# Citra Cascade Centennial Apa



## Deebo (1/1/12)

Got a pound of 2011 citra from Niko Brew before xmas and hopefully will have time to brew with it tommorow as stocks are getting low (had 6 kegs of beer but 4 got polished off SWMBO's birthday party).

Feel like making something like an APA and was after some feedback on wether there is anything that stands out as a bit out of whack in the recipe below that I bodged together (I no chill so bitterness will be a bit higher):


Recipe: C^3 (BIAB No.12)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 32.80 l
Post Boil Volume: 29.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 23.00 l 
Bottling Volume: 21.00 l
Estimated OG: 1.046 SG
Estimated Color: 13.1 EBC
Estimated IBU: 38.8 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 79.1 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
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Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
4.50 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) ( Grain 1 85.7 % 
0.50 kg Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) Grain 2 9.5 % 
0.25 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 3 4.8 % 
12.50 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 4 5.3 IBUs 
12.50 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 5 7.9 IBUs 
25.00 g Citra [13.90 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 17.1 IBUs 
12.50 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 3.4 IBUs 
12.50 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 8 5.1 IBUs 
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 9 - 


Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 5.25 kg


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## WitWonder (1/1/12)

No flame-out additions? Dry hopping? Personally I wouldn't use US05 - I find it strips beers of hop character. 1272 is my yeast of choice for APA's but if you don't have any perhaps up the flavour hops to compensate?

Also, I'm not convinced on the 30min additions. To me that's not really a bittering addition nor is it a flavour or aroma addition.


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## Deebo (1/1/12)

WitWonder said:


> No flame-out additions? Dry hopping? Personally I wouldn't use US05 - I find it strips beers of hop character. 1272 is my yeast of choice for APA's but if you don't have any perhaps up the flavour hops to compensate?
> 
> Also, I'm not convinced on the 30min additions. To me that's not really a bittering addition nor is it a flavour or aroma addition.



Thanks for the tips.

I only have nottingham and us-05 handy at the moment so will look at upping the hops and adding them later. 

My current process after flameout is to wait 20 mins before pulling out 0 min hops and whirlpooling (time to let convection currents stop) then wait 20 mins and cube.

Would you suggest dry hopping a combination of the 3 hops or maybe just citra to get more of an idea of its taste? Would say 25g in 21L for 7 days be suitable?

Here is my attempt at revising the recipe, keep in mind the ibu's are probably a lot higher than what beersmith estimate due to no chill (will it be too bitter?).

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 32.80 l
Post Boil Volume: 29.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 23.00 l 
Bottling Volume: 21.00 l
Estimated OG: 1.046 SG
Estimated Color: 13.1 EBC
Estimated IBU: 25.7 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 79.1 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
4.50 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) ( Grain 1 85.7 % 
0.50 kg Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) Grain 2 9.5 % 
0.25 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 3 4.8 % 
0.50 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 4 - 
25.00 g Citra [13.90 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 5 17.1 IBUs 
12.50 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 3.4 IBUs 
12.50 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 5.1 IBUs 
25.00 g Citra [13.90 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 8 0.0 IBUs 
12.50 g Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 9 0.0 IBUs 
12.50 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 10 0.0 IBUs 
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) Yeast 11 - 
25.00 g Citra [13.90 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 12 0.0 IBUs


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## Acasta (1/1/12)

Hey deebo, I'm not sure how hoppy and bitter you like your beers but I would be upping the 0min additions as well as adding a 60min bittering addition to bring it up to around 35-40 IBUs.
But that really depends on personal preference.


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## Murcluf (1/1/12)

Just used US-05 for the first time. used it in a in a Single Hop Citra APA and it worked great had no issue with stripping of hop character. Hop additions were at 60, 20, & 0 minutes for 40-45 IBU


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## Deebo (1/1/12)

Acasta said:


> Hey deebo, I'm not sure how hoppy and bitter you like your beers but I would be upping the 0min additions as well as adding a 60min bittering addition to bring it up to around 35-40 IBUs.
> But that really depends on personal preference.



I dont mind hoppy but dont like too much bitterness. The last 'APA' I made had the following:
Estimated IBU: 25.0 IBUs
4.50 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) ( Grain 1 85.7 % 
0.50 kg Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) Grain 2 9.5 % 
0.25 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 3 4.8 % 
25.00 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 5 10.2 IBUs 
25.00 g Galaxy [13.20 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 14.8 IBUs 
25.00 g Centennial [8.30 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 7 0.0 IBUs 
25.00 g Galaxy [13.20 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 8 0.0 IBUs 

Which I really liked but many people found it a bit bitter (Galaxy is pretty high IBU which I guess was amplified a fair bit by the no chilling) Citra is slightly higher AA than galaxy so not sure if I should cut that back a bit or not.

I personaly have found us-05 to accentuate the hops a bit better than most other dried yeasts, seems to make a bit of a 'crisper' beer also (havent really got into liquid yeasts yet though)


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## Tony (1/1/12)

my 2c worth

Drop half the crystal.... it will just mute the hops.

I get the feeling you want to do all lade additions.

i have made some great APA's with just 20, 10 & 0 min additions and it works well.

When i work out hopping rates, i work in g/liter. It makes it easier to calculate what you need once you know the effect that different amounts have on the beer.

Im mot real sure what software gave you all those numbers? 

Boil Size: 32.80 l
Post Boil Volume: 29.12 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 23.00 l 
Bottling Volume: 21.00 l

how do you get from 29 liters post bol to 23 liters in the fermenter? If your leaving that much in the kettle, thats a lot of waste.

anyway..... recipe......

2g/L @ 10 min
3g/L @ 0min
add your desired bittering hops to give about 35 IBU at 20 min and your done!

PS... add your Wirlfloc at 8 - 10 min, it works better

cheers


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## Deebo (1/1/12)

Tony said:


> how do you get from 29 liters post bol to 23 liters in the fermenter? If your leaving that much in the kettle, thats a lot of waste.
> 
> anyway..... recipe......
> 
> ...


Thanks Tony,

I do leave a fair bit in the urn to avoid getting too much hot break into the cube (Last batch was 32L preboil to 26.5L left after boil to 23L in cube, I just havent dialed in my beersmith 2 settings yet). 
Will change the whirfloc to 10 min, I see a lot of conflicting information regarding when and how much to do add, is half a tablet pretty standard for a 30L or so boil, the instruction on the packet say 1 tablet.

Problem with adding to 35 ibu in beersmith is that it doesnt take into account no chill which I have found can add a fair bit of ibu's for high aa hops (to my taste buds anyway).
Basing this off the last brew which beersmith reckoned was 25 ibu but to me was a fair bit more bitter than a lcpa I think the current hop level should be ok if maybe just slightly more bitter.


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## Tony (1/1/12)

Ahhh yes... no chill

The hoppy beers enemy

I have tried to make very hoppy APA's with no chill but it never weoks as well as a snap chilled beer. Its ok but not as good.

Add all your 10 min and 0 min addition hops in the software as 10 min addition and drain it to the cube after 10 min.

Thats what i used to do and it works fine for the bitterness.

get a chiller 

cheers


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## Deebo (1/1/12)

Chiller is on list of things I want to get.. don't suppose you know a good place to get a ready to go immersion chiller?


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## Shifter (2/1/12)

Try using Brewmate, it is free and accounts of No Chill. Also take a look at a similar recipe to yours called APA Sans Nelson by Lord Raja Goomba. Some good tips there.


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## hefevice (2/1/12)

Deebo said:


> Chiller is on list of things I want to get.. don't suppose you know a good place to get a ready to go immersion chiller?



Two quick options.

1. Buy a plate chiller from on the site sponsors.

2. Make your own chiller by wrapping 5-10m of copper tubing around a corny keg. It's quite simple. I attached some brass compression fittings to the ends and screwed on standard 1/2" brass hose fittings.

There are plenty of sites (including videos) on the interwebs, just google "how to make an immersion chiller".


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## seamad (2/1/12)

Deebo,
I found i could recover a fair bit of wort by pouring the trub into a colander lined with some cheese cloth ( voile would work well). This recovered wwort makes a good starter if required or used for a mini boil of late addition hops ( argon method). Have you tried cube hopping? If you have a pool cube hop and wait ten minutes then chuck in pool to cool quicker
cheers
Sean


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## Nick JD (2/1/12)

I find dropping 1g/L of Citra into the fermenter when it reaches FG for two days beats the living hell out of any late kettle additions. Citra is a wonderful dry hopper.


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## Deebo (2/1/12)

Thanks for the tips. Decided to use 15 and 0 min additions and will try the dry hopping with citra for this batch once it reaches fg.

I looked at the plate chillers but then I would have to get off my arse and fit a ball valve to the urn.

Do plate chillers work ok without a pump or do you really need one to recirculate to get down to pitching temps?

I'm not too concerned with the loss to trub. I did collect it once in a couple of bottles then let the trub settle out in the fridge to muck around with wild yeast but prefer to keep brew day as simple as possible, less cleaning the better.


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