# 2007 Hop Plantations



## wally (9/6/07)

.


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## randyrob (9/6/07)

Hey Wally,

yes mine had simular this morning (also only a year old) i just built up some mulch around them
and we'll see how they go eh!

Rob.


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## randyrob (9/6/07)

Heya Guys,

also if anyone in Perth is looking to swap some Rhizomes, i've got 4 Columbus cuttings that are going quite well  

Pretty much after any variety.





Rob.


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## Chris (9/6/07)

wally said:


> Just checked my year old POR and saw the following activity.
> 
> View attachment 13095
> View attachment 13096
> ...



That looks odd Wally, as my Mt Hood and Wuertemberger only recently died off.
I think Robs on the right track.


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## ale_snail (9/6/07)

is there anyone in darwin with any spare hop rhizome things? 

i would like to plant some..

cheers


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## Trough Lolly (10/6/07)

G'day Wally,
I'd not count on any shoots this early in the year as being your major cone providers. From the last few years, I found it best to trim them off if they grow runners at this time of the year or, let them grow and wait for the explosion of growth closer to summer - and trim the early runners off. 
If you've had unseasonably warm weather, your plants will try to grow but all you're doing is robbing the rhizome and sub soil roots from gaining nutrients during the dormant period at the expense of early runners that typically don't give much in the way of flowers.
Cheers,
TL


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## Trough Lolly (10/6/07)

ale_snail said:


> is there anyone in darwin with any spare hop rhizome things?
> 
> i would like to plant some..
> 
> cheers



Most aussie references on hops suggest that hops grow best between the 30th and 50th latitudes...but when you think about it, this time of the year in Darwin is probably ideal for them! Let us know how you go.

Cheers,
TL


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## ale_snail (10/6/07)

Trough Lolly said:


> Most aussie references on hops suggest that hops grow best between the 30th and 50th latitudes...but when you think about it, this time of the year in Darwin is probably ideal for them! Let us know how you go.
> 
> Cheers,
> TL



hey yeah ill let ya know.. but i need to find some rhizomes first.

can i buy them online?


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## peas_and_corn (11/6/07)

I'm looking into growing hops, and I'm going through the pdf that was in the 2006(?) thread. Where's the best place to order rhizomes from? Grumpys sell some, and the site say they will send out in a couple months.


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## barls (11/6/07)

i still have to trim mine back from last year as they have only just died off


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (12/6/07)

Chris said:


> That looks odd Wally, as my Mt Hood and Wuertemberger only recently died off.
> I think Robs on the right track.



I may be sounding like a broken record, but my Chinook from last year has not only not died off, its still got hops on it and is still putting out sprays of new flower buds. Weird? 
The nights here over the last week have been down around 10oC.

ATOMT :blink:


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## QldKev (12/6/07)

AngelTearsOnMyTongue said:


> I may be sounding like a broken record, but my Chinook from last year has not only not died off, its still got hops on it and is still putting out sprays of new flower buds. Weird?
> The nights here over the last week have been down around 10oC.
> 
> ATOMT :blink:




Mine are the same still producing cones; up in bundy.


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## Screwtop (12/6/07)

Pretty much the same as Bundy here, the nights have been down to 10C on a couple of occasions, the canes are still green and still in leaf, where the hoppers haven't eaten them off. Going to cut them back today. Have these big mongrel brown hoppers here that eat everything even the palm trees, they hadn't touched the Hops, thought they must not like the taste, but no. They've now developed a taste for them as well, at least they don't eat the cones, YET!


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## Lukes (12/6/07)

wally said:


> Just checked my year old POR and saw the following activity.
> 
> View attachment 13095
> View attachment 13096
> ...



Wally,
They are fine and will go a darker purple colour over winter.
Try to protect them from frost if applicable ( I just chuck a plant pot up side down over it).

As TL said just cut them off if they start to kick in early as you want root growth not shoots.

Here is a pic of my Cluster hops just at the start of last summer and you can see the dead growth from the year before.​


- Luke


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## DarkFaerytale (12/6/07)

peas_and_corn said:


> I'm looking into growing hops, and I'm going through the pdf that was in the 2006(?) thread. Where's the best place to order rhizomes from? Grumpys sell some, and the site say they will send out in a couple months.



i think it might be to late to order rhyzomes from Grumpys, you'd better shoot them an e-mail or better yet give them a call

www.grumpys.com.au

-Phill (no affiliation to Grumpys)


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## Screwtop (12/6/07)

DarkFaerytale said:


> i think it might be to late to order rhyzomes from Grumpys, you'd better shoot them an e-mail or better yet give them a call
> 
> www.grumpys.com.au
> 
> -Phill (no affiliation to Grumpys)




Buy from the source:

Stewart Ferguson
PO Box 173
Scottsdale TAS 7260
PH: 03 6352 7207


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## Cannabaceae (12/6/07)

> Wally wrote: (snipped)
> 
> Does anybody else have their hops shooting at the moment?
> 
> Seems very early considering we are only in the second week of winter:


Definitely greenhouse warming  

Here is a photo taken today of young seed grown female with very long shoots, the declining photoperiod

should slow further growth, but after June 21st...

Also took a photo of my Chinook cutting which gave me a tiny late harvest today  

Rupert.


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## QldKev (13/6/07)

Since a couple of plants have refused to stop growing from last season, would it be worth cutting them back to ground to encourage a new growth for this season, of just let them reshoot from the existing folage?

QldKev


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## chris.peile (13/6/07)

Great to see the growth you are all getting - I'm damn jealous...  By the way - I ordered some hops rhysomes from grumpys about a month ago - should they be arriving yet?! 

But maybe there is no rush.. after all I am in cold Melbourne at present (15 degrees max today!!) h34r:


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## DarkFaerytale (13/6/07)

Mmmmm... beer said:


> Great to see the growth you are all getting - I'm damn jealous...  By the way - I ordered some hops rhysomes from grumpys about a month ago - should they be arriving yet?!
> 
> But maybe there is no rush.. after all I am in cold Melbourne at present (15 degrees max today!!) h34r:




and your reply from the Grumpy's website



> Just a gentle reminder that we will be closing off orders for rhizomes on Friday 1st June. We will then forward everyone's details down to our grower in Tasmania and he will be sending out the orders directly to you in mid to late July.
> 
> Happy growing!



so we should be getting them by the end of next month

-Phill


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## chris.peile (13/6/07)

DarkFaerytale said:


> so we should be getting them by the end of next month
> 
> -Phill




Awesome - thanks for that. Much appreciated, and I can't wait to have my very own hops plants growing out the back!


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## DarkFaerytale (13/6/07)

same goes, i'v already cleared a space out for my willamet. 

-Phill


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## peas_and_corn (13/6/07)

Just a gentle reminder that we will be closing off orders for rhizomes on Friday 1st June. We will then forward everyone's details down to our grower in Tasmania and he will be sending out the orders directly to you in mid to late July.

Happy growing!



Shit!


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## wabster (14/6/07)

OK Given we have the details of the grower in Tassie can anyone help me with the appropriate breed of hops to try to grow here in southern Sydney? 

Does he offer different varieties to anyone's knowledge? 

Has anyone grown any type with success here in or around Sydney?

I have only just returned to brewing after a long break and figure if I can get some hops in the right place in my yard it will give me greater options as time goes by, Thanks for any tolerant help, Cheerz Wab.


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## peas_and_corn (25/6/07)

Hmm... I rang the number of the bloke in Tassie over a week ago and he hasn't rung back <_< so does anyone in SA have any rhizomes I can steal?


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## Josh (27/6/07)

Screwtop said:


> Buy from the source:
> 
> Stewart Ferguson
> PO Box 173
> ...


I got a reply from Stewart that he has sold out of this years stock. 

Bugger!

If anyone has POR or noble hops rhizomes available I'd be prepared to pay market value. Am in Western Sydney if that helps.


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## peas_and_corn (29/6/07)

Ahh, that explains his lack of a reply!

D'oh!!


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## fw00r (29/6/07)

Likewise, I am down in Tassie... but if Stewart Ferguson is out of stock then I am not seeing much hope in getting any planted this season. =( =(


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (10/7/07)

QldKev said:


> Since a couple of plants have refused to stop growing from last season, would it be worth cutting them back to ground to encourage a new growth for this season, of just let them reshoot from the existing folage?
> 
> QldKev




I am bumping this question back up as i am seeking an answer to the same.

It is now full winter and yet my Chinook is not only still covered in Leaves, it is still producing new hop cones (albeit a dribble). Do I cut back anyway or just let it go through to the next season?

Anybody?

ATOMT.


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## Steve (10/7/07)

AngelTearsOnMyTongue said:


> I am bumping this question back up as i am seeking an answer to the same.
> 
> It is now full winter and yet my Chinook is not only still covered in Leaves, it is still producing new hop cones (albeit a dribble). Do I cut back anyway or just let it go through to the next season?
> 
> ...




Id probably cut it back ATOMT....let the rhizome have a rest for a few months. Give it some food (compost) and i'll bet it'll come back bigger and better...which after looking at your pics I hope you have new plans for a bigger trellis.
Cheers
Steve


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (10/7/07)

Steve said:


> Id probably cut it back ATOMT....let the rhizome have a rest for a few months. Give it some food (compost) and i'll bet it'll come back bigger and better...which after looking at your pics I hope you have new plans for a bigger trellis.
> Cheers
> Steve




Thanks steve. I will do that then.

Thankfully I have a huge wall to spread it over......and a fence if I need to.

I never did get onto the Tassy supplier re the male plant and looks like Ive missed the boat now.

cheers

ATOMT


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## huisbrouwen (10/7/07)

AngelTearsOnMyTongue said:


> I may be sounding like a broken record, but my Chinook from last year has not only not died off, its still got hops on it and is still putting out sprays of new flower buds. Weird?
> The nights here over the last week have been down around 10oC.
> 
> ATOMT :blink:



Hey ATOMT, can I enquire where you get you rhizimes from? I'm keen to buy some and whack 'em in the ground while there's still time. Is there anywhere in MELBOURNE that sells them? Any help gratefully recieved.
G


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (10/7/07)

huisbrowen said:


> Hey ATOMT, can I enquire where you get you rhizimes from? I'm keen to buy some and whack 'em in the ground while there's still time. Is there anywhere in MELBOURNE that sells them? Any help gratefully recieved.
> G



Unfortunately for you and me, I got these from the Tassy supplier previously mentioned in this thread. As you may also have read he is already out of stock, so unfortunately i am not much help there.

Note of interest. I didnt order mine last year until August and he still had supplies. Either he has a scant supply this year or there are a lot more people ordering now. I would say by the number of enquiries on this thread that "hobby hoppist" is really a booming past time now.

Now if only I had a few acres to cultivate my own barley.........


ATOMT


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## huisbrouwen (10/7/07)

AngelTearsOnMyTongue said:


> Unfortunately for you and me, I got these from the Tassy supplier previously mentioned in this thread. As you may also have read he is already out of stock, so unfortunately i am not much help there.
> 
> Note of interest. I didnt order mine last year until August and he still had supplies. Either he has a scant supply this year or there are a lot more people ordering now. I would say by the number of enquiries on this thread that "hobby hoppist" is really a booming past time now.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that, I might have to wait until next year.
G


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## barls (15/7/07)

well i finally got my trellis made and this is what i ended up with. now all i have to do is wait for the the shoots to come up


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## wabster (15/7/07)

Wow Barls quite the setup there. I have some POR rhizome headed this way next weekend and plan to put them down near my back fence, where they will gets lots of sun especially during winter. 

I will make a trellis from the trunk of a large banksia and a fence post and put some running lines up to them in a similar way to you, but my setup won't be near as orderly as yours  

How many sorts/rhizomes have you planted, and when? Cheerz Wab


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## barls (15/7/07)

this is my 2nd attempt so we will see how it goes
ive got 3 in total, 1 halletau 1 mt hood and 1 wurtenburger all in there 2nd year but the first in the ground


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## sinkas (17/7/07)

SHould I get rid of what is possibly a Male vine, (goldings) I beleive some UK brewers actually use th Male flwoers, but will it affect the rest of my vines, if they aver bloody produce a flower?


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## Steve (17/7/07)

sinkas said:


> SHould I get rid of what is possibly a Male vine, (goldings) I beleive some UK brewers actually use th Male flwoers, but will it affect the rest of my vines, if they aver bloody produce a flower?




what makes you think its a male plant sinkas? Maybe ATMOT could post a pic of his male plant that he had to compare? It was covered in hundreds of little white fluffy looking buds.
Cheers
Steve


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## sinkas (17/7/07)

Mine just had one small branch of off small flowers, not hanging cones...


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (17/7/07)

sinkas said:


> Mine just had one small branch of off small flowers, not hanging cones...




Hi Sinkas. I am not sure if this Link  will take you to the page in last years thread where I included photos of my male plant. If not, it is Page 16 of "2006 Hop Plantations"

BTW, I didnt use the flowers from the male.

ATOMT


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## Cannabaceae (17/7/07)

sinkas said:


> Mine just had one small branch of off small flowers, not hanging cones...



If the small 'flowers' looked like this they were burrs from which the female cones develop:







Mature male flowers especially when shaken produce clouds of pollen:






(Maybe its another male plant from the same Tassy supplier where ATOMT got his 'Mt Hood' male) ??

As to "...will it affect the rest of my vines" ...yes it will make them bigger! 
Check out the picture in the paragraph titled "Seeded vs Seedless hops" here: (scroll down about a third)
Seeded vs Seedless hops.
There are lots of wild hops growing all over the UK so you could find seeds in their diploid hops,
they don't like them because I think they jam up the picking machines. 
Male hops are illegal over certain areas of Europe.


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## sinkas (17/7/07)

Hi all,
Well in examining those photos, mine is definitely Male, but on review of that article, Ill just leve it in place, its the strongest plant I have and looks like it would be a PITA to dig out now anyway.


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## Screwtop (24/7/07)

For those growing Wurtemberger, finally some information, courtesy of Alexbrand in Germany.





> Hi!
> 
> Short info, what my german brewing colleagues found out:
> 
> ...



And from a query to Hopco:



> The Wurtemberger that you purchased from Stewart was imported from Germany in the late 80’s. It was sent to us as a variety that may be of interest and that might grow well in Australia. I do not have any information in my system on this variety any more. For further information you might try Joh Barth & Sohn in Germany. You might also find the spelling WURTTEMBERGER will give you more information.
> 
> John Ross




Certainly works well as a flavour/aroma hop using fresh flowers.


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## Fents (25/7/07)

BUMP - Gonna plant my hops today....can someone tell me if this is right? Just gonna plant em in pots for now till i landscape my garden.,,

Going to Bunnings to buy 20litre + maybe bigger pots, with some quality potting mix...well draining of course.....

Fill pots half with potting mix, make a bit of a hole throw the hop root thingo in and fill up rest of pot with soil? how much "hop" has to be sticking out?

Should i mound the soil around the base of the plant or leave the soil flat in a pot?

help greatly apprciated.


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## Steve (25/7/07)

Fents said:


> BUMP - Gonna plant my hops today....can someone tell me if this is right? Just gonna plant em in pots for now till i landscape my garden.,,
> 
> Going to Bunnings to buy 20litre + maybe bigger pots, with some quality potting mix...well draining of course.....
> 
> ...



Instructions for Growing Hops (Humulus Lupus) 

Hops are a perennial climbing plant, they are incredibly hardy and aside from the brewing benefits, make an attractive ornamental plant. They can be grown on a trellis or a pergola in full sun and need to grow from east to west. It is supplied to you as a rhizome or rootstock. 

If you are not ready to plant your rhizomes, keep them refrigerated (not the freezer) in a plastic bag in the vegetable crisper. Try to plant them by no later than September the 1st. 

A very manageable hop plant will be trained to grow vertically to 1.5-2 metres then 3-5 metres horizontally. This will make the training of the bine and harvesting safe and easy. 

Generally, they are grown in latitudes where the days are long enough for them to successfully go through their growing cycle, hence the major hop growing regions of the world lie between the 35th and 55th parallels. 

However, hops have been grown successfully in the south of W.A., in the Adelaide Hills, and NSW. We also know of brewers with successful yet small yielding crops in Qld. 
Commercially they are grown in Victoria and Tasmania. 

The rhizome should be transplanted into well-mulched soil either in a pot (bigger than 20 litre and only for the first year) or the ground in a sunny position and a northern aspect. 
Plant the rhizome vertically with the buds pointing upwards or horizontally if you cant tell. 
Either way keep them under 2-3 cms of soil. 
If you are planting more than one rhizome then space them 2 metres apart. 

Ensure that there is a spot where you can tie several pieces of household string or baling twine from the pot up to a trellis or high post so that it can climb. Under ideal conditions it can grow up to 250mm per day, usually they manage 500-600mm in a week. 

The rhizome will produce shoots during spring which, once long enough, must be trained to follow the string. No more than 2-3 bines at a time per string. Wind the shoots in a CLOCKWISE direction (looking from the top) around the string otherwise it will not climb effectively. 

Once there are sufficient bines growing upward, any new growth should be pinched off to promote bine growth. 

Whilst growing, the plant should be thoroughly watered every 7 days (every 2nd day in >35C weather) with high nitrogen fertiliser added once a month. 

Flowers (cones) will develop on the lateral side-arms and try to keep these from tangling. Maturity will be reached between March and April. Commence harvesting once the cones feel paper dry and the tips start to turn brown. 2-3 harvestings are normal, this ensures that you are harvesting the whole crop at its peak. 

Cones can be dried on fly screen wire in the sun for two or three days or in a cool oven in a few hours until they are fluffy and light. Afterwards they should be packed airtight in freezer bags or jars and kept in the freezer. 

IMPORTANT: Once the plant has reached maximum height and laterals have started to grow the bottom metre or so of each bine MUST be stripped from the plant to avoid the growth of various soil borne fungi and to ensure good air circulation at the base of the plant. 

Once the hops have been picked, the bines can be cut off at ground level and disposed of. In the following spring the process will start all over again, hopefully youll have used up the previous years harvest!


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## Fents (25/7/07)

Thanks heaps steve i would of planted them with there buds in the soil for sure! glad i didnt.


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## Steve (25/7/07)

Fents said:


> Thanks heaps steve i would of planted them with there buds in the soil for sure! glad i didnt.




it'd prolly still grow....cant kill em with a stick


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## brendanos (12/8/07)

Just planted a Tettnanger and a Columbus in a brand new hop garden I dug out on the west side of the shed out the back. It gets plenty of afternoon sun, and is probably the only practical space I had to grow them. I planted them in a mixture of compost, mulch, chook poo and soil, hopefully I haven't over-fertilised them.

Will post some photos when/if they pop up.


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## Maeldric (13/8/07)

After a week in the soil i have seen some activity all ready, here are some pics of my columbus and tettnanger.




- Columbus




- Tettnanger


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## Steve (13/8/07)

Maeldric said:


> After a week in the soil i have seen some activity all ready, here are some pics of my columbus and tettnanger.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




yum.....give them a few more inches and chop them off, saute in frying pan with butter and eat on crackers....same as asparagus. Its quite common apprently but ive never done it.
Cheers
Steve


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## Ross (13/8/07)

A few days of warmer weather & my little beauty has sprouted  





cheers Ross


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## Plastic Man (16/8/07)

Brought some Goldings and Columbos from Rupert which will go in the ground this weekend. Yippeee. Can someone who has grown hops for a season please clarify which way they grow around the twine.

The US sites say clockwise so my thinking is that it should be counter clockwise in the southern hemisphere. But the instructions on the grumpys site and some of the advise above says clockwise (???). There is a good article on the Oz crafterbrewer site that says counter clockwise.

If the hops follow the sun during the day, then it seems logical that they will grow around the twine counter clockwise as they follow the sun during the day - based on looking down the twine.

Any help appreciated.

richard.


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## Steve (16/8/07)

Mine have been very happy going clockwise for three years


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## leeboy (16/8/07)

My hops have been in the ground for 2 weeks now and already making great progress. my trellis was obtained from bunnings. Was wondering just how i was going to build one. With so many different setups around was having trouble finding which one to go with until I found a bamboo extendable one. Really cheap ($20) and functional. just gotta get the hops to 8cm then they can climb.


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## Plastic Man (16/8/07)

Steve

Thanks. Maybe either way is OK.

I've got two so might try one, one way and one the other and see what happens.

ta - richard.


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## drsmurto (16/8/07)

mine have been in the ground for nearly 3 weeks and nada. Too bloody cold still and have had some scary frosts. Took a bucket of luke warm water to get my windscreen wipers to move yesterday. Place looked like it has snowed. Hoping they are working hard underground getting their root systems going........ :unsure:


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## Fatgodzilla (16/8/07)

Rupert's rhizones have arrived and will be planted this weekend. Read a bit about what I am trying to do. But since I've been recognised as a gardener capable of killing wallpaper flowers,we'll see what happens, shall we ??


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## sqyre (16/8/07)

I was i one of the lucky lads to get some of Ruperts rhizomes...

Here is the "Victoria" he sent...going sweet!! :super: 




and a little cluster...(if my memory serves me)






And here is last years... unfortunatly it fired up a bit early with a nice bunch of buds but i think it got hit with a second dose of frost which killed it back to this again..




anyone had that before?? i'm a bit worried the little fella wont make it now.. :unsure: 

Sqyre...


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## Keifer (16/8/07)

wow, that victoria's pumpin!

I read somwhere that the frost you need to be careful of is the -20c kind. My POR and Tettnanger rose to about a meter last year before completely dying off. Not sure why, but im not too worried coz they grow like weeds apparently.


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## drsmurto (17/8/07)

You northerners should be banned from posting pics of anything growing at this time of the year, its making me feel far too inadequate  even the weeds are doing it tough at my place.


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## fraser_john (18/8/07)

DrSmurto said:


> You northerners should be banned from posting pics of anything growing at this time of the year, its making me feel far too inadequate  even the weeds are doing it tough at my place.



Yeah, but....we can brew lagers in our sheds in winter without the use of refrigeration :super: 

Anyway...put the trellis up and planted the POR and Goldings.......the plants are under the little wire cages at the base of the two right posts, keep the rabbits off! I'll be getting some tettanang from Cannabacae (.sp?) when he digs them up. Then I'll be hunting for some cascade :lol:


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## Maeldric (20/8/07)

Only one week since the last pics and wow these little guys are going full steam ahead!




- Tettnanger




- Columbus

And my hersbrucker has decided to show his head now too


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## wabster (21/8/07)

My POR courtesy of Johnno have been in the outdoor pot just on 2 weeks, with one weekend of mid 20s temps and last weekend 80-100ml of rain, so they have had a variety of climates :beerbang: 

I'll see how these go this year and maybe try more varieties via Rupert next season, Cheerz Wab.


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## Steve (21/8/07)

It is interesting to see the difference in growth from plants from Newcastle upwards compared to down here....just a couple of tiny shoots starting appear on my 3 year old POR.
Cheers
Steve


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## Lukes (27/8/07)

With the fine day's we had down here over the weekend my hops have sprouted.
Anyone else's down south showing signs of life?
I will get some pic's during the week for this thread.
I think they should be safe from any more frost's but I do live in Melbourne  .
It look's like I will be hiding in the garden setting up some trellis
and not hiding in the brew shed this coming weekend.

- Luke


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## barls (27/8/07)

i think this is one of mine but not sure will let it grow a bit more then make the call


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## Steve (27/8/07)

Nah......that looks like ivy.....prolly sprouted from bird poo.
Cheers
Steve


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## barls (27/8/07)

ill give it a week and then have another look if its not then ill piss it off


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## Wasabi (27/8/07)

Lukes said:


> Anyone else's down south showing signs of life?



My Tettnagers have both popped their heads out of the ground, the first one came up about 2 weeks back, the second this weekend.

Luckily as I'm in the middle of a move they are both still in plant pots, and safely stored in the shade house, otherwise I think the evil Ballarat frosts over the past few weeks would have surely destroyed them.

The Hallertaus are still safely under the soil, biding their time.


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## braufrau (27/8/07)

I was visiting the local biodynamic farm for international kitchen gardeners day yesterday
and the lady there told me that only POR will grow in the hills.

I hope she's wrong about that!

I think she prolly is.


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## brendanos (27/8/07)

Which hills are we talking about?

My tettnanger have sprouted (the first two sprouts were ravaged, i presume, by snails) to about 2 inches above ground, but my columbus are still loitering. They're not getting much sun yet, but have had a slow steady stream of rain over the last week or so since planting two weeks ago.

Whenever I hear a weather report/forecast, or whenever it rains, all I seem to consider is how it will affect my hop plants. They are currently, after all, the closest thing to children I have.


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## johnno (27/8/07)

wabster said:


> My POR courtesy of Johnno have been in the outdoor pot just on 2 weeks, with one weekend of mid 20s temps and last weekend 80-100ml of rain, so they have had a variety of climates :beerbang:
> 
> I'll see how these go this year and maybe try more varieties via Rupert next season, Cheerz Wab.
> 
> View attachment 14433




Hey that is awesome wabster. Good to see you got them there ok.

That is what we want to see. The progress of the babies  

cheers
johnno


----------



## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (28/8/07)

Last weekend was a cracker! I finally got the time and the weather together and got stuck into the gardening. First up I cut back my Veggie garden and my hops which still had leaves on them. I was a little surprised at what I found.

1stly, My Mt Hood (The Male).




Not only are they already well shooting, but note the extensive rhizomes. These were planted a year ago and the rhizomes were absolutely all over the place. This one is being pulled out in about ten minutes from now and going over to WA to Rupert tomorrow.

2ndly My Chinook.




Again a year old. Nice shoots starting and plenty of Rhizomes. Some of the rhizomes are around an inch in diameter and again are all over the place.

Today these are even longer as we just had a 25oC day after a weekend around 19oC.



Happy hopping folks.


----------



## Lukes (28/8/07)

braufrau said:


> I was visiting the local biodynamic farm for international kitchen gardeners day yesterday
> and the lady there told me that only POR will grow in the hills.
> I hope she's wrong about that!
> I think she prolly is.



Braufrau,

When established P.O.R. grows like a weed  
Check out last years hop thread as Johnno's P.O.R. was grown in the inner Melbourne suburbs, he dug it out and shared it with the AHB crew and now it has spread all over the country.
The people that moved into his old place will have any rhizomes left lifting the concrete in a few years :lol: .
The only things that may kill them is lack of water, frost, mildew, roundup or a shovel.
BTW: the original P.O.R farm in Ringwood was not in the hills but in a bit of a valley.

- Luke


----------



## sqyre (28/8/07)

Got a Question for the Horticulturusts'ss... :blink: 

I am going to re-pot my Victoria soon as it looks like it going get to big for its home..

I want to know if its possible to chop it in half and get 2 seperate plants???

i relize it was chopped up as a died back rhisome but can it be done when its happily growing and whats the trick to do it?



Thanks in advance..

Sqyre...


----------



## braufrau (28/8/07)

brendanos said:


> Which hills are we talking about?



Adelaide.


----------



## Maeldric (4/9/07)

5 weeks after planting and my hops are going great guns. Put them all into larger pots on sunday which should suffice. 




Tettnanger




Hersbrucker




columbus

Only one small problem though. A stupid possum bit the top off one of the Columbus bines (spat it straight back out so hopefully that will be a one off) and now that bine has stopped growing. Only thing is now at each place there are leaves, side bines are coming out. Its only 4 foot tall so far and i want it much higher  will it continue to grow or will it just spread sideways now? Should i cut off the offshoots or try train them to climb upwards?




sideshoots.

Cheers in advance guys


----------



## barls (4/9/07)

just an update it wasnt a hop the hop plant came up a foot to the right so i ditched what ever it was


----------



## braufrau (4/9/07)

Lukes said:


> Braufrau,
> 
> When established P.O.R. grows like a weed
> - Luke



The reason I was worried that the biodynamic lady was right about POR being the only
thing that would grow in the hills, is I have cluster and goldings! :blink: 

But surely she can't be right! The hills are like parts of Tassie and hops grow in Tassie!
And more temperate than England and that's where Goldings come from.

I hope she's wrong. I've got an ESB all planned out! 

"Climate The hop plant produces best under specific climatic and soil conditions. A minimum of 120 frost free days are needed for flowering. Direct sunlight and long daylength (15 hours or more) is also needed. As a consequence of daylength and season length, hop production is limited to latitudes between 35 and 55 degrees. The hop plant requires ample moisture in the spring followed by warm summer weather. In dry climates the hop plant will produce best if supplemental irrigation is provided. Soil and Plant Nutrition A deep well drained, sandy loam soil is best. Soils with a pH of 6 to 7.5 is ideal for hop production."

So we just sneak in on the lattitude. Quite sure we have at least 6 months frost free and we have acid soils. Warm summer weather depends on your definition I guess.


----------



## Lukes (5/9/07)

sqyre,
My understanding is that the should only be split while dormant so best to wait till next winter.



Maeldric said:


> Only one small problem though. A stupid possum bit the top off one of the Columbus bines (spat it straight back out so hopefully that will be a one off) and now that bine has stopped growing. Only thing is now at each place there are leaves, side bines are coming out. Its only 4 foot tall so far and i want it much higher  will it continue to grow or will it just spread sideways now? Should i cut off the offshoots or try train them to climb upwards?ots.
> Cheers in advance guys


Maeldric,
It will split and grow both ways now that the tip is gone so you now have 2 main bines  .
I would only cut off the real low shoots that don't shoot up, to protect it against mould and mildew.
I too had the possums eating the tips as they grew up to the top of the fence and a wild rabbit come into the back yard and have a bit of a munch. The rabbit was not healthy for a day or so and just sat under a bush in the backyard like it was a pet, the hopped up possums drove the dogs mad.


Braufrau,
I can vouch that she is wrong. First year you don't get allot of hops but usually enough to use for late editions. Having said that some of the pics in the thread prove me wrong.  
Here is a pic from this years cluster pick back in March.
The plant is in it's 3rd year and I got 2 of these frames full of flowers for a harvest ale.






Luke


----------



## jendres (5/9/07)

Does any one have a definitive answer on the clockwise/anti-clockwise winding in the southern hemisphere? I read in Charlie Papazian's Complete Joy of Homebrewing he says that it tracks the sun across the sky and that would mean anti-clockwise in the southern hemisphere.

Any horticulturists here?

Mine hasn't sprouted yet, but I want to be prepared.


----------



## Keifer (5/9/07)

My columbus jumped up to the wire by itself and wrapped itself clockwise looking downward around it.


----------



## jendres (5/9/07)

Thanks. 

I found something about vines and their winding direction here and here.

It looks like it is species specific with most climbers showing right-handed growth. Interesting stuff!


----------



## braufrau (5/9/07)

Lukes said:


> Braufrau,
> I can vouch that she is wrong. First year you don't get allot of hops but usually enough to use for late editions. Having said that some of the pics in the thread prove me wrong.
> Here is a pic from this years cluster pick back in March.
> The plant is in it's 3rd year and I got 2 of these frames full of flowers for a harvest ale.
> Luke



oooohhh ... how exciting! Can't wait!


----------



## drsmurto (5/9/07)

Braufrau - i have cluster, chinook and goldings in my backyard (Mt Torrens) and am still getting frosts at least once a week so nothing has happened above ground as yet. Most people have told me that hops are like weeds, you are doing well to kill them and they grow best if ignored. Once they do poke their heads above ground i will be caring for them with the same loving attention i give my chillies. I am still confident that they will grow - like you said, if they grow in Tassie they can grow in the the Adelaide hills. The Grumpys crew have successfully grown hops.


----------



## braufrau (5/9/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Braufrau - i have cluster, chinook and goldings in my backyard (Mt Torrens) and am still getting frosts at least once a week so nothing has happened above ground as yet. Most people have told me that hops are like weeds, you are doing well to kill them and they grow best if ignored. Once they do poke their heads above ground i will be caring for them with the same loving attention i give my chillies. I am still confident that they will grow - like you said, if they grow in Tassie they can grow in the the Adelaide hills. The Grumpys crew have successfully grown hops.




i know ... I'm being silly.
Most of the fruit trees still don't have leaves. The glory vine is juuust starting to show green so why should I expect hop bines??

Now if everyone in QLD would stop showing off I could stop panicking and concentrate on finding seed potatoes which are turning out to be hard to find unless you want bright purple taties!


----------



## drsmurto (5/9/07)

braufrau said:


> i know ... I'm being silly.
> Most of the fruit trees still don't have leaves. The glory vine is juuust starting to show green so why should I expect hop bines??
> 
> Now if everyone in QLD would stop showing off I could stop panicking and concentrate on finding seed potatoes which are turning out to be hard to find unless you want bright purple taties!



OT but these people sell seed potatoes and i recently bought a mini green/glasshouse from them so that i could get my chillies/tomatoes etc a headstart so they are ready to plant once the frosts are over. Quick delivery and really helpful on the phone.

Linky

Cheers
DrSmurto
p.s. i have asked the cheeky northerners to stop showing off with their hop plants growing but they seem to enjoy tormenting us. :angry:


----------



## Lukes (6/9/07)

Just starting to get a few shoots and leaves on this one.






And this one is almost ready to start climbing.





Hope I can water them this summer ?

- Luke


----------



## barls (6/9/07)

my mount hood and halleteua have come up waiting on the wurtenburger now


----------



## Hashie (6/9/07)

Thought I'd better get some pics of this years growth.



This is my Hallertau as of this morning.



This is my Wurtemburger.

Still waitng for the Mt. Hood to come up.


----------



## jimmyjack (8/9/07)

Colombus. Seems to be growing fine in the pot. I will have to get some twine soon and attach it to my gutter.





Cheers, JJ


----------



## braufrau (8/9/07)

Hashie said:


> Thought I'd better get some pics of this years growth.



Aaaaggghhh! Now the southerner's are showing off!

I'm sooo inadequate!


----------



## Fents (8/9/07)

Lukes said:


> Just starting to get a few shoots and leaves on this one.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thats exactly what my little buds look like sticking out of the soil. Except they just wont shoot been like that since i planted them, so now i've covered them up with soil....mine are at soil height tho i dont have massive branch's like that..


----------



## Jazzafish (8/9/07)

Mine were a bit late into the pot... but they'll be ok :beer:


----------



## drsmurto (12/9/07)

Sorry Braufrau but my Cluster has finally come to life - the goldings and chinook are still asleep on the job tho....


----------



## braufrau (12/9/07)

oh dear .. why am I thinking I may have planted them upside down?

:unsure:


----------



## rich_4646 (12/9/07)

Just wondering if it's possible to import rhizomes from the U.S.A.

How would AQIS react?


----------



## domonsura (12/9/07)

Don't know Rich , you'd have to ring them and ask. I doubt you'd get them through though.
Braufrau, don't worry, you wont be last of the blocks, I haven't even received my rhizomes yet.


----------



## kabooby (12/9/07)

rich_4646 said:


> Just wondering if it's possible to import rhizomes from the U.S.A.
> 
> How would AQIS react?



Could always just ring and ask

Kabooby


----------



## braufrau (12/9/07)

rich_4646 said:


> Just wondering if it's possible to import rhizomes from the U.S.A.
> 
> How would AQIS react?



You should ring them.
It looks like it would cost $100 + $17 / rhizome.
link

But here is the application form ...
http://www.daff.gov.au/aqis/import/applica...t-seeds-nursery

I think you might be able to import tissue culture more easily but getting the tissue
culture from an approved lab would probably be costly.


----------



## T.D. (12/9/07)

braufrau said:


> i know ... I'm being silly.
> Most of the fruit trees still don't have leaves. The glory vine is juuust starting to show green so why should I expect hop bines??
> 
> Now if everyone in QLD would stop showing off I could stop panicking and concentrate on finding seed potatoes which are turning out to be hard to find unless you want bright purple taties!



I wouldn't worry Braufrau, my hops are in the Hunter Valley and so far my EKG has not fired yet. I have very small shoots on the other varieties but nothing like the growth in the pics above. I am currently putting a new irrigation system in and will be planting them in the ground very soon which should make them go well. This will be the 2nd year and I'm hoping to get more than the 6 Cascade flowers I got in their first year!


----------



## KillerRx4 (12/9/07)

T.D. said:


> I wouldn't worry Braufrau, my hops are in the Hunter Valley and so far my EKG has not fired yet. I have very small shoots on the other varieties but nothing like the growth in the pics above. I am currently putting a new irrigation system in and will be planting them in the ground very soon which should make them go well. This will be the 2nd year and I'm hoping to get more than the 6 Cascade flowers I got in their first year!



T.D., You have a cascade? I didnt think we had them growing here since I havent seen it offered as a rhizome.

What are the chances of scoring some cuttings when its gets up & going?


----------



## mfdes (12/9/07)

Are you guys aware of nettlehead?

You might learn from my mistake 

Hops that sprout too early when the days are still short can think it's autumn and stop growing altogether, so it's best to trim all early growth till late september / early october. Not all varieties do this and it can be more of a problem the further south you are. It's called nettlehead because they look a bit like nettles when they do it.
In 1995 I planted Tettnang, Hallertau, Goldings, Fuggle, Cascade and Pride of Ringwood here in Hobart and all but POR sprouted too early, grew a few inches, then the internodes (stem between leaf joints) got shorter and they stopped growing. 

Problems with this are two:

In newly planted hops they may not put in enough growth overall in the season (by the time they eventually resprout) to get bigger and yield hops the following year. 
In mature plants they may resprout so late as to start flowering way before they reach the top of the support and you can get little or no crop.

Mine, being recently planted, resprouted in november and stopped growing again in mid Jan when the days started to get significantly shorter. They didn't put on enough size (in the 8 weeks of growth they had) to survive the winter well and I lost several plants. I've since learned my lesson to cut them hard till the time is right and never had the same problem again.

Cheers,

MFS.


----------



## Fents (12/9/07)

^^^ so that means my hops i planted 3 or 4 weeks ago and havnt even sprouted yet are doing what there meant to do?


----------



## Steve (13/9/07)

I was having a scratch around my 3 year old POR last night. Its starting to shoot. I was scraping leaves and twigs away then all of a sudden the earth started moving slowly....on hands and knees with my face inches from the plant I noticed lots of little black maggots. Same shape as maggots, just black and very slow moving. Loads of em writhing around and sticking their heads back in the soil and slowly wriggling their way back into the ground. It was bloody fascinating, my little boy didnt think so he picked up a stick and started beating them (and my plant). I quickly scraped the leaves back on top. Anyone else seen these before?
Cheers
Steve


----------



## leeboy (13/9/07)

Hops are going strong. here is my goldings, climbing about 2-4cm per day depending on how warm it is. Currently about 70cm tall. Go you good thing.


----------



## tangent (13/9/07)

Adelaide Hersbrucker


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## Maeldric (13/9/07)

That could be the making of a beer horror movie steve! Gave me shivers just reading about it. Attack of the killer hop maggots!!


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## mfdes (13/9/07)

tangent said:


> View attachment 14891
> 
> Adelaide Hersbrucker



This is a perfect picture of what nettlehead hops look like. The internodes have got very short, and the leaves have unfurled, which indicates the plant has pretty much stopped growing, rather than putting on 5-20 cm per day as they will when the conditions are right for them to be allowed to sprout.

The reason, I should say, is that most varieties are descended from continental European hops where the spring thaw doesn't happen till much later than in our warm, oceanic climate capital cities.

MFS.


----------



## Quintrex (13/9/07)

mfdes said:


> This is a perfect picture of what nettlehead hops look like. The internodes have got very short, and the leaves have unfurled, which indicates the plant has pretty much stopped growing, rather than putting on 5-20 cm per day as they will when the conditions are right for them to be allowed to sprout.
> 
> The reason, I should say, is that most varieties are descended from continental European hops where the spring thaw doesn't happen till much later than in our warm, oceanic climate capital cities.
> 
> MFS.



So, how do you overcome this, do you just cut back the early growth? If so how and what do you prune?


----------



## Steve (13/9/07)

Quintrex said:


> So, how do you overcome this, do you just cut back the early growth? If so how and what do you prune?




I just leave them


----------



## mfdes (13/9/07)

The recommended way is that you cut all early growth to below the surface till at least late september (after the equinox) at least at this latitude. Will be different where you are a few degrees north but not by much.

Edit: Should also say that counterintuitively, this will not weaken your plants, but strengthen them long term.

MFS


----------



## tangent (13/9/07)

i dunno about stopped growing... wasn't there a week ago!


----------



## drsmurto (13/9/07)

I keep getting told that hops are like weeds - you are hard pressed to kill them.

Would have thought that if this was the case we should RDWHAHB. Or maybe HTFU. 

I wont be doing squat tell the time comes to train them along a trellis. 

And whats the consensus - should we treat them the same as the citrus plants and give them a regular does of urea?


----------



## mfdes (13/9/07)

Once established they're impossible to kill. I've found them growing on hedges in places where no hops have been grown for yonks.
However they are trickiest in the first season... and if you want a crop you should look after them properly.

The text below is from this Link:

"Commercial hop farmers do not train up the first shoots of spring but prune them off mechanically. Hardier shoots are trained onto the string about 4 weeks later (early to mid-May in Oregon). Only 2-3 vines should be trained onto each string with 2 strings per plant. All subsequent vines, which can be extensive with older plants should be cut off. Vines are ready to be trained when they are about 12" long and must be gently wrapped clockwise onto the string without kinking. Once trained, the vine will take care of itself unless you wasnt the vine to grow horizontally, this must be done manually."


----------



## Quintrex (13/9/07)

mfdes said:


> Once established they're impossible to kill. I've found them growing on hedges in places where no hops have been grown for yonks.
> However they are trickiest in the first season... and if you want a crop you should look after them properly.
> 
> The text below is from this Link:
> ...



So if i had a columbus with 3 main shoots, all reasonably developed, but with the tip of the vine still "wrapped up" should I prune them all or just one or two, cos there are no further shoots from the base.


----------



## mfdes (13/9/07)

Quintrex said:


> So if i had a columbus with 3 main shoots, all reasonably developed, but with the tip of the vine still "wrapped up" should I prune them all or just one or two, cos there are no further shoots from the base.



Well, I personally pruned all shoots coming out of mine the moment they reared their ugly head until early October. They will continue to shoot up out of the ground, no worries. 

MFS


----------



## Yeasty (13/9/07)

braufrau said:


> You should ring them.
> It looks like it would cost $100 + $17 / rhizome.
> link
> 
> ...



Imagine though if u got amarillo or the likes in, how u could make your money back on cuttings


----------



## petesbrew (17/9/07)

My Columbus Rhizome, just on two weeks old.
Thanks Duff! :beer: 
Pete


----------



## mika (17/9/07)

Pretty sure it was on a brewing network podcast where a Pro Hop grower recommended against cutting the vines back. Something about the machines used to harvest it all, supposedly not an issue with home grown hops where it's all hand picked. Sorry, my memory gets hazy about 5mins after I listen to something. I believe it was on the Sunday show featuring the hop-union dude.


----------



## oldbugman (17/9/07)

after ~3 weeks in the ground..


----------



## mfdes (17/9/07)

mika_lika said:


> Pretty sure it was on a brewing network podcast where a Pro Hop grower recommended against cutting the vines back. Something about the machines used to harvest it all, supposedly not an issue with home grown hops where it's all hand picked. Sorry, my memory gets hazy about 5mins after I listen to something. I believe it was on the Sunday show featuring the hop-union dude.



There is a difference between cutting the bines back in spring (not a lot of energy has gone into the small shoots), when they'll just grow back, as opposed to autumn, when the plant is in the process of translocating (moving) all its nutrients from the bines to the root system for winter.

Cutting them in autumn (as for modern harvesting) does weaken them significantly. Hence we as home growers have an advantage over commercials.

MFS.


----------



## big d (17/9/07)

Some great feed back guys on hop growing.I scored some hops from Deebee and unfortunately it carked it after a fantastic growth spurt.No pics as we all no what a pot of dirt looks like.

Anyway enough of the hop growth pics how about some mixed feedback on how your beers turned out using homegrown hops.Maybe a new thread is in order.This is what we are really after.

Cheers
Big D


----------



## johnno (17/9/07)

big d said:


> Anyway enough of the hop growth pics how about some mixed feedback on how your beers turned out using homegrown hops.Maybe a new thread is in order.This is what we are really after.
> 
> Cheers
> Big D




Hi Big D,

Bit of a discussion here but some more feedback would be appreciated.

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...?showtopic=5173

cheers
johnno


----------



## big d (17/9/07)

Cheers Johnno
A good read and yep a few more replys would be great.Good to see a placing was the result with the home grown as well.

Cheers
Big D


----------



## randyrob (19/9/07)

Hey Guys,

well me hops have sprouted this year already, they sure are looking alot healthier and greener than last year!






Rob.


----------



## floppinab (19/9/07)

OldBugman said:


> after ~3 weeks in the ground..



Good to see yours are OK OB, I'm seeing shoots on mine after only 1.5 weeks in the ground. But I'm in a bit of a quandry looking at the advice from MFS on whether to cut back the new shoots or not. The "don't **** with whats working" gene in me says don't touch it so I'm not sure what to do.


----------



## domonsura (19/9/07)

floppinab said:


> Good to see yours are OK OB, I'm seeing shoots on mine after only 1.5 weeks in the ground. But I'm in a bit of a quandry looking at the advice from MFS on whether to cut back the new shoots or not. The "don't **** with whats working" gene in me says don't touch it so I'm not sure what to do.



After putting my first rhizome in the ground a couple of days ago, I've been wondering the same thing - but what sticks in my mind is the fact that some of the guys on here aren't newcomers to growing hops and if it was _really_ necessary to cut them back surely there would be more people doing it? Especially when everything I read about 'nettlehead' in my limited research on the subject suggests that nettlehead is in fact a _disease_ that humulus lupus can suffer from as a result of having been infected with Arabis Mosaic Virus, and has absolutely nothing at all to do with early growth.
Maybe that's just the cynic in me. But I wouldn't be cutting anything back 'try' to prevent it. In fact if the problem that mdfes is talking about shows it's ugly head in your hop garden, I'd be making sure they aren't diseased..... 

Source one
Source 2
Source 3
Source 4


----------



## Fents (19/9/07)

ZOMG i think my hops are sprouting :blink:

Little purple shoots coming up!


----------



## Thommo (19/9/07)

Just poked my head out the back, my neglected hops from last year are poking through. Second year in the ground. Didn't get any hops last year but probably didn't give them the most favourable conditions.

Hopefully will have a good crop this year.

Cheers,
Thommo.


----------



## Steve (19/9/07)

I dont cut mine back.....I let all the bines climb. Last year I did think about cutting them back so there are only 3 or 4 main bines - apparently this produces more flowers and is what the commercial growers do. But I didnt bother. Its just personal choice. My plant always has the nettle appearance to the leaves when they first sprout and by looking at all the pics so does everyone. They all still grow and produce hop flowers....
Cheers
Steve


----------



## mfdes (19/9/07)

Just looked up stuff about nettlehead, and indeed it is the name for a viral disease. The person who taught me (from Hop Products Australia Bushy Park Estates) always called the stunting caused by early sprouting nettlehead.

Perhaps it's a problem in Tassie and not in mainland latitudes.

But come on, some of you out there have grown them for several years. Did anyone else experience stunted first year growth: bines grow 20-30 cm in September then stop, and might perk up a bit again in December... no crop. For me Goldings, Hallertauer mittlefrueh and Tettnang were especially prone to this.

Properly grown hops will normally send 2-3 bines up a trellis and climb up at least 3m in the first year, as well as send out a few flowers. This is what mine do when cut back till mid October, and what POR often does being the weed that it is 

In the right climate and latitude (Yakima valley), 1st year properly treated plants give a commercial crop.

MFS.


----------



## Maeldric (20/9/07)

Been a few weeks since my last post so thought id show my babies progress 




Columbus (over 8' tall now)




Tettnanger, just got to the top of the steak yesterday so gonna put in a mesh trallis like i had for the columbus up to my balcony.




Hersbrucker, finally starting to grow


----------



## Hashie (20/9/07)

mfdes said:


> Just looked up stuff about nettlehead, and indeed it is the name for a viral disease. The person who taught me (from Hop Products Australia Bushy Park Estates) always called the stunting caused by early sprouting nettlehead.
> 
> Perhaps it's a problem in Tassie and not in mainland latitudes.
> 
> ...



MFS, My Hallertauer came up early last year, grew ~400 mm then stopped for a month before shooting to ~4 metres. It was its first year in the ground and yes we had an early start to spring followed by a cold snap. All 3 plants went on to produce cones, Wurttemburger producing 250 grams, Hallertauer 130 grams and Mt Hood only a handfull.

Already this season my Hallertauer is ~1.8 metres tall with the Wurttembuger close behind (Mt Hood is just poking its head up). I haven't cut or pruned any early shoots, this year or last.

Is this the sort of information you're looking for?


----------



## mfdes (20/9/07)

Definetly.
Mine had stopped growing altogether and new growth came later out of the ground. The stalled bines never resumed growth.

Did your Hallertau resume growing after it had stopped, or was the new growth from below ground? 

The reason I ask is that textbooks tell you the new growth will come out from below ground (mine did) and it may take too long to resprout for the plants to put on enough growth to flower. It may be very much a local microclimate thing as it sounds as though most people haven't had this problem before. 

I'm in Woodbridge (south of Hobart) and I think our soil warms up quite early, stimulating the plants to shoot out of the ground at a time when daylength is telling the plants they should be dormant. The further south you go the more extreme are the daylength differences between summer and winter, and so the more this problem might show itself.

On a tangent, all you read pretty much says forget about getting hops to flower below parallel 35. Any of you Queenslanders care to comment? I know that it may be crap as India and Zimbabwe have both had commercial hop farms in the past.

MFS.


----------



## barls (20/9/07)

here are my two plants that are up still waiting on the 3rd to come up, but it has shoots coming up.
here is the mt hood




here is the hallertau




also i know the garden does need a weed before anyone mentions it


----------



## tangent (20/9/07)

> the garden does need a weed


no it's cool, you've got a few already


----------



## Hashie (20/9/07)

mfdes said:


> Definetly.
> Mine had stopped growing altogether and new growth came later out of the ground. The stalled bines never resumed growth.
> 
> Did your Hallertau resume growing after it had stopped, or was the new growth from below ground?
> ...




The new growth was from the ground. The early shoot shrivelled and died. Also, the new growth was 4-6 weeks behind the other 2 plants. Definitely made a difference, but still produced a small crop of cones. Which was good for its first year. Fingers crossed for this year.


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## Duff (20/9/07)

petesbrew said:


> View attachment 14951
> 
> My Columbus Rhizome, just on two weeks old.
> Thanks Duff! :beer:
> Pete



Good to see it up and going Pete :beerbang: 

And no need to get technical at all with it. Give it a good all purpose fertiliser every month or two (low P) with regular watering and watch it go.

Cheers.


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## Mightypns (24/9/07)

My Columbus, 1st year. Anybody else grown Hops in Canberra? How well do they go?


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## Fents (25/9/07)

yep so my tett and columbs have def sprouted. not posting pics as im sure we have all seen new plant growth, but im still pretty excited.

how many meters high will they grow?

and instead of growning them straight up string can i train them sideways around my fence trellis?


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## petesbrew (25/9/07)

Duff said:


> Good to see it up and going Pete :beerbang:
> 
> And no need to get technical at all with it. Give it a good all purpose fertiliser every month or two (low P) with regular watering and watch it go.
> 
> Cheers.



Cheers Duff. They're loving the sun, (facing northwest) and are growing like crazy ATM.
Should make the pool area nice and good-smellin'-like!


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## Steve (25/9/07)

Mighty - hops grow very well in Canberra.
Fents - you can train them horizontally, but its more hard work as they naturally want to go vertically. You will have to train them manually by hand probably every day by wrapping them around the trellis.
Cheers
Steve


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## tangent (25/9/07)

my hersbrucker is chest height already and climbing like crazy


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## Fents (25/9/07)

cheers steve.


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## domonsura (25/9/07)

I put my Hallertau in 5 days ago - it 'woke up' quite visibly by the following day and within the last 2 days it already has 3-4 inches of growth on one shoot with 2 others preparing to go for it. First one already has 3 little sets of leaves unfolding!
Is this normal? I thought I was going to have a couple of weeks to get some kind of support in place, but not at this rate!
On the other hand, the *much* larger cluster rhizome I planted a week earlier is thinking about it (I can see slight unfolding of the uppermost bud, but only just noticeable) but no real action.
This is going to be a cool summer


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## tangent (28/9/07)

1st bine has almost reached the top and ready for the extension rope


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## oldbugman (28/9/07)

Just wondering, one of my cluster bines is showing some yellowing of the leaves, is this like other plants and shows signs of the plant being hungry?

What to feed him if so?


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## mfdes (28/9/07)

OldBugman said:


> Just wondering, one of my cluster bines is showing some yellowing of the leaves, is this like other plants and shows signs of the plant being hungry?
> 
> What to feed him if so?



Do you have it in a pot or in the ground?
If it's in a pot it may either be a mineral deficiency, or an excess of another mineral (which stops the plant absorbing what it needs and causes the same symptoms). 

If you have it in the ground mineral deficiencies are much less likely. If it sprouted early (it is still early), that is, before the spring equinox and days longer than 12 hours, it may be thinking it's already autumn and going to sleep. It may not resprout till 6-8 weeks from now and then may be significantly weakened. Is it a new plant or an established one? With an established one you'd probably still get a few cones. A new one may be too weakened.
This can happen because we get FAR less frost than Europe or the US and the plants think it's time to wake up too early, when the days are too short.

MFS.


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## Lukes (28/9/07)

My Tassie Hall has gone mad in its new spot and is up over fence height already:



Fents,
At this point I start to grow/train them horizontally along wire at the top of the fence.


It makes them easy to pick as the hop cones hang down underneath.
- Luke


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## petesbrew (29/9/07)

My columbus at 4 weeks. Nice!


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## Fents (29/9/07)

Thanks Lukes! That looks madness....oh so many cones 

I shall grow mine up to the top of the trellis then along it with string in both directions..should make a great fence / neighbour cover too!


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## drsmurto (9/10/07)

The hills are alive......

Finally some real growth - my chinook is taking off. Need to pull the finger out and build a trellis. About time something outgrew the weeds......

Is there a huge variaiton in growth between types? My 2 goldings are still in hibernation and my cluster sprouted but stopped after 1cm and stayed put for a month. Chopped him back down again so hoping to see some signs of growth soon.


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## domonsura (9/10/07)

My hallertau and cluster plants, going for it. Growing on average 2 inches a day now.


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## Fents (9/10/07)

Dr S - Same

My Tettnang has gone mad, my cluster has sprouted but aint going no where and the other one hasnt even rear'd it head yet!


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## Screwtop (9/10/07)

Wurttemberger is up now about 10cm After the Perle not growing properly last year I moved the rhizome during winter, it's now shooting and looks good up to 10cm.


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## Plastic Man (22/10/07)

after what seemed like endless weekends of kids parties and family BBQ's I finally got some quality time to put up my "trellis" - (I was getting worried they'd get eaten by snails).

Goldings:



Columbus:



gardenings never been so exciting !!!....

I only got one vine from the Columbus though ?? The Golding has about 4.


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## tangent (22/10/07)

my hops have grabbed the rope extension and taken off.
it's about 45 degrees though so i'm giving them a hand every few days wrap around the rope.
around 2m high now


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## bindi (22/10/07)

My vines have died off and are just small lumps at the base  still living,but I know SFA about plants, so I just cut them off and hope it will go again. <_<


----------



## InCider (22/10/07)

bindi said:


> My vines have died off and are just small lumps at the base  still living,but I know SFA about plants, so I just cut them off and hope it will go again. <_<









Hey Bindi, if you want me to whack one between my grapevines to the left of the picture, I have made a trellis with the boy, some bamboo, fishing line and wire. Obviously all cones would be delivered on the 605 bus to your door.  Can we make a lychee beer? It's going to fruit for the first time this year, but the mango has found the 2 hot weeks a bit tough...

Sean.

Etid: Spellering


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## domonsura (22/10/07)

My Cluster hops are going mental, growing 6-8 inches a day now with several bines. Can't believe how fast it's growing, it's actually growing 1-2 inches overnight!!
On the 9th of this month....





and today...







The Hallertau (much smaller rhizome) is a bit slower on it..

Again on the 9th of this month ..





and today...







AMAZING plants, that's for sure....


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## Lukes (26/10/07)

My cluster has shot up 9 foot in the last 30 days with no shortage of new shoots following.
I raised the bar from fence height to 9 foot as I don't get any hops on the lower parts of the plant.
Once over the bar I grow them horizontally like the big farms do up in Central Vic.
With warmer weather this weekend I will give them a good dose of liquid fertilizer and watch them grow before my very eyes.

How are the rest of the hop gardens doing around the country?

- Luke


----------



## Steve (26/10/07)

My POR is at about 3 metres......sadly though we are moving house in six weeks time so I have to chop it down, dig it up and take it with me.

Cheers
Steve


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## braufrau (26/10/07)

Well a watched hop never sprouts so we went away for 5 weeks and now the cluster is up and running
but no sign of the Goldings.
Since its supposed to be impossible to kill hops, I must deserve some sort of booby prize right?


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## Lukes (26/10/07)

braufrau said:


> Well a watched hop never sprouts so we went away for 5 weeks and now the cluster is up and running
> but no sign of the Goldings.
> Since its supposed to be impossible to kill hops, I must deserve some sort of booby prize right?




Once established ....


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## braufrau (26/10/07)

Lukes said:


> Once established ....



oh. So no hops *and* no prize!


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## domonsura (26/10/07)

She'll be right BF, it'll all come good. Just have faith in the beergods....


----------



## BoilerBoy (26/10/07)

The one hop I ordered from Tassie was a total "no show" after 5-6 weeks,

It certainly was a miserable looking specimen and after a poke around to see what was happening it couldn't be found! .

My wife the (bless her) the gardening guru around here then got a hersbrucker and tardiff of ebay for me, it cost more, but the the roots are already well developed which increases the chances of success and I dont have to wait another year for another go.

Cheers,
BB


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## drsmurto (26/10/07)

braufrau said:


> Well a watched hop never sprouts so we went away for 5 weeks and now the cluster is up and running
> but no sign of the Goldings.
> Since its supposed to be impossible to kill hops, I must deserve some sort of booby prize right?



Dont stress BF, neither of my goldings have sprouted, nor has my cluster re-sprouted after its premature sprouting during the frost season. My chinook which i got from Stuart in Tassie is 3 foot and counting. I havent planted them in pots so i discovered another shoot from the chinook trying to escape - it was nearly 1m from the plant so i dug him up and put him back where he belongs. Cascade was the tiniest rhizome ever and the most expensive and has done %#^$# all :angry: Think i got dudded.

Its still relatively cool at night in the hills so i wont be stressing for another few weeks yet.


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## Steve (26/10/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Cascade was the tiniest rhizome ever and the most expensive and has done %#^$# all :angry: Think i got dudded.



Dr....you still havent fessed up about where you got it from?


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## chovain (26/10/07)

I put a Tardif down a week ago (late purchase from our eBay friend). I thought I was asking for trouble putting it in so late, but it's coming along really well. The main bine has only grown from 13cm to 16cm, but there are 5 other bines further down that seem to be doing well. All are just starting to sprout really healthy looking (and legally dubious, to the eye) leave.

I'm thinking of cutting back the two shortest bines, and letting the other 4 grow up 2 strings in pairs. Does this sound like a reasonable plan?


----------



## floppinab (26/10/07)

I took the advice of someone on this thread and cut the early growth back in my Hallertau and Perle............. and I have yet to see anything pop up since :angry:


----------



## chovain (26/10/07)

floppinab said:


> I took the advice of someone on this thread and cut the early growth back in my Hallertau and Perle............. and I have yet to see anything pop up since :angry:


It's pretty common to cut back early growth. When was it cut back? I'd personally want to avoid completely cutting back (unless it was *really* early, like June/July), and would probably leave one or two bines to do their own thing if we're looking at August or later (I'm in Sydney - I'm not going to have problems with frost).

Then again, I'm a complete newbie, so what I think probably counts for squat!


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## drsmurto (26/10/07)

Steve said:


> Dr....you still havent fessed up about where you got it from?



Cascade was the smallest but i have been assured its time will come - none of the hops i have got from Cannabacae have done anything/much - sometimes it pays to be patient and remember than i live in the hills and its till damn cold at nights. The only thing growing is weeds and the chinook..........

Its probably a good thing that only 1/5 hops is growing as i havent rigged up anything for them to grow on....!

Got the cascade from a swap organised by Cannabacae. They have been sold on ebay as well. Will be happy to swap next year providing i can work out how to take a cutting and get it to grow - maybe that green house i bought will come in handy after all. 

Not sure why i am expecting growth/sprouting - of the 26 chilli seeds i put in my green house, not one has popped thru the soil....


----------



## beerguide (26/10/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Not sure why i am expecting growth/sprouting - of the 26 chilli seeds i put in my green house, not one has popped thru the soil....



Eeek! Thats not a good track record. Are you using seed raising mix - or just regular old soil?


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## Mitternacht Brauer (26/10/07)

Here is a pic of my Hersbrucker that went in around late July . Sprouted straight away and then stopped and has looked the same now for a month and a half .

Anyone else watching their hops doing similair??


----------



## drsmurto (26/10/07)

zoddy said:


> Eeek! Thats not a good track record. Are you using seed raising mix - or just regular old soil?



Seed raising mix - i know why they arent sprouting - its too $%&^%& cold at nights. Chillis need a min average soil temp of high teens, low twenties. I should move them inside, top of the fridge but laziness has prevented me thus far. 

If i had thought about it more, i would have planted the rhizomes in pots until about now so they were up and running before planting them into he ground.....


----------



## KillerRx4 (26/10/07)

buster3931 said:


> Here is a pic of my Hersbrucker that went in around late July . Sprouted straight away and then stopped and has looked the same now for a month and a half .
> 
> Anyone else watching their hops doing similair??View attachment 15648




Yes, my Columbus looks pretty much the same as that & its in its 2nd year. It started out with about 6 shoots that got to between 1-4 inches then grew no further. I cut back all but 2 about a month ago but nothing has changed since.
Interestingly last year in its 1st season it did the same but late in the season it started to climb & got to about a metre before the season ended.

1 of my Cluster plants is starting to pick up its stride now after doing pretty much the same as the columbus. Its now got 3-4 thick purple shoots steaming ahead. This was a cutting from the original & is in its 3rd year now.

My original cluster plant (3rd year) is dismal, 2 shoots all of 1/2" tall & going nowhere fast.

2nd year pearle is a no show. As is another cluster cutting that would have been 3 this year.


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## KillerRx4 (26/10/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Got the cascade from a swap organised by Cannabacae. They have been sold on ebay as well. Will be happy to swap next year providing i can work out how to take a cutting and get it to grow - maybe that green house i bought will come in handy after all




Growing from cuttings is too easy. You just need to snip off a shoot, stick it in a cup with the stem submerged in water for about a week until roots sprout then whack it in the ground.


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## Mitternacht Brauer (26/10/07)

The father inlaw got a perle and a tettanager at the same place and time as me and his have not even showed through the soil yet . 

After the partial that I did two weeks ago I put the spent grain and hops around it .Thought that may help . It is in a garden that I had to explain as a vege patch but ended up with cabbages next to it . There is heaps of chock poo/straw in the soil .Maybe over fertalized??


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## drsmurto (2/11/07)

Ok, so i know ppl refer to hop plants as weeds but i think i may be out of my league. I have been trying to identify a few rogue plants that i initially thought were blackberries, then i started to wonder if they were hops. I planted my rhizomes in the ground. So far the chinook is going great guns, one sprouted right where i planted it, the other popped out some 60cms from the rhizome so i trained him back. These 'rogue' plants are nearly 2 metres from any of the 5 rhizomes i planted. So i am going to have to dig them up and trace them to their source so i can confirm if they are actually hops at all and if so, which one! They look very similar. 

Any comments from the gardeners amongst you? These were taken a few weeks back so they are much larger now but dont seem to be all that vine like.


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## Fents (2/11/07)

They certainly look like hop shoots to me. did they start out as litle bud thgings just sticking there heads out of the ground?

second thoughts i dunno, i dont think my hops had that many sets of leaves on them when they were that small...more like straight bine growing upwards.


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## Steve (2/11/07)

they aint hops


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## fraser_john (2/11/07)

My tettenang (.sp?) and Goldings, the goldings is the smaller sprouter!


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## braufrau (2/11/07)

My cluster is zipping away now but I have given up on the goldings. 
Try again next year. I think I will wait 'til spring to plant next year, like the americans do.
Its so cold here its not too dumb to think like an american wrt planting times. I've tossed
away the yates planting guide and made my own based on first and last frost dates
like the yanks do.


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## agraham (2/11/07)

Is it too late to plant one now? When do you have to get the rhizomes? I wouldnt mind a crack at planting some hops.


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## drsmurto (2/11/07)

agraham said:


> Is it too late to plant one now? When do you have to get the rhizomes? I wouldnt mind a crack at planting some hops.



Not too late and cannabacae still has this one for sale


----------



## agraham (2/11/07)

I was looking for a good european lager hop, i.e hallertau etc


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## beerguide (2/11/07)

How much do rhizomes typically sell for? Having never bought them before I want to know what I should set my limit to for that ebay sale. I can wait until next season if need be, I just don't want to get ripped off as can so easily happen on eBay.


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## amita (2/11/07)

zoddy said:


> How much do rhizomes typically sell for? Having never bought them before I want to know what I should set my limit to for that ebay sale. I can wait until next season if need be, I just don't want to get ripped off as can so easily happen on eBay.



on ebay your bid should reflect the price you are happy to pay,  If you get sucked i you loose,
only bid with what you are happy to pay and dont mind what other think about it.

there are many ways to get a plant growning,

good luck amita


----------



## beerguide (2/11/07)

Ummm.... thanks :S
Anyone else care to share what they typically sell for through stores like Grumpy's etc..?


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## drsmurto (2/11/07)

In November? Its a bit late in the year to be getting fussy... :lol: 

You could also try this bloke 

I bought a chinook from him after i missed the grumpys sale.


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## tangent (2/11/07)

get a very small cutting from a friend for free. put it in a glass of water. few days later roots start to grow


----------



## Steve (2/11/07)

Have a read zoddy

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=16490

Cheers
Steve


----------



## beerguide (2/11/07)

Cheers Steve, reading that now.
Tangent - I would grab some off somone if I knew anyone that had them, which unfortunately I do not.

I'll just wait till next year if I can't get any - it really isn't a drama.


----------



## chovain (2/11/07)

zoddy said:


> How much do rhizomes typically sell for? Having never bought them before I want to know what I should set my limit to for that ebay sale. I can wait until next season if need be, I just don't want to get ripped off as can so easily happen on eBay.


You can get them for about $25 in season. The bigger suppliers sold out quickly this year, so you should expect to spend more than that. They've been going for anything up to triple that for the less common varieties over the past few weeks. I'd expect that particular rhizome to go for $30-$40. On the plus side, if you don't mind the effort you'll be putting into growing your hops, it won't take too many harvests to get your money's worth.


----------



## oldbugman (2/11/07)

Personally I think the cost is negligible for the time you'll spend admiring and grooming your little hop plant on its way to glory.

And that rhizome is MASSIVE compared the the few roots I got.


----------



## agraham (2/11/07)

My only friend in victoria is warren


----------



## chovain (2/11/07)

OldBugman said:


> Personally I think the cost is negligible for the time you'll spend admiring and grooming your little hop plant on its way to glory.


Yep - I (knowingly) overpaid for a Tardif a couple of weeks back. I figure it'd cost me $20 to waste 2 hours at the cinema. At $10/hr, I've already easily got my money's worth! Hell, I'll get my money's worth just this weekend! :beerbang:



OldBugman said:


> And that rhizome is MASSIVE compared the the few roots I got.


Yeah - my Tardif (from cannabaceae) had a huge root system. Started growing within a couple of days of going in the ground.


----------



## The Scientist (4/11/07)

buster3931 said:


> Here is a pic of my Hersbrucker that went in around late July . Sprouted straight away and then stopped and has looked the same now for a month and a half .
> 
> Anyone else watching their hops doing similair??View attachment 15648



Yeah mine have seemed to have come to a halt after growing over 7ft in a month and a half.

Now the leaves are becoming fraile and are falling to bits. I've been told a give it dose of super phosphate, hope that works.





Any advise would be appreciated.

Cheers,

TS


----------



## domonsura (4/11/07)

Depends on the variety, and how many there are available......
When there's a few of them available I would have said $20-$30 would be a reasonable price for most average sized rhizome. Larger will cost more.

Around this time of year, there's not much going. I just had a quick squiz at what's available on eBay at present, and I wouldn't bother with any of them. They're reasonably priced, but the 'aureus' variety seems to be touted (from what i can tell) as an ornamental hop, rather than a brewing one. The other one shown looks to be a rather sick and confused looking Pride of Ringwood maybe, however the seller doesn't seem to know much about it, which is never a good start.
If I were you I would wait till next season now, and buy some from Rupert in WA (who also sells via eBay) - I purchased a cluster rhizome from him, and it's quickly grown into a vigorous and healthy vine.

Scientist - give it some fertiliser - seasol, phostrogen, miracle gro, fermented chicken poo liquid etc, and fert regularly, from all accounts these plants are hungry little suckers....


----------



## Ross (4/11/07)

My plants are going better this year having transferred them to pots. Really taking off in the last few weeks.
the Chinook is leggy, but has started side sprouting everywhere. The Columbus is being more restrained.
Unfortunately they only get the afternoon sun itheir current position, so not expecting too much.

Columbus




Chinook




cheers Ross


----------



## BoilerBoy (4/11/07)

Yes, got a tardiff de bourgogne and hersbrucker from Rupert in WA,
Both were a good size with excellent root growth and are doing well despite late planting.

They cost a little more, but considering I wasted $25 on a very minute sickly looking hop that failed, <_< $40 ea for hops with good root development have a much greater chance of success.

If I buy anymore I would definitely go through him again.

Cheers,
BB


----------



## oldbugman (4/11/07)

Wuretemberger




Cluster


----------



## bindi (4/11/07)

bindi said:


> My vines have died off and are just small lumps at the base  still living,but I know SFA about plants, so I just cut them off and hope it will go again. <_<



Update:
My Gouldings has died  but the Chinook has come good and has about 6 shoots growing fast.  , it had some nice flowers last year.
Photo to follow.


----------



## Doc (4/11/07)

My hops are really starting to kick into gear.
Five varieties this year and the latest addition (right most plot) is Chinook which is a stormer.

Doc


----------



## glennheinzel (4/11/07)

My wife decided that she didn't like the position of my Chinook hop today so she moved it to a nice shady spot. <_< Unfortunately in the move she broke the top 12 inches off and now I'm left with a seven foot "stump". 

I'm hoping that the main plant continues to grow. I've placed the tip in a glass of water in the hope that I'll have a second plant.

Edit - Damn. She just walked in and caught me moaning online. Now I've got to hang out the washing... :unsure:


----------



## voota (4/11/07)

This might be a long shot, but last year I had a Pride of Ringwood plant die due to a lack of rain/love... it was out of my control as I was overseas. Anyway, I'm missing fresh hops this year... and I had developed a great recipe to use fresh homegrown pride of ringwood in...
Now I know from experience that POR plants produce loads of hops... does anybody have a bunch of Pride of Ringwood flowers that they don't need? I can provide some beer or something in exchange. Probably best if you live in Melbourne...

cheers, 
Chris


----------



## etbandit (4/11/07)

Doc said:


> My hops are really starting to kick into gear.
> Five varieties this year and the latest addition (right most plot) is Chinook which is a stormer.
> 
> Doc




Doc,

I noticed your growing them in pots. Im thinking of doing the same. Are you get good yield from using pots?


----------



## Screwtop (4/11/07)

Bit late in the season to buy, but you could try calling Stewart Ferguson in Tassie to see what he has left. Last season Stewart $17, Grumpy's were $35 I think and then there were prices in between for internet and other retailers. My Wurttemberger is now at 2.5M (second season) and the Perle is at about 60mm much like last year.

Screwy


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## amita (5/11/07)

look what I found in the back lane, walking the dogs!!!!
a homebrewer used to live there and the new owner doesnt know what treasure he has,
anybody guessing what it is?????

now I have a good reason to walk the extra mile.......  
cheers amita


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## chovain (5/11/07)

amita said:


> anybody guessing what it is?????



It's 5-lobed, which narrows things down quite a bit, right? I can't for the life of me find details of the number of lobes on each of the varieties - seems like an obvious thing to have catalogued somewhere...


----------



## amita (5/11/07)

Mark Chovain said:


> It's 5-lobed, which narrows things down quite a bit, right? I can't for the life of me find details of the number of lobes on each of the varieties - seems like an obvious thing to have catalogued somewhere...




got a photo of the leaf, maybe a help???

cheers amita


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## Steve (5/11/07)

Mark Chovain said:


> It's 5-lobed, which narrows things down quite a bit, right? I can't for the life of me find details of the number of lobes on each of the varieties - seems like an obvious thing to have catalogued somewhere...




my POR has 5 "lobes" :blink: only when the leaves are fully mature. It starts off with 3. The leaves on that in the pic are really small where as my mature leaves are the size of a dinner plate. Anyway its a good find. Id be telling the new owner that you would be more than willing to take it off his property.
Cheers
Steve


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## amita (5/11/07)

Steve said:


> my POR has 5 "lobes" :blink: only when the leaves are fully mature. It starts off with 3. The leaves on that in the pic are really small where as my mature leaves are the size of a dinner plate. Anyway its a good find. Id be telling the new owner that you would be more than willing to take it off his property.
> Cheers
> Steve




might have to bring the chooks along for the walk in the back lane and teach them to do their poo right there!!  

cheers amita


----------



## mfdes (6/11/07)

Just bringing back the old topic I talked about a couple of months ago in this thread.
I was saying then that one ought not let any shoots develop that come out before end of october. They ought to be cut below ground, especially in 1st year plants.

They should be allowed to start growing about now, for maximum potential.

Anyone had problems with the rhizomes shooting then stopping altogether?
For me this has been the most common cause of cuttings dying in the 1st year.

MFS.


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## drsmurto (6/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


>



mfdes, my cluster hop did this just on 2 months ago, i cut them back after a few weeks of staying the same and nothing has happened since.

The other hops (apart from my weed like chinook which grows faster than i can extend the climbing trellis - 1m and counting) are still asleep.


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## domonsura (6/11/07)

Whereas my cluster hops shoots came up, had a little rest (during which I left them alone) and then took off again. Now at the end of a 3 metre pole and straining for the sky.

Mdfes, I have a lot of trouble with the advice you have given. ALL of it. I'd be happier with it if you could provide some reference material perhaps? Because everything I've seen disagrees with what you have said about nettlehead, (I believe I pointed that out before) _and_ cutting back young hops shoots. My opinion (and experience) is that when a plant decides that it's time to come up - cutting it's head off when it hesitates for a bit doesn't make sense. It's just cutting off the very thing it has been putting ALL of it's energy into, using up precious food reserves in the process. I don't recall ever seeing a plant that is happy about having first season growth lopped off - but I know of a couple who's response is slow stunted growth (for that season or the rest of it's life) or flat out refusal to do anything at all for the season (ie: stuff this, I'm going back to sleep until next year) or just plain old death because it doesn't have the food reserves for a second effort. Plants from the same family have also been known to stunt/turn hermaphrodite or develop strange mutations if damaged/interfered with when young......Mother nature has been doing things her way for eons now - why not just let her decide eh? 

If you can supply reference material, please feel free to educate me  because I am at a loss as to where your information came from.

Dr Smurto, I've just taken some cluster cuttings from an extra bine, you're welcome to one if they take


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## Dr Gonzo (6/11/07)

Domonsura,
I have read the same info before in a number of places, but can't remember where.
I have cut back all new growth to the ground twice now this year,
and the round 3 shoots coming up are much stronger, thicker, and healthier looking than the earlier ones.
One plant has grown over a foot in the last 3 days.
I think there is some validity in what mfdes says.
Will try to remember where else i read about the advantages of doing this.


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## chovain (6/11/07)

Dr Gonzo said:


> Domonsura,
> I have read the same info before in a number of places, but can't remember where.
> I have cut back all new growth to the ground twice now this year,
> and the round 3 shoots coming up are much stronger, thicker, and healthier looking than the earlier ones.
> ...



I seem to remember reading that it's worth cutting shoots back if they grow to early to avoid damage from frost and cold weather. I don't think that's generally a major concern for us here.


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## drsmurto (6/11/07)

Mark Chovain said:


> I seem to remember reading that it's worth cutting shoots back if they grow to early to avoid damage from frost and cold weather. I don't think that's generally a major concern for us here.



Maybe not for you pesky northerners but here in the Adelaide hills its still brass monkey weather till late October, when the frosts finally stop. The cluster popped up when it thought all the frosts were done but a week later, wham, another week of severe frosts and it froze in place. I chopped it all back down to the ground and a week again it sprouted again, but this time about 1cm and then the rains came and its done squat since. Tempted to nip it back again. 

Now that spring is well and truly here the chinook is happy as a pig in shit and growing like thats what its sitting in..... pity the other 4 are still sound asleep.

And what is chewing on the leaves, cant find any caterpillars or is that a sign of needing fertiliser?


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## Barramundi (6/11/07)

is it too late to be planting a rhiosome now in sydney ???


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## chovain (6/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Maybe not for you pesky northerners but here in the Adelaide hills its still brass monkey weather till late October, when the frosts finally stop. The cluster popped up when it thought all the frosts were done but a week later, wham, another week of severe frosts and it froze in place. I chopped it all back down to the ground and a week again it sprouted again, but this time about 1cm and then the rains came and its done squat since. Tempted to nip it back again.



And this is why it's important when giving advice to explain _why_ certain procedures should be followed (I'm as guilty as the next guy on that one). It's not enough that it's just the way it's always been done; a procedure that is right for one person is not necessarily right for another. 

When I was growing up, I always watched my mum preparing the roast. She'd always cut a few centimetres off each end. When I asked her why she did that, she explained it was how her mum always did it. I did the same things until one day, I asked my grandmother why she cut the ends off the roast. "I only did that if it wouldn't fit in the pan!" What a waste of meat! (*)

(*) Story may not be factually correct.


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## chovain (6/11/07)

Barramundi said:


> is it too late to be planting a rhiosome now in sydney ???


I planted a Tardif about 2-3 weeks ago, and it's going strong (in a good sunny position). If you've got one, it wouldn't hurt to give it a shot, but you shouldn't expect a good harvest (I suspect it'll do better in the ground than the fridge).


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## domonsura (6/11/07)

That's what I'm looking for if you can remember thanks Dr Gonzo, I've been looking all over the place for some info on that because I wasn't keen to do it to mine unless I'd seen verification of it  & there also seem to be a few new hops growers who _did_ cut back, and are sitting wondering now.( I'm not trying to say mdfes was bs'ing us all, just his info on nettlehead seemed to be a bit backwards and I can't find anything to corroborate his info on cutting back early growth myself.) So when in doubt, ask the horse


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## domonsura (6/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Maybe not for you pesky northerners but here in the Adelaide hills its still brass monkey weather till late October, when the frosts finally stop. The cluster popped up when it thought all the frosts were done but a week later, wham, another week of severe frosts and it froze in place. I chopped it all back down to the ground and a week again it sprouted again, but this time about 1cm and then the rains came and its done squat since. Tempted to nip it back again.
> 
> Now that spring is well and truly here the chinook is happy as a pig in shit and growing like thats what its sitting in..... pity the other 4 are still sound asleep.
> 
> And what is chewing on the leaves, cant find any caterpillars or is that a sign of needing fertiliser?



Have a look on the underside of the leaves, see if you can spot any little tiny red/black mites. I've had to evict some of the little buggers from my hallertau already, it was looking a little sickly, I got rid of them and it's off again. Maybe you have some tiny unwanted guests?


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## bindi (6/11/07)

Chinook making a come back after I cut it back to the ground.


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

Hi All,

Still chasing the references, but in the meanwhile I'll explain the mechanism. 
First to say I was indeed wrong as to it being called nettlehead. Down here in Bushy Park growers do refer to this process as nettlehead, however elsewhere it is the name of a viral disease caused by the Arabis Mosaic Virus.

It has all to do with photoperiod (daylength), and the environmental cues that trigger hops to go dormant in autumn and grow in spring.

Hops come from middle latitudes in Europe. In this area winters are far more continental, and consistently frosty throughout winter and into the middle of spring. This will become important in a moment. Also it is important to know that the hop uses daylength to determine when to go dormant in autumn. It uses daylength for most of its growth cues actually: the longest days of the year trigger flowering, and the onset of the autumn equinox (days become shorter than nights) approximately determines when the hops go yellow and the tops senesce (die). Some varieties are early and late flowering, depending on the number of hours in the day that triggers flowering. In the same way some hop varieties keep their leaves slightly longer than others. 
Now, while it's short days that tell the hop plant to go to sleep for autumn, it can't use daylength as its spring cue to get growing. Why? Because it has no foliage out of the ground to detect daylength. So hop plants, as most deciduous plants, use temperature to determine when to sprout in spring. 
Why is this important? As I said above, European climate is colder in winter and early spring than ours. Plants from those latitudes will sense the soil is warm enough and sprout earlier than they should in our climate. Normally, this would not be a problem and an extra long growing season would be a huge bonus, as more vegetative growth equals higher yields, generally. HOWEVER, hops are very sensitive do daylength, and the emerging shoots unfurl a few leaves, notice the days are short and it should in fact be going to sleep for winter, it stops growing and nothing else happens, usually for quite a few weeks. 
This is the main problem. the vigour drops dramatically, the plant may or may not have enough energy to send shoots later on, or it may spend long enough in its obligate dormancy period that it looses too much vigour and cannot re-sprout in time to put enough growth to make a good growing season.

As I've said before, some varieties are more sensitive to this than others, and it all depends on where the parent stock comes from. 

References to follow when I get a chance to go to the library.

MFS.


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

Found some passages that go into hop cutting in spring at length on Rybacek, but not much info on why.

Rybachek, V. 1991. Hop Production. Elsevier, New York. 286pp.

Page 101: "Under Czechoslovak climatic conditions a retarded sprouting of the hop plant has been shown to be advantageous..."
Mentions of hop cutting in the section of "Spring treatment of the hop stands", pp 195-202.

Mind you this is in a climate where it's not considered necessary.
More to come when I find it.

MFS.


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## drsmurto (7/11/07)

So apart from cutting back early shoots what other recommendations do you have mfdes? If the plant loses the vigour it needs to grow again will a dose of fertiliser give it the kick up the arse it needs? Since they successfully grow hops in Tassie and kiwi land (2 places much colder than where i am) i assume they have some method of dealing with it? 

Sorry mate, i'm a scientist and so identifying a problem is only half the job, we need to solve it and like others have mentioned, evidence helps. Now that we have a name for it, other than nettlehead, it should be easier to track down some info. 

Keep up the research mfdes.

And Wayne, checked the chinook last night, not a bug in sight. I gave it a healthy drink of fertiliser to see if that helps it. 

Cheers
DrSmurto


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## floppinab (7/11/07)

> As I've said before, some varieties are more sensitive to this than others, and it all depends on where the parent stock comes from.


There's no guarantee to anything but looking at the some of the responses there's a bit of a common theme, and your last comment on where the parent stock comes from, also has a lot of merit I think.

I cut back all the growth on my two newly planted Rhizomes based on your advice that popped up as soon as I planted in early Sept. and they haven't been seen or heard of since apart from one shoot that popped up around 20cm from where I planted that I originally missed when I cut the rest back. That shoot is going quite strong. I just hope I haven't killed the other rhizome.

I am in Sydney and of course it is signficantly warmer, earlier, than the southern states. I suspect that north of Ulladulla, particularly on the coast, where we can expect warmer weather from early Sept. onward we are better off letting them go, whereas in the southern states where regular spring temps aren't experienced until mid-late Oct. you are better off cutting them back.

My Rhizomes came from Tassy so I strongly expect as soon as they were in the ground with day time temps avging 24 odd degrees they knew it was time to go and I should never have cut them back.


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## Screwtop (7/11/07)

My hop plantation (second season):
Below is the Wurttemberger, at the base, up the trellis, then up the string, and almost to the top 3.5M. Cloudy weather doesn't help the pics, sorry. 
Incider saw this plant 10 days ago before it had reached the string, not bad growth in 10 days, Sean.






Below is the Perle, which didn't do very well last year, transplanted to this position during winter, seems to be doing better. But still no where as robust a plant as the Wurty.



And the baby Wurties, tip cuttings potted last year. So far only 2 little girls have appeared this year.



The shoots appeared about a 6 weeks ago, and looked for a while to be as described above (nettlehead). Cut them back on one plant but not on the other. The one which was not cut back is the one which has taken off. Guess it was just photosynthesising and building up some energy so it could shoot that growth up to the top of the trellis in just on 19 days.


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

Hey guys,

I seriously can't comment on what happens to stuff grown outside what is considered the natural range of hops, i.e. latitudes 35-55. Your climate and more importantly daylength are completely different. I have no idea what the plants will do in those conditions.

MFS


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## Steve (7/11/07)

Anyone had to dig up and transplant their growing rhizome? Im moving house early december. My POR is already 3-4 metres tall :angry: 
Cheers
Steve


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## chovain (7/11/07)

Steve said:


> Anyone had to dig up and transplant their growing rhizome? Im moving house early december. My POR is already 3-4 metres tall :angry:



That sounds like it's going to be a chore! I have no experience with it myself, but can only suggest very slowly and carefully digging out as much of the root system as you can. These things can go down several metres though, and like most roots, are extremely delicate. At best, it's going to be a sick-looking plant for a while.  

Perhaps start by digging a deep trench off to the side (hopefully not taking out too many roots), then come in from the side, removing soil from the root system. You're going to want to get it in the ground again pretty quickly...

Whatever you do, keep us updated on the progress - I'm sure you won't be the last to want to do this.


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## kevnlis (7/11/07)

There are hormones you can use to transplant that encourage the regrowth of roots. Combine this with a good mix of compost/manure with some Blood & Bone and Fish Emulsion you should have no worries.

I have mine burried in sand out in the citrus grove and it is going batty. Doesn't need much water or food and enjoys the strong Bundy sun so far.


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## Steve (7/11/07)

Mark Chovain said:


> That sounds like it's going to be a chore! I have no experience with it myself, but can only suggest very slowly and carefully digging out as much of the root system as you can. These things can go down several metres though, and like most roots, are extremely delicate. At best, it's going to be a sick-looking plant for a while.
> 
> Perhaps start by digging a deep trench off to the side (hopefully not taking out too many roots), then come in from the side, removing soil from the root system. You're going to want to get it in the ground again pretty quickly...
> 
> Whatever you do, keep us updated on the progress - I'm sure you won't be the last to want to do this.




I was advised by LHBS who gave me it a few years ago to just trim if down to the ground, dig er up, shove it in soggy newspaper and plant within a few days. A couple of years ago I was scratching around the area where it lives. The roots are running horizintally and they definately arent delicate. They're like tree roots 4-5 cm in diameter! Will keep you posted.
Cheers
Steve


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## Screwtop (7/11/07)

To my mind, transplanting during the growing period could be risky, depends upon a lot of variables, mostly the current condition of the plant and where it's being located to (climate, soil type etc).

As insurance I would be taking as many tip cuttings as possible (put them in water to strike, then into pots of potting mix) beforehand, then dig up the rhizome as recommended when you leave.

Screwy


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## Steve (7/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> As insurance I would be taking as many tip cuttings as possible (put them in water to strike, then into pots of potting mix) beforehand, then dig up the rhizome as recommended when you leave.



Good thinking screwy


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## kevnlis (7/11/07)

I would not take these cuttings before you move but rather at the same time. An already stressed plant will take the move harder than a healthy plant.


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## Kingy (7/11/07)

Does any one know what specific hop this is, "Humulus Lupulus"


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## Duff (7/11/07)

mfdes said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I seriously can't comment on what happens to stuff grown outside what is considered the natural range of hops, i.e. latitudes 35-55. Your climate and more importantly daylength are completely different. I have no idea what the plants will do in those conditions.
> 
> MFS



I haven't followed this thread for quite some time as I grew hops last year, but not this year.

As a plant breeder who is trying to finish writing his %$#@ing PhD thesis, some of your comments mfdes are a long way off the mark.

I'm not surprised that guys who have cut back the inital shoots have had problems since. They are the main growth point. When anyone plants a rhizome during late winter/early spring, the rhizome will have a limited supply of carbohydrates stored in it, as most plants store carbo's when they do into dormancy. When the rhizome is planted, roots develop and nutrients from the soil which assist growth are exchanged by the release of hydrogen into the soil. This is in part, along with rainfall and other factors, why soils without natural calcareous deposits gradually go acidic in nature over time and why lime is applied by the manager. With the uptake in nutrients, the plant is able to expend energy into producing growth points which develop into shoots, which bear leaves, which photosynthesise sunlight, which produce sugars, which makes cells within the plant divide and elongate, which make the vine grow. If you go and cut back those intial shoots, no leaves, no photosynthesis, no sugars, no cell division, no grow.

As far as daylength, or photoperiod, is concerened, plants have an amazing ability to adapt to individual growing conditions. We are not talking about a delicate orchid or anything here, we are talking about a vine. Photoperiod is one factor which can trigger flowering in plants, but so are temperature interactions, maturity of the plant, nutrient levels, etc. The whole notion that photoperiod affects hop plants outside of 35 degrees latitude is plain wrong. I had a bumper crop in Sydney last year with my first season Chinook.



Steve said:


> Anyone had to dig up and transplant their growing rhizome? Im moving house early december. My POR is already 3-4 metres tall :angry:
> Cheers
> Steve



Steve, if you are going to do it, do it now while the temperatures are still cool. Cut it back, but leave at least 3 to 4 nodes (or 3 to 4 points where the leaves are sprouting) and pop it in a pot. You may not unfortunately see any flowers when time comes, but you never know. Do leave in this case some roots surrounding the rhizome to assist in re-establishment.



Mark Chovain said:


> That sounds like it's going to be a chore! I have no experience with it myself, but can only suggest very slowly and carefully digging out as much of the root system as you can. These things can go down several metres though, and like most roots, are extremely delicate.



Hop roots have to be the most rubbery, strong and not delicate at all things I have seen in any plant. I planted my rhizomes in the garden last year and trained them over tomato trellises. You can afford to be very aggressive with them. The rhizomes I dug up, I chopped into pieces based on the growth buds I saw on them. I then cut all the thick roots off. The rhizomes seem to be growing quite well for others in this thread, such as petesbrew, Doc, Gerard_M and Jazzafish to name a couple. I obviously missed a small part, and with no water, no fertiliser, no nothing, I had this pop up a few weeks back.







If I could add anything for those growing hops:

1. The KISS principle applies.
2. DO NOT cut back the initial shoots.
3. Keep the pH between 6 - 7.
4. Water regularly.
5. Fertilise every 6 weeks or so with something like Thrive.
6. Add some mulch around the base.
7. You can seperate them easily by digging up the rhizome if you wish.
8. If you grow them in a pot, remove them at the completion of the season and cut back all the roots. Place the rhizome in wet paper towel and pop it in the fridge until next planting. Replace your potting mix. You'll be amazed at the rootball.


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## Steve (7/11/07)

Thanks Duff for that information. Very interesting. I will do the deed this weekend (with a tear in my eye) and stick it in a pot.
Cheers
Steve


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## floppinab (7/11/07)

Duff said:


> As a plant breeder who is trying to finish writing his %$#@ing PhD thesis, some of your comments mfdes are a long way off the mark.
> 
> ............................................



Where were you when I needed you..!!!!!!! B)


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

http://www.americanbrewmaster.com/growing_hops.htm in "Getting Started"

http://hbd.org/hbd/archive/4731.html#4731-2 "Growing hops in central Texas" <-- Similar latitude to Sydney


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

Duff said:


> As a plant breeder who is trying to finish writing his %$#@ing PhD thesis, some of your comments mfdes are a long way off the mark.



I don't really know that it matters whether you're a student or not. I am talking of experience growing hops where they are grown commercially, here in southern Tas, and not in Sydney. I don't know what level of experience you have breeding hops in Sydney, but I was not aware of a hop breeding program other than the one run by my department and HPS. I am sharing my experiences growing hops, and how I understand them to behave. You cannot generalise experience with other plants to how hops behave...

Again, I am sure there are people lurking here who have had EXACTLY the same problem as I with stunting from low light. As to the rhizomes losing vigour, in my experience they do not, quite the contrary, IF you cut the early growth the moment it breaks the ground, until mid october. Keep in mind they have generally quite a few buds, and are establishing a root system.

However, if you see a stem come up in August, wait to see what happens, it grows up 10-15 centimeters, stalls, and THEN you cut it, the damage is done and the plant's likely gone dormant again. As to whether plants adapt or not, they certainly do over generations. Keep in mind hop varieties are all clones of the same, and as such restricted by what their genes code that they can and cannot do. There is no selection, as we're only propagating vegetatively.

Am I the only one to have seen this happen? I have been growing hops since 1995, and have seen this frequently with newly established plants. Anyone?


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## Duff (7/11/07)

mfdes said:


> http://www.americanbrewmaster.com/growing_hops.htm in "Getting Started"
> 
> http://hbd.org/hbd/archive/4731.html#4731-2 "Growing hops in central Texas" <-- Similar latitude to Sydney



From the first link:

'The first bines that begin to grow may be subject to frost bite. Commercially, all new bines if they come up too early, like in February, will be cut.' 

A quick search shows the minimum temperature of Yakima in February to be around 25F, around -4C. Of course frost bite will injure a plant, but the guys growing here are not doing it commerically and they are planting in spring, in Australia. Soil temperature is the driving factor for the initial shooting. I don't think the guys on the Sunshine Coast are affected by frost, and here in Sydney I haven't seen any frost on my lawn for the past 3 winters. However, all have been advised to cut back the initial shoots which is incorrect.

With around 14h photoperiod now in Sydney, and taking into account the phytochrome activity within the leaf of around 30min either side, the hops are getting sufficient sunlight right now and will continue to right through flowering. And not just here, same applies right the way up to Kevin in Bundaberg, with his reports of good growth, at 25 degrees latitude. Comes back to the point about adaptation.


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## Steve (7/11/07)

mfdes said:


> Anyone?



Two interesting reads mfdes - thanks. I prefer the KISS principle though, chicken shit, compost and treat it like the weed that it is i.e. leave it alone...and let it do its own thing. Each to their own and all that. :icon_chickcheers: 
Cheers
Steve

Edit: Any tips on transplanting a 3-4 metre 10 bine hop plant?


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## drsmurto (7/11/07)

Not yet read those links mfdes, but what happened to my hops are as you suggested. Unlike the ppl in Sydney, spring doesnt mean the end of cold weather, the last frosts in the Adelaide Hills were early October. So my cluster rhizome poked its head up late August and subsequently got frozen to death a week later with the 'nettlehead' like growth. I left it 2 weeks, it did nothing so i cut iut all back. It reemerged recently but its still damn cold at nights on and off so its not done much. The chinook i keep mentioning was from tassie, a colder climate much like the Adelaide Hills and is growing at a rate similar to those down on the plains.

i think before we turn this into another divisive thread (a la no chill) we need to take into account the wildly different climatic conditions that these plants are being grown in and each of these require different treatments.

As an alternate example i gave earlier - my chilli seeds have not germinated yet due to the fact that the average soil temperature has not reached the required levels, this likely is the reason why some of my hops have yet to emerge.


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## mfdes (7/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> i think before we turn this into another divisive thread (a la no chill) we need to take into account the wildly different climatic conditions that these plants are being grown in and each of these require different treatments.



True, and I've said all along that this IS a problem in southern Tas, where we only get 8 hours of daylight in july-august, but I don't know about the big island to the north. 
Apparently spring pruning is widely carried out in the US too:

http://www.cals.uidaho.edu/pses/Research/r..._hopprofile.htm

http://www.ebrew.com/primarynews/hop_rhizomes_planting.htm

http://www.ipmcenters.org/cropprofiles/docs/wahops.html


MFS


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## drsmurto (7/11/07)

Sorry mfdes, wasnt having a go per se, but i will point out thet soil temperature plays a big part and like you, we take a lot longer to get to a warm enough soil temp for some plants to sprout. In the hills we are around a month to 6 weeks behind on the growing season when compared to the plains. I suspect southern tas has even colder average soil temps


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (7/11/07)

Peace man.

Steve.

I have the same problem as you. I had my magnificent first year Chinook that gave me 3 Kgs last year. Then I did a swap with Cannabaceae and he gave me a Hursbruker, a Goldings and a Hallertau. All good size Rhizome root balls. I was really excited to get them and was all set to Plant them in my Veggie patch that I have nurtured for the last five years.

I got home the next day and my wife told me they were selling our house.   

I had to plant them all in pots to my very great disappointment. Not only that but I have been too upset to dig up my Chinook and now I may have left it too late. It just started going beserk last weekend.

To add to my misery, despite its terrific condidtion, the Hersbrucker never came up.

Now we cant find a house with enough garden, and to top it all off, after six years in the same place our rent is going to go up by $200 - $300 per week. SHEEESH

I just hope I can see these babies through to a good planting somewhere worthwhile.
I knew the dream would come to an end.

ATOMT


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## Steve (8/11/07)

I know your pain ATOMT.......I tried convincing my wife that we should wait until winter to buy a new house as the hops would be having a nice nap....she just rolled her eyes and said "I dont think so do you?". They just dont understand the love between a man and his 'op plant!  Good luck man.

Cheers
Steve


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## mfdes (8/11/07)

ATOF,

I don't think you should have too much problem with the chinook, it's one of the most vigorous varieties out there. I have moved hops twice during the growing season before, and as long as you keep the water up to them in the first season (this is crucial, but careful not to waterlog them), they're usually fine. It's the water availability that makes all the diference. Also, on the same note, it pays to make sure you really keep the weeds at bay (I go with bare ground, other people mulch) and don't plant too close to established trees to ensure all the water is available to the hops.

Beers

MFS


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## Lukes (9/11/07)

Started to train them over the line to grow them horizontally as can be seen in the insert pic.
Shot up heaps in the last couple of weeks since the last post thanks to a big dose of fertilizer.


Expecting some warm weather over the weekend that will kick them along even more (they are in full sun all day).
- Luke


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## Thommo (9/11/07)

Steve said:


> I know your pain ATOMT.......I tried convincing my wife that we should wait until winter to buy a new house as the hops would be having a nice nap....she just rolled her eyes and said "I dont think so do you?". They just dont understand the love between a man and his 'op plant!  Good luck man.
> 
> Cheers
> Steve



I got in a heap of trouble last week when I had to admit to the misses that the weeds she wanted me to remove were some Chinook and Columbus I'd planted in our Rose garden out the front.

She was Not happy Jan.


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## mudsta (9/11/07)

Well as a first time hop grower I'm pretty happy with my hops so far.
They have been in just on two months and are growing crazy!!

See attached pics of my hop yard. Poles are 4.5m high off the ground, with two wires strung between the tops of each pole.
I have a total of 84 strings (6 for each plant) tied up to the overhead wires.

The current hight of my hops are below:
Goldings 2.8m!!!
Hersbruker 2.0m
Hallertau 1.9m
Tettnanger 1.25m
Cluster - 0.85m
Chinook - 0.4m

I think my Goldings will reach the top of my wires in two weeks at the speed they are growing. 
I spent a few hours this week removing the excess bines and leaves around the root crown and have also given them a dose of fertilizer.
I have had some issues with leaf wilt; some powdery mildew and the snails also seem to like them.
The wind down here was also really giving them a beating, so I put up some shade cloth, which helped a lot.
They are starting to shoot out side runners all the way up the main bines at each leaf segment, I cant wait to they start to flower!!! 

Does anybody know if I should leave the side shoots on the main bines on or cut them off?

Mudsta :beerbang:


----------



## domonsura (9/11/07)

Nice one Justin, they look like they're doing well. I had a couple of snails try a sneaky one too, bit I put some cane sugar mulch around them and haven't had a problem since. Spider mites have also had a go, I zapped them with a tomato general pest spray and they are gone too.





Cluster starting to head along the string





Hallertau starting to get moving again, but definitely less vigorous than the rest





A couple of POR that Wally gave me, they're just starting to take off but I'm putting them out next to the cluster tonight as the spot they are in has become recently shaded.

I reckon you'd want to leave the side shoots on, the stuff I've read reckons just to try to make sure they don't tangle too badly.


----------



## kabooby (10/11/07)

mudsta said:


> Well as a first time hop grower I'm pretty happy with my hops so far.
> They have been in just on two months and are growing crazy!!
> 
> See attached pics of my hop yard. Poles are 4.5m high off the ground, with two wires strung between the tops of each pole.
> ...



Great Selection of hop plants there Mudsta

My only concern is that if you let them all go than they are all going to grow together. Then it will be a real PITA to try and work out what hops you are actually picking

Kabooby


----------



## Maeldric (12/11/07)

My columbus has already reached about 5m in the air and has started to flower! Have about 30 little flowers on it and a few decent sized cones now  ill post a pic of it later on for yas


----------



## mudsta (12/11/07)

Kabooby,

I think I will leave all the side shoots on the main bines. 
To stop them getting mixed up or tangled I will train them onto the same string with the host bine.

That should keep the little buggers under control!

Mudsta :beerbang:


----------



## drsmurto (12/11/07)

domonsura said:


> Cluster starting to head along the string
> 
> 
> Wayne - thought i was meant to make them grow straight up until they start to shoot sideways?
> ...


----------



## domonsura (12/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Wayne - thought i was meant to make them grow straight up until they start to shoot sideways?
> 
> Was planning on building a 3+ metre tall trellis to allow them to grow straight up until they want to go sideways.
> 
> ...



lol, I dunno man I'm just trying to keep up with the bugger.....I have just been manipulating them to where I want them to go - if they wind around something i don;t want them too, I just carefully unwind, and rewind around something more suitable. It does seem to want to keep going up though, so i may have to move the other end of the string to a higher point......


----------



## Lukes (12/11/07)

mudsta said:


> Well as a first time hop grower I'm pretty happy with my hops so far.
> They have been in just on two months and are growing crazy!!
> 
> See attached pics of my hop yard. Poles are 4.5m high off the ground, with two wires strung between the tops of each pole.
> ...



I would leave the side shoots.
Someone once posted here the mix of 1 part vinegar to 9 parts water to solve mold and mildew issues and I tried it and it worked.




Check out the Red Hill Brewing hopyard as they have been growing for a few years now for the beer they brew and you probably will need a few more poles like this to hang them on as they kick in.

- Luke


----------



## drsmurto (12/11/07)

Lukes said:


> I would leave the side shoots.
> Someone once posted here the mix of 1 part vinegar to 9 parts water to solve mold and mildew issues and I tried it and it worked.
> 
> - Luke



Just mixed up and sprayed on the leaves?

At what point do you remove the lower leaves?


----------



## Lukes (12/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Just mixed up and sprayed on the leaves?
> 
> At what point do you remove the lower leaves?



I just mixed it up in a soft drink bottle and poured it into the base of the plant root ball.
I get rid of the lower leaves when they started to look like they are not working any more and before they go yellow or when I start mulching around the base (in a circle just a little away from the stem) to retain water in summer.

- Luke


----------



## etbandit (12/11/07)

Im starting to grow hops for the first time. I got a rhizhome cutting of Saaz with a shoot that was 40cm long. I kept it in direct sunlight but the tip of the shoot whithered and died but the bottom half of the shoot is still green and looks ok. Will it continue to grow and climb or is it doomed for this season?

Anything I can do to remedy this?


----------



## mfdes (12/11/07)

etbandit said:


> Im starting to grow hops for the first time. I got a rhizhome cutting of Saaz with a shoot that was 40cm long. I kept it in direct sunlight but the tip of the shoot whithered and died but the bottom half of the shoot is still green and looks ok. Will it continue to grow and climb or is it doomed for this season?
> 
> Anything I can do to remedy this?



Keep the water up to it, careful not to waterlog. Assuming you don't have a root rot issue then the plant should continue to grow. You may not get anything but 1st year yields are often negligible.

Also, what are people's experiences growing Saaz?

Here in TAS the commercial growers can't get any crop out of them, as flower initiation consistently fails. Their take is we seem to be too close to the equator for them. Anyone had success getting them to flower?

MFS


----------



## mfdes (12/11/07)

Forgot to add, in my experience one of the most crucial issues in establishing 1st year cuttings is to minimise competition: keep the weeds well at bay. Once established they are weeds themselves, but you'll get better yields if you keep them free of competition.

MFS.


----------



## troydo (12/11/07)

mmm red hill brewer .. i like their beers!!

Im keen to try growing some hops!

What time of year is best to take a tip cutting and get it going?

Any Brissy brewers wanna swing me a cutting?


----------



## Steve (12/11/07)

Troydo said:


> What time of year is best to take a tip cutting and get it going?



Ive taking cuttings when the lateral shoots are at about 20-30cms long (half way through the season). Snip it off, pull the lower few leaves off and stick it in a glass of water, wait for it to shoot roots and plant it in a pot. Very easy.
Cheers
Steve


----------



## randyrob (16/11/07)

In Pots




Goldings




Golden Cluster




Chinhook




Wuertemberger




Columbus Rhizome




Columbus Rhizome 2










me wild hops going nuts this year.


----------



## NickB (16/11/07)

I'd be very keen for some rhizomes/cuttings for next season...anyone feeling generous  Maybe we should have a "Rhi Swap" as well as a Case Swap each few months h34r:

Cheers


----------



## drsmurto (19/11/07)

I still cant find whats eating the leaves of my chinook, possibly earwigs as they are in plague proportions this year and are almost as hard to kill as cockroaches. My garden is organic so that makes life much harder. I did notice some small webs higher up in the plant - spider mites? Altho my reading tells me they dont eat holes in the leaves which look more like aphids or caterpillars. The leaves turn yellow and i cant find any mites or any critters at all. Maybe earwigs after all....

Any organic remedies? I had thought to pick some flowers of the pyrethrum plant and mix that with some soap flakes, chilli and garlic..... 

Cheers
DrSmurto


----------



## Screwtop (19/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> I still cant find whats eating the leaves of my chinook, possibly earwigs as they are in plague proportions this year and are almost as hard to kill as cockroaches. My garden is organic so that makes life much harder. I did notice some small webs higher up in the plant - spider mites? Altho my reading tells me they dont eat holes in the leaves which look more like aphids or caterpillars. The leaves turn yellow and i cant find any mites or any critters at all. Maybe earwigs after all....
> 
> Any organic remedies? I had thought to pick some flowers of the pyrethrum plant and mix that with some soap flakes, chilli and garlic.....
> 
> ...



Same here, white oil worked and fertilise the shit out of them to beat the munchers.


----------



## domonsura (19/11/07)

Yep, you gotta watch those earwigs, they destroy everything. I usually go completely organic, but the garden is getting annihilated by so many different bugs this year that we've been losing half of everything to the bugs :angry: even with garlic interspersed with the plants and using pyrethrum/garlic sprays etc - so reluctantly I have had to resort to a mixture of physical barrier (closing the garden in completely with shadecloth - except the hops) and real chemical warfare - which I'm hoping the exclusion of the bugs etc by the shadecloth will keep to a minimum the chemicals required. I hate chem's but I'm not putting all that work & $$ in to get 5kg of tomatoes back for us, and 25kg for the local insect population. Hopefully I will only need to use the chems once or twice..... <_< 
Last year in the hills was earwig city - and they aren't easy to get rid of either. I managed to stave off everything else naturally, but the earwigs won in the end. I wouldn't be suprised if it's them eating the hops for you, they seem to eat anything and get in everywhere.


----------



## Screwtop (19/11/07)

NickB said:


> I'd be very keen for some rhizomes/cuttings for next season...anyone feeling generous  Maybe we should have a "Rhi Swap" as well as a Case Swap each few months h34r:
> 
> Cheers



Happy to join in a Rhi/Cutting swap. If you want to kick off a thread for a swap in 2008 I'll join up Nick.

Took six cuttings near the end of last season, just stuck them in potting mix, all grew but unfortunately only two reappeared after winter. This year I'll take them earlier and strike them in water first as others have done. I owe four cuttings next year to brewers who missed out this year, but plan on taking a over a dozen Wurttemberger cuttings this season as the bloody thing has gone mental, flowering now.

Swapping plants that have taken root would be best kept among brewers who live close to each other, for longer distances rhizomes can be swapped via post during the winter rest, simply packed in damp cottonwool and wrapped in newspaper. 

Screwy


----------



## drsmurto (19/11/07)

Organic gardening is tough but the more chemicals you spray the more of the good bugs you kill. Earwigs are normally kept under control by lizards/geckos etc but i think the drought has affected their population. My garden is also next to a creek so it would be eco terrorism to apply anything chemical. I am hoping that if i keep restocking the pak choi they will keep eating that and leave my other plants alone.

i have interspersed companion plants amongst the tomatoes, capsicum etc. Pyrethrum, marigolds and borage. 

My hop plants are all in the ground rather than in pots but are only 1st year. Am i likely to be able to pull of side shoots and not dramatically reduce my yields? I noticed already that shoots are coming of the sides from as long as 10 cm form the ground. Would these be good to remove and see if i can get then to take? I read that i am suppose to prune them below 1 m anyway to prevent mould etc but i thought that was once the cones appear?


----------



## apd (19/11/07)

Steve said:


> Anyone had to dig up and transplant their growing rhizome? Im moving house early december. My POR is already 3-4 metres tall :angry:
> Cheers
> Steve



Yes, I've done this but I did it after flowering when it was time to cut it back. I'm not sure that moving it mid-season would allow you to keep this year's crop.

Andrew


----------



## winkle (19/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> (snip)
> This year I'll take them earlier and strike them in water first as others have done. I owe four cuttings next year to brewers who missed out this year, but plan on taking a over a dozen Wurttemberger cuttings this season as the bloody thing has gone mental, flowering now.
> 
> Swapping plants that have taken root would be best kept among brewers who live close to each other, for longer distances rhizomes can be swapped via post during the winter rest, simply packed in damp cottonwool and wrapped in newspaper.
> ...



Your blood is worth bottling, mate :super:


----------



## Fourstar (19/11/07)

wow... i really need to get my hands on some rhizomes. Just missed the season this year but next im hoping to get my hands on some chinook and a noble variety! Mmmmmmmm!


----------



## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (20/11/07)

AngelTearsOnMyTongue said:


> I had to plant them all in pots to my very great disappointment. Not only that but I have been too upset to dig up my Chinook and now I may have left it too late. It just started going beserk last weekend.




Just to follow up on this.

I watered the crap out of it the day before the transplant.
Dug out a root / earth ball about the size of a basket ball, leaving all bines and growth in place and put it in a good size pot.

To my amazement, the next day was hot as hell and the plant didnt even wilt. Its bines are rocketing on and searching out any handhold (Binehold) they can find.

Unfortunately my Hallertau which poked up about 6 weeks ago went brown and died back having only got to about 10cm. Over the last few days some more shoots have appeared.

I love these plants. If you stand and look at them long enough, you may find one has effectionately wound a bine around your ankle.

Dont know as yet what I am going to do with these four pots of hops however as we have to move on 14th Dec and our new place will not be ready til 24th Jan. Mmmmmmmmmmmmm.

ATOMT


----------



## Chris (20/11/07)

NickB said:


> I'd be very keen for some rhizomes/cuttings for next season...anyone feeling generous  Maybe we should have a "Rhi Swap" as well as a Case Swap each few months h34r:
> 
> Cheers






Screwtop said:


> Happy to join in a Rhi/Cutting swap. If you want to kick off a thread for a swap in 2008 I'll join up Nick.
> 
> ...plan on taking a over a dozen Wurttemberger cuttings this season as the bloody thing has gone mental, flowering now.
> 
> ...



Yeah I reckon I'll have a few wuertemberger to swap too. second year in a big pot and it has about 20 shoots with the main ones seriously challenging the Mt Hood. I have about 12 trained allready, so probably cut off and strike the rest.


----------



## drsmurto (20/11/07)

Just repeating an earlier question. Am i able to pull off some side shoots this early? My chinook is about 8 foot high now and going crazy ith loads of side shoots appearing from as low as 10 cm off the ground. Can i snip a few of these off and put them in water to see if they grow roots? Will snipping of side shoots below 2 m effect the yield? i would have thought removing more side shoots would promote cone production.....


----------



## Steve (20/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Just repeating an earlier question. Am i able to pull off some side shoots this early? My chinook is about 8 foot high now and going crazy ith loads of side shoots appearing from as low as 10 cm off the ground. Can i snip a few of these off and put them in water to see if they grow roots? Will snipping of side shoots below 2 m effect the yield? i would have thought removing more side shoots would promote cone production.....





When you say side shoots are you meaning smaller shoots coming from the ground or side shoots coming from the main bine at the junction of a leaf? If so yeah, chop them and stick em in a glass of water and put on a window sill.


----------



## drsmurto (20/11/07)

Steve said:


> When you say side shoots are you meaning smaller shoots coming from the ground or side shoots coming from the main bine at the junction of a leaf? If so yeah, chop them and stick em in a glass of water and put on a window sill.



Not coming from the ground, these are coming off the main bine. How long should i let them grow before attempting to snip them off and putting them in a glass of water. 

And once they grow roots? Bung em in a pot and see what they do? 

Cheers
DrSmurto


----------



## Screwtop (20/11/07)

My Wurttemberger on steroids. Flowering already!


----------



## Steve (20/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Not coming from the ground, these are coming off the main bine. How long should i let them grow before attempting to snip them off and putting them in a glass of water.
> 
> And once they grow roots? Bung em in a pot and see what they do?
> 
> ...




About 10-20cms, snip em off, leave a few of the leaves on the top, put them in water, once you have roots growing put in a pot of fresh/new seedling potting mix and then.... yes see what they do. Thats what I did. Trough Lollys POR is now a very nice healthy plant.

Cheers
Steve


----------



## drsmurto (20/11/07)

Well that sounds easy.

If i can get things to work will be happy trade hops next year. If my cascade takes off i suspect i might have a few takers.......What hops cant we grow downunder? - ive never seen any one mention amarillo or saaz.


----------



## troydo (20/11/07)

Im in nick and screwy, i have nothing to swap except some cash but im keen to give some hop growing a go!


----------



## KillerRx4 (20/11/07)

DrSmurto said:


> Well that sounds easy.
> 
> If i can get things to work will be happy trade hops next year. If my cascade takes off i suspect i might have a few takers.......What hops cant we grow downunder? - ive never seen any one mention amarillo or saaz.



AFAIK Amarillo is a proprietary strain. 

When you take the cuttings expect them to take 1-2 weeks for roots to shoot. When you pot them, keep them in a shady area for a while, Ive had my last few attempts this season wilt & die from too much sun (I think).


----------



## tangent (20/11/07)

don't expect the same hop character when grown here. look at Kiwi Saaz compared to the proper stuff.
same plant, but vastly different character.

and yes, taking cuttings has never been easier. my gardening skills are pretty crappy but i do have 2x hersbrucker cuttings in a glass of water almost full of roots.


----------



## mudsta (20/11/07)

Sweet!!! You guys have just made my day!  

I thought that only new plants should be grown from taking cuttings off the rhizomes thick roots.
Reading the posts saying I can strike new plants from the main bines side shoots is fantastic!

Now it will take no time to increase my total amount of hop plants! Bring on the hop invasion!

AHB is the coolest! :beer: 

Mudsta :beerbang:


----------



## mudsta (20/11/07)

Wally,

How well do they grow in the following season? 
I guess what I mean is - how long does it take for the plant to build up a decent rhizome? And get any yield?
Any help would be great.

Mudsta :beerbang:


----------



## mfdes (20/11/07)

tangent said:


> don't expect the same hop character when grown here. look at Kiwi Saaz compared to the proper stuff.
> same plant, but vastly different character.



Kiwi Saaz is not Saaz, but new triploid varieties bred from saaz, and bear no resemblance to it. This is also the case, for example, with Nelson Sauvin, which is a seedling of smoothcone, and Cascade, which is a seedling of Fuggle. None of them bear resemblance to the parent in character.

Saaz is not grown commercially in either New Zealand or Australia as they cannot get them to flower. They are adapted to the much longer daylength of central and northern Europe and have photoperiodicity problems this close to the equator (Bushy Park, TAS). The commercial experience with these is that they want to shoot way to early, go dormant again straight away, and by the time they shoot again have no time to put on enough growth to flower well, if at all. HPA (Hop Products Australia) have a breeding program and are trialling thousands of Saaz and Hallertau seedlings, so a half decent one may come soon. They have one that analytically tests identical to Czeck Saaz, so we'll see.

MFS


----------



## Chris (20/11/07)

Thats good news mfds about a possible decent aussie saaz or halletau cultivar, pity the yanks and kiwis did it 20 odd years ago. Hmmm Kaichen HPA?




Screwtop said:


> My Wurttemberger on steroids. Flowering already!



Im green with envy Screwy, how many seasons have you had the werty?




KillerRx4 said:


> AFAIK Amarillo is a proprietary strain.
> 
> When you take the cuttings expect them to take 1-2 weeks for roots to shoot. When you pot them, keep them in a shady area for a while, Ive had my last few attempts this season wilt & die from too much sun (I think).



Keep them in semi shade, I had about 12 Mt Hood struck cuttings die from the severe Aussie sun last year.


----------



## Screwtop (20/11/07)

Chris said:


> Im green with envy Screwy, how many seasons have you had the werty?



Second flowering season Chris. One gi-normous bine emerged and ran up the fence and twine in about a fortnight. It's really thick and the rhizome is around 250mm long and 55mm thick this year. Digging around in the vegie garden I've come across roots almost a metre away from the rhizome. Last year the Perle grew some weak bines about 200mm high, so I moved it to the same location during winter, it's now about 1.5M high so hops like the position/soil. I rotate organic and chemical fertiliser into the garden each 3 months (blood and bone then CK88).

Gonna toss a big handfull of flowers into a Zwickel Weizen tomorrow.


----------



## Lukes (21/11/07)

Screwy, 
Not far behind you northerners as I have a few early flowers (stigmas) starting to show too.
I picked up a roll of clothes line wire and they seem to like being trained along it.

Looks like this year I will be making a few harvest ale's earlier than March  

I will take some cuttings and get them going for a winter swap / trade





BTW: What is the Wurttemberger like? Noble, higher than the current 2% euro's  ?
Hopefully it's better than the Tassie Tet's or Hall as I agree with MFS as they are far from Noble.

- Luke


----------



## Screwtop (21/11/07)

Lukes said:


> Screwy,
> Not far behind you northerners as I have a few early flowers (stigmas) starting to show too.
> I picked up a roll of clothes line wire and they seem to like being trained along it.
> 
> ...



As for AA who would know without testing. From my limited knowledge Wurttemberger is a hop native to the Baden?Wurtemberg area nd is most likely related to Tettnung/Saaz. 

Maybe mfdes can add some info on this as Wurttemberg were brought to Tassie during the 80's. That's where my Rhizome came from, not sure if they are grown commercially there. Adding a big double handfull of fresh flowers at 30 min gives a nice flavour but the greatest impact I find is that the beer has a really fine creamy stick to the lip head.

Screwy


----------



## mfdes (21/11/07)

I'll find out


----------



## mfdes (21/11/07)

The plant breeder at Hop Products Australia has never heard of them. Never been grown commercially down here apparently. 
I wonder where the original material came from. As you said Wurttenberger just means from Wurttenberg, as Hallertauer means from Hallertau and Tettnanger means from Tettnang, with no indication of the variety. 

MFS.


----------



## Lukes (21/11/07)

The hop of mystery. 
Maybe someone else growing them or Mr Ferguson has a bit more info?

Screwy, I too love the affect of late fresh flowers and have been buying a few of the Kiwi ones lately.



There's a little cara in there to help too  

- Luke


----------



## braufrau (21/11/07)

Lukes said:


> BTW: What is the Wurttemberger like? Noble, higher than the current 2% euro's  ?
> Hopefully it's better than the Tassie Tet's or Hall as I agree with MFS as they are far from Noble.
> 
> - Luke



So what are all these hops like grown all over the place in the land of Oz?
How much does the climate effect the flavour and aroma.
Are Adelaide Saaz comparable to Czech Saaz? Bisbane Goldings to East Kent??


----------



## Screwtop (21/11/07)

braufrau said:


> So what are all these hops like grown all over the place in the land of Oz?
> How much does the climate effect the flavour and aroma.
> Are Adelaide Saaz comparable to Czech Saaz? Bisbane Goldings to East Kent??



BF, I think the differences in climate, soil, daylight etc will result in something unique in each variety similar to wine grapes. So what you get, you get!



mfdes said:


> The plant breeder at Hop Products Australia has never heard of them. Never been grown commercially down here apparently.
> I wonder where the original material came from. As you said Wurttenberger just means from Wurttenberg, as Hallertauer means from Hallertau and Tettnanger means from Tettnang, with no indication of the variety.
> 
> MFS.



I contacted Stuart Ferguson for some background info, he directed me to John Ross at Hopco who replied:


> The Wurtemberger that you purchased from Stewart was imported from Germany in the late 80s. It was sent to us as a variety that may be of interest and that might grow well in Australia. I do not have any information in my system on this variety any more. For further information you might try Joh Barth & Sohn in Germany. You might also find the spelling WURTTEMBERGER will give you more information.
> 
> John Ross



Contacted John Barth and Sohn in Germany, their reply:


> Dear Sir,
> We have not heard of that variety either. As a matter of fact a variety by
> that name has never existed officially.
> I can imagine that the variety in question is Tettnang. Tettnang is a
> ...



Then Zwickel checked with Alexbrand in Germany who found this information for me:


> Hi!
> 
> Short info, what my german brewing colleagues found out:
> 
> ...



I like the aroma, it is very similar to Tett.


----------



## braufrau (21/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> As for AA who would know without testing. From my limited knowledge Wurttemberger is a hop native to the Baden?Wurtemberg area nd is most likely related to Tettnung/Saaz.



So what do people assume for AA of their home grown hops?
Whatever beersmith tells them?


----------



## oldbugman (21/11/07)

Use a commercial hop to bitter and leave the home grown for finishing seems to be the smartest way to do it.


----------



## Simon W (21/11/07)

I seem to remember someone in the 2006 thread saying to chew a flower!
I think it went something like this: Time however long it took 'till you had to spit out the flower, say 4 seconds, and subtract from 10 to give an approximate AA. 10-4 = 6%
Obviously not accurate and useless for high-alpha, but from memory it gets pretty close.


----------



## Quintrex (21/11/07)

Simon W said:


> I seem to remember someone in the 2006 thread saying to chew a flower!
> I think it went something like this: Time however long it took 'till you had to spit out the flower, say 4 seconds, and subtract from 10 to give an approximate AA. 10-4 = 6%
> Obviously not accurate and useless for high-alpha, but from memory it gets pretty close.



Heh, thats funny!!! Does it work?

Obviously some individual calibration is required, so use a commercial hop flower of known alpha acid, to work out your values  

Q


----------



## Simon W (21/11/07)

Dunno, maybe the originator of that could post an update?.....


----------



## Ross (23/11/07)

Woo Hoo.... My Columbus has cones B) 




The cones are still small , but they are everywhere  



Cheers Ross


----------



## Jye (23/11/07)

Ross said:


> Woo Hoo.... My Columbus has cones B)
> 
> Cheers Ross



Ill be around for a rhizome later


----------



## brendanos (23/11/07)

My plants still continue to be harassed by what I believe to be slugs and spider mites. Very frustrating! Poor buggers are still struggling to get off the ground


----------



## johnno (23/11/07)

My plants are up but considering they follow their botanical cousins flowering cycle I do not anticipate any signs of flowers yet. And a harvest in April hopefully.

cheers
johnno


----------



## Screwtop (23/11/07)

Ross said:


> Woo Hoo.... My Columbus has cones B)
> 
> View attachment 16136
> 
> ...




Looks good! Can I pinch a tip cutting next time I'm in Carbrookistan? will bring a Wurttemberger to swap.


----------



## Ross (23/11/07)

Screwtop said:


> Looks good! Can I pinch a tip cutting next time I'm in Carbrookistan? will bring a Wurttemberger to swap.



You are welcome mate, any time.

cheers Ross


----------



## randyrob (4/12/07)

My Columbus Christmas Tree


----------



## braufrau (4/12/07)

So Ross .. I guess no one told your bines that they don't grow north of Adelaide??
What does the shorter summer day length do to hops? Looks like the heat doesn't worry them!


----------



## Lukes (4/12/07)

randyrob said:


> My Columbus Christmas Tree
> View attachment 16396



Rob, that is quite festive.
Don't forget to leave Santa a little something under there on xmas eve.

- Luke


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## Lukes (6/12/07)

My cluster hop as of October and the latest December shot.
It takes the old 30 ltr no chill cube full of water every Saturday and Tuesday with a slow drip watering system connected to the cube tap.
I will get some xmas decorations on it this weekend and make it a little festive like Rob's.

- Luke

Edit: watering times !


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## tk75 (6/12/07)

I wonder...Is it too late to plant now? I would really like to get a hop plant going...even 2 or 3. Or does anyone in Melb. have a plant forsale??


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## Lukes (6/12/07)

maltaddict,*
* I took some tip cutting the other week but they are no looking too healthy and I think I may have left it a little late in the season for them to grow roots.
Best to get the dormant roots in winter and plant them at the end of winter.


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## AngelTearsOnMyTongue (6/12/07)

brendanos said:


> My plants still continue to be harassed by what I believe to be slugs and spider mites. Very frustrating! Poor buggers are still struggling to get off the ground





Maybe you could build some little ladders for them or even just lift them up onto the leaves........

 

Sorry. Pest problems are not a funny matter


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## domonsura (6/12/07)

He could also do what i did, throw my organic gardening principles to the wind, say "#@#[email protected]## IT" in disgust after seeing what the latest round of pests did to _all_ of the plants in the garden - and get nasty with 'Rhodor'(pesticide) and some fungicide. Not a hell of a lot happening pest or mildew wise in the garden now.....yet it doesn't even cause the earwigs to blink... :huh: I looked up what i would have to use on the earwigs(carbaryl), and I just plain refuse to. There's pesticides, and then there's 'are you #[email protected]##@ nuts?!?!...' So I've taken to physical removal with the earwigs. I put rolled up bits of corrugated cardboard all over the place, they hide in it and you take them away and burn/drown them. Yep....it's medieval mixed with modern chemical warfare....now I'm starting to get veges out of the garden again, and the hops are starting to recover from spidermite and what looked like the beginnings of mildew.....


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## beerguide (6/12/07)

For mildew, try to encourage 'lady bettles/lady birds/lady bugs' into your garden - specfically the yellow ones. They love eating mildew off leaves.

A good plant for attracting them is Dill, maybe plant some near your affected areas Domonsura?


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## braufrau (6/12/07)

domonsura said:


> I put rolled up bits of corrugated cardboard all over the place, they hide in it and you take them away and burn/drown them. Yep....it's medieval mixed with modern chemical warfare....now I'm starting to get veges out of the garden again, and the hops are starting to recover from spidermite and what looked like the beginnings of mildew.....



When I used to have a worm farm the earwigs would hide in teh newspaper I covered the top with.
I'd periodically shake the paper out for the chooks who would go berserk for them.
Maybe you need some chooks.


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## tk75 (6/12/07)

braufrau said:


> When I used to have a worm farm the earwigs would hide in teh newspaper I covered the top with.
> I'd periodically shake the paper out for the chooks who would go berserk for them.
> Maybe you need some chooks.



Surely there is a 'Feedin The Chooks' joke in there somewhere :lol: :lol:


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## winkle (6/12/07)

NickB is the resident Chook expert I believe h34r:


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## domonsura (6/12/07)

I used to have chooks, I loved it - fresh eggs etc, but they woudn't be practical here in suburbia on our little lot. Too much else for them to get into...and I've never trusted them in the garden around my other plants, they can be worse then the original problem if they discover something they like....

Might have to try planting some dill anyway, I knew I was missing something important... I need a bigger garden....:blink:


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## drsmurto (7/12/07)

My earwig problem seems to have stopped, or at the very least, reduced.

I took the organic approach as my garden is right next to a creek and dug holes which i placed pots in and filled up with screwed up newspaper. In theory i should take them out each morning and shake the earwigs into a bucket of boiling water but the resident blackbirds have clued up and pull the newspaper out and get an easy feed. I then put the newspaper back in the pots and repeat. Dill. A herb i dont have. Got a few spare places in the garden i could fill with dill.

Carbaryl was recommended to me by my local hardware/fodder store. They told me it was 'close to organic'. WTF??!! Nuclear warfare is more organic than that shit. It kills just about everything. 

And some good news, my cluster plant is alive. I thought when i cut it back after discussions here about nettling that it would never come back to life but in the last week new shoots have emerged. And i have noticed 2 little leaves poking thru on my cascade. The 2 goldings are however, still asleep on the job.....


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## turto77 (7/12/07)

Hi all,
I scored some hops seeds from ebay and was just wondering if it would be to late to be planting them now.


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## domonsura (7/12/07)

I reckon you'd be able to get them started, but you'd need to protect them from the heat and keep them moist. I reckon you'd want a little propagating tray & cover or seedling tent out of direct sunlight. I got some also and I got pl,anting instructions with them, but when mine arrived most of them had been unfortunately squashed flat by auspost. The seller (Rupert) refunded my purchase back to me immediately, so no complaints there and I'll be making sure I spend at least the same amount with him next year if he is selling rhizomes etc....


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## turto77 (7/12/07)

Thanks Domonsura, i will have a go at planting them this weekend.


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## beerguide (7/12/07)

I thought with seeds you may not be sure of sex of the resultant plant whereas with Rhizomes you would....?


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## Guest Lurker (7/12/07)

DrSmurto said:


> And some good news, my cluster plant is alive. I thought when i cut it back after discussions here about nettling that it would never come back to life but in the last week new shoots have emerged. And i have noticed 2 little leaves poking thru on my cascade.


Hey D S
You need to cut those shoots off in order to have them grow properly


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## domonsura (7/12/07)

Yeah, you need to cut them off, put them in some soil after dipping them in rooting hormone and then bring them to the swap. I'll dispose of those nasty little troublesome offshoots....


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## Thommo (7/12/07)

How's this for a huge problem with my hops.

I planted some Chinook and Columbus out the front of our Town house in the rose garden. Was just about to start training them up a stake, when they started to turn brown and die off over a few days, along with a couple of weeds that were in there as well.

The F#%$ gardeners must have given them a spray with something.

At least I still have my Perle and Mt Hood out the back.


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## Doc (9/12/07)

With all the wet weather and thunderstorms we've been having my hops haven't seem to have grown much at all.
So surprise me when on closer inspection I see that the Columbus and bourne cones. 







The others haven't but are all looking good.




Beers,
Doc


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## Ross (9/12/07)

braufrau said:


> So Ross .. I guess no one told your bines that they don't grow north of Adelaide??
> What does the shorter summer day length do to hops? Looks like the heat doesn't worry them!



Hi Braufrau - sorry I missed your Q.

They seem to be thriving, but the shorter days will apparently decrease the hop yield. I think it was QldKev (where is he these days) that showed pics of his last year, that were laden in hops right up in Bundaberg.
Hoping for slightly better next year, once they've had time to settle in their new pots, but since they only get the afternoon sun where I've planted them, I'm not expecting too much other than foliage...

cheers Ross


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## kevnlis (9/12/07)

Ross said:


> Hi Braufrau - sorry I missed your Q.
> 
> They seem to be thriving, but the shorter days will apparently decrease the hop yield. I think it was QldKev (where is he these days) that showed pics of his last year, that were laden in hops right up in Bundaberg.
> Hoping for slightly better next year, once they've had time to settle in their new pots, but since they only get the afternoon sun where I've planted them, I'm not expecting too much other than foliage...
> ...



Is there another Kev here in Bundy? I did not know that!

I have a hop plant up here, but I think the soil is too sandy, I am gonna pile some clay up around it and hope it washes into the soil and improves the growth a bit.


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## johnno (9/12/07)

lol..just had a look at mt POR out the front. I have bareley glanced at it this year so far.

I have not put any support up for it yet and it is starting to support itself, growing upwards.

Starting to look like a hedge.

cheers
johnno


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## the_fuzz (9/12/07)

domonsura said:


> I reckon you'd be able to get them started, but you'd need to protect them from the heat and keep them moist. I reckon you'd want a little propagating tray & cover or seedling tent out of direct sunlight. I got some also and I got pl,anting instructions with them, but when mine arrived most of them had been unfortunately squashed flat by auspost. The seller (Rupert) refunded my purchase back to me immediately, so no complaints there and I'll be making sure I spend at least the same amount with him next year if he is selling rhizomes etc....



I got the cascade/Kent seeds - been in little punnet pots of a week in the garage - right next to the fermenters - I was hoping the cascade smell coming out of the fermenter, might entice the seeds to sprout  

Roughly how long until you would normally see a shoot come through the soil?

Also in there anyway to tell which is male and female early on?


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## glennheinzel (9/12/07)

Damn. We just had a massive hail storm and my hop is looking a bit shabby at the moment. Hopefully it will come good in a couple of days.


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## Doc (9/12/07)

Mine aren't looking as pretty as they did a few hours ago either Rukh.
A number of the longer bines that were growing horizontal at the top of my trellis were cut off. 

Doc


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## NRB (9/12/07)

You guys sure do get some decent hail stones up yonder.


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## glennheinzel (9/12/07)

Hey Doc,

Mine was mostly protected because of the direction that the hail hit. The exposed bine looked battered, but came good when the sun came out.

At least you have some "cuttings" to offer.

Cheers,

Rukh.


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## Doc (9/12/07)

Rukh said:


> At least you have some "cuttings" to offer.



Just a lottery of which plant variety they came from 

Doc


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## Linz (10/12/07)

Ive been trying to search out fixes to problem with hops with no avail.....

Ive got one long bine to about 2.5m, but I feel theres a bug eating the leaves and now the new growth on the lower plants are throwing new growth but is appearing spotted/faded???

Whats the fix??? 2 years and nothing yet from this Cluster.....


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## drsmurto (10/12/07)

Linz said:


> Ive been trying to search out fixes to problem with hops with no avail.....
> 
> Ive got one long bine to about 2.5m, but I feel theres a bug eating the leaves and now the new growth on the lower plants are throwing new growth but is appearing spotted/faded???
> 
> Whats the fix??? 2 years and nothing yet from this Cluster.....



Sounds exactly the same as my chinook which is growing faster than whatever is trying to eat it. 

I am no longer organic, i took Waynes approach and nuked the garden last night. Partner went to town on the tomato dusting and when i read the contents was surprised to find it contains carbaryl! And i thought i was just sulphur. So i doused my hops with that too  . I DARE any little critter to have a go now. Double dare you! After a week of not looking to closely at the garden just about every vegie is being eaten so drastic action was needed. 

Cheers
DrSmurto


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## Fents (10/12/07)

yep getting the munching bugs / spotted leaves too. whenever i tap or shake my leaves these tiny little white / brown critters fly off. Have put mulch (lucerine) around the base now and might give em a spray with morning fresh dishwashing soap mixed with water in a bottle. morning fresh is meant to not harm the plant but bugs hate it too.


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## chovain (10/12/07)

Linz said:


> Ive got one long bine to about 2.5m, but I feel theres a bug eating the leaves and now the new growth on the lower plants are throwing new growth but is appearing spotted/faded???



My Tardif had a problem with bugs that started about 3 weeks ago (when it was about 1.5m high). It started out as spotty leaves, which I'm told is the baby grubs eating their way out. I spent about 3 days holding each leaf up to the sun to spot the little critters, and treating the problem organically (my vegetarian GF didn't initially approve of my interpretation of "organic", but soon came around to the idea that it was going to be either the grubs or the beer supply ).

I killed about 40 caterpillars on the first day, 10 on the second, then only one or two on the third. The vine is now about 3m tall, and has leaf damage up to about the 1m mark. We now have a praying mantis and a couple of spiders living in the lower levels of the vine. I now carefully check the band around the top of the leaf damage (about 3 leaves down and 3 leaves up) a couple of times a week to make sure there are no more pests, but I don't bother clearing the lower levels any more (I just do a quick check to make sure there isn't an infestation, but don't kill anything). By letting the predators feed, I don't need to spend as much time looking after the vine. The vine seems to be doing quite well for it, too. The damage doesn't appear to be getting any worse, and the insects are thriving.

I'm not sure if there's anything you can do to promote predators on your vine - perhaps you could look through the rest of your garden for some specimens to manually transfer.


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## Simon W (10/12/07)

Doc, that hail is trippy! Pic on right looks like corn-on-the-cob!


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## johnno (10/12/07)

Here is a pic of the POR.

Starting to kill al the weeds around it.

Have a gander at the crap quality of the soil. More like dust really.






cheers
johnno


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## blackbock (10/12/07)

This wet and warm weather had made my plants take off this year, I fertilised early on, just after they shot out of the ground, but haven't needed to since. Here's hoping for a good harvest this year.










Linz, I had the problem of the mysterious leaf-eating menace last season, turned out to be a well-camoflaged green caterpillar, so look hard all over the stems and even underneath the leaves and you may stop the problem in its tracks.


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## QldKev (10/12/07)

Ross said:


> Hi Braufrau - sorry I missed your Q.
> 
> They seem to be thriving, but the shorter days will apparently decrease the hop yield. I think it was QldKev (where is he these days) that showed pics of his last year, that were laden in hops right up in Bundaberg.
> Hoping for slightly better next year, once they've had time to settle in their new pots, but since they only get the afternoon sun where I've planted them, I'm not expecting too much other than foliage...
> ...




Hey, I'm still around; mainly just a reader these day.

The hops that were from fresh rhizomes were planted into pots; they got to about 7m last season, and I got about about 400g wet of them (about 100g dry weight).

This year they are still in the same pots, and have started shooting later but have already climbed over 3m, and when I remember to water them really do well.

An idea on last years crop

26 Aug 2006 - Planted newly purchased rhizomes
2 Sep 2006 - New shoots after 1 week
16 Sep 2006 - 600cm POR starting to boom; the Mt Hood is not far behind
23 Sep 2006 1200cm Right hand stem has caught up and taken over, thats 2 foot growth in 1 week. Also had a stem breakage on the Mt Hood
07 Oct 2006 2800 cm
14 Oct 2006 3300cm 
28 Jan 2007 Approx 6m each These things are taking over the back patio, have so far done 2 fresh hop beers; picked on 26 Jan 93grams, after 2 days drying have 27g of harvest. 

Didn't keep anymore log from here

Catch you later....

kevinlis maybe us Bundy boys better get together with AndrewQld for a beer..
(and any other locals on the list)

PS. AndrewQld hows your hops growing this season?


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## petesbrew (13/12/07)

Since the decent amount of rain we've been getting for the past month, my Columbus has grown 4-5 new bines which are now starting to overtake 2 of the original bines, which aren't even 1 foot. The 3rd one has thankfully taken off again and is approaching 4 foot now.
I'm not sure if I should cut any back. Any suggestions? It's only in a pot plant too.


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## chovain (13/12/07)

petesbrew said:


> I'm not sure if I should cut any back. Any suggestions? It's only in a pot plant too.


Have you considered cutting them all back? I've heard it's really good for them :lol:
(Only joking)


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## glennheinzel (13/12/07)

My chinook had one bine which grew pretty high whilst the other bine got to about 10cm and stayed there. The smaller bine sat at that height for a couple of months so I recently decided to trim it back (to allow the main bine to get all the goodness).

In the week since I cut the small bine off, the regrowth is probably 40cm high and is going great.


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## braufrau (13/12/07)

Mark Chovain said:


> I killed about 40 caterpillars on the first day, 10 on the second, then only one or two on the third. The vine is now about 3m tall, and has leaf damage up to about the 1m mark.



Have you tried a physical barrier to whatever owns the caterpillars? I have net curtains from the op shop over my cabbages and they are finally growing faster than they are eaten because the moths can't get in.

I haven't had any trouble with my hops (touch wood) but let me tell you about pear and cherry slug .... another time perhaps.


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## aspro (13/12/07)

Gday All

How are all the Perth Hops going, mine seen to be struggling a bit.Not sure if its the weather or me.

Cheers Aspro


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## Doogiechap (13/12/07)

aspro said:


> Gday All
> 
> How are all the Perth Hops going, mine seen to be struggling a bit.Not sure if its the weather or me.
> 
> Cheers Aspro



Bloke, my Nugget is coming alone nicely  . I planted the rhisome in late Sept and is probably about 7 or 8' high/ long and is probably growing 3-4 inchs a day at the moment. Piccy's soon  .
Cheers
Doug


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## aspro (13/12/07)

Holy Crap Doug thats fast ,mine might need a bit more TLC then.


Cheers Aspro


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## Keifer (13/12/07)

My Tettnanger & POR which are in their second year in the ground (no flowers first year) are finally starting to make some remarkable growth. 

This year i got Perle, Columbus and Goldings. All into pots.

Silverwater Goldings has died. RIP.

Columbus in the last few days has taken off (seasol is good stuff) and is about 1.5 meters high.

Perle has brought his a-game. In a short filled pot, has grown with many bines and the main bine is now prolly 2.5-3 meters long (up and then along a wire).

Will take some pics when it stops raining.

Might finally get my first home grown hops into a batch


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## Doogiechap (14/12/07)

Doogiechap said:


> Bloke, my Nugget is coming alone nicely  . I planted the rhisome in late Sept and is probably about 7 or 8' high/ long and is probably growing 3-4 inchs a day at the moment. Piccy's soon  .
> Cheers
> Doug


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## amita (14/12/07)

aspro said:


> Gday All
> 
> How are all the Perth Hops going, mine seen to be struggling a bit.Not sure if its the weather or me.
> 
> ...


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## Steve (14/12/07)

Thats a massif POR I reckon. Exact same leaves as mine.
Cheers
Steve


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## amita (14/12/07)

Steve said:


> Thats a massif POR I reckon. Exact same leaves as mine.
> Cheers
> Steve



forgive the ignorance but what does POR stand for and what do I compare it with ,where does it originate and what are its main qualities?

cheers amita


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## Stuster (14/12/07)

Amita, it stands for Pride of Ringwood, an Australian hop. There's heaps of info on it in this thread.


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## troydo (14/12/07)

Pride Of Ringwood


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## amita (14/12/07)

Stuster said:


> Amita, it stands for Pride of Ringwood, an Australian hop. There's heaps of info on it in this thread.



thanks Bindi and Stuster

I am the proud father of POR  

cheers amita


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## Lukes (14/12/07)

P.O.M.R
pride of margaret river


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## amita (14/12/07)

Lukes said:


> P.O.M.R
> pride of margaret river




happy man!!!


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## Steve (14/12/07)

amita said:


> forgive the ignorance but what does POR stand for and what do I compare it with ,where does it originate and what are its main qualities?
> 
> cheers amita



Pride of Ringwood, Origin...no idea, mainly used in aussie ales as well as some of the well known commercial beers. Search for POR and you will get lots of ideas for its uses. Some good, some bad. I use my own POR along with cluster a few times for aussie type AG ales.
Cheers
Steve


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## aspro (14/12/07)

Hey 

Nice pics Doug and amita ,I will be raiding the chook shed tonight for some poo, and putting a drip system in I think cause the sprayers dont do much.


Cheers Aspro


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## mashdog (14/12/07)

Hi fellow hopsters.

Just couldn't resist putting up some photos of my new babies. Planted these rhizomes in the North Adelaide ground late september 2007. The one on the left is chinook, middle is goldings and right is tettnanger. This is my first hop growing experience and have loved it so far.

November 1st 2007: The goldings (the biggest rhizome planted) has absolutely taken off. I;m supporting 4 bines (two up each string). The chinook on the left and the tettnanger are both starting off slow.



December 1st 2007: The chinook has been the suprise package this month. Only one bine really took hold and has shot past the goldings. Both are now the length of the horizontal strings. The chinook has small flowers starting to form. 3 tettnanger bines are almost fence high now but no sign of flowers yet.




December 14th 2007: Went outside this morning to be greeted by some nice looking chinook cones. The golding is starting to flower too. Tettnanger is still lagging with no sign of flowers. Bine growth of the chinook and goldings seem to have stopped.




Cant wait to use some in a brew.


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## bindi (14/12/07)

The Chinook now has cones  and growing faster then any weed [any weed that is :lol: ] photos to follow.
Also 2 of my 4 cuttings are growing.

edit: 3 years on the forum tomorrow [I did read every post for months before signing up] off topic, sorry.


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## Steve (15/12/07)

Well after a week of being dug up and stuck in a pot due to moving house my 4 year old POR is bloody sprouting. Honestly you cant kill these with a stick. Very happy!
Cheers
steve


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## Doogiechap (15/12/07)

I've just spotted flowers on mine today  . Didn't expect any yield for this first year so am very appy.


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## Gerard_M (16/12/07)

I have some of those green catapillers having a go at my hops, so I have trained a Magpie to help. Now every time I go near the hop plant he wanders down to see if I will throw him a feed!
I will post some pics soon as these are now getting close to 20ft.
Cheers
Gerard


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## oldbugman (16/12/07)

geez gerard, what form of roman engineering did you use to build them up so high.


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## Gerard_M (16/12/07)

Nothing too flash, just some wire & a few Eye Screws! Once it hits the corner it travels horizontal along another wire. It will be interesting to see how far it gets by X-Mass.
Cheers
Gerard


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## Gerard_M (16/12/07)

Gerard_M said:


> Nothing too flash, just some wire & a few Eye Screws!
> Cheers
> Gerard



There are a few other pics that are too big to attach, & I am not interested in learning how to do it.
Not bad for one little rhizome!


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## oldbugman (16/12/07)

resized


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## Doc (2/1/08)

I'm no longer hoping for much of a crop this year.
After the hail ripped through them mid December, they were looking rather woeful.
After getting back from holidays one variety has all but given up on life, with the other 4 varieties not far behind. 
Bloody hell, was only away for 10 days. The lawn and weeds grew like wildfire, yet my hop plants all but died. Go figure.
Trying to show them some love and nurse them back, but my hopes aren't high.

Doc


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## barls (3/1/08)

ive all ready got about 150g of dried hops off one of my bushes, with plenty more still on it that im waiting to get a little bit bigger before picking


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## domonsura (3/1/08)

My cluster was going great, but then just stopped growing, so I ended up stripping the cones off it because they were already drying and starting to brown up on the edges. POR are hanging in there, hallertau is trying to have a second wind after the spider mites all but killed it............


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## petesbrew (3/1/08)

Doc said:


> I'm no longer hoping for much of a crop this year.
> After the hail ripped through them mid December, they were looking rather woeful.
> After getting back from holidays one variety has all but given up on life, with the other 4 varieties not far behind.
> Bloody hell, was only away for 10 days. The lawn and weeds grew like wildfire, yet my hop plants all but died. Go figure.
> ...


That's sad news, Doc.
Mine is in a pretty sorry state. One vine has fiiiiinally hit 2 metres, but I'm not expecting much from it. The others are losing leaves and going brown.
Maybe next time I'll stick it in the ground, rather than a pot.


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## Gerard_M (3/1/08)

Doc said:


> I'm no longer hoping for much of a crop this year.
> After the hail ripped through them mid December, they were looking rather woeful.
> After getting back from holidays one variety has all but given up on life, with the other 4 varieties not far behind.
> Bloody hell, was only away for 10 days. The lawn and weeds grew like wildfire, yet my hop plants all but died. Go figure.
> ...



I am out of here next wednesday, so you can always just come around & keep an eye on these Chinooks & pick them when ready. They have gone through another growth spurt over the last couple of weeks. Plenty of cones out there already. Landlord has popped the rent up by $80 per week, which goes to show how the price of hops reallyeffects everything!
Cheers
Gerard


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## Lukes (3/1/08)

I went down to the local horse stables and got some of my old malt bags full of sawdust/manure and chucked it around the bases in a donut shape.
The plants are going great even after the 2 day's @ over 40 and restricted water.
I would have thought the extreme hot weather lately in Melb would have burnt the ornamental Tassie nobles but only a few tips that were in contact with the wooden fence are dead..

Luke


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## crells (3/1/08)

Does anyone know the best way to get rid of spider mites ?


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## Lukes (3/1/08)

> Does anyone know the best way to get rid of spider mites ?


I googled this link and it suggests milk, flour and water mix.

Hope it helps.

Luke


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## crells (3/1/08)

Lukes said:


> I googled this link and it suggests milk, flour and water mix.
> 
> Hope it helps.
> 
> Luke



Thanks for the link. My milk just went out of date. I have tried pest oil in the past, but with the hot weather it causes leaf burn.


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## NRB (3/1/08)

What about diatomaceous earth? It's a simple, non-chemical solution to many insect infestations in the garden...


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## glennheinzel (3/1/08)

My chinook copped a hammering whilst I was away for 6 six nights over Xmas. The weather forecast was for rain during a few of those days so I was reasonably confident that it would be okay, but it was extremely dehydrated when I returned and has taken a lot of attention to rehydrate it. A smaller Chinook was okay, probably because it doesn't need as much water as the larger one.

Both plants are in small pots so must use up the available water pretty quickly.


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## NRB (3/1/08)

For Spider mite infestations, apparently the best solution is "Neem Oil". I've just done a little research and the good folks who grow the cousin seem to think Neem oil is the bees knees.


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## tk75 (3/1/08)

crells said:


> Does anyone know the best way to get rid of spider mites ?



If you go into a hydroponics  shop, they will generally have what you need to get rid of mites. You also need to get onto them as soon as you notice them otherwise it makes them harder to get rid of.
Just remember if you use chemicals, do it early on so you get a good spell of not using chemicals on the plant before using the hops(you may end up with shrinkage of the manhood, or worse it may drop off  ) - not speaking from experience!!


----------



## Tim (3/1/08)

crells said:


> Does anyone know the best way to get rid of spider mites ?



My old man reckons you water them with soapy water. Whilst I was back in Oz in November I put a little bit of detergent into the watering can before i filled it up, and made sure i washed all the leaves whilst watering. The spidermite things were gone the next day!
If the temperatures hot, I would do this at night though otherwise you might scorch the leaves.
Tim


----------



## chovain (4/1/08)

Tim said:


> My old man reckons you water them with soapy water. Whilst I was back in Oz in November I put a little bit of detergent into the watering can before i filled it up, and made sure i washed all the leaves whilst watering. The spidermite things were gone the next day!
> If the temperatures hot, I would do this at night though otherwise you might scorch the leaves.
> Tim



Yep - and if you don't mind spending a few bucks, pick up some "Natrasoap" from your local nursery or hardware store. It's really effective on spidermite and those little "mealy bug" things (which seem to be great at avoiding my praying mantis colony)


----------



## blackbock (4/1/08)

Regularly keep the leaves moist, both above and below, and spider mites won't set up shop nearly as badly.
Stressed plants get attacked by insects a lot more.


----------



## crells (4/1/08)

Thx great info.

Can products like 'natrasoap' be used in the hot weather. Its 35+ here until Sunday..


----------



## bindi (4/1/08)

Just picked half my Chinook flowers, now to dry them  .


----------



## glenos (28/1/08)

I have just put some cuttings in that I took on my way through Bushy Park this arvo, it was growing over the fence on the edge of a paddock of hops, so no idea of what I have got, will be interesting to see:
1) if it survives
2) what variety it is and 
3) if it is a female plant.

EDIT- I have attached a picture of a leaf, I am sure this is next to useless but anyways.


----------



## Lukes (29/1/08)

I see Bindi up north already has cones.
Anyone else starting to get this years crop showing.





Cali Cluster is getting a few flowers on it.






The Ornamental Hallertau are still quite ornamental with no flowers.  

- Luke


----------



## drsmurto (29/1/08)

My 1st year chinook





Has flowers!


----------



## NRB (29/1/08)

Mine's given up the ghost - stalled growth a little over a month ago with the ridiculously hot spell in Melbourne and hasn't changed since. I wish she looked as bushy as the examples here.


----------



## Mitternacht Brauer (30/1/08)

After a slow start my Hersbrucker has had a growth spurt by putting on 100-150mm a day . but Rossy's golden cluster just down the road seems to be taking over the back of his house with massive cones. this pic is a few days old .the leading bine is about two feet along the top wire. a few strings have been added from the pot to support new shoots .


----------



## braufrau (30/1/08)

My cluster has flowers.
Its growing up string attached to the trellis fence and the neighbours think its lovely.
She seems to admire its tenacity in getting to the top of the fence and then winding itself in and out of the trellis.


----------



## devo (30/1/08)

probably a silly question that has most likely been answered before but how do you know or calculate the alpha rating of your home grown hops?


----------



## mfdes (30/1/08)

glenos said:


> I have just put some cuttings in that I took on my way through Bushy Park this arvo, it was growing over the fence on the edge of a paddock of hops, so no idea of what I have got, will be interesting to see:
> 1) if it survives
> 2) what variety it is and
> 3) if it is a female plant.
> ...



Hi Glenos,

It is probably a seedling and not a named variety. Most if not all of the plants growing on the roadside between Westerway and New Norfolk are chance seedlings dropped while transporting cones to the kiln. Will be interested to see how they go. You have one bonus point though: You know they can grow well down here 

MFS


----------



## mfdes (30/1/08)

bindi said:


> Just picked half my Chinook flowers, now to dry them  .



Hey Bindi!

They look fantastic. Some of the cones though look a bit unripe. The way to tell is they feel stiff and papery dry when they're ready, and spring back if you press on them, and if you pull the cone in half sideways, the strig (central stem of the cone) will split in half lengthways and the lupulin will be bright yellow-orange and very aromatic.

Keep in ming alpha levels and oils skyrocket in the last few days before they're completely ripe, so you'll be doing yourself a disservice by picking them too early... 

MFS.


----------



## jbirbeck (30/1/08)

no photos of mine but my Chinook has a stack of cones but its nowhere near as bushy as some of the ones shown on here. two decent bines that have done 4 metres or so up and accross. no more growth on this one aside from the cones.

My cluster is much bushier with lateral shoots coming from every leaf junction and has just started to get cones and is still growing like mad.

Columbus has finally found its way upwards and is starting to show early signs of cones.  

But the poor wurtemburger hasn't found its way yet. two small shoots working their way out but they aren't very long. I doubt this little bugger will get far this year. Maybe next year.

Looks like a good year for my hops, all in their first year and 3 out of 4 with hops. pretty happy


----------



## Kai (3/2/08)

This is one of my 2006/2007 rhizomes. I don't know if it's the chinook I cut from my 2004/2005 big daddy or the willamette I newly planted that season, not because I've got them mixed up but because I only get updates on my babies via email so I'm not sure which one is in the photo.


----------



## redbeard (3/2/08)

my two hop plants have over the last week sprouted cones. is there an average time to pick or do u need to check weekly when its ready ?

cheers


----------



## johnno (3/2/08)

Hi redbeard,

Good aussie article here.

http://oz.craftbrewer.org/Library/Methods/.../GrowHops.shtml




> For established plants, the hop flowers are ready for picking in mid-March through to late May, depending on local conditions. The hop cone will turn from a moist silky feel to being dry and papery. When the edges of the hop flowers begin to turn brown they are ready to be picked. As the flowers will ripen at various stages you able to have a few pickings per year.



cheers
johnno


----------



## capretta (3/2/08)

i was picking some cones today off my 2 year old tettenager today and found this!

as such i would like to open the contest for mutant hop cones..


----------



## Lukes (4/2/08)

capretta said:


> i was picking some cones today off my 2 year old tettenager today and found this!
> as such i would like to open the contest for mutant hop cones..
> View attachment 17539



capretta,
I have had a few that have started to flower and then started too shoot again.
My Tassie Tett has not one flower yet .  

I think it's missing a German Lake.

- Luke


----------



## capretta (4/2/08)

last year mine was quite scrawny with only a few cones until the sewerage pipe next door burst inundating it with effluent. took off like a rocket then! maybe thats what your needs..


----------



## Blackfish (4/2/08)

capretta said:


> last year mine was quite scrawny with only a few cones until the sewerage pipe next door burst inundating it with effluent. took off like a rocket then! maybe thats what your needs..



well, don't complain if the beer you make with that tastes like sh1t!!

Sersiously, well done, did you get many cones from the Tet? or just large mutant ones.
At last count mine had 3  , but is shooting wildly after side dressing it with fertiliser.


----------



## capretta (4/2/08)

i have already copyrighted "POO BREW" !

mmm got a fair few cones, cant remember the exact weight but it wasnt a big producer. less than half a kilo wet all season, but that was its first year. it responded really well to lots of fertiliser, i went nuts with the chook poo this year, and it seems pretty sensitive to low water so try and flood the bastard if you can i reckon. here is a pic of my second harvest this year, and i should be able to get cones well into late april if last year was any indicator.


----------



## Lukes (4/2/08)

capretta said:


> last year mine was quite scrawny with only a few cones until the sewerage pipe next door burst inundating it with effluent. took off like a rocket then! maybe thats what your needs..



I think it is still early days as the ornamental Hall has no signs of hops either.

I got a couple of bags from the Tet last year and dumped then into secondary for 60 ltrs of ale.
It was a bit grassy at first but mellowed.



Next time strait into the kettle late.

Luke


----------



## Cannabaceae (4/2/08)

capretta said:


> i was picking some cones today off my 2 year old tettenager today and found this!
> 
> as such i would like to open the contest for mutant hop cones..
> View attachment 17539



That's one odd cone!

This one was grown from seed this season and has reddish cones:


----------



## Steve (4/2/08)

Cannabaceae said:


> reddish cones:
> 
> View attachment 17561



thats cool :beerbang: 

Cheers
Steve


----------



## capretta (5/2/08)

yer i like those, are you sure thats not an ornamental variety? or perhaps you will be using them in a flanders red.. even the stems look pretty red, some bizarre hop/rhubarb cross? very cool B)


----------



## Cannabaceae (8/2/08)

capretta said:


> yer i like those, are you sure thats not an ornamental variety? or perhaps you will be using them in a flanders red.. even the stems look pretty red, some bizarre hop/rhubarb cross? very cool B)



It was a seed from a Columbus x Wild hop. Seed genetics are very diverse in plants where you have separate sexes,
(most plants are both male and female at the same time.) 

A Hop/Rhubarb cross! :lol: ....I did plant it next to my Boysenberry, maybe my little hop has developed a mutant parasitic rhizome!

Anymore entries for capretta's contest of mutant hop cones ?


----------



## jbirbeck (8/2/08)

would love a cutting from that if you have them...def a nice looking plant.


----------



## Fents (8/2/08)

Cannabaceae said:


> That's one odd cone!
> 
> This one was grown from seed this season and has reddish cones:
> 
> View attachment 17561



purple red haze!!!

or red kush take your pick!

looks good enough to consume!


----------



## Cannabaceae (9/2/08)

This was a mutant cone from another seed grown hop.

It grew a slim second cone out of the first one, which ended up longer than the original.

By the time the second one was ready to harvest, the first cone was well over-ripe.


----------



## Lukes (11/2/08)

No mutant cones but the cluster are starting to fully kick in now that the days are getting shorter and should get a few this year.














- Luke


----------



## Simon W (11/2/08)

Nice! VERY nice!


----------



## drsmurto (11/2/08)

Jaysus Luke thats a very productive plant youve got there. Cant be a 1st year plant? :unsure:


----------



## Lukes (12/2/08)

Same as everyone's cluster but just 4 years in the ground with heaps of fertilizer and water.
This one (cluster) is the best grower out of the bunch from Tassie and can be used in a CAP to an old ale.

- Luke


----------



## johnno (12/2/08)

Lukes is da man.  

cheers
johnno


----------



## Lukes (12/2/08)

Johnno,
Hows your Pride of Ringwood monster coming along.
Did it re-establish itself and take over again after the move?
- Luke


----------



## Fents (12/2/08)

johnno said:


> Lukes is da man.
> 
> cheers
> johnno



someone scored cuttings.

finally my 2 hop plants are going for it, bit late in the season tho, heres hoping for next.


----------



## braufrau (12/2/08)

Lukes said:


> Same as everyone's cluster but just 4 years in the ground with heaps of fertilizer and water.
> This one (cluster) is the best grower out of the bunch from Tassie and can be used in a CAP to an old ale.
> 
> - Luke




OMG! I'm gonna need a bigger fence!


----------



## johnno (12/2/08)

Lukes said:


> Johnno,
> Hows your Pride of Ringwood monster coming along.
> Did it re-establish itself and take over again after the move?
> - Luke




Lukes,
yes it did alright last season. First pic was March last year just before harvest.


This year I am punishing it. Have not proped it up or watered it even. I really want those roots to go down deep. That's it just laying on the ground. There will be no crop from it this year.

The ekg in the backyard has started doing ok as well. That may be moved to another spot this winter.

cheers
johnno


----------



## mfdes (12/2/08)

Hey Johnno,

If you want them to grow well let them climb up as high as they can. Allowing them no climbing support will stunt them severely by comparison. The higher they climb in a year the more energy they'll store for next year's growth. They are not deep rooted plants at the best of times (regardless of how much you stress them) and commercially get one inch of water per week. 

MFS


----------



## Ross (12/2/08)

Woo hoo...My Chinook is producing little cones everywhere.  
It produced a few cones early in the year & I thought it was all over, but the latest flooding up here seems to have really given it a spurt...

cheers Ross


----------



## blackbock (12/2/08)

Regarding Alpha Acid levels: Does anyone know whether the amount of volatile oils present on the cones is an indication of alpha acid levels, or are the two unrelated?

Also, are Australian hops grown in less-than-ideal climates likely to be stronger or weaker than those in, say, New Zealand or Northwestern USA?


----------



## BoilerBoy (12/2/08)

First year growing hops and so far I've got 100g of Hersbrucker ready to go in the dehydrator.

For those who use a dehydrator How long do you dry them for?

Thw instructions say 6-12 hours for flowers which seems quite a broad figure :unsure: 

Cheers
BB


----------



## mr_walker (16/2/08)

It's my first year at growing hops, and I picked up a tiny POR rhizome at the LHBS. Didn't get it in the ground until about mid September which was way too late.

Anyway, with a good spot in the sun, and plenty of "worm juice" from my worm farm it's done OK I think. The cones really started taking shape about two weeks ago. Should get enough for a couple of brews.

If it's grown this much this year ... I need to think about building a bigger frame for it next year. Scary.

Cheers,

Walker


----------



## bindi (16/2/08)

Just finished packing away my 2nd crop of Chinook after drying them, 135g of dry hops and they smell great  the first crop was 122g, not bad for SEQld.
A 3rd crop is just starting and it's jumped the fence and growing up the neighbours trees.

Edit: Spelling typo


----------



## Screwtop (16/2/08)

BoilerBoy said:


> First year growing hops and so far I've got 100g of Hersbrucker ready to go in the dehydrator.
> 
> For those who use a dehydrator How long do you dry them for?
> 
> ...




They are so dead easy to dry I doubt anyone would need a dehydrator. I have a steel shed and I just leave them spread out on top of the freezer fo three days, temps are usually around 28 - 32.



bindi said:


> Just finished packing away my 2nd crop of Chinook after drying them, 135g of dry hops and they smell great the first crop was 122g, not bad for SEQld.
> A 3rd crop is just starting and it's jumped the fence and growing up the neighbours trees.



Have a third crop on my Wurty also Bindi, must be all of the rain, only one crop last year.

Screwy


----------



## Steve (16/2/08)

Mr Walker said:


> It's my first year at growing hops, and I picked up a tiny POR rhizome at the LHBS. Didn't get it in the ground until about mid September which was way too late.
> 
> Anyway, with a good spot in the sun, and plenty of "worm juice" from my worm farm it's done OK I think. The cones really started taking shape about two weeks ago. Should get enough for a couple of brews.
> 
> ...




MrWalker - nice look plant for its first year and being planted in September! Where abouts are you?
Cheers
Steve

Edit....welcome to AHB too! Cheers!


----------



## mr_walker (16/2/08)

Steve said:


> MrWalker - nice look plant for its first year and being planted in September! Where abouts are you?
> Cheers
> Steve
> 
> Edit....welcome to AHB too! Cheers!



I'm in Canberra, and thanks for the welcome. Looking forward to putting on my first brew with home grown hops! Not sure what I'll put them in ...

Cheers,

Walker


----------



## redbeard (16/2/08)

Are these ready to be picked ? as i couldnt see any yellow spots at the base & the leaves are sortof papery. Perhaps another week ?




sorry for crappy ph camera quality


----------



## Steve (16/2/08)

Mr Walker said:


> I'm in Canberra, and thanks for the welcome. Looking forward to putting on my first brew with home grown hops! Not sure what I'll put them in ...
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Walker




I've made a couple of nice all grain kent old brown ales using my own home grown POR....you get it from Col?
Cheers
Steve


----------



## braufrau (16/2/08)

I can see I'm going to have to add aheap more compost around my hops next year!
Mine aren't going to have anything like 100g on them.


----------



## capretta (16/2/08)

BoilerBoy said:


> For those who use a dehydrator How long do you dry them for?
> 
> 
> Cheers
> BB



never used one myself, just an old flyscreen and frame from a window in a dry airy spot. never sun though cause i was worried about pre skunking them! ( im pretty sure that skunking only affects isomerised {ie boiled} hops though!  )

you could probably give them the full 12 hours or whatever, cant see any dramas with being *too* dry.. h34r:


----------



## BoilerBoy (17/2/08)

Thanks all,

Everything seemed to go ok.
Hopefully with a 2nd and 3rd picking I may have enough for a single hop batch

Cheers
BB


----------



## mr_walker (17/2/08)

Steve said:


> I've made a couple of nice all grain kent old brown ales using my own home grown POR....you get it from Col?
> Cheers
> Steve



Yeah - best $5 I ever spent



I'm not at the all grain stage yet, but I've been doing partial mashes with some specialty grains. I see a lot of people bag out the POR as an aroma hop - is it really that bad?

Thanks for the suggestion Steve.


----------



## Lukes (18/2/08)

Woke on Sunday to find my hop plant had grown a big strange can like golden hop. :huh: 

Has anyone else had these mutant cones grow on the cluster plants?


What about our growers in *QLD*

with all that recent rain or maybe it's that cold south winter thing?






The old man liked the look of it and suggested I pick it early as it will be sweeter and dryer than the smaller ones.



But to me it was a little light looking but I don't think it's going to get any more body or bitterness.


----------



## capretta (18/2/08)

lol! look after that plant cause if it keeps growing aluminium hops like that you can just pour that icky nectar out and sell the cans at the scrappy for $1000 a ton!


----------



## lochrockingbeers (18/2/08)

Interesting triple hop cone on one of my chinook vines. First time I'd noticed this but I usually harvest the cones quickly without much thought. It was the only one I could see this morning on any of the vines.

I also sectioned some chinook and columbus cones down the centre and looked at them under the microscope. Photos below. They don't quite do the lupulin glands justice as the microscope camera doesn't have great depth of field so it's hard to focus on objects that aren't completely flat. At higher magnifications you could clearly see the bright yellow lupulin gland sitting precariously on a fine hair/trichome.


----------



## capretta (18/2/08)

nice.. plant ear wax!


----------



## randyrob (22/2/08)

mmm..... surely they must be for the picking by now <_<


----------



## Guest Lurker (22/2/08)

randyrob said:


> View attachment 17848
> 
> 
> mmm..... surely they must be for the picking by now <_<



Nope another few weeks by the look.


----------



## capretta (22/2/08)

wait till they dry out a bit! they look too fresh..


----------



## Gerard_M (22/2/08)

[quote post='270086']


























resized[/quote]

These pics were taken 4 weeks before we left Sydney. They had just about doubled in size, very nice & bushy with lots of flowers, probably ready for picking this week. I wonder if the new tennant is a brewer?

Cheers
Gerard


----------



## T.D. (22/2/08)

GM, I am still tempted to sneak in for a midnight hop harvest - wouldn't mind a bit of Chinook...

How tragic, I still remember seeing all those flowers coming on, and knowing they wouldn't be ready before you left! Would have been a bloody good harvest!

Here are a couple of pics of some of my hops from this year. I'll be doing a brew with them in the next week or two...
The goldings flowers were no kidding close on the size of golf balls! Never seen flowers so big!


----------



## Gerard_M (23/2/08)

T.D I will send the new tennant a letter this week to see if we can arrange for the FaB boys to harvest the "North Epping Chinooks"! Not sure if we will get a response but it is worth a try.
Cheers
Gerard


----------



## mr_walker (24/2/08)

My first batch of hops, so I'm trying to figure out when to harvest. I've read that they need to sound papery, and starting to brown on the tips. Can anybody tell me if my POR looks like it's getting close? I think it might need a bit more time yet.

Walker


----------



## capretta (24/2/08)

i would probably give them a little longer. are these the oldest hops on your plant? if so give it another week i reckon..


----------



## mr_walker (24/2/08)

capretta said:


> i would probably give them a little longer. are these the oldest hops on your plant? if so give it another week i reckon..



I don't know about oldest, but they're definitely the biggest. Being a new plant there's a lot of smaller hops as well. Thanks for the tip.

Walker


----------



## Mitternacht Brauer (25/2/08)

Hi just wondering if anyone had grown plants from cuttings? I have a couple that have taken off for the last two months but am wondering whether they will be any good when they die back over winter? the cuttings have come from my 1st year Hersbrucker .


----------



## Fents (25/2/08)

Most hops are grown from cuttings buster. They will be fine.


----------



## Quintrex (25/2/08)

buster3931 said:


> Hi just wondering if anyone had grown plants from cuttings? I have a couple that have taken off for the last two months but am wondering whether they will be any good when they die back over winter? the cuttings have come from my 1st year Hersbrucker .



I think it depends whether they manage to store enough energy back into the rhizome to withstand the winter hibernation!

Q


----------



## drsmurto (25/2/08)

Ok, so my chinook is now ready to be picked and dried, the cones are very papery and have gone brown around the edges. Got some fly screen from partners old man to dry them on. Can i just pull them off or do they require cutting?


----------



## randyrob (25/2/08)

Guest Lurker said:


> Nope another few weeks by the look.



Thanks GL, i'll live and let be for now!


----------



## lochrockingbeers (25/2/08)

DrSmurto said:


> Ok, so my chinook is now ready to be picked and dried, the cones are very papery and have gone brown around the edges. Got some fly screen from partners old man to dry them on. Can i just pull them off or do they require cutting?



They're pretty easy to pull off as long as the bine is attached to something. Use 2 hands - one to hold plant and one to pull the cones - if you are worried about damaging the plant.


----------



## drsmurto (25/2/08)

lochrockingbeers said:


> They're pretty easy to pull off as long as the bine is attached to something. Use 2 hands - one to hold plant and one to pull the cones - if you are worried about damaging the plant.



Cheers. Thought just in case there is time for a 2nd crop, quite a few of the side shoots havent got cones. Dont want to damage the binesbut they are held securely to the chook fence.


----------



## Steve (25/2/08)

Dr - wear a long sleeved shirt too....your arms can get a bit scratched up.
Cheers
Steve


----------



## randyrob (26/2/08)

is there a male amonst my ranks???


----------



## domonsura (26/2/08)

Geez man, that's what it looks like to me........


----------



## chovain (26/2/08)

Okay - I had a slight problem. First year grower: I have one plant with 3 bines. I picked a few off one of the bines to see how they were. The next day, that bine completely died. Coincidence, maybe... Anyway, I've grabbed all the hops off the dead bine. They're quite brown, but they're still green in the middle.

Should I still be able to use them, or will I want to dump them?


----------



## randyrob (26/2/08)

domonsura said:


> Geez man, that's what it looks like to me........



hmm... no probs, the next thing i guess would be to rip it up so it doesnt make my female hops flower?

i've heard having a male around can also increase hop cone output? or is it to risky?

Rob.


----------



## domonsura (26/2/08)

Might do I suppose, but get some more qualified opinions than mine before ripping it out....I'd hate to be wrong...


----------



## mfdes (27/2/08)

Some females occasionally produce male flowers. This is especially the case with aneuploids when you're breeding polyploid plants. However, if your plant didn't also produce female cones, then it is a male.

The argument as to males or no males is the following: pollination increases yield (not more cones, just more cone mass) but slightly decreases alpha. Thus triploid sterile hops are being bred nowadays because they can be pollinated but still set no seed. I don't mind seed in may brew, and if you're using them primarily for flavour and aroma you may as well leave them in. On the other hand you could use that precious hill for a productive female.

MFS.


----------



## jendres (27/2/08)

mfdes said:


> Some females occasionally produce male flowers. This is especially the case with aneuploids when you're breeding polyploid plants. However, if your plant didn't also produce female cones, then it is a male.
> 
> The argument as to males or no males is the following: pollination increases yield (not more cones, just more cone mass) but slightly decreases alpha. Thus triploid sterile hops are being bred nowadays because they can be pollinated but still set no seed. I don't mind seed in may brew, and if you're using them primarily for flavour and aroma you may as well leave them in. On the other hand you could use that precious hill for a productive female.
> 
> MFS.


I think I heard of basic brewing radio that the main reason for seeds not being desired is because it messes up the brewing systems in most large breweries. I forget the details, but i think it is this podcast: Gerard Lemmens from Brewers Supply Group joins us to give us some background on hops and trends in the hop industry. or it could be the next one: We continue our chat with Gerard Lemmens of Brewers Supply Group as he gives us practical tips on using hops in home brewing.

Another one that might be interesting, and I'll have a listen to it today: Dave Wills of Freshops walks us through the process of planting, growing, and harvesting our own hoppy goodness at home.


----------



## Cannabaceae (29/2/08)

randyrob said:


> hmm... no probs, the next thing i guess would be to rip it up so it doesnt make my female hops flower?
> 
> i've heard having a male around can also increase hop cone output? or is it to risky?
> 
> Rob.


No risk, it will make your cones a little bigger and you get a tiny amount of extra lupulin on the seed coats.






Let it pollinate all your cones this one time, then rip it out and grow a female in its place. 
Check out the picture in the paragraph titled "Seeded vs Seedless hops" HERE: Scroll down about 
a third of the page to the paragraph titled: Seeded vs Seedless hops.
There are lots of wild hops growing all over the UK, so you find occasional seeds in their diploid hops.
Commercial growers don't like seeded hops because of processing problems ...seeds leach out 
fats when they get crushed. Male hops are illegal over certain areas of Europe because of this.

Of course you could take up hop breeding as a hobby as getting a good male is the first step.

Rupert.


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## randyrob (29/2/08)

you've talked me into it rupert!

i might still keep it next season, just far away from my usual crop.

thanks for taking the time and effort to respond!

how is your crop going this year? surely u've got some pics we can all drool over?

Rob.


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## Cannabaceae (1/3/08)

randyrob said:


> you've talked me into it rupert!
> 
> i might still keep it next season, just far away from my usual crop.
> 
> ...


It is going well, though had a spider mite problem, I used emulsiied neem oil at 10ml/litre.
I keep a close eye out for them with my jewellers loupe x20 mag, so I can hit them early.
Here is the Chinook the first one to finish with a Hersbrucker coming on in the background.





Same Chinook lower down:




Golding:




Hersbrucker:




Hallertau:




Perle:




Wuertemberger, it's still growing, this was taken Feb 11th:




Cascade is still growing, this was taken Feb 17th:




Glad to get around posting some hop pics for you guys, have enjoyed
looking through this thread.
Rupert.


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## Guest Lurker (1/3/08)

Hmm my crop is looking puny. Nice work.


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## domonsura (1/3/08)

WOW...........thanks for posting those pics Rupert, now I know what mine should have looked like  Never mind eh, next year....


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## lochrockingbeers (1/3/08)

Cannabaceae said:


> It is going well, though had a spider mite problem, I used emulsiied neem oil at 10ml/litre.
> I keep a close eye out for them with my jewellers loupe x20 mag, so I can hit them early.



Rupert

Wettable sulfur is a better option and easier and cheaper to obtain. Lime sulfur is another option but it knocks the beneficial insects and mites around more. Another option is to go biological and release some predatory mites but perhaps a bit expensive and over the top but it looks like you're verging on semi-commercial there. Planning on setting up a stall selling fresh hops at the albany farmers market?

Neem, while often quoted as the new magic bullet of insecticides, it's never really gone anywhere. Results haven't been outstanding for many pests, and it still seems relatively expensive. Perhaps it's worked for you and could be used for other pests. Sulfur is widely and successfully used in many australian industries for spider mite control.

Spider mites typically attack stressed plants or occur as a result of insecticides being sprayed that knock out their natural enemies and the mite populations surge. They love hot dry days. Even just finely spray blasting the foliage of plants with water regularly can knock back a spider mite population substantially. In your case it looks like hot dry days may have cranked up the mites as your plants don't look very stressed.

Lochy


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## Little_Squares (2/3/08)

Praying mantis good or bad?? Had feeling it would be good.....but not sure




My miniscule effort in 2nd year(as of just now)...they need water dont they!?!?!?!




Please excuse the crappy backyard...Im working on it!...........fixing it up , not making it crappier.... <_<


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## Linz (2/3/08)

Sorry,

that was me....someone doesnt know how to log off!!!!


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## Cannabaceae (2/3/08)

lochrockingbeers said:


> Rupert
> 
> Wettable sulfur is a better option and easier and cheaper to obtain. Lime sulfur is another option but it knocks the beneficial insects and mites around more. Another option is to go biological and release some predatory mites but perhaps a bit expensive and over the top but it looks like you're verging on semi-commercial there. Planning on setting up a stall selling fresh hops at the albany farmers market?
> 
> ...


Lochy,

Thanks for the sulphur tip, I do like the idea of using predatory mites, (the spraying was a bit of a chore.) 
I got a price of $50 for 5000, (which was the minimum sold). I will try these next year if needed.

Neem is supposed to work mainly as a growth regulator, so works slowly ...pests take a few days to die. 
Anecdotal evidence may arise of it not working well, from growers more use to contact toxins that kill relatively quickly.
It worked for me, but I had low levels of mites and the 15% potassium soap added to emulsify the neem oil, is effective
in itself.

I think the mites where coming from neighbours and were just wandering through my hops, looking for stressed plants.
I will be putting predator mites over the fence 

Rupert


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## lochrockingbeers (3/3/08)

Neem works 2 ways: inhibits pests eating your plant and those that do eat the plant are poisoned. You would have predatory mites around and they would increase in numbers as the spider mites increase but your plants are likely to get damaged. Depends on your tolerance for damage.

Be careful with neem. I had a uni entomology lecturer who worked with it, raved about it, became a raving lunatic, and was sacked by the university. Just because it's naturally derived from a plant does not mean it's safe.

Whoever posted the praying mantis photo is correct in their identification. It's a generalist predator of soft bodied insects; spider mites don't quite make a meal for a mantid.


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## mr_walker (3/3/08)

Well I've just had my first harvest from my one year old POR. 90 grams of goodness.

I guess I'll have about 10-20 grams by the time it dries. I can't wait until next year, now the roots are established.

Walker


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## Doogiechap (7/3/08)

I'm pretty happy with how my Nugget has gone for it's first season  .


Not a big harvest but am looking forward to tossing it into one of my brews soon  .

edit :spellign


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## Plastic Man (8/3/08)

I'm getting a serious case of cone envy reading this thread.

I've got about 12 cones off my Goldings and none off my Columbus - though it's year 1 so I shouldn't complain...


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## randyrob (9/3/08)

Evening Brewers,

just some piccys of my first harvest:




Cluser 220g




Chinhook 180g




Columbus 110g

also got 80g of Wertemberger.

here's a pic of the yield so far




i'm just about the bung them in the dehydrater, anyone done this before can u let me know how long yours took to dry?

Cheers Rob.


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## chovain (9/3/08)

randyrob said:


> View attachment 18069



Didn't I see those bags on the evening news recently?


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## randyrob (9/3/08)

well 2 hours in the dehydrator did the job, if anyone was interested the dry weight vs wet weight was 20%




Cheers Rob.


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## chovain (10/3/08)

I don't have a dehydrator, and have been asked to curtail spending by the MoF. That means no buying screen material to make my own rack. Here's my solution (no laughing at my paltry harvest - It's only about half of my first harvest) :



It's a fan forced oven with a couple of bits of foil to increase the flow across the hops. The hops are sitting at a nice stable 40 C. I'm regularly rotating the plate to ensure even drying.

Can anyone tell me if 40 C is a reasonable temperature? I'm not going to damage the hops, am I? 

Anyone know how long it will need to sit there?


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## Doogiechap (16/3/08)

Just harvested my Nugget  .
Very happy with the amount considering it's it's first crop.


How convenient that we had the front screen door replaced !  


Happy days !
Hmmm now for the Alpha Acid guessing game.......


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## mfdes (17/3/08)

randyrob said:


> well 2 hours in the dehydrator did the job, if anyone was interested the dry weight vs wet weight was 20%
> 
> View attachment 18072
> 
> ...



Hey Rob,
That doesn't sound dry to me. The central strig takes a lot longer to dry than the bracts. They should lose close to 90% of their weight, not 80%. Still, incompletely dried hops are probably OK as long as they're vacuum stored in a freezer.

MFS.


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## randyrob (17/3/08)

mfdes said:


> Hey Rob,
> That doesn't sound dry to me. The central strig takes a lot longer to dry than the bracts. They should lose close to 90% of their weight, not 80%. Still, incompletely dried hops are probably OK as long as they're vacuum stored in a freezer.
> 
> MFS.




Hey Mfs,

thanks for the input! they are vacuum stored in the freezer. i read around if the stem brakes and not just bends there pretty much dry ah well theres always next year
still haven't had a chance to brew with them i cracked the grain and then got busy....

Rob.


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## randyrob (17/3/08)

Doogiechap said:


> Just harvested my Nugget  .
> Very happy with the amount considering it's it's first crop.
> View attachment 18176
> 
> ...



:super: :super:

i feel a nugget summer ale on the horizon for you doogie!


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## mfdes (17/3/08)

You'll be fine. They wouldn't deteriorate frozen, I'd think.
MFS


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## masculator002 (17/3/08)

If you want to improve the outcome of the hops a proper curing and drying process will make a big difference. This is something I have learned from curing other related herbs over the years. it goes a little some thing like this. :
first of all hang in a warm room for 2 to 3 days or until you see the bright dark green start to dull prefferably still in collas.
At this stage the stems should be starting to become brittleish. then using an esky or poly styrene broccolli box with a lid lay them in without any kind of compression. (loosely in other words.) in hot weather leave the lid on during the day and remove at night, in cooler weather reverse this. allow to cure like this for 1 to 2 weeks during 25 to 30 degree heat and up to 3 weeks in cooler conditions. 
After this store in GLASS jars NOT plastic bags as there is a dangerous (to your health) chemical reaction between plastic and herbs. Personally I use nescafe coffee jars. 

This process will help to draw the deep moisture from the tissues more gently without closing the stomata of the plant tissue and locking in the clorophyll and grassy yucky taste, And will allow the floral, fruity flavenoids and aromatics to come to the fore.

Try it next time, it really works, and I guarantee that you will be throwing the dehydrator to the trash or using it to dry apples like it was designed too. B)


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## masculator002 (17/3/08)

randyrob said:


> View attachment 17916
> 
> 
> is there a male amonst my ranks???



Yes that is a male perenial hemp (humulus lupulus) plant


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## masculator002 (17/3/08)

masculator002 said:


> Yes that is a male perenial hemp (humulus lupulus) plant



It is possible to revert it to female by obtaining some giberellic acid and making a foliar spray of it. This is how they produce all female seeds in holland and other places, They clone a female plant and spray it with the acid which makes what would otherwise be a female plant male. They then use the pollen to produce all female (98% female) seeds by pollenating either another clone or the original mother plant.


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## barls (22/3/08)

ive done alright tihis year so i thought id share some pics of the last harvest off one bush i got








































the box is about a meter square and its about an inch and a half deep when laid out


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## chovain (24/3/08)

barls said:


> the box is about a meter square and its about an inch and a half deep when laid out



Very nice harvest! Do you know what weight you got?

For the pedants who don't like people mixing units, that's about 4.68 cubic millifurlongs. I'm not sure how many football stadiums it would be though.


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## barls (24/3/08)

it was about 400g dry which isnt too bad considering its the third harvest off that plant


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## chovain (24/3/08)

barls said:


> it was about 400g dry which isnt too bad considering its the third harvest off that plant



That's incredible. I managed a whopping 18g dry off my Tardif this year - enough for a basic lager, I suppose. It's only the first year (and it lives in a pot, and it got moved around a bit last year), so hopefully it will do a little better next year.


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## barls (24/3/08)

its my plants 2nd year but i got 3 harvests of 2 plant and nothing of the third one


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## Linz (26/3/08)

mine had a late start to the year with a severe lack of water, but now is going off...should it still be producing flowers??

It has some large flowers(size of a 10 cent coin) near the older growth, but some small ones near the tips, but none of the 'bunches' of flowers growing together as in other peoples pics. BTW its a cluster variety

Do I pick the bigger ones and leave the smaller one?? or take the lot in one hit??


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## barls (26/3/08)

thats what i did linz


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## KillerRx4 (26/3/08)

My plants are about done for this year, only a few new cones popping up now. They have been producing cones solidly since December through to now.

Ive done 5 or so harvests in that time & as of tonight a dry weight of 1.4kg

Mostly came off 1 3rd year cluster.

I have a 2nd year columbus that didnt produce last year. I managed a whopping 50g odd off that. Hopefully next year it will deliver.

Pics>
http://s267.photobucket.com/albums/ii318/k...x4/2008%20hops/


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## lowtech (26/3/08)

Is it common to get nothing in the first year?


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## barls (26/3/08)

hell im in the second and still have yet to get anything of my hallertau


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## capretta (27/3/08)

in wollongong my tettenang produces fairly evenly from decemberish through to late april but probably in total makes about 100g dry.


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## eric8 (27/3/08)

My plants did pretty much nothing at all this year, first year in. When should I be cutting them back down to the ground? Now or closer to winter?

Eric


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## Lukes (27/3/08)

Got mine picked and dried in the hot weather we had in Melb the other week.
Ended up with a couple of those recycle shopping bags almost full.

Now to find some Harvest Ale brewing time and get a false bottom sorted for the kettle  .

Luke


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## mfdes (27/3/08)

masculator002 said:


> It is possible to revert it to female by obtaining some giberellic acid and making a foliar spray of it. This is how they produce all female seeds in holland and other places, They clone a female plant and spray it with the acid which makes what would otherwise be a female plant male. They then use the pollen to produce all female (98% female) seeds by pollenating either another clone or the original mother plant.



Mate, hop plants are dioecious and have their gender coded genetically. I don't know what this GA spray stuff is you're talking about, but I'd be very doubtful it would work on hops. Have you tried it on this plant?
The only hops plants with both male and female flowers are unstable aneuploids that result from polyploid breeding. Diploid plants and well-selected triploids and tetraploids are either male or female. You can't change that.

MFS.


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## chovain (27/3/08)

mfdes said:


> Mate, hop plants are dioecious and have their gender coded genetically. I don't know what this GA spray stuff is you're talking about, but I'd be very doubtful it would work on hops. Have you tried it on this plant?
> The only hops plants with both male and female flowers are unstable aneuploids that result from polyploid breeding. Diploid plants and well-selected triploids and tetraploids are either male or female. You can't change that.



A lot of people figure that hops are more like their cousin than they actually are. Hops and hemp have very little in common.

Among the Cannabaceae family exist trees and vines. There are about 170 species, in around a dozen genera. Some produce cones, while others produce nuts. It really is quite a large, and varied family.


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## beerguide (31/3/08)

I am going to have a crack at growing hops myself this year once they are available for purchase. I was just reading this article which has what appears to be a good pole design for growing 4 varieties.
Can anyone see any problems with it?

Link: http://basementbrewing.blogspot.com/2008/0...-back-yard.html


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## Sprungmonkey (31/3/08)

Might have to give it a go this year. Does anyone have any suggestions as to which varieties to choose? I have only just started brewing and using hops and love the idea of growing my own (ie. what hop varieties do people use the most of). I see that cascade, fuggles, and chinook are fairly poplular.


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## chovain (31/3/08)

zoddy said:


> I am going to have a crack at growing hops myself this year once they are available for purchase. I was just reading this article which has what appears to be a good pole design for growing 4 varieties.
> Can anyone see any problems with it?



I reckon it looks like a reasonable design to me. Be aware that 13 feet isn't all that much clearance for hops, but with nearly 3 feet between varieties at the top, it should avoid serious tangling.

For my first year (this season just gone), I used two 2.5m wooden poles about 8m apart for mine (dynabolted to the brick wall at each end of my apartment's balcony ). I have 3 slots cut all the way around each pole 20cm apart, so the slots are at about 2400, 2200, 2000mm off the ground. I then run three lengths of twine between the two poles, using the slots to keep the twine from slipping.

At the eastern end, I then put three long stakes in a nice big pot, forming a "tee pee" with the peak near the twine lines. I picked 3 good bines, and trained them onto the three stakes. When they got to the top of the stakes, I trained them onto the three horizontal lines. First year growth put them about 2 metres along the lines (4-4.5m of growth per bine). Next season, I'll be getting myself a POR, and will grow it from the middle of the lines.

While this needs a lot more space than the link you posted, it has lots of advantages: You can reach all of the hops, and can do multiple harvests without messing about with a ladder (my hops became ripe over a period of a month or so); It's a cheaper, and less permanent rig; Finally, you don't lose as much space as you might think - you can still walk around under the lines.


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## beerguide (31/3/08)

Thanks Mark for the great post. I'm not neceassarily concerned about space, just trying to create something effective and reliable. Your solution sounds quite good too given the shape and space in my yard. Thanks again.


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## chovain (31/3/08)

zoddy said:


> Thanks Mark for the great post. I'm not neceassarily concerned about space, just trying to create something effective and reliable. Your solution sounds quite good too given the shape and space in my yard. Thanks again.



Let me know if you want a pic, and I'll take one this afternoon. I only have the bottom two lines up now (top bine died back in Feb, and it was looking a bit unsightly), but it should give you an idea.


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## beerguide (31/3/08)

I think I have a good idea in my head of what you mean - but if you don't mind a pic will definately help.


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## Justin T (31/3/08)

My plant struggled a bit this season. Had to be cut back and moved state. Did alright in the end but not too productive.

Not sure if I should cut it back yet though. It is quite cold in Melbourne these days


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## NRB (8/4/08)

I'm going to dig my non-producing first year plant and stick it in a pot for next year. When's the best time to cut Rhizomes out of the dirt? Should I store them in a fridge until later, or can I stick it into a pot as soon as it's cut out?


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## beerguide (22/4/08)

I received an email back from Grumpy's saying they are no longer selling rhizomes, or at least not this year. They advised I should contact Stewart directly, but I haven't had a reply.
Any ideas on when they'll be available for purchase, I definately do not want to miss out this year?


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## slacka (22/4/08)

Looks like grain & grape was sourcing from the same individual.
http://www.grainandgrape.com.au/articles_o...prhizomes01.htm

Note: "The season for buying rhizomes is from May 30th to August 30th, the optimum time is during July."


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## oldbugman (22/4/08)

OK, my hops plants are giving up the ghost and dying back. What do I do?

I plan to remove them from the ground and replant elsewhere next season. 
I'm thinking along the lines of cutting them back to a 2-3 inches above the ground and removing the root system from the ground and putting them in pots for the winter.


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## Sprungmonkey (22/4/08)

Did anyone contact Grain and Grape about hop ribosomes this yr? Im keen for a few varieties


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## mfdes (22/4/08)

Sprungmonkey said:


> Did anyone contact Grain and Grape about hop ribosomes this yr? Im keen for a few varieties



That's a great one 
I never heard of hop ribosomes before, though I'm sure that, like all eukaryotes, they have some 

Just being facetious. We plant rhizomes not ribosomes.

MFS.


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## capretta (22/4/08)

OldBugman said:


> OK, my hops plants are giving up the ghost and dying back. What do I do?
> 
> I plan to remove them from the ground and replant elsewhere next season.
> I'm thinking along the lines of cutting them back to a 2-3 inches above the ground and removing the root system from the ground and putting them in pots for the winter.



i remember reading somewhere that without a proper dormancy period (ie sub zero temps) they will eventually over a few years stop producing hence the lack of western sydney hop plantations i spose! 

if your digging them up why not try putting some in the freezer for a few weeks?


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## Sprungmonkey (22/4/08)

whhoops


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## gerald (22/4/08)

Hey guys,

just wondering if anyone in Adelaide (closer to town the better) has some hops cuttings i could try and get growing.

money would be transfered for sure and id come and pick them up. doesnt bother me too much on what varieties, just wanna give it a shot, something mild would be nice (nor POR)

thanks
gerald


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## Sprungmonkey (22/4/08)

Anyone selling any in Brisbane?


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## drew186 (21/5/08)

wally said:


> Just checked my year old POR and saw the following activity.
> 
> View attachment 13095
> View attachment 13096
> ...


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## drew186 (21/5/08)

Hi,

Do you still have some Hop seeds or cuttings for sale, if so what variety. i can pick up or arrange post and $ transfer.

cheers, drew


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## nosco (12/8/18)

drew186 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Do you still have some Hop seeds or cuttings for sale, if so what variety. i can pick up or arrange post and $ transfer.
> 
> cheers, drew


Check on ebay. There are still rhizomes for sale. There was some really big Centennial going pretty cheap

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Aussie Home Brewer mobile app


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## Nullnvoid (12/8/18)

nosco said:


> Check on ebay. There are still rhizomes for sale. There was some really big Centennial going pretty cheap
> 
> Sent from my VTR-L09 using Aussie Home Brewer mobile app



Wow! Way to reply to a 10 year old thread and quote someone who hasn't been active in 9 years


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