# **help**



## Birdbeak55 (11/10/17)

Hey guys in short ive been using air hose into a milk bottle full of sodium percarbonateas an air lock. Basicly i was waiting for wort to cool i plugged the airlock on and im guessing the changing temperature created a vacume and drainef im guessing 700ml of water with about a tablespoon of sodium perc disolved has contaminated my 50lt wort. 
It the brew spoiled ? and not worth adding yeast and fermenting ?(which im guessing is the case)
Or can it some way be still used ? 
Any help is greatly apreciated as im gonna water the lawn with it tomorro just thought worth a shout on here.

Cheers Birdbeak


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## mtb (11/10/17)

Don't chuck it. I'm fairly confident it'll be fine - perc breaks down into oxygen, sodium carbonate & water - you may want to bring the batch to a boil though, to a) kill nasties from your blowoff water and b) maybe force the perc to dissolve.

Someone more knowledgeable will weigh in soon, don't feed the lawn just yet


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## manticle (11/10/17)

You won't poison yourself but there's a good chance the flavour will be below average. Sodium is also toxic to yeast in high levels. Was it pure perc? Could taste the wort and see what you reckon or just cut losses and start again.

I reckon the spectre of 'hmm, not sure, maybe, maybe not' would lead me towards the second.


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## Mr B (11/10/17)

Taste it

You have already incurred much of the cost there, so may as well check it out


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## Danscraftbeer (11/10/17)

When in doubt chuck it out. Sorry but that's the harsh rule I trust by and carried from being a pie chef under lots of higher level goals.
Commercial standards, consumables etc. There's reasons for all that science in guidelines etc but then again some chemicals can work beneficial but ~25g Sodium Percarbonate in 50lt i couldnt drink it just knowing its in there but then again I would taste a sample out of curiosity but that means committing to finishing the brew,,,,,,,,,,,knowing yuno.... . Its a kit yeah? $$$ thrown etc. All grain is loads of work to throw away as well but I still would.
Hard lessons sometimes.There's always the next brew!

Bring in the mathematicians here to work out the levels etc..


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## 2cranky (11/10/17)

Next time use starsan in your blow off. 
Maybe don't hook it up until cooled.
Yeah I'm with the taste it crowd but that amount in 50 litres I doubt you will notice. Might as well pitch the yeast and see how it goes.


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## Dae Tripper (11/10/17)

Why did you put perc in there in the first place? 
It is a cleaner not a sanatiser that some say.


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## Birdbeak55 (12/10/17)

Cheers guys think ill just chuck it n start again. Thanks for all the feedback. 
@ dae tripper ive been using sodium perc as a no rince steriliser is this not the done thing ??


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## warra48 (12/10/17)

Sodium Perc is definitely a cleaner, *not* a sanitiser. 
And I also never do not rinse it.


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## GrumpyPaul (12/10/17)

If you've been using sodium perc as "no rinse" in all your other brews you may have built up a taste for perc.

I'm told it's an acquired taste


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## TwoCrows (12/10/17)

While waiting for the wort to cool down, you could put cotton wool soaked in Starsan into to blow off tube to stop those nasties


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## hoppy2B (12/10/17)

Sodium percarbonate is made by mixing hydrogen peroxide and sodium carbonate if I recall correctly. Both of those ingredients are food additives. 
As people have said, sodium percarbonate is a cleaning agent. Cleaning agents (detergents) can kill bacteria etc., through an action known as osmotic pressure (something I learnt through researching mushroom culture). 
I don't think the quantity that is in the brew would be detrimental to fermentation to any large degree. I wouldn't expect to know what it will taste like until it is fermented and carbonated.


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## Danscraftbeer (12/10/17)

I wonder how much it would raise the pH to a degree that's abnormal for beer. Since its Alkaline Salts etc.


warra48 said:


> Sodium Perc is definitely a cleaner, *not* a sanitiser.
> And I also never do not rinse it.


Coopers do a good job of confusing that for newbies since they sell a sanitizer that is sodium percarbonate.
In my early days I used those satchels sold as no rinse sanitizer from brewcraft I think, or Copper brand? that are also Sod perc.
But I only use it for cleaning as best practice. Rince well then star san or equivalent (Phosphoric Acid) sanitizer that wouldn't be as much of a worry if you sucked that back into your beer but still best not to suck anything back into your beer.


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## Birdbeak55 (12/10/17)

2cranky said:


> Next time use starsan in your blow off.
> Maybe don't hook it up until cooled.
> Yeah I'm with the taste it crowd but that amount in 50 litres I doubt you will notice. Might as well pitch the yeast and see how it goes.



Cheers mate ive learnt allot fron this **** up but will def use starsan from now on. And just sod perc for cleaning.


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## Birdbeak55 (12/10/17)

GrumpyPaul said:


> If you've been using sodium perc as "no rinse" in all your other brews you may have built up a taste for perc.
> 
> I'm told it's an acquired taste


Hey mate ive always rinsed the "NO RINCE" sod perc and i like to think i havnt developed a taste for the stuff. To be honest im pretty pissed off that the brew shop and specificly brewmart. As they sell sodium percarb as a no rince sterilizer. They boys down the shop are gonna get an earfull.


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## mtb (12/10/17)

KegKing call it a sanitizer too? I've used it as a fermenter cleaner/sanitizer plenty without issue.

http://kegking.com.au/100-pure-sodium-percarbonate-1kg-bag.html
"has a high kill rate on wide range of micro-organisms making it an effective sanitiser as well as cleaner"


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## Danscraftbeer (12/10/17)

Birdbeak55 said:


> Hey mate ive always rinsed the "NO RINCE" sod perc and i like to think i havnt developed a taste for the stuff. To be honest im pretty pissed off that the brew shop and specificly brewmart. As they sell sodium percarb as a no rince sterilizer. They boys down the shop are gonna get an earfull.


Probably no need to give em an earfull. 
Take this for an example: http://store.coopers.com.au/coopers-sanitiser-280g.html
and this: https://www.ibrew.com.au/products/copper-tun-no-rinse-steriliser-sodium-percarbonate
and this: http://www.westbrew.com.au/showProd...W0540016+/Beer+Essentials+NO+RINSE+STERILISER


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## wide eyed and legless (12/10/17)

I get through a lot of sodium perc, besides cleaning bottles and other brewing gear I have used it to soak soak dirty washing, clean the deck,clean the patio, clean the outdoor furniture, and its the best carpet cleaner you could get. But try and get it to get eel slime off a towel it will not come close.


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## Danscraftbeer (12/10/17)

(crosses off eel slime removal for uses of Sodium Percarbanate)


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## 2cranky (12/10/17)

Danscraftbeer said:


> (crosses off eel slime removal for uses of Sodium Percarbanate)


Damn, I just bought a load for all my eel slimed towels. 

Hang on that's not a euphemism is it?


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## mtb (12/10/17)

2cranky said:


> Damn, I just bought a load for all my eel slimed towels.
> 
> Hang on that's not a euphemism is it?



Load? Slime? Towel? Phallic creature?

Nah, nothing to make from that.


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## wide eyed and legless (12/10/17)

2cranky said:


> Damn, I just bought a load for all my eel slimed towels.
> 
> Hang on that's not a euphemism is it?


No that would be, off bedroom curtains.


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## Birdbeak55 (12/10/17)

Thanks again for everyones responses its greatly appreciated. 
Just a quick question. If im brewing using extract kits in 50ltr batches and also am boiling 20ltrs of that with different hopp varietys and also dry hopping. Am i extract brewing with an addition of hopp tea? or is it considered partial mash brewing ?


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## Birdbeak55 (12/10/17)

Danscraftbeer said:


> Probably no need to give em an earfull.
> Take this for an example: http://store.coopers.com.au/coopers-sanitiser-280g.html
> and this: https://www.ibrew.com.au/products/copper-tun-no-rinse-steriliser-sodium-percarbonate
> and this: http://www.westbrew.com.au/showProd...W0540016+/Beer+Essentials+NO+RINSE+STERILISER


Enough said. Cheers mate


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## manticle (12/10/17)

Birdbeak55 said:


> Thanks again for everyones responses its greatly appreciated.
> Just a quick question. If im brewing using extract kits in 50ltr batches and also am boiling 20ltrs of that with different hopp varietys and also dry hopping. Am i extract brewing with an addition of hopp tea? or is it considered partial mash brewing ?



Extract. Partial mash involves getting some of the total fermentables from mashing base grain.


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## Donz (14/10/17)

I'd let the sodium perc break down a bit then add yeast.
I've only ever thrown out 2 kegs of beer out of 7, I was using sodium percarbonate as a "no-rinse". I now use it as a cleaner, then rinse it out and use hydrogen peroxide with silver ions as the no rinse, and have done 30+ kegs since with no problems.


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