# Cocoa Nibs In A Porter.....anyone?



## SJW (24/4/12)

I just bought 200g of raw Cocoa nibs to use in a Porter. Was planning on using the in the keg but though maybe "dry hopping" or dry nibbing them may be better. They taste pretty funky, bitter and dirty with this choc background, should work fine but if anyone has had experience with using them I would like to know about it.

Ingredients
Amt Name Type # %/IBU 
2000 g Pale Malt (Weyermann) (6.5 EBC) Grain 1 38.1 % 
1500 g Smoked Malt (Weyermann) (3.9 EBC) Grain 2 28.6 % 
750 g Vienna Malt (Weyermann) (5.9 EBC) Grain 3 14.3 % 
600 g Caramunich II (Weyermann) (124.1 EBC) Grain 4 11.4 % 
150 g Carafa Special II (Weyermann) (817.5 EBC) Grain 5 2.9 % 
150 g Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (750.6 EBC) Grain 6 2.9 % 
100 g Caraaroma (Weyermann) (350.7 EBC) Grain 7 1.9 % 
20 g Magnum [14.40 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 8 33.3 IBUs 
20 g Fuggles [4.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 9 3.5 IBUs 
1.0 pkg American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [124.21 ml] 


Steve


----------



## seamad (24/4/12)

Asked the same question about a month ago, i think in the recipe ingredients section, would post link but cant on my nook.
I think manticle suggested toasting em and dry nibbing, which is what ill be doing. Also putting two 85% lindt blocks in the boil and maybe dry beaning some vanilla pods and even some french oak chips, getting abit busy though
Cheers
Sean


----------



## manticle (24/4/12)

Yeah I toast til aromatic and add about 100g into 20 L after fermentation. Gives a nice 'dark choc/cocoa flavour' , no sweetness obviously.

The flavour is distinct with this amount but not overpowering so more is a possibility. Once in though, it's hard to take out so as with any flavourings, find your preferred level by experimenting and tweaking.


----------



## SJW (24/4/12)

Thanks Manticle, sounds great.
Sean, I have done the Lindt chocolate thing.........dont bother, not worth it. Just save the choc and eat it with the beer. Vanilla pods work a treat though. But the flavour does subside over time, but great in a big stout. I found the Lindt choc just killed the head and did nothing for the flavour, thats why I am going with the Cacao Nibs.

Steve


----------



## seamad (24/4/12)

Cheers steve, was concerned about the effect on the head. Toasting the nibs seems to be the way to go, think ill do the whole cb pack. Some have also ground them.
Got some really lush pods will try 2 in fermenter, can always add to keg if required. Thought the french oak will some vanillan flavours as well.
Did you soak the pods or just split an add?


----------



## GrumpyPaul (24/4/12)

SJW said:


> I just bought 200g of raw Cocoa nibs to use in a Porter. Was planning on using the in the keg but though maybe "dry hopping" or dry nibbing them may be better. They taste pretty funky, bitter and dirty with this choc background, should work fine but if anyone has had experience with using them I would like to know about it.
> 
> Ingredients
> Amt Name Type # %/IBU
> ...



What size batch is this recipe for? I have been looking at a very similar recipe as this in the Lucas smoked choc porter. The betrays are very similar but amounts different.

Still learning so excuse this if out is a dumb question.

T hanksBnB


----------



## SJW (24/4/12)

Sean, from what I have read there is no need to toast the crushed cocoa nibs, but you could try. I would just be concerned by doing that and adding them to the fermenter or keg that you would get a burnt astringency flavour in the beer. Just go very easy if you are going to toast em. If u have whole cacao pods/seeds you will need to crush em up prior to putting them in the fermenter. And just split the vanilla pods down the centre and scrape the guts into the fermenter and also throw in the cases.

BNB, That recipe is for 25 litres post boil at 80% efficiency. I wanted to use Munich instead of Vienna and Maris Otter instead of the German Pale, but this should be fine.

Steve


----------



## Kranky (24/4/12)

I tried toasting after manticle mentioned that he did it. I couldn't notice the difference between toasting and not toasting nibs. 

I have a coffee machine so I ground up some nibs and ran hot water through them. The result was awful - cocoa nibs have a lot of fat in them. They are best left for post fermentation.


----------



## sinkas (24/4/12)

I have used 100g in a 20L batch of RIS, soaked them in vodka for a day then dumped them in, made a chock martini with the left over vodka


----------



## SJW (24/4/12)

that sounds like a plan sinkas


----------



## kevo (22/9/12)

Kranky said:


> I tried toasting after manticle mentioned that he did it. I couldn't notice the difference between toasting and not toasting nibs.




Do people find they need dark malts so the nibs compliment and support, or are the nibs able to stand alone?

I've got some untoasted in a very basic ale with no spec malts with the intention that I can really taste what they contribute. 
I haven't been terribly impressed by what I've tasted so far(they've been in secondary for about a month). Was thinking I should have toasted, may repeat and do this. But if there's no noticeable difference...

Kev


----------



## Logman (22/9/12)

A bit of Smoked Malt in darker beers has given me the best results. I think you need some spec malt background to get them to pop. Done about 100 litres total with them now I guess.

Did you grind them at all? My Mrs has a food processor with a mini blender attachment - started putting them in there and got better results.


----------



## kevo (22/9/12)

Just using them raw Logman or toasting?

If toasting - toast and then grind, or grind & toast?

Think I'll do a couple of small batches this weekend with and without dark spec grains...

Cheers


----------



## manticle (22/9/12)

Think I've done both Kevo. You get more surface area if you grind them first but they are a bit harder to look after and oil does exude from them (one other good reason to toast - you can leave some of that behind). Might even be worth toasting and letting sit on greaseproof till cool and dry, grinding then another light toast, something I might do next time.


----------



## jammer (22/9/12)

i used about 60g dry nibbing.... bit of a waste really...very, very subtle
then next batch, 40g in a 60min boil, as if using bittering hops, there is a definite choc background....
i think id boil 100g next time.
had no probs with oils and the like. still had great head retention


----------



## Logman (22/9/12)

kevo said:


> Just using them raw Logman or toasting?
> 
> If toasting - toast and then grind, or grind & toast?
> 
> ...


I don't toast them as I've been very happy with the flavor. They can gel together a bit after they go in the grinder, so try and get them 'loose' before they go in the fermenter so you can spread them out well.


----------



## kevo (22/9/12)

Cheers for the advice Gents - see how I go...

Kev


----------



## kevo (22/9/12)

One further question - does anyone cut back on their dark malts a touch to leave some 'space' for the nibs to come through - just let everything fight it out for position?

Cheers again

Kev


----------



## manticle (22/9/12)

No. It's an addition. Use it with a grist that works to add something.


----------



## punkin (23/9/12)

Where are you all sourcing the cocau nibs?

Is ebay the best place price wise?


----------



## Josh (23/9/12)

I got some from More Beer! when I purchased some hardware from them.


----------



## humulus (23/9/12)

punkin said:


> Where are you all sourcing the cocau nibs?
> 
> Is ebay the best place price wise?



Punkin Swambo pick up 500g of raw nibs at the local healthfood shop for $14! :icon_cheers:


----------



## manticle (23/9/12)

That price looks good. I've been getting mine from Craftbrewer but they are pricier than that.


----------



## Kranky (23/9/12)

I get mine from these hippies:

http://www.rawpower.com.au/CatalogueRetrie...p;ObjectType=27


----------



## szopen (24/9/12)

Raw cocao nibs normally have very high levels of contamination with bacteria and moulds (as they are produced in tropics, on farms, fermented in heaps under the sun and just dried).

This is one of the reasons why they should be roasted (or toasted), the other one is flavour development during roasting when large part of that chocoalte flavour is created.

They do contain a lot of fat (round 40%) so the best way to deal with them is to roast/toast, cool the nibs down and then crush (possible to remove shell pieces at this stage) this stops them sticking together and forming paste.

Freshly roasted nibs have the best flavour.


----------



## grimpanda (26/9/12)

Also interested in using cacao in future brews.

Any advice on roasting/toasting method? i.e: temperature, time, whole pods or nibs?

Cheers.


----------



## humulus (26/9/12)

Gabe said:


> Also interested in using cacao in future brews.
> 
> Any advice on roasting/toasting method? i.e: temperature, time, whole pods or nibs?
> 
> Cheers.



Manticle posted a while back how to do it,I toasted 100g on a baking tray under the griller constantly moving them to avoid burning.Then threw them straight into the secondary,the smoked choc porter turned out really good(SJW,s)recipe nice background choc taste that blended in well with the smoked malt :icon_cheers:


----------



## [email protected] (26/9/12)

All you need to know and and the various ways it can be done. http://www.chocolatealchemy.com/roasting.php

I roast my own coffee so i am keen to give the cocoa roasting a go one day as well, probably add a bit off both into a porter or something.


----------



## jammer (26/9/12)

why bother roasting? bung em in the boil....
there's ya contaminants dealt with....


----------



## [email protected] (26/9/12)

jammer said:


> why bother roasting? bung em in the boil....
> there's ya contaminants dealt with....



Its not just about contaminants.

The roasting process if done right will develop much of the flavour as well.


----------



## szopen (28/9/12)

At work we roast cocoa nibs in roaster until air going out reaches 155C, this takes about 15 minutes and might be hard to replicate at home.

Home roasting ideas in the above link from Beer4U are good.
Another way is to roast them in a wok or stainless bowl on gas fire (continuously stirring them all the time) until they are just starting to burn.


----------



## kevo (1/10/12)

Howdy,

For me - toasting is the go. 

Toasted some late last week, 150C in 3 min bursts over about 30 mins. Toasted on baking paper on a baking tray. Toast, check, move around on the tray, start again...

Great flavour, bitter choc, roasty, vegetal flavour gone - sensational!

Left on the toasted nibs for three days, bottled tonight - delicious.

Kev


----------

