# How Long Can You Leave Beer In Primary Fermentation?



## Cognosis

Ahoy there,

I'll start by saying I've made a few brews and they've all turned out great so far . Right now, I have a Coopers Pale Ale Can brew in primary fermentation. I havn't exactly had the time recently to get it bottled up, and as a result she's been sitting in the fermenter a bit longer than is optimal. We're talking 4 weeks here.

Which brings me to the question; is it worth bottling the brew, or should I just write it off, pour it down the drain and start again? The seal has been maintained throughout the brew and there's no signs of infection.

I'd love to hear some opinions

Cheers guys


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## Fourstar

she should be ok assuming it isnt a high alcohol beer and you havnt had extremely hot temperatures where your beer is stored. I'd recommend fridging it if possible, otherwise relax and bottle when you are ready. just not in 4 months time.


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## Aus_Rider_22

I've left a brew in the fermenter for 3 weeks before and found no ill affects. I am very sure yours will be fine.

Something you could try next time, as many others do on here including myself, is after the fermentation is finished you can move it to a fridge so the temps drops for a few days 2-5 and the yeast will drop out and you will get less yeast in your bottles and clearer beer.


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## gunbrew

Will be fine.
Personal opinion being the extra time in the fermenter will make the beer better.
My experiance on that being:
I had a 50 litre brew going and was due to keg it before leaving on a 1 month overseas trip.
My leaving date was fast approaching and fermentation was not complete still reading 1020.
In the end I decided not to fret and just left the fermenter in the garage.
Arrived back 4 weeks later to test the beer and it was 1013.
After kegging that was particularly good beer.
Should have been in the fermenter for 2 or 3 weeks and was in there for about 7 weeks!
Cheers.


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## argon

When i used to bottle i always left the beer in primary for about 3 to 4 weeks cause i always hated the bottling process. I never had any ill effects and i certainly would never had thought of chucking the brew. Crash chill it if you can it will make it even better over a few more weeks. Don't worry it'll be all good


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## manticle

If the environment it's in is good it should be fine. If it tastes ok and not overly yeasty then bottle it. I t will likely benefit from some extra time - all my brews get left an extra week or so by default before being cold conditioned.


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## jzani

I always leave my beers in the fermenter for about three weeks instead of racking to secondary. Usually for a couple of weeks after fermentation finishes. Results in a much clearer beer with less sediment in the bottle. Apparently it give the yeast a chance to clean up after itself but I certainly wouldn't be an expert on that.


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## peterhop

I thought my 5-weeks-in-primary beer had a more interesting taste than shorter ones.


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## Verbyla

+1 for leaving brew in primary due to the hatred I have for the bottling process! 

It'd have to be the most hated time consuming step :angry:


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## Cognosis

Thanks for the several quick, detailed and positive replies guys 

Thankfully the temperature has been freezing (not to mention its been pissing down rain) here in Newcastle for the last few weeks, so I would certainly imagine that hasn't hurt things 

now I'll have to enter into the painstaking task of:
A) making sure I have enough bottles to actually store this badboy, and
B) washing these bottles OCD style.

Speaking of washing bottles; Does anybody have any particular process for washing the plastic bottle caps? Do you clean them with a bleach solution, or just use hot water? I think some of the caps I've washed in the past have retained a little bit of bleach, and its affected the taste of the beer

Cheers guys


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## katzke

Cognosis said:


> Thanks for the several quick, detailed and positive replies guys
> 
> Thankfully the temperature has been freezing (not to mention its been pissing down rain) here in Newcastle for the last few weeks, so I would certainly imagine that hasn't hurt things
> 
> now I'll have to enter into the painstaking task of:
> A) making sure I have enough bottles to actually store this badboy, and
> B) washing these bottles OCD style.
> 
> Speaking of washing bottles; Does anybody have any particular process for washing the plastic bottle caps? Do you clean them with a bleach solution, or just use hot water? I think some of the caps I've washed in the past have retained a little bit of bleach, and its affected the taste of the beer
> 
> Cheers guys



A comment on extended fermentation. Why would we worry about what temperature it has been stored at after active fermentation is over?

No one seems to say that storing bottles at too high of a temperature is bad. When we bottle we add sugar to encourage fermentation and also suggest a higher then storage temperature.

Just wondering why the storage tem is an issue when the fermentation temp is the only thing to worry about. Or said a different way who cares if the beer has been put on ice for storage if the fermentation temp was at sauna temps.


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## manticle

I had a few issues this recent summer with beers in secondary for extended periods and also longer term stability with some of my bottled beers.

Could be other issues but I don't usually have problems so I surmised it was extreme temps.


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## barneyb

Cognosis said:


> Speaking of washing bottles; Does anybody have any particular process for washing the plastic bottle caps? Do you clean them with a bleach solution, or just use hot water? I think some of the caps I've washed in the past have retained a little bit of bleach, and its affected the taste of the beer
> 
> Cheers guys


Getting a no rinse sanitizer such as starsan or iodophor makes cleaning bottles much easier. I create a litre or so of solution, pour a bit into each bottle then give each bottle a shake and empty the contents (you can also empty the contents into the next bottle if you want to conserve your sanitizer). For bottle caps I just throw them all in a bowl with the solution. 

If you do use bleach make sure you rinse everything a couple of times until there is no hint of that bleach chlorine smell. There are other ways to get rid of the bleachyness but I don't remember them.


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## MarkBastard

I've left a beer in primary for months before, thought that was crash chilling. Fermented for two weeks at 18 degrees, then crash chilled at 2 degrees for probably 3 months or so.

Didn't really like it to be honest.


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## manticle

barneyb said:


> Getting a no rinse sanitizer such as starsan or iodophor makes cleaning bottles much easier. I create a litre or so of solution, pour a bit into each bottle then give each bottle a shake and empty the contents (you can also empty the contents into the next bottle if you want to conserve your sanitizer). For bottle caps I just throw them all in a bowl with the solution.
> 
> If you do use bleach make sure you rinse everything a couple of times until there is no hint of that bleach chlorine smell. There are other ways to get rid of the bleachyness but I don't remember them.



Very hot water and sodium or potassium metabisulphite are two. Obviously very hot water and glass bottles are not always a good mix.


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## WeaselEstateBrewery

Verbyla said:


> +1 for leaving brew in primary due to the hatred I have for the bottling process!
> 
> It'd have to be the most hated time consuming step :angry:



+++++++++++1

moving to kegs has probably been the highlight of my brewing career


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## michaelcocks

Four weeks should be no problemif you are clean and sanitary and good temp control
it will be a better beer (if you have been clean) 
have a listen to the basic brewing radio yeast experiment episode
I have left coopers pale kit on yeast for almost 3 months with no bad effects
but I am VERY clean


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## Cognosis

katzke said:


> A comment on extended fermentation. Why would we worry about what temperature it has been stored at after active fermentation is over?
> 
> No one seems to say that storing bottles at too high of a temperature is bad. When we bottle we add sugar to encourage fermentation and also suggest a higher then storage temperature.
> 
> Just wondering why the storage tem is an issue when the fermentation temp is the only thing to worry about. Or said a different way who cares if the beer has been put on ice for storage if the fermentation temp was at sauna temps.



My understanding is that storage at too high a temperature may lead to denaturing of proteins in the beer, which may affect the taste. And I may or may not have pulled that explanation out of my arse...

I actually havn't heard of chilling the beer before storage before this topic. I might have to have a play around with it.

Thanks barneyb, I'll try that stuff. I'm getting sick of my hands stinging from all that bleach, not to mention the extra abrasion from tightening the caps afterward 

Manticle: cheers 

Weasel: I'm highly tempted to look into kegging as an alternative to bottling

Gees...its a slippery slope, this beer brewing


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## michael_aussie

I rarely bottle in less than 3 weeks, and often around 4 weeks.
I keep the temperature 18-24 during that whole period.
I haven't had any problems so far.


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## chiefbrewlord

Hey, I left mine in primary for almost four weeks too. I think it was my best beer to date, clear and had no off flavors like a young beer often has.


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## MHB

The only research that has been done is from commercial brewing (unless you count Brulosophy and other anecdotal evidence as research which I don't.)
Two weeks is regarded as the maximum, after that harm can be measured. Most of the damage comes from yeast Autolysing (autolysis literally means self eating).
When yeast autolyses it releases Nitrogen compounds mostly Ammonia based chemicals, apart from not tasting and smelling good they raise the pH of the beer which makes it less palatable. At it's worst these flavours start to taste like burnt rubber.
The other really noticeable damage comes from the release of Protease-A, an enzyme that will given time chop every protein it can find down to peptides. The first sign is a fall in the head holding ability of the beer, certain proteins (LPT1 and Protein Z in particular) are vital to head formation and retention, at extremes a loss of body and mouth feel in the beer. Call it flat and thin - not really a good look in beer.

Commercial brewers tend to pitch way bigger than home brewers do, good rule of thumb is if you haven't hit FG in 7 days you have under pitched.
This is a bit of a two edged solution, more yeast, more that can autolyse, more autolysis products.
Less yeast, slower ferments, the yeast tends to be older by the end of the ferment and more prone to breaking down, but there is less of it to do harm.

I suspect there is no way to give a definitive, perfect solutions, one of these so often brewing answers "well it all depends..."
For mine, pitch a lot of good healthy yeast, control the temperature well, if I'm going to leave the wort in primary for more than 7-10 days - rack (or drop from the cone is you are lucky enough to have a conical).

Mark


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## monkey brewing

MHB said:


> The only research that has been done is from commercial brewing (unless you count Brulosophy and other anecdotal evidence as research which I don't.)
> Two weeks is regarded as the maximum, after that harm can be measured. Most of the damage comes from yeast Autolysing (autolysis literally means self eating).
> When yeast autolyses it releases Nitrogen compounds mostly Ammonia based chemicals, apart from not tasting and smelling good they raise the pH of the beer which makes it less palatable. At it's worst these flavours start to taste like burnt rubber.
> The other really noticeable damage comes from the release of Protease-A, an enzyme that will given time chop every protein it can find down to peptides. The first sign is a fall in the head holding ability of the beer, certain proteins (LPT1 and Protein Z in particular) are vital to head formation and retention, at extremes a loss of body and mouth feel in the beer. Call it flat and thin - not really a good look in beer.
> 
> Commercial brewers tend to pitch way bigger than home brewers do, good rule of thumb is if you haven't hit FG in 7 days you have under pitched.
> This is a bit of a two edged solution, more yeast, more that can autolyse, more autolysis products.
> Less yeast, slower ferments, the yeast tends to be older by the end of the ferment and more prone to breaking down, but there is less of it to do harm.
> 
> I suspect there is no way to give a definitive, perfect solutions, one of these so often brewing answers "well it all depends..."
> For mine, pitch a lot of good healthy yeast, control the temperature well, if I'm going to leave the wort in primary for more than 7-10 days - rack (or drop from the cone is you are lucky enough to have a conical).
> 
> Mark


My fg on day 8 (last night) was 1022, sg was 1050, need to dry hop yet as well, im hoping that when I check it tonight the gravity reading is down a few more points


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## gap

you are using a hydrometer to do your readings?


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## monkey brewing

gap said:


> you are using a hydrometer to do your readings?


Yeah


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## Rocker1986

Jeez. I have one on almost the same readings except after three days. Started at 1.051 pitched on Saturday around lunchtime, took a reading about an hour or so ago and it's down to 1.022. Will probably be finished tomorrow or Thursday. Similar happened on my last batch as well. Should be able to dry hop tomorrow and look to cold crash a few days later and have it in the keg next Saturday or Sunday.

I always make yeast starters, but on these last two I've done things slightly differently. First thing was making the starter a little bigger than the recommended pitch rate, and the other thing was pitching it at or a little below the fermentation temp. I'm guessing the slightly bigger yeast pitch has had more of an effect than the temperature though.


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## monkey brewing

Rocker1986 said:


> Jeez. I have one on almost the same readings except after three days. Started at 1.051 pitched on Saturday around lunchtime, took a reading about an hour or so ago and it's down to 1.022. Will probably be finished tomorrow or Thursday. Similar happened on my last batch as well. Should be able to dry hop tomorrow and look to cold crash a few days later and have it in the keg next Saturday or Sunday.
> 
> I always make yeast starters, but on these last two I've done things slightly differently. First thing was making the starter a little bigger than the recommended pitch rate, and the other thing was pitching it at or a little below the fermentation temp. I'm guessing the slightly bigger yeast pitch has had more of an effect than the temperature though.


Yeah I rehydrated the yeast, SG was 1050 to start, now into day 9, will dry hop tonight and take another reading then, Im hopefully bottling friday night/Saturday morning.


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## MHB

There is a world of difference between "Rehydrating" and "Making a starter".
Unless done properly rehydrating can do more harm than good, type of water, water temperature, water to yeast ratio, pitch to wort temperature... can all affect the yeast a lot more than many people would like to think. At best the yeast doesn't need to rehydrate in the wort, but it isn't actively brewing so there goes 12-24 hours.

If you gravity has only dropped 28 points (56% apparent) in eight days something isn't right, be it bad yeast handling, or most likely under-pitching (or both), poor wort nutrient, low Oxygen or any of many other causes, its under preforming pretty badly.
It would be well worth looking at your processes and seeing why.
Note that Rocker has pretty much the same gravity change (slightly more) in 48 hours, 2 days instead of 9, or something like 4.5 times faster. Odds are that his beer will taste better to (less yeast stress).
Mark


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## monkey brewing

MHB said:


> There is a world of difference between "Rehydrating" and "Making a starter".
> Unless done properly rehydrating can do more harm than good, type of water, water temperature, water to yeast ratio, pitch to wort temperature... can all affect the yeast a lot more than many people would like to think. At best the yeast doesn't need to rehydrate in the wort, but it isn't actively brewing so there goes 12-24 hours.
> 
> If you gravity has only dropped 28 points (56% apparent) in eight days something isn't right, be it bad yeast handling, or most likely under-pitching (or both), poor wort nutrient, low Oxygen or any of many other causes, its under preforming pretty badly.
> It would be well worth looking at your processes and seeing why.
> Note that Rocker has pretty much the same gravity change (slightly more) in 48 hours, 2 days instead of 9, or something like 4.5 times faster. Odds are that his beer will taste better to (less yeast stress).
> Mark


It was/is my 1st batch, yeast was rehydrated with boiled kettle water, 100mls at 30 degrees, I followed a youtube video to do that, as for the brew its been fermenting at 17degrees, S05 was the yeast strain used


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## Rocker1986

Try warming it up to about 21 and see if it finishes off faster. I would have expected a pack of 05 to finish off quicker than it has though. Old or poorly stored yeast perhaps?


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## monkey brewing

Just did another hydro reading and it has dropped to 1020 so still action happening, I only expect it to be between 1010-1014 as per the local homebrew shops expectation


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## MHB

Agreeing with Rocker, if it was a "standard" sized batch (~23L) I would expect more action.
Other than that, Please don't feel picked on, people are trying to help not to criticise.
Good to see someone using a better yeast in their first brew, you could start coming along to HUB meetings, third Friday of the month (google up Hunter United Brewers).
Might be worth telling what was in the batch, if you had lots of Maltodextrin it might be finished.
Mark


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## monkey brewing

MHB said:


> Agreeing with Rocker, if it was a "standard" sized batch (~23L) I would expect more action.
> Other than that, Please don't feel picked on, people are trying to help not to criticise.
> Good to see someone using a better yeast in their first brew, you could start coming along to HUB meetings, third Friday of the month (google up Hunter United Brewers).
> Might be worth telling what was in the batch, if you had lots of Maltodextrin it might be finished.
> Mark


250g maltodextrin, 250g malt extract
500g dextrose
That was a brewers blend #15
I made batch up to 21.5 litres, and used coles store bought spring water,
Also it was a mangrove jacks lager pouch that had come with starter kit


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## monkey brewing

Also, no offence taken, I understand everybodys trying to help, im also trying to learn as much as I can from the experts here


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## MHB

Good
Well that much Maltodextrin will only add about 1.004-1.005 to the FG, with what comes from the kit and the DME at a guestimate you should be finishing around 1.012-1.014.
Could easily be that as above the yeast was less than pristine, always good to look at use by, or made on dates and how your retailer looks after their yeast.

The water here in the Hunter is really good for brewing, the only thing that might need attention is Chlorine. About half a Campden tablet will take care of that, just fill the fermenter the night before add half a crushed Campden tablet, leave overnight and use the treated water to make up your wort.
Lots cheaper than spring water and like I said Hunter water is brilliant for brewing.
Mark


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## Holden4th

I have a beer that I would normally keg after fourteen days but I will be away for two weeks just before that time. Someone mentioned cold crashing the fermenter so that I can keg when I come back. Would that work OK?


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## Thomas Wood

Holden4th said:


> I have a beer that I would normally keg after fourteen days but I will be away for two weeks just before that time. Someone mentioned cold crashing the fermenter so that I can keg when I come back. Would that work OK?


Keg it just before you leave and cold crash in the keg?


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## MHB

Keg it with the right amount of sugar, come back to carbonated beer that just needs cooling down!
Mark


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## monkey brewing

So this morning at 7am, day 10, I dry hopped the batch, upon opening fermenter I could see action going on, still visible krausen, so i boil my hop sock for 5 minutes then sanitize with star san & add hops to the sock open the vessel and drop them in fermenter, close the lid as tight as i can and now i have air lock action again, so I think I'll still hit that 1014-1012.


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## monkey brewing

Im no scientist but would the airlock be showing action again due to co2 pushing oxygen out?


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## Ben Davies

Hopefully mate but you can disrupt suspended co2 in fermented solution and therefore some airlock action. But if there was krausen well cant deny that. Good luck on your 1st brew. You being patient itll be fine.


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## monkey brewing

Ben Davies said:


> Hopefully mate but you can disrupt suspended co2 in fermented solution and therefore some airlock action. But if there was krausen well cant deny that. Good luck on your 1st brew. You being patient itll be fine.


By krausen I mean it still had a good 1 inch head of foam on top of brew, I assume krausen is the term, correct me if im wrong


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## Ben Davies

monkey brewing said:


> By krausen I mean it still had a good 1 inch head of foam on top of brew, I assume krausen is the term, correct me if im wrong


Yep sure is an actively fermenting beverage will develope a foamy looking layer atop after 9 days is odd but you may have somehow re disturbed yeast and have kickstarted fermentation keep it warm now for a good finnish.


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## Rocker1986

I have read of dry hops causing further fermentation to occur than would have otherwise, I don't know how accurate it is; I haven't noticed it in my own brews, but it would at least create nucleation points for CO2 bubbles to form on. Don't worry about what the airlock is doing though, they're pretty unreliable for that sort of thing. Trust your hydrometer.


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## Coalminer

_Lots cheaper than spring water and like I said Hunter water is brilliant for brewing.
Mark[/QUOTE]
_
Must agree with this


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## ekymetal

MHB said:


> Keg it with the right amount of sugar, come back to carbonated beer that just needs cooling down!
> Mark


I would be very interested in your experience here.
I’m about to try this soon in a 10 ltr keg.
Sorry for starting an old post.
Cheers


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## MHB

Don't be - sorry I mean, we are always telling people to read old threads (do a search...) before starting a new thread, so glad you did!

Most of the beer I brew benefits from a maturation period in the several weeks to months range (some longer)
For a Heff or something intensely hopped turning them around faster is a good idea, but for a bitter or pale ale keg conditioning is a great way to bet both maturity and condition (fizz).
I'm just about to head off to work so to keep this brief - have a look at the relevant section of Braukaiser.
Should be home by 8PM so if you have any questions, catch up around then.
Mark


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## ekymetal

Thanks Mark


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