# 375ml Pet Screw Top Bottles And Other Questions



## maxy007 (5/1/07)

Hi There,
Wow what a great forum!!! I've been thinking about getting a home brewing kit for a while and after reading the posts of the enthusiests here It's made me even more convinced to go ahead and get one.  

I'm going to get the Mexican Cerveza first because I love that style of beer and Corona is my absolute fave!! (yes I'm a girl!!)

I have a couple of questions: 

Can you get 375ml PET bottles with screw top lids?
I read a post where someone mentioned using bundaberg ginger beer diet bottles as the screw top lids are the same but I'm to scared they will explode so would rather go with plastic at this stage.

In the same Mexican Cerveza thread someone mentioned adding glacier hops for lemon flavour. I'm curious as to how this is done? As I'll only have a basic kit will I need to add the hops to the boiling 2 litres of water then put it into the fermenter thingy? 

If that's correct how much Glacier should I use?

Thanks for reading, no doubt I'll be back with more questions later.

Cheers,

Maxy


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## Finite (5/1/07)

Welcome Maxy :super: 

Im sure you will love the AHB comunity its a great source of info for learning and improving your HB. Im afraid you cant get smaller PET bottles that im aware of so either drink or find someone who drinks crown top bottles or you might have to stick with the larger ones.

In terms of adding hops. Glacier are an aroma hop which means you can get away with adding them into the fermenter. Boiling the hops would most likely destroy some of that nice smell. Adding the hops to the fermenter after the wort has been cooled is refered to as dry hopping. To keep things simple I think you can buy Morgans? packet hops which come in a little bag ready to throw in for dry hopping but I personaly wouldnt advocate their use to much as they are probably pretty poor quality (ive used these and hardly noticed any extra aroma), ask if your local home brew shop stocks fresh hops and dont be afraid to ask how old they are etc. Craftbrewer is a great source of some of the best quality hops you will find at a very good price (no affiliation). You can add some to a clean and sanitized pantyhose or similar and put into the fermenter.

In terms of time and ammount ill have to let someone else answer as ive never used this kit or used Glacier for that matter. Good luck mate. Some good info on dry hopping here answers pretty much most of your dry hopping questions.

Brew on,

Blake


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## blackbock (5/1/07)

maxy007 said:


> I have a couple of questions:
> 
> Can you get 375ml PET bottles with screw top lids?
> I read a post where someone mentioned using bundaberg ginger beer diet bottles as the screw top lids are the same but I'm to scared they will explode so would rather go with plastic at this stage.



Maxy,

I'm unsure which post you are quoting, but there are plastic Bundaberg Ginger Beer bottles around, and they are brown too. I think they are bigger than 375ml, probably about the same as small Coke (600ml?)


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## maxy007 (5/1/07)

Thanks for your reply and the links Blake.
I really appreciate it.
I think I'll try it without the hops first just to get started. I guess I'll get the bundaberg bottles and hope for the best  

Would you use the Coopers Brew Enhancer 2 or 1 with the Mexican Cerveza?
Some people say 1 others say 2.

Cheers,

Maxy


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## maxy007 (5/1/07)

Thanks Blackbock,
The post is here
It was posted by Drulupis


Cheers,

Maxy


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## Brownie (5/1/07)

Maxy,

Go the Brew Enhancer 2,
Ditch the kit Yeast, and get some SAFlager or a true lager yeast,
If possible brew at a low temperature, below 12 deg C.

Note: If you can't brew at a low temp keep the kit yeast as true lager yeasts don't like higher temps.


Also put your location in your profile so other brewers in your location can assist.

Brownie


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## Nickb167 (5/1/07)

Brownie said:


> Maxy,
> 
> Go the Brew Enhancer 2,
> Ditch the kit Yeast, and get some SAFlager or a true lager yeast,
> ...




i think a lager yeast is a bit much for a first brew.


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## maxy007 (5/1/07)

Brownie,
I'm in the ACT and have updated my profile. 
Which version of the SAFlager should I use and how much of it?

Cheers,

Maxy


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## Brownie (5/1/07)

Maxy,

I would tend to agree with nickb167, unless you have a way to keep the wort temperature down to below 12C then go with the kit yeast.

I tend to use SAFLager S-23 which can be obtained from Brew Your Own At Home, at Kambah, or Butt n Brew at Kaleen. BYOAH at Kambah has a wider range of everything and will give good/great advice. Butts n Brew at Kaleen are a convenience only, advice is well hmmmm, but they have most general items.

Brownie.


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## InCider (5/1/07)

Hey Maxy,

One of my first brews (Feb 06) was the Cerveza. I brewed it for a party and after two weeks in the bottle it was BLOODY ORDINARY....

But after 4 weeks it was excellent. A real Cerveza. :beerbang: 

I have found that the lighter the beer, the longer it needs to be left before dinking...  

InCider.


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## maxy007 (6/1/07)

Brownie said:


> Maxy,
> 
> I would tend to agree with nickb167, unless you have a way to keep the wort temperature down to below 12C then go with the kit yeast.



Brownie,
Will the yeast that comes with the tin be enough?
If I use the stock standard kit and make 23 lts, roughly what would the Alcohol content be?


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## maxy007 (6/1/07)

InCider said:


> Hey Maxy,
> 
> One of my first brews (Feb 06) was the Cerveza. I brewed it for a party and after two weeks in the bottle it was BLOODY ORDINARY....
> 
> ...



Hey there inCider,
I don't mind waiting. As long as it's worth it


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## glenos (6/1/07)

> I have found that the lighter the beer, the longer it needs to be left before dinking...


Wait till you start brewing heavy stouts that need 6 months in to bottle to smooth out.

I have played with some fruit wines and a year in the bottle is about normal, that is after 4 months of racking and fermenting.



> Will the yeast that comes with the tin be enough?


The kit yeast will be plenty, I usually get it started in a tall glass before pitching it into the barrel, just in some warm (30) sugar solution covered with clingwrap.



> If I use the stock standard kit and make 23 lts, roughly what would the Alcohol content be?


5%ish is about average from memory


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## pint of lager (6/1/07)

Any plastic bottle that has contained carbonated soft drink should be ok for bottling your beers. Not sure of all the sizes available. Do store any clear PET in a dark cupboard or box as light is bad for your beer flavour.

I have noticed that kit beers need at least 4 weeks in the bottle for the flavours to mature.

Fruit wines are great if you have access to trees of fruit.

Years ago, yeast supplied was dodgy and it was necessary to make starters to ensure you had enough active yeast. Also, to make sure you had an active yeast, people would "proof it" by adding the yeast to a water and sugar solution. This is no longer necessary and research has shown that proofing is actually detrimental to the yeast population. Rather than adding your yeast to a sugar solution, just rehydrate it in plain warm water (30 deg C) or simply sprinkle the dried yeast on top of your wort or wine to be.


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## SpillsMostOfIt (6/1/07)

pint of lager said:


> Any plastic bottle that has contained carbonated soft drink should be ok for bottling your beers. Not sure of all the sizes available. Do store any clear PET in a dark cupboard or box as light is bad for your beer flavour.



It gets better. I've found that many glass bottles that carbonated soft drink comes in and the brown 340ml glass bottles that Wild Turkey and Cola comes in have the same threads as PET bottles. I use these for 'samplers' so I don't have to open a big bottle to see if a beer is ready to drink or not (rather than just waiting)...

For one of my earlier brews, I bottled into a 2.5l 'Crowd Pleaser' PET bottle. The crowd is yet to be pleased...


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## Wortgames (6/1/07)

Hi Maxy, welcome to the hobby and to the forum!

(It looks like there are a couple of ladies joining us, is there some kind of master plan behind this? Be on your guard fellas, or there'll be quiche at your next club meeting) 

I think for your first brew, you should aim to keep it clean and simple - the tips that others are suggesting (yeast starters, hop additions etc) are all well and good, but they will really only make small improvements to your beer, and introduce confusion and additional opportunities to screw up. You need to get up and running first, with a couple of nice drinkable brews that you are happy to drink yourself and serve to others - and you can do that with a simple kit and kilo.

It sounds like you have found a kit and booster that you are happy with (so you are already ahead of most brewers who just start off with sugar). The kit will come with perfectly good yeast which will do a fine job sprinkled into your fermenter.

The two biggest things that you need to worry about for your first brew are sanitation and temperature.

If you haven't already, check out http://www.howtobrew.com for some great info on getting started.

If you want to spend more money on improving your beer, then go to your local homebrew shop and get some good no-rinse sanitiser (eg brewshield) that you can squirt on everything after you've cleaned it and before you use it (and in the airlock). Bleach is great for sanitising things but you need to rinse it really well, without re-introducing any germs. Forget sodium met which may have come with your fermenter.

Aside from sanitation, your biggest chance of crap beer is likely to be failing to keep the fermenter at a constant temperature of about 20C. Hot temperatures and fluctuating temperatures will do more harm than not using a yeast starter or adding aroma hops! There are plenty of threads around where folks describe their methods for cooling a fermenter, but if you don't have access to a fermenting fridge then the best bet is to sit it in a tub of cold water in the coolest part of the house with a wet towel draped over it, and keep re-wetting it.

Forget everything you hear about 'keeping it warm' - that's old-school thought from Europe and winter brewing. It may actually be prudent to wait until the weather cools down a bit; even in many European countries, they couldn't brew in summer before refrigeration - let alone here in Australia at 35C!

We'll all help you out, but do yourself a favour and keep it as simple as you can to start with.


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## dairymaid (6/1/07)

Hi guys and Maxie,
Just curious with this yeast rehydrating, where is says - just rehydtrate with plain warm water (30 deg C)
etc etc 
the instructions on the beer kits say do not let the temperture rise above 28 deg C when adding the yeast
as the high temperature kills it?

cheers/beers Dairymaid


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## pint of lager (6/1/07)

The kits only have a small amount of space to fit a huge amount of printed information, so the simplest easiest bits only make it onto the tin.

For newer brewers, keep it simple, concentrate on sanitation, fermentation temperature and good ingredients, plus a dose of patience. Do not fret about rehydration, just sprinkle your yeast on the prepared wort.

Hydrating your yeast is a totally separate process to adding your yeast to your wort. The wort should be as close to fermentation temperature as possible when adding the yeast, 20 degrees is ideal.

Yeast will quite happily work at 28 deg and will not be killed. They will work quickly but also generate off flavours. Fruity, nail polish and harsh are often used for flavour descriptors of hot ferments. If you add your yeast to a wort at 28 deg, by the time it settles to 20, your yeast may well have already completed the job of fermenting your brew.

Have a read of the hydration page on the Lallemand site, the link to the home page is in the links section. Or search for hydration on AHB.


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## Brewtus (6/1/07)

Wortgames said:


> It sounds like you have found a kit and booster that you are happy with (so you are already ahead of most brewers who just start off with sugar). The kit will come with perfectly good yeast which will do a fine job sprinkled into your fermenter.
> 
> The two biggest things that you need to worry about for your first brew are sanitation and temperature.



Welcome to the world of home brew Maxie.

I brew in Canberra and don't brew at this time of year as it is to hard to keep the temp down. If you have a home that has A/C to keep the house below 22 deg 24/7 then you can use ale yeast as provided. Only think of lager yeast if you have a fridge, cool room, basement that stays at 8 to 12 deg on a 35 deg day. I do lager in the garage in winter and it is fine. Pitch the ale yeast with the wort at 24 deg or lower as if it gets above 26 it is hard to get down and the brew goes crazy (see 'steam train fermentation' posts).



Wortgames said:


> go to your local homebrew shop and get some good no-rinse sanitiser (eg brewshield) that you can squirt on everything after you've cleaned it and before you use it (and in the airlock). Bleach is great for sanitising things but you need to rinse it really well, without re-introducing any germs. Forget sodium met which may have come with your fermenter.



Col at "brew your own at home" in Kambah shops supplies an iodine base sanitiser that is cheap and effective. I have used it for 12 brews with no infections or bad tastes on a no rinse basis.

He also gives lessons at 11am Sunday mornings for free.

Good luck.


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## Brownie (6/1/07)

Being a Canberra brewer, I am lucky enough to be able to brew all year round, through some cunning and ingenuity. Or stealing other peoples ideas.

I brew in my Garage, underneath the stairs, just a nice size for my meager equipment, it generally doesn't get hot hot.

But I bought a 125 Litre plastic tub from the reject shop, and place my fermenter (primary or Secondary) into the tub, which I have encased in polystyrene for insulation.

If summer, and brewing an Ale, I just put a couple of frozen 2 litre bottles of water into tub with fermenter, and it tends to keep temp around 16-18 C. If a lager I fill the fermenter 1/ full with water and place a couple a frozen 2 litre bottles of water into the tub of water, this tends to keep the temp around 10 C.

If Winter, the temp tends to sit around 15C constant all the time in my little brew house under the stairs, which means I just need to cool it down a fraction for lagers and the natural heat generated from fermenting beer, keeps the temp fine in the fermenter

Brownie.


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## shazzam (7/1/07)

Dear Maxy,

Welcome to the wonderful world of brewing !


I suppose out of all the advice I have really taken to heart it is

1. Keep it constant - once you get the temperature of the wort down to the level you want 
- try and keep it as close to that temperature as you can - take a tiny look at the weather forecasts to see if there are any predicted REALLY HOT days so you can stock up on ice etc.

2. Clean everything but don't scrub it - get a good sanitiser that works for you, a microfibre 
cloth (recommend coles smartbuy 2 micro cleaning cloths about $4 - like a face washer) and a babys or soft toothbrush (for tap threds) as well as a bottlebrush. I find microfibre will find any burrs on plastic but wont create them - it also persuades the ring of grunge off very nicely. And they are easily washed and sanitised themselves.

3. Light is the enemy of any beer in storage - you were talking pet bottles - not my go personally but some brands have green or brown tints that help. Honestly you would be better off buying a capper !

4. Searching for recipes is fun but keep an absolute record - I am still searching for the perfect JS Amber Ale
this isnt the hardest task I have had I must say - but you need to document all the ingredients so if you find your Corona recipe you will know what went in it.

5. Have fun - I am about to make an odds and ends beer - just a bit of this and that I have left over - maybe weird but will be different !

have fun on your quest !


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## maxy007 (7/1/07)

Wortgames said:


> Hi Maxy, welcome to the hobby and to the forum!
> 
> (It looks like there are a couple of ladies joining us, is there some kind of master plan behind this? Be on your guard fellas, or there'll be quiche at your next club meeting)



Haha Wortgames,
We ladies were going to perform a home brewing Coup quietly one by one but you've found us out and now we have to come clean all together!! I was thinking cheesecake instead of quiche, would that be ok?  

Thanks to you and everone else's for the wonderful information you share. I really appreciate it.
The more I read the more I can't wait to get stuck into brewing my own beer.
Once I get all the gear I'll let you know how I get on.

Cheers,

Maxy :beer:


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## maxy007 (7/1/07)

shazzam said:


> Dear Maxy,
> 
> Welcome to the wonderful world of brewing !
> I suppose out of all the advice I have really taken to heart it is
> ...



Thanks mate,
I'll certianly keep these points in mind. 
I'll be keeping a spreadsheet and notes on how I do things so if I get that perfect drop I will be able to recreate it!!
Good luck with your odds and ends brew it sounds like it'll be alot of fun and lets hope it tastes fantastic!!

Cheers,

Maxy


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## maxy007 (7/1/07)

Brewtus said:


> Welcome to the world of home brew Maxie.
> 
> Col at "brew your own at home" in Kambah shops supplies an iodine base sanitiser that is cheap and effective. I have used it for 12 brews with no infections or bad tastes on a no rinse basis.



Thanks Brewtus,
What do you mean by a no rinse basis? Do you use the iodine base sanitiser instead of bleach?

Cheers,

Maxy


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## Brewtus (7/1/07)

maxy007 said:


> Thanks Brewtus,
> What do you mean by a no rinse basis? Do you use the iodine base sanitiser instead of bleach?
> 
> Cheers,
> ...



I only use bleach when desperate. I am yet to get an infection. You buy the Iodine concentrate and some brewers detergent. Wash everything in the detergent, which is pretty mild stuff. You mix the iodine in a spray pack and spray the inside of the fermenter, all the parts when disassembled and inside the bottles and leave them for 20 min. All you need to do is pour the excess out and maybe give the fermenter a quick slosh with a splash of water. The iodine in moderation (trace levels) is actually good for you and doesn't affect the taste of your beer.


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## maxy007 (7/1/07)

Brewtus said:


> I only use bleach when desperate. I am yet to get an infection. You buy the Iodine concentrate and some brewers detergent. Wash everything in the detergent, which is pretty mild stuff. You mix the iodine in a spray pack and spray the inside of the fermenter, all the parts when disassembled and inside the bottles and leave them for 20 min. All you need to do is pour the excess out and maybe give the fermenter a quick slosh with a splash of water. The iodine in moderation (trace levels) is actually good for you and doesn't affect the taste of your beer.



Excellent!! I'll be sure to get some of that.
Thanks for the info.


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## Drulupis (7/1/07)

Greets

Yet ANOTHER Canberra brewer ;-)


Brownie, 
I love the idea of the insulated container to keep the fermenter cool. Adding salt to the bottles of frozen water will bring their temperature down below zero (up to -20 based on my readings depending on the amount of salt added). I'm going to try this. So far I've just used a wet towel draped around the fermenter which drops it by several degrees. Sitting it in an insulated tub of frozen salt water, with the towel draped around the fermenter and the bottom of the towel sitting in the melting water should keep the fermenter temp quite a bit lower.


Maxy,
the iodine based solution that Brewtus mentioned is called "Iodophor Sanitizing Solution". It costs $11.70 for 250ml, which goes a long way. I add 10ml to every 10L, and the solution can be reused until it loses its potency. As Brewtus says, it requires no rinsing, thereby reducing your water requirements, especially good during these Level 3 restrictions we're under here in the ACT. After draining the solution you just let the fermenter air dry.

I use two fermenters, and still use bottles at the moment. 
Once the specific gravity in my primary fermenter stabilises, I transfer the beer (very carefully so as to minimise aeration of the wort as much as possible) to the second fermenter. This helps separate the beer from the yeast/hop/adjuct residue at the bottom.

I collect the yeast from the primary fermenter for my next batch (I use Nottingham Ale for most of my brews), then I sanitize the primary.

I fill it with water, and add the Iodophor. 30L water = 30ml Iodophor.
After letting it sit for several hours, I use the solution to sanitize my bottles.
I fill the fermenter with as many bottles as possible, let them sit for 30 minutes, then drain them out and sit them on the bottle tree.

Then once I've bottled the beer from my secondary fermenter, I transfer the iodophor solution from the primary into the secondary for sanitizing.


The iodine in the solution disperses when exposed to light, so when I'm done sanitizing I transfer the solution to a separate clear plastic storage bucket and let it sit outside for a day or two. I then use the water on my lawn.

I ALWAYS have a spray bottle of Iodophor solution ready at all times. It's great for spraying equipment before introducing it into your wort, and spraying the fermenter tap before connecting the racking/bottling tubes. 

Thus it takes 30ml to sanitize each batch - both fermenters and all bottles. I get around 8 batches out of each bottle. I've been brewing for just over a year now and am only on my second bottle - and there's still 1/3 of THAT left.


It's a great idea to keep a log of your brewing - your Brew Diary. I sample a bottle of each brew after 3 weeks conditioning and make notes on aroma, flavours and carbonation on the relative page in my diary.
I add more notes as the brew gets older. This helps me keep track of what effects maturation has on each beer. 

BYO have a spreadsheet you can use, but I'm sure a Google search will show up many others.
http://byo.com/spreadsheet/

And lastly, I've learned quite a lot of tidbits listening to the BasicBrewing radiocast. 
I put the headphones on whilst I'm pottering around the garden.
http://www.basicbrewing.com/radio/

The first 5 videocasts are good for info too. You get to watch James and Steve going through the paces of an extract-brew.
http://www.basicbrewing.com/radio/index.php?page=video


Cheers all, and brew up some fun. 

Drulupis


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## Brownie (8/1/07)

Drulupis,

Last time I looked the Reject Shop at Gunghalin had 125 Litre Plastic storage containers with Lids for $22, bargain.

I also use plastic bottles full of hot water in winter if the temp gets too low.

Maxy,

I use Woolworths brand nappy wash powder with sodium percarbinate in it and unscented, this works fine as a sanitiser, I also use unscented bleach sometimes, never had a problem, well none that I know of.


Brownie


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## Drulupis (8/1/07)

Onya Brownie

fortunately the Gungahlin Shops are a mere 3 minutes drive ;-)

cheers mate.


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## Brownie (9/1/07)

Drulupis,

Was as the Gunghalin Shops today and the Reject Shop have 125 Litre Storage containers for $20 each. I think I saw about 6 or 8 left.

Brownie.


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