Recipedb - Altbier

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Hey manticle link to original recipe is broken, I can't seem to find it in RecipeDB.

Very keen to have a crack at one of these as I still have that Spalt from the giveaway!!

I've had Stone & Wood Stone Beer which is apparently an Altbier, have you had it and is it close to traditional? If not can you recommend something I can get locally to try as an example?

 

[manticle]

Last post of mine on the previous page has a revised recipe. From memory, the original was for an odd amount (like 35 L) and featured styrian goldings and tettnanger. I now do it all with spalt but spalt, tett, whatever all works. Needs firm, smooth bitterness some late hopping and healthy active 1007 yeast, fermented at or below 14, good 3 weeks to clear past FG.

Decoction and step mashing well worth it if you can.

No idea what has happened to the link and ever since the db got altered, it's been a total bugger to search for anything that isn't on the first page.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Awesome, will use second recipe you posted, thanks mate am looking forward to having a crack at it!

 

[Weizguy]

I found your Altbier recipe link (35 litre batch)

 

[warra48]

I'm putting down a Düsseldorf Alt tomorrow:

25 litre batch, predicted OG around 1.050.

3000 gr Premium Pilsner
2000 gr Munich I
100 gr Caraaroma
50 gr Choc Wheat
Smaragd & Spalter @ 60 min to 46 IBU
Spalter @ 10 min to 4 IBU
Wyeast 2565 from 2 litre starter (less a bit saved for the next culture).

The Smaragd is not traditional, but I'm using it because I have it and need to use it up. I've brewed several batches of Alt in past years and I think this will get pretty close to actual Alt.

I was in Düsseldorf last year, and my impressions of the beers accord with Foles' comments in post #2.
My favourite from all the many I drank was Schumacher.
Great shame these beers aren't available commercially in Australia, as far as I can see. They're terrific beers.

Bought the Wyeast from Brewman last Saturday, very fresh, 5 Jan date. It fully swelled up within 2 hours, and grew like crazy in the flask.

 

[Brewman_]

I love this style.
Awesome beer.
But unlike Warra I have never had an authentic version, so I've just gone from the Style guidelines.

The one's I have made were using 1007 German Ale. Been pretty happy with that too. Not sure if I fermented as cold as what Manticle did though, recommended between 13 and 20 degrees, I think I was around the 17 mark, but turned out well. Be nice to have some authentic examples to compare to.

Very interested to see how it turns out Warra with the different yeast hops.

 

[manticle]

I found your Altbier recipe link (35 litre batch)

Cheers Les

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Anyone tried WLP036 Düsseldorf alt yeast? Is it similar to or the same as Wyeast 1007?

 

[manticle]

According to Kristen England they are both the zum uriege strain originally.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

According to Kristen England they are both the zum uriege strain originally.

Interesting, as white labs say optimum ferment temp is 18-21C, then also for the WLP029 (German ale) they state it can't ferment lower than 17C unless during active fermentation.

But the alt style is best fermented at 13-14C though and is what you have found gives best results with 1007?

 

[manticle]

I've got my fridge set at 11.5 to allow for fermentation generated heat and in my experience it should it ferment healthily. Same wort starter kicked off at same temp within a day.

Sometimes I bump the temp up to 16-17 after 72 hours or so but I have fermented cool all the way through with no dramas.

It will definitely go below 17.

 

[Weizguy]

I'm putting down a Düsseldorf Alt tomorrow:

25 litre batch, predicted OG around 1.050.

3000 gr Premium Pilsner
2000 gr Munich I
100 gr Caraaroma
50 gr Choc Wheat
Smaragd & Spalter @ 60 min to 46 IBU
Spalter @ 10 min to 4 IBU
Wyeast 2565 from 2 litre starter (less a bit saved for the next culture).

The Smaragd is not traditional, but I'm using it because I have it and need to use it up. I've brewed several batches of Alt in past years and I think this will get pretty close to actual Alt.

I was in Düsseldorf last year, and my impressions of the beers accord with Foles' comments in post #2.
My favourite from all the many I drank was Schumacher.
Great shame these beers aren't available commercially in Australia, as far as I can see. They're terrific beers.

Bought the Wyeast from Brewman last Saturday, very fresh, 5 Jan date. It fully swelled up within 2 hours, and grew like crazy in the flask.

Please bring some to the next club meet for me.

I still have plans for an Alt, and I will post the recipe here, or should I go to the Style of the week thread?
I recall that I have Weyermann Pale ale malt set aside for this, sourced when MHB's shop was still in business.

 

[warra48]

Very happy to bring some along to HUB. Maybe not next meeting, as it will take some time. Will ferment for probably 2 weeks before lagering for another 3 weeks or so, then bottling.

No reason you couldn't post the same recipe in each of the threads you mention.

 

[Weizguy]

Very happy to bring some along to HUB. Maybe not next meeting, as it will take some time. Will ferment for probably 2 weeks before lagering for another 3 weeks or so, then bottling.

No reason you couldn't post the same recipe in each of the threads you mention.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Warra, and offer of a sample.
Looks like I was wrong about the Pale Ale malt. That must have been what I used in my Kölsch.

UERIGE ALTered (based on the Wheeler recipe)

46 litre batch predicted o.g. - 1.050
Est alc - 5.2%

2.086 kg MEU (Aus) Pilsner
6.27 kg Munich I (Weyermann)
1.1 kg Abbey malt (Weyermann) at MHB's suggestion
0.250 kg Caraaroma


Saaz (Bittering) (T45) 120g @ 90 min to 47 IBU
Saaz plugs (Flavour) 28g @ 10 min to ~1.7 IBU

Brewbrite (5 doses) at 10 min before end of boil
Wyeast 1007 - 5 litre starter

 

[manticle]

Looks alright to me. What's your mash schedule? I prefer no crystal - with lots of munich/vienna and some decoction I get plenty of sweet maltiness but I can't see it being terribly out of place.

Great yeast and like so many beers, it plays a starring role.

 

[pat86]

I'm putting down a Düsseldorf Alt tomorrow:

25 litre batch, predicted OG around 1.050.

3000 gr Premium Pilsner
2000 gr Munich I
100 gr Caraaroma
50 gr Choc Wheat
Smaragd & Spalter @ 60 min to 46 IBU
Spalter @ 10 min to 4 IBU
Wyeast 2565 from 2 litre starter (less a bit saved for the next culture).

The Smaragd is not traditional, but I'm using it because I have it and need to use it up. I've brewed several batches of Alt in past years and I think this will get pretty close to actual Alt.

I was in Düsseldorf last year, and my impressions of the beers accord with Foles' comments in post #2.
My favourite from all the many I drank was Schumacher.
Great shame these beers aren't available commercially in Australia, as far as I can see. They're terrific beers.

Bought the Wyeast from Brewman last Saturday, very fresh, 5 Jan date. It fully swelled up within 2 hours, and grew like crazy in the flask.

I also was a big fan of the Schumacher Alt in particular. Have you read Altbier? There is a recipe which was recommended / formulated by the old Schumacher brewer. I definitely didn't nail it due to process and diff hops when I made it but I can post it for you if you haven't got the book?

The main difference if I remember is a much larger % of Munich malt very close to 100% while the other Dusseldorf breweries used more like 20-50%.

I've asked Dr Smurto previously about the yeast and agree with his advice - 1007 all the way.

I thought it was quite different to beers I made with 2565 kolsch yeast.

 

[Weizguy]

Looks alright to me. What's your mash schedule? I prefer no crystal - with lots of munich/vienna and some decoction I get plenty of sweet maltiness but I can't see it being terribly out of place.

Great yeast and like so many beers, it plays a starring role.

I think I got the mash schedule from Horst Dornbusch, when he was BYO's recipe formulator.

50°C for 30 min, and 65°C for 60 min, then mash out for 10 min.

I did a decoction last time I made an alt, and did not see much value. Maybe next time. This batch is mostly for keg filling.

my W1007 culture has been in the family since I was extract brewing, and this is my 10th year of ag (*takes a bow, and has a laugh).

 

[warra48]

I also was a big fan of the Schumacher Alt in particular. Have you read Altbier? There is a recipe which was recommended / formulated by the old Schumacher brewer. I definitely didn't nail it due to process and diff hops when I made it but I can post it for you if you haven't got the book?

The main difference if I remember is a much larger % of Munich malt very close to 100% while the other Dusseldorf breweries used more like 20-50%.

I've asked Dr Smurto previously about the yeast and agree with his advice - 1007 all the way.

I thought it was quite different to beers I made with 2565 kolsch yeast.

I've not read the book, but would love to have a look at the recipe.

 

[pat86]

Here we go, sorry it took a while:

Enderlein's Alt

Munich - light (6.5L) author suggests if your Munich 1 is darker to try subbing a small % of two row pale malt

5 gallons
40IBU
OG: 1047
FG: 1010
ABV 4.8%
SRM 11-12

These values are just predicted of course

Malt: 9.25 pounds of Munich

Hops: 40IBU - Hallertau Mittlefruh
+ 1 ounce of Hallertau Mittlefruh at flame out for aroma.

He doesn't say this is a Clone for Schumacher Alt, just that the recipe was supplied by the brewmaster there for the book...

I had recalled it using spalt so interested to see how it turns out next time and will have to look at what L my best malz Munich is.

He doesn't give a specific mash profile for each recipe, there are a few throughout the book. The generic one he recommends +/-1C is:

50C dough in protein rest -30m

64C beta sacc rest -15 mins

69C alpha - 15 mins

77C mash out

Sparge.

Recommends a 90-120 minute boil

Good luck and keen to hear how your alts progress!