# Choosing a juice?



## D_Skee (28/10/13)

HI erry body.

Im pretty new to homebrewing and i want to try a hard cider. I have read that i should just buy apple juice and dump yeast then let it go. But my question is what kind of juice? I want to use a juice that has ZERO preservatives Does anyone have a good store bought juice that makes a good cider?. Will i need to do anything to kill any natural yeast in the juice? if so what?

thanks in advance for helping me get my head around this 

D-Skee


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## Bax (28/10/13)

I'm also interested. 

From what I'd read, ALDI had a suitable juice. Also, where are you located as it may change the availability of things?


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## JDW81 (28/10/13)

I think I used Berri juice last time I made cider. Really easy, juice into fermenter, yeast into juice and ferment. You can add some spices etc, but this is a great way to start.

Any preservative free juice is suitable.

JD


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## technobabble66 (28/10/13)

Hey JD,
How did that turn out?
Was it just drinkable, actually kinda decent, or better than commercials? (& which commercials? - strongbow is not setting the bar very high!).
Not done a cider yet, but considering it over the next several months.
Thanks


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## Not For Horses (28/10/13)

Go for one of the freshly juiced ones. I wouldn't bother with the reconstituted stuff. You know how you get an apple juice from a juice bar and it tastes worlds better than a shop bought juice? Start with a good juice, finish with a good cider.

Much much much better still, juice some apples. The difference is astounding. Like the difference between K&K and AG. I'll never go back to bought juice for cider.


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## JDW81 (28/10/13)

technobabble66 said:


> Hey JD,
> How did that turn out?
> Was it just drinkable, actually kinda decent, or better than commercials? (& which commercials? - strongbow is not setting the bar very high!).
> Not done a cider yet, but considering it over the next several months.
> Thanks


It generally ferments pretty dry, which is fine if you like it that way. I like it dry so yes, it turns out well. I can't comment on which commercial styles it is like though. Give it a go and see how it turns out. Make a small batch to see if you like it.

JD


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## manticle (28/10/13)

If you're happy to spend the extra, go for preshafruit.

Otherwise blend a few up - get some berri, some speyton, some preshafruit, etc.

No need to worry about wild yeast in any of the store bought stuff.


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## contrarian (28/10/13)

I recently made a cider where I primarily used the reconstituted apple juice from aldi which is about a dollar a litre with about 4 litres of fresh apple and mango (limited options) at about 2 dollars a litre. 

It is a refreshing drink at a good price and has been well received by my cider drinking friends. It's on the dry side but still has some apple flavour which suits me. 

No doubt you would get a better flavour using high grade fresh apple juice or even better, fresh apples but if you're happy with a basic cider on the cheap there's other ways that work out fine.


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## Elderfi (28/10/13)

I have a left over coopers yeast satchel floating around. Is that enough to bang out 20ltre or so of cider? or do you need some special yeast?


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## superstock (28/10/13)

Woolies homebrand 3litres, off the shelf, not out of the chiller. Pour out a good cupful into a sanitized sealable container. Save for later. Add 1/4 cup STRONG , (let it go cold with the teabag still in the cup),black tea, Shake the hell out of it, top on, of course, 1/2 teaspoon yeast nutrient, 1/2 pkt yeast of your choice and put away somewhere coolish. With an airlock.


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## WarmBeer (28/10/13)

Why are you saving a cupful for later? Is that in case you get thirsty from all that shaking?


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## superstock (28/10/13)

Top up, In case you want to rack it for secondary. Or, if you dont like it dry, use it to find out how much to use to backsweeten in the glass


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## jongylary (17/11/13)

i have heard by batching it up in the plastic bottle can have some adverse health affects, especially since of the possible high % alc content (supposedly can break down the composition of the plastic into the drink? has any one else heard of this?

i have seen alot of people using this same process but batching it up in a carboy with a rubber bung and a air lock. has any one tried this as i'm about to go lay cash down for this set up and if the plastic bottle works i prefer to run with that and keep the cash in my pocket for other things  keeps the wife off my back if i'm not spending to much


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## Rodolphe01 (17/11/13)

I did a keg of cider made with nudie brand cloudy apple juice, I fermented 18L of juice and back sweetened with 1 litre in the keg, when there was room in the keg I dropped in another litre to sweeten a wee bit more. It was very good. I stash a bottle a good quality raspberry cordial and lime cordial at the fridge to sweeten & flavour it up in the glass as this is the way my wife likes it (think Rekordelig). I usually drink it unflavoured (apart from the fresh juice back sweetening).

I've done a few batches with woolies/berri pasteurised juice, I find it is OK, and certainly is cheap to make, but the nudie was significantly better.

nudie will set you back about $60 to fill a keg, i recommend grabbing it when it's on special. I was lucky and got mine reduced to clear because it only had a few days left on the use-by. Even at $60 though, go to the bottle-o and see how far $60 goes getting good cider.

also, the nudie cider stays cloudy, adding pectinase might clear it up if that's your thing.


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## Green-Lobster (20/11/13)

beechworth apple juice 2 litre goons 3.95 up here round kelly country. i opted for cloudy. Goulburn valley pear juice 20$ 12 cans 850ml spc cannery clearance centre. 5litre to one ratio . made my best result this year. 
Berri deluxe, strawberry kiwifruit and apple . box of 6 x 1.8 litre 10$. same ratio pear addition . for ladies night. couple of cinnamon sticks some green tea and blood orange / pink grapefruit /lemon whatever citrus handy 500ml per 20l.
Dont forget the yeast nutrient . unless you want to be stuffing around with bits of copper or you like farts in your drink.
beechworth apple was the better of the 2 . not reconstitutted . higher sugar level . supports australian jobs and industry .


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## Kingy (20/11/13)

I've had good results with apple and blackcurrent juice. Gotta be preservative free, no added sugar. Full natural yada yada. I've used bakers yeast and top cropped a wheat beer before with wb06 not much difference of an outcome. Been playing around with stevia and lactose to back sweeten. But not really needed if you like a dry cider. Love fermenting in the bottle. Carbing in the bottle, drinking from the bottle. Sometimes chilled without carbing lol.


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## Phoney (20/11/13)

I like ciders as dry as a dead dingo's donger. So I go 20L 100% Apple juice, tsp of yeast nutrient and wyeast 4766.


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## jongylary (23/11/13)

has anyone goot a good method and receipe for like a 5 lt batch (looking to try a few small batches before commiting to a full fermenters worth


i see the americans use the carboys with a air lock on them - or can i do the small batches in my 30lt fermenter or do i run into an issue with to much air etc....



if someone could list the equipment for me would be greatly appreciated......


planning a wedding in april so maybe even crack a few different batches and set in bottles hopefully in time for april


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## Kingy (23/11/13)

Just try a few by fermenting in the bottle they come in. Try a few different sorts and some different yeasts and go from there. Just remember to tip a little out for headroom during ferment. All tho I haven't had any froth up yet. Preservative free stuff is what you want. Don't get anything with citrus in it.


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## jongylary (1/12/13)

well i have just made up a cider
2.4lt apple
2.4lt apple and pear
250 ml dar tea with honey
1/3 teaspoon on cider yeast
1kg raw sugar

i have dissolved the sugar in a pot with some juice very slowly
mixed and put into a 5lt demi 

i am sitting the demi in a fermenter bucket to reduce light
also able to fill with some water and putting some frozen bottles of water to keep it cool 
(having issues at the moment with keeping beer temps down during fermentation - down side of sunny QLD)

also through a princh on cinnamon and nutmeg - hoping for a apple pir flavour--- should hopefully keep the wife happy

after 14 days or when ever the fermenation stops i'll bottle into some pet bottles and use carb drops for a carbonation hit...



been umming and ahhring if it is worth putting into a secondary - is it worth it with a batch this size?


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## TimT (1/12/13)

General rule is: apples that are good for juice and dessert are NOT good for cider. This is because the sugar that tastes so good in the juice or desserts will all disappear in the fermentation.

Traditional cider apples are high in tannins (to add the winey/astringent taste) and have many other flavours as well - they balance out the fruity sweetness of the apple with bitter, tart, and sour flavours. Crab apples are generally used to add tannins if nothing else will do.

Ciders are generally made with lots of different apples as well, to provide a variety of flavours.

So best idea might be to go with a combination of different juices, with some of the less sweet/more tangy and bitter juices used to add flavour. If need be, adding other ingredients like cinnamon or black tea (as suggested above) can bring tannins back to the cider and help give it a tasty balance.

The sugar in store bought juices may be denatured and so easier to ferment but even so allow for a few weeks for the cider to fully ferment out. A month, maybe more.


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## TimT (1/12/13)

If you wish to crush a few apples to get out their cider qualities, some store-brought apples are good for cider - Pink Ladys, for instance, contain tannins.


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## Tahoose (6/12/13)

phoneyhuh said:


> I like ciders as dry as a dead dingo's donger. So I go 20L 100% Apple juice, tsp of yeast nutrient and wyeast 4766.


Just questioning this as I cracked a bottle of my first cider the other day, I used wyeast 4766 and found it not to dry, still with some sweetness.

I thought that the reason you would use this yeast is because it won't go down as low as a champagne or wine yeast for example...

Side note, the recipe was;
1 tin brigalow cider kit
22ltrs Aldi juice
Wyeast 4766 
OG - not confident of my original reading (would be high though)
FG 1012 
I think it probably about 7% ABV upwards


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## Airgead (6/12/13)

Any yeast will dry out a cider. Juice is all simple sugars and unless you go over the alcohol tolerance the yeast will just chew right through it.

If a yeast leaves a cider sweet its often because of poor yeast health or low nutrient levels. That sort of thing is unpredictable. One batch can be sweet another completely dry depending on the juice and how the yeast is handled.

I find it better to make sure you have good yeast health and nutrition, make sure it ends fully dry then back sweeten. Gives a more predictable result.

Cheers
dave


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## Tahoose (6/12/13)

Maybe some of the stuff in the brigalow tin was unfermentable and have left some sugars there?


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## Mr. No-Tip (6/12/13)

Any yeast will dry out a cider. Juice is all simple sugars and unless you go over the alcohol tolerance the yeast will just chew right through it.

If a yeast leaves a cider sweet its often because of poor yeast health or low nutrient levels. That sort of thing is unpredictable. One batch can be sweet another completely dry depending on the juice and how the yeast is handled.

I find it better to make sure you have good yeast health and nutrition, make sure it ends fully dry then back sweeten. Gives a more predictable result.

Cheers
dave


I've found s04 reliably drops out around 1010 even with nutrients and oxygen. I'm not sure id trust it to bottle in glass, but the flocculation wins, kind of like one often sees using it for brewing beer.


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## Not For Horses (6/12/13)

Mr. No-Tip said:


> I've found s04 reliably drops out around 1010 even with nutrients and oxygen. I'm not sure id trust it to bottle in glass, but the flocculation wins, kind of like one often sees using it for brewing beer.


That is very dangerous advice to give.
I've made a number of ciders over the years. All with proper apple juice and most with ale yeasts, so4 in particular is a favourite for cider. They usually take a short amount of time to get to 1010ish and a long time (6 weeks+) to get to 1000.
Be very careful bottling a cider too early. I've made many a good bottle bomb.


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## Mr. No-Tip (6/12/13)

Hence why I said I wouldn't put it in bottles?


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## Not For Horses (6/12/13)

Yeah I know but I just thought that it needed to be extra extra clear.


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## Sandy35 (12/12/13)

Hey guys,
Great info on here. Me and my girlfriend like a cider that is somewhere between dry and sweet. Rekorderlig is just way to sweet for our liking but something like Strongbow to dry (just as examples). I've heard that Lactose adds sweetness to a cider. Firstly, is that correct and approximately how much would you add. I know this is almost like asking the question, "how long is a piece of string", but I guess any guide would be helpful.
I've sourced this juice on special from coles http://tinyurl.com/otq5vgh which I reckon would be pretty amazing. But I would like to retain some of the sweetness so that's why I thought the lactose would be good. My girlfriend and I aren't lactose intolerant, so that won't be an issue. 
Any thoughts would be welcomed. Thanks guys 
P.S - my first AHB post....have made many beers at home...want to try a cider 
Cheers,
Phil


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## jacknohe (14/1/14)

My nearly 18 year old daughters pestered me to make a Sweet Cider for their upcoming party. It turned out to be a cracker. All the other 18 year olds loved it!!! Here's what I did.

16L of Aldi Apple Juice
1.7L of Goulburn Valley Pear juice (two cans)
SG of 1.043

Fermented it with Cider yeast right down to 1.002.

I added 15L of the fermented juice (I drank the rest) into the keg and back sweetened with 4L Nudie Apple juice which was 1.047 (Total 19L).

So according to my calcs finished product was 1.011 and 4.2% alc.

Totally recommend fermenting with cheap juice and back sweetening with quality juice. It tastes fresh. This one is a little sweet for my tastes but its pretty damn good. Might lower the back sweetening a little. Next time I won't bother with the pear juice and try just fermenting Aldi juice right out and then back sweeten again with Nudie juice.


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