# Please critique my porter recipe...............



## Cervantes (10/3/16)

I'm wanting to brew a porter ready for winter and have come up with the recipe below.

Can anyone who brews this style please offer any constructive criticism?

According to Brewer's Friend it matches the style guidelines, but it doesn't tell me how it's likely to taste.

I'm trying to steer away from using too much crystal as I find it a bit cloying.

HOME BREW RECIPE:
Title: Thirsty Point Porter

Brew Method: Braumeister
Style Name: English Porter
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 20 liters (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 28.5 liters
Boil Gravity: 1.033
Efficiency: 70% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.052
Final Gravity: 1.013
ABV (standard): 5.04%
IBU (tinseth): 25.07
SRM (daniels): 20.86

FERMENTABLES:
3.4 kg - United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale (73.9%)
0.5 kg - United Kingdom - Munich (10.9%)
0.3 kg - United Kingdom - Chocolate (6.5%)
0.1 kg - American - Caramel / Crystal 60L (2.2%)
0.3 kg - Golden Syrup - (late addition) (6.5%)

HOPS:
25 g - East Kent Goldings, Type: Pellet, AA: 5, Use: Boil for 60 min, IBU: 18.47
20 g - Fuggles, Type: Pellet, AA: 4.5, Use: Boil for 15 min, IBU: 6.6
20 g - East Kent Goldings, Type: Pellet, AA: 5, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at °C

MASH GUIDELINES:
1) Temperature, Temp: 38 C, Time: 10 min, Amount: 30 L, Mash In
2) Temperature, Temp: 68 C, Time: 60 min, Amount: 0 L, Beta Amylase
3) Temperature, Temp: 71 C, Time: 20 min, Amount: 0 L, Alpha Amylase
4) Temperature, Temp: 77 C, Time: 10 min, Amount: 0 L, Mash Out

OTHER INGREDIENTS:
1 each - Whirfloc, Time: 10 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Boil

YEAST:
Fermentis / Safale - English Ale Yeast S-04
Starter: No
Form: Dry
Attenuation (avg): 75%
Flocculation: High
Optimum Temp: 12.22 - 25 C
Fermentation Temp: 18 C
Pitch Rate: 0.75 (M cells / ml / deg P)


Many thanks


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## mb-squared (10/3/16)

I brew a porter from time to time. My latest attempt was "brown bag porter" (recipe: http://wiki.homebrewersassociation.org/BrownBagBrownPorter) and it came out really nice. silky smooth. Your Munich and golden syrup additions are a bit unusual for the style I think and the lack of brown malt is unusual too. your hops look fine to me. 

the biggest thing I've found with porters is to keep the Ph up in the 5.5 range. If you don't get enough carbonate into the mash your Ph is likely to get down too low and the beer ends up tasting thin and a bit sour. I've found that I really have to keep on top of the ph during the sparge too as it tends to dip a bit low towards the end of the sparge and can ruin the first runnings which are spot on. If you typically add acid to your sparge water, you may want to go easy for this style.


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## Liam_snorkel (10/3/16)

+1 to the addition of brown malt, try somewhere in the 5-10% range. and note that Simpsons is more than twice as dark as most other maltsters.


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## Ducatiboy stu (10/3/16)

Brown Malt and maybe a touch ( 50-100gms/5Kg max )of black patent malt, will help add some colour


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## Ducatiboy stu (10/3/16)

Caraaroma is also an awesome malt in Porter, especially robust ones. Adds a nice red colour and deep flavours like raisins/currants


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## Rocker1986 (10/3/16)

I usually throw in about 350g black patent and 100g chocolate malt in my porter recipe, rest of the grain bill is pretty similar minus the golden syrup. Turns out rather chocolately and very very dark in colour, pretty much black. Haven't used brown malt in it yet but am open to experimentation next time I brew it. Hops I use are the same varieties, slightly different timings. Same yeast as well. That recipe was an experiment but it turned out so well that I never changed it.


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## Ducatiboy stu (10/3/16)

Thats a lot of black malt


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## warra48 (10/3/16)

Here's my recipe for Brown Porter which got an Highly Commended at the NSW State Comp in 2014, beaten only by a whisker from placing higher. It's a regular in my brewery.

23 litres
OG 1.044 
FG 1.011

3935.0 g Pale Malt, Ale (IMC) (3.9 EBC) Grain 7 79.2 %
411.0 g Brown Malt (Simpsons) (295.5 EBC) Grain 8 8.3 % 
230.0 g Crystal Malt - Light (120.0 EBC) Grain 9 4.6 % 
210.0 g Chocolate Wheat (Weyermann) (817.5 EBC) Grain 10 4.2 % 
182.0 g Crystal Medium (150.0 EBC) Grain 11 3.7 % 
47.0 g Willamette [4.90 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 12 23.5 IBUs 
1.00 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 13 - 
23.0 g Willamette [4.90 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 14 4.2 IBUs 
5.00 g Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 mins) Other 15 - 
1.0 pkg Denny's Favorite 50 (Wyeast Labs #1450) Yeast 16 - 

The Brown Malt is essential, in my view, to make a good Brown Porter. 
Black Malt and Black Patent are for Stouts, again in my view.


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## Rocker1986 (10/3/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Thats a lot of black malt


It is, but for some reason in that beer it just works. :wub:


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## Cervantes (10/3/16)

Many thanks for all of the positive replies

Have made some changes.

I've removed the Golden Syrup (which was from a Graham Wheeler recipe) and the Munich and subbed in some brown malt. I'm still trying to keep the crystal percentage low if I can.

How does this look.....................

HOME BREW RECIPE:
Title: Thirsty Point Porter

Brew Method: Braumeister 20L
Style Name: English Porter
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 20 liters (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 28.5 liters
Boil Gravity: 1.036
Efficiency: 70% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.051
Final Gravity: 1.013
ABV (standard): 4.99%
IBU (tinseth): 24.43
SRM (daniels): 22.42

FERMENTABLES:
4 kg - United Kingdom - Maris Otter Pale (85.1%)
0.3 kg - United Kingdom - Brown (6.4%)
0.3 kg - United Kingdom - Chocolate (6.4%)
0.1 kg - United Kingdom - Crystal 60L (2.1%)

HOPS:
25 g - East Kent Goldings, Type: Pellet, AA: 5, Use: Boil for 60 min, IBU: 18
20 g - Fuggles, Type: Pellet, AA: 4.5, Use: Boil for 15 min, IBU: 6.43
20 g - East Kent Goldings, Type: Pellet, AA: 5, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at °C

MASH GUIDELINES:
1) Temperature, Temp: 38 C, Time: 10 min, Amount: 30 L, Mash In
2) Temperature, Temp: 68 C, Time: 60 min, Amount: 0 L, Beta Amylase
3) Temperature, Temp: 71 C, Time: 20 min, Amount: 0 L, Alpha Amylase
4) Temperature, Temp: 77 C, Time: 10 min, Amount: 0 L, Mash Out

OTHER INGREDIENTS:
1 each - Whirfloc, Time: 10 min, Type: Water Agt, Use: Boil

YEAST:
Fermentis / Safale - English Ale Yeast S-04
Starter: No
Form: Dry
Attenuation (avg): 75%
Flocculation: High
Optimum Temp: 12.22 - 25 C
Fermentation Temp: 18 C
Pitch Rate: 0.75 (M cells / ml / deg P)


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## Midnight Brew (10/3/16)

I don't think S-04 will do a porter justice. There are so many liquid yeast strains out there that will bring more to the table in terms of character.

Wlp002, Wlp005, 1469, 1318, so on. I tend to pick the yeast strain and then design the mash schedule around the strain in what FG you are trying to achieve.


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## warra48 (10/3/16)

Malt bill looks good now, and should make a decent Porter.


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## Cervantes (10/3/16)

Midnight Brew said:


> I don't think S-04 will do a porter justice. There are so many liquid yeast strains out there that will bring more to the table in terms of character.
> 
> Wlp002, Wlp005, 1469, 1318, so on. I tend to pick the yeast strain and then design the mash schedule around the strain in what FG you are trying to achieve.


I'm a two hour drive from my nearest homebrew store that stocks liquid yeasts, so have learned to live with dried yeast.

To be honest the couple of times that I've used liquid yeast I was a little disappointed with the results. Not the great leap up from dried yeast that I was expecting.

It may be because I generally brew cleaner style beers and mostly use US-05 which I like. I'm not really keen on too many estery flavours/smells.


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## Cervantes (10/3/16)

Am I mashing to high at 68?

BJCP style guide states the a porter should be medium light to medium bodied..............


12A. Brown Porter
*Aroma:* Malt aroma with mild roastiness should be evident, and may have a chocolaty quality. May also show some non-roasted malt character in support (caramelly, grainy, bready, nutty, toffee-like and/or sweet). English hop aroma moderate to none. Fruity esters moderate to none. Diacetyl low to none.

*Appearance:* Light brown to dark brown in color, often with ruby highlights when held up to light. Good clarity, although may approach being opaque. Moderate off-white to light tan head with good to fair retention.

*Flavor:* Malt flavor includes a mild to moderate roastiness (frequently with a chocolate character) and often a significant caramel, nutty, and/or toffee character. May have other secondary flavors such as coffee, licorice, biscuits or toast in support. Should not have a significant black malt character (acrid, burnt, or harsh roasted flavors), although small amounts may contribute a bitter chocolate complexity. English hop flavor moderate to none. Medium-low to medium hop bitterness will vary the balance from slightly malty to slightly bitter. Usually fairly well attenuated, although somewhat sweet versions exist. Diacetyl should be moderately low to none. Moderate to low fruity esters.

*Mouthfeel:* Medium-light to medium body. Moderately low to moderately high carbonation.

*Overall Impression:* A fairly substantial English dark ale with restrained roasty characteristics
.
*Comments:* Differs from a robust porter in that it usually has softer, sweeter and more caramelly flavors, lower gravities, and usually less alcohol. More substance and roast than a brown ale. Higher in gravity than a dark mild. Some versions are fermented with lager yeast. Balance tends toward malt more than hops. Usually has an “English” character. Historical versions with Brettanomyces, sourness, or smokiness should be entered in the Specialty Beer category (23).

*History:* Originating in England, porter evolved from a blend of beers or gyles known as “Entire.” A precursor to stout. Said to have been favored by porters and other physical laborers.

*Ingredients:* English ingredients are most common. May contain several malts, including chocolate and/or other dark roasted malts and caramel-type malts. Historical versions would use a significant amount of brown malt. Usually does not contain large amounts of black patent malt or roasted barley. English hops are most common, but are usually subdued. London or Dublin-type water (moderate carbonate hardness) is traditional. English or Irish ale yeast, or occasionally lager yeast, is used. May contain a moderate amount of adjuncts (sugars, maize, molasses, treacle, etc.).

*Vital Statistics*: OG: 1.040 – 1.052 IBUs: 18 – 35 FG: 1.008 – 1.014 SRM: 20 – 30 ABV: 4 – 5.4%

*Commercial Examples:* Fuller's London Porter, Samuel Smith Taddy Porter, Burton Bridge Burton Porter, RCH Old Slug Porter, Nethergate Old Growler Porter, Hambleton Nightmare Porter, Harvey’s Tom Paine Original Old Porter, Salopian Entire Butt English Porter, St. Peters Old-Style Porter, Shepherd Neame Original Porter, Flag Porter, Wasatch Polygamy Porter


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## Adr_0 (10/3/16)

Theoretically 66-67 should be medium bodied, but always depends on your OG and yeast. Body is also impacted by carbonation.

The rest at 71°C is a good one and will improve the body. I think porters have a lot of latitude with OG and FG but it might finish a touch high with the mash profile you have (might be 1014-1016 maybe) so 66-67°C might be more appropriate. IMO water, avoiding too much bitterness, avoid roast barley or too much black (and you can overdo chocolate too), definitely don't add calcium sulphate, and giving it some age are more important than strict OG/FG numbers or the difference between medium-light and medium. It's more of a fine tuning thing with this style IMO.


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## Cervantes (10/3/16)

Adr_0 said:


> Theoretically 66-67 should be medium bodied, but always depends on your OG and yeast. Body is also impacted by carbonation.
> 
> The rest at 71°C is a good one and will improve the body. I think porters have a lot of latitude with OG and FG but it might finish a touch high with the mash profile you have (might be 1014-1016 maybe) so 66-67°C might be more appropriate. IMO water, avoiding too much bitterness, avoid roast barley or too much black (and you can overdo chocolate too), definitely don't add calcium sulphate, and giving it some age are more important than strict OG/FG numbers or the difference between medium-light and medium. It's more of a fine tuning thing with this style IMO.


Thanks for that.

Dropped the rest to 67.

Planning to brew in the next couple of weeks and let it age ready for the winter.


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## Blind Dog (10/3/16)

Personally I'd double the brown malt, halve the chocolate, add a decent amount of Munich (8% or so), swap the crystal for a darker one, and have the main sacc rest just a little lower at 67. But i also reckon it'll be tasty as is.

You should be fine with S04 as well. It's not my favourite yeast by any means, but I've found it works fine in darker, maltier beers like dark milds, porters and stouts.


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## Ducatiboy stu (10/3/16)

Yeast

w1728 - Scottish Ale

Clean. Loves big beers, works very well when fermented at 15*c Works down to 13*c

Perfect yeast for Porter

Its my all time favourite. Does everything from RIS to Milds


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## Reman (10/3/16)

S04 is a well known staller, it stalled in my porter at 1.020.

I'm not sure I particularly like the BJCP guidelines for traditional English beers, I've had a few English Porters and medium-light body just doesn't match.

I'd call Porter the hot chocolate of beer, luscious and chocolatey. I don't think a floral hop flavour is out of place as it gives it a "sweetness".

For the record my porter is 84% MO, 10% Brown and 6% chocolate, with EKG and Fuggles.

My next porter will attempt a historical bent using 95% Amber and 5% Chocolate, it will be interesting to see how it turns out.


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## Midnight Brew (11/3/16)

Cervantes said:


> I'm a two hour drive from my nearest homebrew store that stocks liquid yeasts, so have learned to live with dried yeast.
> 
> To be honest the couple of times that I've used liquid yeast I was a little disappointed with the results. Not the great leap up from dried yeast that I was expecting.
> 
> It may be because I generally brew cleaner style beers and mostly use US-05 which I like. I'm not really keen on too many estery flavours/smells.


I'm about 45ish minutes from a brew shop so a drive there, faff about there then 45mins back I get that it's time consuming. I've found the best way to do it wait till you want a few things and order online and get them shipped. I live in the outer eastern burbs of Melbourne and just had yeast delivered within 36 hours from Newcastle. The temperature down here earlier this week has been above 30 and they still arrived cold. I highly recommend reading the "lets freeze some yeast" thread to build up a collection of your own. Simple and effective.


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## manticle (11/3/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Yeast
> 
> w1728 - Scottish Ale
> 
> ...


I love the yeast but in my experience it really needs time to drop right out as it's unpleasant when there's any still in suspension. Not that there's anything wrong with time and I generally prefer yeast out of suspension in all beers but for some reason I find wy scot beers really need to be super clear.


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## manticle (11/3/16)

Cervantes said:


> I'm a two hour drive from my nearest homebrew store that stocks liquid yeasts, so have learned to live with dried yeast.


Post


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## Adr_0 (11/3/16)

My liquid yeasts often spend the weekend in a hot central QLD warehouse before making it to my door, and can start them fine (including old yeasts).

I think you need to make this porter. Change future recipes, but don't change this one 18 times before you've made it.


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## Liam_snorkel (11/3/16)

as far as dry yeasts go - I really enjoyed one of the new(ish) mangrove jacks called M79 Burton Union in my porter. It was a real treat. estery, dropped clear. It's been renamed Liberty Bell.


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## Cervantes (12/3/16)

Reman said:


> S04 is a well known staller, it stalled in my porter at 1.020.
> 
> I'm not sure I particularly like the BJCP guidelines for traditional English beers, I've had a few English Porters and medium-light body just doesn't match.
> 
> ...


I had exactly the same last year with a porter I brewed, stalled at 1020. Still a nice drop, just a tad sweeter and heavier than planned.


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## Coodgee (27/4/16)

mb-squared said:


> I brew a porter from time to time. My latest attempt was "brown bag porter" (recipe: http://wiki.homebrewersassociation.org/BrownBagBrownPorter) and it came out really nice. silky smooth. Your Munich and golden syrup additions are a bit unusual for the style I think and the lack of brown malt is unusual too. your hops look fine to me.
> 
> the biggest thing I've found with porters is to keep the Ph up in the 5.5 range. If you don't get enough carbonate into the mash your Ph is likely to get down too low and the beer ends up tasting thin and a bit sour. I've found that I really have to keep on top of the ph during the sparge too as it tends to dip a bit low towards the end of the sparge and can ruin the first runnings which are spot on. If you typically add acid to your sparge water, you may want to go easy for this style.


I really like the look of the brown bag porter recipe. I like the fact that it is quite simple and obviously it's a proven winner. did you notice that site and a couple of others list the FG as 1022? Surely that must be a typo?


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