# Safale S-04 Doesnt Seem To Have Finished



## KillerRx4 (9/3/05)

I put down a Coopers pale ale kit on saturday (4 days ago) & used 1kg coopers enhancer 1 & Safale S-04 dry yeast. Fermented at 18-20 degC.
Monday, tuesday & tonight the hydrometer read 1020 (started at 1048).
It smeels kinda fuity maybe like banana?

So anyway i racked it to a secondary fermenter tonight & put it back in the fridge with the thermostat set to 20 deg, the wort was very clear looking.

I also bottled 2 760ml PET bottles worth of trub & it seems very active (if i crack the cap they want to gush everywhere.

What should i do? im thinking maybe pour 1 of my yeast bootles back in the secondary but dont wat to ruin it if its ok the way it is.


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## kitkat (9/3/05)

4 days? By the sounds of it it's still going ... Is the secondary bubbling, if you have an airlock, or did you try to open your secondary to see if there was pressure if you don't have an airlock?

I put down a coopers pale ale with a brewcraft pale ale converter and SAFale S04, and on the 7th day (today) it still came down from 1012 yesterday to 1010. It started at 1042 but fermented outside with overnight lows of 10-15, which would have slowed fermentation a bit, I expect. Brought it in 2 days ago to rack, but it's still going, so I leave it. I'll rack tomorrow if it's still 1010. Tastes nice when I take gravity readings


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## Ray_Mills (9/3/05)

Killer
When i make a beer, whether it be a kit or a mash Ale I always ferment for 14 days. I just let it go and make sure it does not get to high in temp.
Leave the beer alone. Dont open the fermenter, dont take readings. just leave it alone. After 2 weeks it will be ready to rack into a seconday. This can be a keg or fermenter.
Ray


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## warrenlw63 (10/3/05)

Ray_Mills said:


> Leave the beer alone. Dont open the fermenter, dont take readings. just leave it alone. After 2 weeks it will be ready to rack into a seconday. This can be a keg or fermenter.
> Ray
> [post="48489"][/post]​



Ah! Wise words from an experienced Brewer Ray  

It's always the hardest part to learn for the first couple of years. Leave the beer alone for 10-14 days because it's not going anywhere. 

That's why I like using glass carboys for fermenting. You don't remove constant samples worrying if the thing's alright or not.

I'm inclined to think that taps are just a road to interference.  

Warren -


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## Ross (10/3/05)

hear, hear.....


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## Asher (10/3/05)

Gday Killer...

S-04 is a particular high Flocculator (i.e. it settles to the bottom quickly). Sometimes it will settle out before its finished with all the sugars in the wort. A simple rousing the wort with a sterilised spoon is enough to get things moving again.... You say when racking, the wort was clear. So maybe it hadn't finished fermenting, just dropped out of suspension. I'd put the PET bottle of yeast you took back into the secondary fermenter for another week...

The smell you describe, wouldn't be more like butterscotch would it? Diacetyl can be quite a common problem when the yeast is removed before its finished its job..

Asher for now

BTW - My usual practice is the same as Rays. Two weeks on the primary then straight into bottles or a keg...


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## KillerRx4 (12/3/05)

Thanks for the advice guys. 
14 days in primary? Even if fermentation is finished in 5-7? 

I had a look on the web for info on the yeast & found this: http://www.dclyeast.co.uk/DCL_Main/main_br...ebrew_index.htm

" the Safale S-04 will attenuate the wort down to 1008-1012 within 2 or 3 days."

Anyway Asher I think you hit the nail so to speak. In hindsight I should have given it a swirl or stir but too late for that now.

I ended up putting the bottles of trub from the primary back into the secondary but i think it might be infected now because when i took the fermenter lid off to pitch the yeast back in there was a couple of white swirls on the surface.


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## pint of lager (12/3/05)

Don't worry about the white swirls, it is probably the yeast still doing it's job.



> " the Safale S-04 will attenuate the wort down to 1008-1012 within 2 or 3 days."


This is correct for a standard brew, but very misleading for any other brew.

The change from starting gravity to finishing gravity is the attenuation. This is often quoted as a percentage rather than a definite expected final gravity. For instance, a yeast that attenuates 75% with a starting gravity of 1.040 would finish at 1.010. A brew of starting gravity 1.080 would finish at 1.020. More advanced brewers then start talking about real and apparent attenuation.

The attenuation depends on so many factors, how fermentable the wort is, temperature, what sort of yeast, how stressed the yeast is and how flocculant it is for starters.

The best advice for new brewers is leave it alone for 10-14 days. There are a few threads about racking that have already been posted, if you want to do some more reading, do a search of the forum.


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## sosman (12/3/05)

Ray_Mills said:


> When i make a beer, whether it be a kit or a mash Ale I always ferment for 14 days. I just let it go and make sure it does not get to high in temp.
> Leave the beer alone. Dont open the fermenter, dont take readings. just leave it alone. After 2 weeks it will be ready to rack into a seconday. This can be a keg or fermenter.
> [post="48489"][/post]​


I agree on minimum stuffing around and leaving for 2 weeks. IMHO though taking SG readings is educational, I don't need to open the lid of mine to take a sample and I also get to taste how it is going. I rarely bother with a secondary, I cool my primary to serving temp a day or two before kegging to help settle the yeast and then keg.


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## KillerRx4 (12/3/05)

When taking a sample for SG how do you avoid the airlock sucking air/water into the fermenter?


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## deebee (12/3/05)

You'll probably find that the draw of brew through tap won't suck water from your airlock into your fermenter. Air, you can't avoid and isn't really an issue. If worried, remove your airlock or don't put so much water in there.

I worry more about the brew that stays in my tap and gets bugs in it. That gets flushed into your keg/priming vessel/secondary etc. when you next use the tap. I keep a syringe and toothbrush next to my fermenter and give it a quick squirt and scrub after drawing off each sample.

I anal?


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## dickTed (12/3/05)

I usually end up with half my airlock water getting sucked in when I take a sample, but if you can manage to turn the tap on really gently so that you get a string of bubbles.... It can be done, but just make sure your airlock water is clean to start with. I have a sanitized plastic coke top covering the airlock spout. 

While you're watching that string of bubbles, it's easy to overflow the test tube.

Think I'll invent one. An airlock that won't suck in. 

Actually, if you take the airlock out until you've poured your sample, I hardly think that there would be any more than say a cupful of air gets into your fermenter. This is a fairly insignificant proportion of the volume of CO2 in the fermenter's headspace. I think any airborne bacteria would say see ya later, if it had any brains.


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## Plastic Man (13/3/05)

If you have one of the "jiggle hat" airlocks (Big W sell em) you can just pull the top off, take sample from tap, and put hat back on.


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## Kai (13/3/05)

deebee said:


> I worry more about the brew that stays in my tap and gets bugs in it. That gets flushed into your keg/priming vessel/secondary etc. when you next use the tap. I keep a syringe and toothbrush next to my fermenter and give it a quick squirt and scrub after drawing off each sample.
> 
> I anal?
> [post="48868"][/post]​



You may be, but I do the same thing. I keep a squirty bottle of alcohol and a toothbrush or test tube brush for the same purpose.


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## Jovial_Monk (13/3/05)

Hmm there is a guy on the UK Ale list so anal re stale wort/beer in his tap he has installed a tap with backing nut an inch or two up from the bottom of the fermenter and draws his hydrometer samples through that.

I think I will do that too!

Jovial Monk


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## sosman (13/3/05)

I take my airlock out when I remember. Also, the stuff that I put in it is compatible with beer (not bleach) and if some gets in then I don't worry too much.

For cleaning out the tap after taking a sample I just use a few squirts of phosphoric acid solution up the tap from a plastic spray bottle which I keep on hand for misc sanitising duties.


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