# So BIAB is a thing, making the transition from full extract



## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

Hey guys. Relativly new brewer. Got 4 under my belt and doing my first pilsner next weekend.
Guys ive been reading up on all grain meathods, traditional mashing and sparging is a bit beyond me at this point id say and I dont have the equipment. However BIAB seems the goods.
Does this method work well? Does it still keep you to just the brew day?
I have a 50lt aluminum pot, a 3 ring butane burner and all the usual brewing equipment for full extract brewing.
Ive been doing full boils with unhopped extract steeping grains and hopp additions and all that and all grain BIAB doesnt seem that different. 
Like I could chuck in my grains mash them in the bag (following the correct temps and rests) lift the bag out hang it over the pot from the rails of my garage door and move straight into a boil schedual yeah?
Or am I missing something? 
Guys with the way ive been brewing is it a big step to allgrain BIAB and is it worth the step up?
Cheers in advance


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## Pogierob (24/5/15)

Do it, you have all the gear except the bag. and you are correct. it is as simple as doing the mash, removing the bag of grain and starting your boil.


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## Vini2ton (24/5/15)

Make absolutely sure that there are no spiders in your garage as they have an adverse affect on brewer health. But yes BIAB is the way to go. Plenty of stuff about it on this site.


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## nosco (24/5/15)

I did extract for about a year and then moved up to biab. I've done about 15 brews with it and I'd say it's very worth it. The average beers I have made is when I have been messing around trying to make my own recipes. Even then it wasn't terrible beer. 
If you follow popular tried and proven recipes it's very easy to make great beer. In fact I'd say as long a you use proper sanitation, temp controlled fermentation and the rest it's very hard not to make great beer. The set up cost can get out of control pretty quick though 

I started using the BIABicus from biabrewer.info. Very easy to get started with and they have a few sample recipes to get started. The recipes are all from this site I think. Brewers Friend looks the goods for biab too. I might give it a go on my next brew. Beer smith kinda sux for biab though.

I'm not sure how to describe the flavour difference between extract and all grain but AG is heaps better. Nothing like a fresh nicely carbed beer that you have made your self from AG.


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## nosco (24/5/15)

The set up cost get out of control if your stupid like me. But if you already have the pot and burner it won't cost you...erm.....much. Make your self a Swiss Voil bag.


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## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

Yeah I dont have a bag nor a false bottom (do I really need one of these?) But pretty much everything else.
Would everyone suggest sparging the grain? Ie using some water over the bag as ya would when steeping grains?

Haha I currently brew in the garage. No spiders yet, the dogs seem to like fire and beer so they not allowed to get into the brewing shindigs.

Should I 1. make a wodden box and use expandafoam to make a snug insulated box for my pot or 2. should I use that aluminium foild insulation foam stuff from clarck rubber.

Im pretty anal with my cleaning solution rinseing bath and star san tub.
Also do all the hot and cold break things amd use irish moss. I dont have a temp controlled fermentor set up however my house is pretty consistent temp being winter in Melbourne. 

In regards to AG recipes how would a BIAB method effect how one would follow the recipe? 
Or basically follow step by step?

Im like big kev now - im excited


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## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

nosco said:


> The set up cost get out of control if your stupid like me. But if you already have the pot and burner it won't cost you...erm.....much. Make your self a Swiss Voil bag.


As in go by the material from spotlight and sew it up?
How much is a bag usually? And tjey reusable yeah?


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## Danscraftbeer (24/5/15)

It only takes an esky to step up the next level and batch sparge. Then you free your kettles for sparge water or heat santizing etc.
I just didn't like the idea of lifting a big heavy, HOT! wet soaked grain bill in Nanna's Nickers. (BIAB method)
Thats too scarey for me.


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## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

Danscraftbeer said:


> It only takes an esky to step up the next level and batch sparge. Then you free your kettles for sparge water or heat santizing etc.
> I just didn't like the idea of lifting a big heavy, HOT! wet soaked grain bill in Nanna's Nickers. (BIAB method)
> Thats too scarey for me.


I was actually thinking I could get a fry basket/ big colander that I can pull out on a rope on the garage door rails and then I can sparge that way to.
I dont really know just spit balling ideas as ive never done it and it seams an easy step up from what im already doing in full extract


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## nosco (24/5/15)

Yep. Reusable, heat resistant and a better filter than the ones from a brew shop and under $20 easy. It's about $8 a meter or something but I have a big pot and bought a fair bit.

If your pot has a good base on it then you won't need a false bottom. If not just raise the bag a bit if you need to adjust the mash temp.

I don't sparge but a lot of people do. Some would argue that it's better not.

Get the stuff from Clark rubber. You might want to modifie or use your pot for something else down the track.

I don't bother removing the hot break. Your choice. Use Irish moss or similar. It makes a difference.

The good thing about the BIABicus for getting started is it will convert recipes for you but the recipe will need a lot of info like original gravity, batch size,IBU's blah blah. That's why I started with their sample recipes. Or you good just start with a simple brew and try it out. The book Brewing Classic Styles will give you more recipe's than you can probably use but a good read to get familiar with ingredients.

Ok I'm rambling now.....


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## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

Ok yeah cool ill get the gear from spotlight and clark rubber 
The pots pretty thick but id hate to ruin a batch so I might make a false bottom for it.

Ill have to give the BIAB softwear ago. Does it cost anything or is it a free program thing?


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## nosco (24/5/15)

BIABicus is a free spreadsheet so you need open office or something to run it and it might take a bit to find it on the site. You have to join to get it and don't be confused with the "calculator" or whatever, that's the old one. The latest version is 1.T or something like that. The sample recipes are already setup on the spreadsheet you just have to enter in your pot dimensions and some other details.

Brewers friend is just on the web page for free I think but I have only had a quick look. You can buy it as an app too.


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## Bbowzky1 (24/5/15)

nosco said:


> BIABicus is a free spreadsheet so you need open office or something to run it and it might take a bit to find it on the site. You have to join to get it and don't be confused with the "calculator" or whatever, that's the old one. The latest version is 1.T or something like that. The sample recipes are already setup on the spreadsheet you just have to enter in your pot dimensions and some other details.
> Brewers friend is just on the web page for free I think but I have only had a quick look. You can buy it as an app too.


Thanks mate your a legend.
Over the next few weeks ill build a false bottom. Buy material from spotlight and sew up a bag. By some insulation foam from Clarke's and chuck some velcro on it so as I can pull it on and off.
Ill also do a bunch more research and much around with the softwear.

if you all think its worth giving biab a go ill do my next brew after this pil as a BIAB

Thanks heaps everyone


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

Craftbrewer bag is $25 or something. You don't absolutely need a false bottom. One bag, one boiler. I have a a pulley, but even with a double batch of standard strength beer I hardly use it, I just lift it.

I use beertools software and have not changed anything recipe wise since switching from 3v. 

It's a simple process. Get the basics down, then complicate them later.


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## crowmanz (25/5/15)

You only really need a false bottom if you want to do a mash out or try stepped mashing, so to avoid burning/melting the bag when adding heat. I think most brewers mash with the heat off but insulated. During my mash in my urn I chuck on an old sleeping bag and it holds temp ok.

I started with a swiss voil sheet with the edges tied up hanging out of the pot because I didn't trust my sewing, I now have this https://www.craftbrewer.com.au/shop/details.asp?PID=2889 but it has a draw string and has handled my 4-5kg grain bills fine, although it isn't as tight a mesh than the swiss voil.

Get your grain bill milled (for BIAB) from your LHBS and your bag and you are ready to BIAB.


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Dont we alwag wanna do a 2 step mash? Protine rest and the saccharification rest?
And if we mash out we are gunna get better brewhouse efficiency yeah? Or an I over complicating stuff?
Im sure getting all the temps right will be fidly untill I get use to it.
I give the beer gools a look at to, is it a free softwear?
Woild it be better to mak a bag from voil as ifs finer or us the general concensus that the ones from the LHBS are the goods these days?
Yeah my local store is grain and grape and they will mill everything plus even do a fine or double mill. The blokes there ate pretty good


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## yankinoz (25/5/15)

I've been doing BIAB for four years. Long ago I did conventional mashing in a tun and would never go back. Here are a few pointers:

1. It looks like you're mashing in the brew kettle. No worries. With the voiumes you're talking about, wrapping the kettle in insulation will maintain the temp nicely. I drop mine into a box lined with earth wool.

2. If for any reason you apply heat to the kettle after the bag is in, have a colander ring at the bottom.

3. Although most BIAB brewers mash at full volume and do not sparge, you can go with a thicker mash and sparge. The gain is higher mash efficiency, the risk introducing astringency. I mash of a 2.5 -- 3:1 ratio, squeeze the bag, and dunk sparge in another pot below 70 C for 10 minutes, using water on the acid side. I drain but do not squeeze the bag after sparging.

4.Many BIABbrewers who do not sparge put grain through the mill twice and report no problems with astringency as a result. I've done that and sparged and did pick up a liitle astringency despite the precautions in #3.

5. There are many variations and opinions. See the site BIABbrewer.


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## Bribie G (25/5/15)

A few other pointers:

A bag is not necessary, just get a metre and a half of Swiss Voile from Spotlight for about $15. Put it on your garage floor, place pot in middle, draw a big circle, cut and either hem the edge on a sewing machine or melt it all the way around with a cigarette lighter or one of those BBQ lighters.





If you have suitable beams in your garage, get a couple of pulley blocks for a few bucks each, some soft style clothes line and fix up a hoist. Mine cost me less than $20 buying the pulley blocks from a stall at a flea market. I posted a pic of my 80 year old lady friend hoisting a full bag with one hand, can't find it just at the moment.




Learn how to do a hangmans noose.
To make it dead easy, do a little hangmans noose with a SS hook on the end that you can slip over the eyelet on the pulley block. So when you remove the bag you just lift it off, take out to the yard, undo the noose, empty the bag, flap flap then into a bucket of napisan and job done, no need to poke around cleaning out a bag.
I have owned around five bags and gave them all away.

The advantage of a sheet is that it hangs like a tear drop and there are no seams to give way. It's virtually everlasting, my older one is now four years old. I made a backup one, never used it.




Trust me.


To do a step mash, get one of these that cradle the bag nicely. From a kitchen shop.




To insulate the pot you can use a sleeping bag, wrapped around with a car windshield shiny foil thing and secure with two bungee cords. If you want to go upmarket you can get some of this from Clark Rubber.




You'll lose maybe a degree per half hour.

Sparging isn't necessary for normal quaffing strength beers as, if you think about it, the sparge water is actually in the pot at the beginning. The amount of sugars in wort left trapped in the grain after a BIAB mash is far less than in a 3v brew and is almost trivial compared to the extra effort of trying to recover some, especially if you squeeze the bag well.

I've only sparged when doing a strong beer, say over 6% ABV, where it can give a small amount of efficiency increase.


Apart from the quality of the beer, a big advantage of going AG is that, when you get a mill, you can buy grain by the sack and make better beer for half of the cost, or less, of extract.

edit: As Yankinoz says, with your own grain mill you can crush a bit finer for BIAB. I have a Marga Mill that I've modded to give a suitable crush. With BIAB you don't get stuck mashes so forming a grain bed of husks, as in sparging systems, isn't an issue.

further edit: you will occasionally see comments such as "I hated wrestling with the big wet heavy bag, my arms kept giving way, my shirt got soaked, that's the thing that turned me off / would turn me off BIAB"
FFS if you went onto a Holden reno forum and someone posted " I wouldn't recommend changing mag wheels by yourself because your arm will get sore holding up the front end of the car while you use the spanner with the other hand" .........

This is a craft / hobby forum and there are lots of good hints for doing things easily and efficiently but a lot of folk seem to have limited searching abilities. (not referring to the OP here as he posted with an open and enquiring mind) End rant, needed that one


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## Bribie G (25/5/15)

Another point is, don't ever let anyone tell you that BIAB is an "entry level" system that is a useful stop gap until you can somehow step up to real brewing using three vessels or whatever.

BIAB is a perfectly good all grain system that wins heaps of awards in brewing competitions and is perfect for home brewing. The only reason it's not been well known in Australia is that our All grain pioneers over here modelled their systems on scaled down industrial breweries. BIAB would not be possible or desirable at the likes of Tooheys, imagine hoisting a few hundred tonnes of grain using a massive crane or something. The mind boggles.

However it's perfectly doable at home level and produces good wort with far less stuffing around and equipment than some of the other methods that try to replicate a micro Fosters setup in the garage. That's why there has been a proliferation of single vessel systems similar to BIAB, or incorporating BIAB, over the last few years.


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## Mardoo (25/5/15)

Do it. Best thing I ever did. Don't forget that the mash will take at least an hour in most cases. 

I advise working out a meticulous process list. It'll make the difference between pain and pleasure as you get used to all-grain processes. 

Also, brew in the daytime. If anything goes sideways at night, and something will sooner or later, it makes for a very short sleep before tomorrow.


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## Bribie G (25/5/15)

Yes, do it.

As Mardoo says, write out a list and follow it.

Once you get a few BIABs under your belt there will come a brewday when you are thinking "something's wrong, it can't be this easy, I must have missed a step somewhere...". No you didn't miss a step and it is easy.


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Thanks guys. Loving that your all so helpfull.
Just got back from shopping, bunnings and such, (got the day off) I got 4 bull dog type clips to clip the bag in place, I got a pully, 6mm rope and a carabiner.
20 bucks of swiss voil, like 2m ish or something.
I got some insulation from Clarke's as well.
I decided a false bottom would be good so I bought a pot plant trolly/tray. I just realised tho the fact its covered in a protective plastic is probably a bad thing, thoughts? Also if I pull the plastic off ill end up woth steel but this will probably rust, (I doublt its stainless under it). Thoughts? Or should I just throw it away and pick something else?

Due to my burner being direct heat and expecting id do at least a 2 step mash I feel as tho I need a false bottom (or am I over complicating it?)
Other then sussing this bit out and getting some grains and printing off a recipe I yhink I pretty much got everything I need 

Just spit balling a side thought, could I hook the bag up yo the pully and suspend it when I add additional heat?
Additionally if softwear told me use 33 lt say could I put 5-10lt in a second pot at the appropriate temp (I also have a 29lt pot). When I remove the bag steep it in the 2nd pot if you will to sparge it in a way. Squeez it and let it dran into that pot the add that eater to the main BIAB pot prior to starting the boild after tje mash?
(Again am I over complicating things?)

Cheers


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Bribie G said:


> Yes, do it.
> 
> As Mardoo says, write out a list and follow it.
> 
> Once you get a few BIABs under your belt there will come a brewday when you are thinking "something's wrong, it can't be this easy, I must have missed a step somewhere...". No you didn't miss a step and it is easy.


Sounds awesome easy AG brewing and geeat tasting beer with simplified steps to traditional meathods less equipment and only minor improvments over my current full extract brewing methods... I like the sound of this


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

I step mash every beer, I use gas. I don't use a false bottom. 3 pegs hold the bag off the bottom of the pot.


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

mje1980 said:


> I step mash every beer, I use gas. I don't use a false bottom. 3 pegs hold the bag off the bottom of the pot.


Aha awesome. So you suggest I stop worrying about the bottom then? I bought these bulldog clip peg things from bunnings just before. These will do the trick? http://www.bunnings.com.au/craftright-150mm-metal-spring-clamp_p5860149
No risk of damaging the bag when suspending all that weight?


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## yankinoz (25/5/15)

Bribie G said:


> Another point is, don't ever let anyone tell you that BIAB is an "entry level" system that is a useful stop gap until you can somehow step up to real brewing using three vessels or whatever.
> 
> BIAB is a perfectly good all grain system that wins heaps of awards in brewing competitions and is perfect for home brewing. The only reason it's not been well known in Australia is that our All grain pioneers over here modelled their systems on scaled down industrial breweries. BIAB would not be possible or desirable at the likes of Tooheys, imagine hoisting a few hundred tonnes of grain using a massive crane or something. The mind boggles.
> 
> However it's perfectly doable at home level and produces good wort with far less stuffing around and equipment than some of the other methods that try to replicate a micro Fosters setup in the garage. That's why there has been a proliferation of single vessel systems similar to BIAB, or incorporating BIAB, over the last few years.


Bribie's spot on that industrial breweries could not use BIAB, and that the fact they don't is therefore no critique of the system. Thick mash or thin, the grain behaves the same way whether it's in a bag or tun. The advantage of a bag is that it expedites drainage (lautering).


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> Aha awesome. So you suggest I stop worrying about the bottom then? I bought these bulldog clip peg things from bunnings just before. These will do the trick? http://www.bunnings.com.au/craftright-150mm-metal-spring-clamp_p5860149
> No risk of damaging the bag when suspending all that weight?


I just use clothes line pegs ( don't tell the wife ). 2 is fine for a standard batch, sometimes it takes 3 for a double batch. You're only holding it off the bottom, so it's still mostly suspended in water, so isn't that heavy.


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

The bags are pretty sturdy. Honestly for a single batch of standard strength beer it's more than fine. Even for a single batch of high alc beers, it'll hold the weight fine mate.


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Awesome 
Sounds like other then grains im good to go with a BIAB batch 
Im excited. Except the fridge I picked up the other week for turning into. Keg fridge keeps tripping the gpo switch to the house.
Grrr


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## Rocker1986 (25/5/15)

I don't have much to add tips wise, it's all been covered. I've only been doing BIAB for nearly 3 years so not as experienced as some of the others on here. I have a 40L Crown urn, with a false bottom. I have a hook screwed into a beam above where I brew which I use to have a pulley/rope system for lifting out the bag. I just run the rope through the loops on the bag and tie it off, then lift it up and tie the rope to one of the urn handles. I then lift the bag up by hand and place an old metal fridge shelf under it to take most of the weight while it drains about halfway, then untie the bag from the rope and hoist it up onto the hook by the loops. Let drain while I have a beer, then squeeze the crap out of it, remove bag and commence boil.

Step mashes aren't really necessary with today's modern malts. A single infusion and a mashout is adequate in most cases. In saying that though, step mashing is fun to play with. I've started playing with Hochkurz mashing schedules in my pilsners. I may well adopt it for all beers, as it's quite easy. I found a full step mash too much of a pain in the arse and also resulted in a shitload more kettle trub for some reason. And with it not really being necessary, I don't see the point in making a brew day more difficult than it need be.

Other than that though, yeah, it's a great method for producing better quality beers than extracts at a lesser cost. You'll work out your system and refine your processes over a few batches, to suit what works best for you. I'm still refining processes after nearly 3 years! I also disagree with BIAB being something of a "stepping stone" to a 3V system. Some may well do that, but there's no reason why you can't stick with BIAB. I have and have no intention of changing. The beers are great, the cleanup is less, and it's dead simple. I'm not gonna argue with that!


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

True about step mashes. I only step mash because I like dry beers, so I mash low, and I always do a short rest at 72, for head retention, then up to 76 for mash out. Hochkurz but i don't do high 60's rest's anymore.


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Ok so we dont really do a protein rest then a saccharification rest? Just do single infusion to saccharification rest temp hold foe 60min and then mash out?
If BIAB is as simple and straight forward as it reads and produced quality beer as reviews should suggest I cant see myself going to a traditional methods costing more using more equipment and taking longer.
Hey I like the idea of using a fridge wire rack to rest the bag on over the pot clever.

if we could link a AG recipe to this thread and walk me through it from a BIAB perspective itd be greatly appreciated 

Cheers guys


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## Vini2ton (25/5/15)

I find if I get some preparation done the night before makes for a more relaxed brew-day. Weigh grain, set stuff up and what not. I get going early to have it in the fermenter on its way early so I can have a drink as is my want. I don't drink and brew.


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## louistoo (25/5/15)

I've been doing biab for 5 brews now, so minimal experience. Don't use pulley's (grain bill hasn't exceeded 5.5kg) easy with no sparge or just a litre or two of water hot from the kettle, though with a mash out for ten and a bit of vigorous mashing with paint mixing wand no real difference. I do use a false bottom for piece of mind and I do use just a 1.5m circle of (unhemmed or anything) swisse voille. This has yeilded great beer. Local hbs owner texted me with his approval of product couple of days ago. He sounded surprised! Minimal outlay. Simple. Great results (generally!) I've no intention of expanding my system. Go for it!


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

Yeah I dont have a mill and grain and grape are awedome. They are more then happy to mill or double mill any amount of any grain they have in stock. With my full extract experiance id email em the grain I needed 2 days in advance, go pick it up thursday friday take it home chuck it in the fridge and brew saturday sunday. I guess im lucky I have there service at my disposal. 

I now have a brew bag. Sheet of swiss viol, I have insulation foam from Clarke's which I have now cut up and put hols in for pot handles and ive set up my pully hook and carabiner 

Just need me a recipe and some grains.

I just realised my big 50lt pot doesnt fit into my laundry sink which now means ive lost my means of rapid cooling for cold break as my bath is upstairs and I aint risking taking boiling wort up there.
Anyone have any suggestions for how to chill without having to spend 100 bucks on a wort chiller? I also dont like the idea of using tjem as it seems a waste of water and im pretty environmently conscious

Cheers


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## DU99 (25/5/15)

Mate ..where do live..


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

DU99 said:


> Mate ..where do live..


Far northern suburbs. Back of greenvale just up from tullamarine


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## buckerooni (25/5/15)

for no-cost wort chilling - look into no-chill! dump hot wort in jerry can/cube, squeeze out the air, let it cool overnight and pitch at will!

kinda goes hand-in-hand with the less-gear BIAB KISS approach.

At the moment (1 year in) I also see no need to progress my gear beyond BIAB/no-chill/kegging.


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## Bribie G (25/5/15)

Does your pot have a tap?


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

I currently chill all my full extract batches as I like the idea of eliminating chill haze.
I dont wanna go backwards to go forward if ya catch my drift.

Nah my pots a big old pot from a commercial kitchen. Its not a brewers pot and it doesnt have anything fancy.

I do have a 2nd pot wgich is 29lt so I could possibly transfer to it after the boil or the last 15min there of to be able to fit it into my laundry sink to use ans an ice bath. Thougjts?

Also just remembered I do have recycled water so providing I got no leaks I could use it to chill using wort chiller and recyle the recyled water by then watering the plants with it  thoughts


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## troopa (25/5/15)

Just take your time, make the mistakes and tweak to suit your equipment, house, and personality. 

BTW Im still using my 60L aluminium pot that i bought of Hanzie over 6 years ago when i started out BIAB. No need for fancy round here


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## DU99 (25/5/15)

suggest you look at grain grape demo..my pot is a $20(BigW)..


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## Bribie G (25/5/15)

Aha, well the thing is that fast chilling doesn't really affect chill haze at all. What you can do is to cling wrap your pot to avoid any bugs getting in and just let it cool down overnight. In your part of the planet it shouldn't be too hard at the moment.
Then syphon or whatever you do into the fermenter.

The idea about chilling and chill haze is that fast chilling "shocks" the cold break out of the hot wort so that you can remove it from the wort by syphoning or filtering and thus avoid chill haze.

Bollocks.

I once did an experiment where I did two brews side by side and let the wort cool. The next day I took the clear wort off both brews into one fermenter and fermented them, and took the bottom wort of both brews with all the shyte and crap and cold break and fermented that.

It resulted in two almost identical brews that didn't have any chill haze, and the reason they were not identical was that, at a blind tasting at a brew club, they preferred the cold break brew. :beerbang:


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## nosco (25/5/15)

I reckon double crushing grains for biab is a bit of a myth too.


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## buckerooni (25/5/15)

a bit OT and been mentioned before but another side by side experiement leaning towards the KISS brewing approach (include hot break and trub while fermenting) : http://brulosophy.com/2014/06/02/the-great-trub-exbeeriment-results-are-in/


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

So I can buy 3m copper from bunnings for 30 odd bucks plus fittings and then use recyled water.
Would you guys do that or do one of the following. Transfer to a smaller vessel in an ice bath for cold break or transfer to smaller vessle for last 15min of the boil?
Thanks


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## takai (25/5/15)

I use a 6m pancake of 12mm copper from Masters for $30: https://www.masters.com.au/product/900008316/hardwicks-copper-pancake-coil-1-2-12-7-x-0-91mm-x-6m (slightly more now i see) and jammed some garden hose ends onto it for running the water through. I take the first runnings of the cooling coil off into a handipail for cleaning up at the end. 

Also i bought a 45cm mixing bowl cheap off a garage sale on eBay and drilled some holes in the bottom of that, i can then leave it ontop of the urn and it acts as both a lid to speed up the boil time, and as a drainage colander. This is it here, ontop of the handipail





Finally dont let anyone tell you that 'oh the grain bag is too heavy to lift'. Absolute bollocks, i lifted one with a 10kg grain bill with a pair of broken arms and a broken elbow.


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## crowmanz (25/5/15)

If you are handy and keen go the chiller

Masters have 6m copper coil for $35 https://www.masters.com.au/product/900008316/hardwicks-copper-pancake-coil-1-2-12-7-x-0-91mm-x-6m I used this recently for my counter flow chiller. 

I still prefer to no-chill as it saves time and frees me to brew when my ferm fridge is full


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## louistoo (25/5/15)

You may want to get more than that. Mine was half a roll. Like 7m I think 3/8" gives good surface area for heat exchange, then one of those no crimp bending devices and metre of hose and normal hose fittings. About 50 bucks and your home and...er hosed! if you don't wanna no chill.

they beat me to it, as above.


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## DU99 (25/5/15)

could read this Post from LRG


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## mje1980 (25/5/15)

Ah chilling, I remember that. Did that for years as well. Like BIAB, when I tried no chill after using an immersion chiller, I got rid of my chiller .






I'm not against chillers by the way I just don't like wasting water. 






And I'm really lazy


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## Rocker1986 (25/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> Ok so we dont really do a protein rest then a saccharification rest? Just do single infusion to saccharification rest temp hold foe 60min and then mash out?
> If BIAB is as simple and straight forward as it reads and produced quality beer as reviews should suggest I cant see myself going to a traditional methods costing more using more equipment and taking longer.
> Hey I like the idea of using a fridge wire rack to rest the bag on over the pot clever.
> 
> ...


You could do a Hochkurz schedule, I have been doing this on my pilsner recipes of late. Currently playing with it to work out the best times for each step. I believe protein rests are more important when using undermodified malt; most modern malts are well modified, so a sacch rest (or two) then mashout is generally sufficient.

I've been using Weyermann floor malted Bohemian Pilsner malt. I googled it before I tried it and it was split 50/50 whether it needed a full step mash or not. I did a full step mash the first batch but the second just did a Hochkurz type schedule (70 mins @ 63C, 20 mins @ 69C, mashout @ 78 for 10 mins). No real difference the resultant SG readings between the two, so it would appear that it doesn't need a full step mash, at least as far as efficiency goes. Other base malts I've used are also perfectly fine without a protein rest.

Yep that wire rack has been marvellous since I started using it. The fridge it came from is my fermenting fridge. I have ditched the airlock on my FV in favour of a piece of duck tape over the hole in the lid, allowing me to use the top shelf in the fridge plus the door for storing bottled beer in. It comes in quite handy during the cold crashing phase of my schedule!


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

I guess ill have to give a brew a go then with no chill. I hate wasting water so im not sure about the whole chiller sitcho.
Otherwise tho yeah ill be able to make one up I recon. Keen as to do a BIAB. Changing my plans from doing an extract pilsner this weekend to a BIAB


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## Bbowzky1 (25/5/15)

I was gunna be using this fridge as a keg fridge and largering fridge however it doesnt work. Probably the last time I ever go pick up a free fridge 
Looking forward to doibg an AG recipe.

On a separate note anyone in Melbourne know how to fix a fridge?


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## Mardoo (25/5/15)

Put up a "fridge needed" notice in the buy/sell forum. You'll probably have a well-priced one within a week if not sooner. Include your location in the title.


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## Brewman_ (26/5/15)

nosco said:


> I reckon double crushing grains for biab is a bit of a myth too.


This all depends on your mill and your recipe. But basically I agree.

But there are some exceptions, or at least considerations.

I find a good crack for Barley is between 0.9mm and 1.2mm. Single crack for BIAB.
For Wheat, The grain size is smaller and needs a separate crack to the barley.
Then if you use Rye, that needs a different crack, because again its a different size grain.

So for a pretty standard BIAB of Barley it will be one crack. If the Grain bill has anything that has a different grain size, Wheat, Rye, then these are cracked separately, no matter BIAB or 3V.

For a 3V system these are different again.

The ROPPI 1200 is great for getting things just right.

Cheers Steve


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## mje1980 (26/5/15)

I never changed my mill settings when going from 3v to BIAB. 


As you mention I do find different types of grain can sometimes need a gap change.


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

Im hoping the blokes grain and grape can help me out. Ill just let em know its for BIAB and im sure theyll mill it for me good


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## hellbent (26/5/15)

takai said:


> Finally dont let anyone tell you that 'oh the grain bag is too heavy to lift'. Absolute bollocks, i lifted one with a 10kg grain bill with a pair of broken arms and a broken elbow.


with your dick?? WOWWWW!!


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## paulyman (26/5/15)

hellbent said:


> with your dick?? WOWWWW!!


Come on now... He never said the arms were his.


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## Vini2ton (26/5/15)

Carrying a full 50lt pot up stairs boiling, cool or cold is a bit of an issue especially after draining the bag hanging off your dick. Even superman might baulk at that.


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

haha Im glad i wasnt the one who claimed to have removed a full BIAB bag with broken arms and an elbow, the thing people will do for beer tho am i right?


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

On a seperate note.

I wanna make a larger and im thinking of doing this as my first AG attempt and my first BIAB

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/recipe/1611-cascade-lager/
onlything ill be changing is ill be using 2 packs of saflarger s23
oh and i will use 1/2 tab irish moss and chill

does anyone see an issue with this recipe?

also other then just adding the info into BIABrewer does anyone have any tips to addapting this recipe for BIAB?

cheers guys


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## Bribie G (26/5/15)

If you are happy to wait a few weeks for a lager (not larger) with your first BIAB then go ahead. Typically you would need to ferment for a couple of weeks at around 12 degrees or less, then cold condition at near freezing for another couple of weeks.

You might be better with an ale so you can reap the benefits earlier.


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

this is true. my next batch was gunna be a full extract pilsner however now im geared up i really wanna try at BIAB.
my Birthday was yesterday and the missus agreed to get me a new corney for the fridge i picked up of gumtree. what i was looking to do was brew it up, leave it out in the garage (melbourne weather here) for 3 weeks ish, bring it inside for d rest then rack it to the corney and leave it in the fridge for 6-8 weeks.

does anyone know how to use the BIABrewer softwear im confused as fk


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## troopa (26/5/15)

Bribie you dont need a fridge down here for the next couple of weeks to lager.. its only getting to 14-16degrees during the day. Its killing me cause i refuse to use heat pads/lights (personal choice) 

Bbowzky I love ales because its 1 week or so till you know if you stuffed it up or not. if your a die hard lagerer then go for it, otherwise go for a simple ale so you may know sooner if your on the right track.

Just my 2cents


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

Troopa said:


> Bribie you dont need a fridge down here for the next couple of weeks to lager.. its only getting to 14-16degrees during the day. Its killing me cause i refuse to use heat pads/lights (personal choice)
> 
> Bbowzky I love ales because its 1 week or so till you know if you stuffed it up or not. if your a die hard lagerer then go for it, otherwise go for a simple ale so you may know sooner if your on the right track.
> 
> Just my 2cents


ok yeah very good point. what would you suggest is a nice drop? mate likes cascade pale ale, told him id make it for him but its kinda boaring, tho very largerish so could be a nice substitute

quick bottle conditioning question off topic, i have some brews in my cold ass garage, wil they condition/ carbonate if stitting below the yeast operating temps? and how long would you suggest itd take an IPA to condition in our garage?


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## takai (26/5/15)

With gloves you numpties... casts are very good for load bearing if not for absorbing wort.


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## Rocker1986 (26/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> quick bottle conditioning question off topic, i have some brews in my cold ass garage, wil they condition/ carbonate if stitting below the yeast operating temps? and how long would you suggest itd take an IPA to condition in our garage?


No.

Unless they were already carbonated before the temp dropped. If you bottled them and left them in a cold spot straight away then they most likely won't carbonate. I made this mistake a couple of years ago which is one reason I decided to start brewing lagers (not largers ) in winter instead of ales.

If they're already carbonated then conditioning at a low temp like that is no problem. Probably better than higher temps really.

They are conditioned when you decide they are at their optimum drinking. Try one a week and make a note of when you feel they're at their best.


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

Rocker1986 said:


> No.
> 
> Unless they were already carbonated before the temp dropped. If you bottled them and left them in a cold spot straight away then they most likely won't carbonate. I made this mistake a couple of years ago which is one reason I decided to start brewing lagers (not largers ) in winter instead of ales.
> 
> ...


ok cool so i really need them inside to carbonate.
after the primary i waited out to 14 days, i then put the fermentors out n the garage (sg had sytabilized before i did this) and let them sit for a week, i then bottled them. so at garage temps.
what your saying is i should really bring em inside for 2 weeks to let them carbonate then take em back outside?

cheers


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## Rocker1986 (26/5/15)

Well, what is the actual temp of them? IN any case, storing them at 18C or above for two weeks is the best way to ensure carbonation happens.

In my fiasco, they sort of quarter carbonated before the temp dropped too low, and even when the weather warmed up again, they still didn't carbonate. I did receive advice that they would, but that wasn't my experience.

I have, on occasion, used my brewing fridge as a hot box of sorts to make sure ales carbonate properly. I put all the bottles in there, boiled a 2L Erlenmeyer flask of water on the stove and stuck that in on a towel on the floor of the fridge and closed the door. Re-boiled the flask twice a day for a couple of days. Got it up to 27 in there at one stage :lol: however, usually I'm too lazy to bother doing that so i just brew lagers as they will carbonate in my usual bottle storage cupboard at the lower temperatures of winter.


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## jimmy_jangles (26/5/15)

27 degrees will carbonate your ale...but i would imagine you would get some undesirable flavours at that temp, 16 - 19 degrees c for a while longer is how i like to condition my ales, worth the wait in my opinion


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

I live in melbournes north so current temps in the garage are around 10c


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## Rocker1986 (26/5/15)

Yeah I dunno if the beers themselves were that hot, that was just the highest the inside of the fridge got. They were bottled cold from CCing, so I wanted to get the temp up quickly. I left it alone after that to allow it to drop back to 18-20ish.

In saying that I don't think the carbonation temperature has much effect on the flavour of the beer. These flavours have already been created during the first few days of the primary fermentation - this is the point where you want to control the temperature in a good range for whatever you intend the beer to be.

I find my ales are ready to drink at different time frames depending on what they are. Paler styles are better fresh (standard APAs etc, not IPAs), reds I find good at a 2-3 months, porters/stouts I leave for at least 6 months if not 12. I don't brew IPAs so have no experience on when they would be at their best.


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## Rocker1986 (26/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> I live in melbournes north so current temps in the garage are around 10c


Ok well that won't be warm enough to carbonate ales. That's about what mine were sitting at when they failed. I would be moving them to a warmer location for 2-3 weeks to allow them to carbonate, then shift them back to the garage.


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## contrarian (26/5/15)

My first BIAB was a single malt and single hop (SMASH) beer using Maris otter and Amarillo. It's a good way to start and learn the process without introducing too many variables. 

For a 20L batch use around 5kg of ale malt and then choose a hop you like and aim for about 25-30 IBU with about 10-15 IBU as a bittering addition at 60 minutes and then the rest at flame out. This should give you a beer around 1.045-1.050. 

Mash at 65C for 90 minutes. 

I no chill and find it easier than chilling and means I can stockpile wort to ferment later on. 

To transfer hot wort to the cube you can either add a ball valve or buy about 2m of silicone hose and a jiggle syphon.

The BIABacus looks complex but you really only need to fill out a few fields. The dimensions of your pot, the desired volume and the target gravity. Once you've done that you can add grains to the table on the left hand side and instead of a weight add a percentage of the grain bill, in the recipe above 100. 

With this info it should calculate the amount of water you need to start with. 

In the table for the hops you need the target IBUs for the recipe and the AA% for the hops. For the timing you use the time until the end of the boil so for a 60 minute boil a 60 minute hop addition is added at the start of the boil. 

For your first few brews focus on getting comfortable with the process and keeping good records of things like volume, temperature and SG. This will help make software more helpful for your equipment. 

This all sounds pretty complicated but it really is a simple process and generally the worst thing that can happen is that you'll make beer!


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## troopa (26/5/15)

Crack one of your beers and let us know how they are?
Thats my philosophy.. and its the only way to tell with your set up.
I do agree with rocker though that 10deg is too cold but it will most likely carb up but take far longer then you want. if you can warm up a few at a time for another week of so itll help if they are flatish

Crack a beer... you know you wanna


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

Yeah sounds good.
Ill move em in to the underneath of the pantry tomorrow arvo.
They havnt been in bottles long and in the IPA I can see the syrup (priming sugar) settled to the bottom if that makes any sense. And nah its not the sediment lol
Thanks all for ya help.


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## Bbowzky1 (26/5/15)

Ok so instead of doing a larger for my first BIAB im thinking this one.
http://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/3984/cascade-pale-ale
Thoughts? 
The BIABrewer softwear suggests a higher grain bill and hop addition and all units I convereted to metric.
I plan on just using us05 as probably dont have time to make a starter by the time I get the the LHBS.
mash in at 66 (strike) rest at 64 ish for 90min. Mash out 78c for 10min
Half tab irish moss and 1 tsp of wyeast nutrient @15min.
strain into smaller vessle and chill in ice bath.
pitch rehydrated us05 in 18c wort 
Thoughts?
Cheers


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## Rocker1986 (27/5/15)

Did you use carbonation drops or bulk prime the IPA? Reason I ask is, if the sugar is evenly dissolved through the beer, it will not settle out of solution. You would need to add about 1.5kg of sugar per litre at that temperature for it to start doing that. If you used carbonation drops then yes they will dissolve but the sugar will stay at the bottom as it hasn't been mixed through.


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## mje1980 (27/5/15)

Go for it!


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

Yeah first brew I ever bottled. Also bottled a stout same day. Due to ease and not having a bottling bucket as I was using both FV I used carb drops.


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

mje1980 said:


> Go for it!


You think its a nice looking recipe thatll produce some good beer?


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## wynnum1 (27/5/15)

Vini2ton said:


> Carrying a full 50lt pot up stairs boiling, cool or cold is a bit of an issue especially after draining the bag hanging off your dick. Even superman might baulk at that.


Is that deck like the youtube NZ video not dick.


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## mje1980 (27/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> You think its a nice looking recipe thatll produce some good beer?


Looks fine mate.


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## Rocker1986 (27/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> Yeah first brew I ever bottled. Also bottled a stout same day. Due to ease and not having a bottling bucket as I was using both FV I used carb drops.


Fair enough then. 

Back to the beer recipe, it looks very similar to the first BIAB I did, which was a recipe Craftbrewer gave me when I bought my equipment. The grain bill is a bit different, but other than that it's pretty much the same. It turned out a bloody lovely beer though so I reckon you are on a winner there!


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

Rocker1986 said:


> Fair enough then.
> 
> Back to the beer recipe, it looks very similar to the first BIAB I did, which was a recipe Craftbrewer gave me when I bought my equipment. The grain bill is a bit different, but other than that it's pretty much the same. It turned out a bloody lovely beer though so I reckon you are on a winner there!


Haha yeah thats what I like to hear 
Looking forward to brewing this ay


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## troopa (27/5/15)

Strike temp looks low?
Especially for melb. weather. Im usually around 71-72 for strike but thats for 10kg of grain.


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

Troopa said:


> Strike temp looks low?
> Especially for melb. weather. Im usually around 71-72 for strike but thats for 10kg of grain.


Im just going off what little knowledge I have and what ive read.
I read for aprox 5kg of grain to strike at 2 odd degrees above mash temp.

Im happy to take suggestions. I wanna mash at 64c for 90min

Cheers


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## mje1980 (27/5/15)

Aim for 65-66. Even if it drops down to 62 you'll be fine, though I reckon 1-2 seems about right ( on my keggle anyway )


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

I found this 
http://www.brewheads.com/strike.php
Brewhead suggests 68c when table is filled out best I know how.
Does that sound a better strike temp? Thats 4c above targeted


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## mje1980 (27/5/15)

You could aim for 68, though it's a little high for me personally, you'll still make fine beer mate. Check the temp every 30mins, and add heat if needed, just lift the bag. It is a s simple as it sounds mate


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## troopa (27/5/15)

Bbowzky your probably more then right.
Im going off "my" system with more grain. again your system will be different. and your far better off striking in low to start out as its a hell of lot easy ramping the temp up 2-4 degrees then stirring a bloody big pot for 20 mins to try and get the temp back down 

My sugestion would be to strike in at what it says, take a note of what the temp stabilises at and the ambient temp on the day. 
That way you can adjust it next time.


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## Bbowzky1 (27/5/15)

Troopa said:


> Bbowzky your probably more then right.
> Im going off "my" system with more grain. again your system will be different. and your far better off striking in low to start out as its a hell of lot easy ramping the temp up 2-4 degrees then stirring a bloody big pot for 20 mins to try and get the temp back down
> 
> My sugestion would be to strike in at what it says, take a note of what the temp stabilises at and the ambient temp on the day.
> That way you can adjust it next time.


If BIABacus said start with a volume of 50lt, could I say start with 45lt and have 5lt at say 70c in a separate pot. It my strike temp was to low I could add water to get it back up or something. 
And im also not using a temp to hot as to hurt the grain or impart bad flavors? 
Or again am I over complicating things?


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

MORNING GUYS. NEED SOME QUICK HELP!

Ok so ive started my cascade pale ale (my first AG and BIAB) so my sttike temp was about 67-68c. Id forgotten to take my grain outta the fridge sooner so the mash in temp stabilized at 63.
20min in and its down to almost 61c. It is wraped in clark rubber insulation foam and got 3 towls over the lid.
So the question is is it worth refiring the burner and bringing the temp up or introducung some boiling water to get the temp up or just leave it?
I really dont wanna rek my first batch.
Quick answers would be much appreciated cheers


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## Bribie G (30/5/15)

Scoop out a couple of litres of grain/liquid mixture into a large saucepan and bring to the boil on a stove top or even the burner if it's a suitable size, then tip back into mash and stir well. This is known as decoction, traditional with European breweries and won't do the grain any harm at all.
Timing of the mash isn't crucial, you can let a mash go for several hours and no harm done so just bring it up gradually until you hit your preferred temp... 65 or whatever, then re-lag the pot.

In your case as you are starting from a low level, no worries. In fact it may even give you a very slightly more fermentable wort.


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

Awesome. I had a pizza base at the bottom so I suspended the bag just off that then re lit the burner. Brought it back to 65c. Was that the tight eay yo do it?


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## Bribie G (30/5/15)

Good move, several ways to skin a cat.


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## troopa (30/5/15)

Bbowzkt1 how did you go?

I do have one question though.
Why was the grain in the fridge?

Nothing wrong with that but in software like Beersmith it can calc the strike temp of the grain temp. which would of been at your fridge temp.

Unless you have a rodent infestation(it happens) Or you have cracked grain maybe, I personally wouldnt refrigerate the grain.

Sounds like you handled it fine though.

As stated earlier.. Every ones system is different and your better off just doing it, make the mistakes and adjust as you go.


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## mje1980 (30/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> Awesome. I had a pizza base at the bottom so I suspended the bag just off that then re lit the burner. Brought it back to 65c. Was that the tight eay yo do it?


Know you know how a step mash will work on your setup


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

Ok so a few hicups but it came out awesome.
I refrigerated the grain as I got it crushed at grain and grape and had to keep it healthy 2 days till I used it.
After striking I l9st to much temp but I suspended the bag brought the temp up and kep with the mash. I started with 10 less lt in the main kettle. I followed the above steps to mash out at 78c, once there I let sit for 10min.
Removed the bag squeezed, then set aside in 10lt of 75c water for a fuurther 10min removed squeezed and added that 10lt to the main kettle.
Brought yo boil then timed 30min yill I started the 60min hop boil.
Added in some yeast nutrients and half a wirfloc tablet.
The 2nd hicup I had was I ended up with an after boil volume of 33lt not the softwears anticipated 27. I put the left over in a spare cube and in the fridge.
I chilled the wort and added to the fermenter at 20c.
3rd hichup I forgot to rehydrate my us05 (had to use dry as didnt have time yo cultivate liquid)
Ended up pitching at 18ish c

Good point is pre boil sg was 1.041 .003 above softwear anticipated, and after boil OG was 1.051 aprox .002 above that calculated by BIABacus.

I actually cracked a shop bought cascade pale ale when I was chilling and when I tasted the wort after OG measurment other yhen the sweetnes and undeveloped bitternes flavours seemed to be good. (Not close yet but I recon they will be)

I actually really enjoyed brewing this way and really hope it pays off


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## Rocker1986 (30/5/15)

Bbowzky1 said:


> I actually cracked a shop bought cascade pale ale when I was chilling and when I tasted the wort after OG measurment other yhen the sweetnes and undeveloped bitternes flavours seemed to be good. (Not close yet but I recon they will be)
> 
> I actually really enjoyed brewing this way and really hope it pays off


If you're referring to the Cascade brewery pale ale, it doesn't taste much the same as the recipe using Cascade hops, or at least it didn't to me when I tried one.

It is a fun process brewing from scratch, that much is for sure!


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

Rocker1986 said:


> If you're referring to the Cascade brewery pale ale, it doesn't taste much the same as the recipe using Cascade hops, or at least it didn't to me when I tried one.
> 
> It is a fun process brewing from scratch, that much is for sure!


You may be right.
I thought it was just that it hadnt brewed out yet. (I dont really have any experience, ive now done 5 brews none of which ive drunk yet)
Tho yeah the exact beer to which you mentioned is to what I refer.

Yeah the process was very fun I just hope its gunna be equally rewarding


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## Rocker1986 (30/5/15)

Yeah I'm not sure the Cascade brewery one uses Cascade hops, it may do, but having tasted both beers they aren't the same. The recipe I brewed which is similar to yours was a much nicer beer in my opinion.

I reckon the results from AG brewing are definitely rewarding. There are a number of advantages to it over kits or extracts. It's cheaper, you have absolute freedom and control over what goes into your recipes and also the processes you use to influence the resultant beer, and the beers just taste fresher, to name a few.


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

Rocker1986 said:


> Yeah I'm not sure the Cascade brewery one uses Cascade hops, it may do, but having tasted both beers they aren't the same. The recipe I brewed which is similar to yours was a much nicer beer in my opinion.
> 
> HOPE SO
> 
> I reckon the results from AG brewing are definitely rewarding. There are a number of advantages to it over kits or extracts. It's cheaper, you have absolute freedom and control over what goes into your recipes and also the processes you use to influence the resultant beer, and the beers just taste fresher, to name a few.


Im definitely not at the point of trying my own recipes however I like that theres more variety like liquid yeast.

Wish I didnt have to wait so long to try the beer 

Really appreciate everyones help 
Cheers


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## Rocker1986 (31/5/15)

Well, you can use liquid yeast in any type of brewing, even a kit if you wanted to. The freedom with all grain is more to do with the malt and hop makeup of the recipes, and also the mashing techniques and schedules you can use to affect the fermentability of the wort itself. These freedoms aren't really available with extracts because you are relatively restricted by how the brewery mashed the grains to make the extract. Kits are the most restrictive, depending - you can turn a pale ale kit into a stout by adding dark grains etc. but you can't turn a stout kit into a pale ale.

Waiting to try new beers does suck, but it is easier if you have a stockpile built up as you can drink previous batches while you wait for the newer ones to be ready.


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## Bbowzky1 (31/5/15)

Yeah kunda what I was getting at with the liquid yeast over dry as comparison to AG over Full Extract, tho with all the points ypu make I see I made a bad comparison. 
I have 2 batches bottles atm an IPA and dry oatmeal stout about a week away from being carbed I recon.
I have 2 golden ales (an extract equivalent I made up yo try match smurtos AG version, see "golden ale in kits and extracts" for what I did) one brewed with 1272 the other us05 (my first and only liquid yeast brew yet) they finished about 3 days ago so leaving to boytle next weekend.
Then I have an extract pilsner thats 3 days old and my first AG from yesterday.
So yeah im stockpiled up now however unfortunately none of them are still yet ready to drink


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## Rocker1986 (31/5/15)

Ah, now I get you - there is more variety and choice with the liquid strains over dry ones. B)

:lol: Well at least there's a stockpile. When they are ready, you may not find it as difficult to wait for the newest batch to be ready. Most of the time I'm not too worried about trying the newest batch - except when I brew something I haven't brewed before, or tried a new process on a batch or something. It is a bit difficult to leave them alone then, because I want to know if it worked or not.


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