"My beer is too bitter" post, where?

[Nick667]

A short time ago there was a post as above. Can anyone point me in the right direction or give advice.
Could it be not chilling fast enough? I am using an eight coil emersion chiller and when the weather is warm it can take 30 mins to get down to the low 30s. Can this extra time throw out the 20, 10 and 0 min hop additions?
I am getting a really good end product with a fantastic head and beautifully clear but somewhere I am not getting the balance right.
AG, BIAB, chilled, temp control right through, full vol boil, rehydrate yeast dry yeast, total sanitation, using Brewmate software.

 

[kunfaced]

what's the recipe?

 

[Camo6]

What IBUs do you aim for? One of my common mistakes is to apply my rule of thumb far too recklessly when it comes to hop additions. While I love a bitter beer, I'm practising brewing beers in the low 20 IBUs to readjust my palate.

 

[danestead]

Yes, your immersion chiller may be giving you higher bitterness than calculated by your brewing software, but not much. The isomerisation of alpha acids (the process which gives bitterness to your beer) drops off very quickly as the temperature is reduced from boiling. At 90 degrees you are only getting about 43% of the normal isomerisation and at 70 degrees you are only getting about 7%.

The process I use is as soon as time is up, I start running water through the immersion chiller whilst agitating the wort slightly until it is down to 70-75 degrees. This takes me about 3 minutes and as you now know, you aren't really getting any significant isomerisation from then on. I actually remove the immersion chiller then, and whirlpool it for 15 minutes then use a plate chiller. Above 70ish degrees you are still pretty safe in terms infection risk as the wort is still quite hot. From the sounds of it, you use your immersion chiller for the whole process so I wouldn't be too worried about any extra IBU's coming from the process you are using. It'd be 1 or 2 IBU's at most, depending on the quantity, amount and AA% of your late hops.

Where I have screwed up in the past though, is switching the flame off, and then whirlpooling for 15 minutes prior to chilling the wort. This resulted in some quite over bittered beers. I now always immersion chill immediately no matter what my recipe is. It ensures consistency and a reproducible beer. Once again though, if you are immersion chilling for the whole process, you'd be whirlpooling after chilling your wort, so the above shouldn't really apply to you. It gives you some understanding on what is happening though.

The other thing you may be experiencing is astringency and I also know this through my own issues. Astringency can lead you to think a beer is too bitter when in fact it isn't. Bitterness and astringency are 2 different things but can be confused as 1 until you know the difference. I find astringency to give a long harsh 'bitterness' which I find is like steeping a green tea bag for a long time, or sucking on a tea bag. Mouth puckering is another term used often.

Hope that helps.

 

[Dan Pratt]

What was your target ibu and hops/schedule for the beer?

 

[indica86]

Use less bittering hops.
Software IBU doesn't mean a lot apart from a guide.

Work out what works for you on your set up.

Rinse and repeat.

 

[mxd]

need more info, recipe, SG, FG, etc..

have you adjusted your recipe for the AA% of the hops your using ?

 

[Danscraftbeer]

Beer by beer. Take all notes and analyse. The road to perfection! :chug:

 

[Nick667]

Yes, your immersion chiller may be giving you higher bitterness than calculated by your brewing software, but not much. The isomerisation of alpha acids (the process which gives bitterness to your beer) drops off very quickly as the temperature is reduced from boiling. At 90 degrees you are only getting about 43% of the normal isomerisation and at 70 degrees you are only getting about 7%.

The process I use is as soon as time is up, I start running water through the immersion chiller whilst agitating the wort slightly until it is down to 70-75 degrees. This takes me about 3 minutes and as you now know, you aren't really getting any significant isomerisation from then on. I actually remove the immersion chiller then, and whirlpool it for 15 minutes then use a plate chiller. Above 70ish degrees you are still pretty safe in terms infection risk as the wort is still quite hot. From the sounds of it, you use your immersion chiller for the whole process so I wouldn't be too worried about any extra IBU's coming from the process you are using. It'd be 1 or 2 IBU's at most, depending on the quantity, amount and AA% of your late hops.

Where I have screwed up in the past though, is switching the flame off, and then whirlpooling for 15 minutes prior to chilling the wort. This resulted in some quite over bittered beers. I now always immersion chill immediately no matter what my recipe is. It ensures consistency and a reproducible beer. Once again though, if you are immersion chilling for the whole process, you'd be whirlpooling after chilling your wort, so the above shouldn't really apply to you. It gives you some understanding on what is happening though.

The other thing you may be experiencing is astringency and I also know this through my own issues. Astringency can lead you to think a beer is too bitter when in fact it isn't. Bitterness and astringency are 2 different things but can be confused as 1 until you know the difference. I find astringency to give a long harsh 'bitterness' which I find is like steeping a green tea bag for a long time, or sucking on a tea bag. Mouth puckering is another term used often.

Hope that helps.


Astringency had crossed my mind but I didn't know about whirl pooling the wort to early.
I fly? sparge with 8ish litres of 76C water through the bag on an oven rack top of pot, just trickle. Can this be over sparging? How do you over sparge?
I plan to get a bigger pot because at 30lts I cant do full vol boils and top up with boiling water during the boil. No tap on bot.

 

[Nick667]

I use proven recipes and the IBU varies eg; ale at 27 pale ale at 32 APA at 35.8 amber ale at 18.5, and just adjust the quantities with the software so the hop quantities change as well and IBU stays the same.
When I try a really good professional ' craft beer ' like APA or IPA there is a really good rounded balance and that is what I am trying to achieve. The wife who only drinks on the odd occasion loves my Pacific pale I am just trying to nail it better.

 

[Dan Pratt]

You may need to address the water and pH if you want the beer to be better, more rounded and to style.

You say proven recipes, what are you referring too?

 

[mxd]

I use proven recipes and the IBU varies eg; ale at 27 pale ale at 32 APA at 35.8 amber ale at 18.5, and just adjust the quantities with the software so the hop quantities change as well and IBU stays the same.
When I try a really good professional ' craft beer ' like APA or IPA there is a really good rounded balance and that is what I am trying to achieve. The wife who only drinks on the odd occasion loves my Pacific pale I am just trying to nail it better.

ok, just o make sure i undestand
if the recipe says

20g citra 10% at 60 minutes for 18 ibu

do you put 20g f your citra in at 60 ?

or do you look at your citra see it's 15% so adjust so its 15g at 60 ?

just trying to clarify as when I did my first few brews I followed the recipes but didn't adjust the hop quantities for the AA% to get the same ibu rating.

is your mash temp correct, if you mash at a lower temp it can attenuate further and loose the original balance.

 

[indica86]

you look at your citra see it's 15% so adjust so its 15g at 60 ?

Yes.