# How full do you fill your bottles?



## Pixiedust (16/2/13)

Thus far I have been filling mine to the bottom of Mr Fourexs' chest. Can I put more in there? I have been worried about bottle bombs, but now I understand its more about keeping everything clean instead of head space.


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## bruce86 (16/2/13)

Bottling wand the way to go


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## bum (16/2/13)

I will to the very top with a bottling wand/little bottler. Leaves some headspace once you remove the wand.


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## Pixiedust (16/2/13)

Thanks gentlemen! I use a bottling wand, so will fill to that level with my next batch!


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## bum (16/2/13)

I'm glad you could decipher my Saturday morning gibberish.


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## Pixiedust (16/2/13)

Lol, all good bum!

I am rather sleep deprived as woke woke me at 3am with gastro, it made perfect sense!

As I can't leave the house today, I am going to start a couple of brews..... Ok, I have just cleaned out five FVs..... I think I would be killed by HTMBO,O if I filled all five at once!


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## bignath (16/2/13)

Pixiedust said:


> but now I understand its more about keeping everything clean instead of head space.


No it's not. A clean bottle with no headspace for example, can still explode as the secondary process creates the gas needed to be carbed.

As others have said, filling to the top with a bottling wand leaves the perfect headspace once the wand is removed. Tis a reason the wands are that length.


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## going down a hill (16/2/13)

It is also making sure your brew has hit final gravity so it doesn't generate more c02 in the bottle than you want.


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## Black Devil Dog (16/2/13)

Pixiedust said:


> Lol, all good bum!
> 
> I am rather sleep deprived as woke woke me at 3am with gastro, it made perfect sense!
> 
> As I can't leave the house today, I am going to start a couple of brews..... Ok, I have just cleaned out five FVs..... I think I would be killed by HTMBO,O if I filled all five at once!



Gastro on brew day. :blink:

Yikes!


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## DU99 (16/2/13)




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## Danwood (16/2/13)

bum said:


> I'm glad you could decipher my Saturday morning gibberish.


Well, if you will start drinking Brooklyn Acetaldehyde-y Lager and Melbourne Bitter at 8.27am ('what's in the glass' thread), you can't expect to be on top typing form, Bum ! 

It's midday somewhere, I suppose...


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## bum (16/2/13)

Ahaha. I may not have been posting in real time at that point.


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## dent (16/2/13)

Big Nath said:


> No it's not. A clean bottle with no headspace for example, can still explode as the secondary process creates the gas needed to be carbed.
> 
> As others have said, filling to the top with a bottling wand leaves the perfect headspace once the wand is removed. Tis a reason the wands are that length.


This has never made much sense to me. You could have a headspace of exactly zero and the generated gas will go into solution just the same as it would if you had some headspace. The liquid can carry CO2 just as well as the gap of atmosphere you might make at the top of the bottle. 

The only issue with zero headspace is you might spill a bit of beer when you open the lid, when it froths a little.


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## bignath (16/2/13)

dent said:


> This has never made much sense to me. You could have a headspace of exactly zero and the generated gas will go into solution just the same as it would if you had some headspace. The liquid can carry CO2 just as well as the gap of atmosphere you might make at the top of the bottle.
> 
> The only issue with zero headspace is you might spill a bit of beer when you open the lid, when it froths a little.


If that was the case, then if bottling in plastic bottles, the bottles wouldn't expand. Plastic is flexible, glass is not. Bang.


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## dent (16/2/13)

I don't really get your point. The amount of CO2 dissolved in the beer is directly proportional to pressure, headspace or not. You don't need the "spring" of the headspace air, as there is already the "spring" of the amount of gas that dissolves in the liquid. The type of bottle is irrelevant. If the bottle was filled with something CO2 could not dissolve in (I dunno, mercury maybe), sure, the bottle would go bang.


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## warra48 (16/2/13)

Through the hole at the top of the neck.
How do you fill yours?


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## bignath (16/2/13)

dent said:


> I don't really get your point. The amount of CO2 dissolved in the beer is directly proportional to pressure, headspace or not. You don't need the "spring" of the headspace air, as there is already the "spring" of the amount of gas that dissolves in the liquid. The type of bottle is irrelevant. If the bottle was filled with something CO2 could not dissolve in (I dunno, mercury maybe), sure, the bottle would go bang.


My point is quite simple.
Regardless of the co2 going into solution, once you bottle with more sugar creating the secondary ferment process there will be a build up of pressure due to the yeast eating sugar and creating gas. An example of this is easily witnessed by my reference to the plastic bottle expansion.
Sure, some (maybe most even) gets absorbed by the beer, I was always under the impression (from other brewers advice) that the headspace needs to be there to take up SOME of the pressure.
I completely agree that co2 will be absorbed by the beer, I just don't think all of it will. Unless the priming rate is not sufficient enough to generate much gas of course...
Happy to be proven wrong though


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## Nick JD (16/2/13)

If you have 3 volumes of CO2 in a 750ml bottle, and a 50ml headspace ... then you have (3 x 0.8) 2400ml of CO2 in that bottle and 50ml of headspace.

If you have 3 volumes of CO2 in a 750ml bottle, and no headspace ... then you have 2400ml of CO2 in that bottle and no headspace, and the beer will foam down the sides when you open it.

Which is why they leave some headspace, because no one likes beer foaming all over their counter.


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## dent (17/2/13)

That seems like a pointless calculation. I'd agree that you'd probably make a mess with your bottle of hefe at three volumes.

Regardless there is no way that no headspace is going to result in a bottle bomb.


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## Nick JD (17/2/13)

dent said:


> That seems like a pointless calculation. I'd agree that you'd probably make a mess with your bottle of hefe at three volumes.
> 
> Regardless there is no way that no headspace is going to result in a bottle bomb.


It's not pointless. It conveys perfectly that there is no point worrying about having no headspace in a bottle.


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## Yob (17/2/13)

FWIW, Coopers had an issue with their packaging line at some point a while ago and every 6th bottle was filled to the brim.

They had to do some tests to make sure the batches could still go to market and the result was that the carbonation was exactly the same.. (Info from Paul Burge at Coopers)

probably was a messy stubbie to open though. From what I remember, they sent them out.


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## TidalPete (17/2/13)

Pixiedust said:


> Thus far I have been filling mine to the bottom of Mr Fourexs' chest. Can I put more in there? I have been worried about bottle bombs, but now I understand its more about keeping everything clean instead of head space.


Way back before dinasaurs roamed the earth I would fill to the top of Paddy's (Fitzgerald) head after adding sugar.
Then came enlightenment with the discovery of bulk priming & the purchase of a bottling wand. :super:
Thankfully I now keg & only bottle with a CPBF if I need to but heartedly agree with bum's post 3 reply.

I find it hard to believe that filling your homebrew bottles to the brim after priming will result in anything but disaster.


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## DU99 (17/2/13)

:icon_offtopic: Paul Burge your mate that knows about yeast..yob


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## Mr. No-Tip (17/2/13)

DU99 said:


>



Revelation. I always put my want into the tap and sit on a stool in front. Maybe I'll try a hose next time....


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