# Domestic Violence



## Black Devil Dog (10/9/15)

*Men don't hit women!*

Those words are the exact words my dad growled at me, when, as a 15 year old, I hit my sister during an argument. He was holding me by the ear when he said it and he stood about 6ft tall, so he certainly had my attention.

He only needed to tell me once and I'll live my life by those words until I die.


Sadly, over the last couple of weeks we have seen some of the most despicable and unimaginably horrifying acts of brutality on women and children, committed by men.
Men who were at some stage, loving partners, husbands, fathers and protectors.

Nearly every day we hear stories of violence committed against women and children by men and it has got to stop.

The statistics are shameful. As adult men, we need to tell our sons that violence against women and children is not acceptable.


There is a high likelihood that there are men on this site who are violent against their loved ones.

If you are violent against your family. Stop now.

If you can't stop. Click here to get help. 

If you know someone who is violent in their relationship. Tell them it's not acceptable.

If you have a son. Tell them, *men don't hit women*.


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## manticle (10/9/15)

People shouldn't hit people, full stop.

Not disagreeing because I agree fully with the sentiment. Domestic violence is more prevalent in hetero relationships with men as perpetrator but it exists in gay/lesbian relationships (either type) and occasionally with women as perpetrators in hetero.
None of it is acceptable. Keep your hands to yourself.


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## dammag (10/9/15)

I think it's more than men don't hit women (I too was taught to respect women, which was obviously more than just not hitting them).

I don't believe that a normal, healthy person would hurt another person, man or woman. These guys obviously have problems where they want to cause as much damage as possible to those associated with them and then end their own pain. They want others to share their own pain. These are no "normal" act of domestic violence. They are murder, suicides. Albeit, in the public eye.


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## Reedy (10/9/15)

Men don't hit women!

+1 although it would be my mother I'd more afraid of than my father based on what she'd threatened to do to her 3 sons if we ever raised a hand to our wives!


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## mosto (10/9/15)

I have three boys. I try to instill in them it's not acceptable to abuse anyone, physically, emotionally etc, regardless of gender. My only exception is if they're physically in danger and there's no other option, do what you have to do to protect yourself. We're expecting our first girl next month. I'll be teaching her exactly the same thing.


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## Dan Dan (10/9/15)

It's sad that we even have to say this.


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## real_beer (11/9/15)

Human beings are:

The most beautiful thing on the planet, and the most evil thing on the planet.

I respect all life and I'm not scared of spiders, snakes, lions, and sharks etc. But the darkness of a human mind in action scares the shit out of me.

Just do the best you can each day in the world you travel through doing little random acts of kindness when the opportunity arises, believe me you can really help make the world a better place. :icon_cheers:


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## Dave70 (11/9/15)

Lets also rail against men hitting men and downplaying it as 'within context' or 'In the heat of the moment'. If I drag a fellow motorist from his car and punch his jaw loose because he run into the back of me at a stop sign I'll be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. When the smart phone footage inevitably is replayed on the Today Tonight, people viewers will be aghast at the violence. 
Conversely, if at footy on the weekend I take umbrage to being roughed up in a tackle and decide to smack an opposition player in the mouth after the play the ball, what? Sent off for ten? Face the judiciary? No doubt I'll make a you tube 'best of' compilation thats for sure. On things for sure, i wont be escorted from the field in handcuffs by the police. Think of the message being sent, particular to the impressionable younger minds in the crowd, chaperoned no doubt by many fathers with the 'bring back the biff' mentality. 

I'm certainly not the first to notice this. 

I had heated discussion with a mate who couldn't draw a distinction between the controlled violence of MMA, of which I'm a supporter, and the sheer loss of self control driven violence we see in other sports.
In his view I was a hypocrite. Basically two sides of the same coin in his view. And he's not alone.


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## MastersBrewery (11/9/15)

Domestic violence gents doesn't begin and end with physical assault. Probably worse is the unseen domestic violence of bullying and control. Threatening to kick some one out of the house is an act of domestic violence, withholding finances, controlling social interactions, denying contact with children. At any point if some one is trying to control another freedom of choice in any matter and they live together it's domestic violence.
Now 60 years ago if the police turned up to a DV incident the cops would be asking the poor beat up wife why she provoked her husband and advised next time she had better have dinner on the table when he got home from the pub. The social pendulum has swung, and whilst DV is portrait as a crime committed by males it's not always the case. My ex has a blackbelt in taekwondo, and believe me police could care if a bloke has a few cuts and bruises, other way around and I would have been whistling tunes in a cell.
Right now there would be very few people who would allow a school or any other person to administer corporeal punishment on their own children, and it has all but vanished from schools, because this happen to my generation and the one before and we said we're not having our kids go through that.
All relationships are a compromise, some times you have to sit with stuff you don't like or that bugs the hell out of you, you pick and choose what is important enough to stand for, forcing someone to accept your way is not only DV but the sun setting on the love and trust relationships are built on.


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## Blind Dog (11/9/15)

There's a world of difference (IMO) between two consenting adults with appropriate training and skill levels facing each other in a controlled environment and unchecked thuggery whether it happens on the street, in the home or on the sports field. Never have and never will understand why the law of the land seems to end at the edge of a sports field.


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## pcmfisher (11/9/15)

Its all very well to say that nobody should not hit each other, but if it ever arose that my daughter / sister / friend had been hit by their partner, the scum would get one warning and if it happened again, well, lets say it wouldn't happen after that.


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## Weizguy (11/9/15)

Black Devil dog, you said "Men who were at some stage, loving partners, husbands, fathers and protectors". I disagree, as some blokes have been cnuts from the outset and even though it's been generational, there's still no excuse. Just because Dad beat the snot out of Mum, most nights for years, now I should have the same respect for my wife, and keep her in line and well-controlled, just waiting for an excuse. She knew what she was getting into, as I beat her often during our courting period, etc...

As for women beating guys up, I have familial experience, and I'm sure that he defended himself, and it was always an even match, but only one could get away with leaving visible marks... The police got to know them quickly, even after they moved house a few times.

Controlling partners? Don't get me started.


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## HBHB (11/9/15)

20+ years of tending to broken wives, kids and husbands because some arse wipe didn't feel sufficiently strong enough to vent their anger/frustration/drug/substance fuelled rage or just plain shitty inhumane attitude elsewhere.

Must say there was a hell of a lot of battered husbands along the way with unexplained injuries.....just not to the same extent of battered wives.

The thing about a bloke who will lift a hand to harm a woman.....they're not really men. Scum, yes - men, definitely not. Being taught to do it by shitty role model for a father figure isn't a reason to do what you know is just plain wrong. It's just another bullshit excuse to cop out at someone else's expense.

Man Up


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## Gelding (11/9/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> *Men don't hit women!*
> 
> Those words are the exact words my dad growled at me, when, as a 15 year old, I hit my sister during an argument. He was holding me by the ear when he said it and he stood about 6ft tall, so he certainly had my attention.
> 
> ...



Fair enough but is it ok for men to hit men ?

I think we are too heavily influenced by what we see in the movies.


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## seamad (11/9/15)

Timely article in todays Guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/sep/11/most-people-dont-get-domestic-violence-because-it-doesnt-make-sense


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## madpierre06 (11/9/15)

It's a complex and bastard of an issue that in most cases can't be addressed via a 'man it up'. There are those who learn that this is how you do relationships by what they see growing up. There vare those who need to control all areas of life, those who are just violent in how they do life, and all points and shades of grey in between, and those who are just BAD!!

Having said that, most perpetrators are at some stage going to be made aware that their actions are unacceptable, and then they do have a choice to do something about it. For some, this can be a relatively simple process, for others not so as they have no idea how to live life any other way as they've never known any other way. This is a 'whole of society' problem, and requires a solution based around this. The trouble is, our society has been drifting/shaped towards a completely self-centred way of living. There has been more and more insecurity introduced into families due to our govts over the years completely dismantling job and housing security. Numerous other contributors to this blight on our society abound.

There are solutions which are not necessarily palatable to some, but if willing to try the results cvan be astounding and families restored. It depends how deeply the instincts driving the actions are rooted as to how quickly success can be achieved.

But at end of the day, it all comes back to the individual. If he/she is willing to sort it out....there is always an answer.


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## JDW81 (12/9/15)

And when influential organisations have an opportunity to make an example out of a public figure who has been charged with domestic violence and has an AVO taken out against them (which has been breached), to show that it is unacceptable they are found wanting. Why? Because it is football finals and winning counts for more than anything. 

JD


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## madpierre06 (12/9/15)

Thing is, this particular organisation is nothing to do with sport...it is simply a means to generate corporate dollars, so there is no room for real principled action. Just look at any fully professional 'sporting' organisation, draws are compromised and weighted to suit particular (bigger drawing/paying) teams, cover ups, etc...so it is no surprise that they would pull sleight of hand with things like this. And the chooks do have great influence at HQ.

And the NRL allowed two blokes who threatened a ref at a junior comp to get off with 6 week suspensions and a fine and community service. They are no nearer integrity than an integrity-less anti integrity campaigner.


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## Black Devil Dog (24/9/15)

Sadly, this despicable behaviour continues to happen.

It's ugly to hear about, it would be uglier to be on the receiving end, but the ugliest of all, is the perpetrator.

Thankfully, one of the first things Turnbull is doing, is taking action on this scourge.

There is only one acceptable outcome, domestic violence must stop.


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## wereprawn (24/9/15)

A lot of it lately is fuckwits off their guts on ice. Quite a few of the fatal attacks seem to be by blokes who look like they're on the roids too. Particularly dangerous combo. The women had no chance .


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## manticle (24/9/15)

We can't just blame it on ice though - or alcohol for that matter. Something needs to shift so people realise they can't do this shit to other people and men as the most common perpetrators need to take a front seat. We live in a first world country and still think we can solve petty disagreements with fists.


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## GalBrew (24/9/15)

manticle said:


> We can't just blame it on ice though - or alcohol for that matter. Something needs to shift so people realise they can't do this shit to other people and men as the most common perpetrators need to take a front seat. We live in a first world country and still think we can solve petty disagreements with fists.


I think part of the problem is that the people you are describing are fuckwits. How do you stop a fuckwit being such? I ask seriously, as no amount of reasoning will get through to these 'people', they will do what they will do much like any other who exhibits habitual criminality.


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## manticle (24/9/15)

Squeeze them out, make them pariahs so they are never emulated. You can't necessarily stop fuckwittery but you maybe able to arrest or retard the spread of it.


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## wereprawn (24/9/15)

Drug enhanced " super fuckwits". Bit sensitive on the whole ice thing atm. Got dealers next door. Had to hunt a couple of their drug fucked clients out of my back yard at 5:30 yesterday morning .


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## roastinrich (24/9/15)

Whats the bet Chris Brown will still tour Australia?


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## manticle (24/9/15)

wereprawn said:


> Drug enhanced " super fuckwits". Bit sensitive on the whole ice thing atm. Got dealers next door. Had to hunt a couple of their drug fucked clients out of my back yard at 5:30 yesterday morning .


I agree that ice is really ******* unhelpful in helping humans bring out the best in themselves.


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## roastinrich (24/9/15)

Chris Brown = Rianna Basher
FWIW


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## ltp (24/9/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Sadly, this despicable behaviour continues to happen.
> 
> It's ugly to hear about, it would be uglier to be on the receiving end, but the ugliest of all, is the perpetrator.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry, I normally just lurk - but I had to bite at this bait. What on earth makes you think that making something illegal or, as quoted in the linked article, "unAustralian", would ever cause it to stop?

I'm pretty sure that the last thing running through anyone's head as they subject their partner to violence is a question of the legality of their action.

The real issue here is cultural, and as werepawn suggested above; it's a relatively new culture. And by cultural, I mean "hard drugs", and not somehow "Aussie" or "bloke" culture.


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## manticle (24/9/15)

I agree with the first bit but domestic violence is definitely not new or part of a new culture.

Can't we just all agree it's shit and there should be no more of it?

Fuckin' nerds on nerd forums over complicating everything.


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## roastinrich (24/9/15)

it's a silent epidemic.


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/9/15)

I had an ex that was violent

Sitting on the lounge and getting speakers thrown at you

No thanks


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## ltp (24/9/15)

Manticle; you're right. It's shit and there should be no more of it. 

I (in a lot of vague and uncertain terms) tried to suggest that this current media "epidemic" seems to focus mostly on victims affected by a culture of hard drug use, but also makes the fallacy of associating the abuse rate within that sub-culture to a national identity.


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## butisitart (25/9/15)

wereprawn said:


> A lot of it lately is fuckwits off their guts on ice. Quite a few of the fatal attacks seem to be by blokes who look like they're on the roids too. Particularly dangerous combo. The women had no chance .


nah - a lot of it is historical. ice is just the latest excuse (and a piss poor excuse at that) along with whatever other excuse. upbringing, no father, alcohol, copying the father, it's all just bullshit excuse.
dv is the lowest of the low, and controlling and bullying and coercion are the same thing without the bruises.
any guys on here who get into any of that should take a good hard look at yourself, without the bullshit excuses. the buck has to stop somewhere.
if you think you've got some right to hit the person you're supposed to love, then you're ******* sick.
men who blame substance abuse, upbringing, stress, the wife, their self righteous indignation or anything else aren't men. they're slime.
if your problem's that big, be big and walk away. you can always start again.


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## Ducatiboy stu (25/9/15)

butisitart said:


> if you think you've got some right to hit the person you're supposed to love, then you're ******* sick.
> men who blame substance abuse, upbringing, stress, the wife, their self righteous indignation or anything else aren't men. they're slime.
> if your problem's that big, be big and walk away. you can always start again.


So many excuses being made these days


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## Black Devil Dog (25/9/15)

ltp said:


> I'm sorry, I normally just lurk - but I had to bite at this bait. What on earth makes you think that making something illegal or, as quoted in the linked article, "unAustralian", would ever cause it to stop?
> 
> I'm pretty sure that the last thing running through anyone's head as they subject their partner to violence is a question of the legality of their action.
> 
> The real issue here is cultural, and as werepawn suggested above; it's a relatively new culture. And by cultural, I mean "hard drugs", and not somehow "Aussie" or "bloke" culture.


Not sure why you'd call it 'bait'.

A culture of predominantly men, bashing and killing family members should be exposed and hopefully stopped, any way it can be.

It's not a recent scourge, but ice has most likely made attacks much worse.


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## Leviathan (25/9/15)

My advice to those that cant control themselves is to give themselves an uppercut, in fact make it a triple.


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## Dave70 (25/9/15)

wereprawn said:


> Drug enhanced " super fuckwits". Bit sensitive on the whole ice thing atm. Got dealers next door. Had to hunt a couple of their drug fucked clients out of my back yard at 5:30 yesterday morning .


Set fire to their house, preferably in the two hours a week when they're asleep.


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## wereprawn (25/9/15)

butisitart said:


> nah - a lot of it is historical. ice is just the latest excuse (and a piss poor excuse at that) along with whatever other excuse. upbringing, no father, alcohol, copying the father, it's all just bullshit excuse.
> dv is the lowest of the low, and controlling and bullying and coercion are the same thing without the bruises.
> any guys on here who get into any of that should take a good hard look at yourself, without the bullshit excuses. the buck has to stop somewhere.
> if you think you've got some right to hit the person you're supposed to love, then you're ******* sick.
> ...


Mate, I've seen good men that wouldn't raise a hand to their worst enemy, try and beat shit out of family members after they'd been on amphetamines for a week or so straight . Even so there's no excuse and offenders should be dealt with accordingly.


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## kunfaced (25/9/15)

From personal experince, Ice can turn a peace loving human into an anxious explosive rage monger. The idea that it is associated with DV is ludicrous, because it is a far different danger and problem that we ALL face. No discrimination for meth related destruction. What it is good at achieving though is showing the user the absolute worse side of themselves. The pits of despair face you in so many agonizing ways that it drives you to act on impulse and primal instincts over control and rational thought. It is evil.

I never use to understand the extent of domestic violence. I moved out on my own 6 years ago, 400km away from 'home.' In my jobs, the people use to joke about how prevalent DV was in Wodonga, but would talk against it. My next door neighbour was a woman with 4 children, with a fifth otw to the bloke living with her. She was a kind person with lots of love for her children. He seemed pretty decent, could always strike up a convo. Normally when they argued, he would steam on out to the pub and that would be the end of it. One night we were woken to screaming and shit breaking at 2 in the morning. Hearrd a lot of blaming and anger towards the woman, and then a sicken sound of her skull bouncing off the floor boards. My partner called the cops and I went over with a bat. He was starting the car and trying to get away when I ran over, so I took a few swings at his car but he pissed off anyway.

Her partner had punched her square in the eye and dropped her. She was out cold when we got there, blood all over the place and kids screaming hysterically shielding their mum. It was the most devastating thing I have ever seen. She is ok now, had a string of similar events over the next few years with a string of other partners. I have intervened with several other disputes lately which I've accidentally been near. A neighbours teenage son was out the front of the house screaming threats of stabbing his mum and brother. That was a rough afternoon. It ended with the mum apologising to her out of control son. I won't go into the story but he was completely in the wrong. Stories like this add much confusion. A mother enabling her son to act out violence.

Since then I have noticed the impact on downplaying and joking about DV. It is constantly perpetuated unknowingly by so many men, that they see it ok to use it as an empty threat. They figure they will never follow through on the actions, but sometimes some of them do. Even so the empty threat is just as harmful, and DV should always be frowned upon in its many forms.


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## pcmfisher (25/9/15)

In so many cases it gets reported 20 times and nothing gets done.

Eventually someone gets killed.

How can this be allowed to happen?


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## malt and barley blues (25/9/15)

How many people suffer with ACP, it doesn't have to be drug or alcohol related, there are those who just cannot control their anger, and until those people realise that they are the problem no amount of money being thrown at violence against women will do a lot to stop it. 
The best way to control anger is not to get angry, I have 6 sons and a daughter I have taught them that anger must be controlled, a lost temper is a loss of respect.
We should have a good deterrent, a proper prison term, with counselling for anger management, hopefully during the sentence the partner can move on.


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## mwd (25/9/15)

The latest government ploy is to issue all women aged over 18 with one of these except NT where 3m crocs will do.


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## Dave70 (25/9/15)

malt & barley blues said:


> How many people suffer with ACP, it doesn't have to be drug or alcohol related, there are those who just cannot control their anger, and until those people realise that they are the problem no amount of money being thrown at violence against women will do a lot to stop it.
> The best way to control anger is not to get angry, I have 6 sons and a daughter I have taught them that anger must be controlled, a lost temper is a loss of respect.
> We should have a good deterrent, a proper prison term, with counselling for anger management,* hopefully during the sentence the partner can move on*.


Sadly however these women seem to bounce from one abusive relationship to the next. Almost always it comes down to personality type. Insecure, high dominance male, submissive, low self esteem female. Its not so much about these men lashing out after a few to many or a bad day, its more about power and control that manifests as physical and / or psychological abuse. Over and over you see these kinds of men are also insanely jealous and possessive.


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## malt and barley blues (25/9/15)

That is spot on about the bounce, my wife has a friend who has had 3 marriages each spouse has beaten her, she had grown up watching her mother get beaten by her father whether this gives a mind set I don't know.


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## spog (25/9/15)

I once worked with a spineless gutless ****'n wonder who's 2 fiancés left him because he bashed them.
When he claimed it was " a misunderstanding " I laughed and called him a prick,he then said he would " punch me out".
I stood up and so did he but I beat him to it when I said " hang on for 10 minutes while I go and buy a dress and put it on,then you try your best "
The rest of the crew burst out laughing and the gutless wonder jump in IT'S car and fucked of home no doubt to bash his teddy bear.
The pathetic excuse for a man.


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## Tex N Oz (25/9/15)

I don't have time to bash my missus.. By the time I've cooked dinner, cleaned dishes and fixed her a hot chocolate while she kicks back on the couch, I'm too damned tired.


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## Black Devil Dog (25/9/15)

Tex N Oz said:


> I don't have time to bash my missus.. By the time I've cooked dinner, cleaned dishes and fixed her a hot chocolate while she kicks back on the couch, I'm too damned tired.


Satire.

It works well in situations that it works in.
In situations that it doesn't work in, well, it just doesn't work.

Thanks for coming though.


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## butisitart (25/9/15)

wereprawn said:


> Mate, I've seen good men that wouldn't raise a hand to their worst enemy, try and beat shit out of family members after they'd been on amphetamines for a week or so straight . Even so there's no excuse and offenders should be dealt with accordingly.


dv has been around for a long time before amphetamines turned up. not belittling your point, cos it is a valid point, but it is far from 'THE' cause of dv.
i grew up with dv. you don't know how much i ******* hate guys who get into it. and my old man hated drugs and couldn't drink cos he copped a dose of hep A in the 60s. i got to the point where i disowned him and haven't spoken to him since 1991. i'll only go to his funeral to make sure the bastard's dead.

meth is almost another broad societal excuse as to why it happens. it's getting used like it's the problem. like we all need to blame something other than the fact that it is actually a person doing this, and more than likely is not on anything. the dick that hanged his 8 year old in brisbane 2 weeks ago then drove off into the sunset wasn't on anything. get over the meth excuse.


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## Tex N Oz (26/9/15)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Satire.
> 
> It works well in situations that it works in.
> In situations that it doesn't work in, well, it just doesn't work.
> ...


Geez dude.. Bottom line is either you love your missus or you bash your missus. I'm one who loves mine.
What I said was absolutely true 100% every word. I'm medically retired and my missus is a hard working nurse.
She comes home and asks for NOTHING.. In a way it was comedy and in another it was me saying "I'm not a part of that".
Now you can all be sad that this shit happens but I'm not gonna drown myself in remorse for something that doesn't take place in my life, in my home or with those close to me.
I support any law that hammers these fuckwits but I'm no vigilante for the cause and I refuse to wallow in other's problems. If it takes place in your life then you clean up your own mess.
If your mum was slapped around and you as a child had to watch it, then you should have this discussion with your mum, not me.
Now excuse me while I go hang out the washing...


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## wereprawn (26/9/15)

butisitart said:


> dv has been around for a long time before amphetamines turned up. not belittling your point, cos it is a valid point, but it is far from 'THE' cause of dv.
> i grew up with dv. you don't know how much i ******* hate guys who get into it. and my old man hated drugs and couldn't drink cos he copped a dose of hep A in the 60s. i got to the point where i disowned him and haven't spoken to him since 1991. i'll only go to his funeral to make sure the bastard's dead.
> 
> meth is almost another broad societal excuse as to why it happens. it's getting used like it's the problem. like we all need to blame something other than the fact that it is actually a person doing this, and more than likely is not on anything. the dick that hanged his 8 year old in brisbane 2 weeks ago then drove off into the sunset wasn't on anything. get over the meth excuse.


Never claimed drugs were "THE" problem . Shit, my wifes father brutality murdered her mum right in front of her as a child and he didn't take drugs. All I'm saying is that amphetamine based recreational drugs increase dv and often make the violence deadly .


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## jyo (26/9/15)

Bureaucrats and policy makers want to focus more on the reactive approach to fixing problems at the end point when it comes to DV- punishment, longer sentences, more women's refuges, etc. These are all really important, but it's a bandaid response. 

Angry children who can't self-regulate (or understand) their emotions sometimes grow into angry adults who react with violence. I think placing a more proactive emphasis on finding out why kids are so angry, and trying to help them before they grow up would be a far better response. 

With current wait times of up to a year from referral to actually seeing a psychologist, psychiatrist, pediatrician etc, we have a long way to go before our under funded health services come even close to addressing violence in this country.


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## Tex N Oz (26/9/15)

jyo said:


> Bureaucrats and policy makers want to focus more on the reactive approach to fixing problems at the end point when it comes to DV- punishment, longer sentences, more women's refuges, etc. These are all really important, but it's a bandaid response.
> 
> Angry children who can't self-regulate (or understand) their emotions sometimes grow into angry adults who react with violence. I think placing a more proactive emphasis on finding out why kids are so angry, and trying to help them before they grow up would be a far better response.
> 
> With current wait times of up to a year from referral to actually seeing a psychologist, psychiatrist, pediatrician etc, we have a long way to go before our under funded health services come even close to addressing violence in this country.


I say on strike 2 cut their fuckin nuts off and they'll behave..
But saying that isn't PC either and I'm sure I'll hear all about the poor nutless basher..


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## seamad (26/9/15)

I've got 2 ex-mates who wouldn't change. Neither I'd describe as angry/violent as a primary behaviour, moreso they were both extremely controlling/possesive, and a failure at compliance ( to their wishes ) would set them off. Part of the plan announced in giving victims a mobile phone is fraught with danger, when the controlling type finds a "secret " phone the shit will hit the fan.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

And I think that is what half the problem is.

Mr Asshole tells his missus that if anything happens or he finds anything then she will be a dead person

Then he tells her how much he loves her...etc...etc


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## indica86 (26/9/15)

DVOs work well don't they.


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## malt and barley blues (26/9/15)

indica86 said:


> DVOs work well don't they.


I didn't miss out on the sarcasm indica, but really, what are they worth, I doubt whether any are adhered to, and I wonder how many neighbours would get involved in a dispute between a couple, not just personally but with a call to the police?


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## indica86 (26/9/15)

Not worth a pinch of shit.
I have seen someone get a certificate for Ending Family Violence.
Why don't I get one for Never Starting Family Violence?


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

malt & barley blues said:


> I didn't miss out on the sarcasm indica, but really, what are they worth, I doubt whether any are adhered to, and I wonder how many neighbours would get involved in a dispute between a couple, not just personally but with a call to the police?


Tuff call

Old mate is already at full flight and you want to go in and calm/stop him him....


AVO's are not worth shit at the the funeral of a dead person


----------



## dicko (26/9/15)

Not exactly DV but I wonder what penalty the parasite gets that punched the female at the footy?

"Aawww judgee I was a bit pissed and my team was losing and after all she was having a go at me"

Reply,
Well I consider what you did very bad but under the circumstances you were provoked and I will release you on good behavour and no hitting anyone at the next footy game...OK.

I would bet my hanging thingos that this same parasite beats other females....I would have liked to have seen the womans partner beat the absolute crap out of that animal.
I would imagine it would be a similar situation to spogs post above...all bullies are tough until they meet their match, then they bow down of **** off.

Edit
Shit I am watching the news and the woman is an off duty police officer....maybe he will cop a bit after all.


----------



## GalBrew (26/9/15)

So.....what all these posts come down to are fuckwits be fuckwits. If you can find a way of stopping this the world will be a much better place DV nonwithstanding.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

GalBrew said:


> So.....what all these posts come down to are fuckwits be fuckwits. If you can find a way of stopping this the world will be a much better place DV nonwithstanding.


Its more than that

I can tolerate a fuckwitt. Plenty of non violent fuckwits in the world

I *CAN NOT* tolerate a person who beats another person. Period

I have a single mother living across the road from me. All I ever hear is screaming & crying from the kids. Its pretty fucked up. 

Those kids will never know anything else but being sworn at and abused...from their own mother

My kids dont play with them, not cause they are bad kids, not because I have told them they cant, but my kids can see that its not a very nice place be


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## indica86 (26/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Those kids will never know anything else but being sworn at and abused...from their own mother


And the way shit rolls, odds on they will act the same way.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

Can only agree

You learn what you experience as a child


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## dicko (26/9/15)

Maybe a result like this may change things.....

My dad used to beat my mum when I was young but we havent seen dad for a while....the judge gave him 12 years gaol.


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## GalBrew (26/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Its more than that
> 
> I can tolerate a fuckwitt. Plenty of non violent fuckwits in the world
> 
> ...


That's fucked up Stu. You and those kids have my sympathies. Now that I am a dad the thought of beating a kid or abusing a child in any way is the most abhorrent thing I can contemplate.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

There is nothing wrong with discipline 

A smack on the ass does not hurt when needed

BUT... continually ...no..sorry...that achieves nothing

Yes i did give my kids a smack on the ass when they where younger, but not the violent slap around as some do

The amount of times I actually smacked my kids was not very much, and it was nothing more than a hand on the ass

Proud of it, no, needed, probably yes. 

I have clear memories of being "belted' as a kid..yes, I did deserve some of them

i am teaching my kids that violence, fisti-cuffs and swearing are not good things and chip them every time


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## Eagleburger (26/9/15)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHfBXHari34


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## Brew Forky (26/9/15)

It's not ice or whatever is politically correct at the time. I want to precede this by saying I have never hit or emotionally abused etc etc a woman. In fact, i treat them very well.

I had a business where my ex had a business close to me. She abosolutley ensured customers would not come back by coming in to my shop, carrying on, putting me down, talking about what was in her store and basically saying my business was shit and hers was better. Most morons believed it and she took them away for a sale. I didn't want anything to do with her and told her not to come my store anymore. I was already at the end, living on the couch in my store from the outcome of our relationship. She then proceeded to lie on the shops door step at night, leaving her young daughters at home to fend for themselves, crying and screaming for days until she got the idea the calling the police on me would be a good idea. So a muscle builder cop and a lesbian cop had me thrown to the ground and I was physically assaulted by them because of my "Domestic Violence".

Some one deserves a punch in head. But I don't hit women.

A lady I knew for many years and I thought I was part of the family with, accused me of wanting to rape her 5yo Granddaughter at a wedding I was at. She wanted to go to the basement toilet so Uncle Brew Forky wanted to make sure she was safe by standing at the toilet door and that's it. I had to explain to my old Mum as a grown man crying that I was not a child rapist and have never been the same since. Still nervous that I will go out and someone will bash me for being a "child molester" because a lot of people know what she said.

Some one deserves a punch in head. But I don't hit women.

At an Oktoberfest, my GF at the time and myself had a disagreement in which she then decided to tell her butch girlfriend. Her friend then gave me a solid punch to the face. When I got home with my lip broken, my GF caught me unaware and threw me through an inbuilt wardrobe, breaking both doors in two and I scored a gash across the face. The police were called by roommates and I was the bad guy.

Some one deserves a punch in head. But I don't hit women.

My mates ex won the Lotto, and then complained to Child support that he doesn't pay enough, even though he looks after the child for 12 days per fortnight and a massive percent of his wage then went to her.

etc, etc, etc.

I'm a big fella and not scared of any blokes bullshit, but you have no rights when it comes to a Womans whim. Those ******* shit head cowards who beat their beautiful wives to feel like a man deserve everything they get. But you have to realise, some men are driven insane, and when they crack, it's their fault apparently, and then we can all sit here and be all nancy PC about how they are arseholes on a public forum.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

I will say that i have known more than one person who has been framed by a simple call to the police

that aside

*Anyone who hits anyone in my book has no respect*


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## Brew Forky (26/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> *Anyone who hits anyone in my book has no respect*


Agreed.


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## butisitart (26/9/15)

there seems to be a general agreement here that neanderthals on dv are scum. that doesn't fix the problem.
i propose that all here think about a neighbourhood watch style thing where you talk to your neighbours and agree to confront en masse, in a group neighbourly way, on anybody you think is up for a bit of dv. just a friendly 'how ya going'. sounds nerdy, but if a dv candidate realises all the boys in the neighbourhood are onto him then it may, sometimes, but not always, steer him back out of it. not all bullies like an audience. it may just bring him around.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

Problem is that it is silent

The receivers wont talk about it

That is the problem


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## Brew Forky (26/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> I will say that i have known more than one person who has been framed by a simple call to the police
> 
> that aside
> 
> *Anyone who hits anyone in my book has no respect*


Mate, I'm far from a violent man, and rereading my post it sounds a bit rough. True, but rough. I don't settle arguments "with a punch to the head". I think my emotions got the best of me in that post.


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

Mate. i lived with a violent woman. Ex Navy....was shit scary


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## butisitart (26/9/15)

my first missus was a half violent nutter. i knew it was over when i realised i'd married my parents.
my second missus of 15 years is gold. she's the brady bunch mum that i wished i had when i was 13.
me one lucky boy


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

Most people associate DV with men

There are some shit scary women out there who know how to buck the system

With out being cynical, I know blokes who have been sent to jail on the word of a spiteful women


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## Brew Forky (26/9/15)

They play the game. I've had a bloke next door literally crying and screaming out the front of the house to see his child he hasn't seen for months because he's been disconnected due to his ex . The response out the front window was, "I'm calling the police and telling them you abused me."


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## Ducatiboy stu (26/9/15)

My brother is going thru hell simply because his ex claims he is a peado, without any proof or claim. To the point where she cant even provide evidence to court. wont even turn up to appointed mediation. uses delaying tactics.....

The system is broken


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## butisitart (26/9/15)

back to the topic, lads....
first, dv dickheads. let's work on that.
then we can tackle dv hell cats in about 2 generations time.
the control thing is probably our worst nightmare. that's where everything else grows from.
i lived 25 years in europe (mainly in spain) and 5 in north asia (sth korea and japan) - and australian males are easily the biggest control freaks i ever met.
that ain't pretty, and i'm sure there'll be a lot of indignation over that, but even compared to sth korea, aussie males are another level. i've got 3 adult spanish daughters who won't live in aus because of the aus male culture.


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## Brew Forky (27/9/15)

The topic is domestic violence. We are talking about domestic violence. Abuse physically, emotionally and psychologically. We'll deal with abuse from women in 2 generations time???

You've been to Asia. I've spent a lot of time in SE Asia. Australian men are saints compared to the way men treat women there if that is your argument. You know that obviously since you're a well travelled man.

Australian men aren't as shit as you imply. There are certainly dickheads here, like any country, but all in all, the quintessential Aussie male is a good person. Enjoy your daughters wedding with Maurico, Sergio and Gonzalo. I'm sure they wouldn't belittle a woman, Hermano.


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## spog (27/9/15)

Bloody hell Brew Forky your ex was a nasty piece of work !


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## Tex N Oz (27/9/15)

Brew Forky said:


> The topic is domestic violence. We are talking about domestic violence. Abuse physically, emotionally and psychologically. We'll deal with abuse from women in 2 generations time???
> 
> You've been to Asia. I've spent a lot of time in SE Asia. Australian men are saints compared to the way men treat women there if that is your argument. You know that obviously since you're a well travelled man.
> 
> Australian men aren't as shit as you imply. There are certainly dickheads here, like any country, but all in all, the quintessential Aussie male is a good person. Enjoy your daughters wedding with Maurico, Sergio and Gonzalo. I'm sure they wouldn't belittle a woman, Hermano.


I've travelled a lot to China and can promise you the women there are treated absolutely shit. Even in the corporate world they are just well enough to please Westerners.
I know a lot of Aussie men and I don't know a single one who hits his missus. I'm also from rural Texas and the consequences there are far more steep for bashing your missus and it's not from the law.
The stereotypical bubba smacking around his wife is a bit of overdone bullshit. The reality is Martha's dad will help you to an early dirt-nap and get away with it. Police are well known to not over investigate the early demise of a known fuckwit.


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## MastersBrewery (27/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> There is nothing wrong with discipline
> 
> A smack on the ass does not hurt when needed
> 
> ...


 My son thinks a smack on the bum is a game, lots of chasing, followed by a tap or two then a good tickling, once he's calmed down we talk 'did you do the right thing there mate?' 'I don't like it when you ....'

I hate violence I will certainly never let my son experience it from me. For me hitting a kid is telling them 'when all else fails violence is the answer'
DBS no kid ever did anything to deserve being hit with a weapon. But know it wasn't about you it was about them.

MB


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## wide eyed and legless (27/9/15)

Agree with you spog, disturbing reading that post.

I doubt if D V can be stamped out completely, its been with us since the alpha male and his group were in the trees. Self discipline is the key to controlling all of our negative emotions, and if that can't be instilled then we shall always have D V, much the same as
the racist element, being on our guard of a different culture and looks, something else which has come down with us since we were in the trees.

The sad thing is, through evolution some of the feminine gender seems to be attracted to the alpha males of today's society.


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/9/15)

Looks like Chris brwon has been denied entry due to him belting his ex Rhiana

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2015/09/27/chris-brown-denied-entry-australia


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/9/15)

Some interesting stats

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-05-29/domestic-violence-data/6503734


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## wereprawn (27/9/15)

Sometimes violence is the answer. Both of my kids (now adults) were taught to fight. My daughter has beaten shit out of blokes to save her hide. Another time a couple of blokes hit her in the head from behind with a lump of wood in an attempted mugging. She turns around, shapes up and announces " If thats the best you clowns have got, you're in fuckin trouble aren't ya"?. They ran. My son has also beaten 7 shades of shit out of other men for abusing women at parties he's attended . He has found out that the abuse stopped after he pounded the idea that men don't hit women into them. Always drummed into them when they were kids to walk away if you can, if you can't , fight back hard enough to make an example to others that allowing you to walk away will always be a safer option for them. And always stand up those who need protecting from bullies . This theory has worked every time. I say teach you girls to protect themselves with violence and teach your boys to protect females with violence. If men are not taught to not hit women by there parents, a few smacks in the mouth by any other men hearing or seeing dv happening, would sort the dv problems our society almost overnight .


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## goomboogo (27/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Looks like Chris brwon has been denied entry due to him belting his ex Rhiana
> 
> http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2015/09/27/chris-brown-denied-entry-australia


His music should be enough to ban him from entering the country.


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/9/15)

Miranda Devine at her stupidest best

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/miranda-devine-demonising-men-wont-stop-domestic-violence/story-fni0cwl5-1227545469411


"Poverty is the cause of domestic violence, the desperate chaos of the underclass, played out in welfare dependency, mental illness, alcohol and drug abuse, especially psychosis-inducing ice."


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## wide eyed and legless (27/9/15)

I think maybe she is pointing the finger at the indigenous population, but out of 63 deaths this year as a result of D V what is the ratio of the deaths between aboriginal and western culture?


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/9/15)

This is Miranda Devine we are talking about

has about as much credibility of a peice of shit


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## wide eyed and legless (27/9/15)

Yes, but under the picture of Rosie Batty they have published the facts, and it does seem to point the finger for the high stats at the indigenous population.


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## Ducatiboy stu (27/9/15)

I wouldnt treat anything written by her...EVER. as even remotely factual...even if she did manage to ( impossible for her ) to get them right. 

But There seems to be a trend that Aboriginal women suffer more statistically from DV them white folk... but weather that is due to a smaller population with higher reporting figures than white folk is something to look at


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## wide eyed and legless (27/9/15)

That is why I was wondering what the ratio of the deaths would be, in that article which you linked it stated that aboriginal women were less inclined to report D V incidents.


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## Brew Forky (27/9/15)

spog said:


> Bloody hell Brew Forky your ex was a nasty piece of work !


Which one?


----------



## spog (27/9/15)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Agree with you spog, disturbing reading that post.
> 
> I was more than willing and ready to sort that f,ing animal, and I would have. It is renowned for being a weak excuse for a man.
> Karma will get it one day.


----------



## butisitart (27/9/15)

Brew Forky said:


> The topic is domestic violence. We are talking about domestic violence. Abuse physically, emotionally and psychologically. We'll deal with abuse from women in 2 generations time???
> 
> You've been to Asia. I've spent a lot of time in SE Asia. Australian men are saints compared to the way men treat women there if that is your argument. You know that obviously since you're a well travelled man.
> 
> Australian men aren't as shit as you imply. There are certainly dickheads here, like any country, but all in all, the quintessential Aussie male is a good person. Enjoy your daughters wedding with Maurico, Sergio and Gonzalo. I'm sure they wouldn't belittle a woman, Hermano.


no they haven't belittled them, but thanks for the concern. cabron.


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## MastersBrewery (28/9/15)

wereprawn said:


> Sometimes violence is the answer. Both of my kids (now adults) were taught to fight. My daughter has beaten shit out of blokes to save her hide. Another time a couple of blokes hit her in the head from behind with a lump of wood in an attempted mugging. She turns around, shapes up and announces " If thats the best you clowns have got, you're in fuckin trouble aren't ya"?. They ran. My son has also beaten 7 shades of shit out of other men for abusing women at parties he's attended . He has found out that the abuse stopped after he pounded the idea that men don't hit women into them. Always drummed into them when they were kids to walk away if you can, if you can't , fight back hard enough to make an example to others that allowing you to walk away will always be a safer option for them. And always stand up those who need protecting from bullies . This theory has worked every time. I say teach you girls to protect themselves with violence and teach your boys to protect females with violence. If men are not taught to not hit women by there parents, a few smacks in the mouth by any other men hearing or seeing dv happening, would sort the dv problems our society almost overnight .


My son and three girls will be blackbelts in karate by 16; ability to defend one's self and being a violent person are two very different things. Eldest of the three girls(12) is learning weapons she's loving it.


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## dicko (28/9/15)

Bad Boy Elvis!!!


----------



## Batz (28/9/15)

http://barefootinvestor.com/homeless-in-a-mercedes/


----------



## madpierre06 (28/9/15)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Miranda Devine at her stupidest best
> 
> http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/miranda-devine-demonising-men-wont-stop-domestic-violence/story-fni0cwl5-1227545469411
> 
> ...


A vewry well known and 'celebrated' australian 'icon', known to be a bit of a lad, drinker, punter, or is 'ADVERTISED' as such...it was common knowledge back in the day how he used to smack his lady(s) around. Not wanbting to 'single' anyone out, of course. Not a lot of financial poverty there, and poverty has jack shit to do with it.


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## manticle (28/9/15)

Nah poor people smack their hos and bitches cos they don't have cars and only live on chips. 

Rich people are happy, have no mental illness, don't take drugs and are generally quite well behaved.
Also miranda devine is really quite lovely.


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/9/15)

manticle said:


> Nah poor people smack their hos and bitches cos they don't have cars and only live on chips.
> 
> Rich people are happy, have no mental illness, don't take drugs and are generally quite well behaved.
> Also miranda devine is really quite lovely.


Except for the rich ones who can afford coke and smart ass lawyers to get of charges and hide wealth from their partners and come across as upstanding citizens

Miranda Divine...well.....the least said about her the better...


----------



## manticle (28/9/15)

You know which font I wrote that in don't you stu?


----------



## seamad (28/9/15)




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## goomboogo (28/9/15)

manticle said:


> You know which font I wrote that in don't you stu?


I know, I know.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (28/9/15)

But she is the Pin up girl for the Liberal Party.... well Tony Abbots Liberal Party

She must be feeling a bit miffed ATM


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## Brew Forky (28/9/15)

butisitart said:


> .... but thanks for the concern. cabron.


I'll take that as positive connotation.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (28/9/15)

seamad said:


>


I dunno

Vitriole would be like tap water compared to dearest Miranda...


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## Feldon (23/1/16)

[SIZE=medium]Mark Latham has a new radio slot on MMM, called “Lathamland” the first of which was yesterday. In it he gave his views on the politics underpinning the current debate on domestic violence in Australia.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Yesterday I noticed that most news web sites ran with the story that Latham was being an apologist for violent men (which in my view was not what he actually said). [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Today the story has all but disappeared from news web sites' home pages. Interestingly, a search of the ABC News website for “Mark Latham” during the last week comes up with zero results. But a Google search finds this:[/SIZE]

*Mark Latham: Former Labor leader says domestic violence a 'coping mechanism' for men*

ABC, Updated yesterday at 6:15pm

Radio network Triple M has come under fire after former Labor leader Mark Latham used his podcast with the station to say men hit women as a "coping mechanism".

In the 20-minute podcast posted to the Triple M website, Mr Latham took aim at Australian of the Year Rosie Batty and feminists for "demonising men" and making those who hit women "feel worse about themselves".

Mr Latham's comments prompted a petition on Change.org, with signatories calling for him to be sacked from Triple M and Channel Nine.

The petition also calls for anti-domestic violence organisation White Ribbon to distance itself from Triple M and the "disgraceful podcast".

During the podcast, Mr Latham said he worried Ms Batty — whose son was murdered by her estranged partner — was "causing more harm than good".

"The patriarchy argument is that men beat up women in some cases because they hate women," he said.

"But I don't think it is about how men look at women, it is about how men look at themselves.

"They have lost their self-esteem, their job, are welfare-dependent, on drugs or alcohol in their life.

"They use domestic violence as a coping mechanism to get over all the other crap they have in their lives.

"Demonising men and making them feel worse about themselves is not going to solve the problem." (continues…)
See: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-22/mark-latham-under-fire-for-triple-m-podcast-domestic-violence/7107650

[SIZE=medium]Those interested in the topic might find it worthwhile listening to what he actually said. It’s in this 20 minute podcast (he covered many topics (eg. political correctness) – domestic violence comes up at about the 8 minute mark): [/SIZE][SIZE=medium]http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/shows/lathamland/blog/listen-and-download-the-new-lathamland-podcast/[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium](He also spoke earlier in the day on the blokey MMM breakfast show ‘The Grill Team’ to promo his new radio slot going to air later in the day : [/SIZE][SIZE=medium]http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/shows/lathamland/blog/mark-latham-says-there-is-too-much-closing-down-of-debate/[/SIZE][SIZE=medium] )[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]I think his views are a valid contribution to the discussion, said in his typical thorny style but valid nonetheless. He draws attention to statistics showing that domestic violence is more common in disadvantaged areas than in more affluent areas, and he makes a point about the hijacking of the domestic violence issue by the “feminist left”. I think it’s important that this issue be engaged in by all sectors of society and all political factions and not used as a political football to drive a wedge between men and women, and between left and right. The effects of domestic violence are universal and so must be efforts to reduce its prevalence. The sudden dissappearance of Latham’s views from news websites suggests to me that he has struck a nerve among the chattering classes.[/SIZE]


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## Glomp (23/1/16)

I would like the true stats about domestic violence be reported. My ex was in child protection and domestic violence against children, she said, was mainly by women. But the feminists will not like a little fact like that get in the way of a good story. I am against all violence but lets have the true facts so it can be treated properly.


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## manticle (23/1/16)

'The feminists' is not one homogenous group, any more than 'the men' or 'the women' are.

If we want to increase the intelligence of discussion, we should avoid such broad categorisations.


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## Feldon (23/1/16)

manticle said:


> 'The feminists' is not one homogenous group, any more than 'the men' or 'the women' are.
> 
> If we want to increase the intelligence of discussion, we should avoid such broad categorisations.


Does that include the "hos and bitches" that you intelligently mentioned above in post #102?


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## manticle (23/1/16)

You know that post was utterly sarcastic don't you?


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (23/1/16)

Unfortunately there is DV against men, but you never get to hear about it.

If the bloke speaks up nothing happens

If the woman speaks up, the male gets canned immediately


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## Kingy (23/1/16)

My cousin gets beat up by his misses. I always laugh when he tells me. Be differant if it was the other way round.


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/1/16)

I suppose you could put it this way...... How would you feel if you got beaten by your missus and no one gave a shit


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## Kingy (23/1/16)

Yea it would be shithouse. But I wouldn't be with her if she started beatin me up.


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/1/16)

Kingy said:


> Yea it would be shithouse. But I wouldn't be with her if she started beatin me up.


Problem is....they stay and cop it sweet...regardless of which side it is....


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## madpierre06 (23/1/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Problem is....they stay and cop it sweet...regardless of which side it is....


And therein lies one of the biggest problems which people have trouble accepting...if the person being belted gets hit once and stays, then every punch after that they share responsibility for. But you just try and say that publicly. I saw what happened with neighbours of ours a few years back...she used to make excuses for him hitting her, then he moved to the kids and still she did nothing. It was only one of the daughters called the cops that stopped it one day. He was one of the fellas who really should not drink, it was the only time the aggro came out.


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## spog (23/1/16)

Feldon,your post #119 I skimmed through it and two things struck me.
1. Mark Latham is a ......
2. As a long time ABC radio listener I am concerned that the ABC is ? Becoming more commercial .


Madpierre06, yrs ago our nieghbor always got shit face on Friday nights on cheap port and bashed his wife,one Friday night I was in my shed when I heard the prick start up ,his 2 kids lept the fence into my place absolutely terrified and asked me to help their mum before I could get over the fence I heard " no more" then a smash,bang and thud.
His wife ,the kids mum took the drunken bashing Cnut down by smashing it in the face with a crockpot.
Oh sweet justice.
Although we have moved I still see that gutless prick from time to time and I smile at him ,knows I know what an arsehole he is.


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## contrarian (24/1/16)

One important thing to understand about domestic violence is that it is about power and control. Physical violence may or may not be a part of it and often comes further down the track. 

Focussing on physical violence misses the point. It is often emotional abuse, isolation from family and friends, financial control and a systematic breaking down of self esteem and self efficacy so when violence does become part of the picture it isn't as simple as walking out the door. 

There is no justification for this behavior and for Latham to attempt to legitimize biome was as a coping method is flat out appalling. 

What should be taught in schools is identifying early traits of controlling and violent people so that people can avoid entering these relationships in the first place. 

At least we are finally having a conversation about this as a society. That's the first step in making some positive change.


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## MastersBrewery (24/1/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Problem is....they stay and cop it sweet...regardless of which side it is....


And if they do leave it follows them, if there are kids, it'll follow them for years and years. If it's intimidating behaviour or denigration/alienation of children; government agencies and courts won't deal with it because they just don't know how to do that without having negative impact on the children and that's if it can first be proven.
There are some fucked up people in this world who believe they should control their relationships, and that trumps everything including their own kids.
There is a very fine line between love and hate, and when the person who hates you most knows your inner most secretes, your fears,hopes,and dreams..... well lets just say I know from experience.
Solution?.... to be honest I don't know. Money as far as I can see is being poured down the funnel of family law and child protection at a rate that would seriously shock most and outcomes less than stellar. The rate of male suicide related to family breakdown is 6 or 7 times that of deaths resulting from DV. (annually)
No legal system anywhere has got this right yet, and I know it's unlikely to happen in my life time.


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/1/16)

Yeah the whole Family Law court thing is just one big nightmare....been there twice, know many who are or been there

The main problem is the massive backlog just to get a hearing, plus all the pre-requisites like mediation, parenting courses ( I kid you not !!! ) just to get your name in the book for a mention.

Then the judge will want all sorts of things from all sort of people.

In the end for something like getting more access for your kids can take longer than 12mnths and in that time a lot of damage can be done


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## Lager Bloke (24/1/16)

Sad state of affairs- I don't think anybody has the easy fix for DV problem. I will always speak up + offer help/assistance if it was friends or neighbors.If it was being done to or by one of my family it would sort it out there and then as soon as possible-nothing excuses violence and abuse against somebody in a relationship with someone else.


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## butisitart (26/1/16)

i've had the dad daughter conversations with all my daughters - 22 to 30 yrs old now. they know to get up and walk early if things start going astray - back through my front door is always a good door. i sadly don't have a way of getting HIM to walk away if he is going down that road. and that's another facet of the power thing. it's not her fault, but she has to walk. thankfully i haven't had the knock on the door, but you never really know what's going on in any relationship unless you're one of the two people in the room.


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## pcmfisher (27/1/16)

butisitart said:


> i've had the dad daughter conversations with all my daughters - 22 to 30 yrs old now. they know to get up and walk early if things start going astray - back through my front door is always a good door.* i sadly don't have a way of getting HIM to walk away if he is going down that road*. and that's another facet of the power thing. it's not her fault, but she has to walk. thankfully i haven't had the knock on the door, but you never really know what's going on in any relationship unless you're one of the two people in the room.


All you can do is have a word in his shell like ear and make it known it will be his one and only warning.


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## wide eyed and legless (27/1/16)

Lager Bloke said:


> Sad state of affairs- I don't think anybody has the easy fix for DV problem.


I second that, same as there will never be an easy fix for war, bigotry, the sucker punch, trying to change anything that is part of the human make up is like pushing shit up hill, it is nigh on impossible.


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## contrarian (27/1/16)

But it is possible to change people's behavior about what is widely considered to be normal behavior. Drink driving is a great example of something that wasn't even a thing but through changing laws and relentless campaigns is viewed very differently by society than it was a generation ago. It doesn't mean it has been completely eradicated but the harm associated has been reduced.


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## wide eyed and legless (27/1/16)

Drink driving has been reduced, people are more aware of the results of drinking and driving but it isn't a human trait, anger is something we all have, controlling that anger we don't all have, that is why we have road rage, DV , sucker punching and lacking tolerance of a different race or culture.


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## contrarian (27/1/16)

They are both about impulse control, stopping and thinking before you do something. In one case responding to people aggressively when you feel anger in another case not driving when you know you've had too many. Millions of people manage to feel anger every day and yet not take it out on other people. Not doing what you feel every second of the day is the basis of a civil society and why we have a legal system that punishes people with issues around impulse control. 

Just because people feel anger is a poor excuse to accept that there will be violence in our society and there's nothing we can do about it. We may not be able to completely irradiate it but we can make it much more socially unacceptable than it currently is.


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## wide eyed and legless (27/1/16)

As you say one is controlling an impulse but it is another kettle of fish controlling an emotion, emotion doesn't make you jump in a car and drive under the influence, but a conscious decision whether to drive or not. 
Everyone feels anger no one person is immune to it, most will control it while others can't. Everyone is capable of murdering another person but we don't go out and do it, but there are those of us who can do it without any remorse or conscience about doing it, no matter what deterrent is in place, or how socially unacceptable it is it has gone on for thousands of years and will always go on.


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## contrarian (28/1/16)

It's a massive cop out to say that some people can't control their anger and I personally think that is complete
Bull shit. All me people don't control their anger and perpetually blame other people for it. It's not because they can't it's because they won't. 

He belief that people aren't responsible for their own behaviour or can't be expected to control their emotions is what perpetuates the status quo. I would be that if these cowards who bash and kill their wives and girlfriends were facing a 2 meter tall UFC heavy weight they would find a way to be angry and emotional without resorting to violence.


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## wide eyed and legless (28/1/16)

Some people suffer with anxiety, some with depression or bi-polar they can't control that, same as a person with APC can't control their actions, they will not admit to a having a problem and therefore can't be helped until they do admit to it.
No such thing as a perfect world, yes we can try to make it better by saying there are certain things that aren't acceptable that will have some impact but I am afraid that for some that will not change their attitudes.


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## Dave70 (28/1/16)

contrarian said:


> It's a massive cop out to say that some people can't control their anger and I personally think that is complete
> Bull shit. All me people don't control their anger and perpetually blame other people for it. It's not because they can't it's because they won't.
> 
> He belief that people aren't responsible for their own behaviour or can't be expected to control their emotions is what perpetuates the status quo. I would be that if these cowards who bash and kill their wives and girlfriends were facing a 2 meter tall UFC heavy weight they would find a way to be angry and emotional without resorting to violence.


What would likely happen after facing off against the UFC guy, being further demoralized and humiliated, our hero would return home in a stinking rage and still bash their respective partner.
Replace the UFC guy with a boss, cop, smartness down the pub or any other figure who outguns him / her either physically, intellectually or both and the result will be the same. Like I said before, this shit cuts far deeper than simple anger management (though it obviously a major component). You don't even have to raise your voice or your hand do ruin someones life. Years of psychological abuse can be equally as devastating.
If you habitually go around bashing and bullying people, you are mentally ill, not just angry. If this cant be corrected with drugs or therapy, you should be removed from society until it can.


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## wide eyed and legless (28/1/16)

Alex in A clockwork orange was cured, here is a similar treatment. (the original is to explicit)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bgEHAKcG9k


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## pcmfisher (28/1/16)

Dave70 said:


> What would likely happen after facing off against the UFC guy, being further demoralized and humiliated, our hero would return home in a stinking rage and still bash their respective partner.
> Replace the UFC guy with a boss, cop, smartness down the pub or any other figure who outguns him / her either physically, intellectually or both and the result will be the same. Like I said before, this shit cuts far deeper than simple anger management (though it obviously a major component). You don't even have to raise your voice or your hand do ruin someones life. Years of psychological abuse can be equally as devastating.
> If you habitually go around bashing and bullying people, you are mentally ill, not just angry.* If this cant be corrected with drugs or therapy, you should be removed from society until it can. *


Unfortunately this doesn't happen anywhere near often enough. So what then?


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## contrarian (28/1/16)

There's a big difference between being an abusive **** and being mentally ill although you the two can coexist. 

The main diagnoses that would relate to ongoing abuse would be sociopathy or psychopathy, these are very rare, much rarer than mental illness. Depression, anxiety, bipolar are all treatable and even if they are not are absolutely zero excuse for physically, psychologically or emotionally abusing people. 

We as men, need to stop making excuses for men who abuse their partners and children. It might not eradicate the problem completely but it could improve the lives of thousands of people. 

We need to stop saying shit like he was a good bloke about people who have bashed or killed their wives or children. If you do that you are not a good bloke, you are a ******* low life and should be remembered as one 

The belief that nothing can be done about this or that it is human nature absolves people of standing up and saying that this shit isn't acceptable in our society. There is plenty that can be done to both educate men and women about the nature and impact of violence on themselves and their children and there is a lot more we can do in supporting people to leave violent, abusive or controlling relationships. There is a lot more that can be done with perpetrators to help them understand the impact of their actions, take responsibility for them and make positive changes in their lives and I believe as a society we should be doing all we can about it!


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## wide eyed and legless (28/1/16)

contrarian said:


> . Depression, anxiety, bipolar are all treatable and even if they are not are absolutely zero excuse for physically, psychologically or emotionally abusing people.
> 
> We as men, need to stop making excuses for men who abuse their partners and children. It might not eradicate the problem completely but it could improve the lives of thousands of people.
> 
> ...


Depression, anxiety and bipolar are treatable all with drugs and I doubt whether anyone in those three categories would physically, psychologically or emotionally abuse people, it is those with anger management who are the issue here.
The only treatment for those people is counselling, but they first have to admit they have a problem and seek treatment.

That guy Little in Port Lincoln drove into the bay, his wife and friends told him he had a problem but refused to admit to it leading to the tragic deaths of those children. Sane people don't do things like that.

Of course something can be done about anger management but it is up to the person who cannot control his anger, as I have said previously, to admit there is a problem and go to counselling. The other question is why would someone stay in a relationship which is violent abusive and controlling, we can't make them leave. 

Your last paragraph supports what I have been saying, they have a problem and need help, but this is what is being done now, its a complex issue so what is the next step to getting an acceptable standard of social responsibility those who carry out these acts of violence .


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/1/16)

Unfortunatly things like DV are a learnt thing. Kids see their parents do it, so naturally they follow suite. Its basically "well my parents did it, and thats all I know"

And it doesnt come just from fathers. I live across the street form a " very unhappy" house with a single mum and 4 kids. I dont hear much laughter coming from that place, but I do hear lots of crying, yelling and abuse almost daily

I feel sad for those kids. They seem like nice kids, just in a fucked up environment.

If those kids only know violence, abuse, denigration then they will take that into adulthood. And its very hard to make whole eggs from an omelet 

Sure I go of at my kids at times, but with the regularity and depth that goes on across the street


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## Droopy Brew (28/1/16)

wide eyed and legless said:


> Depression, anxiety and bipolar are treatable all with drugs and I doubt whether anyone in those three categories would physically, psychologically or emotionally abuse people, it is those with anger management who are the issue here.
> The only treatment for those people is counselling, but they first have to admit they have a problem and seek treatment.
> 
> That guy Little in Port Lincoln drove into the bay, his wife and friends told him he had a problem but refused to admit to it leading to the tragic deaths of those children. Sane people don't do things like that.
> ...


 No I think you are wrong here. You seem to think it is only people with anger issues that perpetrate DV and that is the only cause. While that makes up some of the cases, what you are not taking into consideration is offenders perception of what is DV.
They may not see controlling their spouse with mental or psychological or physical behaviour as domestic violence because that is a normal relationship to them. Either through experiences within their own family or cultural experiences through peers or extended family. It isnt necessarily someone with anger problems or mental illness, it can often be a result of learned behaviours.
That is why there is a big push for education through schools to young people so that those with a perception that sees this sort of behaviour as normal may work out that, hang on a sec, this isnt normal. Keeping in mind that it is as important to educate kids that are not only potential offenders but also potential victims. Often the victims of DV have a skewed perception and think it is normal to be treated like that and gravitate towards those types of partners. There are a lot of generational patterns with both offenders and victims when it comes to DV.
To say it is human nature and you cant stop people with anger issues is a cop out. I have no doubt that addressing this issue and using tools like education can reduce the instances of DV substantially. You will never eliminate it but lets have a crack at minimising it hey?


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/1/16)

Droopy Brew said:


> No I think you are wrong here. You seem to think it is only people with anger issues that perpetrate DV and that is the only cause.
> 
> There are a lot of generational patterns with both offenders and victims when it comes to DV.
> 
> To say it is human nature and you cant stop people with anger issues is a cop out. I have no doubt that addressing this issue and using tools like education can reduce the instances of DV substantially. You will never eliminate it but lets have a crack at minimising it hey?


Exactly !


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## MastersBrewery (28/1/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Unfortunatly things like DV are a learnt thing. Kids see their parents do it, so naturally they follow suite. Its basically "well my parents did it, and thats all I know"
> 
> And it doesnt come just from fathers. I live across the street form a " very unhappy" house with a single mum and 4 kids. I dont hear much laughter coming from that place, but I do hear lots of crying, yelling and abuse almost daily
> 
> ...


 You pretty close here. But in reality there are parents who really do try and still fail miserably.(your neighbours across the road probably don't fit in this category) It comes down to attachment style. Every kid is different and those differences mean working with the child infront of you. My son at times won't listen unless my voice goes up a notch, if I did the same with my daughter it wouldn't work she's a quite have a serious chat kinda kid. 
All this boils down to the child being comfortable and safe in the relationship.

If you really want to be a great parent STUDY ATTATCHMENT THEORY. 
Your relationships with your kids will be the best, and they will confide in you. You will know what is really going on in their lives when they're teens because they'll tell you.
Yes you still have to stop them drawing on walls and stealing chocolate from the fridge for breakfast, but how you do that will define your relationship with them, and them as a person later in life.


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## contrarian (28/1/16)

This absolutely is an inter generational problem and will take generations to fix as I think most people parent the way they were parented. There is a lot that can be done but it is difficult work and requires long term intervention with families at risk. I currently work in the area and it is amazing the changes that can come out of families who really have the deck stacked against them badly. 

I agree that it is helpful if people want to get help but if someone doesn't want it then there needs to be supports in place to get their partners and kids out of that situation quickly and easily. There's currently a lot of barriers to that including very limited options in places to go. 

Increasing police power to prosecute without the permission of the victim can also make a big difference as had police capturing video evidence when attending domestic disputes. The responsibility to prosecute people needs to be removed from their victims who are often very afraid of the consequences, believing it is their own fault and often psychologically, emotionally and financially disempowered as a fault of years of controlling and abusive behaviour. That is also the reason people don't leave. 

From my perspective I am glad that there seems to be a genuine discussion taking place on the matter and there seems to be some funding following all the hot air so hopefully that will make a difference too.


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## wide eyed and legless (28/1/16)

Droopy Brew said:


> To say it is human nature and you cant stop people with anger issues is a cop out. I have no doubt that addressing this issue and using tools like education can reduce the instances of DV substantially. You will never eliminate it but lets have a crack at minimising it hey?


Anger is a part of human psyche, but fortunately the majority of us can control that anger others can't if that was the case we wouldn't be having this discussion, why is it a part of our make up I don't know except it could be some sort of defense mechanism which is and has been in our society for thousands of years.
I have 2 young daughters and I know I would lose self control if anything happened to them.
It will never be eliminated, as murder has never been eliminated, we all know how wrong it is to take another life even under punishment of death it still goes on, and how many murders are committed through anger, would be far more than premeditated murders, so it isn't a cop out saying it can't be stopped if we can't stop killing each other.


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## Droopy Brew (28/1/16)

Yes anger is in all of us. Is it the only reason for domestic violence? No.
Should we not do anything because we cant ELIMINATE it? Cop out.


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## Ducatiboy stu (28/1/16)

I believe it will eventually become less prevalent over time. Like racism, and allowing women to vote.

These things take time to filter through society. And the younger generation are far more mobile in their cutting of ties with the established ways.


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## wide eyed and legless (29/1/16)

Droopy Brew said:


> Yes anger is in all of us. Is it the only reason for domestic violence? No. Should we not do anything because we cant ELIMINATE it? Cop out.


I don't believe anyone on here as stated anger is the only reason for domestic violence nor have I seen it stated in any of these posts that nothing could be done, no it will never be eliminated but it could be reduced, not by issuing AVO's but a proper prison term and counselling in having respect for women.


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## Black Devil Dog (18/6/16)

Great to see the Western Bulldogs in the AFL taking a stand.

Also, big thumbs up to Jimmy Bartel from Geelong. 


There is more than 1 woman a week murdered in Australia, in a domestic violence situation.

There are thousands of women either raped, murdered, bashed and abused inside and outside of relationships.


I really hope the message starts getting through.


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## GalBrew (19/6/16)

wide eyed and legless said:


> I don't believe anyone on here as stated anger is the only reason for domestic violence nor have I seen it stated in any of these posts that nothing could be done, no it will never be eliminated but it could be reduced, not by issuing AVO's but a proper prison term and counselling in having respect for women.


I'm very dubious as to whether counselling/education programs and the like would have any impact on the sort of man that thinks violence against anyone let alone their partner (who they supposedly care about) is acceptable. It's like the notion of 'anti rape' education. What sort of normal person needs to be sat down and told that rape/violence towards women is a no-no? If this notion is contrary to your system of beliefs then no amount of 'education' will change that and you should be promptly removed from society.


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## wide eyed and legless (19/6/16)

The results of a $36 million VRC into domestic violence hasn't come up with anything to prevent it, apart from all of the obvious notions which have been put forward previously.
I doubt whether many of the offences committed are premeditated, as much as I doubt anything the Commission has come up with will curb it apart from keeping the parties involved apart, but that will not prevent both parties finding themselves in a similar situation with another party down the track.
http://www.rcfv.com.au/MediaLibraries/RCFamilyViolence/Reports/RCFV_Full_Report_Interactive.pdf


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