# Little Creatures Pale Ale And Js Strong Ale



## GMK (8/6/04)

Hi

Does anyone have a clone recipe for the following:

Little Creatures Pale Ale, and
James Squire Strong Ale...

Doc i know you were working on the Strong Ale clone....

How is it coming along.

Thanks


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## Murray (8/6/04)

The first couple of recipes in the Skunk Fart Ale topic are pretty close to LCPA.


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## Doc (8/6/04)

Yep. Have perfected the JS Aussie Strong Ale.
The first time I brewed it I got pretty close. The second time I nailed it.
Have another batch of it ready for kegging now. Just waiting on an empty keg.
Here is the recipe.

*Doc's JS Australian Strong Ale* 

A ProMash Recipe Report

BJCP Style and Style Guidelines
-------------------------------

11-A English & Scottish Strong Ale, Old Ale

Min OG: 1.060 Max OG: 1.090
Min IBU: 30 Max IBU: 60
Min Clr: 20 Max Clr: 49 Color in EBC

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 23.40 Wort Size (L): 23.40
Total Grain (kg): 6.95
Anticipated OG: 1.065 Plato: 16.02
Anticipated EBC: 21.4
Anticipated IBU: 46.7
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 10.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 27.53 L
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.056 SG 13.73 Plato

Formulas Used
-------------

Brewhouse Efficiency and Predicted Gravity based on Method #1, Potential Used.
Final Gravity Calculation Based on Points.
Hard Value of Sucrose applied. Value for recipe: 46.2100 ppppg
Yield Type used in Gravity Prediction: Fine Grind Dry Basis.

Color Formula Used: Morey
Hop IBU Formula Used: Rager

Additional Utilization Used For Plug Hops: 2 %
Additional Utilization Used For Pellet Hops: 10 %


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
89.9 6.25 kg. JW Ale Malt Australia 1.038 8
5.0 0.35 kg. CaraWheat France 1.035 79
5.0 0.35 kg. JW CaraMalt Australia 1.036 60

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
28.00 g. Pride of Ringwood Pellet 9.00 35.1 80 min.
14.00 g. Hallertauer Pellet 9.00 8.4 30 min.
14.00 g. Hallertauer Pellet 9.00 3.3 10 min.


Yeast
-----

White Labs WLP002 English Ale


Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Type: Single Step

Grain kg: 6.95
Water Qts: 22.03 - Before Additional Infusions
Water L: 20.85 - Before Additional Infusions

L Water Per kg Grain: 3.00 - Before Additional Infusions

Saccharification Rest Temp : 66 Time: 90
Mash-out Rest Temp : 78 Time: 10
Sparge Temp : 78 Time: 45


Total Mash Volume L: 25.49 - Dough-In Infusion Only

All temperature measurements are degrees Celsius.


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## Batz (8/6/04)

Ever had a go at the JS Amber Ale Doc?


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## Batz (8/6/04)

GMK

We all tried JSB's LCPA clone at Gloiaths during my Adelaide visit
It was spot on , the best copy I have ever tasted , I am sure others who
sampled it will agree with me
It's a partial , in the recipe section under "Big Animal Pale Ale"
On my hit list for sure


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## Doc (8/6/04)

Yeah Batz. Did the JS Amber Ale as my first ever AG.
Have the recipe around here somewhere. I dig it out in a couple of days (in the middle of painting so god knows where I put it when I cleared out the pantry) and post it.

Beers,
Doc


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## Bobby (8/6/04)

got an extract recipe for amber ale???


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## Doc (8/6/04)

No, sorry Bobby.
Although from memory it was some base malt with a lot of crystal so would be easy to convert.

Beers,
Doc


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## SJW (12/6/04)

GMK:
LITTLE CREATURES- 
Morgans stockmans draught
pale malt 1.5kg
us cluster 10g - to taste & aroma
us cascade 20g - to taste & aroma
safale us56

Its simple but very effective.


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## Doc (16/6/04)

I've dug out the recipe I was given and used to clone the JS Amber Ale.
Remember though that this was replicating the original JS Amber Ale prior to the days when Tooheys at Lidcombe now brew it.

For 23 litres

2.25kg JWM Trad Ale Malt
2.25kg CaraMunich Type I
0.50kg CaraFoam/CaraPils
0.25kg CaraAroma

4gr NZ Super Alpha 12% FWH (Whole)
6gr NZ Super Alpha 12% 80 min (Whole)
10gr Cluster 7% 80 min (Whole)
20gr Williamette 5 min (Pellet)

White Labs WLP005 British Ale Yeast


As for the Australian Strong Ale recipe I've posted above. I tapped my most recent keg of it tonight. It is per the recipe in a previous post in this thread except for I used Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale yeast over the WLP002 English Ale yeast. The difference is quite noticable. The WLP1084 provides a more fruity taste whereas the WLP002 is more malty in this beer.

Beers,
Doc


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## Gout (16/6/04)

Doc would London ale yeast work? i cant imagin why it shouldn't

and how long did you age it?


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## Doc (17/6/04)

London Ale for the Amber ? I don't see why not. I ended up actually using WLP002 English Ale and it came out great.

Beers,
Doc


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## RobW (17/6/04)

Doc said:


> I've dug out the recipe I was given and used to clone the JS Amber Ale.
> Remember though that this was replicating the original JS Amber Ale prior to the days when Tooheys at Lidcombe now brew it.


 Doc, in what ways are they different?


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## Doc (17/6/04)

I believe there a two differences. One is the batch volume (obviously Tooheys at Lidcombe have a larger brewing capacity) and the yeast. I remember hearing from the brewers at the JS brewery that Tooheys use their yeast.
I used to love the Amber ale, but every time I've tried it in the last eighteen months I've hated it. 
Now my tastes have changed, but IMO since Tooheys starting brewing it the beer just isn't quite the same. I just hope this doesn't happen with the JS Pils when (if it hasn't already) out grows the capacity of the Camperdown brewery and Tooheys start making that too.

Just my opinions,
Doc


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## shmick (17/5/05)

Doc said:


> Yep. Have perfected the JS Aussie Strong Ale.
> The first time I brewed it I got pretty close. The second time I nailed it.
> >>>
> 
> ...



Just resurrecting the thread as I'll be trying Doc's JS Aus Strong Ale recipe shortly.

Is there a substitute for the CaraWheat (above)? Maybe Crystalwheat(?) + extra CaraMalt to get a *similar* effect?

Being fairly new to the all-grain thing, I haven't had much experience with substitutions. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Any updates on the recipe Doc since the original post?


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## jayse (17/5/05)

shmick said:


> Doc said:
> 
> 
> > 5.0 0.35 kg. CaraWheat France 1.035 79
> ...




Yeap some thing, I notice doc has carawheat at 79ebc from france, the most common is thomas fawcett or weyermann both around 120-140EBC just use that. Cara is just another name given to crystal malts by some companies.



Jayse


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## shmick (17/5/05)

Thanks jayse
The 79 EBC did confuse me a bit. Thought it must have been something wild and wonderful I hadn't heard of yet. :huh: 

Live and learn.


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## Mac (23/5/05)

Hi Doc,

I was just looking at your JS Amber recipe. Have plugged the details into Beersmith and it appears very dark in colour. Is the amount of CaraMunich Type 1 correct? Maybe the info I have for CaraM 1 is incorrect (51 SRM)....

Thanks

MAc


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## jgriffin (23/5/05)

I've done doc's recipe and found it much too dark. There was another clone in the recipe database that i thought came out much cleaner.

Here's an approximation of that recipe - i say approximation as i converted it to partial, and back to AG, but don't have the original AG recipe

Amount Item Type % or IBU 
5.00 kg JWM Traditional Ale Malt (5.9 EBC) Grain 71.4 % 
1.50 kg JWM Light Munich (19.7 EBC) Grain 21.4 % 
0.50 kg JWM Dark Crystal (220.6 EBC) Grain 7.1 % 
10.00 gm Pride of Ringwood [10.10%] (70 min) Hops 13.1 IBU 
20.00 gm Fuggles [5.70%] (20 min) Hops 5.0 IBU 
20.00 gm Williamette [5.50%] (5 min) Hops 2.4 IBU 
1 Pkgs English Ale (White Labs #WLP002) [Starter 1000 ml] Yeast-Ale


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## Doc (24/5/05)

shmick said:


> Doc said:
> 
> 
> > Yep. Have perfected the JS Aussie Strong Ale.
> ...



I've brewed this recipe probably 6 times with each time just making minor changes to the hopping schedule and the yeast used. I've also tried both the Weyerman and TF Cara/Crystal Wheat malts.
For the best results use the Wyermann CaraWheat and White Labs WLP002 English Ale yeast. This by far gives the closest resemblence to the 2003 JS Strong Ale.
I too will be brewing it again soon and reverting to my second recipe.
I'll need to check my notes at home as to what my second recipe is and whether it is the one you quote.

Beers,
Doc


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## Doc (24/5/05)

Mac said:


> Hi Doc,
> 
> I was just looking at your JS Amber recipe. Have plugged the details into Beersmith and it appears very dark in colour. Is the amount of CaraMunich Type 1 correct? Maybe the info I have for CaraM 1 is incorrect (51 SRM)....
> 
> ...



This was one of my very first AG brews and I used the recipe from a brewshop and that same brewshop measured and supplied the ingredients for the brew. Mine came out very close to the JS Amber, and looking back at the recipe it does seem like a hell of a lot of crystal in it.
As it was one of my first AG brews my efficiency was crap and I even oversparged and got some astringincy, but it came out great and took 2nd place at Bathurst.
I'd go with JGriffins version and work back from there.

Beers,
Doc


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## Mac (24/5/05)

Cheers Doc, thanks for the replies


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