# Sukumaran and Chan



## Black Devil Dog (28/4/15)

So, after 10 years and many appeals, it looks as though the 2 ringleaders of the so called Bali 9, are going to finally be executed tonight, at midnight Indonesian time, 3am est.

Being shot by firing squad is a pretty brutal way to meet your death and it's impossible to imagine what these blokes and their families are going through right now.

I don't have much time for illicit drugs, drug users, dealers, smugglers, ringleaders or any one that is prepared to profit from the misery that heroin, in this case, can bring on families of addicts.

But killing these 2 and the others who are facing the same fate, is not going to change a single thing. Barbarism such as this, has no place in a civilised society.

I'll probably wake up around that time, I usually do, but at least when I close my eyes again, it won't be because of government sanctioned homicide.


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## wide eyed and legless (28/4/15)

I feel sorry for their parents knowing that they will be seeing them for the last time, that would be heart wrenching.


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/4/15)

Yeah well, you don't strap 9kg of heroin to your body and go casually walking thru airports with big signs saying Drugs = Death

I have no sympathy. They knew the risks. And the risk was being shot by firing squad if caught.


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## slcmorro (28/4/15)

Finally, I agree with something DBS says!

They knew the risks, they knew the rewards. They played with fire and now they're going to burn.


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/4/15)

slcmorro said:


> Finally, I agree with something DBS says!


This romance wont last.


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## mitch_au83 (28/4/15)

wide eyed and legless said:


> I feel sorry for their parents knowing that they will be seeing them for the last time, that would be heart wrenching.


 unfortunately there are so many more tragic deaths of people everyday that don't get the chance to say goodbye. Not saying it wouldn't be hard though. I hope I'm never in the situation they (the parents and family) and nor should I be in it


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## Lemon (28/4/15)

An interesting point was made OP, I think,
"In civilised society"
Does everybody think that when they travel overseas, that the same rules, or civilisation applies there, as it does at home?
I think many do. I'm sure a lot are surprised they need a passport to go to Bali.
It is not a first world country. Do not expect the same treatment, privileges and benefits that you have at home. Don't expect to behave the same way and certainly don't think you can get away with frankly disgusting and disrespectful behaviour wherever you go.

And I'm not being specific about Bali, or Indonesia. Although that is my starting point and reference.

Lemon


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/4/15)

The only reason I wont be going to Bali is because of all the other dickhead aussie tourists....


Sometime we really need to stand back and take a look at ourselves


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## DU99 (28/4/15)

Drugs where did they get it from..


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## spog (28/4/15)

I walked into the lounge earlier , the Ch 7 news was on and the said that the Sunrise show was going to air 1/2 an hour earlier than usual tomorrow morning to cover the story.
Well **** me what story would that be I wonder .

Oh , the execution of 2 people who tried to smuggle a heap of drugs in a country that has a death penalty for such crimes.


I wonder what's for tea tomorrow night.


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## labels (28/4/15)

Points in question are, are prisons meant to punish or rehabilitate? or maybe both. Secondly they were carrying drugs out of the country not in, so even if they had got away with it, no Indonesians would have been affected by these drugs. Will their executions change behavior of drug dealers?, statistically, the answer is no, the king-pins don't actually do the donkey work. Then there is justice Indonesian style, a number of people that were involved in the Bali bombings are now walking free - kill someone and stuff their body in a suitcase and you get 18 years. And lastly, should the AFP have tipped of the Indonesian authorities as they would have all been caught anyway, just on Australian soil instead.

I believe the executions are purely political, giving the new president a sense of power and maybe a boost in popularity as he comes across as pissweak - which he is, these deaths will give some strength and some clout (maybe). It is also widely accepted that Indonesia is deeply corrupted from the top down as has been exposed by the bribe allegations of the judges involved with the case.


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## neal32 (28/4/15)

Yawn.

I'm for the 100% decriminalization of drugs worldwide, but this isn't an issue about drugs. This is a group of people that gambled. Sure as shit if they never got caught they would show zero remorse, they would be spending their cash right now with no remorse. They knew the consequences as I know the consequences to putting my life savings on black on roulette at the casino.


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## BJB (28/4/15)

They tried to smuggle drugs through a country with laws everyone knows, the drugs were destined for Australia where people and families would have been affected and in most cases very badly. They did this for one reason, greed nothing else. If they got away with would they do it again? Had they done it before?
A truly awful way to come to your end but it was a choice and risk they took.
I hope it is as painless as it can be for them, I think it will be more painful and for much longer for their families.


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## Smokomark (28/4/15)

Good to see the drug dealing scum getting what they deserve. I'm happy they didn't land 9 kg of heroin and destroy countless lives and kill a few from overdoses. They knew the risks. No sympathy here. Scum


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## Maheel (28/4/15)

hurry up and do it so we can stop seeing their faces on the news and glorifying what they were doing...

they did the crime... and new the risk


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## QldKev (28/4/15)

Take the 9 lives to spare many


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## bradsbrew (28/4/15)

I dont get why so many people are defending the "poor junkies" that may have died from the smack that was entering the country. There is more than enough education in this country on the effects and addiction of drugs. It is all about life choices.


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## Adr_0 (28/4/15)

bradsbrew said:


> I dont get why so many people are defending the "poor junkies" that may have died from the smack that was entering the country. There is more than enough education in this country on the effects and addiction of drugs. It is all about life choices.


As long as they keep bringing 1275 into the country I'll be chewing it. 

I think most of us are lucky that we have everything we need around us. Although life choices probably contribute a lot, I get the impression spiritual isolation drives a lot of addiction... With the other side of the coin being availability. 

I think if they were going to give these guys the death penalty, they should have done it in the first six months, not 10-11 years later when they are potentially rehabilitated. That's a cluster if I ever saw one...


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## Weizguy (28/4/15)

Is it not the case that our government knew what was going on and yet allowed them to leave the country and tipped off the authorities, and is therefore responsible for where the penalty was imposed.

Shame, if that's true.

I know they should have been aware of the risks, and probably got away with it many times before, but is death the best option, after so long?

Scum? - possibly. Idiots/dupes? - definitely. Criminal geniuses/ringleaders - questionable. Poor stupid bastards? Yeah.


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/4/15)

Maybe they had trouble reading


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## Cocko (28/4/15)

The death penalty is completely murder. If you do X we have the right to kill you! - NO ONE has the right to take another's life.

That said, laws [apparently] create a more civil society - if that is the countries laws, do the crime do the time...

Blah Blah Blah......

The media hype has us all talking/typing about it, depends what talk back, paper or news show you listen to, to influence the view you have been fed on it.

Kill the ******* media I say.


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## manticle (28/4/15)

So much hate for 21 year olds doing something stupid.
Guess we're all fucked.


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## Cocko (28/4/15)

Really? Strapping kilos of H to you is a common young mans error? In a country that has the death penalty?

Well, I guess education and up brining is now to blame.


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## manticle (28/4/15)

No I'm not suggesting it's just a young man's error.
I'm not sure people need to be so self righteous is all. Maybe I'm just not into black and white.
On one hand we have young, dumb fuckwits who think about as far ahead as the next street and see an easy way to make cash and live the good life. Consequences not considered, whether their own or the poor/stupid/whatever saps that take the stuff .
On the other you have very explicit laws and punishments for such crimes, possibly superseding the punishments for arguably far worse crimes.
In the middle, you have the whole war on drugs vs legalisation debate, coupled with the morality of capital punishment.
Not something I believe an intelligent person can summarise as 'suffer you morons, get off my news channel'.


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## madpierre06 (28/4/15)

By all reports they have been rehabilitated, accepted and embraced a faith. If so, there is every probability they have a reasonably accepting frame of mind for what is going to happen and have made peace with their maker.

Living under a death sentence for 10 years will cause any 21 year old to grow up real quick. As far as 'they knew the consequences', if I recall correctly I supposedly knew the potential pitfalls of much that I did at that age but it didn't stop me doing seriously idiotic shit....I recall reading somewhere that at that age blokes haven't developed a 'comprehension/recognition/consequence' thoughjt process, which makes us stupidly 'fearless' which is why at that age we are ideal cannon fodder. For the likes of the main man behind them who did get off scot free. Mere sacrificial pawns, as is usually the case in circumstances such as this. Send off a couple dozen, if I lose a few then the profits the others generate still net me a decent quid.


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## Doubleplugga (28/4/15)

They knew what the penalty was. I couldn't care less for them. Hope they get it over with soon as I am sick of hearing people whinge about it in the media.


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## Smokomark (28/4/15)

i'm just happy my teenage children and their friends didn't get exposed to the drugs they where trying to import.

It;s not like they were trying to bring in a big bag of weed.


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## manticle (28/4/15)

Weed, alcohol all good. Alcohol is a harmless drug after all.
Bet you'd all cry if a 20 yr old home brewer in saudi got imprisoned for ten years, then shot through the face and chest.

Yes they should have been smarter.


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## Smokomark (28/4/15)

Same same but different.


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## manticle (28/4/15)

Not that different. Hell, people swim in crocodile infested waters, despite the signs. No surprise when they get eaten but I don't need to be glad or have zero empathy for them or their parents.


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## madpierre06 (28/4/15)

smokomark said:


> i'm just happy my teenage children and their friends didn't get exposed to the drugs they where trying to import.
> 
> It;s not like they were trying to bring in a big bag of weed.


And I agree with you totally there...but the damage caused to those of your/my children's generation by either themselves or parents caught up in compulsive gambling is just as great...and the govt. will NEVER give up on that little pony. And it's entirely legal. I still go back to the 'self at 21 ' test for capability to make sensible and rational decisions based on all available evidence....some can, fewer can't.


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## Cocko (28/4/15)

manticle said:


> So much hate for 21 year olds doing something stupid.
> Guess we're all fucked.





manticle said:


> No I'm not suggesting it's just a young man's error.
> 
> Not something I believe an intelligent person can summarise as 'suffer you morons, get off my news channel'.



Well you sort of did suggest that.... anywho, agree with you.

I think it is not a case of get off my news channel but more so, media should be a little careful with their influence and their desire for rating etc.... the 2 prisoners parents were near crushed today by media while trying to see their own child prior to losing them by execution. Anyway, this isn't about the media, it is about what we know form the news....

I mean, it is about if someone should make the decision that another person should die, I mean, it is about if you break a law whether you should pay the penalty, I mean... Well, I don't know what I mean. I just wanna brew beer - is that illegal here?


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## slcmorro (28/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> This romance wont last.


If you keep making sensical statements, who knows what could happen!


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/4/15)

slcmorro said:


> If you keep making sensical statements, who knows what could happen!


You better brush up on your TISM


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## Fat Bastard (28/4/15)

I'm just glad home brewing is legal here, otherwise we'd all be in the "Aussie Home Brewers, distillers and Crystal Meth Cooks" website.
The death penalty is state sanctioned murder. And in this instance it's murder for no greater reason than some great political desire to "save face" and appear "tough on drugs" to what is seen as the last bastion of European colonialism in the region.


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## DJ_L3ThAL (29/4/15)

I reckon there are far bigger things to get in a tanty about. No candle light vigils by the PM etc for rape/murder victims on our home soil, who were *innocent*. Not saying I believe in death penalty but I think the actions and responses from our government over this is way out of proportion to their efforts on other matters.


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## AndrewQLD (29/4/15)

While it's all very well blaming the AFP for doing their job this guy deserves a lot of the blame as well http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/bali-nine-execution-fallout-barrister-bob-myers-says-afp-has-blood-on-its-hands/story-fnh81fz8-1227326038120

What kind of a Barrister is so ignorant of the law that he dobs in someone who hasn't done anything yet and hopes that the federal police will break laws and policies to stop a family friend from travelling overseas.

Lets face it, if he was defending someone who had been detained under those circumstances you can guarantee he would be crying false arrest and abuse of police process.


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## Grainer (29/4/15)

RIP


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## neal32 (29/4/15)

smokomark said:


> i'm just happy my teenage children and their friends didn't get exposed to the drugs they where trying to import.
> 
> It;s not like they were trying to bring in a big bag of weed.


If you don't think your teenagers can get any drug they want, then you're severely ignorant. If you think that prohibition is an effective deterrent to the availability of drugs, you're severely ignorant. 

If you teenager has $50 and either a friend or an internet connection; if they want heroin, they can get it.

Also as for 'drugs' I would happily argue that other than Methamphetamine, Alcohol is easily the most destructive drug there is. So unless you're a teetotaler, you might want to get down from your high horse.


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## Black Devil Dog (29/4/15)

AndrewQLD said:


> While it's all very well blaming the AFP for doing their job this guy deserves a lot of the blame as well http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/bali-nine-execution-fallout-barrister-bob-myers-says-afp-has-blood-on-its-hands/story-fnh81fz8-1227326038120
> 
> What kind of a Barrister is so ignorant of the law that he dobs in someone who hasn't done anything yet and hopes that the federal police will break laws and policies to stop a family friend from travelling overseas.
> 
> Lets face it, if he was defending someone who had been detained under those circumstances you can guarantee he would be crying false arrest and abuse of police process.


No amount of scrubbing will remove the blood from his hands.


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## Dave70 (29/4/15)

Australias second largest trading partner in the middle east is Saudi Arabia, around 1.1 billion per year. A country that still executes citizens for such heinous crimes as homosexuality, adultery and witchcraft, just to name a few. 
Nobody's out there calling Salman bin Abdulaziz a ****, not like Joko Widodo, what a cold asshole _that_ bloke is. Why aren't we jumping up and down, withdrawing our ambassador and closing our Saudi embassy in disgust? 
Do you imagine we might boycott exports New Zealand if that's how they rolled? Is a gay Arab man's life worth less than an Australian ex-drug dealer? What a load of double standard horse shit.

I hate to echo the conservative tones of 'these guys new what they were doing', but you cant argue with the facts. Let them off the hook, and the precedent has been cast that Indos hard drug laws - right or wrong - can be circumvented if subject to enough lobbying and treats. 

As they say, all life's a wager. These blokes took the punt and rolled snake eyes. Now their loved ones are left paying their debt.

And is it to obvious to notice, with the exception of China, countries who still employ state sanctioned murder also tend to be the most religious - and vice versa.


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## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

Dont agree with the death penalty but they knew the consequences and paid the price- so be it.
But for fucks sake Abbott you clown, even if the Indo government were arrogant show pony ***** about the whole episode, killing off our political relationship with our closest neighbour, one of our biggest trading partners and the worlds 3rd biggest population over 2 drug smugglers is ******* stupid- even for you.


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## bookers (29/4/15)

Droopy Brew said:


> Dont agree with the death penalty but they knew the consequences and paid the price- so be it.
> But for fucks sake Abbott you clown, even if the Indo government were arrogant show pony c*nts about the whole episode, killing off our political relationship with our closest neighbour, one of our biggest trading partners and the worlds 3rd biggest population over 2 drug smugglers is ******* stupid- even for you.


I'm not sure you got your point across, anything else you need to get off your chest


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## Dave70 (29/4/15)

Droopy Brew said:


> Dont agree with the death penalty but they knew the consequences and paid the price- so be it.
> But for fucks sake Abbott you clown, even if the Indo government were arrogant show pony c*nts about the whole episode, killing off our political relationship with our closest neighbour, one of our biggest trading partners and the worlds 3rd biggest population over 2 drug smugglers is ******* stupid- even for you.


Must be an extremely awkward situation for a government I'd imagine when a third world country whos economy / infrastructure you've been pumping to the tune 250 million odd per year wont do you a solid.
I can just imagine Tony slamming the phone down, grabbing a few pencils from the cup in his desk and snapping them in half.


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## Ducatiboy stu (29/4/15)

Abbott is playing the popular card, purely to save his own ass. He will do anything to get the masses to like him


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## Bomber Watson (29/4/15)

.001 of a gram is a cap. 1 cap = 1 hit.

8.7kg of heroin is 870,000 hits of heroin that would have been on our streets. 870,000 potential victims, millions of potential victims' families and friends paying the cost, they showed no remorse upon doing this and would not have shown any remorse for the loss of the families of those victims.

This was not Harold and khumars first go either, it was there third run, so how much did they bring back on the first two?

They got more than they deserved. Our government trying to stop it was ridiculous. People sooking and wining about it is ridiculous.

Claiming to have found Christ is a total crock of shit. Claiming to have been rehabilitated is a total crock of shit. Six months and they would have been doing it again.

Honestly there not even worth remembering with discussions such as this.

Peace.


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## Dave70 (29/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> He will do anything to get the masses to like him


This bloke seems happy enough.
Maby he needs a national 'left hook Tony day'? (public holiday or course).


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## WarmerBeer (29/4/15)

In other news, 5000 people died in an earthquake in Nepal this week. But, they're not Australian, so they don't matter.


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## bradsbrew (29/4/15)

Dave70 said:


> This bloke seems happy enough.
> Maby he needs a national 'left hook Tony day'? (public holiday or course).


Best advertisement for the need of head gear I have seen.


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## wide eyed and legless (29/4/15)

Dave70 said:


> This bloke seems happy enough.
> Maby he needs a national 'left hook Tony day'? (public holiday or course).


That reminds me.


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## Liam_snorkel (29/4/15)

It's widely accepted that the death penalty doesn't work as a deterrence. Drug syndicates will _always_ be able to find someone stupid enough or desperate enough to be a mule.
Indo had a moratorium on the death penalty and looked like moving towards abolishing capital punishment along with the rest of the civilised world. The AFP wouldn't have gifted these arrests to them if they had thought there was a possibility of Australian citizens being executed. This was made clear at the time. These executions are more about keeping up appearances as being tough on drugs (within Indonesia) rather than actually doing anything about the problem.


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## Leviathan (29/4/15)

“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, _ The Fellowship of the Ring _


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## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

bookers said:


> I'm not sure you got your point across, anything else you need to get off your chest


Yes in fact, I dont much care for Lagers. Ahh, better.


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## Funk then Funk1 (29/4/15)

AndrewQLD said:


> While it's all very well blaming the AFP for doing their job this guy deserves a lot of the blame as well http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/bali-nine-execution-fallout-barrister-bob-myers-says-afp-has-blood-on-its-hands/story-fnh81fz8-1227326038120
> 
> What kind of a Barrister is so ignorant of the law that he dobs in someone who hasn't done anything yet and hopes that the federal police will break laws and policies to stop a family friend from travelling overseas.
> 
> Lets face it, if he was defending someone who had been detained under those circumstances you can guarantee he would be crying false arrest and abuse of police process.


7. Policy for cooperation with foreign law enforcement agencies
The AFP is required to consider relevant factors before providing information to foreign law enforcement agencies if it is aware the provision of information is likely to result in the prosecution of an identified person for an offence carrying the death penalty.

Senior AFP management (Manager /SES-level 1 and above) must consider prescribed factors before approving provision of assistance in matters with possible death penalty implications, including: 
 the purpose of providing the information and the reliability of that information 
 the seriousness of the suspected criminal activity 
 the nationality, age and personal circumstances of the person involved 
 the potential risks to the person, and other persons, in providing or not providing the information 
 Australia’s interest in promoting and securing cooperation from overseas agencies in combatting crime 
 the degree of risk to the person in providing the information, including the likelihood the death penalty will be imposed

From the AFP's own guideline, "AFP National Guideline on international police-to-police assistance in death penalty situations "


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## Spiesy (29/4/15)

I don't agree or condone with capital punishment, but I think it's disrespectful of our Government to be grandstanding and pressuring a foreign country to alter the outcomes of a legal trial that follows the laws of said country.

It's a can of worms, no doubt. I wouldn't feel the same about the Government stepping in to defend someone accused of adultery and stoned to death - there's a lot of grey here.


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## Funk then Funk1 (29/4/15)

Spiesy said:


> I don't agree or condone with capital punishment, but I think it's disrespectful of our Government to be grandstanding and pressuring a foreign country to alter the outcomes of a legal trial that follows the laws of said country.
> 
> It's a can of worms, no doubt. I wouldn't feel the same about the Government stepping in to defend someone accused of adultery and stoned to death - there's a lot of grey here.


Yet the Indonesian government have a team that lobby and pressure foreign governments, "to alter the outcomes of a legal trial that follows the laws of said country",  for their citizens who are on death row in other countries (even for drug offences)


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## Mardoo (29/4/15)

Every country lobbies other countries for its own best interests, usually regardless of its own behavior. Take the U.S. pressuring other countries about climate change. Or Australia for that matter.


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## Dave70 (29/4/15)

Spiesy said:


> I don't agree or condone with capital punishment, but I think it's disrespectful of our Government to be grandstanding and pressuring a foreign country to alter the outcomes of a legal trial that follows the laws of said country.
> 
> It's a can of worms, no doubt.* I wouldn't feel the same about the Government stepping in to defend someone accused of adultery and stoned to death - there's a lot of grey here*.


In that instance, even if the accused was put to death in the most _humane_ fashion possible, no grey there for me. Theocratic barbarism in full gallop. Why is the world at large not saying enough's enough?

We're fortunate indeed to live in a society where one can, even if you punch and kill some random passer by, plea bargain murder down to a lesser offence and spare all concerned the hassle of a trial and be out in 5 five good behavior.
Another grey area that I find black and white.

The law truly is an ass.


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## mckenry (29/4/15)

Droopy Brew said:


> Dont agree with the death penalty but they knew the consequences and paid the price- so be it.
> But for fucks sake Abbott you clown, even if the Indo government were arrogant show pony c*nts about the whole episode, killing off our political relationship with our closest neighbour, one of our biggest trading partners and the worlds 3rd biggest population over 2 drug smugglers is ******* stupid- even for you.


Are you just making that shit up or did Koshi say this on the 'Good morning Sunrise Womans Day Show'? They are not one of our biggest trading partners. They arent even in the top 10. They're 12th, and our 11th largest export market. They make more from us than we do from them. They might be the worlds third biggest population at 250 million, but even New Zealand, with their tiny 4.4 million are worth more $ as a two way trading partner to us.
Killing off political relationships can be precarious, but with the backing of the civilised world, we hold the cards here. We are worth ~$10 billion income to them. They are worth about $6 billion to us.
I am not pro Tony, but I believe he has handled this well.


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## AndrewQLD (29/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Abbott is playing the popular card, purely to save his own ass. He will do anything to get the masses to like him


A little one-eyed there aren't you?
http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/labor-leaders-condemn-executions/story-e6frfku9-1227325971941
Looks like Shorten has also gauged the public attitude and is playing the popular card.

they are all tarred with the same brush


LABOR will push the federal government to take further retaliatory action against Indonesia in response to the executions of Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran.

OPPOSITION Leader Bill Shorten said it was important Jakarta understood Australia's outrage against the "senseless" executions overnight.
"We will talk with the government in coming days about other responses," he told reporters in Melbourne on Wednesday, adding Labor supported the decision to recall Australia's ambassador.


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## pat_00 (29/4/15)

Funk then Funk1 said:


> Yet the Indonesian government have a team that lobby and pressure foreign governments, "to alter the outcomes of a legal trial that follows the laws of said country",  for their citizens who are on death row in other countries (even for drug offences)


You are talking about the nanny in saudi?

That was done within some strange islamic pseudo-legal framework. Not saying it's right, or that they are not hypocrites. Just that there are differences in the relations between those two muslim nations than there are between Indonesia and non muslim nations. Messy stuff.


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## pat_00 (29/4/15)

Just in case the can of worms wasn't big enough.


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## pcmfisher (29/4/15)

I wonder if in the end they regretted doing it or just being caught?


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## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

mckenry said:


> Are you just making that shit up or did Koshi say this on the 'Good morning Sunrise Womans Day Show'? They are not one of our biggest trading partners. They arent even in the top 10. They're 12th, and our 11th largest export market. They make more from us than we do from them. They might be the worlds third biggest population at 250 million, but even New Zealand, with their tiny 4.4 million are worth more $ as a two way trading partner to us.
> Killing off political relationships can be precarious, but with the backing of the civilised world, we hold the cards here. We are worth ~$10 billion income to them. They are worth about $6 billion to us.
> I am not pro Tony, but I believe he has handled this well.


You tell me if I made that shit up - they are the 3rd biggest population, one of our closest neighbours ( and arguably most important as the corridor through which people smuggling and terrorism needs to be halted), and are 12th out of over 100 trading partners ( I said one of, not the biggest). If you cant see the relationship is important then you have your head buried shoulder deep up you arse. 
As I said, I dont agree with capital punishment however it is well known this country has it in place (the AFP knew it when they dobbed them in) and we have a right to oppose it as they have the right to implement it. However putting the plight of 2 drug smugglers higher on the list than International relations with a very important regional player is nothing more than stupidity and public grandstanding. Fact is Tony got a dose of the shits because the Indos weren't threatened by him. He is a man who is used to getting his way through intimidation and now he has spat the dummy because the Indos stood firm. 

If he is so ******* outraged at the violation of civil rights he should have recalled ambassadors from China, India, PNG, Saudi Arabia even the good ole US of A. Hell even Australia still lock up people with no charge for an indefinite amount of time for the crime of fleeing persecution and death.

Nup, hypocritical, ignorant dummy spitting is all it is. 


Edit- I stand corrected on the population- they are the 4th biggest (USA the 3rd), however that doesnt change the crux of the argument ie they are kinda important.


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## mckenry (29/4/15)

Droopy Brew said:


> You tell me if I made that shit up - they are the 3rd biggest population, one of our closest neighbours ( and arguably most important as the corridor through which people smuggling and terrorism needs to be halted), and are 12th out of over 100 trading partners ( I said one of, not the biggest). If you cant see the relationship is important then you have your head buried shoulder deep up you arse.


Yep, you did.

Sure its an important relationship as far as being neighbours goes. Thats all. They need us more than we need them. Thats how important the relationship is.

I realise you said 'one of our biggest', that's why I said "They are not one of our biggest".

The top 10 make up ~430 billion worth of trade. Indonesian trade is only $16b which is $4b in their favour.
We can afford to lose them if it happens.

Every previous government has been 'outraged' including todays opposition. It just happened on Tonys watch. Labor, Greens, Palmer United, whoever was in power would be expected to do the same, whether you or I agree with it.


----------



## hoppy2B (29/4/15)

"The biggest criminals are in parliament." 

I remember the old man saying that when I was a kid.


----------



## Black Devil Dog (29/4/15)

Much of this is about showing the Indonesian people that the Indonesian government is being tough on drugs. Apparently it's a popular policy over there.

The Filipino woman who was also going to be executed alongside these blokes, was given an eleventh hour reprieve. There was a lot of public sympathy for her over there leading up to the executions and a sceptic could suspect that that decision was made because it would be popular.


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## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

I actually felt sick when i woke up this morning. but definitely not as sick as chan and sukamaran. Honestly, they knew what they were doing. They knew the risks. It wasnt the first time they smuggled drugs through Bali-Australia. GOODRIDDANCE to the pair! May the news have something better on in the next few weeks.

But I do feel for their families.


----------



## madpierre06 (29/4/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Much of this is about showing the Indonesian people that the Indonesian government is being tough on drugs. Apparently it's a popular policy over there.
> 
> The Filipino woman who was also going to be executed alongside these blokes, was given an eleventh hour reprieve. There was a lot of public sympathy for her over there leading up to the executions and a sceptic could suspect that that decision was made because it would be popular.


And it wouldn't surprise me if her reprieve had a little to do with a raised middle finger to Abbott saying "we can make the choice as and when we choose as to whether they live or die".


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## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

No I didn't make anything up Macca- they are fact (aside from the mistake of 3rd vs 4th) how you interpret it is different but certainly not made up. 

I think the figures are also skewed drastically by our mineral wealth. The Indos are our biggest consumer of wheat by a fair margin and are up there with some of our other agricultural products. While our GDP may not take a serious hit due to our mineral wealth, the agricultural sector will certainly suffer if sanctions are brought in. Our position of cooperation with Indo to reduce the influx of people smugglers, drug smugglers and terrorists is now weaker as well, its not all about economics.

This happened on Tony's watch but it was very much of his own making. In fact both sides- Australia and Indonesia have used these 2 blokes as pawns as a show of political strength. Typical diversionary tactic- when Tony's polls were plummeting it coincided nicely with the impending executions. So a media circus broke out fanned by this government to garner support because they were showing strength. Conversely the Indos were doing the same- a weak government trying to endear itself to the public by shows of strength. And the more the Australian government pushed , the more the Widodo grandstanded such as the military overkill with transportation to the island, the media scrum yesterday with the poor families, the refusal to allow a priest at the executions etc. All special treatment for the 2 Australians because it made Widodo look strong.

I think Abbott picked this as his show of strength and because he had a burning desire to say **** you to the Indos after he had to eat humble pie over the spying incident (which of course was not his fault but was found out under his watch). The more he pushed, the more the Indos pushed. Had this been handled like it should have been at the start, calmly and diplomatically, the pressure to do something like withdraw the ambassador ( Abbott backed himself into a corner) would have been considerably less. Chan and Sukkamaren would still be dead- nothing was going to change that, but our relations would not be up shit creek. I dare say we would also be on a stronger footing to persuade Indonesia to do away with the death penalty in the future.

The only politician to come out of this whole sorry saga with more respect is Julie Bishop.


----------



## Dave70 (29/4/15)

mckenry said:


> We can afford to lose them if it happens


If 'loosing them' also implies withdrawing funding for schools and education so the next generation of Indo kids get nothing but the koran, sharia and wahhabisim hammered into their skulls I'd rather 'keep them'.


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

How about we stop wasting decent bandwidth and talk about something home-brew related? God Forbid!


----------



## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

madpierre06 said:


> And it wouldn't surprise me if her reprieve had a little to do with a raised middle finger to Abbott saying "we can make the choice as and when we choose as to whether they live or die".


Yeah wouldn't surprise me either. Although I did hear on the radio that a drug king pin had come forward with evidence relation to her case.


----------



## Black Devil Dog (29/4/15)

madpierre06 said:


> And it wouldn't surprise me if her reprieve had a little to do with a raised middle finger to Abbott saying "we can make the choice as and when we choose as to whether they live or die".


That too.



Droopy Brew said:


> Yeah wouldn't surprise me either. Although I did hear on the radio that a drug king pin had come forward with evidence relation to her case.


I heard that also, but the sceptic in me takes a bit to convince that drug king pins are so benevolent.


----------



## tavas (29/4/15)

The replies and postulating from both our Govt and Opposition, and Indo govt would have been carefully planned and scripted for months to show an appropriate reaction expected of either side. The reality is the politics of both our countries is far greater than just 2 bloke who did the wrong thing and got caught.

I have no doubt that there have been genuine and empathetic pleas from our govt and opposition but the end result was never in doubt and the Indo govt were never going to lose face. It would not matter if it was Abbott, Shorten, Rudd, Gillard, Howard etc.

What pisses me off are the "social commentators" and dickheads like Peter Heliar, Koshie and the social media Rent a Crowd who think they have a right to interfere in world politics, and think that everything is so black and white.


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




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## wide eyed and legless (29/4/15)

_WALLACE_ said:


> How about we stop wasting decent bandwidth and talk about something home-brew related? God Forbid!


Well your last four posts wasted a bit of bandwidth and they wasn't brew related.


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




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## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Well your last four posts wasted a bit of bandwidth and they wasn't brew related.


it was good though.


----------



## wide eyed and legless (29/4/15)

No not good, it was sick.


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## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

wide eyed and legless said:


> No not good, it was sick.


The Minority Opinion.


----------



## lukiferj (29/4/15)

Wow reading this thread was even worse than I expected. Makes me remember why I don't spend that much time here anymore.


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## Droopy Brew (29/4/15)

Mems... providing expression for those without wit or sentence structure since 2014.


----------



## spog (29/4/15)

manticle said:


> So much hate for 21 year olds doing something stupid.
> Guess we're all fucked.


nah not me, I'm 51 and have never done anything near as stupid as they have.
Fucked, no we all are not,giving an F takes but a moment of anybody's time and these morons didn't give one when they made THE decision to break the law, and CHOOSE to attempt to smuggle drugs and profit from it.
Did they give any thought to the misery of the families of their targets.
I would say no.
Cheers...spog...


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## zappa (29/4/15)

I'm not racist, but...


----------



## Camo6 (29/4/15)

The only ones to win from this whole situation is the ******* media. Makes me sick. Nineteen years ago, almost to the day, 35 _innocent_ people were shot dead by a nutter who's probably getting off in his cell while he reads this on the internet sponsored by our taxes. But that's old news.


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)




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## HBHB (29/4/15)

I can understand why this is on everyone's minds. I mean it's all over the Internet news, TV, radios, newspapers and social media. What I can't understand is why are these 2 so special?

Indonesian troops and police have shot, hacked to death, hanged, skewered and dragged around villages tied to vehicles, burned alive and mutilated - a half million yup, 500,000 non drug running, innocent men, women and children on our doorstep in West Papua over recent years. 

Why isn't anyone interested in them?

Why isn't someone shedding a tear for them?

Why isn't the media turning that into a shit storm?


----------



## Camo6 (29/4/15)

HBHB said:


> I can understand why this is on everyone's minds. I mean it's all over the Internet news, TV, radios, newspapers and social media. What I can't understand is why are these 2 so special?


Sounds like you've answered your own question.


----------



## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

HBHB said:


> I can understand why this is on everyone's minds. I mean it's all over the Internet news, TV, radios, newspapers and social media. What I can't understand is why are these 2 so special?
> 
> Indonesian troops and police have shot, hacked to death, hanged, skewered and dragged around villages tied to vehicles, burned alive and mutilated - a half million yup, 500,000 non drug running, innocent men, women and children on our doorstep in West Papua over recent years.
> 
> ...


You mean rapists, murderers and peadophiles? they deserve to die aswell!


----------



## spog (29/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Yeah well, you don't strap 9kg of heroin to your body and go casually walking thru airports with big signs saying Drugs = Death
> 
> I have no sympathy. They knew the risks. And the risk was being shot by firing squad if caught.


And post number 3 puts the whole topic/subject into honest perspective .....law.


----------



## Liam_snorkel (29/4/15)




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## MartinOC (29/4/15)

Geez, Guys! This thread has almost (ALMOST....!) distracted me away from THE most important thing happening today.. It's THE BLOCK auction tonight!

Get with the program, people!!

Don't forget to Twit-Face-Space-Book your arses-off in order to get your comment on TV!

After all, fame only lasts 15 minutes...


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## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (29/4/15)

Liam_snorkel said:


> Untitled.png


where's the fun in that???


----------



## jlm (29/4/15)

zappa said:


> I'm not racist, but...


Yeah, Australians shit me too. 

Remember when they shot that Amrozi cnut? I'd wager half of my wang that the majority of the "Shoot the druggy bastards" crew would've been all "Don't shoot the bastard......Its what he wants....Let him rot" at the time.


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## Eagleburger (29/4/15)

Maybe if TA gave Indo 600mil per month he could have changed Joko's mind. Why 600mil you say? To pay welfare to all the parents that lost a sponsor of their old age. Welfare for the kids that will grow up without a parent to provide all those things a parent does( I could go into great detail).Treatment for the addicts themselves. Indo isnt a country full of rich tax payers like Australia. It doesnt have welfare like civilised countries like Australia. Thank goodness we are all keen to pay for such things.

So how about, who is ready to give extra? "Put your money where your mouth is" 

My personal opinion, the death penalty is the only punishment that is not soft.


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## slcmorro (29/4/15)

After doing nothing for almost 10 years, keyboard warriors have now taken to social media to condemn Indonesia’s executions of Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran.
“I’ve always been against the death penalty,” one self-righteous Facebook user stated. “Sure, I didn’t go out and protest or actually do anything to prevent their deaths, but I just posted a generic status about how capital punishment is barbaric, so I feel like a good person.”

The Facebook user revealed that his status would almost certainly change Indonesia’s stance on the death penalty. “I could have written a letter to the Indonesian government or taken to the streets to publicly express my outrage, but that would have required me actually doing something,” he explained. “Besides, my status got 20 ‘likes’, so I’m basically a freedom fighter anyway.”


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## Ducatiboy stu (29/4/15)

If it wasnt for the media making something out of it and whipping up a frenzy then no one would care. What is it with the media that can turn 2 convicted ( busted red handed ) criminals into hero's. Look at Shappell Corby...no one would have given a **** if the media couldn't see some ratings in it

Its only slightly fucked up that we turn criminals into hero's for the sake of some fame and ratings.


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## manticle (29/4/15)

Heroes mate. I can understand most of the perspectives thus far offered but I won't stand for the death of the apostrophe.


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## spog (29/4/15)

MartinOC said:


> Geez, Guys! This thread has almost (ALMOST....!) distracted me away from THE most important thing happening today.. It's THE BLOCK auction tonight!
> 
> Get with the program, people!!
> 
> ...


The Block auction tonight ? Ahh,as bad as all the coverage of this topic. Of which I have participated in.


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## meathead (30/4/15)

My beer has been fermenting for 4 hours and there are no bubbles is my brew ruined?


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## Dave70 (30/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> If it wasnt for the media making something out of it and whipping up a frenzy then no one would care. What is it with the media that can turn 2 convicted ( busted red handed ) criminals into hero's. Look at Shappell Corby...no one would have given a **** if the media couldn't see some ratings in it
> 
> Its only slightly fucked up that we turn criminals into hero's for the sake of some fame and ratings.


In the end, its art that suffers most..











meathead said:


> My beer has been fermenting for 4 hours and there are no bubbles is my brew ruined?


Draw off a small portion into a pyrex bowl, place it in plain sight of the fermenter and boil it.
This should send a clear message to the remaining yeast that slacking off will not be tolerated.


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## mje1980 (30/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> If it wasnt for the media making something out of it and whipping up a frenzy then no one would care. What is it with the media that can turn 2 convicted ( busted red handed ) criminals into hero's. Look at Shappell Corby...no one would have given a **** if the media couldn't see some ratings in it
> 
> Its only slightly fucked up that we turn criminals into hero's for the sake of some fame and ratings.


I wonder if the media hadn't kept the story in the headlines for so long if they may have ended up getting a life sentence ( which may have been reduced over time ). 

It's almost as if the constant media attention forced the hand of the indos. 

Probably not but I dunno.


Tragic all round really.


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## tavas (30/4/15)

mje1980 said:


> I wonder if the media hadn't kept the story in the headlines for so long if they may have ended up getting a life sentence ( which may have been reduced over time ).
> 
> It's almost as if the constant media attention forced the hand of the indos.
> 
> ...


I tend to agree. The Indonesian Govt won't want to lose face. If no one had said anything, Australia may have been able to negotiate life or extradition, but with the media frenzy and Social Media Rent a Crowd keeping it alive, there was never a chance.


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## malt and barley blues (30/4/15)

Why bother having any news at all, its usually bad anyway.


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## malt and barley blues (30/4/15)

bradsbrew said:


> I dont get why so many people are defending the "poor junkies" that may have died from the smack that was entering the country. There is more than enough education in this country on the effects and addiction of drugs. It is all about life choices.


Brad sums it up nicely, no one forces the junkies to start taking drugs, they know the risks just as the Bali 9 knew the risks,being young and stupid they all think they can get away with it, if there wasn't any junkies there wouldn't be pushers or mules.


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## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

manticle said:


> Heroes mate. I can understand most of the perspectives thus far offered but I won't stand for the death of the apostrophe.


Sorr'y


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## tavas (30/4/15)

Anyway, this is all Axl's fault. Teach him for being late:
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/axl_rose_writes_letter_to_indonesian_president_to_stop_executions_is_late.html


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## Black Devil Dog (30/4/15)

Is that for real? Kinda funny if it is.


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## manticle (30/4/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Sorr'y



S'OK


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## Dave70 (30/4/15)

tavas said:


> Anyway, this is all Axl's fault. Teach him for being late:
> http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/axl_rose_writes_letter_to_indonesian_president_to_stop_executions_is_late.html


Fair to say someone with the lyrical stylings of Rose may not be best man to have in your corner anyway. 

From 'One in a million' GNR.
*Police and Niggers, that's right
Get out of my way
Don't need to buy none of your
Gold chains today
I don't need no bracelets
Clamped in front of my back
Just need my ticket; 'til then
Won't you cut me some slack?*

*Immigrants and faggots*
*They make no sense to me
They come to our country
And think they'll do as they please
Like start some mini Iran,
Or spread some fuckin' disease
They talk so many goddamn ways
It's all Greek to me
Well some say I'm lazy
And others say that's just me
Some say I'm crazy
I guess I'll always be
But it's been such a long time
Since I knew right from wrong
It's all the means to an end, I
I keep it movin' along*


----------



## Dave70 (30/4/15)

Anyway, threats and sobbing slactivist e mails aren't the way to the mans heart. 
Next time, put Kylie in a wig and send her over. 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH3oOVKt0WI


----------



## wereprawn (30/4/15)

Other G'n'R lyrics that come to mind...

"Daddy works in porno, now that Mommy's not around.

She used to love her heroin, but now she's underground".


----------



## mckenry (30/4/15)

Dave70 said:


> Fair to say someone with the lyrical stylings of Rose may not be best man to have in your corner anyway.
> 
> From 'One in a million' GNR.
> *Police and Niggers, that's right
> ...


Haha - Dont forget Dave, he goes on to say "Radicals and racists, dont point your finger at me. I'm just a small town white boy, trying to make ends meet"


----------



## Dave70 (30/4/15)

Guess its not fair to single him out, it is after all 'art', and Tarantino has basically used the N word as a punctuation mark in his work since 92.
But **** him. 
Angry little tanty throwing prick who uses the women in his life as punching bags. 
Saw GNR at Eastern Creek Raceway back in 93 with an ex-girlfriend. They sucked. The whole beer-less, overpriced bottled water day_ sucked. _


----------



## yankinoz (30/4/15)

I would not have raised this question on a beer site, but since someone else has . . .

Besides whether the death penalty is ever justified, or justified in drug cases, or what rights you surrender in other countries' jurisdiction, there is another issue in the case of the Bali 9 (not just 2 Australians), namely the way Indonesia applies the death penalty. The ABC has just published a very good review of bias against foreigners in Indonesian sentencing: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-04-27/mcdonald-death-for-outsiders-but-leniency-for-locals/6423682

There was one Indonesian in the Nine, and reportedly he made important enemies back in Sumatra.

On the issue of whether judges offered to take bribes in the Chan/Sukamaran cases, the Indonesian Supreme Court has that under review post-execution, after ruling the outcome had no bearing on whether those two would be executed. Really? That tells you much about their mindset.

Indonesia claims it has a runaway drug problem. Their solution is to to apply more of what obviously hasn't been working, but to apply it mostly to foreigners who presumably are not the ones dealing in the street anyway. This, by the way, from a government that profits from the sale of cigarettes to children as young as two.

For Indonesia to announce the execution on ANZAC Day is bad diplomatic manners at the least. Make no mistake: the timing was deliberate. Widodo is pandering to anti-foreigner sentiments rising in Indonesia.

I have had contrasting perspectives on Indonesia. Teaching in PNG, most of my students expressed fear of Indonesian invasion, and I talked to soldiers who'd fought the Indonesian army along the shared boundary. But I have also spent time in Indonesia, not drinking in Bali, but in Bandung and the Javanese countryside. The hospitality was warm and wonderful.

Despite those good memories, and though I know there are Indonesians working for reform, as things stand I won't go back.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

yankinoz said:


> For Indonesia to announce the execution on ANZAC Day is bad diplomatic manners at the least. Make no mistake: the timing was deliberate. Widodo is pandering to anti-foreigner sentiments rising in Indonesia.


 Abbott is pandering to anti-foreigner sentiments rising in Australia.


Its just politics...they are all guilty of it, regardless of country...etc...etc


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

manticle said:


> Heroes mate. I can understand most of the perspectives thus far offered but I won't stand for the death of the apostrophe.


Kinda bought up memories......of my drunken 20's...


----------



## Dave70 (30/4/15)

Kebabs just have so many advantages over a hero when your motor skills are compromised its not funny.


----------



## Droopy Brew (30/4/15)

tavas said:


> Anyway, this is all Axl's fault. Teach him for being late:
> http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/axl_rose_writes_letter_to_indonesian_president_to_stop_executions_is_late.html


I dont for one minute believe Axl is responsible for that letter.
It took him over 7 years to pen Chinese Democracy. There is no way he wrote that in the 9 months Widodo has been in power.


----------



## sponge (30/4/15)

Droopy Brew said:


> I dont for one minute believe Axl is responsible for that letter.
> It took him over 7 years to pen Chinese Democracy. There is no way he wrote that in the 9 months Widodo has been in power.


And it was definitely worth the wait for Chinese Democracy....


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

Dave70 said:


> Kebabs just have so many advantages over a hero when your motor skills are compromised its not funny.


.......and the fact that a Kebab wont break your teeth like the end bits of a hero roll will.........there sort of like eclairs...soft and mushy in the center, hard as **** on the outside


----------



## Eagleburger (30/4/15)

Chewy and satifying. Take a kebab , even a falafel bab over one any day.


----------



## mckenry (30/4/15)

Dave70 said:


> Saw GNR at Eastern Creek Raceway back in 93 with an ex-girlfriend. They sucked. The whole beer-less, overpriced bottled water day_ sucked. _


I was there too. They sounded awful. Didnt realise until then, there was *so much* magic in the editing studio...


----------



## manticle (30/4/15)

Funny - I already knew they sounded awful when I heard appetite for destruction the first time (yr 8 whenever it was released).
And Dave70 reckons my tastes want to make him self harm....

PS. I also have great love for kebabs, kebobs, kebaps, souvlaki, shish, doner and all manner of meaty things wrapped in bread with salad, chilli and garlic. Drunk, sober, tipsy or just really tired, they make my world a wonderful place.
And they're halal!!


----------



## Black Devil Dog (30/4/15)

You'd have to be a pretty cold hearted bastard not to believe that this this bloke could have been spared.


----------



## BJB (30/4/15)

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/bali-terrorist-muhammad-cholili-freed-on-parole-as-18year-jail-sentence-halved/story-fni0cx12-1227017261729?sv=18b30dfed67f7e22640a815e31c97502


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## Seaquebrew (30/4/15)

Did someone mention Nepal?

Perspective?

Give what you can spare

Cheers


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## Black Devil Dog (30/4/15)

Seaquebrew said:


> Did someone mention Nepal?
> 
> Perspective?
> 
> ...


Absolutely, give to whichever charities you feel are going to serve their purpose the best.


Unfortunately natures fury can't be curbed. Human barbarism hopefully can.


----------



## Seaquebrew (30/4/15)

Both losses of lives are bad

Drug traffickers x 2

Nepalese civilians x > 5000 and rising

Maybe the ratings aren't as good


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

mckenry said:


> I was there too. They sounded awful. Didnt realise until then, there was *so much* magic in the editing studio...


I am hoping that ACDC wont suffer the same problem when I go to see them in Sydney...up front.in Arena A....


----------



## wide eyed and legless (30/4/15)

Without pointing a finger at a particular race or religion, I can't see barbaric acts being curbed anytime in the future, its not that far below the surface in most of us, and those who don't receive a good education, and grow up witnessing atrocities like it is an everyday occurrence have barely any hope of living a civilised life, to them acts of barbarism is the norm.


----------



## Vini2ton (30/4/15)

If we brought back hanging and sold tickets can you imagine how much "revenue" the government could make. The ultimate reality show. Sick sci-fi. Meta-Ta-Ta.


----------



## Eagleburger (30/4/15)

https://au.sports.yahoo.com/a/27468070/lingerie-football-players-celebration-causes-a-stir/

Sometimes it is hard to be civilised.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (30/4/15)

Yeah, probably bland tasteless beer, Bit like their foorball


----------



## dicko (30/4/15)

The Nepal earthquake featured on page 8 on this mornings paper in SA.

Political and news sales..... Is what drives the constant report from all corners on the drug trafficers.

This crap wont buy my my vote for either Tony or Bill....what a poor representation of the leaders of our country.

Shit i am regretting posting in this topic....but then some others are probably regretting the same thing...and interpret that as you will..


----------



## Dave70 (1/5/15)

manticle said:


> Funny - I already knew they sounded awful when I heard appetite for destruction the first time (yr 8 whenever it was released).
> *And Dave70 reckons my tastes want to make him self harm....*
> 
> PS. I also have great love for kebabs, kebobs, kebaps, souvlaki, shish, doner and all manner of meaty things wrapped in bread with salad, chilli and garlic. Drunk, sober, tipsy or just really tired, they make my world a wonderful place.
> And they're halal!!


In my defense, I sat through that (roughly 12 hour) maelstrom of white trash cock rock (Skid row were also on the bill) because one of her friends dropped out and I scored a free ticket. 
One highlight was Rose Tattoo, with a typically shitfaced and entertaining Angry reminding us you couldn't get a drink.
Skid row decided to 'help' this situation when they came on by handing out stubbies to a lucky few punters jammed against the security barriers down the front. 

This gesture of humanity was rewarded by Rose refusing to take the the stage until all the bottled had been returned and counted. Yes, seriously.
He then proceeded to dispense a few red roses to some lucky ladies in the crowd followed by rebuking some guys who grabbed at them, probably only to eat the petals or suck moisture from the stems, by calling them a bunch of 'cock sucking pussy faggots'. Oh happy day.

I've also come around somewhat to you're musical preferences and can often be found in my bedroom carving Swans into my wrist by candle light with a state school issued compass.


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## Dave70 (1/5/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Absolutely, give to whichever charities you feel are going to serve their purpose the best.
> 
> 
> Unfortunately natures fury can't be curbed. Human barbarism hopefully can.


China has reportedly already donated millions as well as putting boots on the ground to help out.
Wont be long before the usual chorus of Hollywood A list disciples of the Dali Lama accuse them of having a political agenda I guess.


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## Mardoo (1/5/15)

Sorry, but is there a government that doesn't have a political agenda?


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## Dave70 (1/5/15)

Mardoo said:


> Sorry, but is there a government that doesn't have a political agenda?


Chinese (officially..)


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## Black Devil Dog (1/5/15)

Dave70 said:


> China has reportedly already donated millions as well as putting boots on the ground to help out.
> Wont be long before the usual chorus of Hollywood A list disciples of the Dali Lama accuse them of having a political agenda I guess.


At least we'll feel good about them for a little while before they execute an Australian.

The Chinese 'only' executed 2400 people last year. 'Only', because in 2002 they executed 12,000. But there's a lot of them, so I guess it doesn't matter. :blink:


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## wide eyed and legless (1/5/15)

Funny how politics can take a back seat in a natural disaster, remember the Sichuan earthquake, I believe one of the biggest contributors of aid was from Taiwan, not to mention Japan and Korea.


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## spog (1/5/15)

Doesn't take long,I heard 4 Sukumaran and Chan jokes today.
I won't post them simply because it might upset somebody who doesn't have a sense of humour nor a grip on reality ( their up their arse ), 3 of the jokes were so so,one was ****'n funny.
Well, it suited my sense of humour.


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## indica86 (1/5/15)

Gotta have jokes, it helps us all deal with how shit the world is.


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## lukiferj (1/5/15)

I have no issues with jokes that are in incredibly bad taste. It's when people are serious about them that I have a problem.


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## Ducatiboy stu (1/5/15)

spog said:


> Doesn't take long,I heard 4 Sukumaran and Chan jokes today.
> I won't post them simply because it might upset somebody who doesn't have a sense of humour nor a grip on reality ( their up their arse ), 3 of the jokes were so so,one was ****'n funny.
> Well, it suited my sense of humour.


Just post them. This is AHB, not Facebook


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## eamonnfoley (1/5/15)

Can you imagine how much money the Government has spent on this ? That money could have saved many, many innocent lives here in Australia, especially those of disadvantaged children. Makes me sick to the stomach that drug traffickers are treated like national heroes. Yes, the death penalty is probably a too harsh a penalty for their crimes, but this case does not deserve the Government (spent $$$) and media attention (made $$$) it has received. And then you have people calling to remove foreign aid. So, what they are asking for, is for poor disadvantaged Indonesian families who have no control over their Goverment to suffer, because of two Australian drug dealers who have committed a serious crime in their country. Its just horrible and embarrassing.


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## Eagleburger (2/5/15)

I did the unthinkable. I opened a news piece about this, because I thought it was all finished. Before I caught myself I had clicked on a third article and my bottom lip was trembling. 

Where are the jokes? Very cruel to wave treats in someones face and not offer them.


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## Nullnvoid (2/5/15)

How things change. Sheesh


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## Weizguy (2/5/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Abbott is pandering to anti-foreigner sentiments rising in Australia.
> 
> 
> Its just politics...they are all guilty of it, regardless of country...etc...etc


Abbot is just being a politician, for what ever mileage is available.

Plenty of anti-foreign sentiments among the uneducated, as mentioned here,



Dave70 said:


> In my defense, I sat through that (roughly 12 hour) maelstrom of white trash cock rock (Skid row were also on the bill) because one of her friends dropped out and I scored a free ticket.
> One highlight was Rose Tattoo, with a typically shitfaced and entertaining Angry reminding us you couldn't get a drink.
> Skid row decided to 'help' this situation when they came on by handing out stubbies to a lucky few punters jammed against the security barriers down the front.
> 
> ...


I also went to that gig. Was OK, but no beer? Never again.
I remember Axl's tanty and the delay to the show. Would have been a riot if he had stormed out. He would have needed to get in the chopper pretty quickly.



foles said:


> Can you imagine how much money the Government has spent on this ? That money could have saved many, many innocent lives here in Australia, especially those of disadvantaged children. Makes me sick to the stomach that drug traffickers are treated like national heroes. Yes, the death penalty is probably a too harsh a penalty for their crimes, but this case does not deserve the Government (spent $$$) and media attention (made $$$) it has received. And then you have people calling to remove foreign aid. So, what they are asking for, is for poor disadvantaged Indonesian families who have no control over their Goverment to suffer, because of two Australian drug dealers who have committed a serious crime in their country. Its just horrible and embarrassing.


National heroes? I hope not, but this is coming from a nation that still aggrandises fkn crims like Ned Kelly coz he was a rebel.




_WALLACE_ said:


> The Minority Opinion.


As for -WALLACE-'s take on things, not sure if ignorant or baiting. Time will tell if he's the next to be banned...


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## Mardoo (2/5/15)

Nullnvoid said:


> ImageUploadedByAussie Home Brewer1430523516.196458.jpg
> 
> How things change. Sheesh


Still wondering whether the government of the moment influences the media?


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## Nullnvoid (2/5/15)

Mardoo said:


> Still wondering whether the government of the moment influences the media?


Who in turn influence the public, who in turn influence the government. It's a vicious circle


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## malt and barley blues (2/5/15)

The actual events influence the media who then ramp it up, Government's take is quite rightly that the people are being influenced by the media so take a popular stance, maybe we should start voting for the media we follow, we would still have left, right and indifferent.


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## manticle (2/5/15)

Dave70 said:


> In my defense, I sat through that (roughly 12 hour) maelstrom of white trash cock rock (Skid row were also on the bill) because one of her friends dropped out and I scored a free ticket.
> One highlight was Rose Tattoo, with a typically shitfaced and entertaining Angry reminding us you couldn't get a drink.
> Skid row decided to 'help' this situation when they came on by handing out stubbies to a lucky few punters jammed against the security barriers down the front.
> 
> ...


Compass +bic biro makes awesome tattoo and very in right now.


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## Black Devil Dog (2/5/15)

All decent governments should put every effort into preventing their citizens being shot, poisoned, electrocuted, hanged, beheaded etc, by other governments.

I'm all for these people spending the rest of their lives rotting in jail as convicted criminals, but being taken out in the middle of the night, strapped to a crucifix and having a bullet put into their chest by government employees and it being done in a way that is as insensitive to the families as could possibly be imagined, is wrong at every level. 

There appears to be some kind of pathetic attempt by certain sections of the media to turn them into heroes. They were criminals, they fucked up and they paid.

It's how fucked up Indonesia's way of making them pay was, that some people are not happy with.


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## Ducatiboy stu (2/5/15)

manticle said:


> Compass +bic biro makes awesome tattoo and very in right now.


Ahh...the good old days of making a tattoo gun from an old cassette player motor and a sewing needle and using ink made from a mixture of vodka and ink from a Bic pen...


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## _HOME_BREW_WALLACE_ (2/5/15)

Les the Weizguy said:


> As for -WALLACE-'s take on things, not sure if ignorant or baiting. Time will tell if he's the next to be banned...


Ignorant. But say what I believe.


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## wide eyed and legless (2/5/15)

There appears to be some kind of pathetic attempt by certain sections of the media to turn them into heroes. They were criminals, they fucked up and they paid.(quote Black Devil Dog)
I entirely agree with you there not only did they pay with their lives but what shits me is they have served 10 years incarcerated in an Indonesian gaol and then get shot so they paid twice, why not let them serve another 5 or 10 years, they were doing a lot more good than bad. 
Why not send the bones back to Indonesia in another 10 years so they can burn them just to make sure, like they did with the witches in medieval times, being that seems to be the period they are living in.
​I am sure I could be for capital punishment in the right circumstances but taking into consideration what happened here, surely 15 years is appropriate.


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