# ESB



## time01 (28/4/14)

looking to brew my first ESB and not massively familiar with the style, anyone have a solid recipe or tips on yeast etc.?

I am an AG BIAB, No chill brewer.


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## geneabovill (28/4/14)

Take a gander at the BJCP style guidelineshttp://www.bjcp.org for an idea.

That'll at least tell you what to aim for. Also, a load of great reading material out there. _Brewing Classic Styles_ for starters.


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## manticle (28/4/14)

Keep it simple. Good UK base malt, good UK crystal (don't overdo the crystal).
I like to add in a touch of toasty malt like biscuit or aromatic - be subtle if you use it.

Good liquid UK yeast - I love 1469, 1275 and 1335. 1187 is another good choice as is 1026 but it's only available seasonally(1026 not 1187). 1028 is a lovely yeast but can be a pain. I ferment towards the lower end of the range, bump it up a tad towards the end.

Obviously UK hops - EKG and challenger are both great. Styrians are not UK but work very well in a bitter - either solo or playing with others.

They really shine when the yeast drops right out but they still have freshness.


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## Spiesy (28/4/14)

I have a really nice one on tap right now, and I don't usually dig this style. 

94% TF Maris Otter. 
6% Simpsons Medium Crystal. 

32 IBU of EK Goldings at 60mins. 
30g EK Goldings at flame out. 

67-degree mash for 60 mins. 

21 litre batch. 
1054 OG. 1016 FG.

WLP005 for 10-days.


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## Yeastfridge (28/4/14)

I think I might brew one this week. I often pull my recipes out of my arse, and for this I'll do something like:
88% Maris Otter/Golden Promise
6% amber/victory
5% medium crystal
1% chocolate malt or roasted barley.

Enough for an OG of 1.050-1.055. 

1 tsp calcium carbonate
2 tsp calcium sulfate
(I use Sydney tap water) 

Infusion mash 66 'C.

EKG or Target hops to 45 IBU
30G EKG or Styrian Golding cube hopped (I have an immersion chiller so will probably do this as flameout addition, so maybe adjust your IBU calculations). 

I'll use WLP005 because I've got some and it came out very nicely in my ordinary bitter. 
Curious to hear what other people reckon about yeast.

Unlike hopped up US styles, in my humble opinion ESBs are a great no chill brew. I'm also a BIABer, and just stopped no-chilling.


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## manticle (28/4/14)

Recipe looks good but I question the carbonate addition. What's it for?

Also not sure how big your teaspoons are and whether or not you heap them but I reckon a couple of my teaspoons averagely heaped might be more gypsum than I'd usually aim for.


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## Judanero (28/4/14)

Here's a recipe I've done multiple times and rather enjoy.

5.45Kg Pale ale (Bairds UK)

19g East Kent Goldings (5.2%AA) @90
35g Fuggles  (4.5%AA)@90
5g Magnum (14%AA)@90

17g East Kent Goldings (5.2%AA)@10
[email protected] 10

1 tsp yeast nutrient @ flameout

Mash in 60, 66 for 90, 72 for 10, 78 for 10

90 min boil
Wyeast Ringwood Ale 1187 ferment @ 19 (I actually prefer this over 1469 which I also love, but prefer 1187 for this recipe)

Total vol=~25L


IMO best bottle conditioned, but good in the keg after ~2 weeks.

:beer:


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## pk.sax (28/4/14)

I've been using the wlp005 British ale yeast as well, very good results. Very yummy.

I've got the wyeast version - ringwood ale yeast for my next try though.

Btw, EKG and Styrian goldings are a fairly different hop to each other. I don't mind EKG but the fuggles family (fuggles, Styrian goldings and willamette) I absolutely love. The floral smooth earthy bitterness is great. A nice crystal sort of hides the earthiness very well too. It isn't necessary to dry hop the ESB if the kettle additions were good enough 

Wrt uk crystals, try a bit of caraaroma instead, I think it's a more all round crystal. Personal choice there though. I haven't seen 200 grams of any crystal make the difference 200g of caraaroma does.


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## manticle (28/4/14)

I fell in love with simpsons heritage crystal which unfortunately is no longer available. I have found an equal blend of simpsons light, medium and dark comes pretty close.


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## Andy_Chil (29/4/14)

Spiesy said:


> I have a really nice one on tap right now, and I don't usually dig this style.
> 
> 94% TF Maris Otter.
> 6% Simpsons Medium Crystal.
> ...


I'm not sure if this is a dumb question...how do I calculate the grain weights based on the above percentages? A batch figure of 21litres is given so I think I can work out the hop weight based on IBU. I wouldn't mind giving this recipe a go o the BM.


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## geneabovill (29/4/14)

You can punch the percentages into BeerSmith or some other software to dial in the actual numbers for your system.


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## Spiesy (29/4/14)

Yep, as Ruckus has suggested - if you use brewing software, enter in 94g of TF Maris Otter and 6g of Simpsons Crystal for your malt bill - then scale the recipe up in volume so that you hit 1054OG for your particular batch size and brewery efficiency.


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## spog (29/4/14)

A good read/reference is this book, Brewing Beers like Those You Buy.
Heaps of English beer recipes.



ISBN 1-85486-125-5
First published 1978 but has been upgraded and many times since.
Cheers....spog...


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## Andy_Chil (29/4/14)

Thanks Gents,

Slowly getting my head around beersmith. Did not know it could do that.
Could I indulge you to have a look at this recipe file and let me know if I have got it vaguely correct? I scaled it to 20 litres for 19 litres in keg with 1 litre fermenter loss. Thanks.

View attachment Spiesy ESB.bsmx


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## Spiesy (30/4/14)

Andy_Chil said:


> Thanks Gents,
> 
> Slowly getting my head around beersmith. Did not know it could do that.
> Could I indulge you to have a look at this recipe file and let me know if I have got it vaguely correct? I scaled it to 20 litres for 19 litres in keg with 1 litre fermenter loss. Thanks.
> ...


Would if I could, but I don't run BeerSmith, sorry.


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## Wilkensone (10/6/14)

Hoping I could get a couple opinions on an ESB I want to brew.

Ingredients
4.25 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 1 85.0 %
0.50 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (118.2 EBC) Grain 2 10.0 %
0.25 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (236.4 EBC) Grain 3 5.0 %
50.00 g East Kent Goldings (EKG) [5.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 4 30.6 IBUs
0.50 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 5 -
30.00 g East Kent Goldings (EKG) [5.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 9.1 IBUs
1.0 pkg London ESB Ale (Wyeast Labs #1968) [124.21 ml] Yeast 7 -

I'm no chilling so hops will be 60min and cube hop, mashing at 67.

I've not brewed this style (I'm newb anyway!) but I've tried to keep it simple.

Wilkens

Edit: formatting


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## sponge (10/6/14)

I'd be looking at halving the crystal additions or so. 15% crystal is quite a bit, although not unheard of.

Possibly try more 150g of both light and dark xtal? I often find 95/5 base/xtal a pretty good starting point.


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## Wilkensone (10/6/14)

sponge said:


> I'd be looking at halving the crystal additions or so. 15% crystal is quite a bit, although not unheard of.
> 
> Possibly try more 150g of both light and dark xtal? I often find 95/5 base/xtal a pretty good starting point.


Yeah fair point, thanks sponge, I'll look to get about 5% xtal. 

I'm not sure if I have fuggles still but if I do was thinking to use fuggle to bitter and keep the EKG for cube.

Also any Wyeast recommendations?


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## manticle (10/6/14)

Definitely cut back on the crystal. I used to use 500g with around 5 kg base and while I enjoyed it, many found it a touch too toffee like and I've found I prefer around 250g now. I blend light, medium and dark from simpsons in equal amounts.

A hint of toasty malt never goes astray - victory, biscuit, etc although you will get some of that character from maris on its own. Looks good but that yeast can need some assistance as it tends to slow and sometimes stall near the end.


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## Bribie G (10/6/14)

I ran the recipe through BrewMate and assuming it's for 23 litres, it would come out a bit too weak on alcohol and very dark and caramelly. I'd personally up the base malt to 5 kg and cut back on the crystals as suggested. I usually put around 200g of sugar in as well, boil it up with some citric acid till it goes dark caramel but not burning.

A great bittering hop that also imparts complex flavours is Challenger, I invariably use it as my basic hop in ESBs.

Good yeast would be Wyeast 1968 London ESB, but it can stall so keep it agitated and oxygenate well before pitching.

edit: yup saw the 1968 ... as Manticle says. You can still get 1768 that gives a cleaner finish, it's currently October stock from Craftbrewer but mine swelled up after 3 days and fired up no worries, I've got two more on the way before it disappears for two years.


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## Wilkensone (10/6/14)

manticle said:


> Definitely cut back on the crystal. I used to use 500g with around 5 kg base and while I enjoyed it, many found it a touch too toffee like and I've found I prefer around 250g now. I blend light, medium and dark from simpsons in equal amounts.
> 
> A hint of toasty malt never goes astray - victory, biscuit, etc although you will get some of that character from maris on its own. Looks good but that yeast can need some assistance as it tends to slow and sometimes stall near the end.


Great thanks Manticle & Bribie

I was aiming for final amount of 19L, so hopefully the OG should be okay?

I think I might go with a different yeast this round, looking to get this finished quite quickly.

New recipe:
4.75 kg Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 1 94.1 % 
0.15 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (118.2 EBC) Grain 2 3.0 % 
0.15 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (236.4 EBC) Grain 3 3.0 % 
50.00 g East Kent Goldings (EKG) [5.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 4 30.4 IBUs 
0.50 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 5 - 
30.00 g East Kent Goldings (EKG) [5.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 9.1 IBUs 
1.0 pkg London Ale III (Wyeast Labs #1318) [124.21 ml] Yeast 7 - 

For 19l final volume I'll be getting hopefully OG 1.059 and FG 1.015, been having some efficiency problems so hopefully I can hit those targets


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## manticle (10/6/14)

1318 is a tasty yeast. 1469 is my favourite although most of the Wy UK yeasts are pretty great.


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## Wilkensone (10/6/14)

manticle said:


> 1318 is a tasty yeast. 1469 is my favourite although most of the Wy UK yeasts are pretty great.


I can get 1469 as well, is it reasonably trouble free? :unsure:


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## Bribie G (10/6/14)

1469 is a true top cropper, you'll probably end up with a raft of "popcorn" yeasties floating on the top afterwards. Also being an old Yorkshire Stone Square variety, it likes to ferment at around 17 degrees. Excellent yeast for all Bitters, ESBs etc.


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## Wilkensone (10/6/14)

Bribie G said:


> 1469 is a true top cropper, you'll probably end up with a raft of "popcorn" yeasties floating on the top afterwards. Also being an old Yorkshire Stone Square variety, it likes to ferment at around 17 degrees. Excellent yeast for all Bitters, ESBs etc.


Thanks Bribie


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## Spiesy (10/6/14)

Really loved WLP005 in the ESB I made recently.


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## manticle (10/6/14)

> I can get 1469 as well, is it reasonably trouble free? :unsure:


Never gives me any. I too prefer it around 17 deg.


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## sponge (10/6/14)

1469 is my go-to English yeast. I've tried a fair few wy/wlp varieties and keep coming back to 1469.

Similar to BG and mants, I normally ferment at 17 and warm it up a deg/day after about 5 days with a day or two at 20-21, although that's just probably overkill. Running at 17 still gives lovely results.

If you have another cube of something ready to go, grab a few scoops of that delicious krausen after the first couple of days.


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## Donske (10/6/14)

I've currently got an ESB fermenting with WY1084 Irish Ale, I'd normally run with 1469 but had some 1084 on hand so ran with it.

It's only a couple of days in so I've got no idea what the final result will be like but I have quite high hopes for this one, will probably sample tonight.


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## mje1980 (10/6/14)

Please update mate, I have some Irish ale yeast I hope to try in some bitter n milds. When i get over my love of Edinburgh ale yeast that is


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## Donske (10/6/14)

mje1980 said:


> Please update mate, I have some Irish ale yeast I hope to try in some bitter n milds. When i get over my love of Edinburgh ale yeast that is



Irish Ale is fantastic in milds mate, I've used it in my last 2, throw some Rye into the mix with a 70 degree 30 minute mash and the low attenuation and slight sweet estery thing that 1084 does makes for a fantastic drop, I'm stuck on it for milds now.


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## mje1980 (10/6/14)

Ok cheers for the info mate, tah.


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## Batz (10/6/14)

manticle said:


> 1318 is a tasty yeast. 1469 is my favourite although most of the Wy UK yeasts are pretty great.


1318 is one of my favorites for UK ales as well. A true top cropper.

Batz


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## Donske (11/6/14)

mje1980 said:


> Please update mate, I have some Irish ale yeast I hope to try in some bitter n milds. When i get over my love of Edinburgh ale yeast that is



Took a sample mid ferment last night, smells Belgiany at the moment, really weird, hoping that the yeast clean the esters up when they finish.


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## lukencode (11/6/14)

I've got one just about ready to keg - looking foward to it:

95% golden promise
3% caraaroma
2% torrified wheat
touch of carafa for colour


37ish IBU
EKG at 60 min
EKG + stryian goldings in the cube

1469 West Yorkshire yeast


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## time01 (30/6/14)

[SIZE=medium]I have decided to follow Spiesy recipe of:[/SIZE]

_[SIZE=12pt]94% TF Maris Otter.
6% Simpsons Medium Crystal.

32 IBU of EK Goldings at 60mins.
30g EK Goldings at flame out.

67-degree mash for 60 mins.

21 litre batch.
1054 OG. 1016 FG.

WLP005 for 10-days.[/SIZE]_

[SIZE=medium]I don’t have many EKG (the 30g I do have I will use at flame out) and was thinking of using some target hops for bittering instead, is this a good idea? If so how much should I use? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Im going to do a 21litre batch also, and use 1968 yeast as 1469 was out of stock.[/SIZE]


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## manticle (30/6/14)

Target is fine for bittering uk ales. Use as much as is required to hit target ibu which depends on aa%, gravity and boil time.


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## time01 (1/7/14)

im plugging the details into brewmate and it says 75g of target to hit 32IBU for boil, does that sound right?


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## Spiesy (1/7/14)

time01 said:


> ...and use 1968 yeast as 1469 was out of stock.


Original recipe was with WLP005, from memory. Although I'm sure yours will be just as nice.


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## time01 (2/7/14)

spiesy does 75g of target hops sound a bit too much?


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## time01 (2/7/14)

spiesy does 75g of target hops sound a bit too much?


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## manticle (2/7/14)

Sounds like a lot but it depends. What's the alpha acid?


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## time01 (3/7/14)

Target uk from craftbrewer, alpha acid is 11.4, think on brew mate its 9? Even still at AA 9 and 75g, seems a lot to me?


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## Spiesy (3/7/14)

time01 said:


> Target uk from craftbrewer, alpha acid is 11.4, think on brew mate its 9? Even still at AA 9 and 75g, seems a lot to me?


For a 21l batch that does sounds like too much mate.

I didn't use that much hops and my EKG was lower alpha. Same sized batch.


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## pk.sax (3/7/14)

Use less


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## time01 (4/7/14)

How much we thinking? Perhaps 30g?


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## going down a hill (4/7/14)

I just made an english pale and used 50g but I had a 60, 30 & 10 min additions. Off the top of my head it was 30g, 15g & 15g in that order. It turned out to be a 27l brew.


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## time01 (4/7/14)

By the way I will be no chilling biab


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## going down a hill (5/7/14)

going down a hill said:


> I just made an english pale and used 50g but I had a 60, 30 & 10 min additions. Off the top of my head it was 30g, 15g & 15g in that order. It turned out to be a 27l brew.


Looking at my post, I'm really impressed with my maths.


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## Bribie G (5/7/14)

Target can be very harsh. I'd not use more than 25g personally.
Common misconception about English bitters is that they should be bitter. 
As anyone who has been there and drunk the real ales on offer will probably agree they are mostly a malty beer with hop accents.


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## pk.sax (5/7/14)

If the hops speak all bitter and smug like Sean Connery you might want to try a more gentle accent. Do Irish accent hops go well in English ales, hey Bribie?


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## Spiesy (5/7/14)

Irish hops?


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## time01 (6/7/14)

So we went with 30g of target. Unfortunately I couldn't make the brew day, but the boys said everything went well, and mashed at 65 degrees. Just checked og then and it's 1060. I was told by craftbrewer to mash at a lower temp so the fg would finish lower? Is that correct? I'm using wyeast 1968, any tips on fermenting temp given the above? Stick with 18? And finally how come the og finished so high, is it the mash temp? Or is it perhaps time to calculate with higher efficiency? Currently use 70%


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## going down a hill (6/7/14)

Yes lower mash temp ends with a lower fg. I wouldn't say that the mash temp had an effect on your efficiency, if you constantly get higher than expected og's then change your efficiency. 

If you are concerned about hop malt balance you can always take a pre boil gravity reading and use a boil off calculator (brewmate has one) to see where your post boil gravity will be, you can then adjust your hop additions to keep your hop malt balance to your original recipe. It works both ways, if your efficiency is lower than expected you wont end up with a hoppier beer than you wanted and if its higher you wont end up with a beer that's too sweet.


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## time01 (9/7/14)

cheers boys, will advise how this turns out.
doing another brew on the weekend and have upped efficiency to 75%, see how that goes.


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## Bribie G (9/7/14)

1968 might need some rousing and a bit of a warm up later, if you are fermenting below 19 degrees. It's an infamous "staller". Apart from that, sounds like you are on right track.


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## MattSR (12/7/14)

Stupid question time - what does ESB stand for?


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## manticle (12/7/14)

Extra special bitter


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## mje1980 (13/7/14)

Spiesy said:


> Irish hops?


Green potatoes


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## Vini2ton (13/7/14)

MattSR said:


> Stupid question time - what does ESB stand for?


Edward Smythe Beaverbrooke the inventor of English ale. Oh yeah, and crisps.


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## time01 (15/7/14)

Thanks bribie, it's been ticking along at around 19, checked gravity today and its 1020 with still some visible activity, hopefully it can push down a little further


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## time01 (20/7/14)

looks to have finished on 1015, tastes nice but seems to have a "creamy" taste?
will report back in a month to 6 weeks once bottles are ready to sample


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## time01 (22/7/14)

dry hopped this today and did a gravity reading once again, down to 1012 now, not sure how when it started at 1060.


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