# Vale Little Creatures Pale Ale



## browndog (8/1/14)

Bought myself a 568ml bottle of LCPA tonight, haven't had one for yonks. What has happened to the vibrant, rich and in your face hop/malt profile of this once flagship of Aussie craftbeer? The beer I tasted was somewhat hoppy, but without the tangy grapefruit burst I used to know and it was watery, no sign of a head at all. I'd rate it no better or worse than a Fat Yak. Seems to me LC have sold out to the dollar and their customers, won't be buying it again. What a shame.


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## slcmorro (8/1/14)

Any chance at all that the bottle you got might have been poorly stored?


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## stakka82 (8/1/14)

I find little creatures very hit and miss dependent on age/handling. Same with stone and wood or any hoppy domestic beer. 

The bottleshop near me moves mainly megaswill and every domestic hoppy ale is rubbish due to having sat on the shelves for 6 - 12 months.


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## kevo (8/1/14)

Long way from WA to the 'Swich.


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## philmud (8/1/14)

Yep, poor handling and storage kills this beer. I've had so many misses, I usually bypass it these days but I bought one the other week that was delicious


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## manticle (8/1/14)

I've had some recently (bottled) and it's been fairly reasonable. Just a session beer for me - I even drink it out of the bottle on occasion.

Bit of malt, bit of hops, discernible galaxy on last taste (not my favourite hop but that's Ok). Well I thought I tasted galaxy - could be wrong.

Fat Yak is awful - at least the last few times I've tried it on tap it has been. I'd prefer Carlton Draught. Like Orange juice and butterscotch, the old FY. Might be the pub/pubs where I've had it. Carlton is consistently awful but a $12 jug from regularly cleaned lines served at cold temps after 40 mins of futsal does me OK week to week. At least I know what it will taste like (as opposed to the same pub somehow making Samuel Adams taste like rubbish. How do they do this?)


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## browndog (8/1/14)

kevo said:


> Long way from WA to the 'Swich.


Yes true, but the beers I bought 4 or 5 yrs ago were bought here in Ipswich not in WA or even Vic now. I don't think their transport methods would be any worse now than they were 4 or 5 yrs ago either. So distance has nothing to do with it. The bottle says best before 02 Aug 14 so age has nothing to do with it either. Many years back I brewed 6 beers in a row to try and clone it so I think I have a pretty good idea of what it used to taste like back then. The bottle I had tonight was a paled in comparison.

Manticle, once LCPA tasted of grapefruit (chinook) now it's somewhat fruit salad.


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## Stormahead (8/1/14)

Thats how beers from the east coast taste to us

For that reason I'll stick to local bottled stock

Having said that, if its a little creatures pale and the best before indicates its more than 4 months old, then I wouldn't bother either


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## jyo (8/1/14)

The last few Pale Ales I have had have been pretty decent.

:icon_offtopic: Not that it _should_ matter, but was it brewed in Freo or Geelong, Browndog?
I received a sixer of Bright Ale from my eldest at Christmas and was very surprised to see it was Geelong. Pretty sure Fremantle is closer to me :blink:


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## browndog (8/1/14)

jyo said:


> The last few Pale Ales I have had have been pretty decent.
> 
> :icon_offtopic: Not that it _should_ matter, but was it brewed in Freo or Geelong, Browndog?
> I received a sixer of Bright Ale from my eldest at Christmas and was very surprised to see it was Geelong. Pretty sure Fremantle is closer to me :blink:


How do you tell where it has been brewed?


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## manticle (8/1/14)

I know they change the hops on a semi-regular basis due to availability and other factors. I'd prefer chinook to galaxy for sure. Bit more bite maybe.


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## jyo (8/1/14)

browndog said:


> How do you tell where it has been brewed?


On the front of the label, mate. It's written in tiny font in a semi circle under the main icon. I happened to notice it.


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## GundyBrewer (8/1/14)

I'm with the OP. I remember a night about 2.5 years ago when I was out in Brisbane and Little Creatures Pale Ale was on tap. I gave it a go and loved it from the first sip, then got into all different types of beer from there. I still see it as a moment that set me on the path to enjoyment of diverse beers and eventually brewing. It's kind of a special beer for me, and I'm sure I'm not alone here.

Maybe it's my changing tastes but I don't think it is as good as it used to be either. I've got some Geelong brewed ones in the fridge now, BB 8/7/14 so it's not that old, maybe I'll give one a crack now. Does anyone know how long do they give it on the best before date? I think I bought these about a month ago. It'll sure as hell beat a Fat Yak hands down either way.


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## NewtownClown (9/1/14)

Consensus is: Pale Ales, and their ilk, are best consumed fresh. No Brainer.
I cry, inside, when I hear a homebrewer say his latest APA will be "good' in 5-8 weeks


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## GundyBrewer (9/1/14)

Yeah I drank it just before. Grapefruit was still prominent, as well as a slightly skunked flavour was probably my fault for putting in the hall for a month. It was still pretty damn good. But still, not what I remember it as. Might be a mouthfeel thing, maybe a bit thinner now, and also less flavoursome?


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## chunckious (9/1/14)

To my tastes it's as hoppy as it used to be but just always changing in hops used. The PA used to burst in my mouth, I put that down to my pallet evolving. Still nice and good value though.
Don't think you could bring it down into Fat Yak territory though, I give it more props than that.


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## philmud (9/1/14)

GundyBrewer said:


> I've got some Geelong brewed ones in the fridge now, BB 8/7/14 so it's not that old, maybe I'll give one a crack now. Does anyone know how long do they give it on the best before date?


Not sure about manufacturer's recommended shelf life, but that beer is 6 months old - I wouldn't call that especially fresh. Coopers Sparkling Ale is a beer that I always check the "bottled on" date for. It's a vastly better beer within 3 months of bottling, and if it's more than 4 or 5 I buy something else.

Edit: I misread your post. Thought it was bottled ON 8/7/13 - I wonder how feeds that means it is? I prefer to see a 'bottled on' date.


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## Spiesy (9/1/14)

LCPA is usually my stalwart, fail safe "go to" local APA. I know the recipe is modded yearly to account for changes in hop crops, but the last slab I got was very ordinary and very disappointing. 
Not sure if it's a coincidence, but it's also the first LCPA I've had that was made in Geelong.
I'll be keen to try LCPA when back at out West next to see if there's a notable difference.


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## Midnight Brew (9/1/14)

GundyBrewer said:


> Maybe it's my changing tastes but I don't think it is as good as it used to be either. I've got some Geelong brewed ones in the fridge now, BB 8/7/14 so it's not that old, maybe I'll give one a crack now. Does anyone know how long do they give it on the best before date? I think I bought these about a month ago. It'll sure as hell beat a Fat Yak hands down either way.


From memory it was 9 months on the bottle with all their beers and the ciders are 12-18 months. I think their kegs they give 3 months. When consumed straight from the bottle I always pick up a metallic taste maybe its from the bottle cap but I never get that from other craft beers.

Had a pint of creatures in Melbourne and it was nothing to talk about, just an average pale ale maybe it wasn't fresh who knows. About a month later I was in Tassie and had another pint again and it was amazing. Unfortunately once the beer leaves the brewery and goes to distribution or pubs, its then in the hands of the venue to store correctly, have good rotation, not serve it freezing cold, clean lines, good glassware cleanliness and so on.

Off topic a tad but I love it when I taste a home brewed pale ale and you know its better then most you can buy. Whether its from a case swap or your own. That is when you know you're winning.


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## Cosh (9/1/14)

I had a pint in a pub in Perth just before Christmas and it was amazing. I've never found lcpa to be that great, just ok. Guess it doesn't travel too well.


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## Spiesy (9/1/14)

Midnight Brew said:


> When consumed straight from the bottle I always pick up a metallic taste maybe its from the bottle cap but I never get that from other craft beers.


Whilst I always pour to glass, I have had the metallic taste in many beers from time to time, including (but not limited to, due to my shithouse memory): LC's, Coopers, Squire's, Mountain Goat… and lots more.


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## Moad (9/1/14)

I love LCPA (I'm on the east coast), I was in Perth late last year and had one on tap... wow. Much fresher and really reinvigorated my love for this beer.

off topic: Why does everyone hate on Fat Yak? I'm not as experienced as most here but I still enjoy it!


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## O'Henry (9/1/14)

The LC bright beers used to have a best before of 9 months and the pale ale had a shelf life of 1 year, but this may have been changed recently. I also think it is likely that the pints are all still brewed in WA due to the bottling line there being set up for pints. Not sure they would have got the Geelong line spec'd for pints as well due to them not being a large amount of production.


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## Mardoo (9/1/14)

And here I thought OP was announcing a Vale Ale/Little Creatures collab!

Have to agree that it doesn't seem to be what it used to be. But then, since I've gotten back into home brewing I've become a picky little bitch...


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## mxd (9/1/14)

I've never been a fan of LCPA, I'll have to grab some more and try it again. I thought Fat Yak, when it come out, was fine. At pubs if there got an Tooheys old on tap I have one of those or the VB


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## stakka82 (9/1/14)

Spiesy said:


> Whilst I always pour to glass, I have had the metallic taste in many beers from time to time, including (but not limited to, due to my shithouse memory): LC's, Coopers, Squire's, Mountain Goat… and lots more.


Yeah what's with that??? I have noticed a metallic taste in many beers for as long as I can remember. there is no other way to describe it other than metallic... But that is not a descriptor I have found anywhere for aged or badly handled beers.


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## Spiesy (9/1/14)

Moad said:


> off topic: Why does everyone hate on Fat Yak?


Because it's shit.


Jokes… kind of… it can be really nice, it can be very ordinary - over the past few years I have unfortunately had more "ordinary" than "really nice", which is a shame.


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## Spiesy (9/1/14)

stakka82 said:


> Yeah what's with that??? I have noticed a metallic taste in many beers for as long as I can remember. there is no other way to describe it other than metallic... But that is not a descriptor I have found anywhere for aged or badly handled beers.


I started a thread about it a while back… I've even found it on some imports. Weird. I have dug deeper and found descriptors, think "iron" or "blood" - similar vibe to metallic. Some people attribute it to some crystal malts, others certain hopping techniques - but it is strange that it afflicts so many different brews sometimes.
I've taken slabs back to the retailer due to it before…


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## stakka82 (9/1/14)

Yeah I've definitely had it on imports before too... even the bigger international breweries. Tasted it in many different styles.

Like sucking on rusty nails.


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## paulmclaren11 (9/1/14)

When LC had a Q and A session online I asked them about the LCPA recipe and had it changed dramatically as I too used to love this beer but now find it very hit and miss and average at best. The response I got was 'my tastes had changed' and the recipe is still pretty much the same (different hops from time to time as people have suggested).

I put it down to me drinking more IPA's these days and finding it lacking in flavour.

It's still a good local beer, but I more opt for US beers when I am at the bottlo.

And yes, Fak Yak is horrible now for mine, makes me gag just thinking about it. Unless you get a fresh keg of it forget it....


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## Spiesy (12/1/14)

paulmclaren11 said:


> It's still a good local beer, but I more opt for US beers when I am at the bottlo.


Really? You'd prefer an imported APA over a locally brewed APA?
I'm getting a little over drinking imports, particularly anything that's meant to display fresh hops. They just don't taste or smell as fresh (plus they often cost more).


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## kevo (12/1/14)

Spiesy said:


> Really? You'd prefer an imported APA over a locally brewed APA? I'm getting a little over drinking imports, particularly anything that's meant to display fresh hops. They just don't taste or smell as fresh (plus they often cost more).


Was only commenting on this to a mate recently.

I've been disappointed so many times by imported hoppy beers where either the hops are long gone or oxydation has ruined what's left.

Now spend my money on local beers, able to buy more of them and find they are far superior in terms of freshness.


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## Feldon (12/1/14)

Anyone ever had a bad Sierra Nevada Pale Ale from the Us? I haven't. Cheaper than many local six-packs too.


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## paulmclaren11 (12/1/14)

Spiesy said:


> Really? You'd prefer an imported APA over a locally brewed APA? I'm getting a little over drinking imports, particularly anything that's meant to display fresh hops. They just don't taste or smell as fresh (plus they often cost more).


Yeah I do cause mainly I have tried most of the local beers I like available to me. Don't get me wrong, I love a hop hog or McLaren vale IPA, but I like variety and the bottlos I frequent seem to handle the beers well.


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## manticle (12/1/14)

Feldon said:


> Anyone ever had a bad Sierra Nevada Pale Ale from the Us? I haven't. Cheaper than many local six-packs too.


Bought 4 on friday that were dreadful. Tasted like beer left in the sun.
Fortunately the only time I've experienced it with this beer.


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## Doubleplugga (12/1/14)

It's my go to beer, kinda like my default if I can't think of anything else. I buy quite a lot of it. Yeah the recipe has changed over the years but I still love it. Just roll with the changes. Had a fresh pint off the tap last night, sensational. My taste buds have change over the years but I still love Little Creatures, it's what got me into craft beer.


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## kevo (12/1/14)

Perhaps it's an east coast v west coast thing in terms of freshness and handling.

Had to shake my head at the story last year of soemone enquiring about a small batch up the road from the brewery and were told that the shipment had to come back to WA from the distribution centre in Sydney or Melbourne!!

:icon_offtopic:

Sorry for the hijack - speaking of LC - what was the last Single Batch? Mr Obidiah? Any whispers of a new one soon...?


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## paulmclaren11 (12/1/14)

Yes it was the porter, not heard of the next one....


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## booyucka (4/3/14)

manticle said:


> I know they change the hops on a semi-regular basis due to availability and other factors. I'd prefer chinook to galaxy for sure. Bit more bite maybe.


I agree this could explain the discrepency you have noticed. Have read a few articles about LCPA and over the years the hops combinations are not always the same. My first impression of this beer in 2006 was very impressive peach and citrus flavours. Shame if it has lost that oompf. Reminds me of theSierra nevada "southern harvest" which varies year to year depending on which hops are available.


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## Snowdog (21/3/14)

I don't know... I started buying LCPA again after the recently consistent disappointment with the 4-pak Hop Hogs. Between LCPA and 4 Pines Pale, they are my 'fridge' beer. Can't be drinking Garage Project every day....


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## pk.sax (21/3/14)

I always did prefer their bright ale to their pale ale. But even with the metallic twang the pale used to pack a punch that made you go for the next one. Haven't noted this the last time that was now a while ago too.

Speaking of 4 pines, I had started treating their kölsch as my fridge beer, it's not sumner or trumers but it'd do kinda thing. Last six pack however was butterscotch all over. Dropping it on its head knocked enough out to drink it. But still....


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## Spiesy (22/3/14)

Feldon said:


> Anyone ever had a bad Sierra Nevada Pale Ale from the Us? I haven't. Cheaper than many local six-packs too.


Late on the reply here. But, yes, I have. 
Even the "good" ones aren't a shadow on a fresh SNPA in the States (although I'm sure the romantic notion of drinking it in its natural habitat also helps)


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## Donske (22/3/14)

Spiesy said:


> Late on the reply here. But, yes, I have.
> Even the "good" ones aren't a shadow on a fresh SNPA in the States (although I'm sure the romantic notion of drinking it in its natural habitat also helps)


I always wondered about that, I was drinking some SNPA the other day and was blown away by how fresh it tasted, the aroma was full on too, if it's that good after 6 to 8 weeks transit then fresh must be truly spectacular.


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## lukiferj (22/3/14)

Spiesy said:


> Late on the reply here. But, yes, I have.
> Even the "good" ones aren't a shadow on a fresh SNPA in the States (although I'm sure the romantic notion of drinking it in its natural habitat also helps)



Agreed. Completely different beer in my opinion.


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## paulmclaren11 (24/3/14)

paulmclaren11 said:


> When LC had a Q and A session online I asked them about the LCPA recipe and had it changed dramatically as I too used to love this beer but now find it very hit and miss and average at best. The response I got was 'my tastes had changed' and the recipe is still pretty much the same (different hops from time to time as people have suggested).
> 
> I put it down to me drinking more IPA's these days and finding it lacking in flavour.
> 
> ...


Quoting myself now... I have to admit as Dan's has slabs of LCPA for $56 bucks these days (as opposed to the $65 it used to be) I have bought 3 cartons of it in the last months.

I have to say, I am a reborn LCPA fan. The batches I have had have been well balanced and packing a nice hop flavour. Even the batches I have had brewed in Geelong (I am in WA so have no idea why I am drinking Geelong brewed LCPA...) were nice.

Sometimes I think you need to revisit some beers. It was the beer that got me into craft beer and brewing.

On tap I think depends on the venue and how they treat their beers lines.


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## Jaded and Bitter (25/3/14)

I was just thinking about this yesterday.

Yes LCPA has slowly dwindled (while the price has dropped a little). Ive been drinking this beer for about 10 years, and my taste hasnt changed a great deal as other beers (pilsener urqell etc.) still taste exactly the same.

I recently did a NZ cascade APA so have a pretty good nose for this hop now. Drinking LCPA from the tap yesterday and thought yep NZ cascade. Second round bought JS 150 Lashes PA and didnt really notice a difference (not that was looking att), my old man didnt even notice it was a different beer.

I had a six pack from Geelong a couple weeks back and it was better, but definately not the signature cascade and chinook bang of yesterday. Pints have been better but the bang has gone.

Now it sems to be a gentle pop, or even poof.

Try Vale Ale IPA for hop BANG


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## paulmclaren11 (26/3/14)

Jaded and Bitter said:


> I had a six pack from Geelong a couple weeks back and it was better, but definately not the signature cascade and chinook bang of yesterday.



This I totally agree with, and why I went off it for a while. I think I posted earlier that I asked them had they changed the recipe, and while they say they haven't, they clearly have. I find it to more sessionable now though.


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