# Guinness, Stout, Porter Recipe Needed. Help!



## smilinggilroy (26/5/10)

First off, I am very new to brewing, and wish to do my very first brew of beer. Have a ginger beer going at the moment, (a kit brought home by wife from supermarket spruced up to the max for flavour and body). 

I am a Guinness Draught fanatic (icy cold widget cans at home or a good on tap only) very, very rarely drink any other beer, and would like to knock out a brew that I will enjoy as much as the Guinness.

Reading though the forums, some say that this stuff is watery sh!t, but Sheaf and Guinness type stouts are a little too bitter and harsh for my liking. Would like to brew a style that is smooth, creamy, velvety, rich, and especially dry and full-bodied Oh, and blaaaack!

I know Guinness is charged with nitrogen so I am not going to get exactly the same result but would like to get as close to the taste as possible.

LHBS has this kit recipe:-

3kg X-TRACT BLACK, 1.5kg light liquid malt, 24g Goldings (dry hopped). Makes 18ltr.

Seen recipes with espresso coffee, liquorice, star anise and so on and on and.FFS.

Would like to use a kit as a base (being a newbie) and tweaking it up a bit, and would like to get it under way ASAP.

HELP!!......Please.


----------



## manticle (26/5/10)

smilinggilroy said:


> LHBS has this kit recipe:-
> 
> 3kg X-TRACT BLACK, 1.5kg light liquid malt, 24g Goldings (dry hopped). Makes 18ltr.
> 
> ...



Is there any kit base with that recipe? Basically the way it reads there is no bittering which means treacly syrup instead of beer.

Try a thomas coopers heritage irish stout, boil 500g pale malt extract with 5 litres water and 20g East Kent Goldings for 10 minutes. Add 200 g lactose, 500g dextrose and another 250g malt extract. Stir to dissolve and make up the kit as per instructions (except ferment around 20 degrees). Allow the brew to sit on the yeast an extra few days after it's finished. The lactose and malt will make the attenuation higher so don't freak out if you don't get to 1005. I would guess 1012 -1015 will be the finishing range.

Prime between 1.9 and 2.2 vol or is you use carb drops just use one per longneck and leave them for 4 weeks before trying.


----------



## Bribie G (26/5/10)

I reckon you can't go past a recipe based on a can of Coopers Stout. It's really the flagship of their range and it's not actually too bitter. I regularly make a two-can of Coopers with additions of dextrose and light dried malt extract and even with the two tins it doesn't come out much more bitter than Sheaf or Coopers commercial Stout. 

Now if you don't mind spending a bit extra, probably the best thing is to use a genuine Irish yeast - the liquid yeast Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale. It will do a far more authentic job than the Coopers Kit yeast. Ferment it at around 22 degrees like they do in Ireland. The other thing I would do is to steep some roasted barley, which is the Guinness trademark. You can't overdo it, Bradsbrew and I often use up to a kilo of the stuff  and it adds smoothness and roastiness without harsh bitterness or burn flavours. Then (flame suit on) use a kilo pack of Coopers Brew Enhancer 2 which contains a heading / foaming compound called maltodextrin. Many brewers would hold up their hands in horror, but for a kit brew it can definitely add smoothness, mouthfeel and a better creamier head. You should get an ABV of around 4.6% so not in the Sheaf territory of around 6.

Coopers Stout kit
Coopers Brew enhancer II
500g crushed roast barley, steeped in 4 L warm water at around 70 degrees for 30 mins and strained into a stockpot then boiled briefly to sanitize, and poured into the fermenter

Ferment with the Irish Ale Yeast at around 22 degrees (Guinness allow their yeast to climb to 25 degrees) - it finishes quick and you should be ready to bottle in about a week. 

edit: Manticle beat me to it, sure the Coopers Heritage should be even more tasty. 

BTW no affiliation with CraftBrewer B)


----------



## smilinggilroy (26/5/10)

Thanks for the info guys.

Bribies suggestion sounds the simplest for a first attempt, like the idea of the Irish yeast and steeping the barley shouldnt be a problem. Would using the East Kent Golding as well, as per Manticles suggestion, make any difference?? 

Will also make sure to leave it sit for an extra couple of days. Was going to bulk prime, and believe dextrose is used for this, and will also need help with ratios when I have the final figures.

Manticle mentions Coopers Heritage Irish Stout, is this the same as Coopers Brewmaster Irish Stout?

Thanks again.


----------



## manticle (26/5/10)

Same tin.


----------



## Fourstar (26/5/10)

personally i'd say to get your roast qualities only form malt, not form a tin.

get yourself a coopers ESB tin and a brew enhancer/malt blend.

Steep 600g of roast barley and 200g of carapils or light crystal (for more body) for 20 mins or so in 70deg water, strain/remove grain and boil this liquor for 15 mins and in the last 5 dump ino 30g of EKG.

dump all of this into your fermenter along with the ESB and brew enhancer/malt blend and top up to your expected volume (20-23L)

The roast palate will be 10x better than using just a base stout kit... trust me.


----------



## Dazza_devil (27/5/10)

Those recipes compare more to the Sweet Stout recipe in Jamil and Palmer's 'Brewing Classic Styles'
Their extract Dry Stout recipe uses only roasted unmalted Barley and flaked barley. They advise no use of caramel malts because of unfermentable sugars and caramel flavour. The flaked barley apparently adds mouthfeel but I'm not sure if you can use this effectively without doing a mash.

Edit - Perhaps it may pay to use a more highly attentuative yeast such as US05 if substituting the flaked barley with carapils or unfermentable sugars.


----------



## petesbrew (27/5/10)

The EK Goldings, or just goldings goes brilliantly in a stout.
I've had luck with the Coopers Stout before.
I'm trying to remember one of my stout recipes from Papazian's book.
Coopers Stout Tin
1kg Dark Dried Malt Extract (DDME)
110g Roast Barley (steeped) - have a search for the basic info on steeping grain. Very easy.
11g Goldings @ 60min
11g goldings @ 10min
Safale S-04 yeast
21 Litre batch?

Basically steep the cracked grain in a plunger, strain and rinse the grain getting all the colour out.
Boil that water(not the grain) for 60min in the biggest pot you've got, adding the goldings at the required times. Add the malt & kit about 10min before the end of boil to dissolve them and throw it all in the fermenter, & top up with water. (add yeast once it's cooled down to 20degrees).

PS. The X-TRACT is a 3kg hopped kit from TCB, Manticle. Havent' tried it myself.
PPS. Bribie's recipe looks great too. Nothing wrong with the Brew Enhancers when you're starting out.


----------



## ric004 (27/5/10)

Hi Everyone im new to posting so here goes.
Does any one Know about or tried adding sour
beer to the wort. this apparently is needed to create a true clone
of Guinness.
Any Truth any Ideas?


----------



## manticle (27/5/10)

Add lactic acid or use acidulated malt or do a sour mash would be my three guesses.

And google agrees: http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/arti...hing-techniques


----------



## hazard (27/5/10)

ric said:


> Hi Everyone im new to posting so here goes.
> Does any one Know about or tried adding sour
> beer to the wort. this apparently is needed to create a true clone
> of Guinness.
> Any Truth any Ideas?


I tried this once with my first AG, which was a stout. I followed the suggestion that is on many web sites:
that is, after the boil, keep aside about 2 litres of wort. After the bulk of wort has gone into the fermenter, put the spare wort in a bowl and cover loosely with a table cloth. Wait a week, then boil and add to fermenter.
After a week, I had a lovely blue-green moild on top, and the wort was bubbling with an audible hiss of escaping gas. Lovely!! I scraped off the mould, boiled gently for 5 min, covered and let it cool down, then added it to the fermenter.
Got 3rd palce at VicBrew with this beer, so it didn't hurt, though i can't say that it helped!


----------



## ric004 (27/5/10)

Cheers manticle good article.
Thanks hazard , glad you kept the beer great result if had been me and saw mold would have a dumped it. have to keep this in mind now.
Cheers


----------



## michaelcocks (27/5/10)

smilinggilroy said:


> First off, I am very new to brewing, and wish to do my very first brew of beer. Have a ginger beer going at the moment, (a kit brought home by wife from supermarket spruced up to the max for flavour and body).
> 
> I am a Guinness Draught fanatic (icy cold widget cans at home or a good on tap only) very, very rarely drink any other beer, and would like to knock out a brew that I will enjoy as much as the Guinness.
> 
> ...



If are new (or scared you might screw up) you could always take the short cut:

AHB sponsor (look up and to the far right ^) The brew Shop Sydney has a ready made clone brew..

http://www.thebrewshop.com.au/beerwort-con...s-c-120_78.html

Couldn't be easier just add water: No need for any boil: comes with a safale yeast or your choice (S04 or S05 both work quite well with this style) 

I'd always encourage a brewer to have a go and I am sure any of the above recipes will give you a great Stout - But just in case you are "time poor" or not comfortable (or want a contingency plan) 

This kit is quite nice. I have been brewing for 5 years and still have periods were I just put down a wort kit due to extreme time constraints.... 

(NO Affiliation BTW)

Although I have bought from Collin if I am over that side of town..


----------

