Historical Porter

[reviled]

After re-reading a book on smoked beers and the history of them, it got me thinking I want to brew a historical porter and age it untill the depths of winter, might even look at brewing just before I go overseas for 3 weeks to give it a long fermentation period and a bit of conditioning...

Heres what im thinking so far - keen for any thoughts or feedback

50% Weyermann Rauch malt
40% Brown - I may even go one further and smoke the brown malt for more authenticity?
5% Medium Crystal
3% Dark Crystal
2% Black Patent

44 IBU's at 75 mins from a shitload of EKG
6 IBU's at 15 mins from 20gms of EKG

Shooting for around 1063 and 50 IBU's

 

[neonmeate]

have a read of this before you go off smoking all that malt:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~patto1ro/porter1.htm

"....As brewers and malsters were doing their best to avoid it, I find it unlikely that much smokiness was perceptible in finished porter. Remember that it was being aged (in the case of the earliest porters, four to five months). If nine to twelve months was enough to rid beer of the stench of West Country malt, then a couple of months would have been plenty for the far milder straw-dried malt.

Let's sum up those points:

* there were several ways of making malt, only one of which left it with a strong smoky taste
* most drinkers couldn't stomach the taste of beer made with smoked malt
* smoked malt was only popular in the West Country
* London brewers had occasionally used it, but only because it was cheap, and when they were sure that the smoked flavour wouldn't be noticeable in the finished product
* the straw-drying method was usually employed in the Southeast, the main area supplying malt to London. "

 

[reviled]

Interesting, cheers for that its a good read!

The book i was reading was basically saying that the first 'drinkable' porters were made with 50% smoked (brown) malt and 50% pale, so thats why I had the rauch in there which to be honest will probably be quite subtle...

Hmm, I could try smoking some brown malt and just using normal pale? Allthough I guess its a bit of a hassle, might just stick with what ive got above without smoking the brown malt first off and see how it turns out...

And I know theres a chance I may not like it, but thats what history is all about Im not gonna be scared of a lil smoke! lol

 

[BoilerBoy]

Interesting, cheers for that its a good read!

The book i was reading was basically saying that the first 'drinkable' porters were made with 50% smoked (brown) malt and 50% pale, so thats why I had the rauch in there which to be honest will probably be quite subtle..

If its Wey Rauch subtle is all you'll get.
Used 3 kg's in a smoked porter this year and yet again no detectable smoke flavour at all. <_<

Loved the smoked porter I made when I was partial mashing years ago with only a small addition of Hoepfner Rauch, I loved smoked beer instantly, but sadly in 3 attempts since using Wey Rauch all I have made were "Non Smoking Porters"

If I ever bother trying again I'll have to investigate smoking my own malt.

If using the Wey Rauch try and get it as "fresh" as possible and also consider that the smoke flavour will diminish over time if your thinking of storing it.

Good luck with it,

Cheers,
BB

 

[reviled]

If its Wey Rauch subtle is all you'll get.
Used 3 kg's in a smoked porter this year and yet again no detectable smoke flavour at all. <_<

Loved the smoked porter I made when I was partial mashing years ago with only a small addition of Hoepfner Rauch, I loved smoked beer instantly, but sadly in 3 attempts since using Wey Rauch all I have made were "Non Smoking Porters"

If I ever bother trying again I'll have to investigate smoking my own malt.

If using the Wey Rauch try and get it as "fresh" as possible and also consider that the smoke flavour will diminish over time if your thinking of storing it.

Good luck with it,

Cheers,
BB

Quick question BB - Did you have chlorine in your mash water yes or no??

 

[BoilerBoy]

Quick question BB - Did you have chlorine in your mash water yes or no??

I cannot give a definitive answer as I use filtered tap water for brewing ales and while I'm prepared to go along with the claims of the company about the performance of their filter (in other words I cant taste it) how effective it is in removing all of it I cant absolutely say.

Its certainly never been a taste issue in beer I have made by anybody including comp beers.

Are you suggesting a link between chlorine and rauch taste? If so, it didn't have any impact on the Hoepfner Rauch which was just sensational.

Cheers,
BB

 

[reviled]

I cannot give a definitive answer as I use filtered tap water for brewing ales and while I'm prepared to go along with the claims of the company about the performance of their filter (in other words I cant taste it) how effective it is in removing all of it I cant absolutely say.

Its certainly never been a taste issue in beer I have made by anybody including comp beers.

Are you suggesting a link between chlorine and rauch taste? If so, it didn't have any impact on the Hoepfner Rauch which was just sensational.

Cheers,
BB

Well, interestingly enough, according to the book ive been reading - Chlorine is detrimental to the phenols in the smoke and react rather adversely with the flavours. It advises that it is essential to completely remove all chlorine from the mash and sparge water to avoid this...

Ive done a few smoked beers with wey rauch, and each time have not bothered to remove the chlorine, what ive found is its quite smoky in a harsh way when the beer is young, and then fades quickly over time...

I tasted a Rauchbier that my mate brewed, with around 97% smoked malt, and he went to the effort to remove ALL of the chlorine.. I tasted this beer and was blown away by how awesome it was, and thats not to mention how it was completely different to my beers! It was smoky, but in a subtle, makes you crave more sort of a way - its hard to explain but I definately noticed a BIG difference, which backed up everything that the book was saying!

So I think this is probably the most important, and possibly the most missed out bit of information when brewing with Smoke B)

 

[BoilerBoy]

Thats some good and interesting info there reviled,

However, I guess my bitch is - there is a point where in order to get the desired level of smoked flavour just how much Wey Rauch do you need to use before you start detracting from the rest of the grain bill. The issue to most who in the past remember the Hoepfner Rauch was that it took so little to get an amazing smoke flavour.

Good stuff,
BB

 

[reviled]

Thats some good and interesting info there reviled,

However, I guess my bi*ch is - there is a point where in order to get the desired level of smoked flavour just how much Wey Rauch do you need to use before you start detracting from the rest of the grain bill. The issue to most who in the past remember the Hoepfner Rauch was that it took so little to get an amazing smoke flavour.

Good stuff,
BB

The book adresses this and basically says to use wey rauch as your full base malt, so whatever specialty malts, then all the rest rauch malt...

It also says a way around this is to smoke your own, but smoke the living crap out of it so that you only need to add a small amount to get the desired smoke levels - apparantly doing it this way tho its quite easy to 'overdo' the smoke properties...

And then the other option which isnt reccommended by the book (cos its not really authentic) is to use Bairds Peated malt, which has a completely smoke character, and is strong as! I used 36gms in 20 litres and could fully taste it! Its awesome!

 

[THE DRUNK ARAB]

My smoked marzen used 100% rainwater and around 52% Weyermann Rauch. Still nowhere near as smokey as Schlenkerla unfortunately.
We need to start a bring back Hoepfner campaign!

C&B
TDA

 

[Ross]

Weyermann recommend 100% base malt usage.
If you are blending with 50% pils (or whatever), you are not likely to get the desired smokiness.
The Weyermann Rauch extract is 98% Smoked, 2% carafa.

Cheers Ross

 

[BoilerBoy]

Weyermann recommend 100% base malt usage.
If you are blending with 50% pils (or whatever), you are not likely to get the desired smokiness.
The Weyermann Rauch extract is 98% Smoked, 2% carafa.

Cheers Ross

I'm begining to think that the expectations of many including myself have been terminally skewed by having tried the hoepfner Rauch first, the weyerman recipe for a rauchlager on there website suggests 30% pils and 62% Rauch, I would guess from my own and others experience and depending on the freshness of the malt that not even that would do it.

I'll just have to have a go at smoking my own.

BB

 

[warrenlw63]

We need to start a bring back Hoepfner campaign!

I'll vote for that!! Their Munich Malt was f%$#@^g sublime. :icon_drool2:

Warren -

 

[reviled]

Weyermann recommend 100% base malt usage.
If you are blending with 50% pils (or whatever), you are not likely to get the desired smokiness.
The Weyermann Rauch extract is 98% Smoked, 2% carafa.

Cheers Ross

This is what I was thinking originally :unsure:

I sorta thought that with brown malt being quite toasty and having a heap of it in there, that it might inhance the 'percieved smokiness', if that makes sense??

Hmmmm

Maybe I should just leave the recipe as is, and smoke 200 odd gms of the brown malt myself and smoke it hard h34r:

Never tried this hoepfner malt but it sounds mean!! Have they ceased trading? <_<