# Brew Fridge - The Ideal Fridge



## jacknohe (17/2/11)

Hi all

I'm looking at obtaining a Brew Fridge and using it with a temperature controller. Just wondering what models some of you are using and if there was any particular ones that are more suitable for fermenting etc. 

I'll be using the standard 30L round fermenter. If I can fit two of these in, that would certainly be ideal.

Thanks

Jack


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## Supra-Jim (17/2/11)

Ideally look for an All-Fridge, i.e fridge only no freezer section. These will give you maximum internal space for multiple fermenters or single larger fermenters.

Cheers SJ


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## raven19 (17/2/11)

Whatever fridge you can pickup for free/cheap is the answer you are probably looking for. And the bigger the better for multiple fermentors. Willow blue jerry cans are good for secondary or primary ferments and can be squeezed into most fridges side by side (by side if fridge is really big).

Although any newer fridge that does not drop condensation inside would be better (I have one old skool fridge that gets a fair buildup of condensation on the inside).


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## SpillsMostOfIt (17/2/11)

Fisher & Paykel Upside Down Fridge.

My 520litre beast (you can get smaller ones) uses a 12volt fan to move cold air from the freezer section to the fridge section. That allows me to have a four-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 17degC and a two-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 0degC, or just left to run as a freezer.

Or... Brewery fridge and fermenting cabinet in the one unit.


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## adryargument (17/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> Fisher & Paykel Upside Down Fridge.
> 
> My 520litre beast (you can get smaller ones) uses a 12volt fan to move cold air from the freezer section to the fridge section. That allows me to have a four-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 17degC and a two-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 0degC, or just left to run as a freezer.
> 
> Or... Brewery fridge and fermenting cabinet in the one unit.




This sounds ideal.
The other option is looking into a fridge that fits in 2 x 30 liter fermenters, or a 60 liter.
If you hang around here you know your going to be moving to all grain double batches soon


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## argon (17/2/11)

this is what you want... it's an all in one freezer... 341 L Fisher and Paykel. Picked it up in front of a house on a council pickup weekend. Can fit 4 fermenters with ease. Or could probably fit 6 kegs in over 2 levels. Haven't checked that part though.


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## stux (17/2/11)

I like the 400L all-fridges (got two so far )

Easily fit 3 30s, or 1 60, or even a 100L conical 

can fit 8-12 kegs too..


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## Bizier (18/2/11)

Yeah, I second the all-fridge thing for sure.

I used to use my 520L F&P (freezer on top) for fermenting, but I managed to pick up a 300L ish all-fridge westinghouse (I think). Cost a lot more ($200-300 or so) than the hundreds that one could have picked up at the time super cheap in Sydney, but I was getting sick of cleaning mould out of every corner of the freezer for each ferment. When finishing the ferment at around 20C or so, the freezer section of the F&P was like a perfect mould incubator.


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## Tilt (18/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> Fisher & Paykel Upside Down Fridge.
> 
> My 520litre beast (you can get smaller ones) uses a 12volt fan to move cold air from the freezer section to the fridge section. That allows me to have a four-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 17degC and a two-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 0degC, or just left to run as a freezer.
> 
> Or... Brewery fridge and fermenting cabinet in the one unit.



Thats a great idea Spillsmostofit - any idea what model you have (or a pic or two would be great)? Is the 12V fan a mod you put in or is it stock?

I've heard of folk having a dual fermenting and conditioning fridge and thought they must have had a model with two compartments controlled by independent compressors which they control with separate tempmates.

I like the idea of being able to ferment in one section, and then condition or store hops in the freezer section.


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## SpillsMostOfIt (18/2/11)

Pretty much all of the F&P fridge/freezers work the same way. I have just intercepted the fan *they* use to blow cold from freezer into fridge. One or two more details on my blog. F&P service manuals are also easy to find, which helped me during the *cough* design *cough* phase.

Our (VestFrost) kitchen fridge is a completely different matter, btw. It has two compartments: a fridge and a freezer and they each have their own compressor. I like the simplicity of the F&P design.

An associate purchased a Westinghouse fridge that does the same thing but completely differently. He is yet to make it work. Caveat Cooler.


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## Tilt (18/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> Pretty much all of the F&P fridge/freezers work the same way. I have just intercepted the fan *they* use to blow cold from freezer into fridge. One or two more details on my blog. F&P service manuals are also easy to find, which helped me during the *cough* design *cough* phase.
> 
> Our (VestFrost) kitchen fridge is a completely different matter, btw. It has two compartments: a fridge and a freezer and they each have their own compressor. I like the simplicity of the F&P design.



Thats great - thanks. Yeah, agreed the simplicity of the F&P design sounds damn good. :icon_cheers: 
What's the greatest temp diffferential yours can manage? Will it handle a 22degC D-rest up top while still crash chilling at 1deg (or even freezing stuff) in the bottom compartment?
I'll get onto your blog and scan the F&P manuals to decide which 2nd hand model i'm after.
Much appreciated


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## [email protected] (18/2/11)

argon said:


> this is what you want... it's an all in one freezer... 341 L Fisher and Paykel. Picked it up in front of a house on a council pickup weekend. Can fit 4 fermenters with ease. Or could probably fit 6 kegs in over 2 levels. Haven't checked that part though.
> 
> View attachment 44120




+1 This exactly what I use.


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## SpillsMostOfIt (18/2/11)

tilt said:


> What's the greatest temp diffferential yours can manage? Will it handle a 22degC D-rest up top while still crash chilling at 1deg (or even freezing stuff) in the bottom compartment?



I thought I'd pre-answered that in a previous post.

The freezer section is unmodified, so it can behave as, well, a freezer if need be. Probably the only tricky bit to my situation is that the heating brick in the fridge compartment maintains warmth when needed and the fan which makes that fridge compartment cold also makes the freezer compartment warm when needed. So, I have upper and lower limit temperature control of both compartments, which is important in this part of the world.


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## wakkatoo (18/2/11)

If you only want one fermenter at a time and can't find an all-fridge, try and chase up an upside-down fridge (freezer section on the bottom). I have one of these as my fermenting fridge and a larger one for the kegs. The advantage of them is the flat floor with no need to make up a shelf.


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## stux (18/2/11)

wakkatoo said:


> If you only want one fermenter at a time and can't find an all-fridge, try and chase up an upside-down fridge (freezer section on the bottom). I have one of these as my fermenting fridge and a larger one for the kegs. The advantage of them is the flat floor with no need to make up a shelf.


Also you can put your keg taps high so no bending to pour


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## SpillsMostOfIt (18/2/11)

Imagine if you could find a fridge that had the same mechanism as I'm advocating, but with a big enough freezer section up high - for keg serving - and a fridge section down below for fermenting.

It would be a bit like Thirsty Boy's aquarium heater in fermenter in serving fridge idea, but more aligned to my energy sensibilities..


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## Tilt (18/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> *I thought I'd pre-answered that in a previous post.
> *
> The freezer section is unmodified, so it can behave as, well, a freezer if need be. Probably the only tricky bit to my situation is that the heating brick in the fridge compartment maintains warmth when needed and the fan which makes that fridge compartment cold also makes the freezer compartment warm when needed. So, I have upper and lower limit temperature control of both compartments, which is important in this part of the world.



Yep - you're right there, didn't mean to ask you to repeat yourself - just wondering if you'd been able to get greater than a 17deg difference.
I'd imagine there comes a point where too great a temp diff (e.g attempting to do a Saison up top while CCing below) that the whole shebang would crap itself (too much cycling of the heater/fridge) and not doing either very well.
This'd dictate to some extent the order of "brew pairing/ scheduling" (ie only cooler fermenting ales paired with lagering vs Ale conditoning paired with a Saison).
S'pose I'm just musing on the possibilities but....
That all said sounds a fantastic set up to me!!
Cheers :icon_chickcheers:


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## wakkatoo (18/2/11)

just be careful with using the fridge as a fermentation area and expecting the freezer to remain as a freezer. My fermentation fridge is controlled by a tempmate, so when it turns the cooling off, the freezer also turns off, thus rendering it useless, until the tempmate needs to turn the cooling back on.


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## SpillsMostOfIt (18/2/11)

wakkatoo said:


> just be careful with using the fridge as a fermentation area and expecting the freezer to remain as a freezer. My fermentation fridge is controlled by a tempmate, so when it turns the cooling off, the freezer also turns off, thus rendering it useless, until the tempmate needs to turn the cooling back on.



...and that is why I went to the bother of explaining what I do. <_<


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## Amber Fluid (18/2/11)

This topic has made me wonder and therefore ask the question:

What would be the best to run in general.... a fridge or a freezer or there really is not much difference to worry about it?


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## SpillsMostOfIt (18/2/11)

Amber Fluid said:


> This topic has made me wonder and therefore ask the question:
> 
> What would be the best to run in general.... a fridge or a freezer or there really is not much difference to worry about it?



Let's assume the price of either is about same. Let's assume you just want a single fermentation chamber.

I reckon Freezer. They will have thicker insulation than Fridge so will be able to hold a temperature better. Also their compressor will be designed for a higher duty cycle than fridge (I think) so should last longer. If you get a chest freezer, you won't lose all the cold each time you open the door.

If you want vertical freezer, you will want to look for one that does not have cooling coils in each shelf. That can limit the size of the things you put in there.


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## Yob (18/2/11)

this thread has prompted a question in my mind. Ive just aquired a second fridge, a small bar fridge that ive hacked to bits to get the fermenter to fit in. Ive got a STC1000 (noticed they are charging postage again now) on the way and was wondering this morning which fridge would be better to hook it up to. (idea being I have 1 fridge exclusivly for CC and my large one can freese a fermenter in 24 hours - the thing is fearsome :excl: ) 

My thinking is that it should probably be the smaller fridge as the thermal mass of the fermenter in it will do alot more to keep the temp stable in a smaller environment. 

So if I hook up the temp control to the smaller fridge it will probably switch on and off less? cheaper to run etc. ??


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## adryargument (18/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> Let's assume the price of either is about same. Let's assume you just want a single fermentation chamber.
> 
> I reckon Freezer. They will have thicker insulation than Fridge so will be able to hold a temperature better. Also their compressor will be designed for a higher duty cycle than fridge (I think) so should last longer. If you get a chest freezer, you won't lose all the cold each time you open the door.
> 
> If you want vertical freezer, you will want to look for one that does not have cooling coils in each shelf. That can limit the size of the things you put in there.




++

I just converted a chest freezer.
With the appropriate thermo's they cost around 85-95% cheaper to run. My thermo is rated from 2-12 Degrees. However as the thermometer is just under the base, it runs from 5'C upwards. (Aint tested the highest setting yet). Perfect for pouring.


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## Gormand (18/2/11)

iamozziyob said:


> this thread has prompted a question in my mind. Ive just aquired a second fridge, a small bar fridge that ive hacked to bits to get the fermenter to fit in. Ive got a STC1000 (noticed they are charging postage again now) on the way and was wondering this morning which fridge would be better to hook it up to. (idea being I have 1 fridge exclusivly for CC and my large one can freese a fermenter in 24 hours - the thing is fearsome :excl: )
> 
> My thinking is that it should probably be the smaller fridge as the thermal mass of the fermenter in it will do alot more to keep the temp stable in a smaller environment.
> 
> So if I hook up the temp control to the smaller fridge it will probably switch on and off less? cheaper to run etc. ??



Comparing big vs small fridges I would say your bigger issue is going to be the insulation. I dont think the size will make a huge amount of difference in the end. Also the bigger fridge likely has a more powerful motor/compressor and cools faster, meaning it would be on for longer.
Just my feelings, not based off any actual measurements. 

I do like the sound of the chest freezers using a lot less power though.


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## brocky_555 (19/2/11)

How about this fridge for free come and get it I want it gone from my house i'll even help you set it up into a ferment chamber by drilling holes and wiring up your controller for a ' contribution ' 
(Please provide all you need for installation except cable and plugs) 



http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=52084


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## Amber Fluid (19/2/11)

brocky_555 said:


> How about this fridge for free come and get it I want it gone from my house i'll even help you set it up into a ferment chamber by drilling holes and wiring up your controller for a ' contribution '
> (Please provide all you need for installation except cable and plugs)
> 
> 
> ...




I've been looking for a fridge for a while now but they are few and far between in Tassie


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## jacknohe (21/2/11)

SpillsMostOfIt said:


> Fisher & Paykel Upside Down Fridge.
> 
> My 520litre beast (you can get smaller ones) uses a 12volt fan to move cold air from the freezer section to the fridge section. That allows me to have a four-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 17degC and a two-fermenter area that can be kept at (say) 0degC, or just left to run as a freezer.
> 
> Or... Brewery fridge and fermenting cabinet in the one unit.




Ended up going for one similar to this for a few reasons, one being it was close to home for pick up. I got a F&P 400L upside down fridge. But if you ask me, its actually the right way up.  I can fit two fermenters in nicely.

Spills, had a look at your blog. Very interesting, would love to get some more info on controlling the freezer to fridge fan. Unless of course you're waiting for that patent to come through... :lol:


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## SpillsMostOfIt (21/2/11)

There are two things to know.

1. You're going to have to pull some of the inside lining off. It's easy and undoable, but you have to commit.

2. Service and/or parts manuals are your friend. Try Here.

I had considered putting a switch somewhere so that the fan could be controlled by the fridge or by a plug-pack via a socket on the outside of the fridge somewhere, but that would be too neat. Instead, all cabling goes through the condensate drain.


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## steve78 (21/2/11)

I use a 270L freezer with a temp controller, its great. You can stick a hot cube in there in the afternoon/evening, and its ready in the morning, you can lager at cold temperatures I believe more efficiently, can fit two fermenters in there cause you can bend (with care, and only recommended if you can't work around them) the freezer elements. If u wanted to make an Eisbock, it would be ideal as well cause u can freeze. 

Basically, I crash chill, ferment and lager in there and I reckon it would be more efficient than a fridge only because it can reach lower temps quicker and easier, and can probably hold temp for longer without switching on and off constantly.

My 2c worth 
Steve


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## Tilt (7/3/11)

Looking at different models of fermenting/ conditioning fridges with the capacity for two vessels each held at a different temperature.

I'm wondering what those of you who use the F&P upside down fridge/ freezer (or similar design, other brand) use for your lagering vessels?
Does anyone use a glass carboy in the lower compartment for the 2 month lager - or is this not possible with the compressor hump in the way?

If you do use a carboy - how big does the fridge/ freezer have to be?
Or alternatively is that where willow cubes and rectangular containers come into play?

Thanks


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## Xarb (8/3/11)

adryargument said:


> ++
> 
> I just converted a chest freezer.
> With the appropriate thermo's they cost around 85-95% cheaper to run. My thermo is rated from 2-12 Degrees. However as the thermometer is just under the base, it runs from 5'C upwards. (Aint tested the highest setting yet). Perfect for pouring.


I've actually been looking at getting a bar freezer as a fermenting fridge and possible future keg fridge. 

Something similar to this:
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Bar-Sized-Freezer-/...a#ht_500wt_1156

I have limited space so a bar fridge/freezer is my only option and as it is hard to find bar fridges without a freezer section I was thinking about getting a freezer instead. 

I'm pretty confident it would work for fermenting with a temp controller but not sure if it would suit a kegging setup.

Would this work or am I missing something glaringly obvious?


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## pimpsqueak (8/3/11)

Amber Fluid said:


> This topic has made me wonder and therefore ask the question:
> 
> What would be the best to run in general.... a fridge or a freezer or there really is not much difference to worry about it?



I suppose with a freezer you are able to crash chill, whereas with a fridge you are stuck with the lowest it can go unless you fiddle with the fridges thermostat. If crash chilling isn't your thing, then a fridge would be perfectly ok I reckon.


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## earle (8/3/11)

Xarb said:


> I've actually been looking at getting a bar freezer as a fermenting fridge and possible future keg fridge.
> 
> Something similar to this:
> http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Bar-Sized-Freezer-/...a#ht_500wt_1156
> ...


While those shelves are sitting in slots they also look like they are the cooling elements so may not be able to be moved, in which case it will be pretty useless for brewing.


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## Xarb (8/3/11)

earle said:


> While those shelves are sitting in slots they also look like they are the cooling elements so may not be able to be moved, in which case it will be pretty useless for brewing.


That one I linked was just an example but looking at the one I was considering it seems that two of it's shelves are cooling elements. I'll make sure they are removable before making any commitments!


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## thylacine (8/3/11)

Amber Fluid said:


> This topic has made me wonder and therefore ask the question:
> 
> What would be the best to run in general.... a fridge or a freezer or there really is not much difference to worry about it?




I currently ferment up to 4x15L (ex-FWK containers which hold 16.5L to the brim) in a small 150L chest freezer with Fridgemate. Stovetop BIAB. eg. brew 3-4 ale batches over a week-end, leave in freezer (18-20c) a fortnight, drop the Fridgemate to 0c for a week. Bottle the lot (18 longnecks per batch). Usually carbed in 4-5 days (room temp). Into 6c fridge.


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## alfadog (20/11/13)

What size chest freezers has everyone got? I am looking to expand and would like a chest freezer that can hold two FV any info would be muchly appreciated


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## br33zy (20/11/13)

Just linking in the following "The Perfect Fermentation Fridge" which I used to choose my fermenter fridge: http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/43363-the-perfect-fermentation-fridge/

Great for those looking for a more compact solution.


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## vittorio (20/11/13)

if you want a free fridge, go to the steel section in a dip or a transfer station. you bound to find a few  lol


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## vittorio (20/11/13)

#tip


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## Glot (20/11/13)

Better quality fridge/ freezers have two separate compressors but you're unlikely to find one on the cheap because they're worth fixing. The thing is you can set the temp of each individually and accurately. Miele/ Lemair are two examples.


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## Wortgames (21/11/13)

I've never been that impressed by the upside-down fridge-freezer concept for normal kitchen use, but I can see some serious advantages for brewers.

You get a good-sized fermenting cabinet at a good height, that can be totally temperature-controlled (including heated) without really affecting the freezer section below.

Ideal if you have a separate brewing area in the garage / basement etc, you can justify it as extra freezer storage space for the house (who doesn't want that?) and your fermenting cabinet is a bonus. Plus, you get a convenient place to store all your ingredients.

Depending on the size (eg, French-door model) you could maybe even divide the fridge space into two and have a fermenting side and a normal fridge - or kegerator - side. Imagine that - a complete beer station, with fermenting, serving and storage for all your ingredients (and glassware) in one place!


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## alfadog (21/11/13)

Breezy too said:


> Just linking in the following "The Perfect Fermentation Fridge" which I used to choose my fermenter fridge: http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/43363-the-perfect-fermentation-fridge/
> 
> Great for those looking for a more compact solution.


and I thought I had used the search function properly...

Cheers Breezy


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## Yob (21/11/13)

For me, the perfect fridge is a side by side.. we all know that you _*NEED *_more than one fridge anyway, one to ferment in and one for everything else.

Ive got 2 all fridges which I'm starting to think is a little excessive but you know... better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it B)

and one fridge to CC/serve from.. my side by side can hold 4 x 19l and one 9lt or an FV to Cold Condition





Fermenting Fridges like this




Ed: added FV' fridge pic


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## Nedasaurus1 (21/11/13)

Yob said:


> For me, the perfect fridge is a side by side.. we all know that you _*NEED *_more than one fridge anyway, one to ferment in and one for everything else.
> 
> Ive got 2 all fridges which I'm starting to think is a little excessive but you know... better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it B)
> 
> ...


bloody show off Yob lol


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## indica86 (21/11/13)

I just bought a 215 litre F&P chest freezer for $50, it fits 2 x FVs... add $20 for an STC-1000...


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## bmarshall (21/11/13)




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## Tangle Foot (1/1/23)

Resurrecting this thread - sorry - please let me know if I should start a new one.

My fermentation chest freezer died this weekend, mid-ferment  So looking for some new options.

I'm considering an upside down Fisher & Paykel fridge/freezer given the comments earlier in this thread about being able to keep the freezer section as a freezer. Getting some pressure from SWMBO regarding the number of fridges and freezers I have and like the idea of being able to offer up a some freezer space as a peace offering.

Just wondering if anyone can point me in the direction of a thread/website/etc that provides some photos of the process. Also wondering whether I can use an Inkbird or one of the new RAPT temperature controllers to control the fan that pushes cold air up from the freezer space.


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## djebel (1/1/23)

Lots of things are possible, but it's going to be more difficult to use the freezer as a freezer and use the fridge for fermenting. Not impossible, but you will have to dig deeper into how the fridge temperature is maintained so that you don't effect the operation of the freezer. And of course, modifications void warranties (if that's a problem).

An idea (RUN! DANGER!): re-assess your current fleet, and see if you have something currently used as a fridge suitable to convert to a fermentation chamber. Could be a lagering chamber/cold crash, kegerator -- anything. Then use your "new" upside down unit to replace THAT, which shouldn't effect the operation of the freezer.


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## Tangle Foot (1/1/23)

I have temporarily repurposed an upright freezer that still gets use the family kitchen.

I'm using a Keg King Mk II Temperature controller and a low wattage heating pad. It means I'm running two cables in through the front door (temperature probe and a 240v for the heating pad. A bit worried about damaging the door seal. Is there a better way to route cables into the freezer other than by the door? Or do you know any tips that might avoid damaging the seals?

Cheers


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## djebel (1/1/23)

Depends on the layout of the fridge or freezer. There's often a nice hole to let in the wires for the thermostat, and the interior light. Removing all that (and the light, door switch, and thermostat if possible) may leave you with a nice conduit in the back of the fridge to feed in cables, but you would probably need to do some 240V wiring, which can only legally be done by a sparky.

As an added bonus, removing all that also frees up (a small amount) of extra space inside the fridge, and allows for complete control over the operation of the fridge.


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## Eddy Monsoon (2/1/23)

Just get an approx 200 litre upright freezer off gumtree or facebook marketplace and an inkbird STC.

Bob's your confused Auntie


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## Tangle Foot (2/1/23)

Lot's of people mention using an Inkbird - does it provide any advantage over the Keg King Mk II Temperature controller?

Cheers


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## Paddy (3/1/23)

Tangle 
I have the Inkbird Wifi version its connected to my home network so can manage temps when work interferes with my brewing. Track my brews using tilt on brewfather then adjust temps as necessary, it works for me. Fridge I use as ferment chamber is an Esatto from appliances online holds std allrounder with Hop bong or Fermzilla or the double batch allrounder but can't fit the hop bong on the last two.


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## Narapoia (6/1/23)

Tangle Foot said:


> Lot's of people mention using an Inkbird - does it provide any advantage over the Keg King Mk II Temperature controller?
> 
> Cheers



I just went from an Inkbird to the Keg King. The Inkbirds have a well-known issue where the measured temperature randomly spikes by 1-3 degrees and then slowly drops back down to the actual value. Inkbird know it happens in some units but their support won't admit it because they would then be liable for all the blown out compressors (Like the one from my old fridge) caused by the needless cooling cycles kicked off by the temp spikes. Some units get it, some don't. Since I got the Keg King I've had no issues along these lines.

In terms of the fridge - I use a Fisher & Paykel 373L fridge (no freezer). You can't buy them new but I've found 2 of them now by being a bit eagle eye'd on FB marketplace and gumtree. I have the same setup as you in terms of the cables etc - I haven't considered the long term effect on the seals of just closing the door on them. 

I am not a 'handyman' in any sense but made a quick cheap stand for the base of the fridge and with that I can get two 30L fermenters in there at the same time (and store some beers to bottle condition). It was the first thing I made with power tools since woodwork in high school. It's a great sized fridge for fermenting and really nice to be able to have two fermenters in there at the same time. Would definitely recommend it if you can find one.


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