Confused Brewer.

[gava]

Howdy All,

Let me introduce myself Im a beer drinker and now a AG brewer.. Thing that confused me is that when people taste a beer they tell me .. Oh that's hoppy or malty or has a fruit kick.. or along those lines.. When I taste it I think oh thats a nice beer..

Question : I read people making their own recipes for beers saying "It was a little off I'll add 10grams of Hops at 15mins, that should fix it or might try different grain etc.." How do you know this stuff? how do you kow if its too hoppy/malty and how to fix it? is it simply experience? if not how do I find out this? I would love to brew some of my own recipe and fix along the way..

Same question about people that 'clone' their fav beers.. where do you start? how do you know what you should start to put in the beer to get the desired effects?

signed
Confused Brewer..
also known as Gav

 

[newguy]

It all really comes down to experience. Most brewers start off with recipes from other brewers or from books [I did]. Once you get a few brews under your belt you feel confident enough to start tweaking recipes. Pretty soon you have enough confidence to strike out on your own. One of the better books if you want to create your own recipes from scratch is Designing Great Beers by Ray Daniels. As far as recipes are concerned, Brewing Classic Styles by Jamil Zainasheff must be pretty good. I say must be because while I don't have the book myself, a novice brewer walked away with brewer of the year and best of show awards at a recent competition and he told me that most of his recipes were straight from this book.

 

[Supra-Jim]

Hello Confused,

I think it is something that comes with experience, and also some people are blessed with more sensitive palates. Ideally the best way to improve your knowledge of how this affects that etc, is to brew and brew again. Remember each time to keep records of what you did/used etc and then compare.

Knowing a few of the basics (i.e. bittering comes from the longer boil hops, flavour from the 20mins, and more aroma from the shortest boil/flame out) you can easily experiment with your beer, i.e lacks bitterness, lacks aroma etc.

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[gava]

It all really comes down to experience. Most brewers start off with recipes from other brewers or from books [I did]. Once you get a few brews under your belt you feel confident enough to start tweaking recipes. Pretty soon you have enough confidence to strike out on your own. One of the better books if you want to create your own recipes from scratch is Designing Great Beers by Ray Daniels. As far as recipes are concerned, Brewing Classic Styles by Jamil Zainasheff must be pretty good. I say must be because while I don't have the book myself, a novice brewer walked away with brewer of the year and best of show awards at a recent competition and he told me that most of his recipes were straight from this book.

Im brewing a recipe from "brewing classic Styles" this sunday.. i've read through a bit have to finish it.. seems good.

well I guess i'll HAVE to drink and brew more beers

 

[Supra-Jim]

well I guess i'll HAVE to drink and brew more beers

Yeah that really sucks doesn't it!!!

Another point worth noting i was listening to a Jamil podcast the other day and he was talking about being able to taste IBU's, i.e. could tell what 40 IBU should taste like. He clarified this by saying he knew what 40 IBU's tasted like 'from his system' as we all know things differ between equipemnt and brewers and methods etc.

Another good rule is only ever change one thing at a time, that way you will understand how that affects your brew. Change too much at once and you won't know what impacted who/where and how much.

So brew more, taste more and keep notes and compare your results!!

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[brendo]

Hey Gava,

Pretty much what the other guys said... it comes down to experience and exposure.

Experience in playing with different ingriedients and brewing different styles and noting the differences. As the others suggested, brewing classic styles is a great resource. It contains descriptions of the styles and then provides you a recipe to brew to that style. This would help you to start calibrate your pallete - brew a malty style, taste it and understand the description.

Exposure (linked to the above) would be to go out there and sample as many different beer styles as you can and taste them in conjunction with the Beer Judging Certification Program (BJCP) beer style guide, which will tell you what a beer style should taste like and you can use that for a basis of comparison (will only work if they have brewed to style).

Another avenue would be to look at beer rating sites (beeradvocate, ratebeer, etc), read the descriptions/reviews, taste the beers and learn from that.

Basically mate... just get out there and brew and taste as much beer as you can - but think critically about what you are tasting. It is all subjective and everyone's pallete is different, but it will help you on the road.

Sounds like a pretty horrible process to me :super:

Brendo

 

[gava]

thought I'd reuse this post since im a little confused again..

brewing my second AG and the recipe says

"ferment at 10c. allow the beer to larger for 4 weeks before bottling or serving"

Since i'm putting them into kegs do I let it ferment down to FG then put in my Keg to lager? then carb up after the four weeks

or should I rack to a cube and leave it in fridge? also it doesn't tell me what temp I should larger at? 4c? 10c?

 

[Kleiny]

"ferment at 10c. allow the beer to larger for 4 weeks before bottling or serving"

Since i'm putting them into kegs do I let it ferment down to FG then put in my Keg to lager? then carb up after the four weeks

or should I rack to a cube and leave it in fridge? also it doesn't tell me what temp I should larger at? 4c? 10c?

Whats the recipe?
Whats the yeast?

If its wyeast there web site has guides for temperature.

 

[gava]

Whats the recipe?
Whats the yeast?

If its wyeast there web site has guides for temperature.

Kleiny you got "brewing Classic Styles" if so it's page 60 "to George" bohemian pilsner..

it's a Wyeast.. "2001 - Urquell Lager" says 9c to 14c... I guess 10 is a little heavy on the wrong side.. book says 10c but should I be safe and split the difference? 12? i guess the guy that made this book knows what he's doing and I do have a fridge mate thats regulating my temp..

But my question is : Do I let it "larger" in the fermenter or can I keg it and let it larger in there for 4 weeks.. "Want to do another brew and I only have one fermenter at the moment"

 

[mckenry]

thought I'd reuse this post since im a little confused again..

brewing my second AG and the recipe says

"ferment at 10c. allow the beer to larger for 4 weeks before bottling or serving"

Since i'm putting them into kegs do I let it ferment down to FG then put in my Keg to lager? then carb up after the four weeks

or should I rack to a cube and leave it in fridge? also it doesn't tell me what temp I should larger at? 4c? 10c?

As you keg, you should keg the beer when FG is achieved - if you can spare the keg...
Its worth upping the temp towards the end of fermentation to finish it properly - say 14 - 15C for a couple of days. The reasons are many - search for D-rest or diacetyl rest - Lager at close to freezing temps, so 4 will be OK, I go to 2C.
I dont fully gas up kegs that are lagering - just enough CO2 to drive out the Oxygen in the head space.
After 4 weeks, up the CO2 to carbonation pressure for a couple of days, then serve as normal.
Also - hate to be picky, but, its lager (German word for store) not larger (English word for bigger) - you did get it right once out of three

 

[Kleiny]

It probably will take a while longer to get down to your FG (just the way it goes with lagers) possibly 2 -3 weeks, once its down to your FG raise the temp to around 16C for a couple of days for a diacetyl rest (just incase its their, the yeast will clean it up at a higher temp).

From their i usually keg and lager in the keg between 2-4C for at least 4 weeks (in the case of my oktoberfest its from march to October).

 

[gava]

larger lager....soo close

cheers guys that clears it up...

 

[bum]

larger lager....soo close

Try to tell your missus that there's not much difference!

 

[np1962]

Also - hate to be picky, but, its lager (German word for store) not larger (English word for bigger) - you did get it right once out of three

Next you'll be telling us it's not Rice Gulls h34r:

 

[driveitlikeustoleit]

Stoopid spellink chequer.

The other thing i try is tasting all the ingredients separately before brewing with them. Just go easy on the hops if your chewing them. They might blow your head off if you stuff too much in. :unsure: