Safale S-04 Ale Yeast Off Flavours.

[Mitcho89]

Hi everyone,

I've only just stopped using s-04 due to it's awful flavors kicked off and I just can't work out why. I've usually kept it at about 22-26C'.

Until now I thought that was within the safe range of the yeast but upon reading AHB, the best range is 16-17, close to what I have my US-05 at in my Black Rock Lager brew.

I really miss using this yeast. It's high flocculation and settling properties are just fantastic but I'm just scared to use it again. 3 batches now thrown out due to this awful flavor. Makes it worse that I used it always in my Coppers Mexican Cerveza so being a weak beer in flavor anyway, this off taste just absolutely dominated.....regardless of how much lemon or lime I used!

Anyone who has had a similar problems, I'd love to hear from you!

Kind regards,

Mitch.

 

[Pennywise]

Mitcho, I'd say the off flavours you're getting would be from the temp it was fermented at. Personally I don't really like S-04 regardless, and for that type of beer, a Cerveza, is totally out of place. US-05 would be a much better choice, or even a Lager yeast. If you want to give S-04 another go, try it in a coopers English Bitter, Coopers Real Ale or even an IPA, and I'd say deffinatly ferment below 20. Maybe someone could chime in and give some advice as to what temp this yeast is best at?

 

[Mitcho89]

Yeah I'd say it's definitely the temperature. The owner of the local brew shop was the one who gave it to me and said it was "in that style of beer" so I'm not sure.

Why aren't you much of a fan of the yeast?

Thanks mate,

Mitch.

 

[mckenry]

Hi everyone,

I've only just stopped using s-04 due to it's awful flavors kicked off and I just can't work out why. I've usually kept it at about 22-26C'.

Until now I thought that was within the safe range of the yeast but upon reading AHB, the best range is 16-17, close to what I have my US-05 at in my Black Rock Lager brew.

I really miss using this yeast. It's high flocculation and settling properties are just fantastic but I'm just scared to use it again. 3 batches now thrown out due to this awful flavor. Makes it worse that I used it always in my Coppers Mexican Cerveza so being a weak beer in flavor anyway, this off taste just absolutely dominated.....regardless of how much lemon or lime I used!

Anyone who has had a similar problems, I'd love to hear from you!

Kind regards,

Mitch.

Hi Mitch,
Firstly, I use US05 & S04 at 19*C. I dont think using it with a coopers blonde kit is going to make it bad enough to tip. Sure, it may not be the exact yeast for that type of beer, but its not going to spoil it either.
If this is 3 batches in a row, with nothing else brewed in between (that was good) I'd be thinking infection in your equipment and possibly your process. Let us know and we can help more.

Edit - 26*C is the high end, but again, should not ruin it. So, more likely infection than temp I'd say.

 

[JestersDarts]

Yeah I'd say it's definitely the temperature. The owner of the local brew shop was the one who gave it to me and said it was "in that style of beer" so I'm not sure.

Why aren't you much of a fan of the yeast?

Thanks mate,

Mitch.

I'm not surprised your not sure!

your LHBS owner is either:


a. Keeping it simple for you so not to bog you down with too much information
b. Apathetic
c. An idiot

poll?

 

[fraser_john]

your LHBS owner is either:

a. Keeping it simple for you so not to bog you down with too much information
b. Apathetic
c. An idiot

+1

Corona is a lager and hence should use a lager yeast, not an ale yeast. Plus the grain bill (or kit) for a mex-lager has no crystal or anything to offset the flavours of an ale yeast.

I'd go for option c) above.

Gotta love a good LHBS.....oh hang on, I don't have one near me.

 

[Pennywise]

Why aren't you much of a fan of the yeast?

I prolly shouldn't bad mouth it too much as I've not used it for quite some time, like over 3 years at least. But I never had much luck with it flavour wise, I should give it another go sometime soon, now that my process and attention to detail have improved, so I can make a more learned opinion

 

[Mitcho89]

With my next batch of Mex Cerveza I reckon I'll just go for the US-05 I'll collect from my most recent batch and blew it at about 16 or so C to get that nice nuetral "fake lager" taste going on. Should come out a treat. Still working out the best options for clearing the beer. I think just time is the best medicine *thumbs up*

Craig at my local brew shop is a real nice bloke but yeah... if he's not sure then what hope do I have

 

[keifer33]

My 2nd brew using better products had this yeast and after a few weeks in the bottle has very off flavors but I am more putting it down to bad method (was also given bad info by lhbs I was using at the time) and products not mixing well. What is the off flavour u are experiencing?

 

[Mitcho89]

It's hard to say. Sort of like funky off tasting banana's. More or less something you'd never want to taste in a beer!...or much else for that matter.

What did you experience?

 

[keifer33]

Yeh hard to describe. The only thing I can link it too is almost vegimite which even for an ale is unbearable and I can't even get threw a glass of it.

 

[mckenry]

With my next batch of Mex Cerveza I reckon I'll just go for the US-05 I'll collect from my most recent batch and blew it at about 16 or so C to get that nice nuetral "fake lager" taste going on. Should come out a treat. Still working out the best options for clearing the beer. I think just time is the best medicine *thumbs up*

Craig at my local brew shop is a real nice bloke but yeah... if he's not sure then what hope do I have

Where are you Mitcho? Liverpool way?

 

[Mitcho89]

Keifer, I have had similar problems. It's just shit. I feel like I'm throwing money away. I've binned enough batches over the last couple of months using s-04 to buy me 2 slabs of commerical, no hassle, no dick around beer oh well.....We live, we learn, we forget and move on!

McKenry, No mate I'm about 30 min outside of Brisbane.

Cheers lads,

Mitch.

 

[ballzac]

It's hard to say. Sort of like funky off tasting banana's. More or less something you'd never want to taste in a beer!...or much else for that matter.

Definitely sounds temperature related. I've only used S-04 twice, but never had off flavours from it. I actually had a brown ale fermented at about 24C with Notty that produced a lot of banana flavour (though it was not funky). 18 months took care of it, and it turned out wonderful. I believe this is why hefeweizen's are meant to be enjoyed fresh. If you get this again, don't tip it. Just wait and see.

S-04 was a very user friendly and good tasting yeast, and I will definitely use it again. I fermented both my brews with S-04 at 18C.

 

[Beer Magician]

I've used S-04 heaps of times and never had a problem with it. Some of my best IPA's have been brewed with S-04. I usually ferment in the 18-20 degrees range.

 

[Mitcho89]

Hmmm makes me wonder if it was something cleaning wise. I'll use a packet of 'no rinse' I just got twice over with the next time i make a beer that uses s-04

 

[hsb]

+1 to only having problems with S04 when it ferments too warm. When it has been up to 22-24C it's left a rank banana ish taste in my Ales. Since making sure I keep it down nearer 17C I've only had good results. Only used it in English style ales mind.
I get noticeably better results with Liquid yeast, the contrast is big but S04 is useful when starters go awry.

 

[Mitcho89]

Yep sounds like the taste i've been getting. Looks like lower temps along with the proper beer style should see this being a good clear yeast. Might make it in my next Pale Ale but then again.... I want to reculture Coopers Pale Ale yeast for that one! I think this yeast has scared me a little too much to want to use it again when I'm getting great results with US-05.

Thanks mate.

 

[katzke]

I use both US-05 and S-04. The S-04 is an English Ale yeast so will have more flavor then the clean US-05 American Ale yeast. That said I have used both in Wit beers and I liked the clean American Ale yeast and my wife liked the bit of character that S-04 gave the beer. I am not going for a Belgian Wit or even a German Wit. I do not like Belgian yeast flavors as they taste like bubble gum to me. I do not like banana beer and have not found the clove balance I like either.

I can say S-04 for a light no taste beer like the Mex Cerveza is totally out of character. Not that it would, not be good, but I think you would be better off with US-05.

Temperature is also against you and I would not ferment any beer at that high of a temp unless you wanted to push the yeast for a particular flavor.

The suggestion of infection is also a good one. Good to change up your sanitation technique once in a while. Stay away from miracle all in one cleaners. There is a difference between a cleaner and a sanitizer. It needs to be clean first then you need to sanitize before use. Something that has been sanitized will get infected if it gets dirty or dusty or even just from setting as the air is full of bugs. We do not always brew in the cleanest places. A kitchen has to be one of the more infected rooms in our home just because we bring in all kinds of stuff on food. If you buy bread from a good baker it will have yeast on the package as the bread is packaged not far from where the dough is made. Fresh fruit and vegetables have all kinds of friendly bugs on them if they are healthy and natural. Then there is cheese and good cheese like blue has mold in it. I am sure I missed something.

So if you are getting beer that is bad enough to tip then you are either very picky or you have a problem with your brewing procedure. In all the beers I have tasted at or brew club I can say I only poured out 2.. I have only brewed one beer I did not like and never drank. I am not sure to this day what the problem was but I think it was the combination of a hop that I am not fond of and grain I do not like.

 

[QSR]

North, South, East or West of Brisbane Mitch?