The "no Chiller" Method

[bindi]

I have had little or no difference with a couple of double batches split the same way, the no chill was a little clearer , mind you they were ALES and not Pilsner and the were stored no more then a week waiting for fridge space AND I pitched fresh ALE yeast and both dry hopped.
So for Ales the no chill is a winner for me, yet to try a Pilsner/Lager no chill.

 

[JasonY]

I can't say I will put the difference down to the no-chill completely as the things i would have thought to be affected were not the main ones.

The yeast regime was certainly different, if anything the chilled one was probably underpictched while the no-chill one had a nice healthy yeat cake (perhaps overpitched). Perhaps a more vigorous ferment drove the hop aromas out?

In terms of comparisons its about as accurate as I will be bothering as I don't have room to ferment tow lagers (hence the trial using a split batch). Next time I may repeat what i did but just store chilled wort.

Anyway this is only onw comparison and as Bindi said he has not noticed the same differences so I would not call this conclusive at all.

 

[colinw]

I'd say the difference between the chilled and no-chilled batches was some degradation of the wort (particularly the volatile hop aromatics) due to oxidation during the long storage.

Unless you can contrive to store the "no chill" wort under a blanket of CO2 or Nitrogen, in my opinion some loss of quality is inevitable.

 

[Finite]

JasonY,

Are you saying that you stored the no chill beer for 2 weeks before pitching then added it to the yeast bed of the chilled beer?

I cant see how that would be an acurate experiment as aside from storing the no chill beer for 2 weeks you have also added the no chill brew to protiens, and dead yeast which was in the trub from the previous batch.

 

[JasonY]

JasonY,

Are you saying that you stored the no chill beer for 2 weeks before pitching then added it to the yeast bed of the chilled beer?

I cant see how that would be an acurate experiment as aside from storing the no chill beer for 2 weeks you have also added the no chill brew to protiens, and dead yeast which was in the trub from the previous batch.

Yep spot on. There is only so far I was ever going to go in trying to provide exact conditions for each brew because I simply dont have room to ferment two lagers simultaneously. The stored no chill wort was kept at 13degC for the duration (except for the slow chill at ambient overnight).

Who knows, perhaps the outcome would have been the same regardless of chilling technique, perhaps it says something about pitching onto a yeast cake. I am just reporting on what was as close a comparison as I am ever likely to do.

Regardless I think leaving wort around for two weeks or longer as others have said is probably not a good idea.

 

[lucas]

is anyone doing this who doesnt have a tap on their boiler? if so, how are you starting your syphon? I can't imagine the sucking method would be at all safe with boiling hot wort and steam coming through the tube.

 

[warrenlw63]

Lucas

If you're worried about 3rd degree burns on your lips maybe fill the siphon hose with water, block both ends with your fingers, keep the ends even. Drop one end in your wort, let it run to a jug to get rid of the water then carefully direct to your cubes to avoid splashing. With care the siphon will continue.

Warren -

 

[Weizguy]

is anyone doing this who doesnt have a tap on their boiler? if so, how are you starting your syphon? I can't imagine the sucking method would be at all safe with boiling hot wort and steam coming through the tube.

I have a Stainless Steel U-tube which reaches to the bottom of the kettle, just above the trub level.
Connected to it is a thick silicone hose. I hold the hose-end level with the top of the kettle and place a clean tea-towel over the end of the hose. By sucking, I fill the hose (mostly) with hot wort and then place the hose end in the cube. Easy!

Seth's tip # 12

 

[Aussie Claret]

I did a no chill over the weekend and added some extra dry hops to the cube for extra flavour aroma (whilst at close to boiling). I removed the wort whilst still close to boiling and added 30g from memory to the cube.

I didn't think of this previously but the cube remained very hot for over a 24 hour period and I think that the dry hopping has added alot more bitterness than I was expecting, also the aroma and flavour is alot less than expected.

JYE - I'd be interest to hear how you went with the 90g of Amarillo that you added, did this contribute to extra bitterness? And what was the aroma and flavour like, more or less than expected?

I had about 2-3 inches of break material and hops in the bottom of the cube, when I siphoned out the wort to the fermenter it was the cleanest and brightest I have seen just as clear as finished beer.

Has anyone else noticed flavour, bitterness issue when adding dry hops to the no chill ?

Thanks
AC

 

[Jye]

JYE - I'd be interest to hear how you went with the 90g of Amarillo that you added, did this contribute to extra bitterness? And what was the aroma and flavour like, more or less than expected?

AC, I dont know if it added any extra bitterness since it was an AIPA over 100 IBUs. Some flavour and aroma was added but it was a great disappointment, it would have been more worth while adding it to the boil or dry hopping. I wont be doing it again.

 

[user 384]

Has anyone else noticed flavour, bitterness issue when adding dry hops to the no chill ?

Adding hops to a no-chill beer that is still hot will not be the equivalent to dry-hopping and is basically a flame out addition kettle hops.

Dry hops is added to cooled beer and the fact that it's chilled means that it doesn't readily disolve hop oil, alpha acids etc. Tru dry hopping will give a completely different flavour and aroma impact to kettle hops.

When hops are added to hot wort they readily give up their oils etc, including alpha acids. The alpha acids are isomerised iso-alpha acids, which gives the beer its bitterness. It was believed that for isomerisation to occur you need heat plus agitation, hence a rolling boil. Latest studies have show that isomerisation is a first order reaction and only needs heat to occur (activation energy is 98.6kj per mole - no idea what temp this translate to). However agitation is still need if using plugs or flowers as with pellets they are already much more broken up and the lupin glands have already been burst by the processing making the alpha acids more accessible, unlike plugs and flowers.

So yes there will be some isomerisation of the alpha acids whn added to the hot wort. If you use pellets it will be more pronounced and the hotter the wort the more pronounced. However having said all this, it is likely to be only a slightly increase in bitterness. Remember the same principle applies to brewers who use plate or CFC chillers, where their wort can sit hot with late additions, before it is chilled. If you use a CFC and are used to the impact of late additions, adding hops to the no-chill cube is likely to have a similar result. If you are used to an imersion chiller, you will have to make some adjustments. Or simply use a hop bag/sock and remove all your hops after the desired length of time, then siphon into the cube.

Cheers
MAH