Contemplating Having A Go At Ag

[pist]

Gday all

Ive been doing kit brewing for a while now, and whilst I enjoy doing it, some of the beer that comes out just has that taste that you can't get rid of that the kits are renowned for even with hop additions. I don't feel that going to extract brewing would be any more worthwhile as I have read and been told that it doesn't make all that much difference, and moving to AG brewing is the go.

I have read a bit in here about BIAB, and this seems to be a method that would suit me best given my space limitations.

I guess, my questions to get me off to a start on deciding what to do from here on, would be what equipment do I need to buy to get me going, and how much is it likely to cost me? Do I need a chiller or can you make do without this? I would probably be looking at sticking with the standard 23L batch size, as this suits me perfectly.

Also, any tips suggestions or things for me to consider here would be welcome.

Cheers :icon_cheers:

Pist

 

[argon]

Do this;

Move To All Grain For Thirty Bucks

or for bigger batches do this;

20l Stovetop All Grain Aussie Lager

or for full volume do this;

A Guide To All-grain Brewing In A Bag

 

[npenno]

It really depends on how much money you want to spend.

For me about $100 was the right mark. Got a BIAB bag from G&G for $10 and spent $75 on a 40L crab cooker (I found the insert stainer works grate, I use a potato masher to squeeze the wort out of the bag).

With regards to chilling, I chuck the whole pot in a big plastic tub full of cold water from the tap and stir. After about 3 water changes and 10 minutes I am down to about 30 degrees. Pour into fermenter, leave over night and pitch yeast.

Cheers,

Nick

P.S you wont be disappointed with ag. I started on kits and gave up because I didn't like the taste until my brother dragged me into ag.

 

[stux]

You can do 9L or so easily with a 19L pot on your stove. Good to see if you like the results

You can do 23L with the same pot and a 2$ plastic bucket and some dicking about

Or you can go for a full size setup

40-50L pot or a 70L pot for doubles
Gas burner, electric element or urn, expect to spend 250-400$

I use a silicon hose + jiggle siphon to get the hot wort out and into no chill cubes

10-20$ for some no chill cubes

7$ for some voile or buy a bag for $30


Http://biabrewer.info
Check out the guides to mini-biab and maxi-biab

 

[Bribie G]

I would recommend the 20L stove top method if your stove is up to the job. Or a 40L electric urn.

Basically you can save on the pot but you might need to then buy a gas heater and a gas supply. An urn is an all-in one solution which is cheaper to run per brew than gas, just switch it on.

Another method that is recommended by the guys who do BIAB demos at Grain and Grape is to get one of these



And use it in a big (50L) pot with tap.

At the end of the day, up to a point, the more you spend on a system to get you a full volume batch with the least fannying around, then the easier and quicker your brewday will be.

However to dip your toe in the water the 20L stovetop method is going to get you into the obsession for less than $50 and you can then decide if you want to go bigger. RdeV has stuck with the method all along and won quite a few gongs in this years' comp season.

 

[RdeVjun]

Yeah, bypass extract is a sensible idea and stick with Stovetop BIAB if you're worried about space and cost, although lately the ghetto buckets have had a resurgence in popularity as well.
If you do go BIAB, the big double ewe 19L stockpot is the cheapest and a very common mash/ lauter tun/ kettle (i.e. does just about everything!), while the sponsors BIAB bags are well regarded by those who've used them.
With the smaller pot, you can do two batches one after another to fill the fermenter by the $30 method (that's one long brewday!), Goomba also has a two- pot stovetop method which will do much the same, however for 23L batches in that pot in one go, the second link of argon's will get you there, here's an alternate guide if required. However, I'd recommend the single $30 method to begin with for about 12L, it is so simple and an excellent starting point, if you're confident after that then by all means step up to bigger batches.
Obviously you can go for a bigger kettle, however the 19L jobbie is so cheap (usually $20) and I recommend it as introductory gear, its worthwhile remembering that all- grain brewing isn't for everyone, if you do give it a go and don't actually like it for what ever reason (time, taste, relative complexity etc) then the losses from that initial outlay will be minimal and you can still use the pot for other things. Not much other all- grain start up equipment and method is like this, often there's modification required rendering some things thereafter useless for anything else.
The small gas camping stove from the big chain stores can be had for $15 at the moment, if there's any hassles with your kitchen stove just use that, I can assure you that it boils the 19L pot, albeit fairly slowly, but gets there well enough.
Chilling in the laundry tub is what I do, its simple and effective, however you've got to be prepared to lift a kettle full of near- boiling wort (and have tested its handles beforehand!), so fitting an outlet tap or using a siphon to drain it are attractive possibilities.
If you have any locals that are all- grain brewing perhaps they could give you a demo, likewise getting along your local brew club and rubbing shoulders with like- minded brewers is a great way to get the ball rolling.
Hope that helps and good luck with it! :icon_cheers:

 

[DU99]

PIST..where are you located..some LHBS run demo's

 

[pist]

I'm located in the newcastle area...pretty much only have the 2 LHBS's around, so a bit limited in that department I think.

Not sure if marks holds demo's but he has alot of gear in there that HBI/beer'n'gear does not stock.

 

[MaestroMatt]

Http://biabrewer.info

Brew in a Brewer??????? Or even worse....what the hell is a 'Rewer'?


I disagree about the all extract change from kits being all that different. When I moved from kits to full extract + specialty grain 'tea' + hop additions.....there was a MASSIVE difference. And there are so many different varieties of extract now that most styles are possible.

But for easy of use and cost on the hip-pocket, the BIAB for $30 thread is a ripper. I am using that method for 'test' batch brews and it works a treat.

It will only take one AG beer, no mater the volume, to completely change your mind about brewing.

 

[Spork]

<snip>

It will only take one AG beer, no mater the volume, to completely change your mind about brewing.

Couldn't agree more.
After one "toucan" and a couple of "Recipe kits" - @ close enough to $50 each, and shite results, I tried stovetop BIAB and haven't looked back!
Only did 3 stovetop brews before getting an urn to do full size batches, as faffing around for a couple of hours for < a dozen tallies seemed exhorbitantly time expensive.
A couple of the BIAB's I've done with my own recipes are OK but nothing special. The ones I have done with "tried and true" recipes - DSGA and the Oatmeal Stout from "Brewing classic styles" are bloody amazing!

Having said that, I went BIAB and a urn for convenience and space limitations. If I had a bit more room I'd probably go the "Ghetto style" 3v with the BOD, or even "Stainless steel Bling" 3V.

At least the stovetop method costs 3/8th of FA and you can get an idea of what results you can expect from a bigger, and more expensive, AG system.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

$31 for my 2 big w pots (one was on special) and $10 worth of voile.

The pasta pot, colander and other kitchen paraphernalia, we already had.

Still plugging away with it, though the ghetto bucket idea is starting to seriously look good, if only to cut the amount of squeezing I do.

 

[alcoadam]

I wouldn't worry about chillers and other gear whilst your starting out.

You can knock-up a small batch on the stove and when done add 10L or so of icy water and a can of goop....that will solve your cooling and volume concerns. I'm currently drinking one done like this....and not a bad drop! :icon_drunk:

 

[Diesel80]

Bribie, where can someone get one of those elements with the end in that configuration? I have only seen the coil version which some people are telling me are not designed for wort, (get too hot, need a lower density of heat generated to not caramelise wort etc). This is what i have been told but then i talk to some other brewers on here who have 0 issues using the coiled ones.

Who to believe? :blink:

Apologies for thread sidetrack.

Cheers,
D80

 

[gravey]

I wouldn't worry about chillers and other gear whilst your starting out.

You can knock-up a small batch on the stove and when done add 10L or so of icy water and a can of goop....that will solve your cooling and volume concerns. I'm currently drinking one done like this....and not a bad drop! :icon_drunk:

BIAB definately seems like a good way to get into AG and I agree that extract really isnt a big step up from kits. I was lucky and had a 50L keg donated to me that had already been turned into a mashtun (insulation foil, holes drilled). I just needed a tap and a thermometer and away I went. I already had a 18L pot, so I did a few partial mashes using the keg and pot on the stove for a while.

You could easily turn an esky into a mash tun though....all you would need is a SS tap, bulkhead and false bottom and you can make these up yourself (I found some scrap perforated steel at work). You see plenty of eskies on the side of the road during hard rubbish days.....or gumtree will often have them very cheap. The round ones work a treat too. Even the partial mashes I have done tasted brilliant.

Speaking of hard rubbish days - this was my source for my kettle. I found a 50L keg on the side of the road (yeah right, I hear you all saying) the valve was seized hence why it was being ditched. I got my BIL to cut the top off with a plasma cutter. Bought an SS Tap, bulkhead and gas burner and now I can proudly call myself an AG Brewer.......my friends are amazed at the beer I produce - rather than giving me the mediocre response I used to get, I now get big smiles and praise along the lines of "I cant believe you made this" and "I could drink this all day". I'm hoping to start making some beers they wont be able to drink all day but will still enjoy nonetheless :beer:

Scrounging through other peoples rubbish? Best thing I ever did (hey, thats a great sig right there)

 

[adz1179]

mate I'm on the central coast, doing a full volume biab either next weekend or the one after. if your keen to be the assistant brewer shoot me a PM.

 

[QldKev]

I think got straight to full vol BIAB. It's a lot less screwing around than some other methods, and if you ever go to 3V the pot can be reused.

QldKev

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

Less stuffing around to go straight to BIAB (from personal experience) and far better beer.

Goomba

 

[winkle]

Check out the ghetto rig in the systems wars thread buckets featuring the "Bucket-o-death". It impressed me on the day how cheap, quick and easy it was.

 

[gone brewing]

There's a brew club in Newcastle, the Hunter United Brewers. Here is a link to the website. Shouldn't be hard to get on to someone doing a brew soon.
http://www.hunterbrewers.com/forum/

The next meeting is Fri 21st at Adamstown Bowling Club at 6:30 and you are welcome to come along.