# Growing Hops along a fence - bines stop growing



## drtablet (20/12/14)

Hello all,
I'm new at growing Hops bines.
I've planted 4 varieties. POR, Cascade, Fuggles and Golding.
All from Rhizomes, so I guess this is the 1st year.

I don't have a place for them to grow up as they would naturally like to so I have them in large pots growing sideways along fences.
They all have sent out a lot of very healthy bines of which I choose the 3 best looking and trained them by hand along the fence twine.

All bines have grown quite vigorously to about 3 meters then the growth tips get very thin and weak looking and stop growing in length.
The plant itself around the same time is sending out new thick healthy looking bins either form under the soil or from near the base of the existing bines.

So why don't the original 3 keep on growing in length?
There is enough water (I think because the plant easily sends out new bines).
Could it be I am hand winding them and after a few metres they don't like being wound in a "unnatural" sideways way rather then climbing up and up to the sun as they would prefer.
Ideas welcome from those with more experience.

The POR has already started little flower cones, i guess this variety has the home advantage over the others.

thanks


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## going down a hill (20/12/14)

Some hops stall in the middle of their growth cycle, when i grew my chinook it stopped for a month before growing at a rapid rate once it took off again.


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## leighaus (20/12/14)

They may lose out in some sunlight which would stunt them...






They may just be stagnant and kick off again


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## drtablet (21/12/14)

thanks fellas,
Do you find if they stall that all bines stall at the same time - as well as not sending out new thick healthy bines?
Or do you think they could stall just one 2 of the 3 bines at the same time sending out new healthy bines?
(I'm only allowing 3 to grow along the fence)

I've been cutting off the new bines in the hope that the stalled ones will recover.

Also, yes the one that is doing the worst is the fuggles which does have some shade in the morning.


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## wynnum1 (21/12/14)

Building a t-frame may be worth looking at using bailing twine for the hops to grow up on.



Mittleider Garden: T-Frame Canopy Construction


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## hoppy2B (21/12/14)

Fuggle is an early grower and stops growing once the days become longer, so don't expect it to restart. It may restart once the days become shorter but it will be too late to expect anything from it. In my opinion not worth growing Fuggle in Australia at all.

In the ground, most of the bines on POR and Cascade tend not to grow more than about 4 metres, with some bines getting higher. So 3 metres in pots isn't unusual.

Golding is fairly tall and can be expected to grow to 7 metres. 

I don't know what you were expecting, especially growing them in pots. I have know idea why you're stressing out seeing as the POR has started flowering. What were you expecting them to do?


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## drtablet (21/12/14)

I'll take a look at the T-Frame wynnum1, thanks

Thanks Hoppy2B for the details on bines lengths of different varieties and growth expectations.

Far from stressing about POR flowers - I'm delighted.

cheers


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## beerfarmer (23/12/14)

Just for the record... Fuggles grows very well in my neck of the woods and starts to slow as daylight hours decrease which is what triggers flowering. All my 10 varieties reach the top of my trellis at 5meters. I've seen hops give great crops down here growing on fence lines. You need to identify exactly what is happening to your tips.... Are they snapping off, dying back or attacked by mildew? If their snapping off then it's a mechanical issue, dying back then most likely soil issue,or rotting then most likely powdery mildew. If they are snapping, not all is lost as this will promote lateral growth. Happy growing.


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## hoppy2B (23/12/14)

Nonsense, most of my hops are flowering and the days are still getting longer. Flowering just happens when they get to a certain size.


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## beerfarmer (24/12/14)

Well hoppy2b. I'm not going to argue with an expert mate but most farmers who grow hops, myself included, understand that hops are photoperiod sensitive ( the reason Tassie is best suited to grow hops). Stress and climatic conditions can also trigger flower.Now I suggest you get educated on a topic before you differentiate between sense and nonsense. I thought my reply was a subtle switch of direction from your previous post which was total bollocks!!! Now back to original post... 3m of growth is ok for a first year rhizome. Your plant will grow more as the crown becomes more established. Don't take everything you read in these forums as gospel. Be sure to cross reference any advice given. Including mine! Happy hopping.


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## beerfarmer (24/12/14)

Ps... The days are getting shorter now!


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## Dan Pratt (24/12/14)

My East Kent Goldings require a bit of effort to keep them going. They prefer vertical growth.


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## beerfarmer (24/12/14)

Looking good pratty. Makes easy picking to go horizontal thou. I'm gunna trial a dwarf trellis on a patch next year. You run a low trellis and tip the bines to promote lateral growth. I've seen a few trials in the UK which looks promising. Keeps them out of the wind as well.


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## hoppy2B (25/12/14)

beerfarmer said:


> Well hoppy2b. I'm not going to argue with an expert mate but most farmers who grow hops, myself included, understand that hops are photoperiod sensitive ( the reason Tassie is best suited to grow hops). Stress and climatic conditions can also trigger flower.Now I suggest you get educated on a topic before you differentiate between sense and nonsense. I thought my reply was a subtle switch of direction from your previous post which was total bollocks!!! Now back to original post... 3m of growth is ok for a first year rhizome. Your plant will grow more as the crown becomes more established. Don't take everything you read in these forums as gospel. Be sure to cross reference any advice given. Including mine! Happy hopping.


I'd suggest your perspective has evolved from the fact that Tassie is backward from the rest of Australia. I have about 20 hop plants, most of them in the ground and most of them have been flowering for ages. And I don't believe flowering has anything to do with day length.

Its true that hops don't want to start growing until day length reaches a certain point, so in that regard day length plays a role. But aside from that, day length is fairly irrelevant in relation to flowering. Hops will stop growing once day length recedes past a certain point, and if hops haven't reach sufficient size then flowering won't occur. 

Its probably the fact you live in Tassie and your days are likely shorter than parts of the mainland, and your temps are also cooler. Temperature being the other factor capable of spurring on growth.


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## Yob (25/12/14)

hoppy2B said:


> I'd suggest your perspective has evolved from the fact that Tassie is backward from the rest of Australia. /quote]
> 
> If this is an attempt at humour, your an idiot, if you actually mean it, much worse and I won't type it.. Commercial hop farms in tassie for over 100 years hoppy..
> 
> ...


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## beerfarmer (25/12/14)

Well.... I was always taught not to argue with an idiot, so I'm not about to start. Hoppy keep believing what you believe mate, I've no problem with that just keep it in your own head to save yourself from further embarrassment, and leading others down your garden path. Remember people believed the earth was flat until they were educated otherwise, so I suggest again that maybe you read up on this topic and get yourself educated. Maybe this is a chance for you to learn a little more. Cheers to you yob for backing Tassie!!! Merry Xmas!! Oh and by the way hoppy Tassie is a horrible backward place, not a place you would ever like to visit!.... No not really, I would still have a beer with you.


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## Bomber Watson (25/12/14)

Now that the cocks have stopped swinging...I hope....

OT, but hell, anything to redirect the thread a bit, any advice on growing hops in Central QLD? Pretty North....Any reading i can do on growing the tasty fuckers this close to the equator? Everything i find is very south, few lads in brissy, thats 600km closer to the antartic than i am....

Cheers.


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## Yob (25/12/14)

Any number of people grow up north, some better than others, totally the wrong time of year to start though now if that's what you are asking.


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## beerfarmer (25/12/14)

Ha ha.... Good call bomber. Point taken. Sorry no advice for that far north. Some varieties may do better than others depending on the Origen of that strain.... The cock stops here! Ha ha..


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## KevinR (26/12/14)

Merry Christmas all.
At the risk of getting back on topic, and I know notthing about hops other than measuring a few grams of pellets, I have done a little gardening.I once tried to train a climbing rose horizontal. When i moved the shoots from vertical to horizontal the would die back and shoot vertical again.Nature seemed determined they went up.
just a thought?


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## Bomber Watson (26/12/14)

Yob said:


> Any number of people grow up north, some better than others, totally the wrong time of year to start though now if that's what you are asking.


Yes I realize its the wrong time, Just seeing everyones plantations has me excited...

Plus the nice convenient eastern facing fence i have needs some real development work of the soil under it, so if i start planning now i have six months to improve the soil 

Cheers.


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## hoppy2B (26/12/14)

Yob said:


> hoppy2B said:
> 
> 
> > I'd suggest your perspective has evolved from the fact that Tassie is backward from the rest of Australia. /quote]
> ...


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## hoppy2B (26/12/14)

beerfarmer said:


> Well.... I was always taught not to argue with an idiot, so I'm not about to start. Hoppy keep believing what you believe mate, I've no problem with that just keep it in your own head to save yourself from further embarrassment, and leading others down your garden path. Remember people believed the earth was flat until they were educated otherwise, so I suggest again that maybe you read up on this topic and get yourself educated. Maybe this is a chance for you to learn a little more. Cheers to you yob for backing Tassie!!! Merry Xmas!! Oh and by the way hoppy Tassie is a horrible backward place, not a place you would ever like to visit!.... No not really, I would still have a beer with you.


And the same applies to your name calling also.

Why on earth would I go and read a book that would suggest that shorter days bring on flowering when all my hops have been flowering for ages?


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## Camo6 (27/12/14)

Pfffft. Pigs ass. Your post seemed fairly definitive H2B. 
Once again you've criticised another avid hop grower, whose obviously got a clear understanding of biology, because you don't agree. C'mon mate, pull your head in a bit.
It's biological fact that hops and many other plants develop and flower depending on length of daylight. But that doesn't mean they won't flower early given optimum conditions.


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## dicko (27/12/14)

MODERATION:

Some content in this thread has stepped over the mark with regard to abuse.
We could easily remove the offending posts but in my opinion some reasonable on topic content and information may be lost by doing so.

Let the name calling and the general abuse stop and keep the thread on topic and if comments made are only personal beliefs then say so, unless you may provide technical reference in the form of a link.

Thank you for your co operation.


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## going down a hill (27/12/14)

I've had a quick look around the internet with what beerfarmer was talking about and found these two links 

Short day plants
http://extension.oregonstate.edu/gardening/what-are-short-day-and-long-day-plants

This is a pp slideshow so a lot of the finer points were probably spoken but it's about how hops are grown
http://hops.msu.edu/uploads/files/GLEXPO_2012_Perrault_Hops.pdf

Beerfarmer was bang on.


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## hoppy2B (28/12/14)

Seriously, I should believe that rubbish that is telling me my hop plants are not all in full flower now and haven't been for some weeks, and will instead flower in a month's time? 

You can believe whatever rubbish you want, just don't expect me to do the same.


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## manticle (28/12/14)

Back down hoppy. Dicko's warning included you. You have opinions? Great. Back them up, politely and graciously.


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## Camo6 (28/12/14)

hoppy2B said:


> Seriously, I should believe that rubbish that is telling me my hop plants are not all in full flower now and haven't been for some weeks, and will instead flower in a month's time?
> 
> You can believe whatever rubbish you want, just don't expect me to do the same.


Hey, my cascade had cones in November while my chinook was barely a foot high. Easy to explain - good fertiliser, good weather, good growing conditions.
I had a mate, years ago, sponsored to grow a similar variety indoors and stuffed up the light cycle and wound up with all males. Explaining a $30k loss to the 'social/recreational club' that fronted the setup - not so easy.
In the eternal words of Jesse Pinkman: "It's science, bitches."


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## Josh SA (28/12/14)

My plants started flowering about 6-7 wks ago. I rekon the orientation of the hop yard (my 3x 50l pots situated just under the verandah) has alot to do with it.

Even though daylight hours were increasing, there was a point (around early october) when the sun started to set further SW, leaving the actual plants in shade earlier than previous.

If I grew my hops in the middle of the yard & Knocked both neighbours houses down, then my plants would prob just have started flowering.

morning sun on my hops has always been late due to huge hedge in neighbours place.

Thats how i see it anyway.


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## going down a hill (29/12/14)

Camo6 said:


> I had a mate, years ago, sponsored to grow a similar variety indoors and stuffed up the light cycle and wound up with all males. Explaining a $30k loss to the 'social/recreational club' that fronted the setup


[SIZE=14.3999996185303px]Did the bikies take any of his fingers as remuneration [/SIZE]


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## beerfarmer (29/12/14)

I can't help but think that the latitude of your growing area may play a part in the timing of flower commencement also. Sydney's nights are currently 55 minutes longer than Tas and Adelaide are 45mins longer than Tas.... As well as warmer temps, just a thought. Now to get us back on topic, here's a pic of a hop down the road growing along a fence line. She's a beauty. I'll post a pic when she flowers too as it's a sight to behold.


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## leighaus (29/12/14)

any idea what it is? what a monster!


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## wereprawn (30/12/14)

Bomber Watson said:


> Now that the cocks have stopped swinging...I hope....
> 
> OT, but hell, anything to redirect the thread a bit, any advice on growing hops in Central QLD? Pretty North....Any reading i can do on growing the tasty fuckers this close to the equator? Everything i find is very south, few lads in brissy, thats 600km closer to the antartic than i am....
> 
> Cheers.


Hi there Bomber,
Hoppy2B was kind enough to send me some rhizomes last year. The wet killed some and the heat others and fungus others but the POR and Dwarf Cluster are going well and the POR has a dozen or so budding cones atm( would be more if some mongrel, bastard, critter would stop eating the tips of the bines). I have bugger all experience growing Hops but my advice would be to water really often in those hot months leading up to the wet and use a fungicide when the rain starts in earnest. Grasshoppers love them and the cane toads like to burrow in the loose, moist soil and they disturb the roots. From what i hear we shouldn't expect a big harvest anyway in the tropics. Hope this helps. Cheers.


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## Yob (30/12/14)

wereprawn said:


> and Dwarf Cluster


sorry to bring this up again... there aint no such thing as Dwarf Cluster, yes dwarf hops exist LINKY but there is no evidence that a: Cluster is among them b: have ever been either trialled in Australia or developed here AFAIK.

The fact that a particular hop may not grow to 'usual' heights is not indicative of a Dwarf variety.

I mean no particular offense to vertically challenged hops of any variety and wish them all the best for the future


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## beerfarmer (30/12/14)

leighaus said:


> any idea what it is? what a monster!


. 
Not sure of variety, but I'm guessing by the long cones on it last year that it's a POR. It's been establishing there for many years so I'd say there's a few crowns under all that growth. I'll take a closer look at her when she flowers and try to identify it.


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## oakburner (13/1/15)

In my experiences here on the Sunshine Coast they will stall in pots..... The ground provides more stable root temperature and moisture. ....and don't forget to feed them. ..... These are hungry thirsty plants (caveat: thirsty but with good drainage)....


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