# Where To Put The Fan In A Kegerator?



## alexbrand (16/10/07)

Hey mates!

I am about installing a fan into my kegrator to prevent / solve some problems (bubbles in the beer line, unreliable temperature probes, etc.). But I ran out of ideas. Has anyone a picture of his fan installation for me and would like to post it here, please?

I think about putting it under the ceiling with blowing direction to the bottom. If I install it at a side wall I get problems with the space for my 4 kegs which just fit exactly. Am I right with this idea?


Alex


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## Zwickel (16/10/07)

Hi Alex,
Id say, it doesnt matter *where* the fan is, it only matters to have a fan at all.

:icon_cheers:


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## alexbrand (16/10/07)

Zwickel said:


> Id say, it doesnt matter *where* the fan is, it only matters to have a fan at all.



So just throwing it in should be enough?  Okay, I'll stick it under the ceiling.

Thanks.


Alex


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## Ross (16/10/07)

alexbrand said:


> So just throwing it in should be enough?  Okay, I'll stick it under the ceiling.
> 
> Thanks.
> Alex



Alex, & pointing downwards Id say that would be perfect. That's how I had mine placed & less than 1c varience over the whoile 1100 cubic area.

Cheers ross


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## bonj (16/10/07)

I get similar results to Ross with my fan blowing up from just below the collar. I should imagine that as long as you circulate the air vertically, you should be fine.


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## Adamt (16/10/07)

Another vote for doesn't really matter. As suggested at least have it pointing somewhat downwards. Remember that the fan does not create air, it drags air from behind it and pushes it forward, so the air behind the fan is being circulated too.

There was a thread around recently describing quite accurately how to wire a computer fan using an old mobile phone charger. Can't find it at the moment but I will post it when I do.

EDIT:

There's this one.

Also, this one.

Neither were the ones I was looking at the other day, I think theres a picture somewhere, but anyway.


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## Doogiechap (16/10/07)

I couldn't believe how much of a difference the fan made to my setup ! I had all sorts of problems with bubbles in my beer lines and a huge variation in temps between the top and bottom of my fridge :angry: . My fan is currently just loosely sitting on top of my 4 kegs and pushing the air down. Such an improvement for such a simple addition. Go the fan !
Cheers
Doug


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## kevnlis (16/10/07)

Excellent! I just pulled a 140mm fan out of my dead 13 month old AeroCool PSU and wondered what to do with it. Now I know!


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## yardy (16/10/07)

i've got a q, can you swap the wiring in a freezer lid from the light to run a fan ?

Cheers
Yard


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## bonj (16/10/07)

That depends on whether the light is 12V DC or 240V AC, and what your fan requires.


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## Doogiechap (16/10/07)

yardy said:


> i've got a q, can you swap the wiring in a freezer lid from the light to run a fan ?
> 
> Cheers
> Yard


And will need to bypass the switch or the fan will only run when the lid is open  .


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## bonj (16/10/07)

Doogiechap said:


> And will need to bypass the switch or the fan will only run when the lid is open  .


Good thinking (my freezer doesn't have a light).

I have my fan wired to a microswitch so it only runs when the lid is closed. You don't want to blow all that lovely cool air straight out the top when you open it.


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## kevnlis (16/10/07)

yardy said:


> i've got a q, can you swap the wiring in a freezer lid from the light to run a fan ?
> 
> Cheers
> Yard



Genious! I will try it this weekend and let you know  

Thanks for that mate!


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## yardy (16/10/07)

Bonj said:


> That depends on whether the light is 12V DC or 240V AC, and what your fan requires.



pulled the cover off and it reads 240.


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## SJW (16/10/07)

If I want to put a fan in my fridge. It has a light, but what would I wire it up to? I am not a spark so need to talk in simple talk. If I wire up to the light and removed that button switch thing near the door this should keep the fan going 24/7? can I just use a old computer fan?

steve


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## bonj (16/10/07)

SJW said:


> If I want to put a fan in my fridge. It has a light, but what would I wire it up to? I am not a spark so need to talk in simple talk. If I wire up to the light and removed that button switch thing near the door this should keep the fan going 24/7? can I just use a old computer fan?
> 
> steve


Well, as yardy says above, his light measured 240V, so if you're no sparky, you'd be better off going the 12V route. If you wire a 12VDC fan to a 240VAC supply, you will blow the pisser out of it and possibly hurt yourself or start a fire. Stick with low voltage stuff. I wired my fan to an old printer power supply at 13.5VDC.


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## SJW (16/10/07)

OH Crap. just relised that I use my temp controller on my fridge that cuts the power when not running. Might need to use the fridge thermostat to maintain power to run the fan. Just dont know where the best place to run the wires to.


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## SJW (16/10/07)

> Well, as yardy says above, his light measured 240V, so if you're no sparky, you'd be better off going the 12V route. If you wire a 12VDC fan to a 240VAC supply, you will blow the pisser out of it and possibly hurt yourself or start a fire. Stick with low voltage stuff. I wired my fan to an old printer power supply at 13.5VDC.



So have a separate power supply? not the fridges?


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## bonj (16/10/07)

SJW said:


> So have a separate power supply? not the fridges?


Yes. One that runs all the time (independent of the freezer).


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## alexbrand (16/10/07)

Thanks mates for all the comments and suggestions. Today I will installt somewhere in the upper part pointig down. I am just thinking about howto do it without drilling more holes or using to many screws. May be I use some glue. The insulation already looks like a swiss cheese. 



Adamt said:


> There was a thread around recently describing quite accurately how to wire a computer fan using an old mobile phone charger.


Found the thread, but not necessary, I can deal with the two wires at the fan.



yardy said:


> i've got a q, can you swap the wiring in a freezer lid from the light to run a fan ?


My kegerator already runs on 230 and 12 V so I have no proplems with the voltage. When I installed my digital temp controller I had to install 12 V for it, the power supply is strong enough. But the idea gives me another clue: somewhere in my "archive" must be an old fan with blue illumination... so I'll do some fridge modding... 



Bonj said:


> I have my fan wired to a microswitch so it only runs when the lid is closed. You don't want to blow all that lovely cool air straight out the top when you open it.


I installed an ordinary swith just to stop or run the fan. Because in my machine the door switch still controlls the light. May be now I have to paint the light bulb blue as well? 


In three weeks my kegerator has its world premiere. A birthday party. Well, not mine but my brother in law's party.


Alex


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## alexbrand (18/10/07)

It's done. I just put it under the ceiling blowing downwards. Works great, no more temp. difference betweenthe bottom and the top.

Cheers,

Alex :super:


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## Thunderlips (18/10/07)

SJW said:


> If I want to put a fan in my fridge.


Do you really need to put a fan in a fridge?
I thought their main use was for chest freezers.

And that word, kegerator, it's just so...American. <_<


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## FNQ Bunyip (18/10/07)

Thunder, go the fan , I've put them in everything too do with brew, without the fan if you put a warm keg in the fridge it can take 2 to 3 days too pull down too temp and in the process warms up the others , with the fan a warm keg is pulled down in under a day .... I run 3 , Brew box,larger fridge and serving fridge, I also think (IMHO) that it probly saves power by moving the warm air around and getting it all cool quiker , the fridge soon settles down and cycles less...

Cheers


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## Thunderlips (18/10/07)

FNQ Bunyip said:


> I also think (IMHO) that it probly saves power by moving the warm air around and getting it all cool quiker , the fridge soon settles down and cycles less...


Sounds like a good idea then. I must look into it.
Thanks.


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## Zwickel (18/10/07)

another point of view:

between bottom and top of the fridge, there might be easily a difference of 2 to 3 degree.

If you draw a beer, youll get it from bottom, that means youll get cold beer from bottom into the line. After you have drawn a beer, its going to warm up in the beerline on top of the fridge.
But then the beer releases gas into the tube. So your next pour will be froth at first.

thats avoidable by using a fan.

Cheers :icon_cheers:


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## sanders4_ (19/10/07)

I just remembered, the last time i was in Jaycar, i saw fans that looked EXACTLY the same as standard computer fans, but they were rated at 240v, meaning a 12V power source isn't needed. Only problem is they are 10 times the price of 12V fans, costing $30 instead of $3... BUT if money is no object, and your competent handling 240V safely, it could be a more straight-forward way to go.


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## Prawned (17/3/08)

Ive got an old cordless phone charger laying around.. Just not sure if it is what i need to run my computer fan, Here are pictures of both of them 

The fan is really really dirty! but still works fine so will just clean it up


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## bonj (17/3/08)

Yep, that phone charger will work fine. Just connect the wires such that the fan spins the right way, and Bob's yer uncle.


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## LethalCorpse (17/3/08)

Bonj said:


> Yep, that phone charger will work fine. Just connect the wires such that the fan spins the right way, and Bob's yer uncle.



To clarify: It's not a trial and error thing, most fans will blow if wired backwards, not run in reverse. On the fan, the red wire is positive, black wire negative, that's pretty much invariant. On the PSU, look for a symbol like the one under the C-Tick, the concentric boxes and the shield-looking thing. That symbol tells you that the output is centre positive, ie the middle of the plug is positive, the outside is negative. See how the symbol has a small + connected to the middle of a pair of circles, and a - to the outside? This can be the other way around, but the symbol should always be there to tell you which way it's wired. You can cut the end off and test with a multimeter to work out which wire is connected to the centre of the tip, or get a socket which matches the tip (Jaycar/DSE) and wire the fan into it the same way.


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## bonj (17/3/08)

I apologise if my post was deceptive. It is my understanding that PC fans are just simple DC motors and will run at either polarity, just in different directions.


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## LethalCorpse (17/3/08)

nah, they're a brushless DC motor. One direction only.


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## bonj (18/3/08)

That could explain what happened to my first one h34r:
The 2nd one is still going strong and is much quieter than the first one was.


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## ausdb (18/3/08)

LethalCorpse said:


> nah, they're a brushless DC motor. One direction only.


Some may be but not all, as otherwise you could not speed control them to make tight arse stirplates. All the BLDC motors that I know of have a fixed supply and use a separate input for the speed signal. An old skool DC fan motor will run in either direction and vary its speed according to the voltage that is applied.

FWIW has anyone tried putting a fan at the bottom with a bit of 90mm stormwater pipe on top as a duct to direct the air upwards and get some nice convection currents going?


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## LethalCorpse (18/3/08)

Computer fans are basically exclusively BLDC driven, with the commutation pulses being setup by an onboard circuit. The voltage and/or duty cycle (if being driven by PWM) determines the winding current, which determines the torque, which determines the RPM, which allows you to undervolt them for stir-plate use. The controller just senses the position so that it knows which coils to fire and when. They're used in computer fans for a bunch of reasons, including their much lower EMI than brushed fans, longer lifespan, and lower noise.


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