# Getting started in sours.



## Dave70 (22/10/15)

Can anybody recommend a good resource that explains the ins and outs brewing sour beers for a newbie? 
Even a recipe with a reasonably fast turnaround - if there is such a thing - yeast recommendation and so on would be great.
My only experience withe the style is the odd bottle of _Kreik _from Dans. So virtually nil.
Having said that, I much prefer fermenting my milk out with lactobacillus casei Shirota - or basically dumping a bottle of Yakult into a jar full of milk and proceeding as you would make yogurt - to regular milk. So I do enjoy that sour 'twang' if that helps.


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## Motabika (22/10/15)

I am about to take the plunge into sour brewing. Been listening to http://www.thebrewingnetwork.com/category/shows/sourhour/


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## Grainer (22/10/15)

Start with a Berliner weiss maybe first.. really easy and tasty


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## SimoB (22/10/15)

I'd love to try something like Cleansing Ale by Two Metre Tall. I have no idea where to start. I'm keen to get the knowledge as well - please share!


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## droid (22/10/15)

dave70 I bought a book called American Sours - written by Michael Tonsmeire, who not long ago developed the recipes and grew the microbes for the sour beer program at San Diego's Modern Times Brewery, the book has techniques and recipes for "mixed fermentations" check it out


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## crowmanz (22/10/15)

droid said:


> a book called American Sours - written by Michael Tonsmeire


this is the book everyone of the youtube video's I watch on sours recommends. 

there is also the mad fermentationist and milk the funk facebook group.


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## dannymars (22/10/15)

a few fantastic blogs... including Michael Tonsmeire (mentioned above)

http://www.sourbeerblog.com
http://www.themadfermentationist.com

Dan Pixley is awesome too..
https://www.youtube.com/user/arrogantbastardale 
heaps of people associated with him on youtube also.

this site is amazing... http://www.milkthefunk.com/

hope this helps!


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## Liam_snorkel (22/10/15)

SimoB said:


> I'd love to try something like Cleansing Ale by Two Metre Tall. I have no idea where to start.


Me too. I'm going to culture up some bottle dregs in the coming months & see what happens


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## super_simian (22/10/15)

I've done "kettle" (pre-boil) souring three times. Twice made lovely Berliner Weiss*. Once made the house smell like someone had puked Parmesan topped dirty nappies into a 100-year old running shoe.

My advice is to use a known lacto-strain, and keep the souring wort hot and free of oxygen. And boil outside.

*TBH I've not had a genuine BW, but it was a very tasty, tangy low alcohol brew, and one my friends still ask me to recreate.


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## stef (22/10/15)

I've been brewing sours for a few years now. Lambic, Gueze, Framboise, Kriek and random funky beers.

You can either work out what you want to achieve (IE, sour/funky/tart/dark/spicy etc) and find a grist, yeast & bacteria to get you there. Or you can brew whatever, add some stuff and see what happens. The latter is how i started.

Generally- keep your IBUs low- 5-15, and dont bother adding any late hops. I usually ferment with a clean strain- whatever i have around- then pitch some dregs of a previous batch or bottles of commercial sours. Bung in, put in cellar and leave for a year or 2. Then taste, blend (if needed) and bottle.

Its a long term process, more like wine making with respect to waiting years etc.


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## Cortez The Killer (22/10/15)

Just wait til mje1980 swings past

Pretty sure he's exclusively sour now... by choice 

Cheers


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## stef (22/10/15)

Also, Wild Brews by Jeff Sparrow would be my suggested book on technical/process details, while getting inspiration from mad fermentationist website.


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## Blind Dog (22/10/15)

Nick R's (just had an adolescent moment there) sour mash and boil method works well for a Berliner Weisse (post 161): http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/66316-berliner-weisse/page-9

Makes it really easy to control the sourness and reduces the chances of brewing a batch of spew or infecting fermentors etc, makes a really tasty, smashable beer quickly

Reminds me I need to get some going for summer


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## Danscraftbeer (22/10/15)

I'm having a little go at this sour mash idea for a Saison to brew this weekend. I'm sour mashing 20% of the grain bill (2kg). Started the milled grain mash at 65c for 1 hour in stainless kettle then chilled to 40c. Now for the culture. Its going to be added and sparged with the main mash so I can go as wild as I want, or not. Its either 2 X Kefir Sachets. Or 200g Greek Yoghurt, or juice from an excellent mixed vegetable ferment that I made. Maybe it would be better to throw them all in??
Purge the kettle with co2 then lid and seel and let sit for 2 days. If it smells awful I just wont add it the main mash.

Split into two 19lt brews each with different Saison yeast. Should be good in a month or two, crossed fingers.


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## mje1980 (22/10/15)

Cortez The Killer said:


> Just wait til mje1980 swings past
> 
> Pretty sure he's exclusively sour now... by choice
> 
> Cheers



Convincing my wife we need to buy a house with a cellar with room for 10 or so 50litre glass fermenters isn't going well though.


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## mje1980 (22/10/15)

Dave70 said:


> Can anybody recommend a good resource that explains the ins and outs brewing sour beers for a newbie?
> Even a recipe with a reasonably fast turnaround - if there is such a thing - yeast recommendation and so on would be great.
> My only experience withe the style is the odd bottle of _Kreik _from Dans. So virtually nil.
> Having said that, I much prefer fermenting my milk out with lactobacillus casei Shirota - or basically dumping a bottle of Yakult into a jar full of milk and proceeding as you would make yogurt - to regular milk. So I do enjoy that sour 'twang' if that helps.



I've got the American sour beer book. It's pretty good. I'm not as experienced as others here, but the best ones I've done have been the simplest. A wyeast blend pitched into glass, and I added bottle dregs every now and then. And patience as has been said. Just wait, it's fucked because I'm impatient but worth it. 

I think glass fermenters are a must. I got 2 x 11 litre ones instead of one 25 litre one. Mainly because my spot is inside on top of the fridge, so lifting them up there wouldn't be possible with a 25 litre one. I can also do split batches. 

Barls and a few others here have a lot of experience, so listen to those guys. 





This thread has just cost me, as I am now going to buy some more kriek, the dregs of which will go into a porter I have on top of the fridge now. 


Thanks


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## Benn (22/10/15)

https://itunes.apple.com/au/podcast/beersmith-home-beer-brewing/id398500515?mt=2&i=353561706
Beersmith podcast that discuses sours, quite interesting particularly how the guy goes about utilising barrels he sources from distilleries and the like.


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## yurgy (29/10/15)

google liddell lambic lessons the cult of the biohazard


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## 2much2spend (29/10/15)

yurgy said:


> google liddell lambic lessons the cult of the biohazard



I'm getting threw it and really good reading! 

Thanks man!


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## Aydos (9/11/15)

How does everyone regulate the fermenting temp for those with a barrel aging a lambic? I'm looking into doing a lambic in my barrel when I get it and I'm concerned I will just be making vinegar.


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## yurgy (19/11/15)

aydos said:


> How does everyone regulate the fermenting temp for those with a barrel aging a lambic? I'm looking into doing a lambic in my barrel when I get it and I'm concerned I will just be making vinegar.


keep air locks toped up acetobacter needs oxygen i ferment in glass demijohn no temp control


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## Ciderman (20/12/15)

Question regarding hops. Bit of talk about using aged hops. I've actually found dried hops in a health food store. Is that what you would use or just regulation hops at start of boil to get the required IBU.


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## yurgy (20/12/15)

Ciderman said:


> Question regarding hops. Bit of talk about using aged hops. I've actually found dried hops in a health food store. Is that what you would use or just regulation hops at start of boil to get the required IBU.


i age my own hops for lambic but not necessary as you wont taste the hop after 1 to 2 years i think the hops mainly keep lactobacillus from running rampant to let the pedio do most of the souring


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