# Raspberry Pi vs Arduino vs C.H.I.P vs Photon (inc. Poll)



## idzy (11/12/15)

Which and why?

Raspberry Pi
Photon
C.H.I.P
Arduino
Other
What have you done to help you brew with yours?


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (11/12/15)

For any specific brewing step (mash or fermentation)? Or just in general mate?


----------



## Mattrox (11/12/15)

I don't know enough about each to comment specifically.

However, my criteria are:
1) it works reliably
2) cost effective 
3) easy to DIY - if it breaks I can fix it.

Being more sophisticated doesn't always mean better. Just different.

For my fermentation fridge the STC 1000+ is the most sensible option. 

If I had a fridge in the house a brewpi via and old pic would be good. Proven to work, well documented etc.

Does it control "better"? That would need a data logging of both systems to find out. My hunch is that any gains are marginal, but showing your brewmates how your beer is going on your smart phone would be pretty cool.


----------



## GibboQLD (11/12/15)

Raspberry Pi & Arduino together -- the RPi for the logging, Arduino for the low-level hardware interface.

Used to use an ethernet-enabled Arduino and a sketch I slapped together to push data to a logging & graphing API (which worked well enough I guess), but decided to go down the BrewPi route instead, since it would allow me to split the hardware up and host things in-house.


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (11/12/15)

I use an STC on my RIMS without issue also...


----------



## kaiserben (11/12/15)

There won't be a huge difference in the final product. They all switch things on/off, more or less at whatever times you tell them to. However some are easier to use, nicer to look at (ie interface on PC or mobile), are more flexible, could be utilised for more types of concurrent monitoring in future (pH, specific gravity etc - all possible, just that probes are expensive right now), and require less parts. 

Close monitoring and hyper-control also gives brewers a better understanding of what is going on. Better understanding can lead to better methodology. Most brewers like building, tinkering, testing and experimenting, so you'd think most would be really into this sort of thing. I don't get the "It's fine the old/simple way, so why bother doing it differently?" brigade. It's like saying: "Why bother researching anything? What has science ever done for us?"  But anyway ...

I'm already part-way down the R-Pi path (no need for arduino or photon). It'll have data logging and wifi capability to remotely create, use and alter profiles (on my PC at home, or my Phone while at work or on holidays). But I'll also look into CHIP and Pi Zero. 

CHIP (does anyone have their hands on them yet? I can see it's a Kickstarter thing and they're taking pre-orders) and Pi Zero look promising. I don't know enough about them to vote for them. CHIP does, but Zero doesn't, include in-built wifi capability. Both are under US$10 (cheaper than an STC1000 let alone STC1000 with arduino or photon added).


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (11/12/15)

kaiserben said:


> . I don't get the "It's fine the old/simple way, so why bother doing it differently?" brigade.


Because it often is


----------



## bluedoors (11/12/15)

I have a RPi that i have connected to my kegorator - gives me temp info (graph) and warnings (in case one of my kids fiddles the thermostat button on front). Also has RFID to scan when i pour a beer to give keg levels and connects to my ratebeer cellar for bottle stock

http://bluedoors.duckdns.org/keg/beer.php


----------



## GibboQLD (11/12/15)

BlueDoors said:


> I have a RPi that i have connected to my kegorator - gives me temp info (graph) and warnings (in case one of my kids fiddles the thermostat button on front). Also has RFID to scan when i pour a beer to give keg levels and connects to my ratebeer cellar for bottle stock
> 
> http://bluedoors.duckdns.org/keg/beer.php


Nice, I'd read about Kegerface but hadn't seen anyone using it in Australia yet. Slick setup!


----------



## SBOB (11/12/15)

BlueDoors said:


> I have a RPi that i have connected to my kegorator - gives me temp info (graph) and warnings (in case one of my kids fiddles the thermostat button on front). Also has RFID to scan when i pour a beer to give keg levels and connects to my ratebeer cellar for bottle stock
> 
> http://bluedoors.duckdns.org/keg/beer.php


one bottle of crown lager hey


----------



## Moad (11/12/15)

BlueDoors said:


> I have a RPi that i have connected to my kegorator - gives me temp info (graph) and warnings (in case one of my kids fiddles the thermostat button on front). Also has RFID to scan when i pour a beer to give keg levels and connects to my ratebeer cellar for bottle stock
> 
> http://bluedoors.duckdns.org/keg/beer.php


Would be interested in the RFID aspect of this one, can you provide more info? Maybe a thread on this?


----------



## GibboQLD (14/12/15)

Moad said:


> Would be interested in the RFID aspect of this one, can you provide more info? Maybe a thread on this?


If it's anything like the Hymas Wood version, he'll have a bunch of RFID tags that correlate to his taps, and he just swipes the relevant tag when he pours a beer.

The Hymas Wood version used RFID tags for bottled beer too, but given the variety of bottled beers you could have in your cellar/fridge at any given time, this seems a little unworkable in the longterm.


----------



## megabyte (14/12/15)

I love the "I think I might be in the wrong thread..." option :lol:


----------



## mr_wibble (14/12/15)

Arduino PID controlled the temperature of my HLT.

Little OLED display to set the temperature (via a knob on a rotary encoder), switching a 2200 watt element via an SSD.
Temperature reading with a dallas DS18b20

The OLED display is massive overkill, but someone gave me a Jaycar gift-card, so i used it.
... a 16x2 LCD would have been easier & cheaper.


Plan to arduino control a complete HERMS when I find some time to actually get the hardware together.
It's not really much different to the HLT controller, except perhaps I'd add a few extra temperature points for extra info.
Maybe some failsafes too - like Pump malfunction, Low Water, etc.

Oops, i forgot the "Why":

Because it's cheap and easy. I use no-name brand arduino nano, bought directly from China. Cost about $5-7.

There's hundreds of tutorials and all sorts of examples, pretty much for anything you'd want to do someone has already done, written 3 webpages and made 14 "how-to" videos.


----------



## Bribie G (14/12/15)

I find a little bit of cinnamon goes well in the crust of a raspberry pie.

I bought an arduino but it won't lift my bag.


----------



## bluedoors (14/12/15)

GibboQLD said:


> If it's anything like the Hymas Wood version, he'll have a bunch of RFID tags that correlate to his taps, and he just swipes the relevant tag when he pours a beer.
> 
> The Hymas Wood version used RFID tags for bottled beer too, but given the variety of bottled beers you could have in your cellar/fridge at any given time, this seems a little unworkable in the longterm.


Yes, exactly like this. expect i found it too cumbersome for bottle stock, so bottles are managed in my ratebeer cellar and i use the mobile app to remove or add items from there. I did look at using barcodes - i have a barcode scanner for this purpose but then found many beers didn't have barcodes on them


----------



## idzy (14/12/15)

BlueDoors said:


> Yes, exactly like this. expect i found it too cumbersome for bottle stock, so bottles are managed in my ratebeer cellar and i use the mobile app to remove or add items from there. I did look at using barcodes - i have a barcode scanner for this purpose but then found many beers didn't have barcodes on them


Sounds like you need a hybrid bar code scanner / photo recognition camera


----------



## idzy (19/12/15)

I wonder if most people that play around with them work in IT? (i.e. Software Engineers)


----------



## Gweedo (25/2/16)

I agree the Arduino and Raspberry Pi combo, but I went with a cheaper option and utilized an Acer Netbook that was just gathering dust and about to see the hammer and the bin until it dawned on my to flash the latest stable Debian and installing BrewPi, and use that in place of the Raspberry Pi, saving me about $100.


----------



## megabyte (26/2/16)

If you're wondering about the CHIPs (that nobody voted for), the CHIP is like a Pi Zero but with Bluetooth and WiFi built in and it costs a little more ($9 vs $5 for the Pi Zero). My boards arrived about a week ago so here are a couple of pictures showing what they look like...






I'm absolutely smitten with the keg monitoring projects that have been mentioned in this thread and working on yet another solution after having a few unexpected blows on my own taps recently. In this case I'm using a small bluetooth module instead of any of the platforms mentioned in the poll.




With so many development platforms available I almost feel bad for voting in the poll, it's an exciting time and we're spoiled for choice. Pi, Photon, Arduino, CHIP or other. I have love enough for all of them!


----------



## Blind Dog (26/2/16)

I have absolutely no idea what any of the above means. I asked my 10 year old son if he knew what raspberry Pi was. He sighed, looked at me as if I was an idiot, rattled off lots of words that kind of made sense but mostly didn't and went back to his laptop. I'm pretty sure there'll be tales at school today about how 'my dad is, like, so old...'

And to think that back in the day I actually used to write code in c++. I guess that's what 20 odd years of being a desk jockey does to you.


----------



## kaiserben (3/3/16)

My >65 year old dad is doing all the programming/coding work for my Raspberry Pi "BrewPi-esque" project. So don't let age be a barrier. 

We're trying just a Raspberry Pi (and a Sainsmart relay board, but with no arduino or photon required) and expect it'll do the job just fine. (Anyone have any feedback about this working or not working?)

Simple testing indicates the relays switch when required to. 

I'll be putting the prototype into a jiffy box either this weekend or next and then testing it on an actual fridge. 


EDIT: We haven't been able to get our hands on a Pi Zero to try that, but it'd probably work. We didn't get the CHIP because details were a bit scarce and it was so new that there wasn't yet a community of people using it to fall back on for advice if need be.


----------



## kaiserben (3/3/16)

PS- Raspberry Pi 3 was released this week. It has in-built wifi and bluetooth. And a slightly faster processor (1.2gHz). It's only $5 more expensive than the Pi 2.

So I've just ordered a Pi 3. I already have a Pi 2 running my TV/media centre. I'll probably end up using the Pi3 for media centre and Pi2 (with wifi dongle) for Brewing.


----------



## gezzanet (3/3/16)

Did the same. Ordered a pi3 yesterday. Because of wifi. Now thinking of it for rasp plex setup but see if I can get wifi brewpi to work first.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (3/3/16)

Pi3 looks a very nice thing. But some more RAM would be nice


----------



## GibboQLD (7/3/16)

gezzanet said:


> Did the same. Ordered a pi3 yesterday. Because of wifi. Now thinking of it for rasp plex setup but see if I can get wifi brewpi to work first.


I have an old RPi running BrewPi over wifi (Edimax dongle) and it works pretty well.


----------



## rude (8/3/16)

Bribie G said:


> I find a little bit of cinnamon goes well in the crust of a raspberry pie.
> 
> I bought an arduino but it won't lift my bag.


Why not once the mash is finished (timed ) it brings a relay in which operates the electric winch


----------



## kaiserben (17/3/16)

kaiserben said:


> PS- Raspberry Pi 3 was released this week. It has in-built wifi and bluetooth. And a slightly faster processor (1.2gHz). It's only $5 more expensive than the Pi 2.
> 
> So I've just ordered a Pi 3. I already have a Pi 2 running my TV/media centre. I'll probably end up using the Pi3 for media centre and Pi2 (with wifi dongle) for Brewing.


I couldn't get the Pi3 to boot OpenElec for my media centre, so for now my DIY BrewPi-eqsue controller will get the fancy new Pi3. I've been able to switch relays on and off wirelessly/remotely (from my PC), so things are looking good. 

Inside the jiffy box all there is is a Pi3, Sainsmart 4 relays and wiring (240V power source for relays, 5V Pi power source, connections from Pi to Relays, connections from relays to cooling and heating devices. No need for Arduino etc). 

It's been tested and it all works. I can switch devices on and off remotely via a webpage. The only work left is to work on the programming for running ferment schedules and to make the webpage look pretty.


----------



## Siborg (17/3/16)

I bought a raspberry pi ages ago and was thinking of ditching it, but using it for brewing seems a lot more tempting. Do I need an arduino to actually control the fridge/whatever? And the pi just handles logging? I've had a look on the brewpi site and it looks like they've got it controlling mashing all the way through to fermentation.


----------



## MastersBrewery (17/3/16)

kaiserben said:


> I couldn't get the Pi3 to boot OpenElec for my media centre, so for now my DIY BrewPi-eqsue controller will get the fancy new Pi3. I've been able to switch relays on and off wirelessly/remotely (from my PC), so things are looking good.
> 
> Inside the jiffy box all there is is a Pi3, Sainsmart 4 relays and wiring (240V power source for relays, 5V Pi power source, connections from Pi to Relays, connections from relays to cooling and heating devices. No need for Arduino etc).
> 
> It's been tested and it all works. I can switch devices on and off remotely via a webpage. The only work left is to work on the programming for running ferment schedules and to make the webpage look pretty.


Brewpi has been ported to run under python, using just the Raspberry. In final dev now as I understand it but has been up and running with .1c variation. Remember Elco didn't just cobble together some hardware to run PID he created an algorithm to deal specifically with ferment conditions. You might save yourself some time and frustration and I believe the Developer will be looking for testers soon.


----------



## mr_wibble (17/3/16)

kaiserben said:


> PS- Raspberry Pi 3 was released this week. It has in-built wifi and bluetooth. And a slightly faster processor (1.2gHz). It's only $5 more expensive than the Pi 2.
> 
> So I've just ordered a Pi 3. I already have a Pi 2 running my TV/media centre. I'll probably end up using the Pi3 for media centre and Pi2 (with wifi dongle) for Brewing.


Which media centre software do you use?

I was beta-testing MythTV on the PI2 (frontend only) to talk to the MythTV box under the telle.
It was mostly OK, but the browsing of the static video library (as opposed to recordings) let it down a bit.
Video playback was mostly fine, but the (~15 second) browse delays became a show-stopper. I do have a lot of files though.


----------



## megabyte (17/3/16)

kaiserben said:


> I couldn't get the Pi3 to boot OpenElec for my media centre, so for now my DIY BrewPi-eqsue controller will get the fancy new Pi3. I've been able to switch relays on and off wirelessly/remotely (from my PC), so things are looking good.


Pics! (or it didn't happen h34r: )

Sounds great!


----------



## klangers (17/3/16)

Arduino - easier hardware interface to my knowledge than the others and the only code I know with any hint of fluency is C, so C++ or whatever the variant for arduino is is nicely familiar.


----------



## Bribie G (17/3/16)

I've got a girl slave now to hoist my bag so I won't be needing this, I just don't seem to be getting any cinnamon flavour into it:




I can't see any use for it personally ( geek mate gave it to me about 3 years ago to watch free TV shows back before Netflix etc, never really got into it ) .

If anyone would like it, just send me a prepaid padded bag and it's yours. Generation 1 I'd guess.

Ed: I think the SD cards have movies on them, probably Coen Brothers etc.


----------



## gezzanet (17/3/16)

Pm sent. I'm sure to break it but corn bros sounds good


----------



## kaiserben (18/3/16)

Mr Wibble said:


> Which media centre software do you use?


Using Kodi (I think I'm still on v15). Once it's up and running it's superb.


----------



## kaiserben (18/3/16)

MastersBrewery said:


> Brewpi has been ported to run under python, using just the Raspberry. In final dev now as I understand it but has been up and running with .1c variation. Remember Elco didn't just cobble together some hardware to run PID he created an algorithm to deal specifically with ferment conditions. You might save yourself some time and frustration and I believe the Developer will be looking for testers soon.


Oh, interesting! I didn't know that was happening. Although one of the big reasons for going it alone is that I don't really want to be tied down to his cloud system.


----------



## MastersBrewery (18/3/16)

kaiserben said:


> Oh, interesting! I didn't know that was happening. Although one of the big reasons for going it alone is that I don't really want to be tied down to his cloud system.


This is the original code that ran on Arduino and RPI all mashed up onto the RPI - nothing to do with clould or spark


----------



## kaiserben (14/4/16)

This weekend my RPi controller is at the stage where I'll test it on an actual beer (not the initial active ferment, just the slow rise for a lager diacetyl rest, then hold, and then chill down to lagering temp and hold). 

I've run testing outside the fridge (with my warm hands & a bottle of cold water to manipulate the temps measured by the sensors) and also a quick test in a fridge. 

It's pretty much ready to go. (no PID though, so we'll see how it performs. I suspect PID won't be necessary, particularly as it has built-in delays of 5 mins after each time a relay switches - as does BrewPi). If I see large overshoots following a relatively large temperature change (say anything above a 5C change) I'll just build in a way of making it slow down 2C shy of the target. Easy! (in my head it seems easy).


----------



## kaiserben (21/4/16)

I beta tested the above in an actual, real-life ferment overnight (actually it had fermented out and I was just chilling it down for a period of lagering) and it passed with flying colours. 

Speaking of colours, I have a pretty graph tracking the temperature of air inside the fridge (blue) and temperature of the wort (green). The fridge relay is controlled by that blue sensor. It also has a small delay to protect the fridge compressor (the delays are currently set at 3 mins after relay goes on and 8 minutes after relay goes off). 





In the test I set it to target 5C for 4 hours, 2C for 4 hours, and then 0C for 4 hours. It never reached those targets, but I was just wanting to see how it behaved.


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (8/5/16)

Hey those in the know. I saw on GitHub the firmwares etc for BrewPi. Is it open source and therefore if I have an Arduino and RPi can I simply download and install and have myself a fully functioning BrewPi?

I've got an Arduino Mega with various relay modules and Fotek clone SSRs. Stripping the panel down at the moment to rebuild to my needs. This would help me get things moving a lot faster if my assumption is correct.

Ps. I think I'll change to Inkbird SSRs, they appear to be a Chinese version of a genuine Fotek.


----------



## SBOB (8/5/16)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Hey those in the know. I saw on GitHub the firmwares etc for BrewPi. Is it open source and therefore if I have an Arduino and RPi can I simply download and install and have myself a fully functioning BrewPi?
> .


yep
I have a RPi, Arduino Uno, a 2 channel external relay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Two-2-Channel-Relay-Module-With-Optocoupler-For-PIC-AVR-DSP-ARM-Arduino-5V-New-/181752994310) 
Few wires, a power supply, a couple of external temperature probes and a bit of code understanding/stuffing around and BAM

BrewPi setup


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (8/5/16)

That's awesome!! All I don't have is the Pi, saves me mucking about trying to learn the code from the ground up. [emoji3][emoji3][emoji3]


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (8/5/16)

Will attempt to incorporate level sensing with an aquarium pump bubbler (already got the gear and code for this) into the BrewPi code


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (10/5/16)

Backpedalling here, just realised they are yet to realease a 3V or Mash control software for BrewPi. Might have to try the CraftBrewPi as an alternative for the mean time.

Took a further step back and did some thinking about what I am after at this stage with my 3V RIMS rig control. Right now I would be more than satisfied if the controller was able to:


Measure Pot level (via already installed bubbler/P-sensor) onto a computer screen interface in real time (Web or local, web is more flexible).
Measure Pot temperatures (already have DS18B20 sensors in thermowells) onto a computer screen interface in real time (Web or local, web is more flexible).
Control RIMS element for mash control with PID loop (have the SSR, DS18B20 and thermowell on RIMS tube outlet). 
Control Kettle element(s) with PWM? (Would required different SSR's than I already have) - stretch target, as my two elements can be utilised depending on my batch size for a reasonable boil off rate that I am happy with already.
Considerations:

If controlling RIMS element based on temperature, how to incorporate safety, ie. don't allow element to be turned on unless the pump is running. I have manual ball valves also, so there will be an element of risk with this that I will have to manage as the brewer hands on.


----------



## mr_wibble (10/5/16)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Considerations:
> 
> If controlling RIMS element based on temperature, how to incorporate safety, ie. don't allow element to be turned on unless the pump is running. I have manual ball valves also, so there will be an element of risk with this that I will have to manage as the brewer hands on.


My HERMS heat exchange (which is currently a bunch of parts in a box) will include a stainless water-level switch.
So if it "boils" dry, the heat will no longer turn on, and maybe a red flashing LED on top of the tank.

The only outstanding issue right now is that I don't know how good the stainless is. I guess time will tell.

-kt


----------



## DJ_L3ThAL (10/5/16)

Got a link or pics to the switch you have?


----------



## kaiserben (25/5/16)

kaiserben said:


> We haven't been able to get our hands on a Pi Zero to try that


So I recently bought a Pi Zero. I had to buy it in a "starter kit", including some parts/cabling that I already owned, because nowhere in Aus was selling a Pi Zero by itself. So that bumped the price up to $38. But I really wanted to test it out and ... 

It works fine. 

The downside of the Pi Zero compared to a Pi2 or Pi3 is that you have to solder on the GPIO pins yourself. To use wifi you'll need to buy a wifi dongle and a micro USB to USB connector (a connector came with the starter kit I bought).

If I were recommended this to anyone else I'd say just grab a Pi3, which has the GPIO pins ready to use and has in-built wifi & bluetooth (I paid $56.20).


----------



## mr_wibble (27/5/16)

DJ_L3ThAL said:


> Got a link or pics to the switch you have?


http://www.aliexpress.com/item/ES-4510-2A1/32336271638.html

They also sell something like this at Core Electronics, except with a 90 degree bend.

Sorry for the late reply, i did mean to earlier, but once our internets run out for the month, it's just about impossible to logon to aliexpress.


----------



## roger mellie (27/5/16)

Other

RPi/Arduino whatever pissy arse little gay microprocessor pieces of crap just suck. They aren't kids play - they are infuriating and flaky.

Buy a PLC and a touch screen HMI - will be robust, it will work, programming is done in a logical language not Swahili - sure they cost more to buy to start with but time is money and the months you will save instead of debugging will be repaid in spades. 

Proper PID interfaces
Computer based HMI systems to event log/data log to your hearts content
You don't need to speak a stupid stack based if/then/else langauge

PLC's are kids play

Its Friday.

RM


----------



## MastersBrewery (27/5/16)

roger mellie said:


> Other
> 
> RPi/Arduino whatever pissy arse little gay microprocessor pieces of crap just suck. They aren't kids play - they are infuriating and flaky.


 Stop sugar coating it tell us what you really think.


----------



## mr_wibble (1/6/16)

Arduino *is* kids play, I spent 2 terms teaching kids how to do basic projects on them after skool.
All of them could do it, even the ones who weren't so good at normal "bookish" school work.

Arduino is programmed in a C/C++ style language, it's fairly simple and there's a truckload of examples.
I've never found them to be "flaky", not even the cheap $3 arduino-nano knockoff boards.
(Although out-of-the-box non-working I/O pins... yes.)


----------



## GibboQLD (1/6/16)

Mr Wibble said:


> Arduino *is* kids play...


If you're using the IDE it is -- you can follow any number of online tutorials and have an example sketch running in <10 mins. The IDE can be limiting at times due to the "translation" between coding used in the IDE and C/C++, though it's typically not an issue for the majority of users.

The reason Arduino is so popular is because it can be as easy or as difficult as you want it to be. You can write a decent sketch in the IDE to make _X_ do _Y_ in ten minutes or less, or you can write your code in C/C++ and have complete control over the microcontroller (there are even some folks using pure assembly, from what I've read).


----------

