Infection Problems - HELP

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SimoB

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Hi All,

Not new to the forum but new to posting. I have read lots on here that's helped me, but i have hit a snag.

I have been brewing for about a year. I have never had an infection until recently. I have had to throw 3 kegs down the drain... in a row!! It's killing me, to point where I sometimes want to quit.

I was doing Partial mash on the stove top using the BIAB method. I had no chiller, wasn't overly sanitary and never had a problem. My natural progression of wanting to make better beers I went to AG.

This is when the problem started, I have been using:
  • a keggle.
  • BIAB method.
  • I now have an immersion chiller. (left in 20 mins before flameout)
The 3 batches I did like this all failed. 3 different beers but they all end up tasting the same. Super cloudy and does not settle. Smells and taste not like beer. Almost soury bad mouth feel. Leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

I really stepped up the sanitation after the first one. Cleaned everything! used starsan etc. I finally thought my old plastic fermenter was the culprit.

I now have a new beer on with a new fermenter. Everything went well and frementation started within 3 hours. Used safale-04. everything looks right in the fermenter. However, it smells almost like a bad cheap wine. (only been fermenting since Sunday) Kinda taste like one too.

Is this infected as well? It is nothing like the last 3 batched but still smells odd. Am I being way to dramatic here?

Thanks in advance.

SImo
 
Sounds like it may be infected mate. What concerns me is the bit about the S04 visibly fermenting within 3hrs. It sounds to me like something had already kicked off before you added the yeast. Could you outline your whole process including how you clean and santise and also if you continue to do so as you are brewing.
 
Sure thing. And thanks for the reply.

The keggle is new. Cut out and new tap added. Have done 3 batches (4 with the new one on at the moment).

Start of the brew day I rinse out the keggle and clean out anything that may be there. No sanatiser though as I will be boiling.

Heat up my strike water.
Add my grains - leave for an hour
Remove grains and bag. rinse grains and top up for boil.
Bring to the boil (60 mins)
At this stage I would have my fermenter cleaned and sanitising. My transfer hose will be also in a bucket of water sanitising with starsan.
20mins to go I would place my immersion chiller in the boil.
Flameout and start chilling. I have covered the keg with a lid as well.
Once chilled I transfer into the fermenter.
I did rehydrate my yeast, this would be why the fermentation is a little faster i think. Pitch yeast.

That's about it. Temperature seemed to be pretty stable. go back to partial mash... :(

Cheers,
 
What did you rehydrate your yeast in how was that sterilized/sanitized?
 
Even rehydrated, you shouldn't have visible fermentation within 3 hours. Unless something has beaten your yeasties to the party. Wild yeast infection maybe? Bacterial? What sort of environment are you brewing in? (Inside, outside, how clean is the area, any fruiting trees nearby,...) Is this the same area you've always brewed/fermented your partials? Is starsan definitely made up as per instructions? (and thoroughly cleaned before the starsan?) When you do the transfer to the fermenter, are both you kettle and fermenter covered up?
 
Sounds like wild yeast to me. I have been battling this beast on and off for 6 months now, it is absolutely soul destroying.

"Super cloudy and does not settle. Smells and taste not like beer. Almost soury bad mouth feel. Leaves a bad taste in the mouth."

This.

My advice would be to give it one more go, test batch, 10 litres, and chill in the laundry sink without the chiller - eliminate that as a variable. The other thing you can try - Ross recommended me this method - is to no-chill in your fermenter - and pitch the next day when the wort is at pitching temp.

Ross's advice unfortunately did not solve my issues, and I have had to go to the extreme of fermenting at my folk's joint. Since I have started doing this I have not had a problem - my problem is airborne, I hope yours isn't, because it makes life very, very hard :(
 
stakka82 said:
Ross's advice unfortunately did not solve my issues, and I have had to go to the extreme of fermenting at my folk's joint. Since I have started doing this I have not had a problem - my problem is airborne, I hope yours isn't, because it makes life very, very hard :(

Had that problem too! Had a damp issue in the beer room from a leak of water under the carpet through the walls from other apartments. Soul crushing 6 months!

All fixed now after a lot of contractors and testing and now I have my brewery back!!!
 
Rehydrated the yeast with pre-boiled water then cooled down.

I'm thinking it is a wild yeast issue. I moved from the Kitchen to the Garage. I did do 1 batch in the kitchen inside but with windows and stuff open as im using the gas cooker. I don't have any plants in my whole house. I live in Bendigo though and there is plenty of trees and stuff about.

I do cover up the kettle when chilling. as much as i can because i have the immersion chiller sticking out. Starsan is made up as per instructions. I dont think that would cause an infection even it wasn't though.

Pretty much certain now that it is wild yeast. Beer God - I am moving hose next year... hopefully the new environment will solve some of my issues. Ross was kind enough to help me out also, I am going to try his method and see how I go.


Thanks for the help all. I will keep you posted with my next batch, hopefully i get to drink some beer and not tip it down the sink.
 
Is there any chance of there being some gunk in the kettle tap that could be causing the problem? Perhaps take it apart and have a look and give it a boil.

Also eliminate the chilling method and perhaps swap to no chill and see if it makes any difference.
 
SimoB said:
The keggle is new. Cut out and new tap added. Have done 3 batches (4 with the new one on at the moment).

Start of the brew day I rinse out the keggle and clean out anything that may be there. No sanatiser though as I will be boiling.
Are you using a ball valve on the keggle? Might pay to take the ball valve apart and give it a good clean, they can trap some nasty crap inside them and as your chilling in the keggle its one place that might be escaping your sanitising efforts.
 
yes I am using the Ball valve. I will pull it apart. I didn't realise it could hold some nasties above the ball itself until now. That def could be it. I will move to no chill for the next batch and see if that's the problem too.

I will be drinking delicious beer! even if it kills me.
 
I just squirted some starsan up the nozzle... I had once boiled it whole. it was a 1 piece. I have a 3 piece now so I completely take it apart this time and give a good clean.

Can I ask, how do you clean yours... I'm making it up as I go along.

Cheers,
 
I take mine apart every so often to give them a good clean out. After a brew when I'm cleaning out the vessels I run sodium perc solution or whatever I'm using through the valves whilst opening and closing them which helps flush out the cavity the ball sits in.

In between brews I leave the valves half open which also exposes the ball cavity to air preventing any nasties festering, if you leave them fully open or closed the cavity around the ball is effectively sealed off and so any moisture and gunk trapped in there will stay and fester until your next brew.

This is where 3 piece ball valves are handy as they are easy to disassemble without removing the whole valve form the vessel.
 
Having an infection is a process of elimination, since you have changed your fermenter I would also change your transfer hose.

Give everything that touches your beer a good soak with a bleach solution and thoroughly rinse with hot water.

Maybe try smaller batches as well, if you still have an infection then tipping it out is not so soul destroying
 
Jaypes,

I am def going to try some smaller batches. clean clean clean.
 
You will probable get a surprise at how much gunk accumulates around ball valves, I have them on my fermenters and I now pull them apart and clean every batch. I don't worry as much on the kettle though as i recirculate the hot wort for over 10min to sanitize the pump, hoses and of course the ball valve.

Fermentation in 3 hours that's amazing, didn't realize wild yeast could kick in that fast.

Wish you good luck with exterminating those wild yeast.
 
I've recently discovered that straining from chilled kettle to fermenter through a hop sock was infecting all my brews for almost 1 year. Somehow I refused to believe it. But I made 10 litre batches changing 1 thing at a time until I got it. My advise, distrust the "she'll be right" item on your list.
Oh, and best of luck.
Edit graemer
 
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