Fruit And Your Beer

[alien13]

Hi,

I've just started reading through Extreme Brewing by Sam Calagione, and a few (66) pages into the book, I came across this awesome little resource. If you would like me to remove this, please let me know, but this section can be found freely on the internet (legitimate sites) anyway, so I'm hoping it should be okay to post.

This particular page describes various fruits that can be added to your beer as well as the amounts used, when to add them, and for how long. I think this is a great resource for people who are looking to add fruit into their beer, but are unsure of where to start off. This may not be a 100% perfect solution, but it should give enough of an idea for a foothold, and the members here on the forum can easily give the extra push along the way.

Sorry if it's been posted before, but I didn't find anything with the searches I did.

Hope to get some feedback and opinions on this sometime soon
Cheers

 

[donburke]

Hi,

I've just started reading through Extreme Brewing by Sam Calagione, and a few (66) pages into the book, I came across this awesome little resource. If you would like me to remove this, please let me know, but this section can be found freely on the internet (legitimate sites) anyway, so I'm hoping it should be okay to post.

This particular page describes various fruits that can be added to your beer as well as the amounts used, when to add them, and for how long. I think this is a great resource for people who are looking to add fruit into their beer, but are unsure of where to start off. This may not be a 100% perfect solution, but it should give enough of an idea for a foothold, and the members here on the forum can easily give the extra push along the way.

Sorry if it's been posted before, but I didn't find anything with the searches I did.

Hope to get some feedback and opinions on this sometime soon
Cheers

View attachment 52543

interesting that the fruit in this article is added pre-fermentation

most other readings on this forum suggest to add the fruit post-fermentation, given the consensus that the process of fermentation tends to scrub out the flavours of the fruit

i am attracted to the strawberry, perhaps a strawberry wheat could be nice, looks like you chuck them in at flameout, then chill to 71-77 and hold it there for 20 mins then proceed to chill to pitching temp

i presume the rest at 71-77 serves to extract the goodness from the strawberries, also pasteurise them without having continued isomerisation of your hops

looks like it could be a plan ...

 

[bconnery]

interesting that the fruit in this article is added pre-fermentation

most other readings on this forum suggest to add the fruit post-fermentation, given the consensus that the process of fermentation tends to scrub out the flavours of the fruit

i am attracted to the strawberry, perhaps a strawberry wheat could be nice, looks like you chuck them in at flameout, then chill to 71-77 and hold it there for 20 mins then proceed to chill to pitching temp

i presume the rest at 71-77 serves to extract the goodness from the strawberries, also pasteurise them without having continued isomerisation of your hops

looks like it could be a plan ...

I've 4 or 5 strawberry wheats now and they are nice beers, but I'd highly recommend adding them after the bulk of fermentation is finished, or even in secondary.
The strawberry flavour is difficult to get into the beer, it isn't as robust as some fruits. And forget about colour too... I've added 5kgs to a 16L batch and gotten only the tiniest hint of pink in the right light...
If you have a search for 'Strawbeery' on here you'll see some info but I used 50/50 wheat/pils, noble hopped to around 15IBU and wb06 for preference in this type of wheat...

The info there says to strain into the fermenter, so perhaps they are literally thinking a kind of stewing, but then 20 minutes doesn't seem enough to me...

 

[donburke]

I've 4 or 5 strawberry wheats now and they are nice beers, but I'd highly recommend adding them after the bulk of fermentation is finished, or even in secondary.
The strawberry flavour is difficult to get into the beer, it isn't as robust as some fruits. And forget about colour too... I've added 5kgs to a 16L batch and gotten only the tiniest hint of pink in the right light...
If you have a search for 'Strawbeery' on here you'll see some info but I used 50/50 wheat/pils, noble hopped to around 15IBU and wb06 for preference in this type of wheat...

The info there says to strain into the fermenter, so perhaps they are literally thinking a kind of stewing, but then 20 minutes doesn't seem enough to me...

sounds like i'd be pushing shit uphill to get any colour or flavour in there, might scrap that idea then

cheers

 

[sim]

You could use a small amount of another fruit (say cherry) to bump up the colour a bit. I cant exactly remember which, but i know this is done in some fruit lambic examples ie some small amount of cherry in raspberry beer, because the raspberrys dont quite cut it colour wise, nor acidity i'd wager.

 

[alien13]

interesting that the fruit in this article is added pre-fermentation

Yeah, that is what really surprised me, going off what I have read on various forums. Hence why I posted the article, and also mentioned that it might be good as a starting place.

There is a recipe for a Sour Cherry Ale that looks good, and hopefully I will be able to try out sometime in the future (sooner rather than later). It will be good to see how it goes as the cherries are added at the end of the boil and left during primary fermentation.

I've 4 or 5 strawberry wheats now and they are nice beers, but I'd highly recommend adding them after the bulk of fermentation is finished, or even in secondary.
The strawberry flavour is difficult to get into the beer, it isn't as robust as some fruits. And forget about colour too... I've added 5kgs to a 16L batch and gotten only the tiniest hint of pink in the right light...
If you have a search for 'Strawbeery' on here you'll see some info but I used 50/50 wheat/pils, noble hopped to around 15IBU and wb06 for preference in this type of wheat...

The info there says to strain into the fermenter, so perhaps they are literally thinking a kind of stewing, but then 20 minutes doesn't seem enough to me...

I've been interested in using fruit in beers for a while, and that sounds like a good place to start. As you have noted, it is more of a stewing/'fruit' tea method, and like Don suggested, the temperature range that the fruit is kept at may have something to do with what makes it work a bit better.

 

[bconnery]

sounds like i'd be pushing shit uphill to get any colour or flavour in there, might scrap that idea then

cheers

The colour is not there but the flavour is good.
It's a nice beer, and worth making, if you can get cheap strawberries, you just can't expect the sort of colour and flavour from something like raspberries or other berries.

 

[hsb]

Could you not just cheat on the colour and add food colouring into the keg/bottle?
I'd imagine you need a lot of strawberries to really get a flavour hit.
Dried fruit might give a punchier flavour hit? (yes there was a joke there!)

 

[Wolfy]

most other readings on this forum suggest to add the fruit post-fermentation, given the consensus that the process of fermentation tends to scrub out the flavours of the fruit

I'm not sure about post-fermentation, but more often post-primary fermentation.
As the ferment is starting to settle, that way there is still a large amount of active yeast, so add the fruit, and then leave it for another week or two.

 

[bconnery]

Could you not just cheat on the colour and add food colouring into the keg/bottle?
I'd imagine you need a lot of strawberries to really get a flavour hit.
Dried fruit might give a punchier flavour hit? (yes there was a joke there!)

You could. A friend of mine did just that when his missus complained it wasn't pink
I buy a box of jamming strawberries from a grower. $5 for between 3-5.5 kgs depending on the season, so the amount isn't really a concern.
What I've been doing over the years is reducing the batch size.
I know ferment it as a weizen, draw off enough for a 9L keg for me so I can drink it nice and fresh and the rest is for the strawberry batch.

 

[alien13]

I'm not sure about post-fermentation, but more often post-primary fermentation.
As the ferment is starting to settle, that way there is still a large amount of active yeast, so add the fruit, and then leave it for another week or two.

I remember reading something about how the yeast will eat away at some of the flavours, which I guess would lead to the 'add fruit after primary'.
Is there a particular reason you recommend doing it when there is a large amount of active yeast still present in the beer?

Also, on another note, for the Sour Cherry Ale, would I replace the 3kg light malt extract with something like two-row pale?

Thanks

 

[Wolfy]

Is there a particular reason you recommend doing it when there is a large amount of active yeast still present in the beer?

I feel that 'treating' fresh fruit (chemical, freezing, blanching, boiling) in order to remove harmful bacteria or wild yeast, can have a negative impact on the resulting fruit flavour in the beer.
But if you add the fruit while there is still a large amount of yeast active, it should out-compete any 'nasties' that are added if the fruit is not 'treated' first, the yeast will also consume some of the sugars in the fruit and the beer will not be overly sweet.
If you were to use tinned, boiled or otherwise treated fruit, you could simply add it as a flavor addition at the end of the process, just before bottling (which has the advantage of being able to taste-test to determine how much you need to use).

 

[Malted]

...the yeast will also consume some of the sugars in the fruit and the beer will not be overly sweet.
If you were to use tinned, boiled or otherwise treated fruit, you could simply add it as a flavor addition at the end of the process, just before bottling (which has the advantage of being able to taste-test to determine how much you need to use).

In short:
yes I think the yeast chewed up the sugars from an addition I made. I added it after primary fermentation had finished but it still got chewed up.

Long version:
I stewed some rhubarb and added it to the fermenter after primary had finished. I did not rack to secondary, just let it sit with the rhubarb for another week after fermentation. Prior to adding the rhubarb I bottled some of the wheat beer. After the fermenter had sat for a week I bottled some of the rhubarb wheat and kegged the rest. 3 totally different beers resulted.

Kegged version retained some of the aroma, flavour and sourness of the rhubarb. It was almost like a saison of sorts.
The bottled rhubarb wheat has much less aroma, flavour and sourness of the rhubarb - it is all there but much more subtle than the kegged version. A bit too subtle for my liking. It is more like a wheat beer than a saison.

I suspect that the bottle fermentation had digested a lot of the rhubarb sugars and thence aroma and flavour.

Colouring: I used beetroot juice, aka natural food dye. Even so, it would take a heck of a lot to make a serious impact on the colour of a whole batch.

 

[alien13]

I feel that 'treating' fresh fruit (chemical, freezing, blanching, boiling) in order to remove harmful bacteria or wild yeast, can have a negative impact on the resulting fruit flavour in the beer.
But if you add the fruit while there is still a large amount of yeast active, it should out-compete any 'nasties' that are added if the fruit is not 'treated' first, the yeast will also consume some of the sugars in the fruit and the beer will not be overly sweet.
If you were to use tinned, boiled or otherwise treated fruit, you could simply add it as a flavor addition at the end of the process, just before bottling (which has the advantage of being able to taste-test to determine how much you need to use).

Okay, well that makes more sense now that you have explained it. I like the idea of using the fruit towards the end/post-primary, rather than before bottling. But if I do one batch of it, and I feel the flavour isn't a strong as I like, I might try adding it before bottling on the next batch.

I don't mind if the colour doesn't come through as much, it's mostly the flavour I'm concerned about, and the aroma, if that will show.

Kegged version retained some of the aroma, flavour and sourness of the rhubarb. It was almost like a saison of sorts.
The bottled rhubarb wheat has much less aroma, flavour and sourness of the rhubarb - it is all there but much more subtle than the kegged version. A bit too subtle for my liking. It is more like a wheat beer than a saison.

I suspect that the bottle fermentation had digested a lot of the rhubarb sugars and thence aroma and flavour.

The bottle fermentation is something I hadn't actually thought of to be honest, unfortunately for me, that's all I have to work with. I guess it will be more a matter of just playing around with different methods to see what I can come up with to suit my tastes. That's not necessarily a bad thing though because either way I should end up with some pretty nice beer.

 

[ballantynebrew]

Hey fellas
I've got this issue ATM, I had about 4 limes I chucked in a lager. I squeezed two in with pulp and driced the other two into quarters, while boiling one with some malt for sbout 10min and chucked the other one in. It got hungry indeed and had no yeast. I took out the lime after 4 days, and added a bit more yeast, however I'm sure as above too much sugar. It's been going two weeks now, but it was worth a go. Haha
Btw- infection might be on the cards also or it's just pulp

 

[hyjak71]

Have recently bottled an apricot ale, used 2kg of apricots added to the boil as per Sam Calagiones method outlined in the book (fresh apricots that had been frozen) then added 500g of dried apricots to the secondary when racking. On bottling had a strong apricot aroma and mild taste, fairly lacking in body but I put that down to recipe composition. Going to crack one over the weekend to see how its travelling.

IMO the advantages of adding fruit prior to primary fermentation are too good to dismiss, less risk of infection and unless you are expecting your beer to actually taste like the particular fruit used rather than a beer made with fruit your not going to miss out on much flavour.

eta:
**Whoa, all this time a member and only my first post. Must contribute more often**

 

[Mr. No-Tip]

I was coming along to post a thread on this (still might), but thought I'd start here.

Anyone tried a quince beer? I've still got a tree full of quince after making more quince paste than I need, so I thought I might tree a quince beer. I know there's been a quince saison brewed commercially before, and I found this one: http://hopville.com/recipe/964299/saison-r...nce-saison-2011

Anyone got any suggestion on approaches?

 

[doombrewer]

Great book that one, I brewed the kiwi wheat beer recipe he's got in there, was a wicked summer beer.

 

[Trippers]

i just racked my American wheat over 3.5kg of apricot nectar. Its smelling unblievable, I cant wait to taste it when its carbed up. Must add this book to my collection. Any local places to obtain a copy?

 

[doombrewer]

i just racked my American wheat over 3.5kg of apricot nectar. Its smelling unblievable, I cant wait to taste it when its carbed up. Must add this book to my collection. Any local places to obtain a copy?

Not sure, I got mine through an ebay book store.