# New Low Volume Craft Beer "aussie Cool"



## mark_m (3/10/11)

Hi All,
I had the good fortune at the weekend to meet an enthusiastic bloke by the name of Manol.
He appears to have done a number of things with his life, the latest being to bring to market the "Aussie Cool" lager brand.
After having a crack at the first of my sample 6 pack, I would characterise it as a nice clean lager driven by saaz hops.
Link below, worth a look.
Cheers,
Mark.

http://www.aussiecoolbeer.com.au/


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## /// (3/10/11)

And we need another lager like this ...


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## Bribie G (3/10/11)

Like we need another hop monster APA and wonder why mainstream beer drinkers mysteriously don't "get" how unfortunate they are not to be drinking "craft beer"

Bring on the lagers I say, it's the "natural" beer of Australia, and just because the mainstreams have prostituted the style, no reason why well made lagers and Pilsners in particular should be sneered at.


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## /// (3/10/11)

Yep, DIPA's are simply a waste of malt and hops. As much as it pains some folks, there aint much selling going on with those beers. The hop zealots on Beer Advocate hate the fact I show disdain for commercially unviable beer ... what happens in the US aint always good here. Just like Snapple.

Sorry, i found the marketing tacky and the story full of the usual rhetoric by folks that had beer made on contract and knew little about beer. Give me a Moo Brew Pils or Australian Brewery Pilsner, thems the real beers you are after BG ... 

Scotty


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## bignath (3/10/11)

Whilst i will go out and grab a sixer to try it, that's some of the most wanky marketing bullshit i've read in a long time on the "about our beer" page....


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## Amin (3/10/11)

Big Nath said:


> Whilst i will go out and grab a sixer to try it, that's some of the most *wanky marketing bullshit* i've read in a long time on the "about our beer" page....


I take it you don't drink much wine then?


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## jbowers (4/10/11)

/// said:


> Yep, DIPA's are simply a waste of malt and hops. As much as it pains some folks, there aint much selling going on with those beers. The hop zealots on Beer Advocate hate the fact I show disdain for commercially unviable beer ... what happens in the US aint always good here. Just like Snapple.
> 
> Sorry, i found the marketing tacky and the story full of the usual rhetoric by folks that had beer made on contract and knew little about beer. Give me a Moo Brew Pils or Australian Brewery Pilsner, thems the real beers you are after BG ...
> 
> Scotty




I understand this if you are talking in terms of very large scale operations, but in terms of smaller craft-based beer stores this simply isn't the case. Without a doubt good IPA's and RIS's are selling like hotcakes at these kinds of stores. Epic Hop Zombie, for one, is a massive commercial success, like it or not. I'm sure even Moylans Hopsickle has sold well since arriving, despite genuinely being a total waste of all the ingredients that went in to making it.

To be honest, I'd probably love the beers you make at your establishment - I can't really drink more than one or two super hoppy beers any more - but I feel like on this point you might be ignoring reality just a touch?

Also, what's the point of making a european style pilsener when traditional examples of the style can be had for a lower price? I reckon beers like Knappstein, Red Angus and Hop Rocker are much more on the money for what southern hemisphere brewers need to be doing with their pilseners.


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## /// (4/10/11)

jbowers said:


> I understand this if you are talking in terms of very large scale operations, but in terms of smaller craft-based beer stores this simply isn't the case. Without a doubt good IPA's and RIS's are selling like hotcakes at these kinds of stores. Epic Hop Zombie, for one, is a massive commercial success, like it or not. I'm sure even Moylans Hopsickle has sold well since arriving, despite genuinely being a total waste of all the ingredients that went in to making it.
> 
> To be honest, I'd probably love the beers you make at your establishment - I can't really drink more than one or two super hoppy beers any more - but I feel like on this point you might be ignoring reality just a touch?
> 
> Also, what's the point of making a european style pilsener when traditional examples of the style can be had for a lower price? I reckon beers like Knappstein, Red Angus and Hop Rocker are much more on the money for what southern hemisphere brewers need to be doing with their pilseners.



I think its a mutual bro-romance gone a drift, in smaller craft bars you'll understand RIS's and DIPA's are the worst selling beers on tap in a bar. Retail stores will and can differ. Punters on a Friday do not want to drink or pay for this sort of beer in a pub/bar; an everyday beer will suffice.

The old salesman in me see's sales a result of success, there is no ignoring reality with sales numbers at hand. The last DIPA we had on tap took 2.5 weeks to sell a keg, we are selling 10 kegs a week of our pale, triple that out in trade. We also have 3 other beers gong boingo.

The 3 pils listed are all NS based. To be honest, Croucher Pils made these beers look pedestrian with the same hop. The Aust Brewery Pils brewed by the same brewer as Red Angus, and something you have not seen in Melb (and best Pils at the Adelaide Show) is awesome. 

So I reckon when it comes to Pils, it is all about balance for the Southerners ... no the hop.

Scotty


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## spaced (4/10/11)

My misguided opinion is that when people are "getting on it", they usually want something easy drinking.

They'll go for a lager or some type of James Squire as they wont be dominated by the flavour.

Back on topic.

Not my type of beer, but good luck to them all the same.


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## jbowers (4/10/11)

/// said:


> I think its a mutual bro-romance gone a drift, in smaller craft bars you'll understand RIS's and DIPA's are the worst selling beers on tap in a bar. Retail stores will and can differ. Punters on a Friday do not want to drink or pay for this sort of beer in a pub/bar; an everyday beer will suffice.
> 
> The old salesman in me see's sales a result of success, there is no ignoring reality with sales numbers at hand. The last DIPA we had on tap took 2.5 weeks to sell a keg, we are selling 10 kegs a week of our pale, triple that out in trade. We also have 3 other beers gong boingo.
> 
> ...



Sure, in a bar setting it is bound to be different. If I just wanted to get pissed then I'd be slamming down pints of pils/pale too. There is a not insignificant market though for hoppy australian beers. Hop Hog seems to sell like hotcakes at my local pub in carlton, but again I don't have the figures as to how well it compares to the other beers on tap. Interestingly, most people who go there seem to order carlton draught despite being able to pay marginally more for a pint of a wide range of craft beers.

Could it also perhaps be, and this is just a theory, that because of your obvious preference for lower abv, highly drinkable beers which are good representations of classic styles that those people searching for big experimental beers or hop bombs have learned not to visit your venue and as such your clientele are not the kind of people who would particularly enjoy drinking an IIPA?

I'll have to try Croucher Pils as I reckon the Knappstein especially is really something special.


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## mje1980 (4/10/11)

jbowers said:


> Sure, in a bar setting it is bound to be different. If I just wanted to get pissed then I'd be slamming down pints of pils/pale too. There is a not insignificant market though for hoppy australian beers. Hop Hog seems to sell like hotcakes at my local pub in carlton, but again I don't have the figures as to how well it compares to the other beers on tap. Interestingly, most people who go there seem to order carlton draught despite being able to pay marginally more for a pint of a wide range of craft beers.
> 
> Could it also perhaps be, and this is just a theory, that because of your obvious preference for lower abv, highly drinkable beers which are good representations of classic styles that those people searching for big experimental beers or hop bombs have learned not to visit your venue and as such your clientele are not the kind of people who would particularly enjoy drinking an IIPA?
> 
> I'll have to try Croucher Pils as I reckon the Knappstein especially is really something special.


I don't think hart's pub regulars are mainstream lager swillers looking to "get on it"!


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## pimpsqueak (4/10/11)

You'd think that if they were so proud to introduce the latest and greatest Aussie beer, they would take the time to proof-read their "About us" blurb. 
Incompetence leaves a bad taste in my mouth. :blink:


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## manticle (4/10/11)

/// said:


> Sorry, i found the marketing tacky and the story full of the usual rhetoric by folks that had beer made on contract and knew little about beer. Give me a Moo Brew Pils or Australian Brewery Pilsner, thems the real beers you are after BG ...
> 
> Scotty



No only tacky but written by someone with a minimum grasp of the written English language.

It sounds like it was originally written in a different language, then put through babelfish.

Snap, pimpsqueak.


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## jbowers (4/10/11)

mje1980 said:


> I don't think hart's pub regulars are mainstream lager swillers looking to "get on it"!



Not trying to say they are, was just making observations about my own experiences at other venues.

edit: this has gone way off topic. 

Back on topic: I agree with above posters - website looks terrible and the packaging reminds me of chinese beer.... Not great things!


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## MarkBastard (4/10/11)

A really innovative pale lager that uses saaz! I bet it tastes like adjunct.


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## bignath (4/10/11)

and the "innovative" brewing technique seems to include (but may be limited to) a long cool fermentation cycle......

wow, lager's feremented cool and for longer than an ale? who would've thought.....

bignath is feeling sarcastic this morning.


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## stux (4/10/11)

Mark^Bastard said:


> A really innovative pale lager that uses saaz! I bet it tastes like adjunct.



But it's fermented slow and cool!


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## petesbrew (4/10/11)

Name doesn't do it for me, and lagers don't get me excited.
But hey, good luck to him. I'll give it a try if I see it.


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## esssee (4/10/11)

Hmmmm,

I must get me to this "Regional City of North Western Victoria, in the Sunraysia region". I wonder if Mildura knows it has a new competitor?


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## Mayor of Mildura (4/10/11)

esssee said:


> Hmmmm,
> 
> I must get me to this "Regional City of North Western Victoria, in the Sunraysia region". I wonder if Mildura knows it has a new competitor?



Come and check out how phenomenally pristine it is. 

I reckon they should of called the beer Aussie Rad or Aussie Sick or Aussie Mad Snake.....


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## kirem (4/10/11)

View attachment 48807


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## eamonnfoley (4/10/11)

It's got to be the worst name for a beer I've ever heard. Embarrassing.


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## sim (4/10/11)

kirem said:


> View attachment 48807



hah, totally.


sim


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## Liam_snorkel (4/10/11)




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## Murcluf (4/10/11)

mark_m said:


> Hi All,
> I had the good fortune at the weekend to meet an enthusiastic bloke by the name of Manol.
> He appears to have done a number of things with his life, the latest being to bring to market the "Aussie Cool" lager brand.
> After having a crack at the first of my sample 6 pack, I would characterise it as a nice clean lager driven by saaz hops.
> ...


Clicked link, browser opened, read "Premium Lager" closed browser, I'd seen enough to form the opinion that I'm not interested.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (4/10/11)

On the IPA saleability front, I noted in the Australian article about the growth in craft beer, that the bloke from Lickyourland noted that they get some small profit on craft beers, as opposed to nil or a slight loss on cartons of megaswill.

Given that most craft beers tend to be of the American Pale Ale variety (with the odd IPA, Stout, Porter and the like thrown in, as occasionally, but not frequently a pilsner) - I'd say that there's a market for beers that the mainstream public may not consider sessionable, and that these beers are turning better profit than the bog standard Aussie lager/kraut pilsner.

Given that APAs tend to be rather forgiving of faults (hell, you can chuck a ton of hops at traces of diacetyl and only a discerning palate will really pick it up), most micros do one as a matter of course (and usually avoid pilsners for the converse reason). So the growth in the craft beer industry in Australia is almost synonymous with a growth in APA, and other non lager/pilsner beers.

Just theorising.

On topic - any beer called Aussie cool doesn't even get a look in for me for 2 reasons:

1. It sounds juvenile/try hard/sick mate boganesque
2. Aussie Cool? If referring to serving temp, then you'd guess that they don't want their beer served at a temp that true beer nerds prefer, as it will highlight all faults. Tooheys new is designed to be drunk ice-cold, as are most megaswills. It hides the blandness of the beer.

Sorry for such a long, meaningless post - I'm bored at work today.

Goomba


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## winkle (4/10/11)

I wonder why they didn't go with "Lunatic Soup", thats as Aussie as...


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## bconnery (4/10/11)

But guys, the beer is unique, didn't you read the site?! 
"Our beer is unique in that it receives a long cooling fermentation process"

How can you resist?


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (4/10/11)

bconnery said:


> But guys, the beer is unique, didn't you read the site?!
> "Our beer is unique in that it receives a long cooling fermentation process"
> 
> How can you resist?



And then it has fruity esters - from the long cool fermentation process, I assume!


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## Bribie G (4/10/11)

That reminds me, my cube of Chinese Saaz lager should be cool enough now - just got to pitch some Danish yeast for a quick 17 fermentation. :icon_cheers:


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## cdbrown (4/10/11)

Don't forget that it's brewed in the regional city called North Western Victoria and it's new, new, new! I'm interested in how they installed the delicate malt and hop character - maybe they'll release the installer for download?


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## petesbrew (4/10/11)

Liam_snorkel said:


>


That's the best tatt I've ever seen in my entire life... cool.


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## pimpsqueak (4/10/11)

petesbrew said:


> That's the best tatt I've ever seen in my entire life... cool.


Agreed.

You reckon the guy getting the tattoo on the bottom right just said "I'll have what he's having?" :icon_chickcheers:


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (4/10/11)

I never got to try that Chinese Saaz - what's it like? I'm trying to think of the cheapest boring beer possible to fill a keg for parties, etc.

Goomba


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## Bribie G (4/10/11)

I'll send you a bottle. Won't take long :icon_cheers:

edit: I brewed it as the cheapest boring beer possible to fill a keg for a party :lol: 

:icon_offtopic: 

*Chinese Lager*
International Strong Lager

*Recipe Specs*
----------------
Batch Size (L): 25.0
Total Grain (kg): 5.500
Total Hops (g): 92.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.050 (P): 12.4
Final Gravity (FG): 1.011 (P): 2.8
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 5.12 %
Colour (SRM): 3.1 (EBC): 6.1
Bitterness (IBU): 22.4 (Average)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

*Grain Bill*
----------------
5.000 kg Pilsner Barrett Burston (90.91%)
0.500 kg Maltose Syrup Chinese (9.09%)

*Hop Bill*
----------------
12.0 g Magnum Pellet (12.5% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (0.5 g/L)
80.0 g Saaz Chinese Pellet (3% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil) (3.5 g/L)

*Misc Bill*
----------------

Single step Infusion at 66C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 17C with Wyeast 2042 - Danish Lager


Recipe Generated with *BrewMate*


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## Nick JD (4/10/11)

IM(not very)HO, three quarters of beer drinkers drink it to get pissed. 

We're in the minority (and it's a very small minority) us blokes who actually _like to taste beer._

Why that's a revelation to so many people is beyond me. 

People don't want taste. They want something cheap and cold and bland that their mates don't laugh at. Wanna market a new beer? 

You could sell a 50% Pils malt, 30% sugaz and 20% rice fermented hot down to 1.002, served at 2C so long as you had an ad on TV for it with ugly blokes scoring hot chicks while drinking it.

People on AHB have far too much faith in beer drinkers. They're yobs and morons by and large. Let 'em have their VB. No skin off my nose.


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## sim (4/10/11)

Nick JD said:


> People on AHB have far too much faith in beer drinkers. They're yobs and morons by and large. Let 'em have their VB. No skin off my nose.



actually i reackon the most half-brained blokey aussies would see through this beer just by the name, sensing its "obviously for export" fake-ness, and opt for something steeped in a bit more "comes from here, brewed by this guy, recognised by you" kinda guff.

I think you dont give the yobs and morons enough credit, their damned discerning - they can spot the trademarked colours, of the brand of beer they've grown to love more than their dog, from a mile away.


sim


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (4/10/11)

Bribie G said:


> I'll send you a bottle. Won't take long :icon_cheers:



Look forward to it.

Thanks for the recipe - it's somewhat what I was thinking.

In my brewing hobby, there's two goals I'm always trying to achieve - my best beer and my cheapest beer.

Goomba


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## petesbrew (4/10/11)

Lord Raja Goomba I said:


> Look forward to it.
> 
> Thanks for the recipe - it's somewhat what I was thinking.
> 
> ...


2nd one is always the easiest of the two goals, Goomba.
Try hitting both at once... near impossible.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (4/10/11)

petesbrew said:


> 2nd one is always the easiest of the two goals, Goomba.
> Try hitting both at once... near impossible.



Yup - I set one goal for keg filling for quick consumption by persons who don't want to be too challenged and the latter goal is for me and pushing the boundries of what I like to drink. Both at once, I'm not even game.

My cheapest beer ever made a 10 kit brewer travel down to craftbrewer and buy an urn that weekend.





Cheap good beer is easy, cheap and best ever is impossible. 

I know the Chinese Saaz thing left a bad taste in people's mouth (figuratively, not literally), but to pick up hops for uber cheap would have been fantastic for knocking a quick, easy drinking beer for goal 1.

Goomba


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## Clutch (4/10/11)

Lord Raja Goomba I said:


> My cheapest beer ever made a 10 kit brewer travel down to craftbrewer and buy an urn that weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Quoting that for truth.

Getting back to the topic, it smacks of "made for export, but still trying to seem hip and cool to people who like to be beer snobs but really want Extra Dry in a bottle their friends won't recognise to seem edgy."
Good on 'em for having a go though, I hope to do something similar one day. And when I say something similar, I mean something that's nothing like what they're pushing.


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## Truman42 (4/10/11)

And the writing is cut off at the edge of the panel (well in Google chrome it is anyway) and whats with that Gaybo music??? Poor website design. If you cant get your website design right then whats that say for your product?


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## pbrosnan (4/10/11)

/// said:


> Yep, DIPA's are simply a waste of malt and hops. As much as it pains some folks, there aint much selling going on with those beers. The hop zealots on Beer Advocate hate the fact I show disdain for commercially unviable beer ... what happens in the US aint always good here. Just like Snapple.
> 
> Sorry, i found the marketing tacky and the story full of the usual rhetoric by folks that had beer made on contract and knew little about beer. Give me a Moo Brew Pils or Australian Brewery Pilsner, thems the real beers you are after BG ...
> 
> Scotty


Woefully out of touch I'm afraid. In case you haven't noticed a great deal of what happens in the US happens here. OK, so you don't have a taste hops. Good for you! There's an endless supply of insipid lagers and tasteless, flat English ales out there that won't offend. And I presume you've sampled the US craft beer market at source.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (4/10/11)

pbrosnan said:


> Woefully out of touch I'm afraid. In case you haven't noticed a great deal of what happens in the US happens here. OK, so you don't have a taste hops. Good for you! There's an endless supply of *insipid lagers *and tasteless, flat English ales out there that won't offend. And I presume you've sampled the US craft beer market at source.


You know they are not all like that . Well the ones we make at home !
Nev


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## pbrosnan (4/10/11)

Gryphon Brewing said:


> You know they are not all like that . Well the ones we make at home !
> Nev


Indeed Nev, I was not addressing quality pilsners merely the tasteless insipid ones that some posters apparently enjoy.


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## Blackapple (4/10/11)

If you drink too much Aussie cool, would you be Aussie fully sick?

Awesome name.......


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## bignath (4/10/11)

Blackapple said:


> If you drink too much Aussie cool, would you be Aussie fully sick?
> 
> Awesome name.......



Yeah, and then all of your shirts turn into flannelette, your 10 hole Doc Marten boots mystically morph into a pair of thongs, and your "no.2 haircut" grows a "rat's tail".....


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## super_simian (4/10/11)

/// said:


> Yep, DIPA's are simply a waste of malt and hops...






/// said:


> ...RIS's and DIPA's ...The old salesman in me see's sales a result of success...



Please, read my sig.


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## technoicon (5/10/11)

lol, why would i need this beer when i can drink Carlton Draught from the mildura brewery! 

Seriously though, everyone I knows would get a carlton over this sort of beer. 

If your at a Micro brewery I think you expect Different more hopy beers.

This is just another crap beer from Mildura Brewery...


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## mje1980 (5/10/11)

pbrosnan said:


> Woefully out of touch I'm afraid. In case you haven't noticed a great deal of what happens in the US happens here. OK, so you don't have a taste hops. Good for you! There's an endless supply of insipid lagers and tasteless, flat English ales out there that won't offend. And I presume you've sampled the US craft beer market at source.




Scotty is politely sharing his experience, which happens to be real life experience working in a pub, that serves mostly craft beers in the Rocks. Im pretty sure scotty likes drinking those beers, i know, i've seen him drink plenty of "different" beers, although he does deep down truly love fizzy yellow lagers ( haha, the thruth is out scotty! ). He also brews some pretty damn fine non lager beers too. 

"flat english ales"??, who's out of touch here??


Just because "we" love DIPA's and massive beers, doesnt mean they will sell well on a commercial level. Sad though it may be, it's reality. If you opened a brewpub, and just had 3 belgians, a DIPA, and a RIS, how commercialy viable do you think it'd be??. Basically do you think you'd sell enough volume to stay open??. Sure you'd have a small band of diehard beergeeks like us coming in, but realistically it wouldn't be enough week in week out to cover little things like bills, wages etc. Most of them have an "entry" lever beer, like lager or blonde, so joe public can tell his mates he drank "real fancy" beer.


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (5/10/11)

I'm waiting for the time someone says my beer is warm and flat.

Actually it's funny, I remember either Bumble (David Lloyd) or Geoffrey Boycott reading a sign by an Aussie at the cricket in England that said "yes, it really is warm and flat" and the commentator says in his thick northern accent "better than being freezing cold and flavourless".

I'm actually tempted to knock up a keg of an Aussie Pale Ale - especially CPA, but that requires me to 1. Have another keg on hand; 2. Stop brewing APA (never!) and 3. Have POR come into my possession.

That solves it, I'm not tempted enough - another APA is coming.

Goomba


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## Zizzle (6/10/11)

mje1980 said:


> Just because "we" love DIPA's and massive beers, doesnt mean they will sell well on a commercial level. Sad though it may be, it's reality. If you opened a brewpub, and just had 3 belgians, a DIPA, and a RIS, how commercialy viable do you think it'd be??



Well I think you may be right if you qualify that with "in Australia".

In certain parts of the US you probably wouldn't be able to keep up with demand if you did that with any level of competency.

Like this:

http://www.russianriverbrewing.com/pages/brews/index.html

Which I believe is relevant due to the original quip about 



> The hop zealots on Beer Advocate hate the fact I show disdain for commercially unviable beer ...



Guess where most of the Beer Advocate posters live?


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## pk.sax (6/10/11)

Let's get it right here. For a country with the heat of Australia, you HAVE to have a lager on tap in a pub. You could have weiss beers but that would be dependent on beer recognition from yobs a lot.

Whenever I happen to drop in at the Bavarian beer house, most of the guys are drinking variants of Lager, especially lowenbrau. Ffs, when they have hofbrau on tap and some pretty fresh schneider and franziskaner available, wy'd you buy lowenbrau?! It's about brand recognition more than anything else. You absolutely need a crowdpleaser specific to Aussie tastes and heat.

PS: me, I get the chilli spatzle and an aventius to turn down the heat  people stare and ask what is Das!


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## WSC (6/10/11)

My 2 cents.

Good on this bloke for having a go.

Is it good marketing? Probably not great. 

For the knockers out there if you believe what you say then borrow some cash and put out the beer you want to sell. There is plenty of room in the market for more beer, gateway beer or hop monster or in between.

It all depends on your passion, your target market and business strategy/model.


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## Kingbrownbrewing (6/10/11)

Anyone who think DIPA's don't sell in a commercial environment is sadly mistaken.

Whenever I get a new shipment of new beers in, the big IPA's are always the first beers to sell out, regardless of price.

IPA sells FAR more than lager at our venue, although I am sure my love of big IPAs might have a little to do with it....

Hops for the win.


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## MarkBastard (6/10/11)

Where's your venue? Don't tell me there's a decent place in Banyo!


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## Kingbrownbrewing (6/10/11)

Well now that you mention it, due to my persistant whinging, the Banyo Bowls clubs stocks little creatures pale and rogers.....

Nothing fantastic, but better than swilling XXXX Gold with all the old codgers....

The venue I run is in West End.


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## mje1980 (6/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Anyone who think DIPA's don't sell in a commercial environment is sadly mistaken.
> 
> Whenever I get a new shipment of new beers in, the big IPA's are always the first beers to sell out, regardless of price.
> 
> ...




It's not so much the argument that they don't sell, just that "entry level" beers, like pale ale, and lagers/blonde ales sell much more by volume on a regular basis. 

How many kegs of swill sell, compared to the LC pale and rogers at the bowlo? and your venue? If you're selling more IPA than any other beer at your place, well done, you should be proud. LEt us know where it is!!.


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## bconnery (6/10/11)

Without wanting to name the venue in case he doesn't want to for forum reasons I suspect KingBrown is talking about bottle sales from their attached bottle store whereas Scotty is dealing more from the tap sales point of view, and even acknowledged that bottle sales are a different beast...

I know, without having actual figures, that the venue in question goes through a lot of pale ales, lager etc. from the front bar, probably more than kegs of IPAs (with some possible exceptions for really good IPAs for example...)

Let's face it, neither of them is wrong, because they are talking about their experiences in the sales end of the industry. 

Personally I welcome a well crafted pilsner as much as a well crafted pale ale or RIS or IIPA as part of a wide and varied choice for me as the selfish consumer. 

But another bland lager (and yes I am making assumptions about this beer without tasting it)? No...


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## mje1980 (6/10/11)

*Personally I welcome a well crafted pilsner as much as a well crafted pale ale or RIS or IIPA as part of a wide and varied choice for me as the selfish consumer. 

But another bland lager (and yes I am making assumptions about this beer without tasting it)? No... 


*

I agree with you 100%


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## Kingbrownbrewing (6/10/11)

Bowls? Shitloads. (LC is only in pack though, and I give it a nudge  


My joint, its on par, but as I said before, probably has alot to do with what I like to promote and drink.

I like educating people about good beer from the deep end if you know what I mean...

If I can get a regular VB drinker to buy a schooner of 1000IBU for 15 bucks and ask for another, I consider my work on earth done.

Come on down for a beer sometime, 100 boundary st West End, I'm always here.


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## argon (6/10/11)

well you certainly do have some excellent IPAs on at the moment... don't they Ben? h34r:

Edit: although i must say... last i was in there, whilst the selection of IPAs are great i was looking for some variety after having the massive hop-bomb of the Brewdog Hardcore. Would have liked a malty lager or rich ale to counterbalance. Either way keep it up :icon_cheers:


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## HoppingMad (6/10/11)

If you have to put the name 'cool' on your beer I think you're trying a tad too hard.

That said Craft Lagers in this country are largely ignored by our craft brewers and I'd like to see some more of them churn out a few interesting ones.

In New Zealand they have heaps of interesting lagers - strong lagers, hoppy lagers, those guys are actually pushing the envelope a bit. Where as here we simply get quasi lagers and try hard lagers like 'Mountain Goat's Steam Beer' - to which I say meh. I suppose it's their best seller though so maybe I shouldn't diss it. It has a home and a bit of a following.

About time someone experimented more in this zone methinks. Realise that the process is longer and all making lagers, but would be good to see some clean ester free beers really showcasing their ingredients in this country. I love my ale as much as the next guy - but Pale Ales are becoming a tad cliche. All the tasting notes for them are starting to look the same.

Hopper.


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## mckenry (6/10/11)

Aussie Cool ??? come off it...

Sounds like the head of marketing is a 9 year old, naming an ice block he just invented, by mixing green and yellow cordial and putting it in the freezer.


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## eamonnfoley (6/10/11)

If you want a good semi-mass-produced pils. Little Creatures Pils is the bomb. It used to be rough, but the last 12 months it has been really nice. Nice gentle hoppiness.

Or Konig pils if you want a cheaper german option (got it for $37 for a carton the other day). Solid beer.

And my 2 cents on the debate: Good lagers are as good as good american IPAs, which are as good as good english ales, which are as good as good stouts, which are as good as good belgian ales, etc. But they all have to be fresh and in good condition, and from a good brewery. If you think lager = mass produced blandness, you need to get your hands on some good local examples (i.e. hop rocker, little creatures, etc)- or visit Bamberg (heaven for lagerbiers of all forms - unfiltered, keller, rauch, landbier, hoppy dunkel, bock, pils, hell, and the list goes on).


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## /// (6/10/11)

pbrosnan said:


> Woefully out of touch I'm afraid. In case you haven't noticed a great deal of what happens in the US happens here. OK, so you don't have a taste hops. Good for you! There's an endless supply of insipid lagers and tasteless, flat English ales out there that won't offend. And I presume you've sampled the US craft beer market at source.



The warmer and flatter the better when it comes to Real Ale my friend. Loving how Hop Zealots never let the facts get in the way of a good story. Can you give an example where a DIPA's and RIS's in Australia commercially makes sense and a brewer making a living on this style of beer? $100 + on excise per keg, min $13-15 bucks a pint on tap .... customers can drink how many pints? Are there no brewers doing some really interesting stuff not at 10% alc and 100BU, here or in other countries?

Sure, diversity is great and I more than most support a wide range of beers, but commercially those beers are a waste of malt and hops. I didn't say I disliked them, moreso they are not a profitable exercise. So am I out of touch or just being rational?

Same applies to another fizzy yellow lager, seems the only guys making money out of those beers are owned by South Africans and Japanese ... with deep pockets ...

Scotty


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## MarkBastard (6/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Well now that you mention it, due to my persistant whinging, the Banyo Bowls clubs stocks little creatures pale and rogers.....
> 
> Nothing fantastic, but better than swilling XXXX Gold with all the old codgers....
> 
> The venue I run is in West End.



Hahaha wow.

I used to live across from that bowlo (on froude street). That's classic.


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## eamonnfoley (6/10/11)

/// said:


> customers can drink how many pints? Are there no brewers doing some really interesting stuff not at 10% alc and 100BU, here or in other countries?
> 
> Sure, diversity is great and I more than most support a wide range of beers, but commercially those beers are a waste of malt and hops. I didn't say I disliked them, moreso they are not a profitable exercise. So am I out of touch or just being rational?



Yes, many American Craft brewers are known for their standard balanced IPAs (think union jack or hop devil), pilsners (think Avery Joes Pilsner, or Prima Pils from Victory which is outstanding), Stouts (think Shakespeare Stout, Sierra Nevada), and the list goes on and on. Countless classic US craft beers top out at about 7%. Also sour beers are not high in ABV. I think the trend in the US is now going the other way - session beers are the trend.

Yes there can be a heavy use of hops and malt - but that is only an issue here in Australia where beer and ingredients are relatively expensive (and tax sucks). Its not a problem over there. A double IPA at the bar will often cost you the same as a pale ale. Or in Bavaria a doppelbock usually costs exactly the same as a helles. For that reason, you may have a point - whats the point of a malt or hop bomb here if its A$15-20 a pint. Good beer becomes a "privilege" rather than a "right". I reckon Aussie brewers should brew to our conditions (those including economic & regulatory). Maybe yeast driven beers are the go, as yeast is basically free!! Brew some session beers based around belgian ale yeast or something. Less of a burden to the taxman and lower hoploads. Develop some new bloody styles (or takes on existing styles) instead of copying a country where bucketloads of cheap, exciting hops are grown on their doorstep. In general, a lot of genius is carried out under restraint, where you are forced to work with less and be innovative. In this case, less hops...... at least that is which way I would go if I was commercial. So maybe its good I'm not or I may be broke


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## Hargie (6/10/11)

King Brown Brewing said:


> Well now that you mention it, due to my persistant whinging, the Banyo Bowls clubs stocks little creatures pale and rogers.....
> 
> Nothing fantastic, but better than swilling XXXX Gold with all the old codgers....
> 
> The venue I run is in West End.




...heya Dan...It's Scotty...Greetings from the Jackie Lounge...still yet to try a King Brown Beer....


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## Kingbrownbrewing (7/10/11)

I'll have to send one down with rosco the next time he is up mate.

When are you coming up to show me how to use my equipment properly?


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## chunckious (7/10/11)

Had a KIng Brown BIPA..... :beerbang: 
Was there last night to scab some more but they had already been drunk.


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