Do Crown Seals Need To Be Steralised?

[kabooby]

When I first started, I had 5 fermenters going at once, thus 25 gallons at a time, so I aquired hundreds of the old style heavy xxxx tallies, and still using them today.
As for sanitising prior to bottling, Tony {with the Colgate smile} told us years ago on Grumpy`s------ boil 2 jugs of water, line your bottles up and pour a few inches of boiled water into each, swirl and discard.
This assumes of course your bottles are clean to start with. Mine always are. Soon as they`re empty, rinsed 3 times under hot tap, onto bottle tree to drain, once dry a 50 mill. square of alfoil crimped over neck and into milk crate till bottling day.
Too easy.
{Thanks again Tony :beerbang: }

staggalee.

Hey Staggalee,

If this is your method I can almost guarantee that there are deposits in the bottle that rinsing will not get rid of. Try getting some caustic or sodium percobonate in the bottle and fill it with boiling water. Let it sit for a while and watch the colour of the foam coming out the top of the bottle. This should be bright white. If its not than it is lifting deposits out of the bottle.

Kabooby

 

[Stuster]

If this is your method I can almost guarantee that there are deposits in the bottle that rinsing will not get rid of.

+1.

I certainly found that over time bottles that were just rinsed out exactly as you describe stagga would build up layers of crud. I now go to the extremes of napisan solution to clean my bottles. The difference is clear to me.

 

[staggalee]

ok, you`ve both convinced me to be a little less tardy.

staggalee.

 

[Carbonator]

I would like to add that new crown seals are plastic coated inside (BPA???) and when they are immersed in steriliser for the hour it takes to bottle, they wont suffer. After installing the seal on your bottles, straight out of the solution, the outside will dry and since the plastic is sealing the top, the only short-term rust will be outside the sealed area. (just like commercial bottled beer that has has condensation under the seals). Just have a rag ready to wip off the thread before drinking/

 

[Tony]

BTW, Tony, with your recent series of bad beer, do you expect us to believe that none of your bottled beer has ever been contaminated. How can you tell? That comment is misleading, in the extreme

They went bad in the fermenter and i tracked the problems to things like problems in the rubber bung of my starter vessel, cavities in a fermenter holding nasties, leaking imersion chiller and pool water.

yeah my comment was a bit off (excuse the pun)...... more poorly thought out than misleading. I bow down and appolagise to the all knowing perfect ones!

I will re-submit my comment as.......... before my recent spat of pre bottle infections, i have not had beer go off in the bottle.

But i will never say it wont happen because a certain procedure works for me.

I even did an experiment once with a pale light flavoured 4.5% pilsner. I bottled it into a bottle with a patch of mold about half the size of a 5c piece crowing on the inside of the bottle. I left it for 3 months and did a side by side and there was no difference. The mound was white and dead on the bottom.

Im sure Darren and others will say there are other germs that could kill my beer but i dont really care any more. Im all burnt out on germs. along with ******** arguments on here about crap.......... admit it folks..... this is all ********!

like i said............. if your beers are getting infected from new clean bottle caps you have big problems.

I just love how so many think because they do something and believe its right............. it is right.

People need to realise that everyone is different, everyones brewing systems, conditions, techniques are different. And everyones standards and tastes are different. I think we all brew to our own standards. We make beer that is to an acceptable standard or better, to fill our consumption wants and needs.

If thats a coopers lager with a kg of dex, so be it, if its a decoction mashed AG thats lagered for 6 months, so be it. If its either with a slight bit of funk that the consumer cant really detect or couldn'r give a **** about, so be it.

If you want to clean your caps, clean them, if you dont want to...... dont!

and move on!

 

[Weizguy]

...but would U sanitise a re-used commercial twist-top. ...Or just wash, or even just dry it out before re-use. Seriously.

Just drank a beer from the NSW comp left-over (next best beers). It re-used a commercial crown seal cap.
Compliments to the beer maker. There will a Witbier in your near future, from my current batch (with WLP410 - Wit II), my lazy fave. Never used Hoegaarden yeast, and probably never will.

Rambling...back on topic... I'd like to know why these Crown Seals need to be sterilised. Are they breeding rampantly and eating the world's fish supply?

 

[Tony]

When i started brewing i resued caps..... both comercial and homebrew and yes i steralised them.

I stoped when some showed signs of rust from being wet and soaled in chemicals. I stopped re-using caps very soon into my brewing days and used new caps only after that

I keep them sealed and clean.

If i drop one on the ground and it disapears under the work bench to god knows what, i chuck it in the bin and get another.

But i dont clean, sanatise or staralise them.

I have no problem with people doing this to their caps........ nothing wrong with being cautious but just because i dont believe its a necessary step in the process doesnt mean its right. same goes for the other side of the argument

 

[Muggus]

I've found my caps are more than likely to become rusted and I have to chuck out way more than I plan when I do sterilise them before hand.
These days I just keep them in an airtight container when not using them. No cleaning of any sort, and 95+ bottled batches later still no sign of bottle related infection.

 

[dr K]

Its not just restricted to home brewing..look at at all the products that are being pushed (usually along the "its a mothers role to protect her nest" line), cleaning cloths with built in bacteriacides, blasted purse size hand cleaners from a major detox name.
A clean surface is far less likely to harbour bacteria, funghi,spores and such,no a clean surface it is not a bacterial,fungal, sporic repellant and yes no doubt you can get transient, itinerant even, bacteria and such on them.
Sanitising the tops (Crown or Bench) will certainly kill any of these apparent visitors but in most cases so will the environment into which they are about to be cast.
Finished beer is a fermented product, just like salami and just like salami it is a very poor environment for the growth of bacteria, again just like salami if the infection develops during the fermentation process then you are in trouble, cept with salami it may kill you.
If you are going to get an infection you are going to get it between the kettle outlet and the fermentor outlet, and this is why sanitation in preparation for and during the fermentation process is critical, either side, apart from obvious things like cleanliness its just good practise.
Back to the Housewife..funny you know, about the best thing you can do to reduce infection is wash your hands with soap and water, like we used to.

K

 

[Stuster]

So let me get this straight, drK. You're saying we should wash the bottle caps with soap and water. :icon_chickcheers:

 

[kook]

So let me get this straight, drK. You're saying we should wash the bottle caps with soap and water. :icon_chickcheers:

Liquid or Bar? :lol:

 

[Screwtop]

Yes

Glad you stepped up and answered for me Bro :lol:" Have been looking at this thread in the line up but not opened it till tonight, thinking along the same lines.

Screwy

 

[Stuster]

Liquid or Bar?

:lol:

But of course, only one of those choices makes any sense. The other one is just crazy talk, as I'm sure you'd agree.

 

[staggalee]

The funniest part of some threads is when someone vents and says they`re ********, does a bit of a song and dance and advises the posters to move on
But the juggernaught just keeps going like no one heard, like some big ol steamroller that`s got the throttle out and no one at the wheel. :lol:
But then my sense of humour might be different. {I was always a fan of Spy vs. Spy in M ad magazine}

staggalee.

 

[HoppingMad]

I feel sorry for Stewills who opened up this topic.

Poor fella must be right well confused after this many pages of debate! :lol:

 

[staggalee]

what was the original question anyway?
It`s buried in there somewhere. :huh:

staggalee.

 

[SJW]

hi.

i was just wondering if the crown seals need to be steralised?

i usually keep them in a cupboard so i assume that they are generally clean when i use them... first time i steralised them.. second brew i didn't ( turned out alright didnt have any off taste) third brew i was just wondering if i should.. should i steralise them in bleach or just pour boiling water over it?

thanks..

I bet your glad you asked this question!
2 tips for future postings.
1/ Ask a simple question and get a thousand different answers.
2/ There is no such thing as a simple question.

Steve

 

[staggalee]

I feel sorry for Stewills who opened up this topic.

Poor fella must be right well confused after this many pages of debate! :lol:

Less the 2 posts pulled by the mods. this morning.
That`s a couple he won`t have to read.

staggalee.

 

[SJW]

Its funny, the amount of debate that can be generated by something that is so simple. Takes me back to the NO CHILL METHOD and the ROSS METHOD OF FORCE CARBONATING. Like so many things its up to the brewer as to what method he uses.
What anoys me is when people post there way of doing things as if its the only way or the only correct way.
IMO Brewing good beer consistantly is about mimising risk. Minimising risk of infection and if your happy to take short cuts and still make great beer......well more fool us who don't.


Steve

 

[PostModern]

about the best thing you can do to reduce infection is wash your hands with soap and water, like we used to.

Ah, but beer does not have an immune system!