Help With Few Questions

[dav]

Hi everyone iv just started brewing and thought id join to get a little help. Firstly I made a coopers draught with be1 but since i didnt know i brewed around 27degrees (everyting else including priming went well) and the beer after a few weeks has come out with a tiny head. Is that most likley a temp prob.
Secondly and more importantly aatm Im now trying a second brew and id love to make a lager similar to the style of peroni or 1664 but keep the price under say 25 if possible. I was wondering if anyone would know if there would be much of a taste diff between these to recipes i found or if someone has got a better still simple alternative.
coopers original lager, 1kg dry malt, 12gTETTNANGER finishing, 12gsaaz dry. (using suppled yeast )
or
coopers premium lager, 1.5kg light extract with same hops and supplied yeast.
first one a fair bit cheaper and was wondering if it will turn out much different.
Thanks

 

[boingk]

Hi there! Welcome to the forums.

With your first brew, I'd say the tiny head problem would be a combination of poor fermentation temperatures, and the ingredients. Coopers BE1 is just dextrose [a clean fermenting suagr that doesn't affect taste] and maltodextron [a sugar that is only 30% fermentable, thus making better beer body and head]. Generally this isn't a great combo for a good-tasting beer, but a good start for your first batch by any means. Malt does the job of giving flavour and body and alcohol - so dextrose and maltodextron are rendered semi-impotent.

I have no idea of the Peroni/1664, but the recipes you propose should come out quite well indeed. The latter one will give the best results, as it uses a 'higher grade' kit and more malt - meaning more flavour and body. One question: what specific process are you using for hopping?

Also, I'd give away brewing to a price unless its a major factor. I spend about an average of $30 a brew, and am very happy with the results. That said, some people spend more, some less - its all personal and down to what price you can get things at.

Another pointer for your lager would be to nick down to the homebrew store and get some S-23 Saflager yeast. Great stuff, I've used it for all my lager brews and am very happy with the results. It'll brew down to proper lager temps as well [ideal temp 12'C, but will brew to 18~20'C ok].

Hope this isn't too much of a mouthful for a first reply!

Cheers - boingk

 

[dav]

Ok all good info and thanks for the rapid reply.
about the hops i was just going to do it as i read on the net. that is put the tettnanger in some hot water for 10 mins then put all of it in the fermenter then just put the saaz hops in before you put in the yeast??? (what happens to the hop pellets??)
One other quick thing does brewing a lager at 12degrees with a lager yeast and then putting in a secondary for a few weeks taste noticeably better than an ale yeast at 18. Is it worth while??
Thanks again.

 

[0M39A]

Ok all good info and thanks for the rapid reply.
about the hops i was just going to do it as i read on the net. that is put the tettnanger in some hot water for 10 mins then put all of it in the fermenter then just put the saaz hops in before you put in the yeast??? (what happens to the hop pellets??)
One other quick thing does brewing a lager at 12degrees with a lager yeast and then putting in a secondary for a few weeks taste noticeably better than an ale yeast at 18. Is it worth while??
Thanks again.

If you want to get the most out of your hops, do a mini boil on your stove top in 5-6L of water, 500g of malt or so, then once the water is boiling, chuck in your hops, let them boil for 20-30min then strain into your carboy.

If you want some extra hop aroma, throw in some more hops at the end of the boil, or if you rack to secondary, throw some in then in a hop bag.

Seeings how you have little experience brewing to date, i wouldnt bother going for a true lager. what you could do instead is ferment your brew using a nice neutral ale yeast, like US-05 or danstar nottingham (both easy to find dried yeasts), and ferment it nice and cool (15C-16C)

 

[boingk]

dav - I've had good results with the 10 minute method, although I personally prefer around 12 to 15 minutes to be honest just for a bit more flavour. The hops will float around in the brew while its fermenting, some settling to the bottom, some up top, and some riding the bubbles between. Once in the brew the hops expand from pellet form to look like greenish scum - don't freak out at this. After fermentation has finished they will sink to the bottom.

If you can go for the lager yeast and 12 degrees [or at least sub 17'C], do it. Otherwise you will have an ale on your hands. It'll still taste good, and be good beer, but if you want the all-the-way true to style beer [which it sounds like you may] then the lager yeast and low temp is the go.

Secondary isn't of huge importance, but it does benefit your beer. If you have a second fermenter, do it. If not, don't worry. Basically it makes for a clearer beer that tastes marginally better - I've done my first 11 brews with no secondary and only started secondary-ing on my #12 brew. I've had good results without using secondary.

End point is that its all personal choice - do whats easiest and most convenient for you, and that which complements your drinking style.

Cheers - boingk

[PS - OM39A's suggestions are spot on (cept for the last bit which I personally disagree with), but I remember being freaked by stuff like that when I started, so don't worry if you don't want to go down that path immediately]

 

[0M39A]

I was the same as you boink, i was freaked out by the thought of playing with hops for quite a while as well.

Spent prolly a year just doing basic k+k batches, to start with the most adventurious i got was using a differnet yeast and malts instead of dextrose for sugars.

Then i finally tried dry hopping, and realised it could make a difference, so played with that for a while, then finally gave in and tried an extract brew.

Once i brewed my first extract beer i was kicking myself for not having the guts to give it a try a long time ago. You can make such a vastly superior beer using this method. But in the mean time just give boiling a few hops on your stove a go. wonderfull first step towards brewing extract, and once you taste the difference you'll never look back. it really isnt anywhere near as hard as it sounds.

 

[simpletotoro]

Secondly and more importantly aatm Im now trying a second brew and id love to make a lager similar to the style of peroni or 1664 but keep the price under say 25 if possible. I was wondering if anyone would know if there would be much of a taste diff between these to recipes i found or if someone has got a better still simple alternative.
coopers original lager, 1kg dry malt, 12gTETTNANGER finishing, 12gsaaz dry. (using suppled yeast )
or
coopers premium lager, 1.5kg light extract with same hops and supplied yeast.
first one a fair bit cheaper and was wondering if it will turn out much different.
Thanks

hi
according to the PR from kroenburg "The Strisselspalt hop has been exclusive to Alsace the home of Kronenbourg 1664 - since 1885 and is a unique variety of French aromatic hops, giving the beer an unrivalled aroma and superior taste. It is a 5% continental premium lager, more bitter than sweet, with a distinctive citrus flavour predominantly reminiscent of grapefruit."
beyond this i can only tell you some possible substitutions for the Strisselspalt hop as follows Mt. Hood, Crystal, Hersbrucker...for the "distinctive citrus flavour predominantly reminiscent of grapefruit" maybe the yeast us -56 ...okay its more like passionfruit but should do ok...

links following to posts on adding hops to a boil
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...ic=15659&hl
also
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...ic=15323&hl
good luck ..PM me if you want any other info
cheers simpletotoro

 

[0M39A]

"distinctive citrus flavour predominantly reminiscent of grapefruit" maybe the yeast us -56 ...okay its more like passionfruit but should do ok...

umm, not sure about this line.

us-05 (the new name for us-56) is a very neutral yeast, good for bringing out the best flavours from your malt and hops. any "passionfruit" flavours would be coming from your hop selection.

if you're really after those kind of flavours, id be looking more at cascade, amarillo, centennial or glacier...

 

[dav]

OK thanks guys. Ill try a few different brews with different types of hops and see what comes out best.

 

[boingk]

OM39A - Yeah, I've only been brewing since mid march, er...or something - anyways, I'm up to my 13th brew which is an improved version of my earlier Heineken recipe which I loved. My first batch was sh!thouse - was a Tooheys Special Draught with 1kg of Maltodextron syrup that came with the fermenter I got. After that I was adamant to make something better. I've been grain-steeping for the last say four batches, and my 10th batch was where I started doing boils - with the 12th one being the first 'from scratch' addition with bittering, flavouring and aromatising hops.

I've been rocketing along mainly because this is my only source of beer and I don't drink a lot else. That, and I'm at uni [whats this about us all being piss-heads?]. Plus I think I'm addicted to brewing :beerbang:

Oh and dav - if you want some passionfruity flavours to spice up the brew with, try a 10 minute addition of Cascade. Correct me if I'm wrong on this one guys.

 

[simpletotoro]

umm, not sure about this line.

us-05 (the new name for us-56) is a very neutral yeast, good for bringing out the best flavours from your malt and hops. any "passionfruit" flavours would be coming from your hop selection.

if you're really after those kind of flavours, id be looking more at cascade, amarillo, centennial or glacier...

hmm really...i always seem to taste passionfriut...then again theres usually willamette or cascade in there somewhere ..i figured it was from the yeast...cheers for that a days not wasted if you learn something new yeah..
think adding amarillo might overwhelm it a bit ...maybe 5 or so grams wouldn't hurt just to add a tinge

cheers simpletotoro

 

[hbg]

Hi everyone iv just started brewing and thought id join to get a little help. Firstly I made a coopers draught with be1 but since i didnt know i brewed around 27degrees (everyting else including priming went well) and the beer after a few weeks has come out with a tiny head. Is that most likley a temp prob.
Secondly and more importantly aatm Im now trying a second brew and id love to make a lager similar to the style of peroni or 1664 but keep the price under say 25 if possible. I was wondering if anyone would know if there would be much of a taste diff between these to recipes i found or if someone has got a better still simple alternative.
coopers original lager, 1kg dry malt, 12gTETTNANGER finishing, 12gsaaz dry. (using suppled yeast )
or
coopers premium lager, 1.5kg light extract with same hops and supplied yeast.
first one a fair bit cheaper and was wondering if it will turn out much different.
Thanks

The [premium lager will be far better.