Royal Commission into botched home insulation scheme.

[bradsbrew]

I think its part of your licence registration that you do have insurance

Not in QLD. To be a licenced contractor you need to fulfil the trade qual and small business management requirements. Ridiculous, yes.

 

[browndog]

Interesting comments re liability for Tradies in domestic situations, can't recall ever hearing anything in the news about home owners ending up liable for Tradies getting injured at their premises.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Who is at fault? The party that didn't enforce these requirements or the party that didn't fulfil these requirements?

In NSW it is the Contractot or Employer. So its the party who didnt fullfill. The enforcement is actually part of the workcover (2000) act that legally requires the employer ( or principle contractor ) to provide a safe work environment. You dont neccesarally need to enforce it as it is a legal requirment. It is illegal to not provide a safe work environment & SWMS/JSA is part of this. The same as its illegal to drive drunk. Its not enforced but if you get caught your gone. So if the Insulation mobs where not doing SWMS and making sure the work area was safe then they where breaking the law. Period. If some one dies or gets injured on a work site, someone, some how has broken the law. They have broken the law by not providing a safe work place. This is what happened with the deaths of the insulation installers. You cant blame anyone but the contractor or employer. Its the law.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Interesting comments re liability for Tradies in domestic situations, can't recall ever hearing anything in the news about home owners ending up liable for Tradies getting injured at their premises.

Thats because the tradie should have his own insurance.....well maybe not QLD...

 

[Black Devil Dog]

I'm not sure what the requirements are in NSW, but like I said earlier, anyone can do minor trade works up to $3,300 inc GST in QLD.

That people were able to get in and do the work without any accreditation, is a major failing of the scheme. You can blame the bosses all you like, (and rightly so) but it seems as though there were no checks in place to ensure it was done properly and safely.

 

[spog]

Thats because the tradie should have his own insurance.....well maybe not QLD...

Tradies HAVE to have their insurances ,not having a go at you Dbs,but someone/ employers have fcuked up it has cost lives.
The system is a system and it is useless ,that system is the licensing ,inspectors,paper work checkers whatever title we chose to give them.They are all part of the system that honestly couldn't find it's arse in the dark.
When things go arse up all the system does is try to cover its self any way it can.
I have been a chippy since 1980,my licence has NOT once been checked by any person who's job it is to do so,not once.
In the last 15 years only twice has any site I have been on been checked.Twice in 15 years!.
Every time I have rung work safe or been too their office I got no satisfaction as they have all been at a conference,and I have rung numerous times and made countless enquiries all with no returned calls,which really pisses me off!!!!
Self regulation is being pushed across the trade which will not stop the dodgy tradies .
The Royal Commision should directed at lazy fuckers who's job is to ensure that no dodgy shit is going on....jeez I could go on and list all kinds of shocking complacent crap that goes unchecked,oh hang on I just did.
Cheers....spog....

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

But the onus is for Joe Public to check there tradies licence. Thats what we get told. But as you pointed out...who does.

I have had a full comms licence for 20yrs...no one has ever asked. Not even come close.

But they write the legaslation so that its not up to the government to police it, its up to you and me to check Bob the tradie's licence and report accordingly. And make Bob legally resposible to his workers. Thats why when Bob ends up in court cause Jim the labourer died the first thing he will get accused of is breaking the law because he didnt provide a safe work environment.

 

[wynnum1]

Home insulation 'Mr Fluffy' Testing had found amosite asbestos, the most deadly form of the building material

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/mr-fluffy-house-sealed-after-asbestos-found-20140314-34so5.html#ixzz2wp1yhdKX

 

[Dave70]

It's always got me stuffed how the thrust of the whole scheme was to save an estimated *20,000 gigawatt-hours (72,000 TJ) of electricity and 25 petajoules (6.9×109 kWh) of natural gas by 2015 (wiki)* based on some shaky estimates, so in a nutshell, all about consuming less power - using less fossil fuel and so on, right?
Why wouldn't a government with such a green environmental bent not do everything in its power to encourage use of the biggest mixed blessing we have, sunlight. Why would you roll back schemes and rebates that encourage people to bolt as many solar panels and water heaters as possible to their roofs? Windmills? Get em in there. Who knows, perhaps even help get local production of the requisite technologies up and running rather than import panels and transformers by the container load. Just imagine actually, like, 'making stuff'. Yeah, we can do it.


Perhaps Garret was made the fall guy in all of this, with friends psychopaths like K Rudd, that's only to be expected, but bugger him.
He's an rabid leftist and I always hated Midnight Oil anyway.

 

[wynnum1]

Why would they buy Chinese insulation when fiber glass is made from recycled glass bottles .

 

[Dave70]

Why would they buy Chinese insulation when fiber glass is made from recycled glass bottles .

Same reason they buy recycled iron ore, coal and limestone from China in the form of structural steel.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Why wouldn't a government with such a green environmental bent not do everything in its power to encourage use of the biggest mixed blessing we have, sunlight. Why would you roll back schemes and rebates that encourage people to bolt as many solar panels and water heaters as possible to their roofs? Windmills? Get em in there. Who knows, perhaps even help get local production of the requisite technologies up and running rather than import panels and transformers by the container load. Just imagine actually, like, 'making stuff'. Yeah, we can do it.

well we wont see much or any of that with the current gov. Abbott is a climate change denier.... and has cut schemes to do with green renewable power....

 

[Dave70]

Is he actually an anthropogenic climate change denier or calls bulllshit on the whole scientific consensus of climate change?

I realize dragging his religious convictions into the spotlight sounds like picking the low hanging fruit, but lets face it, he has form relating to issues directly at odds with his faith.
Cant help but feel anything 'science says' may be antagonize him a touch.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Mm...he isnt one much for science, or so it seems. He has cut a few "science" related groups and cut into the CSIRO. I think he is on the side of the fence of those that may not believe that man has had an influence on the climate over the last few hundred years. He is a god botherer, but I think he has enough political sense not to let that influence him to to much in the public eye.

 

[spog]

It's always got me stuffed how the thrust of the whole scheme was to save an estimated *20,000 gigawatt-hours (72,000 TJ) of electricity and 25 petajoules (6.9×109 kWh) of natural gas by 2015 (wiki)* based on some shaky estimates, so in a nutshell, all about consuming less power - using less fossil fuel and so on, right?
Why wouldn't a government with such a green environmental bent not do everything in its power to encourage use of the biggest mixed blessing we have, sunlight. Why would you roll back schemes and rebates that encourage people to bolt as many solar panels and water heaters as possible to their roofs? Windmills? Get em in there. Who knows, perhaps even help get local production of the requisite technologies up and running rather than import panels and transformers by the container load. Just imagine actually, like, 'making stuff'. Yeah, we can do it.


Perhaps Garret was made the fall guy in all of this, with friends psychopaths like K Rudd, that's only to be expected, but bugger him.
He's an rabid leftist and I always hated Midnight Oil anyway.

Correct me if I am wrong,but is Oz not the driest inhabited continent on the planet,and south Oz the driest state ?.
Yet here the law states that if you build a new house you must have a minimum 1000 litre rainwater tank and that water is non potable,
Meaning it has to be plumbed into the house and used for flushing the dunny,not for drinking filling the kettle etc.
The government rebate on these jokes of rainwater tanks is gone,but 1000 litres?
And recently some half sucked off pollie raised the suggestion of taxing people for the amount of rainwater collect,FFS.
But I guess it's on the cards seeing that solar panels have a separate meter measuring the power generated and the existing meter measuring the usage.

 

[browndog]

Correct me if I am wrong,but is Oz not the driest inhabited continent on the planet,and south Oz the driest state ?.
Yet here the law states that if you build a new house you must have a minimum 1000 litre rainwater tank and that water is non potable,
Meaning it has to be plumbed into the house and used for flushing the dunny,not for drinking filling the kettle etc.
The government rebate on these jokes of rainwater tanks is gone,but 1000 litres?
And recently some half sucked off pollie raised the suggestion of taxing people for the amount of rainwater collect,FFS.
But I guess it's on the cards seeing that solar panels have a separate meter measuring the power generated and the existing meter measuring the usage.

Somebody may be able to confirm/refute this, but I believe they can tax a farmer on the amount of water the dams on his property collect.

 

[spog]

Somebody may be able to confirm/refute this, but I believe they can tax a farmer on the amount of water the dams on his property collect.

Correct,I reckon this is happening in the Adelaide hills,farmers collecting the storm water runoff from roads ( not sealed or curbed) and being charged for it.
As one bloke on the radio said,"how can the government charge farmers for what god gives,perhaps the government can get together with the insurance company's and tell us all who god is and wether or not all things can be blamed on him."
There was silence on the radio for a short while,one of the radio guests was a pollie.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Somebody may be able to confirm/refute this, but I believe they can tax a farmer on the amount of water the dams on his property collect.

In NSW there is (basically) a licence on the size of the dam you can have on your property. The licence depends on a few factors. It relates to the size of your property, the rainfall band it falls in, the size of the dam and if it is within a direct water course. They dont care if the dam is full or empty. Most farm dams do not require a licence. Its only when a dam is built that is of a size within a rainfall band that can affect flow into rivers and creeks that you need a licence

There is no "tax" on the amount of water, well not in NSW. ( Maybe in the the great state of QLD...but **** knows what strange things go on up in that great state )

I have a few mates that work in the lands dept and the way it is worked out is very sensible. You can look up the nsw lands website and get all the info you need

 

[shaunous]

Government has to take some blame.

U cant blame the employer wholey, it wasnt just one or 2, its was thousands of 'employers' rorting this system, how could the system be rorted to easily, by lack of governance.

 

[shaunous]

Somebody may be able to confirm/refute this, but I believe they can tax a farmer on the amount of water the dams on his property collect.

I was waiting for this to come out.

Thats how it works, you dont have to become a conspiracy theorist for that one.

1. Government hands out rebate
2. Government sits tiddling thumbs for some time untill the plebs have forgotten about it
3. Government taxes said item and makes money plus more out of the original rebate they offered.

Win Win.