# Murray's Whale Ale



## cliffo (10/9/09)

Hi All,

I've really been enjoying the Whale Ale on tap at the Dockyard in Newcastle and want to attempt an AG clone.

Does anyone have a recipe or can suggest something similar?

Cheers,
cliffo


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## hoohaaman (10/9/09)

Well I'll never ever buy any product from them.

In short the product was shit,they didn't answer the problem.Sent numerous emails,not a single reply


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## kevo (10/9/09)

Yes, yes, yes.....but do you have a clone recipe?


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## hoohaaman (10/9/09)

hmmmmmm,let me look.Absolutely no.Their product is SHIT


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## [email protected] (10/9/09)

hoohaaman said:


> hmmmmmm,let me look.Absolutely no.Their product is SHIT




Can I ask if you could elaborate on "SHIT" please? It is a rather broad term... B) 

Booz


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## MHB (11/9/09)

Funnily enough my experience has been the exact opposite; I think Whale Ale is a dam fine beer. In fact I have yet to have a bad beer from Murrays; lucky for me it's on tap at quite a few pubs round Newcastle.

Over the years I've had the odd dodge Coopers (especially in the days of the rip tag bottles) doesn't make them bad brewers, probably means the beer was mishandled after it left the brewery.

Let me guess you went to Dans that's just asking for trouble.
MHB


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## hoohaaman (11/9/09)

MHB said:


> Funnily enough my experience has been the exact opposite; I think Whale Ale is a dam fine beer. In fact I have yet to have a bad beer from Murrays; lucky for me it's on tap at quite a few pubs round Newcastle.
> 
> Over the years I've had the odd dodge Coopers (especially in the days of the rip tag bottles) doesn't make them bad brewers, probably means the beer was mishandled after it left the brewery.
> 
> ...




Dans or not,they ignored my concerns.If I sent an email about "vb" I bet I'd get a return.

Put simply I tried the Blonde from various stores,all tasted like band aids.Emailed my concerns...............no response.

Piss poor,like the product I had the misfortune to taste.

I don't drink alot of commercial beer,but keep my ear to the ground in here regarding beers to try, Murray's got some great feedback so tried some.Wow what a waste.


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## Wisey (11/9/09)

Had a Murrays Pale the other night and it got a 2 big thumbs up from me.


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## bconnery (11/9/09)

I believe Whale Ale is an American Wheat style from memory, but probably has NZ hops or Australian at a guess. 
Have a search for american wheat recipes then sub in something local hop wise...

That's a broad answer I know but it's a start...


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## T.D. (11/9/09)

Isn't there a beer that the Flying Horse Brewery does called Whale Ale??? Wonder who got it first...?


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## glennheinzel (11/9/09)

T.D. said:


> Isn't there a beer that the Flying Horse Brewery does called Whale Ale??? Wonder who got it first...?



Looking at www.ratebeer.com, there are 57 beers that play on the whale/whale's tale theme.


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## glennheinzel (11/9/09)

bconnery said:


> I believe Whale Ale is an American Wheat style from memory, but probably has NZ hops or Australian at a guess.
> Have a search for american wheat recipes then sub in something local hop wise...
> 
> That's a broad answer I know but it's a start...



Is the Whale Ale simply their "Sunrise Wheat" (filtered wit) renamed? Their Dark Knight porter may also be a renamed version of their Swinging Arm Dark Ale. 

PS. They love their kiwi hops.


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## T.D. (11/9/09)

Rukh said:


> Looking at www.ratebeer.com, there are 57 beers that play on the whale/whale's tale theme.



Clearly copyright doesn't apply to beer names then!


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## bconnery (11/9/09)

Rukh said:


> Is the Whale Ale simply their "Sunrise Wheat" (filtered wit) renamed? Their Dark Knight porter may also be a renamed version of their Swinging Arm Dark Ale.
> 
> PS. They love their kiwi hops.



Don't know about the first two, I thought I read somewhere it was an American wheat style...
Definitely on the last point. I know that in the past they where all made with NZ hops, but that information is a few years old now so it may have changed especially with more Aussie varieties around...


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## brettprevans (11/9/09)

T.D. said:


> Clearly copyright doesn't apply to beer names then!


of course it does, but yor cant copyright a single word otherwise there would only be one beer in the world with draught in its name. get my drift. you copyright the whole name not part of the name


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## Ross (11/9/09)

hoohaaman said:


> Put simply I tried the Blonde from various stores,all tasted like band aids.
> 
> Piss poor,like the product I had the misfortune to taste.




I trust you realise it's a Belgian Style Blonde & not an Aussie (bland) style Blonde?

I rate Murrays one of the very best micros in the Country, their beers are generally outstanding :icon_cheers: 
They are also one of the best when it comes to customer service from my experience, so I'd be checking to see if they actually recieved your email before slagging off the Company & their beers - Have you tried calling them?

Cheers Ross

*** Not affiliated, but a very happy customer***


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## glennheinzel (11/9/09)

bconnery said:


> Don't know about the first two, I thought I read somewhere it was an American wheat style...
> Definitely on the last point. I know that in the past they where all made with NZ hops, but that information is a few years old now so it may have changed especially with more Aussie varieties around...



Doh. I went to the source and it is indeed named as an American Wheat-
http://www.murraysbrewingco.com.au/web09v2/beersPage.php?5

Sorry about that!


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## T.D. (11/9/09)

citymorgue2 said:


> of course it does, but yor cant copyright a single word otherwise there would only be one beer in the world with draught in its name. get my drift. you copyright the whole name not part of the name



But "Whale Ale" doesn't describe the style or type of beer like "Draught" or "sparkling ale" or "amber ale" does. Whale Ale is a specific product name. So I would have thought either "Flying Horse Whale Ale" or "Murrays Whale Ale" would have been copyrighted (depending on whoever named it first). Then presumably somebody else naming a beer Whale Ale could be seen as trading off the name of a competitor's product.


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## brettprevans (11/9/09)

business names and copy right are differant. business names have to be distinct wherre as 'brand' names dont.

if some body tried sellin a beer as citymorgue2 whale ale i get done for as murry';s would jhave whale ale copyrighted. if i tried sellin something as whale drool ale id get away with it, even though it takes off murry's and a canadian beer (there is a moose drool beer). funny thing copyright. and actually thinking about it, it would be a combination of trademark and copyright. mostly trademarking.


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## T.D. (11/9/09)

citymorgue2 said:


> if some body tried sellin a beer as citymorgue2 whale ale i get done for as murry';s would jhave whale ale copyrighted.



Yeah that's exactly what I am saying though. I'm just using Murray's and Flying Horse as an illustrative example, its not specific to them, just something I've always been puzzled about. From what I recall, the Flying Horse beer is called "Flying Horse Whale Ale", and the Murrays one is called "Murrays Whale Ale" - that seems like a copyright breach to me (by whoever created their name second).


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## .DJ. (11/9/09)

Ross said:


> I trust you realise it's a Belgian Style Blonde & not an Aussie (bland) style Blonde?
> 
> I rate Murrays one of the very best micros in the Country, their beers are generally outstanding :icon_cheers:
> They are also one of the best when it comes to customer service from my experience, so I'd be checking to see if they actually recieved your email before slagging off the Company & their beers - Have you tried calling them?
> ...



+1 here.

Service is OUTSTANDING. When I had a issue where 1 bottle wasnt capped properly from a 4 pack, I got and apology AND a whole carton!! Shawn is brilliant!

Just dont buy them from Dan Murphy's... Poor storage can ruin them.


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## Online Brewing Supplies (11/9/09)

I think The whole "Whale Tail" thing has been blown out of the water  
GB


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## kevo (11/9/09)

It gets a bit of a mention in their interview on the Brewing Network late last year/early this year.

http://thebrewingnetwork.com/shows/The-Sun...raft-brewing-Co

that link should take you to the show page, but it might be a bit of a mission finding the reference.

Cheers

Kev

BTW - I've never had a bad beer from Murray's to complain about, excellent, interesting beers.


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## Duff (11/9/09)

hoohaaman said:


> hmmmmmm,let me look.Absolutely no.Their product is SHIT



You've got no idea.

Everyone of their beers I tried has been excellent, even after shipping up north here.

Shawn has also gone out of his way a number of times to detail some of their methods whenever I've enquired.

Of the commercially available micro brewed beers in Australia, I'd rate Murrays right at the very top.

Another very happy customer here.


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## kevo (11/9/09)

Just had a skip through the BN show, Whale Ale is mentioned at about 1 hr 29mins.

Described as a Belgian Wit, influenced by hogarden(sp?) with honey and spices.

Enjoy


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## bigfridge (11/9/09)

kevo said:


> Just had a skip through the BN show, Whale Ale is mentioned at about 1 hr 29mins.
> 
> Described as a Belgian Wit, influenced by hogarden(sp?) with honey and spices.



Pity that the show is nearly a year old as the information is wrong. While I would never 'confirm or deny' what I see on my visits to breweries or chats with the brewer, I can cay that it 'may' have been that style a year ago but it isn't now  

It seems that it is the sworn duty of every HB'er to first classify the style of a commercial beer and then brew 'that' style in an attempt to reproduce it. In my experience it would be more rewarding to try to identify what you like about a particular beer and then selct the ingredients and processes that are known to produce the desired characteristics.

Many of the commerical beers are not brewed to a style or slavish adherence to a list of ingredients but to a flavour profile that the brewer knows they can sell. This often means that you will have Ales brewed with lager yeast and pilsner malt and Wheat beers brewed with ale yeast.

This is why it is so distressing to see a beer described as 'shit' as if this was the true characteristic of the beer it would see us fishing around in the toilet bowl in an attempt to re-create the style  It is far more helpfull to see it described as 'sour', 'band-aide' or 'rotten cabbage' as these help to pinpoint what may have gone wrong. But even 'shit' beers have flavours (malty, wheaty, crisp, hoppy) and other descriptions that can help.

The best place to start to 'clone' a beer would be to grab a sample and read what the producer describes it as. Taste the beer and try to identify what you like as you sip. For Murray's Whale Ale the website says:

[codebox]Handcrafted in celebration of our relocation to Port Stephens, Murray's 
Whale Ale is a crisp and refreshing American Wheat Beer named in honour of the 
majestic creatures that grace our beautiful shores each year. This unfiltered wheat 
beer has low bitterness and is a very easy-drinking beer. Our most popular beer.

Murray's Whale Ale offers a crisp, clean alternative to heavier bodied wits and hefeweizens.

Murray's Whale is a great session beer and also a beautiful accompaniment to white meats and salads.

Available all year round.

Type:Ale
Style: American Wheat Beer
4.5% abv[/codebox]

In summary:

'crisp and refreshing ... unfiltered wheat beer .. low bitterness and is a very easy-drinking beer. ... crisp, clean alternative to heavier bodied wits and hefeweizens'

So if you use 50% wheat malt or extract and the balance Ale/Pilsner grain or light malt extract will get you close, keep the hops low (15-20 IBU) and use a clean American ale, lager or wheat yeast fermented around 15 DegC.

You won't necessarily get Marray's Whale Ale but you will get a fairly close beer that you can proudly call your own.

HTH,
Dave


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## kevo (11/9/09)

> QUOTE (kevo @ Sep 11 2009, 03:54 PM)
> Just had a skip through the BN show, Whale Ale is mentioned at about 1 hr 29mins.
> 
> Described as a Belgian Wit, influenced by hogarden(sp?) with honey and spices.
> ...



Sorry guys, just paraphrased what was said by Shawn, the brewer, on the BN show - just trying to help.

Kev


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## wyatt_girth (15/9/09)

MHB said:


> Funnily enough my experience has been the exact opposite; I think Whale Ale is a dam fine beer. In fact I have yet to have a bad beer from Murrays; lucky for me it's on tap at quite a few pubs round Newcastle.




What?? Where are these pubs......please

Love the Murray's Pale and tried my first Whale Ale from the bottlo at Warners Bay - you know the one.


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## uncyp (30/4/10)

I have just had a couple pints of Whale Ale and (now available at Transit Bar in Canberra City) it was served at 2 degrees but by the end of the pint I found it to be extremely good.


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## brocky_555 (2/5/10)

+4 for the Whale ale 

good beer, better than the other swill available at my local.

No wonder shawn ignored your emails hoohaaman you sound like an F**n beer swilling moron idiot no beer of thiers is remotely like VB, have you tried their grand cru ?

Why would a brewer that has won awards need to dignify a response to VB ?

I'm not a huge fan of the sassy blonde either but the rest of the range is gold, even have 2 of this years anniverary ales in the cellar ready for that special occasion. Because the last ones were excellent examples of good barely wine. 

As for the mention on the BN podcast thats a big thumbs up for him, how many beers are there in the US and only very few get mentioned in the good ol U.S of A he must be doing something right despite what you might think hoohaaman, have any of your beers been mentioned in the podcast ?


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## sama (5/5/10)

brocky_555 said:


> +4 for the Whale ale
> 
> good beer, better than the other swill available at my local.
> 
> ...



your abuse is not waranted,where did he compare the actual beer to vb?And maybe,just maybe the product he got was actually shit,it is possible (why he determines it to be "shit beer" i dont know,infection,taste etc)


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## Kingy (2/11/10)

anyone tried brewing this yet, i brewed a wheat beer earlier this year and put a lager yeast in by mistake and it turned out to be the best beer ive ever brewed but i moved houses and didnt brew for a while and i didnt save the recipe in beersmith  
Ive fallin in love with the whale ale over the last few months as it reminds me of the wheat beer i brewed.
I would really like this beer permanently on one of my taps at my house.

Murrays Brewery and the lord nelson brewery are my favorite brewery experiences so far as far as taste, service and vibe at these places are.


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## SanDiegoBrewer (3/11/10)

Murray's is one of the best breweries in NSW, they make amazing beers and dont use electric probes to boil their wort, and I'm pretty sure they use liquid yeast unlike alot of Sydney breweries, Murray's Grand Crew is a very well respected beer in a few big magazines, don't worry about ratebeer any idiot with an un-educated opinion can get on there and rate a mediocre beer amazing.


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## JonnyAnchovy (3/11/10)

SanDiegoBrewer said:


> Murray's ... dont use electric probes to boil their wort ...




Totally agree and echo the sentiments about the brewery and their fantastic beer, but what does this have to do with it?


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## SanDiegoBrewer (4/11/10)

Alot of small Sydney breweries do that and it carmalizes the wort a bit and doesn't produce the best product. There are a couple small Calif. breweries using probes and it just doesn't cut it in my eyes


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## samhaldane (4/11/10)

SanDiegoBrewer said:


> Alot of small Sydney breweries do that and it carmalizes the wort a bit and doesn't produce the best product. There are a couple small Calif. breweries using probes and it just doesn't cut it in my eyes



By probes do you mean exposed electric elements?


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## unterberg (4/11/10)

+5

I rate Murrays highly and all their beers are of exceptionally high standard. And Shawn is a great bloke always open for questions from someone interested.


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## SanDiegoBrewer (4/11/10)

yea big ass exposed electric probe or probes to heat the wort, shit heats up too quick and in one small area and caramalizes some of the wort to give it a different, sometimes un-desireable characteristic


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## Bribie G (6/12/11)

Necro alert.

Well the OP's question never got answered. Whale Ale certainly opened my eyes to wheat beers - until then I thought that all wheat beers were supposed to taste like trough lollies - then MHB took me over the road for a pint and I was won over, so eventually I got round to having a stab at something similar.








Smooth, easy drinking, that nice wheat head - I only used 10g of Stella as you can see but plenty of bitterness for the style. Probably go great on Green Bullet for a more Murrayish flavour and use Wy 1056 or even Wy 1007 if you don't want to use the Sandiego, but it seems to be perfect for the style.

I like this one.


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## sim (6/12/11)

Ahh nice one Bribie, and what a crackin' beer it is!

I'll be brewing similar tommorow, hooray.


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## brocky_555 (6/12/11)

I was looking for something similar, thanks bribie might give that a go over summer.


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## Kingy (11/2/12)

This is a beer I want to concentrate on and get close, if not slightly different. Everyone I've introduced to this beer absolutely loves it.


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## flano (13/2/12)

yep ...the whale = great drop.

Angry man is not as angry as I hoped, but still good and upset.


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## wombil (13/2/12)

Just finished drinking a keg of Moby Wheat as per Bribie G's post #39.I used the Green Bullet hops and it was really good.Will surely do another one.


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## mccuaigm (13/2/12)

wombil said:


> Just finished drinking a keg of Moby Wheat as per Bribie G's post #39.I used the Green Bullet hops and it was really good.Will surely do another one.



Sounds good Wombil, I got a crapload of GB here with no idea what to do with....

What yeast you end up going with?


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## wombil (13/2/12)

US-05 Goldy.


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