# Jazz Up A Cider.



## Sammus (22/3/09)

Howdy, I've got a cube of cider apple juice on its way, and a wyeast cider yeast. Sweet, should make some killer cider. But that seems a little boring. Get apple juice. Add yeast. How might one jazz it up a little bit? I don't want to go too whacky a move away from a good old cider, but what kind of variation can one introduce?

PS woohoo! first to break in the new forum section


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## Pollux (22/3/09)

I used to do a boil of ginger and cinnamon for the missus when she wanted a cider, throw in some star anise if you want.....


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## RdeVjun (22/3/09)

Good question Sammus, one that's been on my mind with harvest apparently underway at the moment. I have a few drums of organic pressed juice ordered from a friend of a friend's Stanthorpe orchard and am wondering how to liven it up a bit.
Having only ever brewed kit cider before and being rather underwhelmed with the results, the next logical step was to make it from juice, although I have been tempted to grab a few on- special bottles of preservative and artificial sweetener-free plain juice from the supermarket, but have always come up with much better things to put in my fermenters.  
Pollux's suggestion of star anise might be good too, I particularly enjoy it in irish stout now that I've worked the method out.
Some of the retail juice blends might be worth a whirl, but for starters I'll make one plain and unadulterated. Seeing as it'll be fresh juice though, when I start adding things, I might stick with fresh fruit additions like some blue/rasp/boysen berries, mushed up and pasteurised. Probably will have to pasteurise the whole lot, although I'm not quite sure about that yet- I'd rather not cook it all, might do a small pilot batch to begin with and check.
Anyway I'm sorry, this doesn't really answer your question, I'm also keen to see what suggestions there are.

Oh, and yeah- lookie here, a nice shiny, squeaky- clean new forum! It'd be a shame to get it all dirty with rant, soil it with dribble or despoil it with OTs. (Sure is tempting though, isn't it...  )


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## InCider (22/3/09)

I also used pear juice in differing ratios and sometimes champagne yeast for making it real dry. Might want to add some lactose if your palate doesn't like the real dry, crisp finish. I mean it's REAL dry!

Also Nottingham yeast is awesome too. I prefer it to cider yeast.

InCider.


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## pdilley (22/3/09)

You can add honey to make a simple cyser. Complex being tossing in sour cherries or blueberries, etc. 

Apple juice must and even honey must are barren deserts when it comes to nutrients yeasts need even more so when the final mix is acidic. Pitching yeast into that means slower ferments. So if you ever want to get more technical with non wort brewing then proper yeast nutrient addition like fermaid-k, and DAP will put healthy metabolic turbo chargers into your musts. Balance the Ph to around 3.8-4 if you want to see it go out of site. Keep away from distiller water as yeast need those trace minerals in tap water.

And finally add nutrients over 4 separate stages, with 82% or so before the 1/3 sugarbreak (1/3 of fermentable sugars eaten by the yeast). Counter to making beer from wort beat the crap out of it oxygenating the buggaru out of the must and getting out CO2 up to 50% sugars consumer then let it rest as the explosive yeast reproduction is done and serious alcohol production begins. This method brings for example pure honey must fermentation down from 1-2 months to 5 days and first consumption time down from 6-12 months down to 3-6 months.


Or KISS it and pitch yeast into unmodifief wort and wait both during fermentation and before ready for consumption as the tradeoff to nutrient additions.

I feel you want to KISS it but included the extra info for anyone reading that wants to take brewing non-worts to the next level.


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## Sammus (22/3/09)

Some good suggestions Cheers! Like RdeVjun, I'm thinking it might be a good idea to just see how it goes with the fresh pressed juiced first (sourced from the Blue Mountains). Don't wanna jazz anything up my first go  Maybe I'll get two cubes...if there is a second available when I go to pickup.


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## MHB (22/3/09)

Hay Sam

I think you forgot to mention that we are getting real cider juice; the cider apples are a 300 year old variety.

They taste nothing at all like juice apples, quite tart and with a distinct tannin flavour, not to mention that they are ugly wizened looking little things and about as much fun to eat as cardboard.



Yes a bit of nutrient might be a good idea, but I will be taking a pH reading before I toss in any acid or the like.



I'm doing one as it comes, the other I want to cyser for winter drinking.

Should be delivered on Monday (23/03/09)

MHB

Edit PS
Sam still a couple avaliable
M


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## RdeVjun (22/3/09)

InCider said:


> I also used pear juice in differing ratios and sometimes champagne yeast for making it real dry. Might want to add some lactose if your palate doesn't like the real dry, crisp finish. I mean it's REAL dry!
> 
> Also Nottingham yeast is awesome too. I prefer it to cider yeast.
> 
> InCider.


Cheers InCider, I'd forgotten about pears, being another pomme (i.e. very closely related to apple), it makes complete sense too and I've seen mention of them in cider blends before.
Yep, the one I tried with champagne yeast was particularly... no make that really, really _dry_, from memory the FG was 1.006 as well. Lactose would've been a useful addition I think, personally I don't like it in milk stout but in the cider I think it'd balance the dryness out a bit. Will give notto a whirl, its a versatile little number, although by the sounds, all ciders need, or would benefit at least, from close attention to diet (i.e. yeast nutrients).


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## Sammus (22/3/09)

MHB said:


> Hay Sam
> 
> I think you forgot to mention that we are getting real cider juice; the cider apples are a 300 year old variety.
> Edit PS
> ...



Yeah, that's what I meant by 'cider apple juice' in the op, I guess that is kind of ambiguous though. Can't wait to get my hands on. I've spoken for one, I won't commit myself to two yet, but if there's a spare nd I have the $ when I come and pick up, I'll probably get two.

Cheers

Sam


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## InCider (22/3/09)

RdeVjun said:


> Cheers InCider, I'd forgotten about pears, being another pomme (i.e. very closely related to apple), it makes complete sense too and I've seen mention of them in cider blends before.
> Yep, the one I tried with champagne yeast was particularly... no make that really, really _dry_, from memory the FG was 1.006 as well. Lactose would've been a useful addition I think, personally I don't like it in milk stout but in the cider I think it'd balance the dryness out a bit. Will give notto a whirl, its a versatile little number, although by the sounds, all ciders need, or would benefit at least, from close attention to diet (i.e. yeast nutrients).




Hi RdeVjun,

The yeast nutrient is something that I have not used as yet - but I do know that the champagne yeast leaves nothing fermentable! Even after 4 weeks in the cube, I kegged it and left it to settle... it kept fermenting in the corny!  

Would you need nutrient for Nottingham?

InCider.


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## RdeVjun (22/3/09)

InCider said:


> Hi RdeVjun,
> 
> The yeast nutrient is something that I have not used as yet - but I do know that the champagne yeast leaves nothing fermentable! Even after 4 weeks in the cube, I kegged it and left it to settle... it kept fermenting in the corny!


Gooday InCider. Yep, that's what I gathered from my experiences. I had to let that champers yeast ferment right the way out and it wrings every last sugar molecule/ complex out of the wort in getting to such a low SG. I was using thinner green glass bottles at the time (the Bavaria 660mls) and I didn't want to risk any bombs so I let it go in primary for a couple of weeks and it still carbed up mightily, however I was using drops at the time (I don't any more).


InCider said:


> Would you need nutrient for Nottingham?


I dunno, never used it either the yeast or the nutrient. Brewer Pete's got a few thoughts on how to do it (see above), not sure if he's talking champagne or ale yeast tho' in this example. Pete? 


Brewer Pete said:


> Apple juice must and even honey must are barren deserts when it comes to nutrients yeasts need even more so when the final mix is acidic. Pitching yeast into that means slower ferments. So if you ever want to get more technical with non wort brewing then proper yeast nutrient addition like fermaid-k, and DAP will put healthy metabolic turbo chargers into your musts. Balance the Ph to around 3.8-4 if you want to see it go out of site. Keep away from distiller water as yeast need those trace minerals in tap water.
> 
> And finally add nutrients over 4 separate stages, with 82% or so before the 1/3 sugarbreak (1/3 of fermentable sugars eaten by the yeast). Counter to making beer from wort beat the crap out of it oxygenating the buggaru out of the must and getting out CO2 up to 50% sugars consumer then let it rest as the explosive yeast reproduction is done and serious alcohol production begins. This method brings for example pure honey must fermentation down from 1-2 months to 5 days and first consumption time down from 6-12 months down to 3-6 months.


So, it seems that if you want to tear the fork out of it then keep a close eye on pH, gradual or staged additions of nutrients and/or DAP, oxygenate thoroughly and stand back, it could get messy.



Brewer Pete said:


> Or KISS it and pitch yeast into unmodifief wort and wait both during fermentation and before ready for consumption as the tradeoff to nutrient additions.
> 
> I feel you want to KISS it but included the extra info for anyone reading that wants to take brewing non-worts to the next level.


Yep Pete, probably the KISS for me! Sounds like there will be some waiting involved with that route though, so I could be swayed. But, if I do end up with gallons of that pressed organic juice on my hands, I just know I'll probably start faffing around with non- wort brewing plus additions of fruits etc. I'm also keen to hear how those cider apple juices go Sam!
Thanks everyone, and a thousand pardons Sammus for the slight thread hijack...


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## pdilley (22/3/09)

Out shopping with the wife and typing on my phone so excuse the typos all over the place in the posts 

For ciders you can stick to a cider yeast like Wyeast 4766 or a dry if you can find it. 4766 will ferment out dry so you can stop the yeast near the final stages and back mix fresh juice to sweeten. Or just mix on the pour out if worried about refermentation. If you want to carbonate in the bottle you will have to do the latter. You could add non fermentable sweeteners but that's not my thing. Personally I'd ferment out dry but that's my preference.

Commercial ciders use up to 6 different apple varieties to get a better flavour that's not so bland. Pears are a great addition if you have the where with all to process them. Supermarket pears are rubbish, floury flavourlesd modern rubbish so get yours already juices or something crisp with good water content. If you are anal do a brix refractometet reading beforehand to see what you have to work with.

CO2 is a yeast stressor so needs to be beaten the byggary out of must up to 1/3rd sugar break. As heart metabolize they consume the nutrients in the must and future metabolism us compromised as heart multiply so you need to reintroduce the nutrients in stages to keep their hearty motors humming along at full speed. DAP adds the phosphates and hard water the calcium (so the flocc. and fall out of suspension when finished). Fermaid K provides the micro nutrient balance to keep them healthy.

Releasing CO2 can make a *lot* of foam so make sure your primary is a bucket or similar and not a carboy or deminohn unless you wan to see your very first very impressive foam volcano shooting up to your roof and explosively flying of the cieling 

Once you hit 50% lay off and you are at maximum yeart in suspension and the yeast will start a massively quick conversion of the must sugars to alcohol. This rapid fermentation is what you want. Contrast sharply to the 35C plus of a kit first timer making cider beer.

Ale yeast is nothing more than bread/bakers yeast. All the variations are due to differing strains within the genus. You don't be high alf tolerence so stick with a wine yeas or cider yeast.


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## Airgead (23/3/09)

MHB said:


> Hay Sam
> 
> I think you forgot to mention that we are getting real cider juice; the cider apples are a 300 year old variety.
> 
> ...



Where are you guys scoring those from? I've been trying for years to find a source.

Any you can spare?

Cheers
Dave


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## manticle (24/3/09)

I have a bottled cider that is mainly juice (fresh and bottled). It's only fresh and it's beautifully clear but the taste of the potassium sulphite I was initially concerned about is present. Can someone knowledgeable please reassure me that it will disappear (both odour and flavour) as it matures?

Otherwise next time I'm taking the risk with the wild yeasts and so forth. Too much work to be drinking an apple fart.


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## petesbrew (24/3/09)

:icon_offtopic: Sorry, for the quick hijack, but to the AHB admin, well done on the addition of a great new sub-forum!


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## pdilley (24/3/09)

Back in 2007 Kevin Civille did a good Matrix Ferment across Cider Juice and Yeasts and Sugars to see what each would impart to the final finish and taste, very good stuff and highly commendable -- something I'd love to see done with Meads!

YMMV applies.

Hi Folks Last year I decided it was time to come up with some new cider and cyser recipes, so in addition to 20 keg batches, which were mostly made with ole trusty Nottingham ale yeast, I did roughly 80 single gallon batches with different yeasts, juice and sugars. I saved a liter each of the better ones (36 total) and drank them with friends last month to see what was worth replicating for this year. For anyone who is interested, here are the results:





The goal I try to make ciders and cysers that are semi-dry to semi-sweet ie from 1.002 to 1.008 when they finish out. Thats a good bit dryer than the commercial ciders I like, but not so dry that it tastes like a white wine (or jet fuel). 

Juice I used fresh juice from a couple of local cider presses. One has the option of UV pasteurization, the other just sells unpasteurized. 

Some people say that unpasteurized juice tastes better. It depends. I did several keg batches where the guy at the press filled a couple of carboys right before the juice went through the UV, and a couple right after the UV. The only difference was the UV. The UV changes the color a little bit, but the taste was exactly the same. 

Once the juice ferments, its a different story. The pasteurized juice ferments faster, the results are more consistent, and you can drink it in a few weeks. If you cold crash it, it is quite drinkable in about 10 days. Since you dont have to sulfate it, it doesnt stink up your brew cellar as much. Finally, if you use Nottingham, S04 or a lager yeast and add sugar, enough of the yeast will stay close to the bottom that you can stop fermentation before the sg bottoms out just by racking a couple of times, which is a lot less hassle than cold crashing. 

Using pasteurized juice does have disadvantages. It doesnt get the nice clear finish of unpasteurized juice. And it often overwhelms the airlock with krausen and makes a mess, because there is no sulfate slowing the initial fermentation. But mainly it doesnt keep as well. I didnt realize this before last year, because previously everything I made would be drunk up by February. However after a few months the pasteurized stuff gets vinegary. Without exception, all of the batches that we tasted last month which were made with pasteurized juice had a noticeable vinegar taste, even though they tasted fine back in the early spring. All of the unpasteurized stuff was fine. 

The unpasteurized juice tastes really sour during and after fermentation even when it has a relatively high final sg - and it takes several months to mellow. But it still tastes great almost a year later and in many cases improved. Unlike the pasteurized juice, I havent been able to stop the fermentation by using a bottom fermenting yeast, extra sugar and racking (at least not so far), but cold crashing still works. 

The type of apples makes a big difference. You have to start with a good blend or the final result will taste crappy, no matter what yeast and sugar you use. I had the best results with blends that were based around Staymans and Winesaps as the main juice, with Granny Smiths to give it some extra tartness and Golden Delicious, Yorks or Pink Ladys for sweetness. Im sure there are lots of other combinations that work, but these are whats readily available in Central Virginia. 

Yeast the best ones so far (for the juices I used):

Nottingham This has been my favorite yeast for several years. It works well for sweet ciders and cysers with pasteurized juice, although not so well for unpasteurized cyser. It cold crashes well with any juice. With just juice, no sugar, and cold crash around 1.004, it is outstanding. If you use sugar and bump sg up to at least 1.060, then you can stop fermentation with pasteurized juice by racking. You have to do either rack or cold crash to keep it from drying out all the way, as it tends to strip out the flavor if it goes all the way dry.

Safale S-04 This is becoming my new favorite. It has a little fruitier taste than the Nottingham. It cold crashes well with any juice. If you use sugar and bump sg up to at least 1.060, then you can stop fermentation with pasteurized juice by racking. With unpasteurized juice, if you dont cold crash and just let it ferment out to dryness, it leaves more of the apple taste than the Nottingham. It also works better for unpasteurized cysers. I havent tried a pasteurized cyser with it yet.

Saflager S-23 This lager yeast has a similar flavor profile to Nottingham. It doesnt do as well with unsweetened juice, but is good if you add sugar to bump the sg up to about 1.060. This is one that definitely improves with age. It was one of the best that we tasted last month. It cold crashes well. 

Safale US-05 This yeast imparts an interesting taste to the cider which reminds me a little bit of a pale ale. It works better with pasteurized juice with unpasteurized it tends to knock out some of the body.

Yeasts Ill probably try again:

Wyeast 3068 So far Ive just used this with pasteurized juice, with and without extra sugar, cold crashing both batches. It has a nice smooth taste and lots of body, but not much tartness. However, mixed with juice that is fermented with WLP300 (which fermented out a little too tart) it was outstanding. Im planning to try it with unpasteurized juice this year to see if that imparts a bit more of a bite.

Wyeast 4184 Sweet Mead Yeast I tried this one with pasteurized and unpasteurized juice, with and without extra sugar, all of them cold crashed. All were good, although the best was unpasteurized with sugar. 

Wild yeast I did several experiments with wild yeasts. Generally, they tasted pretty good until the sg dropped below 1.020 and then they started picking up nasty flavors. Cold crashing keeps them stable for a little while, but not for long. But they do pick up some interesting tastes. 

Yeasts I probably wont use again, but still were OK

WLP002 Ive just used this with pasteurized juice, with and without extra sugar. It tasted nearly the same as using Nottingham, which is very good, but they were similar enough that I would say its not worth the extra hassle and cost of a liquid yeast

WLP300 Ive just used this with pasteurized juice, with and without extra sugar. It was very slow to start fermenting. It had a nice body and flavor but a really sour finish, even though I cold crashed it. Mixed with the Wyeast 3068, it was really good though.

Windsor So far, Ive just used this with pasteurized juice. It finishes out really sour, but has a fruity taste. I kinda liked it but none of my friends did. Adding sugar before fermentation makes it taste worse. 

Coopers So far, Ive just used this with pasteurized juice with no sugar added. It ferments out more tart than Nottingham and has a woody taste which I wasnt crazy about, but some might like. If you like Blackthorn dry commercial cider, youll probably like working with Coopers. 

Lalvin 1118 I used to use this yeast all the time back in the day until a friend turned me on to using Ale yeast. It ferments very fast and very dry. With unpasteurized juice, the only way I could ever get decent results was to let it dry out and then back sweeten with the original juice. Ive been able to get OK results with pasteurized juice by cold crashing, but you really have to keep an eye on it because it drys out fast.

Yeasts I dont particularly recommend:

Wyeast 4766 Cider Yeast - Tested with pasteurized and unpasteurized juice, sweetened and unsweetened. Of these, only the sweetened unpasteurized juice was drinkable, and just barely

WLP720 Sweet Mead - Tested with pasteurized and unpasteurized juice, sweetened and unsweetened. Of these, only the sweetened pasteurized juice was drinkable, and just barely

Safbrew WB-06 - Ive just used this with pasteurized juice, with and without extra sugar. They were both really bitter.

Lalvin-1116 I just tried this with pasteurized, unsweetened juice. It left a real bland, butter taste.

Red Star - Cotes de Blanc I just tried this with pasteurized, unsweetened juice. It left a real bland, buttery taste.

DV10 - Tested with pasteurized and unpasturized juice, no extra sugar. Both were drinkable but somewhat bland.

Safbrew S-33 Tested with pasteurized and unpasturized juice, sweetened and unsweetened. All tasted pretty crappy. Basically sucked all the flavor out of the juice. 

Sugar:

I experimented around with different combinations of cane sugar and dextrose. I found that both leave an aftertaste, with the dextrose a little more of a beery taste and the cane sugar a little more winey. Of the cane sugars, the darker sugars leave more of a butterscotch taste. I got the best results with a mix of 2/3 dominos organic cane (which is a light turbinado) and 1/3 corn sugar and adding whatever is needed to get the sg to 1.060 to 1.065. I found that going above 1.065 causes the finished juice to lose the apple taste. 

For cysers, I add 3lbs of honey to 5 gal. I warm the honey jar up a little in a hot water bath so that it mixes easier. For some reason, the honey causes pasteurized cider to finish a lot more clear that with sugar or on its own.

I also tried using agave nectar on a couple batches. The result tasted like diluted and alcoholic agave, which was interesting, but not what I was going for. It tasted like the yeast fermented out all of the apple sugar (and taste) and left the agave sugar behind.


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## Muggus (24/3/09)

I've made a cider with raspberries and blueberries before. Really nice red hue about it, the berries didn't come through all that much, but it was only 1kg of frozen per 20L. Could have done with some more.

You might also want to consider oak-aging a cider for additional flavours. Leaving it to mature on French oak chips for a couple of months should give it the nice sweet buttery oak complexities you'd expect in a wooded Chardonnay. Makes it more of an apple wine than cider really.


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## Stuster (25/3/09)

Very informative post, BrewerPete. That picture looks amazing. No complaints from the other residents of your house! :unsure: 

Mark, like Dave I'd love to know where you source good juice from.


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## manticle (26/3/09)

A big gold star for that post.

That's something I'll be coming back to.


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## John_Smith (26/3/09)

Airgead said:


> Where are you guys scoring those from? I've been trying for years to find a source.
> 
> Any you can spare?
> 
> ...



Ditto. 

Any suggestions for a source of cider apples (or preferably juice) in the Brisbane area would be greatly appreciated.


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## heyyu (2/4/09)

hi making my first cider, used 20l shop apple /apple pear no preservative,used champagne yeast and is working away well.have taste tested and apple flavour seems to have dissapeared,will this return in time after bottling or should i rack and add more juice and a little lactose after final sg then bottle.this is a little new to me so i would appreciate your suggestions.thankyou :mellow:


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## John_Smith (3/4/09)

Champagne yeast makes a very dry cider. At the end of primary fermentation, there is almost no residual sugar so basically all you can taste is the malic acid. Eventually this will mellow out and some of the apple flavour will return. You could add lactose to restore some sweetness but since this not the same as the original fruit sugar the flavour will not be the same. The best bet is to retain some of the original sweetness by either using a lower attenuating yeast or stopping the fermentation early.

In my cider experiments some evidence of mellowing can be tasted after 3 or 4 weeks but 6 months or more seems to be the timeframe required to make a drinkable cider from champagne yeast.


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## bum (3/4/09)

A cider I have on for the missus (my first - both cider and wife) at the moment is finishing like a very cheap white wine when tasting the FG sample - is this the malic acid taste you're talking about? Christ, I'd be stoked if someone can tell me this will go away.


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## pdilley (3/4/09)

bum said:


> A cider I have on for the missus (my first - both cider and wife) at the moment is finishing like a very cheap white wine when tasting the FG sample - is this the malic acid taste you're talking about? Christ, I'd be stoked if someone can tell me this will go away.



10 day old cider tastes nasty :icon_vomit:

#1 Age is your friend with Cider, the longer you age it the better it gets. so don't freak out and toss your brew at week 3 or 4 when you bottle it.
2, 3, 6 or ***12*** months aging does wonders for an uninfected cider.

#2 Traditional ciders can be up to 3 months before bottling to make sure it really is cleared properly. If I had the spare demijohns or other fermenters and not in a rush, then a basic apple cider would be left alone for at least eight weeks before bottling, the best indication a cider is ready for bottling without resorting to the hydrometer is seeing that all the yeast has dropped to the bottom and the brew is absolutely crystal clear.

#3 On bottling or racking, if it tastes nasty then don't toss it. Nasty being tangy, tart, harsh, or just plain un-apple-flavoured.
Only if it tastes like vinegar, or nailpolish remover, camel vomit, etc. - you may want to consider dumping it.

#4 Always hold back part of your brews for extended aging - 9 months to well over a year or two in a bottle or two is fine. This is so you can learn how much patience makes a top notch brew.


For Cider Maturation, the malo-lactic fermentation is carried out by non-slime forming strains of Leuconostoc mesenteroides, Lactobacillus collinoides and very rarely Pediococcus cerevisiae. These bacteria are readily inhibited by the levels of sulphur dioxide used in cider making yet ciders readily undergo malo-lactic fermentation in the spring/summer after they were made. The explanation for this is not certain, possibly lab strains of these organisms are more sensitive to sulphur dioxide than are wild strains, possibly the sulphur dioxide merely inhibits the bacteria and they subsequently recover, or possibly there are other organisms at work.


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## bum (3/4/09)

Great to hear! I had already decided I was gonna put it away for 2 months before I even crack one but I was worried that it would continue to have the white wine quality and this would displease the boss. I wasn't even thinking about tipping it - no matter how bad I'd end up drinking it even if she refused.


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## heyyu (4/4/09)

all maybe isnt lost,i thank you


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## Plaz (2/12/12)

John_Smith said:


> Champagne yeast makes a very dry cider. At the end of primary fermentation, there is almost no residual sugar so basically all you can taste is the malic acid. Eventually this will mellow out and some of the apple flavour will return. You could add lactose to restore some sweetness but since this not the same as the original fruit sugar the flavour will not be the same. The best bet is to retain some of the original sweetness by either using a lower attenuating yeast or stopping the fermentation early.
> 
> In my cider experiments some evidence of mellowing can be tasted after 3 or 4 weeks but 6 months or more seems to be the timeframe required to make a drinkable cider from champagne yeast.




I was also worried about my cider getting too dry so I used a sachet of the Coles Tandaco yeast I had leftover from the JAOM. 


6 x 2ltr bottles Aldi Apples Juice

6 x 2ltr bottles of Aldi Apple and Mango Juice

3 Cinnamon Sticks

2 Star Annise

1 Kg white sugar

5g Tataric Acid

5g Citric Acid

24g Vinters Harvest Wine Nutrient

Yeast (Coles Tandaco 7g)

OG was 1060

Its fermenting well and smells nice but im not really sure if the Mango Juice was a good idea or not. 

Im hoping it will have a sweeter finish from the combination used above. 

Not really sure if this is technically a cider but looking forward to seeing how it turns out. 

Any comments welcome as im new to fermenting. :unsure:


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## Plaz (5/12/12)

Plaz said:


> I was also worried about my cider getting too dry so I used a sachet of the Coles Tandaco yeast I had leftover from the JAOM.
> 
> 
> 6 x 2ltr bottles Aldi Apples Juice
> ...





Just an update on this. 

My SG is slightly under 1.000 today and the fermenting looks to have slowed right down. 

I'm going to rack off from the 1.5cm of Lees. Into a 23ltr glass Carboy with the cinnamon and star annise transferred over. Ill top up with apple juice if needed. Then fit an airlock. 

I am surprised at the fermentation progress as this is now only 4 days. With the Tandaco Yeast I had thought the SG would not go this low either. 

The ferment temp was mostly 27 - 28 degrees C throughout, so a little higher than I usually see recommended on these forums. My Swamp cooler set up kept this fairly constant. 

To my pallet this tastes like a good brew with mango flavour comming through strong. Its drier than I had hoped but so far not too dry. No yeasty or sulphor taste either so im happy. 

Im assuming that the above means the alcohol content is around eight percent but im still a little confused by all the jargon or how to determine this accurately so would appreciate any feedback. . 

Will post a progress report in a few weeks.


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## bum (5/12/12)

There's a few different ways to work out alc. I think the most common (easiest) is (OG - FG)/7.46. I understand that this is not the most accurate method but it is supposed to be close enough. OG/FG are expressed without the decimal point, so for your cider it might be:

(1060 - 0999)/7.46 = 9.38

Add 0.5% if you're bottle carbing and you've got yourself a genuine headbanger. And having fermented in 4 days, there's a good chance you might get a few headaches as well.


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