# Best Priming Sugar/ingredient



## Brownie (24/10/05)

Dear Brewing Masters,

What is the best (or most reliable) priming sugar/ingredient?

And should you use different priming ingredients for different beer styles?

Have only done 2 brews thus far:

First brew was the Coopers Lager that came with the kit, and I used the carb drops

Second brew was a Morgans Australian Old, just bottled Sunday and used dextrose.

So much information so little time.

Cheers in advance

Andrew

java script:emoticon(':beer:')
smilie


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## mudsta (24/10/05)

I have tried many different types and amounts of priming sugars over 9years.
The most reliable i find is good old sucrose (cane sugar) It is fast, easily dissolved and has even results. Dextrose is good aswell, but takes longer and costs more.
Ive had problems with using corn syrup, very slow and unpredictable. Dried malt is also a little like this i find.

Maybe other people swear by dextrose/corn syrup or DME but i personally steer clear.

As for flavour i dont think sucrose has any residual flavors when used for priming.
My judged beers speaks for that.

I bulk prime and use between 150-165g of sucrose for a 23L batch. My amount used depends on beer style.

Hope that helps a bit,
Mudsta :beerbang:


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## delboy (24/10/05)

well you can experiment with any realy it is just the quantaties you must get right as it is about the carbonation you are trying to acheive.

as for carbonation drops well they are ok but they can give your beers a citrus tint or taste .
also depend on the types of bubbles you want to (not a true science though it realy depends on you and your tastes and what you are building .
now i wouldn't say i was an expert in this feild but as a rule of thumb i do this .
ale s "lights and pales" i use dextrose about 6-10 gms per litre again less priming saugars little less carbonation (say 6) more priming sugars more carbonation (say 10) now i like fine carbonation bubbles so i use dextrose.
ale's "ambers and bitters"again 6-10 gms per litre light pale malt 
ale,s "porters and stouts" 6 grms per liter of dbs(dark brown sugar) soft type less carbonation slightly larger bubble than dextrose.
but then i will experiment on my next batch with a mix of 3 gms dbs+3gms of dex perliter to see what i get .

no as i said not an exact science but that is what it is all about building a beer for you and what suits your pallet.

plenty of info here suggest looking at second fermenting post and bulk priming posts .
hope that helps .

delboy


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## Boots (25/10/05)

Although I now keg most of my beer, I swear by Dried Malt Extract for priming bottles. What I did was do two bottles of the same batch, one with Dextrose, and one with DME, and i noticed smaller C02 bubbles, and an ever so slightly improved taste (not more malty or anything like that though) if i was forced to explain the taste I'd say more less green. The difference could of course have been caused by factors other than the ingredient ....

I'd say the best bet is to do the same. On your next batch do a bottle with a carb drop, a bottle with sugar, a bottle with dextrose and a bottle with DME. Then make your own mind up. Keep in mind that DME will not provide the same amount of carbonation as sugar as it's not fully fermentable. Do a search on the forum to see what ratio you should use.

I reckon you'd find that most people just use dextrose..


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## quincy (25/10/05)

I'm a kegger but if the batch size is greater than 20 litres, I bottle the remainder to build up some take away stock.

I work in the hospitality industry and can get (amoungst other things  ) sugar sticks that contain 3g of sugar. So each long neck gets 2 sticks and stubbies get 1. Easy to tip into the bottle and no need to be stuffing around with measuring etc etc.

So, long story short, plain old table sugar works fine for me  

Cheers


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## deebee (25/10/05)

When I started brewing I used sucrose, plain old table sugar. Then I got all flash and used dextrose. Then I got rooly rooly flash and started using DME.

Then one bottling day, when I had no DME or dex, I just used sucrose again. It is easy, cheap and I couldn't tell the difference. Now I routinely use sucrose.


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## pint of lager (25/10/05)

If you are doing a kit and kilo, total ingredients weighs 2.7kg, priming at 10 gms per litre, that is 200 gms, so your priming sugar represents roughly 7% of your total ingredients. This means that the priming sugar will contribute to the flavour.

Years ago, I tried comparing bottles primed with LME compared to dextrose, and couldn't detect a difference. It would certainly be an interesting experiment for a club to do, get members to bottle the same batch with different priming sugars, then do blind tasting tests.

Blind tasting means that someone else pours the beers into numbered sample glasses and does not tell the tasters what glass contains what beer. This removes the preconcieved ideas about what is better.

I use dextrose to bulk prime with, dextrose to prime individual bottles and plain sucrose if I have run out. Maybe for the next few batches DME will get a go round.


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## RobW (25/10/05)

deebee said:


> When I started brewing I used sucrose, plain old table sugar. Then I got all flash and used dextrose. Then I got rooly rooly flash and started using DME.
> 
> Then one bottling day, when I had no DME or dex, I just used sucrose again. It is easy, cheap and I couldn't tell the difference. Now I routinely use sucrose.
> [post="85294"][/post]​



Totally agree


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## Linz (25/10/05)

I used dextrose for the first time, last night, for my christmas case entry. The weird thing was that the beer fizzed up a bit(almost "Disprin" like) going into the bottle. Is that normal?? Dont remember getting it with white sugar....


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## bindi (25/10/05)

You guys use 10g a L? I have never used that much, for me it is 6g/L for most and only 4g/L for a few others [depends on the style]..Mind you I use anything but white sugar/sucrose. Opps I have started something.


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## johnno (25/10/05)

I usually use dextrose at 5-6 g/L.
If i run out I use white table sugar.
I have not been able to tell the difference so far.

johnno


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## delboy (25/10/05)

yes sorry about that i use around 5 gms sugar or 7 gms dex in most of my brews 

the last brew i botteled i used 7 gms per long neck of dme

no taste difference thus far only bubble size i was told though buy another that saugar will give a citrus taint ? but i cant pick it .

any ways i going on to kegs soon so the botteling will only be very minimal so i will just use plain old sugar for them .
bulk priming is the way though as you get a better mix and consistant .

delboy


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## mudsta (25/10/05)

By the way i would just like to add....

:excl: In no way do i encourage the use of sucrose for any thing other than carbonation. I avoid it at all costs in recipes. 

Three cheers for malt!!!!!!


Happy brewing,
Mudsta :beerbang:


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## pint of lager (26/10/05)

The sugar scoop as supplied in most homebrew kits gives 7 gm per long neck which is 10 gm per litre. This amount of priming suits newer brewers used to high carbonation levels of the common commercial brews.

As the new brewers become more aware of the effect of carbonation levels on flavour (kills flavour) they will move more to bulk priming so they can more accurately control carbonation.

Generally, I use 6-7 gms of dextrose per litre, which, when you take into account that dextrose gives less carbonation than sucrose, works out to be equivalent to 5-6 grams sucrose per litre.


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## Ross (26/10/05)

pint of lager said:


> The sugar scoop as supplied in most homebrew kits gives 7 gm per long neck which is 10 gm per litre. This amount of priming suits newer brewers used to high carbonation levels of the common commercial brews.
> 
> As the new brewers become more aware of the effect of carbonation levels on flavour (kills flavour) they will move more to bulk priming so they can more accurately control carbonation.
> 
> ...



I just went & weighed the sugar using my double scoop (red) from Coles.

5 gms max on large scoop & 3 gms max on small (1 out of 3 tests just flicked under, probably due to not tapping scoop to get max sugar).

Never bulk primed - I've always felt there's a higher risk of solution not being properly mixed. Also the scoops give you a chance to vary the bottle carbonation within a batch if you so desire...


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## tangent (26/10/05)

i agree Ross,
if your solution isn't mixed in properly bulk priming can lead to inconsistency
i bulk prime with 160gms white cane sugar for 22L but use a few tricks when I fill my fermenter to make sure it's mixed.
I HAVE had bottle bombs from my 1st attempts at bulk priming due to the syrup staying at the bottom of the priming drum.
However, how i have that under control, it makes bottling a lot less painful.


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## Stuster (26/10/05)

What tricks Tangent? :blink: 

I usually bulk prime and so far the mixing has been fine. As well as anything else, it's just quicker and easier than doing each individual bottle. I attach the little bottler to the end of a piece of tubing and then you can just fill all the bottles which are sitting on the floor. Works for me.


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## pint of lager (26/10/05)

Thanks Ross, for checking out your sugar measure. Have just checked mine and it is 5.5 gms when filled with sugar.

Had read somewhere that 7 gms was the amount they measured. The first few times I bulk primed a keg, this was the amount that I based the total on, and the kegs were overprimed. Now I know why.


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## tangent (26/10/05)

Stuster
I get my priming drum, which is usually a 2nd fermenter.
I have ziplock bags with pre-measured amounts of sugar in them in the brewery (bathroom). They used to be 160gms and 180gms but I seem to go for the 160s more now, maybe because my brews are getting maltier.
I empty the bag into the drum, followed by a good splash of boiled water out of the kettle. Maybe 200mls.
I swish the fermenter around so the water runs around like swishing a red wine glass before you take a sniff. I continue until all crystals are dissolved.
Then i take my brew from the CCing fridge, and put it up high on a tall bench so there's a lot of potential energy waiting to drop the beer. *Note - No sediment (and flow) reducing tap is fitted to the CCing drum.
Now I lean my bulkpriming drum with the sugar solution in it on a 45degree angle with the tap facing up. *Note - Your tap will be full of sugar syrup so leaning the fermenter will now empty it. I think failing to do this resulted in my 1st bottle having about 5 times the sugar required. A sediment reducing tap will also be more of a pain to empty at this point.
I start dropping the beer until the tap is covered, altough still up at a 45deg angle, there's a good amount of beer and sugar mixed now. Then I rest it back to a stable upright position. The height and a normal tap results in a quick and turbulent racking but silent with no splashing. I'm fairly confident that everything has been mixed well.
When complete with about a pint of crap left in the bottom of my CCing drum, i get ready to bottle, but allowing for slight paranoia, i use a sanitised mash paddle and stir from bottom to top a few times as well.

Using almost only 750ml and 1L champers bottles and this method, I've found bottling to be much less of a chore.
I believe these improvements marked with an * have led to consistency in bulk priming.


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## OCC (26/10/05)

Linz said:


> I used dextrose for the first time, last night, for my christmas case entry. The weird thing was that the beer fizzed up a bit(almost "Disprin" like) going into the bottle. Is that normal?? Dont remember getting it with white sugar....
> [post="85531"][/post]​



hey linz i had this the first time i primed with dex,the trick is ta fill slowly, the smaller surface area of dex makes it froth up alot more than sugar. so don't be in so much of a hurry ta fill the bottles to get that carboy refilled..... occ


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## Ross (26/10/05)

tangent said:


> Stuster
> I get my priming drum, which is usually a 2nd fermenter.
> I have ziplock bags with pre-measured amounts of sugar in them in the brewery (bathroom). They used to be 160gms and 180gms but I seem to go for the 160s more now, maybe because my brews are getting maltier.
> I empty the bag into the drum, followed by a good splash of boiled water out of the kettle. Maybe 200mls.
> ...



Jeez, & that's easier than priming with the measure :blink: 

Takes me all of a couple of mins to prime each bottle with the measure - no secondary fermenters or spoons to clean, no oxidisation worries, no consistancy worries - This bulk priming has me beat unless you want to vary away from the measure amount, which I can't say I've ever had a problem with - each to there own hey  I know I'm in the minority on this one....


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## Trough Lolly (26/10/05)

Before the kegs came along, I normally bulk primed a 23L batch with 180g of dextrose in 300ml of boiled water. White sugar was a backup for when I ran out of dextrose...

I used dextrose because it's highly fermentable and leaves very little of itself behind in the brew - it may up the alcohol levels and thus lower the final gravity of the beer but I'd rather do that than apply a post boil addition of malt, which is what you do if you prime with DME or LME. I like the idea of trying different priming ingredients and doing a side by side comparison...Do whatever pleases your palate!

Never used a hard to ferment adjunct like corn syrup (aka maltodextrin) as a primer - it's best used by extract brewers who want to up the body of the beer, and don't want to muck around with its grain equivalent - Carapils...

Cheers,
TL


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## Trough Lolly (26/10/05)

Ross said:


> Jeez, & that's easier than priming with the measure :blink:
> 
> Takes me all of a couple of mins to prime each bottle with the measure - no secondary fermenters or spoons to clean, no oxidisation worries, no consistancy worries - This bulk priming has me beat unless you want to vary away from the measure amount, which I can't say I've ever had a problem with - each to there own hey  I know I'm in the minority on this one....
> [post="85723"][/post]​



G'day Ross,
I know this is drifting slightly O/T, but I need to reply to your comments here...Yep, I agree that this is a fairly detailed and labour intensive variant on how to bulk prime, but I like to bulk prime since I can then confidently bottle my beer in any sized vessel.

I have two darwin stubbies, a bunch of 330ml green stubs, some 375ml stubs, a dozen grolsch swingtops and some 780ml king browns that I bottle with. Now maths was never my strongpoint, so working out how much primer to add to each container is a load of feck!

So I toss 180g into a pyrex bowl with 300ml of water, nuke it till it boils, leave it in the freezer (covered) for 20mins afterwards and I have a primer that goes into the racking bin. I can bottle any vessel afterwards knowing I have a well primed beer. As I mentioned earlier, I keg now, but for the last 3 or more years, I bulk primed every brew and I've never had a bottle bomb or flattie!

I must admit though, that when I fill the keg and have enough left over for a six pack, I use a spoonfull of dextrose to prime the six stubbies! h34r: 

Cheers,
TL

Edit: spelling.


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## johnno (26/10/05)

I just boil some water and stir in the dextrose in a pyrex jar.
Then i bulk prime.
The only thing I make sure I do is give it a good stir so the mixture spreads out evenly.
Never had an infection like this.
By this stage there should be enough alcohol to keep the bugs away for the short while it takes to do this.

johnno


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## mudsta (26/10/05)

All i do is put my sucrose or dextrose in a plastic jug, pour 500ml boiling water over it and stir.

Tip that into an empty sterized fermenter. Rack my brew into it via hose at slow-med speed to help mix. Maybe give 1 or 2 slow stir with a spoon then bottle. 

Bulk priming is the way to go. You cant double prime random bottles, you dont
get sugar reside around the bottle top (wont cap properly) and you can bottle all diferent size bottles out of the same batch without having to adjust sugar amounts.

mudsta :beerbang:


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## bindi (26/10/05)

johnno said:


> I just boil some water and stir in the dextrose in a pyrex jar.
> Then i bulk prime.
> The only thing I make sure I do is give it a good stir so the mixture spreads out evenly.
> Never had an infection like this.
> ...


This what I do except I pour the priming sugar[usually dex now] into a 2nd fermenter [cube] transfer the beer onto it and GENTLY give it a swish around, then bottle,and bottles I have a large range of, so bulk priming makes it easy.  
Oh and I am usually drinking while bottling so I don't want to think about it. :chug:


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## Murray (26/10/05)

I bulk primed with wort I saved from the boil a couple of times. Bit of scribbling to work out the target volumes from the wort gravity. Worked well, but certainly not worth the effort.


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## tangent (26/10/05)

Ross, it sounds complex but it has really speeded up my bottling.
And what TL said about different sized bottles.


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## cubbie (26/10/05)

Trough Lolly said:


> I used dextrose because it's highly fermentable and leaves very little of itself behind in the brew - it may up the alcohol levels and thus lower the final gravity of the beer but I'd rather do that than apply a post boil addition of malt, which is what you do if you prime with DME or LME.
> 
> [post="85728"][/post]​



I just add about 300ml of boiling water to my DME, no further boiling.

I also as others have mentioned just rack onto the primer, never stir afterwoods.


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## tangent (26/10/05)

stirring is bad?


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## Linz (26/10/05)

OCC said:


> don't be in so much of a hurry ta fill the bottles to get that carboy refilled..... occ
> 
> 
> [post="85705"][/post]​




Aint that what its all about????  :chug: :beer: :beerbang:


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## Trough Lolly (27/10/05)

tangent said:


> stirring is bad?
> [post="85842"][/post]​



If you're referring to stirring the beer when you bulk prime, then yes, you should avoid stirring the brew to mix the priming fluid through it - you run the risk (although it's a pretty small risk, admittedly) that you will add air to the beer and potentially introduce cardboard like flavours to the beer. In reality, I've accidentally stirred up a beer when rousing it in primary and I haven't noticed outrageously high levels of oxidisation occurring, but anyway, it should be avoided.

And the easiest way to avoid this is to try the following technique for bulk priming:

- Pour in the cooled priming fluid to the bottling vessel,
- Fit a hose on the source fermenter and place the other end in a coil, in the bottom of the bottling vessel, (I'm assuming you gravity drop the beer from the fermenting source vessel to the bottling destination vessel).
- Carefully fill the hose with beer, place the outflow end in the bottom of the racking vessel and then let her rip so you rack to the bottling vessel with minimal bubbles and full flow of the beer out of the fermenting vessel (air is bad at this stage, as mentioned above so you want the hose to be full of beer with minimal bubbles or air in the transfer line - just like a keg beer line!!).
- Stare at the whirlpool created by the coiled racking hose and do a merry jig because physics is doing the work for you!!

The whirlpool effect the coiled racking tube creates will greatly assist in mixing the primer into the beer, without having to stir - I've never stirred my beer when I bulk prime and I've never had any bottle bombs or dud bottles. If you want to get real techo, get thee to Bunnings and buy a Pope in-line irrigation filter and put it in the transfer line to catch and filter out any hop residue before it gets to the bottling vessel...

Cheers,
TL


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## tangent (27/10/05)

I must point out, that my stirring style is more like an elderly gent doing sidestroke than a frenzied butterfly dash at the olympics. No bubbles or splashing but rather gently moving some beer from the bottom to the top. But I will bear that in mind.


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## Murray (27/10/05)

Nothing wrong with stirring as long as it is gentle. It is certainly better than a higher risk of the priming solution not being uniformly mixed.


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## Murray (27/10/05)

Ooh, double post! Here is a letter to Brewing Techniques that may be of interest.



> Priming Methods Compared
> Shortly after starting to home brew (and after reading about Reinheitsgebot, the German Beer Purity Law of 1516), I began to get philosophical about my beer and pondered whether to prime with corn sugar (dextrose) or with dried malt extract (DME). I'd like to share my observations about the pros and cons of priming with DME and dextrose.
> Because DME has only about 60-80% of the fermentables of dextrose by weight (not volume), duplicating the carbonation level of a recipe in which you used dextrose, requires that you weigh out the dextrose you used for that recipe, add 25-55%, and use that weight of DME.
> 
> ...


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## RobW (27/10/05)

Murray said:


> Ooh, double post! Here is a letter to Brewing Techniques that may be of interest.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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