# When to add acid and salts



## Muz (15/12/17)

Another water question from me.

I’m brewing an IPA tomorrow. Brew in a bag with a sparge.

I’ve been mucking around on BrewSmith for the last couple of days trying to work out my water additions. It seems I want:

Phosphoric acid to bring PH down from a forecast of 5.67 to 5.2

And small amounts of:
Gypsum
Epsom
Calcium Chloride

I’m aiming for a final batch size of 19 litres but I'm starting with 23.5L for the mash and adding 12.25L for the sparge.

I’m wondering if I should add my phosphoric acid to the mash volume and then add the salts to start of the boil…

If I add it all to mash before the sparge the concentration will be much higher than the beersmith calculator which is based on my final batch volume.

Thanks for your help. I’ve learning so much from this forum.


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## manticle (15/12/17)

The way I look at it is - get your calcium levels right. Use a salt or combo suited to the beer you're making- chloride for malt, sulphate for hops.

I split this between mash and boil.

Calcium will affect mash pH. See how much* then add acid if required. I also acidify sparge water.

*Just so drsmurto doesn't get upset - this should be done via actual pH measurement, at least the first few times. Software predicts but you check the data and make sure it's correct.


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## mabrungard (16/12/17)

Having at least 40 ppm Ca in the mash helps reduce oxalate levels and the resulting beerstone it produces. So that's a minimum you should target. However, reserving your calcium salts from the mash is NOT likely to avoid the calcium/phytin precipitation reaction that you're trying to avoid. That reaction can occur in both the mash or kettle and all you're doing by delaying the salt addition, is delaying that reaction. Since the calcium/phytin reaction produces a desirable pH drop, it may make more sense to have that reaction in the mash. (of course, if you're trying to avoid an excessive pH drop in the mash, then adding the salts to the kettle is OK)


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## manticle (16/12/17)

My main reason for dosing the kettle is not so much the calcium (although I take the total into account) but the flavour component of the respective ion (eg. Sulphate or chloride).


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## nosco (16/12/17)

Since ive mostly done a full volume biab mash I've only ever ajdusted the water for the mash. Now that im brewing with the Guten im just learning about sparging. What is the purpose of acidifying the sparge water?


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## stewy (16/12/17)

I brew BIAB the same as you. 20-25 L mash & approx 10L sparge. 

I add all salts & acid to the total amount of water in my urn, set timer, wake up to water at strike temps, transfer 10L to smaller urn for my sparge, mash in. Etc. 

Works for me. 

I have heard about people holding back some salts & adding late in boil to enhance hop flavour/bitterness (gypsum to do this & maybe Manticle? has mentioned it?). 

What I do works well for me


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## stewy (16/12/17)

nosco said:


> Since ive mostly done a full volume biab mash I've only ever ajdusted the water for the mash. Now that im brewing with the Guten im just learning about sparging. What is the purpose of acidifying the sparge water?



You want to keep the pH of your sparge water below 6.0 otherwise you increase the risk of unwanted tannin extraction


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## mabrungard (18/12/17)

manticle said:


> My main reason for dosing the kettle is not so much the calcium (although I take the total into account) but the flavour component of the respective ion (eg. Sulphate or chloride).



Sulfate and chloride are very soluble in water and wort and are not typically precipitated or adsorbed in the mash. If you put them into the mash, they are very likely to make it through to the kettle.


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## manticle (18/12/17)

Fair enough. Cheers


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