# Retailers mark up and what is a fair hit?



## bruce86 (21/2/13)

Just curious what is a general mark up on products from the states for a retailer?
I looked into getting barrels last year and saw that the price in aus was too high for my budget i found a place in the states which looked the goods before they decided not to email me back about my query. 
I started this thread because as you know there is this new add and the barrels are as expected quite expensive however they look just like the ones from the american site i found and even the info sheets seem similar.

http://www.barrelsonline.com/Default.aspx

Now I'm not trying to start a shit storm just generally interested in how this works. But from what i worked out off the sites buy vs sell its a 400% mark up (give or take) Now i get that there are things like import taxes and gst but i am also aware that if a company is a supplier then they would not be paying the same rates i worked out. 

Disclaimer: I also realise that in fact these could not be the same barrels and this retailer could be paying more for theirs it is more about the concept.

Are we getting ripped off by SOME of our retailers in Australia. As i would love to support the Aussies.


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## barls (21/2/13)

im going to ask did you happen to get a quote on shipping to over here so you could do a comparison.


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## bruce86 (21/2/13)

I did email them a while back and never got a reply I expected for a single barrel it would be quite costly.
I also realise that a cooperage here the cost of creating these would be a lot higher than the states and hence the price tag. That i can understand even if i cant afford to pay it.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

There are some Croatian Oak barrels sold in the Swan valley. Cant give you a price but the seller was Purely barrels.
Bloody retailers trying to make a profit , what next ,you expecting wages for the work you do :huh:
Nev


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## bruce86 (22/2/13)

Hahaha nev not trying to have a dig mate was just interested. I know you need to do a mark up and I understand it would most likely be over 150 percent due to running cost and all that that. Don't stress I'm still going to but my grain and other bits and Bobs from you  not going to start a coo.


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## yum beer (22/2/13)

Its not about mark up, its about the retailer selling a product at a reasonable price.
If the locals retailers price is too high in comparison then they may lose business to the few who will buy online.
At the end of the day it is the customer that will drive the sell price and hence the mark-up.

I know a retailer who sells a product he buys at $70 to his door from the states for $600...customer pays and is happy.....


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## dth (22/2/13)

*coup

Sorry, I know English is a bastardised language, but even when we are attempting to use _le Francais_ we could at least try to use it correctly.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

If Aussie retailers' markup puts their price above the cost of shipping it from overseas and paying tax/duties on it - then they are charging too much and relying on the ignorance of the shopper for a chunk of their profit.

It's no longer a viable business model. Used to be, but now people have Google and a credit card. And forums to establish credible overseas retaliers' reputations.


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## eamonnfoley (22/2/13)

Blame the government - high cost economy due to growth funded on overseas debt, and using real estate as a tool to create false wealth.


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## manticle (22/2/13)

dth said:


> *coup
> 
> Sorry, I know English is a bastardised language, but even when we are attempting to use _le Francais_ we could at least try to use it correctly.


Then use a cedilla.

Pots and kettles, etc.


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## tricache (22/2/13)

Working in a company which major business is importing parts from the US we see a lot of people buying it themselves just to cut us out (mainly because it does work out cheaper in some areas)

To give an indication to how big a shipment we do every 2 weeks :- We air freight from 15 different companies which usually is about 1.5 - 2 tonne of parts, it is then consolidated and shipped, we then have to pay shipping charges & tax when it arrives (due to size and cost of shipment) and then we have to pay the poor slob (me) who has to unpack and distribute the parts. Some parts we make a lot money on because we can but some we don't make any on (we make money on the parts which are needed to go with them, hull needs a motor ect)

The major thing to look at though, is the company you are dealing with getting a good deal themselves on the items you are looking at. If they are just paying a few percent below retail US then by the time they ship and land them here they are going to be overpriced. Shipping is going to be your biggest hurdle and obviously if your order is over $1000 you will be stung with GST when it arrives and will jack up the price.

Just my 2c before everyone goes and jumps on the "They are ripping us off" bandwagon  and yes I do order my hops from the US but I also buy my malt and yeast from my local HBS even though its a bit more expensive.


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## pmastello (22/2/13)

I think the volume of sales in Australia also plays a big factor. The size of the market in the US is much bigger, hence they can afford a lower margin.
The number of Oak barrels you will sell to the Australian homebrewing community is going to be minscule, hence, you need to make it worth your time and effort to do so.


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## tricache (22/2/13)

Gingerbrew said:


> I think the volume of sales in Australia also plays a big factor. The size of the market in the US is much bigger, hence they can afford a lower margin.
> The number of Oak barrels you will sell to the Australian homebrewing community is going to be minscule, hence, you need to make it worth your time and effort to do so.


Exactly right...its worth a retailer bringing in 10 if they get the demand but 1s and 2s are not worth it.


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## Paul H (22/2/13)

Socialists must still be in bed 

:icon_cheers:

Paul


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## Spiesy (22/2/13)

I work in wholesale (not brewing wholesale)... our margins and those of our retailers are NOWHERE near 400%. 

I know a lot of retailers in my sector make around 18-20%GP.


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## hsb (22/2/13)

I don't know anything about retail or logistics or markups or cooperage, but I do know that I wish barrels were a third of the price they are, might buy one then.
Spoken with total ignorance of the practicality of making them and running a business off it and costs involved, not implying anything or criticising anyone, just noting that they're out of my league as things stand, maybe one day my desire/resources and the cost will meet somewhere in the middle.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

Maybe Vince Coz can do a barrel making course ? :lol:
You know you want to !
Nev


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I think a mention of Allens / Billy Hyde Music deserves being said here. You went in there on a Saturday and there were 50 people in there all trying out products.

No one at the cash register. If there was, it was someone saying, "I can get it online for this ... can you match it."

Almost their entire range was 25-75% more than buying it online and paying shipping.

They are no longer.

Would they have been able to shift enough stock at US (+ shipping) prices to stay in business? I say yes.

But they were working to a business model that treats the consumer as a fool. Consumers are not fools - people who are working with receivership lawyers/acountants are.

2013. If you cannot compete on an international market you'd better either be the sole retailer (like Craftbrewer is with NZ hop board) or cheap enough to shift a lot of stock.


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## bum (22/2/13)

Bought by Gallins and still trading. I'm sure your point is still awesome though and the fact that there were attractive enough for someone else to purchase does nothing to counter your well reasoned and informed FACTS.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

How much of the company did they buy again?

EDIT: 7 out of 25.

Check out the online store:

http://gallinsmps.com.au/abh.html

WHAT! It's not up yet and is being redesigned? Wanna bet they are going to be matching US prices...

Come on bum, they were "attractive enough" for someone to rip the whole company to shreds, get their stock for nix and only leave open the well-established high-traffic stores.


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## Camo1234 (22/2/13)

This argument is always ridiculous.

If you are going to look at mark up you have to look at their entire product range, not just a single item.

If you still feel that they are making a massive profit and don't deserve it then either start up your own company and compete with them to bring the cost down for all involved or simply don't buy from them.

If a company has no competitors then they will charge a premium for their product... But if that premium is not justified then a competitor will come along and even things out. If a competitor doesn't come along then chances are that the premium was justified.

If you think that retailers are sitting back, ripping off customers and rolling around in their super profits then you really have no clue what so ever about the retail environment at the moment.

Camo

Ps... Not having a go at anyone in particular, but dealing with small businesses in the retail sector on a daily basis, this type of topic really gets on my nerve.


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## Spiesy (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> But they were working to a business model that treats the consumer as a fool.


Not exactly right.

We, Australian wholesalers and retailers, are at a serious disadvantage in trying to compete with US-based online retailers. Being hamstrung by our Government, certainly doesn't help matters....


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## Spiesy (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> Come on bum, they were "attractive enough" for someone to rip the whole company to shreds, get their stock for nix and only leave open the well-established high-traffic stores.


They wouldn't have got much stock... most of it was liquidated.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

Buy my stuff as I need more money . :super:
Nobody needs music gear, thats why they when broke and muso's dont have any money.
Nev


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## bum (22/2/13)

That is all the liquidator would allow them to buy - they wanted more. The website being redesigned is a very good point - I'm not sure what you think it is but I have no doubt it is up to your usual calibre and is completely irrefutable. Why would they enter into talsk with the liquidator to buy the name to get the stock? The liquidator's job is to _liquidate_ such assets. But I suppose the whole industry has no idea what it is doing so this arse-backwards sort of behaviour is par for the course?

There is no way they can match US prices because the wholesale price is not the same for us. Been reading the papers at all lately, Nick? Quite the to do about it recently.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

This is the money I made last week because I am an Online retailer.
License to print .....................


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## Ross (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> If you cannot compete on an international market you'd better either be the sole retailer (like Craftbrewer is with NZ hop board) or cheap enough to shift a lot of stock.


Quick correction - We are not the sole retailer for NZ hop board, infact we are not a seller for them at all & purchase from elsewhere. They simply direct people to us as we generally stock their entire range & they like the way we've packaged & handled their stock from the first day we started business.

Cheers Ross.


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## hsb (22/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> This is the money I made last week because I am an Online retailer.
> License to print ....................<snip>


Just confirmed my suspicions, homebrew retail is the last gold rush of Australia, a vast untapped resource of untold riches, a playground of George Hearst types, I knew it. Damn you!


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## Yob (22/2/13)

Nick banging on, as usual, with his well informed industry dribble...

on ya Nick, if little else you are always good for a laugh..

feck.. I seem to have misplaced the sarcastic font again :blink:


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

Me and the wife after we sold our music business
Who said muso's had no .............................


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## bruce86 (22/2/13)

Was holding off replying as on my phone and did.not want sp spelling nazis to get me again. But you all think nev is joking but I saw him having a bath in 100 dollar bills when I picked up grain one time. Weird bit was the bath was in the living room


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## Ross (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> If Aussie retailers' markup puts their price above the cost of shipping it from overseas and paying tax/duties on it - then they are charging too much and relying on the ignorance of the shopper for a chunk of their profit.
> 
> It's no longer a viable business model. Used to be, but now people have Google and a credit card. And forums to establish credible overseas retaliers' reputations.


Wrong again... We stock quite a few products bought from the USA at exactly the same price that you brewers can purchase for. Not only that, but we have to add 10% gst when we sell, so we are already 10% behind the game before we make any margin. We could just not stock these items, but fortunately, whereas we are unlikely to make a sale to computer savy individuals that have no desire to support Australian business, we have many customers that aren't or like/prefer dealing with us & understand that without a margin we don't exsist.
Do you buy any meat from the supermarket or local shops Nick, or do you buy it all direct from the farm because of the money grabbing retailers in the middle?
I have no problem with people buying direct from source, or anywhere they like, just get a little tired of the constant attacks from some quarters that we are money grabbing bastards. Our business model is based on having the lowest prices we can sustain, but unfortunately (unless we buy up all the chinese factories & USA hop farms) we cannot always be the cheapest.

Cheers Ross


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## brettprevans (22/2/13)

No u cant ross but where you justify your extra prices is through adding value likw in advice and customer service. If somwonw want toask u a question about say a keg setup they can. They wont be able to getvthe same info from an online retailer OS (just an an example and possibly not a great one). 

Just my 2c in a topic thats been done to death. Plenty of threads on this topic already.



Welease wodderwick. Are there any wodderwicks? Well then welease woss


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

bruce86 said:


> Was holding off replying as on my phone and did.not want sp spelling nazis to get me again. But you all think nev is joking but I saw him having a bath in 100 dollar bills when I picked up grain one time. Weird bit was the bath was in the living room


Just picked up the new GOLD car for the wife..............
The Gryphon mobile....


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## Maheel (22/2/13)

it's a a funny thing but i am reading this thread about barrels, well it started out about them but then turns into how aussie retialers are awash with cash...

and there is a site "sponsor" who sells what i reckon are the same mexican barrels adertising at the top of the AHB page

http://barrelsandkegs.com.au/store#ecwid:category=3470596&mode=category&offset=0&sort=normal

lol


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## Spiesy (22/2/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> No u cant ross but where you justify your extra prices is through adding value likw in advice and customer service. If somwonw want toask u a question about say a keg setup they can. They wont be able to getvthe same info from an online retailer OS (just an an example and possibly not a great one).
> 
> Just my 2c in a topic thats been done to death. Plenty of threads on this topic already.
> 
> ...


come again?


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## jlm (22/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> This is the money I made last week because I am an Online retailer.
> License to print .....................
> 
> 
> ...


Yet look at ya, counting it out with your fingers. By a calculator you tight ass.......Or abacus if thats cheaper.


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## brettprevans (22/2/13)

Spiesy said:


> come again?


 which part? The top part should be self explanatory bar a few spelking mistakes. 

The 2nd part is becuase in another thread some life of brian jokes are going on and I couldnt resist making one in here.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Ross said:


> Wrong again... We stock quite a few products bought from the USA at exactly the same price that you brewers can purchase for. Not only that, but we have to add 10% gst when we sell, so we are already 10% behind the game before we make any margin. We could just not stock these items, but fortunately, whereas we are unlikely to make a sale to computer savy individuals that have no desire to support Australian business, we have many customers that aren't or like/prefer dealing with us & understand that without a margin we don't exsist.
> Do you buy any meat from the supermarket or local shops Nick, or do you buy it all direct from the farm because of the money grabbing retailers in the middle?
> I have no problem with people buying direct from source, or anywhere they like, just get a little tired of the constant attacks from some quarters that we are money grabbing bastards. Our business model is based on having the lowest prices we can sustain, but unfortunately (unless we buy up all the chinese factories & USA hop farms) we cannot always be the cheapest.
> 
> Cheers Ross


I've spent thousands of dollars at your shop, Ross. Would I spend these $$$ elsewhere if I could get the same range cheaper? Yes.

I "support" that which treats its customers well.

Never said you're ripping people off. But when I want to buy musical instruments and gear ... I don't shop at Allens. If you decide to take this as a dig at you, them that's unfortunately not within my control.

EDIT: where else can I buy NZ hops in Australia? Or from NZ? They just tell me to go to you...


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

My airlock is not bubbling, what should I do?


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## Yob (22/2/13)

If I google _*any*_ australian retailer they are stocking... h34r:

dumbarse

sound familiar?


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## Spiesy (22/2/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> which part? The top part should be self explanatory bar a few spelking mistakes.
> 
> The 2nd part is becuase in another thread some life of brian jokes are going on and I couldnt resist making one in here.


Sorry mate, I was just taking the piss regarding the spelling...


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I'd like to buy a pound for ~$20. Like the kiwis do.

Ross buys $11 pounds of Cascade and sells them for $9.90 per 90g. That's $50

So yeah - quite the markup. I have no worries with this - but why not sell Cascade for $30 a pound instead of $45?

Then I'd not buy straight from America.

Is there honestly no profit in it unless you mark up by 400%?

EDIT: I bought a 90g pack of cascade from CB last week. I find them invaluable for small quantities and service and quality.


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> I'd like to buy a pound for ~$20. Like the kiwis do.
> 
> Ross buys $11 pounds of Cascade and sells them for $9.90 per 90g. That's $50
> 
> ...


I'd like to know where the hell I can buy a pound of hops for $20...seriously, I would. I'm currently paying about $9 for 100g


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Yob said:


> If I google _*any*_ australian retailer they are stocking... h34r:
> 
> dumbarse
> 
> sound familiar?


How much for a pound of B Saaz?


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> I'd like to know where the hell I can buy a pound of hops for $20...seriously, I would. I'm currently paying about $9 for 100g


Kiwis can't buy pounds of kiwi hops?


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> I'd like to know where the hell I can buy a pound of hops for $20...seriously, I would. I'm currently pay about $9 for 100g


You bloody Kiwis would just jump the fence and steal it :beer:
and my thongs, What is it with you blokes and thongs ?
Nev


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## Bada Bing Brewery (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> My airlock is not bubbling, what should I do?


But another one - check the overseas price first.
BBB


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> You bloody Kiwis would just jump the fence and steal it :beer:
> and my thongs, What is it with you blokes and thongs ?
> Nev


Over here a thong is something *completely* different. :lol:

I'm serious about the hop thing though, I'd love to know where I can buy bulk in NZ...any Kiwis here?


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> Kiwis can't buy pounds of kiwi hops?


Sure we probably can, just don't know where.


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## Yob (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> How much for a pound of B Saaz?


I have my Riwaka.. did you miss that diddums?

admittedly not a pound


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Yob said:


> I have my Riwaka.. did you miss that diddums?


Where did you buy it from?


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## Westaussiebrewer (22/2/13)

the way i see it is if you need / want something bad enough you will pay what the retailer is asking simply because if you didnt need it you wouldnt be buying it.

sometimes i dont mind paying a little bit more simply because generaly the service that comes with it from the likes of Nev, ciro and ross any anyone else i have delt with has been great. 

simply put yes it costs more to purchase here in australia but why hot help out the guys that are here that do help us ???


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Westaussiebrewer said:


> the way i see it is if you need / want something bad enough you will pay what the retailer is asking simply because if you didnt need it you wouldnt be buying it.
> 
> sometimes i dont mind paying a little bit more simply because generaly the service that comes with it from the likes of Nev, ciro and ross any anyone else i have delt with has been great.
> 
> simply put yes it costs more to purchase here in australia but why hot help out the guys that are here that do help us ???


I agree. But only if they aren't taking the piss.

As an example, an old guy was in Craftbrewer last week buying a $70 temp controller. Now we've all bough the exellent STC 1000 for $16-$20, and I said nothing and watched it get rung up - and I assume it's a much better quality product (when my STC is still working perfectly), but fark me, there's a big difference between $75 and $16.

So, I'll continue to shop wisely. Retailers may see it as shopping like a wise arse - I see it as questioning the status quo and voting with one's wallet.

Craftbrewer is a great shop, I'm always spruiking their products ... when they are better than others. My refractometer is the same as theirs for less than half the price. Etc.


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## Yob (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> Where did you buy it from?


why from HERE of course

Im happy to sell you some at a 400% markup h34r:

aah feck... Im not a retailer so alas I can offer you bubkis


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Yob said:


> why from HERE of course
> 
> Im happy to sell you some at a 400% markup h34r:
> 
> aah feck... Im not a retailer so alas I can offer you bubkis


Where do you get it?


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## Westaussiebrewer (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> I agree. But only if they aren't taking the piss.
> 
> As an example, an old guy was in Craftbrewer last week buying a $70 temp controller. Now we've all bough the exellent STC 1000 for $16-$20, and I said nothing and watched it get rung up - and I assume it's a much better quality product (when my STC is still working perfectly), but fark me, there's a big difference between $75 and $16.
> 
> ...



fair enough but simply put some people really dont care about cost as they find it easier just to go buy off the shelf this guy you seen purchasing the temp controller may just not have known where to look or may have just not cared and wanted something local its up it each individual to do there research on what they want and how much there willing to pay

sure i shop around to but at the end of the day its easier to just put an order in down in perth with the guys down there and pick up next time in down that way.


basically each to there own


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## Yob (22/2/13)

..erm.. piss off.. I aint tellin _*you*_


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I question whether it was even B Saaz. Probably Summer Saaz.


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## warra48 (22/2/13)

Ross said:


> Wrong again... We stock quite a few products bought from the USA at exactly the same price that you brewers can purchase for. Not only that, but we have to add 10% gst when we sell, so we are already 10% behind the game before we make any margin. We could just not stock these items, but fortunately, whereas we are unlikely to make a sale to computer savy individuals that have no desire to support Australian business, we have many customers that aren't or like/prefer dealing with us & understand that without a margin we don't exsist.
> Do you buy any meat from the supermarket or local shops Nick, or do you buy it all direct from the farm because of the money grabbing retailers in the middle?
> I have no problem with people buying direct from source, or anywhere they like, just get a little tired of the constant attacks from some quarters that we are money grabbing bastards. Our business model is based on having the lowest prices we can sustain, but unfortunately (unless we buy up all the chinese factories & USA hop farms) we cannot always be the cheapest.
> 
> Cheers Ross


Actually, it's more like 11% if you do the reverse calculation.

I have no problem with anyone making a decent and fair buck. I really don't think any _reputable and knowlegable _Aussie HB retailers, whether on line or shopfront, are ripping us off.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I noticed Smurto boasting about a Kg of D Saaz, so someone's selling it...


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

Doesn't Smurto grow his own hops?


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## warra48 (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> My airlock is not bubbling, what should I do?


Better check you added wort to your yeast starter.
Alternatively, strangle a puppy or two.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Again, I said a Music retailer in Australia (that went under) was ripping people off. Ross infered I was refering to him when I commented about NZ hops. Which I was wrong about - the hop board telling me to go to CB had me thinking they had the monopoly.

I don't think Aussie retailers are ripping people off. Some products are available elsewhere cheaper - that's all.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> Doesn't Smurto grow his own hops?


He must have stolen the D Saaz rhizomes then.


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## Yob (22/2/13)

red letter day... bookmarked so I can read it every so often 



Nick JD said:


> Which I was wrong about
> 
> I don't think Aussie retailers are ripping people off. Some products are available elsewhere cheaper - that's all.


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## wbosher (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> He must have stolen the D Saaz rhizomes then.


Now you're done getting all technimical.


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## Yob (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> I question whether it was even B Saaz. Probably Summer Saaz.


no

ed: ask the previously linked thread... there are some people in there that know what hops are what. I cant be arsed convincing you.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I'd be great if you could let everyone know where you buy cheap NZ hops in bulk.

But if you don't want to then everyone can make their minds up about your motives for keeping it to yourself themselves.

Me, I can't see any reason why you'd not want to let people know. Except dickhead reasons.


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## Yob (22/2/13)

was a very limited supply as you would know if you took the time to read even the first few posts... 

but may I just add that yet again you are wrong.. I saw the stamp on the foil myself. Not Summer S.

I also have a packet of Summer S... would you like I open them both and compare?

No, sorry, I dont cater to dickhead reasoning...


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## TidalPete (22/2/13)

Spiesy said:


> Sorry mate, I was just taking the piss regarding the spelling...


If you use Internet Explorer ----- http://www.iespell.com/ :super:

PS -- This thread is great entertainment & I REALLY need some cheap 'D' Saaz.


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## doon (22/2/13)

There was 5kg of riwaka on ebay maybe thats where he got it???


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## QldKev (22/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> You bloody Kiwis would just jump the fence and steal it :beer:
> and my thongs, What is it with you blokes and thongs ?
> Nev


I saw a kiwi the other day wearing just one thong
I said to him, hey mate ya lost a thong
He said, Na just found one!


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

QldKev said:


> I saw a kiwi the other day wearing just one thong
> I said to him, hey mate ya lost a thong
> He said, Na just found one!


Replace "found " with stole from Nev.
Bloody Kiwis. Watch out for your cat !
Nev


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## brettprevans (22/2/13)

Spiesy said:


> Sorry mate, I was just taking the piss regarding the spelling...


ahh. then continue good sir


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## Yob (22/2/13)

he blames his phone... Im starting to wonder


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## jlm (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> I question whether it was even B Saaz. Probably Summer Saaz.


http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/62720-riwaka-d-saaz-supplier/
Post 7
You sure you know the difference bro?


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## manticle (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> I'd be great if you could let everyone know where you buy cheap NZ hops in bulk. But if you don't want to then everyone can make their minds up about your motives for keeping it to yourself themselves. Me, I can't see any reason why you'd not want to let people know. Except dickhead reasons.


He came across a limited supply, advertised it here and split the whole supply at cost to interested parties. A mini bulk buy, essentially. What motives are you questioning?


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

I want to find a place that sells NZ hops at a price lower than $45 a pound.

Not interested in someone finding a couple of pounds on ebay. I thought he had an actual retail source.

At the start of the harvest, who sells NZ hop varieties in pounds? Craftbrewer sells them in pounds, but the discount is feeble for the volume.


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## manticle (22/2/13)

I get that. It has nothing to do with the motives of someone distributing rare/hard to get hops for no profit.
I realise you and yob aren't internet friends but casting aspersions on his motives is a really long shot. Read the relevant thread.


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## bum (22/2/13)

Nick JD said:


> the discount is feeble for the volume.


Why must he provide a discount?


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

bum said:


> Why must he provide a discount?


Indeed. If no one else is selling pounds of NZ hops for cheaper, he does not need to.


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## bruce86 (22/2/13)

apologies for causing such a big ruckas. And Cammo was defiantly not trying to give you the shits and yes i do not know a lot about retail hence the reason i posted. I did not either mean to say that every retailer is out to rip the public off here in Australia i was just trying to find out if this was a possibility. As many have stated the Gov with all their taxes have played a massive part in why our prices seem inflated to our american counter parts which is a shame.
Unfortunately i couldn't get online in time to to respond to those that made comments a bit more OT to my post but thanks for the info.
As there are 3 main guys here in Aus i use Ross(who i would use a bit more but your are on the other side of the country) Nev and Ciaron, I do try to use the local guys first, that being said i also order my hops through Yakima as the value is just too good. 
The add for the barrels just give me the shits especially since they seemed to be the exact same ones from the other site so instead of going on a rampage i would ask first to get more info on the topic. Im usually happy to spend a little more for service and product but those differences in prices were crazy especially since they are imported goods going for what a local cooperage was selling theirs for.


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## AndrewQLD (22/2/13)

bruce86 said:


> apologies for causing such a big ruckas. And Cammo was defiantly not trying to give you the shits and yes i do not know a lot about retail hence the reason i posted. I did not either mean to say that every retailer is out to rip the public off here in Australia i was just trying to find out if this was a possibility. As many have stated the Gov with all their taxes have played a massive part in why our prices seem inflated to our american counter parts which is a shame.
> Unfortunately i couldn't get online in time to to respond to those that made comments a bit more OT to my post but thanks for the info.
> As there are 3 main guys here in Aus i use Ross(who i would use a bit more but your are on the other side of the country) Nev and Ciaron, I do try to use the local guys first, that being said i also order my hops through Yakima as the value is just too good.
> The add for the barrels just give me the shits especially since they seemed to be the exact same ones from the other site so instead of going on a rampage i would ask first to get more info on the topic. Im usually happy to spend a little more for service and product but those differences in prices were crazy especially since they are imported goods going for what a local cooperage was selling theirs for.


I'd start by finding out shipping costs plus relevant taxes that need to be applied if any, then look at how much you could save, probably not a lot on something like a barrel.
Importing quantities of anything into Australia can incur quite a few extra fees that most people don't realise and if the shipment is held up in port the fees go up and up. Retailers have to take all these things into account and so the price difference.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

AndrewQLD said:


> I'd start by finding out shipping costs plus relevant taxes that need to be applied if any, then look at how much you could save, probably not a lot on something like a barrel.
> Importing quantities of anything into Australia can incur quite a few extra fees that most people don't realise and if the shipment is held up in port the fees go up and up. Retailers have to take all these things into account and so the price difference.


Govt obviously doesn't care about retailers.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

Ross said:


> Do you buy any meat from the supermarket or local shops Nick, or do you buy it all direct from the farm because of the money grabbing retailers in the middle?
> 
> Cheers Ross


Did you just compare yourself to Coles and Woollies? :blink:


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## Yob (22/2/13)

With due regard, I thinkc it has been on topic, and one dear to nicks black heart, for pretty much the whole time. Agree that it moved on from the listed advertiser but still pretty relevant to the thread title.

These sorts of threads do tend to bring out some..er.. Strong opinios.. 

Re the add, its what is told to nick time and again, if you dont think its a good deal, nobody is twisting your arm but good on him for paying for the advertising which keeps this forum free and gives me the opportunity to poke nick with a burning stick for the stuff he writes which is clearly misinformed... Repeatedly..


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## neal32 (22/2/13)

Ultimately the price is set by the market, fair or not. I buy locally, from interstate and overseas (for hops). I never whinge about the prices because they are what they are and to be honest my dealings with Niko, Craftbrewer, Grain & Grape, TWOC and Nev have been exemplary, they have gone out of their way to make sure my experience has been perfect (Hat-tip to Niko and Grain & Grape). So to the retailers reading, don't let the cretins get you down or tell you your charging too much because you're doing a top job in an industry that by it's nature evidently attracts tight arses.

P.S I buy from Niko mainly due to buying 'straight from the source' so the hops arn't double/triple handled and the quality is the best i've experienced. Price is secondary, although nice.


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## bruce86 (22/2/13)

kudos Yob. Your right it was still kinda OT i just meant that there were a couple of really good posts i saw on my phone earlier i wanted to also give kudos to but messing around on my phone is a hard task.


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## Diesel80 (22/2/13)

Entertaining banter in this thread. When is the sequel being released? :beerbang:

Cheers,
D80


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## bruce86 (22/2/13)

ill see what i can do D80 :lol:


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## Online Brewing Supplies (22/2/13)

bruce86 said:


> apologies for causing such a big ruckas. And Cammo was defiantly not trying to give you the shits and yes i do not know a lot about retail hence the reason i posted. I did not either mean to say that every retailer is out to rip the public off here in Australia i was just trying to find out if this was a possibility. As many have stated the Gov with all their taxes have played a massive part in why our prices seem inflated to our american counter parts which is a shame.
> Unfortunately i couldn't get online in time to to respond to those that made comments a bit more OT to my post but thanks for the info.
> As there are 3 main guys here in Aus i use Ross(who i would use a bit more but your are on the other side of the country) Nev and Ciaron, I do try to use the local guys first, that being said i also order my hops through Yakima as the value is just too good.
> The add for the barrels just give me the shits especially since they seemed to be the exact same ones from the other site so instead of going on a rampage i would ask first to get more info on the topic. Im usually happy to spend a little more for service and product but those differences in prices were crazy especially since they are imported goods going for what a local cooperage was selling theirs for.


You are obviously just a shit stirrer, cease and desist :lol:
You American hugging barrel boy.
Nev


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## Westaussiebrewer (22/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> You are obviously just a shit stirrer, cease and desist :lol:
> You American hugging barrel boy.
> Nev


hahhahah \

GOLD


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## drsmurto (22/2/13)

I didn't buy the Riwaka (500g for $35) via ebay. I don't have Riwaka rhizomes.

I supported an Australian retailer.


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## Nick JD (22/2/13)

wbosher said:


> I'd like to know where the hell I can buy a pound of hops for $20...seriously, I would. I'm currently paying about $9 for 100g


NZHops.co.nz show a couple of retailers with stuff like green bullet and super alpha for NZD$19 a pound. Can't find anything "good" though - but the harvest is probably happening very soon.


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## hsb (22/2/13)

You must spend a lot of money, saving money and fighting corporate greed. You are the all powerful consumer and I fear you!


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## punkin (23/2/13)

Loathe to get into this discussion but a couple of points.

To the OP, if you never ended up getting a freight quote to ship a big box of American air half way around the world then you'll never be able to say whether the price was comparable, let alone with the niggling 10% gst and 5% duties and other charges (should see what we have to pay to get stuff off a boat and into a warehouse here).

To the people who truely believe that all prices are set by what people will pay, can i say that not all business models are based on that. Ross has said his is not and i know that ours is not. There is another philosophy that says deliver the best possible value for the best possible quality and the customer will keep coming back.

So you set a reasonable margin that will allow you to stay in business and you strive to keep lowering price and improving quality.

Not all items are marked up the same either. Sometimes an item may be presented at well below your s
'stay alive'price because another competitior is doing it a whole lot cheaper due to a good deal, volume whatever. Then you'll need to make that margin up on something else that you are able to offer great prices on by putting your margin up.
Otherwise you are bust.
There are items i slaughter Ross on price, but that is because i buy them by the crate load and as he said, he keeps them as a service to his customers, probably pays near retail prices and sells a couple a month. If i tried to match him on price by selling pounds of hops i would be on the arse of my pants very quickly.


It's all been said before, but anyone who thinks that retailers should be able to offer the same prices here as an individual can get stuff overseas for is not putting any thought into it.


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## yum beer (23/2/13)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> Just picked up the new GOLD car for the wife..............
> The Gryphon mobile....
> 
> 
> ...


Come now Kev, no need to show off......what did that cost, profits from a few bags of hops...


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