# Where to buy foil bags and vacuum sealer for hops?



## zarniwoop (30/11/13)

Hi All,

I'm chasing the non-oxygen permeable foil bags and a vacuum sealer for storing hops, can anyone point me to a good source?


Cheers

Zarniwoop


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## QldKev (30/11/13)

This is where I get my bags from, but the vac sealers they are currently selling only seal channel bags, so are no good for the foil ones.


This is the same as my machine which does seal the non-channel bags.
edit: The top machine on that page


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## toolio666 (30/11/13)

I see Kogan has their vacuum sealer now (Sat 3.50pm) for $49 with free shipping. No idea if it would handle the foil bags though.

They have the standard 2 x 3m rolls of bags for $19 as well.


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## QldKev (30/11/13)

I just checked http://www.aliexpress.com

Search for Vac sealer and there are plenty the same as mine for cheaper than that link above


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## zarniwoop (30/11/13)

Sorry what's a channel bag?


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## DU99 (30/11/13)

this might explain it 

these textured vacuum bags have a special embossed surface, creating channels for air to easily be removed from the bag. As a result of their textured design, embossed vacuum bags provide an higher than usual oxygen barrier, which significantly extends the shelf life and flavor of food products, as well as greatly reducing the occurrence of freezer burn and moisture loss, thus reducing waste.


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## QldKev (30/11/13)

As DU99 linked too. I'm not aware of any foil bags that have channels in them. But a decent thickness vac bag is still great for hops storage, although the foil are that bit better. I use non-foil bags for all my hops.

edit: At the packaging center the "home bags" are channel bags, and the "commercial bags" are non-channel. You will see the non-channel are a lot cheaper to buy, but realistically for the quantities we use it's probably not such a big factor.


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## zarniwoop (30/11/13)

Ah ok thanks, I guess provided there's no light the standard plastic channel bags would be fine?


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## DU99 (30/11/13)

i keep mine in the fridge,some also keep in the freezer


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## QldKev (30/11/13)

Yep a decent vac bag (not a ziplock bag), cold and in the dark they will last for a very long time (years).


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## DU99 (30/11/13)

three year old cluster flowers..


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## Yob (30/11/13)

whats up with that floor DU99 looks phaaarked :unsure:


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## DU99 (30/11/13)

Yob..the beer did it..getting the brewroom floor fixed over xmas


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## lael (30/11/13)

QldKev said:


> This is where I get my bags from, but the vac sealers they are currently selling only seal channel bags, so are no good for the foil ones.
> 
> 
> This is the same as my machine which does seal the non-channel bags.
> edit: The top machine on that page


Kev,

I bought one of the new versions of that machine recently - but having trouble getting a full vacuum seal - any tips on how to use the snorkel / release thingo effectively?

Thanks!


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## QldKev (30/11/13)

lael said:


> Kev,
> 
> I bought one of the new versions of that machine recently - but having trouble getting a full vacuum seal - any tips on how to use the snorkel / release thingo effectively?
> 
> Thanks!


I find keeping the product towards the snorkel, and not the bottom of the bag helps a lot. Although you only have a new one so it should not have clogged up yet, in the snorkel there is a filter that clogs up quickly from the hop debris. After cleaning it a couple of times I got the idea from Batz to leave it out. It's been out for the past 2 years with no issue. If it's the same as mine, on the back of the housing behind the snorkel there is a removable panel. Inside that there is the back of the snorkel with a removable rubber cap. Remove the cap and you can push out the filter from the snorkel side and out through the hole where the rubber cap was.

edit:
This thread has a pic of mine with the top off. You can see the black rubber cap in the middle of the pic


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## lael (30/11/13)

Sweet, thanks. I think I might have had the bag collapsing over the snorkel.


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## bradsbrew (30/11/13)

DU99 said:


> three year old cluster flowers..


Sorry for OT but DU99 that lino looks like it has an asbestos underlay. Which if it is would be classes as friable asbestos (the worst type) because it can not be removed without disturbing the bonding. Only cost about 60 bucks for a NATA lab test.

Cheers


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## DU99 (30/11/13)

will get it checked :icon_cheers: ..was thinking off getting flooring laid over it..


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## Brettco (3/12/13)

I've found them on ebay in past by searching for _Mylar vacuum bags_ and _textured_ or _channel_. This listing is the only current one I can see, but the seller is in the US so the shipping is more than the bags. Still, works out about $1.40 a bag, and they are nice and thick and a reasonable size at 10 x 14". Says at the bottom to be careful with cheap vacuum sealers - may not be strong enough to heat and seal, so might need a double-shot.

I've tried the non-channeled foil/mylar bags in my Sunbeam VS7800 with a fairly random 1 in 3 or so success rate, but had no luck at all in my old cheaper Costco FoodSaver model. The Sunbeam walks all over that one for quality, power and not sucking the juice out of the meat before it heats and seals.


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## tateg (24/2/15)

Sorry to be dragging up an old thread but does anyone have a good source to get quality bags where you don't have to buy 200 odd.


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/2/15)

Bulk bag bulk buy


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## stux (24/2/15)

I just buy rolls from an ebay seller I'm happy with

http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/planetbucks3/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=

Nice thick plastic. Good quality. Some other rolls can be too thin.

48$ for 60M or so, I bought a mixed pack of 8 28 and 20cm rolls last time.

Easy enough to seal one end to make a bag.


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## tateg (24/2/15)

Stux said:


> I just buy rolls from an ebay seller I'm happy with
> 
> http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/planetbucks3/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=
> 
> ...


Thanks stux 
Might have to check them out was just hoping to find some bags


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## DU99 (24/2/15)

good price for bags could cut in half for smaller size,remember you need the correct bags for the machine..


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## Rod (25/2/15)

Don't know your location , but

Cooperage home brew in Smithfield NSW

http://www.cooperagebrew.com.au/

$15 for 2 rolls


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## barls (25/2/15)

VISIT OUR WEBSITE
I've bought from here before just specify no valve


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## tateg (25/2/15)

ended up getting some from below
[SIZE=medium]http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/100-PREMIUM-VACUUM-FOOD-SEALER-BAGS-FOOD-SAVER-SEAL-STORAGE-BAG-HEAT-22CM-X-30CM/291172491817?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140106155344%26meid%3Da41fcd8abf1f49f290c552f33db6901e%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D281400204095&rt=nc[/SIZE]


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## Feldon (25/2/15)

Aldi had rolls of textured bag plastic on special a few weeks back (along with their own brand vacuum sealer).

If there's a store near you might still find the rolls on sale (I bought some a week after they went on sale).


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## Roosterboy (20/11/16)

Sorry for bringing up this thread again , but I'm after foil mylar bags for hops. There's lots on ebay but can anyone
recommend a supplier that has a good product at a reasonable price that they have used recently ?


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## SBOB (21/11/16)

Why use foil ones instead of just regular old vacuum seal bags? 
It's dark in the freezer anyway...


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## Lyrebird_Cycles (23/11/16)

SBOB said:


> Why use foil ones instead of just regular old vacuum seal bags?
> It's dark in the freezer anyway...


Because almost all plastics are permeable to oxygen or water vapour or both. Vacuum deposition of a microscopically thin layer of metal (aluminium) increases the barrier properties: as an example a typical PET (mylar) fim has an oxygen transmission rate* of 160 mg / m2 / day while the same film when metallised has a transmission rate of 2.2 mg / m2 / day, almost 100 times lower.

That means if you had 100g hops in a bag that was 100mm x 100mm a standard mylar film would admit 3.2 mg O2 / 100g hops / day, while the metallised film would admit 0.044 mg / 100g hops / day.

http://www.slideshare.net/henkywibawa/barrier-properties-of-films-03-12


* Taken with atmospheric conditions on one side and zero O2 on the other.


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## Roosterboy (23/11/16)

Lyrebird_Cycles said:


> Because almost all plastics are permeable to oxygen or water vapour or both. Vacuum deposition of a microscopically thin layer of metal (aluminium) increases the barrier properties: as an example a typical PET (mylar) fim has an oxygen transmission rate* of 160 g / m2 / day while the same film when metallised has a transmission rate of 2.2 g / m2 / day, almost 100 times lower.
> 
> http://www.slideshare.net/henkywibawa/barrier-properties-of-films-03-12
> 
> ...


Well said


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## Lyrebird_Cycles (23/11/16)

Please note that you quoted this before I corrected a mistake: the transmission rates are in milligrams / m2 / day, not grams. I've fixed my post but of course I can't change yours.


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## SBOB (23/11/16)

Lyrebird_Cycles said:


> Because almost all plastics are permeable to oxygen or water vapour or both. Vacuum deposition of a microscopically thin layer of metal (aluminium) increases the barrier properties: as an example a typical PET (mylar) fim has an oxygen transmission rate* of 160 mg / m2 / day while the same film when metallised has a transmission rate of 2.2 mg / m2 / day, almost 100 times lower.
> 
> That means if you had 100g hops in a bag that was 100mm x 100mm a standard mylar film would admit 3.2 mg O2 / 100g hops / day, while the metallised film would admit 0.044 mg / 100g hops / day.
> 
> ...



from a quick google scholar search, doesnt that transmission rate differ with temperature though?

the numbers are less for foil mylar bags, but if you kept your 2 100g hop samples in the freezer for 2 years vacuum sealed in a normal vac seal bag and a foil bag, what would the measurable hop AA%, flavour and usability differences be?
I'm going to go out on a limb and guess 'not much'...


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## Lyrebird_Cycles (23/11/16)

Yes it's temperature dependent, as a rough figure transmission rates will about halve in a freezer compared to room temperature.

Re the diff between two foils: from experience packaging foods*, I'd say it's likely to be night and day and will mostly affect the aroma.

It's an easy test to do: put the same hops in a plain film bag and a metallised film bag, keep them a year then open them up.




* I used to work as a process engineer in a big food plant. We paid a lot of attention to barrier properties of packaging films.


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