New To Hb, Getting Some Odd Results

[rday]

I'm pretty new to brewing; I've done 5 kits over the last couple of months, and I've had a couple of annoyingly strange results with some of my brews. Here's a quick rundown: my first kit was okay, but the fermenting temp was about 26, so taste was obviously affected.

I fermented my second kit in a tub full of water, which kept the temp around 23. This kit has been my best so far.

My next two kits (3 & 4) were an experiment brewing two sets of the same kit and a package of Coopers brew enhancer 1 each, one with kit yeast and one with safale yeast, each brewed at 20. And here's my first issue... The kit yeast beer has turned out really well, but the safale yeast is flat after about 1 month of conditioning. There is a bit of live yeast on the bottom of the bottles, but not much. I've tried inverting the bottles a few times over the past couple weeks to resuspend the yeast and see if that makes a difference and it doesn't seem to.

Now for my second problem... Kit 4 was brewed with 1 kg dextrose and 500 g malt and safale yeast, brewed at 18. OG was 1.044 and it only got down to 1.013. I even gave it a vigourous swirl at one point to see if it might help things along. An online calculator suggested it should have ended up around 1.007. I was concerned about bottle popping, so I took a reading every other day 3 times and it hadn't changed, so I bottled. I cracked one open the other day and it was green (9 days in the bottle), but pretty good. I wouldn't be two concerned with the high FG, but...

Kit 5: Cooper's Draught + BE1 + Kit yeast: OG 1.039, FG 1.015, brewed at 18.

So, in summary, one kit with safale has been flat whereas the same kit brewed with kit yeast and all other conditions the same turned out well, and lately my brews don't seem to be ending up with a FG anywhere near the predicted value.

Sorry for the longwinded post, but I figure the more details the better. Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[Cube]

Welcome to the world of brewing, and welcome to this site

You seem to be going down the tried and true path of a lot of brewers ie: to high temp, going to tub of water, using better yeast and ingredients etc. Well done. Next you will be doing small boil ups with hops ( so easy ) and re using the good yeasts.

As with the SG readings, you need to 'flush' the tap before taking a reading for the first time, and for FG as well ( works for me ). Basically, what's in the tap is 'thicker' and does not represent the true SG of the wort in the fermenter. Just open the tap fully for a few seconds to flush out the build up of fermentables that get in there when filling it right up then fill your test tube.

Try this - most likely be your funny SG reading and thus effecting your calculations.

But hey, I'm just learning as well :icon_drunk:

Edit: Are you using carb drops? These seem to be random and unreliable from what I hear. Try using a measured spoon from the supermarkets in the beer section and plain homebrand sugar for carbing, or bulk priming. I don't bulk prime and never will. Just another step to go wrong in my opinion ( flame suit on hahaha )

 

[Cortez The Killer]

High FG's are pretty normal for kit beers though 1.015 seems a little high - probably wait a little longer - though BE1 does contain a large proprotion of maltodextrin which can bump up FG

With batch #4 give it another month - safale S-04 sets like concrete when its done fermenting so only a small amount may have made it to the bottles. Time should resolve this.

If concerned about FG try using Safale US-05 this will get your FG down as it attenuates well

Cheers

 

[Bribie G]

Hi, rday. The flat beer after a month in the bottles sounds a bit of a worry. Have you cracked one to see what it tastes like? Safale yeasts are usually quite fast and vigorous so I can't figure out what the problem could be. By flat do you mean flat as a tack, or just not as fizzy as you have had with the previous brews?

Assuming you primed the bottles with the right amount of sugar (can you remember how much you used?), one suggestion is - if the bottles are PET home brew bottles - mix up a little bit of kit yeast with some sterile water, and inoculate half a dozen bottles and check them daily by squeezing. If they start to harden up then it's been a yeast problem, but nothing I have personally come across with the safales or saflagers.

Happy experimenting :icon_cheers: :icon_cheers:

 

[brendo]

If you are starting to use more malt extract in your later brews than in your earlier ones, this will account for a higher FG as malt extract is less fermentable than dextrose is.

I rarely had an extract based brew go below 1012... just ain't gunna happen.

Sounds like you are on the right track though with your brewing.

As to the flat beer - can't really explain why one batch has done better than the other if they were done at the same time. If they aren't already, trying warming up the flat batch to 20-22 degrees for a week or so to see if it spurs the yeast on. Might need to rouse them a little while you are at it.

Cheers,

brendo

 

[caleb]

And here's my first issue... The kit yeast beer has turned out really well, but the safale yeast is flat after about 1 month of conditioning. There is a bit of live yeast on the bottom of the bottles, but not much. I've tried inverting the bottles a few times over the past couple weeks to resuspend the yeast and see if that makes a difference and it doesn't seem to.

I'm assuming you used S-04 here. I've used this yeast a lot and really like the results. HOWEVER, my last batch had the exact same problem, and took about 2 months before it was ready - VERY slow conditioning. Normally its fizzy after about 1 week, if not at its peak. The only difference was I normally bottle after 1 week, with this one I left it in the fermenter for 2, and I guess the high flocculence of S-04 meant most had settled and little made it into the bottle.

Now for my second problem... Kit 4 was brewed with 1 kg dextrose and 500 g malt and safale yeast, brewed at 18. OG was 1.044 and it only got down to 1.013.... Kit 5: Cooper's Draught + BE1 + Kit yeast: OG 1.039, FG 1.015, brewed at 18.

Sounds OK to me. I've had beers finish at 1018, after starting around 1046 - 1048. Depends on the yeast used and type of fermentables. Dextrose ferments out fully, whereas malt extract leaves more "residue" which contributes to body and flavor, and also higher FG. The darker the malt, the more unfermentable stuff it contains, as a rule. The S-04 is not a particularly hungry yeast, and does tend to leave a fairly malty body and finish higher than some others.
So, what you've got sounds perfectly reasonable to me. Remember, yeast is a living organism and can be somewhat unpredictable. As long as it stays at the same FG for a few days, you should be right. What's more important is how the beer tastes once it comes out of the bottle!

 

[rday]

Thanks for all the tips and advice!

Are you using carb drops?

I am. I thought they were great for convenience, but if the results aren't there, I might have to try just adding sugar. Flushing out the tap sounds like a very good idea as well. Though I hate the idea of wasting even a little bit of beer!

safale S-04 sets like concrete

I've noticed that. After bottling, the bottom of the fermentor looks like the surface of the moon!

Hi, rday. The flat beer after a month in the bottles sounds a bit of a worry. Have you cracked one to see what it tastes like? Safale yeasts are usually quite fast and vigorous so I can't figure out what the problem could be. By flat do you mean flat as a tack, or just not as fizzy as you have had with the previous brews?

Assuming you primed the bottles with the right amount of sugar (can you remember how much you used?), one suggestion is - if the bottles are PET home brew bottles - mix up a little bit of kit yeast with some sterile water, and inoculate half a dozen bottles and check them daily by squeezing. If they start to harden up then it's been a yeast problem, but nothing I have personally come across with the safales or saflagers.

I've tasted the beer and it's fine, just flat. As a tack. The first time I opened one it was beer flavoured water, but the last one had a bubble or two of carbonation, so maybe I just need to wait a few months... As for the sugar, I've been using Coopers Carbonation drops, 1 in a stubbie, 2 to a tallie.

It's good to hear that my problems aren't really that problematic. I'll keep doing what I'm doing and read up here to hopefully stay one step ahead of the beer.

 

[wyethm]

I've had a similar thing happen recently with two very similar brews. Both using US-05, both exactly the same dextrose used to bulk prime, both were in the primary for 3 weeks. One was a kit and bits, the second LME and bits.

The one using a kit carbed up perfectly. The other one is still almost flat (small amount of carb) after 6 weeks.

The LME and bits only had an OG of 1035 (v's 1040 for the kit), so I'm not sure if this would make a difference to how they would carbinate in the bottle.

I'm going to try a few different experiments (carefully add a little more dextrose, add more yeast) over the next few weeks and if one works, I'll do to the whole batch.

Worth the effort as the taste of both is very good, so I want to recover the LME and bits brew.

Cheers

Mark