# Which Pilsner Kit?



## reformed99 (23/2/09)

Looking to do a pilsner kit with some extra saaz for my next brew. Have been looking at the following kits

Morgans Golden Saaz Pilsener
Muntons Export Pilsner
Wal's Pilsner
Thomas Coopers Pilsner

Anyone done one of these kits and how'd it turn out?


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## chappo1970 (23/2/09)

Oh how I love a pilsner!

G'day BTW reformed

Morgans Golden Saaz Pilsener - A+++ top kit, good flavours but needs bits and pieces to make it excellent
Muntons Export Pilsner - A+ As above
The others I have never tried.

I'm not to sure on where your brewing is at ATM but definitely go with the Saaz B hop additions also try some steeped crystal say 300gr and 1kg LDME instead of the BE2.


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## boingk (23/2/09)

I did a Thomas Coopers kit with 650g LDME, 300g Dextrose. I also used 20g Saaz hops (half for each addition) boiled for 15min and 0min with a bit of the LDME and a litre of water. Came out quite well, wasn't dissapointed at all.

I've also used Cascade Golden Harvest Lager, which is a bit of a pils. Recipe for that one is in the database, search for 'Black Pils' by me.

Cheers - boingk


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## brendo (23/2/09)

The Morgans kit is a great one... go with some Czech Saaz and 1kg light dry malt extract. I fyou have temp control, go with a lager yeast such as S23 or similar.

I would probably avoid the crystal as it will darken the beer - Pils should be nice and light. If you are into steeping grains, a little Carapils will add some grain flavour and aid head retention, without contribuing much in the way of colour.

Cheers,

Brendo


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## chappo1970 (23/2/09)

boingk said:


> I did a Thomas Coopers kit with 650g LDME, 300g Dextrose. I also used 20g Saaz hops (half for each addition) boiled for 15min and 0min with a bit of the LDME and a litre of water. Came out quite well, wasn't dissapointed at all.
> 
> I've also used Cascade Golden Harvest Lager, which is a bit of a pils. Recipe for that one is in the database, search for 'Black Pils' by me.
> 
> Cheers - boingk



boingk I have been meaning to thank you for that Black Pils recipe! I love it, just got in the bottles on Friday night. Can't wait to try it, BTW it was tasting damn good from the hydro readings.  

reformed forget me and go the boingk-sters black pils. You won't regret it!


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## donburke (23/2/09)

about a month ago i made my best beer, it was

st peters brewery czech pilsner fresh wort kit
added 4.5 litres water
steeped 30g saaz for ten minutes in 200ml boiling water and threw the lot in fermenter
pitched us05 at 20 degrees and threw fermenter in the fridge set at 16 degrees
fermented 12 days at 16 degrees
crash chill for 2 days at around 4 degrees
back to room temp and bottled

its been in the bottle for 2 weeks and has been tried by around 10 beer drinkers and everyone loves it

although not true pilsner because of the ale yeast, i must say it is a fantastic beer, so good that i put down the exact same recipe yesterday


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## brettprevans (23/2/09)

I assuem you can brew at lager/pils temps? ie ~10.

if not then it wont matter what kit you use as it wont bcome out tasting anything like a pils.

Ive used the muntons export and coopers. montuons better than the coopers. but if yor using kits and bits it shouldnt matter what kit you use. if its plain K&K then go the better kit.

EdIT:

Donburke - the guy is aksing about K&K kits. freshwort kits are AG. but yes he could use fresh wort. at significantly more of a cost. Also if youve just started brewing im not suprised that your best brew is from a brewery's fresh wort. no offense implied just saying that its an AG wort so it should taste great.


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## donburke (23/2/09)

citymorgue2 said:


> EdIT:
> 
> Donburke - the guy is aksing about K&K kits. freshwort kits are AG. but yes he could use fresh wort. at significantly more of a cost. Also if youve just started brewing im not suprised that your best brew is from a brewery's fresh wort. no offense implied just saying that its an AG wort so it should taste great.



no offense taken, i didnt read the brief properly

i am happy to pay the small premium of the fresh wort kit for the result i get


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## chappo1970 (23/2/09)

I would say the temperature control as CM2 says is a much more important aspect to this guys brewing. Won't matter what yeast or goodies he throws at a kit without fermentation temp control it ain't going to be a great beer. Lager or Pils brewed at 23C on say Saflager whouldn't be pretty no? We really need to know if reformed99 has the means for temperature control. Then we argue about the recipe  

BTW DonBurke I just my first FWK only a week or so ago and IMO they are wayyyy easier that K&B's and by the way it's tasting a much better resulting beer.


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## reformed99 (23/2/09)

Got a fermentation fridge so temp isn't an issue. Have only brewed ales so far though, down to about 16C with US05.

Was thinking 500g LDME and 750g Dex + Saaz steeped.

HEard that the S189 yeast could be a better bet than S23?


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## donburke (23/2/09)

Chappo said:


> BTW DonBurke I just my first FWK only a week or so ago and IMO they are wayyyy easier that K&B's and by the way it's tasting a much better resulting beer.



chappo, which FWK did you put down ?

i did a few clones using K&B, which end up costing around $35 once you trick them with hops and saf yeast to yield about 22 litres

with the fresh wort kits, you pay $39.50 and it includes saf yeast to yield about 19 litres

K&B $35.00/22 litres = $1.59/litre
FWK $39.50/19 litres = $2.07/litre

i'm lazy and the FWK suit me, but more so because of the result

i also consider that i would be paying about $6.00/litre for commercial premium beer, so i'm ahead as far as that is concerned, not counting my time


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## chappo1970 (23/2/09)

reformed99 said:


> Got a fermentation fridge so temp isn't an issue. Have only brewed ales so far though, down to about 16C with US05.
> 
> Was thinking 500g LDME and 750g Dex + Saaz steeped.
> 
> HEard that the S189 yeast could be a better bet than S23?



Well that's good to know about the temp control. I know when I got my tempmate it made the world of difference to the quality of my brews A+ reformed99
All sounds good with 500gr LDME and maybe Brew Enhacer #2 instead of straight Dex? Definitely go the Cech Saaz as brendo recommended as well. I haven't had a berl of the S189 but the S23 I have, and it's a very good yeastie for the style of beer you want to make. Just keep it 10-12C and it will reward you with a top brew. Only thing to remember with brewing a Pilsner or lager is that it can tie up the ferment fridge for some time due to frement times being longer. Also then the lager for 2-3 and or 4 weeks at a time. I usually try to do 2 brews at a time if I am doing a lager that way I ulitise the ferment fridge to the max without stuffing up my beer stocks, if you get my drift?



donburke said:


> chappo, which FWK did you put down ?
> 
> i did a few clones using K&B, which end up costing around $35 once you trick them with hops and saf yeast to yield about 22 litres
> 
> ...


NNL Brewing IPA straight up with no extras. Here's a [topic="29845"]linky[/topic] to the post I did a few weeks ago. Thanks for reminding me I need to do a bit of an update on that one.  

I agree that the Kits and bits can quickly add up $35-40 a brew easy and I think alot of people seem to forget that. The juries still out for me with FWK's but the proof is in the pudding huh?

I can't comment on the results as yet as the brew I am doing is still going and I probably won't be bottling till this weekend. But I can say that the are dead easy and if you are lazy and want to build the stocks up quickly I reckon they are brilliant!

Well it's a hobby so your right you can't add your time $ but you can drink alot more beer to compensate! :lol:


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## citizensnips (23/2/09)

I did the muntons export pilsner with S-23 just recently and hate to say wasn't overly impressed, cant remember what else i put in there, thing some form of brew blend. Dont be put off however because i think what made the batch quite average was the high level of carbonartion in the bottles which i am yet to find out what casues this.


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## brettprevans (23/2/09)

nothing wrong with FWK. im so time strapped at the moment i considered buying a couiple the other week just so I can my stocks up. and yes it is quite possible for K&K / K&B to end up more expensive than FWK esp if your biuying the premixed recipe malt converter things from HBS

FWK also have the advantage of being AG. good for people to see if they want to go AG or stay doing what they are doing. G&G has a good recipe list of what you can do with their FWK (ie adding stuff). so your also certainly not stuck with just whats in the platic container. 

oops I forgot this wasnt a FWK thread.

s189 is a swiss yeast. I love it. craftbrewer also sell their version of it (which is actually what I buy). Ive used the s-23 and it has slightly more fruity characterstics. your doing a pils so go with a cleaner lager yeast like saflager or swiss. depends on what you want.


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