possibly Burton ancestry is quite obvious.
The body of the beer is now clearing after a week in the FV and what you are looking at here isn't krausen as such, it's a raft of floating yeasty goodness with visible clumps of yeast floating around.
I'll keep a good eye on it when I keg off during the week and try to capture that layer into a couple of mason jars without disturbing the slurry layer that's on the bottom of the FV.
Aldi have some German "masons" on spec during the week.


----------



## stuartf

Kegged and bottled my Macclesfield xxxk ale today. Had been cold crashing for a week and the yeast cake was the most compact I have ever seen. Managed to basically all of the beer out of the fermenter without a sign of the yeast being disturbed. Taste was good and quite fruity, be interesting to see what its like once it's carbed up


----------



## captain crumpet

Ipa 3rd gen ferment with wlp059. 45L batch had 3.5kg of invert and glucose. OG 1.070

Golden promise
Castle 2row pils
Roasted barley
Carafa 2
Caramunich

PoR 90min
Galaxy and Melba cubed
Galaxy, Melba, EKG and PoR dry hop

Ferment at 22c

Pitched at 3pm Monday, now Thursday morning, gravity reading (hydro) is sitting at 1.012 (82% apparent attenuation) Yeast has dropped out already. Buttloads of diacetyl. Will give it untill this time next week to crash it.


----------



## kaiserben

Bribie G said:


> I was pleased with the results, comments were a pleasant well brewed beer with some nice fruity character but somewhat undercarbed, average score 33.5.
> 
> The carbing issue was expected, this yeast drops like a drop bear onto a Dutch Tourist and was so clear in the bottles that I could hardly see any yeast regrowth on tipping bottles, even after three weeks.
> Next time I need to bottle any I'll save some of the first murky stuff out of the FV tap and re-inoculate the portion to be bottled.



What level did you aim to carb at? In Bronzed Brews all the recipes pretty much sit at 2.0 volumes CO2. I decided this would be too low for my tastes and so I aimed for more like 2.3. 

When it came time for bottling there was quite a lot of chunks of nearly solid yeast that came out of the tap to begin with. Most went in my gravity sample. I then took an extra 0.5L sample or so just to get the beer running clearer into my bottling bucket. 

I bottled (mostly in PET) and not yet opened one. I've given the bottles a squeeze and the carb level seems pretty good. Might be time for a taste, I think ...


----------



## Bribie G

I only bottle for competitions or to take a batch on a trip. I always bottle in brown PETs with a CSR sugar cube and this gives really good carbonation. If it does get a bit lively that's fine for most comp purposes as mostly a beer will be marked down for poor carb rather than high carb. Unless it's a gusher of course.

I entered two beers and the other one was judged good carb, whilst the Melbourne had basically conked out in the bottles.
I'm actually kegging my Tooheys Standard Pale Ale today and might glean a bottle to see how it goes with a good charge of yeast this time.


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

Pitched my first beer with this last night, a Melbourne Ale. Fired up within 8 hours and is very lively indeed, excited to see the results and need to plan a couple more beers with it!

*Melbourne Ale*
*Blonde Ale (6 B)*




Type: All Grain
Batch Size: 47.50 l
Boil Size: 55.98 l
Boil Time: 60 min
End of Boil Vol: 49.48 l
Final Bottling Vol: 45.50 l
Fermentation: Ale, Single Stage
Date: 05 Aug 2017

Asst Brewer: 
Equipment: 3V RIMS Rig - Double Batch
Efficiency: 75.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 75.0 %
Ingredients
* Amt* * Name* * Type* * #* * %/IBU*
8.00 kg Pale Malt (Weyermann) (6.5 EBC) Grain 1 92.6 %
0.09 kg Acidulated (Weyermann) (3.5 EBC) Grain 2 1.0 %
0.05 kg Crystal, Medium (Simpsons) (178.5 EBC) Grain 3 0.6 %
38.20 g Pride of Ringwood [9.10 %] - First Wort 60.0 min Hop 4 22.7 IBUs
0.50 kg Raw Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (2.0 EBC) Sugar 5 5.8 %
2.00 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 6 -
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 mins) Other 7 -
1.0 pkg Melbourne Ale (The Vault) (White Labs #WLP059) Yeast 8 -
*Gravity, Alcohol Content and Color*
Est Original Gravity: 1.044 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.008 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 4.7 %
Bitterness: 22.7 IBUs
Est Color: 9.5 EBC
Measured Original Gravity: 1.046 SG


----------



## Bribie G

I bet that turns out a bit like the VB Original Pale Ale that was out around 15 years ago. 
Why they don't issue it again instead of crisp lite blonde lo-fucken-carb swill beats me.


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

I remember that one! Oh how posh I felt with my special VB Original!!!

Depending how this first cube turns out in the FV, I may drop the second straight back in, or I may opt for a lager yeast version to have a difference to compare...


----------



## malt junkie

Have some 059 on the plate, might steal the above recipe, and knock it out tomorrow. Need a decent cake for RIS rescue, when the RIS slows, though it went from 1.130 to 1.075 overnight, so maybe it won't be needed but better to be prepared.


----------



## MitchD

malt junkie said:


> Have some 059 on the plate, might steal the above recipe, and knock it out tomorrow. Need a decent cake for RIS rescue, when the RIS slows, though it went from 1.130 to 1.075 overnight, so maybe it won't be needed but better to be prepared.


I don't think this will be a good yeast to finish off a stalled RIS with due to its high flocculation, when I kegged I was able to drain right down to the cake without any yeast getting stirred up. If needed I'd pour in a few litres, give it a good shake then fill the rest.


----------



## malt junkie

MitchD said:


> I don't think this will be a good yeast to finish off a stalled RIS with due to its high flocculation, when I kegged I was able to drain right down to the cake without any yeast getting stirred up. If needed I'd pour in a few litres, give it a good shake then fill the rest.


I only want it to chew sugar, I'll cask age(keg with some oak dominoes) with lager yeast till next winter, the fact it flocks so well sorta works for me, it just means good yeast handling and pre planning brews to provide yeast cakes.


----------



## MitchD

malt junkie said:


> I only want it to chew sugar, I'll cask age(keg with some oak dominoes) with lager yeast till next winter, the fact it flocks so well sorta works for me, it just means good yeast handling and pre planning brews to provide yeast cakes.


Nah, when I said it flocks well I meant like concrete, stuck together with chemset. I'd use it to start a RIS and get the flavour profile but it really won't chew the remaining sugar when it's compacted on the bottom of the fv.


----------



## malt junkie

MitchD said:


> Nah, when I said it flocks well I meant like concrete, stuck together with chemset. I'd use it to start a RIS and get the flavour profile but it really won't chew the remaining sugar when it's compacted on the bottom of the fv.


ahh gotcha, thanks will move to plan c


----------



## Bribie G

I just kegged the Toohey's 1913 Standard Pale Ale and it's a ripper. I finally bought a hydrometer and the yeast had ripped it down to about 1.005 so based on the OG of 1.048 I've ended up with a 5.6% ABV beer rather than the 4.8% using something like Yorkshire Stone Square. 

So I'll be adjusting recipes in future where a xxx type yeast is called for, don't know how it goes in Beersmith but in Brewmate I've reset the attenuation for this yeast to 83% so it's all calculating out ok now. 

Now to get the yeast out into storage, the bottom of the FV looks like a fishtank with gravel overlaid with crystal clear wort. Even got a couple of wannabe seahorses to the left of the photo. The original topcrop sank during cold conditioning. Having a few sneaky ice colds off the remains, I can understand now how they could smash ten or twenty of these no problems during the six o'clock swill.


----------



## technobabble66

Great, thanks Bribie!
So 83% attenuation. Pretty damn good ;-)
It does look a little like someone pissed into you fish tank. 

What was your saccharification temp in the mash, or the mash schedule?
And how much sugar did you go with in this?

(just asking so i can update my version of ianh's spreadsheet).


----------



## Bribie G

Here's the final recipe, adapted slightly from Korev's recipe in the book to account for no chill and cube hopping. It's amazing what a nice malty flavour it has, considering that when I milled the grain, it was such a small bill compared to my normal AG brews that the mill said "WTF Bribie????"

I put the sugar in the boil - careful to dissolve it well in some hot wort out of the tap and stir furiously to avoid a heavy syrup sinking down onto the heat source and scorching (or cutting an urn out as has happened twice to me).

*1913 Tooheys Standard Pale*
Australian Pale Ale

*Recipe Specs*
----------------
Batch Size (L): 22.0
Total Grain (kg): 3.790
Total Hops (g): 76.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.048 (°P): 11.9
Final Gravity (FG): 1.005 (°P): 1.3
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.66 %
Colour (SRM): 5.3 (EBC): 10.4
Bitterness (IBU): 33.7 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 74
Boil Time (Minutes): 90

*Grain Bill*
----------------
1.800 kg Bairds Pearl (47.49%)
0.850 kg Barrett Burston Pale(22.43%)
0.570 kg Raw Sugar (15.04%)
0.570 kg White Sugar (15.04%)

*Hop Bill*
----------------
14.0 g Cluster Pellet (7.4% Alpha) @ 90 Minutes (Boil) (0.6 g/L)
14.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.6 g/L)
14.0 g Cluster Pellet (7.4% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Cube hop) (0.6 g/L)
14.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Cube hop) (0.6 g/L)
20.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop on pitching) (0.9 g/L)

*Misc Bill*
----------------
3.0 g Calcium Chloride @ 0 Minutes (Mash)
4.0 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) @ 0 Minutes (Mash)

Single step Infusion at 69°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 20°C with WLP059 - Melbourne Ale Yeast


----------



## Coldspace

Bribie G said:


> Here's the final recipe, adapted slightly from Korev's recipe in the book to account for no chill and cube hopping. It's amazing what a nice malty flavour it has, considering that when I milled the grain, it was such a small bill compared to my normal AG brews that the mill said "WTF Bribie????"
> 
> I put the sugar in the boil - careful to dissolve it well in some hot wort out of the tap and stir furiously to avoid a heavy syrup sinking down onto the heat source and scorching (or cutting an urn out as has happened twice to me).
> 
> *1913 Tooheys Standard Pale*
> Australian Pale Ale
> 
> *Recipe Specs*
> ----------------
> Batch Size (L): 22.0
> Total Grain (kg): 3.790
> Total Hops (g): 76.00
> Original Gravity (OG): 1.048 (°P): 11.9
> Final Gravity (FG): 1.005 (°P): 1.3
> Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.66 %
> Colour (SRM): 5.3 (EBC): 10.4
> Bitterness (IBU): 33.7 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)
> Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 74
> Boil Time (Minutes): 90
> 
> *Grain Bill*
> ----------------
> 1.800 kg Bairds Pearl (47.49%)
> 0.850 kg Barrett Burston Pale(22.43%)
> 0.570 kg Raw Sugar (15.04%)
> 0.570 kg White Sugar (15.04%)
> 
> *Hop Bill*
> ----------------
> 14.0 g Cluster Pellet (7.4% Alpha) @ 90 Minutes (Boil) (0.6 g/L)
> 14.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.6 g/L)
> 14.0 g Cluster Pellet (7.4% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Cube hop) (0.6 g/L)
> 14.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Cube hop) (0.6 g/L)
> 20.0 g East Kent Golding Pellet (4.7% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop on pitching) (0.9 g/L)
> 
> *Misc Bill*
> ----------------
> 3.0 g Calcium Chloride @ 0 Minutes (Mash)
> 4.0 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) @ 0 Minutes (Mash)
> 
> Single step Infusion at 69°C for 60 Minutes.
> Fermented at 20°C with WLP059 - Melbourne Ale Yeast


Cheers for this...

Got 2 vials of this yeast sitting in the fridge. Will try this recipe out next week or so...


----------



## technobabble66

Bribie G said:


> ...
> Single step Infusion at 69°C for 60 Minutes.
> Fermented at 20°C with WLP059 - Melbourne Ale Yeast


Wow - 81% attenuation after a 69°C mash. (at least that's what my spreadsheet indicates). 
That's pretty damn amazing!

Thanks v much for posting the recipe details. 
Appreciated!


----------



## technobabble66

Do you think there could be any difference in the resulting flavour profile adding the sugar pre-ferment compared to mid-ferment?

I'm assuming there's a big benefit with 059 in that, unlike other strains (e.g.: Belgian, English), it's so well suited to sugar/sucrose that it doesn't apparently struggle to convert from chewing simple sugar/sucrose to chewing maltose halfway through fermentation. So we can add it during the boil, and thus it should have maximum flavour impact as it's affecting the initial fermentation phase that's meant to produce the majority of flavour compounds (a little paraphrasing of White Labs explanation, etc). 
As opposed to those other strains where the (apparently) "best" time to add the sugars/syrups is towards the end of the fermentation as they struggle to chew through maltose after chewing through easier sucrose/glucose. And so the flavour impact should be greatly lessened as it's not present during that primary "flavour-forming" phase at the start of fermentation.

But that's all just my theory, as i haven't brewed with this yet. So i'm just wondering f anyone who has might've noticed anything along these lines?


----------



## technobabble66

Probably a more useful question, again to those who've been brewing with 059: 
What do you think is the better/best mash temp for 059 beers, given we're looking to use 15-30% sugar in the recipe?


----------



## Bribie G

The mash temperature is high because the malt is needed to provide flavour, body, head etc so not many fermentables are produced. 
The sugar addition does the heavy lifting to produce the alcohol, so is needed in the fermenter from the beginning. 

I just follow Bronzed Brews as he's the guy with the actual brewing logs.


----------



## technobabble66

Yeah, I understand the general idea, I was just wondering if you or others had tried a few different mash temps and had discovered a sweet spot from your trials yet?
Otherwise I do what you did and go 68-69*C for 90mins. [emoji4]
Though it sound like bronzed brews has already done that empirical work [emoji6]


----------



## kaiserben

My recipe (1931 White Horse Pale Ale) called for 66C and I ended up with FG of 1.003 (which is also what my software predicted). 

The beer is thin, but not ridiculously so. It's nice and easy to drink.

I asked the author of Bronzed Brews about my FG and he was surprised it got down that low. I'm saving a bottle for him so he can have a taste.


----------



## stuartf

My Macclesfield xxxk after 3 weeks in the keg. Funnily the bottled beer from this batch is clearer than the kegged? Fruityness has subsided with time but it's left a really smooth easy drinking ale that is going to disappear fast once the sun decides to show it's face down south.


----------



## Bribie G

With the extra hour of sunshine coming up on Monday you'll be able to drink heaps more. 

Yeah FG of 2006 with my last batch, might even have been 2005 - it's just a LHBS hydro so keeps clinging to side of the cheapo plastic cylinder and a bit hard to read - I'll do a few more checks in a larger vessel like a pint glass for example  once it's on tap and pouring.


----------



## stuartf

Got another vial in the fridge so there'll be another brew coming up soon. Thinking of splitting and freezing it so I have a ready supply on hand.


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Bribie G said:


> I bet that turns out a bit like the VB Original Pale Ale that was out around 15 years ago.
> Why they don't issue it again instead of crisp lite blonde lo-fucken-carb swill beats me.


I'd imagine it probably doubles their ingredient cost...


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

My Melb Bitter is tasting spectacular. Very very similar to Melb Bitter in fact 

One interesting thing is the hydro samples come out SUPER frothy, with a bit more head than would be ideal in the drinking glass. Makes it difficult to read the gravity accurately. However it is down to 1.013 in 7 days and activity-wise looks to have almost stopped, fermenting at 20C and the mash temp was 67.0C single infusion. Weird as it is still 5 points off estimated FG, was oxygenated and received a very healthy 1.5L yeast starter (from original vial). Will bump the temp up to 23C and see how it finishes off.


----------



## Bribie G

I let mine rest at 19 for a week after activity ceased.
I think theres still a lot going on.


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

Were you at FG before that week rest Bribie?


----------



## Bribie G

I don't actually check gravities until I keg, introduces O2. That's why I leave as long as possible in primary.


----------



## malt junkie

Brown Ale
19L

Briese Ale malt 3.6kg
Med Crystal 60g
Pale choc 120g
Brown sugar 500g

Amarilo 60min 30 IBU

OG 1052

My 30 IBU maybe out, got better utilisation swimming free, I may water this down a few points to 1045-48, see what is comes up like. Been in ferment 24hrs and has a nice build up of krausen @17c, it was a big starter see where it is in 5 days or so.


----------



## Randai

Thinking of doing a sugar less batch of beer for my first one (life got in the way) with WLP059. Not using sugar due a large amount of grain that really needs to be used.
Doing it to mimic tooheys bulk 1922.

40% Vienna
34% Ale
23% Pils
2% Roasted Barley

OG: 1.041
IBU: 31.6

What sort of attenuation are people getting from all grain if anyone has tried it.
Also any particular flavours fermenting it warmer that are desirable say 20C?


----------



## Bribie G

I just sampled a sneaky 1913 Tooheys Standard Pale on kegging.

It had been in cold conditioning in FV for about a week at 1 degree, then biofine into keg for another 10 days. So after about a schooner of murk it's pouring bright. I still can't believe that with a kilo of sugaz this beer is so full bodied and malty. 
I'm also picking up the catty notes you still get from a lot of the traditional brews like VB and XXXX.


----------



## technobabble66

Got my baby spinning up, ready for pitching in a few days. 
Gratuitous shot of the Yeast Forge - awesome piece of kit!





First beer will be an Aussie Bitter, waiting patiently in a cube. 
Currently thinking I might try a malty Munich2-heavy beer with perle+saaz & 15% sugar. 
Then something like a Belgian Blonde, but with 059 & ~15% sugar, to target ~6.5-7%alc. 
Probably followed by an Amber-ish IPA (mongrel brew from Vic July case swap) & a stout/RIS (also from the case swap).


----------



## Mat B

Thought I'd mention that I was at Grain & Grape yesterday for a gas swap and had a bit of a moment with their sample taps. One of the beers there was called Melbourne Ale and it mentioned it was brewed using WLP059. I asked if they had the recipe, and when they gave it to me, I saw that it was the Melbourne Sparkling Ale from the Bronzed Brews book. It was very drinkable, and I noticed that slight bubblegummy taste a few have mentioned here. Wasn't anywhere near as dry as I expected considering it uses nearly 1kg of table sugar. Nice and malty. I think I'm going to brew it!


----------



## Midnight Brew

mblackam said:


> Thought I'd mention that I was at Grain & Grape yesterday for a gas swap and had a bit of a moment with their sample taps. One of the beers there was called Melbourne Ale and it mentioned it was brewed using WLP059. I asked if they had the recipe, and when they gave it to me, I saw that it was the Melbourne Sparkling Ale from the Bronzed Brews book. It was very drinkable, and I noticed that slight bubblegummy taste a few have mentioned here. Wasn't anywhere near as dry as I expected considering it uses nearly 1kg of table sugar. Nice and malty. I think I'm going to brew it!


Is that the recipe on page 281, the Tooth's Crystal Ale?


----------



## laxation

I'm gonna have to go next week to GnG and give it a try...


----------



## technobabble66

Midnight Brew said:


> Is that the recipe on page 281, the Tooth's Crystal Ale?


Does it use any crystal?
(actually a serious question - it sounds like 059 leaves a crystal like effect in the beer, so wondering if it's that combined with base malts, or if there's actual crystal in it)


On another note, has anyone used Biscuit or Aromatic in a 059 beer yet? If so, how did it affect the beer, in your opinion?
I'm curious as to how they'd perform under this yeast, or any of the other toasty elements (victory, amber) or heavy-malty elements (Munich2 or melanoiden). Otherwise i'll have to broaden that horizon myself...


----------



## Midnight Brew

technobabble66 said:


> Does it use any crystal?
> (actually a serious question - it sounds like 059 leaves a crystal like effect in the beer, so wondering if it's that combined with base malts, or if there's actual crystal in it)
> ..


No crystal, I think its called that in order to appeal to the drinker visually. That actual recipe does not call for WLP059 but its the only one I could find on a quick flick through of which would be as @mblackam described of nearly a kilo of sugar. Curious to know the if it is the same recipe because I have nearly all the ingredients.


----------



## Mat B

I haven't actually checked in the book to see which recipe it specifically relates to, and I'm at work now so don't have it handy (working very hard as you can see). I did however take the attached photo of the recipe they used, which should help narrow it down. It was pretty damned nice in my opinion, but that might have been influenced by the fact that I'd just got out of some heavy traffic, so any beer would have probably hit the spot. I'd be interested to hear other people's thoughts if they get a chance to sample it.

Edit: I just remembered the guy in the shop said they got the recipe from the White Labs site, so it's safe to say they based it on this: https://www.whitelabs.com/sites/default/files/1916_Tooths_Pale_Ale.pdf


----------



## Midnight Brew

mblackam said:


> I haven't actually checked in the book to see which recipe it specifically relates to, and I'm at work now so don't have it handy (working very hard as you can see). I did however take the attached photo of the recipe they used, which should help narrow it down. It was pretty damned nice in my opinion, but that might have been influenced by the fact that I'd just got out of some heavy traffic, so any beer would have probably hit the spot. I'd be interested to hear other people's thoughts if they get a chance to sample it.


 That looks like the one! page 281, Tooth's Crystal Ale


----------



## kaiserben

Midnight Brew said:


> That actual recipe does not call for WLP059 ...



None of the recipes call for WLP059 because it wasn't available when the book was written. Somewhere in the book it mentions something along the lines of "WLP059 can sub in anywhere where the Whitbread yeast was used".


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Just about to crack open my 2 vials of wlp059 for a starter and this stuff is like cement glue in the vial. Lots of shaking to try and dissolve the clump and you only let it sit for a bit and it sets solid again.


----------



## TidalPete

Danscraftbeer said:


> Just about to crack open my 2 vials of wlp059 for a starter and this stuff is like cement glue in the vial. Lots of shaking to try and dissolve the clump and you only let it sit for a bit and it sets solid again.



"Whole Lotta Shakin Goin' On" (Thanks Elvis LOL!) alright DCB but once you've the yeast out of the tube & into another 100 ml or so of sterile water then it's easy enough to split into tubes.

Added Biofine to the keg (10 g) & here's a pic of the first pint after dumping the sludge from my 1894 Macclesfield XXXK Pale Ale Clone (P.269). It's much clearer ATM thanks to the extra week or so since the pic was taken but can't be arsed doing another pic at present.

I have learnt the lesson & will be making the extra effort of racking to secondary on top of the Biofine in future before kegging but only with my Pale Ales & Lagers. All the dark (Brewbrited) beers can sit in their kegs clearing themselves up whilst awaiting their turn at the taps.

Must agree with Bribie about the cat piss reminiscent to VB, XXXX, etc.
Quite tasty though IMHO!


----------



## contrarian

Just brewed the 1917 Tooths XXX recipe from bronzed brews to try this yeast out. Now just need to wait for free fermenting space to try this yeast out.


----------



## Bribie G

Pete how long did you cold condition? I usually give about a week at near zero. My MK2 kegmate can get right down to there no problems, even froze a brew once. Racking to secondary fills me with fear of the O2 barbarian molecules.

Here's my Tooths tribute that I bottled just now for the Queensland Xmas case swap (which of course, as is true of the best case swaps is actually being held in NSW haha). Of course there's no Biofine involved here, and in fact because it's a bottler I only gave it about four days and even poured a bit of cloudy stuff back into the FV to enhance the conditioning yeast, as this stuff just drops like a bogan's knickers and it's hard to get a good bottle condition going, so I'd bet that if I had kegged this on Biofine it would be crystal in a couple of days.






This is my Toohey's 1913 Standard Pale Ale, been pouring like this from the beginning.


----------



## Coldspace

Does anyone know where I can buy a copy of the book "bronzed brews " in Australia ?

Cheers


----------



## Gloveski

Coldspace said:


> Does anyone know where I can buy a copy of the book "bronzed brews " in Australia ?
> 
> Cheers



I just recently ordered it off his website only took a week and a half to get to Tassie as it's printed in the US. Think it's just printed per order , you can also get a discount code if you google lulu.com coupons


----------



## Coldspace

Gloveski said:


> I just recently ordered it off his website only took a week and a half to get to Tassie as it's printed in the US. Think it's just printed per order , you can also get a discount code if you google lulu.com coupons


Cheers


----------



## MitchD

Anyone used this in an all malt (no sugar at all) English style ale pitched and fermented ~20c? Thinking about a bitters style abv 3.5-4% & ~35ibu.

My first gen was used on the tooth's 1931 ale at 18c and it's definitely more malty than hoppy, just wondering if the higher temperature will bring out an "English" ester profile?


----------



## Bribie G

I've actually run this yeast through a couple of all-malt brews to build up extra slurry and it works really well. It's even the yeast in my Coopers Toucan Headbanger stout on tap at the moment. At higher temperatures it resembles a Burton Ale yeast very much, rising to the top after the fermentation like a layer of oily pancake batter, and I guess that's how yeasts were in Victorian Britain where it came from originally. As for esters you might get more of the bubble gum at 20 degrees, personally I like it and it tends to fade out over a few weeks.


----------



## Randai

Anyone brewed anything high ABV with wlp059, since I can't seem to find any mention of alcohol tolerance. Would be interested to see what the highest OG was.


----------



## TheWiggman

I'm on my second brew with 059 and it's a Toohey's Old as per Brewman's site (previous brew was very good). It's been in the fermenter for the 8th day now so I figured it would be done, fired off quicker this time with a hit of O2. I took a hydro before racking and it came in at 1.011, which long story short implies it's got a bit to go. It took a good fortnight for my Tooth's WHA to finish off so from my experience it's been a slow fermenter. Fairly quick off the mark, but finishes slowly.


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Yeah mine is slow too in the 50lt pressure fermenter. Funny thing that struck me was the second stir plate starter I made to be an 1lt activated pitch breached the 3lt flask over night (7 hours) making a mess of lost high krausen yeast over the bench .
In fear of blow off considering this character I set up a 5lt mini keg with 1lt sterile water to be the collector of the blow off yeast since its a 43lt brew I was sure it would blow off but no.
Fermenting at 18c for 2 days as per the recipe its a slow rev thing. Now creeping up to 21c.
As per the recipe of 1917 White Horse Ale. That's not actually in the Bronze Brew book ha  https://www.whitelabs.com/sites/default/files/1916_Tooths_Pale_Ale.pdf


----------



## technobabble66

Fwiw, I've finally got my 059 going.
Initially did a 700mL starter, fully fermented & chilled, decanted then pitched.
Pitched into a simple Aussie Bitter, ~12% sugar, OG=1.042, FG~1.009 (76% attenuation). Currently at ~1.010 after 9 days at ~20°C, most of it chewed through within the first 5 days, transferred to the 2nd FV to try to finish the last 1-2 points.
Drained the cube of the 2nd beer, a Malty Bitter or Aussie Alt (  ) onto the yeast cake yesterday, fridge set to 20°C. ~15% sugar, OG=1.048-50, FG~1.010 (76% attenuation). Down to SG=1.026 within 24 hours!
Both were mashed at 68°C for ~80mins.

The first one will go into the 2nd fridge in the next day or 2 to CC, then we'll see how it all clears up. So still early days, but i just thought i'd mention my progress for the record, and I'll report the more meaningful results when they carb up!


----------



## laxation

This weekend I was going to brew up something for this yeast, based on Bribie's recipe.

50% Golden Promise (2.3kg)
21.7% Raw sugar (1kg)
17.5% Pale malt (.8kg)
10% Supernova (.5kg)

Supernova is there for no reason other than "I have it and want to try it" so if anyone has any idea how much to use i'd be keen to hear it!

Same/similar hops as Bribies.
20g Cluster FWH
20g EKG FWH
20g Cluster cube
20g EKG cube

1.050 sg, 34 IBU
Mash at 68


----------



## stuartf

Last pour from the keg of my Macclesfield xxxk. Good job I have 49 odd bottles in the garage and another tube of the magic goo left


----------



## Danscraftbeer

This yeast is a Draught Horse.
Slower Revs but consistent. This is something of what I have experienced on my first go with this elusive strain.

Two vials stir plated to up and activate then settle, (1.5l X 1.030) tip off, add 1l new wort (1.040)
Stir plate activation took off! Considered that good enough for 40lt brew at 1.050.
Again its been a slower pace than any yeast I've experienced.
Results yet to come. It smells very neutral so far.


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Tooths 1917 Pale Ale. WLP059. Pressure fermented self carbonated. Excess volume in a 4lt mini keg on tap for taste testing cloudy green beer with yeasty fluffy head this is spectacular!
Cidery beer in a good way. Totally yummy. Like no other beer i have made but hitting good marks that I never have before.
I may bottle this for the Vic swap meet over two other options.


----------



## technobabble66

Danscraftbeer said:


> ...
> I may bottle this for the Vic swap meet over two other options.


There'll be 2 others in the swap to compare it with...


----------



## Danscraftbeer

I'm feeling the commitment thing then for the swap bottle. I'm bringing mini kegs and such of the other good shit but who will remember those after the night haha


----------



## Korev

My new book is now available from Lulu.
Check their homepage for discount coupons.
http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/prsymons

Cheers
Peter


----------



## indica86

Nice one!


----------



## Coldspace

Good stuff,
Just finished the Bronzed brews, great book and value. 
I'll get this one.


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Korev said:


> My new book is now available from Lulu.
> Check their homepage for discount coupons.
> http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/prsymons
> 
> Cheers
> Peter


No chance you could make the Vic Case Swap on the 24-25th November 2017 is there?
Just in case some freak chance there will be three brewers at least committed to the wlp059 you launched.
I really like that yeast too, its new! in good ways to your 1917 Tooths Pale recipe as the first for me.
Love yu work!


----------



## Korev

Danscraftbeer said:


> No chance you could make the Vic Case Swap on the 24-25th November 2017 is there?
> Just in case some freak chance there will be three brewers at least committed to the wlp059 you launched.
> I really like that yeast too, its new! in good ways to your 1917 Tooths Pale recipe as the first for me.
> Love yu work!



Well I would love to but unfortunately have other commitments. Perhaps next year when ANHC is on there would be an opportunity for a 059 fest??
Peter


----------



## Coldspace

I just kegged up the tooheys 1913 pale ale yesterday going on Bribies posted receipe as my book had not arrived by then.
I think its good, malty with all the sugaz but mashing at 69 prob helped ,but it also crisp like a lager but its an ale, interesting yeast. Glad I grown and froze a heap as its going to be good to try a few other receipes.

Should keep my Mega swill drinking mates happy.... but I kinda like it after a few schooners sarvo its grown on me. Should mellow off a tad in the next couple of weeks.

I too find that unique catty background taste, I used to get it 25 years ago in the old xxxx beers. 




Cheers


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Nice and clear Coldspace. Kegged yesterday? Cold conditioned before transfer? I assume. Do you draw beer from the bottom? Mine is still quite cloudy. I'm going to have to look into those clear beer things that draw the beer from the top etc.


----------



## Coldspace

Danscraftbeer said:


> Nice and clear Coldspace. Kegged yesterday? Cold conditioned before transfer? I assume. Do you draw beer from the bottom? Mine is still quite cloudy. I'm going to have to look into those clear beer things that draw the beer from the top etc.


Hey mate,
This brew was done in my old stainless fermenter as my kegmenters were occupied at the time.

I also only brewed 23 ltr batch first to try it , next time I'll go a double into the kegmenter .

Was brewed at 20 degrees for 7 days then 3 days at 23 to finish out plus dry hop. I then biofine , and cc to 0 for 8 days then siphoned into corney and mini keg been carefull not to suck up any crap.
Did yesterday morning, then onto the gas at 38 psi for 24 hrs. Then leave for 6, poured sarvo.
Happy days....


----------



## Coldspace

Can taste the carbonic bite abit from the force carb compared to my pressure ferment brews. Deff can tell a diff in force carb and natural carb now I'm so used to natural carb. Haven't done a force carb beer in ages, so it will improve over the coming weeks .
Will be keen to do some kegmenter brews next up with this yeast.


----------



## Korev

Coldspace said:


> Hey mate,
> This brew was done in my old stainless fermenter as my kegmenters were occupied at the time.
> 
> I also only brewed 23 ltr batch first to try it , next time I'll go a double into the kegmenter .
> 
> Was brewed at 20 degrees for 7 days then 3 days at 23 to finish out plus dry hop. I then biofine , and cc to 0 for 8 days then siphoned into corney and mini keg been carefull not to suck up any crap.
> Did yesterday morning, then onto the gas at 38 psi for 24 hrs. Then leave for 6, poured sarvo.
> Happy days....



FYI I have seen no evidence of dry hopping PA in 20th century Australian brewing records so far.
Peter


----------



## Coldspace

Korev said:


> FYI I have seen no evidence of dry hopping PA in 20th century Australian brewing records so far.
> Peter


Ok cool, it was my f up, as I just followed bribies posted receipe and it states 20 grms d hop into the pitching, but I was doing another brew at the same time and forgot, so just chucked it in at the end of ferment .
Will get it right next time, still happy with the result,
Can't wait for your next book to arrive, will keep me busy for ages your books 

Got some original early 1900 tooths and reschs tallies from a collector I'm gunna fill up with a receipe from your book and drink from them as a tribute.
#lovethisbrewingstuff


----------



## Korev

Coldspace said:


> Ok cool, it was my f up, as I just followed bribies posted receipe and it states 20 grms d hop into the pitching, but I was doing another brew at the same time and forgot, so just chucked it in at the end of ferment .
> Will get it right next time, still happy with the result,
> Can't wait for your next book to arrive, will keep me busy for ages your books
> 
> Got some original early 1900 tooths and reschs tallies from a collector I'm gunna fill up with a receipe from your book and drink from them as a tribute.
> #lovethisbrewingstuff



Well, the 1904 Tooth's Imperial Ale would seem a good candidate for those tallies.
P


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

Korev said:


> My new book is now available from Lulu.
> Check their homepage for discount coupons.
> http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/prsymons
> 
> Cheers
> Peter



I’m 3/4 of the way through Bronzed Brews and loving it!! Excited you’ve done an extension/amplification! Coopers history is exciting I had wondered why they got no mention in BB. Buying 6 O’Clock now! Look forward to a potential wlp059 feat next year at ANHC. Great work [emoji481]


----------



## Bribie G

Korev said:


> FYI I have seen no evidence of dry hopping PA in 20th century Australian brewing records so far.
> Peter


Peter, 1913 Tooheys Standard Pale Ale recipe page 276 specifies dry hopping. Then on p 278 "Worcester hops for dry hopping" 
Was this specific to Pale Ales as opposed to XXXs etc?

I'm old enough to remember some of the last XXXs over the bar back in the 70s - for example Tooths and they were fairly bitter but didn't display much hop aroma. I was fresh out of pom land, CAMRA member and home brewer even back then so I approached all these new Aussie beers with what would nowadays be a BJCP type mindset


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL

Oh also for those ordering from LuLu, use coupon codes LULU20 for 20% discount and then SHIPITNOW2017 for free shipping. Mine was USD$15 delivered, yay!


----------



## TheWiggman

For those it may concern, I knocked up another Toohey's Old recipe using the Brewman's Brewbuilder recipe with WLP059.
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/attachments/tooheys-old-jpg.84137/
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/attachments/tooheys-old-jpg.84137/

I added the [liberal quantity of] dextrose at about day 4 and allowed it to ferment out over 2 weeks at 18°C, bumping it up later. It finished at 1.004: perfect. It's been in the keg about a fortnight and I got stuck into some on the weekend. As chance would have it, I very much enjoyed a schooner of Old after a round of 18 in Bermagui last week so my taste of it is pretty fresh.
Much lighter in colour, like an amber but browner. Remarkably clear, no finings in sight. It doesn't have the same degree of chocolate/roast that the real example does and probably tastes 'younger', but apart from that is a very similar beer. Even though they use a proprietary malt perhaps a bit more roast wouldn't go astray, else I'd wager Old has brewer's caramel added. The main difference however is the quaffability of my brew - it was incredibly easy to line up one after the other and about halfway through the first schooner my tastebuds hit neutrality and I don't think I wouldn't have been able to pick it apart from the real deal. The yeast works very well in this beer and certainly matches the style. One thing the mega brewers are able to do with their beer is make them so that after you'd had 8 Draughts/VBs/News (we've all been there) you're still heading back to the bar for another. It's a challenge on the home brewing scale to make beers that allow this - especially for non-HB drinkers - but I've managed to nail it on this brew. I reckon the yeast has done a lot to allow this as it did a great job chewing away 750g of dextrose with effectively no aftertaste. I'd use it again in this beer for sure, and of course every time I brew a Toohey's Old I wonder why I don't brew it more often.
I've still got another sample in the fridge, I'm thinking I might do the Bronzed Brews version of Old and see how it compares.


----------



## Bribie G

I'd bet that Toohey's Ale yeast is a descendant or great great nephew or something of the old Melbourne No. 1.


----------



## technobabble66

Hey @TheWiggman (or others), have you done a 059 beer where you added the dex/sugarz in during the boil?
I'm curious as to whether there is any detectable difference between the 2 options of when to add sugar.

I suspect, for Belgian yeasts at least, that adding during the boil can enhance the subtle flavour contributions from the yeast with relation to sugar - i think it might give a little more caramel/bubblegum(?) for my tastebuds, but might make the yeast struggle to attenuate fully. Whereas adding towards the end of the fermentation allows the yeast to attenuate more easily, but reduces those flavour contributions from the yeast acting on the sugars.
So i'm curious as to whether there might be a similar thing happening with the remarkable 059?
(... or with the Belgians, for that matter - maybe it's all just my imagination!)


----------



## Randai

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Oh also for those ordering from LuLu, use coupon codes LULU20 for 20% discount and then SHIPITNOW2017 for free shipping. Mine was USD$15 delivered, yay!


God dammit, oh well I only got the free shipping.


----------



## Bribie G

Bulk buy?


----------



## technobabble66

Any word on what 059 does to hoppy beers, compared to, say, US-05/M44/M42/1272/051?
I need to do a hoppy IPA/DIPA for Xmas, and wondering if this would be good for it; or if I should shelve the 059 and get a more appropriate yeast going.


----------



## Korev

Bribie G said:


> Peter, 1913 Tooheys Standard Pale Ale recipe page 276 specifies dry hopping. Then on p 278 "Worcester hops for dry hopping"
> Was this specific to Pale Ales as opposed to XXXs etc?
> 
> I'm old enough to remember some of the last XXXs over the bar back in the 70s - for example Tooths and they were fairly bitter but didn't display much hop aroma. I was fresh out of pom land, CAMRA member and home brewer even back then so I approached all these new Aussie beers with what would nowadays be a BJCP type mindset



Hoist on my own petard - well sort of - the dangers of making sweeping statements!!

I went back over my notes (from 2013) for the Tooheys 1913 PA and I have extrapolated backwards from a July 1925 Brewing Materials book - which is where they accounted for DH. By that time the Bottling Bitter had been re-named Flag Ale and used an ale yeast from Ordinary, not a lager yeast. Flag Ale was not brewed very often and stopped production in April 1926.

The record had a notation that 180 lb dry hops were used in a 181.5 hhd - finished beer batch. This is where my 1913 assumption about DH in the Tooheys recipe has come from for this beer. This may or may not be correct. I have not found any DH references for PA in the Tooths records that I have seen - and I have seen quite a few!

The other beers in the pre WW2 period that were DH - were Stag Stout, Flag Stout and Oatmeal Stout. No DH used in Ordinary (Old/ XXX). 

The ABJ "cribbed" a lot of content from the UK, the reference on p278 comes from The "English Brewers Journal" and was UK practice. 

P


----------



## Korev

technobabble66 said:


> Any word on what 059 does to hoppy beers, compared to, say, US-05/M44/M42/1272/051?
> I need to do a hoppy IPA/DIPA for Xmas, and wondering if this would be good for it; or if I should shelve the 059 and get a more appropriate yeast going.



Well I have just kegged a 1917 Crystal Ale and during the early part of the ferment ~ 18C the fridge smelt fruity then after 2 days I ramped up to 23C to ferment out - sampling from the fermenter it has come out hoppy and very dry ( probs the 22% sugar)
P


----------



## Batz

Korev said:


> Well I have just kegged a 1917 Crystal Ale and during the early part of the ferment ~ 18C the fridge smelt fruity then after 2 days I ramped up to 23C to ferment out - sampling from the fermenter it has come out hoppy and very dry ( probs the 22% sugar)
> P




I have kegged mine a few days ago as well, very easy drinking ale.

Tooths 1917 Crystal Ale.

_'A light refreshing summer ale'_ 

I have to agree with this.


----------



## Korev

Batz said:


> I have kegged mine a few days ago as well, very easy drinking ale.
> 
> Tooths 1917 Crystal Ale.
> 
> _'A light refreshing summer ale'_
> 
> I have to agree with this.View attachment 109786




Did yours use Chevallier Malt?
P


----------



## Batz

Korev said:


> Did yours use Chevallier Malt?
> P



No, T.F. floor malted pale was the best I could do this time around. Chevallier is not that common around my parts.

Batz


----------



## Korev

Batz said:


> No, T.F. floor malted pale was the best I could do this time around. Chevallier is not that common around my parts.
> 
> Batz



It took me a while to convince The Brew Shop to get the Chevallier from Crisp in the UK. Now I am working through my favourite old recipes to see if it and 059 makes a difference from my previous tasting notes. Just brewed a 1931 WH Pale Ale today again with 059 
P

P


----------



## pirateagenda

i brewed a slightly altered version of the 1917 Tooth's xxx due to not being able to get all of the ingredients as per the book. 
7 days into the pressure ferment and it's still going at 1.012. The flavour is awesome. Tastes like "Beer" and reminds me of that flavour you get off the froth off dad's beer as a kid.


----------



## TheWiggman

technobabble66 said:


> Hey @TheWiggman (or others), have you done a 059 beer where you added the dex/sugarz in during the boil?
> I'm curious as to whether there is any detectable difference between the 2 options of when to add sugar.



I'm not sure of the mechanisms of simple sugars in the boil, the analogy which I'm sure you've heard is that the simple stuff will be consumed early and condition the yeast to not fully ferment other more complex sugar chains. Anecdotally I've had better results adding sugar late in the ferment than in the boil. In the case of my Toohey's Old I changed 3 things - JW to BB, sugar in the boil then mid-ferment, and the yeast. So I can't really give a fair comparison.


----------



## Korev

TheWiggman said:


> I'm not sure of the mechanisms of simple sugars in the boil, the analogy which I'm sure you've heard is that the simple stuff will be consumed early and condition the yeast to not fully ferment other more complex sugar chains. Anecdotally I've had better results adding sugar late in the ferment than in the boil. In the case of my Toohey's Old I changed 3 things - JW to BB, sugar in the boil then mid-ferment, and the yeast. So I can't really give a fair comparison.



I add sugar to the boil and 059 seems happy 24 hours in 




P


----------



## technobabble66

^^ yeah, that's essentially what I was referring to. I understand the theory of it being better for the yeasties to hit full attenuation, however 2 things with this:
1) it occurs to me the majority of flavour contribution from yeast occurs in the first 1/3rd of the fermentation, so anything flavour wise that simple sugars affect (aside from their innate caramel flavours, etc) would be missed;
2) this particular yeast seems totally fine ho-ing thru a fat bagful of sugarz and still getting thru the maltose later on. At least that seems to be the case. So I'm wondering if it makes any improvement adding the sugarz later in the fermentation, or if it works just as well if the sugarz at there at the start.


----------



## Midnight Brew

That is some beautiful Krausen you have going there P. I'll spin this yeast up in a few weeks soon as I have drained some kegs.


----------



## Batz

Midnight Brew said:


> That is some beautiful Krausen you have going there P. I'll spin this yeast up in a few weeks soon as I have drained some kegs.



Amazing yeast, the only one I have ever had that has crawled out the top of the erlenmeyer flask.


----------



## Curly79

Korev said:


> I add sugar to the boil and 059 seems happy 24 hours in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P


That looks amazing! Never seen a Krausen like that before.


----------



## Bribie G

Curly79 said:


> That looks amazing! Never seen a Krausen like that before.


And I've found that at the end of fermentation it rises to the top of the brew and forms a solid raft of peanut butter.
It has to be son of son of son of Burton Union or whatever came over in barrels and bottles from the Old Dart earlier in the 19th Century.


----------



## technobabble66

My Rezza Bitter. 
I must admit, I'm pretty impressed. Only 10 days in the bottle, so a little more to go carbonation wise. 
Aroma is "beery" but with a light floral candy element - funnily enough an element I've been (unsuccessfully) trying to create in my Old Speckled Hen clone. Flavour similar, initial sweetness that fades rapidly to a mild dry finish. 
No twang. 
******* tasty. 





Goes really well with curry puffs and the Women's T20 international. 

44% Ale, 40% Pils, 1% Choc, 11% white sugar, 1% dark brown sugar. 
15g PoR + 5g EKG @FWH 
5g PoR + 10g EKG @ 20mins (cubed)
059 @19-20*C

Definitely shouldn't have entered this into the Vic Xmas Case Swap


EDIT: fwiw, I think the main contributor to the floral Candi/nectar element is the late EKG addition. Though i suspect the 059 has helped bring it out nicely, given its only 10g. 
However, I could be wrong - maybe it's all yeast derived. In which case I'll definitely be brewing a lot more with 059! [emoji1]


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Mine wont clear . Questioning as to why. Maybe the flaked maize? Anyway it doesn't matter because its good. An interesting unique beer for me. My first attempt in this league. I followed the recipe as best as can but got higher efficiency and these are the variables.
Tooths 1917 White Horse Ale.
Anticipated OG = 1.048. Mine was 1.051
Anticipated FG = 1.008. Mine was 1.007
Anticipated EBC = 18. Mine is ~9 by my eye
Anticipated IBU = 42. Mine feels to me more like um 30? Did the age degradation on hop AA calcs and everything....
Anticipated ABV ~5.2%. Mine 5.8%.

I did cube this though and that's the significant variable to be fair. I added the sugar to the cubes before filling 95c wort. I took 15 minutes off the hop times.

In the end? Well I think its so different and interesting that Its a ripper really. Tangy and refreshing, sessionable but watch out its 5.8% etc. Cidery but in a good way. I've shunned the idea of cidery beer but make an exception for this one. New flavours to me the yeast, flaked corn and sugar. No hoppyness. Its not dry at all. More sweat and with body believe it or not. I froze some yeast for the first time but hope to see it as a regular go to yeast option.

Good yeast.


----------



## pirateagenda

mine has stalled at 1.011, est 1.008. Has been at 1.011 for 2 days (day 8 to 10) at 22C. should I wait it out or is it terminal? It tastes bloody good either way.

recipe had 19% sugar, which I added during the boil, but have read here that some are adding it to the fermenter.


----------



## Stubbie

Just a heads up: anyone seeking to purchase Bronzed Brews or 6 O'clock Brews, Lulu is currently offering a 10% discount + free shipping. Use coupon code BOOKSHIP17. Ends 20 Nov.

Now, to get hold of some WLP059...


----------



## madpierre06

Anybody round this way got some 059 they can spare?


----------



## Batz

madpierre06 said:


> Anybody round this way got some 059 they can spare?



Is this yeast going to be released again or was that just a one off?
I have a few vials of it here mate.

Batz


----------



## madpierre06

Batz said:


> Is this yeast going to be released again or was that just a one off?
> I have a few vials of it here mate.
> 
> Batz



It was a seasonal mate, one vial would be really appreciated thanks.


----------



## laxation

pirateagenda said:


> mine has stalled at 1.011, est 1.008. Has been at 1.011 for 2 days (day 8 to 10) at 22C. should I wait it out or is it terminal? It tastes bloody good either way.
> 
> recipe had 19% sugar, which I added during the boil, but have read here that some are adding it to the fermenter.


Same as what mine got to.

Unfortunately while I was away, the sticky tape came off the light in my fermenting fridge (it's always on due to some shelves being out) so the light has been on while it was fermenting. Tastes/smells a bit funny, but hoping it turns good once it's cold and carbonated.

If it is ready by Friday, I will try to bring some (with a carb cap) to the case swap to see what others think... Not sure if it's just that it is a different beer, or if there is something wrong with it.

In the meantime that fkn light is unscrewed. Really should have done that as the first option...


----------



## Batz

madpierre06 said:


> It was a seasonal mate, one vial would be really appreciated thanks.




No problem mate, sent you a PM. I'm away ATM.


----------



## pirateagenda

i harvested an extra 100m cells to what was required, planning to build a little farm of this so I don't run out


----------



## BrockHops

What have you Beer Smith guys done when building a brew with this yeast?
I couldn't find it in the listing.
Using it in an all grain English Porter


----------



## captain crumpet

BrockHops said:


> What have you Beer Smith guys done when building a brew with this yeast?
> I couldn't find it in the listing.
> Using it in an all grain English Porter



Created a new yeast profile with the bare essentials from here https://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-bank/wlp059-melbourne-ale-yeast


----------



## Bribie G

Based on a couple of brews I've done so far and measured with hydrometer for FG, I've set attenuation to 83.0 in BrewMate.

QLD case swap next weekend, a couple of us are putting in Bronzed Brews with 059 if anyone wants to reculture. However you'll need a stir plate as theres SFA bottle sediment with this stuff.


----------



## Randai

Bribie G said:


> Based on a couple of brews I've done so far and measured with hydrometer for FG, I've set attenuation to 83.0 in BrewMate.
> 
> QLD case swap next weekend, a couple of us are putting in Bronzed Brews with 059 if anyone wants to reculture. However you'll need a stir plate as theres SFA bottle sediment with this stuff.


Can echo sentiment after just finishing the bottling of this stuff. It really dropped out. I hope there is enough to bottle condition this in a decent time.
Guess I'll see.


----------



## madpierre06

Randai said:


> Can echo sentiment after just finishing the bottling of this stuff. It really dropped out. I hope there is enough to bottle condition this in a decent time.
> Guess I'll see.



Yeah, after having tried a drop of the 1917 XXX a bloke did, real keen to try these two beers you blokes have got. A lovely drop.


----------



## Randai

madpierre06 said:


> Yeah, after having tried a drop of the 1917 XXX a bloke did, real keen to try these two beers you blokes have got. A lovely drop.


Yeah it tasted alright today with the left overs that didn't go into the 30 bottles. Can't wait to see after its conditioned a bit.


----------



## Carboy

I was just given a vial from a good mate. Of those who have brewed with this yeast what is the recommendation for the best style of beer to brew, I'd like to brew something that complements these yeast and does it justice 

Thank you in advance for any advice.

Cheers
Carboy


----------



## Bribie G

An old school XXX Aussie Ale from the post war era would be the go.. six o'clock swill at the Exchange / Tatts / Royal / Station Hotel where Grand Pops drank when he was an apprentice loco driver and all that stuff.

4.5% ABV

Sulphates in water
Australian Base Malt 69 degree mash.
800g of sugar
Cluster single addition to 20 IBU
(or POR for a more modern example)

Ferment at 18, cold crash for a week.
Add a tsp of Parisian Essence for a bit of colour if you wish. 

Learn how to do two up.


----------



## Batz

Carboy said:


> I was just given a vial from a good mate. Of those who have brewed with this yeast what is the recommendation for the best style of beer to brew, I'd like to brew something that complements these yeast and does it justice
> 
> Thank you in advance for any advice.
> 
> Cheers
> Carboy



Here's a good start. I did one very similar with great results.

https://www.whitelabs.com/resources/1917-tooth-s-pale-ale-recipe-wlp059-melbourne-ale-yeast


----------



## Danscraftbeer

Just giving this yeast another thumbs up. I used it for an all grain Hoppy Ale. This yeast does have a tang. Its a complimentary tang IMO. Very happy with this green beer so far it should be great by crissy!.
40lt. 83% Brew House Efficiency. Esky Mash.
MO 90%
Wheat 8.4%
Acidulated 1.7%
Mashed for high body. 62c 20min, Decoctions to 69c over 40min let sit for another um? 60 minutes or something... 
Batch Sparged. Long boil with small first wort addition: 10g Mosaic hops = 7.4 IBU. Adding batch sparges reboiling etc.
60g Chinook flowers 15m
40g Mosaic pellets at flame out ~20m
Chill to 70c
300g Cascade flowers. Deep whirl break up the flowers to mix it all up well and let sit for 30m at ~70c. 
Chill down to pitch temp and pitch that good yeast and pressure ferment ~5-15psi at ~18c to finish at ~24psi at ~ 21c.

and then ....


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## Danscraftbeer

OG = 1.054
FG = 1.014 (that is highest for me for pale ale but its good and may be more pleasing for regular people etc)
IBU = ~33.3 by my software and interpretations
EBC = ~ 10
ABV = 5.3%
Carbonation is around 2.0 at least in pressure ferment. I'd give it 2.2 as a green beer. Kegged at serving pressure (10-12 psi) is the polish over weeks etc.

Serve cold as beer should be in summer. ~4c. Or less if you can.


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## Danscraftbeer

Melbourne Yeast? Locality? This is something of significance. A yeast that is favourable to the locality, maybe? That's the way of beer evolution through the history yes? Yeast evolution etc.
I you are to be of BJCP evolution then this definitely has significance. At least on the evolution of beer.


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## captain crumpet

AusIPA with WLP059. It's bloody good.


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## Bribie G

The provenance for Melbourne No. 1 is described in Bronzed Brews. Whilst I've also used it in an all grain brew, it does very nicely fermenting a high sucrose wort which is what it was bred to do. It could ferment up to 50% cane sugar without "weakening" and be repitched and became a common strain throughout at least Eastern Australia.

I'd bet my boots that some of the current Megabrewery Ale yeasts such as Tooheys Old are still cousins, nephews etc in this yeast family. Would love to get my hands on some.


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## Stubbie

Anyone in Melb consider donating a WLP059 yeast sample, frozen or other wise? Happy to repay a generous favour with a good deed in return.


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## tonz_a_fun

Stubbie said:


> Anyone in Melb consider donating a WLP059 yeast sample, frozen or other wise? Happy to repay a generous favour with a good deed in return.


Hi mate,

I have one unopened vial if you are interested. In south east.

Cheers

Damo


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## TidalPete

TidalPete said:


> View attachment 108903
> 
> 
> 
> Added Biofine to the keg (10 g) & here's a pic of the first pint after dumping the sludge from my 1894 Macclesfield XXXK Pale Ale Clone (P.269). It's much clearer ATM thanks to the extra week or so since the pic was taken but can't be arsed doing another pic at present.
> Must agree with Bribie about the cat piss reminiscent to VB, XXXX, etc.
> Quite tasty though IMHO!



Still a bit of my 1894 Macclesfield XXXK Pale Ale Wannabe left in the keg. Dropped nice & clear a week after the above post.
This yeast is an excellent choice for chewing up sugaz. Multiple thanks to Peter, London Yeast Bank & White Labs.ITO. 
Doing another recipe from Bronzed Brews early in the New Year.


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## captain crumpet

Anyone else noticed the lack of head on their brews with WLP059? It even lacked on an all malt brew.


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## RdeVjun

CC, maybe wait for it to carbonate?  /Only joking.


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## Bribie G

When I arrived in Australia in the 70s beer was served right up to the top of the glass with a slight slick of foam if that. Ripoff heads seemed to come in in the 90s.
Maybe a result of new big pubs with the beer pushed with nitro.


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## DJ_L3ThAL

captain crumpet said:


> Anyone else noticed the lack of head on their brews with WLP059? It even lacked on an all malt brew.



Absolutely not. Mine is a certified cappuccino on the first pour every time. Was only 5% sugaz too.


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## Batz

Bribie G said:


> When I arrived in Australia in the 70s beer was served right up to the top of the glass with a slight slick of foam if that. Ripoff heads seemed to come in in the 90s.
> Maybe a result of new big pubs with the beer pushed with nitro.



True Bribie, too much head and not enough beer in the glass....barman going to be told.


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## Coldspace

Only one brew down with sugar and no head probs


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## Danscraftbeer

captain crumpet said:


> Anyone else noticed the lack of head on their brews with WLP059? It even lacked on an all malt brew.


Not on mine. Its a good frothy like any all malt beers I've made and mine had ~20% Raw Sugar and ~9% Flaked maize. Finished at 1.007.
Excellent head and retention too. Mine took a month cold chilling to finally clear though, it was a hazy beer for 3 weeks on tap.
I've now got a hop bomb all malt brew with the wlp059 and good head and retention on that too although it did finish at 1.013.


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## Korev

captain crumpet said:


> Anyone else noticed the lack of head on their brews with WLP059? It even lacked on an all malt brew.



Not on the Crystal Ale and White Horse PA that I have done so far both with a fair amount of sugar .
P


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## technobabble66

Hey, fwiw, there were 3 beers in the Vic Xmas Case Swap this year that used 059 and semi-typical Aussie Bitter with 5-15%(?) sugar. So trawling through that might give a little extra insight into what 059 has done with a few of our beers.

Some of the relevant posts:
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/vic-2017-xmas-case-swap-tasting-thread.97180/#post-1490497
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-2#post-1490687
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-2#post-1490741
(and the next several posts)
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-2#post-1491094
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-3#post-1492021
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-3#post-1492175 (and the next few posts after it)
https://aussiehomebrewer.com/thread...swap-tasting-thread.97180/page-4#post-1492384

(and the recipe for mine is in post#81)


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## contrarian

Just kegged my version of a 1917 xxx ale and carbed a bottle up using a carbonation cap. Very dry and clean for the amount of sugar in the grist and very easy drinking. I think this will make a great lawnmower beer for summer


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## Danscraftbeer

Brewed a second version of this brew. 1st time despite a 69c mash it finished low gravity 1.007 and ended up as 5.8%. I wanted the second version closer to 5% so I backed off the sugar and base malt a bit and made sure mash was at no lower than 69c.


Danscraftbeer said:


> Tooths 1917 White Horse Ale.
> Anticipated OG = 1.048. Mine was 1.051
> Anticipated FG = 1.008. Mine was 1.007
> Anticipated EBC = 18. Mine is ~9 by my eye
> Anticipated IBU = 42. Mine feels to me more like um 30? Did the age degradation on hop AA calcs and everything....
> Anticipated ABV ~5.2%. Mine 5.8%.
> 
> .



So less sugar, a tad less malt. Ridiculous efficiency that rattles the brain of Beersmith it calculates at over 100%.  (adding the sugar to the cubes rather than the boil seems to get this result)

Targets OG 1.047 at 88% BHE, result 1.050.
Target FG 1.009.
2nd time result! Gravity finished at 1.002!!! so now the target of ~5% ABV its a 6.3% ABV beer darn it!!! Bugger!  Good beer though. Yeah its dry in the mouth but still manages to taste sweet at the same time.
I pitched onto the yeast cake this time I definitely wont do that again. Strictly good yeast count calculation necessary for this yeast.


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## Korev

Danscraftbeer said:


> Brewed a second version of this brew. 1st time despite a 69c mash it finished low gravity 1.007 and ended up as 5.8%. I wanted the second version closer to 5% so I backed off the sugar and base malt a bit and made sure mash was at no lower than 69c.
> 
> 
> So less sugar, a tad less malt. Ridiculous efficiency that rattles the brain of Beersmith it calculates at over 100%.  (adding the sugar to the cubes rather than the boil seems to get this result)
> 
> Targets OG 1.047 at 88% BHE, result 1.050.
> Target FG 1.009.
> 2nd time result! Gravity finished at 1.002!!! so now the target of ~5% ABV its a 6.3% ABV beer darn it!!! Bugger!  Good beer though. Yeah its dry in the mouth but still manages to taste sweet at the same time.
> I pitched onto the yeast cake this time I definitely wont do that again. Strictly good yeast count calculation necessary for this yeast.



I did a quick calc using Promash (yes I know) based on a 23l batch outturn of 1.032 with no sugar adding 0.94kg of sugar post boil, assumed 18l, results in 1.052. My recipe was based on adding the sugar to the boil. So adding the sugar to the boil or reducing the amount of sugar post boil would seem to be the go.
Using Mr Maltys calculator might be handy http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

Cheers
P


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## Bribie G

Having uses sugar in a lot of brews, for example heritage UK ales and not just bronzed brews, I've often wondered about when sugar should be added. 

In the case of UK usage, adding to the kettle - especially where direct fired kettles were used - would result in some caramelisation from "scorching" from the surface of the kettle. 
However adding to the kettle results in the eventual trub being sweet trub, and in the case of a large brewery would involve chucking away large amounts of cane sugar in the long run and no doubt the brewery accountants would have a bit to say. 

With Australian beers, including modern examples which use as much sugar as ever, is this added to the kettle or to the FV?


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## Korev

Bribie G said:


> Having uses sugar in a lot of brews, for example heritage UK ales and not just bronzed brews, I've often wondered about when sugar should be added.
> 
> In the case of UK usage, adding to the kettle - especially where direct fired kettles were used - would result in some caramelisation from "scorching" from the surface of the kettle.
> However adding to the kettle results in the eventual trub being sweet trub, and in the case of a large brewery would involve chucking away large amounts of cane sugar in the long run and no doubt the brewery accountants would have a bit to say.
> 
> With Australian beers, including modern examples which use as much sugar as ever, is this added to the kettle or to the FV?



Most of the large Australian breweries from the 1870s onwards were using steam coils in the kettle so sugar would not be so likely to burn. There are some accounts of liquidising sugar before addition to the kettle. By the 1950s liquid sugar was being supplied by CSR which may or may not have been partially or fully inverted. I have not come across any descriptions of sugar additions to the FV other than priming sugar prior to racking.

As an aside Houghton said that cane sugar in wort has to be first inverted by the yeast in the FV then the yeast can ferment. The upshot was that pitching rates should be increased to 4 lb/brl. for a 20 lb. beer. Brewing and Malting in Australasia 1906ish

As to the comment about sugar and wort being retained in the trub. Many UK records that I have detail the addition of hop sparge as part of the blend particularly where parti-gyling was used. This in conjunction with using a hop back would have recovered wort retained in the hops including sugary additions. Alternatively, hop sparge could be used to mash in the next brew so no extract would be lost.

Cheers
P


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## Danscraftbeer

Wow. Tasting that last screw up beer posted above after a day chilling and this is Cider Beer. In a good way. I think its even better than my first attempt only it is a screw up. Meant to be 5% turned out 6.3% of FG=1.002. Though it doesn't taste dry, its sweet! Whats with that I don't know.
Truly interesting character and potential of this yeast. I'll have to try this for Apple Cider too.
Wow the smell and taste reminds me of something, its like fruit punch in a way, kind of spirit cocktail I just cant describe it atm.


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## pirateagenda

Noticed yesterday on white labs site.... only 134 more orders needed before they'll ship another run.


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## Danscraftbeer

pirateagenda said:


> Noticed yesterday on white labs site.... only 134 more orders needed before they'll ship another run.


Is there a list to add yourself to with that count? I have frozen some and also harvested to third gen now but nothing beats the yeast from the Lab.


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## Bribie G

I'll order some more. 

Peter...skitch'em.....


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## laxation

Danscraftbeer said:


> Is there a list to add yourself to with that count? I have frozen some and also harvested to third gen now but nothing beats the yeast from the Lab.


https://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-vault
you do it here, but dunno if they ship to Aus. Might need to organise something through one of the brew shops?


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## pirateagenda

Danscraftbeer said:


> Is there a list to add yourself to with that count? I have frozen some and also harvested to third gen now but nothing beats the yeast from the Lab.



yep i just harvested up 500B cells worth of 3rd gen (starters only not full ferments) also.


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## Danscraftbeer

pirateagenda said:


> yep i just harvested up 500B cells worth of 3rd gen (starters only not full ferments) also.


I also think this yeast is a good recycler. From a 30% sugar Bronze Brew. To an all grain hop bombed all grain. Then back to a 30% Bronze Brew. All very clean with a unique flavor character in the background. Extremely hard to detect really because whatever your grist and hops they come through clean. A slight favourable tang is the most technical description I can give.


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## technobabble66

^^ similar for mine. 
I've now done 2 sugar beers/bitters, 2 AG hoppy APAs and finishing up an AG stout, all on 059. 
All seem to have come through with the malt & hops elements fairly prominent, maybe with a slight/subtle character from the yeast. I need to brew similar recipes against something like US05 for a proper comparison, but at face value seems kinda similar to how M42 finished a few beers earlier in the year. 

And it's a beast. I had to drop the stout down to 15-16*C to calm it down after it blew through the glad wrap of the FV 4 times, the 4th while at 17*C. Chewed down from 1.070 to 1.016, the latter half was at 15-6*C, and was down to 1.020 within the first 4-5days, then has taken another several days to take off the last few points (at 21-22*C). However, obviously the low temps probably weren't helping the finish. 

Very happy with this yeast. It happily chews through anything and everything. Great top cropper. Operates well ("cleanly") over a reasonable range of temperature. 
Drops like a stone after fermentation, well at least 99% of it does. 
Attenuates (mainly) fast. 
The only downside is the last 4-5 points take as long as the rest of the attenuation (~4-6 days). However, I prefer to condition a bit in the FV after the main fermentation anyway so it's not really taking any longer overall; and I'd wonder if a slightly active final bit of fermentation during my "conditioning" phase might help the conditioning anyway.


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## technobabble66

NB: that stout was on 4th generation yeast cake, so I'd assume a massive pitch rate would have a lot to do with why it happily chewed through it at 16*C.


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## Danscraftbeer

technobabble66 said:


> Chewed down from 1.070 to 1.016, the latter half was at 15-6*C, and was down to 1.020 within the first 4-5days, then has taken another several days to take off the last few points (at 21-22*C).
> The only downside is the last 4-5 points take as long as the rest of the attenuation (~4-6 days). However, I prefer to condition a bit in the FV after the main fermentation anyway so it's not really taking any longer overall; and I'd wonder if a slightly active final bit of fermentation during my "conditioning" phase might help the conditioning anyway.


I've found it just like that. At (close to) correct pitch rate its like a low rev steady brew all the way through to the end. Rather than hit FG in 3-4 days it gets there in 7 but I leave it in primary for 10 days standard on any brew so its no disadvantage.
When I pitched onto a yeast cake being very over pitched it did exactly how you described. 3 days to ~80% attenuation then another 4 days to get the last 20%. But to be noted that's when I got a very low FG = 1.002. First time on the recipe I got 1.007 so It seems to appear that over pitching this yeast with sugars and maize will get higher attenuation. I've pitched AG's onto other yeast cakes before but the over pitch never seemed to change the attenuation %.


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## Korev

Danscraftbeer said:


> I've found it just like that. At (close to) correct pitch rate its like a low rev steady brew all the way through to the end. Rather than hit FG in 3-4 days it gets there in 7 but I leave it in primary for 10 days standard on any brew so its no disadvantage.
> When I pitched onto a yeast cake being very over pitched it did exactly how you described. 3 days to ~80% attenuation then another 4 days to get the last 20%. But to be noted that's when I got a very low FG = 1.002. First time on the recipe I got 1.007 so It seems to appear that over pitching this yeast with sugars and maize will get higher attenuation. I've pitched AG's onto other yeast cakes before but the over pitch never seemed to change the attenuation %.



That is interesting, as Kaiserben contacted me and his beer using 059 attenuated to 1.003 from memory and he followed the recipe parameters. Perhaps being careful not to over pitch is one of the keys to using this yeast.
I am now on my 4th repitch and I am really happy with the results. They are currently working on a 1913 Coopers Sparkling

Cheers
P


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## Mat B

I brewed the 1917 Tooths Ale from the link on White Labs website on Sat. Smelled awesome when it was transferred to the fermenter. Pitched yeast on Monday and checked this morning to find the brew fridge is now sitting at 23C (it's set to 19.5C) and the beer is bubbling like mad. It's only a little unit and I suspect it's struggling with the hot Melbourne weather. Hopefully this yeast doesn't throw off any crazy flavours as a result.


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## HoppyDays

Should be no problems you can always throw some ice tubs In near fan to cool or cold wet towels to cool wort down .

HOPPY DAYS


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## Mat B

HoppyDays said:


> Should be no problems you can always throw some ice tubs In near fan to cool or cold wet towels to cool wort down .
> 
> HOPPY DAYS


Thanks mate, yeah I've been putting frozen bottles of water in to help keep the temp down.


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## kaiserben

Korev said:


> That is interesting, as Kaiserben contacted me and his beer using 059 attenuated to 1.003 from memory and he followed the recipe parameters. Perhaps being careful not to over pitch is one of the keys to using this yeast.



For reference I pitched (roughly) 230bn cells.


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## Mat B

Finally drinking my crack at the 1917 Tooths Whitehorse that I brewed recently with the 059. It's pretty good! There's a lot of flavour that I think is yeast driven. It's tricky to find where the hops flavour ends and the yeast begins (or vice versa). Like I mentioned in an earlier post; this one got away on me with temps during the heat wave and was fermenting around 23C. No noticeable unpleasant flavours.


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## pirateagenda

i brewed up a 5.3% maris otter single malt ale using with a bit of super pride for bittering and home grown victoria hops in the whirlpool. decent drop!

have now pitched an IPA on the yeast cake and it's gone banana's.... from 1.058 down to 1.003 in 5 days and still seems to have some activity going on. I was planning on it finishing arouns 1.006 so my high 6% IPA has now turned into mid 7's. hopefully its not too dry


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## Danscraftbeer

1.003 ha! Its notorious like that sometimes. Got me at 1.002 when it was meant to be 1.008.
Its finished unexpectedly high G for me once too. An all malt with high mash temps. Maybe the best Hop bomb beer I've ever made. 
Its attenuation is unrecognized on record etc. Its one I wish I could learn more on the brewing experiments. 
I have 2 frozen vials but you cant beat it from the Lab.


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## pirateagenda

I capped the fermenter at 1.003 and it rose to 15psi in about 8 hours. So I reckon it's going to finish even lower.

Hopefully it tastes ok, or I might have to back sweeten it.


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## Danscraftbeer

Don't mess with it. It is what it is. Take notes of it all especially the unexpected results like its Attenuation.
That's still got me puzzled since it has gone both ways higher and lower but still has a favourable flavor. Its distinct flavor comes out in those dry beers so get to know it. My last brew is still going in the keg. Half gone now.
Tooths 1917 Whitehorse Pale Ale gone wiley in high efficiency and low FG.
Using sugars and flaked maize its efficiency is high and FG low. Still it tastes sweet to me. but hesitant to drink because its higher ABV. Dangerous!


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## pirateagenda

The planned 6 something% ipa turned into a 1.002 fg, 7.3% monster. It was a little hot tasting to start with but has conditioned into a very nice drop. Only a quarter keg left from 3 kegs brewed so thats a good sign. Despite finishing so low it isn't too dry or thin on the mouth at all.


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## stuartf

Gone a bit quiet on this thread so thought I'd bring out the shovel and dig it up. Found a vial of this in the back of my fridge that I'd forgotten about. Nearly a year past it's use by date, made a starter to see if its still viable and its gone off like a frog in a sock! Just pitched it into a sparkling ale so here's hoping i get that nice dryness i had in my earlier beers with this yeast. Love it


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## Mat B

stuartf said:


> Gone a bit quiet on this thread so thought I'd bring out the shovel and dig it up. Found a vial of this in the back of my fridge that I'd forgotten about. Nearly a year past it's use by date, made a starter to see if its still viable and its gone off like a frog in a sock! Just pitched it into a sparkling ale so here's hoping i get that nice dryness i had in my earlier beers with this yeast. Love it


How did it turn out? Thinking about firing up a starter of this myself. Haven't used it since my first attempt which ended up being too high in ABV to be enjoyable. I'll be skipping the sugar next time and just stick to malts. Read some stuff online about American guys using it for APAs etc with success. I might use it for my next APA.


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## pirateagenda

im still using generations of this. 
made a 5.4% old on it..... one of the best beers i've made


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## pirateagenda

https://www.whitelabs.com/yeast-vault

only 125 more orders until it ships again. I reckon if an aussie shop put in an order it would go pretty quickly.


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## professional_drunk

I made the tooths pale ale with this yeast and didn't like it. I then made a coopers like aussie ale and everyone loved it.


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## stuartf

Mat B said:


> How did it turn out? Thinking about firing up a starter of this myself. Haven't used it since my first attempt which ended up being too high in ABV to be enjoyable. I'll be skipping the sugar next time and just stick to malts. Read some stuff online about American guys using it for APAs etc with success. I might use it for my next APA.


Hey yeah went really well, ferment took off quickly and dropped nice and clear as always. I made a sparkling ale which I'm drinking now. Nice dry with a slight bubble gum ester. Took some yeast samples after fermentation to culture back up for bext time. Maybe see how it goes in a big hoppy pale ale next.


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