Suggestions On This Altbier Recipe?

[Tim F]

Hi all, wondering if anyone can offer suggestions on this recipe I'm working on? I'd like to make a fairly sweet/malty Altbier with only moderate bitterness. Not sure if the crystal malt will be right in this, but I want some honey/toffee notes. Actually, wonder if a little honey would add interest too?

% Amount Name
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
42.4 2.50 kg. Munich Malt
33.9 2.00 kg. Pilsener Malt
11.9 0.70 kg. Melanoidin Malt
8.5 0.50 kg. JWM Caramalt
3.4 0.20 kg. Weyerman CaraAroma

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
40.00 g. Tettnanger Tettnang Pellet 4.50 26.4 60 min.
15.00 g. Tettnanger Tettnang Pellet 4.50 2.0 10 min.

 

[geoffi]

I reckon you should cut back (if not cut out) the Melanoidin. 700g is a hell of a lot, and a little goes a long way. I'd say 200g tops.

I haven't used CaraAroma, but I've heard that's pretty powerful too.

 

[mika]

Batz Altbier from the RecipeDB is worth a shot.

2.5 kg Powells Ale Malt (Powells Malt)
2.2 kg Powells Munich (Powels Malts)
0.25 kg Powells Caramalt (Powells Malt)
0.06 kg TF Pale Chocolate Malt
30 g Select Spalt (Pellets, 6 AA%, 60 mins)
20 g Select Spalt (Pellets, 6 AA%, 45 mins)
30 ml Danstar - Nottingham
0.25 tablet Whirfloc

I suspect you're thinking up a complicated recipe for a simple beer. I'd limit the adjunct malts to less than 15% of the beer and 10% or less would be fine as well. Munich/Vienna malt not being thought of as an adjunct here.
I've got a bit of a thing for Golden Promise Pale Ale Malt at the moment and I think this style could fit it well.

 

[Stuster]

I agree with Geoffi, those levels of melanoidin and crystal look much too high to me. I'd cut the melanoidin back to 200g or so, maybe halve the caraaroma and ditch the caramalt. If you want a sweeter alt, some caramunich would be ok, say 5%, but in that case cut back on the mel/caraaroma a bit. I don't think the honey will go, but experimentation is half the fun after all. Most altbiers also include some dark malt for colour, so 1% carafa I would be good. Hopping looks good to me. What yeast were you thinking of using?

 

[Tim F]

Was going to use Kolsch if I can get it, unless anyone can recommend something better? Thanks for the suggestions.

 

[geoffi]

Nottingham seems to work well in this one.

 

[Stuster]

I liked the alt I made using 1007. I've never used it, but 1388 might be another good choice that should leave you with some sweetness. Never used Nottingham, but it's supposed to be good for alts. US-05 is fine too.

 

[Ross]

I normally use Nottingham but just used the CraftBrewer German Ale yeast (K-97) for the 1st time, being as it's a genuine German ale yeast.
1st impressions a week ago in the keg, I wasn't that impressed with the brew, but now it's already coming into its own. A month or 2 conditioning & it should be excellent.
The Alt in the recipe section of my site took out several State 1st places, including ANAWBS.

Cheers Ross

 

[Tim F]

I ended up going with this:
47% Munich malt
47% Pilsener malt
4.7% Melanoiden malt
1.3% Carafa

26 IBU of tettnang at 60
1.8 IBU of tettnang at 10

1338 European Ale yeast
Had it in the fridge for a week now at 19C and it's tasting pretty awesome!

 

[blackbock]

What OG and volume did you start off with? I'm just trying to replicate this into Beersmith to see what colour it came out!

I imagine this would be a fairly dryish-tasting beer with no crystal at all though...Probably at its best young.

 

[BoilerBoy]

I ended up going with this:
47% Munich malt
47% Pilsener malt
4.7% Melanoiden malt
1.3% Carafa

26 IBU of tettnang at 60
1.8 IBU of tettnang at 10

1338 European Ale yeast
Had it in the fridge for a week now at 19C and it's tasting pretty awesome!

Not an expert in alt's and I dont want to argue with your taste buds by any means, but it looks a little light on IBU's with all that munich and melanoidin. For its style an alt is a dry beer and I reckon at nearly 27 IBU's it would have to be on the sweet side.

I did one last year using similar amounts of melanoidin, Munich 2 and pilsner and aiming for 50 IBU's and it was still to sweet but nice eniugh all the same.

Cheers

 

[mje1980]

I did one last year using similar amounts of melanoidin, Munich 2 and pilsner and aiming for 50 IBU's and it was still to sweet but nice eniugh all the same.

Cheers

I have my first alt attempt in the keg now. I used something like 60% munich. Anyway, all i can taste is bitterness, the 1007 fermented from 1052, to 1007, despite all the munich. I have heard this beer needs to be conditioned for a while, i hope so, as mine is all bitterness, i cant even taste the munich.

 

[Tim F]

Yeah I definately wanted this one to be a bit sweet for the style. I actually made this for my girlfriend, who loves grumpys Auld Fokker which I have been told is around 25 IBU.

I made a 13L batch and got 1.044 (60%). Still need to work on my efficiency a little bit with my new setup but I'm getting there!

I did think about keeping some crystal in but ended up deciding to give it a go with a fairly basic recipe and then make adjustments in the next batch.

 

[blackbock]

Hey Tim F,

How does it taste, is it sweet, or low in bitterness, and what was the FG?

I very much like the idea of making a simple house Altbier with just three malts, just getting the proportions right is the tricky part.

Boilerboy I disagree that the lowish IBU level would make it taste sweet. Like you said, 50 IBU can taste sweet, but 20 IBU can also taste dry - just ask the TED drinkers!

I haven't been to Dsseldorf, but I'll bet the locals also prefer their Alts fresh on tap, not aged.

 

[Tim F]

It's only been a week in the fermenter so far so I won't be able to give any real impressions for a few more weeks. But it's promising so far!

 

[brendanos]

I found my first (and only) Altbier changed quite dramatically as it aged, a 4 week lagering definately rounded out the edges, and the melanoidins became more pleasant as it got older. The last few bottles were getting a bit oxidised, which wasn't good in this beer.

 

[Tim F]

I've been drinking this for a while now and it's just starting to get really nice. The harsher malt flavours are becoming more rounded and some sweetness is coming through. The bitterness is definately on the low end but there is some hop flavour and aroma still. Next time I might use slightly less munich & melanoiden and a handful of tettnang at 30 minutes or so. The only real problem is it's slightly overcarbonated with 7g/L - next time I might try 5g/L. This is the best beer that I've made so far! Pours crystal clear with a nice reddish brown colour and a thick head that leaves lacing down the glass.

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

I liked the alt I made using 1007. I've never used it, but 1388 might be another good choice that should leave you with some sweetness. Never used Nottingham, but it's supposed to be good for alts. US-05 is fine too.

Yes Wyeast 1007 is a very good choice for an Alt but it does require a long drop out period or some califing agent such as Isinglass.It would be my first choice of Alt yeasts.The Wyeast 1338 doesnt have the same attenuation as the 1007 and I like you can get the 1007 to ferment down as low as 13C compared to the 1338 which likes between 16-22C.Lower the temp the better the alt style finish.It a hard style to get right and Im still trying.
GB

 

[alexbrand]

[...] The only real problem is it's slightly overcarbonated with 7g/L - next time I might try 5g/L.

Do you use kegs? Just attatch a pressure limiter and decrease the pressure slowly to the desired value. So it'll drop from 7 to 5 g/L easily.

Alex

 

[therook]

I've made 2 ALTs and this one was the best by far out of the 2. My mates came over and had a choice of the ALT or APA out of the kegs and the ALT won hands down.

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
4.50 kg Munich I (Weyermann) (14.0 EBC) Grain 77.5 %
1.00 kg Ale ( Barrett Burston ) (8.0 EBC) Grain 17.2 %
0.25 kg Wheat Malt (Barrett Burston) (3.0 EBC) Grain 4.3 %
0.06 kg Carafa Special III (Weyermann) (1400.0 EBC) Grain 1.0 %
45.00 gm Spalter [6.20%] (90 min) Hops 29.3 IBU
25.00 gm Spalter [6.20%] (40 min) Hops 13.4 IBU
1.00 tsp Epsom Salt (MgSO4) (Mash 90.0 min) Misc
1.00 tsp Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash 90.0 min) Misc
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-Ale


Rook