# Your Favourite Belgian Brew



## Curry (14/6/06)

Hey Guys,

Some of will know that I am off to Brussels next year from my where to drink post. I am now interested in what Belgian to drink. Maybe I can compile a list from your answers to this short but not so easy question.

Q. If you could have any three and *only three* Belgian brews regardless of availability, what would they be?

If enough people respond I will try and make a list based on popularity

Cheers

Curry

RESULTS _(updated 28/06/06 @ 1830est)_

*1*. Trappist Rochefort 10 _(12 votes)_
*2*. Chimay Grande reserve (Blue) _(7 votes)_
*3*. Triple Karmeliet (Bosteels) _(5 votes)_
*4*. Westverleten 12 _(3 votes)_
*4*. Delirium Tremens _(3 votes)_
*4*. Duvel _(3 votes)_
*7*. Gulden Draak (Brouwerij Van Steenberge) _(2 votes)_
*7*. Deus _(2 votes)_
*7*. Chimay Cinq Cents (White) _(2 votes)_
*7*. Rose de Gambrinus (Cantillon) _(2 votes)_
*7*. Westmalle Tripel _(2 votes)_
*7*. Hoegaarden Forbiden Fruit _(2 votes)_
*7*. Goulden Carolus (Het Anker) _(2 votes)_
*7*. Girardin Lambics _(2 votes)_
*7*. Leffe Blond _(2 votes)_
*7*. Leffe Radieuse _(2 votes)_
*7*. Gouden Carolus Grand Cru de Kaiser (Het Anker) _(2 votes)_
*18*. Piraat Ale (Brouwerij Van Steenberge) _(1 vote)_
*18*. La Wambrechies _(1 vote)_
*18*. Huyghe Delirum Tremens _(1 vote)_
*18*. Pannepot _(1 vote)_
*18*. Drie Fontaine Schaerbeekse Kriek _(1 vote)_
*18*. Belle-vue Selection Lambic _(1 vote)_
*18*. Affligem Tripel _(1 vote)_
*18*. St. Idesbald Triple _(1 vote)_
*18*. Orval _(1 vote)_
*18*. Dulle Tieve (De Dolle) _(1 vote)_
*18*. Westvleteren Blond _(1 vote)_
*18*. Oerbier (De Dolle) _(1 vote)_
*18*. La Devine _(1 vote)_
*18*. Rodenbach Grand Cru _(1 vote)_
*18*. Grottenbier _(1 vote)_
*18*. Poperings Hommel Bier _(1 vote)_
*18*. De Koninck _(1 vote)_


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## goatherder (14/6/06)

rochefort 10. three times.


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## bindi (14/6/06)

goatherder said:


> rochefort 10. three times.



Yep, and Chimay blue :beerbang:


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## bconnery (14/6/06)

Curry said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> Some of will know that I am off to Brussels next year from my where to drink post. I am now interested in what Belgiums to drink. Maybe I can compile a list from your answers to this short but not so easy question.
> 
> ...



Come on, give us 5 at least...

Something from Cantillon is a must. 
Personally the Rose de Gambrinus but the Lambic or Gueze would do as well. 
Or just all three and more 

Westverleten 12 ( I haven't tasted this one myself but the guys over on BA appear to regard it as one of the Holy Grail's so it might be worth a try...)

Rochefort (insert number here) 

Chimay Blue is a great one but can be had here fairly easily. Freshness might play a part but personally I found it very tasty here and in Belgium. 

Gouden Carolus Grand Cru de Kaiser is a personal favourite. The Grand Cru itself is pretty good too


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## mhan7073 (14/6/06)

My top three would be triple karmeliet, delirium tremens (but I'm desperate to try delirium nocturnum and delirium noel, you couldn't smuggle one back for me or something...) and chimay grand reserve (blue).


Having said that, for everday beers in Belgium, hoegaarden is hard to beat. Served with mussels, chips and mayonaise.

Personally I'm not really a fan of leffe or orval, but Rochefort seems pretty popular. I've not gotten around to trying it myself, and my local Dan Murphy's doesn't stock it.

But whatever you do, drink a magnum of belgian beer, if not a jeroboam. One of the best things you can ever do I reckon.

Mic


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## sinkas (14/6/06)

1) Piraat Ale (Brouwerij Van Steenberge)
2) Gulden Draak (Brouwerij Van Steenberge)
3) Rochefort 10

What can I say the brewers at Brouwerij Van Steenberge cought my imagination.


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## Malnourished (14/6/06)

Sorry to be contrary but I question the logic of going to Belgium and drinking beers you can buy in a bottle shop here!

As for recommendations, The Good Beer Guide to Belgium will help you decide what you want to drink. It's my favourite book. :super:


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## bindi (14/6/06)

Malnourished said:


> Sorry to be contrary but I question the logic of going to Belgium and drinking beers you can buy in a bottle shop here!
> 
> True <_< but they don't taste the same here.


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## smashed jaffa (14/6/06)

westmalle 

WESTMALLE

*WESTMALLE*

Sorry Didn't mean to shout! :beer:


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## Lindsay Dive (14/6/06)

I recently had a friend who raced a Porsche at SPA and he bought back 6 fresh Belgian Beauties for me.
My pick was the Gulden Draak...absolutely sensational.

At $9.50 for 330ml here in Sydney, I wont be rushing out to buy many.


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## Kieren (14/6/06)

Favourite belgian brew?

That's like trying to answer whether a tree falling in a forest makes a noise with know one around to hear it.

But to put three out there

Rochefort 10

Hoegaarden Forbiden Fruit

Deus - hugely expensive but perfect for a special occasion. Like no other beer i've tried.


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## apd (14/6/06)

<pedantic>

Kieren, Lindsay, thank you for using the correct adjective, "Belgian", rather than "Belgium".

Belgium is the country.

Belgian beer is the beverage.

</pedantic>


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## Hopsta (14/6/06)

1. Trappist Rochefort 10

2. La Wambrechies - not well known but this is a beautiful beer and deffinatly one of my favourites (if not the favourite) i once posted here about this beer to see if anyone had any recipes but not much was known about it. Found this on ratebeer Ale blended with gin. The " LA WAMBRECHIES " beer is brewed with the finest malt and hop. Old Malt Jenever 40% is added before passage into the heating room. It is a high fermentation beer, refermenting in the bottle. An exclusive product by the CLAEYSSENS Distillery."

3. Deus - one of lifes little luxuries, $55 aus for a champagne size bottle.


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## monkale (14/6/06)

1- Rochefort 10 :beerbang: 


2- Chimay Grand Reserve ( oh how I luv him so ) :super: 


3- Huyghe Delirum Tremens (strong golden ale)  


But asking me to name my 3 favourite children when I have 20 is a hard job to do  


Cheers Monkale


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## Doc (14/6/06)

It is really hard when the Belgian Beer Cafe Heritage is one door up from my office, and I have to walk past it to catch the bus. Even harder if I've had a shit day.
I enjoy many, but the ones I always go back to are:

Leffe Radieuse
Rochefort 10

Doc


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## Ash in Perth (14/6/06)

I was in belgium recently.. a couple of good ones:

Westvleteren 12 -Very hard to find. look for 'de bier tempel' or something like that. its a little beer shop that had it. i got them in brugges but apparently the owner has another store in brussels that might have it too. Its the only place aside form the monastary that may have it (www.sintsixtus.be give them a call to see if they have any at the monastary). cost be about 4Euro ($7 AUS) at the beer shop but only 27Euro for a carton at the monastary but they ran out before i got there. I have 2 of these aging aswell as one of their weaker beers, the '8'. If they are less than 6 months old dont waste them, they get much better with age so bring them back to aus.

Chimay Grande reserve (Blue) - although this is common as anything over here even, you can get it cheaper than frites over there. found it at 2.70Euros for a 750mL bottle in a supermarket.

Girardin Lambics - The real stuff!

Stick to stuff you cant get over here. Supermarkets sell beer cheaper than anywhere else, around 1Euro per bottle of good ones. Pubs charge up to about 4Euro for a glass.

Hope this help


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## Curry (14/6/06)

I thought this one might open a Pandoras Box, but hey its good to get some great gen.

bconnery: Yeah I know 3 is a bit tight, but I wanted to try and get a definitive list

Malnourished: thanks for the recommendation on the book

apd: I stand corrected, thanks for pointing that one out

Anyway keep e'm coming; Ill edit my original post with the results so far.

Cheers

Curry


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## tangent (14/6/06)

sorry but i gotta add leffe blond and chimay white
sweet as hell and sweet and bitter  (and cost me $24 for the 2x330ml bottles at The Bar)


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## colinw (14/6/06)

Oh dear, so many lovely Belgian brews.

My favourites in no particular order.

Chimay Grande Reserve (Blue)
Westmalle Tripel
La Chouffe
Duvel
Tripel Karmeliet
Hoegaarden Forbidden Fruit
Hoegaarden Grand Cru
Cuvee de Koninck
Blanche de Namur
Delirium Tremens
Leffe Radieuse
Leffe Vielle Cuvee
Rochefort 10
Rodenbach Grand Cru

and not Belgian but definitely Belgian inspired

La Fin Du Monde (Unibroue, Canada)


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## Voosher (14/6/06)

Here's the top 20 (with ratings out of 5) blatantly copied from Ratebeer.

Some of these were limited releases and won't be available.
More food for thought though.
Chimay Blue gets a guernsey in the mid-20's...


Westvleteren Abt 12 
4.52	

Drie Fonteinen Framboos (Framboise) 
4.45	

De Dolle Stille Nacht Reserva (2000 version) 
4.38	

Rochefort Trappistes 10 
4.35	

Westvleteren Extra 8 
4.27	

Belle-Vue Slection Lambic 
4.24	

Drie Fonteinen J & J Oude Geuze Blauw 
4.2	

De Dolle Speciaal Brouwsel 20 
4.2	

Drie Fonteinen Oude Geuze 1998 (50th Anniversary) 
4.17	

Abbaye des Rocs Brune 
4.17	

Struise Pannepot 
4.16	

St. Bernardus Abt 12 
4.14	

Drie Fonteinen J & J Oude Geuze Roze 
4.13	

Rochefort Trappistes 8 
4.13	

Rodenbach Alexander 
4.12	

Abbaye des Rocs Grand Cru 
4.12	

Eylenbosch Framboise Cuvee Speciale 
4.1	

Girardin Gueuze Black Label 
4.1	

Cantillon Goldackerl Gueuze 
4.09	

Bush Millennium Cuve 2000 
4.06


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## Busboy (15/6/06)

My favourites are Tripel Karmeliet and Leffe Blonde. Drinking the Karmeliet was a revelation.


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## kook (15/6/06)

3 only?

Pannepot - Brilliant brew. Hard to find, but you can get it in Bruges at t'Bruges Beertje or from the brewery in Woesten Vleteren. It was hard to choose this over Westlveletern Abt 12, but I personally prefer it. Either of the brews are world class dark strong belgian ales though.

Drie Fontaine Schaerbeekse Kriek - My favourite Kriek, once again hard to find. If you cant get hold of this, their standard kriek is brilliant too.

Belle-vue Selection Lambic - Very hard to find now, though I suspect Kulminator still has some. Brilliant Gueuze.


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## warrenlw63 (15/6/06)

I have no firm favourite but these I've always found good;

Cantillon Rose De Gambrinus
Rodenbach (all their beers)  
Affligem Tripel (neck and neck with Westmalle)
Brugse Tripel
Kasteel Bier
Liefmans Frambozenbier
Saison Dupont
Straffe Hendrick (All their beers) :beerbang:
Westvleteren 12
Probably all the Trappist beers save for bloody horrid Orval 

There's probably a lot more but there's some memorable ones.

Warren -


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## mhan7073 (15/6/06)

I was playing cards online with a belgian and I asked him his favourite beer, he said St. Idesbald Triple. I can't seem to get it here, so that might be worth a shot. 

If you're in an area that was involved in the great war they generally take pretty kindly to Australians. I remember going into a chocolate shop at Ypres and being given some mega pack of chocolate because they asked If I was Australian. It can be kinda weird when you see Australian flags in shop windows for no particular reason ... 

Michael


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## neonmeate (15/6/06)

I will stick up for Orval. In fact it's pretty much my favourite beer, if such a thing existed . the beer has everything: clean malt, big spicy hoppiness, fruitiness AND funk. all in perfect balance. and the most amazing head of any beer ever - all lumpy and silky.

otherwise if youre in belgium here's 3 i'd go for that you can't get here:

De Dolle Dulle Tieve (amazing tripel - the gran riserva aged in calvados casks is great too)
a hardcore gueuze such as Girardin, Hanssens or Drie Fonteinen
and....um....
I really like Westvleteren blond as well as the big fat dark ones - it's a real zippy hoppy peppery dry blond, like everything that tooth-rotting Leffe Blond isn't.

so when is somebody opening a belgian micro importing business here?


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## Curry (15/6/06)

Hey Guys,

I have done another update on the list.

Not as many Lambics as I thought there might be and its good to finally see a Kriek on the list (thanks kook).

Obviously the Trappist Rochefort 10 & Chimay Grande reserve (Blue) are the standouts amongst this learned group.

Cheers

Curry


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## neonmeate (15/6/06)

may I also say with all respect to my learned colleagues that i think Chimay blue is dirty brown dishwater. thin, one-dimensional, bland, trading on packaging, monastic sentimantality and past glories.
completely crapped all over by abbaye des rocs, gouden carolus, st bernardus 8 to name just three dark 9%ers you can get in this country, iMO of course!


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## hefevice (15/6/06)

Jeez...that's a tough ask!

In no particular order the favourites of those I have tried so far are:

Oerbier (De Dolle)
Goulden Carolus (Het Anker)
Tripel Karmeliet (Bosteels)

But you can get most of them here (albeit in varying condition), so if you are visiting, focus on the stuff you can't get here. Just try anything you see that is of interest - it is relatively inexpensive and it is very rare that you will be disappointed.

Have a great trip,

Cheers
Geoff


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## Ash in Perth (15/6/06)

Ordinary Goulden Carolus can be found easy enough in Perth. The 'Cuvee Van De Keizer' is not as common and i rate it up with rochefort 10 and even westvlet 12(seriously try and find this one).


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## Jazman (15/6/06)

Duvel,,,,,,,,,rochefort 10,karmelite ,chimays blue,white just a few stil got lot more to try


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## PMyers (27/6/06)

Even I had to log in for this one...

Rochefort 10. Definately.
Delirium Tremens.
One that you didn't mention, that I believe tops all others on the list; La Devine. My GOD I wish I had been successful in culturing that yeast.

You also, absolutely MUST, try an old (five years cask-conditioned) straight, unblended lambic. Even if it takes you ages to find a place that sells it, and costs you your first born child. I think the Belgians call it "vieu" lambic, or something similar.

Cheers,
Pete
:chug:


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## Curry (27/6/06)

Hey Pete,

Thanks for the heads up on the cask-conditioned, you have now given me a mission.

Cheers

Curry

P.S. Orginal post updated again


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## jimmy01 (27/6/06)

Tried a Gouden Carolus and a Guden Drak the other night. 
Both very tasty brews, though the Drak at 10% is a special occassion beer only.

As a staple can't go past Hoegarden

Dave


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## PMyers (27/6/06)

Curry said:


> Thanks for the heads up on the cask-conditioned, you have now given me a mission.



After brief consultation with texts at home, it is actually called "vieux" - with an "x"... not that that makes any _real_ difference. Oh, and it is cask conditioned for three years and bottle conditioned for one.

By the way, I tapped my first lambic effort the other day. It had been conditioning in stainless for about 2 years. In retrospect I really should have added an oak stave or two to the vessel, but otherwise BLOODY BRILLIANT :beerbang: 

I seperated it into 25 litres for Kriek, 12 litres for Cassis and 12 litres of unblended lambic. Obviously it is the unblended that I am sampling now, and I couldn't be happier.

Cheers,
Pete
:chug:


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## big d (27/6/06)

Mmmm a few more to look out for next month when i visit the International beer shop in Perth.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$  

Cheers
Big D


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## dreamboat (28/6/06)

Rochefort 10
Rodenbach Grand Cru


Not sure after that... would love to try a westy, but hard to put it on the list until I have.
The rodenbach grand cru is brilliant, nothing like any other beer I have tried. Full of such weird flavours that meld into something outstanding, challenging but very drinkable. Go out and get one!



Rob


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## mikem108 (28/6/06)

1. Chimay Cinq Cent
2. Grottenbier 
3. Popperings Hommel bier
4. Duvel


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## sjc (28/6/06)

Hi MikeM
I see you list Grottenbier as one of your favourite belgian beers. I recently tried this one and also decided to try cultivating the yeast. I had almost given up on it and then one morning I see the telltale signs that there is life down there!

As one of your favourites, do you have any ideas as to its probable composition, as I may as well put the yeast to use now.
Cheers
Stephen.


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## brewwizard (28/6/06)

sjc said:


> Hi MikeM
> I see you list Grottenbier as one of your favourite belgian beers. I recently tried this one and also decided to try cultivating the yeast. I had almost given up on it and then one morning I see the telltale signs that there is life down there!
> 
> As one of your favourites, do you have any ideas as to its probable composition, as I may as well put the yeast to use now.
> ...



I am sorry to say, BUT, most bottle conditioned Belgian beers do not have the same yeast in the bottle as they use in the brewing process. Because they cold lager they normally use a lager yeast. Therefore you won't copy the beer. You should check first, but I don't know how you will find out.
Good luck
brewwizard :chug:


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## sjc (28/6/06)

Hi Brewizard
I'm aware that they may be the case in some instances, but I've successfully cultured yeasts out of a number of belgian beers, including Chimay, Orval, Hoegarden Wit, Hoegarden Grand Cru and most recently Grottenbier and to date all of the beers I've made with them have very similar flavour profiles to the original beer and were not at all lager like. And they didn't just taste like lagers fermented at the wrong temperature.

I'd certainly be interested to hear the views of others who have tried reculturing yeasts from bottle conditioned beers.

Regards
Stephen.


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## brewwizard (28/6/06)

sjc said:


> Hi Brewizard
> I'm aware that they may be the case in some instances, but I've successfully cultured yeasts out of a number of belgian beers, including Chimay, Orval, Hoegarden Wit, Hoegarden Grand Cru and most recently Grottenbier and to date all of the beers I've made with them have very similar flavour profiles to the original beer and were not at all lager like. And they didn't just taste like lagers fermented at the wrong temperature.
> 
> I'd certainly be interested to hear the views of others who have tried reculturing yeasts from bottle conditioned beers.
> ...



Well done. I stand corrected. I saw a list years ago. Obviously things change.
Even Chimay is brewed in a factory now ??? I visited the monestary and brewery 
in 1990. Went back in 2004. No brewery at monestary, moved into Chimay town
and a factory. I felt cheated. Cheers
brewwizard :chug:


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## sjc (28/6/06)

Hi Brewwizard
that's an interesting point you make about Chimay and I read somewhere about similar happenings the Orval brewery. In 2003 I cultured the yeast from an Orval and made up a clone beer. It had similar although not identical features to the original. This year I again cultured the yeast from an Orval, but when I tasted the fermented wort in the starter I thought it tasted very neutral - a lager yeast for bottle conditioning? So I recultured the yeast in my earlier clone (yes I still have some left) and brewed up a clone beer. I initially pitched the newer yeast from the bottle I cultured this year and fermented it for one week. I then added the culture from my earlier clone and allowed fermentation to finish.
The resulting beer seems much closer to the original than my first attempt, which perhaps lends weight to the theory that they may have changed the yeast/culture they add at bottling. Anyway, with a sample of both cultures, I know seem to have the means to produce a reliable clone of this one.

regards
Stephen.


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## GothGargoyle (28/6/06)

Add my vote for the Gouden Carolus. Simply one of the nicest beers (Belgian or otherwise) I have ever had!

Another one I quite enjoyed in the Belgian Beer Cafe is "The Bolleke" by De Koninck.


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## Curry (28/6/06)

Guys,

Thanks for more feeback, listed updated again.

Goth: My understanding is that a Bolleke is actually a glass (I could be wrong) and that De Koninck actually has 9 beers. I'm assuming that Belgian Beer Cafe serves the one under the name of De Koninck - anyone care to comment on this?

Cheers

Curry


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## PMyers (28/6/06)

brewwizard said:


> Obviously things change.
> Even Chimay is brewed in a factory now ???



If people have been culturing yeast from Chimay bottles recently, then things have DEFINATELY changed. I remember reading an article several years ago (translated from Belgian by an online translator) that stated implicitly that Chimay is centrifuged after fermentation to remove suspended particulate, then reinnoculated with a neutral yeast for bottle conditioning.

Didn't know about Chimay being brewed outside of the monastery, though.

Cheers,
Pete
:chug:


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## Malnourished (28/6/06)

PMyers said:


> Didn't know about Chimay being brewed outside of the monastery, though.


It's still brewed at the monastery, but it's packaged at the factory in town. I can't recall where fermentation takes place off the top of my head, though I think it's in the monastery. I'd be very surprised if they used a different culture for bottle-conditioning too, but I guess strangers things have happened.

And lambic isn't _that _ hard to find. You can definitely get draught lambic in Brussels at Cantillon (err... Cantillon) and Warm Water (Girardin.) The bottled Cantillon lambic (aka Bruocsella 1900 Grand Cru) should be relatively easy to find in specialist beer places. If you can find De Cam's bottled Oude Lambiek then you should start thinking about trading away that first born.


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## PMyers (29/6/06)

Malnourished said:


> And lambic isn't _that _ hard to find.



I agree totally. Lambic in Belgium is very common. It is found on tap in many Brussels cafes. What isn't easy to find are the _viuex_ lambics. In fact one of them is only served to VIP guests of the Lambic Museum, apparently. They are very expensive, and you certainly won't find many served outside of the actual breweries.

Cheers,
Pete
:chug:


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## kook (29/6/06)

PMyers said:


> I agree totally. Lambic in Belgium is very common. It is found on tap in many Brussels cafes. What isn't easy to find are the _viuex_ lambics. In fact one of them is only served to VIP guests of the Lambic Museum, apparently. They are very expensive, and you certainly won't find many served outside of the actual breweries.
> 
> Cheers,
> Pete
> :chug:



Viuex is another word for Old. It's simply Old, unblended lambic. This isn't that uncommon, and I've certainly never paid more for it than Jonge lambic. I've tried it from Girardin, De Cam, Boon and Drie Fontaine. You simply have to hunt a little (or visit festivals). Cantillon doesn't officially serve it, however i'm sure Jean Pierre would serve it to friends if asked.

FYI, I had the Boon at Zythos Beer Festival, the De Cam is bottled. I tried the Drie Fontaine and Girardin at the Weekend of Spontanious Fermentation (with Malnourished).


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## Malnourished (29/6/06)

PMyers said:


> What isn't easy to find are the _viuex_ lambics. In fact one of them is only served to VIP guests of the Lambic Museum, apparently. They are very expensive, and you certainly won't find many served outside of the actual breweries.


I'm 99.9% certain we are talking about the same thing. 

In Belgium, the word "lambic" (or lambik/lambiek) means the stuff straight from the barrel. Of course this can be vieux/oude or jeune/jong, but in my experience the young stuff is the one that's hard to find. This is a happy coincidence though, the old stuff is far superior, IMO. We Anglophones confuse the situation by referring to the entire family of spontaneously-fermented beers as lambics. "Lambics" in form of Belle-Vue Kriek and the like are literally available everywhere in Belgium, as you say. "Lambic" in the Belgian sense (and what you are talking about) is also available in Brussels at (at least) the two places I mentioned above for anyone who walks in off the street, and they are generally far _cheaper _ than gueuze because there's no blending and refermentation time required.

I'm assuming by "Lambic Museum" you mean Cantillon. You can buy draught lambic there (usually about 18 months old, at least it was when I was there) and you can buy the Grand Cru for 5 or 6 (I forget which) a 750mL bottle. I know they've experimented with some unique one-off lambics (in cognac barrels or dry-hopped with Cascades for instance!) which might be reserved for VIPs, but there are definitely two that anyone can walk in off the street and buy.

In the Payottenland there are quite a number of places selling draught lambic, but a few of the more industrial producers don't generally release theirs before blending. If you're interested in other places which sell draught vieux lambic, check out LambikLand by Tim Webb, Joris Pattyn and Podge... or get to the Weekend der Spontane Gisting in Buggenhout one day :beerbang:


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## Malnourished (29/6/06)

kook said:


> Cantillon doesn't officially serve it, however i'm sure Jean Pierre would serve it to friends if asked.


Damn you beat me to it! 

Cantillon served lambic "officially" whenever I was there... And it was available at kook's favourite restaurant, In 't Spinnekopke.


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## kook (29/6/06)

Malnourished said:


> Damn you beat me to it!
> 
> Cantillon served lambic "officially" whenever I was there... And it was available at kook's favourite restaurant, In 't Spinnekopke.



They serve the Jonge (and Faro) there  I've never had them serve me Oude.


edit - Strange, I've got my tasting notes as "Cantillon Jonge Lambic", yet I clearly state that its 2 years old. Which to me, is Oude lambic! I guess I take back what I said above


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## Malnourished (29/6/06)

kook said:


> edit - Strange, I've got my tasting notes as "Cantillon Jonge Lambic", yet I clearly state that its 2 years old. Which to me, is Oude lambic! I guess I take back what I said above


It makes sense if you're tasting individual barrels, but as a consumer the jonge/oude differentiation never really made much sense to me. I only ever saw Girardin specifically advertised as such. All the others were just "lambic/k." I guess Cantillon's is "jonge" (why Flemish?) to differentiate it from the Grand Cru.


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## mikem108 (29/6/06)

sjc said:


> Hi MikeM
> I see you list Grottenbier as one of your favourite belgian beers. I recently tried this one and also decided to try cultivating the yeast. I had almost given up on it and then one morning I see the telltale signs that there is life down there!
> 
> As one of your favourites, do you have any ideas as to its probable composition, as I may as well put the yeast to use now.
> ...



According to MJ :
Amber Vienna and a marginally smaller proportion of Cara-Munich
Original Gravity: 16 Plato (1064)
spices from a tropical country in addition to hops to create that very distinctive and rather hard-to-analyze character."

Difficult to pin down, i'm ordering more bottles ...for research!


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## sjc (29/6/06)

Hi Mike
thanks for the analysis. Where do you get your Grottenbier supplies? In Queensland I've only ever seen it in a bottle shop in Toowoomba. Other Qld AHBers who are belgian beer fans would know the bottle shop I'm referring to.
Cheers
Stephen.


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## GothGargoyle (29/6/06)

Curry said:


> My understanding is that a Bolleke is actually a glass (I could be wrong) and that De Koninck actually has 9 beers. I'm assuming that Belgian Beer Cafe serves the one under the name of De Koninck - anyone care to comment on this?



Yes you are correct, a Belgian colleague of mine pointed out this on my last visit to the Belgian Beer Cafe but I was only half listening  He was saying it couldn't be a "real Bolleke" because it came in a bottle.

I did a bit of research and a "bolleke" is apparently what you ask for in Antwerp cafes which have De Koninck Ale as their house beer. So if you aren't going to Antwerp on your trip, don't worry about it.

I'd say the one in the Belgian Beer Cafe is what De Koninck bottle for export, naming it "The Bolleke" to capitalize on their reputation as the "everyday beer in Antwerp".


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## PMyers (29/6/06)

Malnourished said:


> I'm 99.9% certain we are talking about the same thing.
> 
> ...
> 
> You can buy draught lambic there (usually about 18 months old, at least it was when I was there)



Now I am not so sure we are talking about the same thing (although I must say my knowledge on this hasn't been updated for several years).

The vieux that I know of is at least three years old, and anywhere up to five years in the cask. Unless this is actually called something else (which would account for the confusion).

Cheers,
Pete
:chug:


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## Malnourished (29/6/06)

PMyers said:


> The vieux that I know of is at least three years old, and anywhere up to five years in the cask. Unless this is actually called something else (which would account for the confusion).


Well, like I said, Cantillon's bottled lambic is three years old. Girardin's oude lambik is also generally three years old. De Cam's bottled oude lambiek was five years old when it was bottled.

I'm curious as to where you had this vieux lambic though. And who brewed it? I'm guessing that because you refer to it as "vieux" it's either Cantillon or Belle-Vue - or was it an older producer that is no longer?


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## mikem108 (3/7/06)

sjc said:


> Hi Mike
> thanks for the analysis. Where do you get your Grottenbier supplies? In Queensland I've only ever seen it in a bottle shop in Toowoomba. Other Qld AHBers who are belgian beer fans would know the bottle shop I'm referring to.
> Cheers
> Stephen.




I get it delivered by megabeer.com.
I had another bottle on the w/e it was like a cross between Leffe Brun and Chmay Red. I think there is a fair proportion of caramel syrup in there and not much hops.


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## brendanos (16/4/07)

Gueze (Cantillon), Oud Bruin (Liefmans), and Quadruple (St Bernardus). Maybe not the best of each style that I will ever taste, but for now they're at the top.

Reculturing some yeast from a bottle of St Bernardus Abt 12 for a similar brew, but found out they may bottle with a different strain, so it might not be the Westvleteren strain that I was chasing.


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## Vlad the Pale Aler (16/4/07)

Brendanos - save yourself a lot of farting around and buy it, White Labs 530, Wyeast 1762


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## stillscottish (5/8/07)

I'm heading off to Scotland for my sister's wedding in two weeks.
I just discovered my nephew, a truckie, is driving into Belgium just now so I'm compiling a shopping list for him to pick up for me.

So far I'm thinking about:

Rochefort 8 & 10
Westmalle Tripel
La Chouffe
Chimay Grande Reserve
Gulden Draak
Saison Dupont
Hoegaarden Grand Cru

I don't want to go for the more obscure ones as he'll just be getting what's available in supermarkets there.

Anything else you think I could add to the list?


Campbell
who's ashamed to admit when he spent time in Belgium years ago, drank nothing but Stella


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## oldbugman (5/8/07)

Love my Westmalle glass/goblet.


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## capretta (5/8/07)

stillscottish said:


> I'm heading off to Scotland for my sister's wedding in two weeks.



have you thought about some rodenbach grand cru? not a bad drop! if you are in scotland you should check these links

http://www.scotland.org.uk/features/breweries.htm
Travel Scotland - Features - Breweries In Scotland 18/11/99

and


http://www.whitebeertravels.co.uk/edinburgh.html
Edinburgh, Scotland and its Caledonian Brewery

EnjoY!


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## winkle (5/8/07)

Off the top of my head he might be able to score some of these-
*Boon, 3 Fonteinen* or any other non-Inbev lambic
De Ranke XX Bitter
Petrus Oud Bruin
Saison de Pipaix
and a bunch of beer glasses  

Most of the ones on your list you could get here, with a bit of digging - although they'll be in far better condition up there.
Have a good trip mate, don't freeze ya goolies off if you go regimental.


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## stillscottish (5/8/07)

winkle said:


> Off the top of my head he might be able to score some of these-
> *Boon, 3 Fonteinen* or any other non-Inbev lambic
> De Ranke XX Bitter
> Petrus Oud Bruin
> ...



I know you can get them here but at what price!!
Hopefully getting them there they'll be cheap as chips.
I'm going to get him to look out for Beer + Glass gift packs.

Thanks for the input

Campbell


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## Malnourished (5/8/07)

I definitely recall Delhaize stocking several Cantillon brands and Mort Subite Oude Gueuze (and it's probably the right time of year for their Oude Kriek too), as well as Achel and a few other interesting things.

If you just want cheap stuff in bulk get him to stop at a "drankencentrale" - they're dotted along main roads and will sell all the big brands in bulk by the case. Some will sell singles. Noel Cuvelier's is a famous one just off the road back to Calais near Poperinge.

But geez, please don't go all that way and just drink beers you can get here just to save yourself a few bucks! There's an incredible world of beer out there - get amongst it.


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## stillscottish (5/8/07)

Malnourished said:


> I definitely recall Delhaize stocking several Cantillon brands and Mort Subite Oude Gueuze (and it's probably the right time of year for their Oude Kriek too), as well as Achel and a few other interesting things.
> 
> If you just want cheap stuff in bulk get him to stop at a "drankencentrale" - they're dotted along main roads and will sell all the big brands in bulk by the case. Some will sell singles. Noel Cuvelier's is a famous one just off the road back to Calais near Poperinge.
> 
> But geez, please don't go all that way and just drink beers you can get here just to save yourself a few bucks! There's an incredible world of beer out there - get amongst it.



You're right. The trouble is I don't know what the shops he'll be in will have but I've had a rethink and am at the moment pasting pics of a heap of bottles into a word doc so he can just look along the shelves until he finds one that matches.


Campbell


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