# Changes Afoot At Crankandstein



## Thommo (5/10/07)

Some interesting news.

Being the procrastinator that I am, I have been um-ing and ah-ing over which mill to buy, and finally made up my mind. I went to the Crankandstein website to place my order, and found this...

(Following copied/pasted from the website.)

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We have changed manufacturers in an effort to bring you a better product, better availability, and a better value.

Monster Mills are coming soon!


Completely NEW product!!!

Would a completely CNC machined grain mill interest you? Our new mills are being built on modern equipment with state of the art accuracy. They feature:

* 6" long 1.5" diameter rollers
* Superior steel, almost as hard as stainless, "Stressproof"
* Large diameter 303 stainless knobs that are lightly knurled for a positive grip
* Aluminum frames with SAE 841 oil impregnated bronze bushings - long life
* 3/8" axles, larger and stronger than the competition
* precision machined shafts and bearings for an accurate fit
* Integral drive shaft, fine with CW, OR CCW rotation
* 3/8" standard drive shaft, with 1/2" as an upgrade option for motorizatorization

*The new mills should be ready in the middle of this month. As soon as the web site changes are done, we'll be taking pre-orders, at the low introductory price of $99. Pictured below is our pre-production model. As soon as production mills are ready, we'll have the photos updated.

Initially we will only offer a 2 roller model, with 3 roller, base/hoppers, and even larger models on the way in the future. We will also be expanding our product line outside of grain mills. Look for sanke keg conversion kits (mash/HLT, and boil), motorization packages, as well as pumps, and fittings. We've changed our name and our products, but not the friendly customer service, with your satisfaction being of the utmost importance. Its all for the beer!


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## JasonY (5/10/07)

Hmm sound sweet, I just bought a CGM-3D and its the ducks nuts so I am sure if it is the same mob running the show they will be good. I can't see this one breaking but so I will have to hold off


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## Jye (5/10/07)

Looks like they are trying to keep up with Mashmaster by increasing the roller size... but still a long way off.


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## winkle (5/10/07)

> *The new mills should be ready in the middle of this month. As soon as the web site changes are done, we'll be taking pre-orders, at the low introductory price of $99.



US $99 and getting cheaper by the day


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## troydo (5/10/07)

whats the price gonna be on the mashmaster? still says coming soon...


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## Sammus (5/10/07)

Jye said:


> Looks like they are trying to keep up with Mashmaster by increasing the roller size... but still a long way off.



Only made them an inch longer, I would've preferred to see them larger diameter, they didn't even change that though!


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## sinkas (5/10/07)

Millmaster says MillMaster is designed for professional micro breweries and pro brewers, so I doubt he'll be floggin them off for anything like US$99

Is he getting hopper designed?


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## BrissyBrew (7/10/07)

Sammus said:


> Only made them an inch longer, I would've preferred to see them larger diameter, they didn't even change that though!


length will increase crush speed, but it's diameter which is necessary if you want to reduce the ripping knurl down to a friction and textures knurl.


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## ffrancis (8/11/07)

I wanted to let you guys know what's happened over at CrankandStein recently. Please allow me to introduce myself. I'm Fred Francis. I've been partners with the guy that builds the CrankandStein mill for the last 7 years. I basically ran all of the shipping, marketing, customer service, etc, and the other guy built the mills. Any of you that have a CrankandStein mill now, I packed it, shipped it, and answered your questions before you bought it. I also paid for the web site at CrankandStein.com, and the advertising that we did in BYO (american beer magazine for brewers) out of my own pocket. In the middle of September '07 my partner decided that his mills "sold themselves", and that he no longer needed me. At first, I really hoped that I could use the CrankandStein.com URL to my advantage to sell my own mill, hence the info above. As it turns out, I'm not allowed to do that!

So, to make a long story shorter, I'm now on my own, running a different company, and selling my own design mill. It's called the Monster Mill, and is what is referred to above. I've made several design improvements on my new offering, and I feel like the new mill is a good value. I'm using 6" long 1.5" diameter rollers made out of a higher grade of steel than the competition. The knobs are knurled and of larger diameter for an easier grip. The axles are larger, and are integral to the rollers rather than screwed into the ends. You can run the mill CW, or CCW with no worries. We offer a 1/2" shaft option with 3 flats for an easy grip on a standard drill chuck. I currently have a 3-roller prototype that we're testing, and hope to offer soon. Later, we'll offer a 2" diameter roller model, and bases and hoppers. All of our mills will be CNC machined on modern equipment for the best in repeatability, and accuracy, and are made in the USA. We don't have 69mm rollers, or gears, but we don't cost as much either. TWOC in Bibra Lake, WA plans to pick up our new product, and may make an order soon.

You can check out the review of our new mill on the Brewboard at http://www.brewboard.com/index.php?showtopic=81794 . We're offering the new MM-2 model for sale at http://www.monsterbrewinghardware.com/ . I can be reached at [email protected] if you have any questions.

Looking at some of the home made mills here on your forum, I'm surprised any of you ever needed to buy a commercially built mill. VERY impressive.

Thanks,

~~fred francis
Monster Brewing Hardware


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## Steve (8/11/07)

Welcome to AHB ffrancis. Love hearing info from the horses mouth. Good luck with your venture.
Cheers
Steve


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## alexbrand (9/11/07)

Hello mates!


I already bought this MM-2 mill from Fred and have to say (concerning the price they came for to Germany) they are really good! I only had some test crushes durig assembling my mill housing but i am impressed. First I wondered, if the "rough" surface of the rollers are useful. But I think it's a good idea not to have "blank" rollers. I am quite satisfied, yet.

What I do not like is that they turn slightly rusty in a rather short time in my bureau...


Cheers,

Alex


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## alexbrand (13/11/07)

Hey peers!

Just some additional information:

I had my first crush with my new MM-2 (see above). I've chosen a medium size gap (didn't measure it) and filled the hopper with 5kg of pilsner malt. My old but wounderful 500 Watts B&D electric drill pulled the grain through in 30 secondes. It's a really good crush. I had no problems with the fact that one roller is passive. I only know now that I have to look for a bigger electric motor if I want to motorize the mill than I thought...


Alex


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## warrenlw63 (16/11/07)

A monster just arrived at my door exactly 1 week after ordering. Talk about quick !! B) 

Cost was $147 Aus landed. Fantastic price and great looking bit of kit too.

Thanks Fred and I highly recommend him for great service. :super: 

Warren -


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## AndrewQLD (16/11/07)

warrenlw63 said:


> A monster just arrived at my door exactly 1 week after ordering. Talk about quick !! B)
> 
> Cost was $147 Aus landed. Fantastic price and great looking bit of kit too.
> 
> ...



Warren,

I am waiting for mine to arrive, should be here soon. Will you be able to post some pics once you have it set up? And a bit of a critique would be good too.

Cheers
Andrew


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## warrenlw63 (16/11/07)

No worries Andrew. Not allowed to get my grubby paws on it until next week (birthday). I'll most definitely post some pics of the base, hopper and first crush though.  

I don't think my poor, partially shagged little Marga is going to forgive me though. :lol: 

Warren -


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## AndrewQLD (22/11/07)

My Monster Mill arrived today :super: no thanks to Aust Post who delivered it to the wrong address. It's a fine piece of kit and a lot chunkier than I thought it would be, compared to my good old Marga anyway. Looking forward to setting this up and running through my first lot of grains.

How's the pictures of your setup going Warren?

Cheers
Andrew


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## AndrewQLD (24/11/07)

Ran the first 5 kilo of grain through my new monster mill today, this baby requires a bit of grunt to get it rolling when the hopper is full of grain. My 14.4 volt cordless drill wouldn't even turn over and my VERY expensive XU1 corded drill ($19.99) struggle with the massive amount of torque required as well, but 4 kilo of grain crushed in under 1 minute sort of makes up for the 30 seconds of trying to get it rolling.

Fantastic crush with very little flour and the husk was pretty much intact. I was a little concerned my Eff would drop because my marga tended to produce a lot more flour but my eff went up to 86% from 82% for the same recipe.

Overall this is one well made mill that performs exceptionally well and gives a very consistant crush.

Easy to setup and comes with some good instructions on it's use.

At the moment given the great exchange rate, it's very well priced at around AU$147.00 delivered to your door.







Cheers
Andrew


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## mika (24/11/07)

So you're happy with the overall quality of the mill and the way it's put together, or did you expect low quality from a budget mill ?. I've seen some up close photo's of the thing which made me wonder a bit about it, but then perhaps I'm just being picky for a mill costing only $150.


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## AndrewQLD (24/11/07)

mika said:


> So you're happy with the overall quality of the mill and the way it's put together, or did you expect low quality from a budget mill ?. I've seen some up close photo's of the thing which made me wonder a bit about it, but then perhaps I'm just being picky for a mill costing only $150.



The quality is fantastic, everything is precision cut and finished well, to be honest, as much as I loved my marga mill there is no comparison as far as quality goes.

The rollers on the Marga are only 3 1/2 inches long compared to 6 inches on the MM, also the rollers on the marga look to be only about 1/2 the diameter of the Monster Mill ones and the deeper knurling pulls the grain through very well.

Technically this is not really a budget mill, it's only the great exchange rate that makes it cheap. A few months ago this would have cost around $200 plus delivered, the same as the smaller Crankandstien and barley crusher.

Cheers
Andrew


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## Jye (24/11/07)

AndrewQLD said:


> Fantastic crush with very little flour and the husk was pretty much intact. I was a little concerned my Eff would drop because my marga tended to produce a lot more flour but my eff went up to 86% from 82% for the same recipe.



Did you use feelers to set the same roller gap? and do you plan to reduce the gap for the next batch?


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## AndrewQLD (24/11/07)

Jye said:


> Did you use feelers to set the same roller gap? and do you plan to reduce the gap for the next batch?



To be honest Jye I set the gap to what my drill could handle at the extreme ( I don't have any feelers), it wasn't a fine crush but all the grains were broken and the husks were halved if you know what I mean, and there was a small % of flour, the crush seemed more uniform than I am used to with the Marga. I will be leaving the gap set as it is, I had good Eff results and the sparge was very smooth and didn't stick.

Cheers
Andrew


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## warrenlw63 (29/11/07)

Hey great stuff Andrew. :beerbang: 

Mine's still sitting in a box next to my desk. I'm more or less mulling over a few ideas on how to set the thing up.
Thanks for posting your findings... Be nice to come across a good motor and flywheel at the right price. B) 

Warren -


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## ffrancis (5/12/07)

Wanted to give everyone a heads up with what's going on with me here at Monster Brewing Hardware.

The MM-3 is going into production as of tomorrow, and I should have mills ready to ship some time late next week....can't commit to an exact date, but release is immanent. MM-3 will retail at $149

303 stainless rollers with 3/8" and 1/2" drive shafts will come available at the same time.... It'll be a $50 upgrade for the MM-2, and $75 for the MM-3. Availability will be limited initially. Only getting 15 sets.

Crank handle is designed and submitted, just waiting for the prototype for checkout, and pricing.

Thanks to EVERYONE!!! With all that I've been through over the last several months, I don't think it could have gone much better.  Good feedback here is really helping get the word out. I appreciate your kind words of encouragement, and especially telling your friends about Monster Mills.

Please let me know if anyone has any questions.

~~fred francis
Monster Brewing Hardware


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## warrenlw63 (17/12/07)

Okay

Step one towards a motorised monster is on the way. Just got back with this 12 inch pulley bushed for a 3/8 shaft. Cost was $60.
They also tossed in a 1/2 inch bore - 1 1/2 inch dia pulley for the motor. With a 1/4 hp, 1440rpm motor it should give me a mill speed of around 150 rpm (est.)

I'll keep posting pics as the project comes along.

Should keep me out of trouble over the holidays. :lol: 

Warren -


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## browndog (17/12/07)

Jeebers, that is a hell of a knurl those rollers have there, should be interesting to see what sort of a crush they provide.

cheers

Browndog


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## warrenlw63 (17/12/07)

Browndog

Haven't done a crush yet (Andrew has though). I suspect it would be similar to a Crankandstein.

Warren -


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## PJO (17/12/07)

warrenlw63 said:


> Step one towards a motorised monster is on the way. Just got back with this 12 inch pulley bushed for a 3/8 shaft. Cost was $60.
> They also tossed in a 1/2 inch bore - 1 1/2 inch dia pulley for the motor. With a 1/4 hp, 1440rpm motor it should give me a mill speed of around 150 rpm (est.)



Thats one hell of a large pulley you got there Warren!!  

Should act like a big flywheel, make sure you don't get your fingers jammed in the rollers  

150rpm sounds like a good speed, can't wait to see it in action.

Cheers,
Petr


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## warrenlw63 (17/12/07)

Fly-wheel good. Crushing with Fly-open bad. :lol: 

I'll keep updating as the whole thing progresses Petr.

Warren -


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## warrenlw63 (13/1/08)

Just an update re; my Mill

Finally got back from holidays and off my rear end and completed it. Also did a cupboard cleaning beer to test its capabilities. These things live up to their names of being monsters. I crushed 9kg of Barrett Burston Pale malt in around 90 seconds. Scary stuff indeed after using a Marga. 

I gapped the mill to 0.9mm which I believe is a touch too narrow. That said it produced a nice crush and no set mash. Previously the same grainbill was getting me a beer with an OG of around 1.046 on the Marga (Promash efficiency of 76%) The monster's crush got me a beer of 1.054 (Promash efficiency of 92%) for some reason. Not that I'm complaining.

So far I'm happy with its performance. Really fantastic mill for the current price. There's still a couple of things I've got to do to finish it but other than that its at lockup stage. :beer: 

Warren -


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## capretta (23/1/08)

hey, i got mine delivered today, *massive* chunky kit compared to the other mill i used (maybe 4 inch rollers on the old one?). Good quality and 5 day delivery. i got mine with the longer shaft at an exchange rate of 86c and cost me $175ish AU in total. im pretty happy with it, now to get it mounted and stuffed (with grain).


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## Back Yard Brewer (2/2/08)

After looking at the MM2 can anyone see the value of spending the extra $50u.s on the SS rollers? I realise the SS won't rust and is a harder type steel. What have others bought or found with theirs. I don't mind the extra few bucks for the larger shaft.

BYB


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## Darren (2/2/08)

BYB,

Unless you are going to pre-wet your malt (not a good idea), save the $50.

cheers

Darren


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## sah (2/2/08)

I have a Barley Crusher which is made from mild steel. I find it's the shaft that my drill grabs that rusts, not the knurled section.

Why is that?

Scott


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## sah (2/2/08)

warrenlw63 said:


> Just an update re; my Mill



Gday Warren,

Looks good. Where are the casters? You don't want to put your back out.

regards,
Scott


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## warrenlw63 (2/2/08)

SAH said:


> Gday Warren,
> 
> Looks good. Where are the casters? You don't want to put your back out.
> 
> ...



:lol: Timely reminder Scott, I actually put some on yesterday (that motor is quite heavy) ... Pics to come. 

Warren -


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## Back Yard Brewer (3/2/08)

wally said:


> If you can afford the stainless option, then IMO, that is the way to go.
> Wally




Could scrape up the extra $$ but I want to justify it first.It would be interesting to know what the marga & barley crusher rollers are made from.I think some brewers out there would have one of these.


BYB


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## warrenlw63 (4/2/08)

BYB

My previous mill was a Marga. From memory the rollers are zinc plated hollow mild steel. Certainly good enough to crush over 300kg of grain for me. Mine's still doing good duty with another brewer. Fantastic little mills if you plan to crush for 23 litre batches only.

My grainbills are between 8-10kg so I bought the Monster to cope with the extra duty.

Here's the final pics of the completed mill. Last ones I swear. :lol: Thought I'd include them if there's other brewers out there considering similar things. 

I've cut the spout from a 25 litre cube to catch the grain. Holds up to 10kg with no problems and the handle remaining is a real bonus for pouring the grain into the tun.  

Warren -


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## Cortez The Killer (17/3/08)

My Monster Mill MM-3 arrived today (ordered on Thursday 6/03/08) pretty quick!

Looks good! - went for 1/2" drive and SS upgrade (on SWMBO's orders!)

Won't have time to mount + build hopper before brew day this long weekend though

Looks like my marga will get one more go

Probably will be flogging it once the MM is right to go

Cheers


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## T.D. (17/3/08)

warrenlw63 said:


> BYB
> 
> My previous mill was a Marga. From memory the rollers are zinc plated hollow mild steel. Certainly good enough to crush over 300kg of grain for me. Mine's still doing good duty with another brewer. Fantastic little mills if you plan to crush for 23 litre batches only.
> 
> ...



Hey Warren, great idea to use a modified cube for a grain bucket! Maybe I do have a use for my 25L cube with a crack in it afterall!! :beerbang:


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## warrenlw63 (17/3/08)

Thanks T.D.

'Tis a cube reborn. B) 

Also gives me a spare black lid now. I'm cursed with such frugality. :lol:

Warren -


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## Josh (17/3/08)

Cortez The Killer said:


> My Monster Mill MM-3 arrived today (ordered on Thursday 6/03/08) pretty quick!
> 
> Looks good! - went for 1/2" drive and SS upgrade (on SWMBO's orders!)
> 
> ...


Did you order from the states? I reckon I x-rayed it on Saturday morning. I remember seeing it at the time and thinking was that the dude who was involved in Crankandstein?

I'm happy with my Crankandstein, but can't wait to hear the reports.


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