Infection Id From Attached Pic

[Bizier]

Can anyone ID this infection?

This is a close-up of my hydro sample, and the pattern is damaged after moving it.

The entire surface of one beer is covered with this. I am guessing it is a kind of Lacto.

I kind of knew this would be infected because I had the chilled wort exposed to outdoor air for ages when I had a nightmare trying to transfer.

 

[seravitae]

Unfortunately I have no idea what that is so my only comment is DEAR GOD KILL IT WITH FIRE

 

[O'Henry]

Are you taking the piss? Did you just pour rice on top of your sample for the lulz? I am very confused...

 

[Siborg]

DEAR GOD KILL IT WITH FIRE

 

[Siborg]

in all seriousness, it looks too big to be microbial... maybe larvae of some sort?

 

[Bizier]

Not larvae, started as a thin film and then developed rapidly into a strange mat with a definite 'woven' texture.

I think after I have dealt with this, this particular fermenter has put its hand up for the FRA I have planned.

 

[Bizier]

These are some pics of the fermenter. The large bubbles are from me adding a US05 starter to get the ferment to dry out further.

 

[Tony]

I get infections like this at my place. After some studdy and questioning on here..... it turns out to be a wild airbourn yeast that breeds on the beers surface, forming a white silky layer. It usually comes with a scent of nail pollish remover and masks all other flavours in the beer.

I gat this infectiuon when i rack to secondary. It needs an oxygen rich environment to live. I have left beers in primary for over 2 months (a saison) and a dya after i rack the beer from its protective Co2 bubble, it gets the white skin and smells of nail pollish remover.

The beer is lost so tip it. I have tried filtering ect but it still tastes funny. Not sour or off but just weird.

I experimented this week. I had an Old Ale finnished fermenting, so i purged a clean fermenter with Co2, racked the beer in and then purged the airspace again to remove most of the oxygen. I left it on the bench for a few days to settle out clear and had no white skin infection I just bottled it and its the first beer i have bottled in almost a year due to loss after loss from this.

I now make sure i have nice active yeast to pitch every time to get the gas flowing over the brew nice and fast, to stop it taking hold.

I think the wild yeast lives on dust particles, possibly pollin from certan plants...... i dont know, becasue i never had this problem untill i moved to this area.

Anyway.... thats my findings to date..... hope it helps.

Cheers

 

[Bizier]

After looking at the beer surface, I think you are right there Tony. It looks like some sort of strange yeast.

As I said, the beer was open for yonks outside with an afternoon/evening breeze blowing millions of cells of all sorts of shiz into the wort. I even did the ol' 'sanitise the arm and try to fix the transfer blockage'. Yesterday Redbeard stated that I should use a scrubby on my pickup, which would have averted the whole affair.

I will give it a taste, if it is crap, it is gone. Hopefully the other fermenter (with no pellicle) is half decent, this beer used all of my existing wet hops.

 

[unrealeous]

I will give it a taste, if it is crap, it is gone.

It looks like that and you are still going to taste it???? You are a brave Man bizier. Respect.

 

[Bizier]

It looks like that and you are still going to taste it???? You are a brave Man bizier. Respect.

Ha, either that or stupid.

I am sure that many of my favourite beers in the world look worse than that before I drink them.

I am half tempted to keg it, and if it is barely noticeable, perhaps serve it to uninitiated drunkards at a party or something. Does an angel die every time someone does that?

I should add that I just tasted it and I think I get a bit of a varnishy vibe, but at a level where I am questioning whether it is because I am looking for Tony's description. GF said it doesn't smell bad or out of the ordinary.

 

[MarkMc]

I am half tempted to keg it, and if it is barely noticeable, perhaps serve it to uninitiated drunkards at a party or something. Does an angel die every time someone does that?

No but it decreases your chances of meeting one...

 

[hefevice]

As I said, the beer was open for yonks outside with an afternoon/evening breeze blowing millions of cells of all sorts of shiz into the wort. I even did the ol' 'sanitise the arm and try to fix the transfer blockage'. Yesterday Redbeard stated that I should use a scrubby on my pickup, which would have averted the whole affair.

Here's a tip for next time (in addition to the scrubby). Soak a towel in StarSan (or your favourite no rinse sanitiser), ring it out, and drape it over the kettle as soon as you finish the boil. That way you can eliminate the breeze carried nasties while cooling.

 

[white.grant]

Acetobacter I believe. I've read somewhere that gnats carry it around.

cheers

grant

 

[zoidbergmerc]

Acetobacter I believe. I've read somewhere that gnats carry it around.

cheers

grant

Nasty stuff that, I remember reading about it in school. It's like the Anti-christ of yeast.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetobacter

Acetobacter is a genus of acetic acid bacteria characterized by the ability to convert alcohol (ethanol) to acetic acid in the presence of oxygen

I once got an infection like this in one of my amber ales, I kegged it anyway and I'm drinking it now, it's got a nice little sour taste to it.

 

[absinthe]

if it has even a tiny hint of nail polish remover smell. dump it.. i have had this infection in some fruit washes i have made. its most likely Clostridium acetobutylicum, or a close relative, nasty stuff.

 

[unrealeous]

C'Mon fella's - if its got a definite infection - don't drink it. You can always make another batch and put it down to experience. Best case is it tastes a little funny and doesn't do anything bad to you... worst case is well... what do you guys know about Botulism.

 

[Siborg]

C'Mon fella's - if its got a definite infection - don't drink it. You can always make another batch and put it down to experience. Best case is it tastes a little funny and doesn't do anything bad to you... worst case is well... what do you guys know about Botulism.

+1... don't drink it or serve it to anyone. Tip, cleanse with fire (maybe not if its plastic), start again.

 

[Benniee]

I get infections like this at my place.

If there is one person to listen to on this topic Tony would be the man. If you feel like a bit of research see if you can dig up some of his earlier threads about his infection problems. In my opinion the biggest dissapointment when you get an infected beer is all the care and time you took to craft it is gone.

Tony - knowing your setup in your garage, have you considered getting a HEPA style filter that can shift/cycle through the air in there? I have heard a couple of online podcasts from some guys in the US that have such a beast. Wouldn't know the cost of one, but you could just turn it on a period of time before you do any transfers and hopefully reduce the chance of the wild bugs being in the air.

Bizier - sorry for the slight hijack.

Benniee

 

[Bizier]

Bizier - sorry for the slight hijack.

Not at all.

I am normally pretty careful, and as soon as the flame is off, and there is not a chiller or something in the way, I have a lid on my kettle. I really want to move to the "Jamil style" whirlpool chiller when I have space for a permanent three tier system, so it is far less exposed.

I have a CTP at work with a HEPA filter on it to ensure there is no dust in the laser path, and I have thought of the awesomeness of using one in the brewery. Especially now after a 2 week 22 degree ferment, where my fridge is nicely covered in mould, indicating a plethora of potential for infection directly where I ferment. I really like the idea of positive pressure in designing a brewery.

As for botulism and everything, I am not super concerned, perhaps blissfully ignorant. Lambics are beautiful beers. I am willing to see how the keg goes if it tastes OK. I will not serve it to anyone other than myself and will put a biohazard symbol on the tap. If I am hospitalised with immovable limbs, you can all point and say "I told you so."