# My First Partial



## BRAD T (28/4/05)

Hi All,
I am about to have a go at my first partial, I am trying for a ESB/Strong Bitter. I am planning on the following,

1.2kg Marris Otter
300g Dark Crystal
1.7kg Light Extract
500g Amber Extract
500g Malto Dextrin
30g Northern Brewer Hops 8.0%AA boiled 60min.
15g Goldings 5.0%AA boiled 15min.
Safale S-04 Yeast

I am expecting an OG of around 1.055 to 1.057 and a FG of around 1.013 

Any Comments would be appreciated.

Cheers
Brad


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## warrenlw63 (28/4/05)

Sounds and looks good Brad.

Only thing I would change is to chuck the malto dextrin. Does nothing but give the beer a cloyingly thick body. Either that or add 100g of CaraPils to your mash.

Good luck with it and enjoy. :super: 

Warren -


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## BRAD T (28/4/05)

Thanks for the advice Warren, I had the Malto Dextrin in to add more body, but will take your advice.

Cheers
Brad :beerbang:


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## pint of lager (28/4/05)

What volume into the fermenter are you after?

That quantity of malted grain and malt extract will not give you og 1.055 for 23 litres into the fermneter.

As a rough guide for partial mashing, allow about 1/2 of your grain bill to end up in the fermenter as malt.

I agree with Warren, ditch the maltodextrin, it certainly plays a role in kits as a booster, but doesn't belong in a mini mash/extract brew.


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## BRAD T (28/4/05)

I was planning on a batch size of 20ltrs. I did the calculations with Beer Tools recipe calculator, is this reliable?

Cheers


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## Gough (28/4/05)

G'day Brad,

You may have already factored this into your recipe, but how much are you actually boiling? You may need to factor a higher gravity boil into your hop bill if you aren't boiling the full volume eg: If you are aimng for 20 litres are you boiling 23+ litres for 60 mins. to get to that final volume or are you boiling say, 15 litres, and topping up to 20 after the boil with water? If you are boiling less and topping up you might want to factor this into your hop bill. See www.howtobrew.com for an excellent explanation of all this.

Again, apologies if you have already factored this in. Just thought I'd raise as a potential issue if this is your first go. Your recipe looks nice, esp. without the maltodex. NB and Goldings go well together.

Good luck with the brew,

Shawn.


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## PostModern (28/4/05)

In line with what Gough is saying about hop utilisation, I've found that I get pretty good utilisation if I don't add the extract until near the end of the boil. ie, most of the AA are extracted in a thin boil. YMMV


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## pint of lager (28/4/05)

That recipe (excluding the malto dextrin) will give roughly 2.9 kg of extract, which will be about 1.050 into the fermenter for 20 litres. You will lose a bit to hops trub too, which I didn't factor in.

For your first partial mash, you are aiming at getting the procedure right. Make sure you write all quantities used down, that way, when you next formulate a recipe, you have your own yardstick to use.


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## BRAD T (28/4/05)

Thanks for all the advice guys, it is really useful. I was going to do a boil of about 20 litres without the goldings and boil them in about 2 litres seperately then add this infusion to the wort and top up with spring water if needed. I am trying to achieve an OG of 1.056 or so and thought that I could top up if required. How does this sound.

:huh:


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## Gough (28/4/05)

G'day Brad,

That method sounds OK. If you want to make it even simpler though and you can obviously boil 20 litres already, why not go the whole hog and boil, say, 23 litres for the full hour just adding your Goldings 15 minutes or less from the end? You should end up somewhere around the 20 litre mark depending on your boiloff rate (increase that volume if you are boiling outside). It seems easier all round if you have the boiler capacity. If not go with your plan - if it's your first go just have a stab and see how it turns out. I bet it'll be great  

Good luck,

Shawn.


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## BRAD T (28/4/05)

Shawn, thanks for that, I am have a s/s pot big enough to boil 30litres so I will do as you suggest and boil about 23ltrs

Cheers :beerbang:


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## Kai (28/4/05)

What are you using for your mash tun and how big is it? Your pot is plenty big enough, so I would say mash as much grain as you possibly can and make up the difference with extract.


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## BRAD T (29/4/05)

Kai, 
I have a small esky, I guess about 12-15 ltr, I was going to use this for a Mash Tun. I was going to follow the instructions and calculations given by John Palmer in "How to Brew" for a multi rest mash adding boiling water. I was planning on 1/2 hour rests at 40/60/70 degrees C.
I could do a compromise by just mashing at say 68 deg. but I thought I should try the hard way. :super:


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## BRAD T (30/4/05)

Well Guys, 
I am just getting ready to start the mash for my first partial, I racked the cider to a cube yesterday to free up the fermie and I am quite excited to be doing something other than opening a few cans and bunging in some yeast. I will let you know how I go.

Cheers
Brad :super:


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## BRAD T (30/4/05)

Well I have my first partial put to bed, after the boil( started with 23ltr finished about 19.5ltr) I chilled the wort in the pot in a bath full of ice and water, didn't take too long to come down, kept stirring so that it would cool quicker and probably helped with aeration. I rehydrated the yeast and gave it a little feed to make it happy and pitched it in at 25deg., the OG(taken just before pitching) was 1056 and with adjustment for temp. I guess it is really 1057, pretty close to what I was aiming at, I suppose I had a fairly successful mash and sparge for my first time(3 rest mash then batch sparge). I had a wee taste of the wort before pitching, it tasted pretty good, quite sweet, maybe not as bitter as I was expecting, but full of flavour. Can't wait till this one is ready to drink.

Cheers :beerbang:


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## barfridge (30/4/05)

Sounds good brad, congrats 

Dont stress about not tasting the hops too much, the excess sweetness does a good job of masking them.


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## jgriffin (30/4/05)

BRAD T said:


> I chilled the wort in the pot in a bath full of ice and water, didn't take too long to come down, kept stirring so that it would cool quicker and probably helped with aeration.
> [post="56840"][/post]​



You should try to minimise splashing while the wort is still hot - say above 40C or so. Otherwise you risk hot side aeration aka cardboard taste.


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## BRAD T (2/5/05)

Hi All,
Well all seems good with my first partial, airlock has been bubbling away quite nicely since saturday, now I would like some more advice. The OG was 1057 and have maintained a temp of 20deg - 22deg, I took the SG this morning as the airlock activity had slowed down a bit and the reading I got was 1012, that S-04 yeast sure works fast. My question is, should I rack to secondary now? It is also very cloudy, I didn't use any finings in the boil, should I think about gelatine addition when I rack.

All help is appreciated.

Cheers
Brad :unsure:


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## pint of lager (2/5/05)

That is probably close to the terminal gravity.

My suggestion is to leave it at your current temperature in the primary for another week, then rack into secondary (with no headspace) and cold condition if you can for a week or two, then bottle. If it is still cloudy when you are ready to bottle, 24 hours prior to bottling, add some fining.

Your choice, you could rack now if you want as it appears to be close to terminal gravity.

If you cannot cold condition, just put the secondary somewhere as cool as you can organise in your house.

The cloudiness is probably just yeast still happily working away.


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## Trough Lolly (2/5/05)

FWIW I agree with PoL,

I did a similar brew the weekend before and I actually bottled at 1012 after about 8 days in primary (I had no room or fermenters left for cold conditioning!!). S-04 is a quick brewing English Ale yeast, that's ideal for the recipe that you used. 

I used Weyermann Carapils in my brew (200g) and it does a great job in lieu of maltodextrins. I chatted via email to John Palmer about this stuff and he confirmed that the dextrinous nature of Carapils, as well as its protein content does add to the body and head of the beer - it is possible that the haze may at least be partially contributable due to the presence of this grain in the recipe, but then again, you apparently did a protein rest, according to your original mash schedule. Regardless, some cold conditioning or extended time in primary should help the beer to brighten.

Earlier in the thread you mentioned hop bittering outside the main wort - You said:


> I was going to do a boil of about 20 litres without the goldings and boil them in about 2 litres seperately then add this infusion to the wort and top up with spring water if needed.



Did you end up boiling the hops in a decanted portion of the wort off the main boil? If so, you might want to consider adding the hops to the main boil instead of a portion of the boil, to improve the bittering efficiency of your hops. The volume of the boil has a direct relationship between bittering efficiencies for a given amount of hops. When I do small volume boils, I actually hold back on tossing in all the malt extract until the last few minutes of the boil, so I get good bittering efficiencies during the main small boil. In my English bitter, for example I held back on 2kg of malt extract so I bittered the wort first and then tossed in the 2kg of malt extract in the last few minutes of boil - I still got good hot break from the mashed grains, etc, but didn't have to worry about a high gravity boil reducing the bittering capacity of the hops. I also do this when I toss in a kit to the main boil - mash the grains, boil, bitter the small boil and then toss in the kit in the last few minutes to finish off and ensure that I don't lose the existing bitterness and hop flavours present in the kit concentrate...

Cheers,
TL


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## BRAD T (2/5/05)

Thanks for the advice PoL and TL,
I will leave it in the primary for another week and see how it looks then rack to a cube for cold conditioning. TL in answer to your question I ended up doing a full boil( including hops) of just over 23ltrs , it came down to a touch over 19.5 ltrs at the end of the boil. 

Cheers
Brad :super:


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## Trough Lolly (3/5/05)

G'day Brad,
No probs - congrats again on your departure from kit only brewing - it's a lot more effort but worth it, IMHO...

Cheers,
TL


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## BRAD T (3/5/05)

Hi TL,
I really enjoyed the process and I am thinking about what I will do next, whether to do another partial to refine my technique, or perhaps try AG, I was considering a Schwarzbier or Vienna Brown Lager as it is starting to get a bit cold here now for ales, even with a heater pad or my home made hot box( which will be tied up for the next month or so with the cider for SWMBO). I see you are in Canberra as well, is the HBS at Kambah the only one here?

Cheers
Brad :chug:


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## Trough Lolly (3/5/05)

Hi Brad,
Yeah, the cooler weather has triggered an English Bitter, Irish Red and a dry stout here in the brewery! I need to balance that lot, however, so a Skunk Fart Pale Ale is next on the production line!  
When I launched into partials etc, I did recipes of beers that I liked to drink (duh!) and had made a few times. That way, I had a reasonable idea of what it should taste like - especially if you can taste the same beer either from a good brewer or commercial (non-megaswill) outfit. The reason for that was so I could work on my brewing techniques and once you have a good feel for the method, etc, you can then launch into the beers that you'd like to drink and have never tasted - and if your brewing method is sound, a reasonably accurate recipe of that style will deliver the beer you're after, as opposed to a beer that you think is what that style is all about.
You sound like me, enjoying the process - I get as much a kick out of making a beer as drinking it! Am I obsessed!?!? h34r:  

Does any of that make sense? It's early in the morning and I'm only on my first coffee! :blink: 

As for shops, Brewyourownathome in Kambah, run by Bro Shoppe from the Canberra Brewers Club is a good starting point for not only brewgear, but helpful and friendly advice. Colin is only too happy to help out starting mashers and of course, he'll toss a membership form at you if you aren't a member of the Canberra Brewers Club already! 
He gives discounts to club members and the savings in a year can easily cover the cost of club membership - sorry to launch into a recruitment drive!! There's a bottle shop in Phillip (Georges Liquor) that sells kits and bits and has a good range of boutique beers as well. I've also heard of another place called brews 'n butts but I've never been there...
Cheers,
TL


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## BRAD T (3/5/05)

Hi TL,
Thanks for the encouragement, I guess I am becoming obsessed because I am not just doing to make cheap beer( there is enough cheap beer on the market) I suppose I get satisfaction out of it. Thanks for the tips on Canberra Brewers Club, I was wondering about that, I did try to follow the link in one of your posts but kept getting:"Web page unavailable". I will try again tonite.
Colin at BYOAH has been very helpful to me but so far has not mentioned the Brewers Club. I think he is in the U.K. at the moment. He was going to try and find a recipe for Ram Rod Clone for me, or at least drink a few and try to work it out.

Cheers
Brad :beer:


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## Trough Lolly (4/5/05)

Sorry about the dodgy link h34r: 
Good to see you registered - welcome! - The club meets every first Thursday at the Griffin Centre - the last room (ie the one at the servo end of the building) is where the club members gather. Kick off is around 7:30pm or when the person with the key to the room turns up! If you want a membership form, just ask anyone there and they'll either steer you in the right direction or put a beer in your hand, or both  !

I believe the group will be tasting English Ales at the May meeting tomorrow....I can't make it since the missus is on night shift and I'll be Mr. Mom again <_< . Ah, well, at least I have the best part of 22L of English Ale at home, so I'll have one anyway :chug: 

Cheers,
TL


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## BRAD T (4/5/05)

Hi TL,
Unfortunately I can't make it to the meeting tomorrow nite either, I work most thursday nites but I would still like to join the club as there are other get togethers that I may be able to attend. I see that there is a get together this sat., not sure if I can make that either , I was going to go to BYOAH on friday for a snoop around (I find it quite interesting having a browse thru the shop) and I will ask about a membership form then. Maybe if I can get there on sat. and you are there I can get to meet you.and perhaps partake of an ale with you.

Cheers
Brad :beerbang:


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## BRAD T (13/5/05)

Hi all,
Been out of the ether for a few days, too damn busy at work with all those bloody politicians etc. around for the Budget. However I have been continuing to look after my brews, would appreciate a little advice on bulk priming. I have had this particular brew(ESB) in the fridge for a week to CC ( OG 1057, racked to cube for 2ndary at 1012, FG 1008) I am bringing it back up to 20deg. and was going to bulk prime, what reccomendations do you have for what to use and how much?

Cheers Brad :unsure:


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## Jovial_Monk (13/5/05)

I like dry wheat malt extract as a priming sugar--really helps with head rentention.

Start with 180g per 20L batch

Jovial Monk


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## BRAD T (13/5/05)

Thanks JM,
I will give it a try.

Cheers Brad :beerbang:


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## BRAD T (20/5/05)

Well All, 
I couldn't wait, I just had to crack a bottle of this one, even though it had only been in the bottle for a week.
I must say that I am pretty impressed with the results, I guess it will only get better.

:beerbang:


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## buddingbrewmaster (20/9/05)

I hope i'm not hijacking this thread.
I'm doing my second kitless brew.
I have got my last one ( bohemian pils). in the secondary and am about to cc.
I made the mistake of boiling all the malt extract in not enough water which darkened the wort. I found out later that i didn't need to boil all the malt just some of it then dissolve the rest at the end of the boil.
Anyway my next brew is in 2 days is going to be an APA.
I got the recipe off the grain and grape website like my last one.

Base Malt 4.0 kg Light Malt Extract (dry)
Grains - 300 g Crystal Malt, 80 g Wheat Malt, & 20 g Roast Malt.
I'm going to just steep the grains and strain into the fermenter.
For 23 litres this should be a high OG ( I'm guessing a bit over 1.060?) :blink: 
I did my IBU calculations on the G&G website. For a OG of 1.060

10gms Northern brewer (9.5%)AA 60mins for 12 IBU
20gms Cascade (6%)AA 60mins for 15 IBU
30gms Cascade (6%)AA 15mins for 11 IBU
27gms Cascade (6%)AA 5mins for 4 IBU
23gms Cascade (6%)AA 1min 
I'll dry hop in the secondary with 20gms(for how long).
So i calculate around 42 IBU. Oh i'm using only hop pellets.
I love my hops but is this over doing it? I want it with heaps of hops flavour and not overly bitter. I'm using Dry yeast ( Safale US-56 )

I know the OG affects the IBU's you get out of the hops. But is this the OG of the boil, or the OG once i have diluted it into the fermenter
My big question is if i only boil up about 1kg of malt in around 7 litres of water and do my hop additions then dissolve the rest of the malt after flame out. Are my calculations correct.
Do i need to use Irish moss to clarify. I didn't think it was that important for an APA to be clear.
Anyway i have looked all over the site and could't find an exact question like this one. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

This site is great and keep up with all the great info. :beerbang: 

Cheers.


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## buddingbrewmaster (20/9/05)

Sorry about the length of my post i just want to get this Beer to be great.


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## buddingbrewmaster (20/9/05)

Oh and by the way brad how did your beer taste after a few weeks.


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## BRAD T (21/9/05)

Hi Buddingbrewmaster,
It tasted bloody fantastic, I just wish I hadn't been so greedy and drank it all. I took a few bottles to my father in law, he had the last one last week and said it was even better than the first couple.

Cheers
Brad T


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## Guest Lurker (21/9/05)

Hi BBM

Time to download some demo or free brewing software when you start generating recipes that complex.

That amount of malt in 23 l will give a starting gravity of roughly 1.079, definitely more than 1.060.

It is the gravity of the boil only that determines hop utilisation. 1 kg of DME in 7 l gives a gravity of 1.054, so that is about the right amount to include in the boil.

The hop amounts need to be calculated from that gravity. If you look at the table in How to Brew, utilisation should be about
22% for 60 mins
11% for 15 mins
4% for 5 mins

So applying that to the hop amounts indicates your current IBU estimates are over estimated a bit and total IBUs would be around 33 ish, but you could try a few different software packages and look at the range.


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## buddingbrewmaster (21/9/05)

Thanks GL.
I guess i'll check the IBU's from some different sources.
Thanks for the advice.
Congrats Brad T i can't wait to taste my first partial mash.
It tastes great in the secondary right now.

Cheers guys.


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## Jazzafish (22/9/05)

Continuing from what Guest Lurker said...

download yourself Beer Smith of Pro Mash... my beer smith has run out so I'm onto promash at the moment... I prefer Pro Mash so far but they both have their ups and downs.


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