Using O2 To Push Beer Kegs.

[frogman]

Has anyone ever tried using a small compresser/holding tank as used in 4wds to push there beer?
We all know that CO2 is heavier than O2.
So once a Keg is carbonated would it not be possible to use O2 to push the beer?
CO2 shoul cause a blanket effect, thus not allowing oxidation of the beer.
would save a hell of a lot of money on CO2 refills.

 

[Justin]

Unfortunately your beer will just stale, and quite quicky at serving pressure. You'll still end up with a mixture of O2 and CO2 in your beer as the whole sytem will equilibrate until there is an equal amount of air in the beer as in the head space.

I do use air to push sanitizer, cleaning solution or hot water out of my kegs when cleaning. In fact I have just used a bike pump that fits a schrader (sp) valve and clamped it onto the 1/4" barb of a gas disconnect. Pump up the pressure to push your cleaning solution around. Works well and you don't need to waste CO2 to do it.

I still purge the kegs with CO2 before I transfer beer into them though. I'd really like to set up a closed transfer system but that's still a pipe dream and will be for quite a while.

By the way, CO2 isn't particularly expensive given the number of kegs you push with it. If your using soda streams then yes, expensive but a 5 kilo bottle of CO2 will last so long that it's hardly worth messing with to save the CO2.

 

[Steve Lacey]

Has anyone ever tried using a small compresser/holding tank as used in 4wds to push there beer?
We all know that CO2 is heavier than O2.
So once a Keg is carbonated would it not be possible to use O2 to push the beer?
CO2 shoul cause a blanket effect, thus not allowing oxidation of the beer.
would save a hell of a lot of money on CO2 refills.

Frogman, sorry to pour cold water on your grand idea, but two words, "partial" and "pressure". Under pressure, the O2 will mix completely with and quickly dominate the initial CO2. In other words, no matter which way you look at it, you'll be exposing your beer to oxygen and it will be oxidized. You would need an impervious membrane between the layer of CO2 and the added oxygen for your idea to work. They are gases. They mix. Heavier and lighter alike.

In short, "There is no blanket." (older members au faix with Derek and Clive should enjoy that line).

Steve

Edit: typed too slow, Justin beat me to the punch.

 

[frogman]

It was just an idea and was hoping for some feedback.
Used to work in pubs and know that cellar mix is used on commercial kegs to prvent over carbonating when pushing large distances i.e. nitrogen/CO2 mix.

 

[tangent]

I do use air to push sanitizer, cleaning solution or hot water out of my kegs when cleaning. In fact I have just used a bike pump that fits a schrader (sp) valve and clamped it onto the 1/4" barb of a gas disconnect. Pump up the pressure to push your cleaning solution around. Works well and you don't need to waste CO2 to do it.

Top idea! :beer:

 

[Ross]

Get a plastic bladder & pump air into that, the pressure will push the beer out

Cheers Ross

 

[danbeer]

Unfortunately your beer will just stale, and quite quicky at serving pressure. You'll still end up with a mixture of O2 and CO2 in your beer as the whole sytem will equilibrate until there is an equal amount of air in the beer as in the head space.

Also depends on what timeframe you intend on using your keg in...

If you're pumping it out in an afternoon (eg: for a party) you probably won't notice any ill effects. - This is esentially what brumby pumps do (Pump in air to force out the beer)

As others have mentioned tho: time + air = stale beer.

 

[frogman]

I do use air to push sanitizer, cleaning solution or hot water out of my kegs when cleaning. In fact I have just used a bike pump that fits a schrader (sp) valve and clamped it onto the 1/4" barb of a gas disconnect. Pump up the pressure to push your cleaning solution around. Works well and you don't need to waste CO2 to do it.

What a great idea.

 

[Justin]

FWIW you don't need a lot of pressure to make stuff move, but you'd be surprised what pressure you can get to if you really want to pump (I guess my pump is a fairly good quality one - Blackburn? From my mountain biking). My pump has one of those schrader type setups that just clamps a big rubber fitting over the valve, it's not a threaded fitting. If you look at a lot of pumps I think most seem to have this set up these days. I haven't noticed any ill effects and I haven't seen or tasted any evidence of any grease, oil or smells/flavours . I mainly used it to push cleaning solution and hot water through to clean the kegs and beer lines/taps when I blew a keg or had a big cleaning spree.

When pushing out sanitiser I tended to use CO2 just because I was about to purge with CO2 anyway so it was partly getting the job done of filling the keg with CO2 anyway.

But it's a thought and it works, you may find your own uses.

Probably don't really need to be said, but I wouldn't pressurize on the liquid disconnect in case you happen to blow the pump off the barb-hasn't happened but could do. Depending what your pushing you could have hot/caustic liquid flying out your still attached liquid disconnect. Looks cool when you spray it across your lawn but bad for your skin and eyes. Use the gas one.