Immersion Chiller Syphon Style

[Spartan 117]

Okay guys so i have an idea,

Given that here in melbourne we're on stage 3 water restrictions and I can't be bothered spending money on a pump I came up with and idea for the immersion chiller I'm planning on building in the next few days. So rather than have water running from a tap through the chiller and down the drain, i thought of filling my laundry room sink with ice and water to make a slurry of sorts then on the floor below have my kettle with the immersion chiller in the wort and a bucket next to that. the idea being that I syphon the ice cold water through the chiller into the bucket and when the buckets full just pour it itno the sink to be chilled by the ice and reused.

From waht i know about the whole syphon effect is that so long as the finnishing point is lower that the end point there should be know worries, my only concern is that the coil of the chiller might have other plans.

So has anyone done something like this at all? And do you rekon it would work?

Cheers

Aaron

 

[Maple]

I think as long as there is no air in the line, it should work, but i wouldn't be thinking that you'll want to re-use the water at least for the first bit, as it will be coming out pretty hot.

 

[Spartan 117]

I think as long as there is no air in the line, it should work, but i wouldn't be thinking that you'll want to re-use the water at least for the first bit, as it will be coming out pretty hot.

ok, cool I'll keep my eye on that, maybe into a seperate container for the plants or something.

Aaron

 

[razz]

You need to give it a test run before you brew so there are no leaks in the coil. But you probably thought of that already. I think if you tip the first lot of water back into the ice bath you will loose your ice very quickly. I think you should go the $10-20 pump and recirculate, it's a lot more efficient. And keep the ice out of the sink until you have taken a lot of heat out of the fermenter. Lots of people on here that do chilling in two stages so their ice will last longer and be more effective.

 

[raven19]

+1 for testing first.

Diameter and length of tubing will have an effect on flow speed, plus the greater the drop in height, the more water head you have pushing the cooling water through.

I do like your thinking regarding reusing water.

Others use a larger water store (like a rainwater tank) in a similar way with pumps.

 

[mesa]

You might have a problem with getting high enough flow rate through the immersion chiller. If the flow rate is too low, the water will reach the same temperature as the wort when its only halfway though the chiller and you end up wasting half of your expensive copper. I find with my chilling its easy to get enough ice to last the whole chill, but its still better to use warm tap water at a high flow rate to knock the first 20+ degrees off the wort before I switch to the pump and ice water (which is much slower but doesn't heat up so fast once the first 20 degress is gone)

 

[rich_lamb]

It won't actually work very well. I've tried frigging around with a few recycling arrangements using an immersion chiller and had dubious results (I've moved to no-chill and am not looking back - yet).

Problem 1: Your ice will melt VERY quickly initially. You might achieve a sllightly faster cool initially but will probably struggle to get down to pitching unless you use a LOT of ice, which is not environmentally helpful.
Better to use normal tap water at first as the temp differential is still high - keep the first 40L of hot runoff for cleaning water. Then start with your ice.

Problem 2: Low flow rate. The flow rate ideally should be matched to the temperature differential, or more accurately, the output temperature. Siphoning MAY not be fast enough, unless you get a good height difference and use large hoses. It will do the job eventually though.

Most people who use ice baths use a pre-chiller - they tap water running through a separate coil in the ice bath so what goes through the coil in the kettle is VERY cool, and consistent temperature. It really helps with the later parts of the chill, but doesn't really apply to what you're doing

Having said all that I'd give it a go and see how it works - based on the suggestion you do it in two stages, keeping the hot water separate and using the ice water later. And as others have said watch out for leaks - diabolical keeping hoses tight when the water is really hot.

cheers,
B&T

 

[drsmurto]

Okay guys so i have an idea,

Given that here in melbourne we're on stage 3 water restrictions and I can't be bothered spending money on a pump I came up with and idea for the immersion chiller I'm planning on building in the next few days. So rather than have water running from a tap through the chiller and down the drain, i thought of filling my laundry room sink with ice and water to make a slurry of sorts then on the floor below have my kettle with the immersion chiller in the wort and a bucket next to that. the idea being that I syphon the ice cold water through the chiller into the bucket and when the buckets full just pour it itno the sink to be chilled by the ice and reused.

From waht i know about the whole syphon effect is that so long as the finnishing point is lower that the end point there should be know worries, my only concern is that the coil of the chiller might have other plans.

So has anyone done something like this at all? And do you rekon it would work?

Cheers

Aaron

With the rebates available on rainwater tanks why dont you get yourself a tank and then recirculate it thru your choice of chiller back into the tank.

Getting my new tank plumbed into the house today and will get a nice $800 rebate.

 

[afromaiko]

With the rebates available on rainwater tanks why dont you get yourself a tank and then recirculate it thru your choice of chiller back into the tank.

Getting my new tank plumbed into the house today and will get a nice $800 rebate.

I would think that the pressure drop through the chiller will make it hard to get a syphon started and running problem.

And just to play devil's advocate.... What's worse from these two options - [a] use some water from tap or use the freezer to make the ice, which is powered by non-renewable coal and also uses water to make steam to drive the turbines creating pollution at the same time. Especially more of a concern now during the peak summer demand time.

The rain will be back.. or if not the government will be forced to get their act together. The coal however won't be back for a very, very long time.

Me, I'd opt for the tap water.. I run mine off the water tank these days, but then again.. how do you think the pump gets the power to run?

 

[drsmurto]

Green energy

 

[Spartan 117]

use the freezer to make the ice, which is powered by non-renewable coal and also uses water to make steam to drive the turbines creating pollution at the same time. Especially more of a concern now during the peak summer demand time.

At work they have there ice machine running 24/7(something I'm not happy with) but i aske dand i can take as much ice as i like so 1. it doesn't cost me anything and 2. given that it runs all night and day me taking some ice wont make a huge difference. I'll also use the water for my dogs basin so they can cool off during the hot days to come

But I see where you're coming from.

Aaron

edit:bit about the dogs

 

[br33zy]

Water use is a real concern with brewing isn't it... I think it takes us between 3 and 4 litres of water for every litre of beer and it would be nice to improve on that. Bottling (and cleaning the bottles) makes it very difficult - I'm sure kegging would use a lot less water.

Interestingly, if you believe the press, the big breweries use between 2.2l and 4l per litre of beer - http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/queen...2941335253.html

Well, they may use less water, but at least we're not incurring beer miles!

We don't have an opportunity to re-use the water in our brew-space. Now that we are starting with the big 98l pot and thus full volume boils; cooling has become an issue.

I've bought a plate chiller and plan to run it off the tap; then use the resulting warm/hot water to fill our bottle washing barrel. Means we have to be a little more organised by having all the dirty bottles in the barrel come boil night, but that's not too big an ask.

Cheers

Breezy

 

[WarmBeer]

You need to give it a test run before you brew so there are no leaks in the coil. But you probably thought of that already. I think if you tip the first lot of water back into the ice bath you will loose your ice very quickly. I think you should go the $10-20 pump and recirculate, it's a lot more efficient. And keep the ice out of the sink until you have taken a lot of heat out of the fermenter. Lots of people on here that do chilling in two stages so their ice will last longer and be more effective.

Where could I find these cheap pumps? Interested in picking one up myself.

 

[razz]

Just a cheap pump from Bunnings or the like for aquariums.

 

[Spartan 117]

Water use is a real concern with brewing isn't it... I think it takes us between 3 and 4 litres of water for every litre of beer and it would be nice to improve on that. Bottling (and cleaning the bottles) makes it very difficult - I'm sure kegging would use a lot less water.

Interestingly, if you believe the press, the big breweries use between 2.2l and 4l per litre of beer - http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/queen...2941335253.html

Well, they may use less water, but at least we're not incurring beer miles!

We don't have an opportunity to re-use the water in our brew-space. Now that we are starting with the big 98l pot and thus full volume boils; cooling has become an issue.

I've bought a plate chiller and plan to run it off the tap; then use the resulting warm/hot water to fill our bottle washing barrel. Means we have to be a little more organised by having all the dirty bottles in the barrel come boil night, but that's not too big an ask.

Cheers

Breezy

That's pretty interesting, should post a topic on water saving techniques other brewers use. that way we could all be sure to be saving as much water as possible

Aaron