# us-05 at cold temps - fermentation advice



## Andrewbarnes83 (20/5/15)

Hi,

I have recently read on the forums about people using us05 at the bottom of the range and getting very clean results.

I would like to try this and was wondering from people that have done it did you need to pitch more yeast or did you just pitch warmer and slowly lower the temp?

Thanks


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## Rocker1986 (20/5/15)

I sort of did both when I did it.

I fermented a German lager recipe with it at 16 degrees. I made a starter for it, which isn't necessary but I was partly doing it to harvest some for later, anyway, I did pitch it warmer then bring it down. It was at room temp whatever that was when I pitched it, maybe around low 20s. Probably only took a few hours to come down, which is fine.

Definitely got very clean results from it. It was a little different to the same recipe fermented with W34/70 but not very much. I preferred the W34/70 version, but I was still happy with the results of the US-05 fermented low. It was purely an experiment to satisfy my own curiosity so I most likely won't do it again, however it did work quite well.


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## Danscraftbeer (20/5/15)

Rocker1986 said:


> I sort of did both when I did it.
> 
> I fermented a German lager recipe with it at 16 degrees. I made a starter for it, which isn't necessary but I was partly doing it to harvest some for later, anyway, I did pitch it warmer then bring it down. It was at room temp whatever that was when I pitched it, maybe around low 20s. Probably only took a few hours to come down, which is fine.
> 
> Definitely got very clean results from it. It was a little different to the same recipe fermented with W34/70 but not very much. I preferred the W34/70 version, but I was still happy with the results of the US-05 fermented low. It was purely an experiment to satisfy my own curiosity so I most likely won't do it again, however it did work quite well.


How long did you ferment at 16c?.
I ferment at 18c for at least 2 weeks with us-05. 30 days no probs In primary.


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## Rocker1986 (20/5/15)

Probably about 5 days, then I ramped it to 20C. It was at FG in 9 or 10 days I think, but then I left it in there for another week and a half before bottling it. It sat at 0C for about 6 days prior to bottling.

I usually get pretty fast fermentation for some reason, however I don't bottle as soon as I hit FG. They always get another week or two cold conditioning first.


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## verysupple (20/5/15)

I've done a few batches with it at ~16 C. I rehydrated and pitched one pack in to ~23 L. These beers had OGs of 1.045 - 1.050 and typically finished fermenting in four days. I let it mature for a few days more after that of course. I didn't really do it to ferment ultra clean or to mimic a lager, it was just fermenting in winter before I had proper temp control. It's probably a good thing that I wasn't trying to do a faux lager because they didn't turn out very lagerish. They tended to have a crisp citrus character that I don't think was coming from hops.


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## Danscraftbeer (20/5/15)

Good beer by the sounds of it. :chug:


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## yum beer (21/5/15)

In my kit days I used the Coopers Cerveza kit with kit yeast(supposedly US-05) and brewed at 15-16c, got good results, very clean, my little bro still raves about that original beer.
Takes its time, not as long as a lager yeast but probably 2-3 weeks to bottling.
I may have to give it another go on an AG lager to see how it goes.


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## Bribie G (21/5/15)

I'm pretty sure that the Coopers yeasts are from Mauribrew but they are very flexible and I bet they run ok as t low temps.
Funny this thread popped up as I've got a few Cooper sachets and thinking of doing a couple of small test ferments. 

With Winter here There's a possibility of 15 degree ambient in my garage so it would be useful to have the information. 

I use Coopers stout tins pimped for my Nitro stouts.


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## Forever Wort (26/5/15)

I don't know why people give the Coopers yeast a bad rap, it's serviceable and flexible and when treated nicely makes great beer.


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## mabrungard (30/5/15)

I recently finished a pseudo Munich Helles that I fermented with US-05 at 12C and I can report that the yeast did an admirable job of attenuation and in producing an almost lager-like cleanliness. I found there was just a hint of fruitiness in the beer, but the malt character was excellent. That yeast is a real trooper! I understand its rated by the manufacturer to perform to 11C. There were no problems at 12C


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## waggastew (30/5/15)

In my experience the fermentation profile of US05 (like most yeasts) is very sensitive to temperature. Even a shift of one degree can change the profile dramatically.

For me it seems it is a balance between going low for less esters but still keeping the fermentation vigorous enough so that the yeast doesn't struggle and start throwing esters. For me the neutral sweet spot for US05 is 19degC, any lower and I start to get a stonefruit ester. I have attempted fake lagers with US05 at 16degC and they had a definite perceptible ester profile.

Like said above you might be better with one of the dried lager yeasts (S23/W3470) fermented warm? Plenty of info in threads about the pros and cons of that.


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## GalBrew (30/5/15)

waggastew said:


> In my experience the fermentation profile of US05 (like most yeasts) is very sensitive to temperature. Even a shift of one degree can change the profile dramatically.
> 
> For me it seems it is a balance between going low for less esters but still keeping the fermentation vigorous enough so that the yeast doesn't struggle and start throwing esters. For me the neutral sweet spot for US05 is 19degC, any lower and I start to get a stonefruit ester. I have attempted fake lagers with US05 at 16degC and they had a definite perceptible ester profile.
> 
> Like said above you might be better with one of the dried lager yeasts (S23/W3470) fermented warm? Plenty of info in threads about the pros and cons of that.


I [email protected] hate the stonefruit esters from us-05, I mentally equate that flavour with 'homebrew' and I only every get it when I use us-05 (have also noticed the same thing in some commercial beers). I ferment with it at 18deg, should I bump it up to 19-20 to avoid this ester?


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## waggastew (30/5/15)

GalBrew said:


> I [email protected] hate the stonefruit esters from us-05, I mentally equate that flavour with 'homebrew' and I only every get it when I use us-05 (have also noticed the same thing in some commercial beers). I ferment with it at 18deg, should I bump it up to 19-20 to avoid this ester?


Worth a try. One thing to remember is that the sweet spot will vary a bit with systems. This is because fermenter shape, placement of temp probe, efficiency of fridge will affect actual ferment temp.

I started out fermenting at 17-18degC in the ops of reducing esters. In the end increasing the temp of the ferment to 19degC on my temp control reduced the esters. They are probably not below threshold, particularly in neutral beers like fake lagers, but are not noticeable on ales.

Stew


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## manticle (30/5/15)

Forever Wort said:


> I don't know why people give the Coopers yeast a bad rap, it's serviceable and flexible and when treated nicely makes great beer.


Main issue with most kit yeasts is not the yeast itself, it's amount (~7g) and storage (ambient temps under the lid for who knows how long?). Combine that with recommendation for warm fermentation and you have the recipe for pretty terrible, headache inducing swill.


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## Bbowzky1 (30/5/15)

Ive done 4 brews with us05 now.
3 which have finished and mostly fermented out 75-80% ive been doing then at room temp which is currently 16-18c after aprox 3 weeks each have tasted quite nice, one thing I noticed to after having done a liquid yeast brew that us05 doesnt create clean crisp flavor diferencials.
Just my 2c.
Ps im am an amiture so happy to be proven wring


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## mje1980 (1/6/15)

GalBrew said:


> I [email protected] hate the stonefruit esters from us-05, I mentally equate that flavour with 'homebrew' and I only every get it when I use us-05 (have also noticed the same thing in some commercial beers). I ferment with it at 18deg, should I bump it up to 19-20 to avoid this ester?


Normally, fermenting warmer gives more esters. You may be under pitching, which can also contribute to esters. Try fermenting cool with 2 rehydrated packs and see how it goes.


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## menoetes (1/6/15)

I've got two packs of us-05 bubbling away in an American wheat at 14'c atm. Low and slow gets you a nice clean neutral flavor IMHO.


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## rude (1/6/15)

mje1980 said:


> Normally, fermenting warmer gives more esters. You may be under pitching, which can also contribute to esters. Try fermenting cool with 2 rehydrated packs and see how it goes.


Thats what I do 2 packs rehydrated 22litres usually at 18c but have gone to 16c
I must admit I am a fan of us05


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## yankinoz (1/6/15)

Which range do you mean? Fermentis says it ferments as low as 12, but the ideal range begins at 15. I've tried it at 13 and 14, and it was very slow starting. I'd recommend a higher pitching rate at those temps. Really it ferments clean at 16, so use that if you can. When you get down to 12 or 13 better choices are various German ale yeasts and Nottingham; between those two and at those temps I prefer Notty in making clean APAs if you can avoid temperature drops that tend to make it drop early. The yeasts sold as German Ale are low flocculators.


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## Vini2ton (4/6/15)

Why not find a lager yeast that you like? Why push US-05 out of it's specs when there are plenty of others to choose from?


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## GalBrew (4/6/15)

I agree, w-34/70. The king of dry lager yeasts.


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## panzerd18 (4/6/15)

S-189 Swiss lager yeast also has a good reputation.


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## Rocker1986 (4/6/15)

It's fun to experiment with things.

However, having done it once, I have satisfied my curiosity and won't be doing it again. My lager recipes will be fermented with lager yeast, as I did prefer them that way.


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## Andrewbarnes83 (14/6/15)

I have been trying to troubleshoot an annoying flavour that I seem to get with my homebrews (biab no chill) with us05 and I notice that some have mentioned an annoying stonefruit tasting ester. This is the taste I have been getting when fermented at 18, so will try at 19 as mentioned above before ditching the us05.


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## mje1980 (14/6/15)

If you can taste a difference between 18 and 19 you've got a hell of a sensitive tongue


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## Andrewbarnes83 (14/6/15)

Yeah, could be due to underpitching perhaps? I normally just sprinkle one pack in at ferment temps but I have also pitched in the low twenties and have had the same issue the only common factor has been my ferment temps 18 degrees.

I normally only brew ales in the low 1.040s.


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## Vini2ton (14/6/15)

Would 1 degree make a hell of a difference to the taste? Maybe to a homeopath. Soon they'll be able to get married.


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## Beermonster (24/6/20)

Rekindling an old thread....

I'm fermenting US-05 down at 10 degrees at the moment. I've done it down at 8-10 before and been very happy with the results. Generally a three week fermentation.

So a slightly related experiment;

Presently doing a session ale and after a week it's gone from 1.040 to 1.020 (expected FG 1.010). For a few reasons I won't go into I'm keen to transfer to my kegs early and allow this to finish in the keg (essentially a part Kegmenter method, without transferring out on completion), without a spunding valve and let it carbonate / condition (I normally leave in primary for extended time then add 80g DEX to the 19L Kegs on transfer, which I like, so in this case adding nothing). I know that this is not a particularly concise way of carbonating, but with .01 to go I am wondering if I'll be way over carbonating.

Usually adding the DEX mentioned above it would add 0.002 to the gravity, so I'm thinking I could end up with 4-5 times the volume of CO2 if I transfer now.

Yes I know there'll be a little Trub and yeast in my Keg, that's okay.

This could be a lesson on what not to do , see how I go. I think I'll do this in the future, just with a spunding valve.

I'm thinking if I way over carbonate I can just connect the spunding valve that I'm yet to buy and set the pressure wait several days and all should be well.


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