No Chill 0 Min Hop Additions

[felten]

Usually its because you want the yeast active to absorb any oxygen you're adding along with the hops. If you're using boiling water in your press though that should be minimised, I'd just go ahead and add it now instead of at bottling.

 

[Bribie G]

It should work out ok, but there could be a problem with "grassyness" depending on the hop variety. However seeing as you are bottling, this should fade out as the beer conditions, also any oxygen would be taken care of in the bottle.

 

[Bizier]

I have recently taken to a disposable hop sock in the keg on a piece of thread, and I am stoked with the results. I am finding the results different to adding the hops while there is yeast activity, I am guessing because there is no real interaction with yeast, and any dissolved volatiles are trapped in the keg. I have only done it twice, but I will continue. Obviously it is style appropriate.

Once I did a case swap IPA with a large hopsock of high aa% hops (250g or so from memory) which I put in a small pot of boiling water (all soaked into hops), and then threw into the bulk priming vessel, stirred and left for a few hours. I actually wedged it with a long spoon against the outlet, and drew though the hops. The bottles had yellow sediment, but I was impressed with the hop character the method gave, lots of the melon type characters.

 

[outbreak]

I am having great results with cooling my no chill cube down to approx 4 degrees and drawing about 3l of wort then boiling it up and doing my 10 and 0min additions then mixing it with the rest of the wort thus bringing it to ale pitching temps and locking in flavour and aroma. Someone has outlined the method on another thread. The last IPA i made this way had thr keg drained in record time.

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

Okay I'm reviving this thread rather than posting a new one. I'm new to NC cubes and very new to AG brewing. What's everyone doing now with NC hopping? I'm thinking that my 15-0 minute additions will be put into the cube instead, but I'll dry hop in the keg too, with a hop sock and dental floss, will remove the bag after a couple of weeks as I've heard that 6-10 days is optimum apparently (but don't know why?!). I'll have a go at FWH sometime as some people are using this instead of 0 minute additions.

I've heard that instead of a 60 min addition, a 30 min should be used in NC, any truth to this?

I have two cubes, I plan on putting one into my brew fridge at pitching temp overnight, rather than storing it somewhere, then I'll use it as a FV. Anything wrong with this? Kind of slow chilling it overnight. I've read Manticles very good guide on using a NC cube as a FV.

The second cube I'll store then pitch the yeast from the first cube into it. Sound okay? Just making sure I won't be doing any obvious mistakes! Thanks.

 

[black_labb]

When you say storing the cube in the fermenting fridge overnight you want to have it at room temperature before putting it in there. I'm not sure if you were thinking it but some people thought they would get it to cool quicker by putting the hot cube in the fridge. This is a good way of turning your fridge into an oven and you would be much better using a fan to cool it quickly.


Otherwise it sounds like a good plan.

I personally do mostly 60 minute additions and cube additions. I'll add some dry hopping or boil up some saved up wort after pitching for extra late hopping if I feel the need.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

I do one 60 or 90 minute addition and then cube addition.

When I get back to Qld, I'll try to time how long, on average it takes for the wort to get from 'boiling' to '1 degree below isomerisation' temp and see if I can adjust my NC cube additions accordingly by adding the hops into the cube x minutes after cubing (or hours YMMV) and seeing if I can get some really good aroma additions.

As it stands though, my cube additions are pretty spot on with the 15 minute additions mark.

 

[wombil]

G'day Guys,
I have been reading this thread with great interest and note where warm beer says,

2) Tea hops. Using a Bodum-style coffee plunger, steep your 0 min hops in boiling water for a couple of minutes, press down the plunger, and add the liquid into the fermenter full of wort. This is best done at about Day 3 or 4 of fermentation, after the majority of activity has slowed down.
I am thinking of trying this as I have been putting hops in the keg in a hop bag with good results but this looks easier Question is , Ïs this the bodum style coffee plunger that is referred to"?

 

[idzy]

If it makes tea, it should make hop tea. The point of the plunger is to disregard the hops and keep the clear liquid.



Thought I would throw a spanner in the works too... If I no chill, I whirlpool for 20 minutes. If I chill, I whirlpool for 20 minutes...

 

[Kingy]

I add my flavour hops at flame out then wait ten minutes then whirlpool then wait another 10 minutes then into the cube. Dry hop in fermenter with aroma hops. Been working out great. I've also been adjusting hop additions in brew mate so tge beers aren't so bitter. My beers have improved greatly.

 

[Yob]

When I get back to Qld,

sorry :icon_offtopic:

Kickin yorself you didnt storage your old gear?

 

[Yob]

coffee.jpg

Yep

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

When you say storing the cube in the fermenting fridge overnight you want to have it at room temperature before putting it in there. I'm not sure if you were thinking it but some people thought they would get it to cool quicker by putting the hot cube in the fridge. This is a good way of turning your fridge into an oven and you would be much better using a fan to cool it quickly.


Otherwise it sounds like a good plan.

I personally do mostly 60 minute additions and cube additions. I'll add some dry hopping or boil up some saved up wort after pitching for extra late hopping if I feel the need.

Thanks Black, will cool outside the fridge, good point.

 

[Nicko_Cairns]

I do one 60 or 90 minute addition and then cube addition.

When I get back to Qld, I'll try to time how long, on average it takes for the wort to get from 'boiling' to '1 degree below isomerisation' temp and see if I can adjust my NC cube additions accordingly by adding the hops into the cube x minutes after cubing (or hours YMMV) and seeing if I can get some really good aroma additions.

As it stands though, my cube additions are pretty spot on with the 15 minute additions mark.

good idea Goomba, I might do the same, this will be very interesting. I don't brew often (yet) but I'll take notes anyway and post the results, I might as well do two side by side cube comparisons too, one hopped before adding the hot wort and the second added at X time and X temperature.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

sorry :icon_offtopic:

Kickin yorself you didnt storage your old gear?

Kegging system - yes. I got most of my kegs for $40 each when there were still plenty available.

Oh well, YOLO. I was always told "if you always do what you always did, you always get what you always got" - it was worth a crack.

 

[citizensnips]

Dry hopping will definetely give you the aroma your looking for

 

[seehuusen]

As I'm fairly new to brewing, with about 10 AG batches of IPA experience, I've been recording hop schedules and experimenting.

Because it's my preferred beer, I've been reading the Mitch Steele book on IPA, which is a great read by the way.
In it, he describes that FWH was an old method used during a time in Europe when they had a hop shortage. In doing FWH, you end up getting 10-15% better utilization/extraction of the hops, in part due to the longer contact with the wort, but also due to the Ph level of your wort is kept higher.

The idea with taking out 3 liters and adding all your hop additions to that during a boil is a pretty good idea.
From my understanding, a volume of wort can only take on so much isomerized hop bitterness, leaving aroma and flavour more pronounced in that smaller batch. (There's a formula in the book, I won't bore you with that LOL)

I have to say, Lord Raja's idea is fantastic!
I'll measure mine next time I brew up a batch and try that out :icon_cheers:
By adding it at less than 85C you'd get no isomerization, which would in theory only add aroma/flavour.

As far as dry hopping goes, Mitch mentions that the majority of the extraction of flavours and aromas are achieved within only a few days. Any more than 2 weeks would add grassy, stick notes to the beer rather than the fruity citrus flavours we all strive for.
Also worth noting, hopping prior to fermentation, you'll loose IBU's to the yeast. In the book, Mitch instructs that dry hopping should only be done after fermentation has finished, so I do this when I've racked to secondary. This also allows me to save my yeast cake to wash it

Cheers
Martin

EDIT: Just confirming that I no-chill, but I am looking to use a CFC soon... I'll see how Raja's idea goes first though!

 

[mofox1]

Thought I would throw a spanner in the works too... If I no chill, I whirlpool for 20 minutes. If I chill, I whirlpool for 20 minutes...

You're just stirring... h34r:

 

[The Village Idiot]

My two bobs worth....I no chill and couldn't get much flavour or aroma by adding hops even at flame out. Haven't like the grassiness I get from dry hopping. I am drinking an APA at the moment that I "experimented" with that has 9 IBU's of Magnum at 60 min and 50g of Citra in the cube. :super: My best APA for flavour/aroma by a long way. Go the cube hops!!!!

 

[danestead]

By adding it at less than 85C you'd get no isomerization, which would in theory only add aroma/flavour.

It's funny you should say this actually because there is a recent thread going where the original poster has done some research into the isomerisation of hops at different temperatures.

http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/81226-calculation-of-ibu-additions-after-flame-out-no-chillwhirlpool/#entry1194637

Basically, through the use of a couple of his formulas I have been able to establish the following isomerisation amounts, as a percentage compared to a boil hop addition.

95 degrees - 66%
90 degrees - 43%
85 degrees - 28%
80 degrees - 18%
75 degrees - 11%
70 degrees - 7%

A quick example.

You are going to do a 20min whirlpool addition of 40g of Citra (12% AA) at 85 degrees. Your OG of the wort is 1.050. You enter this data into your brewing software as a 20min addition and it tells you it will contribute 33 IBU's. Multiply 33 IBU's by the % for 85 degrees (28%) and you have determined that your whirlpool addition has contributed 9 IBU's to your wort.

Just thought you may be interested and I hope it doesn't confuse you.