# Salami 101



## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

I am not an expert and I dont know that much about salami processing etc but I have been making my own salami at home over the last couple of years without killing myself, kids, wife or friends. What follows is my process of making salami which I learned from talking to my local butcher, reading some of a book or three and chatting to friendly grocery check out ladies - you know the old Italian types at specialty grocery stores.

The recipe I will take you through is one that I have never made before today and one that I put together after consulting a couple of books and getting in the mood to get creative. So here goes....

Oh THIS IS IMPORTANT - making your own salami and hanging them in the garage is climate specific. You can only really do it mid to end of June and into July. You also need a good flow of cold air through your garage. Making your own salami is a bit like brewing your own Lambic the old way - it is climate/time specific. So if you were thinking of making your own you should make it this weekend whilst the weather is still cold. If you live in QLD and the temp is up around the 15 I would do some research to see if that is okay - I would think maybe not. Humidity also plays a part in how your salami dry's but as I said I am not an expert so you should look into that your self.

So on to my version of a pepperoni or sopressata which is what I have made today.

The ingredients




1.7k pork neck
1.3 girello (beef)
95g of fine crystal Iblea sea salt - 30g per 1 kilo of meat is the rule of thumb for salami 
8g roasted chillie powder
8g smokey paprika
8g of fennel powder
9g freshly crushed black pepper 8 cloves of garlic pound into paste in mortar and pestle
1/2 cup of conseria Peperone dolce - capsican paste...basically boiled down red capsicans
1 cup of red wine

Cut the meat into cubes that are easy to place itno the feeder of your mincer or porketta.




note the run of fat in the pork neck. You can also use pork shoulder as it also has a good meat to fat ratio.







make sure as you place the meat into the mincer that you put some beef followed by some pork and then followed by beef etc so that you get the two meats well and truly combined. When you have finished the first pass flatten the meat out in a large tray and check for fat content.




I am pretty happy with the look of the balance so I wont add any of the pork fat I had on hand. It will go in the freezer for another day. If you think you need to add some pork fat just chop it up real fine and mix it through the meat.

Now it is time to add our spice mix, salt and garlic. I sprinkly half of each spice evenly over the meat and then give it a really good mix. I then flatten the meat out again and repeat the process with the remaining spice ingredients.


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## ausdb (12/7/07)

More more more


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## InCider (12/7/07)

Great article Merc.

I was watching SBS last night and saw the tail end of Vasilis Garden - saw a big smoker for the snags/salami but missed the making of it. Thanks for the time you put into it.

InCider.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

Below is a picture of me delicately adding the spice and salt mix and getting my hands in there!





Once this has been done put the mixture back through the mincer. I use the same sized cutting blade for all of this as there is no need to go down to a smaller size, you could if want but I dont see the need. Once you have finished pushing through the second mincing round I flatten out the meat and now add the wet ingredients. The capsican paste or sauce is basically boiled down red capsicans - this is used for colour, sweetness and it's preservative affect. In my all pork salami I use two cups to 4 kilo's of meat but for this recipe I only want a hint of it. 




Once you add the wine you have a slightly wet meat mixture and now comes the all important secret to making a good salami - or so I am told by those lovely Grocery grannies and my butchers - you must give the meat a really really really good mix! The meat goes from a thin feeling wet mixture to a sticky gluey kind of consistency.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

Sorry I am doing this in bits but for some reason it wont let me post anymore pictures so I have to reply to myself. Hmmm not all that uncommon me replying to me!!

All done. Take a couple of small pinches of the meat, shape them into little patties and fry them in some olive oil to check for seasoning. 




It was perfect but you could always add some seasoning and give it another mix if you feel the need. All that is left is to cover the tray with glad wrap and stick in the fridge for two days for all those flavors to really meld. Beware the smell is strong and enticing unless your my wife or one of my three kids. Thankfully I can put it in my brew fridge in the garage.



Notice the colour now that it has been really well mixed.

Clean up - we all know what that is like! Have a beer.

I will stuff these on Saturday or Sunday and I will be sure to take pictures of that process and then hang them in my garage next to my pork salami's that I made last week.


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## Franko (12/7/07)

Nice work there Merc,

My mum just made 190 of them last week I'm waiting for them now to cure and dry so I can dig in big time.

Franko


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## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

Franko said:


> Nice work there Merc,
> 
> My mum just made 190 of them last week I'm waiting for them now to cure and dry so I can dig in big time.
> 
> Franko



Grazie Franko!

190!?!?!? My butcher friend boned out two 180 kilo pigs for all his family last weekend and they all came round and did the salami and procuitto etc - I would have loved to have been there to be a part of it!

What is your Mums recipe?  family secret hey maybe you could show her mine and she could give me some feedback on tweaking it.

Ps I hope you helped out your Mum!


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## InCider (12/7/07)

Franko said:


> Nice work there Merc,
> 
> My mum just made 190 of them last week I'm waiting for them now to cure and dry so I can dig in big time.
> 
> Franko


Maressi!


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## Duff (12/7/07)

Nice stuff Merc.

I recently convened with a local family for their annual salami get together. At a secret garage at 6am on a cold Sunday morning we chopped up 2 and a half pigs. Lots o' salami, sausages, procuitto, et al.

Can't beat those gatherings. One of the sons (a police officer) suggested a break for drinks. Break out the scotch and coke at 8.30am :blink: Quickly followed by a second round, then breakfast with red wine at 9.00am :huh: Then lunch at 12.00pm. Needless to say, when my wife picked me up I was a little chatty.

Glad most of the chopping was done by then.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

Duff said:


> Nice stuff Merc.
> 
> I recently convened with a local family for their annual salami get together. At a secret garage at 6am on a cold Sunday morning we chopped up 2 and a half pigs. Lots o' salami, sausages, procuitto, et al.
> 
> ...



Ah yes but I want recipes, authentic recipes!! Sounds like a damn fine day!


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## devo (12/7/07)

top thread mercs, I'm actually going to a "how to" session of salami making at the end of this month. 

So looking forward to it.


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## Trent (12/7/07)

Hey Merc
This is a great thread, but ya shoulda posted it a few weeks ago so lazy bums like me could get everything ready before it warms up too much :lol: Anyway, keep it all coming, next june and july is only 11 months or so away, plenty of time for me to get organised. In the meantime I will just bust out the food dehydrator and make some hickory smoked beef jerky (using liquid smoke from the states). How many does that mound make? Is it something that will last the year, or do you have to do it weekly through the "salami season"?
Trent


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## Mercs Own (12/7/07)

Trent said:


> Hey Merc
> This is a great thread, but ya shoulda posted it a few weeks ago so lazy bums like me could get everything ready before it warms up too much :lol: Anyway, keep it all coming, next june and july is only 11 months or so away, plenty of time for me to get organised. In the meantime I will just bust out the food dehydrator and make some hickory smoked beef jerky (using liquid smoke from the states). How many does that mound make? Is it something that will last the year, or do you have to do it weekly through the "salami season"?
> Trent



I checked the weather for the next week and it is good for salami here in Melb - so get going Trent.

I love the sound of the hickory smoked jerky but it is a shame that you are using liquid smoke - why? Cant you smoke it on the bbq for an hour or so? Never made jerky myself must do that soon. Or smoke the meat in the bbq for an hour or so before you put it in the oven for the drying out process. You will get a good smoke flavour that way.

Devo where is the how to session? Love to hear how it goes.


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## devo (12/7/07)

Out at an friends farm in Werribee. Apprently the folk who own the wine making supply joint near the vic market put on the demos. 

I'll let you know how it goes and report back.


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## Weizguy (12/7/07)

Merc,

No wonder you need that cholesterol reduction margarine.

My Doc has warned me off all snags due to high cholesterol. Apparently my ratio is god but the individual levels are too high. All things in moderation of course (including moderation, I sez).

Let us know how they go, coz I love a good "wog sausage", and if Trent makes some, feel free to bring a few to a HAG event.

Best of luck to all. I stare in awe at sausage making.

Trent, I'm happy to dry stuff for ya in my drier ( not been used for a while).

Les out


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## DarkFaerytale (13/7/07)

thanks for the how to merc! what sort of beer is that i see in most of your pics? 

-Phill


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## Screwtop (13/7/07)

Thanks Merc,

Top pics and description will look for some info re temp, can you use a temp controlled fridge at say 12 or do they need air circulation? Sorry to keep bugging you with questions.

Screwy


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## Mercs Own (13/7/07)

As far as I know you need air circulation. I have heard of some people who have their salami in the garage with out good air flow and they have fans going all the time. I have read sites where they have speacially made fridges where they can control temp, air flow and importantly humidity. As I said I am not an expert but a novice so I would suggest finding some good sites about making and storing your salami's.

oh pass on any good sites you find!


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## Mercs Own (13/7/07)

Hey Devo, I know the store you mean - it's run by ther Biaggio family isnt it? Is the workshop open to anyone or invite only?


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## johnno (13/7/07)

There is a lonk to a good site in the links section.

They pretty much cover everything.

cheers
johnno


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## SpillsMostOfIt (13/7/07)

I have to say that I am very disappointed there is no blonde in any of Merc's pictures... :blink:


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## Ducatiboy stu (13/7/07)

I was lucky enough to grow up in a region of NSW ( Leeton in the Riverina) that had a large population of Italian migrants. All our neighbours where Italian

We used to do a yearly trade of meats. We would kill a steer,another friend killed a few lambs at the Italian's would do a pig

It was an amazing experience to see the process of making salami, bacon etc.

They would start with an old bath full of water on a fire then they would drop the pig in with a forklift.

Eventually after about 6 weeks they would bring the salami's etc around home and hang them up under the verandah.

They where the most amazing salam's I have ever eaten. Totaly fresh , made the Italian way..


The Salami's where awsome, but the vino was shit....made Ben Ean taste good...


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## devo (23/7/07)

Mercs Own said:


> Hey Devo, I know the store you mean - it's run by ther Biaggio family isnt it? Is the workshop open to anyone or invite only?




hey merc, this mob ended up falling through for some reason but my mate still managed to hook up another session with a werribee local who is known as the antz pantz for this kinda thing.

ended up making italian pork sausages and salami.


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## warrenlw63 (23/7/07)

:lol: We'll be calling you "IL DEVO" now. 


Warren -


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## devo (23/7/07)




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## Mercs Own (23/7/07)

Devo the snags look great!

Okay time to finish off my salami's. The meat mix has been in the fridge for three days and the flavours are certainly well combined. So first off is to attatch the stuffing tube to the mincer




and then give the natural casings a bit of a wash and a soak in some water with a squeeze of lemon in it. Then I cut the length of casing I want to start with and give it a rinse through with cold water.







Then thread it on to the stuffing tube and tie a knot in the end of the casing. When you first run your meat mix into the casing it will likely have a lot of air in it so have a sterilised pin handy and prick the casing several times so the air can escape. You should prick the sausage when ever you see air pockets as it helps in filling the casing properly and air in the sausage will allow the meat to go rancid and there fore spoil all your hard work.






okay it might not look all that appetising right now but keep reading.

Once you have a sausage about 20cm long stop the machine and carefully twist the sausage around several times so as to create a break before the next sausage. Also as it is important that your salami's do not touch each other as they are hanging to dry - if they do touch they will not dry correctly at that point which is not a good thing - so I pull some of the casing off the feeder tube before making my next sausage.








Now just repeat the process - fill, twist, space, fill, twist space - oh and admire your handiwork!





When the casing you threaded is used up cut another length give it a rinse and thread on to the filler tube and continue until you have a heap of sausages. I basically thread as much casing on as I can so I dont have to fiddle around with it. I made 17 sausages out of this batch and threaded casing onto the feeder only twice. If you get greedy and over stuff a sausage it will split, with practise you will get the hang of feeding the mixture in - but if it splits just pinch and twist the sausage a couple of centermeters before the split and tie a knot in the casing and you will end up with a short salami.

When you get down to your last bit of mix and last sausage peel a potato and cut it into small cubes and feed that through your mincer. This will push the remaining meat in the mixer through and into your last sausage. Make sure you dont get any potato into the sausage as this is not a good thing for your salami. If you do then tie it off and fry that sausage up for lunch it's actually quite nice as the potato cooks in the casing with the meat and it is yum!





Now it is time to string the sausages so that you can hang them. Use cooking twine but not the waxy version as that tends to slip and you will find your future salami's lying on the garage floor in the morning. I tie the string as close the the end of the sausage so as to avoid air pockets being created when you hang the sausage also this is a good time to prick the sausages to get rid of any air pockets. Occassionally the knots will slip off the ends of the sausages so check your knots.




Just to clarify - depending on the size of the sausages I group them into lots of two or three so I can hang them easily. I will cut the piece of skin between them so as to create these groups and I will, if need be tie the sausage ends I have cut so that they remain compact. I cut them in the middle of the extra casing I left between each sausage so I can use the casing ends to tie knots and tie them off. I will then use a longer piece of string and tie it to one end of the group - this becomes the hanging end. At the end of this process I have nine groups to hang with a total of 17 salami's in all. 




Note the darker Salami's are the ones a made and hung the week before so they are drying along quite nicely.

Below are some pictures of the salami's after they have been hanging for one week after taking the pictures above of the making of them. The darker ones are the pork and beef, the redder looking ones have been hanging for two weeks and are pure pork.






That is it for now. I will post a picture or two when I take them down and enjoy the fruits of my labour


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## wildschwein (23/7/07)

Hey Paul,

Nice post; very detailed coverage of the process. And, the salamis look really good: I wouldn't mind getting into one of those with a brew or two. Can I ask what brand your mincer is and about how much it cost as I'm thinking of buying one in the near future for household sausage production?


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## Steve (23/7/07)

How long do you leave them dangling/curing? Is it the old "longer the better rule"
Cheers
Steve


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## devo (23/7/07)

too good merc's, orsum.


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## Mercs Own (23/7/07)

Wildschwien, here is a link to the mincer I have. I used to do all this with a hand cranked porketta and I have to say the electric mincer and filler is great - at least three times as fast and easy. Having help is good too, someone putting the meat mix in as some one else fills and twists.

http://www.sunbeam.com.au/products/product...2&sec_id=11

Steve, the time taken to hang and therefore dry varies according to size, weather and humidity. Basically I hang them until I judge that they are ready to be eaten. Last years lot dried too quickly so I oiled the outside to stop it going too hard whilst I was waiting for the middle to dry. You want the salami's to be firm to hard to the touch, if you let them hang longer after this they will become very hard to rock hard. They will still be edible (sliced real thin). Once I think they are ready I will take them down and off to my friendly butcher who cryovacs them for me in lots of two. I then can leave them in the fridge for months - but they never last!

Devo thanks for the comment. I certainly wouldnt mind you divulging some recipe information regarding the salami you made or is it a long held family secret? Come on cough it up B) 

Oh and BTW the beer in the shots from the mincing day was a Becks - imported of course!


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## Darren (23/7/07)

Hi Mercs,

Looks like some great fun and I would love to do it. 

The obvious question from me is... What stops the meat from going off? Why use a sterilised needle if the meat obviously was not sterile to start with.

I know an Italian bloke who had a heart worm from eating meat that was not cooked (made his own proscuitto). Is that a risk too?

cheers

Darren


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## Mercs Own (24/7/07)

Darren, you got me there! I dont use a sterilised needle but I thought I would suggest that anyway as it seems safer.

The salt cures and preserves the meat. It is as simple as that. Cant really explain any more than that but you would be able to find heaps of info on the net regarding this. You do need to be aware when you eat the salami checking that it is okay and that it has cured properly. If you have a bit of an air pocket in the meat it can go rancid etc which means ditching that salami. If I am unsure about a salami I ditch it - better that than risking the alternative.

As for worms etc all that is possible but there are ways to avoid it. Keeping your work area, utensils and hands clean, keeping the meat cold and working fast so the meat does not get to warm is the go. Buy good meat - I must ask my butcher about the quality of the pork we get now as pigs that are fed bad things ie uncooked bits of other pigs that have the worm, can have worms. My butcher recently carved up two 180kilo pigs with a group of mates and family and made salami, procuitto hams etc so I dont think he is too concerned about the possibility of worms or bacteria. But if you are worried the best thing is to freeze the meat you are going to use for salami for a week or more before using it - this kills any worms that may be there - again do you own research on this as I am paraphrasing.


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## Mercs Own (24/7/07)

Oh, if you do freeze your pork to kill off any nasties it is best if you cut the meat up in to 2.5cm dice or so as this aids in the freezing and killing of any possible bugs - Trichinella spiralis there called. I dont know if they are the same as heart worm but they are a tiny round worm and fairly nasty if you get a lot of them. You should also freeze the meat for about 21 days.


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## Mercs Own (1/8/07)

Update: My first lot of salami has been hanging for three weeks and certainly seemed hard enough to have finished drying and ready to eat. I cut one done and cut the end off it to find that unfortunately whilost the outside was very firm the inside still had a little way to go before the drying out process was finsihed. It was okay to eat but I would have prefered it to be a little dryer. When cut open you see a darker red/greyish circle around the outside and the centre of the salami is still a fresh red kind of colour. It was dry but it needed a little more. The issue is if I leave them hanging as is the outside would dry even more trapping the moisture inside and therefore they would not dry out properly.

I had read somewhere that you could spray them with water to moisten and slow done the outside drying but I was a little worried about mold. A quick chat to my salami making butcher and he told me that he heard the Italians would use left over wine to wipe down the outside of the salami and slow the drying down so the inside could continue to dry out. So I bought a good bottle of Australian made Spanish style wine to spray onto my italian style salami. I gave them a good spritz so they were quite wet and have done so for the last couple of days - the outside is in good condition and the inside is feeling firmer so I reckon it has worked and they are almost done.

I'll post pics of the finished product.


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## bonj (1/8/07)

Nice work Merc. Can't wait to see the pics.


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## Tony M (1/8/07)

This thread is another subsection of AHB that I will have to start following as my son presented me with this book last week. I put on five kilo just reading it, but I cant wait to extend my basic sausagecraft.


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## Mercs Own (2/8/07)

Tony M I am reading that book also and I agree reading it does seem to add kilo's to your waist!

The River Cottage Meat book is also a good read. I am currently looking to get a copy the River Cottage Cookbook as it has (apparently) a good small goods section.

http://shop.rivercottage.net/rcv2/shop/boo...amp;filter=hugh

A good website too!


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## Bobby (2/8/07)

River cottage is a great tv series as well. well worth a watch.
particularly the episode where hugh makes a cold smoker using an old cider barrel and air conditioning ducting.


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## Mercs Own (16/8/07)

Well the salami are all done and being eaten as I type. The first lot hang for just over 5 weeks and the beef and pork lot for just over 4 weeks. Spritsing them down with wine worked quite well

I could have started to spritz them a lttle sooner or perhaps because it was so cold they did dry a little quicker on the outside than I would have liked - they are very tasty though and the only problem I am having with them is going to be able to keep them long enough.




Out of the 31 salami I made I only had to discard one. It had dried too fast and the meat in the middle dried and split leaving a small space running right through the length of the salami. When I squeezed this salami it was hard on the outside but felt hollow in the inside. This can be rancid and also have BAD bacteria so straight to the bin.

Here is a picture of the bad one held next to good examples of the straight pork (more red) and the pork and beef.




Below is an example of how you can see the drying ring around the cured and dried meat.




I took all the salami's to my butcher and for a fee - a couple of salami he cryovaced the rest in packs of two. Started out two weeks ago with about 32 packs and am now down to about 25 - too many too fast and too long to wait until next winter so as I can make my next batches.




BTW the pork and beef with garlic and red wine which I never made before came out great!


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## chillamacgilla73 (16/8/07)

Fantastic work Merc. I am drooling just thinking about those salamis!

I am a fresh sausage maker and have been closely following this thread for some time and feel very much inspired to have a crack next year. I have thought about home salami making for years but your step by step quide with pics make me feel a lot more comfortable. And I also now have a fathers day prezzy lined up...the Charcuterie book..


:beer:


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## Mercs Own (16/8/07)

chillamacgilla73 said:


> Fantastic work Merc. I am drooling just thinking about those salamis!
> 
> I am a fresh sausage maker and have been closely following this thread for some time and feel very much inspired to have a crack next year. I have thought about home salami making for years but your step by step quide with pics make me feel a lot more comfortable. And I also now have a fathers day prezzy lined up...the Charcuterie book..
> :beer:



Chilla, I am happy to give you the recipe for my salami, if you would like as I know they work and are safe providing they dry correctly. Either as a reference guide or to make out right let me know.

These are two books I refer to as well as the Charcuterie book and Hugh Fernley Whitingstall.





The Sausage Making Cookbook is my favorite as it doesnt use insta cures and pink salts etc it is more tradtional ie red wine, salt, pork, stuff, hang , dry and eat!


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## Little_Squares (25/4/08)

Merc, I was wondering about the safety of not using those insta-cure type products. from the reading I've been doing (mostly online to be honest) the use of lactic starters and nitrate are widely used to kill off those nasty bacteria. Apart from wine and salt, what it is that does the job, so to speak?


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## Mercs Own (23/6/08)

I just ate my last stick of salami that I made in July last year and it was BEAUTIFUL!! I am sorry to see it go and yet happy with its passing.

SO - it is time to make my next batch. All of my salami making friends and contacts have began the process of buying in their pork and mixing up their secret spices. A couple have already got their salami hanging in their garage - in fact a friend of mine hangs his at his mates garage as it has a better air flow no doubt he will visit once a week or more or he will send his mother to check that the sausage are not drying too quickly or too slowly and yes none of them are using nitrites or nitrates it is all done the old fashioned way.

i will be buying 10 kilos of pork this week and then mincing it up mixing in the spices and salts then letting it sit for a day or two before stuffing in into sheeps guts and hanging it in the garage until ready.

If you are thinking of making your own and you live in Vic, Tas or some place suitably chilly get going, the time is right, the time is now!


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## Sprungmonkey (24/6/08)

Im going to have to go and take a photo for ya all to view. Be right back.


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## Sprungmonkey (24/6/08)

Some Salami in Maturing room Hmmmm....


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## NME69 (24/6/08)

This is one of the most interesting post I have read on this forum. It's probably because I have been wanting to make these home made salami's for a while now. 
I've got a Italian friend who's always giving me samples of his salami's and have to say they taste better then anything at a shop. I've tried to invite myself to one of those family salami making days but it seems as its some big secret mafia confrence which only the famalia cana coma.
Thank you Merc for your posts, good job.
I can see the days coming when the guys at the Illawarra brewers union enjoy a beer brewing day with home made beers, home made cheeses and
home made salami's 
Ahhh just thinking about makes it me salivate 

Three cheers for Merc, Hiphip hooray, Hiphip hooray, hiphip hooray  Yay woo hes the man :icon_chickcheers:


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## Mercs Own (24/6/08)

Sprungmonkey said:


> Some Salami in Maturing room Hmmmm....



Mmmmmm I think I need one of those maturing rooms for my next batch of salami!

NME69 keep an eye out here as i will post my straight pork and fennel salami recipe here ijh the next few days if you want to have a go at that - or you can make the recipe in this post it is nice too! But most people liked the straight pork more.


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/6/08)

MMM...A beer, Salami, Cheese thread...Yum


I make my own Pasta...so that could be another thread...


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## Mercs Own (25/6/08)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> MMM...A beer, Salami, Cheese thread...Yum
> 
> 
> I make my own Pasta...so that could be another thread...



Mmmmm...... home made pasta....1 egg, two egg yolks, a splash of coopers best extra and 100g of flour, a little bit of salt, mix, knead, rest and roll out and cut into spag, fett or parpedalla you are more than half way there to a good meal. Dice some onion, crush some garlic, melt some anchovoies, chop some red chilli - fry it up then throw in some speck, pancetta or home made salami cook a little, toss in some crushed tomato, some torn basil leaves and some broccolini then the cooked pasta, mix thoroughly and then grate some fresh good parmesan over and serve.

Have with a glass of red or a leffe or an abbey ale or trappist tripple something hovering around the 8.5 as the fruit and the alc will complement the big flavours of the pasta - a Murrays Grand Cru perhaps.

Enjoy - I did!


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## Thirsty Boy (25/6/08)

I'm about to launch into a bit of a meat and sausage bender.

Need to make Toulouse sausages for a casulet Mrs Thirsty has planned, going to use the leftover pork belly from that to have a small scale go at making some bacon - and then I think I will be having a go at some salami. (when Paul posts the pork & fennel recipe mmmm)

Couple of meals out of that - the casulet, the pasta from above, thick slices of bacon and some of the sauerkraut I made recently on crusty bread

All washed down with lovely lovely beer

Life is good


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## fraser_john (25/6/08)

Finally caught up with this thread!

Where do you get the natural casings from?? We had given up making our own fresh sausages because we could not get the natural casings anywhere here.


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## Ducatiboy stu (25/6/08)

Mercs Own said:


> Mmmmm...... home made pasta....1 egg, two egg yolks, a splash of coopers best extra and 100g of flour, a little bit of salt, mix, knead, rest and roll out and cut into spag, fett or parpedalla you are more than half way there to a good meal. Dice some onion, crush some garlic, melt some anchovoies, chop some red chilli - fry it up then throw in some speck, pancetta or home made salami cook a little, toss in some crushed tomato, some torn basil leaves and some broccolini then the cooked pasta, mix thoroughly and then grate some fresh good parmesan over and serve.
> 
> Have with a glass of red or a leffe or an abbey ale or trappist tripple something hovering around the 8.5 as the fruit and the alc will complement the big flavours of the pasta - a Murrays Grand Cru perhaps.
> 
> Enjoy - I did!



I make a simple Ravioli, Pasta dough with a filling of Roast Pumpkin, Ham,Chives and a bit of sour cream, made in nice big squares with a simple tomatoe & basil sauce...


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## NME69 (25/6/08)

Mercs Own said:


> Mmmmmm I think I need one of those maturing rooms for my next batch of salami!
> 
> NME69 keep an eye out here as i will post my straight pork and fennel salami recipe here ijh the next few days if you want to have a go at that - or you can make the recipe in this post it is nice too! But most people liked the straight pork more.




cool, thanks will do.


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## Sprungmonkey (26/6/08)

just wondering if you guys are measuring the pH and/or Water Activity or even yeilds when maturing has finished? I would suggest measuring the pH after fermentation maybe around 48 or 72 hrs.


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## Thirsty Boy (26/6/08)

fraser_john said:


> Finally caught up with this thread!
> 
> Where do you get the natural casings from?? We had given up making our own fresh sausages because we could not get the natural casings anywhere here.




I got some from here (under the Hi mountain section) and Country Brewer is also doing sausage making supplies and has casings etc - here

Cheers

TB


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## Mercs Own (29/6/08)

I get my natural sausage casing from my butcher. Sadly a lot of butchers are now using the synthetic casings which you cannot use for salami and in my opinion are nowhere near as good for sausages. Find a butcher nearby who uses the natural casings and ask to buy some - they normally dont charge but hey it is only a dollar or two if they do.

Will post the pork and fennel salami recipe soon.

My salami doesnt ferment - I hang it and it dries. Since it doesnt ferment I dont need to worry about ph etc


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## Mercs Own (29/6/08)

Straight forward recipe for my pork and fennel salami:

4 kilo of pork shoulder (or could use pork neck as both cuts have a good meat to fat ratio)
10g fennel seeds - give them a toasting in a dry fry pan over heat - dont burn - and then a gentle crush so as to release flavours
10g black pepper - give it a good crush
5g dried chilli flakes
10g garlic powder
2 cups of paprika paste - Conseria Peperone Dolce - you will get this at a good Italian grocery but have also used Marco Polo - Ajvar and my butchers Mums paste (the best!)
120 g of salt - I use Iblea sea salt fine crystals from spain but have also used maldon sea salt ground fine. General rule of thumb is 30g of salt per kilo of meat.
casings from your butcher - give them a rinse etc

Simply follow the 101 instructions keep it clean and hopefully if the temp and wind is right the salami's will be great. If in doubt throw it out.

Good luck and let me nkow how you go.


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## Sprungmonkey (30/6/08)

Sounds a bit weird to me. How do you control the growth of pathogens in particular E.coli without droping the pH. 3% salt sounds about right but Im a little concerned with the fact that there is no culture unless you are cooking or heat treating afterwards.

Most of the commercial smallgoods use fiberous casing for salami's.


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## Mercs Own (2/7/08)

Sprungmonkey said:


> Sounds a bit weird to me. How do you control the growth of pathogens in particular E.coli without droping the pH. 3% salt sounds about right but Im a little concerned with the fact that there is no culture unless you are cooking or heat treating afterwards.
> 
> Most of the commercial smallgoods use fiberous casing for salami's.



Sprungmonkey I cant answer your questions as I am no expert in salami making. As far as I can tell I am making salami the way the peasants have always done. Obviously when I make my mix Cleanliness is the key, keeping the meat as cold as possible also, making sure the salt ratio is right and that all the spices are mixed well and then mixed again and maybe a third time again all the time keeping all utensils clean and sanitised.

You can add store bought/internet bought instacures, started cultures etc that probably encourage fermentation or you can add dextrose to your meat mix as there is something in that that encourages the right kind of bacteria (lactic acid organism) in the salami causing a fermentation of sorts and the by product of that which is flavour a tangy zing - (a flavour I dont personally like) If you do encourage a ferment to happen in your salami then you also need to stop it, you do this by heating the product until then internal temperature reaches between 59 - 66 degrees celsius. Also if you ferment your sausage you need to keep a more accurate eye on temperature of the sausag and the hanging surrounds.

I dont know if my sausage has a quiet little ferment or not - taste wise I would say no - the amount of salt I use acts as a preservative and an antiseptic. It draws the moiture from the meat and because bacteria requires moisture to grow this therefore inhibits it's growth. Making them in winter when the temperature is low will also inhibit bacterial growth. From what I have read ideally below 4 degress c is the magic number but if this is not possible you can add a little more salt to make up for it. Alcohol also has antibacterial properties that will stop bacterial growth as well as add flavour.

Most of the people I know that make their own salamis do it the old fashioned Italian way using the above methods to produce safe and tasty product. They also know what to look for in the case it is not right - as I have said when in doubt throw it out. There is certainly risk but probably not as much as one might think. I reckon you are much more at risk of eating a good dose of E.coli when purchasing any fast food or take away product and lets not even talk about all you can eat serve yourself places!

The soures of my info are the two sausage books I put pictures of on this post.


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## Ducatiboy stu (3/7/08)

Has anyone tried smoking salamies to cure them


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## Katherine (3/7/08)

> Has anyone tried smoking salamies to cure them



yes

worked quite well... nice flavour


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## Sprungmonkey (3/7/08)

Sounds interesting anyhow Mercs. Working in the smallgoods industry I have never heard of a "naturally - no starter culture" fermenting salami. Far too risky, espeically commercially. Asked a few guys around here and none of our guys have heard of it. One of the guys mentioned an Austrian variation of the salami which involves fully cooking after fermentation - it is called a summer sausage. I guess it sounds a little simiar to dry curing like Proscuito excepting with proscuito it is a whole muscle which is rubbed in salt and therefore the risk is minimised, but with a minced product any contamination / pathogens are mixed thoughout the salami.

As far as stopping fermentation in salami - its exactly the same as that for brewing beer. It isn't necessary to stop fermentation. It stops itself (or virtually) when the cultures can no longer survive in the environment they have created. For salami's it the lowered water activity and lowered pH and for beer its alcohol. 

Anyhow Im not saying don't do it (I wouldn't) but I would definately be cautious. Making salami safe is a risky business - just look at the Garibaldi incident


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## Kleiny (4/7/08)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Has anyone tried smoking salamies to cure them




Yep just waiting on a mettwurst recipe from my oma she and opa made back when they first got to Aus from Germany 
Last time i talked with her she said i would have to build a smoke house / box and while im at it make her some smoked ham / bacon

they used to get a whole pig and make all different small goods from it


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## horner34 (4/7/08)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Has anyone tried smoking salamies to cure them



I couldn't get mine to light :lol:


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## Mercs Own (5/7/08)

Sprungmonkey said:


> Sounds interesting anyhow Mercs. Working in the smallgoods industry I have never heard of a "naturally - no starter culture" fermenting salami. Far too risky, espeically commercially. Asked a few guys around here and none of our guys have heard of it. One of the guys mentioned an Austrian variation of the salami which involves fully cooking after fermentation - it is called a summer sausage. I guess it sounds a little simiar to dry curing like Proscuito excepting with proscuito it is a whole muscle which is rubbed in salt and therefore the risk is minimised, but with a minced product any contamination / pathogens are mixed thoughout the salami.
> 
> As far as stopping fermentation in salami - its exactly the same as that for brewing beer. It isn't necessary to stop fermentation. It stops itself (or virtually) when the cultures can no longer survive in the environment they have created. For salami's it the lowered water activity and lowered pH and for beer its alcohol.
> 
> Anyhow Im not saying don't do it (I wouldn't) but I would definately be cautious. Making salami safe is a risky business - just look at the Garibaldi incident



The Garibaldi incident should never have happened. They are a large commercial producer and should have had all the safety and health things in place so it didnt happen. My three daughters have eaten salami ever since they were very young and as a parent we trust big producers to get it right. Sometimes things dont go right and some innocent family pays a way to high price for that.

I havent made my salami yet because the conditions here in Melbourne arent right. Firstly we have had too much wind which would dry the outside of the sausage way too fast and second we havent had the cold temps we need. My garage is averaging about 12 degrees which is higher than I want or which is healthy for making good salami. What we need is a couple of 8 degree days but they dont look like happening. I will keep an eye on the weather and hopefully the right conditions will come along. I may still make some but up the salt and keep a good eye on how they dry - I dont really want to make and lose 10 kilos of the prescious stuff but if it isnt right I wont bite!

Lastly in observing what is happening in Australia re food safety I am confused. They - the regulating authority - seem to be making it harder to commercially produce food stuff and small goods in the old fashioned way instead pushing through laws demanding higher security (greater cost) and more chemicals and additives (higher cost in $ and health) yet the old fashioned way is probably safer, cheaper and the more healthy option. case in point in Australia the regulations to make salami and proscutio mean fermentation and chemicals etc etc yet they have only recently allowed proscuittos from spain and italy to come into australia that are made the old fashioned way. in short you cant make them here like that it is against the law but you can import them??????? Food safety is a good thing but like political correctness has gone way over board. Sadly accidents will always happen that is just the way of life. When was the last time some one ddied from a badly made lamington?? but now you have to get a liscence to serve them at a church function.

Should I trust my salami?? Should I trust garibaldis?


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## AndrewQLD (6/7/08)

Merc,

Is there any reason why you couldn't dry the salami in a temperature controlled fridge set at 8?

I ask because there is no way I will ever see an 8 day here in Bundaberg let alone a couple.
I am sure I have read somewhere about doing this but I can't remember where.

Andrew


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## Mercs Own (6/7/08)

AndrewQLD said:


> Merc,
> 
> Is there any reason why you couldn't dry the salami in a temperature controlled fridge set at 8?
> 
> ...



Andrew I have been reading about doing this and when I mention it to my butcher he looked pretty non plussed and yet you think with all the fridges etc they would do it. There are three factors that you would need to get right: temp, humidity and air flow. Temp is no problem as you could set the fridge to 4 degrees. Humidity is an issue as you need a humidity of 70% or so I have read. In one of my sausage cook books they say if you fill a tray with salt and then add water and keep it topped up it will give you a humidity of 70% - I need to read more on this. Air flow could be an issue as you need the right air flow so as to dry out the salamis evenly, too fast and the slami will dry on the outside and not in the middle (no good) too slow and the they will take too long and therefore be open to bacterial growth (no good)

Some one I think on here (was it you Devo?) tried doing a salami in a fridge and it didnt work out. If the weather doesnt work out maybe I will try a small batch in the fridge and see what happens - I have an old two door commercial fridge so it may work. Maybe some more discussion is needed with my various salami making friends.


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## Ducatiboy stu (6/7/08)

I do tend to think airflow would be the limitng factor, as you just wont get it in a fridge. You need gentle airflow, not a breeze or wind

I remember at home (Leeton..which along with Griffith has a LARGE Italian community) we would kill steers in winter, and let them hung outside over night, wrapped in a sheet with out any issue before taking them to the chiller in the morning......Note...beef that has been hung for 2-3 weeks before butchering is awsome in flavour and texture...ours used to go ruby red-black before cutting..

The Italian co-contributors would also do the Salami's in winter and hang them in the shed, away from the breeze and in the dark for about 6 weeks, then deliver them by hanging them up under the verendah. Lucky it was cold enough not to be an issue.


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## Thirsty Boy (6/7/08)

Not quite salami - 

But yesterday I whipped upa batch of toulouse sausages. I am gettiing a bit of practice in with the mincer/filler on fresh sausages before, I attempt a salami. The tolouse sausages are to use as ingredients in a Casulet.

Needed some pork belly for the sausages... and I bought a kilo and a bit when I only needed 150g, so I turned the rest into proto-bacon. Rubbed it down with honey and lots of good salt and its curing in the fridge right now. Turn it every 2 days for a week or so, then a bit of smoking to finish it off. mmmmm bacon.

If the bacon works, I might have a go at ham/pancetta/prosciutto. Oh... does anyone know where I can get the curing salts in australia. Buggered if I can find them. So a source for Prague powders #1 & #2 would be great, or perhaps just some saltpetre (potassium nitrate)

Need em for hams etc - and I also wouldn't be adverse to putting a little in the salami just to be on the safe side.

I know where to get the Prague powder in a pinch, but I would rather not get it from the States - and its equally silly to get straight saltpetre from the UK. But i cant find it here.

Just need it to get a little colder now.....

Thirsty


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## AndrewQLD (7/7/08)

Mercs Own said:


> Andrew I have been reading about doing this and when I mention it to my butcher he looked pretty non plussed and yet you think with all the fridges etc they would do it. There are three factors that you would need to get right: temp, humidity and air flow. Temp is no problem as you could set the fridge to 4 degrees. Humidity is an issue as you need a humidity of 70% or so I have read. In one of my sausage cook books they say if you fill a tray with salt and then add water and keep it topped up it will give you a humidity of 70% - I need to read more on this. Air flow could be an issue as you need the right air flow so as to dry out the salamis evenly, too fast and the slami will dry on the outside and not in the middle (no good) too slow and the they will take too long and therefore be open to bacterial growth (no good)
> 
> Some one I think on here (was it you Devo?) tried doing a salami in a fridge and it didnt work out. If the weather doesnt work out maybe I will try a small batch in the fridge and see what happens - I have an old two door commercial fridge so it may work. Maybe some more discussion is needed with my various salami making friends.



A small 12 volt computer fan would probably work well to get the air circulating, but I think the main problem will be your humidity. I might try your salt water pan idea in my fermenter fridge and see what effect it has. I'll report back tommorrow.

Andrew


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## Sprungmonkey (7/7/08)

Mercs Own said:


> The Garibaldi incident should never have happened. They are a large commercial producer and should have had all the safety and health things in place so it didnt happen. My three daughters have eaten salami ever since they were very young and as a parent we trust big producers to get it right. Sometimes things dont go right and some innocent family pays a way to high price for that.
> 
> I havent made my salami yet because the conditions here in Melbourne arent right. Firstly we have had too much wind which would dry the outside of the sausage way too fast and second we havent had the cold temps we need. My garage is averaging about 12 degrees which is higher than I want or which is healthy for making good salami. What we need is a couple of 8 degree days but they dont look like happening. I will keep an eye on the weather and hopefully the right conditions will come along. I may still make some but up the salt and keep a good eye on how they dry - I dont really want to make and lose 10 kilos of the prescious stuff but if it isnt right I wont bite!
> 
> ...



Garibaldi was a high tech facility - lots of new very shiny equipment and they got it wrong -- infact not only once but twice (most people didn't hear about the first incident). That guy got away with murder.

Don't know if I understand what you mean by making smallgoods the old fashion way. Salami traditionally is a fully fermented, matured product. Proscuitto is a little different - it is dry cured product and some manufactures use a lacto producting culture on the outside of the muscle. Both these products have been made in Australia for ages.

As far as our food authorities making manufactures put chemicals/addatives in products to make them "safer", donno if I agree. This is driven by consumers (including Woolies and Coles) wanting more shelf life out of products for lower prices hence the requirement to add certain preservatives or bulk ingredients to products to meet consumers demands.


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## AndrewQLD (10/7/08)

AndrewQLD said:


> A small 12 volt computer fan would probably work well to get the air circulating, but I think the main problem will be your humidity. I might try your salt water pan idea in my fermenter fridge and see what effect it has. I'll report back tommorrow.
> 
> Andrew



I found the humidity in my fridge set at 9 was 40%, I added a bowl with 1.5 lt of water and 300g of salt mixed in and after 24 hrs the humidity was 95% and stayed that way for the next 24 hours.

I think an RH of 95% might be a little moist for Salami (perfect for Blue cheese) so I have halved the solution to see if that makes any difference, I'll also add a small fan as well.

Cheers
Andrew


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## Katherine (10/7/08)

> Not quite salami -
> 
> But yesterday I whipped upa batch of toulouse sausages. I am gettiing a bit of practice in with the mincer/filler on fresh sausages before, I attempt a salami. The tolouse sausages are to use as ingredients in a Casulet.
> 
> ...



My partner picked some prague powder up not so long ago (took him awhile to find it also) .. I'll find out where for you.


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## Mercs Own (15/7/08)

AndrewQLD said:


> I found the humidity in my fridge set at 9 was 40%, I added a bowl with 1.5 lt of water and 300g of salt mixed in and after 24 hrs the humidity was 95% and stayed that way for the next 24 hours.
> 
> I think an RH of 95% might be a little moist for Salami (perfect for Blue cheese) so I have halved the solution to see if that makes any difference, I'll also add a small fan as well.
> 
> ...


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## Mercs Own (18/7/08)

Finally made my salami today!! My butcher got in two legs which he boned and mince for me. I went down for the event and then tipped in my magic spice blend gave it a good mixing and brought it home to rest (ferment apparently) in the fridge for two days.



This arvo I got it out and stuffed it into 43m casings with the help of my eldest daughter. 10 kilos of pork went into 43 salami.

They are now hanging in the garage (quite smelly say the kids, but that is the wet skins)

Now I have to wait and hope and watch that they dry evenly.


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## Thirsty Boy (19/7/08)

nice, very very nice. Need to pull my finger out and get ready to do this.

Thanks Merc


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## hairofthedog (25/7/08)

pics look good as merc ill post some pics of the capracolas im making with my mates 80 year old italian father in law


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## Mercs Own (11/8/08)

I took pictures of my latest salmi drying but havent posted them yet - I will when I find the camera. That said I have now eaten three of the salami and they are as good as I expected them to be!! They hung for three weeks and I could possibly have taken them down after two and a half weeks but they were still a little soft in the middle. That extra two days really firmed them up. I like them on the firm side and then sliced thin with a bit of good cheese and a beer.

I started with 43 hanging and now I have 39 all cryovaced and ready to be eaten over the next year. I will give some away to family and friends and already look forward to next years batch!

now where is that camera - pics coming!


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## Mercs Own (18/6/09)

Ladies and gentleman start your mincers! Yes the time is again upon us - well in Melbourne anyway. The temperature has dropped enough that we can now place our orders for a couple of pig legs - once boned out etc should yeild around 15 kilos of meat and 38mm skins. 

Unfortunately I blew my mincer up making buffalo sausages so I am out to buy another one today - yes I will buy another sunbeam. I looked into buying a pofessional bench top machine but they range between 600 - 1200 bucks - which I dont have so $170 for a new sunbeam and I will be right. Be picking up the pork next week and the salamis will be hanging within a few days of that!

Anyone giving it a go I wish you happy mincing, stuffing and hanging!

ps I still have 6 sticks of last years salami in the fridge and it is eating beautifully.


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## brettprevans (18/6/09)

god i wish i has somewhere to hang salami. oh well will just have to wait until we move. so i guess next winter.


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## Renegade (18/6/09)

Have any salami makers out there tried making the Armenian lamb sausage Sujuk, which is also cured for several weeks. Unlike salami though, it needs to be cooked before serving. This occasionaly appears on the menu at arabic restaurants, and is an amazing food. I considered making it but as with salami, I think I'd prefer to leave it in the hands of the experts.


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## AUHEAMIC (18/6/09)

Mercs Own said:


> Ladies and gentleman start your mincers! Yes the time is again upon us - well in Melbourne anyway. The temperature has dropped enough that we can now place our orders for a couple of pig legs - once boned out etc should yeild around 15 kilos of meat and 38mm skins.
> 
> Unfortunately I blew my mincer up making buffalo sausages so I am out to buy another one today - yes I will buy another sunbeam. I looked into buying a pofessional bench top machine but they range between 600 - 1200 bucks - which I dont have so $170 for a new sunbeam and I will be right. Be picking up the pork next week and the salamis will be hanging within a few days of that!
> 
> ...


Well Merc, this will be the first year for me and I am using both your recipes from this thread as a starting point. Already have the dried natural casings and will be picking up 10kg of meat (pork and Girello) next Friday. I will be making 5kg of your version of sopressata, 4kg of pork and fennel and 1kg of pork and fennel without the chilli for the kids. 

I did a test run of fresh Spanish sausages a couple of weeks ago to test all the equipment and iron out any processing bugs and I was surprised how well (and tasty) it went.

Thanks for all the info and inspiration.

Cheers
Peels


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## Mercs Own (18/6/09)

Peels said:


> Well Merc, this will be the first year for me and I am using both your recipes from this thread as a starting point. Already have the dried natural casings and will be picking up 10kg of meat (pork and Girello) next Friday. I will be making 5kg of your version of sopressata, 4kg of pork and fennel and 1kg of pork and fennel without the chilli for the kids.
> 
> I did a test run of fresh Spanish sausages a couple of weeks ago to test all the equipment and iron out any processing bugs and I was surprised how well (and tasty) it went.
> 
> ...



Peels - you will be hanging all of these??

Good luck, keep it real clean and let me know how you go.

Any questions let me know.


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## hairofthedog (18/6/09)

Peels said:


> Well Merc, this will be the first year for me and I am using both your recipes from this thread as a starting point. Already have the dried natural casings and will be picking up 10kg of meat (pork and Girello) next Friday. I will be making 5kg of your version of sopressata, 4kg of pork and fennel and 1kg of pork and fennel without the chilli for the kids.
> 
> I did a test run of fresh Spanish sausages a couple of weeks ago to test all the equipment and iron out any processing bugs and I was surprised how well (and tasty) it went.
> 
> ...



hey pellsy ive done a few batchs of these type of sausages & doing another batch in a week or so if you need any hints,tips,info let me know mate id be happy to help


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## AUHEAMIC (18/6/09)

Mercs Own said:


> Peels - you will be hanging all of these??
> 
> Good luck, keep it real clean and let me know how you go.
> 
> Any questions let me know.


Hey Merc
I will be hanging the lot. I am lucky enough to have plenty of space under the house which should provide enough air flow without being too windy. 

I have spoken at length with Mario at the fruit shop (he does a 6 pig, 3 day, many family event each year) and several people at work who each have their own versions of salami, one of whom is coming over to help on the day, so I feel reasonably confident at this stage but I do have a question about your recipe.

This may be difficult because taste is so subjective but I like chilli and I was thinking 2.5 grams per kg might not be enough. I will be cooking a couple of test patties prior to stuffing the casings to check the spice level and was wondering if the chilli intensifies as the salami dries? 

Cheers
Peels


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## AUHEAMIC (18/6/09)

hairofthedog said:


> hey pellsy ive done a few batchs of these type of sausages & doing another batch in a week or so if you need any hints,tips,info let me know mate id be happy to help


Hey HairODog

I will be swapping salamis with 3 people from work and Mario down at the fruit shop. Not all between us like a beer case swap (maybe get something like that going down the track). More just me trying to taste others recipes and hopefully apply what I like in theirs to develop my recipes. Want to swap?

Should be pretty right on the hints and tips side of things for now. Thanks for the offer.

Cheers
Peels


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## hairofthedog (19/6/09)

Peels said:


> Hey HairODog
> 
> I will be swapping salamis with 3 people from work and Mario down at the fruit shop. Not all between us like a beer case swap (maybe get something like that going down the track). More just me trying to taste others recipes and hopefully apply what I like in theirs to develop my recipes. Want to swap?
> 
> ...



yeah mate id be in for a salami swap for sure ive got about 6kg hanging at the moment that need about another week


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## Mercs Own (19/6/09)

Peels said:


> Hey Merc
> I will be hanging the lot. I am lucky enough to have plenty of space under the house which should provide enough air flow without being too windy.
> 
> I have spoken at length with Mario at the fruit shop (he does a 6 pig, 3 day, many family event each year) and several people at work who each have their own versions of salami, one of whom is coming over to help on the day, so I feel reasonably confident at this stage but I do have a question about your recipe.
> ...



The chilli component in my recipe is background so you could certainly up the amount if you wanted a more in your face chilli bite. Some people notice the chilli as being hot but they are usually the people that dont eat much chilli. If you were a chilli head you would certainly want more than what is in there. I dont believe the chilli character intensifies as they age I reckon it is fairly stable from wow to go - although that said it may slacken off the older it gets if it does anything but then perhaps the more I eat the more used to it I am!!

Sounds like you are in great hands and well under control!


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## AUHEAMIC (27/6/09)

Today was salami day for me. The dried natural casings were great to work with. They are very strong so you can pack them tight and still link them with string without splitting them. You have to dunk them in wine for a couple of seconds prior to threading them onto the stuffing nozzle. If you dont want your hands looking like two big bruises use white wine.

As far as the chilli goes I used 8g/KG which has given it a good kick without turning it into hero salami.


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## Mercs Own (27/6/09)

Well done Peels, they look good! The snags in the second photo are they snags or salami? I ask as it is important that the salami's do not touch each other or you can develop wet spots and then mold and then bad bacteria which means the salami's go in the bin. They need to dry evenly and they cant do that if they are touching other salami's or other objects.

This is why when I hang my salami I actually make sure there is a couple of centremeters gap between each sausage. I cant get over how straight the salami's are. What skins did you use and what size? I use a 38mm bung and they curve - admitidly I make mine a little longer than you have yours. (I am not saying mine is bigger than yours....it just has more of a curve)


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## AUHEAMIC (27/6/09)

Mercs Own said:


> Well done Peels, they look good! The snags in the second photo are they snags or salami? I ask as it is important that the salami's do not touch each other or you can develop wet spots and then mold and then bad bacteria which means the salami's go in the bin. They need to dry evenly and they cant do that if they are touching other salami's or other objects.
> 
> This is why when I hang my salami I actually make sure there is a couple of centremeters gap between each sausage. I cant get over how straight the salami's are. What skins did you use and what size? I use a 38mm bung and they curve - admitidly I make mine a little longer than you have yours. (I am not saying mine is bigger than yours....it just has more of a curve)


Sorry Merc, Posted the photos in the wrong order, they are one and the same. 

Second photo: It was a temporary place to hang the salamis as they came off the production line and a chance to pimp my brewery. 

First photo: Safely hanging (and not touching) under the house in front of my pathetically empty wine rack.

I cant remember what diameter they are but I guess they are about 38mm I will check tomorrow and let you know. I use the smallest nozzle on a #8 mincer. I got the skins from Costante Imports (the Italian Bunnings), Bell street, Preston and they call them dried natural casings. 

They come out very straight as you can see from the photo below. One problem I had was the knot of the string at the hanging end couldnt support the weight of the whole length. It kept slipping so I made the string on the first link long enough to tie in with the main hanging string. It worked very well. The long salami in the first photo in the post above was about 1.3kg and felt very secure.


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## hairofthedog (28/6/09)

some pics of the finished product 

yours look great peels cant wait for the salami swap


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## AUHEAMIC (29/6/09)

hairofthedog said:


> some pics of the finished product
> 
> yours look great peels cant wait for the salami swap


They look magnificent. How long did they take to dry?


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## AUHEAMIC (29/6/09)

Mercs Own said:


> I cant get over how straight the salami's are. What skins did you use and what size? I use a 38mm bung and they curve - admitidly I make mine a little longer than you have yours. (I am not saying mine is bigger than yours....it just has more of a curve)


Hey Merc. Mine measure 42mm so a bit fatter than yours  . Jokes aside I think they would be a 38mm casing.


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## hairofthedog (29/6/09)

3 & a bit weeks to dry peels


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## Steve (30/6/09)

Always wondering about this.....dont the flys go nuts over them?


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## Fents (30/6/09)

how many flys do you see in winter?


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## Mercs Own (30/6/09)

No flys in my garage.......rats, mice, dogs, cats and possums but no flys....in fact and to be truthful the worst pest I have in the garage is my daughter who is always sneaking in to steal some salami!! I guess as she helps me make it that is okay however if it was up to her we would have eaten the lot before Xmas! I still have 6 sticks of last years in the fridge.


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## Mercs Own (1/7/09)

16 kilos of pork mince with spices thouroghly mixed through now just relaxing for a couple of flavours for flavour and ferment to develop and then they will stuffed into skins on Sunday!


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## kirem (1/7/09)

View attachment 28482


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## Steve (2/7/09)

kirem said:


> View attachment 28482




wow! me wants some of those!


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## Fents (2/7/09)

kirem said:


> View attachment 28482



my god is that capricola on the left?!!!!!


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## kirem (2/7/09)

Fents said:


> my god is that capricola on the left?!!!!!




there are 4 caps hanging, two that can be seen next two other fillets and two outside the right of the photo.

vacuum packed the little salamis last night.

4 caps, 4cheeks, 1pancetta, 3belly and 2 fillets off the back are still hanging.


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## Fents (2/7/09)

pls tell me your in melb kirem! i'll be over at 4.30pm this arvo....


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## kirem (2/7/09)

Fents said:


> pls tell me your in melb kirem! i'll be over at 4.30pm this arvo....




6 hours north west on the border.

the cheeks are called boofalata or something sounding similar, any Italians can correct or confirm me on this one?


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## fraser_john (2/7/09)

:icon_drool2:


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## hairofthedog (5/7/09)

gearing up for another batch on salami :icon_drool2:


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## AUHEAMIC (6/7/09)

hairofthedog said:


> View attachment 28571
> 
> 
> gearing up for another batch on salami :icon_drool2:


Hey HairO, youre an absolute salami maniac but Im with you. Cant wait to swap. Much like swapping beer I think it will be good opportunity to get some recipe ideas of others first hand. 

Just on a side note I found the best knot to tie the links (i.e. the middles not the ends) is a clove hitch. It works like a pulley system so it requires very little effort and it is self locking (one half hitch to be sure). Just a word of warning; Its very powerful so over do it too much and you will cut your salami in two.


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## hairofthedog (7/7/09)

thanks for info peels but ive worked out an even easier knot :lol:


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## hairofthedog (7/7/09)

Yep i with you peels bring on the swap :icon_cheers: 

how many people are goin be in this swap mate ? :huh: 

are we recruiting anyone from the forum to participate ? :blink:


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## AUHEAMIC (8/7/09)

hairofthedog said:


> Yep i with you peels bring on the swap :icon_cheers:
> 
> how many people are goin be in this swap mate ? :huh:
> 
> are we recruiting anyone from the forum to participate ? :blink:


Just you and me so far. Happy to get others involved or just pop up for a beer and we will cut some up and have a tasting (read pig-out) session.


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## Mercs Own (11/7/09)

salami day


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## Mercs Own (11/7/09)

All up about 75 salami's were hanging in the garage until some of them decided they couldnt handle the weight and actually broke in half!! ie the actual sausage snapped in half!!!! I lost about 4 or 5 which is disappointing! The skins must have had an issue as some of the strands I hung had 5 salami's on them and they didnt break and others only three. Obviously if I had hung them all seperately then none would have snapped but I didnt have room for that.

They have been hagning just on a week, look good and smell great!


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## hairofthedog (11/7/09)

nice pics merc are you intrested in joining the swap with myself & peels mate ?


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## Yeastie Beastie (13/7/09)

Mercs Own,

Two thumbs up for this, couldn't have made it simpler. I know an old Italian bloke from Dromana, VIC and he has his own hobby vineyard and makes his own wine, grappa etc. He also makes his own salami. I asked him how to make it and he hasn't told a soul apparently. He says it's something you have to learn, trial and error sort of thing.

Definitely giving this a go.

Cheers
Kev.


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## Thirsty (14/7/09)

Hi,

I made about 5kg with my father in-law a few years ago but found after a little while they dried out and become too hard.

For those making larger quantities for the months ahead, how do you keep them fresh or store them for the longer period.

This has rekindled my interest again.


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## hairofthedog (14/7/09)

hey thirsty i vacum seal all mine they last for a good 12 months like that without getting any harder


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## kirem (14/7/09)

I vacuum seal mine as well


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## Steve (15/7/09)

Mercs Own said:


> I lost about 4 or 5 which is disappointing!



Dont you believe it the 5 second rule? :lol:


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## Mercs Own (16/7/09)

Steve said:


> Dont you believe it the 5 second rule? :lol:



Absolutely however these ones snapped in half or split and I couldnt restuff them so in the bin they went. I did save parts of them my tieing them off as little short ones.

I will start spraying them down with redwine this week to keep the outer skin moist so as it doesnt dry out quicker then the inside. Then in about 3 weeks or so I will be taking them to my butcher and cryovac them.

Sure I will be up for a salami swap.


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## kirem (16/7/09)

I'll be in a salami swap as well.


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## hairofthedog (16/7/09)

looks like the salami swaps a goer so far we have 4 of us i recon 5 would be a good limit

1. hairofthedog
2. peels
3. mercs own
4. kirem

anyone got an idea as to where & when we should meet someones house or a pub ?

just consuming a salami & esb atm perfect combo :icon_drool2:


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## Fents (16/7/09)

i'll be in as long as i can just grab some of yours and swap that hahahaha


> just consuming a salami & esb atm perfect combo



barstead!


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## kirem (16/7/09)

hairofthedog said:


> looks like the salami swaps a goer so far we have 4 of us i recon 5 would be a good limit
> 
> 1. hairofthedog
> 2. peels
> ...



You are welcome to do the swap in Mildura, or I'll put my contribution in a postbag


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## AUHEAMIC (17/7/09)

kirem said:


> You are welcome to do the swap in Mildura, or I'll put my contribution in a postbag


I asked the question and as much as I would like to I wont be able to make it up to Mildura. I guess there is no rush for the swap as our salamis are preserved. It is likely you will get to Melbourne any time soon?


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## kirem (18/7/09)

Peels said:


> I asked the question and as much as I would like to I won't be able to make it up to Mildura. I guess there is no rush for the swap as our salami's are preserved. It is likely you will get to Melbourne any time soon?



I'll be in Melbourne for the wine show, normally a whirlwind of of tastings and dinners.


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## AUHEAMIC (18/7/09)

kirem said:


> I'll be in Melbourne for the wine show, normally a whirlwind of of tastings and dinners.


Is the wine show in October? Im happy to offer my place (Diamond Creek) for the swap.

My wife looked at the first batch of salamis (10kg) and said that wont last a year you better make another lot. So round two tomorrow.


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## kirem (19/7/09)

I am sorry, I just wouldn't have the time to do a swap meet. I am more than happy to drop my salami in the CBD when I am down for the show or post them down with a return post bag.

If you want to do a swap meet without me or my salami then I am happy to drop out.


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## Mercs Own (28/7/09)

It was a good year for drying this year. My salamis took 2 weeks to dry and they dried super evenly! in the past my salamis are wrinkly but this year they are round and proud! Here are some pics.


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## Mercs Own (28/7/09)

See what I mean about the round full shape?


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## Mercs Own (28/7/09)

For Vacuum sealing your salami have a look at my other post here

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...mp;#entry497654


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## hairofthedog (28/7/09)

fents learning the way of the salami :lol:


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## Fents (28/7/09)

classic. note white jumpers do not mix with red wine. and for anybody that cant work it out thats a PROJECTOR with the footy on in the background. mad dog troy we call him. wicked bar.


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## benno1973 (11/8/09)

Total newbie question here...

My neighbour's family makes salamis every year down in Harvey where it's pretty cold during winter. This year, he took lots of notes so we could try it ourselves. Due to kiddie commitments and the like, we're running pretty late this year. We agreed that we'd be pretty happy to make the sausage (he does the fennel/chilli ones as well) and freeze them wet, to be roasted in the oven which (from experience) is awesome. I'd rather do this than kill myself and my family with some sort of bug. But the questions I have are:

1. Is it too warm to dry a few? I'm in Perth and we're having minimums of 9-11C and maximums of around 17-19C. I would guess that this is too warm. It's a bit colder in my shed, but not much.

2. Can I use my fermenting fridge? Someone did a test recently with some salt water for humidity and a fan to circulate air, but not sure what the outcome was?

3. Can I just hang them in my shed (next winter, if it's not appropriate this winter)? It's a single car garage with a concrete floor, pretty cool temps, but I'm worried that there's not enough air flow. Do I need a fan blowing over them, or just a lot of room for the air to flow around them? The shed is closed up for most of the day. Otherwise would they be better hanging outdoors in my decking area, where there's shelter from the rain and strong wind, but enough air flow?

Thanks for all the advice so far!...


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## Mercs Own (12/8/09)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Total newbie question here...
> 
> My neighbour's family makes salamis every year down in Harvey where it's pretty cold during winter. This year, he took lots of notes so we could try it ourselves. Due to kiddie commitments and the like, we're running pretty late this year. We agreed that we'd be pretty happy to make the sausage (he does the fennel/chilli ones as well) and freeze them wet, to be roasted in the oven which (from experience) is awesome. I'd rather do this than kill myself and my family with some sort of bug. But the questions I have are:
> 
> ...



I would say it is too warm in Perth to make salami's. My brother lives in Cottesloe and he would love to make salami but I keep telling him it is not going to work. That said go and talk to some Italian locals and see what they say as maybe they have it worked out but from what I know - and it is not much - the ideal temp for hanging salami's is in the 10 - 12 degree range. Heer in Melbourne all the people making salami wait for june July and then bang everyone is getting pork and casing etc and making them but they wait for that windo temperature wise.

I dont know if it is possible to do the fermentation fridge thing as it would take a fair bit of work to sort out the right humidity and keep it constant for the 2 - 3 weeks that the salami need to hang. Again ask around and see if any one locally has done it.

I hang my salami's in my garage which is a double car type. I come in and out of the garage with the car, some times the door is up for a while whilst doing stuff outside etc. If it was very windy outside I would not open the garage and be as casual about it as the wind can dry them out too quick. Also I would put the car in the garage until it had cooled right down as I didnt want it raising the temp in the garage. Your garage maybe okay regarding air flow - my garage has the double door and then two house doors so there is plenty of draft with out too much air flow. Last year however we had lots of wind right when I wanted to make salami so I held off for a couple of weeks until the wind passed and then made them. A friend of mine didnt wait for the wind to pass and he lost his salamis that he made as they dried out too fast - most went in the bin.

If you had a house with a cellar that stayed at a constant cool temp you could possibly do them but air flow may be a problem - you need some but not too much. No way would I hang them outside and no way would I make them in Perth unless the temp was down around the 12 - 14 every day.

Do some research with locals who are making them if you can find any.

Cheers and good luck


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## Katherine (12/8/09)

I live in Coogee/spearwood full of Italians. They all have double garages for reasons... Hanging salami's and making tomato sauce.


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## Mercs Own (12/8/09)

Katie said:


> I live in Coogee/spearwood full of Italians. They all have double garages for reasons... Hanging salami's and making tomato sauce.



Cool, meet up with Kaiser and introduce him to some of them and get the low down. When you do let me know because my brother would kill to be making his own!


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## Bongchitis (13/8/09)

Hi all,

Just read Mercs post about the temp controlled fridge and it is easy to keep the humidity up. I have grown gourmet mushrooms (which require high humidity) in my temp controlled fridge by having a tray of moistened pearlite at the bottom of the fridge. For those that don't know, Pearlite is used in Hydroponics primarily but it serves to lighten and airate soil and is great for this use due to its porosity and thus high surface area. It is very much like pumus... volcanic rock. A high surface area for evaporation means a fast transition to a humid environment after opening the door and letting the moisture out. The problem is that it works almost too well and can generate humidities in the 90's. A mixture of half dry and half moist (not wet) should be a bit better (or just put less in!) and to maintain the moisture just mist the pearlite every couple of days with a dilute sanitiser solution to prevent nasties growing in there. I don't think this is such a big deal as you would be checking more often than that anyway.

This is how I plan to make my cheeses too when I finally get around to it.

On second thought, wouldn't the moisture from the salami in such a confined space maintain a high humidity?... Maybe. I have a humidity meter and could sus it out if anyone is interested.


Edit: Engineers can't spell


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## benno1973 (13/8/09)

Merc, Katie and Bong -

Thanks for the reply. The Italians making sausages that I know are all down south or inland in the hills, where the temps are much cooler than up here. The butcher I spoke to said that if we left it till the end of August, then we may as well not do it as it'd be getting too warm. And with the warm weather we've been getting here in Perth recently, I'd say it's probably not an option to dry them. Maybe early June might've been fine, but it looks like we've missed the boat.

Having said all that, we've got 50kg of pork on order from the butcher, and sausage making Saturday is going ahead as planned. We're making a few different styles (chilli, pepper) and we'll probably freeze most fresh for oven roasting, but I'll still hang a few in a couple of different locations to see how they turn out. I just read on Len Ploi's site that he uses a converted chest freezer with a dish of water in it to keep the humidity up. Pearlite's a great idea - I have a hydro shop down the road and was just about to buy some for a hydroponics setup anyway. Can't hurt to give it a go with a few of them to see how well/evenly they dry, although I'll be pretty cautious tasting them initially! We're also making a bunch of fresh bratwurst, so should be a busy day.

Bongchitis - can I PM you to find out more about growing gourmet mushrooms? I've done a bit of research to find out what's required, and I'd love to know what sort you're growing and how you did it?


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## Katherine (15/8/09)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Merc, Katie and Bong -
> 
> Thanks for the reply. The Italians making sausages that I know are all down south or inland in the hills, where the temps are much cooler than up here. The butcher I spoke to said that if we left it till the end of August, then we may as well not do it as it'd be getting too warm. And with the warm weather we've been getting here in Perth recently, I'd say it's probably not an option to dry them. Maybe early June might've been fine, but it looks like we've missed the boat.
> 
> ...




Ill ask a guy I work with his parents live in Hamilton Hill and they do them every year. Ill ask when they do them.


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## benno1973 (16/8/09)

So Sausage making Saturday went well. 60kg of pork, done and dusted. 20kg pepper salami, 20kg chilli salami, 6kg bratwurst and 6kg portugeuese linguica. 8kg of fat reserved for another day. Picked up the meat at 9am and all done and dusted by 5pm. I'm hanging 5 in my shed (which is sitting at around 12-14C) but the rest I froze fresh. A few piccies from the day...


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## Steve (17/8/09)

Holy crap  

Thats serious salami making! WOW

Cheers
Steve


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## benno1973 (18/8/09)

Yeh, we ended up with 36 chilli, 35 pepper, 10 linguica and 12 bratwurst. We were pretty happy with the outcome. No huge mistakes on the day, but the old kenwood is probably a bit small to handle that amount again next year.


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## cubbie (18/8/09)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I'm hanging 5 in my shed (which is sitting at around 12-14C) but the rest I froze fresh.



Your shed stay nice and cool, it already hit 19c today outside, but the forecast has it cool and wet for the next week. So the ones that your froze, will then be hung at some stage??


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## Fents (18/8/09)

Our last salami's died. was too hot in troys shed. got up to 19c one day and that was it. The outer layer of meat dried way too quick whilst the inside layer is still wet and now has no way to dry.

Salami FA1L!


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## benno1973 (18/8/09)

cubbie said:


> Your shed stay nice and cool, it already hit 19c today outside, but the forecast has it cool and wet for the next week. So the ones that your froze, will then be hung at some stage??



My shed stays pretty cool, but yesterday and today had me a bit worried. The shed is shaded and even though there's no insulation, the overnight temps and concrete floor help everything stay pretty cool. Here's hoping I don't lose them (although there's only 5 to lose I guess). The frozen ones I'm not going to hang. This year I'll cut my losses and resolve to start earlier next year. The frozen ones are sooo good roasted in the oven for an hour, boiled, or even just cut open and added to passata for a quick pasta sauce. And my neighbour just picked up 90 dried salamis from his family down south, so there's no shortage of salami down our way.

Fents - good to know. I might mist mine with a little red wine to make sure that the outsides don't dry too quick.


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## Quintrex (18/8/09)

Fents said:


> Our last salami's died. was too hot in troys shed. got up to 19c one day and that was it. The outer layer of meat dried way too quick whilst the inside layer is still wet and now has no way to dry.
> 
> Salami FA1L!



I think they can be possibly be rescued by wetting the outside with wine to help moisten it again.

Good luck.

Q


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## Mercs Own (18/8/09)

Fents sorry to hear about the death of your salami's. Every year I watch mine closely - at least a couple of times a day - to check how they are going. I know how you must feel on losing them!

Kaiser Soze - man what a mamoth day that must have been! I was wondering what you were using to stuff them and was hoping it was something more of a commercial machine but the Kenwood? It must be a little tired after that! Good luck with the five hanging!

I have sprayed my salamis to keep the outside moist if I thought they were drying too quickly but I imagine if they get to that stage where they are pretty much dry on the outside and still wet on the inside I dont know if you can save them by that time?? As Fents says they have no way to dry as the moisture cant get out - rehydrating the outsides my cause more problems as you would need to almost soak them?? Anyone done that?


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## brettprevans (18/8/09)

tough break Fents. maybe you should have hhung them in your music room. then you would have had smoked salami!

in all seriousness why sdont you try wetting a few of them and see what happens. you've got nothing to loose.


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## Fents (18/8/09)

i would but old mate threw them out. we did taste a couple and they just wernt cutting the mustard.

im just pissed off cause every batch troys made has come out sooooo good but the ONE time i try and help it turns to shit. Bad omen stuff going on i reckon.


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## Renegade (18/8/09)

Hey Soze, looking like a top effort, that's a lot of mulched animal you have there ! If you're not hanging them to cure, then are they still considered salami (do they taste like salami when you cook them?) 

Being a brand-newbie to the sausage making art, but without anywhere to hang, i'm considering of making a few salami styled snags and smoking them in a webber as a curing method. Would this even work? I'm a mad salami fan, so it would be nice to be able to have a home-made substitute.


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## benno1973 (18/8/09)

Mercs Own said:


> Kaiser Soze - man what a mamoth day that must have been! I was wondering what you were using to stuff them and was hoping it was something more of a commercial machine but the Kenwood? It must be a little tired after that! Good luck with the five hanging!



Actually, the mincing it handled with ease. Took about 30 mins to coarse grind the 50kg of pork, which really surprised us. Stuffing them took around 4 hours though, so we'd look at either getting something a bit more industrial for the day, or having a second stuffer there.




Renegade said:


> Hey Soze, looking like a top effort, that's a lot of mulched animal you have there ! If you're not hanging them to cure, then are they still considered salami (do they taste like salami when you cook them?)



No, probably not salami if they're not cured. And they don't really taste like salami, but not like a regular sausage either. Because of the coarse grind, they are more chunky than a normal snag. Let me know if you end up smoking them - I'd be keen to do the same to mine next year if that's an option. One of the guys who attended on the day had been told by an old italian guy that he cured them in wood ash, so he was going to give that a shot also. I hadn't heard of it, but I guess it's worth a shot?


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## Katherine (18/8/09)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Actually, the mincing it handled with ease. Took about 30 mins to coarse grind the 50kg of pork, which really surprised us. Stuffing them took around 4 hours though, so we'd look at either getting something a bit more industrial for the day, or having a second stuffer there.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



We have smoked them that way, defiantly not salami but different. Has anybody had that sausage in Bali it kind of tasted like that. I wouldnt want 40 of them. Also not sure how long they would keep that way.


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## Quintrex (18/8/09)

Fents said:


> im just pissed off cause every batch troys made has come out sooooo good but the ONE time i try and help it turns to shit. Bad omen stuff going on i reckon.



I think it's just too late in the season to be able to age them in shed, without some temp control. I'm sure one day you'll make great salami fents. 

I'm trying to sort out a curing chamber at the moment, just dealing with some humidity issues at the moment.

Hope you're well, almost time we brewed that kolsch dude, the pressure should be off some september sometime.

My final talk is next week friday, can't wait for that to be over.

Cheers
Q


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## hairofthedog (18/8/09)

chin up fentsy well bang out some BBQ snags shortly mate thatl sort ya out :icon_cheers:


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## Warrior Poet (27/8/09)

Guess I have a use for all the room under my house now. :lol: 

But will wait till next year. Have been monitoring the temperature and it hangs around 12c from May and hasn't really budged. Saving for my mincer now. 

I don't think I could see myself doing 50kg of pork. :blink:


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## Steve (28/8/09)

Currently eating a chopping board full of sliced home made salami from kirem...........wow! Got to give this a go. Absolutely delicious. Thanks very much kirem
Cheers
Steve


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## Mercs Own (30/8/09)

hairofthedog said:


> looks like the salami swaps a goer so far we have 4 of us i recon 5 would be a good limit
> 
> 1. hairofthedog
> 2. peels
> ...



I have been away - at the BrewNZ beer awards - but that is another story - time for a salami swap. I will send each of you guys one salami which just so you know weighs about 110g per stick. They are cyrvaced and I would suggest sending them express post so that they dont sit around in hot temps etc Rather they arrive in good \shape as apposed to questionable shape. Pm me with your address and I will do it thias week. When you pm me I will send you my address so you can send your slami. Note I am moving in 3 weeks so lets do it before then!

How did Steve get on the list?? :lol: I will be sending you one too mate!


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## kirem (30/8/09)

Mercs Own said:


> I have been away - at the BrewNZ beer awards - but that is another story - time for a salami swap. I will send each of you guys one salami which just so you know weighs about 110g per stick. They are cyrvaced and I would suggest sending them express post so that they dont sit around in hot temps etc Rather they arrive in good \shape as apposed to questionable shape. Pm me with your address and I will do it thias week. When you pm me I will send you my address so you can send your slami. Note I am moving in 3 weeks so lets do it before then!
> 
> How did Steve get on the list?? :lol: I will be sending you one too mate!



I sent Steve a salami outside of this swap.


View attachment 30263


----------



## Mercs Own (31/8/09)

kirem said:


> I sent Steve a salami outside of this swap.
> 
> 
> View attachment 30263


 yes I am sending him one outside of this swap also - seems he managed to get in with out actually getting in - smart man!


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## kirem (31/8/09)

Mercs Own said:


> yes I am sending him one outside of this swap also - seems he managed to get in with out actually getting in - smart man!



I think we all could learn something from Steve!

I got a bottle of chilli in exchange for my salamis.


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## Steve (31/8/09)

kirem said:


> I think we all could learn something from Steve!
> 
> I got a bottle of chilli in exchange for my salamis.



Mercs - thanks very much. Will swap you a bottle chilli sauce in exchange if you like.
Cheers
Steve

Oh and Kirem - I only have the little one left in that pic!


----------



## kirem (3/9/09)

I tried the chilli sauce on Monday, very nice.

I used it in a toasted ham and cheese (and chilli sauce) sandwich.

Thanks again Steve.


----------



## Steve (9/9/09)

Dont you just love it when the post man delivers a surprise!

Thanks very much for the salami Mercs.....cant wait to get into it.

Some chilli sauce will be in the mail to you tomorrow!

Cheers
Steve


----------



## Steve (9/9/09)

kirem said:


> I tried the chilli sauce on Monday, very nice.
> 
> I used it in a toasted ham and cheese (and chilli sauce) sandwich.
> 
> Thanks again Steve.



Cool! Glad you like it.....it basically goes with anything.....even with a plate of shepherds pie n chips!
Cheers
Steve


----------



## Mercs Own (22/9/09)

Steve love the chilli sauce! That jar is not going to last long at all, Thanks  

Kierem, the salami is great the only problem with it is keeping the wife and daughters away from it so I can actually have some!


----------



## Steve (15/10/09)

Mercs Own said:


> Steve love the chilli sauce! That jar is not going to last long at all, Thanks
> 
> Kierem, the salami is great the only problem with it is keeping the wife and daughters away from it so I can actually have some!



Anyone want to swap some more salami for sauce? Im making another batch on the weekend.
Cheers
Steve


----------



## Steve (30/10/09)

What skins do commercial company use on their salamis. Just got some DON hot hungarian salami and the skin is hardly chewable! Your eating it and you end up with a chewed up circle of skin that you just have to swallo whole as it doesnt break down!
Cheers
Steve


----------



## Mercs Own (31/10/09)

Steve said:


> What skins do commercial company use on their salamis. Just got some DON hot hungarian salami and the skin is hardly chewable! Your eating it and you end up with a chewed up circle of skin that you just have to swallo whole as it doesnt break down!
> Cheers
> Steve



I dont think you are meant to eat the skin - peel it off and eat the salami. They would be the cologen made casings.


----------



## Steve (31/10/09)

Mercs Own said:


> I dont think you are meant to eat the skin - peel it off and eat the salami. They would be the cologen made casings.



Whoops! How embarrassing! :lol: 
Cheers
Steve


----------



## Fents (23/3/10)

Epic bump.

That time of year is nearly upon us. Break out the mincers, clean the stuffers, werd up your butcher!


----------



## Quintrex (23/3/10)

Fents said:


> Epic bump.
> 
> That time of year is nearly upon us. Break out the mincers, clean the stuffers, werd up your butcher!



Damn straight, Got your cranking arm ready fents.... then once you're done we can make some salami :lol: 

Going to get a sausage stuffer this year. I think it'll speed up the process remarkably, rather then using the old porkert to stuff the casings.

Q


----------



## Fents (24/3/10)

yes Q, troy just brought a kenwood electric. It rocks. Took us 20 mins to do 5KG of BBQ snags the other night as opposed to 1hr on the hand stuffer.

maybe the next can be an apa/salami day.


----------



## brettprevans (24/3/10)

thx for the info re kenwood stuffer Fents. im hoping to get a good mincer and stuffer for my 30th this year, so im collecting info on brands etc and dropping subtle hints to the missus.

besides my 2yr & 3yr olds are costing us a fortune in the amount of salami and snags they eat!


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## kirem (24/3/10)

pigs are fattening up nicely

chilli sauce is made ready

nearly sausage time again.


----------



## Fents (24/3/10)

kirem said:


> pigs are fattening up nicely
> 
> chilli sauce is made ready
> 
> nearly sausage time again.



what state you in again kirem? if its vic we really should hook up for swaps.


----------



## brettprevans (24/3/10)

I havent seen anyone using 'cure' for salami etc? its obviosuly not neccesary?

this bloke in Warrnambool sells all sorts of sausage/salami making stuff incl casings and equip. are his prices any good (having done little research myself).


----------



## Quintrex (24/3/10)

citymorgue2 said:


> I havent seen anyone using 'cure' for salami etc? its obviosuly not neccesary?
> 
> this bloke in Warrnambool sells all sorts of sausage/salami making stuff incl casings and equip. are his prices any good (having done little research myself).



depends on the type and the size of the casings afaik. I've used cure to make Saussison Sec which is a french style "salami". I've also made spanish style chorizo which used curing salts. If you want to make fat salami's the use of a lactic culture at least is recommended, as the inside stays "wet" longer and is thus more susceptible to going off.

It's easier to stick to making the thinner salami

Q


----------



## Steve (24/3/10)

If anyone in the ACT is into making their own. Give me a hoy. Always willing to help out and learn something new....especially when you can eat it at the end. Surely BrewerPetes into Salami, he's into everything else home made?

Cheers
Steve


----------



## kirem (24/3/10)

Fents said:


> what state you in again kirem? if its vic we really should hook up for swaps.



yeah I am in Mildura


----------



## Fents (24/3/10)

kirem said:


> yeah I am in Mildura



:lol: you can fly them down... its on!


----------



## kirem (25/3/10)

happy to do a salami swap again this year. I swapped with Merc last year and sent a few off for chilli sauce or just to share.

On a side note, I purchase a bench top electric mincer and sausage stuffer yesterday, a Tefal brand, 800w, ~$200. I looked at the Kenwood one 400W and the sunbeam one 600W. All seemed to have similar build quality and from my experience power goes a long way in these things.

Anyone else have experiences with those little bench top mincers?


----------



## brettprevans (25/3/10)

kirem said:


> happy to do a salami swap again this year. I swapped with Merc last year and sent a few off for chilli sauce or just to share.
> 
> On a side note, I purchase a bench top electric mincer and sausage stuffer yesterday, a Tefal brand, 800w, ~$200. I looked at the Kenwood one 400W and the sunbeam one 600W. All seemed to have similar build quality and from my experience power goes a long way in these things.
> 
> Anyone else have experiences with those little bench top mincers?


Tefal that cheap? The kenwood 400W proffessional model was like $249. 800W sounds way to go.


----------



## benno1973 (29/3/10)

Fents said:


> That time of year is nearly upon us. Break out the mincers, clean the stuffers, werd up your butcher!



We've got 2 pigs, a kangaroo and a sheep lined up for the day. 6 participants. Still breaking out the trusty Kenwood, but there may be 2 more mincers/stuffers this year, as everyone seems to have the bug to invest in sausage making equipment.


----------



## barls (29/3/10)

kirem said:


> happy to do a salami swap again this year. I swapped with Merc last year and sent a few off for chilli sauce or just to share.
> 
> On a side note, I purchase a bench top electric mincer and sausage stuffer yesterday, a Tefal brand, 800w, ~$200. I looked at the Kenwood one 400W and the sunbeam one 600W. All seemed to have similar build quality and from my experience power goes a long way in these things.
> 
> Anyone else have experiences with those little bench top mincers?


ive got the same one i think kirem. havent had a problem so far but have only made mince and Chorizo so far. but i tell you what they smoked wonderfully.


----------



## brettprevans (30/3/10)

well the missus asked me if i knew what brand mincer i wanted last night. so it looks like ill be joining the sausage making fraternity in may when my bday rolls around.

toss up between the tefal 800W and the kenwood 400W Pro. the kenwood for some reason it about $60 more. 

then i need to re-read this thread and buy all the stuff i need to pump out some salami and sausages.


----------



## lukewarm (5/4/10)

Great thread everyone. Certainly keen to give it a go myself.

Thought I might pass on this blog I've been reading on the subject.

Cured Meats. The art and the craft.

Tons of great articles and recipes.

Apologies if someone already mentioned it earlier, I didn't notice it while reading through.


----------



## Fents (6/4/10)

great link!


----------



## Kleiny (9/4/10)

Are the guys making salami here useing a starter to ferment the outside of the sausage

Ive been reading the blog earlier and he says he is useing a meat starter, if anyone is useing it where do you get it from?

Im about to have a crack at some prosciutto first and the salami when the weather cools.

Kleiny


----------



## Fents (9/4/10)

it all depends on what salami mate. like Q's french salami needed a starter i think. Troy and mine didnt because they are a thin salami.


----------



## brettprevans (12/4/10)

just 'emailed myself' to our home email address a list of things with internet links. its all about dropping the hints to the missus who can pass it onto the family in regards to upcoming birthday pressies 

TEFAL ME710 LE HACHOIR 800W MEAT MINCER
The Sausage Making Cookbook
Charcuterie: The Craft of Salting, Smoking and Curing 
Professional Charcuterie: Sausage Making, Curing, Terrines and Pates 

I dont think it will be in time for making this year though. will wait and hope.


----------



## brettprevans (10/5/10)

well i got given the tefal mincer over the weekend, wohoo! no books thought as yet., so will have to get a few and bone up for next year. will cut my teeth on making snags in preperation of next salami season.


----------



## Fents (10/5/10)

you dont need books mate just someone to show you. up for a session next time we make some?


----------



## brettprevans (10/5/10)

yeah mate for sure. just PM me when you (and I assume Troy) are having a session.


----------



## AUHEAMIC (11/5/10)

Havent been on for a while and the first thing I see is this thread taking off again.

I was gearing up to make 100kg this year but I completed my salami fridge a couple of days ago. Its running at 10 degrees, 70%RH so all going well I will do a 5kg test batch of salami after another week or so of reliability testing. If it works out OK I will scale back the seasonal batch to 50-60kg.


----------



## Fents (12/5/10)

bell me when your making mate, been far too long between sessions, i'd be up for a night in the peels shed.


----------



## brettprevans (12/5/10)

i'd love to come along, see how the pro's do it and be the salami/sausage bitch for the evening

edit:
hmmm that sentence sounds very wrong now that i re-read it


----------



## Mercs Own (12/5/10)

Peels said:


> Havent been on for a while and the first thing I see is this thread taking off again.
> 
> I was gearing up to make 100kg this year but I completed my salami fridge a couple of days ago. Its running at 10 degrees, 70%RH so all going well I will do a 5kg test batch of salami after another week or so of reliability testing. If it works out OK I will scale back the seasonal batch to 50-60kg.



Hey Peels I would love a bit more info on your salami fridge?? Perhaps a pic or two and a blurb about the bits and pieces.

Keep us posted on how it works.

I still have some salami from the batch I made last year and they are eating very nicely. I am looking forwrd to making more this year but think I will try for something a little different this year not quite sure what but will be happy to be in a swap again this year.

Cheers guys


----------



## kirem (12/5/10)

Mercs Own said:


> I still have some salami from the batch I made last year and they are eating very nicely. I am looking forwrd to making more this year but think I will try for something a little different this year not quite sure what but will be happy to be in a swap again this year.



I still have some as well, care to swap another in the interest of seeing how they have developed?

I used the last of the capicola on the week, I love that stuff.

As for this years, having learnt the secrets of Calabrian Salami day, I am holding a hybrid Scottish-Calabrese version in my carport this year!


----------



## fraser_john (12/5/10)

kirem said:


> I still have some as well, care to swap another in the interest of seeing how they have developed?
> 
> I used the last of the capicola on the week, I love that stuff.
> 
> As for this years, having learnt the secrets of Calabrian Salami day, I am holding a hybrid Scottish-Calabrese version in my carport this year!



How can you blend a black-pudding with a Calabrian salami.

<Insert picture of some creepy mutant sausage here>

ha ha

<edit>
Oh, and then you can send me some when you are done!
<end edit>


----------



## kirem (12/5/10)

fraser_john said:


> How can you blend a black-pudding with a Calabrian salami.
> 
> <Insert picture of some creepy mutant sausage here>
> 
> ...



Well sometimes it takes all my effort to stop myself from blending my Scottish sausage with some...well you get the idea!


----------



## Mercs Own (12/5/10)

kirem said:


> I still have some as well, care to swap another in the interest of seeing how they have developed?
> 
> I used the last of the capicola on the week, I love that stuff.
> 
> As for this years, having learnt the secrets of Calabrian Salami day, I am holding a hybrid Scottish-Calabrese version in my carport this year!



Absolutely! Pm me your address and I will l send you one.


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## gregs (29/5/10)

Well after being inspired by the home cured salamis Ive been researching the hows and whys of it all. Im currently awaiting the arrival of a Humidity controller and temp controller.

The humidity controller will operate a simple ultrasonic humidifier built from a cheap pond forger a bucket to hold water and a fan. This will sit in the bottom of the fridge along side of a 100 watt light bulb. The light will be operated with the temp controller as will the fridge; this will enable the perfect conditions at my finger tips to produce cured meats all year round.

I will be able to dial in 25 30 degrees to start the fermentation posses- re (lactic acid production) then dial in 12 degrees temp and 70% humidity.

I will post some pics during the build and Im also keen to hear from others who have similar set ups.

Cheers.gregs.


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## Steve (29/5/10)

kirem and mercs, yours were great 12 months ago.....how do they change in over time? Richer? Smoother? Riper? What happens to them? Do they change colour etc? Do they get harder?
Cheers
Steve


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## Fents (29/5/10)

first salami night on the cards tonight, only a small one as it might get a bit warm next week. massive one next weekend though. 20kgs of pork neck for zeee capricola!


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## Kleiny (20/6/10)

Just bought a mincer and sausage filler, i have cure#2 and i was thinking about getting a culture.

Its nearly salami making time.

So im looking for recipes and tips

Kleiny


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## kirem (20/6/10)

salami making season is well and truly in full swing around Mildura

been to two pig kills/salami days this season

I'll be doing some more in another two weeks

we don't use a culture and the cure is just salt, dehydration and time. Flavours are fennel, home made capsicum sauce and dried chilli flakes.

they come out great, but for a pig kill, by far the capocola is the prize.


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## Fents (20/6/10)

kirem said:


> we don't use a culture and the cure is just salt, dehydration and time. Flavours are fennel, home made capsicum sauce and dried chilli flakes.
> 
> they come out great, but for a pig kill, by far the capocola is the prize.



we dont use a cure either...think its 46grams salt per kg meat for memory (dont quote me our last salami night involved loads of drinking.)

its all about the cap! we dont get to kill pigs but the butcher at preston market looks after us on the pork necks.


----------



## Kleiny (21/6/10)

Just found this link its got 100s of recipes for curing meats and sauages

Sausage and Salami Link

Kleiny


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## brettprevans (22/6/10)

kirem said:


> we don't use a culture and the cure is just salt, dehydration and time.





Fents said:


> we dont use a cure either...think its 46grams salt per kg meat for memory


so with your salami its just salt and making thinner salami to counteract the potential for botulism etc? how many have you had go bad? rough % is ok. just trying to get an idea. I dont really want to use the cures etc as one of the reasons Im doing this is to stay away from all the preservitives etc and get back to old school natural
cooking



Kleiny said:


> Just found this link its got 100s of recipes for curing meats and sauages
> 
> Sausage and Salami Link
> 
> Kleiny


great link. ashame a lot of them use curing powders. 

just found a use for the remaining pomagranite syrup i have left (sausage not salami so a little OT). 
Lamb Sausage (Assyrian)
3 pounds ground lamb
1 Tsp salt
1tsp coarse ground black pepper
1 Tsp basil leaves, minced fine
1/4 cup pomegranate juice
1 tsp tarragon
Hog casings for stuffing
Mix together all ingredients and stuff into casings.Twist into 5-inch lengths.


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## kirem (22/6/10)

citymorgue2 said:


> so with your salami its just salt and making thinner salami to counteract the potential for botulism etc? how many have you had go bad? rough % is ok. just trying to get an idea. I dont really want to use the cures etc as one of the reasons Im doing this is to stay away from all the preservitives etc and get back to old school natural
> cooking



Yep just salt. The salami end up being 2" think, never had a bad one. when they are hanging we wipe any mould etc off them and when they are vaccum sealed we wipe them clean with a rag that has been in olive oil. the guys I do it with have been doing it for over 50 years in Australia and god knows how long the technique and method has been developed for in Calabria

sure botulism and other badies are a concern and if you are concerned then don't do it, but we are tough up here and can handle it!


----------



## hairofthedog (23/6/10)

Hey boys this is my recipe for salami

:icon_drool2: _* ROYCEYS SALAMI SENSATION*_ :icon_drool2: 

10 lm 45mm dry natural casting
10kg pork shoulder no 5 grind
300gm salt
500gm capsicum sauce
Bottle of red wine
20gm ground black peppercorn
15gm chilli flakes/seeds 
5gm dry garlic
sprinkle sweet praprika

made this recipe a dozen times take around 4 weeks to dry if your not sure if its ready you can weigh it its ready when its lost 30% of its weight 


_*30 grams of salt per kilo is the correct amount no less no more*_


----------



## brettprevans (24/6/10)

hairofthedog said:


> Hey boys this is my recipe for salami
> 
> :icon_drool2: _* ROYCEYS SALAMI SENSATION*_ :icon_drool2:
> 
> ...



simple as. nice Troy. so with the pork shoulder. is that whole shoulder ie with skin and fat on? or are you skinning it, and leaving the fat for use?


----------



## benno1973 (24/6/10)

hairofthedog said:


> _*30 grams of salt per kilo is the correct amount no less no more*_



Yep, 3% is what we use. Weigh it, don't just guess. 

In the lead up to sausage making, I went to a course run by Vince Garreffa of Mondos the other day. Some great info passed on, including:


3% salt. Use of cure is optional, although required by law for the big producers.
Use a female pig, as male pigs (unless castrated early) smell.
Mould isn't necessarily a bad thing. Some schools of thought are that mould will prevent the sausage from drying out too quickly.
If you have cold nights but warmish days, stick the sausages in the fridge for a week before hanging them. This encourages the formation of the mould on the sausages. When you take them out of the fridge, they will be tacky and a day or so after you hang them they'll form some mould on them, and prevent the sausage from drying too quickly.
If you want to encourage good salami mould, take the rind from an existing mouldy salami, and put it in a spray bottle with some water for 24hrs. Then spray this on the drying snags.


----------



## Kleiny (24/6/10)

How do we know if the mould is good mould KS?


----------



## Quintrex (24/6/10)

Kleiny said:


> How do we know if the mould is good mould KS?



I think the general rule is 

white mould ok, green mould not good, black mould bad


----------



## benno1973 (24/6/10)

Quintrex said:


> I think the general rule is
> 
> white mould ok, green mould not good, black mould bad



Yep, I've heard that. I've also heard that any mould is fine and won't kill you. But I think it's generally accepted that white is the good stuff...


----------



## hairofthedog (25/6/10)

as far as mould goes anything but black is fine


----------



## hairofthedog (25/6/10)

CM2 everything but the skin & bones of the shoulder is used you can also ask your butcher for some back fat if the shoulder is a bit lean you want around 25% fat in your meat


----------



## Fents (25/6/10)

hairofthedog said:


> CM2 everything but the skin & bones of the shoulder is used you can also ask your butcher for some back fat if the shoulder is a bit lean you want around 25% fat in your meat



put the caprcola recipe up.


----------



## gregs (27/6/10)

Well I finally got around to making salami for the first time with some help from Andrew and Scott.

After butchering a pig during the week we got to making the salami yesterday, their now hanging in the temp/humidity controlled fridge so hope all gos well.


----------



## gregs (27/6/10)

A pic of the control box


----------



## gregs (27/6/10)

The guys hard at it.


----------



## AndrewQLD (27/6/10)

And don't forget the 20kg of sausages we did as well Gregs, it was a mammoth effort and a fun day to boot, but why do I have such a bad headache this morning?


----------



## benno1973 (28/6/10)

Nice work guys! 

Out of interest, how do you control the humidity? I was thinking of just sticking a small bowl of water in the fridge (ala someone else's post at the start of this thread), but that's not very scientific. You seem to have a humidifier hooked in to the control box? Or at least you have a hygrometer (is that what it's called?) in there to tell you what the humidity is?


----------



## gregs (28/6/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Nice work guys!
> 
> Out of interest, how do you control the humidity? I was thinking of just sticking a small bowl of water in the fridge (ala someone else's post at the start of this thread), but that's not very scientific. You seem to have a humidifier hooked in to the control box? Or at least you have a hygrometer (is that what it's called?) in there to tell you what the humidity is?




Looking at the fridge full of salami you can see in the bottom a small bucket with a computer fan on the top; this is full of water with a small single disc pond fogger floating in it. A pond fogger is an ultrasonic device that when activated creates a cool mist. The lid has four 12 millimetre holes drilled in it so as the fog gradually filters out through the fan when activated. All this is connected to the humidity controller.

This type of unit works if your fridge when cooling actually lowers the humidity, as most fridges do. The controller I think is called a Hygrostat.

Cheers.gregs.

Another pic


----------



## brettprevans (29/6/10)

2 questions

1. do i have enough time left in winter to make salamis? 
2. anyone had any experiance making twiggy sticks? is it just using really thin diamater casings and making little salamis with a finer grind?
3. I might just hanf mine in the fridge thats outside and not currently on (like gregs pic above but without humidity control). its cold enough at the moment. although i can use a temp controller if needed.


----------



## Quintrex (29/6/10)

citymorgue2 said:


> 3. I might just hanf mine in the fridge thats outside and not currently on (like gregs pic above but without humidity control). its cold enough at the moment. although i can use a temp controller if needed.



Nope, you need air movement they'll go mouldy/off hella quick. Hang it somewhere that stays reasonably constant temp wise but has some air movement. The humidity should be ok this time of year in melbourne afaik.

Cheers
Q


----------



## Kleiny (29/6/10)

I reckon you still have heaps of time to make it CM2

The above recipe says 3-4weeks cureing and id say we have at least 6-10weeks of cold weather still.


----------



## brettprevans (29/6/10)

Quintrex said:


> Nope, you need air movement they'll go mouldy/off hella quick. Hang it somewhere that stays reasonably constant temp wise but has some air movement. The humidity should be ok this time of year in melbourne afaik.
> 
> Cheers
> Q


hmm forgot about that. i need to wire up a computer fan. not that i know know to do that. i suppose i could use my outside room (a converted garage) and leave the window open. it should gives some air flow. ill have to break out the heatpads for my beer though.

cheers Q


----------



## hairofthedog (29/6/10)

citymorgue2 said:


> 2 questions
> 
> 1. do i have enough time left in winter to make salamis?
> 2. anyone had any experiance making twiggy sticks? is it just using really thin diamater casings and making little salamis with a finer grind?
> 3. I might just hanf mine in the fridge thats outside and not currently on (like gregs pic above but without humidity control). its cold enough at the moment. although i can use a temp controller if needed.




1.Plenty of time left mate if you use 25mm casings they will dry in about 2 weeks if you want to do 50mm casings (salami) they take about 6 weeks so you can probably sneak them in as well
2.the thinest ones seen are made with sheeps intestine maybe 10mm when dry but a lot of work 
3.dont worry about a fridge just hang them in a dark dry shed with a small amount of draft


----------



## AUHEAMIC (29/6/10)

OK so here is this years effort. I ordered 5 pairs of pork shoulder on the bone which is about 120kg. Once it was boned and skinned it was 78kg of clean meat. One of the benefits of buying it on the bone is the bones themselves which are half spareribs and the slabs of skin (crackle).


----------



## AndrewQLD (30/6/10)

Impressive Peels, they look great, what was your recipe if you don't mind my asking?

Andrew


----------



## benno1973 (30/6/10)

Bloody hell Peels, that'll keep you going for some time!!

How do people keep rats away from nibbling at the salamis while they're drying? Last year I hung mine from a rope, with paper plates at either end to act as rat barriers, but this year I'm looking for something different.


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## Fents (30/6/10)

you are a machine peels. get a leave pass and bring some to the swap.


----------



## AUHEAMIC (30/6/10)

AndrewQLD said:


> Impressive Peels, they look great, what was your recipe if you don't mind my asking?
> 
> Andrew



The recipe (and inspiration) came from thread originator. I based it on Mercs recipe in post 57 minus the fennel seed, plus chilli power, with different proportions (except the salt).

This is the mincer/filler I built for the occasion. Still needs a couple of finishing touches such as levelling feet, a coat of paint and a better foot switch. I made the foot switch in a drunken hurry so its a little bit sh!t.


----------



## AUHEAMIC (30/6/10)

gregs said:


> Well I finally got around to making salami for the first time with some help from Andrew and Scott.
> 
> After butchering a pig during the week we got to making the salami yesterday, their now hanging in the temp/humidity controlled fridge so hope all gos well.


How do you reduce the initial high humidity of all that wet meat?


----------



## gregs (4/7/10)

Peels said:


> How do you reduce the initial high humidity of all that wet meat?




The initial humidity was hovering around 80 83% although this is considered high the salamis lost 14% of their original weight in the first week and the humidity during that time has been slowly decreasing, so after 7 days the RH is sitting at 70 74%.

Im assuming that soon the RH will be low enough to activate the humidifier and hold it at around 70%.

Pic of a salami after 1 week in the fridge.


----------



## Steve (5/7/10)

Peels said:


> OK so here is this years effort. I ordered 5 pairs of pork shoulder on the bone which is about 120kg. Once it was boned and skinned it was 78kg of clean meat. One of the benefits of buying it on the bone is the bones themselves which are half spareribs and the slabs of skin (crackle).
> View attachment 39077
> 
> View attachment 39078




:icon_drool2: nice one peels


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## AndrewQLD (5/7/10)

gregs said:


> The initial humidity was hovering around 80 83% although this is considered high the salamis lost 14% of their original weight in the first week and the humidity during that time has been slowly decreasing, so after 7 days the RH is sitting at 70 74%.
> 
> I'm assuming that soon the RH will be low enough to activate the humidifier and hold it at around 70%.
> 
> ...




I can't wait to hook into those gregs, that looks great.

Andrew


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## benno1973 (5/7/10)

Salami and sausage day at ours on Saturday. Off a 150kg carcass, we managed to get about 130kg of meat and fat, which was far more than we expected. We also had kangaroo, goat and chicken which made the scheduling a bit complex.

Anyway, started boning out the pig at 9am and wrapped up around 7:30pm, so a pretty long day for all participants (and partners and kids!). We ended up with:

100 chilli salamis
100 pepper salamis
50 pork and kangaroo chorizo for hot smoking
10kg kangaroo linguica salamis
15kg satay kangaroo sausages
6kg goat longaniza sausages
4kg curried chicken sausages

Mincing the meat. This year we had the Kenwood and a Tefal mincer, both of which were shelved after mincing to make way for the Reber stuffing machine




100+kg of pork, waiting to be mixed. 4kg of salt 'sprinkled' on top.


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## Thirsty Boy (5/7/10)

Gents I am inspired.

There's a few kgs of good Pork shoulder in the fridge and have finally worked out a spot in my flat where I can hang them that wont be in the way or get heated (hallway, up high above our heads... they don't drip do they??) and I have some casings in the fridge ready to go... I am too chicken to do it with just salt so I'll be using some nitrite/nitrate though. Maybe next year for just salt after I have had a go and not killed anyone.

Just put a ham on to cure (rosemary, juniper berries, corriander seeds) and that'll get cooked sous vide and then smoked to finish. Trial run, I'd like to make 
x-mas hams for the family this year.


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## benno1973 (5/7/10)

They do drip unfortunately. I generally have an old towel underneath mine when I hang them to catch the drips.

Make sure you do some good research on the nitrite/nitrate before you start, you don't want too much or too little. The prague powder we bought is 12.8% sodium nitrite mixed with salt, so when mixed in the correct quantities with additional salt, you want to get around 0.5% nitrite. Having said all that, this year we went with just salt.


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## benno1973 (6/7/10)

Can anyone talk me through the humidity requirements during drying the salamis? I've always just hung them in the shed and hoped for the best, but I understand that some 'shed hangers' build a fire in the corner at the start of the drying period, and wash down the floor towards the end. I gather this is to reduce humidity towards the start (while the sausages are still quite wet) and increase humidity towards the end. Is this right?


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## Thirsty Boy (10/7/10)

I am following recipes from trusted sources for my nitrite/nitrate levels (correlate with the research I have done about the proper levels too) - and I have confirmed with my supplier the ratios used in the cure I bought... so I am pretty confident I have the right level in my salami ... which I made today !!  

Also cooked a ham I have been curing - tomorrow its off to the market for pork belly (Pancetta) and Girello eye of Beef (bresola) ... maybe more prok for chorizo.

Here's my effort.. meagre by some of the standards here - but it'll do for a first go.

*Salami hanging in the Hallway of my flat*.. I can only hope they don't drip too much.





*Ham Hanging in the kitchen*... just surface drying for a few hours before going in the fridge and eating fat slices fried with eggs for breakfast tomorrow. It was cured and cooked in a vacuum bag.




so.... 3 or 4 weeks to wait then I see how the Salami adventure turns out. Thanks for the ideas and pointers in this thread everyone.

TB


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## mxd (10/7/10)

TB, that looks great and kaiser what a great looking day.

my birthdays coming up and I always wanted to get a sausage maker, I think seeing the salami's I will go for the sunbeam mincer/sausage maker this year.

And maybe the cheese maker for fathers day


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## kirem (10/7/10)

I have been quiet on the nitrite/nitrate discussion for fear of starting yet another shit-fight thread on AHB, but stuff it, here goes. Let see if we can have a decent thread

One of the main reasons I made an effort to learn traditional salami and meat curing from my Italian mates is that I have heard and read a lot about the negative effects of nitrite/nitrate on the body or more correctly they can form nitrosamines. Meat is very high in amines and I wanted to make nitrite/nitrate free cured meats but also have some skills in spoilage detection

It is illegal to sell cured meats without the addition of nitrite/nitrate in Australia. I think minced meat or any meat that has been processed to allow oxygen contact and therefore microbiological growth has to have nitrite added

They have been linked to cancer (like just about everything these days), destroys red blood cells and a whole lot of short term effects similar to what SO2 in wine is blamed for ie headaches, asthma, hangovers etc. I even read that it has been blamed for HIV! I have found as much information on nitrite/nitrate being bad for you as I have found that it is unproven

Now I don't suffer from any effects of high SO2 in wine and don't suffer from the short term effects (that I know of) from commercial cured meat but I don't like the sound of nitrite/nitrate in anything I consume.

I figure people have been making cured meats for centuries. I am not sure maybe they did it in the bronze age or before? I think the skills to check for spoilage have been replaced by reliance on chemicals in many parts of our life. We have rules forced on us by the fear of the dickheads in our population killing themselves and therefore we no longer have natural selection to remove the dickheads from the gene pool.

If I can make my cured meats without nitrite/nitrate then I don't need to worry. There are so many skills for food collection, production that have been lost or are not practiced anymore that it is really sad. On a side note, I watched a thing on the Italian food safari on mushroom collection and the skills taught as a young kid on what is a good eating mushroom and what will make you sick or kill you. I thought shit, imagine all the place in Australia that mushroom collection could be enjoyed but isn't practiced.

So those that use nitrite/nitrates why and those that don't why not?


View attachment 39300


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## Steve (10/7/10)

Saw some meat slicers at Aldi yesterday for $50 if you want to slice some of your salamis etc.


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## Thirsty Boy (10/7/10)

Nitrates/Nitrites

*Safety -* till I learn more about what I am doing. When I have experience under my belt at doing the smallgoods thing. Then maybe I wills start to explore curing with just salt. Hell, I considered it to be risky and adventurous to skip fermenting the sausages to drop the pH.

*Tradition -* Hundreds of years using nitrates in smallgoods making. Sure.. thousands of years making smallgoods without them before that... but Botulism means "sausage sickness" (or some such thing) in Latin... While maybe Nitrosamines give you cancer, botulism gives you dead. So since they worked out that nitrates help to stop it, they've been using the stuff - and Saltpeter isn't exactly an invention of the modern age. Yeah I know... little wizened Italian guys have been making salami without nitrates for generations... but check the incidence of botulism poisoning in areas where its common.... want to lay a few bets that its not a shitload higher than it is in areas where people buy their smallgoods from manufacturers who follow modern methods?

*Flavour -* Made bacon or ham without the nitrites?? I have. Tastes like salt pork... not like bacon. The nitrites contribute flavour, stop the meat going grey and stop you poisoning yourself... winners all round.

Cancer Threat as a concern.... OK. Fair enough. I get that. But I've been eating commercially cured bacon, ham, salami etc all my life... and I have no doubt I will continue to do so every time I by any small goods from a shop. The small amount I would save by not using them in teh smallgoods I make for myself is hardly going to make a massive difference. Besides.... I smoked for 20 years. If the nitrosamines can get me before all the crap I sucked into my lungs does - good luck to em I say.

I don't insist that other people "should" use nitrites or bacterial cultures etc... hell if you offer me some of your homemade Salami see how much I care as I scarf the stuff down. But I don't trust me not to kill my friends and family - so I plan to be careful till I know what I'm doing... and probably after that too.


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## benno1973 (10/7/10)

I haven't used Nitrites/Nitrates, just salt so far. We have a big bag of prague powder if ever we want to use it (should last us for a lifetime, given the amount you add), but till now I've trusted that my salt additions are in the right proportions and the temperatures are low enough to discourage bad microbial growth. Legislation means that commercial producers need to use it, and I eat commercial products, so I can't say that I'd never eat it. But if I have a choice as to what goes into my salami, I'd prefer just salt.

I tried looking for a discussion about the good and bad points of using nitrates, but there's no real unbiased discussions on the net. Like when I searched for the pros and cons of child immunisation - the arguments are polar, and no-one presents the facts in an unbiased way. Anyone who's done the same search will understand what I mean.

Interesting point about the bacon and ham. I've never done one, and I was thinking about doing it. Might use some prague powder in that, so I guess I'm not that adverse to it.

As a side note, I also have a big bag of saltpetre, which I understand isn't used in the industry any more? Wonder what I'm going to do with that... gunpowder anyone?

And nice work on the salami TB. Would love some info about the ham curing process and what you did?


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## kirem (10/7/10)

Thirsty Boy said:


> While maybe Nitrosamines give you cancer, botulism gives you dead.



I was of the understanding that cancer gives you dead as well!  



Thirsty Boy said:


> Made bacon or ham without the nitrites?? I have. Tastes like salt pork... not like bacon. The nitrites contribute flavour


yes I have and it didn't taste like salt to me, it was some of the best I've tasted.

Out of interest, do you have any flavour descriptors of nitrite/nitrate?

We have a really good local butcher, I might grab a few beers and ask some questions about nitrite use etc and get another opinion as well


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## Ducatiboy stu (10/7/10)

Does anyone know where to get liquid smoke from instead of having to smoke them... i want to try it with some jerky


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## kirem (10/7/10)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Does anyone know where to get liquid smoke from instead of having to smoke them... i want to try it with some jerky



http://www.jomaysgifthampers.com.au/shop/p...products_id=111


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## Thirsty Boy (10/7/10)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> Does anyone know where to get liquid smoke from instead of having to smoke them... i want to try it with some jerky



Or

http://stores.shop.ebay.com.au/BBQHQnet__W0QQ_armrsZ1

I've bought cure, casings etc from here. Good guy good service and most sausage ingredient related things you need including the cheapest stainless sausage stuffers out there that i know of.

Ntrites taste... well... like ham. I haven't tried it.. but apparently if you cure chicken or turkey with nitrites, they end up distinctly "hammy" so I think its just one of those things.

Bacon etc cured with just salt doesn't have that thing that screams ham - like prosciutto. Its ham alright, but because its just salt cured and aged.. it doesn't have that "thing" that most of us would associate with ham. They are still delicious and one day when I find a place to do it I'll give proper prosciutto a go... but until then I want ham that tastes hammy.

I have made up a general purpose dry cure mix - 450g salt, 225g sigar, 50g Prague Powder #1 and I use it at 22-25g /kg of meat as a dry cure. Thats how I did the ham... just added herbs and spices, rubbed the ham and sealed it in a vac bag.

It actually didn't work out properly -- I didn't wait long enough for it to cure or for the salt levels to equalize before I cooked it. So I have a cooked peice of meat that is almost bacon on the outside... lightly cured ham on the inside and lightly salted pork in the very middle. its bloody delicious still. But not what i was trying for. I will probably stick to immersing in brine form now on.. maybe I will use the big marinade injector I have coming to pump the meat a little to speed things up.

Speaking of which... I'm just about to go fry a couple of slices up for dinner with sauerkraut.


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## kirem (10/7/10)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Ntrites taste... well... like ham. I haven't tried it.. but apparently if you cure chicken or turkey with nitrites, they end up distinctly "hammy" so I think its just one of those things.



hmm so to make anything taste like what we have been led to believe is the taste of ham, just add nitrite.


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## Thirsty Boy (10/7/10)

exactly - it might be a problem if I didn't like that taste - but luckily I do.


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## hairofthedog (10/7/10)

i agree with kirem just salt to cure ive been reading Preserving the Italian Way by Pietro Demaio the guy is a doctor in melbourne & he only uses salt to cure so i recon if its good enough for someone whos studied medicine for 7 years its good enough for me


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## benno1973 (12/7/10)

kirem said:


> yes I have and it didn't taste like salt to me, it was some of the best I've tasted.



Hey Kirem,

Have you got some info on how you did the ham? I've been doing a bit of research on suasagemaking.org, but everyone there uses either cure #1 or #2, or saltpetre. Can't seem to find much info on just using salt, and I'd be interested to try this method.

Cheers, Ben


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## kirem (12/7/10)

I have used this recipe and technique a few times. first one was too salty and dried out. but with trial and error I have made a few really good ones. I reduced the 32 days in the attached recipe/technique to 3 weeks and it was about right for me and my fridge conditions. I think the trick is to take all the salt, garlic pepper off once the meat is just cured and that takes trials.

It is nothing like the ham in the supermarket, but if I want that I'll get some chicken breast and add nitrite!  

View attachment 39335


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## benno1973 (12/7/10)

Oh yeah! That sounds good!...

Will have to try this.


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## gregs (12/7/10)

Salami looks to be drying ok after 16 days, also added a coppa this weekend heres to hoping they all turnout.  All this is new to me.


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## gregs (12/7/10)

Another pic


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## AndrewQLD (12/7/10)

They look great Greg, certainly have shrunk a bit by the looks and the texture of the meat looks fantastic, can't wait to slice into these.

Andrew


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## gregs (12/7/10)

Yeah Andrew, I cant wait for that day myself, wondering if they are drying out to fast.

I put your gauge in next to my humidity sensor to check that all is well, so will have a look soon and let you know.


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## brettprevans (15/7/10)

One last hurdles now fixed. Bought these tonight. 
The Sausage Making Cookbook
Professional Charcuterie: Sausage Making, Curing, Terrines and Pates


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## gregs (16/7/10)

Well I just had to do it; I cut one of the salamis today.

This is the first time Ive attempted this and its all new to me; just have a look at it, it tastes as good as it looks.


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## Thunus (16/7/10)

Well done shags :kooi: 

All the way from "Piggy piggy piggy" to home made salami
Who'd have thought.

Can't wait to try some with a couple of beers.


10 minutes untill the pork rack comes out of the weber mmmmmmmmmmmmm can't wait


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## AndrewQLD (16/7/10)

Looks great guys, I'll be sticking my head in tomorrow morning for a taste test.
Blue cheese pics are up here.


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## gregs (16/7/10)

Well after nominating me as test pilot heres to hoping that all is well. 

I now have a tangy flavour on the tip of my tongue being washed down with the help of a cascade A.P.A how good is life. :icon_drool2:


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## AndrewQLD (16/7/10)

gregs said:


> Well after nominating me as test pilot here's to hoping that all is well.
> 
> I now have a tangy flavour on the tip of my tongue being washed down with the help of a cascade A.P.A how good is life. :icon_drool2:
> View attachment 39441



Keep rubbing it in Greg! And your not much better Thunus! is that a pulled pork your doing with plenty of smoke?
Enjoy the fruits of your labour guys.


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## Thunus (16/7/10)

"And your not much better Thunus! is that a pulled pork your doing with plenty of smoke"

Plenty of pork pulling around here AndrewQLD B)


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## gregs (17/7/10)

Thunus said:


> "And your not much better Thunus! is that a pulled pork your doing with plenty of smoke"
> 
> Plenty of pork pulling around here AndrewQLD B)



Could you guys please jerk your pork in private! :lol:


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## Mercs Own (19/7/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Yep, 3% is what we use. Weigh it, don't just guess.
> 
> In the lead up to sausage making, I went to a course run by Vince Garreffa of Mondos the other day. Some great info passed on, including:
> 
> ...


 
Hey Kaiser, what was the cost of the course???? And what if anything did you take away apart from knowledge??

There is a course down my way this weekend but at $500 for the two days and no take home goodies I am thinking whilst it would be great to do it is a little on the expensives side.

Good job Gregs!!!

Went looking for my salami recipe today and couldnt find it!! :huh:


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## benno1973 (19/7/10)

Mercs Own said:


> Hey Kaiser, what was the cost of the course???? And what if anything did you take away apart from knowledge??



The course was $80, and was well worth the money. On the night we got big Vince talking for 4 hours and demonstrating everything, including cutting into 3 carcasses to show us the difference between the different ages of pork. Additionally, we got to eat some biltong, chorizo, coppa, dried sausage, smoked fresh sausage, smoked pastrami, along with a couple of glasses of wine and some salad. His wife also made a dessert, and we got to take home some salted pork mince (for brekky the next day), 2 italian sausages prepared, ready for hanging and drying, a section of pork belly pancetta all ready for hanging and drying, and some fresh chorizo.


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## benno1973 (5/8/10)

Just wondering if anyone has any advice on either of the following situations:

1. My pepper sausages have decided not to dry. The chilli sausages have dried beautifully, but the pepper sausages are hard on the outside and squishy within. It's not the environment they are drying in, as they're both hanging in the same spot. It's not the amount of salt - each pile was weighed and had an equal amount of salt applied. I think it may be the skins - we ran out of ox-runners during the chilli sausages so made an emergency trip to the butchers to buy more for the pepper ones. Its possible that these didn't get washed as thoroughly as the first batch, and still had salt on them causing the casing to dry first and trap moisture in.

Anyhow questions as follows:

Are these safe to eat? They had around 3.5% salt added to them, but no nitrites/nitrates.
Given that they are still safe, can I just vaccuum seal them and store them that way, or do I need to treat them like fresh sausages and freeze them?
Is there an alternative, such as soaking them and re-drying them?

2. The chilli sausages are drying beautifully, but with 3.5% salt, they taste like eating a salt lick. I've heard of people soaking their sausages to reduce the salt and redrying them - has anyone done this? Anyone know how it can be done?


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## Fents (5/8/10)

cracked a couple of mine last night and im just flawed at how good they taste. first "june" batch we thought had dried out to much but old may royce cryovaked them and they have turned out wicked, not to dry not to soft. Big hit of chilli and fennel to keep the tastebuds amused.

the other "july" batch are near on perfect, little bit more mostuire hardly any chilli and NO fennel!

any one keen for a bit of swapsie's?


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## Mercs Own (6/8/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Just wondering if anyone has any advice on either of the following situations:
> 
> 1. My pepper sausages have decided not to dry. The chilli sausages have dried beautifully, but the pepper sausages are hard on the outside and squishy within. It's not the environment they are drying in, as they're both hanging in the same spot. It's not the amount of salt - each pile was weighed and had an equal amount of salt applied. I think it may be the skins - we ran out of ox-runners during the chilli sausages so made an emergency trip to the butchers to buy more for the pepper ones. Its possible that these didn't get washed as thoroughly as the first batch, and still had salt on them causing the casing to dry first and trap moisture in.
> 
> ...



The fact that both salamis are the same - salt, drying conditions etc would point to the skins as you said - how ever what liquids did you use in the salamis? were they the same - wine? Paprika paste?

If they are dry on the outside and squishy in the middle I would say they are a lost cause - if they are squishy it could be because they are still wet and havent dried as the same time as the skins or it could be that they werent stuffed firmly and they are squishy due to air pockets in them also either way the end result is the same - BIN THEM.

If the skins are hard then moisture can no longer get out - they will not dry and could in fact turn nasty I wouldnt risk mucking around with them. How long have they been hanging? This is my opinion and I am no expert - there are guys here that know more than I (Fents what say you or your Italian connections?) Why dont you ring and ask the guy you did the course with for his opinion if you havent already.


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## Fents (6/8/10)

sorry guys i cant offer advice im still a novice but yea if the liquids were all the same (merc knows the deal, wine and paprika paste ) then they should have dried evenly which leaves you with the skins problem. i wouldnt be trying to rehydrate at all, if in doubt throw em out.... bit of meat is not really worth 2-3 days in bed crook in the guts and shitting at both ends or worse no more shitting at all ever again...dead.

edit - cut one open and compare the "softness" to your good chilli ones....if there is any airholes/pockets defiantly piff them.


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## Mercs Own (6/8/10)

Peels, Kirem, AndrewQld???? wot say youse?


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## benno1973 (6/8/10)

Yeh, thanks guys. Liquid added to both was just wine, although this wasn't measured so could have been different for the chilli than for the pepper. They have been hanging around 3 weeks, so I'd say that they are not going to dry any further, given that the skins are dry.

Just so you know, the question about being safe to eat wasn't meant as eating them in their current state. I'd cook them and use them that way. Possibly in pasta sauce or soups or something like that. Actually, before thinking of the possible risks and posing the question, I cooked one up and added a tin of tomatoes and it tasted great! However if the general consensus is that they aren't safe, I'll bin them.


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## Mercs Own (7/8/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Yeh, thanks guys. Liquid added to both was just wine, although this wasn't measured so could have been different for the chilli than for the pepper. They have been hanging around 3 weeks, so I'd say that they are not going to dry any further, given that the skins are dry.
> 
> Just so you know, the question about being safe to eat wasn't meant as eating them in their current state. I'd cook them and use them that way. Possibly in pasta sauce or soups or something like that. Actually, before thinking of the possible risks and posing the question, I cooked one up and added a tin of tomatoes and it tasted great! However if the general consensus is that they aren't safe, I'll bin them.



Better safe than sorry


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## gregs (9/8/10)

Mercs Own said:


> Peels, Kirem, AndrewQld???? wot say youse?



It would be interesting to note the PH of the two batches as PH has a great influence on drying. The recipe can have an influence on PH as dose the bacteria (Bactolactilious) and the total fermentation time and temperature.



PH should not be second guessed, it is an important proses in the drying of salami.


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## benno1973 (9/8/10)

Yep, I'm fairly new to this, and so far have followed my neighbours advice, which seems to have been handed on through traditional italian relatives, without much explanation of the whys and wherefores! Anyway, I've sent an email to Vince (the guy who ran the course), but at this stage I'm thinking that they are headed for the bin.

Not too worried - I did a quick head count and there were only about 10 large salamis, so not enough to be too concerned.

BTW - Merc, I checked a pepper sausage and it didn't have air pockets. It's just the residual liquid that hasn't dried making it squishy. 

Thanks for all your help everyone!


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## Thirsty Boy (9/8/10)

Mine have stopped drying out I think... They seem to be going nowhere fast after 4 weeks or so now. They are I think "just" dry enough. They sort of shifted inside the skins, with the bottom half ending up thicker than the top - so the top halves have dried perfectly, and the bottoms are less perfect. They aren't squishy and look cured all the way through, but the top half is better and you can actually taste the difference between the really well dried bits and the less dried bits... With the well dried bits tasting saltier and better.

I've eaten two of them so far in the interests of research... My verdict is "not bad for a first try" they are a little fatty, and I think that's because I didn't have the fat cold enough when I minced it and a decent proportion emulsified rather than cutting... The cut bits have gone nice and white and glossy... But there is a lot of oil floating around too that I think is from the emulsified fat. Less fat next time, and better technique on the minced. Also not quite salty enough and too much garlic. Still, they are good with cheese and crackers so what more could you ask for.

They look upsettingly like large poos though... Visually very unappealing. I will tie and hang them differently next time.

Thanks for this thread... I see many salami in my future.

TB


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## Mercs Own (10/8/10)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Mine have stopped drying out I think... They seem to be going nowhere fast after 4 weeks or so now. They are I think "just" dry enough. They sort of shifted inside the skins, with the bottom half ending up thicker than the top - so the top halves have dried perfectly, and the bottoms are less perfect. They aren't squishy and look cured all the way through, but the top half is better and you can actually taste the difference between the really well dried bits and the less dried bits... With the well dried bits tasting saltier and better.
> 
> I've eaten two of them so far in the interests of research... My verdict is "not bad for a first try" they are a little fatty, and I think that's because I didn't have the fat cold enough when I minced it and a decent proportion emulsified rather than cutting... The cut bits have gone nice and white and glossy... But there is a lot of oil floating around too that I think is from the emulsified fat. Less fat next time, and better technique on the minced. Also not quite salty enough and too much garlic. Still, they are good with cheese and crackers so what more could you ask for.
> 
> ...



TB I would like to see a photo of them hanging to understand what happened to them. If you packed them tight enough when stuffing them there wouldnt really be any where for the meat inside the skins to run or slide down to the bottom half of the hanging skin? Needless to say what you want is for your salami to dry evenly throughout the whole sausage.

Also when you initially mix all of your meat with all of the spices pastes and liquids etc you leave it for a couple of days before stuffing during which time it firms up and becomes quite sticky making it very unlikely to run down inside the casing??


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## benno1973 (10/8/10)

Mercs Own said:


> Also when you initially mix all of your meat with all of the spices pastes and liquids etc you leave it for a couple of days before stuffing during which time it firms up and becomes quite sticky making it very unlikely to run down inside the casing??



Hey, that's something I was told not to do by Vince! Having said that, talking to friends who make salami, they mix in the evening, leave it overnight, and stuff in the morning, and they make a fantastic sausage, so I'm a believer. What's the science behind leaving it for a bit? And before stuffing, do you re-mix it?


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## AndrewQLD (10/8/10)

Mercs Own said:


> Peels, Kirem, AndrewQld???? wot say youse?



Sorry Mercs, I've been away with the fairies these last couple of weeks and missed this.
However gregs is the guru of Charcuterie as far as the Bundy Brewers are concerned and his advice below I think is spot on.



gregs said:


> It would be interesting to note the PH of the two batches as PH has a great influence on drying. The recipe can have an influence on PH as dose the bacteria (Bactolactilious) and the total fermentation time and temperature.
> 
> 
> 
> PH should not be second guessed, it is an important proses in the drying of salami.




Cheers
Andrew


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## Thirsty Boy (11/8/10)

How do you measure the pH of a meat paste? PH strips obviously, but we all know their limitations and I have read one or two info sources that suggest strongly using a pH meter instead... But for the life of me I can't work out how to use my brewing pH meter on a meat paste.

Tips, hints??

Merc... I think perhaps I didn't stuff the cases firmly enough. I was planning on mincing straight into the cases... So i cut the meat up into a fairly small dice, added spices etc and mixed it all up, then let it sit overnight. Minced next day. Once again attempting to mince straight into the casings was a total disaster.... So I minced and stuffed separately.


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## Mercs Own (11/8/10)

Thirsty Boy said:


> How do you measure the pH of a meat paste? PH strips obviously, but we all know their limitations and I have read one or two info sources that suggest strongly using a pH meter instead... But for the life of me I can't work out how to use my brewing pH meter on a meat paste.
> 
> Tips, hints??
> 
> Merc... I think perhaps I didn't stuff the cases firmly enough. I was planning on mincing straight into the cases... So i cut the meat up into a fairly small dice, added spices etc and mixed it all up, then let it sit overnight. Minced next day. Once again attempting to mince straight into the casings was a total disaster.... So I minced and stuffed separately.



I mince once then add in all the spices, salt, paprika paste etc then mix by hand to make sure it is well mixed through then mince again and leave it for a day or two before stuffing. Leaving it for a day before stuffing lets it have its ferment and makes it set or become a little thicker so you can stuff it firmer.

All that said I am no expert at all in fact I completely stuffed my salami this year!!! I bought 10 kilos of pork that my butcher also did the first mince for me. I was supposed to pick it up on Sat but couldnt - I went to brunswick to get my Paprika paste. Didnt get there till monday. Pork went straight into my fridge no probs. I got busy, real busy - I am writing a beer cookbook so I have been cooking and experimenting like mad!! Friday came and I thought oh %&@^ I gotta do the pork so I mixed up all the spices got the pork out of the fridge and openned it up and yep it smelled like something had crawled in there and died. So 10 kilos went in the bin and the spice mix is sitting in the cupboard for when I make some Pork and Fennel Sausages. Way to burn $150.00!

Live and learn.


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## gregs (25/8/10)

We can make salamis or cured meats and be successful without knowing what is actually happening within the product. We can argue about the uses of nitrites and nitrates Vs salt only, but theres much more happening in the meat than can be explained in a short answer, like PH etc.

 Like all things in life, the greater the understanding we have of what you are trying to make the more successful we will be. So for those who are interested, and like to read up on a topic Ive attached a paper, one of many Ive read over the past couple of years, so enjoy.
View attachment Salami_advice.zip


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## Thirsty Boy (25/8/10)

Thanks for that Gregs,

I'vegot some books and read a bunch of stuff too.. But that paper seems to be the most readable of them, whilst still covering the topic reasonable comprehensively. Thanks very much.

Also explains the technique for measuring a meat paste's pH... Which had me stumped.

Cheers mate

TB


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## gregs (26/8/10)

Cut this coppa yesterday, its the first whole mussel Ive cured, Im happy with the results although I need to work on the flavour as its quite mild.


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## Fents (26/8/10)

yea our should be right soon too.

did you roll it in pepper?


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## gregs (26/8/10)

Fents said:


> yea our should be right soon too.
> 
> did you roll it in pepper?




Yeah Fents rolled it in pepper and fennel seed but I feel I didnt get the ferment happening as it should. I now have the correct cultures sitting in the freezer to inoculate the next batch.

Cheers.gregs.


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## gregs (20/9/10)

A batch of Soppressa about to go into the curing chamber.
It's great to be able to make salami all year round.


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## winkle (20/9/10)

gregs said:


> A batch of Soppressa about to go into the curing chamber.
> It's great to be able to make salami all year round.
> View attachment 40927



Damm that looks good.


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## Katherine (23/9/10)

gregs said:


> Cut this coppa yesterday, its the first whole mussel Ive cured, Im happy with the results although I need to work on the flavour as its quite mild.
> View attachment 40400



That is my fav cured meat.... looks good! But yes I like it hot.


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## AndrewQLD (4/10/10)

gregs said:


> A batch of Soppressa about to go into the curing chamber.
> It's great to be able to make salami all year round.
> View attachment 40927



Had a taste of this on the weekend, absolutely fantastic, has that beautiful tang you can only get from a fermented product.
Great work Greg. 
By the way, humidity/temp controller arrived today so will have the fridge setup soon.

Cheers
Andrew


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## gregs (14/10/10)

AndrewQLD said:


> Had a taste of this on the weekend, absolutely fantastic, has that beautiful tang you can only get from a fermented product.
> Great work Greg.
> By the way, humidity/temp controller arrived today so will have the fridge setup soon.
> 
> ...



Good work on your curing chamber Andrew, :icon_chickcheers: 
I was wondering when you would pull your finger out, as you know we have some very happy pigs fattening. :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2:


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## AndrewQLD (21/10/10)

gregs said:


> Good work on your curing chamber Andrew, :icon_chickcheers:
> I was wondering when you would pull your finger out, as you know we have some very happy pigs fattening. :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2:



Ran the system today Greg and used this temperature/humidity data logger to see what the results were, nothing in the chamber so there will be variations when it's full of salami but this will give you a rough idea. You can see when the fridge compressor kicks in and the humidity starts to fall, but it doesn't take long for it to raise back up.





Andrew


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## Fents (22/10/10)

can you guys post pics or show me a link or just tell me how i can build such a thing?


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## AndrewQLD (22/10/10)

Fents said:


> can you guys post pics or show me a link or just tell me how i can build such a thing?



Hi Fents,
The humidity/temperature controller is from here and the Ultrasonic humidifier is from ebay. The controller is pretty straight forward to wire up if you have done a fridge or mash controller before.





The controller box has a socket on the front for the ultrasonic humidifier and a socket on the back for the fridge.

Cheers
Andrew


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## gregs (23/10/10)

Fents said:


> can you guys post pics or show me a link or just tell me how i can build such a thing?




http://www.sausagemaker.com/tutorials/cham...ng_chamber.html

Hop this helps.


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## AndrewQLD (25/10/10)

Peperone in the drying chamber, temp set to 14 and humidity set to 75%.


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## gregs (25/10/10)

Shit they look great Andrew, well done. :icon_drool2: 

Making salami in a controlled environment when the outside ambient temp in Bundaberg is 28 degrees and humidity to variable to mention sure says something about electronic controllers. :super:


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## AndrewQLD (25/10/10)

gregs said:


> Shit they look great Andrew, well done. :icon_drool2:
> 
> Making salami in a controlled environment when the outside ambient temp in Bundaberg is 28 degrees and humidity to variable to mention sure says something about electronic controllers. :super:



Just checked the PH Greg, looks like it's fluctuating from 5.3-5.5, I've kept a sample aside as you suggested and will check again in a day or two.

Andrew


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## gregs (25/10/10)

Andrew this is just a small part of a salami tutorial I found and up loaded a few pages back, it seems that beef has a lower starting ph than pork, hope this helps. This is from two parts of a 70 odd page paper.

*Foods with a low pH value (high acidity) develop resistance*

*against microbiological spoilage. *Pickles, sauerkraut, eggs, pig feet,

anything submerged in vinegar will have a long shelf life. Even ordinary

meat jelly (headcheese) will last longer if some vinegar is added and

this type of headcheese is known as "souse". Bacteria hate acidic

foods and this fact plays an important role in the production and

stabilization of fermented sausages. Ideally the pH value of meat to be

used for making fermented products should be below *5.8.*

Pork 5.9 - 6.0

Back fat 6.2 - 7.0

Emulsified pork skins 7.3 - 7.8

Beef 5.8

Combining different meats will have an effect on the final pH value of

the sausage mass.

When using acidification as a main safety hurdle, salami is microbiologically stable​when​​​​*pH is 5.2 or lower *and this normally requires about *48 hrs *fermentation time​
for fast-fermented product and​​​​*72 - 96 hours *for medium-fermented type. In slowfermented​
salami pH does not drop lower than 5.5 but the sausage is​microbiologically stable due to its low moisture level (prolonged drying).


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## AndrewQLD (27/10/10)

Thanks Greg, I've downloaded the file and reading it.
Tested again today and it is rock solid on 5.2 ph so it's looking good and the weight has dropped 7.5%.
Here's a pic of the datalogger info for the last 24 hours, interesting to note the variations in daytime and night readings.


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## gregs (27/10/10)

That data logger is the go Andrew, Ill have to grab one for myself, is that temp getting above 16? I would prefer 14.5 degrees max but cant see any harm. Its just that some pathogens may start to grow at just above 15 degrees (although your 16 is not the average during cycling) and this is just one step in the hurdle. But considering you have followed other food safety standards in your process, they will be good.

Buy the way when I lower my fridge temp the humidity is also lowered on average as you probably already know.

Interesting graph on the logger temp, I wonder if the small spike in temp is compressor delay in conjunction with just that cycling on period or is that you having a peek at the produce?  

Great work I cant wait for a taste.


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## AndrewQLD (3/11/10)

Well I couldn't resist, I wanted to test the pH of these today and so I cut one open (4.6 pH) and of course I had to have a sample, they seem to be drying well and they have lost a total of 33% moisture over the last 10 days but I think they will need a couple more days to firm up. Sadly they are not as peppery as I would have liked and are very mild in flavour too, but nice nonetheless just not Peperone as I know it.


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## gregs (3/11/10)

AndrewQLD said:


> Well I couldn't resist, I wanted to test the pH of these today and so I cut one open (4.6 pH) and of course I had to have a sample, they seem to be drying well and they have lost a total of 33% moisture over the last 10 days but I think they will need a couple more days to firm up. Sadly they are not as peppery as I would have liked and are very mild in flavour too, but nice nonetheless just not Peperone as I know it.
> 
> View attachment 41849
> View attachment 41850




Wow, ten day salami Andrew and an incredible 4.6 PH seems the only thing to improve on is the flavour youre chasing. Well done, Ill be around for a taste if there is any left. :icon_cheers:


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## AndrewQLD (3/11/10)

gregs said:


> Wow, ten day salami Andrew and an incredible 4.6 PH seems the only thing to improve on is the flavour you're chasing. Well done, I'll be around for a taste if there is any left. :icon_cheers:



There's a couple here with your name on them Greg, I could use your opinion on the flavour issue as well, it could be just my penchant for spicy food but these seem a little restrained.

Andrew


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## AndrewQLD (6/11/10)

Milano Salami


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## gregs (6/11/10)

Ive been doing a few myself Andrew, have the peperonis finished already?

Here are some all beef salamis I knocked out today. :icon_drool2:


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## benno1973 (7/11/10)

AndrewQLD said:


> Hi Fents,
> The humidity/temperature controller is from here and the Ultrasonic humidifier is from ebay. The controller is pretty straight forward to wire up if you have done a fridge or mash controller before.



I bought one of these Rittal hygrostats the other day (for $20 off ebay). It's for controlling the humidity in server rooms. Will this do the job?


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## AndrewQLD (8/11/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I bought one of these Rittal hygrostats the other day (for $20 off ebay). It's for controlling the humidity in server rooms. Will this do the job?



I can't see why not, so long as your confident wiring it up, have you got a humidifier?


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## benno1973 (8/11/10)

AndrewQLD said:


> I can't see why not, so long as your confident wiring it up, have you got a humidifier?



I have a mate who used to be a linesman and checks all my wiring before I plug it in. 

I have a small dehumdifier, and i was going to buy a pond fogger from Bunnings, but those ultrasonic humidifers on ebay look as good, or possibly something like this. I guess they all work the same, as long as I don't get a heated humidifier.


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## AndrewQLD (8/11/10)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I have a mate who used to be a linesman and checks all my wiring before I plug it in.
> 
> I have a small dehumdifier, and i was going to buy a pond fogger from Bunnings, but those ultrasonic humidifers on ebay look as good, or possibly something like this. I guess they all work the same, as long as I don't get a heated humidifier.



That's just about the same as the one I use, they work really well.


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## AndrewQLD (13/11/10)

Milano day 7, 15% moisture loss.


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## AndrewQLD (13/11/10)

gregs said:


> I've been doing a few myself Andrew, have the peperoni's finished already?
> 
> Here are some all beef salamis I knocked out today. :icon_drool2:
> 
> View attachment 41902



Looks great Greg, got an update yet?
I noticed with the peperoni being all beef that it has a much meatier flavour than the shop bought ones if that makes any sense.


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## gregs (13/11/10)

The salamis seem to be going ok one week in, the smell is very tangy although the colour is not as bright as I expected but this is the first all beef salami Ive done, so I hope they will be ok.


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## Mercs Own (18/11/10)

Hey Gregs you and Andrew are realy taking this to a fantastic and whole new level!!!! I will at some stage follow in your footsteps however if I bring another fridge home I think my wife will kill me!

I was just wondering what the recipe for your all beef was especially the use of insta cures?? and starter cultures etc

cheers


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## AUHEAMIC (25/6/11)

Well its that time of year again. Made the mixture today, will be stuffing tomorrow.

On the list this year is:

Plain: Pork, salt and capsicum
Mild: Above with pepper and garlic
Hot: Above two with chilli
Extra hot: Above three with chilli
Fennel: As it says
Lap Chong: Rice wine, soy, five spice and white pepper.


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## Fents (26/6/11)

i miss that shed!

troy and co are already at it too. with the new squid (kid) ive been pushed for time so instaed of salami i got in on the curing meat side, so far theres beer pork neck (capacollo), pork loin and some lamb just for something different. mostly rolled in salt for 2-4 days, then rolled in pepper mixture, wrapped in muslin cloth then into a net and hung up for approx 1 month depending on size/cut.

think we will try goat and roo soon.


save me some of that salami peels for tradeoffs.


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## Mercs Own (26/6/11)

I stuffed up and missed out making salami last year and I cant believe the time is here again! Unfortunately I am on the road until July 13 - the first thing I will be doing when I get home is ordering lots of pork!

Nice work Peels


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## AUHEAMIC (9/7/11)

2 weeks in since stuffing day. Weather in Dimo has been great for salami. Cold, wet and humid. 

Had a fry up and tasting on stuffing day as you do and the only change I will make next year is the addition of schezuan pepper to the lap cong.


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## Mercs Own (15/7/11)

Peels said:


> 2 weeks in since stuffing day. Weather in Dimo has been great for salami. Cold, wet and humid.
> 
> Had a fry up and tasting on stuffing day as you do and the only change I will make next year is the addition of schezuan pepper to the lap cong.
> View attachment 46966



what casings and size are they??


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## AUHEAMIC (16/7/11)

They are 45mm dried collagen. I get them from the Italian Bunnings on Bell street Preston.


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## Mercs Own (17/7/11)

minced and mixed 15 kilos today - fermenting in the fridge tonight and will stuff and hang tomorrow.

looking forward to it!


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## Ducatiboy stu (17/7/11)

As it is to worm up here to do salami, how would I go cold smoking them....


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## Mercs Own (18/7/11)

Hit a bit of a snag with my salamis and need a bit of advice. Mixed the meat up on Sunday and put it covered in the fridge the garage fridge which doesnt get openned very much during the day. I was going to fill and hang the salami today how ever I got waylaid with various things not to mention a couple of trips to Bunnings to get/exchange/swap dyna bolts etc so that I could secure my salami hanging rack to the garage wall. After an hour and a half of measuring, drilling, exchagning and swearing said rack is now hanging on the wall. The salamis will have to wait until tomorrow to be filled and hang is this a problem??? I suspect not as they are happilyfermenting in the mixing bowl but........thought I would ask.


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## Ducatiboy stu (18/7/11)

I cant see why some extra time would hurt, bit like bread...

Good to see you used the ancient art of swearing to construct the salami hanger. That makes you a qualified tradey now :lol:


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## Thirsty Boy (18/7/11)

Not gonna do anything in the bowl that they wouldn't do in the casings anyway. I wouldn't leave them too long though, i assume the fermentation will go more quickly at higher (non fridge) temps and the drop in pH is a big part of making them stable.

i have casings arriving in the post in the next few days... A smalll batch of some sort of salami is definitely in order.


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## Thirsty Boy (20/7/11)

Peels said:


> They are 45mm dried collagen. I get them from the Italian Bunnings on Bell street Preston.



Peels - given that there doesn't seem to be an actual bunnings on bell street preston - can I assume that that's a euphamism and can i trouble you for the real name of the place? Is it Costante Imports ?


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## Fents (21/7/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Peels - given that there doesn't seem to be an actual bunnings on bell street preston - can I assume that that's a euphamism and can i trouble you for the real name of the place? Is it Costante Imports ?



yes it is, thats the one TB, it where we go as well. they sell everything italian, really good place. get a book called preserving the italian way whilst your there! duck procisutto mmmmmmmm~!


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## Mercs Own (21/7/11)

Finally packed them and hung them. Ive tried a bigun this time also but only the one as it is late in the season and I am concerned about how well it will dry. Thats a kilo of meat in there!


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## DU99 (21/7/11)

Look's good Merc ..now the wait


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## Mercs Own (21/7/11)

DU99 said:


> Look's good Merc ..now the wait



Yep now the wait!!!!

Anyone done a big one like mine??? Love to hear re drying time etc

No nitrates or trites just good old fashioned salt.


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## Ducatiboy stu (21/7/11)

Mercs Own said:


> Anyone done a big one like mine???



There are web sites for that sort of thing...

OOpppp... hold on.... wrong forum.. :lol:


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## Thirsty Boy (21/7/11)

Fents said:


> yes it is, thats the one TB, it where we go as well. they sell everything italian, really good place. get a book called preserving the italian way whilst your there! duck procisutto mmmmmmmm~!



Thanks Fents, might head out for a squizz tomorrow.


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## Mercs Own (23/7/11)

I thought I had done 15 kilos before but when I hung them I ran out of room on my specialised salami hanging rack! Some are touching just a little which is not ideal butu I figure once the start to dry I will move them around so that none touch.

Looking good though and the smell.......you can smell right at the other end of the house - yes even lying in bed, I dont mind it but the wife and daughters arent too crazy about it!


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## DU99 (23/7/11)

:icon_drool2: :icon_drool2: :icon_drool2:


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## Silo Ted (23/7/11)

One day I'll try my hand at salami making. Can you just cure them in a temp controlled fridge, or is fresh air exchange essential ? 

Failing air exchange facilities (I dont have a shed) what are some other ways to cure a sausage for a cold-cuts style of meat? For example can I slow-smoke them in a weber, then vac seal them for long term refrigeration storage? 

I was speaking to an Italian guy earlier this year who my partner works with, and he & his parents, grandparents and siblings still do the old-country family events such as wine, passata & salami making. He gave me a couple of links, but I have to say that the smell & taste were very very strange, not at all like any spice I have ever tried (and I am quite the cook). Not worth risking a serious sickness, I chucked them :icon_vomit:


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## Mercs Own (24/7/11)

Silo Ted said:


> One day I'll try my hand at salami making. Can you just cure them in a temp controlled fridge, or is fresh air exchange essential ?
> 
> Failing air exchange facilities (I dont have a shed) what are some other ways to cure a sausage for a cold-cuts style of meat? For example can I slow-smoke them in a weber, then vac seal them for long term refrigeration storage?
> 
> I was speaking to an Italian guy earlier this year who my partner works with, and he & his parents, grandparents and siblings still do the old-country family events such as wine, passata & salami making. He gave me a couple of links, but I have to say that the smell & taste were very very strange, not at all like any spice I have ever tried (and I am quite the cook). Not worth risking a serious sickness, I chucked them :icon_vomit:


 
You can set up a fridge to do salami but you need to maintain the correct temperature and humidity. Some on on here has done it - cant remember who but if you go back through the posts on this thread you will find out who and how.

I have given people my salami and told them when you taste it if you dont think it is quite right then ditch it - no point persevering with a not quite right salami only to die afterwards.


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## benno1973 (30/7/11)

We ad our sausage making day last weekend. 200kg of pork shoulder arrived at 9:30 and the whole thing was done and dusted by 3:30, which is a bit of a record for us. We made 125 pepper/aniseed and 130 chilli/aniseed. Currently I have them hanging in my fridge with temperature control and a fan for air circulation. Still haven't hooked up my hygrostat (will do one day!), but the humidity is fairly high in there for now, so I'll just monitor it as I go.


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## Mercs Own (7/8/11)

Kaiser Soze said:


> We ad our sausage making day last weekend. 200kg of pork shoulder arrived at 9:30 and the whole thing was done and dusted by 3:30, which is a bit of a record for us. We made 125 pepper/aniseed and 130 chilli/aniseed. Currently I have them hanging in my fridge with temperature control and a fan for air circulation. Still haven't hooked up my hygrostat (will do one day!), but the humidity is fairly high in there for now, so I'll just monitor it as I go.



Must be a bloody big fridge!!!! Show us a pic of that.

Nice work by the way!


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## benno1973 (9/8/11)

Mercs Own said:


> Must be a bloody big fridge!!!! Show us a pic of that.



Hmmm... I wish I had a fridge that big! Actually, I only took about 25 of the sausages and have them in my fridge. The rest are hanging in a few garages around Perth!

I'm on holiday at the moment - not sure what the sausages are doing. Hopefully they're ok. My brother checked on them and said that they had a good fluffy covering of white mould and smelled like cheese. Nice!


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## Thirsty Boy (10/8/11)

Thanks to Peels and Fents pointing me towards constante imports... Love that place. Went nuts and bought all manner of casings and netting and crap.

Got a little excited so i have 5 hungarian salami stuffed and drying, a panectta thats finished curing and has been rolled and drying for a couple of days now, chunks'o'pork for a sort of Coppa that need a few more days in their cure, as does the Breasola - the Lonzino should be ready and tonight I'll stuff it into a casing, net it and hang it to dry.

My modest salami effort





i have decided I want to do this stuff all year round, with small 1-2 item batches - what do people think of using my temp controlled fermentation fridge as the drying chamber... And every time i brew a lager and its set to 9-13C for a month, I simultaneously cure a small batch of salami? I think that the active fermentation should provide enough humidity, especially if i run the CO2 through a blow off tube and it bubbles out through a jar of water.

Comments/Suggestions....


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## benno1973 (10/8/11)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I'm on holiday at the moment - not sure what the sausages are doing. Hopefully they're ok. My brother checked on them and said that they had a good fluffy covering of white mould and smelled like cheese. Nice!



And the moral of my story is... don't go on holidays while your sausages are experimentally hanging in a fridge.

One of the sausages fell onto the fan, which meant that there was no air circulation. And all the other sausages went wet and drippy, and then a few more fell down onto the floor of the fridge. And a heavy coating of mould. And then somehow a fly got in there, which wasn't good news. Anyway, 25 sausages went into the bin today. 

The smells and sights I saw when opening the fridge were not good - kind of like a nice mouldy cheese, except with a slight smell of rancid meat thrown in. Anyways, lesson learned I guess.


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## Mercs Own (11/8/11)

Kaiser Soze said:


> And the moral of my story is... don't go on holidays while your sausages are experimentally hanging in a fridge.
> 
> One of the sausages fell onto the fan, which meant that there was no air circulation. And all the other sausages went wet and drippy, and then a few more fell down onto the floor of the fridge. And a heavy coating of mould. And then somehow a fly got in there, which wasn't good news. Anyway, 25 sausages went into the bin today.
> 
> The smells and sights I saw when opening the fridge were not good - kind of like a nice mouldy cheese, except with a slight smell of rancid meat thrown in. Anyways, lesson learned I guess.



Oh man!!! Feeling for you! I went away for 10 days but my daughter who helped me make the salami kept an eye on them - had to wash them down with wine and water a couple of times as the mould was getting a little tingey. About to cryovac them in a day or two.

Did they all go in the bin?


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## Mercs Own (11/8/11)

3 weeks hanging and I had the first taste today!! Consistency and texture is really good and the taste is excellent!! Time to cryovac 

The big boy will hang for another two or three weeks.


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## benno1973 (11/8/11)

Mercs Own said:


> 3 weeks hanging and I had the first taste today!! Consistency and texture is really good and the taste is excellent!! Time to cryovac



Geez, they look great! Good effort!

All mine went in the bin, but I only took 25 away from the day, so there's still around 230 sausages being dried in a few other locations. So all's not lost, as my neighbour's drying about 100 of them and is a sharing kind of guy. Was a great day anyway, regardless of the outcome!


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## Mercs Own (12/8/11)

86 salamis - 84 cryovaced today (two eaten) and the big one still hanging.


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## kirem (14/8/11)

Local butcher grows a rare breed of pigs, not sure which breed, but they are apparently good for salt/air curing. So a guy I work with and I decided to give a capocollo and a prosciutto a go.

I used 12kg of local Murray River salt, purchased for $6/6kg bag.

The butcher prepared the legs for a prosciutto and all we did was pack them in salt. He removed the bone and vein for us as well, he left the trotters on. Any opinions on if I should fill the bone cavity with salt or not? Given my previous thoughts on nitrite, the butcher convinced me to use some nitrite....... 

The cap is under salt as well. It will be removed from salt after 3 days, washed with red wine, then put in an ox bung and some netting and hung to dry for atleast 6 months

The prosciutto is under salt for 15 days. 2 days per kg, then

Anyone done these before? Any opinions, advice?


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## kirem (14/8/11)

decided to stuff the cavity with salt.


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## ledgenko (14/8/11)

Hey Guys ... Thanks heaps for this thread .. It has made me feel like the ultimate under achiever !!! LOL ... I got into brewing AG about 18 months ago ... have moved from Brisbane to Perth and have started all again .. SWMBO .. has been patient and now will be ever sufferign as I am dead keen on making salami ... The best Thread yet ... 

Very much appreciated !! Thanks Merc ... I am booking in for class in Ingelwood on Air drying salami !! 3 hours = $99 ... and a feed !!! totally pumped !!

Matt


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## Thirsty Boy (15/8/11)

kirem said:


> decided to stuff the cavity with salt.



Better safe than sorry - can only improve the penetration of the salt and nitrites. Will the "gap" in the leg be an issue during drying do you think? Or will it get pressed closed during the curing time?


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## Fents (15/8/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> i have decided I want to do this stuff all year round, with small 1-2 item batches - what do people think of using my temp controlled fermentation fridge as the drying chamber... And every time i brew a lager and its set to 9-13C for a month, I simultaneously cure a small batch of salami? I think that the active fermentation should provide enough humidity, especially if i run the CO2 through a blow off tube and it bubbles out through a jar of water.
> 
> Comments/Suggestions....



i think it might be fine to do, dont forget you need some air movement as well, maybe rig up a PC fan? and im sure i dont need to tell you to make sure your fermenters airtight as the salami's / meat may grown mould?


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## benno1973 (15/8/11)

ledgenko said:


> Hey Guys ... Thanks heaps for this thread .. It has made me feel like the ultimate under achiever !!! LOL ... I got into brewing AG about 18 months ago ... have moved from Brisbane to Perth and have started all again .. SWMBO .. has been patient and now will be ever sufferign as I am dead keen on making salami ... The best Thread yet ...
> 
> Very much appreciated !! Thanks Merc ... I am booking in for class in Ingelwood on Air drying salami !! 3 hours = $99 ... and a feed !!! totally pumped !!
> 
> Matt



Hi Matt,

If that's the Mondo's air dried salami course, then it's great - I've done it twice now, and the tasters alone are worth the course fee!


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## kirem (15/8/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Better safe than sorry - can only improve the penetration of the salt and nitrites. Will the "gap" in the leg be an issue during drying do you think? Or will it get pressed closed during the curing time?



the meat parts get sealed with a lard and herb mix. So I don't think it will be an issue.


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## benno1973 (15/8/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> i have decided I want to do this stuff all year round, with small 1-2 item batches - what do people think of using my temp controlled fermentation fridge as the drying chamber... And every time i brew a lager and its set to 9-13C for a month, I simultaneously cure a small batch of salami? I think that the active fermentation should provide enough humidity, especially if i run the CO2 through a blow off tube and it bubbles out through a jar of water.



Hi TB, just saw this.

Despite my dismal failure with the fridge, I think it would be fine. My sausages were in the fridge before I went away, with a small PC fan circulating the air. The moisture from the sausages was enough to provide a fairly high initial humidity in there, and they took a few days for the skins to start to feel as though they were drying. It was only when the fan stopped circulating that things went horribly wrong.

My suggestions?...

1. Hook up a fan as Fents suggested.
2. Buy a cheap remote wether station with humidity display so you know the humidity in your fridge (without having to open the fridge).
3. Based on the above, you can increase humidity by sitting a bowl of water in the fridge, or by buying a cheap ultrasonic humidifier. Alternatively, you can reduce humidity by sitting a bowl of salt in the fridge, or by buying a cheap dehumidifier
4. Test this in winter with a small batch. If you need to take the sausages out of the fridge to dry, you'd rather do it in winter than the heat of summer.


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## AUHEAMIC (15/8/11)

Mould has been mentioned recently so I thought I would give you my 2 bobs worth. 

From all the research I have done and my limited experience I would say if its white its all right. It adds a subtle but distinctive flavour and aroma which Im sure is different depending on the particular local strain. 

In my local environment the white mould is the first one to appear as very small spots. I have found the best way to promote its growth, thereby making it the dominant strain, is to wipe down each one with a cloth dampened with white vinegar. Make sure you dont rinse the cloth and go back over the first few you started on. This may need to be done 2-3 times over the drying stage. 




When I pack them I wipe most of the mould off with vinegar. The only reason for this is cosmetic. Next year I will pack a couple with the mould on as an experiment.


And so the journey continues.

Thanks again Merc for the inspiration


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## Thirsty Boy (15/8/11)

Thanks Fents/KS - your suggestions mesh pretty closely with my plans, so i am happy that I'm on roughly the right track. I'm OK with a bit of trial and error too - one of the reasons I want to be able to make all year round in small batches is so that I can try new techniques and recipes, but only have 1 or 2 items per batch, then if it all goes horribly wrong, its just a matter of chuck em in the bin and have another go rather than losing a whole season's production.

Speaking of a whole seasons production - this is all the stuff I have made thhis year, the last just got stuffed and hung to dry today, so hopefully things dont warm up too much before they are ready. My Salamis are startingto get the nice white mould too and i have been encourgaing it to transfer to both the less mouldy salamis and the other small goods by the simple act of fondling them with clean hands and repeating with the target meat.

L to R we have Hungarian Salamis, Lonzino, Pancetta, Coppa, Breasola.





Salamis look like they will be ready in a week or so, still just the tiniest bit of squish to them. The Pancetta is probably ready to go any day now.

And its all your bloody fault Merc. You made it look so easy I had to have a go and now I have a cupboard full of hanging meat... Thanks

TB


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## Mercs Own (16/8/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Thanks Fents/KS - your suggestions mesh pretty closely with my plans, so i am happy that I'm on roughly the right track. I'm OK with a bit of trial and error too - one of the reasons I want to be able to make all year round in small batches is so that I can try new techniques and recipes, but only have 1 or 2 items per batch, then if it all goes horribly wrong, its just a matter of chuck em in the bin and have another go rather than losing a whole season's production.
> 
> Speaking of a whole seasons production - this is all the stuff I have made thhis year, the last just got stuffed and hung to dry today, so hopefully things dont warm up too much before they are ready. My Salamis are startingto get the nice white mould too and i have been encourgaing it to transfer to both the less mouldy salamis and the other small goods by the simple act of fondling them with clean hands and repeating with the target meat.
> 
> ...



sorry about that guys - I have three daughters who are very happy that I make salami and I love the idea that either they or their husbands on pain of death or withheld .....things... like dishes or vacuuming maybe they better bloody well make salami. It is addictive, fun, nourishing and some how completes one in an esoteric kinda way. 

May we all find the wog within.


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## ledgenko (17/8/11)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Hi Matt,
> 
> If that's the Mondo's air dried salami course, then it's great - I've done it twice now, and the tasters alone are worth the course fee!



Kaiser ... i tought it sounded pretty good but now more excited ... saw your posts and would love to join the fun next time you decide to crack out a couple of hundred salami's ... i am on the north side but i will get to where ever it is u make the sausage .. wife will pick me up and i will def bring a keg of my finest !!!!!!!


matt
:icon_chickcheers: :icon_chickcheers: :icon_chickcheers: :icon_chickcheers:


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## ledgenko (17/8/11)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Hi Matt,
> 
> If that's the Mondo's air dried salami course, then it's great - I've done it twice now, and the tasters alone are worth the course fee!



Kaiser ... i tought it sounded pretty good but now more excited ... saw your posts and would love to join the fun next time you decide to crack out a couple of hundred salami's ... i am on the north side but i will get to where ever it is u make the sausage .. wife will pick me up and i will def bring a keg of my finest !!!!!!!


matt

:icon_chickcheers: :icon_chickcheers: :icon_chickcheers:


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## benno1973 (18/8/11)

ledgenko said:


> Kaiser ... i tought it sounded pretty good but now more excited ... saw your posts and would love to join the fun next time you decide to crack out a couple of hundred salami's ... i am on the north side but i will get to where ever it is u make the sausage .. wife will pick me up and i will def bring a keg of my finest !!!!!!!



G'day Matt! Enthusiastic participants are always welcome. We do Salami day in Bayswater, but unfortunately only once a year, which is why we tend to churn out about 200 of them, so it lasts us through the 12 months. Having said that, the experiment with the fridge was so we could do some small batches year round.

I'll keep you in the loop if we do something...

Cheers, Ben


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## ledgenko (23/8/11)

Ben , 

Cheers ... that would be awesome ... 

Matt


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## kirem (23/8/11)

capicola went into the bung and netting tonight.

The bungs stink to high heaven


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## Mercs Own (23/8/11)

kirem said:


> capicola went into the bung and netting tonight.
> 
> The bungs stink to high heaven



Seems a little late in the season?? Any pics


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## kirem (24/8/11)

Mercs Own said:


> Seems a little late in the season?? Any pics



yeah I know, events conspired. I am very keen to make temperature and humidity controlled cool room, so I can do this all year round.

but for this one, I'll hang it in the laundry  until the missus finds it.

I'll take a picture of it tonight. I'll also take a picture of the prosciutto, although it won't be much more than black box with a large mound of salt in it


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## Thirsty Boy (24/8/11)

Been finding with my "chunks of muscle" curing, that i am getting a little blue fuzzy mould growing at the points where string/netting meets meat. More so towards the bottom of the hanging piece of meat. i am assuming that this is because directly at the string meat interface is a moister micro climate, same with the bottom of the chunk being a little bit wetter than the top.
s
i suspect its because there's not enough airflow in the space where I am drying them, something i will rectify for future efforts. I also thought that it might be an idea to dampen the string/net in some vinegar before applying it, that way the pH in the small area where they touch would be a bit lower, discouraging mould growth.

What do you more experienced makers think - Will it be enough just to make sure of the airflow and humidity? Will the vinegar help? Will it hurt?

Cheers TB


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## kirem (25/8/11)

Mercs Own said:


> Seems a little late in the season?? Any pics



View attachment 47844


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## Mercs Own (26/8/11)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Been finding with my "chunks of muscle" curing, that i am getting a little blue fuzzy mould growing at the points where string/netting meets meat. More so towards the bottom of the hanging piece of meat. i am assuming that this is because directly at the string meat interface is a moister micro climate, same with the bottom of the chunk being a little bit wetter than the top.
> s
> i suspect its because there's not enough airflow in the space where I am drying them, something i will rectify for future efforts. I also thought that it might be an idea to dampen the string/net in some vinegar before applying it, that way the pH in the small area where they touch would be a bit lower, discouraging mould growth.
> 
> ...



Blue fuzzy mould not good - vinegar wont hurt. Spray and wipe and repeat as necessary - if mould persists start to worry. I had lots of white mould on my salamis and wiped them down with a spray of red wine and water. I had some slightly darker mould on "the big one" sprayed and scrubbed that but it was all surface mould on the skin. 

I would be calling the shop where you got the netting and ask the question re the skin/meat meeting of the moulds.

Let us know what you find out.


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## Mercs Own (13/10/11)

Sad to inform anyone that remembers or may share in my dissapointment the bigun or the big salami I made this year - about 1 1/2 kilos didnt make it!! It had an air pocket through the centre so the meat didnt dry properly etc. I had it hanging in my local DOCS deli for the last month at a steady 14 degrees hoping that the last of it would dry up but it didnt. I knew something was wrong with it as you could feel the give in it like it was slightly hollow in the middle - oh well, there is always next year! Vince from DOCS reckons it wasnt packed tight enough which it obviously wasnt although when I stuffed it I thought it was. Cant wait till next year as I will try again and this time stuff the little mother like I have never stuffed before.

At least I have 75 of my smaller salami's in the fridge! Soon to be 74.


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## MaestroMatt (13/10/11)

How is it I have only today discovered this gift of a topic?!?!?!?!? I think my wog sense has diminished since moving to the country.

Genius!

Merc - looking back over the thread, I actually had a good chuckle when I saw the 'big boy' that you made. It's looked like the Godzilla of all salami. Sad to hear it didn't pull through. Definitely have another go - will be following with interest!


Now if you'll excuse me......I have the biggest craving for a Salami sanga right now....


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## Mercs Own (17/10/11)

Have a read of this - it is about setting up your own curing chamber.

http://curedmeats.blogspot.com/2007/07/key...ng-chamber.html


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## benno1973 (24/10/11)

I find this article interesting. For a while now, I've been getting bits and pieces together to set up a curing chamber. All the literature that I read seems to suggest that the air will be too dry in a frost-free fridge, and I guess there's definitely circumstances where that will be the case. However, every year when I've hung my suasages in the curing fridge, the RH shoots up to 95%, mostly from the moisture coming out of the sausages. So much so that I have to crack the fridge a bit to release some of the humidity and drop it down. 

This high humidity lasts for some time, much longer than I would want it to if I'm drying/curing the sausages. Admittedly, I generally have 20-30 sausages hanging in there, which probably counteracts the dryness quite considerably.

When I finally pull my finger out, I'm going to hook up a dry side (dehumidifier) and a wet side (humidifier) to my hygrostat. I just recently bought one of these on ebay, so the price for hygrastats is definitely coming down these days...


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## Mercs Own (10/11/11)

Just a catch up re my salamis - they are bloody delicious! Had one for lunch today on fresh crusty bread!!!

The big one I made unfortunately didnt make it. I hung it in the garage for about a month and a half and then gave it to a friend of mine who hang it in his salami fridge at Doc's Mornington for two months. I was always worried about the big boy as it felt like it was a little soft in the middle (still talking about salami here) so after all that time hanging in a controlled environment we cut it open to find that it had a bit of an air pocket running right through the centre! It was dead and it was binned! Bummer!! Next time I will make sure it is really well stuffed.


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## Margrethe (12/11/11)

i've made friends with our butcher, who makes his own stuff at home, so I am wanting to give some salami a go. With HWMBO working at jaycar, getting the elements to create a great salami/meat cupboard are at hand, so all going well I'll be giving some a go once we've got it made. 

I love that on a beer forum I can learn about meat curing and a plethora of other awesome food ideas!


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## Mercs Own (29/11/11)

We will wants photos of the cupboard construction and of course a step by step intruction sheet so we can make one after learning from you!!


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## ledgenko (23/12/11)

Merc and others ... I have been making Biltong (from QLD KEVS design 'ish) ... in a plastic trunk with rods attached and a computer fan ... now I am starting to think that this same machine might just be the key you are looking for ... this takes about 5 - 7 days to dry out the Biltong so I would imagine that a month and your salami will be awesome .... 


Kaiser ... let me know when you are doing your next batch and I will create a LARGE version of the machine I have and give it a red hot go .. who knows we might have hit the nail on the head here .. and u get to watch it as it dries ... 

I will try and post a pic tomorrow ... 


HAVE A GREAT XMAS ..

Matt and the Pavlenko family...


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## benno1973 (24/12/11)

ledgenko said:


> Merc and others ... I have been making Biltong (from QLD KEVS design 'ish) ... in a plastic trunk with rods attached and a computer fan ... now I am starting to think that this same machine might just be the key you are looking for ... this takes about 5 - 7 days to dry out the Biltong so I would imagine that a month and your salami will be awesome ....
> 
> 
> Kaiser ... let me know when you are doing your next batch and I will create a LARGE version of the machine I have and give it a red hot go .. who knows we might have hit the nail on the head here .. and u get to watch it as it dries ...
> ...



Hey Matt,

I have you in mind for our next batch! Sometime in the coldest part of June, generally...

I got an old fridge and just wired up a humidity controller the other day. That, in conjunction with a temp controller and computer fan, should make a pretty good fermenting/curing chamber. I'd be interested in trying yours side by side with it! Last year, my curing fridge destroyed all my salamis, while my neighbour (who hung his in the garage) came up trumps, so it can sometimes be the less technical method that does the best job. 

Can you post a photo so I can see what yours is like?


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## ledgenko (31/1/12)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Hey Matt,
> 
> I have you in mind for our next batch! Sometime in the coldest part of June, generally...
> 
> ...



Hey Kaiser ... 

Yes I have been slack ... Pic up tomorrow night ... I forgot all about posting it up .. I am working on getting the Biltong recipe right .. Sister spent 9 yrs living in RSA ... my chilli version using Roasted Thai chilli for some reason did not cut it ...  ... 

But the machine .. hell yeah .. I will pic it , load it .... but remember it is the Biltong version .. I am thinking a Toy plastic bin (kinda like the council bin ) but smaller .. a large fan unit (120mm computer fan - 240v) on top and air holes at the bottom ... 60watt globe at the bottom = heat ...


I am thinking of becoming inventive this week end ... I am a bit confident , however it may dry the outside out too quick ?? 

Open to suggestions on this ... 


Matt

Matt


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## ledgenko (31/1/12)

Ben ... I have been thinking about this for a while .. can u tell me whether the fridge you plan to use is a working fridge with a temp controller on it or is it a carcass of a fridge with a humidifier in side ... or ??? I am really interested !!!

I am also interested to know if your salamis got a coating of white mould like has been discussed on page 18 I think ...maybe 19 ... 

cheers 

Matt


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## benno1973 (31/1/12)

Hey Matt,

It's a working fridge with a temp controller. I'm currently testing it out with some pork bellies/pancetta and they are coming out nicely, so it's all working well. Next I will do a batch of italian salamis and see how they go. If it can handle them in the heat of summer, I'll be happy that it can do it any time of the year.

All my past sausage efforts had a white mould coating. I hung a good quality mouldy italian salami in the fridge with them to encourage it!


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## ledgenko (31/1/12)

Ben .... I want to learn this stuff .... awesome ... stunned ... and really very interested !!!! 


Could you pop up some pics of the fridge system ???

Cheers 

Matt


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## ledgenko (1/2/12)

Ben ... thins is my Biltong machine ... I made it pretty simply through using QLD Kevs instructions .. pure genius the boy is !!!



Anyway , I am thinking that using nothing other than a larger fan (see 120mm 240v) and a 56 lt kids toy bin with some drilled in holes at the base and a few pieces of dowel to hold the salami via strings... it should work a treat ... no flies enter .... its dark, secured and dries meat evenly in the case of biltong anyway and salami should work too ... see Hypothesis 2012 by me .. ... I could see it worth a try ... I will give it a go anyway .. using chorizo ... as I do like dry chorizo .... I am thinking a bit of kitty litter or news paper at the bottom might be good to sop up the oil ???


Thoughts ??? Considerations ??? 


Note that this machine is not too big however the bins I am thinking of is about a meter high which would / could allow for a light globe if you needed heat .... I am not sure how it would go with a humidifier ....


Matt


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## benno1973 (1/2/12)

Hi Matt,

Looks good! I am still to take a picture of mine but a few comments on yours...

Rather than a light globe, it might be better to buy a ceramic reptile heater as they don't put out any light, and they are pretty cheap. I have a couple for a dehydrator project that I'm still yet to start, but they are 200W or something like that, so might be a bit big for your needs. I'd also wonder about adding heat to a plastic container, but maybe I'm being overly nervous?...

A heat source wouldn't be needed with chorizo or salami or anything like that - you'd be wanting to keep it as cool as possible. Below 15C is ideal.

Rather than a humidifier, you could use just a bowl with salt water in it, and an adjustable lid that would allow you to open it/close it as required to increase/decrease humidity. Otherwise, I bought a small cheap humidifier from a chinese online store. It uses PET bottles as the water source so it allows you to use small bottles to reduce the height and it has a really small footprint. I'll take a photo of it in my fridge.

The other thing you'd need is airflow, although I've found that a PC fan on full bore is too much for dry curing things. You tend to get a crusty outer which doesn't allow the inside to dry properly. I've since ordered a 12V 8A LED dimmer (similar to those used on stir plates) so I can control the air flow.

Will try to post some pics of my setup later. In the meantime, I find http://forum.sausagemaking.org/index.php a really useful forum full of great information.


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## benno1973 (1/2/12)

Ok, so here's some pictures of my dry curing chamber, and a bit of a step by step on what I used. First off, please excuse the state of my shed - it's due for a tidy this weekend! <_< 

So here's my fridge, kindly donated by my mother-in-law. It's not huge, but it's certainly big enough for dry curing, and it doesn't have a freezer section which is a bonus. 




On top of the fridge are an old style temp controller (bought on gumtree for $10) and a hygrostat from ebay. The hygrostat was around $40 from memory. It came with a really bad wiring diagram that was different to what was shown on the device itself, but if you've ever wired a STC-1000, you'd be familiar with the concepts. It's essentially a single relay, normally closed to dehumidify, but when the sensor goes below a set point it changes to humidify. Simple really. Still, I had the wiring checked by a sparky friend before I plugged it in.

If anyone does want to wire one up, I'm happy to pull mine apart to show you my wiring and setup.

Similar to the STC-1000, it has 2 extension leads coming out of it, one for the humidifier and one for the dehumidifier. It also has a humidity probe that hangs in the fridge.




Inside the fridge, I have a PC fan for circulation (as yet I'm still to add speed control to the fan, so it currently goes flat out), an ultrasonic humidifier and a dehumidifier. 

The ultrasonic humidifier was from DealsDirect and was delivered for around $30. It really is tiny, and it takes a PET bottle, which means that you can tailor how big it is. Currently I use a 750ml brown beer PET and it lasts about 2 days, but is space wasn't an issue, you could use a large 2L coke bottle and it'd last a lot longer. If space was tight, you could get away with a poptop juice container.

The dehumidifier was donated from my brother. Dehumidifiers aren't cheap, they're generally around $100, so I was lucky to have one donated to the project. Still, sometimes I wonder whether you even need one. Hanging wet meat in a fridge does tend to increase humidity, but in summer, the fridge turning on automatically drops the humidity anyway. In winter, it might be better to simply put a dehumidifying sachet in the fridge if required, or just a bowl of salt? It'd take a bit more trial and error. 

Note that the black bits on the floor are pepper and chilli from the pancetta hanging above!




And finally a shot of some pancetta dry curing in the fridge. It's coated in pepper and chilli to keep the flies away (if they were somehow able to get into my fridge). These two have been hanging for just over a week now. A third one dried out quicker and has been taken down - tasting delicious!!


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## keezawitch (1/2/12)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Ok, so here's some pictures of my dry curing chamber, and a bit of a step by step on what I used. First off, please excuse the state of my shed - it's due for a tidy this weekend! <_<
> 
> So here's my fridge, kindly donated by my mother-in-law. It's not huge, but it's certainly big enough for dry curing, and it doesn't have a freezer section which is a bonus.
> 
> ...



absolutely fantastic, do you think this type of set-up would work for curing cheese, I have been trying to work out how to make a "cave" so i can progress onto hard cheeses


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## ledgenko (1/2/12)

Ben .. wow .. a sweet deal ... I free in concept with the use of plastic for heating ... my store room where I do most of my fermenting is normally around the 20 degree mark and it takes about 5 - 7 days to dry the beef rump right out.. although I start tasting it around day 3 or 4 ... I love it !!! I am thinking you are correct in as far as the dehumidifier goes and I will give a few chorizos a go in the biltong machine first as well as a few csabi just to see how they go... I love salami ... soft or firm ... but I do love a bit of meat you can sink your teeth into !!!! mmmmm ... Meat !!! 


Looks like I might just have to keep an eye out for a working fridge ... I don't think this is something the Boss has considered just yet ...  


Cheers 

Matt


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## ledgenko (1/2/12)

Oh ... I think instead of using a bowl of salt .. there is a product called Thirsty camel which captures any moisture in the air that is designed to be used in your wardrobe ... might be a solution for the dehumidifier ??


Cheers


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## benno1973 (2/2/12)

keezawitch said:


> absolutely fantastic, do you think this type of set-up would work for curing cheese, I have been trying to work out how to make a "cave" so i can progress onto hard cheeses



I'd say definitely. I have considered using it as a cheese cave, but I don't produce that much at a time. At the moment only soft cheeses that don't require aging like feta and haloumi. However I am trying to do a cheddar this weekend, and I have a small wine fridge that holds good temps. I'll have to fudge the humidity thing with a bowl of water I think. But yes, this setup would work perfectly, if it wasn't full of drying meat!!



ledgenko said:


> Oh ... I think instead of using a bowl of salt .. there is a product called Thirsty camel which captures any moisture in the air that is designed to be used in your wardrobe ... might be a solution for the dehumidifier ??
> 
> 
> Cheers



I like the look of these silica gel units. Pretty cheap, and you can re-dry them in the oven!


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## keezawitch (2/2/12)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I'd say definitely. I have considered using it as a cheese cave, but I don't produce that much at a time. At the moment only soft cheeses that don't require aging like feta and haloumi. However I am trying to do a cheddar this weekend, and I have a small wine fridge that holds good temps. I'll have to fudge the humidity thing with a bowl of water I think. But yes, this setup would work perfectly, if it wasn't full of drying meat!!
> 
> 
> 
> I like the look of these silica gel units. Pretty cheap, and you can re-dry them in the oven!



on the cheesemaking forum they just use a spray bottle and give a light mist, it seems most of them use an esky set up, but i have a small bar fridge i want to use unless I can score a lger free one. I try to make a few cheeses a week to use up the excess milk from my goat, mainly a variation of maltese, soft, cottage and quark but they arent getting eaten fast enough that is why i want to have a go at hard cheese. A wine fridge might also be better for me and you can pick them up at a good price thanks for the ideas


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## benno1973 (2/2/12)

keezawitch said:


> on the cheesemaking forum they just use a spray bottle and give a light mist, it seems most of them use an esky set up, but i have a small bar fridge i want to use unless I can score a lger free one. I try to make a few cheeses a week to use up the excess milk from my goat, mainly a variation of maltese, soft, cottage and quark but they arent getting eaten fast enough that is why i want to have a go at hard cheese. A wine fridge might also be better for me and you can pick them up at a good price thanks for the ideas



Well you're very lucky to have fresh goats milk, and cheesemaking is the perfect way to use it up! If you do decide to go down the route of wiring up the humidity controller, let me know and I'll happily take a photo of my wiring so you can compare. In the meantime, make sure you have a read of the cheese thread, and post some pictures of your results!!


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## keezawitch (2/2/12)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Well you're very lucky to have fresh goats milk, and cheesemaking is the perfect way to use it up! If you do decide to go down the route of wiring up the humidity controller, let me know and I'll happily take a photo of my wiring so you can compare. In the meantime, make sure you have a read of the cheese thread, and post some pictures of your results!!



yeh i am lucky to have a nice dairy goat, slowly working on a small herd, got my full blood saanen girl i am milking and a nice little boy also a xbreed girl so hope to have the start of herd in 6-7 mths, looking for another girl in milk, i find milking them relaxing, and fresh milk is nice. back to cheese there is a thread on here? i will have to look, i also check out a cheeseforum and it is informative. As for posting pics i am hopeless at that but will try when i am happy with the look of cheeses, My son is interested in the salami/smoking thing and bow hunts so hopefully we will have some venison to play with this season. I plan to show him your set up, he is in the air-con trade so I think he will understand it and fingers crossed may help out.


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## Ces (7/2/12)

hey sausage friends,

great thread! i've been making fresh sausages for awhile but want to get int fermented/dry cured sausages. My only option for a curing room is a converted fridge due to space/pet/partner issues. 

However i am not confident at all in wiring up anything and wondered if anyone had managed to find a releativley cheap hygrometer/humidity controller that will just plug in to a humidifier and will not require plug converters etc because they are shipped from overseas?


appreciate the help guys.


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## benno1973 (7/2/12)

I had a decent look around when I was looking to wire mine up, but humidity controllers are insanely expensive. There's this one for $130, but it's a bit unclear as to whether it powers the humidifier based on the humidity reading or a timer. Otherwise you're looking at $330 for this unit, but again I don't think you can control a dehumidifier at the same time.

Ultimately, it might be cheaper to buy one of the $30 units and arrange a sparky to wire it up for you. Where are you located BTW?


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## Ces (8/2/12)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I had a decent look around when I was looking to wire mine up, but humidity controllers are insanely expensive. There's this one for $130, but it's a bit unclear as to whether it powers the humidifier based on the humidity reading or a timer. Otherwise you're looking at $330 for this unit, but again I don't think you can control a dehumidifier at the same time.
> 
> Ultimately, it might be cheaper to buy one of the $30 units and arrange a sparky to wire it up for you. Where are you located BTW?




thanks for the links. you're right its not clear about the type of control the unit provides. sparky may be the way to go.
i'm in the mascot area of sydney. all the way across the desert mate.


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## Tommu-Hiid (9/2/12)

I have no idea if this is a good price or not but just came across this:

Aroma Diffuser & Humidifier $35


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## Mercs Own (23/6/12)

It's that time of year again - yep salami time!!!! I am sure you guys are either making or planning on making your salami pretty soon. I am planning on doing mine in a week or two but did start the season out by making my first pancetta and am currently curing a pork neck for my first go at Coppa. Thought I would post a couple of pics


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## bradsbrew (23/6/12)

Timely post Paul. I am just reading up on cured meats and will be having a crack at Salami in the next few weeks, would like to make my own mettwurst. This thread is a cracker and thanks for sharing.

Cheers


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## Thirsty Boy (23/6/12)

Salamis and chorizos already up and drying - meat in the fridge for a try at a traditional christmas style ham, a few small experimental air dried hams, pancetta and breasola. I'll be putting them on to cure as soon as i buy a new pack of bags for my vac sealer on monday. Probably going to do a few all beef pepperoni as well.

Merc - you'll love the homemade pancetta. Easy peasy and they taste fantastic

This years sausage crop 8 chorizo and 18 Salami - i'm giving them a daily mist with a sprayer filled with red wine plus a teaspoon of good quality liquid smoke. Should stop em drying out too fast, minimise the white surface mould and make em taste of smoke and red wine..... that cant be a bad thing.






I'm still too cautious to do the "just salt" thing - so mine have both a lactic culture and nitrites in em.


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## BigDaddy (24/6/12)

I'm doing 30kg salsici calabrese next W/E - do it every year. Done so for practically 30yrs. (we r of Italian extraction)

@Thirsty Boy - you will be fine with 'just salt' - the key is to make sure u hang them in the right place at the right time. The time of year is right now.....just make sure there is no air movement/drafts and they will dry slowly which is what you want. 

We always give them a light wash/rub down by hand once a week with red wine vinegar - that stops any probs with mould on the outside. 

It is great to see people doing this - keep it up. It's a good day's work/fun for the whole family!


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## benno1973 (24/6/12)

We're running late this year, haven't even set up a date. It's heading into the perfect time here in Perth, temps nearing 1C overnight, so we really should get our fingers out.

We also do no nitrates (just salt), but I find it important to make sure that there's a small amount of circulation of air, no huge draft. I have a computer fan just turning over in my curing fridge to make sure that the air is circulated.


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## manticle (24/6/12)

Thirsty Boy said:


> Merc - you'll love the homemade pancetta. Easy peasy and they taste fantastic



I've done the pancetta thing a few times and getting ready to chuck a couple up in the next few weeks. Did a few 'traditional' carbonaras using eggs from hens we know (not ours), homemade pancetta, home grown parsley and home made fettucine. 

Problem with this stuff is you spend a bit on large good cuts of pork and eat the lot within about a week. Lucky I'm skinny.

Aiming to knock out my first batch of salamis this year. Really keen to do the just salt thing but until I've got a handle on the process, I will use some nitrate/nitrite cures. Pancetta, bacon and cooked sausage don't need anything of the sort but I want to be confident that the salami can be given to friends and family without incident.

Very interested to hear about methods and recipes for salt only from people that do it this way though - PMs are fine if you want to avoid the occasional controversy that seems to go with no added nitrite homemade botulism suggestions.


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## Thirsty Boy (25/6/12)

BigDaddy said:


> @Thirsty Boy - you will be fine with 'just salt' - the key is to make sure u hang them in the right place at the right time. The time of year is right now.....just make sure there is no air movement/drafts and they will dry slowly which is what you want.



yeah - people keep telling me that. "people have been making salami with just salt for thousands of years...." etc etc. But then again, Botulism translates as "sausage disease"(or something like that) - so I'm guessing that people have been poisoning each other with incorrectly made salami for thousands of years too.

I think I'll stick with a couple of teaspons of safety until I am much much more experienced and sure of what I am doing. Better safe, than killing my whole family with a dodgey charcuterie platter at christmas (although if they dont up the ante on the presents sometime soon........)

I wish i had a family tradition of this sort of stuff - i love it and it would have been great to grow up in a house where it was just a normal thing to do. I'm only discovering the joys in my 40's - so little time left and so many different sorts of salami to eat


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## Fents (25/6/12)

First 10KG batch went down a week ago, maybe a little bit early as there was one 18c day there with sun! have checked them though and they are looking fine. Just salt no cure (you will be fine thirsty!)






Also laid down some duck breast's to cure, worked good last year, duck pancetta of sorts!

Pork necks for coppa this weekend!


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## benno1973 (25/6/12)

Thirsty Boy said:


> I think I'll stick with a couple of teaspons of safety until I am much much more experienced and sure of what I am doing. Better safe, than killing my whole family with a dodgey charcuterie platter at christmas (although if they dont up the ante on the presents sometime soon........)



You're absolutely right. Nothing wrong with a bit of nitrate/nitrite in my opinion, and until you understand the process and why you're doing what you're doing, it's a safer way as long as you are certain about the correct amounts of pink salt etc. They do affect flavour and colour of the finished product however, so it's interesting to try the difference. Certainly whole cuts of meat (pancetta, bacon, etc) don't need nitrates, but the nitrates can make bacon taste a bit more like bacon!


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## Mercs Own (25/6/12)

I have only done the salt way and never had a problem. If I cut a salami and I am not sure about it I bin it. If that happens it is normally because there was an airpocket and a rancid smell etc. The accepted safe version is 28 g of sea salt per kilo of meat ( never use iodised salt) Every one talks about safety etc but the last salami that killed someone was commercialy made and full of nitrites and nitrates....Just saying - each to there own.

Manticle whats your pancetta recipe? I rubbed mine with all the usual stuff but flavoured it up with Tasmanian pepper berries instead of juniper. Also how long do you normally hang yours?

I did a 15 kilo batch of salami last year and still have quite a few left over so this year I reckon I will do two 7 kilo batches one pork and fennel the other a pork red wine and garlic. Cant wait.


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## BigDaddy (25/6/12)

Thirsty Boy said:


> yeah - people keep telling me that. "people have been making salami with just salt for thousands of years...." etc etc. But then again, Botulism translates as "sausage disease"(or something like that) - so I'm guessing that people have been poisoning each other with incorrectly made salami for thousands of years too.
> 
> I think I'll stick with a couple of teaspons of safety until I am much much more experienced and sure of what I am doing. Better safe, than killing my whole family with a dodgey charcuterie platter at christmas (although if they dont up the ante on the presents sometime soon........)
> 
> I wish i had a family tradition of this sort of stuff - i love it and it would have been great to grow up in a house where it was just a normal thing to do. I'm only discovering the joys in my 40's - so little time left and so many different sorts of salami to eat



Good on ya - you cant start your own tradition now!

FWIW - I go with 25gms salt (not iodised) per kilo of meat mix it thru - I then taste it and go from there. I've gone as high as 30gms per kilo depending on the pork and how it tastes. U must taste it and add make any changes from there - I taste it raw & also fry a small piece

For our style of salami (Calabrian) we also add fennel seeds (~1.5gm/kg) & plenty of paprika (25gm/kg). U also add chilli at the rate of 1-2gm/kg depending on how hot u want them. You mix everything up and knead the hell out of it until it becomes sticky. Then leave it for 2-3hrs for the flavours to amalgamate and fill the bungs from there.

These are Calabrian style that my family who came to Australia in 1951 have been doing for years. I have only just returned to making them again after a 10yr break following the death of my grandparents - i have many fantastic memories of whole process (including the wonderful smells) especially as a kid & I want my son to have the same experience. Back then we would kill the pig and have it hanging from railway irons built into the shed walls. We'd make everything from prociutto, lardo, pancetta, cappocollo and then the salamis - they'd also make soap from the left over fat by mixing it with caustic soda. That is a smell u wont forget!

I have all the gear we used way back then including my nonno's (grandpa) knives, mincers etc so they will continue to be used for a long time still. If u get everone into it, its a great day.

We are doing ours this Saturday (30kg).


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## manticle (25/6/12)

Mercs Own said:


> Manticle whats your pancetta recipe? I rubbed mine with all the usual stuff but flavoured it up with Tasmanian pepper berries instead of juniper. Also how long do you normally hang yours?



It's a bit like my beer recipes - Slightly tweaked each time. I write down my beer recipes but not yet my smallgoods recipes.

However it is based on the pancetta in the Ruhlman charcuterie book but a bit simpler from memory.

Essentially coat a good hunk of fatty pork belly completely in salt using decent quality salt for about a week, covered with glad and placed in the fridge. Loads of black pepper, garlic and a portion of Tasmanian pepperberry. I used juniper too though. Quite probably some fresh herbs (thyme and oregano) but I can't remember exactly as it's last year I did it.

Check the salt level/cure level by rinsing first then slicing 2 small portions and eating 1 raw and cooking the other (own risk with eating raw - I'm happy to take it but not happy to get sued if somehow a bug makes its way through 7-8 days of salt and into your tummy). Cooked will always be more salty than raw so use that to find preferred balance. If too salty, soak in cold water for thirty minutes and repeat. If not salty or cured enough, whack more salt on and give a couple of days extra, covered in fridge and repeat.

Once the meat is cured and at the right salt level, rinse, dry it off very well, rub with whole garlic and coat in black pepper (and juniper and/or pepperberry) on the inside, then cover in muslin and hang for around 3 weeks in low humidity, cool temps (as per all the other bits - mine just hangs from a washing line under shelter during winter.

Skin will harden and become rind like and whole thing will toughen. Amazing and well easy to do (realise you've probably done loads more than me Merc - the 'tutorial/recipe is as much for anyone else interested as to answer your QU but hopefully it does that also.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/12)

manticle said:


> It's a bit like my beer recipes - Slightly tweaked each time. I write down my beer recipes but not yet my smallgoods recipes.
> 
> However it is based on the pancetta in the Ruhlman charcuterie book but a bit simpler from memory.
> 
> ...



Heres the thing I am concerned about with my pancetta - I only used 1/4 cup of salt (along with all the other flavourings) - in all the literature I found that was the oft recommended amount, Ruhlman included. Is this enough to cure it?? My copacola used 1/2 cup of salt.

The pancetta is still hanging - almost four weeks now - I will be cutting it down and having a taste tomorow or Sat but must admit to being a little concerned.


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## manticle (12/7/12)

Ruhlman's recipe works. More recent times I've made it, I've just coated the surfaces in salt, laid in a bed of salt, covered and in the fridge so less accurate (but likely more rather than less salt) I also tried wet curing which worked OK.

Did you try the taste test after rinsing the salt off? That should give you an idea if the meat is cured enough and if the salt level is too high/too low.


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## benno1973 (12/7/12)

I use salt as a percentage of meat+fat weight, same as for salamis, generally around 2-3%. So for a 1kg piece of belly, that's only around 25g of salt, which sounds like way less than 1/4 cup. I leave it to cure around a week or just over and then hang for a few weeks. I've used recipes from Vince gareffa (Mondo di Carne here in Perth) and Jason Molinari (check out his Cured Meats page), and both recommend salt by weight of meat.

Again, I'd suggest that I'm using less than 1/4 cup. From memory, a tblsp of my salt was around 20g or just under. That's from memory though, so I could be way off...


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## Thirsty Boy (13/7/12)

Almost all my salamis (except the big ones) are ready or aout to be ready to eat.

I made some more, all beef pepperonis (the brown ones) and some saucisson sec.





I also cured a bunch of small shoulder peices for dry cured/air dried hams, a bresaola (red wine brine cure), a pancetta and a regular old ham ham for sandwiches (wet cure and hot smoking)





now the salamis are nearly dry, I'll have room to hang the hams etc.

Pics of finished salamis in a week or so.

TB


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## benno1973 (14/7/12)

Wow, you're prolific TB! They look fantastic, I'm sure that your kitchen smells awesome with all those salamis drying (if that's where they dry)...


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## Thirsty Boy (16/7/12)

They hang in a storage cupboard out the back door of our unit - my first year of salami hung in our front hallway... but unfortunately swmbo does not share your opinion of drying salamis smelling 'awesome'. She did not officially complain, however I decided it would be prudent to come up with another solution before she did.

All salamis but the big pepperioni are down, delicious and vac sealed. Hams up to dry when I get home form work.


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## scon (10/6/13)

Do people have a source locally for Sodium Nitrate/Pink Salt? I got some Kwik Urit from the local butcher but it's not labelled with how much to use etc so i'd rather just buy a full pack myself.

I want to hang and cure some salamis is why I'm asking.


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## brettprevans (10/6/13)

Adding a localation may help know what u mean by local supplier.
A lot of guys on here specifically make their own so they dont need to use nitrates. Lots of info in this thread if you care to read it. Brendo are I are stuffing salami tomorrow or wednesday. Sausage casings so its not as thick and allows for meat to breath, no preservatives etc. Will be beautiful.


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## QldKev (10/6/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> Adding a localation may help know what u mean by local supplier.
> A lot of guys on here specifically make their own so they dont need to use nitrates. Lots of info in this thread if you care to read it. Brendo are I are stuffing salami tomorrow or wednesday. Sausage casings so its not as thick and allows for meat to breath, no preservatives etc. Will be beautiful.



Throw up a recipe/how to for salami, including how to cure them. I've been wanting to give this a go for a long time.


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## Whiteferret (10/6/13)

QldKev said:


> Throw up a recipe/how to for salami, including how to cure them. I've been wanting to give this a go for a long time.


Here are some threads I follow

salami

bacon

smoking

Have not done any myself and this one is now on my follow list too.
Will have too pull my finger out one of these days and build a smoker. :icon_drool2:


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## punkin (10/6/13)

If you ask your butcher to get you some lesnies ham cure it comes in a 3 or 4 kilo bag. Has dilution instructions on the label. I use the Royal Ham Cure for Jerky.


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## Aces High (10/6/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> Adding a localation may help know what u mean by local supplier.
> A lot of guys on here specifically make their own so they dont need to use nitrates. Lots of info in this thread if you care to read it. Brendo are I are stuffing salami tomorrow or wednesday. Sausage casings so its not as thick and allows for meat to breath, no preservatives etc. Will be beautiful.


Im just about to start making salami's also, and everything I read on the sausage making forums suggest that you really should use nitrate/nitrite. Do you use a starter at all CM2? How long do you hang them usually?




scon said:


> Do people have a source locally for Sodium Nitrate/Pink Salt? I got some Kwik Urit from the local butcher but it's not labelled with how much to use etc so i'd rather just buy a full pack myself.
> 
> I want to hang and cure some salamis is why I'm asking.


Scon, I've just ordered some off ebay from a place in Melbourne as I couldn't find anything locally in Perth. 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/250-Gram-Cure-2-for-Fermented-Salami-and-other-Sausage-making-etc-/310470291123?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:AU:3160


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## QldKev (10/6/13)

I've decided to join the salami mob. I just ordered a stc'ish humidity controller and a misting thingy and a 12v power supply from ebay all up for about $40, I've got a stc spare, pc fan and an old fridge. I'm copying "Gregs" design from a few pages back. In case your wondering why I'm not going to try and start making them in the winter air, it's winter now and it's currently 24c in my carport. Time to waste the arvo on google , maybe I should just invite Gregs over to teach me...


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## Aces High (10/6/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> Yeah cause peoplw had nitrates hundreds of years ago. People read the salami thread on ahb. More info on there than youll ever need. I did post a recipe on previous page for salami. If u arent using nitrayes then u have to do things diff so the meast can breath and dehydrate and not go rancid.
> 
> Horses for courses. If u want to use nitrayes then use them. I dont want to as its not needed. Same as cures in dausages are fkn ridiculous if if make rhem and freeze them. Each to their own


This is what im struggling with now... there is so much conflicting information out there. Once person says you don't need cure, just salt, the next says you'll die if you even look at raw meat the wrong way, its doin my freakin head in.

Ive been on different hobby forums which go ridiculously over the top when it comes to safety, to the point and they often scare the beejesus out of people for no good reason, but its just a matter of deciding for yourself based on all the relevant information where you draw the line.

I was reading on a meat forum of a guy who's made 100's of batches of dried chorizo without a problem....next poster "you're playing Russian roulette and you'll eventually make yourself and your friends very sick or dead" Who to believe...


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## manticle (10/6/13)

A bowl of rice can kill you.

There are risks. Educate yourself about them, reduce the risks, make the ones you take calculated. Anything that will be cooked or is a whole muscle cut (pancetta, bacon etc) doesn't need nitrites/nitrates. Minced stuff that's cured, not cooked/heated is the stuff you need to look at. I know many people who make lovely salami without anything but salt but they do know what they are doing. 

Been in the same boat myself - wanting to make salami without additives but not wanting to kill anyone I give it to. Hopefully going to observe/help with a bunch of people who annually do up a whole pig (I'll supply a keg or two and get my hands messy). Have some pink salt cures so will make up my mind whether or not to use them once watching other people's methods.


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## punkin (11/6/13)

Just do a risk assessment. I'd suggest if you're feeding uncooked meat to kids or other people and you think there is a possibillity of harm (and it's pretty severe harm when it goes wrong) then use a cure. If it's only going to be eaten by yourself (and a consenting partner who is also educated about the risks) then don't if that's what you choose.

I didn't use to use cure in my Jerky, thousands of other people don't, but when i started selling it the addition of cures were a no brainer. Made it taste better too 

It's cheap, it's considered harmless in small doses and it's peace of mind.


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## scon (12/6/13)

So this is my understanding of the whole nitrate thing:


nitrates change the colour and flavour of the meat - think unsmoked bacon vs salt pork.
nitrates are not needed when you are curing whole muscles unless you are doing it for flavour..
the time when you want to consider doing it for food safety reasons is when you are mincing meat and then holding it at low temperatures for a long time, the botulism spores are found on the outside of the meat and need a low or no oxygen environment to thrive, so when you mince and mix meat you're putting them into that sort of environment. If you are then curing them at room temperature or cold smoking them, then you need to make the decision whether or not to use nitrates.
Me? I like the flavour and the colour that nitrates give to cured meats. I have never heard of someone getting nitrate poisoning but botulism poisoning does happen, so for me it's a no-brainer.

Anyways, thanks for the links, I'll buy some from that ebay guy.


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## benno1973 (12/6/13)

Yep, I'm same as you scon. I use nitrates in my bacon and ham, because while I don't need to for a food safety thing, it makes it taste like bacon and ham. I forgot to put it in the Xmas ham and it tasted ok, but more like roast pork. Then again, I make salami most years with my neighbour, who has made it many years with his Italian family. There's no way that they use nitrates/nitrites, but that's their call, and I make it their way. It's delicious, and I have no problem with eating it.

CM2 - what do you mean when you say "If u arent using nitrayes then u have to do things diff so the meast can breath and dehydrate and not go rancid."? We've never done anything differently when omitting nitrates.


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## brettprevans (12/6/13)

There's disc in the salami thread about makin thinner salami instead of fat ones to compensate for the reduction in curing agent.


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## scon (12/6/13)

Yeah, so if I knew someone who was making Salami, and they didn't put nitrates into their Salami, I'd have no problem with eating it, however, I like the taste, and I'm going to be serving it to other people, so I want to be safe.

That being said, the Guanciale hanging under my house is only cured in salt and pepper, and should be ready soon.


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## benno1973 (12/6/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> There's disc in the salami thread about makin thinner salami instead of fat ones to compensate for the reduction in curing agent.


Oh righto, I get it. Yes, I thought you meant more something different in the process. Quicker water reduction times helps for safety measures.


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## pcmfisher (12/6/13)

I think its a no brainer to use nitrates for all dry cured products, ie ones that do not require cooking, smoking or refrigeration. 
Yeah, you can do it without them, but why would you? 

You can make beer without sanitising your fermenter and get away with it most times. Why would you?
You can make wine by letting it ferment from wild yeast, but once again why would you?

Nitrates are not going to hurt you considering the natural occuring type found in spinach and celery in large amounts.
Botulism is nasty shit.


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## benno1973 (12/6/13)

Yeh, on that note, I bought nitrate-free bacon a while ago for my sis-in-law. Tasted like regular bacon, and had that pink tinge to it that cure imparts. I'm guessing that they added celery salt/seeds to the mix, which is adding nitrates without having to declare it. I understand it's pretty common for nitrate-free products to include this.


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## Fents (12/6/13)

pcmfisher said:


> I think its a no brainer to use nitrates for all dry cured products, ie ones that do not require cooking, smoking or refrigeration.
> Yeah, you can do it without them, but why would you?
> 
> You can make beer without sanitising your fermenter and get away with it most times. Why would you?
> ...


You ask any old italian family if they use nitrates when making salami / curing meats....The answer will be 28grams sea salt every time.

When was the last time someone died from a confirmed case of salami botulism?


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## benno1973 (12/6/13)

Yeh, while I regularly use nitrates/nitrites, I think that the counter argument to "botulism is nasty shit" would be "cancer is nasty shit". I can see why people don't want to use them, it's certainly a personal decision about weighing up the risks. There's many other hurdles that can be employed to counter cb.


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## benno1973 (12/6/13)

Just took down some Sopressa from the curing fridge. This tastes delicious, done from a recipe from Len Poli's site. I upped the salt a little (he had around 1.7%), but it still could do with a little more. They're completely covered with white mould - I gave them a spray with a p.candidum spray just after I hung them.


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## tanukibrewer (12/6/13)

Looks good Kaiser, what beer will you pair with it?


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## brettprevans (12/6/13)

Been mentioned before and I thought about going to abbutcher or similar and get a scraping od thebwhite mould on their salami and mixing it with somw red wine as per mercs posts and seeing if its takes as an extra precaution and flavour additive. Its what a lot of cheeses do after all. 

Looks good. Brendo and mine salamis get stuffed and hung tonight.


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## punkin (13/6/13)

Fents said:


> You ask any old italian family if they use nitrates when making salami / curing meats....The answer will be 28grams sea salt every time.
> 
> When was the last time someone died from a confirmed case of salami botulism?


2005
http://www.listeriablog.com/listeria-watch/smallgoods-listeria-strain-matches-sample/

1995
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-11-22/garibaldi-e-coli-contamination-legal-case/3686838






> “From 1991 to 2008 there were 13 foodborne illness outbreaks in Australia attributed to
> smallgoods products, which led to over 460 people falling ill and three deaths,” he said



source...
http://www.foodauthority.nsw.gov.au/_Documents/media_releases/mr-2009-aug-13-smallgoods-pass-safety-test.pdf


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## scon (13/6/13)

Nitrates also apply to cold-smoked sausages so surely it's relevant here also?


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## pcmfisher (13/6/13)

Fents said:


> You ask any old italian family if they use nitrates when making salami / curing meats....The answer will be 28grams sea salt every time.
> 
> When was the last time someone died from a confirmed case of salami botulism?


And that same old Italian family still makes their wine by wild fermenting too because that's how they have always done it.
The length of time you do something is not an indicator of whether its the best way or not.


Do you think its coincidence that people do not die of botulism any more since we have be using nitrates as preservatives?


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## Fents (13/6/13)

punkin said:


> 2005
> http://www.listeriablog.com/listeria-watch/smallgoods-listeria-strain-matches-sample/
> 
> 1995
> ...


I'd nearly bet both those case's are commecrial suppliers who use nitrates in their products.


----------



## brettprevans (13/6/13)

Fents said:


> I'd nearly bet both those case's are commecrial suppliers who use nitrates in their products.


garabaldi small good is in that time frame and was the largest outbreak from a single supplier from memeory.


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## punkin (13/6/13)

Fents said:


> I'd nearly bet both those case's are commecrial suppliers who use nitrates in their products.



Yes, if you follow the links you'll find that's true. The quote you left out tells more of the story though. The backyard operators wouldn't nessercarily show up on a google search as they could well just go down as food poisoning etc.

But the question asked was when was the last death by botulism. I think i answered it fairly well considering a short search.


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## benno1973 (13/6/13)

tanukibrewer said:


> Looks good Kaiser, what beer will you pair with it?


I like a good IPA anytime. But maybe a dry pale ale to wash the oils away 




citymorgue2 said:


> Been mentioned before and I thought about going to abbutcher or similar and get a scraping od thebwhite mould on their salami and mixing it with somw red wine as per mercs posts and seeing if its takes as an extra precaution and flavour additive. Its what a lot of cheeses do after all.
> 
> Looks good. Brendo and mine salamis get stuffed and hung tonight.


Looking forward to the pics CM2. I've bought a nice mouldy salami and just hung it with mine to encourage mould growth. Seemed to work pretty well. Didn't have a mouldy salami on this run, so I used some camambert mould and it obviously took. I've heard you can just get a little cam rind and mix it with some water and spray that on. Would probably be a cheaper alternative than buying a salami, although I think they are different strains of mould.


----------



## brettprevans (14/6/13)

@ KS. yeah ive hears the mould trick works so ill check out some cam and salami tomorrow whilst doing the grocery shopping.

ok so sole pic so far is below. we got a bit slack with pics. 



getto rig! its an old wire draw basket suspended rom a beam in my outside room.

now to care for it over the next 5 weeks. 

i was rereading mercs original posts and he said he started to wipe bhis down with some red wine every few days to help stop the outside drying out too fast (ie before the inside). so ill do that if i cant get any mould to take. we lost 2 salamis whilst trying them off ie the skin broke. we would have had 20 40cm+ salami otherwise. fried it off and damn mofo they are hot!


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## brettprevans (15/6/13)

Bought some nice looking salami with mould on it this morning. Got home and started to scrape off the mould. ..no mould! Its a patterned casing the cheeky bastards! Wasnt cheap either. Ill go some camambert rind. At least I know thats real.


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## benno1973 (16/6/13)

Just made some kimchi salami this morning. For some reason I've never gotten around to buying any commercial salami starter culture, and instead I've been using milk kefir as my starter culture. It works really well, and gives a really nice tangy flavour to the salami. I've never gotten around to testing pH to confirm a quick drop - should do that one day.

Anyway, today I used kimchi juice for the starter culture, so it'll be interesting to see how this turns out. Followed my general sopressa recipe, but swapped the chilli for Korean gochugaru chilli flakes, added 1/2 a cup of kimchi juice, and finely diced some kimchi as well. Currently incubating for 24 hours before being hung in the curing fridge.


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## brettprevans (16/6/13)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Just made some kimchi salami this morning. For some reason I've never gotten around to buying any commercial salami starter culture, and instead I've been using milk kefir as my starter culture. It works really well, and gives a really nice tangy flavour to the salami. I've never gotten around to testing pH to confirm a quick drop - should do that one day.
> 
> Anyway, today I used kimchi juice for the starter culture, so it'll be interesting to see how this turns out. Followed my general sopressa recipe, but swapped the chilli for Korean gochugaru chilli flakes, added 1/2 a cup of kimchi juice, and finely diced some kimchi as well. Currently incubating for 24 hours before being hung in the curing fridge.


love an experiment. Please post a review once ready.


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## benno1973 (16/6/13)

Absolutely! I fried up a couple of patties and they tasted really good. 2% salt, so I'm at the low end of the safety range, but given that it has cultures and nitrites/nitrates, I'm pretty happy with it.


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## benno1973 (19/6/13)

Well, I hung the salamis last night after about 60 hours fermentation. One of the casings broke as I was hanging it, so I had a chance to measure the pH. It was 4.6! That's presumably pretty low, and they had a distinct sour smell. I fried some up, and it tasted 'tangy' but still delicious! Will be interesting to see how they turn out.

It was fascinating to see how the meat had changed in just that short space of time (generally they are encased, so I don't get to see). The meat was spongy, almost rubbery. It had bound together, and while it was still moist, there wasn't a lot of free liquid. Just thought it was interesting.


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## brettprevans (21/6/13)

Im suprised that after a week mine smell like salami and less like raw meat.
Ive got some nice camembert rind and some goats cheese ash for good measure and will spray the salamis tonight.
Heres a shot


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## brettprevans (3/7/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> Im suprised that after a week mine smell like salami and less like raw meat.
> Ive got some nice camembert rind and some goats cheese ash for good measure and will spray the salamis tonight.
> Heres a shot
> 
> ...


after spraying the salami every 2 or so days with the camembert water mix there are finally signs of some mould forming. They are also dehydrating very quickly now as the casings are getting some slackness. Around them.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/13)

I've been missing in action from the forum for a fair while and can see I have a bit of reading to do to catch up with all the posts! Just thought I would share a photo or two of yesterdays work. 10 kilos of pork and fennel salami and 10 kilos of pork/beef red wine garlic and black pepper salami.

I used casing for the first time one being 50mm round and 450 mm long. The other were 42mm round in one long continuous tube which I cut and tied my own lengths. They all get soaked in warm water before filling. They seem to work well and are a mix of reconstitutes skin and collagen I think - they certainly stink like skin.

54 salami's in total.


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## punkin (12/7/13)

They look the goods mate.


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## doon (12/7/13)

My sisters husband and his mate made 150kg of salami you can smell it coming out of the shed with door closed. Will have to get her to send me a picture I thought I took one when I was up there


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## brettprevans (12/7/13)

Mercs Own said:


> I've been missing in action from the forum for a fair while and can see I have a bit of reading to do to catch up with all the posts! Just thought I would share a photo or two of yesterdays work. 10 kilos of pork and fennel salami and 10 kilos of pork/beef red wine garlic and black pepper salami.I used casing for the first time one being 50mm round and 450 mm long. The other were 42mm round in one long continuous tube which I cut and tied my own lengths. They all get soaked in warm water before filling. They seem to work well and are a mix of reconstitutes skin and collagen I think - they certainly stink like skin.54 salami's in total.


nice merc! Did you use preservatives or just salt etc.


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## sp0rk (12/7/13)

Mercs Own said:


> I've been missing in action from the forum for a fair while and can see I have a bit of reading to do to catch up with all the posts! Just thought I would share a photo or two of yesterdays work. 10 kilos of pork and fennel salami and 10 kilos of pork/beef red wine garlic and black pepper salami.
> 
> I used casing for the first time one being 50mm round and 450 mm long. The other were 42mm round in one long continuous tube which I cut and tied my own lengths. They all get soaked in warm water before filling. They seem to work well and are a mix of reconstitutes skin and collagen I think - they certainly stink like skin.
> 
> 54 salami's in total.


Welcome back Paul, That prod I gave you on facebook must have worked 
I think that pic has finally convinced me to get a sausage stuffer...


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## Mercs Own (12/7/13)

I'm a just salt bloke and so far so good but as I have said previously in this thread if I am not sure about a salami - any doubt chuck it out!

I had to chuck my pancetta out I did last year as it didn't cure properly however my capocollo was terrific!!


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## Mercs Own (12/7/13)

> Welcome back Paul, That prod I gave you on facebook must have worked
> I think that pic has finally convinced me to get a sausage stuffer...


Spork thanks for the prod! I am definitely going to buy a dedicated hand crank stuffer next year as the poor old sunbeam has some issues with stuffing 20 kilos in an arvo - it can do it but it is a bit slow!


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## brettprevans (12/7/13)

Mercs Own said:


> I'm a just salt bloke and so far so good but as I have said previously in this thread if I am not sure about a salami - any doubt chuck it out!I had to chuck my pancetta out I did last year as it didn't cure properly however my capocollo was terrific!!


cool. Just wanted to see if you had changed ur mind. We went salt only and thin casings. But might do larger casings next time. And def more salami and less snags. Kind if thinking we should have made 50kg of salami instead of 10kg salami and 40kg snags. 


Lots of gurs doing salt curing atm like capocollo duck 'procutto' etc.


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## brettprevans (12/7/13)

Latest pics




Little bit of camembert mould growing


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## brendo (12/7/13)

citymorgue2 said:


> Latest pics
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Mmmmmm looking good, can't wait to start chewing on one real soon!


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## QldKev (16/7/13)

Finally got around to finishing my salami fridge fogger today. Won't be long and I'll be making salami at any time of the year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9reOcOIqe60


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## scon (16/7/13)

One of the best designs I've seen QLDKev, what's the hygrometer you use?


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## Truman42 (16/7/13)

Tonight on "QldKevs homebrewing show" were going to show you how to make a salami fridge fogger.. 

My sons had a great laugh at your "pretty lights...you probably dont give a shit about that".comment..


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## QldKev (16/7/13)

scon said:


> One of the best designs I've seen QLDKev, what's the hygrometer you use?


Its a wh8040. Just a bit over $20 del from ebay


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## punkin (17/7/13)

I used one of those controllers at one stage in my mycology adventures.





I downsized from this one just running a vapourisor on a timer.




Worked very well, both setups.


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## Aces High (17/7/13)

QldKev said:


> Its a wh8040. Just a bit over $20 del from ebay


I bought the hygrometer and humidifier, but found that with salami I was having more trouble trying to get the humidity in the fridge down rather than up due to the moisture given off by the salami. Unfortunately the hygrometer I bought can only do one thing at a time so you have to either set it to humidify or dehumidify, although I believe some others switch between the 2 states. What I do now is set the hygrometer to dehumidify and I have plugged a heat belt into it.

It sounds a bit counter intuitive, but when the humidity gets too high, the heat belt comes on and raises the temp in the fridge by a degree or two. This then turns the fridge on via the STC1000. When the fridge is running it causes the humidity to condense on the cooling plates and dehumifies the fridge. I read it online somewhere (possibly back in one of the 24 pages in this thread) and it seem to work well. Summer may be different as the recirculating fan sucks in dryer air in summer (in Perth), but I will wait and see. 

I also have a computer fan running at a very slow speed via a fan controller which draws in outside air through a filter made from left over voile (from my last biab bag). I just received a couple of $5 electronic timer contollers off ebay (damn I love ebay), so I am going to set up the fan to come on for half an hour twice a day, just to change the air in the fridge rather than having moving air all the time. I don't think that having constant moving air is ideal.


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## scon (17/7/13)

So my chorizo are finished. They're likely a bit dry as they've lost 50% of their weight rather than 30. Will fry some up tonight and give them a go.
​

​


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## QldKev (17/7/13)

Wow pumpkin, that's a pretty serious setup. I'm only running a 300 odd Litre fridge. Those room humidifiers are a lot neater, but I was concerned about bad mold getting on it and not being able to rip it apart to clean it. That's how I ended up with this design as I can pressure clean it anytime. I didn't think of mounting it outside and drilling a big hole into the fridge which avoids the mold growing on it issue.

Aces High, up here is a lot warmer than Perth so the fridge will need to run more often. I noticed in that video above that the carport was still on 21.8 late afternoon, and it's the middle of winter. A mate up here has used a fridge setup for a while, all he said is try and avoid putting a fresh batch in when we have our really cold week (approx 20c days).

scon, that's the idea of setting up the humidity chamber to prevent the salami from either drying too slowly and over drying, or drying too fast and case hardening. Those chorizo still look yummy


QldKev


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## scon (17/7/13)

Could you keep some no-rinse sanitiser in your humidifier to help prevent mold?


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## QldKev (17/7/13)

scon said:


> Could you keep some no-rinse sanitiser in your humidifier to help prevent mold?


Good idea for the inside, then it's just the outside.


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## Mercs Own (20/7/13)

Have been a little worried about my salami due to the abnormally high temps we have had in Melbourne this last week averaging 18 - 21 degree's C. The first couple of days after hanging the temp sat at around 12 degrees but then up it went. The smell in the garage was very strong and I was afraid the salami may be cooking!!! (not really cooking but certainly may be adversely affected) After some phone calls were made to some real experienced salami makers I was told the temps were fine as up to 20 degrees was fine but more importantly keep them in the dark =- ie don't let them, sit in light. My salamis are in my garage which has one window so although they were not getting direct sunlight they were getting secondary light on them so I have covered the window now.

This is the first time I have made salami in this house (moved last year) so it is all an experiment to see how it works. Perhaps due to the heat (or maybe the casing) there is quite a bit of white mould forming on the salami. I will keep an eye on this and spray them down with a mix of red wine and water if it gets too much. Otherwise they seem to be drying quite well.


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## Mercs Own (24/7/13)

Salami's are drying well this year! In addition I have hung my capocollo and also 2 pancetta's.

Not the best photo but enough to drool over!


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/7/13)

Damn you lot.......

Climate up here is just to warm over winter in Nth NSW..

I Dont even own a jumper...


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## brettprevans (24/7/13)

Cut open one of the small salamis on the weekend. Still needs more drying in yhe middle. Surprising given the look of them. Any wayways..tasted them and they are great. Will be awsome once dried out properly. 

Will rub them down with some liquid to help preserve outside moisture whilst the core stll dehydrates.

Still.. no artificial preservatives. Just salt and brandy. No botchalism in sight.


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## Mercs Own (4/8/13)

My salami is almost all done for this year. Just waiting on the larger ones to finish off and also for the pancetta and capocollo to dry. happiest with a fistful of home made!!


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## DU99 (4/8/13)

looks good


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## MattC (4/8/13)

Hey guys, I've been wanting to get into salami making for a while and now with the tax return in I'm in the market for a sausage stuffer. Im looking at a couple of models on ebay

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-5L-Sausage-Filler-Stuffer-Stainless-Steel-Two-Speed-Adjustment-/150959191362?pt=AU_Business_Industrial_Restaurant_Catering_Equipment&hash=item2325de7542

or this one (but in the 5L)

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ROVTEX-sausage-filler-stainless-steel-3L-sausage-stuffer-/260934787705?pt=AU_Business_Industrial_Restaurant_Catering_Equipment&hash=item3cc0ece279

the Rovtex brand are a little more expensive but I cant seem to find any info on them and whether or not the extra price is justified.

Do any of you have any advice or experience with any of these models or in particular, what NOT to buy?

Cheers


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## punkin (5/8/13)

Good job mate.


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## Wolfman (5/8/13)

MattC said:


> Hey guys, I've been wanting to get into salami making for a while and now with the tax return in I'm in the market for a sausage stuffer. Im looking at a couple of models on ebay
> 
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-5L-Sausage-Filler-Stuffer-Stainless-Steel-Two-Speed-Adjustment-/150959191362?pt=AU_Business_Industrial_Restaurant_Catering_Equipment&hash=item2325de7542
> 
> ...


I got a horizontal one the other day. Works a treat. I did get the 3l one for $145. I think that is more than enough for my sausage making. I did really wont the vertical one but settled for the bench top. 

Did make stuffing oh so much easier!


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## AUHEAMIC (16/8/13)

Been a while
Great weather for salami this year.


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## QldKev (16/8/13)

I think it would be great if someone could write a guide to making salami. A real beginners how to, that assumes the user has had no previous experience. Maybe it could cater for both fermented and non-fermented sausages. We could make it a sticky.


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## Ducatiboy stu (16/8/13)

That would be a great idea


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## punkin (17/8/13)

You could just copy one from a sausage making forum


Or Just use Mercs 

http://www.paulmercurio.net/?p=253


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## QldKev (17/8/13)

punkin said:


> You could just copy one from a sausage making forum
> 
> 
> Or Just use Mercs
> ...



That page has feedback/chat about it, not a how to. When I click any link from that page to the archive it comes up bad link?


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## punkin (17/8/13)

I'm sure he'll back to fix it now.


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## Mercs Own (17/8/13)

QldKev said:


> I think it would be great if someone could write a guide to making salami. A real beginners how to, that assumes the user has had no previous experience. Maybe it could cater for both fermented and non-fermented sausages. We could make it a sticky.


QLDKev - if you read this thread from the beginning you will see that I take you through the complete process of making salami at home including pics. It has been good enough in the past that people here have used it as a guide to make their own salami at home. Also there is plenty of debate about using preservatives etc and lots of other people have added their experience and recipes for the salami they are making. Get your glasses on and get in to it!


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## Mercs Own (17/8/13)

The link on my blog site no longer works however it was a copy of the stuff I put on here.


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## MattC (17/8/13)

G'day charcutiers.....

Whilst I wait to get into salami making I thought I would start with pancetta since it is apparently pretty easy. My pork belly has been curing for 6 days in a rub that doesn't contain nitrites (may just use this first batch as cooking pancetta, as the nitrite debate hasn't really encouraged me to eat this batch without cooking). It is pretty thin and weighed approx. 1.3kg (thought Id start with a small piece for my first go).

I used about 1/2 cup cooking salt as I couldn't acquire any Kosher salt at the time, along with other spices (couldn't find juniper berries). I plan on washing it well tomorrow then tasting for saltiness and if too salty, soak in water for 30 mins, then repeat. I was going to leave it flat to dry but it is pretty thin in parts so I was thinking about rolling it. A few websites have recommended rolling it then wrapping it in cheesecloth and tying it up prior to drying. I cant find any info on how this would benefit the drying phase, or the final product at all. Has anyone else used this method and does it work, or am I wasting my time and should I just tie it? 

cheers


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## Ducatiboy stu (17/8/13)

Mercs Own said:


> The link on my blog site no longer works however it was a copy of the stuff I put on here.


Enough said.


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## benno1973 (18/8/13)

MattC said:


> A few websites have recommended rolling it then wrapping it in cheesecloth and tying it up prior to drying. I cant find any info on how this would benefit the drying phase, or the final product at all. Has anyone else used this method and does it work, or am I wasting my time and should I just tie it?
> 
> cheers


Hi Matt,

Wrapping in cheesecloth will just slow the drying process and ensure that you don't get a hard, crusty exterior. It's not totally necessary, I've done it both ways and it does as described above, but if you don't do it, you'll still make delicious pancetta.


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## MattC (18/8/13)

Thanks Kaiser, as I have now got the wife to dig through 4 boxes of fabric to find the cheesecloth.....I think I will use it this time


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## Mercs Own (18/8/13)

MattC said:


> G'day charcutiers.....
> 
> Whilst I wait to get into salami making I thought I would start with pancetta since it is apparently pretty easy. My pork belly has been curing for 6 days in a rub that doesn't contain nitrites (may just use this first batch as cooking pancetta, as the nitrite debate hasn't really encouraged me to eat this batch without cooking). It is pretty thin and weighed approx. 1.3kg (thought Id start with a small piece for my first go).
> 
> ...


It is a bit late in the season to be hanging pancetta usually you would be hanging this in June so as to have the colder months to dry it out over 5 or so weeks. The temps are starting to go up now... I rolled my pancetta last year but it didn't dry properly (hung for 6 weeks) so it went in the bin, probably my fault for not salting it enough and maybe I should have let hang longer but it got warm! This year I have left mine flat and they dried very well pics below. I have maybe left them a little too long this year so next year I hope to get it right. If you are going to hang you pancetta I would probably hang it unrolled due to the fact that it is late in the season and you probably want it to hang and dry quicker. If you roll, it will take longer to dry in the middle and being we are mid August I am not sure that is so good. What do others think?

Also you will notice my capocollo: I wrap it in wet collagen skin and then put it in the elastic sock and hang it that way. The skin is the same I use for salami only it comes in large pieces of "paper" type flat sheets. It is great when stuffing salami and you get a small blow out - instead of ditching that skin and re stuffing you can soak the flat sheet in water and then wrap it around the blow out and it seals it up fine.

Where do you live that you couldn't buy juniper berries??

good luck with it and let us know how you go.


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## MattC (18/8/13)

Thanks Mercs, you have now convinced me to go back to plan A and hang it flat, which is what I was originally going to do but as it was very thin in parts, I thought about rolling it.

Your pancetta in the picture looks quite dark, do you re-season them after rinsing and prior to hanging?

I just moved to Broken Hill at the start of this year and you cant get everything you need out here. I had an extensive look around woollies but could not find the juniper berries anywhere, or kosher salt. It was a very last minute thing to try this as we bought some pork belly (from woollies, thought Id go budget just to try it for the first time) as we were having it for dinner and it was a fairly large piece so I thought id do pancetta with the other piece.

Will be rinsing it this arvo and hanging it. As I didn't use nitrites, when it is ready I might start by cooking it first, then trying it next time cooked a little less and then work up to eating it totally uncooked, rather than go in head first.

Thanks for the advice, a great thread that I will be referring to frequently when the sausage filler is purchased. 

Cheers


----------



## benno1973 (18/8/13)

Mercs Own said:


> ...I would probably hang it unrolled due to the fact that it is late in the season and you probably want it to hang and dry quicker. If you roll, it will take longer to dry in the middle and being we are mid August I am not sure that is so good. What do others think?


Yeh, good point. If you're hanging in Broken Hill, which I assume gets pretty warm, I'd try and get it dried as quick as possible.


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## manticle (18/8/13)

Hi MattC,

If it were me, I would pat the pancetta dry and maybe leave for a few hours for any excess from the rinsing to dry off, then roll and hang.

As for nitrite free/cooking pancetta - the main risk for cured meats is botulism and this does not affect whole muscle cuts - only minced meats (sausage, salami etc). I'd eat your pancetta any way you want if it smells and looks OK.


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## Mercs Own (18/8/13)

MattC said:


> Thanks Mercs, you have now convinced me to go back to plan A and hang it flat, which is what I was originally going to do but as it was very thin in parts, I thought about rolling it.
> 
> Your pancetta in the picture looks quite dark, do you re-season them after rinsing and prior to hanging?
> 
> ...


Hey Mattc - I hang my pancetta for almost four weeks and they are pretty dry - taste bloody delicious (first taste today!) Cured them for ten days then washed them off and dried them then coated in chilli flakes and black pepper that I had ground up. Poked a hole each side of one end - food grade twine through them and hung!

I went down my friendly deli today (friends with the manager) and they sliced some of my pancetta real thin and we ate that - really good! I don't use nitrates or nitrites etc but make sure the salt ratio is spot on. Also you mention cooking salt - I am hoping it was non iodised salt as it is a real no no to use iodised salt in curing things. Don't know why only know that you shouldn't as it interferes with the curing process. 

Did you remove skin before curing? I do mostly because it is easier to cut and eat later on as the skin goes pretty hard.

Herbies Spice ( http://www.herbies.com.au/ ) are great for getting things sent out real quick and if they don't have it no one will.


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## benno1973 (18/8/13)

Mercs Own said:


> Also you mention cooking salt - I am hoping it was non iodised salt as it is a real no no to use iodised salt in curing things. Don't know why only know that you shouldn't as it interferes with the curing process.


I've wondered why myself. I know with vegetable fermentation and cheesemaking, iodine being an antibacterial agent affects the probiotic bacteria that do the fermentation such as lactobacillus. In some sense, if you add a starter culture (i.e. salami), iodised salt could affect how effectively this works. But I know that iodised salt has been discouraged with nitrites, and I found this article which discusses it:



> At the time of the study, it was not permitted to add iodine to nitrite curing salt... According to Wirth and Kühne (1991) there have been reports that the formation of carcinogenic nitrosamines from secondary amines and nitrite is accelerated in the presence of iodide ions. Such an effect could be catalytic or iodine could react in its own right... The authors concluded that addition of iodine to salt had no influence on the formation of nitrosamines in the meat products studied.


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## Mercs Own (18/8/13)

Further to this - you can buy kosher salt that is iodised so you need to be careful and read the packets! Basically pure salt is what you need to use ie nothing added to it.

A couple of pics of my pancetta freshly sliced. Two pics have the flash on and look good but the pic with the flash off show the true colour of the pancetta.


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## MattC (18/8/13)

No it was just normal cooking salt, I recall reading somewhere (probably on here) not to use iodised so I steered well clear. Yep I also removed the fat layer.

Some sources say to hang for min of two weeks, however I'm guessing the two weeks is only a guide as it is supposed to reduce in mass by 30%, so I'm thinking 2 weeks minimum, but longer if required to reach that 30% mark?

Cheers


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## doon (18/8/13)

http://www.orangefarmhardware.com.au/CuringPickling/MeatCures?product_id=83

Is that the curing salt we should use for bacon etc


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## Mercs Own (18/8/13)

Its ready when it is firmish - although I reckon I hung mine a little too long. Hope you didnt remove the fat layer just the skin and left the fat - fat is flavour!


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## Mercs Own (18/8/13)

doon said:


> http://www.orangefarmhardware.com.au/CuringPickling/MeatCures?product_id=83
> 
> Is that the curing salt we should use for bacon etc


I dont use curing salt in my bacon - and I really dont know what that is other than it looks more like a prep for butchers?

Funny term curing salt - pure salt used in the correct quantities will cure meat.


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## MattC (18/8/13)

No only removed the skin, tried to leave as much fat as possible but as it wasn't the best cut, pretty thin all over.


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

Hi Guys

I have been making cured meats for a few years now and I have to say it's hard to go back to store bought products. The process is not difficult , you just need to have a little bit of patience a place to hang it and then somewhere to store it. I have made everything from salami, coppa, capicollo, pancetta, prosciutto, guanciale, bresaola and other stuff. I suppose being born Calabrian has given me a little bit of a head start, however there is plenty of info on the net on how to cure meat. It certainly is worth having a go and believe me once you get it right there is no going back to store bought meats.Here are some pics of some of my stuff. 

Cheers


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## MattC (19/8/13)

Very impressive Fortmonty. That collection looks awesome!! First pic pancetta? What is the second pic? are those two big slabs in the 3rd pic pancetta? Also where in your house is that last pic? Is it a specialised cool room?


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## Aces High (19/8/13)

I managed to sneak my pastie ranga self into an italian family cacciatore weekend a few weeks back. Very interesting to watch the whole process (well they actually put me to work as soon as I walked through the door). No photos sorry as i didn't want to push my luck.

They used 2 full pigs (female only as males can get boar taint apparently), and this year they got the butcher to do the mincing for them. It was all mixed up on the saturday and left on a big table in the shed overnight. They only used salt, no nitrates and when we cooked up a batch it was much saltier than what i make. I missed most of the saturday mixing unfortunately so a I didn't get to see how they worked out salt content.

On Sunday the stuffing started. They were using about 60mm ox casing and had a 5kg horizontal stuffing machine. The stuffing machines are awesome compared to using the mincer to do the stuffing. I am definitely going to have to consider getting one myself. 

They didn't bother to tie the ends and just tied from the middle. Tying a 500mm length into about 4 sausages and hanging them from the middle. The ends were dipped in dry white pepper which apparently keeps the insects away, then they were pricked a number of times with a 5 pronged pricker (is that a word?)

Then they were tied onto a big gal pipe that ran the length of the shed and left. After talking to the boss (the eldest brother in the family) they would be hung there for about 2 weeks then taken down and cryovacked and frozen. They then just pull them out and hang them in the fridge one at a time over the year.

This was their traditonal family recipe and technique and they only starting doing the caccatore weekends again about 3 years after a break of about 20 years. All the kids are now in the 20's and are starting to have their own kids and they wanted to revive the process.


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

MattC

The second pic is the cheats way of making prosciutto , rather than trying to cure the whole leg intact , which takes over 12 months, I split the legs and de bone them. What you see in the last pic is the big slab of leg hanging to dry. The curing time is cut to less than half, and it avoids hanging meat in our hot summer. I have a commercial grade slicer at home , so when I slice my meats they come up like you get in the gourmet deli's . Thats my shed at home, which is lined with 75mil polystyrene foam walls and ceiling. I was going to put in a cellar but to much stuffing around and this was an easier /cheaper solution. 

As I said because I don't cure the whole legs as a single unit, I don't need to have meats hanging over our summer. I have made whole legs as well as culatello ( which is the ants pants of cured meats ) see below. The other pic below is my pancetta with fillet intact.

I didn't get a chance to make anything this year as I went back to the home country for a month and only just got back. I figure though I still have time to make nduja ( spicy hot spreadable calabrian sausage ) this is the big new thing in cured meats despite that fact that calabrians have been making it for ages.


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

MattC

Sorry yes the first pic in my first post was pancetta , made as a flat slab i.e. not rolled. Personally pancetta is my favourite as the fat content gives it the extra flavour and maintains the moistness to it. It is magnificent cubed and stirred through pasta such as carbonara ( however nothing beats guanciale for that ). 

Put it this way I love going out to my deli and slicing up some cold cuts for the Sunday antipasto platter. 

Cheers


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## Mercs Own (19/8/13)

Hey fortmonty - looks fantastic! Looks like we have a new go to guy for all things salami and cured!! 

I have only just in the last 12 months been introduced to nduja and LOVE it! Use it mostly in pasta sauce. Would love a recipe for it and look forward to hearing from you and how you make it.


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

I tried it for the first time in the home town only a few weeks ago. I have traditional recipie for it and hope to make it in the coming weeks when I get a chance. I will let you know how it turns out.

Cheers


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## MattC (19/8/13)

Could you point a real charcuterie noob towards a real good reference, whether it be Internet or a book?


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

One of the best books is "Charcuterie the craft of salting and curing " by Ruhlman & Polcyn. They set out the fundamentals and their basic cure ie salt / sugar is excellent ( minus the curing salts ie nitrates etc).

I have noticed that most if not all US websites advocate the use of curing salts. Personally I think that comes from the fear of being sued should someone get sick because they don't know what they are doing. All I know is that all the Calabrians I know have for generations made salami and cured meats with just salt. 

There is also anther book which I have leant to someone at the moment and I have forgotten the title , but it is basically a collection of traditional Calabrian and some other Italian recipes. Not just cured meats and salami but everything from pickled vegetables to bread. This book is excellent if you want to preserve food tge way most Calabrese do. Many of the recipes are similar to how my parents, grand parents and so on preserved their food. 


Cheers


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## doon (19/8/13)

So with bacon if you dont use pink salt will you still get the traditional colour and flavour? 

Everything I can find says it will come out Grey and not have the same taste


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## fortmonty (19/8/13)

I have not made tried to make bacon , however pancetta is probably the Italian version of bacon though cured to a greater extent. The curing salts are used to maintain colour. I would have tgought that the taste should not be affected only colour. Ruhlman & Polcyn have a recipe for Canadian smoked bacon, which is brined for 48 hrs then smoked. The brine mixture is salt/sugar/spices plus curing salt 
( which they specifically say is to give the cured meat colour). You might try playing around with brining time ?

I suppose used properly there is nothing wrong with using curing salts. It's just that I have never used it.


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## manticle (19/8/13)

doon said:


> So with bacon if you dont use pink salt will you still get the traditional colour and flavour?
> Everything I can find says it will come out Grey and not have the same taste


When you cook it, it will lose its pink colour. The flavour will also differ but my experience of home smoked, un- nitrited bacon is superb. Amazing stuff. Like super kaiserfleisch. Try it both ways.

As for grey - it comes out the colour of cooked pork with nice browning if you fry it good.


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## MattC (20/8/13)

And here starts my charcuterie journey. Thanks to Mercs, Manticle, Kaiser, Fortmonty and others for the friendly advice. Will let you know how it turns out.

Cheers


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## rusty274 (20/8/13)

Nice topic guys! 

This my second year making salami. 1st time me and a mate got a 7kg shoulder of pork and got the butcher to bone it and mince it. We flavoured and stuffed them ourselves. 

This year we may have got a little excited and got a 95kg pig from Springfield pork! It came in two halves so we had to break it down and mince it by hand! We enlisted the help from two mates. 

We stared at 6:30am and finished at midnight! Ended up with loads of roasts, hams, pancetta, salami, belly, ribs and even Braun made from the head. It was a great day with a few drinks and plenty of nice food. 

Salami and pancetta still hanging in the roof. Should be ready in a week or so. 

Just hung some bresaola ( beef cured in red wine and herbs ) hope it works out? 

Might see some of you guys at salamifest.


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## Malted (20/8/13)

Would love to see some pictures Rusty274.


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## fortmonty (20/8/13)

Looks like I'm making bresaola this year after all . A mate called me today saying he had some venison for me . 

This is going to be very interesting . I'll let you know how it works out.

Cheers


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## fortmonty (20/8/13)

MattC said:


> And here starts my charcuterie journey. Thanks to Mercs, Manticle, Kaiser, Fortmonty and others for the friendly advice. Will let you know how it turns out.
> 
> Cheers


Looks good . 

Good luck , drop me line if you need any help.

Cheers


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## rusty274 (21/8/13)

Here are some pics of my salami day.


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## Malted (21/8/13)

rusty274 said:


> Here are some pics of my salami day.


Charcuterie porn. Awesome stuff. :super:


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## fortmonty (23/8/13)

You just gotta love pig.


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## Malted (24/8/13)

fortmonty said:


> You just gotta love pig.


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## seamad (5/9/13)

Heads up for those interested, just got my copy of the revised and updated charcuterie by ruhlman/polcyn today. It was on backorder from the book depository until publication. Don't know how different it is to the original. Says in the foreword that commercial sausage ingredients have been removed and salt levels adjusted.


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## pat_00 (5/9/13)

Perhaps it's the cultures they refer to? Bactoferm or whatever.


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## Mercs Own (6/9/13)

seamad said:


> Heads up for those interested, just got my copy of the revised and updated charcuterie by ruhlman/polcyn today. It was on backorder from the book depository until publication. Don't know how different it is to the original. Says in the foreword that commercial sausage ingredients have been removed and salt levels adjusted.


Interesting and scary that the salt levels have been adjusted - does that mean in the first edition they are out?????? I made my first pancetta to his recommendations last year and it didnt cure due to not enough salt?

This year I just covered them in salt and they came out a treat.


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## seamad (6/9/13)

Mercs Own said:


> Interesting and scary that the salt levels have been adjusted - does that mean in the first edition they are out?????? I made my first pancetta to his recommendations last year and it didnt cure due to not enough salt?
> 
> This year I just covered them in salt and they came out a treat.


Interesting to see how it's changed then. This ed has 2.25kg pork belly with 14g pink salt and 50g kosher salt and 26g dark brown sugar, then garlic/juniper etc.


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## QldKev (6/9/13)

seamad said:


> Heads up for those interested, just got my copy of the revised and updated charcuterie by ruhlman/polcyn today. It was on backorder from the book depository until publication. Don't know how different it is to the original. Says in the foreword that commercial sausage ingredients have been removed and salt levels adjusted.


There goes 35 bucks :lol: 

Hopen tu gut mur edumacated frum tis wun


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## seamad (7/9/13)

Is there any reason why I can't vacuum seal the pork belly ( for pancetta) up with the salt ,sugar, etc ? Haven't read anywhere of it being done so thought there might be a reason for it.


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## Mercs Own (7/9/13)

seamad said:


> Interesting to see how it's changed then. This ed has 2.25kg pork belly with 14g pink salt and 50g kosher salt and 26g dark brown sugar, then garlic/juniper etc.


If the accepted amount of salt needed to cure your salami is 3% to weight of meat ie 30 grams per kilo of meat then the equation above is not enough - yes he is using pink salt or instacure but.... I used 1/4 cup of salt mixed with my herbs and sugar and then rubbed all over my pork belly (1 1/2 kilo piece) Then I put that in a zip bag. What ever salt lay on the bench after doing this was binned.


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## QldKev (7/9/13)

seamad said:


> Is there any reason why I can't vacuum seal the pork belly ( for pancetta) up with the salt ,sugar, etc ? Haven't read anywhere of it being done so thought there might be a reason for it.



How would it dry out?


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## seamad (7/9/13)

QldKev said:


> How would it dry out?


Just for the salt curing, thought it would keep the salt in better contact than just sticking it in a bag. Would take it out to air dry it.


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## benno1973 (7/9/13)

I vacuum seal mine, prevents it leaking everywhere.


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## seamad (7/9/13)

Kaiser Soze said:


> I vacuum seal mine, prevents it leaking everywhere.


That was one of the reasons too, thanks.
Might get one started tomorrow, got some really nice (fatty) belly, made 4.5kg of pork/apple snags today with some shoulder and the belly and saved a chunk of the belly for a pancetta.


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## Mercs Own (7/9/13)

I wouldnt vac seal them as during the process of curing you want the meat and salt to be able to work together to do their thing ie salt draw the moisture out and getting the flavours in. You vac seal things to stop the aging process so therefore I am wondering if vac sealing for the curing proces would in fact retard the curing process.

On that basis I wouldnt do it.

That said I have never done it so I dont know if my assumption would be correct.


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## benno1973 (7/9/13)

Mercs Own said:


> I wouldnt vac seal them as during the process of curing you want the meat and salt to be able to work together to do their thing ie salt draw the moisture out and getting the flavours in. You vac seal things to stop the aging process so therefore I am wondering if vac sealing for the curing proces would in fact retard the curing process.
> 
> On that basis I wouldnt do it.
> 
> That said I have never done it so I dont know if my assumption would be correct.


I've done it ever since I can remember, never had any issues with the curing process. I learnt from Vince "the king of flesh' Gareffa here at Mondo's and at his classes, he hands out vacuum sealed meat in cure, as a 'take home' experiment for the students. Vacuum sealing just prevents oxidation, so I wouldn't imagine that would have much to do with the curing process?


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## fortmonty (27/9/13)

Just posting some pics of the outcome of my venison bresaola. As with all my cured meats I love dressing them in a combo of crushed chillies,paprika and
coarse cracked black pepper. As you can see it's very lean and I have to say absolutely delicious. I will post some more pics up once I have sliced it 
up nice and thin.


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## scon (27/9/13)

Looks awesome fortmonty. Made some coppa recently with a coating like that... it was delicious.


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## fortmonty (27/9/13)

Yes it's my standard coating for all my cured meats , ie prosciutto, capocollo, pancetta, guanciale etc , helps to minimise bugs when drying out, and imparts lovely flavour and a bit of kick 
to the final product.


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## shaunous (3/11/13)

This has been good reading men, have never ventured here before, only skipped past. I'm getting myself a decent set of butchers knives for an early Xmas present, always been a hunter, but have never butchered my own meat, don't hunt with anyone who does so haven't had the learning chance. Pretty much teaching myself from YouTube vids and will give it a decent go once the quality knives turn up.

Then it's onto following this thread and curing, sausage making etc.  

Have a smoker and I regularly smoke meats and have recently ventured into making my own jerky. Would be good to do this with my own stalked, hunted and butchered meats.


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## Mercs Own (15/12/13)

I finally bought my own slicer so I don't have to go to my local and ask them to thinly slice my pancetta and coppocolla. Some may say it is excessive - $450 - but it is a life time buy and better than that I can slice my meat any time any how and anywhere - as long as I am at home! I will use it to slice my corned beef/pickled pork for jerky also! The meats are the fruit of my winter labour and are tasting awesome even if I do say so - but so say all the blokes down Mornington Peninsula Brewery when I have taken some samples down for Friday night drinks!


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## doon (15/12/13)

Damn that looks tasty!


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## shaunous (15/12/13)

Mercs Own said:


> I finally bought my own slicer so I don't have to go to my local and ask them to thinly slice my pancetta and coppocolla. Some may say it is excessive - $450 - but it is a life time buy and better than that I can slice my meat any time any how and anywhere - as long as I am at home! I will use it to slice my corned beef/pickled pork for jerky also! The meats are the fruit of my winter labour and are tasting awesome even if I do say so - but so say all the blokes down Mornington Peninsula Brewery when I have taken some samples down for Friday night drinks!


I want one.

nearly got one at a closed butcher auction, but failed to register properly and it was given to the next bid, would got it for a steal to.


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## scon (18/12/13)

I bought a hobart slicer 2nd hand from Gumtree for $160 - next cheapest 2nd hand price I could find was about $700.

This is it:





And this is what it does to some loin cured in orange, garlic and fennel:


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## Lord Raja Goomba I (18/12/13)

Saw this on ebay - ends today. If I lived in SYD, I might get this past the missus to start curing.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Meat-Slicer-/131071674778?pt=AU_SmallKitchenAppliances&hash=item1e847b099a&_uhb=1


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## Not For Horses (18/12/13)

Lord Raja Goomba I said:


> Saw this on ebay - ends today. If I lived in SYD, I might get this past the missus to start curing.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Meat-Slicer-/131071674778?pt=AU_SmallKitchenAppliances&hash=item1e847b099a&_uhb=1


I've got one of those. Paid 10 bucks for it at a clearance!
They're a good bit of kit if anyone is interested.


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## shaunous (18/12/13)

Off Topic Q about the meat slicers.

How is the moon shaped blade sharpened, as I'm guessing they'd need it regularly like a good handy knife. Or do you buy new ones, they look like they'd be tricky to sharpen, but I have never looked at one close up.

Like Seinfeld, has anyone's missus tried to slice a slither off their high heels to even them up


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## Ducatiboy stu (18/12/13)

Set them in a sharpening jig and rotate them against a stone.


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## shaunous (18/12/13)

Now that sounds technical...

Say if your a lazy prick who hates cutting roasts to serve, these work for that? I'm guessing they do, but just incase this is a stupid question and it wouldn't cut cooked, warm, softish meat.


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## Ducatiboy stu (18/12/13)

It will.

A mate of mine who was a butcher told me that cutting cooked meat will blunt a knife a lot quicker than with raw meat. And he proved it to me.


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## shaunous (18/12/13)

I've noticed most have an inbuilt sharpener, handy!


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## punkin (19/12/13)

Yes, they have adjustable sharpening stones built in on the commercial models.


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## chalky (26/1/14)

After reading all 28 pages of this thread last Sunday, I got excited and have since purchased a mincer, a sausage filler and a pile of books. Thanks to all who have contributed  

I have already made 2 batches (totalling 8kg) of fresh sausage as sausage filling practice before Salami season. 

Has anybody used these - and lived to tell the tale? 
http://www.drybagsteak.com/shop-umai-charcuterie.php

--Chalky


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## Diced (3/2/14)

Hi all,

I have enjoyed reading this post. I have started making fresh snags and am now very keen to get into the world of salami!
As even in winter we don't really have the best conditions for salami making I have decided to make a curing chamber.
I have hooked up a Raspberry Pi (micro computer) to a bunch of relays controlling the fridge, humidifer and a computer fan to extract air from the fridge.

I am hoping to get some advice on how consistant the humidity needs to be. When the compressor turns on the moisture in the air is condesnsed which drops the RH dramatically. In the middle of the day (40 deg C) the fridge usually turns on for 15mins every 50mins and the RH takes nearly 10mins after it is turned off to get back to 70%RH. Is this too inconsistant?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Cheers
Luke


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## Ducatiboy stu (3/2/14)

Would love to know more about hpw you logged the temp & humidity


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## Ducatiboy stu (3/2/14)

Saying that...long term avg looks reasonable


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## Diced (4/2/14)

Hi Ducatiboy stu, as I am using the Raspberry Pi, which is just a credit card sized computer, as my controller when i wrote the code I programmed it to save Temp and RH to a log sheet so I could graph it later.
So as long as the average is reasonable the peaks and troughs are not so important?

Cheers


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## shaunous (4/2/14)

Your troughs seem to only last a coupla mins, i wouldnt worry about that, the salami would big enough it wont have time to react to sudden temp and humidy spikes. Not that i've ever made salami, but same rules apply to any food really, if you were hanging little thin salami well maybe that would have time to react in a big way, decent size salami in my thinking wouldn't matter to much, as stu said, your average looks the looks. But some expert may help you better.


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## void (1/6/14)

Hi all - first post to the forums but have been reading and brewing for about 2 months now. Read this thread from beginning to end and am now inspired to start curing meat. Have already forewarned SWMBO. 

Has anyone tried making sobrassada? First tasted it a few years ago at a pub in Sydney (The Carrington in Surry Hills), and have been fascinated by it since. It's similar to salami in that it is a raw cured sausage, except instead of being dry, it is soft and spreadable, and utterly delicious. Perfect beer snack when spread on some toasted crusty bread with a splash of olive oil. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sobrassada


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## Mercs Own (14/6/14)

I haven't made it or had sobrassada but I have been using Nudja which is pretty much the same thing but of Italian origin. A company here in Melbourne called Salume make a fantastic Nudja, Princi also make a fairly good one. I use it in a pasta sauce which is really damn good even if I do say so. I have a feeling some one here made some and there may be a recipe in this thread somewhere - there are plenty of recipes on the web. Have a go and let us know how it turns out.

Cheers


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## pat_00 (9/7/14)

I won't gloat too hard, but I just got back from 3 weeks in Italy.

The main culinary highlight for me was a random purchase of a skanky looking 3 Euro link of Salami from a Market in Florence. I found out that it was a truffle salami. One of the most amazing cured meats I have ever tasted. So intense.

Anybody tried making this? I suppose the local cost factor of truffles would be off putting?


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## Muscovy_333 (24/7/14)

Good read fellas...
Bumped into Merc last week at MPB and got talking about Salami over a beer (as you do)
Enough to inspire me to have a crack at my first 10kg batch this weekend!
Going to reduce some wild apples' cider that I brewed last season, spice it with sage and peppercorns and add it as one of my flavour variants.


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## Aces High (25/7/14)

I've been making copa recently, its pretty damn easy I reckon. This was my first 1.7kg piece. If finished out at 1.1kg dry weight and tasted awesome... and didn't last very long. I just started another 6 kgs of copa to keep up with requests from some friends


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## Mercs Own (17/8/14)

Muscovy how did the salami turn out, got any pics?

Aces looks pretty awesome mate!!


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## Steve (17/8/14)

You still making your salami Mercs? Good memories of some of the salami you sent me in the chilli sauce/salami swap thread some 4 or so years ago.
Hope you are well.
Cheers
Steve


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## Wolfman (18/8/14)

Hey Merc have you checked out my Mettwurst thread?


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## Mercs Own (1/12/14)

Wolfman said:


> Hey Merc have you checked out my Mettwurst thread?


no but I will!


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## Mercs Own (1/12/14)

Steve said:


> You still making your salami Mercs? Good memories of some of the salami you sent me in the chilli sauce/salami swap thread some 4 or so years ago.
> Hope you are well.
> Cheers
> Steve


Hey Steve made 30 kilos this year! It never seems to last though!?


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## Mercs Own (24/5/15)

Well it is almost that time of the year again and I am sure most you guys and girls are getting ready to put your orders in for pork or pigs, getting skins and capsicum paste etc I am really excited and cant wait to get all the goods and see those babies hanging in the garage!

I have a question and a problem that I am hoping some one can help me out with regarding one of my salami recipes. It is an equal mix pork and beef salami with an extra 10% pork fat added due to the leanness of the beef. Spiced up with black pepper etc and also red wine that has been infused with garlic and also a small amount of capsicum paste. The problem is I had to throw all 10 kilos of this out due to holes through the middle of them - holes cracks - so they oxidised a bit. It didn't matter if they were 42 m skins of the 55 mil ones it happened to all of them - and last years also.

I am wondering what is causing this? The process of making the salami is exactly the same as when I make my pork salami's so it is not the process that is the issue. They hung around the same time - made pork first then beef and pork a week later - so I don't think it is a difference in temps.

I am wondering if it is the amount of wine I am using - 700mil in 10 kilos of meat plus 600 mils of cap paste. (I use 5 cups - 1.25litres cap paste in 10 kilos of pork and fennel salami) 

The meat doesn't feel too wet - is very sticky when I stuff it into skins - feels pretty well packed etc

Any one had this problem? Any one making salami with wine in it? Help and advice welcome!


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/5/15)

Maybe there is some fermentation going on inside that is causing gas pockets ...


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## Mercs Own (24/5/15)

Boil the wine and reduce it a little to accentuate flavour and kill off any active yeast?


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/5/15)

Maybe the capsicum paste is fermenting...

other than that.....no idea...


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## shaunous (24/5/15)

Aces High said:


> I've been making copa recently, its pretty damn easy I reckon. This was my first 1.7kg piece. If finished out at 1.1kg dry weight and tasted awesome... and didn't last very long. I just started another 6 kgs of copa to keep up with requests from some friends
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Fark that looks amazing, how long did that take to cure ??

Did you do it in a metered box or just hung in the shed?


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## Aces High (24/5/15)

shaunous said:


> Fark that looks amazing, how long did that take to cure ??
> 
> Did you do it in a metered box or just hung in the shed?


its takes about 2 weeks to cure in the fridge, then I put it in a temperature / humidity controlled fridge for about 4 to 6 weeks to dry. You should b able to hang it in a shed to dry in winter. I might try it myself this year

When you slice it thin it just melts on your tongue


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## Ducatiboy stu (24/5/15)

Its a shame the winters up here in gods country is not suited to Salami's.

I grew up in Leeton in the Riverina NSW and the winters there where good for Salami

Nice long cold nights and cool days for 2-3 mnths

Had Italian neighbours, mostly immigrants and bought all that knowledge with them

They used to make one sausage with just pork, garlic and chilli....some where almost pure fat with a meat core....so many different types

Still remember the days when I was a kid and we would do share kills. ( We did a Steer, they did a Pig and another bloke did a few sheep ) and coming home to see rows of sausages and salami's hanging up under the verandah.

To think, 20-30 yrs ago I was eating organic beef, pork & lamb as a kid, because it was cheaper that way.


But those salami and sausages where just to die for....



Then it got trendy....


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## dkaos (24/6/15)

Found a PDF that shows how to use a wine cooler, humidifier and hygrostat to setup the right curing environment. It's basic but is a good idea and has some recipes too.

http://www.jamieoliver.com/jimmycharcuterie/dmc.pdf


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## Truman42 (7/7/15)

Well this weekend is my first journey into salami territory. Ive brought some cure #2 and some culture from eBay because I want to be safe for my first few batches, then I might have a go at salt only. And my mincer and hog casings come tomorrow.

I opened up my 2nd fermenting fridge which will be my curing chamber and it had black mould all over the walls. So had to pull the cover off the evaporator and sprayed the shit out of it with star San and wiped what I could. Don't think I got it all but hopefully the star San will at least neutralise it.

In the bottom of the fridge on the first shelf slot I have an ACM panel (aluminium composite) with a hole cut in the middle for a fan. I'm going to use a spotlight I have for brewing (with glass front covered with a metal disc to block out the light) under this plate which will keep ferment temps at 22C for the first 3 days. The fan will blow air past the light and out the front and up along the door to recirculate the air.
Then if needed I can put a bowl of salty water next to the lamp and a damp towel sitting on top of the plate to create extra humidity.

I've been doing tests the past few days and can hold 22C and 85% humidity no problems.

I'm also going to do a pancetta with some pork belly. Looking forward to giving this a crack and this thread has been awesome for advice and ideas.


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## beercus (7/7/15)

2015 vintage done and hanging. we bought 50kgs of pork this year. Over 2 days we prepared and made bacon, pancetta, fresh sausages and 3 different salami. Bacon will be ready in a week and the rest will be ready to taste in about 4 weeks. Need to go brew some beer to go with the meat!


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## Mercs Own (11/7/15)

beercus why do you stuff and net the salamis?


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## beercus (11/7/15)

Mercs Own said:


> beercus why do you stuff and net the salamis?


The nets allow constant pressure on the meat while drying. The net shrinks as the meat shrinks. Allows you to avoid air pockets within the salami reducing the potential for aerobic bacteria to exist .

Beercus


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## Mercs Own (11/7/15)

bad photos of this years pancetta and capicollo. The pancetta's are about 1.3 kilos each.


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## Mercs Own (11/7/15)

Just stuffed 10 kilos of pork, beef, red wine, garlic and black pepper salami's!


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## DU99 (11/7/15)

:icon_offtopic: anyone been to this place in north melbourne


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## beercus (11/7/15)

DU99 said:


> :icon_offtopic: anyone been to this place in north melbourne


She has all the equipment and other stuff you need, but I think the classes are overpriced


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## beercus (11/7/15)

First time capicollo for me this year, excited about this one....


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## Mercs Own (12/7/15)

DU99 said:


> :icon_offtopic: anyone been to this place in north melbourne


They have Cellar Plus near the Vic markets on Peel street. I get my supplies there although last week when I went in they were out of a lot of stuff as they are moving premise up the road on Victoria Street. As for the classes and price $155 seems okay when you think about the Australian BBQ school charges $400 pp and a mob down here doing two day salami classes charges $550 pp and you don't even get to take a salami away!!


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## beercus (12/7/15)

Not a huge fan of cellar plus, I have been to their Epping store. I used "home make it" this year. They are in reservoir and claytom I think. I think cellar plus, home make it and the sausage lady are all in the same family.... 

I can not justify that much money for classes, I would rather spend that on books and do my own research.

Beercus


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## Truman42 (12/7/15)

The missus and I had a salami making day today. Certainly was good weather for it here in Melbourne.

Ended up with around 11 salamis and also did a pancetta. Took a bit getting used to the sausage stuffer so we ended up with some fat salamis and some that were longer and skinny.


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## Truman42 (12/7/15)

DU99 said:


> :icon_offtopic: anyone been to this place in north melbourne


I just brought some salt, spices, stainless hooks and string from this place. Used their click and collect so saved $18 on postage and had one of our drivers at work pick it up for me.


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## Truman42 (12/7/15)

Is anyone using hog casings? We used 38-42mm hog casings and had all sorts of dramas with them slipping through the bubble knots.

A couple that didn't slip through ended up breaking at the knots instead. I'm thinking that perhaps we made them too long and heavy. For now I'm leaving them on a chopping board in my curing chamber whist they ferment. Then hopefully once they are ready to age the casings will be a bit dryer and tougher and I can hang them in a couple of days.


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## beercus (12/7/15)

Truman said:


> Is anyone using hog casings? We used 38-42mm hog casings and had all sorts of dramas with them slipping through the bubble knots.
> A couple that didn't slip through ended up breaking at the knots instead. I'm thinking that perhaps we made them too long and heavy. For now I'm leaving them on a chopping board in my curing chamber whist they ferment. Then hopefully once they are ready to age the casings will be a bit dryer and tougher and I can hang them in a couple of days.


Net them and then hang off the netting.

Beercus


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## Truman42 (15/7/15)

I worked out that I didn't really do my bubble knots properly. Next time I'm going to tie the dirt knot then flip the casing over a skewer and tie the second knot then remove the skewer so I have a definite loop in my casing.
Someone also suggested using fencing pliers and stainless hog rings which should also work well.

After 48 hours my salamis had dropped to a ph of 4.7 so I've dropped the temperature in the chamber down to 13C and the humidity seems constant at 90%. I have my fan running at a slow speed for air circulation and I open the door before work in the morning and again at night. I'm worried I'm going to struggle getting the humidity down to 80% after two weeks although maybe it's just up around 90% due to the moisture coming out of the salamis. They always look wet. Should they be looking more drier by now?


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## beercus (15/7/15)

Truman said:


> I worked out that I didn't really do my bubble knots properly. Next time I'm going to tie the dirt knot then flip the casing over a skewer and tie the second knot then remove the skewer so I have a definite loop in my casing.


Tonight on Vasilli's garden he had a guy making salami. He used cable ties on the salami, then tied off that. Cable ties look nice and efficient and no cut hands from tying.....

Beercus


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## Truman42 (16/7/15)

beercus said:


> Tonight on Vasilli's garden he had a guy making salami. He used cable ties on the salami, then tied off that. Cable ties look nice and efficient and no cut hands from tying.....
> 
> Beercus


i considered cable ties and was going to experiment with them. Wasnt sure if they would pull up tight enough on themselves to stay in place. I suppose tiny ones would do the trick.


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## Truman42 (23/7/15)

My salamis have been hanging for 10 days now and have lost an average of around 23% in weight. My smallest lost 28% and largest lost only 19%. I'm worried this might be too much.
They were in my chamber at 90% RH for the first week then I've tried to drop the RH to around 80% for this 2nd week.

I've noticed during the day when the fridge kicks in more the RH will stay around 76-80% but at night when the ambient drops the RH climbs to 90-92% because the fridge doesn't run at all. I was spritzing them with water but I dont anymore to try and get the RH down.

I used 38-42mm hog casings. They don't feel too dry, still sort of tacky and greasy but the amount of weight loss concerns me as I have read you want around 10% per week.

I dont know how you salami makers in Melbourne are doing it in your garages as my RH is only around 50% lately in the garage which surely is too dry especially for the first few weeks.


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## shaunous (23/7/15)

I haven't made Salami yet, still setting my fridge/humidifier up, but 90% seems way to high from what ive read. Does your set up have a water boiler/warmer and fridge to cool all working together with the controller Truman??


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## Truman42 (23/7/15)

90% is good whilst fermenting for the first few days if your using culture and 80-90% is good for the first week. But then you want to drop it to 70-80% for a week and 60-70% the week after that (according to the recipe Im following)

Im not using anything to keep the humidity that high, Its just the moisture in the salamis coming out I guess.


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## benno1973 (23/7/15)

It sounds a bit counter intuitive, but you could add a heat belt / heat pad / aquarium heater in there so that the fridge kicks in and drops the humidity? I haven't tried this, just speculating...


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## Ducatiboy stu (23/7/15)

I think you also need air movement, which is why hanging them in a room work better then in a sealed fridge.


Someone on the internet mentioned it


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## benno1973 (23/7/15)

Yep, but you can make use of a PC fan and ensure air exchange by opening the fridge morning and evening. Some people drill a big hole in the door of the fridge and mount the PC fan there (behind some flywire) to ensure air exchange, but I doubt, if I did that, that my curing fridge would hold 12C in summer months when the temp was 45C in the shed.


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## benno1973 (23/7/15)

Truman said:


> Im not using anything to keep the humidity that high, Its just the moisture in the salamis coming out I guess.


You can build your own dehumidifier with some rock salt and a false bottomed container.

Alternatively, I have used these dehumidifiers, but they crap out after 12 months and it's an expensive option if you have to replace them yearly...


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## Truman42 (23/7/15)

i have a fan in the bottom of the fridge (See my picture posted on the previous page of this thread) I also used a heat lamp under the fan to raise the temp so the fridge kicked in more and my humidity lowered.

Humidity isnt really my issue. During the day it will drop to 77-82% as the fridge cuts in more. At night it climbs to around 88-90% but thats when I can use my heat lamp to keep the fridge cutting in more. I even have the heat lamp connected to my voltage regulator so I can control how much heat it outputs so it doesnt climb too quickly.

My main issue is that despite my high humidity Ive still lost an average of 22% in weight after only 10 days. Is this too much?


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## beercus (23/7/15)

you want to keep the salami below 15oC and around 65% Humidity.

I do not use a chamber just the shed. At the start of the cure we put out 3 or 4 eskies full of salt water to increase humidity and then take them away as we go, just as insurance against case hardening. The Melbourne weather is absolutely perfect at the moment. Our curing shed is sitting pretty..... Maybe a bit to cold over the last week at night time, but plenty of rain has been good.

We leave the door open during some days to get air movement. This aids drying.

I like the idea of a curing chamber but it would have to be big to hold 30kg of salami or i would have to make a little throughout the year. 

Beercus


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## benno1973 (23/7/15)

Truman - Not necessarily. Sometimes it's a good indication that things are working well. If you get case hardening, you will find that the outside is hard but the moisture loss stops because the inside can't lose water. If you have a few salami, cut one open and taste test to see how it's tracking. If the case is slightly hard, don't be too concerned - some people vacuum seal their salami to allow the inside/case to equalise for a few days before they eat them.


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## Truman42 (23/7/15)

Kaiser Soze said:


> Truman - Not necessarily. Sometimes it's a good indication that things are working well. If you get case hardening, you will find that the outside is hard but the moisture loss stops because the inside can't lose water. If you have a few salami, cut one open and taste test to see how it's tracking. If the case is slightly hard, don't be too concerned - some people vacuum seal their salami to allow the inside/case to equalise for a few days before they eat them.


Well they aren't case hardened and most still feel sticky to touch on the main body of the salami. Its only up near the tops where they are thinner that the casing is drier and somewhat harder. I had read that you don't want more than 10% weight loss per week but have since found out that it depends on how thick your salamis are. I used 38-42 hog casings so can expect to lose moisture quicker and therefore mine will be ready a lot sooner. 



Here's a pic of how they look now.


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## benno1973 (27/7/15)

Truman said:


> Well they aren't case hardened and most still feel sticky to touch on the main body of the salami. Its only up near the tops where they are thinner that the casing is drier and somewhat harder. I had read that you don't want more than 10% weight loss per week but have since found out that it depends on how thick your salamis are. I used 38-42 hog casings so can expect to lose moisture quicker and therefore mine will be ready a lot sooner.


They are looking pretty good! Firstly, the sticky/tacky skins can be a few things, however given that your humidity isn't too high/low, I'd say it's probably yeast on the skins. That's not a bad thing, it's a precusrsor to the mould that will follow.

You have some nice white spots of mould there, keep an eye on them to ensure that the white mould spreads. You can 'spread' it manually over the salami if you like by washing/sanitising your hands and literally wiping the mould around the salami with your fingers. It'll look and feel obscene, so do it in private. It's a little like making camembert - when you see the first tufts of white mould, you rub it over the surface of the cheese with clean hands.

Speaking of mould, if you want to encourage some good white mould, you can take some camembert or brie rind, or the casing of a mouldy salami and add it in to a spray bottle with some water, then mist this over your salamis. I use a bit of the p. Candidum powder that I have for cheese making. If you get any black mould on your salami, wipe it off with a cloth dipped in vinegar. Blue and green moulds can be bad, but... the fruiting bodies of some white moulds can be blue/green so they aren't necessarily a sure sign that you need to bin them.

You mention that the tops are thinner - it's possible that the salamis weren't stuffed fully? When you hang them, the meat falls to the bottom of the casing which makes the tops look thinner. The tops will then dry out quicker, leaving the sausage with a varying consistency from end to end. Or maybe it's something else.

And yes, with hog casings which are slightly smaller than ox runners, you'll dry faster and be able to eat them sooner!!


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## benno1973 (27/7/15)

Sausage making day yesterday -125kg of pork and we ended up with 275 salami, half pepper and half chilli. Was a great day, plenty of beer drunk, and pork parts consumed along the way.


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## Truman42 (30/7/15)

I cut a small one of mine open and it had case hardened. The rest feel hard on the outside too but still soft and squishy on the inside. The middle was more like a sausage. I don't know why when my RH was always at the higher end of the required range. 

Could possibly be due to the fan although I eisnt have it running all the time and had it on low speed. The recipe said to spritz them twice a day but I was worried they wouldn't dry out so only did that every now and again. I've soaked them in red wine for ten minutes to soften the casings and will leave them another week to see how they go. Then vac seal them and hopefully they will equalise. 

After 15 days I've lost around 32-33% for the larger ones and 37-39% for the smaller ones.


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## Mercs Own (9/8/15)

First of my salami's to be tasted and cryovaced along with the first sample of this years pancetta!


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## QldKev (9/8/15)

Good timing, I've just packaged up the smaller of my cured meats too. The bits 2kg etc need a bit longer to finish drying.

A coppa








Mixed Coppa, pancetta, prosciutto


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## Mercs Own (9/8/15)

OldKev - looks absolutely awesome!!


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## QldKev (9/8/15)

Mercs Own said:


> OldKev - looks absolutely awesome!!


Thanks for the compliment. Thank you to you for the motivation to give it a go! Another couple or so weeks the bigger cuts should be ready. Then to save up and get another 1/2 a pig. Have you ever done a boconer? I'm thinking the flavors should be that next level.


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## Truman42 (9/8/15)

Looks bloody awesome kevvo. My pancetta is still curing but hopefully will turn out good.

It has some nice white mould growing on it.


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## benno1973 (10/8/15)

Kev, that looks awesome! Looks like it should last you a while too!

I cut into my first chilli sausage over the weekend, just a smaller one that had dried a bit faster than the others. We ran out of chilli flakes when making these, so rummaged through the spice drawer on the day to see what we could add. Added everything spicy we could find - Kashmiri chilli powder, smoked chilli powder, Korean chilli flakes, smoked paprika - and the results are sensational! Will probably never be able to reproduce it...


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## Mercs Own (10/8/15)

Kaiser looking delicious!

What do you guys do for case hardening? I have 20 kilos of pork and fennel salami stuffed into 43 and 50m casings and the are a little firm on the outside and feel hollow on the inside!!!! Don't want to lose them! I have been spraying them down with red wine and water every couple of days but.... Am thinking if I cryovacing them for a week to soften them up then rehang might work? Soak them in a bucket of water for half an hour and rehang?? Just leave them and pray to the salami gods?


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## Truman42 (10/8/15)

My smaller salamis had case hardened but also felt like they were almost done when I squeezed them so I vac sealed them and left them in the fridge for 2 weeks. We tried them last night and they had equalised and were perfect. The larger ones had case hardened but still felt quite soft in the middle so I soaked them in red wine for 10 minutes, massaging it into the casings then re hung them. This seemed to work and they lost more weight and are now ready to vac seal to equalise.

What will i do next time to try and stop case hardening?

1. Spray them everyday with red wine for at least two weeks. ( I was worried they were too wet so stopped doing this)
2. Don''t bother using my fan in the fridge and instead just open the door morning and night for an air exchange.

These were soaked in red wine and hung for another week. They lost another 10% moisture and are now around 46% weight loss so I will vac seal them

Washing them in red wine also spread the white mould growth more evenly across them.


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## benno1973 (10/8/15)

The salami gods have been kind to me this year, minimal case hardening. To prevent it, I spray camembert mould on the sausages on day 1 and 3 to get a good bloom of white mould growing. I find this protects the sausage and allows the moisture to be drawn out slowly. I also spray them with water (never thought about wine!) morning and night if the humidity is low in the shed.

Truman - that looks good! Have you tasted yet?


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## Truman42 (10/8/15)

Kaiser Soze said:


> The salami gods have been kind to me this year, minimal case hardening. To prevent it, I spray camembert mould on the sausages on day 1 and 3 to get a good bloom of white mould growing. I find this protects the sausage and allows the moisture to be drawn out slowly. I also spray them with water (never thought about wine!) morning and night if the humidity is low in the shed.
> 
> Truman - that looks good! Have you tasted yet?


Yeah we tried some last night. Bloody great. very spicy though, might have to cut back a smidge on the chilli next time. i might spray mine with PC next time and see how I go. Good idea.


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## Aces High (14/8/15)

For those people on the east coast, where are you buying your sausage casings? All the places online are ridiculously expensive compared to the wholesale butcher supplies place I used to buy from in Perth.

Im now on the mid north coast of NSW, but go to Sydney pretty regurlarly


I even got screwed over by OFH (Orange Farm Hardware) that someone recommended to me. I ordered 18 metres of beef middles through his website and when they turned up it was only 9 M. I rang him and said I ordered 18M to which he told me the website was wrong and its only 9 metres and I would have to reorder ( and pay another $15 freight), which pushed the price up to about $5/ metre with freight. 

I tried to push the point that I ordered off his website in good faith and I should get the 18 metres I ordered. He finally told me it was his business and he could do what he liked and that he had hundreds of customers and didn't need me. I notice he has now updated his website and my order has been deleted from my account. That's quality customer service right there!


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## QldKev (14/8/15)

I haven't used these yet, but will be ordering from them soon


15m of 43-46mm is $29.70 posted
http://www.thecasingboutique.com/products/beef/beef43-46


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## Aces High (14/8/15)

QldKev said:


> I haven't used these yet, but will be ordering from them soon
> 
> 
> 15m of 43-46mm is $29.70 posted
> http://www.thecasingboutique.com/products/beef/beef43-46


I've used the Casing boutique, the quality and service was good and they came in a nice plastic container, but I would rather just buy a standard hank from a wholesaler at the right price. These guys are selling to the smaller guys and charging accordingly. Alright if you're doing 10kg or less, but when you're looking at doing 50kg or a whole animal it gets pretty pricey.

Kev, you might want to consider the 50-55mm casings from them, they are specified as beef middles which are much straighter and I reckon easier to hang if you're making salami

aces


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## Truman42 (17/8/15)

The missus and I made batch number 2 on the weekend. Being a little more experienced with the sausage stuffer we were able to fill these ones with a lot more mince so they turned out a lot fatter than the first batch we did.

It might be time to go from 38-42 mm hog casings up to something bigger next time...lol


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## Lincoln2 (18/8/15)

I don't know this lady, just came across the article somehow: interesting read.

http://www.tammijonas.com/2015/08/05/the-regulation-diaries-primesafes-war-against-salami-days/


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## Truman42 (18/8/15)

Lincoln2 said:


> I don't know this lady, just came across the article somehow: interesting read.http://www.tammijonas.com/2015/08/05/the-regulation-diaries-primesafes-war-against-salami-days/


So why the hell did they have to destroy their salami if they weren't selling it and it was only for their own consumption?


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## Lincoln2 (19/8/15)

> So why the hell did they have to destroy their salami if they weren't selling it and it was only for their own consumption?


Think about any aspect of your life and how much of it is controlled/regulated/overseen by the government.


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## Diced (27/8/15)

Please help! I just put my first batch of salami in to ferment, i used opti start sprint quick red (staphylococcus carnosus & pediococcus pentosaceus). The pack has no details of temps and after researching i only found referrence to keeping ferment under 24c. It is averaging a bit of 19c at the moment and 85%RH. Is this ok??


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## Lincoln2 (2/9/15)

A bloke I know bought a new smoker and smoked some salami he'd just made but didn't know how to control the temp. It turned out fully cooked, more like a big old rissole than salami. The one he gave my mate he also wrapped and tied it so it looked like a massive horse cock - complete accident. Didn't we have some fun. He's a vet so I'm a bit wary about his source of meat.


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## shaunous (2/9/15)

Lincoln2 said:


> A bloke I know bought a new smoker and smoked some salami he'd just made but didn't know how to control the temp. It turned out fully cooked, more like a big old rissole than salami. The one he gave my mate he also wrapped and tied it so it looked like a massive horse cock - complete accident. Didn't we have some fun. He's a vet so I'm a bit wary about his source of meat.


Wowzers.

Get some Horse Sedative off him and call it even. That Kedamine is good gear.


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## Aces High (3/9/15)

Last weekends batch. I think im pushing the fridge to full capacity. I'll have to get in earlier next year so it can be hung in the shed while its still cold enough





There has been talk of raising some pigs for next year and doing everything, salami, coppa, prosciutto etc. Its gonna make for a very big weekend.

And this is what you do once its all finished


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## Mercs Own (6/7/16)

Wow no salami threads this year!!! I am sure you guys have been making salami this last month but no posting so I thought I would kick this thread off again. Below are some pics from this years capocollo and pancetta


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## Mercs Own (6/7/16)

Pancetta


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## Mercs Own (6/7/16)

Last couple of pics include the 35 kilos of salami I did this year. 20 kilos of pork and fennel with chilli and 15 kilos of pork beef red wine black pepper and garlic. Stuffed in 50 mil and 43 mil collagen skins. I netted the 50's this year as I had trouble with them drying consistently last year. That said this year I made everything in June and the temp and humidity have been perfect!


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## sp0rk (6/7/16)

I'm very tempted to knock some out, it'll be very cold here for a while yet here in the Upper Hunter so they should be fine
Anyone done any beef salami?
I've gotten a very cheap source of beef so I'm keen to give it a go


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## shaunous (6/7/16)

Aces High said:


> Last weekends batch. I think im pushing the fridge to full capacity. I'll have to get in earlier next year so it can be hung in the shed while its still cold enough
> 2.jpg
> 3.jpg
> 
> ...


How did yours turn out?


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## shaunous (6/7/16)

Looks awesome Merc. 

Recently done a Charcuterie course and im super keen. Got myself a decent quality sausage filler and have access to a mincer. Just need to sort my curing fridge out and we're sweet.


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## Mercs Own (6/7/16)

sp0rk said:


> I'm very tempted to knock some out, it'll be very cold here for a while yet here in the Upper Hunter so they should be fine
> Anyone done any beef salami?
> I've gotten a very cheap source of beef so I'm keen to give it a go


you will still need some pork and pork fat in there to make it work. Here is my recipe for pork and beef salami that I make:
*[SIZE=16pt]Pork and Beef Red Wine Salami[/SIZE]*​​​[SIZE=medium]6.75 kilos pork mince – mix of shoulder and leg[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]6.75 kilos of girello mince[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]1.5 kilos pork back fat – minced[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]150g garlic smashed[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]1.05 litres bottle of red wine[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]12g fennel powder[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]22.5g chilli flakes[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]45g Black pepper[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]15g smoky paprika[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]450g salt[/SIZE]
[SIZE=medium]900 mil of capsicum paste[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Put the wine into an airtight container and add the smashed garlic and put in the fridge for one day. Strain garlic out of wine and add to the meat mix along with all of the other ingredients and mix extremely well until the meat is super sticky.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Stuffed in to 22 x 43m bungs 8 x 50 mils bungs[/SIZE]


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## Aces High (7/7/16)

Looking good Merc,

Shaunous, things got a bit more serous this year, this is Weezy, he lived a good free range life and was well looked after. Its definitely a bigger commitment raising and killing your own, but it does give you a sense of fulfillment knowing where your food comes from.

We made salumi, bacon, ham and then cut the rest up into chops, tenderloin, spare ribs, and numerous mini roasts. Still to do, coppa and make sausages.


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## peteru (7/7/16)

Judging by the colour of the salami, you used nitrates, right?

What is the white stuff, mould? If so, did you inoculate with a particular strain or is it wild?


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## Ducatiboy stu (7/7/16)

Cheese mould is good for salami


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## peteru (7/7/16)

A bit like yeast is good for beer. You still want the right kind in there to get the desired results.


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## Ducatiboy stu (7/7/16)

It a well known to use white cheese mould on Salami 

Something stolen from da Internetz

The salamis should develop a white mould on the outside (we also call this a cheese mould), due to the LS25 starter culture (which is also used in cheese-making, especially with white rind cheeses such as brie). This is a good mould, but if any other coloured moulds appear, i.e. black and/or blue moulds, sadly the salami is spoilt, so please throw it away. If you feel the amount of white mould is putting you off, use a very mild solution of malt vinegar and cold water, dampen a clean cloth with this solution and wipe the moulds off. This should not leave any odours or bad taste.

Read more: http://www.britishlarder.co.uk/home-made-salami/#ixzz4DhGzrM8z 
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial No Derivatives 
Follow us: @BritishLarder on Twitter | BritishLarder on Facebook


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## Steve (7/7/16)

Oops! A customer of mine brought in some of her salami that she was very proud of. It was wrapped in gladwrap and stored in work our fridge for a while until I saw white mold spots so I threw it in the bin! She was very distraught. It was probably magnificent!


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## peteru (7/7/16)

Right, so if this is LS25, then it's Lactobacilus. A bacterium, not a mould. Probably a good idea to keep the salami activities as far from beer brewing as practical.


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## Ducatiboy stu (7/7/16)

There are also white cheese moulds you can also use. Its pretty common actually


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## peteru (7/7/16)

I know, penicillin variants in particular. That's why I asked whether this was a result of specific inoculation or just a wild infection that just happens to look right.


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## Aces High (7/7/16)

peteru said:


> Judging by the colour of the salami, you used nitrates, right?
> 
> What is the white stuff, mould? If so, did you inoculate with a particular strain or is it wild?


I bought some bactoferm Mould 600 for the first time this year. Its the Penicillium Nalgiovense strain. I just put it in a spray bottle and sprayed them every day and I reckon it really helps the salami dry more evenly. I had no case hardening this time and I reckon a more even drying (although I think I also know how to work with my fridge better also)

Yes I use nitrates, I have no problem with nitrates and I have read the dodgey studies on them. Its obviously a personal choice thing, do what works for you, but I do like the nice red colour they give


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## Ducatiboy stu (7/7/16)

It would pay to inoculate to help keep the wrong ones at bay


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## Aces High (7/7/16)

Ducatiboy stu said:


> It would pay to inoculate to help keep the wrong ones at bay


Yeah Stu, i thought if i inoculated the salami fridge this one time i shouldn't need to do it again


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## shaunous (7/7/16)

As far as i have learnt, all healthy salami will grow white mould. The only reason people aint used to it is the major producers of cured meats wipe it off for presentation when selling.


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## QldKev (7/7/16)

sp0rk said:


> I'm very tempted to knock some out, it'll be very cold here for a while yet here in the Upper Hunter so they should be fine
> Anyone done any beef salami?
> I've gotten a very cheap source of beef so I'm keen to give it a go



Why dont you knock out a bressaola or two


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## Devhay (8/7/16)

What sort of temperatures do you guys cure these at?

Salami has always been the next hurdle to tackle after making bacon haha, Would I be able to hang them in my fermenting fridge around 18 deg?


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## sp0rk (8/7/16)

I've wondered about that too a bit, I'm not brewing a whole lot at the moment so my fridge is free most of the time
Just worried about cross contamination happening, which I've had before and took forever to clean up


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## Devhay (8/7/16)

Scratch that, after reading back through the thread a bit seems they'll need to be about 10 degrees cooler than that, with some reasonable airflow.
Will have to monitor the shed temps for a couple of days, hopefully I might be able to squeeze some in with the cool weather we've got at the moment


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## Ducatiboy stu (8/7/16)

Yes, you do need airflow


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## Aces High (8/7/16)

I ferment at about 12 degrees and have a computer fan turn on for 10 minutes four times a day. Works well for me. If you're just hanging in a shed, have a fan running to keep the air moving.


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## Mercs Own (11/7/16)

I recently looked at a salami fermentation fridge at Home Make It http://www.homemakeit.com.au/ They can hold around 60 kilos of meat. I was surprised to learn they hold the freshly made salami at 24 degrees for a couple of days and then slowly bring it down to 15 degree and all is done, cured and being eaten after three weeks. Cost was around $6000. I didn't ask if this was good practice with salami made with out nitrates. If they bring out a 30 kilo version I would be sorely tempted!!


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## sp0rk (11/7/16)

Mercs Own said:


> I recently looked at a salami fermentation fridge at Home Make It http://www.homemakeit.com.au/ They can hold around 60 kilos of meat. I was surprised to learn they hold the freshly made salami at 24 degrees for a couple of days and then slowly bring it down to 15 degree and all is done, cured and being eaten after three weeks. Cost was around $6000. I didn't ask if this was good practice with salami made with out nitrates. If they bring out a 30 kilo version I would be sorely tempted!!


Shit, a full size stand up freezer with a STC1000+ controlling the temp would be what I'd rather do
Then just set up an electronic timer to turn a PC fan on and off every 6 hours


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## Mercs Own (11/7/16)

sp0rk said:


> Shit, a full size stand up freezer with a STC1000+ controlling the temp would be what I'd rather do
> Then just set up an electronic timer to turn a PC fan on and off every 6 hours


and to keep the right humidity? Bowl of salted water?


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## Mercs Own (11/7/16)

_I reckon there is a serious business opportunity here to make and sell fermentation fridges. When you think of the amount of people coming into the world of salami making/cured meats etc there are some big numbers. If you could make an affordable fermentation fridge that worked great......._


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## sp0rk (11/7/16)

Mercs Own said:


> and to keep the right humidity? Bowl of salted water?


That possibly
I like to tinker so I'd probably set up an Arduino with a humidity controller to get the humidity right
Only problem with making and selling these fridges is there are people like me to know enough to set this stuff up cheaply so wouldn't buy one that's got nice sanitary stainless insides and is all setup to be easily controllable
But if you could knock at 60kg unit out for around $4k and be making a decent profit off it, I think plenty of the hipster eateries in the major cities would get in on them


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## Aces High (11/7/16)

Mercs Own said:


> I recently looked at a salami fermentation fridge at Home Make It http://www.homemakeit.com.au/ They can hold around 60 kilos of meat. I was surprised to learn they hold the freshly made salami at 24 degrees for a couple of days and then slowly bring it down to 15 degree and all is done, cured and being eaten after three weeks. Cost was around $6000. I didn't ask if this was good practice with salami made with out nitrates. If they bring out a 30 kilo version I would be sorely tempted!!


They do this because they initially ferment the meat using a meat starter culture. The starter culture creates acid at 25 degrees that drops the PH of the meat quickly stopping bacteria growth. Then they drop the temp down to 15 for curing.

Bactoferm sell this and I actually bought some, but ive never got around to trying it.


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## Aces High (11/7/16)

sp0rk said:


> That possibly
> I like to tinker so I'd probably set up an Arduino with a humidity controller to get the humidity right
> Only problem with making and selling these fridges is there are people like me to know enough to set this stuff up cheaply so wouldn't buy one that's got nice sanitary stainless insides and is all setup to be easily controllable
> But if you could knock at 60kg unit out for around $4k and be making a decent profit off it, I think plenty of the hipster eateries in the major cities would get in on them


On my fermenting fridge I have an stc 1000 and a computer fan that turns on for 10 minutes 5 times a day. I have a humidity controller (similar to an stc 1000 and bought off ebay) which controls a dehumidifier. I initially also bought a humidifier, but I have found through experience that I never need to use it. All up this set up cost me less than $100 and can do 20kg at a time. This set up can be used on pretty much any fridge and although it looks messy as there are cords and cables everywhere it works well.

I just got given that big cool-a-bar fridge that is in my previous posts and I am confident that I could do 100kgs in that using the same equipment. Its dimensions are 1200H x 1100W x 600D


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## shaunous (11/7/16)

Are u lads drilling holes in your fridges and covering with fly mesh? Or leaving the door open a little? Why couldn't the fan run 24/7, wouldnt that be easier instead of stuffing around with a timer? 
I have the STC1000 humidity controller equivalent, just havnt had the time yet to set it all up.


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## indica86 (12/7/16)

Anyone used the banquet bags from smoked and cured? Seem to be a decent solution for fridge curing.


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## gap (12/7/16)

indica86 said:


> Anyone used the banquet bags from smoked and cured? Seem to be a decent solution for fridge curing.


Yes, I use them and they work well. Just a bit difficult to vacuum seal with my sealer but they still work.
I use for pancetta, bresaola and cured pork scotch fillet.


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## Mercs Own (12/7/16)

indica86 said:


> Anyone used the banquet bags from smoked and cured? Seem to be a decent solution for fridge curing.


more info on these - never heard of them? Pics


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## indica86 (12/7/16)

http://www.smokedandcured.com.au/banquet-bags-dry-aged-steak-charcuterie/

Some for steak and some for smallgoods.
There are salami skins that don't need vacuum sealing that you can stuff and smoke and cure in the fridge. I have ordered some of them as living in FNQ shed curing will not work.
Bulk is available from http://www.mistygully.com.au/banquet-bag-cure-smoke-salami-casing-per-metre-20-metres-moq/ .


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## Aces High (12/7/16)

shaunous said:


> Are u lads drilling holes in your fridges and covering with fly mesh? Or leaving the door open a little? Why couldn't the fan run 24/7, wouldnt that be easier instead of stuffing around with a timer?
> I have the STC1000 humidity controller equivalent, just havnt had the time yet to set it all up.


yeah I cut a hole in the fridge this time, but previously I haven't bothered. If you run the fan in there 24/7 you will get case hardening in spots.. Its very hard to defuse the airflow enough so that it doesn't hit the same ones all the time. Also you just need a bit of airflow, you don't want constant, concentrated airflow in such a small space. You can buy the programmable timer off ebay for 5 bucks... it's not exactly going to break your budget.

I use this type. Ok this one is more than $5 bucks, but search and you will find them at that price. They come in both 240v and 12v


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## Devhay (13/7/16)

Picked up this thing this today







and these rocked up this arvo










I know I'm about a month late, but the old boy and I are hoping to knock out a couple of trial salamis this weekend, as well as some tasty bbq snags and have a crack at some home made bacon and pancetta while we're at it.


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## Mercs Own (17/7/16)

Devhay said:


> Picked up this thing this today
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I have made salami this late and a little later in the season and it was fine and even more so if you are using cures. Go for it.


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## Mercs Own (17/7/16)

My salami are three weeks hanging today and I have been very pleased with the temp and humidity in my garage. That said I cut one and tried one yesterday and there was slight case hardening and the middle was a little softer than I thought it would be (due to the case hardening feel of the outside) Being the air temp in the garage has been between 6 degrees on the coldest night and 14 on the warmest day and the humidity has been lowest 62% - 86% probably averaging 74% I am a little disheartened.

Not much to say really other than.....curing chamber?


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## shaunous (17/7/16)

Too cold merc?


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## shaunous (17/7/16)

Devhay let me know how that mincer performs whenever u give it a go. im in the market.


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## Devhay (18/7/16)

shaunous said:


> Devhay let me know how that mincer performs whenever u give it a go. im in the market.


Worked a treat for what we wanted, put 5kg of pork shoulder and 2.5kg of beef girello through it on Saturday arvo and it didn't skip a beat

got a little warm towards the end, but I think that was more due to the meat being warming up towards the end too.


Productive day for sure we managed to pump out 2kg of Salami, 2kg of Chorizo, 2kg of smokey bacon bbq snags, some left over mince for general cooking, a pork belly bacon & a pancetta curing in the fridge and while all that was happening some roo jerky in the dehydrator. 

Room to improve but I'd say a pretty successful effort for our first crack at sausages/salami, Salami is now hanging in a spare commercial style fridge in the garage with the door slightly ajar.. has been holding 10-15deg with 68-78% humidity 

Now we play the waiting game.. will be monitoring the temp and humidity pretty closely, have a small clip fan and a humidifier I can set up on timers if it starts to vary


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## shaunous (18/7/16)

Hell yeh Devhay! Im jealous.


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## Devhay (19/7/16)

Cheers Shaunous, was definitely a bit of fun!
Hopefully I can push it towards being a yearly tradition with the family haha


So far so good, is there anything I need to be keeping an eye out for while they're hanging? 

Casings going hard, dark mould etc?


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## Mercs Own (22/7/16)

Where are you hanging them? You want them in a cool dark environment with some air flow but not breezy. White mould is fine but black, blue or green mould is BAD. Use a cloth with red wine or vinegar to wipe mould off your salami's. I have some white mould on mine which I will wipe off soon but any other colour and it is straight away. As for case hardening there is not a lot you can do about it unless you are curing in a chamber. I cut one of my salami's last week at 3 weeks old and it was delicious but there was some case hardening. I have been spraying them down with water to keep humidity up but perhaps it has been a little too cold for them??

Keep doing what you are doing and you will learn.


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## indica86 (22/7/16)

I'm having a go shortly. I'll be using the banquet bags as I'll need to cure in the fridge, I'll also be using curing salt. All I have read says to heat the product - I will be smoking - to 60° internally. Has anyone done this? I assume it is like the heat treated commercial salamis?

The more I read the more I am confused.


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## peteru (22/7/16)

Heated to 60C is cooked. If you do that, you are not making a salami.


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## indica86 (23/7/16)

Yeah that is what I thought.


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## indica86 (28/7/16)

I think I have it worked out...


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## indica86 (15/8/16)

Alright, I used the banquet bags from Smoked and Cured to make 1 kg of salami.
Will post some pics at the end.


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## indica86 (17/8/16)

Alright, I'll post progress and see how this shit works.

Recipe

Homemade Salami Soppressata

1kg Pork Shoulder
28g salt
2.5g / ½ teaspoon cure #2
12g / 2 teaspoon dextrose
2g / 1 teaspoon black peppercorns
1g / ½ teaspoon red peppers flakes
1g / 1 teaspoon whole peppercorns
1g / ½ teaspoon chilli powder
1g / ½ teaspoon garlic powder
1/8 teaspoon Bactoferm T-SPX

Dissolve culture in 2 tablespoons boiled and cooled water.

Mix all other ingredients.

After 15 minutes add the culture and mix.

15th






17th






Colour change due to the culture doing what it should. One more day then fridge for curing....


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## peteru (17/8/16)

Not sure if you are following more detailed instructions elsewhere, but you probably want to make sure that when you mix the ingredients, you work the mixture well enough to emulsify it. It'll help with the final texture of the product.


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## indica86 (18/8/16)

Yep, got that one.
Just got some books too, a Salumi one and Chacuterie.


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## indica86 (1/9/16)

Pretty impressed with the casings from Smoked and Cured.
Had a sneaky ltaste a few days ago. The bigger ones are drying well and smell awesome.


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## indica86 (16/9/16)




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## manticle (16/9/16)

Looking good


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## shaunous (18/9/16)

indica86 said:


>


Looks great. So the casings are a success?


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## indica86 (19/9/16)

Yeah look I am impressed. Pics above were my second lot.


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## indica86 (7/11/16)

Made some more today. Highly recommend these casings if anyone wants to have a play with something that works flawlessly and safely.
30°c here during the day and still able to cure!
Smoke gets through them too.


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## indica86 (12/12/16)

Pancetta


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## tj2204 (12/12/16)

That looks amazing, I'm drooling all over my desk.


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## indica86 (19/7/17)

Anyone else making any?
I just made a batch of Salami Picante.
I also have some buffalo pepperoni curing at the moment.


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## Aces High (19/7/17)

We just finished a whole pig last weekend. Shot, gutted and salami'd. We ended up with 240 salami's. The pig was free range organic and the meat looked beautiful


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## indica86 (19/7/17)

Nice. All one recipe or some different ones?


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## Mercs Own (3/12/17)

The great thing about making salami is finally getting to eat it! Here is a pic of some of my produce from the 2016 season and still eating beautifully!


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## Ducatiboy stu (3/12/17)

Mercs Own said:


> The great thing about making salami is finally getting to eat it! Here is a pic of some of my produce from the 2016 season and still eating beautifully!




What was your address again


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## Truman42 (6/7/20)

I can't believe no one has posted in this thread in almost 3 years.....On the weekend I tried Mercs recipe way back at the start of this thread. I doubt he or many of the other members of AHB are even on here anymore. (Copped some flak from FB users saying its dangerous and I should have used instacure etc...but they can eat a dick.) If its good enough for Paul and thousands of other Italians...its good enough for me. My casings were 50mm collagen so I only got 5 salamis but they are nice and big.


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## roller997 (6/7/20)

They look quite nice - Are you going to use any netting to keep them tight?

I got together with a mate and we did 37KG of Salami which we shared. 
These were using 43mm casings and the recipes indicated by the pink post it notes from left to right were:
Caccitore Recipe as per Sara Grazia from Sausages made simple
Caccitore Recipe as above but with a fair bit of Fennel
Veneto Club Recipe (I did a course with them after doing a course some years ago with Sara)
Veneto Club Recipe with loads of Chilly flakes

The last 90 were German Landjaeger - Only 23mm thick and ready to eat in 2 weeks. These received 6 hours of cold smoking for 1/3 of them and then about 12-14 hours for the rest of them. These were by far the best type of Salami I have eaten in years and given how lean they were (70% pork without additional fat and 30% beef) I will be making more of those in the future. We didn't use the curing salt suggested in the recipe.





Landjäger


Landjager is a fermented German sausage




www.meatsandsausages.com





This site is awesome for recipes for any sausage including dry fermented sausages BUT they have this habbit of adding Dextrose at a fairly low rate. 
I don't know of a sausage type that they didn't have a recipe for.





Sausage Recipes


Detailed sausage recipes and instructions are provided for making different types of sausages. The recipes cover the production of fresh sausages, smoked sausages, salamis, fermented sausages, liver and blood sausages, and hams.




www.meatsandsausages.com






All of the recipes had the T-SPX bacteria to encourage good fermentation. 
Salt is the only preservation we used for these at around 3% of the meat / fat weight. We didn't use the cure in the Landjaegers given the bacteria and significant smoking.

I put my share of the Salami in my laundry and turned on a humidifier to get to 80% humidity for the first 5 days - Then I hung them high in the garage so the dog can't get to them and they started getting a lovely very light sprinkling of white mould. 
As mentioned the Landjaeger were done in less than 2 weeks and I vacuum sealed them on Sunday after sampling a couple.


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## Truman42 (6/7/20)

roller997 said:


> They look quite nice - Are you going to use any netting to keep them tight?
> 
> I got together with a mate and we did 37KG of Salami which we shared.
> These were using 43mm casings and the recipes indicated by the pink post it notes from left to right were:
> ...


hey mate they look awesome. Im going to try a few of those recipes. So you use the T-SPx bacteria to ferment them? I didn't use that or instacure with this lot as per Mercs recipe on the first page. And have copped a bit of flak from those saying its not safe and dangerous etc.

They are only 50mm casings so I wasn't going to use netting. Should I be??

EDIT:- Where did you get Saras recipe from? I can't find it on her website?


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## roller997 (6/7/20)

Truman42 said:


> hey mate they look awesome. Im going to try a few of those recipes. So you use the T-SPx bacteria to ferment them? I didn't use that or instacure with this lot as per Mercs recipe on the first page. And have copped a bit of flak from those saying its not safe and dangerous etc.
> 
> They are only 50mm casings so I wasn't going to use netting. Should I be??
> 
> EDIT:- Where did you get Saras recipe from? I can't find it on her website?



Netting - I used it for 43mm but probably did not need to if they were packed well enough and there was enough humidity during the first couple of weeks. For 50mm I probably would but you might be fine if it stays reasonably humid for the first couple of weeks. Salami is one of those variable things that depend a lot on environmental factors - Some aspects just reduce your dependence on everything being in your favour.

The bacteria is something I would recommend to start the fermentation. Think of it as using a beer yeast rather than waiting for wild yeast to start your fermentation. The chances are quite high that it will work out as the bad bacteria does not like the salty environment with minimal oxygen but adding the right bacteria provides them a head start. They are not too expensive when you look that you can use it for up to100KG of meat.
The instacure I think is a bit like meat cure 1 - It has sodium nitrate and sodium nitrite in it which is used for cured / fermented sausages as opposed to sodium nitrite only which is used for bacons and cooked sausages.
It is definately safer to use than relying on just salt and the bacteria but ultimately some folks don't like additional chemicals in their food even if this is the same found as in green leafy vegetables and lettuces. I didn't have the cure and I did a similar amount of Salami last year (with two more recipies than above) and I didn't get a spoilt one.

I did the course with Sarah so we received some recipes from her and then I also bought 2 of her books.
I think her recipes are fairly standard and the website above would have a similar one as well I would think.

The Cacciatori was as follows:
7KG pork sholder
3KG pork fat
280g salt (I rounded that up to 300)
50g coarse black pepper
50g ground black pepper
45g crushed coriander
500ml red wine
Given I like a bit of spice 30-50g of chilly flakes would provide a mild to medium Salami. My Veneto recipe was 130g of chilly flakes.

Cheers

Roland

Edit - Forgot to address query about netting


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## Truman42 (6/7/20)

roller997 said:


> The bacteria is something I would recommend to start the fermentation. Think of it as using a beer yeast rather than waiting for wild yeast to start your fermentation. The chances are quite high that it will work out as the bad bacteria does not like the salty environment with minimal oxygen but adding the right bacteria provides them a head start. They are not too expensive when you look that you can use it for up to100KG of meat.
> The instacure I think is a bit like meat cure 1 - It has sodium nitrate and sodium nitrite in it which is used for cured / fermented sausages as opposed to sodium nitrite only which is used for bacons and cooked sausages.
> It is definately safer to use than relying on just salt and the bacteria but ultimately some folks don't like additional chemicals in their food even if this is the same found as in green leafy vegetables and lettuces. I didn't have the cure and I did a similar amount of Salami last year (with two more recipies than above) and I didn't get a spoilt one.
> 
> ...


Cheers for the recipe. Will try that next using the 43mm casings like you did. I ike chilli and make a curry every Sunday using my dads home made chilli flakes from his chilli plants so will certainly add a decent amount. 

I used bacteria a few years ago when I made my first batch of salami but it didn't run out that good as I put too much fennel in and it over powered it so I didn't like the taste. I wanted to follow Mercs recipe and use only what he did which is why I didn't use the instacure or the bacteria. 

But Ill use the starter culture no:1 from Sausages made simple for the cacciatore. 

Do you know much about these meat slicers they sell. Im thinking of getting one?









Electric Meat Slicer - Domestic - Ausonia - Red


This Ausonia electric meat slicer is ideal for domestic use. It is made from a steel base and cast aluminium, giving it strength and stability when in use. The slicing




sausagesmadesimple.com.au


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## roller997 (7/7/20)

Truman42 said:


> Cheers for the recipe. Will try that next using the 43mm casings like you did. I ike chilli and make a curry every Sunday using my dads home made chilli flakes from his chilli plants so will certainly add a decent amount.
> 
> I used bacteria a few years ago when I made my first batch of salami but it didn't run out that good as I put too much fennel in and it over powered it so I didn't like the taste. I wanted to follow Mercs recipe and use only what he did which is why I didn't use the instacure or the bacteria.
> 
> ...



Sorry, but I have not had much experience with meat slicers but I do know that Sara at Sausages made Simple import good quality items that are often made in Italy and at a higher grade than some of the chinese kit available. 
Given the price and "parts made in Italy" I suspect that it will be quite good and it doesn't seem significantly more expensive than others I have seen. I am somewhat shy of buying food grade equipment from Ebay that comes from unknown sources with no local warranty since my grinder purchase and if I needed a slicer, I would have a look at this one.
I bought a 150KG per hour grinder from Ebay once and I suspect the drive shaft was just a touch short as the rear end of the screw ground against the back where the drive shaft comes out while I was grinding some pork shoulder and pork fat. Whe it was grinding the pork fat, we noticed it starting having these dark patches in the fat which turned out to be metal grindings. It ruined mostly pork fat so it wasn't that much of an issue but it does give you second thoughts about the suitability of these for food handling. The grinders she sells are quite good but at times quite a lot more than the cheap Chinese grinders that often have larger motors. 

Cheers

Roller


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## Truman42 (15/7/20)

roller997 said:


> Sorry, but I have not had much experience with meat slicers but I do know that Sara at Sausages made Simple import good quality items that are often made in Italy and at a higher grade than some of the chinese kit available.
> Given the price and "parts made in Italy" I suspect that it will be quite good and it doesn't seem significantly more expensive than others I have seen. I am somewhat shy of buying food grade equipment from Ebay that comes from unknown sources with no local warranty since my grinder purchase and if I needed a slicer, I would have a look at this one.
> I bought a 150KG per hour grinder from Ebay once and I suspect the drive shaft was just a touch short as the rear end of the screw ground against the back where the drive shaft comes out while I was grinding some pork shoulder and pork fat. When it was grinding the pork fat, we noticed it starting having these dark patches in the fat which turned out to be metal grindings. It ruined mostly pork fat so it wasn't that much of an issue but it does give you second thoughts about the suitability of these for food handling. The grinders she sells are quite good but at times quite a lot more than the cheap Chinese grinders that often have larger motors.
> 
> ...


Cheers mate yeah her meat slicers do look good so might go over there and check em out.


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