# Secondary Fermentation In Kegs



## gundaroo (18/4/07)

after 6 months of brewing i am now being told that i should be adding sugar to my kegs as opposed to Co2 carbonation.i have had decent results using gas in the past and i can see the logic in putting sugar into a keg and leaving it for a few weeks but cannot find any info on this very addictive site in relation to adding sugar to secondary ferment in a keg.
any ideas thanks
cheers,gundaroo


----------



## lokpikn (18/4/07)

Im not to sure by what a secondery ferment is but it sound like carbonating. 

Yes you can use saugr to carbonate kegs just like you would in a bottel as that is all a keg is a very big bottel but i would look at dextrose over suagar as far as i know dextrose is easy to ferment and is 100% fermentabe.


I have done some natraul carbonating over the last few months but have gone back to the forced carbonating for the ease of use.

It up to you..... Do you like your beer the way you are doing it??? Is it easy for you????? Are you happy with it?????


Its your beer do it the way you like..

Spelling errors i know.
If i could spell i would be a very smaty man


----------



## Barramundi (18/4/07)

who is telling you to use sugar instead of CO2 ???


----------



## gundaroo (18/4/07)

Barramundi said:


> who is telling you to use sugar instead of CO2 ???


three other brewers so far,actually one of them use to own a HBS some time ago.they all seem to say that it is alot better tasting beer and will last longer ?


----------



## Barramundi (18/4/07)

i havent done it myself dont see the point in it , but having said that i see no harm in doing it either , but wouldnt it make for cloudy beer?


----------



## Wortgames (18/4/07)

There have always been 'rumours' that naturally carbonated kegs have a finer head and better mouthfeel, but then there have always been rumours that priming with malt is better than priming with sugar or dextrose. When people have done direct comparisons they have never been able to show a difference as far as I know.

Natural carbonation requires a second fermentation cycle in the keg. As we all know, this takes a week or two to build up CO2 levels, then another few weeks for the beer to mature, yeast to settle and any undesirable trapped flavours to disappear.

Force carbing with CO2 bypasses all that and the beer is drinkable the same day it comes out of the fermenter.

Remember that beer is never a 'stable' product - it changes constantly, it reaches a peak and then it deteriorates. If you compared the two (ie, force carbonated and naturally carbonated) a week after kegging, then the force carbonated beer will be far better obviously - it will be fully carbonated and it won't have any green flavours still hanging around, whereas the primed keg probably won't even have finished carbonating yet. If you try them again several months later, you'd probably find that the naturally carbonated one will be better - in the same way that naturally carbonated bottles generally fare better than commercial beers that have been force carbonated. The prolonged yeast activity slows and prolongs the maturation process.

If I was, for some reason, kegging a barley wine or a really 'authentic' IPA then I'd probably choose to naturally carbonate. I suspect it would be better after 6 months than a force carbed keg would be (though probably not by much), and the ongoing yeast activity is a helping hand against infection. However with beers like that I'd generally choose to bottle them instead, as that way it's much easier to drink them slowly over a long period of time without affecting the remainder.

I want to drink my draught beer while it's fresh, and that is much easier to do with force carbing. People who prime (either bottles or kegs) really have no idea what 'fresh' beer is all about.

So the question would really have to be 'is a naturally carbonated beer, at its peak, better than a force carbonated beer, at its peak?'. I doubt there is much in it, but a force carbonated peak happens a lot sooner, and I reckon the freshness is worth a few brownie points.

Just my 2c of course.


----------



## Brewer_010 (18/4/07)

My 2c worth...
I tend to do natural carb in kegs that have a darker beer in it (say a stout or a darker ale) or for beers that might have a lowish abv, the extra dextrose to naturally carbonate it will give a beer an extra 0.5% abv. 

But I mostly force carb for simplicity and speed. 

I haven't noticed any mothfeel differences - but I don't brew two beers the same back to back, and haven't tested the theory. Mouthfeel has more to do with ingredients than carbonation technique IMO.


----------



## pint of lager (18/4/07)

Like the other posters say, do what works for you.

I carbonate my kegs naturally, using plain sugar. This works for my setup as I brew in winter and the beer stays in kegs for months before being consumed. If I brewed every week, and only had two kegs, I would be force carbonating.

The problem with natural carbonation is there will be some yeast sediment in the keg. This is not a problem if the keg stays on site, but if you want to take the keg visiting, the yeast sediment stirs up and the beer pours cloudy.


----------



## BOG (18/4/07)

Pint of Lager, 

how do you deal with the now pressureised keg when it comes to pouring pressure?

do you de-gas the keg and then use a dispensing pressure or just get the keg gas to push out the naturally gassed beer.


also, you seem to have a number of kegs available based on previous comments. may I ask how many?


BOG


----------



## pint of lager (18/4/07)

When it is time to pour, hit the pressure relief valve and take most of the head pressure off.

You can try to pour without taking the head pressure off, but it is a challenge to get a schooner of beer.

Sometimes the keg is overcarbonated, just keep releasing the pressure over a few days and it eventually pours well without lots of foam.

There are a few 45 litre kegs, 11 litre kegs and 6 x 19 litre kegs here. Plus a stack of bottles. Batch size is 45 litres, some goes into 45's and the rest into a combination of 19's, 11's and bottles, depending on the brew.


----------



## pickledkiwi2 (18/4/07)

pint of lager said:


> When it is time to pour, hit the pressure relief valve and take most of the head pressure off.
> 
> You can try to pour without taking the head pressure off, but it is a challenge to get a schooner of beer.
> 
> ...





hI pol,
Are the 45 litre kegs true 45s and if so where did you find then (if you dont mind my asking) or have they been liberated from a careless owner of thousands of kegs who wouldnt notice a couple gone astray???????


----------



## pint of lager (18/4/07)

These are true 45's, they once had a life full of syrup for drink dispensing machines. Have a standard hatch with lever and disconnects. Someone did have one to sell recently here on ahb, it had the screw style hatch.

Bought them from the local HBS a few years back. They have been unable to get any since.


----------



## pickledkiwi2 (18/4/07)

pint of lager said:


> These are true 45's, they once had a life full of syrup for drink dispensing machines. Have a standard hatch with lever and disconnects. Someone did have one to sell recently here on ahb, it had the screw style hatch.
> 
> Bought them from the local HBS a few years back. They have been unable to get any since.




Bugger,
They sound like a real handy size, shame there are not so many about any more.
I will have to keep my eyes open for that size in the future as I would like to see 1 or 2 of them perched up in my fridge.

Cheers

(I assum that as they once were syrup kegs that they have the standard ball lock fittings)


----------



## Zizzle (18/4/07)

How do you avoid pouring big glasses full of yeast after priming your keg?


----------



## pint of lager (18/4/07)

The beers stay in secondary before they go to the keg, so most yeast has dropped out.

The first glass or two pull hazy with yeast, then it settles down.


----------

