# Carb drops or caster sugar?



## noss (6/2/14)

Hey guys just started out and was wondering what was better to carbonate your beer? Carbonation drops or caster sugar? Which gives better head and longer lasting? Any help would be much appreciated.


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## Econwatson (6/2/14)

Carb drops are a much easier option for when starting out brewing. How many brews have you done so far? If it was me, and you were brewing first time, I'd just put a carb-drop in each 330ml bottle (2 in a 700ml).

Using sugar gives you a much greater deal of control, allowing you to adjust the carbonation to suit the style. But a bit more faffing as you will need to transfer to another vessel before you add sugar.


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## wynnum1 (6/2/14)

Carbonation drops are very expensive sugar.


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## pommiebloke (6/2/14)

I'm not aware of any type of priming sugar having an effect on head retention.

That's down to your recipe more than anything I would think.


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## Alex.Tas (6/2/14)

Through personal experience, i find that LDME works well (albeit more expensive) in giving you smaller and more densely packed bubbles. It isn't 100% fermentable though, so you need to use say 125g of LDME compared to 100g of dex.
I wouldn't say it is the best for any particular style, but i find it does give you 'tighter' head.
As above though, either doesn't help much in head retention. 

Better head can mean many things depending on the style of beer. using any type of sugar in granules rather than pre determined measures gives you more control over how much head you want in your beer. So if you want more a bit more head, you can up the sugar to beer ratio more accurately than using carb drops


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## verysupple (6/2/14)

As far as head formation and retention go they're identical. CO2 is CO2 no matter how it was created. Alex. Tas and others believe different priming agents give different results in terms of head but the science just doesn't back it up. Don't get me wrong, carbonation method definitely makes a difference to the final product, just not it's head characteristics. The size of the particles acting as nucleation points can have an effect on the size of the bubbles formed. Time is the best ingredient for a nice dense head because given time the larger particles settle out and the partices acting as nucleation sites are smaller.

Carb drops are more expensive but much easier to use. Unless you're going to meticulously measure out the mass of caster sugar for each bottle, the drops are probably more consistent too, unless you bulk prime, but then drops are out of the equation ayway. I used to use drops and only stopped due to the lack of control over the carbonation level - you can use either 1 or 2 for a longneck rather than having a continuous scale. I now make a dextrose solution and use a syringe to meaure each bottle's dose. It's a bit of a faff but I don't mind the extra 5 - 10 min on bottling day.

If you do go with caster sugar remember that different types of sugar give different amounts of carbonation due to them being made of different types of sugar molecules. E.g. the same mass of dextrose will give you slightly less CO2 than table sugar. Most decent priming calculators have the option of choosing the type of sugar.


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## MHB (6/2/14)

As people have mentioned carb drops are just sugar (and a bit of water), if you are using sugar (Sucrose) and a sugar measure just be aware that sugar measures are designed go give the right amount of normal house hold white sugar (called granular sugar), if you use caster in the same scoop it will deliver more mass than it will with the coarser granular sugar, if you used raw sugar with even larger granules you would get even less mass and lower carbonation.

Personally I don't think it matters what you use so long as you use the right amount. Bulk Priming is I believe the best way to control the amount of fizz, you can accurately weigh priming sugar to give the exact amount of carbonation for the style of beer you are making. Believe me there is a big difference in the amount of fizz you want in a German Wheat and an Irish Stout and the beer tastes better for having the right level of carbonation.

If you want to dig a bit deeper into the subject read braukaiser its a great resource for anything relating to carbonation.
Mark


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## wbosher (6/2/14)

+1 for bulk priming. I used carb drops for over a year and have no complaints at all. Started bulk priming for the last three or four brews and will never go back. So much easier and more control over the carbonation levels, I wish I'd done it a long time ago. For some reason I thought that it would be more work, but it's really not.


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## JDW81 (6/2/14)

pommiebloke said:


> I'm not aware of any type of priming sugar having an effect on head retention.
> 
> That's down to your recipe more than anything I would think.


I used to think that until I bottled a couple of AG batches, which had shocking carbonation and head retention. I had a suspicion that it was the drops so decided to remake 2 of the batches with exact same recipe, mash schedule and fermentation temperature. Low and behold, the brews that were bulk primed with LME had perfect head retention, next to their identical, but headless cousins.

JD


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## Hoppers (6/2/14)

sugar, borrowed from places like Work, Cafes, McDonalds, Coffee shops are cheap, and have the benefit of being pre measured


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## Alex.Tas (7/2/14)




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## wynnum1 (7/2/14)

Hoppers said:


> sugar, borrowed from places like Work, Cafes, McDonalds, Coffee shops are cheap, and have the benefit of being pre measured


CSR are 3 grams and carbonation drops 60= 250 grams


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## noss (8/2/14)

Thanks guys your experience is very insightful.


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## berts (14/2/14)

why pay for carb drops, small funnel , tea spoon bag of dex, simple.


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## HalfWit (8/4/14)

Hey, I have been having trouble with the carb drops. The last two batches I have done I used Coopers carb drop to prime. I have chilled the beer to 4C, and bottled. Unfortunatly, the carbination has come in on the very low side. What could be causing the lack of fizz? I thought bottling cold I would need less suger.


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## Droopy Brew (8/4/14)

Have you kept the bottles cold or stored them at ambiant to carb up? If you kept them cold the yeast wont be doing their thing to turn the sugar into CO2.


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## yum beer (8/4/14)

Temp at bottling doesn't matter, the temp that matters is the highest temp your brew achieved after main fermentation is completed.
If you brewed cold you will need a little less sugar than if you brewed warm, use a calculator to work it out.
General rule, 1 carb drop to a stubbie, 2 to a longneck.
I used to use 2/3 - 3/4 a carb drop per 330ml bottle but still found that to be a little highly carbed.
Look into bulk priming if you can, its a bit of messing about but makes a big difference to your final product.
Its much nicer drinking bers with appropriate carb levels and not just a bubbling barrage of gas leaping from the bottom of the glass.


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## berts (8/4/14)

Droopy Brew said:


> Have you kept the bottles cold or stored them at ambiant to carb up? If you kept them cold the yeast wont be doing their thing to turn the sugar into CO2.


+1


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## HalfWit (8/4/14)

Thanks guy's, the max fermentation temp was 19C and the bottles have been stored at room temps. Im at a loss.


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## berts (8/4/14)

what kind of bottles are you using , If glass is your capper seeling the caps properly, If pets what condition are your lids?


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## HalfWit (8/4/14)

Thanks bert, I never thought about the capper. The bottles caps look nice and flat. I will give the capper a good look over. All the bottles seem similary under carbed so Im leaning away from this, slightly. Im using the standard 375ml glass bottles.

Edit. Some of the caps are old and some are new. The new ones are from the supermarket. Might have to look into that also.


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## berts (8/4/14)

_I only said it because it happened to me the other day I ran outa pets and used a couple of proper homebrew bottles with new caps and a hand capper , 3 weeks later when I opened the glass bottle beer was flat, Tasted ok as it was a stout so I drank it,  So far all my pets are fine proper carbonation, I only use one teaspoon per 750ml bottle being a stout._


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## Forever Wort (8/4/14)

I have used dextrose, raw sugar, refined white sugar, caster sugar and brown sugar when priming.

Aaand I haven't noticed a single difference between them h34r:


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## pcmfisher (8/4/14)

Is it actually undercarbed or does it just look that way in the glass?

Basic kit brew?


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## HalfWit (8/4/14)

It's an All Grain APA, luckily it has enough NZ Cascade :icon_drool2: dry hop to cover any flaws . It pours with no head and limited bubbles. I do 50L batches. This batch I kegged half and bottled the other half, the differance is very noticable between the two.


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## yum beer (8/4/14)

If your using 375ml bottles I aaume they are twist tops.
These can be bad for sealing properly as the cap struggles on the angled thread.
Could well be the problem, would not suprise me. Have a mate who recently bottled a batch between crown seal and twist top longies.....all the twist tops were flat and no carb, crown seals were all fine.


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## HalfWit (8/4/14)

Yeah they are twist tops. Unfortunatly I didn't bottle any crown seals in this batch to do a side by side test. I have heard that crown seal better than twist tops but in my personal experience I found the opposite true.


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## Steve (8/4/14)

Ive primed with light malt, dark malt, normal house hold white sugar, dextrose and haven't noticed a difference. Ive never tried carb drops as over the years Ive head they are a bit hit and miss.

I went onto bulk priming eventually because I wanted to adjust the carb levels from say a wheat to a stout. Loved bulk priming. Its very handy when you have 3 or 4 different sized bottles on brew day.

Regarding twist tops vs crown seals they both work fine. Ive bottled thousands over the past 20 years using both and cant tell the difference apart from the lids need a little less effort on the capper with the crown seal bottles.

Cheese!

Edit....I should have said my preferred option for carbing bottles is normal white table sugar


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## wynnum1 (8/4/14)

Twist tops put them on tighter and they work but hard to twist off .


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## MHB (14/4/14)

HalfWit - when you say the beer was chilled to 4oC (presumably a crash cool), the reason for doing this is to drop out yeast, if you have the beer cool enough for long enough you can drop out so much yeast that there is barely enough left to carbonate the beer. Generally it will condition but it can be fairly slow with the smaller population, coupled with the yeast going dormant due to the low temperatures and taking a while to wake back up once the beer is back at ambient, if you are getting some fizz (given you have enough fermentable in there) patience should give you the rest.
The response to cold is very strain dependant, some yeasts don't get fazed others just cross their legs and refuse to play for weeks.
Mark



Hoppers said:


> sugar, borrowed from places like Work, Cafes, McDonalds, Coffee shops are cheap, and have the benefit of being pre measured


We are talking about using a maximum of say 120g of sugar, call it 12 cents worth, doing it properly (bulk priming) so you have complete control of the fizz in your beer and that can make a big difference to how much you enjoy the product of all your work.

Well personally I would question the sanity of anyone who would stand up and admit to being a thief for 12 cents, and who cant understand that the work that goes into making a beer is repaid in the drinking, and in drinking it at its best the amount of fizz plays a large part.
I just guess some of us are lucky we don't have to post under our real names


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## Scooby Tha Newbie (14/4/14)

You can buy lids for twist tops now. I've not been bottling for long but my local 
hbs has both types. Not shoure if there is a difference because I just buy the twist top lids as I use coopers stubies that have the twist top. 
Long neck coopers work with the same lids.

To get back on topic I use dextrose and bulk prime with a wand . Very easy fast good results.


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## wynnum1 (14/4/14)

Thinking of using one of these mixing the sugar up with hot water can easily measure 10 ml accurately looks like star san bottle 


http://www.contapack.com.au/chamber-pack


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