# Dunkelweizen Advice Please



## SJW (26/9/08)

Below is the recipe Jamil put together on his radio show. I have never made one of these and was wondering why he would not be using Dark Wheat malt?


Dunkelweizen

Type: All Grain
Batch Size: 25.00 L
Brewer: Stephen Wright 
Boil Size: 30.64 L Asst Brewer: 
Boil Time: 75 min Equipment: Keg - Ale 
Taste Rating(out of 50): 0.0 Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 
Taste Notes: 

Ingredients

Amount Item Type % or IBU 
3000.00 gm Wheat Malt, Pale (Weyermann) (3.9 EBC) Grain 51.19 % 
1500.00 gm Munich II (Weyermann) (16.7 EBC) Grain 25.60 % 
1000.00 gm Premium Pilsner (Weyermann) (2.2 EBC) Grain 17.06 % 
150.00 gm Caraaroma (256.1 EBC) Grain 2.56 % 
150.00 gm Crystal Malt - Dark (Thomas Fawcett) (350.0 EBC) Grain 2.56 % 
60.00 gm Carafa II (Weyermann) (817.6 EBC) Grain 1.02 % 
40.00 gm Saaz [4.00 %] (60 min) Hops 15.4 IBU 
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc 
11.00 gm PH 5.2 Stabilizer (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs Weizen (DCL Yeast #WB-06) Yeast-Wheat 



Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.055 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 0.000 SG 
Est Final Gravity: 1.013 SG Measured Final Gravity: 0.000 SG 
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.47 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 0.00 % 
Bitterness: 15.4 IBU Calories: 0 cal/l 
Est Color: 30.5 EBC Color: Color 


Mash Profile

Mash Name: Single Infusion, Medium Body Total Grain Weight: 5860.00 gm 
Sparge Water: 11.51 L Grain Temperature: 20.0 C 
Sparge Temperature: 75.6 C TunTemperature: 20.0 C 
Adjust Temp for Equipment: TRUE Mash PH: 5.4 PH 

Single Infusion, Medium Body Step Time Name Description Step Temp 
60 min Mash In Add 15.00 L of water at 74.0 C 67.0 C 
10 min Mash Out Add 10.00 L of water at 91.5 C 76.0 C


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## white.grant (26/9/08)

SJW said:


> Below is the recipe Jamil put together on his radio show. I have never made one of these and was wondering why he would not be using Dark Wheat malt?
> 
> 
> Dunkelweizen
> ...



I'm about to bottle a similar recipe and found that the caraaroma, carafa and crystal gets things pretty dark and adds the roasty flavours that you don't get out of the wheat. 

I've had mine fermenting on the 3068 weihenstephan, and it has finished dry and yummy. I think that weizens really need the liquid yeast for the flavour profile.

cheers

grant


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## SJW (26/9/08)

Thanks Grant. How do you find storing the 3068 slurry for future use? I have heard stories that it does not keep well.

Steve


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## tourist (26/9/08)

I have yet to try or make a great weizen with WB-06. I would recommend a liquid yeast if you can get your hands on one.


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## SJW (26/9/08)

WOW, It must be good stuff, all my wheat beers have been with WB-06, even got some places with a couple in comps. I found that I needed to ferment the WB-06 a bit warmer to get those funky wheat beer flavours going, about 22deg C
Thats it, I will get some.

Steve


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## tourist (26/9/08)

Maybe that was it, then. My temps were more in the ~18C region, as low as 16C possibly. Mind you, so were my liquid weizens, which (to my tastes) were worlds apart. I don't think I'll be going back to dry yeasts of any type for a while, though.


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## white.grant (26/9/08)

SJW said:


> Thanks Grant. How do you find storing the 3068 slurry for future use? I have heard stories that it does not keep well.
> 
> Steve




I have heard the same, though not everyone agrees. To test it I've got a sample sitting in the fridge that I'll step up into a starter in a few weeks and see how it tastes. I'm getting quite familiar with the flavour of 3068  

In the meantime, what I have done over the last month is to get a bit organized so I can keep the yeast actively growing and get the most out of the single pack. 

I initially started with a hefeweizen (which is tasting lovely just now), and when that finished I pitched the dunkelweizen onto 1.2 litres of that yeast. Next in line is a weizenbock and that will go down on the whole dunkel yeast cake -- cause the bock's at 1090 and is going to take some attenuating 

Then I'll cycle back and do another hefe/dunkel cause they don't last long around my place. So that'll be five batches off the one smackpack

cheers

grant


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## schooey (26/9/08)

IMO, WB-06 isn't a scratch on WY3068 or WY3638, you won't be disappointed


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## raven19 (18/5/09)

SJW - Please excuse the total hijack of your thread  , however similar advice is being sought for the following Dunkelweizen we are contemplating.

Thanks in advance to all comments!

Cheers.


Style: Dunkelweizen
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (0.0) 

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 60.00 L 
Boil Size: 75.27 L
Estimated OG: 1.045 SG
Estimated Color: 22.1 SRM
Estimated IBU: 12.1 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
6.40 kg Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 51.20 % 
5.10 kg Pale Malt (2 Row) UK (3.0 SRM) Grain 40.80 % 
1.00 kg Carafa I (337.0 SRM) Grain 8.00 % 
70.00 gm Tettnang [4.10 %] (60 min) Hops 12.1 IBU 
1 Pkgs Weihenstephan Weizen (Wyeast Labs #3068) [Yeast-Wheat 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 12.50 kg
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body
Step Time Name Description Step Temp 
60 min Mash In Add 32.60 L of water at 74.4 C 67.8 C 
10 min Mash Out Add 18.26 L of water at 91.5 C 75.6 C 


Notes:
------
Mash: 60min at 66 deg.


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## jlm (18/5/09)

8% Carafa? Ouch. Use Munich instead of ale malt for a start. I usually then use a bit of choc wheat to get the colour somewhere where it needs to be. My last was basically 50/50 wheat Munich II with a bit of choc wheat and tettnang to about 15 IBU and went down pretty well.


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## Swinging Beef (18/5/09)

Ive made three DVs in the past twelve months.
Im at my wits end with this bloody Weihenstephan Weizen (Wyeast Labs #3068), tho.
It makes a fluffing great 5% Heff, but for the bigger and darker wheats it makes a whole bunch of aromas that I do not feel fit to style.
I wish I could put my finger on it, but I suspect it is just too much aroma and over complicates the brew.
Next DV or Weisenbbock I make will be with a different yeast.
Any clues in this regard would be gratefully received.
Aventinus is still one of my fave beers of all time.


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## manticle (18/5/09)

Swinging Beef said:


> Aventinus




Nothing to add except yum.


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## Tony (18/5/09)

I have made some great dunkelweizens and the trick is to drop the munich malt and use dark wheat to around 60%, Pils malt, about 2 or 3% caramunich 2 and carafar spec 2 to give you about 35 EBC.

8% may be a bit much.

The character you get from the dark wheat is the true character you sould have in a dunkelweizen. Dry maltiness from the wheat.

try it!

cheers


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## raven19 (18/5/09)

Tony said:


> I have made some great dunkelweizens and the trick is to drop the munich malt and use dark wheat to around 60%, Pils malt, about 2 or 3% caramunich 2 and carafar spec 2 to give you about 35 EBC.



Cheers Tony et al,

So basicly is this more along a suitable line based on your post?

60% dark wheat 
35% Pils malt
2.5% caramunich 2 
2.5% carafar spec 2

This only gives me 16-ish EBC

Thoughts on IBU - is 15 for this ok?


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## Tony (19/5/09)

Here is a promash report of one i made a little while back. 

Was very nice.

Les tried it at my place once it had a bit of age on it in the bottle and comented that although it was getting on a bit and had lost the freshness that maked wheat beer great, it was a tops beer.

He may have just been being polite also  

Another great malt to use in a Dunkelweizen is Weyermann Carawheat. MHB described it to me ages ago as coco pops malt and it tastes kinda similar. A great dry malty chocolate character.

gere is the recipe. IMO, 3068 is the best wheat yeast ever, but it depends on your personal preference for bananna/clove ballance. If you like bananna, use it, if you like more spicy clove, use the 3638.

I like to mash in at 52 degc for 10 min @ 2 liters/kg and infuse up to 64 with boiling water. Rest for 45 min and infuse up to 71 and rest for 15 min. No mash out, just run it out to the kettle and sparge as normal. 

Works for me.



Dunkelweizen

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 52.00 Wort Size (L): 52.00
Total Grain (kg): 10.50
Anticipated OG: 1.050 Plato: 12.45
Anticipated EBC: 31.4
Anticipated IBU: 16.3
Brewhouse Efficiency: 80 %
Wort Boil Time: 75 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
60.0 6.30 kg. Weyermann Wheat Dark Germany 1.037 15
33.3 3.50 kg. Weyermann Bohemien Pils GErmany 1.038 4
2.9 0.30 kg. Weyermann CaraWheat Germany 1.037 120
1.9 0.20 kg. Weyermann Caramunich II Germany 1.035 125
1.9 0.20 kg. Weyermann Carafa Special II Germany 1.036 1100

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
80.00 g. Tettnanger Tettnang Pellet 4.10 16.3 45 min.



Yeast
-----

WYeast 3068 Weihenstephan Weizen


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## raven19 (19/5/09)

Thanks Tony!

This looks like a goer then for our first Dunkel.

Will keep you all posted on how this goes, probably make it in a couple of weeks, when time allows!

Cheers.


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## kabooby (19/5/09)

Swinging Beef said:


> Ive made three DVs in the past twelve months.
> Im at my wits end with this bloody Weihenstephan Weizen (Wyeast Labs #3068), tho.
> It makes a fluffing great 5% Heff, but for the bigger and darker wheats it makes a whole bunch of aromas that I do not feel fit to style.
> I wish I could put my finger on it, but I suspect it is just too much aroma and over complicates the brew.
> ...



Maybe try a bigger pitching rate. I mainly use the WLP300 which as far as I can tell is the same yeast. 

Kabooby


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