# Sa Mid Year Case Swap 09



## Effect (23/1/09)

Hey everybody,

It may or may not be too early to start getting a mid year case swap organised, but I thought maybe it wouldn't hurt to get a thread going with some ideas for it. I know that I would like to know when and where it will be taking place, so that I can get a beer prepared in time for it - I don't want to be running around last minute making a beer that is not up to my standard and then wanting to pull out so that no-one has to taste my under-par brew.

So what are your thoughts? Venue and Date? Theme for beer?

As it is in winter (or planned to be) - maybe some ideas for the theme could be:

- Winter warmers
- Lager and pseudo-lagers
- Euro beers


So far:

*Swappers*

Phillip


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## fergi (23/1/09)

Phillip said:


> Hey everybody,
> 
> It may or may not be too early to start getting a mid year case swap organised, but I thought maybe it wouldn't hurt to get a thread going with some ideas for it. I know that I would like to know when and where it will be taking place, so that I can get a beer prepared in time for it - I don't want to be running around last minute making a beer that is not up to my standard and then wanting to pull out so that no-one has to taste my under-par brew.
> 
> ...


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## peas_and_corn (23/1/09)

*Swappers*

Phillip
FERGI
peas_and_corn


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## Frank (23/1/09)

Link to Wiki Article
*Swappers*

Phillip
FERGI
peas_and_corn
Boston


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## Effect (23/1/09)

Thanks boston for the wiki...


Has anybody got any ideas about the theme?


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## peas_and_corn (23/1/09)

How about beer? I like beer.


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## Goofinder (23/1/09)

peas_and_corn said:


> How about beer? I like beer.


As do I. I think we should all make beer. 

I seem to recall someone putting their hand up to host the next one in the other thread... not sure though.


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## Frank (23/1/09)

Phillip said:


> Has anybody got any ideas about the theme?


Not too fussed on a theme. I am not a big fan of Belgians or Barley Wine, but I might just be waiting for that Brewer to change my mind.
I was thinking just a 'something dark', theme but don't want to rule out some ESB or Irish Red's.
Open to all suggestions, My next brews lined up are ESB, Irish Red, and another Stout... so I think any of those would be appropriate. Maybe a theme 'ideal serving temp 6-8oC'. Bigger beers that deserve a gentle warming.


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## drsmurto (23/1/09)

Boston said:


> Not too fussed on a theme. I am not a big fan of Belgians or Barley Wine, but I might just be waiting for that Brewer to change my mind.
> I was thinking just a 'something dark', theme but don't want to rule out some ESB or Irish Red's.
> Open to all suggestions, My next brews lined up are ESB, Irish Red, and another Stout... so I think any of those would be appropriate. Maybe a theme 'ideal serving temp 6-8oC'. Bigger beers that deserve a gentle warming.



I believe Wayne has put his hand up to host. 

I vote for anything winter themed so no lagers or hefes. A good dunkelweizen i wont say no to. Must be AG.

And can i put this one out there - is it possible for people to put in beers they have brewed before rather than subjecting us to their experiments?


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## Frank (23/1/09)

DrSmurto said:


> And can i put this one out there - is it possible for people to put in beers they have brewed before rather than subjecting us to their experiments?


I don't mind a first time recipe coming in, as long as it is sound beer and not just throw together to meet the dead line, and was bottled early enough to have a tasting before swap day, possible by another member before submitting. I am not that keen on last minute brewing to rush an entry in. I am happy with keg conditioned, as long as it has been tried first. 
As we know bigger beers are better in the bottle after a few months, so time for people to pick a recipe and get prepared.
If there are any experiments, bring them for a taste, not to swap.


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## raven19 (23/1/09)

Added my name to the Wiki List, up to 7 so far.

I am keen for a porter style, dark or similar. 2c.


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

Yep, I'm in.
As for theme, I don't mind, as long as it's not too restrictive. Like the idea of darks, but like Boston, I certainly wouldn't want to exclude ambers or reds from that. (particularly seeing as how I'm on a bit of an amber kick myself at the moment.  ).


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## muckey (24/1/09)

buttersd70 said:


> Yep, I'm in.
> As for theme, I don't mind, as long as it's not too restrictive. Like the idea of darks, but like Boston, I certainly wouldn't want to exclude ambers or reds from that. (particularly seeing as how I'm on a bit of an amber kick myself at the moment.  ).




You're not the only 1 on an amber kick at the moment.
I'm interested but before I put my name down, I want to make certain people wont mint pet bottles as most of my brews end up in kegs and I wont have a full set of glass untill I've completed a swap <_<


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## Frank (24/1/09)

Muckey said:


> You're not the only 1 on an amber kick at the moment.
> I'm interested but before I put my name down, I want to make certain people wont mint pet bottles as most of my brews end up in kegs and I wont have a full set of glass untill I've completed a swap <_<


I have a heap of glass at the moment, so can help you out with a donation when it gets closer. If you have a work BBQ coming up, tell them you will buy the beer, and come back with a case of Coopers longnecks. :icon_cheers:


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

Muckey said:


> You're not the only 1 on an amber kick at the moment.
> I'm interested but before I put my name down, I want to make certain people wont mint pet bottles as most of my brews end up in kegs and I wont have a full set of glass untill I've completed a swap <_<



Just put your name down, 'apeth. The details will sort themselves out.


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## muckey (24/1/09)

buttersd70 said:


> Just put your name down, 'apeth. The details will sort themselves out.




OK OK have added name t' list


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## domonsura (24/1/09)

I'm in the swap, but I'll have to confirm that I will have a venue to have it at by then  otherwise someone else might have to take the bait.


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## ~MikE (24/1/09)

awesome, i'm up for this. name's on the wiki. now for some inspiration... i'm thinking i have quite a few Belgian yeasts and it's a style i've yet to actually brew. i might try something in the vicinity of a leffe or chimay red. i'll have to probably put down a batch now to make sure it tastes alright.


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## Murcluf (24/1/09)

You have my interest as it would be nice to actually attend one this time, the only request I have is that all the swap beers be bottle conditioned rather then bottled from keg. As it was detrimental to the beer and easy to pick which one were done from kegs because they were basically flat and all the carb was in the head space of the bottle.That is the only gripe I have from the last swap. 

There was at least a couple of beers I thought were really nice but the fact they were flat took all the enjoyment away from the experience.

An Idea for a theme could be "Global Warming" considering it would be winter when we do it. The format for the theme, we choose 6 style regions of the world (i.e. AUS US ENG GER BEL IRL) that have atleast 2 distinct styles (ie. Lager/Ale/Stout/etc) and do a hat draw or preference list (first in First Served) and select 4 brewers per region. Each brew a beer of their choosing from that region. It would be nice if we could get 2 or more different styles per region. 

Globle Warming Equation: 6 regions x 4 beers/styles per region = 24 beers


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## jonocarroll (24/1/09)

I'm in! Never been to a case swap before, so someone will need to fill me in on the details/requirements.

Cheers!


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

Murcluf said:


> An Idea for a theme could be "Global Warming" considering it would be winter when we do it. The format for the theme, we choose 6 style regions of the world (i.e. AUS US ENG GER BEL IRL) that have atleast 2 distinct styles (ie. Lager/Ale/Stout/etc) and do a hat draw or preference list (first in First Served) and select 4 brewers per region. Each brew a beer of their choosing from that region. It would be nice if we could get 2 or more different styles per region.



I don't like that idea at all, I see it as pretty restrictive. I wouldn't want to get lumbered with a beer style I'm not even all that familiar with dirinking, let alone brewing.....and I know I wouldn't want to get something similar in return. It's a prelude to experimentation, and we all know how that can turn out.



> someone will need to fill me in on the details/requirements.



Brew beer, bottle beer. Do enough to fill enough longnecks for 1 for each person on the swap list, and preferably a few extras for tasting on the day. Everyone brings their case up, then takes it in turns to take 1 bottle from each of the other brewers, so we end up going home with a mixed case.
Other than that, it's like the AMB meet the other day....have a feed, have a chat, drink good beer. Bring along samples of other non-swap beer, if you have them, for others to try, and try other peoples beer as well....


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## jonocarroll (24/1/09)

Cheers for the advice buttersd70. Sounds easy enough. On the theme though - I agree that it sounds a bit restrictive; I'm new to AG, and I'm still finding my feet (despite the fact that the first 2 came out stunning no less) so I'd also hate to get handed a style that I had no idea about.

What if there were say 4 styles - precise styles - and we split up the pool into who wants to do those styles? Someone who reckons they're the duck's nuts at Irish Red or ESB or whatever could put their best effort into that style with some confidence that they know what they're doing. (Edit: I'll point out, I don't mean who can brew the best 'to-style' or who can do a 'creative' interpretation of the style, I mean who can make a damn fine beer that kinda fits into that style). Picking the 4 styles and who does which may need to be settled by fisticuffs, but c'est la vie. Just a suggestion.


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## Effect (24/1/09)

I think a broad theme (just like the 'summer session beers' from the xmas swap case) will allow brewers to find a beer worth swapping. 'Anything dark' was the theme from last years 'christmas in july case swap' - so I thought that maybe this year it could / should be different. BTW I have no objections with 'anything dark' - I am actually planning to make a dark ale...but just want a theme that will get the best out of us all - and hopefully not a case swap where all the beers are DrSmurto's golden ale...or variations thereof


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

Bollocks to 'precise styles'.......not _everyone _brews to style. I certainly don't. I brew for taste, and balance. I refer to my beers, to other people, by the style they _happen _to most closely resemble (or sometimes fit into perfectly, but thats a secondary consideration). But I never look at style *guidelines* (note the _slight _emphasis there) until I'm at least a good way into the recipe formulation. And then, I don't look at the 'specific' part of the guideline, where it has all the ibu, gravities etc. I look at the flavour profile description. How is it meant to _taste_, what are the predominant _flavours_, and _character_. Not what the friggin OG is...."oh dear, my american amber is OG 1042 but the style guidelines say it needs to be at least 1045  . I've roont it...".....bollocks and shyte.

edit in a slightly calmer tone......
Perhaps the theme could be just simply "Your best effort of a beer type (note the absence of the word 'style' :lol: ) that is _appropriate for drinking within the winter season_.


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## jonocarroll (24/1/09)

Ummm... Someone pour some gelatine over butters please? Maybe then he'll settle?  

I put the 'precise' bit in there (half just for you butters) so that there was a decent definition of what was to be brewed. Otherwise I'd imagine you end up with anything vaguely beer. I *didn't* mean (and edited as such before you posted) that the people should brew 'precisely' that beer - but something that you could say 'now that's a tasty <insert style>' about. The point of people picking which style they're good at is that they _would_ be able to find something they can make that is a pretty good example of the style.

If you had 6 people all making an ESB, and none of them adding anything crazy, you could see how different people make that style, and you'd have a 6-pack of uniquely different ESBs to compare. In some way, you could call it 4 mini-competitions for tastiest beer. I agree that counting the IBUs of each beer would be a bit of a w**k so that's not what I'm suggesting. I would be surprised in any case if 6 people tried to brew a 'specific' beer exactly to style and all ended up with something that tasted the same across the board. Picking styles with a lot of flavour would help this.

Trying to make beer, not war.


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## np1962 (24/1/09)

OK I'm in, this is just the push I need to get the rest of my AG setup and get some brews down.
Butters ... you can expect loads of questions over the next few weeks  

Nige


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

NigeP62 said:


> OK I'm in, this is just the push I need to get the rest of my AG setup and get some brews down.
> Butters ... you can expect loads of questions over the next few weeks
> 
> Nige



nyuk nyuk nyuk. A pm at the right time does wonders :lol:


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## np1962 (24/1/09)

buttersd70 said:


> nyuk nyuk nyuk. A pm at the right time does wonders :lol:



Name went in before the PM arrived


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## Effect (24/1/09)

So will anybody get upset if we make the theme 'beer appropriate for drinking within the winter season'?


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## peas_and_corn (24/1/09)

That's crazy. I NEVER have stouts/dark beers lying around.


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## Goofinder (24/1/09)

NigeP62 said:


> OK I'm in, this is just the push I need to get the rest of my AG setup and get some brews down.


The last swap is the reason that I actually got around to setting myself up for AG. 

QB: The bit that Butters failed to mention about the swap is that at some point you'll end up talking to him about styles, guidelines, balance etc. and learn not to get him started about that stuff . He does have a point most of the time though, and I definitely don't reckon a swap should be about trying to fit beers into styles. If you want to pick a style and have a crack at it then go for it (that's basically what I did for the last swap as I'm new to this AG thing), but I don't think we should be allocating styles to people or anything like that.

I reckon a general 'beers for winter' is a good enough theme. That should leave it pretty much open to interpretation. Brew a beer you like that fits in that general theme and hopefully the rest of us will like it too.


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## buttersd70 (24/1/09)

:lol: to dan...
Yeah, I go on if I see an opening
.
To save me several hours of talking on the night.....lets just say, I'm not anti-style, nor anti-bjcp. Lets just say I'm "anti- _overly literal_ adherance to 'style', which is, afterall, a compromise decision by a panel as to the basic comparable atributes of regional beer varieties, which have been categorised with the sole aim of being able to judge beers of a _like nature_ fairly against each other in a competition format"........but that won't fit on the label. :lol:


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## Murcluf (24/1/09)

Settle petals....... I only made a suggestion for an idea for theme as was requested earlier in the thread, just thought it was a way to brake up the select that all. I wasn't expecting it to be a BJCP Nazi Party gathering where everyone must conform to strict style guidelines I was talking about regions and styles very loosely. I wounldn't expect anyone to brew something they didn't too or have no interest in. Was just trying to avoid 2 lagers 3 wheats 4 APA' 15 English Bitters and encourage a bit of variety in the swap selection.

Anyway most of what I brew is considered out of style and so are a large number of commercial beers also, I learnt to take BJCP guideline with a pinch of salt when I'm brew these days.

Perhaps we just brew what ever we want and never mention the word "THEME" every again just incase it might offend someone. 

Looking forward to the Politically Correct or Public Liablity Awareness Case Swap


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## raven19 (25/1/09)

Variety in beers is what I am hoping for, so my vote is for no specific theme.

Did the last case swap utilise glass longnecks (750ml)? or was it more dominated by PET's (not sure of mls)?

2c.


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## Effect (25/1/09)

Glass

I think PET is frowned upon


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## muckey (25/1/09)

last swap was mostly glass - hence my earlier post.

On the theme issue and not to beat a dead horse but I will be brewing a version of what *I* prefer at the time. It will be a winter beer but will be something nice and easy to drink and probably something fairly sessionable. So themes and style guidelines mean very little to me. I brew the beer and then try to work out where it kind of fits, not the other way around.


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## Back Yard Brewer (25/1/09)

Murcluf said:


> There was at least a couple of beers I thought were really nice but the fact they were flat took all the enjoyment away from the experience.




Maybe they used the "Dribble Method" to fill. :lol: h34r:

BYB


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## ~MikE (25/1/09)

peas_and_corn said:


> That's crazy. I NEVER have stouts/dark beers lying around.


LOL dude



Phillip said:


> Glass
> 
> I think PET is frowned upon


i went through and turfed the PET i had and any i get these days go into the recycling. although i can see how some brewers might have trouble sourcing glass given how long i spent building up my longneck collection.


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## Effect (25/1/09)

Trouble finding long necks...

I'm going to go and buy 24 long necks of Coopers - that shouldn't be to hard to find :chug:


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## Timmsy (25/1/09)

How many long necks are you after?? I might be able to give you some if your keen?? coopers and or pick axes........ if not try the scouts bottle depots the one in the port sells long necks and grolsh bottles


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## Effect (25/1/09)

Timmsy said:


> How many long necks are you after?? I might be able to give you some if your keen?? coopers and or pick axes........ if not try the scouts bottle depots the one in the port sells long necks and grolsh bottles



I'm after at least 24...

scouts bottle depot? where are they located?


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## Timmsy (25/1/09)

Phillip said:


> I'm after at least 24...
> 
> scouts bottle depot? where are they located?



Ive brought mine from Greenfields as i live close by but also from Port Adelaide. Thats where i got most. By memory Grolsh where 50cents a bottle and pick axes and long necks where 20cents. If you cant get any pm me and im sure i could help you out. Ill look when i get home from work today and see how many i got

Greenfields - Head Office 
670 Port Wakefield Rd
Green Fields SA 5107


Show map...(08) 8252 3897

Elizabeth West
5 Ridgeway Rd
Elizabeth West SA 5113


Show map...(08) 8388 7409

Hahndorf
Nixon Rd
Hahndorf SA 5245
(08) 8447 5077

Port Adelaide
326 Commercial Rd
Port Adelaide SA 5015


Show map...(08) 8258 1424

Salisbury Plain
81 Stanbel Rd
Salisbury Plain SA 5109


Show map...(08) 8254 9498

Smithfield
43 Anderson Wlk
Smithfield SA 5114


Show map...(08) 8363 0869

Stepney
18 Payneham Rd
Stepney SA 5069


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## muckey (25/1/09)

Nice list timmsy. I have plans to get some glass bottles myself. I mainly keg so have some pet bottles for the excess. However seeing as the preference is for glass I will be sourcing a set specifically for the swap. Mind you if butters keeps leaving bottles at my place after bringing samples to try I may not need to buy any but it will be the oddest collection of bottles, anyone has seen :lol:


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## Goofinder (25/1/09)

Hmm, I've been meaning to get rid of some of my PET to save space and build up a collection of glass longnecks for aging beers. Sounds like this swap should be the perfect way to do both.


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## Murcluf (26/1/09)

raven19 said:


> Variety in beers is what I am hoping for, so my vote is for no specific theme.
> 
> Did the last case swap utilise glass longnecks (750ml)? or was it more dominated by PET's (not sure of mls)?
> 
> 2c.


I was the only one qho had PET bottles in the last swap because they were the only long necks I had at the time. One thing I learnt from the last swap is glass is so much better in a swap then PET.


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## fergi (26/1/09)

sorry guys, i have just read back a few posts and apparently this is only for AG, i am only a kit/extract person so please delete my name out of the list
cheers

fergi


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## Frank (26/1/09)

Anyone after Coopers long necks for the swap?
See the post by jojai, he's giving up brewing.
First in first serve I would say.


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## Frank (26/1/09)

fergi said:


> sorry guys, i have just read back a few posts and apparently this is only for AG, i am only a kit/extract person so please delete my name out of the list
> cheers
> fergi


I have taken your name off Fergi. You should start a new thread to see if you can drum up business for a non-AG swap.


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## KHB (26/1/09)

Just added my name to the list

KHB


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## ~MikE (26/1/09)

fergi said:


> sorry guys, i have just read back a few posts and apparently this is only for AG, i am only a kit/extract person so please delete my name out of the list
> cheers
> 
> fergi


alternatively, someone might be willing to allow access to their AG setup. all you really need is a half day for mash and boil, then into a cube that you can take home to ferment...


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## fergi (26/1/09)

Boston said:


> I have taken your name off Fergi. You should start a new thread to see if you can drum up business for a non-AG swap.




good idea will try that
cheers
fergi


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## Jazman (26/1/09)

see what happens what i brew is what i brew and i wont put it in unless it is good i only brew to style if i want to go in a comp


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## Murcluf (26/1/09)

~MikE said:


> alternatively, someone might be willing to allow access to their AG setup. all you really need is a half day for mash and boil, then into a cube that you can take home to ferment...



Fergi could alway try and hit up GMK for a brew day at his place, as his AG gear is just sitting there going to waste, I hear he's mainly K&K's these days. Something about not having the time to do it anymore, this could be an opportunity to rekindle the passion to brew real beer again. The other theory is he might be better off staying with K&K as there is less chances of floaties in his beer using a tin of goo and a bag of sugar  

All said with love and tongue firmly stuck in cheek


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## Frank (26/1/09)

Murcluf said:


> All said with love and tongue firmly stuck in cheek


Whilst holding Angus Park dried apricot between the teeth...... :huh:


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## GMK (26/1/09)

hahah Funny guys...

I will be in but want :
- bottle conditioned or filled with a counter flow pressure filler
- happy with themes or what ever you come up with...


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## Darren (26/1/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> Maybe they used the "Dribble Method" to fill. :lol: h34r:
> 
> BYB




Hey BYB,

Your not a chef by any chance are you?

cheers

Darren


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## KHB (26/1/09)

Hey Darren no he is not.

I am what are you trying to say there mate???

KHB


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## Darren (26/1/09)

KHB, BYB only met you once (each i think). Perhaps yopu have all been "tarred" with the same brush?

BYB, are you the vegemite, peanut paste etc brewer?

cheers

Darren


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## KHB (26/1/09)

Darren said:


> KHB, BYB only met you once (each i think). Perhaps yopu have all been "tarred" with the same brush?
> 
> BYB, are you the vegemite, peanut paste etc brewer?
> 
> ...





No that would be someone else in the BBC who we dont here from anymore. Also how does a quote from a different thread make it into this one??? Do you have nothing better to do than start fights???

Cheers KHB


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## Jazman (26/1/09)

darren i know fore sure he is not that brewer


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## Darren (26/1/09)

KHB said:


> No that would be someone else in the BBC who we dont here from anymore. Also how does a quote from a different thread make it into this one??? Do you have nothing better to do than start fights???
> 
> Cheers KHB




What you talking about Willis?

Only quoted from this thread KHB. Have a look back.

cheers

Darren

EDIT: Perhaps you have something to feel defensive about?. 

I will be in the swap at this stage. Beer wont be dark or bottle conditioned /CPBF


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## KHB (26/1/09)

MY bad looked back, remembered it from another thread.

KHB


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## Back Yard Brewer (26/1/09)

Boston said:


> I have taken your name off Fergi. You should start a new thread to see if you can drum up business for a non-AG swap.




Now that is a great idea. The swap can still happen where ever and whilst there they could try some AG beer  But then again we could all taste some non-ag beer and be pleasantly suprised  

BYB


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## Back Yard Brewer (26/1/09)

Darren said:


> Hey BYB,
> 
> Your not a chef by any chance are you?
> 
> ...



Nup just a cook

BYB




Murcluf said:


> Fergi could alway try and hit up GMK for a brew day at his place, as his AG gear is just sitting there going to waste, I hear he's mainly K&K's these days. Something about not having the time to do it anymore, this could be an opportunity to rekindle the passion to brew real beer again. The other theory is he might be better off staying with K&K as there is less chances of floaties in his beer using a tin of goo and a bag of sugar
> 
> All said with love and tongue firmly stuck in cheek




 Had a long meaningfull talk with GMK this week-end.

BYB





Darren said:


> BYB, are you the vegemite, peanut paste etc brewer?
> 
> cheers
> 
> Darren



Nup again, he works for a little known brewery in Lyndoch.

BYB


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## KHB (27/1/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> Nup just a cook
> 
> BYB





HAHAHA 

KHB


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## Murcluf (27/1/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> Had a long meaningfull talk with GMK this week-end.


Oh do tell and don't leave out the rauchy bits either....... 

BYB perhap you'd like to host the Inaugural K&K only case swap at your place, you'll more "TWANG!!!" then the Tamworth Country Music Festival


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## drsmurto (2/2/09)

Spoke to Claire on the weekend and since you were so well behaved we are happy to offer up our place again for the mid year swap should Wayne not be able to.

For those of you who didnt make it up at xmas check out the pics here - Link

Plenty of room and lots of shed space for all those who plan on crashing.

Will be very cold up here at that time of the year so we normally fire up a few braziers and i will be making sure the air con in the bar is fixed by then. 

16 beers on tap at the xmas swap, i reckon we do do better.

EDIT - also vote to combine the 2 swaps on the same day - AG and the kits and bits so we get more brewers together in the 1 spot.


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## himzol (2/2/09)

Ok,

Where do I put my name down for attending? 

My attendance will be date dependant, I generally go skiing late July, early August.

Hey DR. S, if it's at your place I have four braziers I can lend for the occasion.

Himzo.


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## Frank (2/2/09)

himzo said:


> Ok,
> Where do I put my name down for attending?
> My attendance will be date dependant, I generally go skiing late July, early August.
> Hey DR. S, if it's at your place I have four braziers I can lend for the occasion.
> Himzo.


On here Himzo.


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## Effect (2/2/09)

only 4 more spots left!


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## Frank (2/2/09)

Phillip said:


> only 4 more spots left!


So what is the maximum number to Swap?
I know there is 24 places on the Wiki. But if you do a single batch 23L, waste 2 in tastes and racking and bottle 21L = 28 x 750ml bottles, save a few to try, potentially swap 24 , therefore, 25 names to Swap.
If you keg 18L would also make 24 x 750ml bottles.
So I think we could change it to 25 for the swap, and bring 24 on the day.
If it fills up soon, we could add an 'Emergency reserve list', a few people did pull out at the last minute last time.


----------



## drsmurto (2/2/09)

Boston said:


> So what is the maximum number to Swap?
> I know there is 24 places on the Wiki. But if you do a single batch 23L, waste 2 in tastes and racking and bottle 21L = 28 x 750ml bottles, save a few to try, potentially swap 24 , therefore, 25 names to Swap.
> If you keg 18L would also make 24 x 750ml bottles.
> So I think we could change it to 25 for the swap, and bring 24 on the day.
> If it fills up soon, we could add an 'Emergency reserve list', a few people did pull out at the last minute last time.



I will be brewing a double batch - 40L. Only because i gave away all of my beer last time and want a whole keg to myself this time! :icon_drunk: 

25 works so that we bring 24 bottles - 2 full milk crates.


----------



## Effect (2/2/09)

sorry, I do 20 litre batches...so that is only really 26ish bottles, 2 to taste and 24 to swap...

but if we get more swappers (the more the merrier I say) - it won't be too hard to scale from 20 litres to 23....(unless you aren't competent with beersmith :huh: )


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## 3G (2/2/09)

Im in!
Thanks Wayne and/or DrSmurto for the venue


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## drsmurto (2/2/09)

himzo said:


> Ok,
> 
> Where do I put my name down for attending?
> 
> ...



Champion! We will need them, not quite snow but the frosts up here in winter look like snow they are that thick!

But after the cold day for the xmas swap it will prob turn into a nice sunny day.....

Regardless of where it is held, i vote RustyCs smoker makes an appearance again, along with Waynes 'tandoori oven'.

Only thing better IMO would be holding it at someones house who had a wood fired pizza oven :icon_drool2:


----------



## Effect (2/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Champion! We will need them, not quite snow but the frosts up here in winter look like snow they are that thick!
> 
> But after the cold day for the xmas swap it will prob turn into a nice sunny day.....
> 
> ...




I would offer to bring up my decks and spin some beats for everybody... :huh: oh - wrong forum <_<


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## KHB (2/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Champion! We will need them, not quite snow but the frosts up here in winter look like snow they are that thick!
> 
> But after the cold day for the xmas swap it will prob turn into a nice sunny day.....
> 
> ...




I have aquired a 44gallon drum to make a smoker so i may have one to drop off to be used too!!

KHB


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## himzol (2/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Only thing better IMO would be holding it at someones house who had a wood fired pizza oven :icon_drool2:



We appointed an architect for rebuilding our place last Friday, While we are living away from here I will be building a Wood Fired Oven at that place (currently a rental we own), and then when we move back will be building one here.. so when I get to hold one of these meets in the future there will definately be one...


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## GMK (2/2/09)

OK - I have my name down - 

but want them to be bottle conditioned or filled with a coounter flow pressure filler.

Now need to work out what to brew.....

Leaning towards a Forbidden Fruit.....


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## Rustyc30 (2/2/09)

More then happy to bring the smoker back up glad to here that everyone enjoyed it at the xmas swap


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## silver_streak67 (2/2/09)

I'm in just let me know where and when sorry but only K&b from me


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## buttersd70 (2/2/09)

GMK said:


> OK - I have my name down -



Oh goody....I won't be the shortest person there. :lol:


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## Back Yard Brewer (2/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> Oh goody....I won't be the shortest person there. :lol:





As long as no-one confuses the two of you :lol: There won't be much in it.

BYB



GMK said:


> OK - I have my name down -
> 
> but want them to be bottle conditioned or filled with a coounter flow pressure filler.



KHB borrowed my CPBF and by all accounts it worked very well  . No excuse for any dribble method here  

BYB


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## Murcluf (2/2/09)

Now that its an AG & K&K swap according to the article, does that mean the AGer's need to smile politely when turning down an offered sample of K&K and do the bottles need to be clearly marked AG or K&K to avoid any unfortunate mix ups or embarassing moments...


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## jonocarroll (2/2/09)

Murcluf said:


> Now that its an AG & K&K swap according to the article, does that mean the AGer's need to smile politely when turning down an offered sample of K&K and do the bottles need to be clearly marked AG or K&K to avoid any unfortunate mix ups or embarassing moments...


Right, coz K&K is like frickin' kryptonite to AGers. Get over it. You're so convinced that anything short of AG isn't even worth sampling, just in case it dare offend your precious little mouth?

It's attitudes like that which will stop people getting together.


----------



## Effect (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> Right, coz K&K is like frickin' kryptonite to AGers. Get over it. You're so convinced that anything short of AG isn't even worth sampling, just in case it dare offend your precious little mouth?
> 
> It's attitudes like that which will stop people getting together.




Don't worry - some of my AGs have been pretty shocking...so when someone gets upset cause they have drunk a K&K we can give 'em a foul AG I have got stored up to really set em off!


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## Goofinder (3/2/09)

Murcluf said:


> Now that its an AG & K&K swap according to the article, does that mean the AGer's need to smile politely when turning down an offered sample of K&K and do the bottles need to be clearly marked AG or K&K to avoid any unfortunate mix ups or embarassing moments...


I'm sure all the K&B swappers will bring an extra bottle or two for Wayne


----------



## drsmurto (3/2/09)

There really is no need to get shirty about this.

The swap was always AG only as we spend several hours making the wort rather than using a can opener.

Elitism, snobbery, perhaps.

That doesnt mean i wont be more than happy to sample kit beers and discuss them, i just dont want a whole case of them.

Good to see a kit swap and even more impressive to see a few AG brewers jumping in.

Its a chance for ALL brewers to get together and talk beer, drink beer etc. I suspect a few kit brewers will be lured to the dark side - we could organise a brew demo on the day so you can see how its done, particularly with a rudimentary setup like mine. 

But as an AG brewer i DO understand that not everyone has the time or inclination to spend hours making beer when a few mins with a can opener produces a decent product. 

Lets keep this thread all nice and friendly. 

RDWHAHB


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## domonsura (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> Right, coz K&K is like frickin' kryptonite to AGers. Get over it. You're so convinced that anything short of AG isn't even worth sampling, just in case it dare offend your precious little mouth?
> 
> It's attitudes like that which will stop people getting together.



(Breaks out recorded message from the last case swap thread - and the one before that - and the one before that.......  )

Wrong, it's attitudes like this that stop AG brewers wanting to have K & K brewers around incessantly trying to convince us that theirs is just as good. And yes it does offend my precious mouth. That's my choice (and my view, so don't harpoon everyone for it). And if the so called 'AG attitude' stops a K & K brewer from coming along, having a beer & a chat and broadening their understanding of the brewing processes in general, so be it. Their loss, my day will be no poorer for it - I'll still have a blast 
If this is going to turn into a great big AG vs Kit shit fight that will spoil the day with pathetic arguments & irrelevant comparisons between beers that aren't even on the same plane, count me out because I'm not interested. We have this stupid argument every year. 
I'm not interested in swapping my AG beer for kit brews, because the kit brewer simply has not made the same amount of effort I have. End of story. The beer might be 'fine' or even 'good'. The same can be said for half the commercial mega-swill - that doesn't mean I want to drink it or talk about it. "Well.......I poked my tongue out this way while I turned the wheel on the can opener. And I poured it into the fermenter with my right hand as opposed to my left like I did last time. The beer will be completely different this time because of that" Whatever. <_< Your brewing method is a shortcut that takes the love out of the brewing process. Simple.
*This is an AG swap event*. If you guys want to do a kit swap as well, go for broke. But it will be a separate swap, pure and simple. This is one of the most entertaining & fun events of the year in general. How about being grateful you're even invited in the first place, instead of trying to rile things up?

I also think that all the other conditions that people are attempting to place on this re: I only want bottle conditioned/cp filled etc are *unrealistic and silly*. You get what you get, however the person chose to bottle/carbonate it. That's their choice. If you don't like it, tough shit, don't drink it. 

For christ sake people, HTFU and remember that this is a swap where we share the fruits of our AG labours, not try and dictate what everyone else makes. 

AG is better. My point of view. No apologies attached.


----------



## peas_and_corn (3/2/09)

domonsura said:


> (Breaks out recorded message from the last case swap thread - and the one before that - and the one before that.......  )
> 
> Wrong, it's attitudes like this that stop AG brewers wanting to have K & K brewers around incessantly trying to convince us that theirs is just as good. And yes it does offend my precious mouth. That's my choice (and my view, so don't harpoon everyone for it). And if the so called 'AG attitude' stops a K & K brewer from coming along, having a beer & a chat and broadening their understanding of the brewing processes in general, so be it. Their loss, my day will be no poorer for it - I'll still have a blast
> If this is going to turn into a great big AG vs Kit shit fight that will spoil the day with pathetic arguments & irrelevant comparisons between beers that aren't even on the same plane, count me out because I'm not interested. We have this stupid argument every year.
> ...



Somebody get this man a beer! (AG only plz)


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## domonsura (3/2/09)

peas_and_corn said:


> Somebody get this man a beer! (AG only plz)



:lol: a little too early methinks :lol:


----------



## Murcluf (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> Right, coz K&K is like frickin' kryptonite to AGers. Get over it. You're so convinced that anything short of AG isn't even worth sampling, just in case it dare offend your precious little mouth?
> 
> It's attitudes like that which will stop people getting together.


ROTFLMAO..... I haven't laughed so hard in ages especially the part about my percious little mouth. Just to give you the heads up I was only joking, I was trawling for a bite but I wasn't expecting you to jump on the hook and bite down so hard. I've nothing against K&Ker's I was one once everyone has to start somewhere and K&K is the best place, and a lot of AGer's keep on coming back for more.

Looking forward to trying your all crystal malt brew..... make beer not war....Friends


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## peas_and_corn (3/2/09)

domonsura said:


> :lol: a little too early methinks :lol:



Yeah, but I couldn't think of a better way to say it


----------



## THE DRUNK ARAB (3/2/09)

I'll probably attend but not swap, date dependant of course!

C&B
TDA


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## Timmsy (3/2/09)

domonsura said:


> :lol: a little too early methinks :lol:



HTFU Its never to early :icon_cheers:


----------



## fergi (3/2/09)

domonsura said:


> (Breaks out recorded message from the last case swap thread - and the one before that - and the one before that.......  )
> 
> Wrong, it's attitudes like this that stop AG brewers wanting to have K & K brewers around incessantly trying to convince us that theirs is just as good. And yes it does offend my precious mouth. That's my choice (and my view, so don't harpoon everyone for it). And if the so called 'AG attitude' stops a K & K brewer from coming along, having a beer & a chat and broadening their understanding of the brewing processes in general, so be it. Their loss, my day will be no poorer for it - I'll still have a blast
> If this is going to turn into a great big AG vs Kit shit fight that will spoil the day with pathetic arguments & irrelevant comparisons between beers that aren't even on the same plane, count me out because I'm not interested. We have this stupid argument every year.
> ...




if you had bothered to read the kits and bits thread you surely would have noticed that we are only intending to swap kit beers with ag,rs who are prepared to help us out with a bit of a swap with their kits beers.we were not intending to swap your precious AG beer, there is no one that i have seen that is trying to tell you that our kit beers are as good as your AG beer,for a retailer i find your remarks so bloody condescending , you didnt mind swapping my money for one of your temp controllers for my kits and bits beer a few weeks ago though, YES AG BEER IS GENERALLY A LOT BETTER THAN KITS but we are all in this hobby for the same reasons ,just that some of you have gone to the next step before us, we will eventually get there too ,just dont talk down to us while we are learning and wanting to explore the differences in our hobby
f

fergi


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## raven19 (3/2/09)

Phillip said:


> sorry, I do 20 litre batches...so that is only really 26ish bottles, 2 to taste and 24 to swap...
> 
> but if we get more swappers (the more the merrier I say) - it won't be too hard to scale from 20 litres to 23....(unless you aren't competent with beersmith :huh: )



You could always do a higher gravity & higher bodied batch, then water it down in the fermenter?

Nice long thread already - I like it.


----------



## drsmurto (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> Right, coz K&K is like frickin' kryptonite to AGers. Get over it. You're so convinced that anything short of AG isn't even worth sampling, just in case it dare offend your precious little mouth?
> 
> It's attitudes like that which will *stop people getting together*.



It didnt last swap when we banished at least 1 kit brewer from joining in and i suspect with the numbers of AG brewers in SA that it will only get bigger, not smaller! (see pics from the last swap - it was a big 'un)

We have extended the olive branch to kit brewers to organise their own swap but join us for the day and enjoy the festivities. That way you still get to meet and greet fellow AHB members and talk beer.

If Wayne hosts he will no doubt fire up Brewboy so you can see AG beer made (and watch 10+ brewers all arguing discussing about the relative merits of various grains/hops etc)

If i host then my cheap setup will get a run.

There will be NO OTHER LIMITATIONS other than what is already on the wiki (AG, glass, longnecks).

Cheers
DrSmurto


----------



## domonsura (3/2/09)

fergi said:


> if you had bothered to read the kits and bits thread you surely would have noticed that we are only intending to swap kit beers with ag,rs who are prepared to help us out with a bit of a swap with their kits beers.we were not intending to swap your precious AG beer, there is no one that i have seen that is trying to tell you that our kit beers are as good as your AG beer,for a retailer i find your remarks so bloody condescending , you didnt mind swapping my money for one of your temp controllers for my kits and bits beer a few weeks ago though, YES AG BEER IS GENERALLY A LOT BETTER THAN KITS but we are all in this hobby for the same reasons ,just that some of you have gone to the next step before us, we will eventually get there too ,just dont talk down to us while we are learning and wanting to explore the differences in our hobby
> f
> 
> fergi



And I found QB's post inflammatory and annoying too. You've missed the point of what I was saying (in which I definitely wasn't trying to be condescending in the least. Kit brewing is a shortcut. It's a fact. OK..... The no love thing sounded a little bit condescending, but FFS I'm allowed to have fun too ). And I know you weren't wanting to swap kit for AG. Never said you did. In fact I wasn't talking to you at all. Not sure what relevance the temp controller purchase (not swap) has in this - am I not allowed to have an opinon on swap ettiquette just because you bought something from me? My opinions are not influenced by my business. 

The fact is I was replying to the post from QB, and the attitude contained therein. You brew how you want to, just don't try and convert me, and I won't try and convert you. Happy to stand and have a chat with anyone at the swap, taste a K & K beer if I want to. But not to be drilled for hours on end by this petty difference. That's my point. In the past, this AG vs kit thing has caused stress, arguments, hard feelings etc. These have no place at a swap. QB's post exibited exactly the same attitude that almost started a fight at one of the swaps in the past. Although I'm not entirely sure how 'tongue in cheek' his comments were, that attitude also has no place at a swap. THAT was my point. 

All said. All done


----------



## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

Yeah, I've no doubt what you've said has been said dozens of times. The problem is that this time it's missed the point and jumped to conclusions.

_... K & K brewers around incessantly trying to convince us that theirs is just as good._
No-one said this. I don't think anyone even implied this. The challenge in the K&B swap thread was the *reverse* of this - can an AGer make a better K&B because of their improved skills.

_If this is going to turn into a great big AG vs Kit shit fight that will spoil the day with pathetic arguments & irrelevant comparisons between beers that aren't even on the same plane, count me out because I'm not interested. We have this stupid argument every year._
No-one started a comparison. You've joined in on a non-existent argument. I wasn't even the one who suggested the non AGers come to the swap. I reckon it's a good idea for those who supposedly know about beer and brewing to try (a sip FFS) the K&B beers and let the brewer know what they think it might be lacking, and how they might improve it. That improvement will likely be AG, fine. I can't get my head around this idea that someone who hasn't mastered the cold side of beer (sanitising, temp control, etc) should suddenly make it so much harder for themselves without any feedback on the product they already make.

I'll repeat - no-one said anything about making a comparison between kits and AG.

_I'm not interested in swapping my AG beer for kit brews, because the kit brewer simply has not made the same amount of effort I have. End of story._
No one's asking you to. No one ever did.

_Your brewing method is a shortcut that takes the love out of the brewing process. Simple._
This from a man who recently said that he'd like a turnkey brewery.

_This is an AG swap event. If you guys want to do a kit swap as well, go for broke. But it will be a separate swap, pure and simple._
See, now you've got it.

_This is one of the most entertaining & fun events of the year in general. How about being grateful you're even invited in the first place, instead of trying to rile things up?_
And I'm thoroughly looking forward to it. Have a look back through the posts. You're yelling at AGers here. The K&B folk haven't even shown up to this argument yet and already they're in the shithouse. The post that started this bit was (presumably) an AGer that got his facts wrong.

_AG is better. My point of view. No apologies attached._
None required. No one is questioning that.

and DrSmurto - I didn't mean it would stop AGers getting together (if anything it's a common hatrid I see) but if every response on this forum to a non AGer was 'drop what you're doing, it's shit, go all-grain' it wouldn't be the place it is now. How many people have upgraded based on the help they've got on this forum? Surely we should be encouraging potential AGers along and showing them how it's done. Not turning our noses up at the mere thought of them.


----------



## drsmurto (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> and DrSmurto - I didn't mean it would stop AGers getting together (if anything it's a common hatrid I see) but if every response on this forum to a non AGer was 'drop what you're doing, it's shit, go all-grain' it wouldn't be the place it is now. How many people have upgraded based on the help they've got on this forum? Surely we should be encouraging potential AGers along and showing them how it's done. Not turning our noses up at the mere thought of them.



Like many of the AGers in the swap i started on this forum as a kit brewer.

I never said kit brewers werent allowed to attend the swap - in my memory of swaps that has never occurred.

We have, however, for the past 2 swaps at the very least, installed an AG only policy as there are so many AG brewers who are new to the craft and find a case swap a great opportunity to taste other AG beers and learn about styles they may not have brewed yet.

Drinking half a case of kit beers wouldnt help us so thats the reason (or at least one of the main ones) why kit brewers were asked to have their own swap.

I tried very hard for the last swap to be open to kit brewers to attend and be able to taste AG beer and see what all the fuss was about but not 1 rocked up. A few of us even offered out setups to allow a kit brewer to brew an AG beer so they could join in the actual swap. All declined.

I am hoping that this time we get a nice contingent of kit brewers. I learnt about AG brewing by being invited to AG brewdays and watched the action unfold. I/We are extending that opportunity to kit brewers for this swap. 

And to make the offer again, if any kit brewer who is thinking about AG brewing as something they might like to try, they are more than welcome to rock up to my place (Mt Torrens) and use my equipment to brew an AG batch for the swap. I am always happy to help out as its how i have been able to move from kits to AG.

Now lets stop the AG vs kit bollocks and get on with the organising of the swap. :icon_drunk: 

Cheers
DrSmurto


----------



## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

domonsura said:


> And I found QB's post inflammatory and annoying too.
> 
> ...
> 
> The fact is I was replying to the post from QB, and the attitude contained therein. You brew how you want to, just don't try and convert me, and I won't try and convert you. Happy to stand and have a chat with anyone at the swap, taste a K & K beer if I want to. But not to be drilled for hours on end by this petty difference.


Perhaps you need to re-read this thread. No one was suggesting a that kits are better in any way. No one was trying to convert you to a K&B brewer. The post that angered me was the suggestion that an AGer wouldn't even taste a beer that wasn't AG. No one was saying there would be a lecture on the differences.

"You brew how you want to" sounds nice and peaceful, except for the prejudiced "but it's fukkin shite!" under your breath. The purpose of the challenge was to see if K&B is inherently a much poorer quality, or if an AG brewer could use their expertise to make something decent. Nothing more. This entire argument has been brought on by the AGers who find it necessary to shit all over anyone who doesn't do AG.

I'm spent. And I'm done with this non-issue.


----------



## domonsura (3/2/09)

I wasn't jumping to any conclusions at all. Myself and half the people in this thread who have been on this board more than a couple of months understand exactly where some of my comments have come from (ie: past years). Perhaps you might like to brief yourself on the history of this 'discussion' by reading through some of the past years case swap threads Jon. This has been done to death. We have a happy thing going on, this time around the K & K guys have been invited to come & take part and have their own swap. No dramas there. The long and short is I don't want this argument to present itself at the swap, because it would have the potential to turn a good day bad. Just as I felt the comments you made about 'fricken kryptonite' etc etc have introduced an element to this thread that is unpleasant. 

And for the record. We ARE encouraging potential AG'ers to come along and see how it's done. That's the point. We always have. Everyone has always been welcome to come along, since the first case swap I hosted and probably before then too, and all since. But the AG vs diehard K & K argument is not welcome because it causes trouble amongst friends. Simple as that really.


----------



## Effect (3/2/09)

I thought (and still do) that most of us started doing K&K - then moved to AG somehow. That somehow was most probably this forum and brewdays.

No-one on here wants to bash up K&K brewers at all - we just want them to come up, appreciate that AG has the ability to make far greater beer - and we want you to learn how to make AG - catch the bug and then there will be more AGers for the next swaps...

The more the merrier I say!


----------



## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

I'm leaving this here. You seem determined to imply that I'm making a comparison between methods, which I'm not.



domonsura said:


> The long and short is I don't want this argument to present itself at the swap, because it would have the potential to turn a good day bad. Just as I felt the comments you made about 'fricken kryptonite' etc etc have introduced an element to this thread that is unpleasant.


Neither do I. I don't even want the argument on here. I'm *not* pushing that argument FFS. If you want to look at who _might_ have introduced a particular element pushing that agenda, have a look at the post I was replying to.

The next person who implies that I'm trying to start or continue an argument over the benefits of each method will get a swift kick to the hop sock.


----------



## Timmsy (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> the hop sock.




Is that some new form of birth control 

:beerbang: :beerbang:


----------



## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

Timmsy said:


> Is that some new form of birth control


The swift kick would be. :blink:


----------



## fergi (3/2/09)

seems like we really need to cool down here, some comments have been made that have fired this up and to be honest pre post 84 i was feeling really welcome by the ager,s that have invited the kk,s along to do our own kit swap and meet the ag boys, but some forum members have jumped out of their mash tuns without reading the facts on what we were trying to achieve, look i for one was feeling excited that i could take some of my kit beer to swap with some ager,s who were going to make a kit beer to help us out with comments and ideas, and also to meet the faces behind this forum and ask as many questions as i could, also to try the "next tier" of brewing and generally have a great day, my enthusiasm for this day has been given a huge kick in the butt as i now feel there could be this underlying resentment to a kk brewer coming to the event. lets all settle down and try and enjoy the day, if we arent welcome by the majority thats fine , but lets not have the infighting that seems to be occuring, we all live here on this site as equals
fergi


----------



## Adamt (3/2/09)

fergi said:


> as i now feel there could be this underlying resentment to a kk brewer coming to the event.



There is *ABSOLUTELY NO* suggestion at all, by anybody that K&K brewers are not welcome to the event. Exactly the opposite! As said, we welcome kit brewers, I'm sure there was one or two at the last swap.

The only resentment will be if you miss the event. :icon_cheers:


----------



## ~MikE (3/2/09)

Adamt said:


> There is *ABSOLUTELY NO* suggestion at all, by anybody that K&K brewers are not welcome to the event. Exactly the opposite! As said, we welcome kit brewers, I'm sure there was one or two at the last swap.
> 
> The only resentment will be if you miss the event. :icon_cheers:



indeed, i don't want to be the only one in the K&K challenge


----------



## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

~MikE said:


> indeed, i don't want to be the only one in the K&K challenge


I've not removed my name from the list. I still fully intend to make a K&B for swapping, and an AG for swapping (there, I separated the two for clarity!) but I'll take caution in who I offer samples to.

So, what's the go for selecting a recipe? Is it good/bad form to pick a style someone else has chosen? Do I need to declare what I'm planning ahead of time? Is there a minimum conditioning time to allow for? Are there any styles that I should avoid (last thing I need is to show up with style X and have people say "_pfft! X? No-one brings X anymore, that's so last year._")


----------



## drsmurto (3/2/09)

QuantumBrewer said:


> I've not removed my name from the list. I still fully intend to make a K&B for swapping, and an AG for swapping (there, I separated the two for clarity!) but I'll take caution in who I offer samples to.
> 
> So, what's the go for selecting a recipe? Is it good/bad form to pick a style someone else has chosen? Do I need to declare what I'm planning ahead of time? Is there a minimum conditioning time to allow for? Are there any styles that I should avoid (last thing I need is to show up with style X and have people say "_pfft! X? No-one brings X anymore, that's so last year._")



Kits - brew whatever you want. 

AG - again, recipe is up to you but i would prefer if people put beers in that they feel confident in brewing. A case full of 'not quite right but feedback appreciated' wont be floating my boat. Some people put in experimental beers, i provide a tried and tested recipe that i believe reflects me as a brewer.

Ideally, and this comes up every swap, the beer should be ready for drinking from the time you hand over the beer. In practice, this isnt always possible so as long as there is a best after date on it then thats ok.

The xmas case swap we were a re bit more restrictive in that we asked for summer session beers to avoid being lumped with a case of belgian strong ales. 

The winter theme is beer and all styles are ok. I still will be providing you with a beer that isnt rocket fuel but thats the sort of beer i brew. Last year we had at least 2 beers >11% abv. Mine was 3% (A dark mild that was filled from the keg by the dribble method).

If you get in and put down a recipe then people are more likely to want to brew something different so as not to get 10 stouts (not that i'd be complaining about a case of stout :icon_drool2: )

Its also normal practice to bring along as much beer as you plan on drinking - the hosts provide a venue, not the beer/food etc so if you can, bring a keg as well.

Hope that clears a few things up.

Good to see the argument hasnt put anyone off attending. Its always a good day. A long day but a good one!

And if my partner was prepared to offer up our place again after the xmas case swap then you lot cant be all that bad? :lol:


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## jonocarroll (3/2/09)

Since I've only done 4 AGs I'll probably need to brew a practice run now, make sure it's up to scratch, then repeat. Shouldn't be a real issue. I won't be doing anything particularly 'experimental' - but as I haven't brewed many styles yet it will likely be an experiment of sorts. Don't worry, the AGs that are ready are great, I haven't tried anything that I've stuffed up yet. <_< 

I'm still not up to kegging, so I'll be bringing along a milk crate full of whatever's done by then for personal consumption and sharing.

Last question - do people consider an APA 'winter drinking'?


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## drsmurto (3/2/09)

Any style is ok, APA is fine.

I started out in AG by modifying my kit recipes that i was happy with.

Doing a trial batch is a good idea.


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## Effect (3/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Its also normal practice to bring along as much beer as you plan on drinking - the hosts provide a venue, not the beer/food etc so if you can, bring a keg as well.



Well I don't have a keg to bring up. Is there any Adelaide brewers that want to let me borrow an empty keg so I can bring it up on the day. I'll fill it with beer, and then you can take whatever is left home.

Cheers

Phil


Oh - and +1 for testing the case swap recipe at least once before making it for the swap!


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## ~MikE (3/2/09)

hmm, i just worked it out, if i want to trial a dopplebock allowing for 2 weeks fermentation and 4 weeks CCing, i'd have to brew it in the next couple of weeks for the second batch to be ready in time. alternatively i'm thinking i'll make it, sample it, if bad (about a month before hand) rush through a nice ESB (which i've brewed quite a few of now).


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## Effect (3/2/09)

~MikE said:


> hmm, i just worked it out, if i want to trial a dopplebock allowing for 2 weeks fermentation and 4 weeks CCing, i'd have to brew it in the next couple of weeks for the second batch to be ready in time. alternatively i'm thinking i'll make it, sample it, if bad (about a month before hand) rush through a nice ESB (which i've brewed quite a few of now).




See that is the spirit! Try something you want to show everyone, and plan it so you are able to make it atleast twice. If it's not good, then make something you know is a dead set winner - one that you brew a lot of...


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## fergi (3/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Kits - brew whatever you want.
> 
> AG - again, recipe is up to you but i would prefer if people put beers in that they feel confident in brewing. A case full of 'not quite right but feedback appreciated' wont be floating my boat. Some people put in experimental beers, i provide a tried and tested recipe that i believe reflects me as a brewer.
> 
> ...





now here it seems is a good platform to use"sensible" not complicated, non restrictive, brew what you know works.
yep i,m a believer
fergi


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## Adamt (3/2/09)

I disagree somewhat... if it ain't broke, why remake it? Make a batch, if it's good and will keep, store it for the case. Much better idea than to make it again, drink most of the first batch, bottle the second batch and figure out a week before the swap it's infected.


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## Darren (3/2/09)

After Dononsura has revealed his true colours in this thread I hope his beer is top-notch. God help you if you tell him its not  

cheers

Darren


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## buttersd70 (3/2/09)

phil, when it's said to bring a keg, thats not necessarily a literal thing...the point is, bring as much (or more) than you plan on consuming yourself, so that it "evens itself out in the wash", so to speak....If it's in kegs, it's easy, but if its in bottles, thats OK too. At this point, I'm unsure if I'll bring a keg...I might bring a variety of bottles instead ....depends on what I have on. Either way, it will be enough to replace what I drink.


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## Back Yard Brewer (3/2/09)

MMM how do I approach this........ there are some AG / kit / part time kit / part time Ag brewers who on some occassion's can't get their (shit right) carbonation levels right to less or waaaay to much. So you can spend as much time as you like brewing but if you don't get the tweak right at the end........... well I will drink what ever is rightly carbonated or will stay in the glass :lol: BTW and FWIW (flame suit on) there is a retailer on here who promotes AG but actually does have goo on his shelf h34r: 

Lets all lighten up a bit I have been to two case swaps, one at my gaff which was a ball... from memory <_< and the last at Smurto's which I can remember  Lesson learnt from my first swap.


BYB


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## KHB (3/2/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> BTW and FWIW (flame suit on) there is a retailer on here who promotes AG but actually does have goo on his shelf h34r:
> 
> 
> 
> BYB





:lol:


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## himzol (3/2/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> :lol: BTW and FWIW (flame suit on) there is a retailer on here who promotes AG but actually does have goo on his shelf h34r:
> 
> 
> BYB



To come to the said retailers defence, 
I know somebody that works for a major cigarrette company but has never smoked themselfs...How you earn a living and what your personal choices in life are can be seperate..  

BTW, I'm one who can put up his hand and say " I f#$%^ed up the carbonation", I won't be offering anything at the swap unless I'm happy with others drinking it.. 

Himzo.


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## mickoz (3/2/09)

I've just put my name on the wiki - that makes 24

Sorry to ask but are 640ml longnecks okay or should they be 750mls? I only have 3 x 750mls and lots of 640mls, maybe a good time to go buy some coopers stout 

Mick


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## Back Yard Brewer (3/2/09)

> BTW, I\\\'m one who can put up his hand and say \\\" I f#$%^ed up the carbonation\\\", I won\\\'t be offering anything at the swap unless I\\\'m happy with others drinking it..
> 
> Himzo.




And that is exactly why my beer did not make the xmas case swap. Mind you a few months on and some serious venting of bottles my ESB isnt tasting to bad  


BYB



> Sorry to ask but are 640ml longnecks okay or should they be 750mls? I only have 3 x 750mls and lots of 640mls, maybe a good time to go buy some coopers stout
> 
> Mick




FFS Mick you will start a war. You will have brewers out with their slide rulers, calculators, dumpy levels aw f**k the list goes on.

Me personally I am fine with 640ml. I'm still geting over the Rocket Fuel from last July :wacko: For those who hung on that Rocket Fuel is just hitting its straps




> phil, when it\'s said to bring a keg, thats not necessarily a literal thing...the point is, bring as much (or more) than you plan on consuming yourself, so that it \"evens itself out in the wash\", so to speak....If it\'s in kegs, it\'s easy, but if its in bottles, thats OK too. At this point, I\'m unsure if I\'ll bring a keg...I might bring a variety of bottles instead ....depends on what I have on. Either way, it will be enough to replace what I drink.



Someone brings the keg I'll bring the pump. Stout through the Engine in winter..... a scene to die for


BYB


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## raven19 (3/2/09)

mickoz said:


> I've just put my name on the wiki - that makes 24
> 
> Sorry to ask but are 640ml longnecks okay or should they be 750mls? I only have 3 x 750mls and lots of 640mls, maybe a good time to go buy some coopers stout
> 
> Mick



It may be ok if its a higher alcohol beer! :lol: 

I bought a carton of longneck pales over the weekend for this very reason. Felt so dirty buying beer! <_<


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## muckey (3/2/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> Someone brings the keg I'll bring the pump. Stout through the Engine in winter..... a scene to die for



At least I know what butters will be talking about between now and the swap


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## ~MikE (3/2/09)

i think the aim was for 750ml bottles but there were plenty of 640's floating around. dont sweat too much, just make sure it's either REALLY good or REALLY bad


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## GMK (3/2/09)

~MikE said:


> i think the aim was for 750ml bottles but there were plenty of 640's floating around. dont sweat too much, just make sure it's either REALLY good or REALLY bad



And Experimental...

I will offer a choice and go with the Majority:
- Award Wining English Barley Wine Recipe 11% - was Best AG beer in SABSOSA 2007 and 1 point off best AG last year
Tried & true.
- AG Trios Pistoles - also have developed a K&B Version - tried & true - has star Anise in it - might not be liked by all.
- Forbidden Fruit Clone - better than commercial - tried & true - 
- Never done before Thomas Hardy BW...been waiting to get the Peat smoked Malt for this which i hav enow.
- Never done before Belgian Scotch silly - ^alc%
- or a wanting to be done Flanders Red - I ahve a lambic (3726 Roselare Yeast base - Oak Barrel aging for a year to blend with the new Brew) - based on an award wining USA Falnders recipe.

Just let me know soon so that I can brew It 

Alternatively - I could just brew them all over the next few weeks and then decide.
:beerbang: 

But I dont have enough long necks.....


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## drsmurto (4/2/09)

640mL is fine.

Kenny, how many longnecks are you short? Am sure i can scrape together enough for the both of us 

Barleywine needs a long time to age so how old will it be by the swap? I have 18L in secondary now but i only made it to go up against you at SABSOSA so wont be giving it away! :lol: 

bottles are fine. Sorry bout that, i assumed everyone kegs cos, well, why wouldnt you? :super: 

Stout thru the engine = liquid silk.

Best ever beer i had at Grumpys was Black Betty, a brown porter that was more stout than porter, thru a beer engine. Effin gorgeous she was. Still to attempt to make something similar. 

Anyone brewed their beer yet? Hoping to get the stout down in the next week or 2 so it has an extended conditioning time. I've made it before so its a tested recipe - 1st in the dry stout category - ANAWBS 2008 (2nd SABSOSA 2008)


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## raven19 (4/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> Anyone brewed their beer yet? Hoping to get the stout down in the next week or 2 so it has an extended conditioning time. I've made it before so its a tested recipe - 1st in the dry stout category - ANAWBS 2008 (2nd SABSOSA 2008)



I am going to struggle to make it mine before Cricket Season Ends, 6 wks plus finals (only a possibility). Then more brewing ahoy!

Then again, I may be able to fit it in earlier - depends on when my mate is free as the brew rig setup is in his shed!


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## fergi (4/2/09)

just a small point here, what is the date of the swap meet
fergi


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## drsmurto (4/2/09)

Nothing concrete but prob late June/early July on a Saturday.


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## KHB (4/2/09)

Ill be making mine soon just need to organise some hops and candi sugar

KHB


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## Darren (5/2/09)

GMK said:


> - Forbidden Fruit Clone




Kenny, what?


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## buttersd70 (5/2/09)

are you involved? are you coming? if not, I have two words with three F's.


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## Darren (5/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> are you involved? are you coming? if not, I have two words with three F's.




No I am not coming but I might rent out some full kegs if that is allowed on this site??

cheers

Darren


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## buttersd70 (5/2/09)

Darren said:


> No I am not coming



praise be for small mercies. :beerbang:


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## ~MikE (5/2/09)

Darren said:


> ... but I might rent out some full kegs if that is allowed on this site??



i doubt it, considering the possible legal interpretations and the moderators likeliness to cover the site's ass... 

besides if the last swap was anything to go by, we should be set...


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## drsmurto (5/2/09)

Darren is referring to Kenny's post

Forbidden Fruit clones - $2.50 each.


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## Adamt (5/2/09)

How about we all bring beer to share and swap. <_<

Edit: Grandma.


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## tangent (6/2/09)

You guys are like freakin chuchies, trying to "convert" each other to AG, BIAB, and all this other crap. Just make your beer, drink it and STFU.

If this "banter" is what the case swaps are like, you can keep your funky beers.


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## peas_and_corn (6/2/09)

The thing is, it's not. Effort is made to make sure that crap of this nature is kept out.


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## drsmurto (6/2/09)

The crap/banter stays in this thread, the actual swap is chilled out with the focus on good food, good beer and good mates.

At least thats my impression of the last 3, from what i remember :icon_drunk:


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## KHB (6/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> The crap/banter stays in this thread, the actual swap is chilled out with the focus on good food, good beer and good mates.
> 
> At least thats my impression of the last 3, from what i remember :icon_drunk:




Surely you remember the K&K guys getting tied naked to lampposts and beaten till they agree to AG  

Nah seriously i remember good beer and great times at swaps with a bunch of good fellas. And the occasional SWAMBO

KHB


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## Adamt (6/2/09)

I've decided I'll be making an Aussie(ish) ale of some description. I'll call it that as I'll be using Coopers yeast, not necessarily POR.

Probably around 6-8% and amber/bronzish and I'll hopefully leave plenty of time to sit it in the bottle (and to test  )


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## peas_and_corn (6/2/09)

KHB said:


> Surely you remember the K&K guys getting tied naked to lampposts and beaten till they agree to AG
> 
> Nah seriously i remember good beer and great times at swaps with a bunch of good fellas. And the occasional SWAMBO
> 
> KHB



Shut up! You'll chase away the sacrificial AG vrigins!


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## braufrau (6/2/09)

I had a thought as I was resealing my 6g of hallertauer yesterday ..
would it be worth people bringing their bibs and bobs of hops like that and if they were all added togethor maybe a brew could be made out of them? If 3 people bought 6g of hallertauer then someone goes home with 18g .. enough for a weizen???


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## Adamt (6/2/09)

That's a decent idea, may be some problems with differing batches/AA/AA losses from aging/whatever but it'd be handy to get rid of dribs and drabs.

Alternatively, do what I did and use your leftovers in a big IPA.


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## buttersd70 (6/2/09)

Back Yard Brewer said:


> Someone brings the keg I'll bring the pump. Stout through the Engine in winter..... a scene to die for
> BYB





Muckey said:


> At least I know what butters will be talking about between now and the swap


AGGGGHHHH. Voices in my head......can't ignore.....Ok, done.

Consider a stout, at a sessionable ABV, in a keg, _naturally _primed to 1.4 (ish) Vol CO2, in readiness to come off the hand pump (with sparkler, of course  ) at winter ambient temperatures, a done deal. It will be part of the contribution from Muckey and myself.....
It will be my session interpretation of smurtos interpretation of warrens 4 shades.....



Adamt said:


> Edit: Grandma.


As Grandpa said, "come again?"


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## Adamt (6/2/09)

You know... sentence structure, word order... grandma. Have a few drinks and say it.


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## buttersd70 (6/2/09)

Makes sense if you have a vocal structure with a soft d....I get it now, but scousers are still scratching their heads.... :lol:

edit: spellingk, like.


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## muckey (6/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> Makes sense if you have a vocal structure with a soft d....I get it now, but scousers are still scratching their heads.... :lol:
> 
> edit: spellingk, like.



dose krasy inglish!!!


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## drsmurto (7/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> It will be my session interpretation of smurtos interpretation of warrens 4 shades.....



So nothing like the original then?  

Am doing a mash tomorrow (50/50 ale/peated malt) that magically purifies itself. Will have some on hand for tasting


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## buttersd70 (7/2/09)

DrSmurto said:


> So nothing like the original then?



Chinese whispers.


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## Darren (7/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> praise be for small mercies. :beerbang:




Maybe I will come, depends on work at the time

cheers  

Darren


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## tangent (8/2/09)

> The thing is, it's not. Effort is made to make sure that crap of this nature is kept out.


... by putting you two way away over in charge of the bbq.


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## GMK (14/2/09)

Hi guys,

I have decided to pull out and taken my name off the list.


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## Back Yard Brewer (14/2/09)

GMK said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I have decided to pull out and taken my name off the list.




C'mon Kenny don't get stage fright now.When you take out the Best Brewer of Tanunda Show with your K&K you can stick it up everyone at the case swap, maybe including me  


BYB


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## buttersd70 (15/2/09)

GMK said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I have decided to pull out and taken my name off the list.



So, I _will _be the shortest guy at the swap??  Not fair, kenny...I have enough stuff going against me, without that. :unsure:


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## Adamt (15/2/09)

We all know you were wearing heels at the last swap!


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## buttersd70 (15/2/09)

Adamt said:


> We all know you were wearing heels at the last swap!



Not to mention the fishnets.....
But, I'm prepared this time. I even have the lampshade hat, ready to go....


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## peas_and_corn (15/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> Not to mention the fishnets.....
> But, I'm prepared this time. I even have the lampshade hat, ready to go....



We're coordinating our dresses like planned, right?


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## buttersd70 (16/2/09)

peas_and_corn said:


> We're coordinating our dresses like planned, right?



of course, we don't want our colours to clash....that would just be ridiculous, ducky.


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## Effect (16/2/09)

buttersd70 said:


> of course, we don't want our colours to clash....that would just be ridiculous, ducky.




colours are a matter of taste - I just don't want to rock up with someone wearing the same thing as me...


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## muckey (16/2/09)

Phillip said:


> colours are a matter of taste - I just don't want to rock up with someone wearing the same thing as me...



Sounds like there'll be no chance that you and Frankenfurter Butters will be wearing the same thing


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## Klemmstein (23/2/09)

Hi Guys,

I have put my name down to attend to see how these meets pan out. I have added my name to the wiki thingy.

I wont be swapping but will bring a corny of something for quaffing and something for scoffing... maybe some smoked & pickled chicken wheels, (will see how I go). Looking forward to meeting you blokes.

Please leave the spandex locked in the cupboard until after I leave....

Cheers,

K


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## Effect (6/3/09)

I would suggest that we start planning a date...but then again - we don't have a set venue yet.

Wayne - how are you feeling about it still? Or are we going to take DrSmurto up on his offer to have his place as a venue again?


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## np1962 (10/3/09)

Phillip said:


> I would suggest that we start planning a date...but then again - we don't have a set venue yet.
> 
> Wayne - how are you feeling about it still? Or are we going to take DrSmurto up on his offer to have his place as a venue again?




I think an indication of roughly when this will be held would be good, late June, early, mid or late July?
Will be handy to know so brewing/ conditioning schedule can be worked out so beers are ready to go at swap time.

Also noticed there are still a couple of empty slots in the line up.

Nige


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## drsmurto (11/3/09)

I'll have a chat to Wayne asap to see who is hosting this one.

Late June, early July would be my pick.

Maybe someone with time and motivation can set up a poll on dates so we can ensure max attendance?
*
Thread has been moved to http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=30865*


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