Help me

[Gorillaboogers]

I'm only pretty new to brewing so just starting out with the basic coopers cans, supplied yeast and sugar but I just can't seem to get it right. Pitching at right temps approx 22* and it looks like fermentation is going fine at a stable temp but by the time I remove the fermenter cover it is a blackish colour with an acidic smell. Taste is very average. Any recommendations or tips?

 

[nosco]

Does it have an acidic taste? Are you using any kind of temperature controler?

I think 18c is a safer temp to ferment at. 22c is probably as high as you would want to go but if it gets much higher than that you might get some off flavours from the yeast.

If it tastes sour it could be from bacteria taking over in your beer which could be from not cleaning and sanitising your fermenter properly. What are you using to clean it and what are you using to sanitise it. Cleaning and sanitising are 2 different things.

I started with the Coopers DIY kit but I found the collar a bit useless and didn't use it in the end. You should avoid taking the lid off until you have bottled/legged the beer.

If it's any consultation my first 2 Coopers beers went sour. That was nearly 4 years ago and I am now making very drinkable (mostly) beer now.

 

[Gloveski]

18 definately the temp to ferment at for K&K .

Spray that sanatiser about with gay abandon

 

[Gorillaboogers]

Yeah the taste is certainly not as acidic as it smells but still a taste of 'vinegar'. I found the collar a bit annoying myself and have already discarded it and with cleaning I'm using just a basic sugar soap and water solution then sanitising with the mangrove jacks no rinse which was recommended from my local HB shop.

I will try dropping one tonight at a lower temp and see how it goes.

 

[barls]

ok first off the acidic note your picking up is c02 a byproduct of fermentation.
secondly ditch the sugar soap and move to home brand nappy san. a its less effort and b it will do a better job for cheaper.

 

[labels]

Yeah the taste is certainly not as acidic as it smells but still a taste of 'vinegar'. I found the collar a bit annoying myself and have already discarded it and with cleaning I'm using just a basic sugar soap and water solution then sanitising with the mangrove jacks no rinse which was recommended from my local HB shop.

I will try dropping one tonight at a lower temp and see how it goes.

Almost definitely an infection - that is 99.9% sure that it is.

Sanitation is THE number one priority when brewing. It maybe too late with your fermenter, depending on what type of infection it is, some are near impossible to remove. The product Star San is the most popular sanitiser homebrewers use.

Separate cleaning and sanitising into two separate processes. Clean all your stuff before storing and sanitise immediately before brewing.

There is lots and lots of stuff on the internet regarding Sanitation in the Home Brewery so I suggest start reading

 

[huez]

Barls is right, you probably are getting a big wiff of co2 but if it actually does taste like vinegar you're getting an infection from somewhere, acetobacter will cause the vinegar flavour.

 

[Gorillaboogers]

Thanks lads. One other question though is based on 18*c how long do you guys usually see before any sort of fermentation/ air lock movement???

 

[manticle]

Less time than it takes to process 3 question marks.

It's fine, your beer will be much better.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Anywhere from 12 hours to 48 hours.

Depends on the type/amount of yeast, degree of aeration and sugar content.

 

[Quokka42]

Without a starter, expect 24 hours or so to see airlock movement with the kit yeast at 18C and be careful it doesn't get much lower or it will go to sleep. Starting out I would recommend aiming for 20-22 with Coopers yeast, it will be quicker and still taste good. Temperature is not your problem here - it is almost certainly infection, though apart from being toxic to you, the sugar soap may be retarding yeast growth - don't ever use it again. If you don't have a local brew shop where you can buy stuff like sodium percarbonate and Phosphoric sanitisers, You can use the bottle washing powder and unscented bleach and/or boiling water. I don't trust nappi san or laundry soakers as most contain detergents and/or scents, but many have used them followed by very thorough rinsing, preferably with boiling water. I suspect you have an infection in your equipment so you will need to be very thorough with your cleaning and sanitising before the next batch.

Black and vinegar smell probably won't kill you (though some sugar soap contains stuff that might,) and may just be that you are opening the fermenter while you don't have a good healthy yeast crop growing though.

 

[decr]

Regarding temps, what Quokka42 said ^. I rehydrate and pitch at 22-24c and let it drop down to 18c. Now while some may argue that pitching temp is high, the only difference I have noticed is rapid start of proper fermentation ie. 12 hours compared to 24+ hours. I can't taste any difference between the one pitched at 18c and the other at higher temps.

As for OPs problem, as others have said, sounds like infection. I'm not the role model of perfect sanitation but I clean with hot water only and sanitise with a no-rinse solution. Which I then rinse off anyway. Never had an infection. YMMV.

 

[labels]

Regarding temps, what Quokka42 said ^. I rehydrate and pitch at 22-24c and let it drop down to 18c. Now while some may argue that pitching temp is high, the only difference I have noticed is rapid start of proper fermentation ie. 12 hours compared to 24+ hours. I can't taste any difference between the one pitched at 18c and the other at higher temps.

As for OPs problem, as others have said, sounds like infection. I'm not the role model of perfect sanitation but I clean with hot water only and sanitise with a no-rinse solution. Which I then rinse off anyway. Never had an infection. YMMV.

I think the colour is the giveaway. Beer doesn't change colour during fermentation neither does it smell acidic unless you're deliberately introducing lacto or something.

 

[BrockHops]

Hey Boogers,
One thought​I had was is this a new fermenter or one given to you from a mate?
I've been offered a 2nd hand fermenter, but I couldn't be sure of the owners cleaning methods..
For example, did they scrub out stubborn stains with Scotch Brite or another type of abrasive?
I feel Napisan AND sugar soap are also abrasives as well.
Any scratches on the inner surface of the FV will harbour nasties which will come out to play in nice warm wort
My 2cents

Brock