# Cocoa Nibs - Chocolate Vanilla Porter



## Dan Pratt (14/3/16)

Hi, 

I've been making a few porters and now I am ready to move this style into a more flavoursome beer with the additions of cocoa nibs and vanilla bean. I read through this maltose falcons link and there is some handy hints. http://www.maltosefalcons.com/tech/formulating-and-brewing-winning-chocolate-porter

I wont be using that recipe, Im using my own that I've made and tuned a few times over the past 12 months The vanilla bean is good to go but I'd like to know - What cocoa nibs to use ?? Can I get them from coles, organic store, online, which have you used before ?

Recipe

*Chocolate Vanilla Porter*

OG - 1.058
FG - 1.014
ABV - 5.7%
IBU - 32
EBC - 60 ish

68% Maris Otter
15% Vienna or Munich
5% Dark Crystal
3% Med Crystal
6% Chocolate
3% Black Patent

Mashed at 67c for 1 hour - bicarbonate levels adjusted with chalk to achieve 200pm

Boil 60mins

Chinook @ 60m = 28ibu
Cascade @ 10m = 4ibu

Fermented with WLP023 - Burton Ale yeast @ 18c for 7days ( finishing ferment on 22c, gradual rise after 3days ) 

Transfer to secondary, racking beer onto the Vanilla Bean and Cocoa nibs and leave for 5-7days. 

2 x Vanilla Bean
140g x Cocoa nibs

Anyone used cocoa nibs before ? should i be soaking them in vodka or anything to sanitize them...?


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## manticle (14/3/16)

I've only ever bought mine from craftbrewer. Toast first.
Yum.


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## Dan Pratt (14/3/16)

Hi mants, I thought that cocoa nibs were already toasted?

if not does the toasted increase the flavour utilization?


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## LorriSanga (14/3/16)

Craftbrewer doesnt have em.


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## manticle (14/3/16)

LorriSanga said:


> Craftbrewer doesnt have em.


Au contraire
http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/product-search.asp

Pratty - you can buy raw nibs. Not sue if the ones I've bought previously are raw or toasted but like the oak chips I use, home toasting brings out a little extra something (and smells divine in the kitchen)


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## mosto (14/3/16)

manticle said:


> Au contraire
> http://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/product-search.asp
> 
> Pratty - you can buy raw nibs. Not sue if the ones I've bought previously are raw or toasted but like the oak chips I use, home toasting brings out a little extra something (and smells divine in the kitchen)


Listed as 'Currently Not Available'


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## manticle (14/3/16)

Phlegm


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## Dan Pratt (14/3/16)

I seen some at woolies which didn't state if they were raw or not. What is your procedure to toast them? What temps and time?


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## waggastew (14/3/16)

They are stocked at the Essential Ingredient. Roselle and Alexandria, from memory you're on the Nth Beaches so not super close unfortunately? 

The ones I got I used plain, they were already a brown colour and smelt like chocolate. I soaked them in vodka for a week and threw the whole lot in. Thinking was extracting some of the oil based compounds which will dissolve in alcohol but not water based bee. 

If using green beans I guess you would have to roast them first?


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## manticle (14/3/16)

Pratty1 said:


> I seen some at woolies which didn't state if they were raw or not. What is your procedure to toast them? What temps and time?


In moderate oven till aromatic.
Can also dry toast in pan. Sorry - no specifics - just hot till it smells good (and it smells good).


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## MickGC (14/3/16)

Gday Pratty,
I made a Chocolate Vanilla Hazelnut stout last year.
for a 22L batch I used 450g Cacao nibs, 2 vanilla beans and 300g of hazelnuts that i roasted myself.
These were added about a week after pitching yeast.and left in fermenter for another 16 days,(only left in that long due to my work roster meaning i was away)
After kegging, it was quite bitter, like dark chocolate, this then mellowed over a few months. Now it is a very smooth and chocolaty brew.

I got the cacao nibs from this place-
http://www.cravve.com.au/store/upload/index.php?route=common/home
TBH i dont know what ones they were lol

I just chucked em straight inalso added 250g dextrose at the same time, my theory was that might fire up the yeast and prevent infection, and also make some more CO2 to keep the fermenter fresh.No infection issues.
I was very concerned about the beer getting or keeping a head due to the oils in the cacoa and hazelnuts, but it isnt too bad.


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## MickGC (14/3/16)

Also, in hindsight for my brew, i would use more vanilla, and if i didnt love chocolate so much, less cacao


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## Blind Dog (14/3/16)

Some Coles stock them with the health foods - raw I think. It's a secret Mayan 'superfood' , so health food stores and fancy chemists stock it as well, although some charge a not so small fortune for it.


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## manticle (14/3/16)

Secret mayan superfood?
Awesome.


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## Mardoo (14/3/16)

I prefer my food not to leave my plate to go save someone.


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## manticle (14/3/16)

When your food wears amazing pants, you must let it be what it was born to be.


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## djgilmore (14/3/16)

I got some from ALDI a couple of weeks ago, they may still have some. They look raw not toasted.


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## Blind Dog (14/3/16)

manticle said:


> Secret mayan superfood?
> Awesome.


I kid you not. Calling it a superfood doubles the price; adding secret and Mayan to the description adds a certain mystique and a dollar or two to the price. Reckon Pratty should call his porter 'super secret Mayan Porter Power'


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## manticle (14/3/16)

I just finished reading tintin and the prisoners of the sun.


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## Dave70 (15/3/16)

I've used this a few times. Predictable and strong. Its to nibs what cocaine is to coca leaf. Available at a store near you.


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## Dan Pratt (15/3/16)

^ what was your dose rate and time in the beer?


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## TheWiggman (15/3/16)

250g for $5 at Aldi at present. Sprayed only with organic pesticides, so it's organic.


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## Dave70 (15/3/16)

Pratty1 said:


> ^ what was your dose rate and time in the beer?


It was give or take 150 grams added late in the boil, but that was in an export stout (22L) so hidden behind the malta a little. I'd be confident to go 150 in a porter.
I've heard of some brewers adding cocoa, but since cocao has had the fat squeezed out during processing I figured that was the better option. Plus I get the health benefits of all those organic enzymes and antioxidants to boot.


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## Dan Pratt (15/3/16)

^ thanks for the info.

I think for a first time I will just aim for 150g of nibs and 2 vanilla beans and for just 7days. Depending on flavour/aromas I will adjust from there.

Off to the shops to get the nibs.


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## Danwood (15/3/16)

djgilmore said:


> I got some from ALDI a couple of weeks ago, they may still have some. They look raw not toasted.


These are the Aldi ones I got. Defo already toasted, but I did them lightly again.

They smell great afterwards. A handful is going into a Manuka smoked stout this afternoon.


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## Dan Pratt (26/3/16)

Planning this beer for Easter Monday and no chilled, will be fermenting onto a US05 yeast cake slurry approx 1lt @ 22c

OG 1052
FG 1.013
IBU 31
ABV 5.2%
EBC 65

Mashed @ 68c for 60mins

70% Golden Promise ( Maris Otter from bulk buy not ready yet )
10% Munich
5% Chocolate Malt
5% Medium Crystal
4% Flaked Oats
3% Dark Crystal
3% Black Patent

60min Boil

Chinook @ 60mins = 27ibu
Chinook Cube = 4ibu

After primary ferment is complete, I will transfer to secondary onto the Cocoa and Vanilla Beans

150g - Cocoa Nibs ( yet to purchase )
2 x Vanilla Bean - sliced, scrapped and diced.


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## sluggerdog (11/4/16)

Pratty1 said:


> Planning this beer for Easter Monday and no chilled, will be fermenting onto a US05 yeast cake slurry approx 1lt @ 22c
> 
> OG 1052
> FG 1.013
> ...


Just wondering how this one turned out?

Also I was wondering as I don't do secondary could I simply add the vanilla / cacao nibs to primary after initial fermentation has complete without too much difference? Like a 10 day dry hop with vanilla / cacao instead?


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## contrarian (11/4/16)

If you're not sure about how much to add you can make a tincture by steeping the nibs or vanilla beans in a neutral spirit, like vodka, for a couple of weeks and then add to taste in the fermenter. Have done this with cacao nibs into a chocolate stout and it worked well.


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## Dan Pratt (11/4/16)

Hi,

I was able to get this fermented with US05, using a 1Lt slurry from the previous batch yeast cake. Pitched at 20c and fermentation started within 2hrs and the krausen was about 8inches high @ 8hrs, nearly reached the top of the old coopers fermenter. After 72hrs the krausen had dropped out and I left it for another 4days to clean up before transfer. The night be fore transfer to secondary I dropped the temp to 17c to get as much yeast out of the beer.

I went with Organic nibs from Coles in a 200g bag. I forgot to take some pictures, I think I still have 50g in the bag. I opened up the 2 vanilla beans and scrapped out all the goo and then chopped up the bean. I transferred the beer into the secondary stainless FV and when about 5-6litres was transferred I added the nibs and beans. closed it up and ste the temp for 18.5c. So another 7days at that temp and I will be bottling this for the midyear case swap.

Could you add direct to the primary, you could. I'm not sure if its the same as the with hops and that the yeast tends to take a lot of the oils extracted which may do the same to the nibs/beans.


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## Dan Pratt (11/4/16)

contrarian said:


> If you're not sure about how much to add you can make a tincture by steeping the nibs or vanilla beans in a neutral spirit, like vodka, for a couple of weeks and then add to taste in the fermenter. Have done this with cacao nibs into a chocolate stout and it worked well.


I was thinking about that method however after a lot of reading many people skip that process, certainly worth trying it as some reported that it got 2 benefits, better extraction of flavours and also a method of sterilizing them before adding to the beer.


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## szopen (13/4/16)

Unroasted beans have a very high micro load on them (moulds, yeast and bacteria) as they come from big fermenting heaps in tropical countries.
Roasted ones are not so contaminated but still far from sterile.

Roasting helps to develop flavour in addition to killing most of the nasties.

For roasting at home oven: single layer in a pan, spread apart, temperature at 155C for 10-15 minutes.
Cool down and crack, separate nibs from the shell for best flavour.


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## Dan Pratt (11/5/16)

The beer has been 3wks since packaging/bottling for the case swap.

I put one into the fridge today and will open that tonight and report back.










Certainly had choc aroma and flavour from the gravity sample.


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## Curly79 (11/5/16)

I made a choc oatmeal stout on Monday that called for 150g of cocoa nibs soaked in bourbon for 4 days thrown in the fermenter after 5 days of fermentation. Do you think I should toast them also? I guess the grog should kill any nasties? Gunna use over proof Bundy just for something different.


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## Moad (11/5/16)

I believe they are already toasted when you get them, not sure if it brings out any more choc flavour.

I just did 300g in spirits for a week. very dark chocolate smell, delicious.


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## Curly79 (11/5/16)

Just checked the pack. It says They are raw. Might toast them them soak them


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## Moad (11/5/16)

well there you go, I thought they were all roasted.


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## Curly79 (11/5/16)

Yep. Raw. I'm really looking forward to toasting them now. [emoji106][emoji481]


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## Dan Pratt (11/5/16)

Curly79 said:


> I made a choc oatmeal stout on Monday that called for 150g of cocoa nibs soaked in bourbon for 4 days thrown in the fermenter after 5 days of fermentation. Do you think I should toast them also? I guess the grog should kill any nasties? Gunna use over proof Bundy just for something different.


I didnt roast or soak mine, if the flavour of this one is lower than expected it could be an option for the next batch.

Are you going to rack to secondary to avoid the nibs landing in the yeast?


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## Moad (11/5/16)

Mine didn't say raw but that is quite clear, I figured the roasting killed nasties and was a part of the process so thanks for adding that. 

I put mine in a sanitised stocking into my beer, along with some coconut and cherries (cherry ripe stout).

250g for $5 is a great buy, I think I paid $17 for 500g


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## Curly79 (11/5/16)

Pratty1 said:


> I didnt roast or soak mine, if the flavour of this one is lower than expected it could be an option for the next batch.
> 
> Are you going to rack to secondary to avoid the nibs landing in the yeast?


Wasn't going to Pratty? Do you mean that this will stop the flavours coming through?


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## DeanMcMullen (3/6/16)

http://barleypopmaker.info/2009/12/15/chocolatizing-your-beer/

For what it's wor th I'm attempting this one soon. The roasted nibs mean less chance of infection due to not being raw, however the 3 day soak in alcohol to act as a sanitizer AND also to allow the nibs to release flavour seems to make sound sense to me. Especially when dealing with something that contains oils which could be volatile to the brew.


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## manticle (3/6/16)

Roasting also develops flavour and draws out oils (which can then be left behind)


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## sluggerdog (3/6/16)

My 2 cents:

I gave this a go for my first time on my latest brew.

I ended up going with the following:

150 grams cacao nibs (No Roasting, just as they came)
3 x 14cm vanilla beans (cut and scraped)
1 cup vodka

Soaked the cacao nibs and vanilla in the vodka for 24 hours then into the primary fermenter with the vodka for 10 days (nibs and beans within my dry hopping SS tube so I can remove them at the end) , this was after 11 day initial ferment (3 weeks total). Part of the 10 days with the additives was 7 days of cold conditioning (so 3 days at 18c then 7 days at 10c).

I couldn't be happier with the result from the cacao and vanilla.


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## Lethaldog (19/6/16)

I've just been putting together/playing with a recipe for this on Beersmith and I'm wondering what the difference is with these nibs compared to chocolate from a block, I was looking at using Lindt 90% cocoa added to the boil would this still work ok?


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## nosco (28/6/16)

In the link above it says that manufacturers use coco butter or other fats in block chocolate which can effect head retention or even go rancid. Could rancid fats be used to add a sour flavour to the beer? 0_o


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## manticle (28/6/16)

I wouldn't


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## nosco (28/6/16)

Sorry. Bad attempt at humour mixed with an attempt to answer an old question


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## nosco (21/7/16)

Could you add the Cacao nibs to the boil after roasting? I am going to do a Choc/Vanilla milk stout on the weekend. A bit late as winter is on the way out but im still keen.

Edit: thinking on it now maybe that would create a lot of mess in the kettle without a hop bag. Could you use it in the mash?


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## sp0rk (22/7/16)

That's how I do my choc porter
on some baking paper under the grill for a few minutes until they're nice and aromatic, then bang them into the last 10 minutes of the boil
This way I figure you may isomerize some of the oils and not ruin your head retention as badly


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## nosco (22/7/16)

500g for a double batch too much! Maybe more like 300g and add more to the fermenter if i think its needed. I have a talent for over doing things.


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