# A Different Stc1000 Question



## woodwormm (16/11/12)

So I hooked up my 3rd STC1000 last night,

I'm getting better at it but how do others cut/trim the jiffy box to suit? i used a drill and jigsaw but it's a real PITA, the black plastic of the jiffy box seems to melt back together after the jigsaw blade's gone through... there must be a trick to cutting these things super easily and accurately? Out of 3 mounted in Jiffy boxes I don't have a single one where the STC faceplate is mounted perfectly square or flush.... and believe me i've tried all i can think of to cut these dammed jiffy boxes accurately...


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## petesbrew (16/11/12)

printed forms section said:


> So I hooked up my 3rd STC1000 last night,
> 
> I'm getting better at it but how do others cut/trim the jiffy box to suit? i used a drill and jigsaw but it's a real PITA, the black plastic of the jiffy box seems to melt back together after the jigsaw blade's gone through... there must be a trick to cutting these things super easily and accurately? Out of 3 mounted in Jiffy boxes I don't have a single one where the STC faceplate is mounted perfectly square or flush.... and believe me i've tried all i can think of to cut these dammed jiffy boxes accurately...


I've got one of those cheap dremel copies from Bunnings. It allows you to get the edges & corners all nice and neat.
As for the initial cutout, I just drilled a shitload of holes and used a hacksaw blade. 
Jigsaw is a bit OTT, I reckon. But we're blokes and powertools are so hot right now.


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## dicko (16/11/12)

printed forms section said:


> So I hooked up my 3rd STC1000 last night,
> 
> I'm getting better at it but how do others cut/trim the jiffy box to suit? i used a drill and jigsaw but it's a real PITA, the black plastic of the jiffy box seems to melt back together after the jigsaw blade's gone through... there must be a trick to cutting these things super easily and accurately? Out of 3 mounted in Jiffy boxes I don't have a single one where the STC faceplate is mounted perfectly square or flush.... and believe me i've tried all i can think of to cut these dammed jiffy boxes accurately...



If you are using a jigsaw you will have problems because the plastic is getting too hot when cutting.

Get yourself a Dremel tool and a set of these http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/6pc-Mini-HSS-Ro...=item3ccc65957e
for cutting the hole
The hole will never be square if you haven't marked it out correctly in the first place.
I cut mine with the Dremel and a metal blade on a reasonably slow speed and then finish the hole with a flat medium file.
I hope this helps

Cheers


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## jaypes (16/11/12)

The easiest way is to mark out the rectangular hole, then drill out the box along the lines. After that use a file to get the box to the correct rectangular shape.

Most people have a drill and a file in their toolboxes.

It takes a bit of time to do it but the result will be professional


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## Lakey (16/11/12)

+1 for the dremel and file method.


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## woodwormm (16/11/12)

Doh! you know i have a dremel in the cupboard!... but it's a 'modern' tool i forget i have!....

those disc cutters look nasty... but nice, i want some, definitely safety goggles and shield with them for when they let go!

i'm confident i marked it square... it was the execution with the jigsaw that let me down!


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## Malted (16/11/12)

Yeah jigsaws will do that.
Others have reccommended using a file.
Cut a smaller hole than you need and clean it up with a file. You can go slow and get a perfect neat edge with a file. Not a rough bastard file/rasp.


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## bignath (16/11/12)

Dremel tools are great, i have one and use it a lot.

But, you might be surprised to find out how easy a stanley knife will go through one of those jiffy boxes.

Mark the rectangle, and use a steel ruler to continuously "score" the box, and you'll quite quickly get a nice mounting hole.


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## geneabovill (16/11/12)

Multitool with plastic cutter. Does the neatest job I've seen.


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## raven19 (16/11/12)

Jigsaw worked for me fine, using a blade for cutting wood (not metal - metal cutting ones definately melt the plastic).


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## dicko (16/11/12)

printed forms section said:


> Doh! you know i have a dremel in the cupboard!... but it's a 'modern' tool i forget i have!....
> 
> those disc cutters look nasty... but nice, i want some, definitely safety goggles and shield with them for when they let go!
> 
> i'm confident i marked it square... it was the execution with the jigsaw that let me down!



Normal safety precautions are definately recommended.
I try to avoid running any Dremel tool at full speed, I run it only fast enough to do the job.
I worry about those carborundum cutting wheels flying to bits.
I dont think the metal ones would break cutting plastic but they get a bit of a vibration if you run 'em flat out. They are not recommended for metal.

Big Nath's Stanley knife sounds OK as well.

Cheers


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## stux (16/11/12)

I use a dremel with the disc tool. 4 quick cuts, push to pop out the rectangle. The stc1000 bezel covers up the rough corners. Then a few drill holes for the cables and you're done

The trick is measuring and scribing the cutout accurately


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## Nick JD (16/11/12)

A jigsaw works perfectly for me. Just gotta go like the clappers so the hot blade doesn't spend enough time in one place to melt the plastic.


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## geneabovill (16/11/12)

Multitool with plastic cutter. Does the neatest job I've seen.


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## QldKev (16/11/12)

geneabovill said:


> Multitool with plastic cutter. Does the neatest job I've seen.



So you haven't changed your mind in the last 1.5hours eh?



I use the dremmel with the cutoff wheels, nice slow speed so you don't melt your way through. 

QldKev


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## nathan_madness (16/11/12)

+1 for the Dremel and file method.


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## Markbeer (16/11/12)

I found an instrument box in Jaycar. Needs no modification the STC-1000 fits in perfectly with the face showing and just two holes for the cord in the back.

Was $20.



printed forms section said:


> So I hooked up my 3rd STC1000 last night,
> 
> I'm getting better at it but how do others cut/trim the jiffy box to suit? i used a drill and jigsaw but it's a real PITA, the black plastic of the jiffy box seems to melt back together after the jigsaw blade's gone through... there must be a trick to cutting these things super easily and accurately? Out of 3 mounted in Jiffy boxes I don't have a single one where the STC faceplate is mounted perfectly square or flush.... and believe me i've tried all i can think of to cut these dammed jiffy boxes accurately...


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## jaypes (16/11/12)

Markbeer said:


> I found an instrument box in Jaycar. Needs no modification the STC-1000 fits in perfectly with the face showing and just two holes for the cord in the back.
> 
> Was $20.



Got a link or pic of the box?


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## iralosavic (16/11/12)

I just drilled a few holes around the corners then used a paring knife, which I sharpened just prior to starting. I've done it with a hacksaw too, but I found a sharp knife to be a lot easier.


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## QldKev (16/11/12)

Make a box out of paper mache, should be pretty easy to cut


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## Markbeer (16/11/12)

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=HB5922

you undo 4 screws, take out the front faceplate, fit the STC in, drill 2 holes for the cords on the back faceplate, put the lid on and screw in the 4 screws.

3 mins tops. Was designed for this very type of thing.




jaypes said:


> Got a link or pic of the box?


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## JaseH (16/11/12)

Drill the corners and cut it out with a coping saw. Tidy up with a file or sharp blade.


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## Maheel (16/11/12)

i used the cardboard box mine came in for ages and gaff taped it up with the extension leads hanging out the back

but it was a bit lite and would move around on the top of the fridge 

cardboard is easy to cut


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## Amber Fluid (17/11/12)

A Dremel with a SS cutting wheel slices through like butter. I bought it when I was on my 3rd STC1000 and only wish I had of got it a lot sooner. Before this I used a hacksaw blade and drill bit.


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## yum beer (17/11/12)

Like Kev I did mine in a platic storage container.$3 from woolies, cuts easy with a stanley.


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## QldKev (17/11/12)

yum beer said:


> Like Kev I did mine in a platic storage container.$3 from woolies, cuts easy with a stanley.




It's lasted 6 years so far, but I have done my Setos PID and all my stc's in proper enclosures  

I should convert this one over too.

QldKev


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## Harry Volting (17/11/12)

I've always used a hot stanley knife blade in one of the original metal stanley bodies to form cut-outs in Jiffy or lightweight plastic boxes.
Heat the blade over a gas flame. Some plastic fumes but neat accurate corners and easy clean-up.
Not as easy as a purpose made box but less grief than a jigsaw.
Harry


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## Juzdu (17/11/12)

QldKev said:


> Use a lunch box, they are easy to cut with a knife.


+1 on the soft plastic lunchbox


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## BJMetallica (4/12/12)

printed forms section said:


> So I hooked up my 3rd STC1000 last night,
> 
> I'm getting better at it but how do others cut/trim the jiffy box to suit? i used a drill and jigsaw but it's a real PITA, the black plastic of the jiffy box seems to melt back together after the jigsaw blade's gone through... there must be a trick to cutting these things super easily and accurately? Out of 3 mounted in Jiffy boxes I don't have a single one where the STC faceplate is mounted perfectly square or flush.... and believe me i've tried all i can think of to cut these dammed jiffy boxes accurately...




okay i am a complete noob to all of this, but finally got my first STC1000 in the mail today on the suggestions of a few on here.... but, how the hell do you wire it up.... i was told there would be instructions on how to wire it, but no.....

can anyone suggest any handy websites that give a step by step process ??

Cheers

BJ


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## stux (5/12/12)

BJMetallica said:


> okay i am a complete noob to all of this, but finally got my first STC1000 in the mail today on the suggestions of a few on here.... but, how the hell do you wire it up.... i was told there would be instructions on how to wire it, but no.....
> 
> can anyone suggest any handy websites that give a step by step process ??
> 
> ...



Www.aussiehomebrewer.com.au


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## stux (5/12/12)

Stux said:


> Www.aussiehomebrewer.com.au



In all seriousness, http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=824333


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## petesbrew (5/12/12)

I considered putting mine in a takeaway container from the local thai place, but I just couldn't get the smell of the red curry out of it.


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## carniebrew (5/12/12)

BJMetallica said:


> okay i am a complete noob to all of this, but finally got my first STC1000 in the mail today on the suggestions of a few on here.... but, how the hell do you wire it up.... i was told there would be instructions on how to wire it, but no.....
> 
> can anyone suggest any handy websites that give a step by step process ??


Did you try googling STC-1000 wiring diagram, or STC-1000 wiring step by step? Both retrieve excellent results as per normal. I found this one in particular quite helpful myself: http://urowiki.filecore.net/Thermostat, but you're going to want to be pretty handy with wire strippers, terminal blocks and understanding what colour our 240v active, neutral and ground wires are in Australia. Or find someone who is.


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## Nick JD (5/12/12)

Don't put it in a lunchbox if children are ever going to be in your house. You might as well wire up a paddlepop.


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## glenwal (5/12/12)

If you need instructions, you probably shouldn't be doing it youself.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

Glen W said:


> If you need instructions, you probably shouldn't be doing it youself.



As a blanket comment, i find the repetitive posting of this type of comment completely useless.

How is someone supposed to learn anything if they ask about it, and someone says "don't even try it".

I understand wiring schematics can cause injury/death easily, and that it should be approached with extreme caution, but how do you know the person can't follow what is a really simple schematic.

Wiring a stc is not difficult at all. If the person has troubles following the schematic then that's a different thing of course, but atleast give them the benefit of the doubt whilst advising of all appropriate cautions.

*REAL WORLD EXAMPLE:*
I don't necessarily understand a lot about electrical systems and components, but i can easily knock up a safe stc controller, and recently have been asking a heap of questions about PID wiring schematics as i had no idea. 
I got some really helpful responses and am now supremely confident in my abilities to wire it all up, complete with switches, led's, emergency stops and all the "bling".

Not having an isolated dig at you Glen, but at the comment in general as it appears a lot by several poster's.

Of course the advise usually given out to get it checked by a sparky is sound advise, or not attempt if you can't follow this simple diagram of the stc, but atleast give them the info so they can decide if they are able to attempt it - any hesitation and they shouldn't...

OT a bit more.... i haven't checked for ages if this type of question is airlocked/sticky'd, but if it isn't, it should be. 
A central place with one correct wiring diagram to send people who ask about it would be awesome (safer) than having people trawl through how many hundreds of pages there would be on the internet which often have incorrect schematics.


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## gravey (5/12/12)

For those who might be confused about the wiring diagram, this is what it translates to:











It really is a piece of piss


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## bignath (5/12/12)

you have your power 'in" going to 5 and 7.

I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8.

5 and 7 as far as i know, are supposed to power your outlets (as per Nick's diagram).


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## Yob (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> For those who might be confused about the wiring diagram, this is what it translates to:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



NFW thats right... and some seriously oversized cable being used :blink:

*ED: what are those connectors rated at? they dont look like they are 10A... mate, delete that post.


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## mr_wibble (5/12/12)

petesbrew said:


> I considered putting mine in a takeaway container from the local thai place, but I just couldn't get the smell of the red curry out of it.


Pete, you need to eat the red curry first, then the container is much more suited to housing electronics.


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## carniebrew (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> For those who might be confused about the wiring diagram, this is what it translates to:
> 
> 
> It really is a piece of piss


Is the use of orange wire just to confuse things for the poor newbies???


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## glenwal (5/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> but how do you know the person can't follow what is a really simple schematic.



Two reasons

1) Because there is simple schematic on top of the STC that tells you what to connect to what.
2) The search function is much eaiser (and safer) than reading a simple schematic, and he managed to fail at that. (Even though he obviously searched because he found this thread :huh: )



A sticky would be good though given the amount of times this is asked - though if it were sticked the mods should really remove all the really bad advice (eg. Lunchboxes) from it.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

Glen W said:


> A sticky would be good though given the amount of times this is asked - though if it were sticked the mods should really remove all the really bad advice (eg. Lunchboxes) from it.



Agreed.


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## Yob (5/12/12)

... and delete the other threads that have 2 lines in them before they were redirected to the thread with the info in.. 

there's a whole bunch of the bloody things now. <_<


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## Nick JD (5/12/12)

Someone needs to do _The Definitive STC1000 Thread_ and have it locked and stickied.


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## tiprya (5/12/12)

Someone needs to just sell pre-wired STC1000s for $60 locally so that noobs don't have to wire these up themselves.


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## gravey (5/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> you have your power 'in" going to 5 and 7.
> 
> I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8.
> 
> 5 and 7 as far as i know, are supposed to power your outlets (as per Nick's diagram).



I'm 100% sure there's more than one way to skin a cat. So who's 100% sureness is correct? Not yours. I have wired this up as per the diagram on the back of the STC-100. I have wired up 2 others the same way. This one has been going strong for almost 2 years now.

Here's another dumbed down diagram that does it the same way







And another...








Yob said:


> NFW thats right... and some seriously oversized cable being used :blink:
> 
> *ED: what are those connectors rated at? they dont look like they are 10A... mate, delete that post.



Oversized cabling huh....yeah that's a huge concern. It's what I had reels and reels of lying around at work. Its perfectly fine for 240v, 10A. Perhaps you should delete your post, or perhaps just not open your mouth on topics you know nothing about?

As for power outlets that are rated lower than 10A - I dont think they even exist mate? The sockets used are simply designed to fit flush in the jiffy box and will cope with 10A just fine, like this - http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=PS4094



carniebrew said:


> Is the use of orange wire just to confuse things for the poor newbies???




Red is the live/hot side of the circuit, the diagram above explains that a bit better. Blue is the neutral side of the circuit. The short answer though is Blue and Red cable is all I had lying around at work. I hacked up a PC power cable for the power outlets, just so they were all bunched together. I also used a PC power cable for Power In.


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## carniebrew (5/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> Agreed.


I'd be more worried about comments such as "I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8" as opposed to getting upset about lunch boxes? Plenty of guys who know what they're doing using a lunch box compared to those who just blindly followed a diagram somewhere using a metal, lockable box.

It simply depends if you like your STC-1000 to cut the power going in vs going out. It makes no difference at all to how the unit functions. Which is why both of these diagrams are perfectly acceptable, despite the different uses of 5/6, 7/8.

6/8 in, 5/7 out
5/7 in, 6/8 out

Also very hard to ever have locally supplied STC-1000's sold for $60, given the legalities around selling 240v electrical wiring without certificates of electrical safety.


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## carniebrew (5/12/12)

Yob said:


> NFW thats right... and some seriously oversized cable being used :blink:
> 
> *ED: what are those connectors rated at? they dont look like they are 10A... mate, delete that post.


Are you taking the piss Yob? That's one of the better hookups i've seen for an STC-1000. And if by connectors you mean the terminal blocks, they look like the type I use, rated WAY above 10A. You can get tiny little crap ones for $1 on eBay that are rated for 10A.

If you are serious, can you explain what you think is wrong in that pic?


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## gravey (5/12/12)

carniebrew said:


> I'd be more worried about comments such as "I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8" as opposed to getting upset about lunch boxes? Plenty of guys who know what they're doing using a lunch box compared to those who just blindly followed a diagram somewhere using a metal, lockable box.
> 
> It simply depends if you like your STC-1000 to cut the power going in vs going out. It makes no difference at all to how the unit functions. Which is why both of these diagrams are perfectly acceptable, despite the different uses of 5/6, 7/8.
> 
> ...



But apparently there is "No ******* Way" its right? Big Nath and Yob are 100% sure on that!

Anyway - here's some stupidly bad pictures of the finished product that cant possibly work or be correct:











Note to self - when filing out the hole for the STC-100, put some cardboard down.....got a bit scratched up on the bench


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## carniebrew (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> But apparently there is "No ******* Way" its right? Big Nath and Yob are 100% sure on that!
> 
> Anyway - here's some stupidly bad pictures of the finished product that cant possibly work or be correct:
> 
> Note to self - when filing out the hole for the STC-100, put some cardboard down.....got a bit scratched up on the bench


Nice, where did you score those low profile power points?

:icon_offtopic: and i'm just as interested in the wine collection in the background!


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## glenwal (5/12/12)

carniebrew said:


> Nice, where did you score those low profile power points?



Jaycar have them (i use the same ones)

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=PS4094


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## gravey (5/12/12)

I didnt go through Jaycar, too expensive. I went through a smaller local supplier in Adelaide, was about half the cost.

Wine list is starting to look good. I have about 80 odd bottles that are worth cellaring, though not having ideal cellaring conditions I can only really hold them for half of their potential.......wine is about drinking anyway, so not that keen to hold on to something for 20 years. I have tried a Darenberg Dead Arm Shiraz from 1996 that is drinking damned well now though, so it would be nice to get a cellar one day.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> I'm 100% sure there's more than one way to skin a cat. So who's 100% sureness is correct? Not yours. I have wired this up as per the diagram on the back of the STC-100. I have wired up 2 others the same way. This one has been going strong for almost 2 years now.



I also agree there's more than one way to skin a cat. I also have three of these wired up going strong for several years too.
What you aren't aware of is that before you joined this forum, there have been a million different ways people have come up with to wire these things up. Apparently they all work.

The diagram you originally posted has been done to death, and in the earlier days of these controllers, was widely considered as not being the best option, for reasons that i can't recall now.....im not an electrician. 
What i will say though, is the other option i presented, as per Nick's diagram, has often been posted here, and qualified by many electricians/brewers as being technically correct. 

The company(ies) that make the STC controllers may have changed the design over the years too. Something you may not have considered. 

So it now seems that there are other ways of doing it with regard to power going in and out. Im fine with that. I see your's works. If you look through my posts you'll see mine works too.



carniebrew said:


> I'd be more worried about comments such as "I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8" as opposed to getting upset about lunch boxes?



Who said i was upset at using lunch boxes? 
I just prefer to use a more secure box with anything housing an appliance running off 240V. 
Besides, there's plenty of "bad advice" when it comes to these things that would have to be cleaned up - how do you know i was "agreeing" with the lunchbox suggestion FFS.



gravey said:


> But apparently there is "No ******* Way" its right? Big Nath and Yob are 100% sure on that!



Whoah....Climb down off your big fucken horse cowboy!
**** me, what an over reaction....
I never said your controller wouldn't work.
I pointed out, that the diagram you presented was considered by many, more experienced brewers than me who have been here longer than me, to be "not the best way to go". 

I know your diagram _work_s. I've seen plenty of previous posts showing your diagram works over the years here. I've also seen it spark debate as to if it's the best way or not, with a LOT of weighted discussion suggesting it was not - from a technical/safety aspect. 

Doesn't mean it won't _work._

If it works for you, and it doesn't matter which way these things are wired up then all good and dandy....but stop acting like a spoilt little ****.

Take your bullshit attitude somewhere else.

It's debate like this that only strengthens the need for a dedicated thread/sticky for wiring these up, that can be locked by the mods/admin after any diagram(s) - assuming both ways are safe, have been verified as being electrically sound.


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## Black Devil Dog (5/12/12)

Jump in the ice bath boys.

If someone is to be called out on something being incorrect or someone is stating something as being correct it would help if those doing so can do from a qualified position.

Not just based on an opinion or here-say.

As a novice who is trying learn more it is unhelpful to have these situations occur because in the end no one knows what is correct.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

Black Devil Dog said:


> Jump in the ice bath boys.
> 
> If someone is to be called out on something being incorrect or someone is stating something as being correct it would help if those doing so can do from a qualified position.
> 
> ...



I agree BDD. Which is why I mentioned that the diagram I have been informed of as correct, has been by qualified people.


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## gravey (5/12/12)

The "No ******* Way" were actually yobs words...you were simply 100% certain that my method was incorrect. A bit more polite, granted, but still fairly arrogant, hence the response.

If there's a reason why it shouldnt be wired up this way, then by all means show me the info. I purchased another STC just a couple of months ago and the diagram is exactly the same. Pins 6 and 8 still operate as the switch. I have had my wiring checked by a couple of electricians the first time I made one, neither mentioned any issues. An electrician at my work checked it and I had a sparky over fixing my aircon just as I was about to plug it in for the first time and he also said it was fine.


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## Diesel80 (5/12/12)

Serious question here.

Whats the go with the fuse shown above?

If these things switch up to 10A under what situation will the 3A fuse fail? Is it there as a safety mechanism for the device or for the user?

Cheers,
D80


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## gravey (5/12/12)

Diesel80 said:


> Serious question here.
> 
> Whats the go with the fuse shown above?
> 
> ...



Its not necessary if you have connected all of your earths together. US only have 2-pin sockets, no earth, hence the extra protection in the wiring diagram.


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## sponge (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> Its not necessary if you have connected all of your earths together. US only have 2-pin sockets, no earth, hence the extra protection in the wiring diagram.



Just my opinion, but I'd rather have all cables (and housing) connected to the main earth. Definitely in no way meant to be taken as a personal attack on anyone...

<3A still does a whoooole lotta damage.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> you have your power 'in" going to 5 and 7.
> 
> I'm 100% sure it is supposed to go to 6 and 8.
> 
> 5 and 7 as far as i know, are supposed to power your outlets (as per Nick's diagram).



Have had another read of my post you responded to.

I don't think it's arrogant at all. 
I've even put a caveat in there that indicates I could in fact be incorrect...

Dunno what's so arrogant about that.


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## Diesel80 (5/12/12)

sponge said:


> Just my opinion, but I'd rather have all cables (and housing) connected to the main earth. Definitely in no way meant to be taken as a personal attack on anyone...
> 
> <3A still does a whoooole lotta damage.





Sponge,

i have all my earth wires joined at the terminal block in my installation. How do i earth a plastic case?
I assume the fact that all earth wires are joined would at least offer me some kind of protection if the worst should happen?

Cheers,
D80


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## Yob (5/12/12)

Ive had another read as well and would like to see the diagram on the back of your STC, it *may* be different than mine...

but I doubt it.. at the end of the day it's a switch, will (possibly) work either way, just not as intended (I guess)..

I also stand by the fact those connectors do not look to be 10A ones.. 

I _could_ be wrong there also..

Harden up a bit soldier, if you know you are correct, back it up with evidence, I have pointed out that to my eye it _looks incorrect_, and certainly todays models are not wired like that, refer Nicks linked image.

Shit, at the end of the day it's your and your familys safety we are trying to look out for


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## gravey (5/12/12)

If you connect all your earths (power in and power out) you dont need the fuse, that's what I was getting at, just in case that wasnt clear.

Yob - They are 15A (possibly higher), so rated higher than necessary - I work in a foundary, pretty sure the sparkies here would not be using anything but. All of the gear was given to me by our maintenance department and the wiring checked by a sparky and double checked by another sparky when I plugged my first one in as I was a bit nervous, despite having reasonable knowledge of circuits  

So, thinking about the apparent 'millions of ways' these things could be wired up I have thought of 'one' other way that would work, but would be quite dangerous and certainly not recommended.

I think what Nath may be referring to as being a dangerous method of wiring an STC-1000 up, is to have the neutral connected to pins 6 & 8 - bad news as you have current still going to your heating/cooling device, it just cant return, circuit is incomplete fridge turns off. When the switch on pins 6/8 turn off, the circuit will work as expected, as there is no return of current via the neutral but you still have current going to your fridge.

The method I have used is perfectly acceptable, it really doesnt matter if power in or power out is doing the switching. Switching on the neutral is certainly not a method any sparky would endorse though. Switching on the live wire, whichever way you go, should not pose any problem as far as I can see.


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## dammag (5/12/12)

I have one of those grey terminal strips in front of me at the moment and mine is 15A 500V so plenty "big" enough.


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## QldKev (5/12/12)

BJMetallica said:


> okay i am a complete noob to all of this, but finally got my first STC1000 in the mail today on the suggestions of a few on here.... but, how the hell do you wire it up.... i was told there would be instructions on how to wire it, but no.....
> 
> can anyone suggest any handy websites that give a step by step process ??
> 
> ...






Stux said:


> Www.aussiehomebrewer.com.au



:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Yob (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> it really doesnt matter if power in or power out is doing the switching. Switching on the neutral is certainly not a method any sparky would endorse thoughi



wouldnt the STC innards for the switch for heating and cooling both be constantly powered but just not switched on? 

Cant be ideal if that is the case


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## squirt in the turns (5/12/12)

Yob said:


> wouldnt the STC innards for the switch for heating and cooling both be constantly powered but just not switched on?
> 
> Cant be ideal if that is the case



I'd agree with gravey and say it doesn't matter. There are 2 sets of relay contacts (5/6 and 7/8). They function exactly the way a single-pole single-throw switch on the live wire would: breaking the circuit when open and completing it when closed. Within the pair it doesn't make any difference which, out the 2 contacts, is "in" (connected to the mains) or "out" (connected to the appliance).

Not sure exactly what you're getting at, Yob, but without the "innards" being powered on, nothing would work.

If the concern is that the appliance/load is not entirely isolated (i.e. that it is permanently connected to the neutral), then the only way to solve that is to add another relay (or 2 if both the heating and cooling circuits are used) to switch the neutral as well. This would require taking the STC apart (bad idea) to solder another relay on. In any event, that'd be overkill if the thing is safely wired and properly earthed.


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## bignath (5/12/12)

gravey said:


> I think what Nath may be referring to as being a dangerous method of wiring an STC-1000 up, is to have the neutral connected to pins 6 & 8 -



No. That's not what i was getting at.


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## barls (5/12/12)

tiprya said:


> Someone needs to just sell pre-wired STC1000s for $60 locally so that noobs don't have to wire these up themselves.


way too much paper work required to make it safe and legal.
saying that you supply me with the parts and ill wire it and tag it safe for a nominal fee using the technical skills and qualification i have. 100% legal then.


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## Black Devil Dog (5/12/12)

Is there a qualified electrician in the house?


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## booargy (5/12/12)

IT DOES MATTER WHICH CABLE YOU SWITCH.
There is a piece of wire in switch boards called the MEN link this connects the neutral to earth. So if the active is connected and an earth fault occurs the circuit becomes live. 
A fuse/circuit breaker is designed to protect the wiring in case of short circuit.
An RCD (residual current device) limits the current through the earth to 30-50mA depending on type. 50mA will kill you.


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## np1962 (5/12/12)

As long as you are switching the Active it makes no difference whether you go in 5 & 7 and out 6 & 8 or in 6 & 8 and out 5 & 7.
Take this from someone who retails these units an who trained as an electronics technician.
As for supplying the units wired and assembled.
As Barls said, it would take many hundreds of units to cover the cost of certification.
Cheers
Nige

P.S. Only have 4 more available until mid January.


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## Yob (5/12/12)

NigeP62 said:


> P.S. Only have 4 more available until mid January.



:lol: 

thanks for clearing that up, think I will still wire mine as per the actual diagram on the unit though


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## dammag (5/12/12)

Maybe it's OK to wire your own unit up but at least test the thing properly.

At the least make sure active, neutral and earth are in the correct position on your outlet and preferably use an RCD tester to make sure your breaker trips in the event of a problem.

As for those lunchbox enclosures, make sure when you knock them off the top of your fridge and go to catch them you don't catch the wrong bit.

As for the which is in, which is out relay contact question, it matters more in DC switching and of course this is AC so I wouldn't worry.


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## np1962 (5/12/12)

Yob said:


> :lol:
> 
> thanks for clearing that up, think I will still wire mine as per the actual diagram on the unit though


Yob, you keep going on about the diagram on the unit, looking at the unit, a brand new one, an older one and then the instructions that come with the units I can't see anywhere that it states which terminals should be in or out.
If you have a different diagram maybe you would care to post it? 
I've done my time working in electrical/electronics and I'm pretty handy at reading diagrams. I think I can find my way around something as simple as this.
Cheers
Nige


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## jaypes (5/12/12)

sponge said:


> Just my opinion, but I'd rather have all cables (and housing) connected to the main earth. Definitely in no way meant to be taken as a personal attack on anyone...
> 
> <3A still does a whoooole lotta damage.


Yep, takes less than 1A to kill you


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## Yob (5/12/12)

My assumption is based on the side of the switch, if the power is on the open side (on the right) then no power can get to the unit until it closes, by no means an expert on electronics but to my thoughts it was a safety way to wire it, still does in my mind, 

Happy to be corrected though I think I would, if wiring up another, wire it as I have been with power in on the right. 

Cheers


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## Nick JD (5/12/12)

Yob said:


> My assumption is based on the side of the switch, if the power is on the open side (on the right) then no power can get to the unit until it closes, by no means an expert on electronics but to my thoughts it was a safety way to wire it, still does in my mind,
> 
> Happy to be corrected though I think I would, if wiring up another, wire it as I have been with power in on the right.
> 
> Cheers



WTF?


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## Yob (5/12/12)

As per the image you posted nick, in on the 6,8 out 5,7.


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## Black Devil Dog (5/12/12)

So is it ok if I lick my finger before I touch the wires to see which one is live?


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## browndog (5/12/12)

```
IT DOES MATTER WHICH CABLE YOU SWITCH
```

That is bullshit dangerous advice to be giving people with no knowledge of electricity.

PLAY IT SAFE, MAKE SURE YOU SWITCH THE ACTIVE ONLY"

I have been the recipient of a good boot from an (apparatus plugged into a power point) because the power point that had the active and neutral reversed. The powerpoint was switched off, but there was still current running through the appliance thanks it being wired incorrectly.

edit- clarification


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## dammag (5/12/12)

browndog said:


> ```
> IT DOES MATTER WHICH CABLE YOU SWITCH
> ```
> 
> ...



Browndog, that say's it DOES matter which "cable" you switch.


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## labels (5/12/12)

browndog said:


> ```
> IT DOES MATTER WHICH CABLE YOU SWITCH
> ```
> 
> ...



Caravans HAVE to have double pole switches by law for this very reason, any silly c*** can wire an extension lead up wrong


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## browndog (5/12/12)

labels said:


> Caravans HAVE to have double pole switches by law for this very reason, any silly c*** can wire an extension lead up wrong



ANY switch (unless double pole) should switch the active because if you are switching the neutral then the item/apparatus you have switched off is still live and can kill you.


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## sponge (6/12/12)

As browndog says, you should always switch the active. 

Put neutrals on the common, and the active on the NO contact. 

Otherwise there can still be current flowing out to the device, even when its switched off, as there's no break in the circuit out to the device along the active.


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## gravey (6/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> No. That's not what i was getting at.



What are you getting at exactly then? So far you've made a claim but I've seen nothing to back it up. So please, rather than confusing the issue, simply supply some evidence for your claims. Please dont launch into a tirade of abuse this time, I'm not looking for a tantrum, just curious to know where your coming from.




Yob said:


> My assumption is based on the side of the switch, if the power is on the open side (on the right) then no power can get to the unit until it closes, by no means an expert on electronics but to my thoughts it was a safety way to wire it, still does in my mind,
> 
> Happy to be corrected though I think I would, if wiring up another, wire it as I have been with power in on the right.
> 
> Cheers



Still fishing yob? Power goes to the relay in both cases. Are you concerned about the STC-1000 contstantly being powered on via pin 1 as well? I mean having power to pin 1 seems dangerous doesnt it? [/sarcasm]. If you are that concerned about having power going to one side of the relay, but not the other, then I'd suggest you throw you STC in the bin and buy something else. Logic FAIL.

Honestly, its uninformed comments like these, said with such authority at the time, with no evidence to back up what has been said, that confuse a basic topic and muddy the waters. Its no surprise some really good brewers CBF with AHB anymore. I've posted my pics of my wiring on 2 other forums and guess what response I got? "Thanks for contributing". If you are 100% sure on something, then back it up with some evidence, otherwise make your post a question, rather than a statement of fact. In the meantime, wire up your STC with power in going to either side of the relay, both are correct, IMHO and in the opinion of several electricians I have spoken to.


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## spudfarmerboy (6/12/12)

Gravey,
Let it go mate.
What youv'e posted is fine. Its a waste of time arguing with some of these people who post things that they don't know much about, but like to make out they do.
Making a comment about the terminal strip that you used is an example.
If they knew what they were talking about they would know that the current carrying capability of that terminal strip is fine.
I think they want to get their post count up because why else would they comment if they don't know.


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## bignath (6/12/12)

Just let it go mate. I can't be fucked with this anymore.

It's not even your thread FFS.

Seriously, I've admitted I don't know a lot about electric circuits, aside from being able to follow simple schematics. Yours works, mine works who gives a ****. 

Put yourself in someone else's shoes for a sec and think how all this shit started...
1. You posted a pic of your wiring.
2. For years, it's been considered by the electrical gurus on ahb that the in should go to the evens, out should come from the odds.
3. I don't know you, or your level of expertise.
4. Yob and I see what we have been led to believe by even more experienced people as an incorrect diagram.
5. We pointed it out. We're trying to keep you safe. If it turns out you know more than us then that's fine. Happy to admit it in fact. I've said all along that I could be wrong or 'as far as I know' etc...

Even the most experienced of us make mistakes every once in a whole, but we are big enough to admit it. I haven't displayed arrogance in my posts, just a desire to help and correct something that has been considered incorrect for a long time. Followed by a sharp tongued defense when my initial advice turned to shit.

You'll notice I backed away from derailing this thread yesterday arvo, and I'd suggest you do the same. 
I have no intention of contributing in this thread anymore.
I'll stick to helping the more appreciative brewers, or at least the ones that can see both sides of the coin.


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## Nick JD (6/12/12)

It'd be good if the mods clean up this thread because for the people who are wiring by rote ... it's really offputting to their confidence.


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## gravey (6/12/12)

Big Nath said:


> Just let it go mate. I can't be fucked with this anymore.



yeah I cant be fucked with people who dish out personal abuse either mate. Apparently questioning The Big Nath warranted abuse? I'll be sure to keep it in mind before I dare to question you again.

peace out and thanks to the PMs from people who thought Big Nath and yobs behaviour was unnacceptable. Personally I think calling someone a "Spoilt Little ****" should not be tolerated.....would The Big Nath say to my face I wonder? I'd certainly call BS when I see it to anyones face, but personal abuse, no, I dont think that is OK.


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## browndog (6/12/12)

dammag said:


> Browndog, that say's it DOES matter which "cable" you switch.




My apologies, sorry for any confusion I may have caused, I really need to get my eyes checked.


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## bignath (6/12/12)

gravey said:


> yeah I cant be fucked with people who dish out personal abuse either mate. Apparently questioning The Big Nath warranted abuse? I'll be sure to keep it in mind before I dare to question you again.
> 
> peace out and thanks to the PMs from people who thought Big Nath and yobs behaviour was unnacceptable. Personally I think calling someone a "Spoilt Little ****" should not be tolerated.....would The Big Nath say to my face I wonder? I'd certainly call BS when I see it to anyones face, but personal abuse, no, I dont think that is OK.



Have pm'd you.


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## sponge (6/12/12)




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## bignath (6/12/12)

Not even close sponge, but i did chuckle at it...

I actually pm'd and clarified my stance and offered an apology.


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## Nick JD (6/12/12)

http://www.bcae1.com/relays.htm

Check out the stuff where they talk about diodes and relay polarity.


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## carniebrew (6/12/12)

sponge said:


>



I was almost sure I was about to be rick-rolled....but somehow it was even worse!


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## spudfarmerboy (6/12/12)

Nick JD said:


> http://www.bcae1.com/relays.htm
> 
> Check out the stuff where they talk about diodes and relay polarity.


Which bit are you referring to Nick?
When they refer to the diode and polarity they are referring to the relay coil not the switched contacts.
On a relay with a DC coil polarity is very important.
The STC1000 uses DC coil relays for switching the heating and cooling contacts and use a diode across the coil for the collapsing field, but that doesn't have any baring on how you connect the active wires to the switched contacts.


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## Yob (6/12/12)

Yob said:


> at the end of the day it's a switch, will (possibly) work either way, just not as intended (I guess)..
> 
> I _could_ be wrong there also..





Yob said:


> Happy to be corrected though I think I would, if wiring up another, wire it as I have been with power in on the right.



''k' n' ell, thought this finished yesterday.

No abuse anywhere in my posts, thought it ended with the 'Happy to be Corrected' bit... when Nige posted some relevant info.

_Again_, Happy to be corrected as I presumably have been. 

My box's are wired as per the diagram Nick posted. (from the thread from a few years ago)


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## Screwtop (6/12/12)

I gotta weigh in here:








Changed the drawing a little, does this change your thoughts Yob ??

NigeP62 are you an old........Blue, Orange, Green, Brown, Slate man from the land of the positive earth??

Screwy


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## Diesel80 (6/12/12)

At the end of the day, 
I think all we really need to know is if our fermentation fridge is going to kill us or not?

Cheers,
D80


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## np1962 (6/12/12)

Screwtop said:


> NigeP62 are you an old........Blue, Orange, Green, Brown, Slate man from the land of the positive earth??
> 
> Screwy



I truly have no idea what this means.... Please Explain :huh:

Edit:- Solved by google... No mate, learned my trade at sea like the best of 'em.


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