# Block & Tackle Chain Hoist



## Crusty (19/3/14)

Well, after my first brew on the BM 50, I've decided to up the pulling power of my pulley system.
I refuse to do another brew until I get something set up better than the BIAB pulley system I was using.
The suction power of the malt pipe & the grain weight was super heavy & I ain't doing it again without some serious help.
I'm looking at a Block & tackle. Any of you guys using one & care to share what you think. I've seen one before but never used one & know nothing about them at all. I'm looking at this one. There's not much price difference between the 1 Ton & 2 Ton & both are more than I need but the chain lift may be handy for jobs down the track.
Thoughts or recommendations will help me out.
Cheers


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## lael (19/3/14)

What were you using previously? I've copied bribie G's system for mine. Works well, still some effort to hoist (17kg grain bills when full in my clone). 

I got the blocks from anzor.


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## Crusty (19/3/14)

lael said:


> What were you using previously? I've copied bribie G's system for mine. Works well, still some effort to hoist (17kg grain bills when full in my clone).
> 
> I got the blocks from anzor.


I was just using a single rope pulley & it was ok for single batch Biab but I didn't enjoy removing that malt pipe with it.
I made a rookie mistake too by lifting the malt pipe a tad too high during the sparge & the malt pipe came off the centre rod leaving it in suspension with nowhere to go. I simply had to hold onto it until the sparge water ran through. The block & tackle has the advantage of locking in position at any height so looking at this at the moment.


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## Spiesy (19/3/14)

I got a block and tackle, rope one, from Bunning's.


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## Howlingdog (19/3/14)

Crusty, get the block and tackle now plan your brewing space. If you having trouble with the 50L brau now it can only get worse strength wise. We had a member in our club that was 95 when he called last drinks and brewed to the end. He had rails for his B&T all through his brewery. He never had to lift more than a pint glass.


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## lael (19/3/14)

http://www.anzor.com.au/marine-hardware/blockspulleys/s315a-double-wheel-mame-block/product

Is what I got. Forget the price, but it was cheaper than a lower quality one from bunnings.


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## idzy (19/3/14)

Spiesy said:


> I got a block and tackle, rope one, from Bunning's.


Might go and grab one. Have been looking into this for 60l ferms into the chesty...have been using a moving trolley to the side then getting a hand or stupidly struggling... not recommended.


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## superstock (19/3/14)

I would suggest a multi sheave rope pulley. I have several chain blocks in my w/shop. The good quality ones get some rust on the chains if they are not used with oily hands. The cheap ones tend to flake the nickel?? coating off the hand chain and I wouldn't want my brew under either of them.


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## shaunous (19/3/14)

If you want to be able to pull the load up and it sit there at your desired height, well a block and tackle is probably the go, i have a 2t one which is great for all my needs, but thats mainly mechanical not brewing, and its fixed in my shed.
I'd grab a 250kg or 500kg one for brewing if I were u crusty, they weigh fukall so u dont have to struggle on a ladder when lifting them above your head (If u plan to move it around and out of the road).

The one problem I see though is excess chain always being in your road, not only the lift chain, but the lifting and lowering hand chain, they are normally really long, and they get in your road enough when doing mechanical tasks, i'd hate to have to use one when trying to keep a brew still and sterile. You have to do some precision measuring to make sure where u want to use it isnt to close vertically to where to want to mount it. (I've probably confused the hell outa u now) 

Maybe try this option http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/750-kg-Beaver-Chain-lever-block-come-along-/251471768710?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a8ce2ac86 , what us diesel mechanics refer to as a 'Come 'along'


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## shaunous (19/3/14)

superstock said:


> I would suggest a multi sheave rope pulley. I have several chain blocks in my w/shop. The good quality ones get some rust on the chains if they are not used with oily hands. The cheap ones tend to flake the nickel?? coating off the hand chain and I wouldn't want my brew under either of them.


Yeh that to.

A rope pulley with a boat style tie to the side might be better. http://www.anzor.com.au/marine-hardware/cleats-fairleads/product


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## DU99 (19/3/14)

every thought of going into a electric hoist


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## MastersBrewery (19/3/14)

I'm lazier like DU99 one of these should cover it


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## shaunous (19/3/14)

MastersBrewery said:


> I'm lazier like DU99 one of these should cover it


Damn, me likey.


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## GABBA110360 (19/3/14)

Crusty said:


> Well, after my first brew on the BM 50, I've decided to up the pulling power of my pulley system.
> I refuse to do another brew until I get something set up better than the BIAB pulley system I was using.
> The suction power of the malt pipe & the grain weight was super heavy & I ain't doing it again without some serious help.
> I'm looking at a Block & tackle. Any of you guys using one & care to share what you think. I've seen one before but never used one & know nothing about them at all. I'm looking at this one. There's not much price difference between the 1 Ton & 2 Ton & both are more than I need but the chain lift may be handy for jobs down the track.
> ...


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## GABBA110360 (19/3/14)

*brian*
*this my top block*
*http://aussiehomebrewer.com/gallery/image/7706-imag0087/*


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## Crusty (19/3/14)

GABBA110360 said:


> *brian*
> *this my top block*
> *http://aussiehomebrewer.com/gallery/image/7706-imag0087/*


Where did you get it all from GABBA?


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## Crusty (19/3/14)

I stumbled across & thought, that's what I'm doing.


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## GABBA110360 (19/3/14)

Crusty said:


> Where did you get it all from GABBA?


I bought the block pulleys from the co-op in maclean plus the 14 mm silver rope is easy on the hands and to splice


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## GABBA110360 (19/3/14)

you can buy just about anything you will need at the co-op chanderlry and all stainless .
see my brother alan in there
most of these things aren't cheap but you will never break them
ken


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## tavas (19/3/14)

I use a boat winch mounted on a frame i made. Cheap boat winch from BCF will work.


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## Crusty (19/3/14)

Supercheap Auto have them too, here.
Don't know if they are cheap & nasty or not. Probably similar quality to the ebay ones.


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## kezza (19/3/14)

i have been using one of these http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Electric-Hoist-MachT-125-250KG-510W-15m-Rope-Winch-Pro-Lift-Power-Tool-/390799650279?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5afd796de7&_uhb=1


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## spog (19/3/14)

What about an engine hoist,winch up the pot wheel it to where ever and bingo,job done.
It could be used for other ? applications and can be had for a reasonable price.


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## superstock (19/3/14)

tavas said:


> I use a boat winch mounted on a frame i made. Cheap boat winch from BCF will work.


Damn, out of sight out of mind. I've got one of these on the boat trailer in the lock up. Even has plastic covered wire.


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## mb-squared (19/3/14)

This is what I use. Very cheap and very easy.

http://www.krabach.info/kayak_hoist/hoist.html


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## Crusty (19/3/14)

Maybe


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## lael (19/3/14)

Gabba, what size are your top pulley wheels?


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## wombil (19/3/14)

This is what I use,good for 200KG no sweat.Could be expensive tho.
Just need a tie off cleat or similar.
Boat winch is good too.


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## wombil (20/3/14)

This is what I use,good for 200KG no sweat.Could be expensive tho.
Just need a tie off cleat or similar.
Boat winch is good too.


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## booargy (20/3/14)

I needed to lift a motor out and in turned out a few times. this is a super cheap chain block on a tripod I knocked up out of some pipe plate and a bolt. needs safety chains to stop the legs slipping out. the design allows you to walk it. 250kg is more than enough. the other thing with these is the chain to operate it needs to hang pretty much straight down. you could hang a bucket there for it to go in. 



That is 2 bolts


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## GABBA110360 (20/3/14)

> Gabba, what size are your top pulley wheels?


they are 90 mm x 2o wide roughly
typical med duty trawler gear
and the rope is 12mm not 14 silver rope
double on top with a single with a becket on bottom
tie off cleat on the shed wall


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## lael (20/3/14)

that is serious sizing. Easy to lift I imagine. What sort of prices were they?


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## booargy (20/3/14)

$87 250kg super cheap hey


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## Crusty (20/3/14)

wombil said:


> This is what I use,good for 200KG no sweat.Could be expensive tho.
> Just need a tie off cleat or similar.
> Boat winch is good too.
> 
> ...


Looks good. Can I borrow her...... :lol:
Seriously though, that setup looks good.
I don't really want the tie off cleat & that's why I was looking at the chain hoist.


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## shaunous (20/3/14)

Even though im young and strong  , this thread has made me now seriously consider I beam rails and a little electric crane above my fermenting freezers and CC fridge. Even more so that I want to start doing massive Ginger Beer and Cider batches in 50L fermenters as my stocks dont seem to last.

Onya Crusty :angry2:


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## wide eyed and legless (20/3/14)

wombil said:


> This is what I use,good for 200KG no sweat.Could be expensive tho.
> Just need a tie off cleat or similar.
> Boat winch is good too.
> 
> ...


I can see it is no sweat for you, or is that you in the pic?


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## superstock (20/3/14)

I tell you guys, unless you can cover your brew, don't use a chain block. The chain and wheels are all wearing parts right above what you are lifting. And for BIAB brewers the steam will rust and corrode things quicker than you would believe. Trust me on this, I am an engine reconditioner, and have chain blocks over hot tanks, cold tanks and just for loading.
A multi sheave pulley system with good quality rope and cleat would be the go. Also an engine crane would serve, as the lifting hook etc doesn't move and the crane is mobile to move from one place to another.


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## Crusty (20/3/14)

superstock said:


> I tell you guys, unless you can cover your brew, don't use a chain block. The chain and wheels are all wearing parts right above what you are lifting. And for BIAB brewers the steam will rust and corrode things quicker than you would believe. Trust me on this, I am an engine reconditioner, and have chain blocks over hot tanks, cold tanks and just for loading.
> A multi sheave pulley system with good quality rope and cleat would be the go. Also an engine crane would serve, as the lifting hook etc doesn't move and the crane is mobile to move from one place to another.


Thanks for the tips.
After a visit to Gabba's place this afternoon, I think I'm sold on his pulley system idea.
I found these on ebay & I don't see any problem lifting anything with either of these.
What do you think Gabba?

4:1 bad boy

The mother of all pulleys, 6:1


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## Black n Tan (20/3/14)

Crusty that seems blood expensive and to borrow a phrase "using a sledge hammer to crack a walnut'. Go to a boat chandlery and buy two 30mm double pulleys (both with a becket I think it is called) and a cleat. Rope from bunnings. All up it will cost less than half. That is what I use for my braumeister.

EDIT: both pulleys should have beckets.


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## woodwormm (20/3/14)

+ 1 for boat winch this is mine - drill attachment almost makes it electric yeah?


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## superstock (20/3/14)

I agree with B&T. Small boat chandlery,(whitworths, bias marine etc) for sheave blocks in SS or acetel. or combination of both. While there get your rope, nylon or polyester braid(preferred).


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## GABBA110360 (21/3/14)

> Thanks for the tips.
> After a visit to Gabba's place this afternoon, I think I'm sold on his pulley system idea.
> I found these on ebay & I don't see any problem lifting anything with either of these.
> What do you think Gabba?
> ...


yeah the 4/1 blocks are the same as mine with an extra sheave- more purchase.
price is about right for them

you can go double braid polyester rope but you better get me stone cold sober if you want me to splice it to the becket!!!!!


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## superstock (21/3/14)

GABBA110360 said:


> you can go double braid polyester rope but you better get me stone cold sober if you want me to splice it to the becket!!!!!


A decent knot will do. Has the benefit of being easily removed and you are not really stressing the rope.
For everyone else stay away from silver rope and the like as they fray and could drop bits into your brew.


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## GABBA110360 (21/3/14)

superstock said:


> A decent knot will do. Has the benefit of being easily removed and you are not really stressing the rope.
> For everyone else stay away from silver rope and the like as they fray and could drop bits into your brew.


a splice will look a little neater than knot
as for stressing the rope/line I don't think it even comes close to being an issue due to the size of the rope
a good splice is as strong as the rope any knot is weaker
a bowline would be easy but a splice is NICE
it's all good have fun


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## superstock (21/3/14)

GABBA110360 said:


> a splice will look a little neater than knot
> as for stressing the rope/line I don't think it even comes close to being an issue due to the size of the rope
> a good splice is as strong as the rope any knot is weaker
> a bowline would be easy but a splice is NICE
> it's all good have fun


No argument about that here, but how many would have the right fid to do it.


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## breakbeer (21/3/14)

MastersBrewery said:


> I'm lazier like DU99 one of these should cover it


I use one of these, at first I thought it was overkill, then I used it. Now I don't know how I did without it 

No more lifting hot malt pipes that weigh up to 25kg


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## GABBA110360 (21/3/14)

superstock said:


> No argument about that here, but how many would have the right fid to do it.


I do that's why I offered to splice it
cheers
ken


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## Crusty (21/3/14)

Ok, all sorted.
Chain hoist probably not suited to this application.
Electric hoist would probably be ok but powering the thing where I needed it was an issue.
So, I went & got myself two double 75mm block SS pulleys with beckets, a 200mm cleat, a SS clip snap, 2 x SS Dee shackles & 15m of 12mm silver rope.
All this gear is used by commercial fisho's on their trawlers so I have no reservations about the durability or quality of the gear.
With the two pulleys, I will get a 4:1 ratio of pulling power so that should make light work of anything I'll be lifting.
It was a tad expensive to set up but will last a life time & it's super heavy duty.
GABBA has been kind enough to offer his splicing skills tomorrow morning to get me over the line... :beerbang:
Next brew on the BM this weekend & looking to even the score with the malt pipe..


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## lael (21/3/14)

for anyone else interested in getting a block and tackle set up I sent a quote request through to Anzor:

MFBM42032 S315A 32MM 304 DOUBLE WHEEL MAME BLOCK 2 $23.2474 EACH $46.49

MFBM42050 S315A 50MM 304 DOUBLE WHEEL MAME BLOCK 2 $32.6424 EACH $65.28

MFBM42025 S315A 25MM 304 DOUBLE WHEEL MAME BLOCK 2 $21.0486 EACH $42.10

ZFFCPLEASE3KG FREIGHT & PACKAGING NATIONWIDE 3KG 1 $16.0000 $16.00

I got the 25mm rollers, but would definitely go the larger ones If I was doing it again. At the time I thought 25mm would be plenty. They're good, but more is better  I ordered a spare set that I don't think I'll be using if anyone somewhat local is after them. Their stainless clips (caribiner like things) are also a bunch cheaper than bias boating / whitworths etc.


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## Crusty (21/3/14)

Mine is a bit beefier.
2 x Block double S/S SHV 75mm - $158.70
2 x Shackle Dee S/Steel 8mm - $9.41
Clip snap S/Steel 12mm Asymetric - $17.60
Cleat Aluminum Alloy 200mm - $10.60
Rope P/Eth Silver 12mm x 15m - $18.54
Total cost $214.84.


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## breakbeer (21/3/14)

Wow. Electric winch cost me $80 & I thought that was pricey

An extension lead would've cost you another $5


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## lael (21/3/14)

That is beefy!


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## Amber Fluid (22/3/14)

$215 :blink:


I think this was only $150 and you can get them cheaper now too.


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## Crusty (22/3/14)

Amber Fluid said:


> $215 :blink:
> 
> 
> I think this was only $150 and you can get them cheaper now too.


I seriously looked at one of these & almost bought one. I looked at the 400/800kg one from ebay which was $155 + $30 for postage so $185.00 all up.
Without starting a war on who has the best what, there were two issues that put me off.
1. It's electric. If the power goes out, so does the machine. The chances of this happening at the same time as I'm lifting the malt pipe.....pretty slim.
If it breaks down, well that's the end of it.
2.The power cord extension lead hanging from the man hole was something else I wasn't keen on. I rent, so mounting it to the roof like you have, although a better option, was probably out of the question for me.

So for an extra $19.00, I got something that has the ability to lift 3100kg ( blocks, not rope ) a 4:1 ratio which makes lifting heavy items just about effortless & the assurance that I'm using something that is used all day everyday by commercial fisherman. Being manual, there's really nothing that can or will go wrong with it so it's pretty much bullet proof. GABBA dropped round this morning & spliced the rope to the top becket & it's now operational. It's super heavy duty & there ain't nothing that I will be lifting that it won't handle. It's going to eat that malt pipe for breakfast.
edit: Spelling


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## Crusty (24/3/14)

First test with the block & tackle pulley system this afternoon on a 40lt batch of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale Clone.
Collected 2 x 20lt cubes @1.045 which is bang on 80% eff.
Removing the malt pipe was easier than effortless & this setup has some serious pulling power.
I was expecting a bit or resistance from the malt pipe suction & the weight of the grain but as soon as I began to lift the malt pipe, I started to winder if I had forgotten to add the grain. It was way too easy & no match for the new setup.
Looking forward to the next brew day............... :beerbang:


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## lael (26/3/14)

Just thinking about this... How much is the pulling power reduced by by having a larger wheel - eg: my block and tackle are 25mm. If I changed the top one to 50mm would it make it significantly easier to lift?


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## Black n Tan (26/3/14)

lael said:


> Just thinking about this... How much is the pulling power reduced by by having a larger wheel - eg: my block and tackle are 25mm. If I changed the top one to 50mm would it make it significantly easier to lift?


No, the pulling power is dependant on the number of pulleys, not their diameter. In this case two double pulleys give a 4:1 pulling power. If you had two single pulleys, it would be 2:1.


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## shaunous (27/3/14)

The size of the wheel only contributes to the speed of the lift/drop, or range of movement is probably a better term.


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## lael (27/3/14)

Ahhh... that is why it takes so long to lift (well.. seems like it...)
Thanks!


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## booargy (27/3/14)

the size of the pulley does make a difference but you have made up for this by adding more falls. also the smaller the pulley the more stress is on the rope. to lift 50kg is fuckall so you won't really notice it on a 4:1 ratio. when lifting out of liquid it adds 1/7 to the load.


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