# Wetting grain before milling Vs not wetting it



## QldKev (1/8/13)

How many people mist their grain with water before crushing it to prevent husk damage, and do you find an improvement in lautering and mash efficiency from it.


----------



## breakbeer (1/8/13)

At the Vic Swap Day last weekend we had some spec malts sitting in a pot that had just been rinsed out with water, so the grain was a bit wet. About 200g went through before the whole mill clogged (really badly) & nearly killed my drill.

We had 45 more kilo's to mill

Just ONE of the swap day mishaps


----------



## jlm (1/8/13)

Used to when I had a drill running the mill......Now I mill by hand don't need to. On my mill at least the slower speed seems to not tear the husk up as much. 

Am one day going to get it motorised at around 150rpm rather than the 500 or so the drill would run it at.

Oh yeah, only ever did it with base malts....never specs.


----------



## manticle (1/8/13)

@Breakbeer: There were more?
I must have been too busy trying to fix the eleven stuck sparges that I didn't notice.

Main problem with that would have been the water:grain ratio when it went in. Technique Kev is talking about involves very small amounts of misted water.

I tried it once but got the amounts wrong and got clag in my mill. Never had a major issue with lautering and efficiency is where I want it so I never bothered trying again.


----------



## Florian (1/8/13)

I have been doing it for quite a while now. Coincidentally I also don't have problems with wort fountains in the BM anymore. Not sure though if those two exactly correlate as I might have also changed a few other things like crush size.

I either wet the grain slightly, or, my preferred method (easier), weigh out the grains a day beforehand and just leave them in an open bucket or pot on the back deck for a day.
I _believe _this has the same effect given the humidity in Brisbane. 

Where's the poll?


----------



## WarmBeer (1/8/13)

Sounds like a good way to get the rollers on your mill rusty.







Edit: Picture for clarity


----------



## QldKev (1/8/13)

The idea of rusty rollers is the main reason I have not tried it myself. I'm getting decent efficiency, but was just thinking about this as it's a topic you don't hear much on, and as with any hobby I was wanting to tinker more.


----------



## Florian (1/8/13)

What's wrong with stainless steel rollers?

But even with easy rust rollers I don't think it is much of an issue, as you wet the grain because you want the husks to absorb that moisture to prevent too much breakage. So really the grain won't be wet if you wait a little bit before milling. 
If still worried use the grain in a bucket on the back deck method I mentioned above. If your rollers rust from normal air humidity then yes, I probably would be worried wetting the grain.


----------



## jimmy01 (1/8/13)

I tried it a while ago for 1/2 dozen brews. Just lightly sprayed grain before milling. 
I stopped doing this as I had no gains in efficiency and it makes a mess of your rollers.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/13)

The amount of water is important. Misting is not the method to use. Tony was the person who first put me onto it. You need about 1/2 cup of water to 5kg. You need to put the grain in a bucket and stick you hand in and stir through the water.It msy take a couple of minutes but there is no real fast easy way...except for a mini cement mixer.You then need to let the grain sit for 5-10 mins to allow the husk to soften. If you get it right you will notice A LOT of intact husk when crushed. This helps sparging. This is one thing I do know about as I allways get better crush and lautering from it.

Remember the trick is the amount of water and how you mix it. If you are getting clogged rollers etc I would say you have used to much water or not mixed it well enough.


----------



## I like beer (1/8/13)

I do it with hot water and leave it for around 10 to 15 minutes, it seems to cut down on dust,& the drill runs a lot smoother when milling. Does'nt seem to tear the husks as against unmoistend grain


----------



## Black n Tan (1/8/13)

I did for several batches. I would mist water onto the grain then mix by hand then spray more on so on. I aimed for 2%v/w e.g. 100mL for 5kg grain. Then leave it for 1-2 hours in a closed container before milling. Certainly the husks remained intact. I had no gumming on my BC MaltMill and found I could go up as high as 5%v/w without issue, although I think 2% is enough. The grain was just starting to stick to my hands at 4-5% which I think is a good sign to stop adding water. The key is leaving for a good period of time before milling so the husks absorb the water, rather than sitting on the surface a gumming your mill. If you are having lautering problems or chasing a couple of points in efficiency then you should try it and see if it helps.


----------



## Black n Tan (1/8/13)

some good info here 

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Malt_Conditioning


----------



## Grainer (1/8/13)

breakbeer said:


> At the Vic Swap Day last weekend we had some spec malts sitting in a pot that had just been rinsed out with water, so the grain was a bit wet. About 200g went through before the whole mill clogged (really badly) & nearly killed my drill.
> 
> We had 45 more kilo's to mill
> 
> Just ONE of the swap day mishaps


Was not good and huge delays


----------



## pk.sax (1/8/13)

I've been set milling for a few years, doing almost exactly what stu pointed to.

Recent brew, I opened up the gap on the mill a notch and did not wet mill as I was doing this the night before the brew.

One difference that I noticed immediately was that even with the wider gap I had considerable trouble getting the grain filter to set properly. I must have stirred the mash at least half a dozen times and slowed the recirc a lot to keep the bed from setting. Obviously, this reduced as the mash converted fully. From my previous use of a fb setup in a keggle tun, this was worse performance on much better equipment (fb insert pot in bigger pot, no centre pickups or suction involved). I plan to do the next one wet again.

The husks this time were about split in half, usually with a wet mill I'm used to hawks nearly 75% intact ish. Malt was pilsner.


----------



## technobabble66 (1/8/13)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> The amount of water is important. Misting is not the method to use. Tony was the person who first put me onto it. You need about 1/2 cup of water to 5kg. You need to put the grain in a bucket and stick you hand in and stir through the water.It msy take a couple of minutes but there is no real fast easy way...except for a mini cement mixer.You then need to let the grain sit for 5-10 mins to allow the husk to soften. If you get it right you will notice A LOT of intact husk when crushed. This helps sparging. This is one thing I do know about as I allways get better crush and lautering from it.
> 
> Remember the trick is the amount of water and how you mix it. If you are getting clogged rollers etc I would say you have used to much water or not mixed it well enough.


@manticle & breakbeer - sooo... it sounds like maybe we didn't add *enough* water to the grain pre-milling :lol: h34r:


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (2/8/13)

Dont worry...I played around and found that 1/2 cup of water mixed by hand worked the best. More water made more problems


----------



## razz (2/8/13)

I used it a few years ago at the rate of 20ml of water per kg of grain. I let it sit for an hour for the grain to absorb the water. It worked wonders for the recirc in the mash tun.


----------



## mabrungard (3/8/13)

When I have the time, the pre-conditioning does significantly improve the integrity of the grain husks. It enables me to crush the grain a little finer, produce a bit more flour and still obtain an adequate permeability through the mash bed. I suppose that probably increases the extraction a bit, but the real advantage for me and my RIMS is the intactness of the husks. 

As pointed out in several posts above, the malt will not really be 'wet' when you condition properly. Let it set for at least 15 minutes to allow any surface moisture to hydrate the husks. I still find that the milling process produces some dust and I don't clog or gum up the rollers. 

Do it if you have the time...but do it right.


----------



## Yob (9/2/15)

interesting stuff, the for and against are pretty evenly split..




Ducatiboy stu said:


> ...well...they definately where not doing it right. In no way should it jam anything up. Sounds like they used way to much water






manticle said:


> That case swap thing was just a matter of using a wet pot to hold grain. Moistening is a legit technique if done correctly but I wouldn't worry about it for kits and bits.



To keep the other thread from getting hijacked discussign wet milling, I thought Id port some of the discussion evolving there to here.


seems to me that if you aren't having lauter troubles, why bother, it reads as though it can (and I've witnessed it, see breakbeers post #2) lead to other issues and cost a shitload of time, personally, I don't have that time to spend cleaning rollers and blowing up drills.

Im not saying that it doesn't have it's place, system dependent, or that people don't get good results by adding another process, I've never had a stuck sparge on my system (No fekkin oats) so why would I bother? 

Ive only got steel rollers also, it's been mentioned that rust could be an issue, anyone suffered from this?


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

Yob said:


> interesting stuff, the for and against are pretty evenly split..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That is all true. But it will help you to get the tiniest teeny little bit more from your mash and give you your highest SG...as we all know, every little bit helps


----------



## Yob (9/2/15)

If we're talking about handful of malt versus an extra process with risks and added time and effort. Think I'll chuck an extra handful in and be done with it


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

Bit like re-hydra.....nah...lets not go there..


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

Yob said:


> If we're talking about handful of malt versus an extra process with risks and added time and effort. Think I'll chuck an extra handful in and be done with it


But thats cheating <_<


----------



## Mardoo (9/2/15)

Clocks are helpful when re-hydrating wet-milled grain with kittens.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

You need to wrap the clock in glad wrap first and let it cool down naturally


----------



## MHB (9/2/15)

There are two terms being tossed around.
Conditioning Malt is a process that hydrates the husk, making it springier and less fragile so we get better filter beds when lautering. If you are BIAB its going to be pretty irrelevant. in a 3V system it might be useful, for a recirculating system it might give some real advantages, and it really can be a big help to efficiency and lautering speeds in big breweries, where those things matter.
On the other hand if you don't do it properly you have a very good chance of causing very highly increases Oxidation of the wort particularly though increased Lipoxeygenase activity
Wet milling is another thing entirely, that is where the strike water and the malt are milled together, again probably more useful to bigger brewers.

To do either well does require a bit of preplanning and ideally some specialised equipment,
Another approach that might be worth looking at is to use steam, with household steam cleaners/wands being so common, a few minutes of stirring the malt in a bucket with a steam hose might work well.

Personally I think that unless your mill has duel roller drive and likely something better than a knurled surface there isn't going to be much point, Knurled rollers and idling rollers will always shred the husk more than a bit of conditioning is going to compensate for.
Mark


----------



## Killer Brew (9/2/15)

Can I ask what is the knock on a blast with a blender? I thought the speed and ease of doing this with 800g yesterday would be hard to go past plus I may save some bucks not having to purchase a mill. The dampening of the grain (20ml water for the 800g) may or may not have contributed to what I thought was a good outcome  but I hit above predicted OG by some way.

Having not milled grain before to compare to though I'm not sure what I may be missing.


----------



## seamad (9/2/15)

If using a blender adding water is pretty pointless. A blender may work OK for BIAB, but if running a recirc system ( I do ) then you need the husks to help set up a filter bed.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

MHB said:


> Personally I think that unless your mill has duel roller drive and likely something better than a knurled surface there isn't going to be much point, Knurled rollers and idling rollers will always shred the husk more than a bit of conditioning is going to compensate for.
> Mark


I always get a much better crush and intact husks with the grain wetting ( or moistening ) and I have knurled rollers with only one driven. Roller speed also has a lot to do with shredding husks as well.. I try to aim for about 30% flour.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

Killer Brew said:


> Can I ask what is the knock on a blast with a blender? I thought the speed and ease of doing this with 800g yesterday would be hard to go past plus I may save some bucks not having to purchase a mill. The dampening of the grain (20ml water for the 800g) may or may not have contributed to what I thought was a good outcome  but I hit above predicted OG by some way.
> 
> Having not milled grain before to compare to though I'm not sure what I may be missing.


Basically as Seamad said, wetting and using a blender is pointless. A blender will tend to cut the grains up regardless. Milling actually crushes the grain, and moistening the husks allows the husk to remain flexible so the inner kernal/endosperm can still be crushed effectively. 

Moistening is not the be all and end all. It is just one thing that can help you on your way to efficiency nirvana. Just moistening alone wont do much at all if the rest of your process is not spot on and equipment dialed in.


----------



## Black n Tan (9/2/15)

MHB said:


> On the other hand if you don't do it properly you have a very good chance of causing very highly increases Oxidation of the wort particularly though increased Lipoxeygenase activity


Can you please explain how improper wet conditioning can lead to this?


----------



## Bribie G (9/2/15)

jlm said:


> Used to when I had a drill running the mill......Now I mill by hand don't need to. On my mill at least the slower speed seems to not tear the husk up as much.
> 
> Am one day going to get it motorised at around 150rpm rather than the 500 or so the drill would run it at.
> 
> Oh yeah, only ever did it with base malts....never specs.


I use an Ozito spade handled drill that's super high torque and can be set very slow to spin my Italian Marga Mill about the same speed as an Italian Mama with PMT who has just found out that Luigi has been shagging her sister.

I seem to remember Ross telling me how this "wetting" thing came about originally and why it's not necessary.

Probably same source as the kittens legend.


----------



## professional_drunk (9/2/15)

This is my standard process now.

since doing it, never had a wort fountain on a bm even with 70% wheat.
can't be stuffed messing around with roller gap. Just set it to smallest.
filter plates are easier to clean as there's less small particles.
chickens have to spend less time pecking at the grains


----------



## RobW (9/2/15)

Black n Tan said:


> Can you please explain how improper wet conditioning can lead to this?


and Mark does it matter if you're then going to boil it off?


----------



## MHB (9/2/15)

B&T
Lipids are a type of fatty acids, mostly found in the acrospires (germ of the malt), this is where during malting the rootlet was attached, so its where water can most easily get into the malted barley corn.
If you hydrate the acrospires and the temperature is in the right range (60-70oC peak activity) and there is oxygen around Lipoxygenase will oxidise the lipids and start (or more properly accelerate) the staling process. The oxidation of lipids is one of the primary cause of staling in beer anyway, there is relatively very little O2 in strike water, and lots in air.

Keeping the hydrating water over 80oC helps, industrially they take a variety of measures to reduce the effect, peeling the angiosperm before crushing, hydrating in a CO2/N2 atmosphere, immersion in de-aired water, using steam...

Like many things in brewing, malt conditioning can be beneficial, if you do it properly, do a half arsed job and you will make half arsed beer.

Mark

Edit
Rob W
No, I believe oxidised fatty acids are not volatile, like putting rancid butter in a cup of tea - its a very unpleasant flavour I would go to some lengths to avoid.
M


----------



## seamad (9/2/15)

So if you hydrate at room temp ( say 25C) how much lipoxygenase activity would you expect ?


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (9/2/15)

Most brewers I know only use tap water to moisten, which is normally around the 20*c mark.


----------



## RobW (9/2/15)

MHB said:


> B&T
> Lipids are a type of fatty acids, mostly found in the acrospires (germ of the malt), this is where during malting the rootlet was attached, so its where water can most easily get into the malted barley corn.
> If you hydrate the acrospires and the temperature is in the right range (60-70oC peak activity) and there is oxygen around Lipoxygenase will oxidise the lipids and start (or more properly accelerate) the staling process. The oxidation of lipids is one of the primary cause of staling in beer anyway, there is relatively very little O2 in strike water, and lots in air.
> 
> ...


Thanks mark - understood


----------



## Black n Tan (9/2/15)

MHB said:


> If you hydrate the acrospires and the temperature is in the right range (60-70oC peak activity) and there is oxygen around Lipoxygenase will oxidise the lipids and start (or more properly accelerate) the staling process. The oxidation of lipids is one of the primary cause of staling in beer anyway, there is relatively very little O2 in strike water, and lots in air.
> 
> Keeping the hydrating water over 80oC helps, industrially they take a variety of measures to reduce the effect, peeling the angiosperm before crushing, hydrating in a CO2/N2 atmosphere, immersion in de-aired water, using steam...


Would expect this to occur at 20-30C? I have conditioned before with 1-2% water and then let the malt sit for 30 mins at room temp (say 20ish C) before milling. Would you expect much lipid oxidation at these temps?


----------



## MHB (10/2/15)

There are too many variables to answer, it isn't something that I have spent a lot of time researching.
I had a customer who was having a lot of stale flavours in quite young beer, he was wetting the grain and leaving it overnight, after we did a bit of research on staling he stopped doing that and the problem went away.
It will happen at ambient , is 20-30 minutes going to be long enough to make a noticeable change to the beers shelf life I don't know, the textbooks recommend 1 minute at 80oC to get the desired hydration of the husk while minimising other problems. Unless I knew a lot more about brewing than Kunze (I don't) I would go with that, or give it a miss entirely (more likely)

I wasn't really trying to start a great debate about the activity of one fairly obscure enzyme, rather to highlight that in brewing all the choices we make have consequences - some of them unforseen. A bit like all the talk a while ago about pressurised fermentation, it to can have pros and cons, there are potential benefits if it is done properly and downsides if you do it wrong.

I think a good mill and well selected crush (or two) and hydration is fairly much more trouble than its worth, but try it and see if you get better beer, if you do good if not - well lesson learned and move on.
Mark


----------



## Eagleburger (10/2/15)

QldKev said:


> How many people mist their grain with water before crushing it to prevent husk damage, and do you find an improvement in lautering and mash efficiency from it.


I mist about 100ml onto 10kg. tap water and mill about 15mins later. I noticed That I still get get a lot of flour but have trouble finding husk fragments. I have a top recirculating system and get a very good flow through with minimal husk material after boil. Yet to experience staling, but fresh is best. I think the longest beer has survived is three weeks. :chug:

Thanks MHB for the food for thought.


----------



## Fat Bastard (20/7/15)

I tried this conditioning thing over the weekend... Been having trouble with stuck mashes and odd grain bed behaviour since I built my new rig, a 3V HERMS thingo.

Probably over did it with the water (1 cup to 10kg), gummed up the rollers something fierce, but was very happy with the results. No more stuck mash. No more grainbed disintegrating when the pump is throttled back for the sparge. Seems fairly advantageous for my system, but whether or not the problems can be overcome remains to be seen. I've tried a lot of different crushes with this system, and ive not been able to get the recirculation perfect until now.

Will try with less water next time and see how it goes.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (20/7/15)

There is a fine line with the water amount.

Try a bit less next time.

You will notice when its right husks are soft and not mushy...


----------



## Fat Bastard (20/7/15)

Yeah, I figure I'll halve the amount I use the next time. I knew I screwed up the third time I had to empty the hopper. My hopper easily holds the whole 10kg, so it's fairly painful to do!

I guess then it's a matter of bringing the gap in until the mash sticks, then opening it up a little. Long-winded process, this brewing lark!


----------



## Danscraftbeer (20/7/15)

Does it gunge up your mill? I dont like the idea for that. It makes sense not to. IMO


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (20/7/15)

Danscraftbeer said:


> Does it gunge up your mill? I dont like the idea for that. It makes sense not to. IMO


Not if you get it right

If its gumming up your mill then its to wet


----------



## antiphile (1/8/15)

I have become a real convert to malt conditioning even though today was only my second crush doing it. Five weeks ago I got another sack of Barret Burston Pale Ale. Yet this particular batch seemed to taunt the millmaster rollers and wanted to jump up away from them instead of being pulled through. It was incredibly annoying and took forever to mill this stuff, even after altering the roller width up and down.

During the week I did an SNPA clone and was _not_ looking forward to crushing 9 kg of the stuff. So the bullet was bitten and the Braukeiser method employed. (170 mls water misted over 9 kg a little at a time while thoroughly mixed by hand). Then left for 15 to 20 mins before milling at 0.9 mm roller separation. The grains couldn't wait to go through the mill (and absolutely no need for double-crushing! It really was superquick and simple. (Photo of this crush attached). I even gained a few more % of mash efficiency.

Today was a 10+ kg grain bill for an Oktoberfest using almost all Weyermann grains (pilsner, munich and vienna). Again it raced through the mill with fantastic results. It looks as though malt conditioning is now going to be standard operating procedure here!


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

I rest my case. B)

You will even notice that conditioned malt actually pushes/squeezes the kernel out and leaves the husk in tact..

I bet your sparging was much better as well


----------



## manticle (1/8/15)

Rehydrating grain. Whatever will they think of next?


----------



## antiphile (1/8/15)

You're absolutely 100% right! For the cost of maybe an extra 30 minutes up front, it probably saved more than three times that in milling, mashing and sparging. I think I'm in love! :icon_drool2:


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

manticle said:


> Rehydrating grain. Whatever will they think of next?


You should what they do with yeast .....


----------



## Danscraftbeer (1/8/15)

Nice Photo Antiphile.
I'll have to try this but I've never had any problem milling dry grain. I only have a twin roller. Connect the power drill. Fill the mill with 2kg grain at a time on lowest speed possible and mill 9kg in about 10 - 15 minutes? at most. Looks the same results a your pic just dryer and dusty. Then again I havnt tried it. I will!, maybe, sometime. B)


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

10-15mins...


My 2 roller mill ( 50mm knurled rollers ) does 5kg in about 1min flat with 30% flour at about 180rpm


----------



## Danscraftbeer (1/8/15)

Thats what I mean. I couldnt be bothered timing the milling but its more likely less than I quoted.
More like a lesurely 10 minutes, :chug:


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

10 mins is a long time......

Maybe you should try wetting than get back to us on the result B)


----------



## Danscraftbeer (1/8/15)

OK then! The next brew I plan is a symple PA to test a strain of cultured Coopers bottled yeast. A 20lt batch with about 4.5kg grain that will be lightly moistened prior to milling.
Thats my next brew then..... B)


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

Your a legend for giving it a go and thinking outside the conventional brewers way of doing things B)


----------



## Danscraftbeer (1/8/15)

pffhaah! You must be drinking some good stuff. As am I. :chug:


----------



## antiphile (1/8/15)

Hi Dan

It sounds as though we have the same setup: a 2-roller mill and a power drill (mine's an Ozito 1050 watt low-speed high-torque spade drill). I tested various roller widths and found (after moistening as described above), 0.7 and 0.9 mm settings worked superbly. At 1.2 mm some grains just went through without being cracked at all. Here's a pic showing it at 1.2 mm.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (1/8/15)

Just trying to get you to think outside the square

I have converted a few. h34r:


----------



## Danscraftbeer (1/8/15)

MaltConditioning3.jpg
Same here. A freak good Ozito drill that they discontinued of course. I have varied the mill gradient and just found that it all works. No really incredible differences to report. It all works. Best to set rollers at around 3/4 of the width of the grain.
That grain looks good enough. Every grain would have at least one fracture. I've done it like that before. It works. B)


----------



## razz (2/8/15)

Helps to cut down on dust too!


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (2/8/15)

Danscraftbeer said:


> . Best to set rollers at around 3/4 of the width of the grain.


Not always the case. All mills are different so you need to adjust acordingly. I set mine at 0.9mm...some set wider, some tighter


----------



## labels (4/8/15)

Looks good at less than 1mm.

I've been conditioning grain for the last 10 years. I use approx. 100ml water per 10Kg of grain. The shape of my mill hopper is different to most in that it has a very shallow sides, although this was done because of occasional stones stopping the mill, it makes it easy to condition grain as it goes through the rollers.

I only allow a minute or two after spraying and before milling. This keeps the water out of the grain starch and into the husks only allowing me to run a ~0.7 gap. Rust is not a problem with ss rollers and a 1/3rd horsepower motor running through a 120rpm reduction gearbox and a chain drive driving the mill, it's pretty easy running


----------



## rude (4/8/15)

jeez I have a home made mill, nickel plated knurled scoffold tube,trailer axel middle

Run by a windscreen wiper motor

Have changed grains from BB to some German & Pommy malts lately

Had to open rollers up from 1.4 mm to 1.7 mm to stop the stuck sparges even then I am still overshooting og just

1mm & less thats fine I do mash & boil hard for a long time though but my wiper motor goes slow & steady she cried

Must give the spay a try also Ducati

Great photo of the crush by the way


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (5/8/15)

rude said:


> Must give the spay a try also Ducati


Nothing like a spayed Duc.


----------



## Ducatiboy stu (5/8/15)

rude said:


> jeez I have a home made mill, nickel plated knurled scoffold tube,trailer axel middle
> 
> Run by a windscreen wiper motor
> 
> ...


+1 for XD Falcon windscreen motor...can also turn a 40-70kg pig.........

Windscreen motors have HEAPS of starting torque...somewhat handy when milling grain......but I have already told people that 

pffft for 1.7mm...open that bitch up until it just touches the husks...


----------



## Fat Bastard (11/8/15)

labels said:


> Looks good at less than 1mm.
> 
> I've been conditioning grain for the last 10 years. I use approx. 100ml water per 10Kg of grain. The shape of my mill hopper is different to most in that it has a very shallow sides, although this was done because of occasional stones stopping the mill, it makes it easy to condition grain as it goes through the rollers.
> 
> I only allow a minute or two after spraying and before milling. This keeps the water out of the grain starch and into the husks only allowing me to run a ~0.7 gap. Rust is not a problem with ss rollers and a 1/3rd horsepower motor running through a 120rpm reduction gearbox and a chain drive driving the mill, it's pretty easy running


I kind of arrived at this figure of 10ml per kg this weekend. Tried 1/4 cup per 5kg (25ml/kg) this weekend and still had problems with sticking rollers, although im sure it also had to do with my 140w motor & gearbox combo.It wouldn't pull through at less than 1.3mm without dramas. I didn't spray though, I just dumped half into the bucket of grain and mixed it by hand for about a minute before repeating, and trying to put it through the mill. Put it through again at 0.9 and had bulk stuck mash problems with my HERMS rig. Learning curves & that...

Now looking for a new drive motor for the mill, although for what that will cost me I could almost stack another mill on top of mine and bodgy up a chain drive and run a 4 roller geared set up with different gaps on each set of rollers.


----------



## technobabble66 (18/8/15)

Ok.
DBS, razz & labels, etc may've converted me also, tha basterds!

I gave the grain rehydrating a shot on Saturday. Definitely seemed to work - i.e.: improved the husk structure and reduced dust as well.

I also used ~ *10mL per kg*, sprayed onto the bucket o grain while i stirred it around by hand. Left it a minute or 2, then milled it (by hand, none of these fancy motors, etc). Pretty obvious the husks were more intact than normal. Conveniently, the mill was actually cleaner afterwards - from less dust formation by the look of it.
Recirc-ing & sparging then seemed to subsequently go a bit more smoothly. Also seemed to possibly add 3-4% efficiency at the end of it.

Yet _another_ bit of process added to my brew day!
Luckily this one takes all of 3 minutes. B)

(so thanks DBS, labels, razz & others for making me aware of the wonders of grain rehydration!)


----------

