# New England IPA



## UsernameTaken (22/5/17)

They say the New England IPA is everywhere these days, but I see little evidence of it?

There seems to be no mention of the style here Beer Styles forum and I see little to none of it in my local craft beer bottle shops?

What I have tasted I have really liked, so I would like to know more about how to make it and where to buy it?

I had the Hop Nation Jedi Juice at GABS in Melbourne on the weekend and it was by far my standout favourite of the festival!

Cheers,
UNT


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## Motabika (22/5/17)

Hargreaves Hill have just done one being sold in bottles, Bacchus have also done one. It's everywhere in the states we are usually a year or so behind.

I'm not really interested in cloudy and chewy beer. Give me a on point West Coast IPA any day


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## UsernameTaken (22/5/17)

Hop Nation Jedi Juice was not too cloudy or chewy just bright hoppy awesomeness!


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## droid (22/5/17)

A little OT, I'm loving my Session NEIPA style, pils, carapils, Munich, acidulated, oats
It's light, cloudy, fruity and punchy - not much to not like, no heavy malt around 4.8%

I think the cloudiness is a mixture of things, one being that part of the dry-hopping is done while the beer is still fermenting, one is the second dry hop, another is oats to round out the mouthfeèl from all the hops

I think some do not use finings and use English yeast

Good onya for getting into it I think it's feckin awesomeness in a glass


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## Liam_snorkel (22/5/17)

I had a crack at brewing one, it turned out great. Was hazy but not murky & turbid like some that you see on social media from the US. If I'd left out the whirlfloc I suppose it would have been. Bitterness was nowhere near 100 IBU, that's just brewmate not accounting properly for late hops.

here was my attempt:

Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 23.0
Total Grain (kg): 6.000
Total Hops (g): 420.00 (blaze it)
Original Gravity (OG): 1.060 (°P): 14.7
Final Gravity (FG): 1.015 (°P): 3.8
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.89 %
Colour (SRM): 3.9 (EBC): 7.7
Bitterness (IBU): 99.6 (Average - No Chill Adjusted)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 75
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
5.000 kg Pale Malt (83.33%)
1.000 kg Flaked Oats (16.67%)

Hop Bill
----------------
30.0 g Cascade Pellet (6.5% Alpha) @ 30 Minutes (Boil) (1.3 g/L)

whirlpool hops (10mins after flameout):
90.0 g Cascade Pellet (6.5% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil) (3.9 g/L)
30.0 g Citra Pellet (13% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil) (1.3 g/L)
30.0 g Columbus Pellet (16% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil) (1.3 g/L)
30.0 g Mosaic Pellet (14% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Boil) (1.3 g/L)

dry hop at high krausen (about day 2):
30.0 g Cascade Pellet (6.5% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)
30.0 g Citra Pellet (12.8% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)
30.0 g Columbus Pellet (16% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)
30.0 g Mosaic Pellet (11.5% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)

keg hop:
30.0 g Cascade Pellet (6.5% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)
30.0 g Citra Pellet (12.8% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)
30.0 g Mosaic Pellet (11.5% Alpha) @ 0 Days (Dry Hop) (2.6 g/L)



Misc Bill
----------------
Protein rest at 55°C for 10 Minutes.
Saccharification at 66°C for 60 Minutes.
Glycoprotein rest at 72°C for 10 Minutes.

pitched at 16°C, fermented at 18°C with Wyeast 1318 - London Ale III

water profile (PPM):
Ca - 145
Cl - 240
SO4 - 135


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## mofox1 (22/5/17)

UsernameTaken said:


> Hop Nation Jedi Juice was not too cloudy or chewy just bright hoppy awesomeness!


One of my stand-out favourites from the festival beers... probably should have visited more of the brewery stands, festival beers were a bit hit and miss.


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## Leyther (22/5/17)

I had the Hargreaves Hill yesterday, pleasant enough but no stand out, its also not cloudy or as light as some of the ones from the festival, I had a couple of samples off the 1-19 that were quite good.


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## hirschb (23/5/17)

Motabika said:


> Hargreaves Hill have just done one being sold in bottles, Bacchus have also done one. It's everywhere in the states we are usually a year or so behind.
> 
> I'm not really interested in cloudy and chewy beer. Give me a on point West Coast IPA any day


More like 5-10 years behind.......


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## Grogler (25/5/17)

Cavalier Brewing have their Fruit Punch IPA out at the moment. From memory that wasn't as 'popping' as the hops from hargreaves but had a smoother hazy flavour. Picked up both from Slowbeer in Richmond

Slowbeer also had a keg there of Tallboy & Moose's Milky Wet Galaxy New England Style IPA - remember it being good, dry and not as fruity as the bottled ones I had


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## lukasfab (25/5/17)

Liam_snorkel said:


> I had a crack at brewing one, it turned out great. Was hazy but not murky & turbid like some that you see on social media from the US. If I'd left out the whirlfloc I suppose it would have been. Bitterness was nowhere near 100 IBU, that's just brewmate not accounting properly for late hops.
> 
> here was my attempt:
> 
> ...


how long did you have your dry hops in the FV mate?


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## Liam_snorkel (26/5/17)

Until I kegged it, I think about 10 days?. Ie waited until it fermented out, quick cold crash then into keg with the 2nd round of dry hops.


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## lukasfab (26/5/17)

No grassy flavours from 10 days then ?


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## Liam_snorkel (26/5/17)

not really. most of that time was during active fermentation, maybe biotransformation had something to do with it. That said, I've never had an issue with grassy flavours with those particular hops.


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## Thefatdoghead (26/5/17)

Is there a particular english yeast for this style?


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## Dan Pratt (26/5/17)

Gav80 said:


> Is there a particular english yeast for this style?


London III - 1318

Or Vermont Al Yeast from the yeast bay strains.


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## TidalPete (26/5/17)

FYI Gav FWIW --- http://craftypint.com/news/1503/Looking_For_New_England_The_Haze_Craze
Pretty much what Pratty1 just posted.


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## Liam_snorkel (27/5/17)

this is a good read also, regarding yeast selection
http://brulosophy.com/2017/03/20/yeast-comparison-wyeast-1318-london-ale-iii-vs-wyeast-1056-american-ale-neipa-exbeeriment-results/


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## droid (27/5/17)

_quote from the haze craze_
_"As for Modus Operandi’s recent release, Dennis says “the vast majority of the feedback we’ve gotten about the beer [Lost Key XPA] is in regards to either its hoppiness or overall flavour and aroma profile. We’ve received very little feedback with regards to the appearance of the beer._
_“Australians seem to enjoy beer and, if the feedback we’ve received is a testament to anything, it’s that Aussies aren’t that fussed about how ya look just as long as you smell nice,” he adds with typical eloquence."_


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## Dan Pratt (28/5/17)

Had Lupulin Fog from Akasha at Gabs Sydney and it was excellent. 

Cloudy but not murky/turbid and low to no bitterness. Just aromatic and full of flavour.


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## Grogler (29/5/17)

Gav80 said:


> Is there a particular english yeast for this style?


WLP007 Dry English Ale yeast has worked very well for me


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## GalBrew (29/5/17)

WY1318, London Ale 3 is a go to yeast for a NEIPA.


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## UsernameTaken (11/6/17)

Is there any point cold crashing your NEIPA?


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## Dan Pratt (11/6/17)

^ ^ nope. I left out the whirlfloc tablet from the boil and didn't cold crash.

full of haze and hop oils!!


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## BrutusB (2/8/17)

I put a NEIPA together which looked/tasted the part.

I used:
80% Pale
20% Coles instant oats

Mashed @ 65c for 60mins.

I found my head retention was crap/non-existent.

Reading some old threads on using oats there were some comments (Advice Please - Crush The Oats?) about head retention and high fat content of instant/supermarket oats.

Has anyone else had a similar experience?


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## Liam_snorkel (2/8/17)

as an aside, at least you can nail the "iceman pour"


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## BrutusB (2/8/17)

Liam_snorkel said:


> as an aside, at least you can nail the "iceman pour"



Yep - every time


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## paulyman (2/8/17)

You've all been doing it wrong. Here is a quote from the Simpsons Malted Oats blurb:

"Silky smooth fullness – Juice Bomb"

https://www.simpsonsmalt.co.uk/our-malts/malted-oats/

Apparently the juiciness comes from the oats... who would have guessed?[/quote]


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## technobabble66 (2/8/17)

Oats FTW! 
[emoji185]
[emoji1]


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## technobabble66 (2/8/17)

Fwiw, I did a red NEIPA with 20% oats a few months ago. Tight creamy head in abundance. 
Just how I like it [emoji6]


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## GalBrew (2/8/17)

GalBrew said:


> WY1318, London Ale 3 is a go to yeast for a NEIPA.



I'm going to suggest WLP 644. Makes your juice bomb even more juicy! I wouldn't bother with any other yeast again for this style.


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## Liam_snorkel (2/8/17)

interesting, it is a tasty yeast. I'll give it a burl
So far I've used vermont and 1318 with good results.


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## GalBrew (2/8/17)

Liam_snorkel said:


> interesting, it is a tasty yeast. I'll give it a burl
> So far I've used vermont and 1318 with good results.



I split my last batch and did WLP644 and WY1318 side by side. Both are good, but the 644 has far more tropical fruit aromas and flavours than the 1318. Also the 644 has the 'softer' mouthfeel of the two.


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## BrutusB (2/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> Fwiw, I did a red NEIPA with 20% oats a few months ago. Tight creamy head in abundance.


What oats did you use exactly?


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## technobabble66 (2/8/17)

Coles generic brand (the slightly better if their 2 generics), Instant Oats.


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## hirschb (2/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> Coles generic brand (the slightly better if their 2 generics), Instant Oats.



I read somewhere to use rolled oats, not instant oats.


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## pnorkle (2/8/17)

hirschb said:


> I read somewhere to use rolled oats, not instant oats.


Shouldn't matter AFAICT - from what I've read, instant oats are just chopped up smaller so they cook quicker.


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## technobabble66 (2/8/17)

Yep. My understanding as well. 
My only query might be whether the instant oats are a little more oxidized as they're more "exposed" and probably have been processed weeks/months previously. 
Probably little difference to rolled, but it might be an argument to try whole oats and mill when ready to mash. 

They were great/fine in my Red NEIPA, as well as a Belgian ale (7.5% oats)


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## goatchop41 (2/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> Probably little difference to rolled, but it might be an argument to try whole oats and mill when ready to mash.



With whole oats (I'm assuming you mean not even rolled) you'd need to do a cereal mash, or boil/cook them first


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## technobabble66 (2/8/17)

Definitely. And possibly a little oven toasting beforehand [emoji6]

That's why I just used instant. With a fair bit of reading, it seemed like there wasn't much difference between instant and rolled in quality for beer-making. Similarly there wasn't much difference between whole and rolled, only the reduced number of steps to utilize the rolled. 
TBH, the steps to use whole oats isn't that big a deal. Really it's just crush and boil for 30mins. But I was feeling lazy at the time. 
They all work. 

Fwiw, if you go over ~5% oats, I'd recommend the beta-glucanase step in your mash (44-45*C for 20-30mins).


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## wide eyed and legless (3/8/17)

pnorkle said:


> Shouldn't matter AFAICT - from what I've read, instant oats are just chopped up smaller so they cook quicker.


They are also pre steamed and the starches are more readily available so you can add them directy into your mash.


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## technobabble66 (3/8/17)

^^ I wouldn't bet on it, but I believe rolled oats go through the same process. So both can go directly into the mash. (Or is that what you meant?[emoji57])


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## GalBrew (3/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> Fwiw, if you go over ~5% oats, I'd recommend the beta-glucanase step in your mash (44-45*C for 20-30mins).



A very good idea.


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## wide eyed and legless (3/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> ^^ I wouldn't bet on it, but I believe rolled oats go through the same process. So both can go directly into the mash. (Or is that what you meant?[emoji57])


I do believe it is better to grind the rolled oats, but the flaked oats have been cut using heated rollers that crush and burst the starch granules so they can go directly into the mash.


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## hirschb (3/8/17)

I always use rolled oats into the mash. Never had any issues. If I use >10% I'll normally throw in some rice hulls to help prevent a stuck sparge.


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## GalBrew (3/8/17)

I've not had a stuck sparge with 10% oats, just a painfully slow one even with rice hulls added.


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## kaiserben (3/8/17)

Rolled oats from my LHBS with no head retention problems (in either oatmeal stouts or NEIPAs). 

But I've never used supermarket oats to make any sort of comparison.


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## goatchop41 (3/8/17)

kaiserben said:


> Rolled oats from my LHBS with no head retention problems (in either oatmeal stouts or NEIPAs).
> 
> But I've never used supermarket oats to make any sort of comparison.



They're the same thing! Just different price and packaging


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## goatchop41 (3/8/17)

technobabble66 said:


> Fwiw, if you go over ~5% oats, I'd recommend the beta-glucanase step in your mash (44-45*C for 20-30mins).



Depends on what you want from having the oats in there, and if you do 3V vs BIAB/1V.
If you're looking for them to add some of that extra thickness to the body, then a beta-glucanase step will rob you of that (reducing the increased viscosity of the wort that the beta glucan will cause). In the case of using it to reduce the viscosity in order to prevent a slow lauter, well this is unnecessary for those doing BIAB.

For the record, I BIAB and have never done one a B-G step/rest


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## AaronL89 (24/9/17)

Hey guys, I have a question about my New England IPA. It tastes amazing, but is very dark and murky as opposed to hazy. Would anyone have any idea as to what I can do next time to improve?





My recipe was roughly:

76% Pale
16% Instant Oats
4% Wheat
3% Maris Otter
1% Acidulated

Amarillo (steep) to 10 IBU

Giga Yeast #GY054 (Vermont IPA)

I added three dry hop additions of a combination of Galaxy, Mandarina Bavaria, Citra and Nelson Sauvin three days apart at 10g/L, with the first addition 24 hours after pitching the yeast.

I left it in primary for 1.5 weeks before transferring to bottles.

Any help and advice would be appreciated. Cheers!


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## Liam_snorkel (25/9/17)

did you weigh out your grain bill yourself or have your supplier do it? It looks like some crystal has snuck in..


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## droid (25/9/17)

Could you take a pic of the beer in natural light? 
Looks for sure like some dark malt is in there, unless you toasted your oats like my old man used to cook his bacon...to the edge of oblivion...

It looks like a nice recipe.


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## Coodgee (25/9/17)

I'd say the 3% MO biotransformed into roasted barley. that yeast will do that with the right dry hopping schedule. The sky's the limit with a NEIPA!!!


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## hirschb (25/9/17)

Yeah, it looks like someone accidentally put some dark malts into your grain bill. 
BUT, keep in mind that NEIPA's are super-sensitive to oxidation. A little bit of oxidation can turn a NEIPA fairly dark (but I've never seen one that dark). If you have kegging equipment, I'd recommend only kegging the beer.
Alternately, if bottling is your only option, I'd look for a CO2 counterfiller for bottling.


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## AaronL89 (25/9/17)

Thanks everyone for the replies!



Liam_snorkel said:


> did you weigh out your grain bill yourself or have your supplier do it? It looks like some crystal has snuck in..



I had my LHBS store weigh it out. I've never had any problems like this before, but you never know.



droid said:


> Could you take a pic of the beer in natural light?
> Looks for sure like some dark malt is in there, unless you toasted your oats like my old man used to cook his bacon...to the edge of oblivion...
> 
> It looks like a nice recipe.



I'll post a pic in natural light later this week.



Coodgee said:


> I'd say the 3% MO biotransformed into roasted barley. that yeast will do that with the right dry hopping schedule. The sky's the limit with a NEIPA!!!



I was unsure whether to add the MO. I wish I held off now. At least I'll learn from my mistakes.



hirschb said:


> Yeah, it looks like someone accidentally put some dark malts into your grain bill.
> BUT, keep in mind that NEIPA's are super-sensitive to oxidation. A little bit of oxidation can turn a NEIPA fairly dark (but I've never seen one that dark). If you have kegging equipment, I'd recommend only kegging the beer.
> Alternately, if bottling is your only option, I'd look for a CO2 counterfiller for bottling.



I don't tend to brew hop-forward beers, and I did have issues with oxidation with my last IPA I brewed earlier in the year. This could well be the issue.

I think I'll definitely look into buying a CO2 counterfiller soon!


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## Leyther (25/9/17)

I made one with Golden promise as the main malt, its darker than the stuff you get in the shops but still an amazing beer. I was drinking 3 ravens juicy off tap last night and it was the colour of orange juice, not sure what malt they are using to get it so light.


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