# Llme Vs Dlme



## GSRman (2/12/03)

I'm looking at buying some more bulk malt extract, (and now seems like a good time since the G&G have their 20% off sale)

I can't decide whether to buy 

28kg of LLME for $89 

or 

25kg of DLME for $125

I've heard that the DME is better, and you use less, but if its too much more expensive i'll just get the liquid... also anyone have an idea what the postage would be?

i'm almost tempted to get both.. but i dont know if i would use them both in a timely manner..


----------



## PostModern (2/12/03)

LLME? DLME? Light Liquid Malt Extract and Dark Liquid Malt Extract? Or is the second "L" for "Light" and the "D" for "Dry"?

If you are tossing up between dry or liquid, I'd say dry. Light dry malts tend to be paler than their liquid counterparts, so if you're using it in a pale pale pale style, the colour advantage alone will steer towards dry extract. You can always add colour with darker specialty grains but it's harder to make a dark beer lighter. Also, liquid malt is a handier environment for mould to grow. If you get a honey gate on your pail and keep the headspace purged with CO2 there will be few problems, tho. I ended up tossing about 5Kg from my last bulk Liquid Malt purchase because I stored it at room temp, had no honey gate (I bailed the extract out with a sterile jug but apparently that wasn't good enough) 

Rather than buy one of each, why not buy one, see if you like using it, then buy the other next time?


----------



## GSRman (2/12/03)

postie: ive currently got liquid, and a pail with honey gate, haven't had any problems... 


i think i might get the dry.. just for a change..


----------



## Batz (2/12/03)

I use liquid malt but often wondered about dry , I bought some dry for my yeast starters and thought , hey how easy is this stuff to use.
Is it true you use less ? Next brew I am going to try the dry stuff , I normally make lagers so lighter colour would be a plus


----------



## PostModern (2/12/03)

Yes, you use less DME by weight than LME. What makes the LME liquid? Water. That accounts for some of the extract's weight. Pop 1KG of LME and one kg of DME into promash and look at the resulting gravities.
Actually, here are the figures from QBrew:

Batch size 5 Litres.
1Kg Light DME - Gravity 1.075
1Kg Light LME - Gravity 1.062


----------



## GSRman (2/12/03)

Wow.. thats like 25%..


----------



## PostModern (2/12/03)

So 25kg of DME is like 31.25kg of LME.

More QBrew fun (too lazy to do the maths myself):

Batch size 100 litres
31.25Kg LME - Gravity = 1.096
25Kg DME - Gravity = 1.094

Pretty close.

So 1Kg DME = ~1.25Kg LME.
Price per kilo of LME is $3.17
Price per kilo of DME is $5.00

Equivalence: 1.25kg of LME is $3.96, which is better value.
I bought my DME for $109, I think, which worked out at $4.36 per kilo. I only use about a kilo and a half per brew (as I'm a partial masher), so the difference is approx 60c per brew for me.


----------



## Shed (2/12/03)

Do you have to store DME in any special way... What I'm getting at is, does it absorb moisture and turn messy?


----------



## GMK (2/12/03)

PoMo

Nice Maths...i always work on the using 1.2 LME as a substitute for 1 kg of DME...

Might have to change that now.

The other problem with DME is if you get moisture in it....Buy one of those plastic sealable buckets - used for storing bread mix flour for teh DME.


----------



## Jovial_Monk (2/12/03)

I would definitely go for the dry.

liquid Extract (LME) apart from the mould problem gtes that 'extract twang' far quicker than the dried extract (DME)

Also easier to weigh out

1K DME=1.2K LME

As for which extract to get, got for the Muntons amber spray malt. Superb extract only very slightly darker than the Bintani stuff. It is dearer, though.




Jovial Monk


----------



## PostModern (2/12/03)

Jovial_Monk said:


> liquid Extract (LME) apart from the mould problem gtes that 'extract twang' far quicker than the dried extract (DME)
> 
> As for which extract to get, got for the Muntons amber spray malt. Superb extract only very slightly darker than the Bintani stuff. It is dearer, though.


 I thought the "twang" came from the colony of mould in my bucket. Makes sense that it would happen sooner in LME because the water provides a medium for further reactions in the malt. DME's chemicals are basically in suspended animation. ie if the salts are there to make acids and whatnot, the reactions won't occur because there is no water.

I bought the Bintani. Meh. Tastes OK so far.

For storage, I presently have the 3/4 full bag still in its bag. I just fold the top over several times and seal with strong pegs. I get nervous opening the bag on rainy or humid days tho. I might invest in a sealable bucket (I use my old LME one for a bottling bucket).


----------



## Wasabi (2/12/03)

PLUS, it's much easier to eat the the dry stuff with a spoon! You don't end up dribbling it everywhere!


----------



## PostModern (2/12/03)

Wasabi said:


> PLUS, it's much easier to eat the the dry stuff with a spoon! You don't end up dribbling it everywhere!


 [Homer] Mmmm. Malt spoon. *drooool* [/Homer].

It is handy for that. I put a couple of spoons in my Special Chocolate Nutella Icecream Milkshakes that the kids love so much


----------



## Boots (2/12/03)

I always thought that if I ever bought bulk Dried extract, I'd store it in sealable containers, and stick a heap of those little dessicant packets (silica?) on the inside of the lids.

Might handle some of the moisture probs for you?


----------



## GSRman (3/12/03)

I think ive decided to get the liquid and think about heading toward all-grain...


----------



## Jovial_Monk (3/12/03)

All grain is cheaper than extract, and gives much better beers. Do not kid yourself extract beers are 'as good as" full mash beers

but there is a capital investment to be made first, but your kettle, chiller etc you use for a long time, and an esky mash tun can still be used as an esky when needed. . .






Jovial Monk


----------



## Hoops (3/12/03)

I can honestly say that the 2 best beers I have ever tasted were mash brewed, all grain homebrew beers.
(Brewed by members of BABBs - Brisbane Amature Beer Brewers)

I bought a 25kg bag of dextrose several years ago and being worried about it caking hard I divided it into 1kg zip-lock bags and had no problems.


----------



## GSRman (3/12/03)

jovial: i have absolutely no question that all-grain is better  i want to head that way..  

but there's no point doing it until im doing the fermenting etc right  

basicly ive nearly got my use of yeast, starters, etc down.. but im out of extract  and i dont have my gear ready yet.. first things on the list... boiler and chiller so i can step up to full boils, and i already have a 15L rubbermaid style container ready to become the mash tun it wants to be  

of course everything takes time and money.. and having just got my keg setup going, and settling on a house next monday, ive got more than i can handle on my plate at the moment


----------



## jayse (3/12/03)

Jovial_Monk said:


> Do not kid yourself extract beers are 'as good as" full mash beers
> 
> jovial Monk


 sounds a little too much like a broad home brew store guy statement.

i must be kidding myself. but imc pale ale malt is far superior than any schooner malt extract i have ever seen or used.
Also all the mash brews i have done and all the mash brews done by others i have tasted have all been better than any extract brew i have tried.

For a start the coopers (AMC)malt which is made from schooner barley has its malting time cut short(the growth stage) to create a wort higher in dextrins to allow the use of more sugar adjuncts by the breweries.
it is not a true craft brewing malt in many of the hard core brewing circles.

whats your stand on this J.M.
if coopers do actually use a standard real lager malt then iam sure it would be availble to us however iam of the impression that all their base malt is based around the mega lager malt.
am i correct or not?


----------



## Murray (4/12/03)

I read JM's statement to mean don't pretend extracts are as good as all grain...


----------



## jayse (4/12/03)

o.k., i read it correctly now.
well spotted murray.


----------



## Trough Lolly (4/12/03)

GSRman said:


> jovial: i have absolutely no question that all-grain is better  i want to head that way..


 GSRman,

Do you know if there are any good bulk grain / malt deals going on at the HBS in Kambah?

Cheers,

TL


----------



## GSRman (4/12/03)

Colin is the owner of 'brew your own' in kambah.. top bloke.. but i dont think so..


----------



## Trough Lolly (4/12/03)

Agreed - he's a nice guy and all that, but I reckon that the Monk, Grain and Grape and Grumpies all give him a run for his money when it comes to buying in bulk ($100+ orders).

I recently did a spreadsheet of grains, malt, hops and yeast from all of the main players and found that there are some substantial price differences as well as a significant variation in what was available at what store. In some cases, HBS were charging 1Kg prices on 500g bags of specialty grains!!! It certainly pays to shop around - even to buy certain products from certain stores!

The only thing in his favour is that I don't have any freight charges - just petrol from my place in Farrer to his HBS!  

Cheers,

TL


----------

