# Using Frozen Raspberries



## MattC (31/5/09)

Hey all, have this one in the fermenter at moment. I plan on adding 2kg of frozen raspberries to secondary for 7 days. Question is, can they just be thrown straight in or should they be treated in some way to guard against infection. 

Fishbone Raspberry Weizen
Brew Type: All Grain Date: 31/05/2009 
Style: Weizen/Weissbier Brewer: Matt Cawley 
Batch Size: 28.00 L Assistant Brewer: 
Boil Volume: 35.67 L Boil Time: 90 min 
Brewhouse Efficiency: 80.00 % Equipment: My Mash Stuff 
Actual Efficiency: 74.29 % 
Taste Rating (50 possible points): 35.0

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU 
2.75 kg Wheat Malt, Ger (3.9 EBC) Grain 52.38 % 
2.00 kg Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (3.9 EBC) Grain 38.10 % 
0.50 kg Vienna Malt (6.9 EBC) Grain 9.52 % 
15.00 gm Hallertauer, New Zealand [8.50 %] (60 min) Hops 11.7 IBU 
10.00 gm Hallertauer, New Zealand [8.50 %] (15 min) Hops 3.9 IBU 
1.00 tsp Salt (Mash 60.0 min) Misc 
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 min) Misc 
1.37 gm Kopperfloc (Boil 10.0 min) Misc 
2.00 kg Raspberries (Secondary 7.0 days) Misc 
1 Pkgs Weizen (AKA WB-06) (Craftbrewer #WB-06) Yeast-Wheat 

Beer Profile Estimated Original Gravity: 1.047 SG (1.044-1.052 SG) Measured Original Gravity: 1.044 SG 
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.014 SG (1.010-1.014 SG) Measured Final Gravity: 1.012 SG 
Estimated Color: 6.7 EBC (3.9-15.8 EBC) Color [Color] 
Bitterness: 15.6 IBU (8.0-15.0 IBU) Alpha Acid Units: 7.5 AAU 
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 4.38 % (4.30-5.60 %) Actual Alcohol by Volume: 4.17 % 
Actual Calories: 411 cal/l


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## TidalPete (31/5/09)

Just place them in secondary & rack on top of them (I use a big hop bag). I have only done a couple of fruit beers but learnt a valuable lesson the first time when I bottled too soon (9 days in secondary) resulting in excess carbonation in the bottle because I was too lazy to check the FG over 3 days.  

TP


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## fcmcg (31/5/09)

not that i've done it
but i have read in reputable HB mag's, that plenty of ppl just throw it in....esp considering if your beer fermented out right..you now have alcohol......i'd be thinking though that you'd de-frost in sterile conditios ad then pitch


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## 3G (31/5/09)

i brought mine up to 70 degrees for 5 mins but i think that was prob not needed.
2 kilo per 20 litre will give a nice colour and flavour. My raspberry wheat atm has 4 kilo fpr 20 litres and is nice but very acidic and def not a session beer. After a crook gut after a few too many pints i masured the pH and it is 3.2


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## MattC (31/5/09)

The plan was to dump them in frozen into the secondary and rack on top of them, leave for 7 days (or until the SG is steady for 3 days - thanks Tidal Pete) crash chill for 48 hours and keg. Crash chilling to allow excess material to flocculate and sink to bottom, hopefully any raspberries will as well, however will crash chilling make the beer clear when it should be cloudy (being a hefeweizen)?


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## Fourstar (31/5/09)

Personally, Bring them to room temp. Pour boiling water to cover for 10 mins then puree and drop into wort.

it will kill majority of any nasites and pasturise the fruit. Then by pureeing the fruit you are increasing the surface aria of the fruit and increasing the raspberry extraction. Im due for antoher raspberry wheat soon too!

Cheers!


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## tdack (31/5/09)

Fourstar said:


> Personally, Bring them to room temp. Pour boiling water to cover for 10 mins then puree and drop into wort.
> 
> it will kill majority of any nasites and pasturise the fruit. Then by pureeing the fruit you are increasing the surface aria of the fruit and increasing the raspberry extraction. Im due for antoher raspberry wheat soon too!
> 
> Cheers!



Other option is to place them in a glass/ceramic bowl and nuke them in the microwave for a few of minutes.


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## MattC (31/5/09)

Fourstar said:


> Personally, Bring them to room temp. Pour boiling water to cover for 10 mins then puree and drop into wort.
> 
> it will kill majority of any nasites and pasturise the fruit. Then by pureeing the fruit you are increasing the surface aria of the fruit and increasing the raspberry extraction. Im due for antoher raspberry wheat soon too!
> 
> Cheers!




Do you puree in a blender?


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## masculator002 (31/5/09)

3G said:


> i brought mine up to 70 degrees for 5 mins but i think that was prob not needed.
> 2 kilo per 20 litre will give a nice colour and flavour. My raspberry wheat atm has 4 kilo fpr 20 litres and is nice but very acidic and def not a session beer. After a crook gut after a few too many pints i masured the pH and it is 3.2




hmmmmm was that beer or hydrochloric acid or worse champagne?...lmao


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## masculator002 (31/5/09)

I made one a few years back with a heap of passionfruit pulp however I fermented it into the primary, and also did this with blackberries. both were raw fruit and although they didnt give a lot of flavour to the beer they did impart other qualities. The passion fruit beer was the clearest beer I have ever brewed, finings, isinglass etc. could not have gotten it that clear. Was clearer than a bottle of that shit they call champagne.


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## Stubbie (31/5/09)

> After a crook gut after a few too many pints i masured the pH and it is 3.2



I know what ya mean.

I made a 23L batch of blond last year witih 2kg of raspberries. So dry and tart it was undrinkable. It was embarrassing to even let people taste the stuff h34r: . The only reason I stopped short of tossing the lot out was because of all the effort in bottling into stubbies - I made it for my wife and knew it would take ages to work her way through it. Anyway, it's only now after 8 mths that its drinkable. The tartness and champagne like dryness has largely gone. Not really my style, but a remarkable improvement nonetheless.

So you may consider putting some aside for a few months, or more.

Stubbie.


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## Fourstar (31/5/09)

MattC said:


> Do you puree in a blender?




Stick/hand blender actually.


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## MattC (31/5/09)

Fourstar said:


> Stick/hand blender actually.



and you just dump em in secondary fourstar? All bits will sink to the bottom?


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## raven19 (31/5/09)

MattC said:


> and you just dump em in secondary fourstar? All bits will sink to the bottom?



Yep dump them into secondary.

Another point, run the finished beer thru some cheesecloth prior to into the keg (if using kegs), otherwise it shall block up your taps... I learnt this the hard way... :icon_cheers:


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## roger mellie (31/5/09)

Stubbie said:


> Snip
> 
> The tartness and champagne like dryness has largely gone.



What a shame - its the champagneness and pinkness that I really like about Raspberry wheats.

To answer the OP's question. I have made several of these - all I ever do is dump then in whilst frozen - in Secondary as you mention. Never a problem with infection.

RM


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## Renegade (1/6/09)

I would avoid blending, you dont want to crush the many tiny seed pods, or you'll end up with some nasty flavours. If if some reason you didnt want to use them whole, heat them up and mash them with a potato masher.


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## Stuffa (1/6/09)

If you just put the frozen raspberries into secondary whole they will just float on top of the wort. Freezing and thawing them actually burst all the cells in the fruit allowing the yeast access to all the goodies. At the end of secondary you will notice all the whole raspberries floating on the surface with all the colour leached out of them. Makes draining the fermenter easy with all the raspberries on the top.
I do all my raspberry wheats and raspberry ciders this way with no problems.
Good luck.


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## bconnery (1/6/09)

Renegade said:


> I would avoid blending, you dont want to crush the many tiny seed pods, or you'll end up with some nasty flavours. If if some reason you didnt want to use them whole, heat them up and mash them with a potato masher.



This is what I tend to do with Strawberries. Defrost them in the microwave a little, pour some boiling water over them and give them a quick mash with the potato masher. 
Just roughly but it all seems fine. 
With the frozen berries I tend to not worry too much. The colour and flavour leeks out pretty well.


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## HoppingMad (1/6/09)

Spoke to a commercial brewer about adding fruit to a beer a week ago and they bring in frozen fruit over unfrozen to their brewery as they've found by experimenting that the frozen stuff seems to lock in more flavour.

In their process they bring in frozen berries, thaw them then crush them ensuring they are not crushed too heavily to ensure you don't crush pips. If there are seeds in the fruit you don't want to release tannins. Then they pretty much put them in the primary over the top of the wort and pitch the yeast. The result is a beer that still has beer flavours, but a nice element of fruit over the top. Their attitude is don't open up the fermenters once everything is going as you don't want to risk bugs getting in so they don't add at secondary or anything like that. All in one drum. Once you rack you strain/filter everything off.

Know you're a little late now you're on secondary, but thought I'd pass this on.

Hopper.


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## roger mellie (1/6/09)

HoppingMad said:


> Spoke to a commercial brewer about adding fruit to a beer a week ago and they bring in frozen fruit over unfrozen to their brewery as they've found by experimenting that the frozen stuff seems to lock in more flavour.
> 
> In their process they bring in frozen berries, thaw them then crush them ensuring they are not crushed too heavily to ensure you don't crush pips. If there are seeds in the fruit you don't want to release tannins. Then they pretty much put them in the primary over the top of the wort and pitch the yeast. The result is a beer that still has beer flavours, but a nice element of fruit over the top. Their attitude is don't open up the fermenters once everything is going as you don't want to risk bugs getting in so they don't add at secondary or anything like that. All in one drum. Once you rack you strain/filter everything off.
> 
> ...



From my (albeit limited) experience with putting fruit in too soon - the yeast strips out all the colour and flavour - leaving less in the finished product.

Just my 2c - if you want maximum flavour and colour from the fruit - add in secondary - leave for a week. 

RM


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## bconnery (1/6/09)

roger mellie said:


> From my (albeit limited) experience with putting fruit in too soon - the yeast strips out all the colour and flavour - leaving less in the finished product.
> 
> Just my 2c - if you want maximum flavour and colour from the fruit - add in secondary - leave for a week.
> 
> RM


I agree with this. I do place mine in the primary, but after the bulk of fermentation is complete. 
I used to rack to secondary, but as I also used to rack again to help clear the fruit out to eliminate steps I now just add to the primary in the same manner I do for dry hopping. 
I then do a mini secondary where I rack to another fermenter for the crash chill and bottle/kegging stage.


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## HoppingMad (1/6/09)

roger mellie said:


> From my (albeit limited) experience with putting fruit in too soon - the yeast strips out all the colour and flavour - leaving less in the finished product.
> 
> Just my 2c - if you want maximum flavour and colour from the fruit - add in secondary - leave for a week.
> 
> RM



I guess in a commercial situation they don't take risks with contamination (a batch of thousands of litres opened up part way through would be a no go for this guy) hence why the fruit is added when the fermentation vessel is first opened. 

Also being commercial all the fruit stays in the one fermenter through primary and secondary process and he's not unsealing the tank at any time, again to avoid infection risk. We homebrewers have the luxury I guess of doing additions when we want without stressing about mega-gallons of infected wort.

The brewer's method is aiming for a subdued fruit flavour so it is part of the composition of the beer and you can still taste some malt. The beer does have good fruit colour but for all I know this could be an artificial addtion later (didn't think to ask) - so you might have a point there Roger. That said flavour wise the technique seems to result in a nicely balanced beer, not a "whack pow hey yeah there's the fruit where's the rest of it?" beer 

If you want a beer where the fruit is bigger then yeah - that could be the way to do it (adding in secondary). If you want balance with other ingredients, the commercial way might have merit. 

Hopper.


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