# Porter Grainbill



## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

Need a little help folks  

I'm in the process of working out a grainbill for a Porter (robust). It's one style I never seem to be able to get that right flavour I'm looking for.

Any chance there's a Porterphile out there that can have a look at this;

Grainbill for 45 litres.

5kg Fawcett's Marris Otter 52.6%
3kg Joe White Dark Munich 31.6%
500g Fawcett's Crystal 120-140EBC 5.3%
500g Fawcett's Choc 5.3%
500g Fawcett's Amber 5.3%

Any comments/alterations, criticisms welcome.  

TIA Warren -


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## neonmeate (30/3/05)

looks tasty to me. I like a bit of black malt or roast barley in mine for some bite but that will be good i'm sure. amber malt is great in porters.

for something to compare with, last porter i made was this recipe with like 10 specialty malts and it was beautiful:
http://www.beertools.com/html/articles.php?view=205

i just subbed munich for the mild ale malt, amber for the biscuit, cara-aroma for the special B, melanoidin for the aromatic but kept all the amounts the same, OG, yeast, hops, everything. it was amazingly smooth and deep. maybe more of a stout than a porter though (but who cares).

another thing i think goes well in porters is dark brown sugar. i've used "muscavado" before which you can get from delis - it's from morocco or something. gives it a beautiful, rich rummy flavour.


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

Cheers Neonmeate :super: 

Was looking for something a little along the lines of Fullers London Porter. I've tried several times to replicate it thus far and haven't come that close.

Warren -


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## jayse (30/3/05)

Hi warren,
For 45l of robust porter you could nearly double all the specialty malts there, you would actually have to really.
Go a whole kg of of 120-140ebc crystal, can even use much darker crystal if you want.
You would have to have at the very least 650g of choc in there.
Also doubling the amber malt would be great too.
Really every thing is looking good just a bit light on in the 'robust' department.
I think it should be dry, malty and clean but deffintly not thin, i aim for a FG of 1.015. wyeast London ale as been the best so far, wyeast 1098 i thought lent it to be a bit thinner in quite a few aspects and extra extra clean. It was great but i think london ale was exeptional.
The hops have too be fuggles no two ways about that!  

Enjoy, its looking good just needs more robusting up a bit.

Jayse


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## jayse (30/3/05)

neonmeate said:


> snipped>
> looks tasty to me. I like a bit of black malt or roast barley in mine for some bite but that will be good i'm sure. amber malt is great in porters.
> 
> snipped>
> ...




I agree the black malt does give it the edge over just chocolate, I love it, the amber malt to.

that recipe looks great neon. I like the bit he says here...

quote> 
'Flavor, color and hop character have to be close. But I've found that sticking to the original gravity as directed by the guidelines can hurt your chances. I typically overshoot the OG by 4 to 8 gravity points. Not sure why, it's just what I do.'

End quote>

I have always thought the same thing.

Jayse


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## neonmeate (30/3/05)

warrenlw63 said:


> Cheers Neonmeate :super:
> 
> Was looking for something a little along the lines of Fullers London Porter. I've tried several times to replicate it thus far and haven't come that close.
> 
> ...



in my huge pile of recipes i havent made yet ive got a recipe that claims to clone fullers:
cant remember where i got it from but judging from the measurements it's a US recipe! (for 5 gallons i guess). brown malt would be an interesting way to go. i guess this is pretty close to what youve got anyway with all that amber. (ie a "brown porter" not a robust one)

8.25# British 2-rwo Pale Malt
1# British Crystal Malt (55degree L)
10oz British Brown Malt
10oz British Chocolate Malt
mash @ 154 for 90 mins
6.5HBU of Fuggles for 60 min
1/4oz of Fuggles for 15 min
Wyeast 1968 London ESB


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

jayse said:


> Enjoy, its looking good just needs more robusting up a bit.
> 
> Jayse
> [post="51622"][/post]​



Geez Jayse, you've got a bit of a sweetooth methinks :blink: 

Might up the spec. malts a tad more and pull back the Dark Munich. 

Time to start "robusting" up a bit. Stay tuned.  

Warren -


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

How's this look? 

Amended "robusted up" grainbill

5kg Marris Otter 53.2%
2kg JW Dark Munich 21.3%
700g TF Crystal 120-140EBC 7.4%
700g TF Choc 7.4%
700g TF Amber 7.4%
300g TF Brown 3.2%

Warren -


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## Dunkel_Boy (30/3/05)

I think it looks great, but I too would go for a darker crystal. IMHO anywhere from 500-750g is a good amount, depends on tastes. I usually do 45L batches, and the roastier malts will get overpowering if you put more than 750g in. Perhaps you'd benefit from a tablepoon or two of roast or black as well.


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

Thanks for the tip DB,  

Would have most probably used a darker crystal unfortunately 140 EBC is the darkest Fawcett's crystal my local HB store stocks. Don't really feel like using Joe White's.

I've sent the order off. Think this should work OK.

Going to eventually get a Porter that works for me.

Warren -


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## Dunkel_Boy (30/3/05)

Good to hear.
What are you going to bitter this bad-boy with? Yeast?


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

DB, Going to be a bit of an Anglo-American hybrid. :beerbang: 

Going to use Wyeast 1056, probably will use the dregs from a batch of APA I've got on the go at the moment, plan to ferment on the cool side to keep the flavours clean and fairly malt-driven. Really want the spec. grains to stand out a little in this one.

Hmmm Hops? Hops? Hops? :huh: 

Haven't given them a great deal of thought yet. Generally have a bit of a think once I turn up to the HB store. I've got some Amarillo left which I'll probably use about 15-20mins from flameout with probably minimal aroma editions.

Was thinking of a mixture of Northern Brewer and Target for the rest. That said I'll could still change my mind.

Not hard to see I'm going to be winging it a bit on this one. B) 

Warren -


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## big d (30/3/05)

northern brewer for bittering followed by ekg for flavour and arome.mmmmm very nice.


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## Tim (30/3/05)

If you want to keep with the american theme, go for some Willamette. hmm
I have made the Porter from the Palmer book which uses Willamette and it is very tasty. 
Also try and use Cararoma as the dark crystal, it gives a nice plummy, raisony taste. (Thanks Jayse for that tip! it was a beauty.)


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

Thanks Tim & Big D,

Now you've really got me tossing a coin.  

Maybe a combo of EKG & Willamette or Fuggles. Even contemplating Styrian Goldings.

Decisions, decisions. B) 

Warren -


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## jgriffin (30/3/05)

I did a pseudo choc porter on the weekend - pseudo because when i got to the brew shop, i discovered they had no choc malt!
I ended up using something like
150g roast barley
250g amber malt
250g cararoma
and (for the hell of it) 250g of Melanoidin 
used fuggles and US Goldings.
Just tasted it out of the hydro tube, quite interesting an very nice, not sure what to call it though.


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## Gough (30/3/05)

Warren,

I've made a porter with Target and Willamette that I was very happy with. Gives the Anglo/Yankee hybrid flavour you were after. It was also a bastardised version of a Palmer recipe (not that close in the end, more 'inspired by') and mixed Choc and Black patent malt. Very tasty. Your grain bill does sound mighty fine though  

I'll put in a vote for the Target Willamette combo though if you are going for a 'trans-atlantic porter'.

Shawn.


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## warrenlw63 (30/3/05)

Starting to sound like a winner thanks Gough, :super: 

As you well know, I'm a bit of a Target fan. A high AAU hop that gives good bitterness and pretty good aroma can't be argued with IMO.

Think Target (bittering), Willamette or Fuggles (aroma) wins.

Just got to try and not change my mind before I wander over to the HB store on Sat. and buy my stuff.

Warren -


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## Dunkel_Boy (30/3/05)

How could I forget cara-aroma?
That's right on.

Funny, I was going to ask if you were going to use northern brewer and fuggles, so I wasn't too far off. Target and Fuggles would be hard to beat, although I like Williamette more, Fuggles is probably a more appropriate hop.

EDIT: Just saw again you're going for the American-Anglo beer... I guess it's Target and Williamette.


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## SJW (31/3/05)

For what it's worth I am doing a Porter next week and this thread inspired the following: 

Jayse or anyone else, I would like to know your thoughts, as i have never used Munich in anything other that Bocks & Oktoberfest's.  

View attachment porter.htm


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## jayse (31/3/05)

Tim said:


> snipped>>>>
> Also try and use Cararoma as the dark crystal, it gives a nice plummy, raisony taste.
> [post="51676"][/post]​



too right its my crystal of choice for porter just can't bring myself to use anything else, You do have to watch your malt balance though if you end up to thin and with not enough roasted malts and other malts to balance the cararoma the cararoma my stick out a little to much. For another crytsal i would use around 500g but cararoma i stick to 360g pretty much religousliy.




warrenlw63 said:


> snipped>>>>>>
> 
> Maybe a combo of EKG & Willamette or Fuggles. Even contemplating Styrian Goldings.
> 
> ...



I did say earlier it has to be fuggles, no two ways about that.  
Those hops would be just as great though.




SJW said:


> snipped>>>>>>
> I would like to know your thoughts, as i have never used Munich in anything other that Bocks & Oktoberfest's.
> [post="51828"][/post]​



Another thing i pretty much just do religousliy without a second thought is use at least 1 kg of munich in a porter.
The recipe looks good, i personally would half the chocolate malt, then it would look almost exactly how i would make a porter.
My last porter i used IMC munich as the base malt its nearly reached full attenuation and final reports aren't too far off.

cheers porter brewers.
Jayse


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## big d (31/3/05)

hi jayse
as ive exhausted my pale base malt stock i read with interest that you have done a porter with munich as the base.ive still a reasonable amount of munich left so look forward to your tasting of your finished porter and how it stacks up against a pale malt based porter.
this may just get me by the deliriums of not being able to brew as often as i usually do.
lack of grain sucks.it hurts

cheers
big d


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## jayse (31/3/05)

Hi bigd,
I think its more than ok to use the imc munich as the base for your porter and actually it will work extremely well.
It did a mild brown yesterday and did the same used the imc munich as the base malt, a stout will be next again with the imc munich.
have fun with it.
I have brewed 5 times in the last week and stocks are starting to look good. :chug: :chug: 

Jayse


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## Gulf Brewery (31/3/05)

Jayse

Can you post your entire recipe into here? Would be nice to compare yours side by side with others.

Cheers
Pedro

PS Its not the recipe for the one that I didn't like was it


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## GOLIATH (31/3/05)

This recipe looks like it's coming on well, Great post Jayse regarding the cara Aroma.

You could have a close look at Northdown hop Plugs.. Stunning in Pale, yet to do a Dark with them, Anybody got any other experience with these hops?

Dave


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## jayse (31/3/05)

Pedro said:


> Jayse
> 
> Can you post your entire recipe into here? Would be nice to compare yours side by side with others.
> 
> ...



Whats was wrong with that porter....oh yeah it tasted like malt vinegar...even i have been known to stuff up a porter...... and i will never live it down! <_<





GOLIATH said:


> This recipe looks like it's coming on well, Great post Jayse regarding the cara Aroma.
> 
> You could have a close look at Northdown hop Plugs.. Stunning in Pale, yet to do a Dark with them, Anybody got any other experience with these hops?
> 
> ...



No experience as yet but they sure tasted and smelt very fine in the last brewshop brewday.
Straight of the bat i picked the northern brewer similarities.
Iam not sure what the A.A% is but for porter i follow what seems to be the ussuall thing to do and use the same low A.A hops for bittering as i would for finishing.
For stouts though thats when i would ussually use a higher alpha hop.
It just another thing i do religously without a second thought.
although i did use challenger the otherday because my hop pile is getting low.


heres a couple recipes.
---------------------------------------------------
RAMBLE ON PORTER

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 25.00 Wort Size (L): 25.00
Total Grain (kg): 7.05
Anticipated OG: 1.062 Plato: 15.23
Anticipated EBC: 54.9
Anticipated IBU: 36.5
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 15.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 32.26 L
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.048 SG 11.94 Plato



Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
2.8 0.20 kg. Black Patent Malt America 233.89 1034
5.0 0.35 kg. Weyermann Caraaroma Germany 284.01 350
7.1 0.50 kg. TF Amber Malt UK 275.65 100
14.2 1.00 kg. IMC Munich Australia 317.42 12
70.9 5.00 kg. BB ale australia 318.45 6




Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
42.00 g. Goldings - E.K. Pellet 6.00 31.2 60 min.
32.00 g. Fuggle Pellet 5.00 5.3 15 min.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 1098 British Ale




Mash Schedule
-------------

67c
------------------------





another


BABE IAM GONNA LEAVE YOU PORTER...I AIN'T JOKING WOMEN.

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 25.00 Wort Size (L): 25.00
Total Grain (kg): 6.30
Anticipated OG: 1.055 Plato: 13.57
Anticipated EBC: 52.5
Anticipated IBU: 35.8
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 15.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 32.26 L
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.043 SG 10.63 Plato




Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
15.9 1.00 kg. IMC Munich Australia 317.42 12
3.2 0.20 kg. Black Malt Belgium 250.59 1182
75.4 4.75 kg. Pale Ale Malt (2-row) Australia 309.07 5
5.6 0.35 kg. Weyermann Caraaroma Germany 284.01 350



Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
14.00 g. Fuggle Pellet 5.00 1.8 10 min.
42.00 g. Goldings - E.K. Plug 6.00 32.0 80 min.
14.00 g. Goldings - E.K. Plug 6.00 2.0 10 min.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 1028 London Ale



Mash Schedule
-------------

67c

-----------------------------------------------------
and another

BONZO'S OUT ON THE TILES PORTER

Brew Type: All Grain Date: 3/26/2005 
Style: Robust Porter Brewer: jayse 
Batch Size: 25.00 L Assistant Brewer: 
Boil Volume: 33.60 L Boil Time: 90 min 
Equipment: skunk fart brewery Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 % 
Taste Rating (50 possible points): 35.0

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU 
5.00 kg IMC Munich (12 EBC) Grain 87.4 % 
0.36 kg Weyermann Caraaroma (351 EBC) Grain 6.3 % 
0.23 kg JWM Roasted Malt (1200 EBC) Grain 4.0 % 
0.13 kg TF Amber Malt (100 EBC) Grain 2.3 % 
18.00 gm Challenger [7.5%] (60 min) Hops 16.1 IBU 
30.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [4.5%] (60 min) Hops 16.1 IBU 
30.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [4.5%] (10 min) Hops 3.2 IBU 
1 Pkgs Northwest Ale (Wyeast Labs #1332) Yeast-Ale 

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.053 SG (1.050-1.065 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG 
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.016 SG (1.012-1.016 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG 
Estimated Color: 60 EBC (59-118 EBC) Color [Color] 
Bitterness: 35.5 IBU (25.0-45.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 1.4 AAU 
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 4.9 % (4.8-6.0 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 0.6 % 
Actual Calories per 12 oz: 32 cal 


Mash Profile Name: Single Infusion, 67C





As you can see i do my porters all with several things all in common.
That is black patent and cararoma, it has to be ale malt i believe although iam sure you could make a nice beer with pils malt you couldn't make these beers with pils malt though.

Hey hey what can i do!
All of my love
jayse


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## warrenlw63 (26/4/05)

Thanks again for the tips on the Porter Jayse. You were spot on the money in regards to robusting it up.  

Quick update. I kegged it on Friday night. All I can say is I could have drunk the lot before carbonating. Very nice indeed even if I do say so myself.

Piles of roast up front with the Marris Otter providing a very nice foundation/balance. It craps on local ale malts in this regard. 

Most dark beers I've made in the past with Joe White's trad. ale malt seem to let the roast take over and make the malt/body very thin.

However MO stands up beautifully in these type of beers. It leaves a residual flavour that everybody who's used the stuff can attest to.

I primed each keg with 100g of dark brown sugar. Should be ready in time for the FA cup final.

Warren -


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## jayse (26/4/05)

Hi Warren,
Thanx for the update, i have a fermentor full of porter ready to be kegged hiding in the back of the cool room which might find its way to a keg today.
I haven't found the JWM trad malt to be that inferior and actually find it quite robust which is clearly not the results you have found anyway glad to hear the porter came up lovely.

If i manage to keg IMC munich malt porter this afternoon i'll post some intial thoughts, so far it is quite different to most i have done and you can pick the cararoma, i don't know if its just my tastes getting better or not but ussually with porters based around similar recipes i can't pick the cararoma really at all.
The munich malt didn't leave it as richly malty as expected either but all up it is one damn great beer.
First time using wyeast northwest ale has been a roaring sucsess aswell.

Anyway have a jolly good afternoon chaps.

Celebration Day
Jayse


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## warrenlw63 (26/4/05)

Jayse,

Mine is MO and also has 2kg of JW Dark Munich. The Fawcett's amber really shines too.

Not slagging local malts completely per se. Just nice to be a bit of a beer snob occasionally and use MO. I just prefer it in darker ales. That said I probably use local malts more frequently.

For bitters and paler beers the local stuff stands up just as well IMO. Especially when paired up with British crystal malts. 

I've only ever used CaraAroma in Belgian beers. In this capacity it stands out likes dog's balls. Very raisin-like. Combined with darker sugar it's extremely rum and raisin like. In higher grav Belgians it's totally in it's element. :super: 

However in a Porter it may be more difficult to detect due to the competing darker malts and extra hopping levels.

Warren -


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## SJW (26/4/05)

What type of IBU'S do u normally aim for? I just bottled a great brew but I fear it is a bit too bitter. On checking Beersmith I reckon I hit about 40 IBU. But with a FG of 1020 its a big one.

STEPHEN


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## warrenlw63 (26/4/05)

Porter is 37 IBU.

Hopped with Target and a small amount of Amarillo 20 mins. from flameout.

Didn't taste overhopped (though well-hopped) at these rates because there's a fair amount of spec. malts to back it up.

FG was 1.014

This is grainbill,

5kg Marris Otter 53.2%
2kg JW Dark Munich 21.3%
700g TF Crystal 120-140EBC 7.4%
700g TF Pale Choc 7.4%
700g TF Amber 7.4%
300g TF Brown 3.2%

Hop additions IIRC were 40g Target @ 10% AA for 60mins. 15g Amaraillo @8%AAU for 20 mins. and 15g Target for 5 mins.

Warren -


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## Jovial_Monk (26/4/05)

I am beginning to think that amber is an unjustly overlooked malt, and have made a few brews now using it, very nice.

Jovial Monk


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## warrenlw63 (26/4/05)

Yep too right JM,

It's always a malt that's most detectable in a beer.

Very distinctive flavour that only gets better with age. Fawcett's is nice but IMO Baird's used to be even nicer. Alas it doesn't seem to be available any more. Not that I can find anyway. :super: 

Warren -


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## jayse (26/4/05)

warrenlw63 said:


> However in a Porter it may be more difficult to detect due to the competing darker malts....
> 
> [post="56302"][/post]​



Yes ussually the cararoma is balanced well in a porter if its not then it doesn't really fit the title porter aswell as it should.
great malt to use in robust porter but I take great care as not to overdo it.




SJW said:


> What type of IBU'S do u normally aim for? I just bottled a great brew but I fear it is a bit too bitter. On checking Beersmith I reckon I hit about 40 IBU. But with a FG of 1020 its a big one.
> 
> STEPHEN
> [post="56303"][/post]​



I stick for around 35-40ibu, ussually in my porters you can hardly pick hop flavour at all and the bitterness is more so balancing than standing out at all. I also aim for a FG of closer to 1.015 because porters although some times are refered to as full bodied i don't think it needs to be or should be full bodied but rather it should finish reasonbly dry.

Bron-y-aur stomp
Jayse


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## warrenlw63 (26/4/05)

jayse said:


> you can hardly pick hop flavour at all and the bitterness is more so balancing than standing out at all. I also aim for a FG of closer to 1.015 because porters although some times are refered to as full bodied i don't think it needs to be or should be full bodied but rather it should finish reasonbly dry.
> 
> Bron-y-aur stomp
> Jayse
> [post="56310"][/post]​



Try late hopping with Target.  This hop personifies "robust"

Boogie with Stu :lol: 

Warren -


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## Ray_Mills (26/4/05)

Hi all
Bit late for this post but I can help
If you want a winning porter or a great porter try this recipe
It won the Tri Nations a few years ago, an outstanding beer, all weyermann malts just to be different. gee I will have to brew it again
http://www.beertools.com/html/recipe.php?view=1597
Cheers
Ray


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## jayse (27/4/05)

Hi Ray,
Thanx for posting your award winning brew. Iam just looking at the amount of crystal malt and the phase 'holly crystal malt batman' comes to mind, is that correct 1.5kg of crystal malt in all?


Jayse


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## Ray_Mills (27/4/05)

Hi
It is a lot of crystal and would be the biggest amount I have ever put in a batch. Because its a dark beer not all the sweetness comes through. Its one of those beers you have to make to find out.
Cheers
Ray


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## jayse (27/4/05)

Ray_Mills said:


> snipped>
> 
> >Its one of those beers you have to make to find out.
> 
> [post="56504"][/post]​



Good evening Ray.
Yeap thats what i figured. :blink: 
Iam the first to admit I'am a little scared to come outside the little square box I live in. h34r: 
But everytime I do venture out side the box on good advice I haven't been let down yet. :super: 
However 1.5kg of crystal has still got me curled up in the corner of my box.  

Houses of the holy
Jayse


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## Ray_Mills (27/4/05)

Jayse
Actually the gain bill came from the Weyermann site from memory
Ray


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## Guest Lurker (27/4/05)

jayse said:


> Ray_Mills said:
> 
> 
> > snipped>
> ...



Good evening Jayse

Yeah, I agree, as a geologist, those hexagonal basaltic columns on the cover of "Houses of the Holy" were something special, pity about those androgynous nymphs laying all over them getting in the way. PS Ray I'm sure its a great beer, but I just dont like raisins and plums in my beer so I stay away from anything with a shed load of dark crystal. So I am staying in my box, and I aint making it to find out!


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## johnno (28/4/05)

warrenlw63 said:


> This is grainbill,
> 
> 5kg Marris Otter 53.2%
> 2kg JW Dark Munich 21.3%
> ...



That looks like an awesome combination Warren. Sounds like an excellent brew.
I will have to make that as soon as I can. Probably about 3 weeks from now. I will use Fuggles and goldings though. I havent used Fuggles yet. 
I will at the moment use the Whitelabs 007. But hey 3 weeks is a while. I may get the Wyeast 1028. Not sure yet.

cheers
johno


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## warrenlw63 (28/4/05)

No worries Johnno.

That's about my only complaint with this beer. I didn't use an English ale yeast. I used Wyeast 1056. 

Good for APAs etc. Problem is this yeast is a little too neutral and clean for this application and you can bet your bottom dollar it will dry the beer out over time.

Hey Johnno. Be bold and toss in some Target. It's rapidly becoming my bittering hop du choice. Little scary (but not unpleasant) as a late hop too. B) 

Warren -


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## warrenlw63 (15/5/05)

Update;

Porter has been 3 weeks in the keg. What I usually do is start consuming a beer after 4 weeks in the keg. However 3 weeks out I usually try a glass for research purposes. :beerbang: 

Summary... Not bad at all. Certainly "robusted" enough for a Robust Porter. Nice mahogany colour with a nice tight, ecru-coloured head and an extremely roasty nose.

Nice, caramel sweetness and coffee flavours with a subtle floral background from the hops. Finish is roasty, hoppy and slightly sweet.

In fact it may be 12.30 am but I might sneak out for another glass to make sure. B) 

Thanks for the tips Jayse (and others). Closest I've gotten to what I've wanted in a porter. :super: 

Certainly one of the nicer styles.

Warren -


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## neonmeate (15/5/05)

sounds good warren,
i did something fairly similar to yours 6 weeks ago, just getting ready to bottle it:

3.9kg maris otter
600g caramunich II
150g pale choc
150g amber
100g carafa III
80g roast barley

+150g billingtons molasses sugar (like muscavado) in boil.

hopped with 15g SImcoe 60', 25g Fuggles 10'

37 IBU, 1067, FG came out 1015 using Southwold.
so a bit stronger and a bit less roasty than i wanted, but still nice, more an English "old ale" I guess.

i'm thinking of tossing in a capful or two of some laiphroaig i just scored dutyfree when my sister came over from the UK, for a poor man's Emersons Whiskey Porter...


----------



## warrenlw63 (15/5/05)

neonmeate said:


> i'm thinking of tossing in a capful or two of some laiphroaig i just scored dutyfree when my sister came over from the UK, for a poor man's Emersons Whiskey Porter...
> [post="59076"][/post]​



Hoooo! Excellent stuff Neonmeate. :super: 

Go for it. Weather's getting perfect for Porter at the moment. Shot of whiskey would make it even more warming. B) 

BTW What are Simcoe hops most like? Never heard of them until recently.

Warren -


----------



## neonmeate (15/5/05)

simcoe is a nice hop, gives clean bitterness - flavourwise kind of like northern brewer - piney, but with a bit of a funny pineapple/lychee flavour. i did an all-simcoe IPA that was pretty good, though lacking something...sure was bitter though.
i like it for bittering cause it's pretty unobtrusive in small amounts, and 100g of the stuff goes a long way.


----------



## johnno (18/5/05)

I havent made a Porter since last year.
I have decided to make this on the weekend after following this thread.
Thanks to everyone that contributed to it and especially warren for brewing it. 
Mine is a bit different but hey thats what its all about.

Can't slow down Porter
Brew Type: All Grain Date: 18/05/2005 
Style: Robust Porter Brewer: John 
Batch Size: 24.00 L Assistant Brewer: 
Boil Volume: 29.76 L Boil Time: 60 min 
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.0 % Equipment: 
Actual Efficiency: 12.9 % 
Taste Rating (50 possible points): 35.0

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU 
3.50 kg Ale Malt (Powells Malt) (7.9 EBC) Grain 57.9 % 
1.25 kg Munich, Dark (Joe White) (29.6 EBC) Grain 20.7 % 
0.40 kg Amber (Thomas Fawcett) (100.0 EBC) Grain 6.6 % 
0.40 kg Pale Chocolate (Thomas Fawcett) (525.0 EBC) Grain 6.6 % 
0.35 kg Ctrystal Malt Thomas Fawcett (120.0 EBC) Grain 5.8 % 
0.15 kg Brown Malt (Thomas fawcett) (150.0 EBC) Grain 2.5 % 
56.00 gm Fuggles [3.80%] (60 min) Hops 22.2 IBU 
24.00 gm Fuggles [3.80%] (30 min) Hops 7.3 IBU 
1 Pkgs Dry English Ale (White Labs #WLP007) [Starter 1000 ml] Yeast-Ale 

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.050 SG (1.050-1.065 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG 
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.012 SG (1.012-1.016 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG 
Estimated Color: 52.5 EBC (59.1-118.2 EBC) Color [Color] 
Bitterness: 29.5 IBU (25.0-45.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 1.7 AAU 
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 5.0 % (4.8-6.0 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 0.6 % 
Actual Calories: 90 cal/l 


cheers
johnno


----------



## johnno (21/5/05)

Just pitched the yeast for my version (sse above) of this tasty sounding drink.
OG 1046. 
23 litres. Yum.

cheers
johnno


----------



## Jovial_Monk (21/5/05)

Nice to see some amber and brown malt in there.

I am looking to brew a porter 1/3 pale, amber and brown. Can't be done,I am thinking of ways to do it, incl adding dry enzyme to the mash and home toasting pale amber malt

Jovial Monk


----------



## Darren (21/5/05)

JM,
Why can't it be done? Just mash cool (61-63) and for longer (overnight).
So long as enzymes are not inactivated they will keep on going for quite a while. High diastase pale ale malts will easily convert that grain bill.
That beer is always going to be "sweet" though.
cheers 
darren


----------



## Jovial_Monk (21/5/05)

you reckon, Darren? Do need that cool mash, agreed.

JM


----------



## Darren (21/5/05)

Jovial_Monk said:


> you reckon, Darren? Do need that cool mash, agreed.
> 
> JM
> [post="60106"][/post]​




Yep,
Done a few wheats with 60% raw wheat. Enzyme activity is often quoted on temp but time is certainly a big factor.
As you would know most mashes are finished in around 20 minutes. That is alot less than 30% of the 90 minute mashes that most people do.
Also often quoted is the "mash-out", Suggests that enzyme activity is still occuring at the 90 minute mark.
Todays malts are produced to have HUGE diastase activity so the megaboys can finish the process as quickly as possible (probably 30 or less minutes).
30% pale malt will do the job if treated with care.
cheers
Darren


----------



## Jovial_Monk (22/5/05)

Cool!


----------



## warrenlw63 (22/5/05)

JM,

One idea would be to make the pale malt component Galaxy (If it's still available ?? ). That stuff can convert anything.

Let us all know how you fare. Sounds like an interesting concept. I dare say your finished beer will take some time to round out though.

Warren -


----------



## Aaron (22/5/05)

Going to do a robust Porter next weekend. This what I have come up with for a recipe. Any thoughts?


Pale Malt 4.5kg
Munich 1kg
Biscuit .5kg
Chocolate .25kg
CaraPils .25kg

Goldings 25g 60min
Goldings 20g 45min
Willamette 20g 30min
Willamette 20g 15min
Willamette 10g 0min
Willamette 10 mash

London Ale Yeast III


----------



## warrenlw63 (23/5/05)

Aaron said:


> Going to do a robust Porter next weekend. This what I have come up with for a recipe. Any thoughts?
> 
> 
> Pale Malt 4.5kg
> ...



Aaron,

Looks pretty good save for a couple of points. 

Buscuit malt to my knowledge is not available here. Probably better to substitute it for some Amber Malt (preferably English).

Also change the CaraPils for some sort of dark (pref English again) crystal malt.

Other than that enjoy! B) 

Warren -


----------



## Jovial_Monk (23/5/05)

I would increase the chocolate to around 500g and add say 50g roast barley. The suggestion to add amber malt is good. If you want the biscuit toast some pale malt in the oven, about an hour at 90C, stir malt every 15 minutes to prevent grains burning

Jovial Monk


----------



## dicko (23/5/05)

Jovial_Monk said:


> I would increase the chocolate to around 500g and add say 50g roast barley. The suggestion to add amber malt is good. If you want the biscuit toast some pale malt in the oven, about an hour at 90C, stir malt every 15 minutes to prevent grains burning
> 
> Jovial Monk
> [post="60266"][/post]​



Hi Aaron

If you add roast barley you may find that your porter is like a stout although roast seems to be acceptable in a the robust style.
My opinion would be to drop the carapils and add a touch of black malt to about 1% to 1.2% of the grist, and up the munich if you cant find biscuit malt.
A substitute for biscuit malt can be Wyermann Caraamber I am lead to believe although I have never tried it.
Or more to style would be the english crystal as Warren has already said.
I add about 4% torrified wheat to my robust porter and it gives it a head like an angry mother in law without influencing the flavour against the darker grains.
Grab the book "designing Great Beers" by Ray Daniels if you dont have it, as it is a wealth of knowledge and guidelines on beer styles and recipes.
Good luck with the brew,

Cheers


----------



## Aaron (23/5/05)

Thanks for the tips guys. Have dumped the carapils and the biscuit and added:

Amber .5kg
Crystal 60 .25kg
Wheat .25kg

Now to see if I can get it all. I think I am going to have to get a mill and start keeping a stock of things myself.


----------



## jgriffin (23/5/05)

Recipe looks pretty good. In line with the others, i'd drop the biscuit, throw in some amber, and slightly increase the choc malt. Personally i'd stay away from the roast barley as i find it creates too much of a burnt taste for a porter. I like my porters choc tasting though. I also prefer an irish yeast as has a lower attentuation and the residual sweetness sits nicely with the choc malt.
My favourite porter consists of base malt, 400g of choc, and some crystal malt (i think 150g or so) , simple but elegant.
I also think your bitterness is a bit high, i'm calculating 41 IBU's which i think is about 10 too high.


----------



## warrenlw63 (23/5/05)

I used Fawcett's Pale Choc. in my latest effort. (670EBC). Really nice flavour. Not quite as bitter/acrid as normal choc. I used 700g in a 40 litre batch (see earlier post this thread).

Highly recommended.  

Colour was spot on for a porter. Black but not opaque. Has very nice ruby/amber highlights as well. I second the idea of no roast barley. Flavour would become too stoutish. IMO a good Porter (like Fuller's) tastes coffee/choc. Roasted but not burnt. If you require extra colour Carafa would be a better option.

Warren -


----------



## johnno (23/5/05)

warrenlw63 said:


> I used Fawcett's Pale Choc. in my latest effort. (670EBC). Really nice flavour. Not quite as bitter/acrid as normal choc. I used 700g in a 40 litre batch (see earlier post this thread).
> 
> Highly recommended.
> 
> ...


 I also used this pale choc malt. Deeeeeelicious tasting runnings.

cheers
johnno


----------



## warrenlw63 (23/5/05)

The aroma ain't too bad either Johnno. 

Warren -


----------



## Aaron (23/5/05)

jgriffin said:


> I also think your bitterness is a bit high, i'm calculating 41 IBU's which i think is about 10 too high.
> [post="60301"][/post]​



I used promash with the rager formula and it gave me 34 for that recipe. I will try calculating it with other formulas. Have revised again and this is what I am going with provided I can get all the ingredients. Not sure about the Crystal though, may use more amber and dump the crystal.


Pale 4.5k
Munich 1k
Chocolate .5k
Amber .5k
Crystal 60l .25k
Wheat .25k

Willamette 10g Mash
Goldings 20g 60m
Goldings 20g 45m
Willamette 20g 30m
Willamette 20g 15m
Willamette 10g 0min


----------



## Jovial_Monk (23/5/05)

Maybe replace the crystal with brown malt?

JM


----------



## warrenlw63 (23/5/05)

Hey JM,

Have you done your 1/3rds Pale, Brown, Amber Porter yet?

I'm hanging out for the results? B) 

Warren -


----------



## Jovial_Monk (23/5/05)

HAHAHAHAHAHA no, not yet--that porter is about 3 weeks away

Gonna do a one kilo of each mash on Wed, I reckon, a pilot brew. Will be sure to do the iodine test and report back. Might do an oven mash to ensure the mash stays at the 62C mark.

JM


----------



## johnno (9/7/05)

Just starting to drink this brew and I am loving it.
Awesome recipe and its variations put together by the members of AHB.
mmmmm just had another taste.


cheers
johnno


----------



## warrenlw63 (9/7/05)

Glad to hear you like it Johnno.  

Mine's still on tap and drinking quite well.  

Got a bit of a sore head from maxing out on it last night though. :blink: Always tend to binge a bit while I'm kegging another batch.

All in the name of research.


----------



## Aaron (9/7/05)

I have started drinking mine too. Turned out very nicely indeed. Really strong coffee flavours and nice heavy mouth feel.


----------



## Boots (14/12/05)

Here's what I'll be brewing tomorrow (my first brew in waaaay too long).


Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L 
Boil Size: 36.42 L
Estimated OG: 1.056 SG
Estimated Color: 53.9 EBC
Estimated IBU: 41.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.0 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
3.00 kg Pale Malt, Ale (Barrett Burston) (5.9 EBC)Grain 47.2 % 
1.40 kg Pilsner (Weyermann) (3.3 EBC) Grain 22.0 % 
1.00 kg Munich Malt (IMC) (11.8 EBC) Grain 15.7 % 
0.50 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (236.4 EBC) Grain 7.9 % 
0.36 kg Caraaroma (Weyermann) (350.7 EBC) Grain 5.7 % 
0.10 kg Black (Patent) Malt (985.0 EBC) Grain 1.6 % 
28.00 gm Northdown [7.20%] (15 min) Hops 11.4 IBU 
10.00 gm Northdown [8.50%] (90 min) Hops 10.4 IBU 
20.00 gm Northdown [7.20%] (20 min) Hops 10.0 IBU 
28.30 gm Northdown [8.50%] (10 min) Hops 10.0 IBU 

Will also be my first brew with my new mash tun. I converted my HLT (stainless 50L pot) to be mash tun; I'll use the kettle as a HLT and Kettle and use spargeless / batchless mashes. If i have to sparge, I will dump the first runnings into a grant.

Any opinions welcome.

Cheers
Boots


----------



## Batz (14/12/05)

jgriffin said:


> Recipe looks pretty good. In line with the others, i'd drop the biscuit, throw in some amber, and slightly increase the choc malt. Personally i'd stay away from the roast barley as i find it creates too much of a burnt taste for a porter. I like my porters choc tasting though. I also prefer an irish yeast as has a lower attentuation and the residual sweetness sits nicely with the choc malt.
> My favourite porter consists of base malt, 400g of choc, and some crystal malt (i think 150g or so) , simple but elegant.
> I also think your bitterness is a bit high, i'm calculating 41 IBU's which i think is about 10 too high.
> [post="60301"][/post]​




There you go !

I couldn't make a Porter without a little Roast Barley , all a matter of taste....or perhaps the grain bill?

Batz


----------



## wee stu (14/12/05)

Welcome back to brewing, Boots. 

At least you should have a few beers to keep you going during the ferment, courtesy of your generous charitable donation to the SA Xmas Charity Case.

Porter lovers, dont forget that the Mash Paddle beer in the 2006 ANAWBS is a robust porter - full details here Lots of quality Porter discussion on that there thread.


----------



## Boots (15/12/05)

Oh you said _PORTER_. I thought you said Brown Ale :blink:  

My grain bill above was too light in colour to be a porter. Would add more black patent if brewed again - in fact looking at my recipe, i thought i was adding more.. I must have put a typo in doh!!.. Adjusted the hop additions to be a bit later to reflect the change to brown ale.


----------



## tdh (15/12/05)

Hi Batz, I reserve roast barley for stouts and use black malt, choc malt and crystal in porters. 

Have to have some way of seperating the cousins!

tdh


----------



## jimmyjack (21/2/06)

I would like to make a porter with ingredients I have, does this recipe look alright or Should I bite the bullet and get some willamette and fuggles???


5.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) (5.9 EBC) Grain 83.3 % 
0.50 kg Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (750.6 EBC) Grain 8.3 % 
0.40 kg Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (78.8 EBC) Grain 6.7 % 
0.10 kg Cara-Pils/Dextrine (3.9 EBC) Grain 1.7 % 
10.00 gm Chinook [12.10%] (75 min) Hops 14.0 IBU 
10.00 gm Centennial [10.00%] (75 min) Hops 11.6 IBU 
15.00 gm Simcoe [12.00%] (10 min) Hops 7.2 IBU 
10.00 gm Cascade [6.00%] (2 min) Hops 0.6 IBU 
4.00 tbsp Coffee (Secondary 7.0 days) Misc 
1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) Yeast-Ale 


Cheers, JJ


----------



## sluggerdog (21/2/06)

Looks good to me jimmy. it's not too far from my first porter recipe. For the hops, I'm not an expert but I feel with all the different grains within the brew you could brew it with saaz and it would still come out a cracker.


----------



## Ross (21/2/06)

jimmyjack said:


> I would like to make a porter with ingredients I have, does this recipe look alright or Should I bite the bullet and get some willamette and fuggles???
> 
> 
> 5.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) (5.9 EBC) Grain 83.3 %
> ...



Mate,

Brew outside the square  - i reckon the American hops would go great :super: - I'd back the coffee off to 3 tbsp though, if adding to secondary...

cheers Ross


----------



## T.D. (21/2/06)

I like the look of that recipe. And there aren't a massive amount of hops there anyway. The malt and coffee flavours will probably mask the hop flavour a bit so I reckon will turn out great.


----------



## Crazy (21/2/06)

JJ
The recipe I use comes out with a bit of a coffee taste but witout adding the coffee. Just a bit of roast.

Derrick


----------



## KoNG (21/2/06)

Jimmyjack,
i made a "Mocha Porter" for my old man for christmas.
He loves his coffee as much as his dark beers so i wanted to combine the two. my recipe was fairly similar grist wise, and yeh i used fuggles for my hopping. As i mentioned i also added fresh ground at home "Sumatran Mandheling Grade 1" i only used approx 2 tablespoons steeped in 300ml of warm water for 30 minutes.. and into secondary for 7 days.
The beer came out well, but it definately had a big espresso flavour for the first month or two, it has mellowed out now and is starting to come great.
My suggestion would be to cut back on the coffee depending on what type you are using and how fresh it is.
If you are willing to cellar it for a few months it could be a cracker.

anywho just my copper coins worth
KoNG


----------



## Ross (21/2/06)

KoNG said:


> Jimmyjack,
> i made a "Mocha Porter" for my old man for christmas.
> He loves his coffee as much as his dark beers so i wanted to combine the two. my recipe was fairly similar grist wise, and yeh i used fuggles for my hopping. As i mentioned i also added fresh ground at home "Sumatran Mandheling Grade 1" i only used approx 2 tablespoons steeped in 300ml of warm water for 30 minutes.. and into secondary for 7 days.
> The beer came out well, but it definately had a big espresso flavour for the first month or two, it has mellowed out now and is starting to come great.
> ...



Just got my vanilla mocha porter judged (3 tbls of fresh ground Brazillian) & all 3 judges claimed they could not detect the coffee - Also 1 judge said the "vanilla dominated" whereas the other 2 had difficultty detecting any? :blink: 

Oh well, I guess for comp beers it's really got to be "in your face"  

cheers Ross


----------



## KoNG (21/2/06)

Ross said:


> KoNG said:
> 
> 
> > Jimmyjack,
> ...



Yeh i remember we discussed this Ross,
But you have to remember i didn't add any Vanilla, but i wish i had added a little  . I've had about 4 people try the beer so far and all have said "coffee" straight away. Dont get me wrong i love to try different things with a brew, so give it a go JJ and let us know. :super:


----------



## warrenlw63 (29/4/06)

Just thought I'd fire this one up again.  

Just kegged a tweaked 1st anniversary version of this beer that started the thread 12 months ago. It's a really nice beer. :beerbang: 

Tastes even better than the previous effort. I could have drank the whole 40 litres flat. :lol: 

Here's the recipe;

Warren -

Power Street Easter Porter

A ProMash Recipe Report

BJCP Style and Style Guidelines
-------------------------------

12-B Porter, Robust Porter

Min OG: 1.048 Max OG: 1.065
Min IBU: 25 Max IBU: 60
Min Clr: 57 Max Clr: 110 Color in EBC

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 45.00 Wort Size (L): 45.00
Total Grain (kg): 10.30
Anticipated OG: 1.051 Plato: 12.66
Anticipated EBC: 55.0
Anticipated IBU: 39.5
Brewhouse Efficiency: 74 %
Wort Boil Time: 60  Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 15.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 52.94 L
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.043 SG 10.83 Plato

Formulas Used
-------------

Brewhouse Efficiency and Predicted Gravity based on Method #1, Potential Used.
Final Gravity Calculation Based on Points.
Hard Value of Sucrose applied. Value for recipe: 46.2100 ppppg
Yield Type used in Gravity Prediction: Fine Grind Dry Basis.

Color Formula Used: Morey
Hop IBU Formula Used: Rager

Additional Utilization Used For Plug Hops: 2 %
Additional Utilization Used For Pellet Hops: 10 %


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
77.7 8.00 kg. Powells Traditional Ale Malt Australia 1.037 4
2.9 0.30 kg. Weyermann Caraaroma Germany 1.034 470
2.9 0.30 kg. Baird's Crystal UK 1.034 145
4.9 0.50 kg. TF Brown Malt UK 1.033 268
4.9 0.50 kg. TF Amber Malt UK 1.033 133
4.9 0.50 kg. Baird's Pale Chocolate UK 1.033 500
1.9 0.20 kg. Bourghul Australia 1.034 4

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
70.00 g. Northdown Pellet 7.20 36.6 60 min.
30.00 g. Willamette Pellet 5.00 2.9 15 min.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 1187 Ringwood Ale (repitched) (fermented 18 degrees)


Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Name: 

Total Grain kg: 10.30
Total Water Qts: 12.21 - Before Additional Infusions
Total Water L: 11.56 - Before Additional Infusions

Tun Thermal Mass: 0.00
Grain Temp: 20.50 C


Step Rest Start Stop Heat Infuse Infuse Infuse
Step Name Time Time Temp Temp Type Temp Amount Ratio
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
40 degree 10 30 40 40 Infuse 47 11.56 1.12
Sacc Rest 10 90 65 65 Infuse 99 11.70 2.26
2nd Sacc 10 30 70 70 Infuse 99 4.77 2.72


Total Water Qts: 29.61 - After Additional Infusions
Total Water L: 28.02 - After Additional Infusions
Total Mash Volume L: 34.90 - After Additional Infusions

All temperature measurements are degrees Celsius.
All infusion amounts are in Liters.
All infusion ratios are Liters/Kilograms.


----------



## stoutdrinker (4/5/06)

Warren,
I really enjoy dark ales/porters/stouts.
I have been reading this thread with a great deal of interest and a bit of drooling too! I have spent a lot of time reading & researching this and other websites & have finally got my gear together (Thanks to a fellow Adelaide brewer for his generous time/help/skills) and wish to do my first AG brew.
I would like to try this recipe or at least a very similar version such as earlier in this thread but want to know what your take would be on doing a single temp infusion rather than a multi rest mash. I have been reading John Palmers book & have seen the calculations etc for that but dont want to make things too hard first up. I can always revisit this recipe later when my skills have improved. Will the flavour/mouthfeel etc be much different?
Cheers.


----------



## warrenlw63 (4/5/06)

Stoutdrinker.

Single temp mash will be more than fine, in fact I'd highly recommend it.  

I only did a 2 step mash because I used Powells Trad. Ale as the base grain. I only experience 55% efficiency with this malt used in a single temp mash.

If you're using Baird's Marris Otter (highly recommended) or Joe White Traditional Ale a single temp mash will give you normal efficiency.

Enjoy your Porter. It's a great style.  

Warren -


----------



## KoNG (4/5/06)

Good luck with your research 'stoutdrinker'...
i've been doing a little of my own lately, i'm planning a robust porter for brewing in a coupla weeks. Ive started a base recipe that will get tweaked until brew day. 
Warren and other "porter people", your comments would be much appreciated, anything is able to be re-arranged at this point.. but i'd like to keep the basic structure.
i guess its that time of year where this style starts to get on everyones lips.

Lets Brew.... 
KoNG



Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L 
Boil Size: 31.13 L
Estimated OG: 1.062 SG
Estimated Color: 56.4 EBC
Estimated IBU: 43.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
5000.00 gm Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 70.4 % 
800.00 gm Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) Grain 11.3 % 
400.00 gm Chocolate Malt - JWM (700.0 EBC) Grain 5.6 % 
300.00 gm Amber Malt - JWM (45.0 EBC) Grain 4.2 % 
300.00 gm Crystal, Dark (Joe White) (216.7 EBC) Grain 4.2 % 
300.00 gm Oats, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 4.2 % 
20.00 gm Target [11.00%] (60 min) Hops 22.8 IBU 
15.00 gm Target [11.00%] (40 min) Hops 15.0 IBU 
14.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.60%] (15 min) Hops 3.7 IBU 
20.00 gm Styrian Goldings [5.60%] (5 min) Hops 2.1 IBU 
2.00 items Vanilla Bean (essence) (Secondary 5.0 daysMisc 
1 Pkgs SafAle American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-56) Yeast-Ale 
1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body
Total Grain Weight: 7100.00 gm
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temp Step Time 
Mash In Add 21.30 L of water at 74.9 C 69.0 C 60 min 
Mash Out Add 11.83 L of water at 89.0 C 75.6 C 10 min


----------



## warrenlw63 (4/5/06)

How about a couple of coffee beans Kong  

Just joking. :lol: Seriously looks the goods. Probably the only critical point would be swapping your spec. malts if it's possible.

Baird's Amber, Crystal & Choc would be elegant replacements that would just finish the whole thing more nicely.  

I can highly recommend Baird's Pale Choc. Very smooth finish.

Warren -


----------



## wee stu (4/5/06)

stoutdrinker said:


> Warren,
> I really enjoy dark ales/porters/stouts.
> I have finally got my gear together and wish to do my first AG brew.
> I want to know what your take would be on doing a single temp infusion rather than a multi rest mash. Cheers.
> [post="124305"][/post]​






warrenlw63 said:


> Stoutdrinker.
> 
> Single temp mash will be more than fine, in fact I'd highly recommend it.
> 
> ...



I second Warren's advice, single stage will be fine, and there is more than enough to get used to in the first all grain, without adding further complications.



KoNG said:


> i guess its that time of year where this style starts to get on everyones lips.
> 
> Lets Brew....
> KoNG
> ...



KoNG, not only is it a great time to think about Porters because the weather is drawing in, it is also a great time to get brewing porters ready for the *Mash Paddle *all grain comp within ANAWBS this year. 

If anybody hasn't heard of the Mash Paddle - check out this thread as well. Entrie close on 29 September, with full details on the ANAWBS website.

Stoutdrinker, good luck with the first all grain, I am sure it will be a great success. 
I would encourage you to enter the beer into the mash paddle too, Not only would it be a great way to get feedback, but it is amazing how often first brews do well in the most reputable of competitions. Even better, ANAWBS is being held in Adelaide, so there is the chance for you to get involved in things on the day, if you want - PM or email me if you want more info.

Into the black...............

stu


----------



## Ross (4/5/06)

Kong,

Not sure I'd be adding flaked oats to a porter - but other than that, it looks the goods :super: 

Cheers Ross


----------



## KoNG (5/5/06)

Stu, i'm yet to enter a comp, but could do in the future. i wouldnt think portwer would be my pick though, i've only done one previously hence the questions 

Ross, as above if i was entering a competition maybe the oats wouldnt fit, but i dont see why oats wouldnt go well in a fairly big winter beer. Is there a reason you mention removing them.? i will say i havent tried them before, but if you have had problems i'd love to hear them.

Dark Brown
KoNG


----------



## Steve (5/5/06)

Kong - noticed you are using both SO4 and US56?? Ive never tried mixing two yeasts together. How does it go?
Cheers
Steve


----------



## KoNG (5/5/06)

steve,
ive never tried it either! i dont know if i will still go with it, the reason being i had the OG at around 1.070 to begin with, but i'ts come down a little since. Recently i've been having trouble with S-04 dropping out and forming a brick in the fermenter. i still may go with it for the hell of it... they should be both fine in a porter.
will keep you posted.


----------



## Ross (5/5/06)

KoNG said:


> Ross, as above if i was entering a competition maybe the oats wouldnt fit, but i dont see why oats wouldnt go well in a fairly big winter beer. Is there a reason you mention removing them.? i will say i havent tried them before, but if you have had problems i'd love to hear them.
> 
> [post="124561"][/post]​



Kong, I think oats will go fine, just out of style for a porter IMO & that's what you said you wanted to make...

cheers Ross


----------



## Tony (5/5/06)

use the oats in an oatmeal stout.

I am planing one of these one day. I recon the oats would compliment the dry bitterness of the roast barly..... which shouldnt be in a porter.

i have no problem with experimenting but brewing to styles will usually result in beers that work better, they are like that cause they do work well.

cheers


----------



## warrenlw63 (5/5/06)

Why would adding a small amount of oats to a Porter be any different than adding wheat?  

If the grainbill had wheat (which isn't traditional either) would there be any comments? Grist for the mill. 

Can't see how they'd hurt. It's only going to change the mouthfeel slightly and add a bit of a head.

Kong. If it feels good do it.  

Warren -


----------



## stoutdrinker (5/5/06)

Thanks guys for the feedback.

I'm still a couple of weekends away from brewing but am currently enjoying an extract stout and a nut brown ale made last october - both very enjoyable.

I will post my recipe and how things go, post brewday.

Cheers.


----------



## KoNG (8/5/06)

Tony said:


> use the oats in an oatmeal stout.
> 
> I am planing one of these one day. I recon the oats would compliment the dry bitterness of the roast barly..... which shouldnt be in a porter.
> 
> ...



Ummm, the way i see it is, there'd be no such thing as an oatmeal stout if someone didnt come along and add it at some stage. The 'forums' would have been in uproar all those moons ago


----------



## Gerard_M (8/5/06)

KoNG throw whatever you like in it. I have always used Roast Barley or Roast Wheat in my Porters as well as flaked barley, torrified wheat, or crystal wheat. If you want just call it a Dark Ale. It's Dark & it's an Ale! 
Cheers
Gerard


----------



## KoNG (8/5/06)

yeh i think i'll stick with it Gerard. outside the box a little.
p.s i only replied so that i was one post count ahead of you again.!


----------



## wee stu (8/5/06)

The porter that I have brewed and been most pleased with had 5% crystal rye in it. A little bit outside the square, but not beyond the bounds of reason.

I subsequently upped the amount to 10% and used it a dry stout grainbill. Not a standard inclusion in a dry stout recipe either, but one I thought might work given the nature of the grain and my past experience with the grain.

The result? One of the best beers I have ever brewed and a piece of nice bright stainless steel in the form of a trophy won. 

Sometimes thinking a *little *outside the square pays dividends. When it doesn't, there can still be a learning experience. And if _you _are pleased with the results of the experiment, don't be afraid to share it with others, maybe by way of a competition entry.

awrabest, stu


----------



## THE DRUNK ARAB (11/5/06)

Have been asked to brew a "Dark Ale" for a mate's 30th birthday party coming up so have gone with Bill Pierce's St. Chucks Porter recipe from here:

http://www.brewery.org/gambmug/recs/975183377-19305.shtml

It gets very good reports in Brews and Views.

I have subbed the malts and scaled the recipe up for my equipment. Here is what I will be brewing.


St Chucks Porter
Brew Type: All Grain 
Style: Robust Porter Brewer: Mark Rasheed 
Batch Size: 23.00 L Assistant Brewer: 
Boil Volume: 30.33 L Boil Time: 90 min 
Equipment: My Equipment Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.0 % 


Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU 
3.64 kg BB Ale Malt (6 EBC) Grain 68.3 % 
0.39 kg Barley, Flaked (3 EBC) Grain 7.3 % 
0.39 kg TF Chocolate Malt (940 EBC) Grain 7.3 % 
0.39 kg Weyermann Caramunich II (124 EBC) Grain 7.3 % 
0.26 kg Weyermann Caraamber (71 EBC) Grain 4.8 % 
0.26 kg Weyermann Caraaroma (351 EBC) Grain 4.8 % 
25.00 gm Centennial [9.0%] (60 min) Hops 33.6 IBU 
51.00 gm Williamette [4.3%] (10 min) Hops 6.6 IBU 
1 Pkgs Scottish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1728) Yeast-Ale 

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.051 SG (1.050-1.065 SG) 
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.014 SG (1.012-1.016 SG) 
Estimated Color: 70 EBC (59-118 EBC) 
Bitterness: 40.9 IBU (25.0-45.0 IBU) 
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 4.8 % (4.8-6.0 %) 

Any comments welcome but will be brewing as above for the first attempt.

C&B
TDA


----------



## warrenlw63 (11/5/06)

Go the Arab!! :beerbang: 

If you don't like it I'll drink it. :beer: 

Warren -


----------



## Ross (11/5/06)

TDA,

That looks awesome - might borrow the recipe myself :beer: 


cheers Ross


----------



## SteveSA (11/5/06)

TDA

I'm not a big fan of that much crystal in a porter. I'd lose the caramunich altogether and drop the caraaroma and caramber to around 3% each.

Good choice of yeast 

Steve


----------



## wee stu (11/5/06)

SteveSA said:


> Good choice of yeast
> 
> [post="125704"][/post]​



Wrong, it a _*GREAT*_ choice of yeast   

Does look like a lot of crystal. 

Ever used or thought of using crystal rye, TDA? 

It is a crystal that doesn't know it is. Adds interesting complexity to a dark beer grain bill, without the residual sweetness often associated with the barley crystal malts.


----------



## Guest Lurker (11/5/06)

Must just be me, but I find crystal rye in a porter gives a subtle aftertaste that is pretty similar to the twang imparted by dark malt extract.


----------



## wee stu (11/5/06)

Guest Lurker said:


> Must just be me, but I find crystal rye in a porter gives a subtle aftertaste that is pretty similar to the twang imparted by dark malt extract.
> [post="125707"][/post]​



Remind me never to offer you my 10% crystal rye stout


----------



## KoNG (11/5/06)

Just quietly, BeerSmith tells me flaked oats and flaked barley produce the same "effects" in porters and stouts. 

therefore i likes TDA's outside the box recipe.


----------



## tdh (11/5/06)

re the Arabs recipe, I'd suggest drop the Caramunich (crystal total at ~10%) and reduce the Choc to 5% and add 2.5% Black malt.

My Robust Porter 'rule of thumb' is

10% crystal
5% choc malt
2.5% black malt
balance ale malt

have fun,

tdh


----------



## bindi (11/5/06)

tdh said:


> re the Arabs recipe, I'd suggest drop the Caramunich (crystal total at ~10%) and reduce the Choc to 5% and add 2.5% Black malt.
> 
> My Robust Porter 'rule of thumb' is
> 
> ...



tdh can you/do you up the choc malt if you don't have black malt?  Anyone?


----------



## tdh (11/5/06)

You could use roast barley, but I'm not a fan of RB in a porter.

Without Black Malt it's closer to a Brown Porter.

tdh

p.s. was your Anzac Ale made with the same ingredients as the biscuits?


----------



## bindi (11/5/06)

tdh said:


> You could use roast barley, but I'm not a fan of RB in a porter.
> 
> Without Black Malt it's closer to a Brown Porter.
> 
> ...



No  no oates or syrup  but 3 kg of pilsner malt
2 kg pale
.61 munich
.25 caramalt
.10 menanoidin
.25 caramunich
Chinook and Tettnang and Nottingham yeast ,yeah I know too much carra <_< but I love it  AND it's NOT a porter.

: Spelling again


----------



## warrenlw63 (11/5/06)

KoNG said:


> Just quietly, BeerSmith tells me flaked oats and flaked barley produce the same "effects" in porters and stouts.
> [post="125717"][/post]​



:lol: :lol: 

Warren -


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (11/5/06)

Caraaroma goeas nice in Porter...But I would add a touch of black malt to give it a bit of an edge


----------



## THE DRUNK ARAB (12/5/06)

Thanks for the input.

Okay, thanks SteveSA and Ducatiboy Stu, I know it's a lot of crystal malt however I will leave the crystal additions as is and "take one for the team" if it does not work out. One change is flaked oats for flaked barley (good on ya KoNG :super: ) as I have none in stock. And if I can obtain some Pale Choc malt by tomorrow then I will use it as the Choc malt addition as recommended by Warren :beerbang: .

Stu, I used crystal rye ages ago in an APA and was fairly happy with it. Might have to experiment with it again.

Ross, go for it. And I converted it from someone elses recipe so if it turns out crap blame him  .

tdh, not really brewing to style but I called it Robust Porter in my BeerSmith programme (which absolutely rocks btw  )

Great replies all the same.

I will report in a month.

C&B
TDA


----------



## warrenlw63 (12/5/06)

TDA.

Haven't you heard? Oats are out of style for a Porter. :lol: 

(Personally I reckon they'd be great)  

Stu, I agree... Cara Aroma gives some nice, raisiny/fruity notes to a Porter. Mine's on tap ATM and I'm loving it. 

Let the first man who brews a Porter exactly to it's original style guidelines cast the first stone.  

Warren -


----------



## MHD (15/5/06)

Hi all, Decided it's time to do a porter,
I want to aim for a sweet style, not driven by roastiness, so just a hint...

Similar to Nelson's Blood at the Lord Nelson in Sydney (SWMBO likes that one)


I was thinking along the lines of (for a 25l batch)
3kg ale
1kg munich
500g caramalt
500g dk xtal
300g pale choc
50g roast barley (or should I use dark malt or black patent?)

Using probably halertau mitenfru for bittering..

Suggestions??


----------



## goatherder (15/5/06)

MHD said:


> Hi all, Decided it's time to do a porter,
> I want to aim for a sweet style, not driven by roastiness, so just a hint...
> 
> Similar to Nelson's Blood at the Lord Nelson in Sydney (SWMBO likes that one)
> ...



My understanding of the style is you probably should skip the roast barley - go for the dark or patent for colour. The roast barley is more of a stout ingredient as I understand.


----------



## razz (15/5/06)

What is dark xtal ?


----------



## goatherder (15/5/06)

razz said:


> What is dark xtal ?
> [post="126512"][/post]​



dark crystal malt


----------



## MHD (16/5/06)

Cool, So the difference between the grains is the RB is not malted?

mmm...


----------



## jayse (16/5/06)

thats it MHD. But at only 50g it would be fine in a porter.

I missed a few of these latest posts, I agree a couple of those recipes look like to much crystal malt for my liking but I'am the same with most recipes in that I only use half as much crystal malt in all my beers as some people do.

I'll have to name drop here and say one of the best ever porters I have tasted was from SteveSA there and used no crystal malt whatso ever and all the others that came close to being as good as that one only used a max of 5% of 120-140ebc crystal. Even SteveSA's similiar recipe that he used crystal malt in it didn't really have a patch on the no crystal malt version. The crystal malt gives them what i discribe as more of a english old ale flavour like suffolk strong and really stands out to much. I like mashing on the low end as well, you can still make it malty and still be dry. The times i have used more than the ussual amount of crystal malts and mashed higher i really have not been happy with them at all. They almost taste like a bastardized over use of special malts extract brew with the crystal malt masking the base malts.

Looking at your recipe MHD i would personally at least half both the crystal malts if not even less. Same as rashy's but I see you have your mind set on giving that recipe a crack so I want stop ya.

Anyway each to there own, this is just my personal taste and i bet its possible to make a great porter with the more than ussual crystal malt just i can't seem to and haven't come across one yet from anyone else either.

Ranting over, i guess make them how you see fit.
Alcohol fueled brewtality.
Jayse


----------



## warrenlw63 (16/5/06)

jayse said:


> Hi warren,
> For 45l of robust porter you could nearly double all the specialty malts there, you would actually have to really.
> Go a whole kg of of 120-140ebc crystal, can even use much darker crystal if you want.
> You would have to have at the very least 650g of choc in there.
> ...




Mate! What a backflip. :lol: 

You had a nasty experience somewhere in the last 12 months with it Jayse?  

Edit: I must admit that it would be interesting to try a Porter made purely from Pale Ale, Brown, Amber & Choc malt to see the difference. 

Warren -


----------



## jayse (16/5/06)

warrenlw63 said:


> jayse said:
> 
> 
> > Hi warren,
> ...



That what i posted there is still only half as much crystal malt as MHD and rashy's recipe as they have that much in a recipe half the size.
But yes even so I have changed my approach to much less crystal malt very drastically in the last twelve months. Always learning and improving Try a more dry malty slightly burnt one someday you'll happy i'am sure.

Boozed, broozed and broken boned.
Jayse


----------



## warrenlw63 (16/5/06)

I've got plans for another one up the track that goes Pale, Brown, Amber, Pale Choc maybe a small amount of Xtal.

What I'd like to add this time is some liquorice root. A-la Shepherd Neame. By all accounts liquorice root was a common ingredient in 18th-19th century Porters.

Just trying to figure out how much liquorice to add could be the problem.  

Yep, she's an evolving drop for sure. Porter's got to be one of the best beers to experiment with. :beerbang: 

Warren -


----------



## johnno (16/5/06)

You want Dark crystal in a porter?

Have a look at this.

Made it nearly 4 weeks ago and just had a taste in the last couple of nights.
I thought it would be a bit sweet but no sweetness there at all.
It was an accident that i used so much crystal.

Seems to have balanced out nicely.

Amount Item Type % or IBU 
5.00 kg Pale Malt, Traditional Ale (Joe White) (5.9 EBC) Grain 73.0 % 
0.60 kg Crystal, Dark (Joe White) (216.7 EBC) Grain 8.8 % 
0.60 kg Munich, Dark (Joe White) (29.6 EBC) Grain 8.8 % 
0.30 kg Amber Malt (Joe White) (45.3 EBC) Grain 4.4 % 
0.30 kg Chocolate Malt (Joe White) (750.6 EBC) Grain 4.4 % 
0.05 kg Roasted Malt (Joe White) (1199.7 EBC) Grain 0.7 % 
65.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.20%] (60 min) Hops 37.2 IBU 
17.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.20%] (30 min) Hops 7.5 IBU 
0.25 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs Thames Valley Ale (Wyeast Labs #1275) 

Est Original Gravity: 1.060 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 1.056 SG 
Est Final Gravity: 1.015 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG 
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.9 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 6.7 % 
Bitterness: 44.7 IBU 
Est Color: 63.2 EBC 

YUM YUM

cheers
johnno


----------



## TasChris (18/5/06)

Hi all,
Just finalising my recipe for my first AG and thought I would go with a porter to drown out any strange flavours my poor technique will create.
After much research and stuffing about this is the recipe I think I may go with. Trying to keep it pretty basic and base it on one of Palmer's.

Porter 1

12-B Porter, Robust Porter


Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 26.00 Wort Size (L): 26.00
Total Grain (kg): 6.50
Anticipated OG: 1.051 Plato: 12.52
Anticipated SRM: 36.2
Anticipated IBU: 42.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
84.6 5.50 kg. JWM Traditional Ale Malt Australia 1.038 3
6.2 0.40 kg. Chocolate Malt Great Britain 1.034 475
6.2 0.40 kg. JWM Caramalt Australia 1.036 28
3.1 0.20 kg. Black Patent Malt Great Britain 1.027 525

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
20.00 g. Target Pellet 11.00 23.7 60 min.
30.00 g. Willamette Whole 5.00 12.9 40 min.
20.00 g. Willamette Whole 5.00 5.9 20 min.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 1272 American Ale II



Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Type: Single Step

Grain kg: 6.50
Water Qts: 17.21 - Before Additional Infusions
Water L: 16.29 - Before Additional Infusions

L Water Per kg Grain: 2.51 - Before Additional Infusions

Saccharification Rest Temp : 69 Time: 60
Mash-out Rest Temp : 0 Time: 0
Sparge Temp : 77 Time: 0

Any thoughts/ideas??
Chris


----------



## jayse (18/5/06)

At a quick glance that recipe looks about right, although doesn't need quite that much roasted malts could cut the choc back to 300g and the black to 150g and it would be exactly the same as the port of palmer porter, also his caramalt would only be 300g. Why not stick to excatly how he has it for your first go?


Good luck with your first full mash, proberly best to go on the cautionary side and stick to palmers recipe rather than adding the extra roasted malts for your first and go from there. Personally I think at 1.051 35 IBU would be enough.
These are just personal opinions as is your recipe is reasonbly on track.

Anyway hope all goes well.
Jayse


----------



## TasChris (18/5/06)

Thanks Jayse, will wind it back a bit!!
Converting Palmers recipe to metric and increasing the batch size and easily sourcing the grain/hops meant i had to make a couple of changes.
Thanks for your input.
Chris


----------



## MHD (19/5/06)

Ok: My latest version 25l
Crossroads Brown Porter
4kg BB ale malt
1kg WM munich
500g choc
500g amber

20g FRESH Nugget for 90mins
10g Hallertauer Mittlefru for 30mins

Probably just use dry yeast... What do people think of S-04 or should I go the US56 or Notty?

Comments?


----------



## MHD (19/5/06)

Hmmm looking at my recipie I wonder if I should throw in 500g of carared I have lying around...


----------



## jayse (19/5/06)

Yeap chuck a bit of that in too and it looks pretty damn good.
around 20g of fuggles at 15-10 mins would be good. 

Jayse


----------



## SteveSA (19/5/06)

My latest (2nd brew from the BBD)

One Metre Back From the Bar
Brewer: Steve
Asst Brewer: Even Drunker Adelaideans
Robust Porter

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 21.50 L 
Estimated OG: 1.059 SG
Estimated Color: 60.5 EBC
Estimated IBU: 37.7 IBU
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item % or IBU 
3.62 kg BB Ale Malt (6.0 EBC) 65.8 % 
1.00 kg IMC Munich Malt (11.8 EBC) 18.2 % 
0.36 kg Hoepfner Rauch (Smoked malt) (5.9 EBC) 6.5 % 
0.33 kg TF Chocolate Malt (1100.0 EBC) 6.0 % 
0.19 kg TF Amber Malt (100.1 EBC) 3.5 % 
27.00 gm Styrian Goldings [4.10%] (60 min) 15.4 IBU 
23.00 gm Williamette [3.80%] (60 min) 12.2 IBU 
22.00 gm Williamette [3.80%] (30 min) 5.9 IBU 
30.00 gm Williamette [3.80%] (15 min) 4.2 IBU 
1 Pkgs Scottish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1728)

Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 5.50 kg
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temp Step Time 
Mash In Add 15.00 L of water at 78.5 C 67.0 C 75 min 
Mash Out Add 9.00 L of water at 95.1 C 76.0 C 10 min 
----------------------------


----------



## KoNG (19/5/06)

Hello Purple Porter People,
2 nights ago i got to brew my Robust 'oatmeal' Porter... at a mates place, for a brew night/tasting/BBQ.  
everything went to plan, kind of, although bad light did not allow the use of my refrac so i dont really know if i hit OG (i'll do that when i pitch on the weekend).
In the end i upped the % of Oats, just because it was the first time i had used them in a brew, so i wanted to get a feel for what they provided. i didnt crush the oats with the rest of the grist and in the end forgot to add them when mashing in.!!  so they got dumped and stirred to begin the standard infusion mash.
i had no troubles with the sparge, so i may even up the oats next time depending on the results of this brew. The funny thing was and T.D. will attest to this, my first runnings looked 'purple' .. i'm gathering it was just due to the racking hose i used which was hazy from living in some napisan too long! but it definately had a purple tinge :blink: 
The night was finished with some english bitter tasting and a bit of meat with dead horse.
Here's my final recipe.... (below)
thanx to warren for starting a great, useful thread.. and everyone that has commented from there on in.

Cheers the Purple Porter Eater.



Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L 
Boil Size: 31.13 L
Estimated OG: 1.065 SG
Estimated Color: 55.6 EBC
Estimated IBU: 48.5 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU 
5000.00 gm Pale Malt, Maris Otter (5.9 EBC) Grain 67.6 % 
800.00 gm Munich, Light (Joe White) (17.7 EBC) Grain 10.8 % 
500.00 gm Oats, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 6.8 % 
400.00 gm Chocolate Malt - JWM (700.0 EBC) Grain 5.4 % 
400.00 gm Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 5.4 % 
300.00 gm Amber Malt - JWM (45.0 EBC) Grain 4.1 % 
25.00 gm Target [11.00%] (60 min) Hops 28.1 IBU 
15.00 gm Target [11.00%] (40 min) Hops 14.8 IBU 
14.00 gm Goldings, East Kent [5.60%] (15 min) Hops 3.7 IBU 
20.00 gm Styrian Goldings [5.60%] (5 min) Hops 2.1 IBU 
2.00 items Vanilla Bean (essence) (Secondary 5.0 daysMisc 
5.00 gm Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
1 Pkgs SafAle American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-56) Yeast-Ale 
1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale 


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 7400.00 gm
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temp Step Time 
Mash In Add 19.30 L of water at 71.2 C 65.0 C 60 min 
Mash Out Add 10.81 L of water at 97.2 C 75.6 C 10 min


----------



## T.D. (19/5/06)

Haha, yeah, she looked purple alright!!! :lol: But as Kong said, it was most likely the racking tube and dodgy low fluorescent light in my garage.

The brew went well, smelt absolutely awesome!! I was brewing a pilsner at the same time so the aromas coming out of the two brew kettles couldn't have been much more different!


----------



## KoNG (22/5/06)

I'm planning on pitching tonight, still tossing up if i will use both yeasts.!?
i think i was a bit under in my final volume, so my OG may be a little higher than planned.. i'll make the decision when i've checked the gravity.
Has anyone ever used a mixture of dried yeasts and noticed any differences in profile or attenuation etc etc.?


----------



## MHD (22/5/06)

Well My porter is bubbling nicely!
http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/recipator/recipator...up=12&item=5606
4kg Barrett and Burston Ale
1kg Weyermaan Munich
500g Weyermann Carared
500g Thomas Fawcett pale Choc
500g Weyermann CaraAmber

20g Nugget (11% AA, 90 min.)
20g Fuggles (5.7% AA, 10 min.)

OG 1062 @24l giving a 75% efficiency... Pretty happy with that...

I ended up making a nottingham starter, even though I know I could just rehydrate and pitch... I wanted a nice strong start and I seemed to get it with it firing up just over 5 hours from pitching...


----------



## BoilerBoy (22/5/06)

Interesting looking at SteveSA's smoked porter.

Last year I did a porter which was a partial mash, 25L with 350g of Rauch Malt and it was pleasantly smokey, but it died back after 3months.

A month ago I did another similar AG recipe except I increased the Rauch malt to 600g, 9% of the grain bill and I swear I can barely taste it, if its there its so very slight.

Anyone else found this?

Cheers
BB


----------



## Airgead (14/6/06)

Hi Folks

I'll dredge up an old topic here as I'm looking at brewing a porter (brown rather than robust) as my winter brew. At the moment I've got a real keep it simple thing going so I'm trying to minimise the number of ingredients (do more with less as my boss loves to say).

At the moment my recipe is looking like this (for 25l) - 

4kg JW ale malt
500g JW Chocolate
400g JW Dark Crystal
50g Black malt for a bit of extra colour

25IBU using northern brewer for bittering plus 40g EKG at 20 min for a bit of flavour (or 50/50 EKG and fuggles)

I'm looking at an OG of around 45. Ferment using WLP005 (brittish ale).

What do you guys think? I'm not sure about that amount of dark crystal. I may cut it to 200g and bump up the black grain by 10-15g to compensate for the lost colour. I don't want too much burnt/roasty flavour though as thats starting to drift into stout...

Any suggestions?

Cheers
Dave


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## stephen (14/6/06)

Airgead said:


> Hi Folks
> 
> I'll dredge up an old topic here as I'm looking at brewing a porter (brown rather than robust) as my winter brew. At the moment I've got a real keep it simple thing going so I'm trying to minimise the number of ingredients (do more with less as my boss loves to say).
> 
> ...


Dave

I am planning on making an Arcener Stout from "Brew Classic Beers at Home." The grain bill for this has no crystal and only 385 gm of chocolate malt: With a final EBC of 150. So if you want to not have the roasty flavour prominent you could quite easily forego the black malt and can quite easily reduce the Crystal. I just played witht the recipe in Pro-mash, selecting brown porter as the BJCP style and the recipe without the black malt and halving the crystal will result in a beer that fits well within style.

Cheers

Steve


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## Trent (14/6/06)

Airgead
My porter for last years xmas case swap was technically a brown porter, and it seemed to be well enjoyed, though I start mine at around 1050, so ya can adjust the base malt to suit 
for 23L

4.5kg Maris Otter
600g Carapils
600g Pale chocolate (approx 5-600EBC)

30g Northern Brewer @ 45 mins for about 25IBU

I have always found that my beers are pretty close to black, and therefore dont need the extra dash of black malt (plus, I feel my recipe was even a little too roasty to qualify as a brown porter, so extra roastiness isnt needed IMO). I find that my beers are fairly tasty with just the bittering addition, and never use flavour/aroma in my porter (unless its a robust), but that may differ for your tastes.
Its just a slightly bastardised version of the porter recipe given to me by Bonk to start my AG career, and I love it (thanks again, Bonk!). If it helps, I never use any crystal in mine, especially dark crystal, though the lads at the BJCP on the weekend reckoned it needs a little bit of crystal in there to give it a more caramel quality, but all rated it better than James Squires (maybe cause it was fresher?). To be honest, the few I put crystal in, I didnt enjoy. I reckon if ya keep it simple, ya cant go wrong.
Hope this helps a little
All the best
Trent

EDIT - Steve just beat me to it, and managed to say it in less than half what I did! Drop the black, and halve the crystal! I would change it to carapils, though Steve felt (at the BJCP) some crystal would have been better in mine


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## stephen (14/6/06)

Trent said:


> Airgead
> My porter for last years xmas case swap was technically a brown porter, and it seemed to be well enjoyed, though I start mine at around 1050, so ya can adjust the base malt to suit
> for 23L
> 
> ...


Actually Trent, I said it could do with some of those Blackcurrant/Plum/Raisin type of aromas and flavour that crystal can impart - and not drown out the slight roasted/chocolate profile.

Cheers

Steve


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## Trent (14/6/06)

Oops
Sorry Steve! Shows my hearing goes down the drain a little as I drink! Didnt mean to misquote you.
All the best
Trent


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## Weizguy (14/6/06)

Trent,
I just consulted my scoring sheet, and it was I who commented that I'd like to taste some caramel flavour in there (for my tastebuds to be really happy).
I also agree with Stephen, that it would also be improved if you could get some of those raisiny flavours.

With the flavours you had, though, I gave the beer 42 points out of 50 and called it a great session beer, which is prob what happens to it at home.

Beerz, Seth


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## Airgead (15/6/06)

Thanks Folks

After reading the suggestions here (and the ones people emailed to me direct) I think I'll go with something along the lines of 

4.5kg ale malt
500g choc
200g dark crystal (I am aiming for some dark raisiny/plumy flavours here)
Maybe a touch of black malt for colour. Using the JW malts stargebrew shows the colour at around 57EBC which is at the very low end of the scale. 50g black malt bumps it up to 62 which is more what I am after. Is it just me or is the JW choc significantly lighter than some of the others out there?

I've bumped the OG up to around 50 and I'll bump up the hops to around 35IBU. Still not sure whether I'll use a flavour addition or not. I'll have to sleep on that one.

Cheers
Dave


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