# Alco Sarsaparilla - Recipe & Discussion Of It



## Malted

Recipe help wanted: Alcoholic sarsaparilla 

I have written a bit of a discussion of what I did (or as it seems, what I did wrong).
So I have a hankering for alco sars and have not yet been able to nail it. I've tried "*Tusker Draught Root Beer" at the Lighthouse Tavern, Port Adelaide* :super: and it is great. It is the benchmark for stuff I'd like to brew and enjoy at home. It is mild at first but builds on the palette and lingers. It is very Moorish and *would put a horn on a jellyfish*. I recommend everyone try a good old pint of it as a small glass just isn't enough (neither is one pint really!) I'd love to be able to make a good alco sars brew to enjoy at home (and score heaps of points with SWMBO and friends). :icon_drunk: :icon_chickcheers: 
So countless hours searching the net for recipes yields a lot of root beer recipes out of the States that are non-alcoholic. I can't find a decent alco sars or root beer recipe!

I've looked at the ingredients in commercial non-alco sarsaparilla such as Bundaberg Brewed Drinks Sarsaparilla "contains no artificial colours Traditionally brewed to a genuine old recipe from real sarsaparilla root, licorice root, vanilla beans and molasses". 

Being that I used to live in QLD I am familiar with Bundy Brewed Drinks and am sure they used to have a slightly different Sarsaparilla drink that they used to call "Horehound", maybe they decided it didn't sound PC enough anymore! Probably sounds a bit like "Milf Hunter" or such. I think BBD Horehound was more of a Root Beer flavour (which I belive is slightly different to sarsaparilla) but either way I like both flavours. 

I have also noted that Sarsaparilla flavour does not seem to be as popluar in South Australia as it is in Qld. I have not yet found Sarsaparilla flavoured cordial in SA and there a not many brands or much quantity of Sarsaparilla softdrink stocked in Adelaide supermarkets. Just in case any of the free settlers get upset, I am not grizzling, I just making an observation  

So I have purchased from America, liquid sarsaparilla extract (smells great and makes me want to roll in it but is quite expensive) and root beer extract powder. I have also bought from a spice wholesaler in Qld: powdered liquorice root (tastes great on sampling) and powdered sarsaparilla root (does not taste very sarsaparillary).

On the net I found a promising recipe in BYO magazine and had a go at it that did not turn out well at all (recipe below with my comments in red). 
The guts of it are that it was too bitter, a bit salty, not sweet enough, had some nasty taints of lactose and a few gritty bits and seemed to be more work than it probably should be.
*Linky to BYO page *for copyright acknowledgement (or read below)

*Real Root Beer* 

Author Scott Russell 
Issue October 1997 
5 gallons, partial mash 

*Ingredients:*
2 lbs. crushed mild ale malt 
1 lb. dark crystal malt, 120 Lovibond 
0.25 lb. black malt 
0.25 lb. chocolate malt 
3 lbs. unhopped dark dry malt extract 
0.5 lb. dark unsulphured molasses Apparently 'unsulphured' is a lighter coloured style. I did not find this out until after I brewed. I can say that all the molasses I came across is dark and salty. I thought 'molasses' would be important for colour of the brew. I'd probably use golden syrup next time or dark brown sugar, or both.
4 oz. maltodextrin powder 
1 oz. Cluster hop pellets (7% alpha acid), for 60 min. I was hesitant about this so went half at 60 mins and half at 30 mins. Even so it was way too bitter. I reckon dry hopping for aroma would work better, maybe Hallertau whole hop flowers? Or maybe no hops at all.
0.5 oz. sassafras bark Did not add
0.5 oz. sarsaparilla bark Added powdered root. It did not settle out fully with crash chilling and I then had to filter/strain it. It still had unappealing gritty bits in the brew.
1 oz. dried wintergreen leaves Did not add
0.5 oz. shredded licorice root Used powdered root. See comments re: sarsaparilla root powder.
pinch sweet gale (optional) Did not add
pinch star anise (optional) You betchya I did! I added a couple of whole star anise.
pinch mace (optional) Did not add
pinch coriander (optional) Did not add
dash black cherry juice (optional) Did not add
10 to 14 g. dry ale yeast I used a smack pack of 1080 (I think)
2 oz. lactose powder I don't think I like this. Maybe it is just me but I can taste it in the brew and don't like it.
7/8 cup corn sugar 
0.5 cup spice tea (pinch wintergreen, sarsaparilla, licorice root) Used sars & liquorice root powders with a splash of Pernod
corn sugar for priming 
I also added a couple of teaspoons of vanilla bean pod guts.

*Step by Step:*
In 1 gal. water mash crystal, black, chocolate, and mild ale malts at 155 F for 60 minutes. Sparge with 1.5 gals. at 170 F. Add 1 gal. water to kettle and bring to a boil. Add dark dry malt, maltodextrin, and molasses. Stir well to avoid scorching. Add Cluster hops and boil 60 minutes. At kettle knockout steep your spice combination (in a mesh bag) as wort cools. Pour into fermenter and top up to 5.25 gals. Cool to 75 F and pitch ale yeast. Ferment seven to 10 days at about 70 F, rack to secondary, and condition at 60 F for two weeks. Prime with corn sugar, add strained spice tea (1/2 cup boiling water over spices for at least a half hour), and bottle. Age two to three weeks cool (55 F). 
Can't remember the OG & FG's but could find them if anyone wants them. As it was in the cooler months, I brewed it in a turned off fridge with a heater and 'tempmate' type of device which I think from memory was set for 19oC?

*Alternatives and Options:*
Non-alcoholic creamy version: Instead of fermenting the wort, cool to 75 F, substitute 5 to 7 g. dry champagne yeast for the ale yeast, and bottle immediately. Store at 70 F for two or three days, then refrigerate. Follow these instructions exactly, otherwise you risk exploding bottles. You may also use ale yeast, which is somewhat safer because it will not continue to ferment in cold temperatures. However, the bubbles will not have that fine champagne quality. A safer way to carbonate: Get a CO2 system and either put your root beer in 5-gal. soda kegs (force carbonated) or get Carbonater-brand couplings and bottle in 2-liter PET bottles (force carbonated at 25 to 28 psi, chilled and shaken well). 

End of recipe. 
Some of my discussion:
I put some in PET bottles and the rest into a keg. I learnt some interesting things.
*#1* Do not put 3 carbonation drops in with this brew in a PET bottle. They don't explode but they are like foamy volcanoes or I suspect foamy rockets if you let go of them when you opened. I thought it needed sweetening to balance the bitter hops hence 3 drops.
*#2 *I had an 'issue' with my keg setup and accidently pumped a small amount of sars into half a keg of English Bitter. The EB tasted great then! I then would pour a bit of sars into a glass and then fill up with the EB as Jamie would say "happy days". When the EB ran out I could not stomach the sars by itself and tipped it onto the lawn. 

So the basis for this BYO mag brew seems to be malts for colour, depth and fermentables and then add some flavourings. Bundaberg Brewed Drinks (BBD) don't use a grain base for fermentables, they seem to just use 'molasses' which I am betting would be the sweet golden syrup kind and not the salty molasses kind. I reckon you could colour it up with some caramelised sugar liquid or such. 
I am not sure if I will try and simplify it by not mashing malts, perhaps I could make it from golden syrup and some DME and some of the liquid sars extract and touch of vanilla to go for more of a BBD style? 

I am happy to share details of where I bought my ingredients if anyone wants to know. 

So is there an Alco Sars genius out there who can help me on my alco sars quest?


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## rosswill

Here was my attempt Linky

I struggled through half a dozen stubbies, and tipped the rest. Needed the bottles for good beer.


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## manticle

3 things

1. I presume you've seen this page in your extensive searching? 

http://www.greydragon.org/library/brewing_root_beer.html

2. If you changed the recipe from BYO as much as you did it would be a pretty different drink I would think. The recipe does look amazingly complicated though.

3. Why would you think carbonation drops would sweeten anything? They'll ferment out, adding nothing but fizz and a tiny bit of extra alc.

Can't help much more but if anyone does work out a good recipe, I'll probably give it a crack.


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## blekk

I found this one floating around a little while ago but haven't tried it yet. It does refer to "crushed malt grains", "hops" and "saccharine" (not needed?), but doesn't state how much or what type to use perhaps your favourite malt and hops? Anyway if anyone gives it a shot post how it goes.

Horehound Beer

Ingredients:
900g horehound
240g ginger
120g coriander seed
2 kg malt extract
1kg sugar
20l of unchlorinated water
Ale Yeast (eg 1762 Belgian Strong Ale) 



Method:


Preparation
As with most of the other recipes here, this has been gauged to make 20l of 'beer' (actually Horehound Beer is more like an ale than a traditional light American beer). 
Begin by boiling the horehound, ginger and coriander seeds in half the water for 15 minutes then add the malt extract and stir till dissolved. Strain and pour onto the sugar and saccharine. Add the remaining water then continue as with the 

If you are using liquid yeast then you will need to prepare it beforehand. Skip this section if you are using dried yeast. The yeast culture needs to be prepared 23 days before it's needed. Most liquid yeasts come in a packet. First burst the blister bubble in this to release the yeast cells into a sugar solution where they will begin to multiply. Once the packet has swelled to about an inch think, open the packet and pitch (pour) the yeast into a sterilized 1l container half-filled with water, into which about 3 tablespoons of sugar have been dissolved. Shake the container well to aerate, and loosen the lid slightly to let some air escape. 


Place your large stainless steel pot on a high heat and add 11l of water. Put your crushed malt grains in a muslin bag, tie this off and add to the water. Bring the water to the boil and remove the muslin bag just before it reaches boiling point (about 80C). At this point take the pot off the heat and stir-in your malt extract. This may be easier if the can of syrup has been sitting in warm water before hand. Whilst adding the syrup, stir vigorously to ensure that the sugars do not burn on the bottom of the pan. 


Once the syrup has been added and dissolved return the pan to the heat and bring to the boil. At this point add the bittering hops. Turn the heat down so that the wort (as the liquid is now called) is on a rolling boil rather than a rapid one (you need to be careful here as too much heat can extract tannins from the hops and can caramelize the sugars within the wort, which will foul the taste of your beer). Be careful near this boiling liquid as the sugars in the wort will make if very hot and sticky. 


After 55 minutes of boiling add the finishing hops. After boiling for a further five minutes (60 minutes' boil in total) remove the pot from the heat and strain off the hops (leaving them in longer will make the beer too bitter). Leave the pot to sit for 30 minutes for the wort to settle and cool. 
You will now need a completely sterilized fermentation barrel or bucket into which 9l of cold water should be poured. Now carefully pour the word through the strainer and sterilized filter combination into the barrel or bucket. Splashing is good here as it helps aerate the wort. 


Next the yeast solution should be prepared. If using dried yeast place about 80ml of warm water (3640C) in a shallow dish (it is best to boil the water and allow it to cool naturally in a covered dish. Sprinkle the yeast evenly over the surface of the water and allow to rehydrate for ten minutes. At the end of this time gently stir the yeast and add to the wort. If using liquid yeast add a tablespoon of corn sugar and shake the bottle again to aerate the solution. 


Once the yeast has been added to the wort (do not add until the temperature has cooled to 24C), stir vigorously with a sterilized long-handled spoon to aerate. At this point take a hydrometer reading and record the Specific Gravity (known at this point as the Original Gravity). Affix the lid (or bung) and fermentation airlock. This should normally be active (bubbling) in 24 hours. Place the fermentation vessel in a dark place at between 1824C and leave to ferment. 
Beer will normally ferment and clear normally within 1014 days (as a rule of thumb beer needs 1 week's fermentation time per 1.5kg of malt extract sugar used. If the fermentation airlock has reduced its bubbling rate to more than once per minute the beer is ready to be bottled, however, if it is still bubbling rapidly the beer needs more time to ferment. 
The next stage is to rack and prime the beer. 

Place your racking tube into the fermentation barrel/bucket and rack (decant) the beer into a sterile bucket (known as a bottling bucket). I'm making a traditional (low carbonation) ale here. As a result the priming sugar mix is 120g of demerara (or any brown cane sugar) dissolved in 200ml boiling water (for a fizzier beer double the amount of sugar and water). This is allowed to cool slightly and poured into the bottling bucket (don't aerate this time). 


Finally, clean and sterilize your siphon and use this to begin filling your bottles. You need about 3cm of head space, which you should get when you remove the siphon (to prevent the bottle over-flowing get a bottle-filler end-piece for your siphon hose). Cap the bottles and store the beer at or slightly above 18C in a dark place for about three weeks to finish conditioning. This allows the beer to carbonate naturally (though for traditional ale this is only between 1.52.0 volumes of CO2 (a lager would be between 2.22.7 volumes of CO2). 


You can now open your first bottle of home-brewed beer and enjoy the fruit of your labours. 
If you wish to make a more authentic Medieval ale then do not add hops to your ale (though you may add the finishing hops to add flavour if you wish). 
The very high sugar content here will give you a high alcohol content, but as a result it will take about twice as long to ferment.


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## Malted

*Rosswill:* thanks for your link. I missed it because of the different spelling (Sarsaparilla & Sarsparilla). Sounds like your story is similar to mine; my lawn liked mine. Very good info about the colour and flavours dropping out. I did not have a problem with the colour but it is perhaps something to think about if I use the liquid sarsaparilla extract.
*
Manticle: 
*(1) I am glad you did not say "assume". If your post was not as helpful as it is, I'd probably note the sarcasm in your text and be a hurt little princess  . You know how it is, you search and search and search until your eyes are dry and bloodshot, your hands press random keys on the keyboard because you are brain dead then you repeat the process another day and another... you get frustrated because you can't find exactly what you want and inevitably you miss something that someone else may have found quite easily. So no I had not seen that particular site and thank you for the link, it looks informative. 

I have been to the HopTech site which is referred to in the greydragon site, I note now that they don't sell root beer extract on their site anymore but have started homemadesodacompany.com in which the volume of the bottles of extract are now smaller.

(2) IMO I didn't think that I changed it all that much: of the main ingredients I just skipped the sassafras and wintergreen (but added some 'root beer' extract) and most of the 'optionals'. The base was IMO similar. I substituted powdered roots for bark and shredded root. Anything I did not add a comment to in the ingredients list, I added as per the recipe (the grain bill was the same). So IMO not too many substitutions or omissions.

On a side note: In a chemist the other day I saw a little vial of 100% wintergreen oil (but did not note if it contains safrole) and thought maybe it could be a goer?

(3) answer = brain fart / stupidity / noob. Perhaps the mistakes we make ourselves, even though we have been previously warned, are the ones we learn the most from?


*Blair: *Looks to be more simple than the one I tried.

I have a hatred of all things coriander leaf but have managed coriander seed on beef jerky. I am still wary of coriander seed though. That would seem to be a heck of a lot of the seed by physical volume (given that it would weigh bugger all). 

Regarding the hops, _Manticle_ or others correct me if I am wrong, but it has just occurred to me, I am led to believe that the bittering of hops acts as a natural preservative? Maybe it is not so much for the flavour but the overall stability or shelf life of the end product? Or could you safely say that carbonation (lack of O2) and proper hygiene/sterilisation would do the trick anyway?

I'd hazard a guess that saccharine is a non-fermentable sugar for sweetening the brew. I hate the taste of most of those no-sugar bloody diet softdrinks, but I am a skinny bastard with a high metabolism that does not have to worry about what goes in my gob.

Thanks for the post, it is food for thought.




Thanks for the replies, it is good to have a robust discussion when one is on such a hunt. If anyone else has something to add, bring it on because we're not over the line yet! I reckon, collectively, we will get there, one day...


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## manticle

Malted said:


> *
> Manticle:
> *(1) I am glad you did not say "assume". If your post was not as helpful as it is, I'd probably note the sarcasm in your text and be a hurt little princess  . You know how it is, you search and search and search until your eyes are dry and bloodshot, your hands press random keys on the keyboard because you are brain dead then you repeat the process another day and another... you get frustrated because you can't find exactly what you want and inevitably you miss something that someone else may have found quite easily. So no I had not seen that particular site and thank you for the link, it looks informative.
> 
> I have been to the HopTech site which is referred to in the greydragon site, I note now that they don't sell root beer extract on their site anymore but have started homemadesodacompany.com in which the volume of the bottles of extract are now smaller.
> 
> (2) IMO I didn't think that I changed it all that much: of the main ingredients I just skipped the sassafras and wintergreen (but added some 'root beer' extract) and most of the 'optionals'. The base was IMO similar. I substituted powdered roots for bark and shredded root. Anything I did not add a comment to in the ingredients list, I added as per the recipe (the grain bill was the same). So IMO not too many substitutions or omissions.
> 
> On a side note: In a chemist the other day I saw a little vial of 100% wintergreen oil (but did not note if it contains safrole) and thought maybe it could be a goer?
> 
> (3) answer = brain fart / stupidity / noob. Perhaps the mistakes we make ourselves, even though we have been previously warned, are the ones we learn the most from?



No sarcasm at all. I wrote 'presume' because I didn't just want to be the google guy when you said you'd spent ages searching but that page looked like it would be very useful.

From reading that page, the sassafras and wintergreen look pretty integral to the flavour you're chasing (although some references mention sassafras not being approved by the FDA due to carcinogenic properties).


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## Malted

manticle said:


> No sarcasm at all. I wrote 'presume' because I didn't just want to be the google guy when you said you'd spent ages searching but that page looked like it would be very useful.
> 
> From reading that page, the sassafras and wintergreen look pretty integral to the flavour you're chasing (although some references mention sassafras not being approved by the FDA due to carcinogenic properties).



Thanks for taking it on the lighter side Manticle, I didn't want to offend a knowledgeable chap like yourself. Yes it appears to be quite a useful page, thanks again for the heads up. 

I reckon I'll have another crack at another brew this weekend if all goes well (I might try some small batch experiements). I am thinking of loading up with golden syrup and some light DME (I have it in my mind that maybe some dried wheat malt extract could go good too) with sarsaparilla root powder, a touch of licqourice root powder and a touch of vanilla maybe a few whole star anise (I reckon that aniseed at the back could give it good depth). 
Do you think there would be much in the way of unfermentables in golden syrup?

I think sassafras and wintergreen would be integral to a root beer brew, which could be good too, but I am really chasing a sarsaparilla brew. Yes I have seen references to safrole being why FDA don't like it. Some people argue that whilst it has unhealthy properties, the amount of those chemicals consumed is neglible. The jury is out in my head. I am a bit risk adverse.


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## Wolfy

Why not ask for the recipe next time you are at the Lighthouse Tavern? Or a list of ingredient since they're obviously doing something right?


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## manticle

Malted said:


> Thanks for taking it on the lighter side Manticle, I didn't want to offend a knowledgeable chap like yourself. Yes it appears to be quite a useful page, thanks again for the heads up.
> 
> I reckon I'll have another crack at another brew this weekend if all goes well (I might try some small batch experiements). I am thinking of loading up with golden syrup and some light DME (I have it in my mind that maybe some dried wheat malt extract could go good too) with sarsaparilla root powder, a touch of licqourice root powder and a touch of vanilla maybe a few whole star anise (I reckon that aniseed at the back could give it good depth).
> Do you think there would be much in the way of unfermentables in golden syrup?
> 
> I think sassafras and wintergreen would be integral to a root beer brew, which could be good too, but I am really chasing a sarsaparilla brew. Yes I have seen references to safrole being why FDA don't like it. Some people argue that whilst it has unhealthy properties, the amount of those chemicals consumed is neglible. The jury is out in my head. I am a bit risk adverse.



I believe golden syrup is pretty fermentable. A lot of people use lyle's brand which is partially inverted (yeast may have an easier time digesting this depending on who you speak to).

I feel a bit funny offering advice in this regard because I'd prefer to rely on my experience. If relying purely on reading, I will at least state that's the case. Here I'm relying on my intuition (so neither reading nor experience).

Keep it simple. Find the simplest root beer/sarsparilla recipe you can and use that. If something is missing in the results then you add it in - it's better to add in than realsie you can't take away. I say I have no experience with root beer but I do have several years of professional cooking behind me and the principle is the same.

It's unlikely DME would have been in an original sars recipe. If you make one without and decide that it could bring what you want to the result _then_ bring it in.

Interested to hear how you go - traditional recipe brewing interests me very much (cider, mead, wine, gruit, wild beer etc) and I have plans for them all (currently only tried wild beer, cider and a teeny bit of winemaking with plans for more).


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## Malted

*Wolfy:* unfortunately every time I make it to the Lighthouse it is a Sunday arvo and the brewer is not in, that and the bar staff look at me stupidly when I ask to see the brewer.

*What I did on the weekend:
*Ok, so if it tastes good before it is brewed then it is likely to taste good after brewing holds true, then the batch I put down Saturday night might be ok. 

I am leaning more towards as Manticle said, keep it simple (KISS principle). 
The plan: make an alco base and add 'sarsaparilla extract' to secondary. 
But what do you use for an alco base, that sounds too simplistic? 

I really wanted to use sarsaparilla root & liquorice root for authenticity but I was doubtful about the sarsaparilla root powder, it appeared to have no smell or flavour (unlike the liquorice root powder) so I made a tea in a coffee plunger to assess the flavour yield of the sarsaparilla. My suspicion was correct - it tasted like dirt. Hence the plan B of using the liquid extract.

So for the alco base: I started using a bit of the old grey matter and planned a few brews in 'BeerSmith' (it's my first time playing with it) to work out quantities, OG & FG for desired Alc % etc with the info from web sites, including the one Manticle pointed me to  .

So the basics for a 19 L batch were:
1.95 kg Molasses
0.45 kg Light DME
0.45 kg Wheat DME (was thinking it would be good for body and some residual sweetness)
0.25 kg Maltodextrine
(spices) Star anise, Ginger, Liquorice powder, Sarsaparilla powder, vanilla

OG 1.048, FG 1.013, 4.56% Alc

*OR
*
3 kg Molasses
Spices

OG 1.047, FG 1.012, 4.51% Alc

But I am a bit hawky about the 'saltiness' of molasses and started looking at other similar products.

*OR
*
2.45 kg Treacle (apparently it is partially invert)
0.25 kg Dememera Sugar (nice and malty brown)
0.25 kg Dark brown sugar
Spices

OG 1.049, FG 1.014, 4.54% Alc.

*I decided on* a KISS recipe
3 KG Golden Syrup
Spices

So off to the shops I went and bought a few 850g jars of Golden syrup and everything looked rosey.

Upon sampling the Golden Syrup I got a bit hawky again as I thought I could taste an undertone of 'saltiness' and decided to only use two jars of it.
So not having a computer at home ATM, all the planning went out the window and I mixed together whatever I had on hand at the time. I kept taking samples to test the specific gravity whilst I went along. Mix, test, add, test, add, test etc. Here's how it went down:

It ended up a 17 L batch

1.70 kg Golden syrup (CSR brand in square plastic jars)
0.50 kg Light DME
0.40 kg Dark DME
0.25 kg Maltodextrine

Sarsaparilla liquid extract to be added to secondary.

OG 1.056, Wyeast 1099 Whitbread pitched at 22 oC. 

Notes: 
* I did a taste test of every sample after specific gravity was tested, samples were NOT returned to ferementor. Final mix tasted quite pleasant; no 'saltiness' observed.
* Colour from Dark DME & Golden Syrup is excellent, nice and inky brown almost black. 
* The smack pack had about 6 hours from activation but was only 1/2 expanded. It was very slow to get going in the brew, so on Sunday evening I added a 1099 starter I had been cultivating from the sars brew that went on the lawn (but had only started it on Friday arvo). Monday morning (was quite a cool evening last night) it was bubbling alright but not what I would call vigorously. I am inclined to think that the 1099 is just a slower yeast. 
* I have it wrapped in a blanket in a ply wood box in the shed, with a desk lamp inside the box and an STC 1000 temp controller set at 19 oC. _Side note:_ energy efficient compact fluurescents bulbs are not very good at generating heat.

Incidentally, I put down a batch of beer the same evening (kit & kilo) and pitched 25g of US-05 American Ale dry yeast in it and it was bubbling so vigorously that it appeared to be generating heat. It is in a turned off fridge also with a temp controller etc. 16 oC ambient temp and the inside of the fridge peaked at 19.5 oC with no heating applied to it.

*Manticle:* Yeah Yeah cooking principles in brewing. My knowledge has gone the other way (or I should say my understanding of what I have observed). The 'hot break' you get when wort boiling seems to be pretty similar to when applying heat to a cream sauce reduction. Heat, heat, boil, foamy foamy, escaping out of the kettle/pan, SWMBO angry, knock foam down, then boils away without escaping until it reduces to desired amount. Yeah proteins etc in the wort/cream and all that... 
I have simplified the cream sauce reduction process because I have not mentioned reducing stock or wine etc before adding the cream but the behaviour of the hot break of the cream seems pretty similar to wort.


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## Wolfy

Malted said:


> *Wolfy:* unfortunately every time I make it to the Lighthouse it is a Sunday arvo and the brewer is not in, that and the bar staff look at me stupidly when I ask to see the brewer.


If you are a member of the OCAU forums, do a search for my old thread about making GingerBeer, I'm pretty sure that the Owner/Brewer's son posted about how they'd be selling sarsaparilla beer at the pub soon, so you might be able to arrange something with him.


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## Malted

Wolfy said:


> If you are a member of the OCAU forums, do a search for my old thread about making GingerBeer, I'm pretty sure that the Owner/Brewer's son posted about how they'd be selling sarsaparilla beer at the pub soon, so you might be able to arrange something with him.


Yes your memory is right on the money. Detailed instructions and photos of making GB by the way. 
No I am not a member of the forum, I just googled it. I notice that Doug said in May 2009 that he'd post a GB recipe but has not done so (well not in your thread). He also called the pub 'Ales & Sails' not the Lighthouse. What does this mean? I don't know. Thanks for the lead.


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## Malted

This is a re-write of my earlier post on Molasses and sugar syrups. 

As I suspected: Syrups aren't Syrups Sol!

Why post it? Well in my mind it is about knowing and understanding ingredients so that you can use them properly. Knowing how it is made and therefore its properties, (i.e. sweet, bitter and salty) is part of understanding the product.

I have contacted a few companies and have got some basic information from them.
Bundaberg Sugar gave a few extra details on how they make sugar & molasses. Below is a mash of information from various sources.

There are TWO basic sources of (sugar cane) Molasses. 

(1) Mill Molasses: extracted at the sugar cane crushing mill. The juice is boiled in a vacuum pan, seeded with sugar crystals and centrifuged to extract sugar crystals. The leftover syrup is molasses. This mill molasses is not fit for human consumption and is sold primarily as an animal feed. However, Bundaberg Rum does brew with it that kind of explains the product! Argh settle down, I will concede that these days they are producing a range of Rums that are better than the yellow label. 

(2) Refinery Molasses: the crystals received from the mill are hydrolysed and Phosphoric Acid is added to break some of the sucrose into glucose (dextrose) & fructose. Lime is added to control the pH of the syrup. Acid + Base = Water + Salt. Therefore these syrups will contain salt to some extent (expressed on a molasses jar label as Sodium content).

I believe that at the refinery, the sugar crystals are hydrolysed and processed three more times.

First boiling of sugar juice, crystal extraction & left over syrup is used to make Golden Syrup.
Second boiling of sugar juice, crystal extraction & left over slightly bitter syrup is used to make Treacle.
Third boiling of sugar juice, crystal extraction & left over syrup is used to make Molasses (Blackstrap). 

Note: boiling to reduce volume (i.e make a syrup) reduces water but gernerally concentrates salt. One would infer that refinery Molasses would potentially be the 'saltiest'.

Bundaberg Sugar says that Refinery Molasses is used by at least one of its brewery customers. 
It also said that all of its refinery molasses is unsulphured.

Is molasses sulphured or unsulphured? It won't say exactly that on a jar label. You will see if it contains Preservative 220, this is Sulphur Dioxide. Sulphur Dioxide inactivates yeast and nasties; this is why it is commonly added to commercial wine and beer at bottling. If you put 'sulphured' molasses in a fermenter, potentially the sulphur dioxide could be in high enough concentrations to affect your yeast.

Bundaberg Sugar Refinery Molasses is sold by Conga Foods as their Blue Label Molasses. This is what their website says about the product: Blue Label Molasses is Blackstrap Molasses, highly concentrated and featuring a distinctively sweet but bitter taste. 
It is usually available at IGA stores.
I have used this molasses before; it is sweet, 'salty' and bitter. Salty & bitter are not good for alcoholic sarsaparilla brew.

Sarsaparilla recipes (I still have not found a good one) or the list of ingredients on some sarsaparilla beverages I have investigated, list molasses. I do not know how they would use it given its saltiness & bitterness. I asked a few basic questions to Bundaberg Brewed Drinks (who do a nice sarsaparilla) and they would not tell me a single thing, not even ambiguous generalisations. "Unfortunately, we are unable to disclose this information as the process is intellectual property".

Given my lack of knowledge, I would stay clear of refinery molasses. I would use Golden Syrup instead. 

Lyle's Golden Syrup is listed in Beer Smith as a Liquid Invert Sugar. What are invert sugars? It is a different manufacturing process to that outlined above but has the same end result. Acid Enzymes (Invertase) are added to sucrose (from sugar cane, beets or other sources) to break it into simpler sugars such as glucose & fructose. This also produces an acidic solution that needs to be balanced and therefore these too end up with a salt content to some extent.

Golden Syrup is usually about 56% invert syrup (high in fermentables) & 44% sucrose (less fermentable). It is possible, and my taste buds confirm this, that it is not as 'salty' or bitter as molasses since it has not been processed as much.


Perhaps, and this smells like an experiment to me, if one were to obtain some animal feed molasses (Mill Molasses) from a rural produce store, making sure there was no preservatives or supplements etc added, and mix it with water and treat it like an all grain wort, i.e. boil it to sanitise it, get a hot break to separate out proteins and particulate matter and whirlpool it, it may then be a suitable liquid base for brewing that could be free from sulphur and salts? Boiling may break down some of the sucrose into simpler sugars? Or maybe the yeast will just be slower digesting sucrose (i.e. a high pitching rate is required)?


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## Wolfy

Malted said:


> Given my lack of knowledge, I would stay clear of refinery molasses. I would use Golden Syrup instead.


Didn't you say above that Golden Syrup _IS _the first boiling of refinery molasses?


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## manticle

You can invert your own sugar too.


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## Malted

Wolfy said:


> Didn't you say above that Golden Syrup _IS _the first boiling of refinery molasses?



Ok I'm up for some philosophical product ponderings (since I have obviously gone down that path already!)  

Answer: *Not really, but sort of; you could interpret it that way*.
It would seem to be a gray area in terms of definition and I am sure it is how manufacturers of sarsaparilla are able to confuse people like us. 

Different end products from the same input products. Golden syrup seems to be the first boiling of the hydrolysed sugar crystals from the mill; it is yet not refinery molasses at that point. This sugar syrup does not appear to become 'refinery molasses' until it is processed three times. It is all the same syrup, it just depends on how many times it is processed as to what product it becomes or is labelled as. The properties of the syrup change each time it is processed. 

As you would know, when you cook sugars they caramelise (this is essentially chef talk for controlled burning, ok lets say browning because it sounds better). The more you cook it, the darker it becomes hence golden syrup is light and refinery molasses is much darker.


Gee I feel like a sugar nerd. Remember I am not a sugar expert nor a food scientist. I am just interpreting and synthesising the research I have done; it is highly probable that my knowledge contains errors.


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## Malted

manticle said:


> You can invert your own sugar too.



Seems to be the case.
It seems to me you could break the glycosidic bond of a carbohydrate such as starch into its two glucose sugars through an enzymatic reaction instigated through mashing a malted grain? What are the enzymes at work in the mash? Would it be invertase? I suppose it depends on temp etc?

You could add the enzyme Invertase to sugar (sucrose) to produce simpler sugars (such as glucose and fructose) that are easier for yeasties to digest.



I am getting out of my depth; I should have stayed with my feet dangling in the kiddies pool. I should have left it at, seems to be the case, or just kept my mouth shut.


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## Malted

*UPDATE: 
*I bought some more shredded sarsaparilla root from Fleabay - no flavour in it either. I abondoned the 'natural' ingredients and used the extract.

Friday night I put the brew in the fridge to crash chill it and kegged it on Sunday evening. Nice solid yeast cake and larger than I thought given it's apparent slowness in fermentation. Yeasties settled out very well. The liquid remained quite inky brown (did not get stripped of colour during ferment.)
I added a bottle of extract to the keg as I was filling it (much like squid ink!):






*Verdict:
*Not bad, could be better but won't get tipped on the lawn. It is good enough for my kidneys & liver to have a go at. 
I think it tastes ok but could be a little sweeter perhaps (maybe more Golden syrup in the recipe), probably needs a hint of liquorice and/or anise for rounding on the palette (but would depend on the particular extract). 
SWMBO says it is good and not to touch it (as in do not add anything else to it).

These were the specs:

17 Litres total volume.

1.70 kg Golden syrup (CSR brand in square plastic jars)
0.50 kg Light DME
0.40 kg Dark DME
0.25 kg Maltodextrine
Boiled filtered water added to fermenter with ingredients, stirred and filtered water added to reach pitching temp.

OG 1.056, FG 1.020 after 2 weeks. Wyeast 1099 Whitbread pitched at 22 oC. Fermented at 19oC. 
4.69% ABV.
Sarsaparilla liquid extract (as pictured above) added to keg.

May have overcarbed it a bit. Serving at 100 kpa, might try 80 kpa (since this what Beer Smith says). Also think the beer lines are too short (but that is another story).
Dark creamy head that leaves residuals all the way down the glass. Lingering flavour in the mouth but not too overpowering. 

Must take more samples to make a more informed opinion... :drinks:


I also found a google search term that gets a few more interesting results. Don't search for "alcoholic" rootbeer etc, use the term "hard" and it gets more useful results (_as in _hard liquor).


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## MarkBastard

If it's not sweet enough couldn't you add something sweet to the keg? I'm assuming that because it's at cold temperatures it wouldn't ferment any added sugers?


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## Supra-Jim

Add some lactose to the keg to sweeten it up a touch?

Cheers SJ


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## Wolfy

Yep, adding more refined sugar (Golden syrup) will not help since the yeast will simply ferment all the sugars, to make it sweeter you'll need something non-fermentable like lactose or to back-sweeten after you've removed (or killed) the yeast.


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## Malted

Supra-Jim said:


> Add some lactose to the keg to sweeten it up a touch?
> 
> Cheers SJ




I was thinking some complex sugar such as Sucrose (i.e. more golden syrup - usually about 44% Sucrose) as I reckon you can taste Lactose (and I don't really like it). But Wolfy is probably right, the residual yeasties would probably get through it eventually despite the cold. Maybe I could race them to see who finishes first? 

How would you kill the yeast without destroying flavours or boiling out the alcohol?

But I had better not touch it if I am to follow SWMBO's orders.




Here's a label  (below) for the kegerator. It is a bit of a running joke with SWMBO's sister who arrives for a visit tommorrow.


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## Wolfy

Malted said:


> How would you kill the yeast without destroying flavours or boiling out the alcohol?


Potassium sorbate (1/2 teaspoon per gallon) is recommended by Ken Schramm for mead (it does not kill the yeast but stops it fermenting), I'd assume it would work well here too.


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## manticle

Malted said:


> I was thinking some complex sugar such as Sucrose (i.e. more golden syrup - usually about 44% Sucrose) as I reckon you can taste Lactose (and I don't really like it). But Wolfy is probably right, the residual yeasties would probably get through it eventually despite the cold. Maybe I could race them to see who finishes first?
> 
> How would you kill the yeast without destroying flavours or boiling out the alcohol?
> 
> But I had better not touch it if I am to follow SWMBO's orders.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a label  (below) for the kegerator. It is a bit of a running joke with SWMBO's sister who arrives for a visit tommorrow.




Sucrose isn't that complex and yeast have no real trouble eating it. The cold will help though. Maybe try various sweeteners in a glass until you find one you like? Alternatively, pour yourself a glass that has had a teaspoon of sugar added. That way you can keep the keg untouched for your lady and have the sweeter version yourself. Brown sugar might work nicely.

You can kill yeast by pasteurisation which doesn't require boiling temps. Anything above 50 would probably do it although more regular temps seem to be higher.

Please research pasteurisation before taking my advice though - it's not something I have done and I'm probably not keen (additives like sulphites and sorbates I'm also no keen on. Whatever flavour lactose may or may not have is preferable to sodium met and its propensity to give me rotten hangovers).


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## felten

You could filter it, not sure what size filter you need to strip out yeast


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## Malted

Some good advice, thanks guys! I appreciate your ideas.
There are a few good options for me to consider.


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## Malted

Whoah a bit of a reality check! 
I just read way too many pages of "Fully Automated Brewing System Design, Self milling, mashing, lautering, boiling, hop adds, chill, ferment" and despite being rather amusing, it did make me look at my behaviour. Newby has 'new' idea that has already been done, over complicates it, prattles on about irrelevant stuff, annoys people, asks questions but does not listen to advice - mmmm I am seeing me fit this picture. Prattling on about what I'd researched rather than more about what I had actually done. I get verbal diarrhoea sometimes, thanks for your patience and advice. 

BTW this story is not finished yet, there are many suggestions and comments in here that I am aiming to experiement with in future (unspecified time frame) batches.


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## felten

This thread is nowhere near as bad as the automated brewing one, not yet anyway....


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## Malted

I went to the Lighthouse Tavern and had a sars on Saturday, then went home and had one of mine. Now that my pallet has 'matured', I think I like mine better! Baseline level met! Mine has a little more depth to it.

Good news #2. I finally got to speake with the brewer whilst at the Lighthouse. Collin is a good bloke and gave me a few tips. He says forget molasses and golden syrup. He brews a base of light malt and adds essence in the last two minutes of the wort boil. He said it took him about 20 brews to get it right. He said to add liquid glucose to sweeten it. He gets his essence from Queensland and said he found it by Googling it. Collin was happy to talk about it, unfortunately he was busy serving and I had girls with me who wanted to go somewhere else... didn't get much time to talk to him.


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## Wolfy

Malted said:


> Good news #2. I finally got to speake with the brewer whilst at the Lighthouse. Collin is a good bloke and gave me a few tips.


Cool, now we can let you perfect the recipe over the next 20 brews and you can keep us updated on what works best. 
I'd be interested in brewing some, but have a few other 'experimental' projects. :chug:


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## fnqbrew

Craft Brewer sell root beer extract. I recently tried a non-alco version of the #2. Basically threw 2kgs of cheap white sugar, 500grams of CSR golden syrup, and the root beer extract in a bucket and half filled it with hot tap water. Stirred it up, put in a keg, topped it up, chilled, gassed, and was in heaven. I have the gnome brand here to try, too. I wouldn't mind betting CB is the qld source for the brewery..

Good luck with the adventures. I'd be interested to read about how you get on if you keep going.


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## SuiCIDER

I'm only new to these forums and haven't seen evidence of it, but you guys don't bottle pasteurise? It's the perfect way to get a sweet fermented product without adding non-fermentable sugars or synthetic sugars... I'm happy to share the method?


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## BjornJ

Hi,
yes, wouldn't mind knowing more about how that works.

Do you boil the capped bottles to kill the yeast?

thanks
Bjorn


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## SuiCIDER

Well, yeah essentially. It's a bit more complicated. I'll make a new thread on it so people can ask question in there.... 

EDIT: It won't let me make a new thread, probably because I'm too new. I'll wait overnight and post in the morning.


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## andy1990

Has anyone come up with the perfect recipe? please tell


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## Green-Lobster

i was given a recipe for sassafras beer whilst living in Hobart . i never tried it but remember a critical stipulation on trunk diamater , it needed to be under or over a certain size as this effected the essential oil, sap, tannin, constituent. im thinking under ,meaning young tree but im not sure.. I shall try to locate it . I like the idea of alco sars and think its well worth a crack . An old german Logger /bushie gave me his secret recipe.


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## andy1990

Sounds good! let me know if you find it.



Green-lobster said:


> i was given a recipe for sassafras beer whilst living in Hobart . i never tried it but remember a critical stipulation on trunk diamater , it needed to be under or over a certain size as this effected the essential oil, sap, tannin, constituent. im thinking under ,meaning young tree but im not sure.. I shall try to locate it . I like the idea of alco sars and think its well worth a crack . An old german Logger /bushie gave me his secret recipe.


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## A Hippie That Brews

Hello All

Try This Extract Zatarain's Root Beer Extract it is a double sars


You can get it here in Australia
http://redbacktrading.com.au/contents/en-us/d60.html

My Alco Root Beer (you would add more extract to increase the sars flavour) SG 1.080 - High 9.5% ABV

Recipe Name Amount
Ingredient 1 Sarsaparilla Root 5 Tlbsp
Ingredient 2 Liquorice Root 3 Tlbsp
Ingredient 3 Star Anise 1
Ingredient 4 Fresh Grated Ginger Root 1 Tsp
Ingredient 5 Cardamom Pod 1
Ingredient 6 Sultanas 10
Ingredient 7 Fresh Lemon Juice 1 Tsp
Ingredient 8 Vanilla Extract 2 Drops
Ingredient 9 Sea Salt 1 Drop
Ingredient 10 Zatarians Root Beer Extract 1/4 Tsp
Ingredient 11 Dextrose 6 Cups
Ingredient 12 Dark Brown Sugar 3 Tlbsp
Ingredient 13 Maltodextrin 4 Tlbsp
Ingredient 14 SN9 Yeast 2 grams
Ingredient 15 DAP Yeast Nutrient 1 Tsp
Ingredient 16 Filtered Boiled Water 4 Litres

Sanitized Equipment 
Measuring Spoons, Measuring Cup, Scales, 5 Litre Bucket, Wooden Spoon, Fine Straining Cloth, 5 Litre Demijohn, Bung & Fermentation Lock 

Step 1 Combine Sarsaparilla Root, Liquorice Root, Grated Ginger Root, Star Anise, Cardamom Pod, Sultanas & Sea Salt with 500ml of filtered water in a saucepan and boil for 5 minutes, let this steep for a further 5 minutes then strain into mixing bucket. Keep Wort and return to saucepan with 250ml filtered water, bring back to the boil and strain to mixing bucket, Repeat this step until you have 3 litres of liquid (ten times) so that all flavour has been released from the Wort, you should see that the colour gets lighter as you go. 
Step 2 Add Lemon Juice, Vanilla Extract, Zatarians Root Beer Extract, Dextrose, Dark Brown Sugar & Stir Well. 
Step 3 Add 1 Litres Cold Filtered Water & Let Cool 
Step 4 Once Cool Add SN9 Yeast & DAP Yeast Nutrient & Stir Well 
Step 5 Pour into 5Ltr Demijohn & Add Bung with Fermentation Lock 
Step 6 Add Maltodextrin When Bottling with Priming Sugar


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## andy1990

That sounds really good! how do you find the finished product? does it taste like bundy sars?


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## A Hippie That Brews

Hi Andy

To get it to taste like bundy sars you need to add 1 Tablespoon of extract


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## Malted

I was really disappointed with the sarsaparilla root that I had purchased ( I don't recall from where). It was just woody with no real flavour. Powdered Liquorice root was ok though. 
Extract kicks butt over sticks, pods and leaves, IMO. 

Hippie - why 9.5% ABV? I'd personally aim for something of a sessionable strength.


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## andy1990

Nothing wrong with 9.5% :lol: unless you had to drive somewhere then that could be a problem.


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## A Hippie That Brews

Hi All

Why 9.5% ABV

Well I found that when I went to this level of ABV it lasted longer when left for awhile, but I was making larger batches then and adding no extract so it was more a root beer not a sarsaparilla. alcohol acts as a preservative.

now I just do a batch every week and had not bothered to lower the ABV. So I have 3x700ml & 6x325ml coming out each week from 3x5ltr carboy/demijohn in rotation.

I like the roots, pods and leaves as they have very good health properties. but yes I have had trouble getting that familiar sarsaparilla store bought taste, that's why I cheat with a little extract.


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## JonGee

You were right about the fact that Bundy Soft Drinks used to have a drink called "Horehound". It was discontinued a few years ago, as the barrels or wooden vats they used to make it in had deteriorated and had to be gotten rid off. Unfortunately the cost of new vats was significant, and "Horehound" only sold in small amounts. Hence it a commercial decision to discontinue it.

Source: A lady at work (whose favourite Bundy Softdrink was Horehound) called the company to find out why it was no longer available.


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