BIAB legacy podcast

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Saw this BIAB interview on basic brewing site .
"Brew in a Bag pioneer Pat Hollingdale and Brew in a Bag enthusiast Bob Stempski talk about the legacy of the technique and the myths surrounding it."
Pat being an AHB serial poster of Magna Carta length posts back in the day :lol:
Nev

 

[real_beer]

Saw this BIAB interview on basic brewing site .
"Brew in a Bag pioneer Pat Hollingdale and Brew in a Bag enthusiast Bob Stempski talk about the legacy of the technique and the myths surrounding it."
Pat being an AHB serial poster of Magna Carta length posts back in the day :lol:
Nev

I always enjoy listening to podcasts with Pat as a guest.

Here's a line from a post he made on another forum that I wont be naughty and mention here of course:

"Incidentally, I was with Simon (NME/admin) the other day and we were able to estimate that I have written over two million words on brewing here and elsewhere. That's 31 average size novels

"

He should bundle them all together & release them on Kindle :lol:.

 

[StalkingWilbur]

Listened to last night. Really enjoyed it. Was good to hear him downplay the tiresome BIAB vs 3v arguments.

 

[PistolPatch]

Thanks Nev for posting the thread :icon_cheers:,

I only had 24 hours notice on the podcast but I think I managed to mention AndrewQLD, stux, crusty and JamesSquire. Apologies I couldn't mention more people but it's hard to think on the go and I suppose you can't mention everyone in an hour.

It's a shame the title of the podcast wasn't something different as much of what is in it applies to all brewers. As I said in the podcast, I really think that some new paradigms are about to beset us. Hopefully we Aussies will lead the way.

One worry I have is that this podcast wasn't posted on AHB sooner. Surely we should be the leaders on news in this area?

Another worry I have is that in real_beer's really nice post above, he felt he couldn't mention the international site I created. On that site I mention that AHB is the go to Aussie site. Surely it is okay to mention my BIAB site? I have heaps of posts there that refer to AHB.

I and many others here on AHB have spent many hours on BIAB. I hope this site isn't forgetting that BIAB and no-chill are remarkable contributions to the home-brew world. I make no money out of BIABrewer.info but it does cost me a lot of time. If I had more time, I'd post the work on what I have been doing here. I was really just hoping/expecting that others would do that naturally.

Why?

Because the stuff I and a few others have helped develop is revolutionary.

I've never forgotten AHB. I just hope that AHB hasn't forgotten me.

Spot ya,
Pat

 

[real_beer]

Hi Pat,

Sorry about not posting the link: http://www.biabrewer.info/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2689&sid=2fddb67b319c4bf90a2fa24031de5738#p38295

I wasn't sure how the Mods view these things nowadays (yes I know I should read the rules, NOT) but now realise how silly I was thinking it'd be a problem. I think it's probably more aimed at disgruntled members actively promoting other forums.

I must say that I'm quite impressed that since your BeerSmith podcast http://beersmith.com/blog/2011/02/24/brew-in-a-bag-biab-down-under-beersmith-podcast-10/ Americans seem to be progressing quite quickly from "I like using BIAB for test batches" or "It's a great way to enter all-grain brewing until you can afford a proper setup" :lol:. They really seem to be embracing the method, and this seems to be reflected by the number of BIAB systems now offered for sale both there, and here in Australia. Great work!

I'm sure a lot of members here are also on the biabrewer.info site. I must also say all your dedication to the advancement of the method has probably cemented you as a Legend who will forever be remembered each time they triumphantly hoist their grain bag out of the kettle, and without sparging move on to the boil :lol:.

Cheers

 

[Yob]

Pistol, your inbox is full..

 

[Aces High]

Some good discussion near the end for newbies trying all grain. They were talking about people trying their first recipe and adding 10 different grains and hops rather than starting simple. I've seen this plenty of times on biabrewer, people coming up with ridiculously complex recipes, 5 grams of this grain and 10 of that, then hop additions every 5 or 10 minutes. A complete waste of time for a new brewer unless they need exercise in walking back and forth to the brew pot.

They also discussed not sweating the small things, your boil off volume will change every time you brew due to outside weather conditions and humidity, being off by a point or two at the end of your boil won't end the world.

 

[PistolPatch]

Ha! Did I write that above? That was after spending 6 hours on one dynamic picture to make the BIABacus really fast to learn. One error meant starting the diagram from scratch which occurred three times. There have been quite a few days like that . Everything takes a lot longer than expected. Once everything is done though, I'll release the BIABacus generally and you will be able to use it here. Mind you it is a spreadsheet so I hope it will be okay to post it here. Fingers crossed! Really looking forward to getting that tool out the door.

That's a super nice post above real_beer. Thanks a heap for that! The Americans are getting in to it. A recent poll of 1800 brewers showed 32.7% usually BIAB'ed, 15.5% occasionally BIAB'ed and 26.1% said they would like to learn. Bob who did the podcast with me has nearly everyone in his brew club BIAB'ing now so they seem to be enjoying it. Those crazy buggers brew on an ice lake once a year - lol.

Yob, my inbox is cleared a bit now and thanks a heap for the excellent hops you sent me a while back. Yum!

Aces, the old eighty ingredients in the recipe trick . Looking forward to being able to put some sensible recipes out soon.

As for the podcast, I think the main points I was hoping to get across were...

1. The importance of clear brewing terminology.
2. Why not to rely on measurements from a single brew.
3. Kettle efficiency is not a constant. It varies with the gravity of the brew.
4. In BIAB, if your kettle can handle all the water required for a brew, then put that water in. Holding water back for a sparge makes no difference.
5. The trick with numbers in brewing is showing them the right balance of respect and disrespect.

Number four above is a really counter-intuitive one initially but hopefully the jeans in the bucket versus two bucket analogy made some sense. Hope so!

I've got today off and so better get going with 26 more dynamic pictures. Ouch!

Many thanks,
Pat

 

[manticle]

Here's a line from a post he made on another forum that I wont be naughty and mention here of course:

OT but people are really misunderstanding this. There is no issue whatsoever with mentioning other brewing forums in a post or linking to pertinent information contained elsewhere.

A guideline was recently brought in pertaining to links to other brewing forums in signatures. That is all.
I myself am a member (not that I go there often) of homebrewtalk and also the babblebelt forum and have read brewing info on many sites, including brewadelaide, beersmith, brewing network and homebrewdouwnunder and others. I will recommend any of these sites if they contain worthy information that may help another brewer. Lightning will not strike me down, the CIA won't knock on my door, I won't get demoted from mod.

On topic - good to see, Pat.

I'm not a BIABer but I introduced a bloke I know to AG brewing yesterday using equipment he'd bought (and some of mine as we did it at my joint) so my demo was also my first full BIAB (have done many a minimash in a bag but never a full batch).

 

[manticle]

Actually I just re-read the guideline and it makes no such distinction. Just says advertising and hyperlinking other brewing forums The discussion between moderators was in regards to signatures. I'll get clarification but based on the discussions admin and mods had at the time, I'm fairly certain it is intended to refer to signatures and any kind of aggressive 'recruiting' (along the lines of 'AHB sucks, join here instead').

 

[NealK]

Listened to the podcast last night.
I recently set my mill to crush finer than the default because I thought it would help. I will be changing it back for my next brew!
It was a very informative podcast and also great to hear from the pioneer of the technique. If it had not been for BIAB I really don't think that I would still be brewing.
Thank you Pat!

 

[thedragon]

Pat, it was a brilliant podcast, thank you.

But most of all, my thanks to you and the BIAB pioneers for inventing and sharing such an elegantly simple brewing style.

If it wasn't for BIAB, I'd still be doing kits.

 

[Eagleburger]

Thanks for posting that. I am a beginner and started SMASH, but after reading too much I was nearly seduced into buying ten different grains yadda yadda. My first brew, despite all the mistakes and lack of recipe tasted just like CPA, the origin of the yeast. Still much fun to be had.!

 

[S.E]

Pat, it was a brilliant podcast, thank you.

But most of all, my thanks to you and the BIAB pioneers for inventing and sharing such an elegantly simple brewing style.

If it wasn't for BIAB, I'd still be doing kits.

I know I upset and alienated half of the members on here when I mentioned this before, but brewing in a bag was not pioneered or invented by Pat or anyone else here on AHB.

Without doubt Pat researched and promoted the method with great enthusiasm, spreading it to the masses via the interweb.

He may have thought he had invented it at the time because he had not heard or read about it, but the fact is it a very old and simple method that has been used and documented by home brewers years before he thought about it.

I don’t want to start a heated argument or upset anyone about this but it is a fact. Perhaps Pat should clear up the misunderstanding. He must get embarrassed whenever he sees himself referred to as the inventor of BIAB.

 

[bundy]

I too admit I frequent both BIABrewer.info and this forum and enjoyed the BIAB specific Podcast from PistolPatch immensely. Very informative

I find that for general brewing info this Forum is great, but anything BIAB specific the other forum seems to have more members able to answer those questions and most importantly provide accurate information on the BIAB process.

As for software BIABicus for me wins hands down, biggest issue I had when starting out were measurements. ie How much water, HOPS etc, and that is the only thing that out there that converts everything simply and easily. Especially when scaling recipes.

As for who invented it, I dont think it matters. Maybe others tried it but the original crew from AHB all those years ago certainly perfected it and bought it to the masses like me.

I was bored one day and went back through the old thread were PistolPatch, James Squire, Andrew QLD etc where just startign out and giving it a go. It was great reading. I remember reading someone trying to brew with their PillowCase as a bag!! (Obviously didnt work too well)

Shows how far the process has come. So to all the Pioneers whoever you are - Hats off to you.

 

[bundy]

Listened to the podcast last night.
I recently set my mill to crush finer than the default because I thought it would help. I will be changing it back for my next brew!
It was a very informative podcast and also great to hear from the pioneer of the technique. If it had not been for BIAB I really don't think that I would still be brewing.
Thank you Pat!

Yes I read one of PistolPatches analogies on this, and I have seen many post on here to do a double crush or mill very fine - Obviously not great advice fo rBIAB or anyone doing AG.

The quote I read went something like - "Grain is like Sugar Cane, The goodness we want is inside the husk. You don't wont to get the husk crushed so fine it gets mixed up with the kernel. Otherwise you get unwanted flavours into your wort. You just need to crack your grain enough to let the goodness out. A BIAB crush should be the same as any 3V crush and definitely not too fine"

Something like that anyway...

 

[r055c0]

I'm a 3V brewer and can't say I'll be switching to BIAB myself (however I have helped a couple of mates get started with BIAB), but I was really interested to hear about the idea of full volume mashing.

I tried it myself with a mild last night and not only did it give me a few extra points of efficiency (could also have been due to the smaller grain bill) but it really simplified the whole process, saved me a lot of messing around time (time better spent playing with Lara Croft...)

Just mashed in, came back an hour later and dialled up the heat (HERMS system), came back half an hour later and ran the lot into the kettle, heat on and boil as usual

I'll be using full volume mashing for my next few brews at least

 

[PistolPatch]

Many thanks for the great feedback above. Really appreciate you taking the time to post how you found the podcast and/or BIAB generally. Hope you found Bob funny. He's a crack-up. Every time he writes something, I'm laughing for the rest of the day .

manticle, thanks for taking the time to investigate the above. Also much appreciated.

S.E. I think what was original about BIAB was not so much the bag but more the fact that it was a full-volume, single vessel method. I'm sure many people would have done full-volume mashing in a bag before but I'm pretty sure it was not really out in the public arena at all. Any popular method in the public arena, including the braumeisters, always involved an active sparge. So I think the hidden sparge / full volume / single vessel bit is the real key. Correct me please though if I have this wrong. If we could re-name it, maybe we would call it full-volume mashing, hidden sparge, single vessel all-grain method - lol!

bundy - that's a really accurate quote mate .

One more thing to pass on is that BIAB is best done with a 90 minute mash as we are mashing and sparging at the same time. This extra 30 minutes can make a real difference especially on certain grain bills.

Once again, thanks for your gracious posts :icon_cheers:.
Pat

 

[Crusty]

Great interview Pat & good to hear from you again.
Biab has proven itself to be an awesome way to brew All Grain & continues to shine in competitions.
Without your efforts & trials back when Biab was taking off, it never would of gotten to the point of where it is today & this has contributed to it's popularity world wide.
I'm happy to consider you as a pioneer & applaud your efforts for all you've done for Biab, this forum & BIABrewer.info
Cheers mate.

 

[Bribie G]

Crusty got a mention :beerbang:

The light really turned on for me when Pat explained the reason for a 90 min mash. I occasionally do a 90 or even 120 (plus a few custom ones like Hochkurz) but more often than not just set the timer for 60. So I'll be doing a 90 as my standard mash now. Thanks Pat.

I echo Crusty's comments. And not just the USA, hop onto any of the UK forums and BIAB is now a well accepted method. Go back only a couple of years ago and senior forum members there were resigning rather than put up with this silly new Australian nonsense :unsure:

MIAB Mash in a Bag - doesn't quite have the same ring, sounds like a cranky cat you accidentally trod on.