Gina looking for a long wall and a load of blindfolds.

[Ducatiboy stu]

Got to love an industry sponsered report on itself putting forward the facts and figures...yes they are credible figures. Who is not to believe the report.

But I reckon if you got 10 different accountants and economists you would get 30 different outcomes

But the report has nothing to do with Ginas abhorent statements to do with those less fortunate than her.

 

[wombil]

Gunna stick my neck out a bit here but doe anyone realise that the stuff that is being dug up and flogged off for a pittance to foreigners actually belongs to all Australians and they should all share in it.
What happens when it runs out and we have to buy the stuff back?
We are getting shafted from all directions.
Greed should be spelt"Gina".

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Yes. We own it, minning companies get the rights to dig it up and sell it and pay royalties to do so. Some miners pay royalties to both federal and state governments.

In WA the rate is $1 per tonne for minerals.

http://www.dmp.wa.gov.au/4407.aspx

NSW rates

http://www.resources.nsw.gov.au/resources/royalty/royalty-rates

 

[schrodinger]

All this raving about welfare spending in Australia needs to be put in context, especially coming from a welfare recipient like Ms Rinehart.

- Total welfare spending in Australia is 18% lower than the OECD average
- Cash 'handouts' to families and children constitute around 3.5% of GDP ($35B vs $1000B)
- Cash handouts to the elderly substantially exceed those to families and children (5.1% or $51B)
- Austudy spending is negligible in this context ($0.4B), and is exceeded by direct cash subsidies to the mining industry ($0.5B)
- The government spends $4.8B subsididing fossil fuel extraction and use, including $2.4B in fuel tax credits to the mining industry
- This subsidy exceeds the total amount spent on government schools ($4.1B)

You can't have an abuse-free safety net, and dependency can become entrenched. But the onus for preventing that lies with the dependent, not the government -- radical cuts to welfare spending don't change people's attitudes. Any cuts have to be coupled to clever incentives and other changes in social policy and spending to have any effect.

How about, for starters, we stop radically subsidising private schools ($8.1B), and with it their religious proselytisation, and instead impose minimum standards on public schools. My daughter is in year 7 in a public school in a country town (we can't afford the $25k/yr it would cost to send her to the nearest private school), and she's had no homework, no projects, no assignments, nothing whatseover to reinforce learning, since we arrived here 9 months ago. Her school spends 40% more time on sport and PE than on any academic subject. It's ******* pathetic. This is a far greater worry than a few dole bludgers, and it will definitely come back to bite this country in the ass.


http://www.aph.gov.au/~/media/05%20About%20Parliament/54%20Parliamentary%20Depts/548%20Parliamentary%20Budget%20Office/02-2013%20Australian%20Government%20Spending/20131210%20Australian%20government%20spending%20-%20full_report.ashx
http://www.aihw.gov.au/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=60129544564
http://environmentvictoria.org.au/newsite/sites/default/files/useruploads/MF%20and%20EV%202013%20polluter%20handouts%20assessment%20FINAL-4.pdf

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Ufortunatly one Mr Tony Abbott has a set against public schools and wants to feed the private schools with more taxpayer money, along with his push for christian ways.

As for homework, dont know what the go is there. I know both my 2 boys in yr2 & 3 in a public school have had homework from day one. In fact they changed schools last year and the homework structure remained the same between schools.

 

[schrodinger]

Tony should realise the FSM helps those who help themselves.

Yeah, the HW thing is pretty ridiculous, and they don't do much work during school either. Good to know it's not generally that way in other public schools, though.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Our dearly beloved PM has in idealogical set on schools.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

There have been a lot of studies regarding public and private schools and which of those pupils do better at university, it is generally the public school entrants who are more inclined to do better.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/Uni-easier-for-public-school-students/2005/04/05/1112489491760.html

 

[booargy]

Are you sure that original article is true or is your news limited?

Funny how some handouts are labelled welfare and others are labelled subsidies, tax breaks etc. A company pays What 20% tax and can earn whatever they can and still get their handout. an income tax earner only has to earn 10k or something and then they get hit with a sliding scale and no more handouts.

Funny how business owners are contributing less but whinge the loudest.

 

[Weizguy]

What is it with all the vicious personal abuse? Do people who peddle this feel better for having done so?

Don't believe everything that former Treasurer Wayne Swan tells you! In fact, the tax rate that mining pays (as a proportion of taxable income) is higher than the average across all industries. Actual facts and evidence can be found here:

http://www.minerals.org.au/file_upload/files/publications/mca_backgrounder_FINAL.pdf

Hope this helps.

Personal abuse not OK, except when political?

 

[schrodinger]

There have been a lot of studies regarding public and private schools and which of those pupils do better at university, it is generally the public school entrants who are more inclined to do better.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/Uni-easier-for-public-school-students/2005/04/05/1112489491760.html

Well, first, if you take this at face value, it is a very strong argument for withdrawing subsidies for private schools. Throwing good money after bad.

However, that study suffers from an elementary fallacy: selection bias. It compares students who are already in a particular uni. If public schools are inferior, then you would expect students who managed to succeed anyway to have exceptional self-motivation and good study habits. Just like the kid who comes from a crappy inner city neighborhood -- if he makes it, it's despite his schools and surroundings, not because of them.

The bottom line is that the two-tiered public/private school system is blatantly regressive. And inconsistent with the whole 'fair go' philosophy.

 

[hoppy2B]

So what you're saying is that Gina who was born with a silver spoon up her bum is stupid because she must have gone to a private school, so we should excuse her stupid comments on the grounds of diminished responsibility. h34r:

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Never will be a "fair go" or all things will never be equal, if every school became a public school which students will get the most attention, the ones who are doing well.
The ones who struggle will be left behind, all the encouragement will go to the students who are hungry for more knowledge.
Also the private school students, what percentage of those have come from families who's parents came from the public school system, a fair few I would be betting.
I think it is good that there is a choice, private or public.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

The Catholic school system is the 2nd biggest educator of K-12 students. And really there is no difference at the end of the day on the difference between the Catholic & Public system. Now when it comes to SCEGGS,KNOX, THE KINGS etc things are different. They are elite which charge accordingly, they charge big fees and have large endowments behind them. You expect top notch education from them. If you can afford to pay ( or want to...its a choice ) then I dont think our taxes should be unproportianatly directed at them. The general Catholic schools deserves the same equal funding as public systems. Its when "The rich " schools put there handout when not needed is an issue.

 

[Liam_snorkel]

Never will be a "fair go" or all things will never be equal, if every school became a public school which students will get the most attention, the ones who are doing well.The ones who struggle will be left behind, all the encouragement will go to the students who are hungry for more knowledge.Also the private school students, what percentage of those have come from families who's parents came from the public school system, a fair few I would be betting.I think it is good that there is a choice, private or public.

Norway.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Never will be a fair go, and all things being equal, I was referring to the little grey cells, the better students will be nurtured in a public and private school systems. If we start discussing countries how long before China is at the forefront of education, at the moment Japan, South Korea and United kingdom are the top three I was expecting Finland to be the top but apparently have dropped away.
I see where you are coming from Liam with Norway giving equal opportunity to all students but I would be thinking human nature would favour the more academically inclined, unfortunate as it is.
But all is not lost I have relished reading about people who have done well who were considered poor or mediocre students.

 

[goomboogo]

There are no private schools in Australia.

 

[Liam_snorkel]

I see where you are coming from Liam with Norway giving equal opportunity to all students but I would be thinking human nature would favour the more academically inclined, unfortunate as it is.

Personally i think there is a place for private schools, particularly if they are going to be small and talent based - ie: music focused, sport focused.. But the general population need high quality standardised education.

There are no private schools in Australia.

care to qualify this?

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

What a lot of people forget is that there (in NSW) are public "select schools". These schools are only available to talanted high achieving students from the public school system. And are held in very high regard.

But it also MUST be pointed out that the NSW system also provide schools for those at the lower end of the spectrum. Those students who will allways struggle with learning and education.

My father was a one of those who helped redraw the NSW education dept views and methods on teaching and providing remedial education for those students that suffered deafness,disability and learning disabilities.

 

[browndog]

All this raving about welfare spending in Australia needs to be put in context, especially coming from a welfare recipient like Ms Rinehart.

- Total welfare spending in Australia is 18% lower than the OECD average
- Cash 'handouts' to families and children constitute around 3.5% of GDP ($35B vs $1000B)
- Cash handouts to the elderly substantially exceed those to families and children (5.1% or $51B)
- Austudy spending is negligible in this context ($0.4B), and is exceeded by direct cash subsidies to the mining industry ($0.5B)
- The government spends $4.8B subsididing fossil fuel extraction and use, including $2.4B in fuel tax credits to the mining industry
- This subsidy exceeds the total amount spent on government schools ($4.1B)

You can't have an abuse-free safety net, and dependency can become entrenched. But the onus for preventing that lies with the dependent, not the government -- radical cuts to welfare spending don't change people's attitudes. Any cuts have to be coupled to clever incentives and other changes in social policy and spending to have any effect.

How about, for starters, we stop radically subsidising private schools ($8.1B), and with it their religious proselytisation, and instead impose minimum standards on public schools. My daughter is in year 7 in a public school in a country town (we can't afford the $25k/yr it would cost to send her to the nearest private school), and she's had no homework, no projects, no assignments, nothing whatseover to reinforce learning, since we arrived here 9 months ago. Her school spends 40% more time on sport and PE than on any academic subject. It's ******* pathetic. This is a far greater worry than a few dole bludgers, and it will definitely come back to bite this country in the ass.


http://www.aph.gov.au/~/media/05%20About%20Parliament/54%20Parliamentary%20Depts/548%20Parliamentary%20Budget%20Office/02-2013%20Australian%20Government%20Spending/20131210%20Australian%20government%20spending%20-%20full_report.ashx
http://www.aihw.gov.au/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=60129544564
http://environmentvictoria.org.au/newsite/sites/default/files/useruploads/MF%20and%20EV%202013%20polluter%20handouts%20assessment%20FINAL-4.pdf

My kids are in a public school and were getting homework from prep onwards, I was pretty pissed off that a prep (kindergarten down south) should be getting home work.