# Clearing Agents



## AkkA (2/10/07)

Hello all,

i recently inherited a heap of brewing gear from my grandfather who cannot drink beer any longer. ive put a Morgans Stockmans Draught together, and that seems to be brewing nicely, but thats not my point.

With all the gear i got was 2 sachets of Brewiser Finings (Clearing Agent). My question is, are they worth using? would they change the taste, or alter anything else in the beer? and what exactly would it clear? would it just stop the beer from being cloudy at all? or will it force all the 'dregs', etc, to the bottom?

Thanks in advance


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## cloudy (2/10/07)

AkkA said:


> Hello all,
> 
> i recently inherited a heap of brewing gear from my grandfather who cannot drink beer any longer. ive put a Morgans Stockmans Draught together, and that seems to be brewing nicely, but thats not my point.
> 
> ...


hi AKKA, yeh mate i think they just drop everthing to the bottom. i have only used finings once just to try it out and from what i can see you get the same results with a bit of patience, rack to a secondary and let it clear out by it self.

by the way the stockmans is not a bad drop.


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## AkkA (2/10/07)

Okily doke then, ill try racking it across first.

Whats the best method for this? ive got two fermenters, however the second one, which is not currently in use is at least 10 litres bigger than the one im using now. A problem or not? i cant see why it would be, but the art of brewing doesnt come naturally to me quite yet.

Also, whats the best method to do it?


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## BenH (3/10/07)

AkkA said:


> Okily doke then, ill try racking it across first.
> 
> Whats the best method for this? ive got two fermenters, however the second one, which is not currently in use is at least 10 litres bigger than the one im using now. A problem or not? i cant see why it would be, but the art of brewing doesnt come naturally to me quite yet.
> 
> Also, whats the best method to do it?



No problem about the size. Just use a bit of food-grade tubing to transfer the beer to the bottom. You don't want much splashing about, or it will oxidise the beer and ruin the flavour. You can get appropriate vinyl tubing from your homebrew store, or some hardware stores stock it as "drinking water" tubing.

Racking will improve your beers as:
- will help to clarify the beers
- will allow the beer longer to fully ferment (as you can leave the beer a bit longer in the fermenter without as much worry of yeast autolysis - yeast cell death which contributes off-flavours to your beer)

However, be *very* careful with your sanitisation of the new fermenter, and the tube (inside and out). And properly clean the tap on the old fermenter before attaching the tubing!


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## Flipper79 (14/12/07)

G'day

I'm new to this so correct me if I'm wrong but aren't finnings or beer clear just a form of glelatine?

I think the basic idea of it is that while your beer ages in the cupboard all the sediment settles at the bottom of the bottle and when you put them in the fridge to chill the gelatine sets over the sediment making it harder to stir up as you poor.

With this in mind I have started to mix a tablespoon of colourless odourless gelatine with my dextrose as I bulk prime.

Any one got an opinion on this practice?


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## troydo (14/12/07)

i add a teaspoon of gelatin to some cooled boiled water and stir till its mixed then pour into the fermenter and drop the temperature of the fermenter fridge to 4 degrees, leave it for a couple of days (depends how lazy i am) and that basically causes all the small particles to clump together and sink to the bottom. 

Also i usually sit a piece of skirting board under the front side of the fermenter under the tap to cause the fermenrter bottom to be angled away from the tap, this helps to keep the crud away from the tap


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## brettprevans (14/12/07)

Flipper79 said:


> G'day
> 
> I'm new to this so correct me if I'm wrong but aren't finnings or beer clear just a form of glelatine?
> 
> I think the basic idea of it is that while your beer ages in the cupboard all the sediment settles at the bottom of the bottle and when you put them in the fridge to chill the gelatine sets over the sediment making it harder to stir up as you poor.


it depends on the finings. there are differant sorts all with pluses and minuses. 
the natural finings are forms of gelatine. but things like Polycar are actualy plastic and not approved for human consumption. commercial brewries get rid of it in the filtering process.

the idea is to add finings in secondary (or in primary if you dont rack) a few days before you bottle. Thats way the sediment, trub, yeast cold break etc etc are pulled out of your beer before you bottle leaving you with a better, cleaner beer. Removing cold break will reduce chill haze. If you put finings in your beer when you bottle then your not removing the crap from the beer, your just transerfing it to the bottle and making it sit at the bottom of the bottle rather than leaving it behind in the fermentor.


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## warrenlw63 (14/12/07)

Here's a pic I took the other day. Same batch racked to two different kegs. One as is and one with a sachet of gelatin added.

Results more or less speak for themselves. It works quite well.  

Warren -


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## Flipper79 (14/12/07)

Correct me if I'm wrong but to get the bottles primed you must have some yeast in the bottle? And if there is yeast in the bottle there will be some sediment left from the secondary?

At the moment I just transfer the wort from the first fermenter to a second fermenter when primary has finished, immediatly stir in the required dex to prime plus 1 tablespoon of gelatine, and bottle.

By doing this I'm already leaving most of the crap in the first fermenter, are you saying I should leave the second fermenter stand for a period of time to settle before bottling?

I've never tried to rack and I don't really know much about it.


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## brettprevans (14/12/07)

hmmm not sure I should have included yeast in that list. its attaches itself to proteins (if im not mistaken) like the cold break. so it leaves yeast alone. my mistake.

racking gets the beer a lot clearer, but fninigs take it that step further. I personally dont use them and rarely rack (although I proly should)

re racking. yes you should let it stand for a little while to let it settle out again, as the secondary will still ferment it just doesnt have the bulk of the trub (yeast, hops crap etc) at the bottom. once you have left for a few days you'll notice more crap down the bottom (just less of it). so when you go to bulk prime you really should pour into another container or stir and leave for another 30min or so and wait for it to settle then bottle.


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## roger mellie (14/12/07)

citymorgue2 said:


> it depends on the finings. there are differant sorts all with pluses and minuses.
> the natural finings are forms of gelatine. but things like Polycar are actualy plastic and not approved for human consumption. commercial brewries get rid of it in the filtering process.



U sure about this CM? Interested to find out more - the breweries filtering methods are much more thorough than a single 1 micron pleated filter. Which I doubt filters ALL the polyclar out. Interesting.

Rossco?

RM


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## sathid (14/12/07)

Does polyclar have to be filtered out, or does it settle out sufficiently?


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## troydo (14/12/07)

Flipper79 said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but to get the bottles primed you must have some yeast in the bottle? And if there is yeast in the bottle there will be some sediment left from the secondary?
> 
> At the moment I just transfer the wort from the first fermenter to a second fermenter when primary has finished, immediatly stir in the required dex to prime plus 1 tablespoon of gelatine, and bottle.
> 
> ...




You can remove an awefull lot of yeast and it will still carbonate .. Remember when you originally pitch the beer you add between 6 and 12 gms to the 25l and that becomes the few L of trub i seem to end up with... so even if you gelatin it or rack it or both there will still be enough yeast to bottle condition, it just may take a bit longer


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## brettprevans (14/12/07)

roger mellie said:


> U sure about this CM? Interested to find out more - the breweries filtering methods are much more thorough than a single 1 micron pleated filter. Which I doubt filters ALL the polyclar out. Interesting.
> 
> Rossco?
> 
> RM


RE Polycar

Yep Im sure.

Ross has posted saying it needs to be filtered out. 
The Amercian FDA (Food Drugs Administration) has not approved it for for human consumption. Check out Palmer _How to Brew_
Not sure about Australia's endorsement or not.

Personally I dont like the idea of drinking plastic particles. So I would be filtering it if I used polycar. Which I wont be. I will use a gelatin based one me thinks.


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## TidalPete (14/12/07)

> the natural finings are forms of gelatine. but things like Polycar are actualy plastic and not approved for human consumption. commercial brewries get rid of it in the filtering process.





roger mellie said:


> U sure about this CM? Interested to find out more - the breweries filtering methods are much more thorough than a single 1 micron pleated filter. Which I doubt filters ALL the polyclar out. Interesting.
> 
> Rossco?
> 
> RM



I've been using Polyclar for the last 12 months or so with good results. I do not filter but prefer to let my kegs sit for a week or three before drinking (if i can last that long  ).
I am still living & breathing but perhaps the Polyclar is the reason why I am such a COB. :lol: 

TP :beer:


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## Ross (14/12/07)

Polyclar:

Regular Polyclar for practical purposes needs filtering as it is made of fine particles (average 25 micron) & takes an age to settle.
Polyclar VT is specially made for fast clarification (48 hrs) without filtering, by using bigger particles (average 140 micron).

From the MSDS: If ingested up to a level of 10% there appears to be no evidence of any toxicity; so for all intents & purposes, it's perfectly safe, though I'd prefer not to get a mouthful of grit even though it's tasteless.

MSDS etc here, for those interested http://www.ispcorp.com/products/beverage/index.html

+++

Gelatin is for yeast removal - Polclar is for Protein haze removal, tannin reduction & prolonged shelf life - 2 very different products.


Cheers Ross


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