Brew Smells Like Perming Solution

[Murcluf]

Bit of background been brewing 18 month to 2 years Kits and Bits and Extract Brews been pretty happy with what I have been doing so far. So I thought it would be a good idea to start ramping things up and start introducing grains into the mix, don't know whether it is an infection, coincidence and is ok or I screwed up big time, but my latest is looking like it is going to go down the drain.

Fermentation completely stopped after 2 days Gravity went from 1.048 t0 1.012, brew is cloudy puss colour, smells like perming solution.

I was attempting a helles, smells and looks like it comes from there

This is the first time I tried to use any grains at all, recipe called for 250g of Carapils and I hopped 15g of Hallertau at flame out these are the only 2 things I have done out of the norm for me.

Any feedback is welcomed

P.S. Should I stop trying recipes I find on the net and buy some good brewing books instead?

 

[Adamt]

I'm not exactly sure what perming solution smells like.

What did you do with the grains? Could be an infection if it mowed through fermentation that quickly. If it is an infection it would most likely have nothing to do with the recipe.

 

[Asher]

What did you do with the grains?
If not used correctly they can be a nice source of lactic infection

maybe you made a Berlinner Helles

Sorry - I have no idea what perming solution smells like (too young in the 80's )

Asher

 

[warrenlw63]

Sounds like sulphur from lager yeast maybe? Assuming you used a lager yeast? :unsure:

Warren -

 

[mika]

Ok...lets go thru the silly stuff;
Were the grains crushed ?
Were the grains removed before the boil commenced ?
Did the water/sugar mix from the grains get boiled for at least 15mins before adding to the fermentor ?

Carapils should be a simple addition, not much can go wrong with that.
I use recipes off the net all the time...AHB's on the net

 

[DarkFaerytale]

*flashback to sitting in the car as a kid waiting for mum to get her hair permed*

mate thats a deffinate infection no doubt about it IMO, that stuff reaks, i'd prolly put it down to what adamt said and maybe you miss handled your grains. how did you add them?

-Phill

 

[Steve]

taste it

 

[Darren]

Bit of background been brewing 18 month to 2 years Kits and Bits and Extract Brews been pretty happy with what I have been doing so far. So I thought it would be a good idea to start ramping things up and start introducing grains into the mix, don't know whether it is an infection, coincidence and is ok or I screwed up big time, but my latest is looking like it is going to go down the drain.

Fermentation completely stopped after 2 days Gravity went from 1.048 t0 1.012, brew is cloudy puss colour, smells like perming solution.

I was attempting a helles, smells and looks like it comes from there

This is the first time I tried to use any grains at all, recipe called for 250g of Carapils and I hopped 15g of Hallertau at flame out these are the only 2 things I have done out of the norm for me.

Any feedback is welcomed

P.S. Should I stop trying recipes I find on the net and buy some good brewing books instead?

Could be the hallertau! They do have a "perfumy" aroma if you have not smelled it before.

cheers

Darren

 

[user 384]

Well I'm going to take a different tack to the rest of the contributors as I don't think it sounds like an infection.

What was the fermentation temp?

The reason I ask is that the perming solution smell you describe could equally be described as a solvent like smell. This is often due to high fermentation temps, which would also explain the rapid fermentation.

Cheers
MAH

 

[Ross]

Cloudy wort (assuming it's had time to clear) & that perfumy smell, sound like a wild yeast infection to me
- always hard to tell though with different peoples descriptions.
The real test is in the taste...if tastes good/ok drink it...if it tastes foul (as I suspect) chuck it...

cheers Ross

 

[Murcluf]

Ok...lets go thru the silly stuff;
Were the grains crushed ?
Were the grains removed before the boil commenced ?
Did the water/sugar mix from the grains get boiled for at least 15mins before adding to the fermentor ?

Carapils should be a simple addition, not much can go wrong with that.
I use recipes off the net all the time...AHB's on the net

Grains were crushed, and steeped in cold water for 12 overnight and strained (going for the smooth flavour) and boiled with 4 litres of water for 15 mins prior to anything else being added to the boil ie malt hops and water. must admit I was some what over cautious in this area because it was my first time and was worried about infection.

 

[matti]

Taste is the best solution.
Perming solution?
Does it curl you stomach?

I've got one meself that smells like a bitter bitch on heat.. though the taste of it seem incredibly hoppy but beer like.

A good beer book is always handy but recipes on the net is nothing wrong with as long as the process is good and clean.

 

[Murcluf]

Well I'm going to take a different tack to the rest of the contributors as I don't think it sounds like an infection.

What was the fermentation temp?

The reason I ask is that the perming solution smell you describe could equally be described as a solvent like smell. This is often due to high fermentation temps, which would also explain the rapid fermentation.

Cheers
MAH

Yeah the smell is like that of a hair dressers on a Saturday morning so to put a bloke's bent on the smell it would be along the lines of used paint stripper. I was using Brew Cellar European lager yeast and the temp is 22 C tastes ok but the smell is a put off

 

[warrenlw63]

Sounds like sulphur from lager yeast maybe? Assuming you used a lager yeast? :unsure:

Warren -

bump!!

Edit: You shouldn't really fermrent at any more than around 14 degrees with a lager yeast.

Warren -

 

[Murcluf]

bump!!

Edit: You shouldn't really fermrent at any more than around 14 degrees with a lager yeast.

Warren -

Yeah I know we have had a few days where its been a bit warm and have used number of other lager yeasts in the past and got away with it, but it is the first time I have used this brand before which has also made me cautious in this area also. Ultimately I'll have to put it down as a learning experience

 

[Bobby]

you cold steeped the grain?

 

[Murcluf]

you cold steeped the grain?

Yes, supposedly cold steeping Carapils for 12 hours (over night) will give you a smoother flavour and will prevent tannin flavours being transfered to the boil. but hey what would I know this was the first time I've used grain and it has all gone pear shaped. I was just trying to follow the helpful suggestions of the more knowledgeable then I

 

[braufrau]

Perming solution is ammonium thioglycollate, as we all remember from the triumphant end
of Legally Blonde right?

So it probably smells a bit like a stinky thiol (sulphur) compound, like that stuff that they
use in colour photo labs, or a mercaptan skunky smell.

Thiols are usually caused by light strike.
http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20051203/bob8.asp (scroll down to spoilers).

Seems unlikely before bottling though so I'm putting my money on Warren and the lager yeast
at high T.

-braufrau

 

[Mr Bond]

What were you thinking fermenting a lager yeast @ 22c?
i wouldn't even let an ale strain go to that temp(with the exception of a weizen strain) for fear of fruitiness etc..
Those brewcellar yeasts are only repackaged saf strains so its prolly s 23 or 34/70 anyways.

 

[Murcluf]

What were you thinking fermenting a lager yeast @ 22c?
i wouldn't even let an ale strain go to that temp(with the exception of a weizen strain) for fear of fruitiness etc..
Those brewcellar yeasts are only repackaged saf strains so its prolly s 23 or 34/70 anyways.

What was I thinking, what was I thinking, probly been watching too many Mad Scientist cartoons and getting over excited by the sight of bubbles. I think I'll chuck this lot down the sink and give up on lagers until I get an extra fidge or something for lagering. Oh well its taken me nearly 2 years before I have had to ditch a brew so i guess I must of been doing something right or just bloody lucky

Cheers and Thanks for everyones input its been valuable

Murcluf